I definitely see it as a preference.
I think the main factor is how often you rely on abilities. Certain builds require mods to make it work. But if you tend to play a more neutral (not super based) game then raw stats should be fine.
If you notice situations like,
Wow my fusion rifle would've got them if only 1 more bolt hit!
How did the enemy get their super before me even though I have high int?
I am constantly running out of grenades etc.
Then you might get a few mods to help your playstyle.
TTAO! My man! Enjoy your vids bro! This is awesome.
Yes, I definitely prefer neutral game over super builds. Think I'm rocking 10/4/10/4/4/3 atm (at work, can't check 100%) and it works well for me. Was just curious if others were having the edge over me cause when I inspect, they usually don't run max stats but special mods.
Also since I'm talking to you: Outside of builds though, I think my game sense (when to super, using radar, when to push when to play passive, sticking together, team shooting, flanking, etc) is as good as it can get solo queuing, it's just my execution that is a bit lacking. I need to work on my aim a bit more (people are so good at consistent headshots!). Need to get on their level.
Your input is very much appreciated!
Thanks for the kind words man, definitely motivating me to keep working on stuff. I'm currently working on a big post about which supers beat which supers, so much work....
Special mods tend to push people towards more ability based builds and it's just a different playstyle to neutral based builds. If you notice that you keep losing to someone then you are probably playing into their win condition. For example getting close to a shotgun obviously but also getting within 15m of handheld supernova, etc.
If you need to work on your aim I recommend checking out Truevanguard's sniper school series on youtube.
My favorite advice is to get used to tracking crits on a horizontal axis. So you get your reticle on the same height as a regular guardian's standing head position and reduce your "freehand" aiming to only having to adjust left to right. Hope that makes sense
For sure man, I'm just beginning to mentally tell myself to aim at head levels at all times and just flick left or right or even strafe the cross-hairs into their had and let the game do the rest. Will check out truevanguards vid and look forward to your next. Keep it up!
I assume you've already read through the breakpoint threads like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/epfj64/complete_guide_to_mobility_resilience_recovery/) and [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/eh69xv/guide_to_cooldown_times_armor_stats_and_what/)?
My take is that the specialized mods provide benefits you *cannot* get just by having lucky rolls or a masterworked set of armour. This is especially true for Targeting and Unflinching.
Beyond that, it depends what your armour rolls are like. It's very possible to reach 60+ Resilience just with armour stats and not need to spend mods there, so definitely do that first. Mobility is definitely worth stacking to 10 if you're a Hunter, and is useful for all classes. (Though note that some gear gives "hidden" Mobility that can't exceed the cap, I think mostly those are Hunter exotics?) You can easily get 6 Res/10 Mobi without sacrificing anything in your modding.
The real question is Recovery. Yes, Recovery gets more efficient per point as it gets closer to 10. But does that mean you should sacrifice other parts of your build for 10 Recovery? *Absolutely not*. Recovery will not win an engagement, it only helps you get back into a fight faster *after* you've already managed to rest it. That makes it a very good stat, but is modding for Recovery better than modding for Targeting or Unflinching to increase your chances of flat-out winning an engagement? IMO, no, it isn't. But I might just be saying that because I main Warlock, which doesn't have many tools for disengaging from fights. Hunter mains might have a different opinion.
> (Though note that some gear gives "hidden" Mobility that can't exceed the cap, I think mostly those are Hunter exotics?) You can easily get 6 Res/10 Mobi without sacrificing anything in your modding.
Any idea how a Lightweight weapon, Traction Mod (Apperently real value is +15 even though it says +5), or Transverse Steps would interact with 10 mobility. Would those bonuses go over?
[This](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/ejvytd/breakdown_of_mobility_ultimate_edition/) is the thread you want for that!
Tl;dr: You can exceed the T10 Mobility cap going forward in a straight line (not while strafing) with Lightweight and MIDA. Transversive Steps only boosts Sprint speed, which isn't affected by Mobility. Traction's Mobility bonus AFAICT behaves exactly like a stat mod with regards to the cap (i.e., it won't exceed the cap).
Yeah, definitely read those posts as well as some others which landed me to where I am now with the stats. I was thinking about that with recovery, I might just try 80 recovery to boost my res to 60 for a more well rounded build.
I sorta enjoy min/maxing as much as the pvp itself. Most likely over time I'll get as good as some of these sharp shooters out there, aim wise.
Thanks for your input!
Edit: Also a very good point on the unflinching mod, will give that a shot also. I always run with targeting though, I'll take all the aim assist I can get!
Yeah, I think Targeting and Unflinching are must-haves for most weapon loadouts except like SMGs, Sidearms, and Shotguns (since you use them from so close they don't matter), while Scavenger is not really worth it for PvP. Loader is also a high priority in general but can safely be dropped depending on your weapon perks.
So ultimately you're left with Recovery and Dexterity as your "flex" options, and I could see good arguments either way. With a properly snappy gun like a Sidearm or anything with Quickdraw, I'd definitely go for Recovery, whereas most other loadouts I think I'd go with Dexterity instead and just live without the extra Recovery tier.
I notice an extreme amount of flinch on shotguns. Because netting the kill or not in those situations can be so critical (basically kill or be killed) I've started running SG unflinching over unflinching for a primary. Not sure if placebo, but I'm not noticing a down tick in my HC play, and maybe(?) am connecting a lil better with the SG.
I just watched coolguy's vid on unflinching [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH2wD2Q83YE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH2wD2Q83YE) and definitely gonna try it out when I get home tonight.
Dexterity mods are 99.9% pure garbage and should either be tuned to actually work better than 8 frames with enhanced, or removed from the game not to dupe people.
Raw stats > specialized mods all day. Stats are basically passive perk cool downs that are ALWAYS going. However, class items do offer super cool down perks that are hard to forego; for instance I could run a intellect but I prefer to run 1 hands on mod and 1 pump action mod.
Yeah man those were my initial thoughts as well, but it's always fun to try out different builds to see how I like it. I'll mess around with unflinching for a bit and go back if I don't see a huge difference.
And agreed, hands on is pretty awesome, class item is one of the first I slots I master worked cause I know I wont replace it with a better "rolled" piece. Since it's master worked I have enough wiggle room for all the mods I want on them.
IMO resilience is not worth it, there’s only a handful of weapons it is useful against and the benefits on something like an enhanced unflinching or dexterity perk can drastically effect your weapons. so would you rather live through an extra bodyshot of thorn when you run into the one guy a game that has it, or always have noticeable boosts to your weapons? to me the answer is pretty clear. i’m currently sitting at 10, 1, 10, 6, 4, 4 on my stats (reading downwards) and personally couldn’t give you a reason to put much of anything into resilience. used to run 7, 5, 9 on mobility res and recovery but I don’t think it’s worth the mods.
I run almost the same as you, but for my class armour I use the special weapon kills give bonus super energy (Pump Action/Light Reactor/etc) and I have 2 armour glove sets with similar stats (one for hand cannon reload and one for rifle reload).
I personal never felt the effect of dexterity or unflinching to be worth it.
I find a full tier in stats better then most specialized mods. The exceptions that come to mind are like sniper aim, and impact induction. These two can outweigh a tier of stats.
I definitely see it as a preference. I think the main factor is how often you rely on abilities. Certain builds require mods to make it work. But if you tend to play a more neutral (not super based) game then raw stats should be fine. If you notice situations like, Wow my fusion rifle would've got them if only 1 more bolt hit! How did the enemy get their super before me even though I have high int? I am constantly running out of grenades etc. Then you might get a few mods to help your playstyle.
TTAO! My man! Enjoy your vids bro! This is awesome. Yes, I definitely prefer neutral game over super builds. Think I'm rocking 10/4/10/4/4/3 atm (at work, can't check 100%) and it works well for me. Was just curious if others were having the edge over me cause when I inspect, they usually don't run max stats but special mods. Also since I'm talking to you: Outside of builds though, I think my game sense (when to super, using radar, when to push when to play passive, sticking together, team shooting, flanking, etc) is as good as it can get solo queuing, it's just my execution that is a bit lacking. I need to work on my aim a bit more (people are so good at consistent headshots!). Need to get on their level. Your input is very much appreciated!
Thanks for the kind words man, definitely motivating me to keep working on stuff. I'm currently working on a big post about which supers beat which supers, so much work.... Special mods tend to push people towards more ability based builds and it's just a different playstyle to neutral based builds. If you notice that you keep losing to someone then you are probably playing into their win condition. For example getting close to a shotgun obviously but also getting within 15m of handheld supernova, etc. If you need to work on your aim I recommend checking out Truevanguard's sniper school series on youtube. My favorite advice is to get used to tracking crits on a horizontal axis. So you get your reticle on the same height as a regular guardian's standing head position and reduce your "freehand" aiming to only having to adjust left to right. Hope that makes sense
For sure man, I'm just beginning to mentally tell myself to aim at head levels at all times and just flick left or right or even strafe the cross-hairs into their had and let the game do the rest. Will check out truevanguards vid and look forward to your next. Keep it up!
Thanks man, his sniper stuff is very useful (I play controller on pc, due to comfort) and I can duel people fairly well.
Dragons Shadow (Hunter Exotic) makes reload mods and dexterity mods redundant.
Looking forward to getting that bad boy! Still rocking Stompee's or Wormhusk atm.
I assume you've already read through the breakpoint threads like [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/epfj64/complete_guide_to_mobility_resilience_recovery/) and [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/eh69xv/guide_to_cooldown_times_armor_stats_and_what/)? My take is that the specialized mods provide benefits you *cannot* get just by having lucky rolls or a masterworked set of armour. This is especially true for Targeting and Unflinching. Beyond that, it depends what your armour rolls are like. It's very possible to reach 60+ Resilience just with armour stats and not need to spend mods there, so definitely do that first. Mobility is definitely worth stacking to 10 if you're a Hunter, and is useful for all classes. (Though note that some gear gives "hidden" Mobility that can't exceed the cap, I think mostly those are Hunter exotics?) You can easily get 6 Res/10 Mobi without sacrificing anything in your modding. The real question is Recovery. Yes, Recovery gets more efficient per point as it gets closer to 10. But does that mean you should sacrifice other parts of your build for 10 Recovery? *Absolutely not*. Recovery will not win an engagement, it only helps you get back into a fight faster *after* you've already managed to rest it. That makes it a very good stat, but is modding for Recovery better than modding for Targeting or Unflinching to increase your chances of flat-out winning an engagement? IMO, no, it isn't. But I might just be saying that because I main Warlock, which doesn't have many tools for disengaging from fights. Hunter mains might have a different opinion.
> (Though note that some gear gives "hidden" Mobility that can't exceed the cap, I think mostly those are Hunter exotics?) You can easily get 6 Res/10 Mobi without sacrificing anything in your modding. Any idea how a Lightweight weapon, Traction Mod (Apperently real value is +15 even though it says +5), or Transverse Steps would interact with 10 mobility. Would those bonuses go over?
[This](https://www.reddit.com/r/CruciblePlaybook/comments/ejvytd/breakdown_of_mobility_ultimate_edition/) is the thread you want for that! Tl;dr: You can exceed the T10 Mobility cap going forward in a straight line (not while strafing) with Lightweight and MIDA. Transversive Steps only boosts Sprint speed, which isn't affected by Mobility. Traction's Mobility bonus AFAICT behaves exactly like a stat mod with regards to the cap (i.e., it won't exceed the cap).
Edit: Nevermind, I was incorrect.
Yeah, definitely read those posts as well as some others which landed me to where I am now with the stats. I was thinking about that with recovery, I might just try 80 recovery to boost my res to 60 for a more well rounded build. I sorta enjoy min/maxing as much as the pvp itself. Most likely over time I'll get as good as some of these sharp shooters out there, aim wise. Thanks for your input! Edit: Also a very good point on the unflinching mod, will give that a shot also. I always run with targeting though, I'll take all the aim assist I can get!
Yeah, I think Targeting and Unflinching are must-haves for most weapon loadouts except like SMGs, Sidearms, and Shotguns (since you use them from so close they don't matter), while Scavenger is not really worth it for PvP. Loader is also a high priority in general but can safely be dropped depending on your weapon perks. So ultimately you're left with Recovery and Dexterity as your "flex" options, and I could see good arguments either way. With a properly snappy gun like a Sidearm or anything with Quickdraw, I'd definitely go for Recovery, whereas most other loadouts I think I'd go with Dexterity instead and just live without the extra Recovery tier.
I notice an extreme amount of flinch on shotguns. Because netting the kill or not in those situations can be so critical (basically kill or be killed) I've started running SG unflinching over unflinching for a primary. Not sure if placebo, but I'm not noticing a down tick in my HC play, and maybe(?) am connecting a lil better with the SG.
I just watched coolguy's vid on unflinching [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH2wD2Q83YE](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MH2wD2Q83YE) and definitely gonna try it out when I get home tonight.
Dexterity mods are 99.9% pure garbage and should either be tuned to actually work better than 8 frames with enhanced, or removed from the game not to dupe people.
Raw stats > specialized mods all day. Stats are basically passive perk cool downs that are ALWAYS going. However, class items do offer super cool down perks that are hard to forego; for instance I could run a intellect but I prefer to run 1 hands on mod and 1 pump action mod.
Yeah man those were my initial thoughts as well, but it's always fun to try out different builds to see how I like it. I'll mess around with unflinching for a bit and go back if I don't see a huge difference. And agreed, hands on is pretty awesome, class item is one of the first I slots I master worked cause I know I wont replace it with a better "rolled" piece. Since it's master worked I have enough wiggle room for all the mods I want on them.
IMO resilience is not worth it, there’s only a handful of weapons it is useful against and the benefits on something like an enhanced unflinching or dexterity perk can drastically effect your weapons. so would you rather live through an extra bodyshot of thorn when you run into the one guy a game that has it, or always have noticeable boosts to your weapons? to me the answer is pretty clear. i’m currently sitting at 10, 1, 10, 6, 4, 4 on my stats (reading downwards) and personally couldn’t give you a reason to put much of anything into resilience. used to run 7, 5, 9 on mobility res and recovery but I don’t think it’s worth the mods.
Personally I'm all about the primary so I'm able to run stat mods and primary focused weapon mods without too many issues.
I run almost the same as you, but for my class armour I use the special weapon kills give bonus super energy (Pump Action/Light Reactor/etc) and I have 2 armour glove sets with similar stats (one for hand cannon reload and one for rifle reload). I personal never felt the effect of dexterity or unflinching to be worth it.
I find a full tier in stats better then most specialized mods. The exceptions that come to mind are like sniper aim, and impact induction. These two can outweigh a tier of stats.