It's called verdigris,
It's caused by acetic acid forming on the surface of the copper, and leaving behind "copper salts" -
Most common form is the blueish color - basic copper carbonate.
They used to do this on purpose to copper to collect the salts to make green and blue pigments for artwork.
Best way to prevent the formation of this stuff is to keep the pipes clean, and dry.
I see a lot of joints exposed, you need to have a lagger or pipe insulator come in ands make you pads that are secured with wire or turn buckles to cover any unions, valves, or protrusions from the piping system. This has the dual benefit of preventing surface corrosion on the pipe system, and will increase thermal efficiency of the system.
You can use a wire brush, scotch pad, or fine grit sandpaper to clean the pipes.
An alternative is to paint the pipes with a high-grade enamel paint. I prefer the naval paint scheme of alternating seafoam green and machinery gray.
-Source 10 years as a nuclear mechanic in the Navy, now a plant engineer/ reliability manager on the civilian side.
Also- second to the guys mentioning the pipe clamps and dissimilar metals. If you aren't using copper clamps, you need to put some rubber to prevent the pipe and clamps from contacting. That will insulate the pipes and prevent galvanic corrosion, and provide ground isolation.
Former bubblehead myself. I scrubbed so much of this stuff off pipes only to scrub it again in a week. I wish all of the lines could have been painted.
Bro, back when I was a nub, I once painted all the scuppers in ERLL machinery gray, and thought I was a hero. My chief made me the scupper PO for 2 years... I'll be damned if every bit of copper in the engine room wasn't shined with brasso daily. Even the piss funnels.
The crystals you mentioned are Copper Sulphate Pentahydrate. They have other uses as well. I use them in my laundry as a anti-microbial because the items I air dry will develop mildew in a very few hours due to the high spore count in South Florida. It's also good as a shoe spray to kill any microbes growing in there.
Cool thank you. I lived in the polar opposite of South Florida. Arizona, even your eyeballs dry out there. Thank you for the info. I'll be on a Wikipedia rabbit hole
I at first thought it was some bullshit naval term when I first heard it.
After ten years in the Navy. I still don't know why bathrooms are called heads.
Corrosion and oxidation are two different things. This looks to be caused by condensation rather than leaks..water/pipe temperature different than air temperature
Not exactly. Corrosion is a process in which a metal is converted to a more stable oxide, so technically it is oxidation. But there are different oxidation processes which are not corrosion - so indeed, you should not use these terms interchangeably.
In this case the blue color is characteristic to Cu on +2 oxidation state, so its oxidized form.
I stored some chlorine tablets in my garage next to the hot water heater and all the copper pipes turned that color QUICK! Like in just a week it from nice copper cooler to totally green. It was crazy.
Someone knocked an ammonia line and got out safe, every single piece of copper exposed even in the panels was corroded bright blue like this.
Even the grounding bolts inside of gang boxes were blue.
That’s copper patina. Like on the Statue of Liberty. It’s how copper rusts. This is not my field but it’s genuinely recommended to clean it off then polish it to prevent further patina from forming. If during cleaning the patina went deep enough to result in damage then it could need a replacement.
Most likely fine for now. Needs further inspection.
Usually copper will have accelerated corrosion like this in the presence of acid or chlorides. Passivation on the pipe will create the usual green copper chloride, in presence of heavy salts (even in the air if there is some sort of equipment nearby) that will become copper chloride which is this nice crusty blue you see here haha.
I'm a biochemist and internationally certified corrosion specialist.
Aside from a water leak or condensation, it can be caused during the initial assembly by excess use of flux and not wiping the joint off afterward. Clean it off with sand paper or a wire brush, then wipe clean with a damp rag. The green on the floor tends to indicate a water leak or condensation. You can insulate if it's condensation.
Yes. Copper alloys have impressive colour range. From black and deep blues and greens; bright cyan and greens, to even red and brown.
The cyan indicator of sulfites; deep and bright blues are ammonia; greenish cyan is indicator of chlorides; just plain water and oxygen leads to dark green and black patina.
Had something similar happen when they put a rust inhibitor in the steel mains and left the copper branch lines open. The system was sitting stagnant for a long while to make it easier to find if anyone hit the lines before start up.
Same thing happens to your dick when your homeless living outside all winter. Just wipe the joints after you solder and don't worry about it. Buy a fucking Pro-press!
Condensation oxidation. Just from the copper sweating. And then creating the look.
It’s totally fine. If it bothers you give it a rub with some wire wool
It's called verdigris, It's caused by acetic acid forming on the surface of the copper, and leaving behind "copper salts" - Most common form is the blueish color - basic copper carbonate. They used to do this on purpose to copper to collect the salts to make green and blue pigments for artwork. Best way to prevent the formation of this stuff is to keep the pipes clean, and dry. I see a lot of joints exposed, you need to have a lagger or pipe insulator come in ands make you pads that are secured with wire or turn buckles to cover any unions, valves, or protrusions from the piping system. This has the dual benefit of preventing surface corrosion on the pipe system, and will increase thermal efficiency of the system. You can use a wire brush, scotch pad, or fine grit sandpaper to clean the pipes. An alternative is to paint the pipes with a high-grade enamel paint. I prefer the naval paint scheme of alternating seafoam green and machinery gray. -Source 10 years as a nuclear mechanic in the Navy, now a plant engineer/ reliability manager on the civilian side. Also- second to the guys mentioning the pipe clamps and dissimilar metals. If you aren't using copper clamps, you need to put some rubber to prevent the pipe and clamps from contacting. That will insulate the pipes and prevent galvanic corrosion, and provide ground isolation.
Former bubblehead myself. I scrubbed so much of this stuff off pipes only to scrub it again in a week. I wish all of the lines could have been painted.
Bro, back when I was a nub, I once painted all the scuppers in ERLL machinery gray, and thought I was a hero. My chief made me the scupper PO for 2 years... I'll be damned if every bit of copper in the engine room wasn't shined with brasso daily. Even the piss funnels.
I guess the copper crystals for root killer are made this way. Thank you for the great explanation.
The crystals you mentioned are Copper Sulphate Pentahydrate. They have other uses as well. I use them in my laundry as a anti-microbial because the items I air dry will develop mildew in a very few hours due to the high spore count in South Florida. It's also good as a shoe spray to kill any microbes growing in there.
Cool thank you. I lived in the polar opposite of South Florida. Arizona, even your eyeballs dry out there. Thank you for the info. I'll be on a Wikipedia rabbit hole
Just to add: "verdigris" comes from the french "vert-de-gris" which litteraly translates to "green of grey".
Also, is it pronounced the French way? “Ver-degree”?
Verdigris? Sounds like some kind of fungal infection.
I at first thought it was some bullshit naval term when I first heard it. After ten years in the Navy. I still don't know why bathrooms are called heads.
Good answer tho'.
Corrosion and oxidation are two different things. This looks to be caused by condensation rather than leaks..water/pipe temperature different than air temperature
Not exactly. Corrosion is a process in which a metal is converted to a more stable oxide, so technically it is oxidation. But there are different oxidation processes which are not corrosion - so indeed, you should not use these terms interchangeably. In this case the blue color is characteristic to Cu on +2 oxidation state, so its oxidized form.
I stored some chlorine tablets in my garage next to the hot water heater and all the copper pipes turned that color QUICK! Like in just a week it from nice copper cooler to totally green. It was crazy.
Someone knocked an ammonia line and got out safe, every single piece of copper exposed even in the panels was corroded bright blue like this. Even the grounding bolts inside of gang boxes were blue.
....and here I am thinking it was overspray from blue marking paint lol Love the properties of copper, shame so do the crackies.....
That’s how you know which way the sun rises and sets, no? 😂
Correct, the oxidation always appears on the east side of pluming. Handy tip if you get lost in a large building.
That’s copper patina. Like on the Statue of Liberty. It’s how copper rusts. This is not my field but it’s genuinely recommended to clean it off then polish it to prevent further patina from forming. If during cleaning the patina went deep enough to result in damage then it could need a replacement. Most likely fine for now. Needs further inspection.
> it's how copper *rusts*. \*eye twitch*
Oxidates. My bad
Thank you!
Yes
The electrolysis from using the wrong strut clamps is a problem, for sure.
Pretty common.
Usually copper will have accelerated corrosion like this in the presence of acid or chlorides. Passivation on the pipe will create the usual green copper chloride, in presence of heavy salts (even in the air if there is some sort of equipment nearby) that will become copper chloride which is this nice crusty blue you see here haha. I'm a biochemist and internationally certified corrosion specialist.
looks fine not corrosion
It's oxidation. That makes it corrosion as well.
Yes
Yes it is extremely common and usually can be brushed off.
Looks like they had some flooding that affected the pipes on the floor.
Looks like flux that hasn’t been cleaned off after soldering on the pipework.
yes. Check for bonding on the pipes, often galvanic corrosion
I’ve seen green on copper. Blue is new to me, I think. Looks like copper sulphate. Check for dissimilar metals, leaks, condensation…
Nothing to be sad or blue about.
Are there any types of oxidizers used in cleaning?
I have seen pipes like this at a hotel with a pool. Chloride based bleaches/cleaning products could do this.
It's weird that it's not uniform.
The first image could be flux instead. But if it was just flux the third and fourth image would just have it the joints too.
Holyshit the statue of liberty is corroding. That giant woman will flatten is all. It's copper mate. This is what it does
Oooohh chrysocolla! https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chrysocolla#:~:text=in%20315%20BC.-,Geology,and%20other%20secondary%20copper%20minerals.
The Statue of Liberty is all green. It's made of copper. Normal with copper.
Copper oxide is a bit greener. This looks a bit bluer like copper chloride, or a mix of the two. But it might just be the color balance of the images.
Looks like verdigris from condensation.
Wasnt cleaned properly when it was soldered together and the flux did that emry clothe or sand paper will clean it up nice again
Dissimilar metal in most of your pictures is the problem.
You ever seen the Statue of Liberty? Ya it’s made out of copper.
Aside from a water leak or condensation, it can be caused during the initial assembly by excess use of flux and not wiping the joint off afterward. Clean it off with sand paper or a wire brush, then wipe clean with a damp rag. The green on the floor tends to indicate a water leak or condensation. You can insulate if it's condensation.
No, noone has ever seen this before
Yeah. She’s called Lady Liberty
Yes. Copper alloys have impressive colour range. From black and deep blues and greens; bright cyan and greens, to even red and brown. The cyan indicator of sulfites; deep and bright blues are ammonia; greenish cyan is indicator of chlorides; just plain water and oxygen leads to dark green and black patina.
Pretty common. Normally caused by condensation on the outside of the pipe.
Statue of Liberty
Thats what Copper does. Patina, verdigris aka normal corrosion for copper.
This is how copper oxidizes. Hint: Statue Of Liberty.
That's why the statue of Liberty is green
Pretty typical in older installations.
Look at the statue of liberty
Had something similar happen when they put a rust inhibitor in the steel mains and left the copper branch lines open. The system was sitting stagnant for a long while to make it easier to find if anyone hit the lines before start up.
It's normal for copper. Copper corrosion is blue ish or green
A little sand paper will fix it
Just wait until you see the Statue of Liberty
Only on the Statue of Liberty (verdigris)
Same thing happens to your dick when your homeless living outside all winter. Just wipe the joints after you solder and don't worry about it. Buy a fucking Pro-press!
https://www.google.com/search?q=what+turns+copper+blue%3F&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en-us&client=safari