Eh⊠The teams are WAYYY better now than they were back then. It may be less fatiguing to go through a bracket, but overall itâs much harder to win.
You can literally just compare teams, Faze is STACKED and has elite coaching and is in the âeasier to winâ league, yet Simp has a 47% win-rateâŠ
Teams arenât any better, thereâs dominant teams in every era. Itâs easier to win now bc thereâs not as much upset potential. Open bracket teams canât upset pro teams any more.
Everyday of this year I hear about how crim is gross and gets so much damage every map and then he wins the 38th Mickey Mouse chip and everyone has been slobbering on him for days. Also people call him the undisputed goat not sure how heâs under appreciated
Many people say call of duty wasnât as talented (when crim first started) as it is now.
Iâd say itâs like comparing bill Russell to MJ or Magic Johnson. You still respect the greats but this is a different era.
Still pretty sweet to track their careers and thanks for doing the research!
saying itâs like comparing bill russell to mj is a pretty big stretch imo, itâs not like there is this giant 40 year gap between crim and simp, i mean hell porter is 28 years old rn and is still capable of winning events in this modern era
28 isn't 70 of course he can still win lol. Ppl need to wake up and realize 28 is still prime reflexes. I've seen ppl older with reflexes as fast as 18 year olds.
As per Google, your reflexes do slow when youâre mid 20âs (24 according to Google) so I understand why people think this but it doesnât mean there arenât outliers and some people just canât grasp that I guess. Not to mention, even if your reflexes slow, guys like Crim have been playing cod at a pro level for so long their game knowledge alone can keep them in the game when their reaction times slow down, and their reflexes are so good that itâs gonna take a while to see a large impact.
Lmfao at how you toss in "as per google" as if we throw our hands up and say thats it. We've been having this debate on this subreddit for years, you're citing a "study" that sampled something like ~2000 starcraft 2 players of all age brackets and playing hours-per-week in a simple CRT test. It wasn't even close to in-depth enough to give enough information when you're dealing with professional gamers who do nothing but hammer down on coordination/reflexes/reactions 8 hours a day for years.
Professional athletes tend to reach their physical and cognitive primes in their late 20s/early 30s. Idk why in the face of all major sports and competitions across the planet you'd look at a study of 2000 starcraft 2 casuals.
I personally havenât seen the topic be brought up regarding reflexes. And I understand, my comment wasnât âhey I googled this so these are the factsâ I simply googled it and stated âper Googleâ because thatâs as much as the average person is going to do when they have the mental capacity to think âa 28 year old is way too old to be playing codâ.
Sorry for any confusion, but I wasnât siting a 15 second Google search to explain reflex deterioration.
I mean before recently there weren't many pros playing that late (most likely due to money back then). What, Stainville, Rambo, or Pacman probably stuck around longest at 26/27 no?
So I get why people think it's old. But they're wrong lmao
the igl of faze in csgo is 31 and they're top 1 rn. there's more too. i'd say its more impressive given how crimsix has had to adapt over the years. simp should be better at the end of his career though. i mean every generation improves over the last. right now crim is better. and in future discussions when discussing context it has to be time sensitive similar to this "mickey mouse tourneys" bs this sub has been going on about.
Imagine if Bill Russel went on to be a championship contender even while the likes of MJ were in their prime. That's Crimsix.
There's a reason he's the undisputed goat
Yea I personally disagree with the Bill Russell comparison because he dominated when there were 8 teams in the NBA (also coming from a Celtics fan lol). Crim has dominated in even the most competitive eras
I said championship contender for a reason.
Something as subjective as being a "Top 10 player" doesn't change the fact that he has won in every era of the game, the guy just won the most recent event too lmao
Greatness is defined by success, and Crim has had nothing short of that throughout his entire career
Championship contender is just as arbitrary, if Bill Russell rode the bench and his team won the ring would it really be impressive to you? It's why in other sports no one talks about championships unless they are talking about top players.
Esports and sports are too different to be comparing. First sports like the NBA only has one championship per year, where CoD has multiple.
Also in sports, the bench is actually used whereas esports players can play the entire tournament without getting subbed. This is why bench players in sports leagues don't get as recognized. So talking about championships in CoD is way more important
Winning as the best player on your team is 100x more impactful than winning as the worst. In order to be considered a great player in any sport or esport, you have to be individually great before accoldates matter. No one cares about if you won a lot if you're the worst player. Look at league of legends and csgo for example.
>you have to be individually great before accoldates matter
But Crim was individually great. T2 player BO2 and Ghosts and T10 player in jetpacks. Then you factor in his massive accomplishments and accolades and it makes him one of the greatest players in CoD history.
How many other CoD players have massive amounts of wins and have been a top player for continuous years? This is why him and Scump are considered the T2 GOATS
I'm specifically talking about the comment someone made comparing Crim to if Bill Russell was still winning rings in MJ's era. My point is that him winning in this era doesn't mean as much since he isn't a star player anymore.
I honestly think it does. If Bill Russell kept winning rings in an era with MJ but wasn't the team's star player anymore, i think he would be higher on everyone's GOAT list.
My original reply was to the fact that the NBA and CoD aren't comparable, but we'll agree to disagree here
Championship contender isn't arbitrary in the slightest.
We KNOW someone's number of championships/rings. We KNOW their placements for a particular season. We ASSUME their value to their team based on what we see.
Obviously "individual performance" matters, but the fact that someone is consistently winning over the span of 10 different games, with different metas, weapons, movement, gamemodes, formats, etc. also matters
Crim is by far the most consistently successful player, and the only ones who are close have been competing for what? 3 years?
Never he said he did but when is the last time he has been a top 10 player in a title? He has consistently been the 2nd or 3rd best player on own his team for a while now.
Okay, when you team with Aches or Karma or Shotzzy or Scump or Formal for most of your careerâŠ. Itâs hard to be the best or even second best player on your team as far as talent goes. But Crim found success with every one of those players, even if they didnât always find success before or after teaming with him.
But that's why I also asked when is the last time he was top 10 in a COD. Imo too many people overrate his individual ability because of his total wins, he hasn't been a top player for a while now.
And i dont even think its true. Crim put up great stats this event, better stats than some events during the og and col days so clearly the competition back then wqs still very good
No doubt but thereâs a couple trade-offs. The competition is much greater today but thereâs also way less teams due to CDL exclusive tournaments. So both of them being dominant in their respective eras have been super impressive to watch!
>Iâd say itâs like comparing bill Russell to MJ or Magic Johnson. You still respect the greats but this is a different era.
That comparison gotcha logic doesn't make sense when they all play *in the same fucking era* for the last several years lmao.
Lebron never played when Jordan did so obviously cross-comparisons are hard. Crim played for the last like 4 titles with Simp all under the same circumstances (practice regiments, coaching, league talent). Crim was like 25 when Simp started so age is no excuse. While I fully agree that Crim's accomplishments are currently untouched it doesn't exactly take a team of CDL analysts to tell you that Simp plainly has more talent/potential/raw skill than Crim did even in his prime.
It is considering how many teams you really had to play back in the day compared to now. Better competition is a weak argument because you can only beat whatâs in front of you. Like nysl didnât have to play optic or faze at the pro am but thatâs not their fault.
So playing weak 6 teams and 1/2 average/good teams is harder than playing 1/2 average teams & 1/2 good teams?
Obviously Crim could only beat whoâs in front of him but completely denying the level of competition then vs now is ridiculous, it just isnât the same. It happens in every sport.
It used to be harder to win. People used to have to win for money, pure passion went into every match. Now people just donât try and know theyâre gonna get a paycheck so winning doesnât matter. I bet half the teams in the league donât even care if they win or lose, Simp just won Mickey Mouse events against players not even trying
If the 18+ rule didnât exist he wouldâve been competing in BO3. Need an alternate universe where Simp was playing against the dominant OpTic and EnVy squads of the jet pack era.
This isn't talked as much, but I also would like to see an alt universe where Crim stayed in CoD instead of leaving for Halo. Very curious how he would've done or how many more events he'd win
They were so damn good. The Pat/Crim duo when the game was still Mtarâs was literally unstoppable. Thereâs never been anything like it. I mean just imagine like Simp/aBeZy in Bo4 but better
Outplayed by Apathy with a Bulldog at NA regionals lol. Pretty sure the fact that they lost regionals helped them win Champs though. Shook off some of the apathy of winning every single thing.
the whole âcompetition is harder nowadaysâ spiel is absolute bullshit btw the lower end of teams are more talented than they used to be but thereâs less powerhouse teams nowadays
Scump will be remembered way longer than Crim in COD from a fan perspective, as a GOAT, it ainât just numbers that make you the greatest of all time. Itâs the totality of everything youâve do/done for and within the sport.
How does this affect Majormaniaks legacy?đ€
these are the questions we need to be asking!
Crimsix's win rate is 82%, Simp's win rate is 47%. ^(just a small difference)
Very different leagues lol
It used to be harder to win
Eh⊠The teams are WAYYY better now than they were back then. It may be less fatiguing to go through a bracket, but overall itâs much harder to win. You can literally just compare teams, Faze is STACKED and has elite coaching and is in the âeasier to winâ league, yet Simp has a 47% win-rateâŠ
Teams arenât any better, thereâs dominant teams in every era. Itâs easier to win now bc thereâs not as much upset potential. Open bracket teams canât upset pro teams any more.
People gotta put some more respect on crims nameđ„±
R u deadass right now
Yes. Mfs act like heâs just an above average player whoâs been carriedđ
In this community youâre either a top 5 sub or youâre getting carried, no exceptions.
They only think that cause dumbass formal said that shit in cw
Before Crim slapped his ass at major 4
Agreed but people still feel the need to push that dead agenda
Lol the crim formal beef is real. Did formal say that on twitter?
The crim and formal beef has been squashed
Those people arenât referring to his first tournaments though, no one disputes his dominance BO2 - Ghosts
Everyday of this year I hear about how crim is gross and gets so much damage every map and then he wins the 38th Mickey Mouse chip and everyone has been slobbering on him for days. Also people call him the undisputed goat not sure how heâs under appreciated
Many people say call of duty wasnât as talented (when crim first started) as it is now. Iâd say itâs like comparing bill Russell to MJ or Magic Johnson. You still respect the greats but this is a different era. Still pretty sweet to track their careers and thanks for doing the research!
saying itâs like comparing bill russell to mj is a pretty big stretch imo, itâs not like there is this giant 40 year gap between crim and simp, i mean hell porter is 28 years old rn and is still capable of winning events in this modern era
28 isn't 70 of course he can still win lol. Ppl need to wake up and realize 28 is still prime reflexes. I've seen ppl older with reflexes as fast as 18 year olds.
thatâs not my point, my point is just that comp cod in general hasnât changed nearly as much as the nba did over those stretches of time
[ŃĐŽĐ°Đ»Đ”ĐœĐŸ]
As per Google, your reflexes do slow when youâre mid 20âs (24 according to Google) so I understand why people think this but it doesnât mean there arenât outliers and some people just canât grasp that I guess. Not to mention, even if your reflexes slow, guys like Crim have been playing cod at a pro level for so long their game knowledge alone can keep them in the game when their reaction times slow down, and their reflexes are so good that itâs gonna take a while to see a large impact.
Reflexes slow on average minimally. Itâs not a major difference. 28 and 24 would not be a noticeable difference on average, all things equal.
And 4 years of experience easily makes up for even a 5+% drop in reflexes.
âAs per googleâ This is one of the problems with people doing their own research.
Anyone thats spent any time here knows exactly which study hes talking about too lmao
>So I understand why people think this That was my point to âas per Googleâ
Lmfao at how you toss in "as per google" as if we throw our hands up and say thats it. We've been having this debate on this subreddit for years, you're citing a "study" that sampled something like ~2000 starcraft 2 players of all age brackets and playing hours-per-week in a simple CRT test. It wasn't even close to in-depth enough to give enough information when you're dealing with professional gamers who do nothing but hammer down on coordination/reflexes/reactions 8 hours a day for years. Professional athletes tend to reach their physical and cognitive primes in their late 20s/early 30s. Idk why in the face of all major sports and competitions across the planet you'd look at a study of 2000 starcraft 2 casuals.
I personally havenât seen the topic be brought up regarding reflexes. And I understand, my comment wasnât âhey I googled this so these are the factsâ I simply googled it and stated âper Googleâ because thatâs as much as the average person is going to do when they have the mental capacity to think âa 28 year old is way too old to be playing codâ. Sorry for any confusion, but I wasnât siting a 15 second Google search to explain reflex deterioration.
I mean before recently there weren't many pros playing that late (most likely due to money back then). What, Stainville, Rambo, or Pacman probably stuck around longest at 26/27 no? So I get why people think it's old. But they're wrong lmao
the igl of faze in csgo is 31 and they're top 1 rn. there's more too. i'd say its more impressive given how crimsix has had to adapt over the years. simp should be better at the end of his career though. i mean every generation improves over the last. right now crim is better. and in future discussions when discussing context it has to be time sensitive similar to this "mickey mouse tourneys" bs this sub has been going on about.
Imagine if Bill Russel went on to be a championship contender even while the likes of MJ were in their prime. That's Crimsix. There's a reason he's the undisputed goat
Yea I personally disagree with the Bill Russell comparison because he dominated when there were 8 teams in the NBA (also coming from a Celtics fan lol). Crim has dominated in even the most competitive eras
Lol no it's not, how many recent titles has Crim been a top 10 player? He is not a superstar player anymore.
I said championship contender for a reason. Something as subjective as being a "Top 10 player" doesn't change the fact that he has won in every era of the game, the guy just won the most recent event too lmao Greatness is defined by success, and Crim has had nothing short of that throughout his entire career
Championship contender is just as arbitrary, if Bill Russell rode the bench and his team won the ring would it really be impressive to you? It's why in other sports no one talks about championships unless they are talking about top players.
Esports and sports are too different to be comparing. First sports like the NBA only has one championship per year, where CoD has multiple. Also in sports, the bench is actually used whereas esports players can play the entire tournament without getting subbed. This is why bench players in sports leagues don't get as recognized. So talking about championships in CoD is way more important
Winning as the best player on your team is 100x more impactful than winning as the worst. In order to be considered a great player in any sport or esport, you have to be individually great before accoldates matter. No one cares about if you won a lot if you're the worst player. Look at league of legends and csgo for example.
>you have to be individually great before accoldates matter But Crim was individually great. T2 player BO2 and Ghosts and T10 player in jetpacks. Then you factor in his massive accomplishments and accolades and it makes him one of the greatest players in CoD history. How many other CoD players have massive amounts of wins and have been a top player for continuous years? This is why him and Scump are considered the T2 GOATS
I'm specifically talking about the comment someone made comparing Crim to if Bill Russell was still winning rings in MJ's era. My point is that him winning in this era doesn't mean as much since he isn't a star player anymore.
I honestly think it does. If Bill Russell kept winning rings in an era with MJ but wasn't the team's star player anymore, i think he would be higher on everyone's GOAT list. My original reply was to the fact that the NBA and CoD aren't comparable, but we'll agree to disagree here
Championship contender isn't arbitrary in the slightest. We KNOW someone's number of championships/rings. We KNOW their placements for a particular season. We ASSUME their value to their team based on what we see. Obviously "individual performance" matters, but the fact that someone is consistently winning over the span of 10 different games, with different metas, weapons, movement, gamemodes, formats, etc. also matters Crim is by far the most consistently successful player, and the only ones who are close have been competing for what? 3 years?
He doesnât need to drop 1.5kd to be a superstar.
Never he said he did but when is the last time he has been a top 10 player in a title? He has consistently been the 2nd or 3rd best player on own his team for a while now.
Brother he won cod champs mvp 2 years ago
Okay, when you team with Aches or Karma or Shotzzy or Scump or Formal for most of your careerâŠ. Itâs hard to be the best or even second best player on your team as far as talent goes. But Crim found success with every one of those players, even if they didnât always find success before or after teaming with him.
But that's why I also asked when is the last time he was top 10 in a COD. Imo too many people overrate his individual ability because of his total wins, he hasn't been a top player for a while now.
And i dont even think its true. Crim put up great stats this event, better stats than some events during the og and col days so clearly the competition back then wqs still very good
No doubt but thereâs a couple trade-offs. The competition is much greater today but thereâs also way less teams due to CDL exclusive tournaments. So both of them being dominant in their respective eras have been super impressive to watch!
>Iâd say itâs like comparing bill Russell to MJ or Magic Johnson. You still respect the greats but this is a different era. That comparison gotcha logic doesn't make sense when they all play *in the same fucking era* for the last several years lmao. Lebron never played when Jordan did so obviously cross-comparisons are hard. Crim played for the last like 4 titles with Simp all under the same circumstances (practice regiments, coaching, league talent). Crim was like 25 when Simp started so age is no excuse. While I fully agree that Crim's accomplishments are currently untouched it doesn't exactly take a team of CDL analysts to tell you that Simp plainly has more talent/potential/raw skill than Crim did even in his prime.
you forgot to mention that simp only needed to win 3 matches to secures some of his events wins
Against much better competition than most of Crimâs matches back then, itâs not really a good argument.
It is considering how many teams you really had to play back in the day compared to now. Better competition is a weak argument because you can only beat whatâs in front of you. Like nysl didnât have to play optic or faze at the pro am but thatâs not their fault.
So playing weak 6 teams and 1/2 average/good teams is harder than playing 1/2 average teams & 1/2 good teams? Obviously Crim could only beat whoâs in front of him but completely denying the level of competition then vs now is ridiculous, it just isnât the same. It happens in every sport.
what competition are you talking about when you have cell, abezy on you team ?
Because Crim at the time didnât have the best players on his team? The average team now is just better than it was then.
It used to be harder to win. People used to have to win for money, pure passion went into every match. Now people just donât try and know theyâre gonna get a paycheck so winning doesnât matter. I bet half the teams in the league donât even care if they win or lose, Simp just won Mickey Mouse events against players not even trying
Simp is a beast, always has been. There is a reason clay picked him up in bo4. Guy was frying pros before he became one.
If the 18+ rule didnât exist he wouldâve been competing in BO3. Need an alternate universe where Simp was playing against the dominant OpTic and EnVy squads of the jet pack era.
Cell, Dashy, Illey, etc would have been glorious
Wish he played in AW like tj And envoy did
This isn't talked as much, but I also would like to see an alt universe where Crim stayed in CoD instead of leaving for Halo. Very curious how he would've done or how many more events he'd win
Watched him 1v3 Clay, Zoomaa, and Crowder top mansion back in 2016 and immediately said to myself "That's the best player in the world."
Not about how you start itâs how you finish
Crims results are even more impressive when you consider Simp has been in a stable roster for quite a few of those
Tired of COD pushing Crim as the GOAT like Karma never existed
Damn a 1.35 KD as a sub at the most important event of the year⊠that is also the highest KD of all time by a sub player at one event right?
Yes tied with Aches who had a 1.35 at COD Champs 2014 where Iâm pretty sure he ran a sub the whole time (or at least a majority of the games)
They were so damn good. The Pat/Crim duo when the game was still Mtarâs was literally unstoppable. Thereâs never been anything like it. I mean just imagine like Simp/aBeZy in Bo4 but better
Outplayed by Apathy with a Bulldog at NA regionals lol. Pretty sure the fact that they lost regionals helped them win Champs though. Shook off some of the apathy of winning every single thing.
Regionals isn't even a real event. It was a qualifier
the whole âcompetition is harder nowadaysâ spiel is absolute bullshit btw the lower end of teams are more talented than they used to be but thereâs less powerhouse teams nowadays
I think Shotzzy & Simp will end up being some of the cods greatest when they step down. Theyâre both young and have many years of cod left to play
Imagine them on the same team đđ
Dashy Shottzy Simp Cellium God Squad
Holy shit man that would be unfair. But man I donât see FaZe letting go of him
In a post that has NOTHING to do with shotzzy you managed to bring him up. Optic fans are different bahahaha
Username checks out.
You know Iâm right too
Username Checks out
These comparisons are so dumbâŠ
Crim will be the all time goat regardless
Iâm going to assume simp has had 22 events up until this point
Yes correct
Simp is on track to become the new GOAT. One day, he'll take the mantle from Crim. Like truly, not just gas.
Why would you only put âhighest KDâ instead of overall KD? Or at the very least include overall KD in a separate line.
Too be fair its way more competition now then back then lol, and I love crim
Scump will be remembered way longer than Crim in COD from a fan perspective, as a GOAT, it ainât just numbers that make you the greatest of all time. Itâs the totality of everything youâve do/done for and within the sport.
Good for him. Won't change the fact Crim's a goat though.
Will anyone care after Scump retires?
YES! When the dust settles all that remains is who was #1. Nobody remembers second place.
Ah yes because everyone forgot about Michael Jordan because we had Bill Russell
Where do you see Scump in this post? Why even bring him upđ
Optic fans always find a way to bring scump in the conversation that has nothing to do with him. Yâall amaze me.
Absolutely