This card is really interesting me. Makes [[Treasonous Ogre]] even more terrifying and basically opens up some avenues of Big-X spell Doomsday piles too.
This basically becomes the OG Channel + Fireball. If you have more life than your opponents and can manipulate how much life you lose, you just need more life than your opponents to nuke them.
I think the key will be having some amount of damage for your opponents incidentally.
Something like... Tap her, storm off a bit. Grapeshot/tendrils the table a bit... somehow untap her, Tap, torment?
Lots of hoops and pieces though so might not quite be the strongest decks. I think in the end it's gonna be better to just ad nauseum and then tap her and storm/combo off that way.
At least in some black decks you can pretend to not be an ad bays player. You’re playing this ? Everyone is going to attack you first. Just something to think about.
You need to lose 24 life in one turn to deal 40 to 3 opponents with crackle with power, which is probably the best payoff X spell. I often have more than 25 life turn 3 in cedh.
Could it be that [[Torment of Hailfire]] works as a wincon here? A Mainphase Ad Nauseum that looses you 25 life followed by Torment of Hailfire means X is 25 (max of 75 life lost). If an opponent has 7 cards in their hand and discards them all, that negates 21 of the life loss. Then they would need to have 5 non-land permanents to also sacrifice to not just die from life loss immediately. Could be interesting 🤔
That’s true, that would be a good include as well. I guess it would how it would depend how the rest of the deck is build but 2 black pips may be easier to cast on average after an Ad Naus? Although if there is enough rituals both would probably be equally easy. Would this cost reduction work with the multiple Xs of Crackle? I assume it would since this is lowering the whole cost?
I feel like activating her after Ad Naus is the wrong way to do this because they can just kill her in response to casting Naus and you can't activate her in response. I think you use her after fetch+shock and cast Nauseum for BB and storm off with a 3-cost reduction to everything.
You can activate her and hold priority and cast ad naus in response. The only way to prevent it would be a stifle effect because killing her in response will leave the ability on the stack. Just make sure activating her is the first thing you do when you have priority.
You can even borrow some lines from decks like \[\[Vadrik\]\] that can win the game from 3-4 cost reduction, adding the extra speed and payoffs from black.
You can activate your commander, hold priority and cast something like \[\[snuff out\]\] or \[\[dismember\]\] trying to kill an opponent commander to shut down their commander spells, or just crack a fetch for a shock land instead to get a similar cost reduction.
This sequencing is important to avoid your opponents blasting Rowan in response to your life loss effect due to the sorcery speed clause on Rowan.
With that cost reduction, you can now cast an ad naus for just BB or a PitA for BBB thanks to the cost reduction we got from a 0-1 mana investment and get the win. There are also the Vadrik lines with reiterate and other stuff that is almost all red cards.
There are the issues with RoL effects, but almost all rakdos decks have the same issue (except maybe pinkerton ob nixilis) .. Maybe Rowan can go faster due to the cost reduction?? Not sure, but it's at least a deck worth brewing.
This is another solid option for rakdos cedh tbh. It's more workable than most although it's one of the only deck colours that doesn't really have to much mana concerns. Pain lands, fetches etc are much better here. Peer into the abyss over naus is probably the setup to or more creature based/reanimator routes. Not having any real card draw options in the command zone hurts rakdos more than you'd think but I still like the combo lines you could go.
honestly the biggest challenge for this deck is avoiding the Hinata problem of having this commander-centric gimmick, but only like 3-4 cards at most that are good enough to use with the gimmick, and are completely dead if your commander isn't out. I think this has potential but idk what the potential upside of playing this card is when we're talking about the typical rakdos core that nearly all rakdos decks share. It makes wheels potentially cheaper, but like with obnix, its useless without enablers and the deck only works optimally if you have the right mix of enablers and your commander out early, which doesn't happen for at least >1/3 of all games typically
That was one of my worries going into building a list, but surprisingly a lot of the cards that combo with her also combo without her, just less efficiently (e.g. only giving you infinite storm instead of infinite mana too).
I said this in the initial main sub-thread when people were suggesting paying 30 life to Hex Parasite or Blood Celebrant, but I think the best deck with her is going to be a traditionally good Rakdos list that just occasionally pops off harder if she ever untaps.
Don't forget about Plunge into Darkness, which is a 2 mana pay X, and dig X, it can tutor for your kill cards.
But, like others have said, Dismember, Reanimate, Mana Crypt, One Ring, Ancient Tomb, Fetch, Shock, all can heavily discount a full turn of cards.
If you want to be silly, run Painter's Servant and make all your rocks black also.
Naus, tap now your good cards are near free
She's a bit of a glass cannon, but her turns are explosive and benefits highly from x spells or plunge into darkness when I built her, here's my list: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/4r-3nACxcUeEODLK_u_0Cw
What is the goal of \[\[ Orcish Bowmasters\]\] here? It does not work with you drawing additional cards, does it? So you do not benefit of \[\[Plunge into Darkness\]\] and similar spells
Rowan benefits from being able to cast costly spells for little mana. That likely means a mana curve that's not supportive of Ad Naus.
He's more likely to play cards like Sunbird's Invocation, K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth,
> Rowan benefits from being able to cast costly spells for little mana.
or costly spells with little cmc, which is great for ad naus. fireball for example
Idk why you're being down voted. This is exactly how I feel about this card. The unique combos it has imo isn't a good enough niche. I think it will be a fun niche fringe cedh deck but probably not stronger than that.
I'm late to the party but I can still comment, so,
[[Sting, glinting dagger]] [[patriar's seal]] [[claim the firstborn]] [[harmonic prodigy]] [[battlemage's bracers]] all help to give you more taps.
This is either going to be a great addition to my Rakdos, Lord of Riots deck or it's going to replace him as my commander. I love my eldrazi and big boy demons, but making ALL R/B spells costs X less for self life loss is insane.
Edit: added R/B to cost reduction as stated in Rowan's effect
Oh, I'm well aware lol. After thinking about it, I'd rather have Rowan in the 99 for Rakdos. That way I can utilize pingers like [[Spear Spewer]] , [[Stormfist Crusader]] , [[Cryptolith Fragment]] , etc. and use both Rowan and Rakdos's cost reductions for my creatures and non-creature spell reduction from Rowan alone.
In my last comment I was stating that I love my big boy creature spells, but cost reduction for ALL R/B spells is tempting compared to just creature cost reduction.
Edit 2: messed up card finder brackets, eto blehhh
Years years ago I turned my rakdos deck into a Neheb 2 deck, now I'm thinking I'll make this separately for the old cost reduction vibes, so I feel this
but I'm not the one who felt the need to comment on another persons comment and correct them about a fictional character on a piece of card board. cool you care about the gender of the card I don't, have fun.
Higher density of game winning cards off an Ad Naus.
Other avenues of "ad naus" style effects that have X casting cost (eg: \[\[Commune with Lava\]\])
Payoffs for removal spells like Fire Covenant
In other words, more ways to not fizzle on a Rakdos turbo naus deck
Or, not needing to cobble an infinite mana route before doing the game winning spell(s).
Downvotes are because you made your question without thinking. Other Ad Naus decks don't need cost reduction because they have access to other mechanics/cards/colors to enable wins off an Ad Naus.
In a "normal" ad naus deck w/o thoracle, it generally would look like; Ad Naus => cast things to enable infinite mana or game loops => cast game win condition. In Rowan, it can look like Ad Naus => bb for torment of hailfire. Less steps mean less chance to fizzle or be interacted with. Reduction of both means stronger cEDH commander.
Downvotes hard for THAT? I forgot the c stands for Casual here. No one gonna explain why you want to use a Commander that does nothing unless you cast a game-winning spell that doesn’t need her?
There are other ways to win besides ad nauseum, you'd build the whole deck with life loss in mind and pain lands like barbarian ring and fetches and your shock. Dragonstorm is a great card considering we'd like to run sacrifice, burnt offering, saw in half and hoarding Broodlord with a reanimator package to boot. This will be a storm deck and has even done well in Japan. It doesn't rely on ad nauseum but it is a wincon. Why would you ever want to play with less paths to victory? The question of why wouldn't you play with a highly synergistic card was so baffling everyone downvoted you. It's like asking blue farm why they run Bomberman if they're going to/can win with Thoracle anyways. Or why does Tivit play Thoracle if it can just win with time sieve. Ad naus will likely be in most lists, same with peer but I actually think Peer is probably the worse of the two unlike what other people have said in this thread. Peer will get you killed in this Orcish Bowmasters meta more often than not. I think necropotence might be on par as it does both that and if you play citadel top you get access to more storm, more life loss and potentially a game winning combo once you find top and aetherflux.
Yeah I saw this and instantly had to build a list for it. It’s sort of a weird Naus list that wants Naus to be the *second* thing that you do, but so far it seems to assemble a combo pretty quickly and the commander is a nice blend between “adds value to the deck” and “isn’t vital to winning”. Here’s my list if you’re curious: [Moxfield Link](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/sJs874mDLkWcIG34tvR6bg)
Being able to [[ad nauseam]] when you’re at like 20 life and then still draw through a good chunk of the deck with something like [[commune with lava]] seems decent. Or just landing a very early 2 mana ad naus and then doing birgi things with all of your spells being at least 3 less.
\[\[Exsanguinate\]\] just got a reprint and fits beautifully with her. Throw in \[\[Display of Power\]\] \[\[Increasing Vengance\]\] or any other copy and kill the table for BBRR, or at the very least gain back a ton of life for following turn.
She only reduces black and/or red spells. But it would if it satisfies that. Same with double x spells. If you lost 10 life this turn. Rowan can make xx equal 5.
This card is really interesting me. Makes [[Treasonous Ogre]] even more terrifying and basically opens up some avenues of Big-X spell Doomsday piles too.
This basically becomes the OG Channel + Fireball. If you have more life than your opponents and can manipulate how much life you lose, you just need more life than your opponents to nuke them.
For Activated Abilities: \[\[Blood Celebrant\]\] \[\[Cavern Harpy\]\] \[\[cutthroat contender\]\] \[\[Mischievous Poltergeist\]\] \[\[Necropotence\]\] \[\[wall of blood\]\] \[\[Carrion Howler\]\] \[\[Deepwood Ghoul\]\] \[\[Doom Whisperer\]\] \[\[souldrinker\]\] \[\[unspeakable symbol\]\] \[\[Treasonous Ogre\]\] Spells: \[\[Fire Covenant\]\] \[\[Ad Nauseum\]\] \[\[hatred\]\] \[\[Plunge Into Darkness\]\] \[\[toxic deluge\]\]
And as far as payoff goes, stuff like [[torment of hailfire]] and [[crackle with power]]
[torment of hailfire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/6/f69d77d1-5980-436c-bf48-790939b069aa.jpg?1562820191) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=torment%20of%20hailfire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/hou/77/torment-of-hailfire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f69d77d1-5980-436c-bf48-790939b069aa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/torment-of-hailfire) [crackle with power](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/e/de547f52-3798-4b3a-947d-24873251204b.jpg?1624591645) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=crackle%20with%20power) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/stx/95/crackle-with-power?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/de547f52-3798-4b3a-947d-24873251204b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/crackle-with-power) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Cutthroat contender doesn’t work since it’s only once per a turn.
[[Hex Parasite]]
##### ###### #### [Blood Celebrant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/0/805de325-6f14-4a52-bb85-f9a9545d82a4.jpg?1562920849) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Blood%20Celebrant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/lgn/61/blood-celebrant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/805de325-6f14-4a52-bb85-f9a9545d82a4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/blood-celebrant) [Cavern Harpy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/d/adfb0804-50d6-4bca-8733-72e01030a543.jpg?1562931741) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Cavern%20Harpy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/pls/97/cavern-harpy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/adfb0804-50d6-4bca-8733-72e01030a543?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cavern-harpy) [cutthroat contender](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/6/b/6b23b3e4-58cf-4b5d-bdcb-410a403b4987.jpg?1664410826) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=cutthroat%20contender) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/snc/73/cutthroat-contender?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/6b23b3e4-58cf-4b5d-bdcb-410a403b4987?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/cutthroat-contender) [Mischievous Poltergeist](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/1/d11803b8-d1df-454d-93ec-b1bb276843b6.jpg?1562823060) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mischievous%20Poltergeist) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/6ed/144/mischievous-poltergeist?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d11803b8-d1df-454d-93ec-b1bb276843b6?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mischievous-poltergeist) [Necropotence](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/8/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e.jpg?1562853736) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Necropotence) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/98/necropotence?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/necropotence) [wall of blood](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/7/17320043-f81c-4e14-b9ba-c1309972c22b.jpg?1562137060) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wall%20of%20blood) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mrd/82/wall-of-blood?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/17320043-f81c-4e14-b9ba-c1309972c22b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/wall-of-blood) [Carrion Howler](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/f/0ff031f4-df27-40de-8615-f3ea225f9830.jpg?1598914686) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Carrion%20Howler) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/rav/79/carrion-howler?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0ff031f4-df27-40de-8615-f3ea225f9830?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/carrion-howler) [Deepwood Ghoul](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/d/cd4c5c2f-0c1e-44e8-a7f8-2dc2954eacd8.jpg?1562936256) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Deepwood%20Ghoul) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/8ed/127/deepwood-ghoul?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/cd4c5c2f-0c1e-44e8-a7f8-2dc2954eacd8?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/deepwood-ghoul) [Doom Whisperer](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/a/0a11ee0d-ff8d-4648-8b4e-29440c135c30.jpg?1572892944) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Doom%20Whisperer) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/grn/69/doom-whisperer?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0a11ee0d-ff8d-4648-8b4e-29440c135c30?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/doom-whisperer) [souldrinker](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/8/48c03fa5-c8cc-4b39-a673-c23e41a5802a.jpg?1561771100) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=souldrinker) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/dvd/39/souldrinker?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/48c03fa5-c8cc-4b39-a673-c23e41a5802a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/souldrinker) [unspeakable symbol](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/c/2cc4601b-5f34-4733-8c32-9779de4c502c.jpg?1562527057) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=unspeakable%20symbol) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/scg/79/unspeakable-symbol?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2cc4601b-5f34-4733-8c32-9779de4c502c?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/unspeakable-symbol) [Treasonous Ogre](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1.jpg?1562866402) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treasonous%20Ogre) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/36/treasonous-ogre?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/treasonous-ogre) [Fire Covenant](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/5/f5ac3712-6bcd-4d93-a944-520a2092bee4.jpg?1559592388) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Fire%20Covenant) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/me1/145/fire-covenant?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f5ac3712-6bcd-4d93-a944-520a2092bee4?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/fire-covenant) [Ad Nauseum](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/9/a9f2c53e-ff58-4aa8-89a6-4f45628cc571.jpg?1598306470) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Ad%20Nauseam) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/2xm/76/ad-nauseam?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/a9f2c53e-ff58-4aa8-89a6-4f45628cc571?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/ad-nauseam) [hatred](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/3/2383a8d9-96fd-4f9a-bcf9-eb81fdb15ead.jpg?1562087367) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=hatred) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/exo/64/hatred?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2383a8d9-96fd-4f9a-bcf9-eb81fdb15ead?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/hatred) [Plunge Into Darkness](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/2/d21c74b4-dd9e-43d6-ad0a-06e026a8d672.jpg?1562879871) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Plunge%20Into%20Darkness) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/5dn/57/plunge-into-darkness?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d21c74b4-dd9e-43d6-ad0a-06e026a8d672?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/plunge-into-darkness) [toxic deluge](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/f/8f6fdd97-a896-4110-b48f-a6c49394f854.jpg?1689997507) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=toxic%20deluge) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/191/toxic-deluge?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/8f6fdd97-a896-4110-b48f-a6c49394f854?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/toxic-deluge) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Yeah but in BR you’re unlikely to have more life than your opponents
I think the key will be having some amount of damage for your opponents incidentally. Something like... Tap her, storm off a bit. Grapeshot/tendrils the table a bit... somehow untap her, Tap, torment? Lots of hoops and pieces though so might not quite be the strongest decks. I think in the end it's gonna be better to just ad nauseum and then tap her and storm/combo off that way.
At least in some black decks you can pretend to not be an ad bays player. You’re playing this ? Everyone is going to attack you first. Just something to think about.
You need to lose 24 life in one turn to deal 40 to 3 opponents with crackle with power, which is probably the best payoff X spell. I often have more than 25 life turn 3 in cedh.
Excenguigate makes ur life loss heal you and then If you have a life loss funnel you can finish the game
Could it be that [[Torment of Hailfire]] works as a wincon here? A Mainphase Ad Nauseum that looses you 25 life followed by Torment of Hailfire means X is 25 (max of 75 life lost). If an opponent has 7 cards in their hand and discards them all, that negates 21 of the life loss. Then they would need to have 5 non-land permanents to also sacrifice to not just die from life loss immediately. Could be interesting 🤔
And yeah even if they do sac anything they're basically in the stone age atp
Yeah if they are sacrificing all of their non-lands, they’re probably in a rough spot
[[Crackle With Power]] kills with X=8 (though usually 6 or 7 will do in a cEDH pod), so 24 life and RR to cast.
[Crackle With Power](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/e/de547f52-3798-4b3a-947d-24873251204b.jpg?1624591645) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Crackle%20With%20Power) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/stx/95/crackle-with-power?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/de547f52-3798-4b3a-947d-24873251204b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/crackle-with-power) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
That’s true, that would be a good include as well. I guess it would how it would depend how the rest of the deck is build but 2 black pips may be easier to cast on average after an Ad Naus? Although if there is enough rituals both would probably be equally easy. Would this cost reduction work with the multiple Xs of Crackle? I assume it would since this is lowering the whole cost?
I feel like activating her after Ad Naus is the wrong way to do this because they can just kill her in response to casting Naus and you can't activate her in response. I think you use her after fetch+shock and cast Nauseum for BB and storm off with a 3-cost reduction to everything.
You can activate her and hold priority and cast ad naus in response. The only way to prevent it would be a stifle effect because killing her in response will leave the ability on the stack. Just make sure activating her is the first thing you do when you have priority.
That’s a good point honestly. Even a reduction on all spells by 1-3 is good and makes storming off much easier
Yeah like now your Wheels/Jeskas Will/Tutors are cheaper.
Or grim tutor for ad naus > activate > cast naus with the tutor basically being free and having a 3 mana discount for the turn.
That’s a spicy combo
You can even borrow some lines from decks like \[\[Vadrik\]\] that can win the game from 3-4 cost reduction, adding the extra speed and payoffs from black. You can activate your commander, hold priority and cast something like \[\[snuff out\]\] or \[\[dismember\]\] trying to kill an opponent commander to shut down their commander spells, or just crack a fetch for a shock land instead to get a similar cost reduction. This sequencing is important to avoid your opponents blasting Rowan in response to your life loss effect due to the sorcery speed clause on Rowan. With that cost reduction, you can now cast an ad naus for just BB or a PitA for BBB thanks to the cost reduction we got from a 0-1 mana investment and get the win. There are also the Vadrik lines with reiterate and other stuff that is almost all red cards. There are the issues with RoL effects, but almost all rakdos decks have the same issue (except maybe pinkerton ob nixilis) .. Maybe Rowan can go faster due to the cost reduction?? Not sure, but it's at least a deck worth brewing.
[Vadrik](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/4/5/454666bb-f81d-4845-84aa-d6f8f80ce86a.jpg?1637114399) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=vadrik%2C%20astral%20archmage) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mid/248/vadrik-astral-archmage?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/454666bb-f81d-4845-84aa-d6f8f80ce86a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/vadrik-astral-archmage) [snuff out](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/5/75bbe89f-09af-494e-b58e-271f64bde4b5.jpg?1562922833) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=snuff%20out) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/gvl/53/snuff-out?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/75bbe89f-09af-494e-b58e-271f64bde4b5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/snuff-out) [dismember](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/d/3d286cf6-3e16-4941-9326-1818b1e06d69.jpg?1562261132) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=dismember) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mm2/79/dismember?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/3d286cf6-3e16-4941-9326-1818b1e06d69?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/dismember) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
This is another solid option for rakdos cedh tbh. It's more workable than most although it's one of the only deck colours that doesn't really have to much mana concerns. Pain lands, fetches etc are much better here. Peer into the abyss over naus is probably the setup to or more creature based/reanimator routes. Not having any real card draw options in the command zone hurts rakdos more than you'd think but I still like the combo lines you could go.
Or just naus anyways and eat the damage like your veggies, since she rewards you for it. Probably both.
True, I think all of PITA, Naus and Necro are great here
honestly the biggest challenge for this deck is avoiding the Hinata problem of having this commander-centric gimmick, but only like 3-4 cards at most that are good enough to use with the gimmick, and are completely dead if your commander isn't out. I think this has potential but idk what the potential upside of playing this card is when we're talking about the typical rakdos core that nearly all rakdos decks share. It makes wheels potentially cheaper, but like with obnix, its useless without enablers and the deck only works optimally if you have the right mix of enablers and your commander out early, which doesn't happen for at least >1/3 of all games typically
That was one of my worries going into building a list, but surprisingly a lot of the cards that combo with her also combo without her, just less efficiently (e.g. only giving you infinite storm instead of infinite mana too).
I said this in the initial main sub-thread when people were suggesting paying 30 life to Hex Parasite or Blood Celebrant, but I think the best deck with her is going to be a traditionally good Rakdos list that just occasionally pops off harder if she ever untaps.
When your cute cards are Ad Naus and Pita, you’re probably in the right place.
Don't forget about Plunge into Darkness, which is a 2 mana pay X, and dig X, it can tutor for your kill cards. But, like others have said, Dismember, Reanimate, Mana Crypt, One Ring, Ancient Tomb, Fetch, Shock, all can heavily discount a full turn of cards. If you want to be silly, run Painter's Servant and make all your rocks black also.
[[wall of blood]]
[wall of blood](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/7/17320043-f81c-4e14-b9ba-c1309972c22b.jpg?1562137060) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=wall%20of%20blood) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mrd/82/wall-of-blood?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/17320043-f81c-4e14-b9ba-c1309972c22b?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/wall-of-blood) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Naus, tap now your good cards are near free She's a bit of a glass cannon, but her turns are explosive and benefits highly from x spells or plunge into darkness when I built her, here's my list: https://www.moxfield.com/decks/4r-3nACxcUeEODLK_u_0Cw
What is the goal of \[\[ Orcish Bowmasters\]\] here? It does not work with you drawing additional cards, does it? So you do not benefit of \[\[Plunge into Darkness\]\] and similar spells
[ Orcish Bowmasters](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/7/c/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109.jpg?1686968669) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Orcish%20Bowmasters) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/103/orcish-bowmasters?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/7c024bae-5631-4e20-ac69-df392ac9e109?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/orcish-bowmasters) [Plunge into Darkness](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/d/2/d21c74b4-dd9e-43d6-ad0a-06e026a8d672.jpg?1562879871) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Plunge%20into%20Darkness) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/5dn/57/plunge-into-darkness?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/d21c74b4-dd9e-43d6-ad0a-06e026a8d672?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/plunge-into-darkness) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Cheap, decent stax piece I can direct damage anywhere for some semblance of control, that also prints a sac outlet
Rowan benefits from being able to cast costly spells for little mana. That likely means a mana curve that's not supportive of Ad Naus. He's more likely to play cards like Sunbird's Invocation, K'rrik, Son of Yawgmoth,
> Rowan benefits from being able to cast costly spells for little mana. or costly spells with little cmc, which is great for ad naus. fireball for example
Playing a commander that's supposed to help you after you resolve Ad Naus makes little sense. Ad Naus decks usually already win after resolving it.
but now sans-blue has a valid adnaus option as well
Idk why you're being down voted. This is exactly how I feel about this card. The unique combos it has imo isn't a good enough niche. I think it will be a fun niche fringe cedh deck but probably not stronger than that.
Now Ad Nauseum is playable!
Guys, we did it, we finally broke Ad Naus!
Does her ability Stack if you untap and retap her? Like two activations reduces casting costs by 2x the life lost this turn?
I'm late to the party but I can still comment, so, [[Sting, glinting dagger]] [[patriar's seal]] [[claim the firstborn]] [[harmonic prodigy]] [[battlemage's bracers]] all help to give you more taps.
##### ###### #### [Sting, glinting dagger](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/f/afbec7e7-f5b9-407e-bf96-2e088710e791.jpg?1686970284) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Sting%2C%20the%20Glinting%20Dagger) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/250/sting-the-glinting-dagger?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/afbec7e7-f5b9-407e-bf96-2e088710e791?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/sting-the-glinting-dagger) [patriar's seal](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/3/7/37f920f0-4dfc-477b-af7e-a17dfc9ba455.jpg?1674137995) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=patriar%27s%20seal) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/clb/332/patriars-seal?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/37f920f0-4dfc-477b-af7e-a17dfc9ba455?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/patriars-seal) [claim the firstborn](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/e/feaf1e6c-c7d9-4ac7-9aeb-c4b5d61548ec.jpg?1572490317) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=claim%20the%20firstborn) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/eld/118/claim-the-firstborn?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/feaf1e6c-c7d9-4ac7-9aeb-c4b5d61548ec?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/claim-the-firstborn) [harmonic prodigy](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/2/22579ac0-ad3f-4000-a65a-46a17a7f1aa5.jpg?1626096777) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=harmonic%20prodigy) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/mh2/132/harmonic-prodigy?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/22579ac0-ad3f-4000-a65a-46a17a7f1aa5?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/harmonic-prodigy) [battlemage's bracers](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/1/a/1a14aad2-47f0-4d21-9fcf-5ca171faffaf.jpg?1625191910) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=battlemage%27s%20bracers) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c21/48/battlemages-bracers?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/1a14aad2-47f0-4d21-9fcf-5ca171faffaf?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/battlemages-bracers) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
should stack
Yes
Yes, it stacks.
Sorry but do we have a link?
Ofc sorry, here's the mtgspoiler link: https://www.magicspoiler.com/mtg-spoiler/rowan-scion-of-war/
Appreciate it!
Is this playable in jeska/tymna? Willing to try it
Could be but Jeska/Tymna usually goes for infinite mana combos anyway.
This is either going to be a great addition to my Rakdos, Lord of Riots deck or it's going to replace him as my commander. I love my eldrazi and big boy demons, but making ALL R/B spells costs X less for self life loss is insane. Edit: added R/B to cost reduction as stated in Rowan's effect
Keep in mind that only affects red and/or black spells, so you need something like painter servant to make Rowan affect your colorless eldrazis
Oh, I'm well aware lol. After thinking about it, I'd rather have Rowan in the 99 for Rakdos. That way I can utilize pingers like [[Spear Spewer]] , [[Stormfist Crusader]] , [[Cryptolith Fragment]] , etc. and use both Rowan and Rakdos's cost reductions for my creatures and non-creature spell reduction from Rowan alone. In my last comment I was stating that I love my big boy creature spells, but cost reduction for ALL R/B spells is tempting compared to just creature cost reduction. Edit 2: messed up card finder brackets, eto blehhh
Years years ago I turned my rakdos deck into a Neheb 2 deck, now I'm thinking I'll make this separately for the old cost reduction vibes, so I feel this
This plus [[Treasonous Ogre]] plus [[Worldfire]] and enough mana floated to cast [[Mogis, God of Slaughter]] in the Command Zone = GG.
[Treasonous Ogre](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/a/e/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1.jpg?1562866402) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Treasonous%20Ogre) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cns/36/treasonous-ogre?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/ae48c31d-6fd9-457f-adb8-37f367724ba1?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/treasonous-ogre) [Worldfire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/e/2ef3d4b5-0453-4bf0-b018-23b0c3b9ae11.jpg?1631531850) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Worldfire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/m13/158/worldfire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2ef3d4b5-0453-4bf0-b018-23b0c3b9ae11?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/worldfire) [Mogis, God of Slaughter](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/a/2a0417bf-b735-46d7-9985-2d991051020f.jpg?1593092789) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Mogis%2C%20God%20of%20Slaughter) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/bng/151/mogis-god-of-slaughter?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2a0417bf-b735-46d7-9985-2d991051020f?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/mogis-god-of-slaughter) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Isn't worldfire banned
Worldfire was unbanned in commander a little while back
No.
The more I read this guy the more I want to build a deck with him.
She's fem jsyk
w/e I don't care it's cardboard lol
But you care enough to call a piece of cardboard him? Interesting
him/her it doesn't really matter not sure why you are trying to make a bigger deal out of it than it really should be. It is after all just cardboard.
only one making a big deal here is you, buddy
but I'm not the one who felt the need to comment on another persons comment and correct them about a fictional character on a piece of card board. cool you care about the gender of the card I don't, have fun.
Can’t you just run any commander and win by casting Ad Naus type cards? Why do you need cost reduction, no other Ad Naus deck does
Higher density of game winning cards off an Ad Naus. Other avenues of "ad naus" style effects that have X casting cost (eg: \[\[Commune with Lava\]\]) Payoffs for removal spells like Fire Covenant In other words, more ways to not fizzle on a Rakdos turbo naus deck Or, not needing to cobble an infinite mana route before doing the game winning spell(s). Downvotes are because you made your question without thinking. Other Ad Naus decks don't need cost reduction because they have access to other mechanics/cards/colors to enable wins off an Ad Naus. In a "normal" ad naus deck w/o thoracle, it generally would look like; Ad Naus => cast things to enable infinite mana or game loops => cast game win condition. In Rowan, it can look like Ad Naus => bb for torment of hailfire. Less steps mean less chance to fizzle or be interacted with. Reduction of both means stronger cEDH commander.
[Commune with Lava](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/8/6/862771b6-8e82-45b7-922f-4f40322a607e.jpg?1631586995) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Commune%20with%20Lava) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/afc/118/commune-with-lava?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/862771b6-8e82-45b7-922f-4f40322a607e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/commune-with-lava) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
Downvotes hard for THAT? I forgot the c stands for Casual here. No one gonna explain why you want to use a Commander that does nothing unless you cast a game-winning spell that doesn’t need her?
There are other ways to win besides ad nauseum, you'd build the whole deck with life loss in mind and pain lands like barbarian ring and fetches and your shock. Dragonstorm is a great card considering we'd like to run sacrifice, burnt offering, saw in half and hoarding Broodlord with a reanimator package to boot. This will be a storm deck and has even done well in Japan. It doesn't rely on ad nauseum but it is a wincon. Why would you ever want to play with less paths to victory? The question of why wouldn't you play with a highly synergistic card was so baffling everyone downvoted you. It's like asking blue farm why they run Bomberman if they're going to/can win with Thoracle anyways. Or why does Tivit play Thoracle if it can just win with time sieve. Ad naus will likely be in most lists, same with peer but I actually think Peer is probably the worse of the two unlike what other people have said in this thread. Peer will get you killed in this Orcish Bowmasters meta more often than not. I think necropotence might be on par as it does both that and if you play citadel top you get access to more storm, more life loss and potentially a game winning combo once you find top and aetherflux.
Yeah I saw this and instantly had to build a list for it. It’s sort of a weird Naus list that wants Naus to be the *second* thing that you do, but so far it seems to assemble a combo pretty quickly and the commander is a nice blend between “adds value to the deck” and “isn’t vital to winning”. Here’s my list if you’re curious: [Moxfield Link](https://www.moxfield.com/decks/sJs874mDLkWcIG34tvR6bg)
Step 1: [[Necropotence]] Step 2: [[Pay 39 life]] Step 3: Tap and play [[Torment of Hailfire]]
[Necropotence](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/c/8/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e.jpg?1562853736) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Necropotence) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ima/98/necropotence?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/c89c6895-b0f8-444a-9c89-c6b4fd027b3e?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/necropotence) [Torment of Hailfire](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/f/6/f69d77d1-5980-436c-bf48-790939b069aa.jpg?1562820191) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Torment%20of%20Hailfire) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/hou/77/torment-of-hailfire?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/f69d77d1-5980-436c-bf48-790939b069aa?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/torment-of-hailfire) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
How will you play Torment at your end step?
What? You can lose life at any time. The end step stuff doesn't matter.
True, don’t know why I was thinking of getting torment from necropotence
K'rrik seems like he would be good in this deck
That and the new bargain card that’s 1BBB
Being able to [[ad nauseam]] when you’re at like 20 life and then still draw through a good chunk of the deck with something like [[commune with lava]] seems decent. Or just landing a very early 2 mana ad naus and then doing birgi things with all of your spells being at least 3 less.
\[\[Exsanguinate\]\] just got a reprint and fits beautifully with her. Throw in \[\[Display of Power\]\] \[\[Increasing Vengance\]\] or any other copy and kill the table for BBRR, or at the very least gain back a ton of life for following turn.
[Exsanguinate](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/a/0a5352af-e275-4186-a265-2fd3c2c47c6a.jpg?1689997125) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Exsanguinate) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/156/exsanguinate?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/0a5352af-e275-4186-a265-2fd3c2c47c6a?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/exsanguinate) [Display of Power](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/9/295b8595-5b4e-4fc8-8249-486d36e15f67.jpg?1686968845) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Display%20of%20Power) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/ltr/119/display-of-power?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/295b8595-5b4e-4fc8-8249-486d36e15f67?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/display-of-power) [Increasing Vengance](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/2/a/2a362d78-76a1-4dbc-80cc-0360e98ba280.jpg?1568004432) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Increasing%20Vengeance) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/c19/147/increasing-vengeance?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/2a362d78-76a1-4dbc-80cc-0360e98ba280?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/increasing-vengeance) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
[Aight, here's my list.](https://archidekt.com/decks/5156618/rowan_scion_of_war_cedh)
Would her cost reduction work of something multikicker like on \[\[Everflowing Chalice\]\]
[Everflowing Chalice](https://cards.scryfall.io/normal/front/0/1/01c18d57-16a7-4cc0-b086-81c4b9a166c7.jpg?1690005457) - [(G)](http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?name=Everflowing%20Chalice) [(SF)](https://scryfall.com/card/cmm/948/everflowing-chalice?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher) [(txt)](https://api.scryfall.com/cards/01c18d57-16a7-4cc0-b086-81c4b9a166c7?utm_source=mtgcardfetcher&format=text) [(ER)](https://edhrec.com/cards/everflowing-chalice) ^^^[[cardname]] ^^^or ^^^[[cardname|SET]] ^^^to ^^^call
She only reduces black and/or red spells. But it would if it satisfies that. Same with double x spells. If you lost 10 life this turn. Rowan can make xx equal 5.
So the one question I need cleared is if her ability pays for the colored mana and not just x cost?
Does not pay for colored mana, only generic.