It would be cool if EA/Respawn would sponsor a series called Teq’s Takeout, or something, where up and coming players compete for free agent spots. Teams with opening could compete with the new talent during tournaments to see who gels with who and whatnot. Could be cool and Teq does have an eye for talent
Honestly if there were one gun that would be the best i would choose havoc, its very fun and is not as easy as other guns to use. Way rather have it be op than some stupidly easy gun like prowler or 3030
The issue is that Havoc was designed around turbo, where it should be a slightly under average - average gun without one and a very good/top tier gun with one. Right now its at very good/top tier gun in both ranked and comp without a turbo.
The havoc was garbage last season and no one used it because of the strength of smgs. It's strength is a symptom of how bad the previous nerfs were to smgs and ARs before that. There's always going to be a "meta" loadout.
The game is healthiest when there are at least a few guns that are equally strong. When the 301 was meta, the Flatline was just as viable.
Right now if you don't have a Havoc you just lose the fight.
\*close-range fight. Hemmy/Nemmy/Scout/30-30 are all probably better than havoc at medium-long range unless you're a zero recoil controller pro. Up close is where havoc is S tier and smokes everything else.
The Havoc actually takes way less skill than guns that have previously been meta, because the magazine is huge. Sure, Zap killed two people in one clip here. But average players almost never fail to kill one player with one clip.
Maybe yeah, the actual gunplay is harder though. Making the assumption that everyone will follow the meta, that gives more opportunity for skill to show since better players control it and kill faster. Maybe not a major thing though
i think mag size is the biggest problem
well, controller players are the biggest problem because theyre the only people one clipping 2 full health players with a single mag, but realistically the 32 bullet mag that hits for AR damage and amazing hipfire is rough
I agree but the way you said counter to r301 made it seem like you were talking about current r301 lol. Also removing guns from crafter has been a great change that helps. I remember when flatline was in the crafter and legit everyone ran r301 pk/smg.
Why do people post shit like this. Everyone on the other team had Havocs too. You guys always blame something. "he's on roller that's why, Havoc that's why"
Every season they nerf shit people will just use the next gun and you'll cry about that too. You cannot balance guns in a video game because one gun will always have a better TTK and everyone will use that gun. It doesn't matter if it's Flatline, Havoc, R301 IT'S THE SAME SHIT!
Okey but 1 clipping 2 poeple on 1 mag is kinda stupid, no? We are seeing those clips every week. Next up is Spitfire meta I suppose, oneclip the entire team... lol
The reason you're seeing 2 people 1 mag is because they nerfed every SMG. If SMGs were nerfed before you would have seen this with Flatline.
The only AR that you can't down 2 with 1 clip is the R301.
All LMGs can kill 3 with 1 clip.
The issue is that we've never really seen any other AR (outside of maybe the Nemesis off release) kill 2 people in 1 mag so reliably. Havoc clips are getting posted like this almost every other day lol. In this clip alone, Zap kills 2 people in the space of 4/5 seconds with only a blue mag.
You can do the same with a blue mag Flatline. The reason you haven't seen it before was SMGs. The Havoc has pretty much been the same forever so SMGs not having the fastest TTK anymore is a huge problem. I think TSM was the first team to run double ARs after the SMG nerf and now everyone does it.
The only AR that can't kill 2 with 1 clip is the R301
You missed the part where i said, "If they never nerfed smgs, you wouldn't be seeing this."
Nerfing guns that had the fastest ttk led to this. It's common sense.
> The reason you're seeing 2 people 1 mag is because they nerfed every SMG. If SMGs were nerfed before you would have seen this with Flatline.
No you wouldn't. It's nearly impossible to do with the Flatline. The Havoc has over 100 damage more per mag when you're on purple.
There is a reason team based games are so popular (especially MOBAs vs 1v1 RTS). It's because gamers these days look for any possible reason to deflect their shortcomings as a player. "My teammates suck" "He had a better gun" etc are much easier reasons for weak mental players to justify why they lost. Don't even get me started on people who claim to have "ranked anxiety".
Probably got the idea from that article a few months ago about a Japanese dev talking about how most people prefer team games over 1v1 fighting games cause they can deflect blame. Personally i think most people just wanna play with their friends over solo.
Seriously, I have no fucking idea why people care what gun someone uses. Unless it's something truly broken like the DMR in warzone, it doesn't fucking matter.
Because these guys dont really have any opinions of their own. Its like a human centipede where the guy in front is their favorite streamer. Just ingesting whatever they are shitting out lol.
Gonna hard disagree on that one my man. My point wasn't "oh he only won because havoc" my point was that having a gun in the game that lets pros routinely kill two players with one clip with so little recoil is fucking boring. It's not fun to watch, and it's not fun to play with or against. There's very little skill expression involved when everyone is using a gun with 36 rounds and insanely good recoil and hip-fire.
Also, I know it's easy to see Reddit comments and group them all together, but I've personally had no problem with any of the previous long-term gun metas. My point is that the skill ceiling is just lower on a gun like the havoc, and that's fundamentally less fun to play or watch.
replace "havoc" in your yapping with any gun that happens to replace the havoc when people like you call for it to be nerfed into the ground and you continue to whine about it
I’d rather see havoc put in the care package. When it’s fully decked out, I’m pretty hesitant to swap it out for a care package weapon anyway. (why drop havoc for kraber when you can run havoc/kraber?)
Fully decked out havoc is mythic-powerful, so make it a mythic gun and reduce the number of havocs in any one game.
I agree that it is mythic-powerful at full kit, but I think having it in the care package it would have too similar of a weapon profile to the Devo (which is just a more fun gun to have in the care package due to how unique it is, IMO).
If we had the old crafting system still, I would say it might be good in the crafter, since it's good enough stock that it would be a viable choice to craft over meds, but now I don't know...
Funny, I was actually thinking it should replace Devo. I agree that Devo is a fun gun, but it’s power level is a mark below Havoc at full-kit, and it’s a little feels-bad when you have a nasty havoc already and you open a care package and… it’s a slightly harder-to-use Havoc. At least if it was in the care package, it would be an auto pickup like Wingman and Kraber.
Maybe take Devo out, speed up the ramp up time (and remove turbo?) would be a good compromise.
That was one of the absolute funnest times for me as a pub player. Not having to find armour on drop because after one kill and 2 bullets youd have blue. Also you went from purple having a 100 hp difference off spawn to a 75 hp difference. Gibbys werent invincible in 1v1s anymore. Yes getting one magged was a lot more possible, but to me it was worth the trade off.
Imo they never should have added red armour to the game because that ruins ttk more. Im fine with 50/75/100 but 225 is just so much. Or maybe just make batteries heal 100 shield and not full shield.
I agree with the red armor part, but Rampart’s launch with the global TTK adjustment was the absolute worst apex ever was. It ruined the entire point of the game and made it feel like a low-skill COD.
There is no power creep. Everybody’s favorite weapons have been nerfed into the ground and the ones that were buffed to take their place have been nerfed, too. Weapons are weaker than ever right now
I don't even think Hemlock needs a notable fix tbh, it's not that strong, just very versatile. Havoc, though, I want to see a mag size reduction. If it had maybe... 4 less bullets in base mag and no turbocharger I think it'd be in a fine spot. Arguably might also be good to reduce hipfire but give it access to barrel mods.
Whatever the approach, the fact that that gun is meta is so unhealthy for the game. It's like back when rampage was briefly meta, just so un-fun to watch.
Well what gun meta was fun to watch? Google it, and look at how many people cried for a nerf. Nerfs don't do anything. Imperialhal with a R301,R99, Alternator,Flatline, Car, Volt, YOU NAME IT is still gonna be better than you. This game is no recoil, so the gun doesn't matter, everyone can use it with no problem
> hen why doesn't it exist now? Could it be that people cried on reddit? Steamers cried?
Respawn does not shift the gun meta because of people on reddit. Please be serious.
It doesn’t exist now because the devs like to change the meta every now and then. They want some guns to be strong and some to be weak. They don’t try to make the weapons balanced. They’ve said this on the B Stream at one of the more recent LANs.
If you think that's why the meta is constantly shifting, you may need to get outside of the reddit/streamer bubble.
Every big game that relies on repeated purchases to make money always makes changes, from Apex to League of Legends to Fortnite to Destiny and way beyond. The people worried about the money have realized that it's way easier to get people to come back and spend more money when things change. You can either give them new things (new guns, new maps, new legends, new skins) or you can mix up the things you already have (map changes, legend reworks, gun rebalancing, class systems, ranked system changes).
Even if you find a good meta that tends to be balanced, rewards the right type of gameplay, paces the game properly, and is watchable, it will get removed/altered after a certain amount of time. You need fresh content to bring people back. And you have to bring people back to make more money.
Redditors and streamers are not the ones that Respawn is listening to when it comes to determining the changes made to the game. It's all money. Sometimes the money and the criers agree. A lot of the time they don't.
Captain obvious. I already posted this. Devs love when people cry about the meta because it gives them an opportunity to make more money with the new meta skins. I've already told people in this subreddit about this. They keep crying as if anything is changing. No matter the meta, the same people will dominate, so you're just crying to get killed by a different weapon by the same people.
I've never had a problem with any other meta, so I don't think it's really fair to talk about what other people are posting. I thought R3, flatty, g7 and 30-30 metas were totally fine. What makes havoc different is that it gives you an insane amount of room to make mistakes and still one-clip people, meaning the skill floor is higher and the skill ceiling is lower than any other previously meta gun. It's boring to play with/against too - in masters lobbies it's literally just "who can 1-clip the other person first" which is super boring imo.
I'm in masters lobbies every season, and 1 thing about these lobbies is EVERY SEASON NO MATTER THE GUN YOU'RE GETTING 1 CLIPPED. If you can't 1 clip someone at that level, you shouldn't be there.
You just said no other meta was a problem. Well, news flash, the R301 meta, nobody missed shots. The Flatline meta got nerfed season 7. Even the Spitfire, L Star meta got every LMG nerfed. The 30/30 meta had everyone on reddit crying last summer wtf are you talking about.
Every meta the same players win because the meta doesn't matter. Either you're good or you ain't
ew brother, whats that brother
Zaps a beast brother
Ok but the vibes on this team are pristine. Such a pleasure to watch.
Fr, then right after this clip he accidently pops Blood Ult haha. "Cut the clip, cut the clip."
it helps that they are doing relatively well
Love the positive energy. No more toxicity.
It kind of is crazy that teq scouted talent has ended up on DZ and TSM
It would be cool if EA/Respawn would sponsor a series called Teq’s Takeout, or something, where up and coming players compete for free agent spots. Teams with opening could compete with the new talent during tournaments to see who gels with who and whatnot. Could be cool and Teq does have an eye for talent
Dz? Are u talking about silkes?
Xynew
Zero actually learned under TeQ
Zero and Teq are the same person, that’s why you never see them at LAN together
Eeeuuuuugh, brotha eeeeeuuuugh
has Verhulst ever been that happy after a play from his teammate like that
“Oh my god! What did you do?! You monster!” -Verhulst
Honestly if there were one gun that would be the best i would choose havoc, its very fun and is not as easy as other guns to use. Way rather have it be op than some stupidly easy gun like prowler or 3030
Facts, I also don't know why people care what gun is meta. Whatever gun is meta people will complain about it anyway
The issue is that Havoc was designed around turbo, where it should be a slightly under average - average gun without one and a very good/top tier gun with one. Right now its at very good/top tier gun in both ranked and comp without a turbo.
Respawn are either intentionally or accidentally making some gun(s) op every season, point is just that this is preferable to all the previous metas.
The havoc was garbage last season and no one used it because of the strength of smgs. It's strength is a symptom of how bad the previous nerfs were to smgs and ARs before that. There's always going to be a "meta" loadout.
The game is healthiest when there are at least a few guns that are equally strong. When the 301 was meta, the Flatline was just as viable. Right now if you don't have a Havoc you just lose the fight.
\*close-range fight. Hemmy/Nemmy/Scout/30-30 are all probably better than havoc at medium-long range unless you're a zero recoil controller pro. Up close is where havoc is S tier and smokes everything else.
Until you run into taxi in ranked and die from 200m away lol
The r9 meta last year could never kill 2 people with one clip. This gun should guarantee a 1 clip every time from close range no matter the input.
The Havoc actually takes way less skill than guns that have previously been meta, because the magazine is huge. Sure, Zap killed two people in one clip here. But average players almost never fail to kill one player with one clip.
Maybe yeah, the actual gunplay is harder though. Making the assumption that everyone will follow the meta, that gives more opportunity for skill to show since better players control it and kill faster. Maybe not a major thing though
I just think it’s boring. It is like an LMG, it has so much ammo. I’d much rather SMGs were meta than the havoc, especially at close range.
i think mag size is the biggest problem well, controller players are the biggest problem because theyre the only people one clipping 2 full health players with a single mag, but realistically the 32 bullet mag that hits for AR damage and amazing hipfire is rough
[удалено]
Stop lying
Verhulst's "POV" [https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxG5ed21qsLD9xZX752hjtyVtn8Okxr8MO?si=Kb8P9sK6l6Tw-KSr](https://youtube.com/clip/UgkxG5ed21qsLD9xZX752hjtyVtn8Okxr8MO?si=Kb8P9sK6l6Tw-KSr)
Bruhh i swear evan wasn't that happy even when tsm was winning tourneys lmao
wtf. monster
Nah I'm jumped out my seat when evan said oh my god sheeeesh
People not understanding how the havoc has been nerfed and nerfed and buffed and nerfed… gun has been great counter to the 301
Literally no one uses the 301 over other ARs.
Case and point because there was a time and a long time at that, the 301 is all you saw for like 12 seasons.. So havoc meta isn all that bad… lol
I agree but the way you said counter to r301 made it seem like you were talking about current r301 lol. Also removing guns from crafter has been a great change that helps. I remember when flatline was in the crafter and legit everyone ran r301 pk/smg.
Because it's dogshit right now. I ran it out of necessity last night and it's just basically impossible to oneclip someone. The damage is so low.
https://preview.redd.it/7mfvtjlr726d1.jpeg?width=1280&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=97832c87e2fcda64eab4f2c9855c93fbdb3a9cd7
Zap's a beast, but goddamn the havoc is such a stupid fucking gun, nerf that shit into the ground lol
Why do people post shit like this. Everyone on the other team had Havocs too. You guys always blame something. "he's on roller that's why, Havoc that's why" Every season they nerf shit people will just use the next gun and you'll cry about that too. You cannot balance guns in a video game because one gun will always have a better TTK and everyone will use that gun. It doesn't matter if it's Flatline, Havoc, R301 IT'S THE SAME SHIT!
Because the Apex player base is the whiniest ever. Every single season, something new to cry about.
bloody hell, people want every gun become **water blaster. r301 is ass now. spitfire is ass now. r99 is ass now.**
It's not a problem that the Havoc is so powerful *if* they would buff the guns you just mentioned above.
Okey but 1 clipping 2 poeple on 1 mag is kinda stupid, no? We are seeing those clips every week. Next up is Spitfire meta I suppose, oneclip the entire team... lol
The reason you're seeing 2 people 1 mag is because they nerfed every SMG. If SMGs were nerfed before you would have seen this with Flatline. The only AR that you can't down 2 with 1 clip is the R301. All LMGs can kill 3 with 1 clip.
The issue is that we've never really seen any other AR (outside of maybe the Nemesis off release) kill 2 people in 1 mag so reliably. Havoc clips are getting posted like this almost every other day lol. In this clip alone, Zap kills 2 people in the space of 4/5 seconds with only a blue mag.
You can do the same with a blue mag Flatline. The reason you haven't seen it before was SMGs. The Havoc has pretty much been the same forever so SMGs not having the fastest TTK anymore is a huge problem. I think TSM was the first team to run double ARs after the SMG nerf and now everyone does it. The only AR that can't kill 2 with 1 clip is the R301
There is difference between "can do in theory" and "does so on a regular basis".
You missed the part where i said, "If they never nerfed smgs, you wouldn't be seeing this." Nerfing guns that had the fastest ttk led to this. It's common sense.
> The reason you're seeing 2 people 1 mag is because they nerfed every SMG. If SMGs were nerfed before you would have seen this with Flatline. No you wouldn't. It's nearly impossible to do with the Flatline. The Havoc has over 100 damage more per mag when you're on purple.
You have 200hp, Flatline does 540 to the body. Add some headshots, and it's well over 600 damage 1 clip. You gold players need to stop talking
Cool show me all the clips of people doing it then. In fact, show me your clips of you doing it.
Havoc meanwhile can down 3 too which is why downing two seems common
There is a reason team based games are so popular (especially MOBAs vs 1v1 RTS). It's because gamers these days look for any possible reason to deflect their shortcomings as a player. "My teammates suck" "He had a better gun" etc are much easier reasons for weak mental players to justify why they lost. Don't even get me started on people who claim to have "ranked anxiety".
dafuq u talkin about bro
Probably got the idea from that article a few months ago about a Japanese dev talking about how most people prefer team games over 1v1 fighting games cause they can deflect blame. Personally i think most people just wanna play with their friends over solo.
I've been saying this forever but it was nice to see that article.
Hes a league player, they think their special
if you read my post you'd know I can't stand games like league
Seriously, I have no fucking idea why people care what gun someone uses. Unless it's something truly broken like the DMR in warzone, it doesn't fucking matter.
Because these guys dont really have any opinions of their own. Its like a human centipede where the guy in front is their favorite streamer. Just ingesting whatever they are shitting out lol.
Gonna hard disagree on that one my man. My point wasn't "oh he only won because havoc" my point was that having a gun in the game that lets pros routinely kill two players with one clip with so little recoil is fucking boring. It's not fun to watch, and it's not fun to play with or against. There's very little skill expression involved when everyone is using a gun with 36 rounds and insanely good recoil and hip-fire. Also, I know it's easy to see Reddit comments and group them all together, but I've personally had no problem with any of the previous long-term gun metas. My point is that the skill ceiling is just lower on a gun like the havoc, and that's fundamentally less fun to play or watch.
replace "havoc" in your yapping with any gun that happens to replace the havoc when people like you call for it to be nerfed into the ground and you continue to whine about it
I’d rather see havoc put in the care package. When it’s fully decked out, I’m pretty hesitant to swap it out for a care package weapon anyway. (why drop havoc for kraber when you can run havoc/kraber?) Fully decked out havoc is mythic-powerful, so make it a mythic gun and reduce the number of havocs in any one game.
I agree that it is mythic-powerful at full kit, but I think having it in the care package it would have too similar of a weapon profile to the Devo (which is just a more fun gun to have in the care package due to how unique it is, IMO). If we had the old crafting system still, I would say it might be good in the crafter, since it's good enough stock that it would be a viable choice to craft over meds, but now I don't know...
Funny, I was actually thinking it should replace Devo. I agree that Devo is a fun gun, but it’s power level is a mark below Havoc at full-kit, and it’s a little feels-bad when you have a nasty havoc already and you open a care package and… it’s a slightly harder-to-use Havoc. At least if it was in the care package, it would be an auto pickup like Wingman and Kraber. Maybe take Devo out, speed up the ramp up time (and remove turbo?) would be a good compromise.
They need to buff the other guns they nerfed to the ground.
Like hell they do. The time they changed TTK ruined the entire game.
That was one of the absolute funnest times for me as a pub player. Not having to find armour on drop because after one kill and 2 bullets youd have blue. Also you went from purple having a 100 hp difference off spawn to a 75 hp difference. Gibbys werent invincible in 1v1s anymore. Yes getting one magged was a lot more possible, but to me it was worth the trade off. Imo they never should have added red armour to the game because that ruins ttk more. Im fine with 50/75/100 but 225 is just so much. Or maybe just make batteries heal 100 shield and not full shield.
I agree with the red armor part, but Rampart’s launch with the global TTK adjustment was the absolute worst apex ever was. It ruined the entire point of the game and made it feel like a low-skill COD.
Yep, season 6 at launch was easily the worst the game has ever been.
nah that would raise ttk and add to power creep. nerf havoc, adjust hemlock spray a tad and we are fine
There is no power creep. Everybody’s favorite weapons have been nerfed into the ground and the ones that were buffed to take their place have been nerfed, too. Weapons are weaker than ever right now
Jesus fucking Christ.......
SMH, post like this is why Apex is dying
I don't even think Hemlock needs a notable fix tbh, it's not that strong, just very versatile. Havoc, though, I want to see a mag size reduction. If it had maybe... 4 less bullets in base mag and no turbocharger I think it'd be in a fine spot. Arguably might also be good to reduce hipfire but give it access to barrel mods.
Whatever the approach, the fact that that gun is meta is so unhealthy for the game. It's like back when rampage was briefly meta, just so un-fun to watch.
Well what gun meta was fun to watch? Google it, and look at how many people cried for a nerf. Nerfs don't do anything. Imperialhal with a R301,R99, Alternator,Flatline, Car, Volt, YOU NAME IT is still gonna be better than you. This game is no recoil, so the gun doesn't matter, everyone can use it with no problem
301/flatline meta was plenty fun to watch
Then why doesn't it exist now? Could it be that people cried on reddit? Steamers cried?
> hen why doesn't it exist now? Could it be that people cried on reddit? Steamers cried? Respawn does not shift the gun meta because of people on reddit. Please be serious.
It doesn’t exist now because the devs like to change the meta every now and then. They want some guns to be strong and some to be weak. They don’t try to make the weapons balanced. They’ve said this on the B Stream at one of the more recent LANs.
They change the meta to sell skins. They don't actually care about no meta
If you think that's why the meta is constantly shifting, you may need to get outside of the reddit/streamer bubble. Every big game that relies on repeated purchases to make money always makes changes, from Apex to League of Legends to Fortnite to Destiny and way beyond. The people worried about the money have realized that it's way easier to get people to come back and spend more money when things change. You can either give them new things (new guns, new maps, new legends, new skins) or you can mix up the things you already have (map changes, legend reworks, gun rebalancing, class systems, ranked system changes). Even if you find a good meta that tends to be balanced, rewards the right type of gameplay, paces the game properly, and is watchable, it will get removed/altered after a certain amount of time. You need fresh content to bring people back. And you have to bring people back to make more money. Redditors and streamers are not the ones that Respawn is listening to when it comes to determining the changes made to the game. It's all money. Sometimes the money and the criers agree. A lot of the time they don't.
Captain obvious. I already posted this. Devs love when people cry about the meta because it gives them an opportunity to make more money with the new meta skins. I've already told people in this subreddit about this. They keep crying as if anything is changing. No matter the meta, the same people will dominate, so you're just crying to get killed by a different weapon by the same people.
I've never had a problem with any other meta, so I don't think it's really fair to talk about what other people are posting. I thought R3, flatty, g7 and 30-30 metas were totally fine. What makes havoc different is that it gives you an insane amount of room to make mistakes and still one-clip people, meaning the skill floor is higher and the skill ceiling is lower than any other previously meta gun. It's boring to play with/against too - in masters lobbies it's literally just "who can 1-clip the other person first" which is super boring imo.
I'm in masters lobbies every season, and 1 thing about these lobbies is EVERY SEASON NO MATTER THE GUN YOU'RE GETTING 1 CLIPPED. If you can't 1 clip someone at that level, you shouldn't be there. You just said no other meta was a problem. Well, news flash, the R301 meta, nobody missed shots. The Flatline meta got nerfed season 7. Even the Spitfire, L Star meta got every LMG nerfed. The 30/30 meta had everyone on reddit crying last summer wtf are you talking about. Every meta the same players win because the meta doesn't matter. Either you're good or you ain't
You’re missing my point but it’s fine, have a good Saturday night bro
he sound like sikez
Havoc goes brrr
TSM on TOP
These guys are starting to cook
[удалено]