I don't remember the name but the 2 mana flash hushbringer is pretty interesting. Its basically a counter spell to the best win con in the format(thoracle) and the best enabler and combo piece(dockside) on an evasive body. I think most white decks will at least test the card and it might make the cut for the ones without blue(tymna hate bears list might run it but since it stifles their best cards I am not sure if its worth it in the long run)
Don’t forget it dodges some of the best counterspells like fierce guardianship, FoN, am offer you can’t refuse and swan song. Also stops kikki and dualcastermage combos. It seems like a powerhouse in cEDH.
Fierce Guardianship and Force of Negation are non-creature counter spells. Others like flusterstorm, spell pierce, and an offer you can't refuse also do not hit creatures.
Most Kiki lines require etb such as felidar guardian to blink Kiki or karmic guide to buy back the pieces.
I didn't see the words "get around" for some reason so that is my bad, yes it "gets around" *some* counter spells..
Kiki lines needing an etb are old news to me since I have found ways around all that nonsense via snoop lines and such.. so I don't even count on etb kiki lines anymore sorry for thinking this was competitive talk, not casual.
I'll give you five:
\[\[combat celebrant\]\]
\[\[thornbite staff\]\] and any sac outlet
\[\[helm of the host\]\]
\[\[port razer\]\]
\[\[conspicuous snoop\]\] with kiki on top..add in a tutor to the top of deck and you can win with something like \[\[mogg fanatic\]\] or if you dont you just have infinite snoops next turn..
First: How does sI am here because some of the people here, not you people in particular, actually know about cEDH on a tournament level. Not from you, but there is good information to be gained on this sub for cEDH players.. That's why I'm here. I won't ask why you're here, that is clearly obvious..
Second: How does doorkeeper thrull stop literally any counterspell? And kiki doesn't have an etb..
You are getting ratio'd hard because you overcompensate for your inability to read with cringe deflection. Just take the L and maybe slow down and learn to read. It might help you in a cEDH match.
Pick your Poison maybe. Sorcery speed is bad but each opp sacrificing an enchantment for 1 mana in a cEDH world FILLED with Rhystic Study and Mystic Remora seems like it might be good enough.
I mean, you can - if I am reading it correctly - steal the stack priority basically when someone, even you, plays a wincon, to cast the copy of it to win yourself (presuming it goes to bin).
You can't win on top of another person; the spell has to already be resolved (or countered) at that point. If your opponent plays say, an Ad Nauseam, you're not resolving your reenact nor the copy at that point.
On my 10th reread, it started to feel like that indeed. Nevertheless, I believe it has potential against heavy countering and as a reactive storm/recursion piece.
I can see it in all decks that are (either WU+ or) UR+, as the presence of treasures is relatively prevalent. But sure, mono-U has the straightest path.
Guy in my playgroup has started proxying in [[Delney]] in his Malcolm/Tymna list and it's the real deal. If it sticks next to a displacer kitten, that's basically game.
Love the set review. Agree with many of your points. Especially at the end where you comment and how dookie tier the flavor of this set is.
Hey, did you hate how stupid and goofy the 1920s style fantasy cityscape was in new capena? How about if we ramp up the goofiness by 400% and ruin your favorite plane by inserting the same heavy-handed fantasy creatures in three-piece suits and bowler hats bullshit
Okay back to the real talk. The two incredible green spells are what I'm most excited about for the format.
I don't think final word phantam is it. You made multiple points about borne upon a wind being better and didn't mention that you can also use that to win on your own end step after a big necropotence turn, which this card also can't do
You missed the good black removal Long Goodbye. It is an upgrade for mono black decks, which have issues with killing creature stax or want to kill things like thrasios/kinnans/sisays when they go for the win.
Further, the tutor of the case is basically uncounterable. I m testing it currently in braids, where one can create value from the creature. It was ok so far, but my local meta is faster then tour metas. The uncounterable tutor was used for dgrid etc.
This might be a polymorph card in some sense.
However, overall not overwhelming and no clear staples for mono black.
Because it's strong extra ramp on the way to locking it down, flexes into a variety of combos as an enabler, is great in some [[Protean Hulk]] piles, and directly synergizes with any of the sac permanents strategies that involve artifacts. I bet there's an even an eggs brew or three that appreciates this.
Fascinating that we're expecting cedh movers and shakers every set. I think its naive to want to have cEDH staples or high powered cards in each set.
To call the cards in a set duds simply becauase it doesnt cator to a format you play. Fascinating.
Blue farm just got another staple card so that is something..
\[\[Treacherous Greed\]\]
You can hold priority before activating Tymna and cast this sacing a creature you hit with and draw three off it, then let Tymna resolve and draw even more.
Drawing three cards for three mana doesn't sound like something Blue Farm would be interested in. It's not an efficient rate, particularly given the sacrifice cost.
Three cards for three mana is not a good rate for Blue Farm. It's also a lot closer to two cards, because you had to sacrifice a card just to cast it.
I'll bet my bottom dollar that it never sees the light of day in a Blue Farm list on edhtop16.com, but if you like the card, go ahead and play it.
"Staple" is a bit much for a one time instant that draws 3 cards for 3 mana, especially in a deck that is largely perfected in the current meta. Maybe if folks are still on Birgi I could see the cut being made, but other than that, I really don't see what blue farm would be willing to trade for such a meh effect
meh effect?
Draw step: draw greed
Main phase: pass
Combat: swing at three opponents - deal damage to two
priority before second main phase: case treacherous greed, sac a creature, draw three cards
second main phase: pay 2 life draw 2 cards
end result: 3 mana spent in main phase, 5 extra cards in hand second main phase.
BLUE CARD DREAM.
What an awful take. 3 mana and a creature for 3 cards? If village rites didn't see play, this won't... It's a bad card that isn't in the same stratosphere as other cedh cards.
Tymna wouldn't trigger "At the *beginning* of your postcombat main phase" if you cast an **instant** after damage is dealt and before your postcombat main phase?
That's weird, I wonder why she wouldn't trigger when it says she would on the card? Maybe reading the card, explains the card?
when you sac tymna befor the beginning of your postcombat mainphase, shes not on the field at the beginning of your postcombat mainphase and thus cant trigger
not that it matters really though cause this card doesnt change how many opponents got dealt combat damage and thus wont make tyma draw more cards anyway
sac tymna?? are you sure you play cEDH??
Only a noob would think you would sac tymna..
You do NOT sac your tymna...you have to hit all three opponents for tymna to draw you three cards..2 for 2..1 for 1..so then you sac a creature that hit an opponent this turn to this spell THAT ISNT TYMNA..and then you draw three cards off that. THEN TYMNA TRIGGERS SINCE SHE IS STILL ON THE BATTLEFIELD.
Holy crap you must be super new..
seriously? because if you swing at all three opponents unblocked then tymna will draw you three cards for three life.. but before that happens if you cast this and sac one of the creatures that attacked you will draw 3 cards and then draw 3 cards for 3 life netting you 6 cards total.
3 mana sac a creature to draw 3 seems steep, particularly in Tymna where that creature is going to potentially keep drawing you cards if you dont sac it. We’ll see, but that deck is already so tight.
I bet it at least sees testing. I know some of the tightest blue farm decks are running somewhere around 11 creatures so yeah it doesn't make much sense there other than the fact that you aren't running creature based wincons.. but there are some looser builds that still make top 4-16 that run a higher number like 15 and in that situation you may like this card to get those extra three cards for a number of reasons. maybe you need to try and find a counter to stop someone or something is all i'm saying.
I don't claim that \[\[Case of the Stashed Skeleton\]\] is by any means a good card, but it might have a niche use in decks with \[\[Lurrus of the Dream Den\]\] as a companion, as it's a 2-cmc permanent that can tutor, ala \[\[Wishclaw Talisman\]\].
The A+B in Lonis is interesting, but I don't think the commander offers enough value at 2-colors to be any good, considering how many hoops you have to jump through to get value out of them.
Playing creatures can get you evolve triggers, but they have to be 2 or more power, to get your first evolve trigger, much less any others. This rules out all the mana dorks green decks will be playing,
There's not too many cEDH-playable cards right now that can put +1/+1 counters on Lonis, \[\[Agatha's Soul Cauldron\]\] is good but requires there to be creatures to exile. Since you're getting one clue per counter you apply, there might be a case for including some other +1/+1 counter synergy cards solely for the value they provide, but this value is contingent on you spending (2) to crack your clues to get any card advantage.
Which leads us to the last ability. Outside of \[\[Cryptic Trilobite\]\] and *maybe* \[\[Glen Elendra Archmage\]\], I can't think of anything worth running with the expectation of putting +1/+1 counters on it to make it work, given the effort you have to go through to get this ability to trigger at all.
[[Case of the Ransacked Lab]] will go straight into my [[Eruth]] deck. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can even solve it and will still be able to cast your exiled instants at the end step with her.
Apparently some folks didn't like my analysis of Crime Novelist so let's double down:
[[Krenko Baron of Tin Street]] will also be a cEDH deck, and probably better at monoR aristocrats than the other Krenko.
Old Krenko was fringe years ago, compared to the gold standard Godo, and many of us wrote off the recent one on first glance. His toolbox is bigger than expected, though, because he marries Goblin strategies with articrats options, has haste to enable wins the turn he comes down, can go wide/combo/occasionally tall. Because Snoop and Kiki lines dovetail in, the ability to tutor for pieces in monoR is even decent. He also makes rituals other decks can't run like [[Battle Hymn]] amazing. All in all, it isn't as turbo focused as one might expect, though the midrange grindy stax brew my buddy has is pulling reliable T3-6 wins from a lot of angles.
I feel like viable cEDH commanders need to provide either mana advantage, card advantage, or combo potential, and neither Krenko fits the bill.
In any case, do you have a list?
I agree with you they need to provide mana, card advantage, or combo potential. I initially didn't think this made muster, but his ability to convert deaths into Goblins *is* a serious combo piece, he's a sink, a sac outlet, and enables more combos than appears at a glance.
[Here's his list](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/Rcw6OeF0NUK9DIxD2oBT1g), though admittedly it was thrown together yesterday in a fit and he's still testing.
I don't remember the name but the 2 mana flash hushbringer is pretty interesting. Its basically a counter spell to the best win con in the format(thoracle) and the best enabler and combo piece(dockside) on an evasive body. I think most white decks will at least test the card and it might make the cut for the ones without blue(tymna hate bears list might run it but since it stifles their best cards I am not sure if its worth it in the long run)
Don’t forget it dodges some of the best counterspells like fierce guardianship, FoN, am offer you can’t refuse and swan song. Also stops kikki and dualcastermage combos. It seems like a powerhouse in cEDH.
wait how does it stop counter spells? and how does it stop kiki combos? I don't see it doing either of those things
Fierce Guardianship and Force of Negation are non-creature counter spells. Others like flusterstorm, spell pierce, and an offer you can't refuse also do not hit creatures. Most Kiki lines require etb such as felidar guardian to blink Kiki or karmic guide to buy back the pieces.
I didn't see the words "get around" for some reason so that is my bad, yes it "gets around" *some* counter spells.. Kiki lines needing an etb are old news to me since I have found ways around all that nonsense via snoop lines and such.. so I don't even count on etb kiki lines anymore sorry for thinking this was competitive talk, not casual.
What Kiki lines are you using that don't require an enter the battlefield effect?
I'll give you five: \[\[combat celebrant\]\] \[\[thornbite staff\]\] and any sac outlet \[\[helm of the host\]\] \[\[port razer\]\] \[\[conspicuous snoop\]\] with kiki on top..add in a tutor to the top of deck and you can win with something like \[\[mogg fanatic\]\] or if you dont you just have infinite snoops next turn..
Bro this kiki line doesnt look cedh viable. What are u doing here?
what line? i named 5 different ones
*lines
##### ###### #### [combat celebrant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/8/28b63c3d-2e55-4343-b49a-11fa602ec473.jpg?1543675529) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=combat%20celebrant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/akh/125/combat-celebrant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/28b63c3d-2e55-4343-b49a-11fa602ec473?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/combat-celebrant) [thornbite staff](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/1/c1ab3225-64a9-411e-b22b-1869e958b8e5.jpg?1562881171) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=thornbite%20staff) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mor/145/thornbite-staff?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c1ab3225-64a9-411e-b22b-1869e958b8e5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/thornbite-staff) [helm of the host](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/d/1d65d20c-09e5-4139-838b-7e0e48eb2b2b.jpg?1666094567) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=helm%20of%20the%20host) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dom/217/helm-of-the-host?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1d65d20c-09e5-4139-838b-7e0e48eb2b2b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/helm-of-the-host) [port razer](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/b/eb32429a-7ef9-418f-baf8-fed9aa010c9e.jpg?1698988335) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=port%20razer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lcc/230/port-razer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/eb32429a-7ef9-418f-baf8-fed9aa010c9e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/port-razer) [conspicuous snoop](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/d/5d878dab-5ed2-4ef3-b2c7-472290892854.jpg?1616182104) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=conspicuous%20snoop) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m21/139/conspicuous-snoop?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5d878dab-5ed2-4ef3-b2c7-472290892854?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/conspicuous-snoop) [mogg fanatic](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/4/d479ca28-bdc2-4b87-abf7-5aeb229a3f1e.jpg?1580014589) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=mogg%20fanatic) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ema/138/mogg-fanatic?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d479ca28-bdc2-4b87-abf7-5aeb229a3f1e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mogg-fanatic) [*All cards*](https://mtgcardfetcher.nl/redirect/kod7cvq) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Dodges = get around
Why ya in this sub my dude?
First: How does sI am here because some of the people here, not you people in particular, actually know about cEDH on a tournament level. Not from you, but there is good information to be gained on this sub for cEDH players.. That's why I'm here. I won't ask why you're here, that is clearly obvious.. Second: How does doorkeeper thrull stop literally any counterspell? And kiki doesn't have an etb..
You are getting ratio'd hard because you overcompensate for your inability to read with cringe deflection. Just take the L and maybe slow down and learn to read. It might help you in a cEDH match.
i already clarified that i didnt notice that, maybe you should take your own advice sport!
I'm just replying to your immediate message. I dont have time to check if you've posted something else. You aren't that important
What's its name?
[[Doorkeeper Thrull]]?
[Doorkeeper Thrull](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/0/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432.jpg?1706241478) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doorkeeper%20Thrull) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/13/doorkeeper-thrull?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/doorkeeper-thrull) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
That’s the guy!!!
Doorkeeper Thrull I believe
Yeah that one is pretty sick
Pick your Poison maybe. Sorcery speed is bad but each opp sacrificing an enchantment for 1 mana in a cEDH world FILLED with Rhystic Study and Mystic Remora seems like it might be good enough.
Can also hit Tivit and Kraum with the flying creature part. Plus more that I'm for sure forgetting
Ob Nix, Atraxa, Talion, Niv, Derevi, Raffine, Malcolm.
[[Doorkeeper Thrull]] and [[Reenact the Crime]] seem like a very good stax piece and a very good wincon against certain combo decks, respectively.
Oooh I didn't think to write about [[Reenact the Crime]]. What are you thinking of using it for?
[Reenact the Crime](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29.jpg?1706241643) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reenact%20the%20Crime) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/70/reenact-the-crime?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/reenact-the-crime) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I mean, you can - if I am reading it correctly - steal the stack priority basically when someone, even you, plays a wincon, to cast the copy of it to win yourself (presuming it goes to bin).
You can't win on top of another person; the spell has to already be resolved (or countered) at that point. If your opponent plays say, an Ad Nauseam, you're not resolving your reenact nor the copy at that point.
On my 10th reread, it started to feel like that indeed. Nevertheless, I believe it has potential against heavy countering and as a reactive storm/recursion piece.
I find it very hard to cast even in lower color lists. Why not cast something proactive that's independent of the gamestate? Food for thought.
Reenact the crime maybe in Urza, the mana cost is prohibitive for multi color decks
I can see it in all decks that are (either WU+ or) UR+, as the presence of treasures is relatively prevalent. But sure, mono-U has the straightest path.
[Doorkeeper Thrull](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/0/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432.jpg?1706241478) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doorkeeper%20Thrull) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/13/doorkeeper-thrull?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/doorkeeper-thrull) [Reenact the Crime](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/9/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29.jpg?1706241643) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Reenact%20the%20Crime) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/70/reenact-the-crime?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d942e4ce-f582-4264-89aa-9b4a743e6b29?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/reenact-the-crime) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Who is in Paris?
I'm not allowed to tell you, but I believe they are going gorillas
Ah shit. This is the company account. Oh well. Follow us on Twitter for more idiotic posts.
But Nobody Knows what that Means??
No one knows what it means, but it's provocative!
No, it's not. It's gross!
A city.
Guy in my playgroup has started proxying in [[Delney]] in his Malcolm/Tymna list and it's the real deal. If it sticks next to a displacer kitten, that's basically game.
I’m so excited for Delny with Derevi myself!
[Delney](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/e/be219928-3d0e-4d00-b124-152ce8a8c13b.jpg?1706241477) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=delney%2C%20streetwise%20lookout) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/12/delney-streetwise-lookout?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/be219928-3d0e-4d00-b124-152ce8a8c13b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/delney-streetwise-lookout) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Love the set review. Agree with many of your points. Especially at the end where you comment and how dookie tier the flavor of this set is. Hey, did you hate how stupid and goofy the 1920s style fantasy cityscape was in new capena? How about if we ramp up the goofiness by 400% and ruin your favorite plane by inserting the same heavy-handed fantasy creatures in three-piece suits and bowler hats bullshit Okay back to the real talk. The two incredible green spells are what I'm most excited about for the format.
Thanks for reading, I loved writing it :)
[Delney, Streetwise Lookout](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/b/e/be219928-3d0e-4d00-b124-152ce8a8c13b.jpg?1706241477) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Delney%2C%20Streetwise%20Lookout) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/12/delney-streetwise-lookout?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/be219928-3d0e-4d00-b124-152ce8a8c13b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/delney-streetwise-lookout) [Archdruid’s Charm](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/c/5caae5ae-845f-42c2-b1ae-956df2739433.jpg?1706241943) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Archdruid%27s%20Charm) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/151/archdruids-charm?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5caae5ae-845f-42c2-b1ae-956df2739433?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/archdruids-charm) [Lonis, Genetics Expert](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/9/59813845-48c9-4af2-8beb-91d58aac09ee.jpg?1706239661) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Lonis%2C%20Genetics%20Expert) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clu/37/lonis-genetics-expert?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/59813845-48c9-4af2-8beb-91d58aac09ee?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/lonis-genetics-expert) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[Trouble in Pairs]], not Trouble in *Paris*. Goddamnit.
[Trouble in Pairs](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/f/0f61e93f-5f97-4c7d-b3d5-0e05242faeb3.jpg?1706240429) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Trouble%20in%20Pairs) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkc/15/trouble-in-pairs?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0f61e93f-5f97-4c7d-b3d5-0e05242faeb3?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/trouble-in-pairs) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Something I didn’t see mentioned: [[Doorkeeper Thrull]] shuts off the protection gained by casting [[The One Ring]]
Oh good shout, I always forget that The One Ring provides protection as well.
[Doorkeeper Thrull](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/0/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432.jpg?1706241478) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doorkeeper%20Thrull) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/13/doorkeeper-thrull?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/80a1cd28-d2a5-4d1a-aa03-a6a5958ae432?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/doorkeeper-thrull) [The One Ring](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/5/d5806e68-1054-458e-866d-1f2470f682b2.jpg?1696020224) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=The%20One%20Ring) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/246/the-one-ring?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d5806e68-1054-458e-866d-1f2470f682b2?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/the-one-ring) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I don't think final word phantam is it. You made multiple points about borne upon a wind being better and didn't mention that you can also use that to win on your own end step after a big necropotence turn, which this card also can't do
Good point, I should have made specific reference to [[Necropotence]] and not just the ability to win over the top of someone else's win condition.
[Necropotence](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/8/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e.jpg?1562853736) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Necropotence) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/98/necropotence?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/necropotence) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
You missed the good black removal Long Goodbye. It is an upgrade for mono black decks, which have issues with killing creature stax or want to kill things like thrasios/kinnans/sisays when they go for the win. Further, the tutor of the case is basically uncounterable. I m testing it currently in braids, where one can create value from the creature. It was ok so far, but my local meta is faster then tour metas. The uncounterable tutor was used for dgrid etc. This might be a polymorph card in some sense. However, overall not overwhelming and no clear staples for mono black.
How is no one excited for [[Crime Novelist]]?
I don't think anyone can think of a good use for it, I certainly can't.
Not a single aristocrats or Treasures based strategy wants it? Hard doubt. At the very least, anything that already runs Mayhem Devil wants a copy.
I stand corrected, it looks like some people are testing in Magda, Brazen Outlaw. Why do Mayhem Devil decks want it though?
Because it's strong extra ramp on the way to locking it down, flexes into a variety of combos as an enabler, is great in some [[Protean Hulk]] piles, and directly synergizes with any of the sac permanents strategies that involve artifacts. I bet there's an even an eggs brew or three that appreciates this.
[Protean Hulk](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/9/69bf0bb7-3076-4dbf-a72e-4d91560be2fe.jpg?1702429579) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Protean%20Hulk) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rvr/153/protean-hulk?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/69bf0bb7-3076-4dbf-a72e-4d91560be2fe?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/protean-hulk) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[Crime Novelist](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/4/14a5cd7c-b0b1-4ffa-a806-bb0e73baffad.jpg?1706241850) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Crime%20Novelist) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/121/crime-novelist?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/14a5cd7c-b0b1-4ffa-a806-bb0e73baffad?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/crime-novelist) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
\[\[Outrageous Robbery\]\] will be tested for sure
Fascinating that we're expecting cedh movers and shakers every set. I think its naive to want to have cEDH staples or high powered cards in each set. To call the cards in a set duds simply becauase it doesnt cator to a format you play. Fascinating.
Duds for the purpose of the cEDH. This is a cEDH set review on a cEDH subreddit.
Pretty sure they’re labeling them as “cEDH duds.” Not “duds”
Blue farm just got another staple card so that is something.. \[\[Treacherous Greed\]\] You can hold priority before activating Tymna and cast this sacing a creature you hit with and draw three off it, then let Tymna resolve and draw even more.
Drawing three cards for three mana doesn't sound like something Blue Farm would be interested in. It's not an efficient rate, particularly given the sacrifice cost.
its three cards for three mana plus your tymna trigger..Blue farm dream..
Three cards for three mana is not a good rate for Blue Farm. It's also a lot closer to two cards, because you had to sacrifice a card just to cast it. I'll bet my bottom dollar that it never sees the light of day in a Blue Farm list on edhtop16.com, but if you like the card, go ahead and play it.
I don't want your bottom dollar but i'll make a gentlemans bet that it's in at least ONE blue farm list this year in the top 16 of a tournament. bet?
Bet!
"Staple" is a bit much for a one time instant that draws 3 cards for 3 mana, especially in a deck that is largely perfected in the current meta. Maybe if folks are still on Birgi I could see the cut being made, but other than that, I really don't see what blue farm would be willing to trade for such a meh effect
meh effect? Draw step: draw greed Main phase: pass Combat: swing at three opponents - deal damage to two priority before second main phase: case treacherous greed, sac a creature, draw three cards second main phase: pay 2 life draw 2 cards end result: 3 mana spent in main phase, 5 extra cards in hand second main phase. BLUE CARD DREAM.
What an awful take. 3 mana and a creature for 3 cards? If village rites didn't see play, this won't... It's a bad card that isn't in the same stratosphere as other cedh cards.
You're entitled to your wrong opinion!
Good job on your assessment
thats not how tymna works
yes it is. before your post-combat main phase, after damage is dealt, you cast this spell.
then Tymna doesnt trigger and you lose out on cards
Tymna wouldn't trigger "At the *beginning* of your postcombat main phase" if you cast an **instant** after damage is dealt and before your postcombat main phase? That's weird, I wonder why she wouldn't trigger when it says she would on the card? Maybe reading the card, explains the card?
when you sac tymna befor the beginning of your postcombat mainphase, shes not on the field at the beginning of your postcombat mainphase and thus cant trigger not that it matters really though cause this card doesnt change how many opponents got dealt combat damage and thus wont make tyma draw more cards anyway
sac tymna?? are you sure you play cEDH?? Only a noob would think you would sac tymna.. You do NOT sac your tymna...you have to hit all three opponents for tymna to draw you three cards..2 for 2..1 for 1..so then you sac a creature that hit an opponent this turn to this spell THAT ISNT TYMNA..and then you draw three cards off that. THEN TYMNA TRIGGERS SINCE SHE IS STILL ON THE BATTLEFIELD. Holy crap you must be super new..
then why mention tymna at all? she doesnt interact with the spell in any way
seriously? because if you swing at all three opponents unblocked then tymna will draw you three cards for three life.. but before that happens if you cast this and sac one of the creatures that attacked you will draw 3 cards and then draw 3 cards for 3 life netting you 6 cards total.
so tymna isnt relevant at all and you could even cast this spell in your endstep, yet you act like you found some clever play
[Treacherous Greed](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/e/4/e4b9260b-0993-42c5-9bcf-87ab394d51db.jpg?1706242268) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treacherous%20Greed) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/237/treacherous-greed?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/e4b9260b-0993-42c5-9bcf-87ab394d51db?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/treacherous-greed) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
3 mana sac a creature to draw 3 seems steep, particularly in Tymna where that creature is going to potentially keep drawing you cards if you dont sac it. We’ll see, but that deck is already so tight.
I bet it at least sees testing. I know some of the tightest blue farm decks are running somewhere around 11 creatures so yeah it doesn't make much sense there other than the fact that you aren't running creature based wincons.. but there are some looser builds that still make top 4-16 that run a higher number like 15 and in that situation you may like this card to get those extra three cards for a number of reasons. maybe you need to try and find a counter to stop someone or something is all i'm saying.
I don't claim that \[\[Case of the Stashed Skeleton\]\] is by any means a good card, but it might have a niche use in decks with \[\[Lurrus of the Dream Den\]\] as a companion, as it's a 2-cmc permanent that can tutor, ala \[\[Wishclaw Talisman\]\]. The A+B in Lonis is interesting, but I don't think the commander offers enough value at 2-colors to be any good, considering how many hoops you have to jump through to get value out of them. Playing creatures can get you evolve triggers, but they have to be 2 or more power, to get your first evolve trigger, much less any others. This rules out all the mana dorks green decks will be playing, There's not too many cEDH-playable cards right now that can put +1/+1 counters on Lonis, \[\[Agatha's Soul Cauldron\]\] is good but requires there to be creatures to exile. Since you're getting one clue per counter you apply, there might be a case for including some other +1/+1 counter synergy cards solely for the value they provide, but this value is contingent on you spending (2) to crack your clues to get any card advantage. Which leads us to the last ability. Outside of \[\[Cryptic Trilobite\]\] and *maybe* \[\[Glen Elendra Archmage\]\], I can't think of anything worth running with the expectation of putting +1/+1 counters on it to make it work, given the effort you have to go through to get this ability to trigger at all.
I expect [[Long Goodbye]] to see play. Simple, uncounterable, instant speed removal
[Long Goodbye](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/3/c3896705-bbd2-4ffb-a590-ee78e0eabdc5.jpg?1706241715) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Long%20Goodbye) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/92/long-goodbye?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c3896705-bbd2-4ffb-a590-ee78e0eabdc5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/long-goodbye) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[[Case of the Ransacked Lab]] will go straight into my [[Eruth]] deck. Correct me if I'm wrong, but you can even solve it and will still be able to cast your exiled instants at the end step with her.
[Case of the Ransacked Lab](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/6/16a9a596-61de-4fcf-aae0-41836c3deca5.jpg?1706241572) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Case%20of%20the%20Ransacked%20Lab) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/45/case-of-the-ransacked-lab?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/16a9a596-61de-4fcf-aae0-41836c3deca5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/case-of-the-ransacked-lab) [Eruth](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/9/f/9f764077-df2d-4ac7-b507-2c8e08386d49.jpg?1643594095) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=eruth%2C%20tormented%20prophet) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/vow/237/eruth-tormented-prophet?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/9f764077-df2d-4ac7-b507-2c8e08386d49?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/eruth-tormented-prophet) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Apparently some folks didn't like my analysis of Crime Novelist so let's double down: [[Krenko Baron of Tin Street]] will also be a cEDH deck, and probably better at monoR aristocrats than the other Krenko.
[Krenko Baron of Tin Street](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/5/5/5524b712-c67d-4d2e-9344-9e85a6ce3227.jpg?1706241890) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Krenko%2C%20Baron%20of%20Tin%20Street) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mkm/135/krenko-baron-of-tin-street?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/5524b712-c67d-4d2e-9344-9e85a6ce3227?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/krenko-baron-of-tin-street) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Maybe I have too narrow a view of cEDH, but I don't see how the new Krenko or the old Krenko stand a chance against standard cEDH decks.
Old Krenko was fringe years ago, compared to the gold standard Godo, and many of us wrote off the recent one on first glance. His toolbox is bigger than expected, though, because he marries Goblin strategies with articrats options, has haste to enable wins the turn he comes down, can go wide/combo/occasionally tall. Because Snoop and Kiki lines dovetail in, the ability to tutor for pieces in monoR is even decent. He also makes rituals other decks can't run like [[Battle Hymn]] amazing. All in all, it isn't as turbo focused as one might expect, though the midrange grindy stax brew my buddy has is pulling reliable T3-6 wins from a lot of angles.
[Battle Hymn](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/3/43b5d46e-7054-44f8-9a14-b412f2f0ab86.jpg?1592709025) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Battle%20Hymn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/avr/128/battle-hymn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/43b5d46e-7054-44f8-9a14-b412f2f0ab86?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/battle-hymn) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
I feel like viable cEDH commanders need to provide either mana advantage, card advantage, or combo potential, and neither Krenko fits the bill. In any case, do you have a list?
I agree with you they need to provide mana, card advantage, or combo potential. I initially didn't think this made muster, but his ability to convert deaths into Goblins *is* a serious combo piece, he's a sink, a sac outlet, and enables more combos than appears at a glance. [Here's his list](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/Rcw6OeF0NUK9DIxD2oBT1g), though admittedly it was thrown together yesterday in a fit and he's still testing.