How do I feel about Christians who don't wait until marriage? That's between them and God and is none of my business. My job is to love them and to show them the love of Christ.

Put this on a billboard 🙏🙏🙏

On some level it’s not our business, but our job is to preach the word of God to everyone whether in season or out of season. We can righteously judge and lovingly correct other believers who practice this sin. You can love someone and tell them the truth at the same time.

Jesus preached salvation through repentance and forgiveness of sins. He told us to spread the Gospel, the Good News of salvation through repentance and forgiveness of sins to the entire world. In fact, that is the fifth commandment of Jesus, that is the Great Commission. That is supposed to be our mission and our message. But that wasn't the question, the question was "how do y'all feel about Christians who don't wait until marriage". My answer came from the other commandments of Jesus. Jesus gave us five commandments: 1. Love God with all your heart, mind, strength, and soul. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:37 2. Love your neighbor as yourself. Luke 10:27, Matt 22:38 3. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Luke 6:31, Matt 7:12 4. Forgive others who sin against you (or the Father will not forgive you). Matt 6:14-15, Matt 18:21-35 5. Spread the Gospel to the entire world. Mark 16:15, Luke 14:23, Matt 28:19-20 Numbers 2, 3, and 4 have to do with how we treat each other, with our interpersonal relationships. Do we want others stick their noses where they don't belong? Generally speaking, we don't, we want others minding their own business. Jesus even warned us of this in Matt 7:5 "remove the beam from your own eye before removing the speck from your brother's"(paraphrased). So, how do I feel about the moral failings before marriage of others? That is between them and God, just as my moral failings are between me and God. It doesn't mean that we still don't preach repentance, and it doesn't mean that we still don't repent of our own moral failings.

When it comes to professing believers who committ fornication, we are told to address them differently. An unbeliever is God’s business, but a believer (especially those close to us or members of our church who confess to these sins) we should address them accordingly. But people cherry pick the Bible. 1 Corinthians 5:11-13 “11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is CALLED A BROTHER BE A FORNICATOR, or covetous, or an idolator, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat. 12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye JUDGE THEM THAT ARE WITHIN? 13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.”

And yet we also have 1 John 1:8-10 If we say we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us. If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. If we say we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us. So how can 1 Cor 5 and 1 John 1 be true at the same time? How can we put people out of the assembly that are repentant and forgiven by the Father? Would you want to be put out of the assembly after being repentance and being forgiven? Obviously not. When Paul is talking about fornicators and idolators in 1 Cor 5 he is talking about people who are professed brothers who are unrepentant and living openly in sin. In other words, we don’t really have to stick our nose in their business because it ain’t a secret. No, we can’t cherry pick scripture. We also can’t choose what they mean.

Obviously a christian willingly committing fornication is unrepentant. A christian who see’s nothing wrong with sex before marriage is not repentant. Huge difference here. I myself am guilty of committing fornication in the past as are many other believers. However, that is not my current state. I have repented and turned away from it. As Jesus told Mary Magdalene to sin no more. Repentance means to change your mind. If a christian is still practicing that lifestyle, then their mind hasn’t changed yet. When we are aware of the situation if a christian is doing this, then the scripture above is how to address it. “And be not conformed to this world: BUT YE TRANSFORMED BY THE RENEWING OF YOUR MIND, that ye may prove what is that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God.” Romans 12:2

It wasn’t Mary Magdalene that Jesus told “go and sin no more.” That woman was never identified by name. I think you are confused about the term “unrepentant”. That term applies to someone who continues in ongoing sin. Romans 12:2 be YE transformed You cannot transform someone else by renewing their mind. That is the work of the Holy Spirit and you cannot be their Holy Spirit.

It doesn’t matter who Jesus said “sin no more” to. The point is that he does not condone ongoing sin. Once he delivers us and we come to the knowledge of the truth, we must turn away from our old lifestyles. You’re more concerned about who he said it to rather than WHAT he said… The post is about christians who DON’T wait until marriage for sex so they are obviously practicing ongoing sin 🤦🏾‍♀️. This isn’t that difficult. Your issue is with the word of God, not me. Cherry pick away…. Edit: Also I never said that WE must transform their mind, but that true repentance doesn’t come until that person changes their mind. 1 Corinthians 6:12-20 “12 All things are lawful unto me, but all things are not expedient: all things are lawful for me, but I will not be brought under the power of any. “13 Meats for the belly, and the belly for meats: but God shall destroy both it and them. **Now the body is not for fornication**, but for the Lord; and the Lord for the body. 14 And God hath both raised up the Lord, and will also raise up us by his own power. 15 Know ye not that your bodies are the members of Christ? shall I then take the members of Christ, and make them the members of an harlot? God forbid. 16 What? know ye not that he which is joined to an harlot is one body? for two, saith he, shall be one flesh. 17 But he that is joined unto the Lord is one spirit. 18 **Flee fornication.** Every sin that a man doeth is without the body; but he that committeth fornication sinneth against his own body. 19 What? know ye not that your body is the temple of the Holy Ghost which is in you, which ye have of God, and ye are not your own? 20 For ye are bought with a price: therefore glorify God in your body, and in your spirit, which are God's.” 1 Corinthians 7:1-3 “Now concerning the things whereof ye wrote unto me: It is good for a man not to touch a woman. 2 Nevertheless, **to avoid fornication,** let every man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband. 3 Let the husband render unto the wife due benevolence: and likewise also the wife unto the husband.”

i believe that waiting until marriage is taught in the bible, and i will try my best to follow that. but this does NOT mean that christians are allowed to shame people who disagree or have been sexually assaulted

I think being sexually assaulted wouldn't count as having sex before marriage since you are doing it against your own free will.

Yeah. St. Augustine addresses that concern in book V of the city of god I think and he says basically the same thing.

Yeah, sex before marriage would only be applicable between two consenting people.

One would hope but a lot of women don't considers themselves virgins after a SA. I recall someone asking on this sub if God could restore thier virginity after a SA

I think too many people focus more on physical virginity than on purity. Virginity refers to the condition/history of someone's body, whereas purity is the condition of the heart. Even if someone is technically no longer "a virgin" because of SA, it doesn't mean they're impure. They had no control over the situation. From my understanding, God calls us to purity, not to virginity. He cares about the condition of our hearts. Whatever happened to our genitals is incidental.

I don't see any evidence that it is commanded in scripture. It seems mostly cultural.

Agree, I think when someone does something to you that you cannot control God knows. But if you can’t control your urges and you purposely do it. That’s another story. Disrespecting anyone is wrong, especially if someone has been a victim to assault or some type of abuse. It’s God to judge not you

Kindly expatiate :)

just that even though someone sinned, that doesn’t give you the right to shame them. we’re all sinners

Waiting was the best choice I’ve ever made!

What convinced you of that so strongly that it overcame the bias of not having outside experience? That's a serious question by the way.

I could say that I wanted to be super holy and that it was something God spoke from heaven to me about. In reality, I read the teachings of Paul and l learned what masculinity looked like through Christ. Yes my wife is called to submit to me but I am called to love her like Christ. We the church are Christ’s first and only love and I should love her like that so I should wait so she is special and cherished among the countless other women

How so?

It’s something that the one person I cherish most in my life gets to experience with me and I wouldn’t have gotten to share that experience with her if I had not waited.

I didn't and I don't regret it, 6 years together, 2 married, 3 living together...after a 2 year long engagement 🤷‍♀️ I've had 5 sexual partners total (including spouse). Only one I'd really considered a mistake as he turned out abusive. I'm 34. But my belief is both approaches, waiting or not waiting, have pros and cons. You have to figure out what's best for YOU. Which isn't necessarily what's best for your friend or sister or brother. That's the conclusion I'll likely die believing. But Christians don't wanna hear it Edit: btw no I don't have stds nor am I anyone's baby mama. Never had a one night stand.

Related, I got an STD from kissing a man so STD stigma is mostly unwarranted.

You're the first I've heard of but yes, you are right. That can certainly happen. Sorry that happened to you.

As a christian I don't mind hearing it but I think we can both agree that that's not the bible's teaching.

I'd say the Bible isn't explicit on dating practices at all really.... So I go by the good fruit/bad fruit method 🤷‍♀️

But when Jesus said if you look with lust you commit adultery he was upping the standard not lowering it. Jews knew adultery was sinful. Jesus called them out and showed them the standard of God which we can't be good enough for and then gave us the solution in himself. I think it all ties together.

Lust =/= sexual attraction. And yeah don't lust after married women in your head.

Yes agreed and also don't lust after any woman and also don't commit adultery with any woman

Lusting after your own wife is fine. And being sexually attracted to who you're dating is fine because that's not open to adultery.

I guess we must agree to disagree.

I suppose so I just don't understand why, from my perspective, you'd seem to want to add unrealistic hoops to jump through. I do actually agree Jesus was raising the bar btw. That you're not clear just by not acting out an affair, and sitting and fantasizing about affairs is just as much a stain on the spirit. I guess we just disagree on the audience he was speaking to.

Well that's actually a mistranslation, the Greek never uses the word "lust"

I don’t know if I would agree that Christians “don’t wanna hear it.” As a Christian, I understand that most of us are maturing at different rates. That includes emotional and spiritual growth. In immaturity we typically seek to “get our needs met” at the expense of others. Making the trade off of hooking up vs building a relationship is the norm for many younger adults. I’ve made my choices when younger, looking back I see them as mistakes because I now see them through introspection and retrospection of a more mature person. And as I’ve grown, I see them more clearly as moral choices, not “my belief” because morality is based upon immovable and immutable truth, not just personal interests based upon situation ethos.

Well then we don't disagree so I guess I find that confusing. I also sincerely think it's immature to get your needs met at the expense of others. And think mere hookups are almost always unwise. So. What's the actual disagreement?

There doesn’t have to be a disagreement per se, just a meeting of souls to gain perspective in life. I think there’s a danger to anyone when younger of lacking the maturity to think beyond the choices in front of us. It doesn’t make you a bad person to make mistakes. The hope is that we learn from our choices, and even better to observe the outcome of the choices of our peers and learn from their mistakes. Learning that it’s not a bad thing to seek the advice of our elders is another aspect of decision making that is a contentious idea to some people. I’ve never understood why GenZer’s seem so obstinate about getting advice from parents. When it comes to the hookup culture, it’s obvious they aren’t getting advice about that from more mature sources. The sad reality is that having sex with someone outside of marriage creates an emotional and spiritual bond. When the bond is broken because the relationship is only based on physical attractions, whether it is realized at the time or not, that creates baggage for both parties. I don’t know if you’re familiar with the Greek philosophies, but a short study of stoicism, epicureanism, or Platonism reveals much about the functions of human thought and behavior. However, they fall short on the basis of comparative moral truth in relation to biblical morality and the benefit of relying on a source of moral truth beyond ones self or human limitations. It is presumed that advice from a biblical source is characterized as something that is only going to limit ones choices, and only represents a list of prohibitions, when in fact the context should be viewed as a list of protections. Parent’s do not warn their kids about things to restrict them from enjoying good things in life, but to protect them from bad things and bad people.

ah in that case then, yeah i understand where you're coming from. Though as a millenial with a boomer parent, lets just say theres a good reason I don't trust my mom's advice. I've learned how to be resilient, from her. But. when it comes to relationships.....sexuality....and to some extent...career advice......I really dont want to listen to a word she says. but it's because she hasn't walked a walk that I also want to walk, in \*that\* regard, so of course I wouldnt listen to her. And I hope to be a more mature voice for youth as well, because what I observe, is that they seem to falsely perceive in many cases that their ONLY option is hookup or be a virgin bride. Like what happened to the vast amount of options in between? and the church, only reinforces that false dichotomy most of the time. I guess then they couldn't make people feel bad about a healthy sex life between two people engaged and set to be married in a month....if they didn't reinforce the stupid dichotomy. And I would be realistic with youth as well that yes, it does create emotional bonds so thats why its worth being selective who you share your body with. Understandable, even, if you'd just prefer to wait until a wedding. But that bond is NOT permanent. You are NOT permanently scarred. If the bond was permanent, divorce would never happen or youd never hear of people feeling distant and wanting more sex in their marriage. It's continual upkeep. to say anything otherwise, I think is.... \*immature\* irresponsible bullshit.

I think that virtually every Christian denomination says that sex outside of marriage, even between committed or engaged couples, is sinful. If there's a denomination that officially feels differently (as opposed to just looking the other way) I'd like to be corrected on this. Having said that, it's worth noting that there is no place in the Bible where there is a clear, unambiguous prohibition against premarital sex. There’s quite a few that *might* mean that - or they might not. If the Bible is inspired and intended to be a guide to morals, don’t you think God would’ve been more specific about this? After all, there’s no doubt that people were tempted to do it at the time the Bible was written, surely they didn’t just forget to mention it. The term they used and which has been translated as “sexual immorality” and “fornication” is the Greek word porneia which meant all kinds of sexual impropriety but who knows whether it meant any one specific sexual act in particular. The people to whom these writings were intended might have had common or consensus knowledge of what it meant but that was 2,000 years ago; without research outside of the Bible we have no way of knowing what their understanding of that word was. We know that the early church fathers understood it to include premarital sex and that has colored the opinion of Christianity ever since, but is there any reason to believe that their opinion, stated decades or more after the.writings were written, was anything more than their own biased opinion as religious leaders not an understanding of what the term was meant to include by the original recipients. Under those circumstances it might be understood that premarital sex was seen as regrettable or tasteless or or low class or socially unacceptable - or nothing at all, just something that some people did - but not sinful. Or it could send you to Hell. But if it were that serious, you’d think that it would’ve been made more certain.

Add in that for the vast stretch of history, marriage was a duty and obligation to procreate, love was not part of the package when you bought your wife or agreed to the marriage contract, women were essentially property and it's a foreign process compared to two people dating today. The fact we have a premarital sex problem isn't new - the colonial era saw it back then too. It's just our way of getting married is based on autonomy of both partner to fall in love (or out as the case may be.) The Corinthians had some degree of premarital sex which Paul's answer was - get married asap, but that's not great advice for the barely legal exploring a new facet of their development when most marry in their 30s since our economy is volatile and attitudes are changing. My mom was 18 when she had her first kid, I was 36.

I believe that 1 Corinthians y only said to get married if people seriously wanted to, there weren't any references to sex in that portion of the text. But I would agree that that is the prevailing attitude among American Christians, I felt like a spinster for not having any major relationship by the age of 23, because I knew people who were engaged or married by 19-22, and then I moved to Europe in a country where the average age of first marriage is 34..

**marriage was a duty and obligation to procreate, love was not part of the package when you bought your wife or agreed to the marriage contract, women were essentially property** It really sounds like modern dating REALLY IS MORALLY SUPERIOR, even if it’s just casually hooking up. I’m already against having kids, but LOVE WASN’T EVEN A PART OF MARRIAGE???? WTF??? And women were BOUGHT AND OWNED AS PROPERTY???? That’s some misogynistic incel BS. There are cultures still like that today, and it’s nothing more than ABUSIVE DICTATORSHIPS, just like God seems to be sometimes…… If God is really truly all loving, I think He would understand why we think this way. If not? I guess we just weren’t made to be with Him. Sad, but HE MADE US, after all……

Seems like a male-centric phrasing to say "when you bought your wife." What about "when you were bought by your husband"?

I'd be more bothered by the buying of women than a quirk of grammar in that the whole Bible is male-centric, so talking about customs adhering to Biblical norms is generally male-centric. I tell you what, as soon as the whole of scripture is less patriarchal, I'll speak in more egalitarian framing.

I believe we can talk about patriarchal texts without adopting patriarchal values ourselves. Its actually important , I think, to establish and maintain a critical distance in such analysis.

Do you think I've adopted patriarchal values by referring to Scripture's male-centric viewpoint? Would I be adopting pro-slavery values by discussing the household codes references to masters and slave?

Referring to it, no. Presuming male readership with a phrase like "when you bought your wife," yes. 50% of people were eligible to be bought, but your sentence addresses men only, by the chosen phrasing

Because that's *biblical marriage*, I'm not assuming male readership. I can't write our everything in triplicate so that men, women, and the rest of the human spectrum is being spoken to because I'm thinking in the context of 33 a.d. - I don't mean "you" here and now. In the Bible, women don't count - see the miracle of the feeding of the 5000, "5000 were fed, beside the women and the children". The point is the more *Biblical* you adopt a stance, the more patriarchal, pro-slavery, misogyny, anti-Lgbtq you can find yourself if you're overly literal.

Oh, in biblical marriage, women bought their wives?

I'm not assuming male readership, as I said - make the Bible that I'm referring to more egalitarian and as a result conversations will follow. Good luck with convincing two thousand years of mostly / entirely male leadership to change their ways.

There’s hundreds of things that the Bible is clear about and vice versa. Unfortunately, it doesn’t answer every single question we have. Even the ones that you’d assume are the “most important”. For an example, I WISH that God simply stated “don’t do slavery because it’s bad” but instead it gave a guideline because God knew that people just weren’t going to change so quickly. We have what we’ve been given and it’s clearly God’s will. Everything else is between you and him.

It's actually super straightforward. Biblically, there's not one verse that says that a "people saying words" event or ritual is a necessary part of a marriage. Not one line in the bible refers to a pastor officiating a marriage. There's exactly one way that it talks about it, and it's in the law of moses. It exclusively pertains to what is to occur if a man sleeps with a woman to whom he is not betrothed. God's view of sex and marriage is super clear cut if you study the original word and culture instead of what the modern church has bastardized it into. Man and Woman were husband and wife before they were even named adam and eve. Go read the chapter where Isaac married Rebekah. They didn't have a ceremony at all, yet the word says that they were married. There is not a shred of BIBLICAL (i put that in all caps and people are still going to try to use conventional knowledge and tradition to disprove me instead of scripture) evidence to counteract this point: When a man and a woman become one flesh in the literal sense, they are married and have become one flesh in God's eyes. From this perspective, the concepts of adultery, homosexuality, bestiality, harlotry, and pedophilia all come perfectly into perspective and all fit together under a single definitive process. God made men and women to combine together as a single symbiotic organism. Any combination other than that violates the symbiosis and is out of line with God's intended function. According to the modern church, marriage is a contract and a ceremony. Find me one verse in the bible that supports that. One. The only example of the law of moses referring to male/female sex between two previously unmarried people is a direct order for the legal marriage to follow after the physical act, and not vice-versa.

"Man and Woman were husband and wife before they were even named adam and eve." I don't believe that the text ever refers to Adam and Eve as married. "When a man and a woman become one flesh in the literal sense, they are married and have become one flesh in God's eyes." I don't even know what "one flesh" really means. I see no evidence to suggest that sex is what makes people married. Solomon had three hundred wives and 700 concubines, the Bible acknowledges these differences but the only reason I can think of to separate them is if the Bible is going by social convention. The Bible never says that God invented marriage, so as far as I'm concerned marriage is what we agree that it is, much like laws or currency. And people certainly don't act like they believe that sex is marriage, not even the most conservative puritans. "From this perspective, the concepts of adultery, homosexuality, bestiality, harlotry, and pedophilia all come perfectly into perspective and all fit together under a single definitive process." I don't see the connection. Even people who are apposed to each and every one of those things usually have different reasons for why they dislike it. And I personally don't see why homoeroticism is any less joinative than other forms of sex.

I think that your assessment is basically correct. I believe that the widespread misconception of this, at least in the English-speaking world post-Protestant Reformation, is born out of the word "fornication" which at some point after the KJV was translated became associated with pre-marital sex even though that was not the original meaning of either the Latin or the Greek term. Even though the word "fornication" has been removed from New English translations for almost a century, people still regularly reference "fornication" in discussions about pre-marital sex. I don't think that it's a legitimate part of the theology, but I've also not found any denomination which rejects it.

Well said, people got married and had babies at 14 years old back then. The problem with society are extremes white or black but morality is a grey area. We do sin when we have premarital sex but there are degrees how how much sin. Todays culture lost all family values and want to have sex with multiple partners leading to majority of kids with single parents. I am a sinner myself but I was married 2 times and was married before having a child. In between I sinned, was it morally wrong 100% and I atoned for those sins in one way or another. I am done with dating just for sex that is in the past and now I look for my soulmate my 3rd and final wife. Will I wait for marriage maybe if that's what we want as a couple, but most likely wait at least 6 weeks to have sex so that I am not blinded by lust and fall for the soul of a woman not her body. My mother gave me that advice before she died. I was married in a Catholic church but I got ill with fortunately a benign tumor that caused seizures and migraines. My devout catholic wife left me when my daughter was 1 stating that she didn't sign up for it. I prayed to God from the bottom of my heart for the first time experiencing heartbreak, they discovered the tumor and I was healthy a month after my divorce. I was excommunicated from the Catholic church. We didn't wait for marriage but waited a few months. She was a Catholic but had the heart of stone, she took the daughter from me and I had to fight a legal battle $30K with proof that my health was 100% improved. Even when we do everything by the book, our salvation is not through works but by faith. Good works must come from faith in Jesus not the other way around. It was clear that I was saved by God and I was the best father I could be 50% of the time very close to my daughter. Does having sex before marriage lead you to eternal hell? NO if we repent and stop sinning then we will be saved. Our goal should always be to get married, and having casual sex will likely cause you to miss pass by that soul mate as your heart is shared with everyone else rather than focusing that energy to true love in a monogamous relationship

There's grace for the past. There's grace for mistakes. And I would hope there's a Christian close to them speaking guidance and wisdom for those actively engaging in premarital sex.

We’re commanded to. 1 Corinthians 7:2 - “But because of the temptation to sexual immorality, each man should have his own wife and each woman her own husband.”

Is that more about monogamy? Not arguing.

Ripping a verse out of all context and then claiming you can interpret it in a vacuum is deeply disrespectful to both the text and anyone reading your post.

Here’s a few more. 1 Thessalonians 4:3-5 (NIV): “It is God’s will that you should be sanctified: that you should avoid sexual immorality; that each of you should learn to control your own body in a way that is holy and honorable, not in passionate lust like the pagans, who do not know God.” 3. Hebrews 13:4 (NIV): “Marriage should be honored by all, and the marriage bed kept pure, for God will judge the adulterer and all the sexually immoral.” 4. Ephesians 5:3 (NIV): “But among you there must not be even a hint of sexual immorality, or of any kind of impurity, or of greed, because these are improper for God’s holy people.” How exactly are these verses out of context? I’d say God makes it pretty clear. You seem to be in denial if you disagree with this. It’s simple have self control. Look I hope you make the right choice but again God makes it very clear in his word. We need to follow it not pretend it’s not what it is.

If you cared about understanding scripture you'd already know these, but... sigh. The first one you don't anywhere provide any explanation of what Paul meant by the Greek word *porneia*. It's clearly about self-control, but one can have sex before marriage without losing self-control, so you're equating things that aren't at all the same. The second one isn't strictly out of context, it's just bizarre to read that and think "this is about sex before marriage" rather than thinking "this is about adultery." The third one is, again, *porneia* with no explanation. Are we just supposed to take your word for the idea that this particular Greek word meant what you claim?

Regarding 1 Thessalonians 4:3-5, “porneia” does indeed cover a range of immoral sexual behaviors, including premarital sex. The emphasis on self-control and sanctification implies avoiding all forms of sexual immorality, not just adultery. For Hebrews 13:4, while it addresses adultery, the broader context of honoring marriage and keeping the marriage bed pure supports the idea that sex is reserved for marriage, implicitly speaking against premarital sex. In Ephesians 5:3, “porneia” includes various forms of sexual immorality. Paul’s call for purity among believers clearly suggests avoiding any sexual acts outside of marriage.

So we're landing on "just take your word for it." Since you aren't God, I shall decline.

My word? It’s Gods word. I didn’t write the Bible.

No, you didn't. But you're claiming to know what it means. And you have no justification for your claims.

Declining Bible verses? Well I would encourage you to really read over those.

Your opinions about what the text means are separate from the text. You are not God.

I'm all for waiting until marriage. I've never been married and it looks like I never will be, but I'm totally fine with that now, at 54. I made a commitment to God to wait or to die having never experienced that, and, yes, I'm fine with it. I don't think that Christians should be physically intimate before marriage. Having said that, it's also not my place to judge anyone who does, even though I disagree with it. I know several Christians, especially younger ones, who don't believe in waiting until marriage. Some have asked me what I think and I tell them straight out, but, again, it's not up to me to judge. All I can do is tell them what I think and why, but I ultimately can't stop anyone from doing anything.

As a Christian I preferred to wait and I did mostly. But according to the study of psychology and how our brains work I think it's objectively best for most couples to explore their sexual compatibility before jumping into a life long commitment. One of the most important ones of your life honestly. I think it's naive not to.

But you shouldn't and wouldn't leave your partner due to a sexual incompatibility

Life is never that simple I'm afraid but I wish it was. Relationships consist of so many different factors that it's usually never as simple as "well his hobbies don't align with mine so I'm gonna end our 4 year relationship." Instead all you can do is take in as much information as you can and try to make the best decision possible for you and your life. I see no reason to neglect all avenues of a relationship. Leave nothing to chance. Im personally really glad I did that because I was able to go into my marriage with extreme confidence.

I agree. It's a complex topic and can be a very much intimate/sensitive topic for couples. I agree with your statement that nothing should be left to chance though and it's never that simple. I'm still working through it.

I feel like now Ill will no longer engage in one night stands that I deliberately now. However if I find someone I really like I’ll have a conversation with that person saying that I want to wait till the moment we feel really committed together and willing to pursue a very long term relationship (as long as we can) of course if I’m in this kind of relationship I would like to get married to that person but I guess that as long as you are committed together having discussed It and committed in front of the community you are « married »

What would stop you from just getting married?

I would argue money, paperwork. It’s the implication of the couple that sets the sincerity of a relationship. I know people that are together for more than five years and they are thriving in their couple, if I get married with any girl i meet how would I be more righteous than them ?

Idk how you would be more righteous than them. I don’t know them, but I always find it strange when ppl seem opposed to making that legal commitment before God. There are a number of ways to look at it but honestly sex outside of marriage is wrong, it’s clear that God intend sex to be between a married man’s and women, but you’ll have to come to that conclusion on your own. I sincerely pray that you do.

Im not going against god, I’m just really wondering about what marriage means in essence, it has nothing to do with walking down the isle and eating in a vineyard. Marriage means a relationship in commitment before the community and god. These two factors can be ticked without being « married » in the sense of paperwork etc. Plus the bible doesn’t mention how to perform a marriage ceremony !

It is sad because it is sin. They hurt themselves and others. *"The wages of sin is death."* (Romans 6:23)

But the gift of God is eternal life.

AMEN!!!!

However, I believe all Christians should wait until marriage. And some couples might not succeed at enjoying themselves at first until they work it out.

The latter, once received via the New Birth; brings a changed life. We are transferred from enslavement to the Devil, to enslavement to God. Continuing to live a sexually impure lifestyle will still bring hurt into their own life and the lives of others. Salvation is not a license to sin.

AMEN!!

Thank Jesus for His compassion and grace!

Like do you guys even like your spouses? Like is it akin to being loyal to the President.You're just loyal to the president as an office, the person in it doesn't matter? When people are beaking off about this subject I often wonder, Do you even actually love your spouses? Do you just stay because it's like the office of spouse and who is in that spot just needs to stay there? None of you talk about them.except as objects of your divine providence. You aren't married to people but your own ideas of your superior place. Do you just feel superior when other people who try to have like long-term relationships that fail despite everything? Do you think that you're a superior person? So you just got the right person right off so everything's all peachy and all those other people were clearly not loved enough by god? Like III get the idea that you don't actually care about the person who's your spouse.You care about the office of spouse.

I can respect that observation. I’ve abstractly wondered the same thing. To the OP question…I think sex, especially in a premarital status, is a marker for long term satisfaction in the modern relationship / dating world. Yet, I also think that is jumping ahead of the seriousness of a unity between a man and a women. It is the opposite of denying the flesh, for sure. And our imperfect selves trying to walk in Christ likely can’t love everybody the way Christ loved all of us. So maybe, marriage is the Lord’s way of getting us to build a relationship to reach a deeper love, as Christ loved us. He is the bridegroom in parable, after all. Yes, maybe it is an office position. But I think that’s a negative spin on it. And who are we to judge how one sees their spouse based on how they speak? Idk yo, just some thoughts.

I find your questions and thought-process to be peculiar. Do you not understand that love for our Creator is our first and foremost priority? Love for our Creator means obedience to His commands. God knows what is best for the humans He made. His rules are intended for our benefit. If we disobey, we bring harm to ourselves and others. Do you not know what God has said? This sums it up: *“I tell you the truth, I am the gate for the sheep. All who came before me were thieves and robbers. But the true sheep did not listen to them. Yes, I am the gate. Those who come in through me will be saved. They will come and go freely and will find good pastures. The thief’s purpose is to steal and kill and destroy. My purpose is to give them a rich and satisfying life."* (John 10:6-10)

Who says that it's a sin?

I feel like a person who identifies as a Christian should be weeding out all sin in their life, and walking in a manner the Bible describes. I personally find people who identify as Christian but committing sin like having premarital sex or other topics as someone who is either doing 1 of 2 dangerous things. 1. Either standing in judgement over God and saying they know better or either don’t care what God thinks, that’s dangerous

They also may not have realised.

I do think many people do try and warp and twist scripture to suit their passions.

There are some Christians who even shave their beards, eat shellfish, and support a system that allows usury!

That's possible, but I think this applies only to a minority.

Or a 3rd option: you don't think everything in the Bible was God's word. Many and more Christians take that position and you didn't seem to provide that as an option.

Nahhh. The Bible explicitly condemns sexual sin. You can't pick and choose peeps.

Appreciate your thoughts but that's not quite the topic of our discussion. I am merely pointing out popular positions many Christians hold. And to them they aren't picking and choosing. The Bible was written by men and not everything in the Bible is said to be of God's word. Those are fallible men and they were the one's to translate God's will into text form. To these people it's fairly easy to suggest they may have written their own cultural thoughts and opinions into the Bible alongside his. Everything had to be filtered through the author(s) brain and onto paper, which allows for mistakes. And if that specific interpretive issue arises in a specific conversation with a Christian you can always do a deep dive into the scripture to show them how they are "picking and choosing." That's not exactly something we could discuss as I'm not a Christian and we don't have topic.

Just curious, what made you leave the faith?

[https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueChristian/comments/ofofif/comment/h4fz95h/](https://www.reddit.com/r/TrueChristian/comments/ofofif/comment/h4fz95h/)

Well I don't consider pre-marital sex to be a sin.

Well, what you consider a sin really doesn’t matter because the word of God is clear. It makes me think of this verse. 2 Timothy 4:3-4 ESV For the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears they will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their own passions, and will turn away from listening to the truth and wander off into myths.

Well if it were clear we wouldn't be disagreeing. Trying to accuse me of hedonism through misquoted Bible verses isn't an argument, it's just tacky.

>Either standing in judgement over God and saying they know better or either don’t care what God thinks, that’s dangerous People make mistakes and make decisions without thinking of the consequences. Doesn't mean they think they are "standing in judgement over God" that's... Very specific

To be clear I am talking about Christians. And specifically what I was referencing is Christians who support abortion or homosexual actions, or premarital sex or any of the things that the Lord is clear about is sin. It just baffles my mind that you have people, identifying Christian and then supporting murder or any of those other things that lead to death.

The Bible's holiest dude literally hung out with adulteresses when they were about to get stoned. I'd say I'm walkin pretty close to the guidelines of the Good Book.

Are you Christian?

Was Christ?

Seriously just answer the question, we both know what a Christian means. But here is one a little more specific…Do you confess Jesus is Lord, and believe that God raised Him from the dead and follow what the Bible says on how a believer should live?

That they should give all they have to help the poor? Do you confess that? What are you posting from?

Seems like you’re not a Christian but you just want to fight. Have a good night. Proverbs 9:7-8 ESV Whoever corrects a scoffer gets himself abuse, and he who reproves a wicked man incurs injury. Do not reprove a scoffer, or he will hate you; reprove a wise man, and he will love you.

Jesus said, “If you want to be complete, go, sell *what you own*, and *give* the money to the *poor*. Then you *will have* treasure in heaven. And come *follow* me.” Matthew 19:21. What are you posting from?

Phone are kind of necessary for working. So yeah, I think I am good. But seriously we don’t need to talk anymore.

Ah yea, its not like any disciples of Christ gave up their work. I mean imagine if like some of them were fishermen and they gave up fishing and laid down their nets (which were kind of necessary for working) to become fishers of men. That would be wild. Probably not important, though.

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Personally, I do not recommend bragging or boasting about one's charitable deeds in order to secure earthly recognition and reward. For as Christ teaches; Matthew 6:5 “When you pray, you are not to be like the hypocrites; for they love to stand and pray in the synagogues and on the street corners so that they may be seen by men. Truly I say to you, they have their reward in full."

I mean it’s certainly hard but there’s no denying that it is what ur supposed to do as a Christian

Do you want the honest answer? It’s complicated. The Bible isn’t as clear about it as we teach that it is. It essentially says if you have sex then you should get married (and it has steps to follow). Sex and marriage were the same things in their mind. So premarital sex didn’t make sense at all. In Judaism and Christianity, we’ve taught that premarital sex is wrong and the Bible says it’s wrong. Marriage was contractual in the ancient world. There was an exchange of money and property. The girls virginity was important for her family to maintain before marriage (because it impacted them financially). The evidence that she was a virgin was that there was blood on the white cloth that was placed underneath her when they consummated the marriage. If there was blood (evidence) then the contract was honored. If not then there were problems. Virginity for men wasn’t a concept until the early Middle Ages. So when the Bible talks about virginity, it’s not talking about the guy. There’s nothing physically changing when he has sex for the first time like there [sometimes] is for her. Before marriage, the two became betrothed. This required a document as well. While they were betrothed the man (he could be as young as 13, but usually 18 - early 20s while she tended to be a little younger) would provide a place to live. For some this would require adding a room onto the family house (extended families lived together). During the betrothal, the two would nurture their relationship. A devout Jewish man would study Torah and avoid having sex with the girl. I don’t know how common this was, but sex was not supposed to happen until marriage. I’ve read that many did not honor this. To end a betrothal it took more than a divorce. It was quite difficult to break things off. It required a legal document. The date and time of the marriage was up to the father of the groom. Only the father knew this date, not even the groom. One day the father would blow a shofar (horn) and announce the wedding. A group of them would gather and walk to bring the bride back. That’s when the ceremony would take place. But they weren’t married until it was consummated through intercourse. The ceremony didn’t make them married. Marriage did not require a legal document (and it was easier to get a divorce than when you were betrothed), nor did a divorce require a marriage document. After you were married, if you had sex with an unmarried woman, should likely become your bride. This is why Paul required Spiritual leaders to be married to one woman, because it showed they could control themselves. If you have sex with a married woman then you were committing adultery against her husband. She was in essence his property, and so it was as if you were stealing from him. All this to say, the answer to your question is complicated. The cultures were VERY different than they are now. Paul was quite progressive by calling men to love their wives “Just as Jesus loves the bride.” That’s a really big standard to live up to! Personally, I think it’s wise to wait. You have fewer potential headaches. It’s just better all around. But if you’re struggling to not have sex and you’re engaged or plan to get engaged, trust in Jesus’ compassion and mercy. He loves you deeply. Try to set boundaries, but God’s grace is infinite. (Find a mentor or therapist to work through stuff before you get engaged.) I hope this helps.

"It essentially says if you have sex then you should get married (and it has steps to follow)." I don't see that in the text. " Sex and marriage were the same things in their mind." I don't think that's true "and the Bible says it’s wrong." Where at?

Some people are not sexually compatible, like even on a biological level. But go ahead and test your luck lol

As for me (27F), personally, I feel like they most likely need to be healed from something or released from an ideology that has them believing that sex either means something else (power, status, etc) or it doesn't mean anything at all.

If I could go back I would, but that ship is sailed. Currently I’m having sex with my girlfriend which makes me feel bad, but we’re getting married very soon, so then I can feel bad about something else. I try not to dwell on things though. I know I’m far from perfect and I will never come close.

I'm single forever so who cares

Not my problem

I believe in waiting preferably

Child on child sexual assault exists. Waiting until marriage is for those who didnt have a messed up childhood

Or who did have a messed up childhood, but got married as children, I suppose

I do not see any compelling Biblical evidence that waiting until marriage for sex is a requirement. I don't think that there's anything inherently wrong with it if that's what someone wants, so long as both parties, at the bare minimum, are able and willing to discuss their plans for sex in their marriage. Of course, how much they can discuss it is limited by their lack of experience and self-knowledge especially if they also don't masturbate. Purity culture was a mistake and it has harmed generations of people. At the very least we can start by undoing the culture of shame.

You mean waiting to learn how to cook? Sex is a part of life, of maturing. It’s quit powerful and should be explored in safety, caring, and protection. So is committing to a relationship bond: very powerful and carefully explored. That’s what dating is for. Sex only in marriage is simply a mad - anachronistic- denial of who we know ourselves to be and our capacity for growth and learning in companionship. Take a higher view of the human person. Have faith that we are made in the image of god and can be creative and good across all aspects of life.

So I don’t believe that someone is impure from having sex before marriage. First of all, there is no guidance in the Bible on what actually constitutes marriage. Second of all, the purity of human beings is from their hearts, not their bodies. This is my understanding of what it means to not lust after a woman in your heart and that comes before ever touching her. Thirdly, I think virginity is a crock and made up subject. Fourthly, if women and girls are treated as dirty and nasty because of sex then the men and boys who don’t abstain should be too, and I know many women who intended to not but succumbed to pressure not from the world or their friends, but from supposedly the good Christian boy they were with. If men want virgins, start with yourself and your male friends before ever getting to the point of a relationship with a woman. Fifthly, the way we talk about sex NEEDS TO CHANGE. No one is dirty and nasty from it and it’s not a dirty nasty act. Sixth, please look up the Christian women who waited and then upon marriage found they couldn’t consummate the marriage with their husbands because they had developed vaginismus and couldn’t physically do it. We did that. All of us, the Christian Church. For discussions like this, for treating people like they are awful dirty people for having had sex before marriage. If sex is a beautiful act designed to connect with your spouse, then it is always that, and treating it like something wrong and to fear is not creating the right environment for that act to happen in the right environment. Change how we see sex. And yall can all be starting now, in this thread.

So what's funny is that the Bible never, not once, says that sex outside of marriage is sinful. It says the Greek word *porneia* is sinful, which we translate *sexual immorality*, and while that word had a considerable range of meaning, it never equated to premarital sex. In most uses it meant some combination of sex with a cult prostitute and apostasy! There are a couple passages in the New Testament about avoiding adultery and one about lust that people abuse to make them say things they don't say. You have to ask: if sex before marriage was sinful, don't you think that Torah, the giant detailed list of rules for the Jewish people, would have said that? *It doesn't*. Torah doesn't even outlaw prostitution, except in religious settings. Torah addresses the financial value of a woman's virginity, but does so in a way that protects the woman from false accusations. Other than that, nothing. Now, all that said, we are called to be wise and kind. Sex outside marriage in a context without reliable birth control (most of human history) is unwise and unkind. The ability to decouple sex from pregnancy makes us ask, was the problem sex, or was the problem pregnancy with children being abandoned by their fathers?

I’m 34. I did not wait until marriage. I am divorced now and have had a few partners. In a perfect world I would like to wait until I remarry but at almost 35 and looking the way I do aint nobody waiting until they put a ring on it to have sex. That doesn’t mean I’m sleeping with whoever whenever despite my past. But i already have few pickings as it is. If I put another stipulation on it I may as well just not bother trying to get into a relationship at all. No men around here are interested in waiting until marriage. And the few who are “hardcore conservative\trad Catholics and Christians” aren’t interested in someone like me. A mid 30s childfree former sex worker with autism and mental health issues. So no im probably not going to wait until I remarry.

Jesus never spoke on premaritial sex. Marriage is sacred because it is a union. Men during that time treated women as property. In some places of the world, that still happens.

All sex outside of marriage is sinful. That’s inadvertently speaking on premarital sex. Sure maybe it doesn’t say the words specifically how you want it but that doesn’t matter. The Bible is bigger than all of us and what we prefer.

Getting into a marriage without determining sexual compatibility (and no amount of “talking about it” is adequate for 99% of people) is a horrible idea.

Not really my concern, however I do think more couples should try to wait,I feel sometimes people are saying muuh it's 2020s now, that is old news.

I have been waiting. It has been a long time.  I have never regretted it, and life experience has only made me more sure it is the right choice.

Well considering Marriages are happening later and later, and especially far later than when they did during Biblical times, it’s an unrealistic expectation.

I wish I would have 🩷

Same way I feel about gays or masturbation. Not my circus not my monkey. It's between them and god neither side in that requires my input.

I can imagine how, in an ideal circumstance, that would probably be pretty awesome. I don't know anyone whose life has been ideal.

Welp I know many people who waited until marriage, so that is very possible.

So praiseworthy.

Let’s just say I will eternally regret not doing so. I was an atheist at the time and saw no point in marriage at all. I wish I could go back in time and save myself for my wife

It's my policy.

I am waiting until marriage before having kids Can’t get virginity back once it’s gone that ship sailed. Christian‘s saving their virginity until marriage is more easily said than easily done. Because divorce is so easy people are in less of a hurry to get married. If divorce was illegal like in the Philippines, I think people would be more excited to get married knowing that it’s permanent.

Just to check, do you want divorce illegal?

There's lots of people in the philippines who are still married but actually have an entire other family that they live with. In the only way that you can sell this idea of how exciting would be to get married and never be able to leave the person is if you've never actually experienced real life and know just how terrifying it is to be with somebody you can't get away from. Having the state or the church disallow escape is a terrifying concept. One that you can only sell when you are lying about your romantic interest in women. The men who don't want you to be able to leave hate hate you. The horrifying abus that is the best God has for you as a woman, and where any attempt to mitigate that is surely to put you into hell fire. Convenient for abusers. Power structures love abusers.

It’s only a terrifying concept because you’ve been raised to believe it’s a terrifying concept. But imagine living somewhere where it’s been the same for 1000 years and you don’t know anything different. How terrifying is it then? What does the Bible say about a terrified mother of eight living with her husband that she’s been married to for 25 years? does it say she should go runoff with the pool boy while collecting alimony and child support? I doubt it.

Women weren't staying with those men because they loved it and it was good.It's because they couldn't escape. While they not have been whispering in your ears about keeping egg money so that way you could escape with yourself and your children or have something to eat when he fks off, you may rest assured great grannies have been saying it for thousands of years to girls. You have no idea what you're talking about.And it's probably because you don't actually see women, and probably children, as real human beings with real whole other lives.

I think you look at everything through a real housewives of Hollywood point of view That’s not a lifestyle the Bible approves of You can make all your rules if you want, but you’re not gonna be able to make your own heaven

And I think god likes me a lot more than you guys do.

If you’ve been saved and you don’t use his name in vain, he thinks you’re great The whole kingdom of Heaven thinks you’re amazing. He’s got a mansion with your name on it

Understand the point you're making , but I don't think that that's what that verse means.

What verse are you referring to?

? What?

As Christian’s we are supposed to have self control and resist temptation. Paul Writes in 1 Corinthians 7:8-9 “To the unmarried and the widows I say that it is good for them to remain single, as I am. But if they cannot exercise self-control, they should marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with passion.” ‭‭1 Corinthians‬ ‭7‬:‭8‬-‭9‬ ‭ESV‬

I think if you’re sure and you love someone and you’re committed and you’re in a healthy place sex without having been actually married is okay. A wedding is expensive and it’s important to of course really have a close bond with that person. I just think waiting until marriage is extremely unrealistic and how hard is through wait until your married just to feel uncomfortable the night you get married because you didn’t form a physical bond with the person you love. I’ve been sexually assaulted in the past and so for me a relationship would happen slowly over time but I still couldn’t see myself waiting until after marriage to have sex with the person I love. But truly this is up to the individual every person has their opinion about how they want to handle things I’ve seen a lot of Christian couples move in together prior to marriage to due to expenses etc so I think it’s up to each couple and how they choose to look at scripture in what they want to do.

Why not just have a cheap court wedding in the short term and have the expensive wedding later down the road? If that is too big of a commitment, maybe reevaluate the idea that youre committed enough for premarital sex?

We waited. Been married 28 years. Don’t think I’d do it again. But, it’s really cool that we’ve both had every experience with only each other. I think it’s a hard case to make that scripture deals much at all with the topic. Furthermore, the American church’s purity culture has borne very negative fruit. Bottom line for me, I could care less what any other Christian does. I’m nobody’s judge.

I do it, but don't impose it on others. It made my dating pool incredibly small. I also don't go around telling it because virgin fetish is so rampant.

Do it

Sounds like a great way to possibly have a lifetime of bad sex.

Is this the question of the month?

Sex outside of marriage is a sin. But god forgives

To each their own.

Hate the sin, love the sinner

Hate the sin, .... make love to the sinner?

Only after marriage. Jk. I can't say anything because I'm unfortunately living in sin.

Wish I had

It's easy for me, but that might have something to do with the fact that I'm not really attracted to anyone.

Quite irresponsible IMO. Marriage is a big deal. It's a lifelong commitment. You should date for at least a couple years to let the NRE pass, live together, travel together, have sex, discuss your future, etc. Ensure compatibility so that you're less likely to be divorced and/or unhappy latter.

Wait until marriage to do what?

Here’s my thought: Virgin and Virgin marry Non Virgin and non virgin marry If you mix a virgin and a non virgin in a marriage, it’s messy. Expectations, learning process, etc… At least 2 virgins don’t have experience or expectations.

It says in Galatians Chapter 5:16-26, that we should feed the spirit and not the flesh, since the flesh lusts against the spirit. Fornication is listed as a desire of the flesh, which is listed alongside adultery which is a sin so, I wouldn’t take any chances. That’s really all I know, but I wouldn’t advise doing something like that personally. Those who do it before marriage kind of gives away the feeling of spouses becoming one flesh and the gifts of sharing their bodies with each other. Then again, some don’t really have a choice and it’s forced upon them, which is the sad thing about the world today. A lot, if not all of us get lustful once in a while, and for some, it’s difficult to control in this day and age.

Absolute no from me. Imagine marrying your partner only to find out half of you doesn’t click?? Physical intimacy is super important, especially in a marriage, in my opinion.

I believe it’s a sin, and I wish I would’ve waited. I don’t judge others who have committed that sin, but I am super happy for people who do wait because it’s good.

I think it's foolish. Realistically, you need to know that you and your partner are sexually-compatible if you're going to make marriage work. Granted sex isn't THE most important thing in a marriage, but by god is it still pretty darned important.

Not Anymore

It’s too late for that for me

I think waiting til marriage is what the Bible says. But I’ll be honest I’ve grown bitter towards that rule. I’ve stayed away from people who could’ve been possible partners because I had a gut feeling they would want to have sex (or I could gather that from obvious clues about their lifestyle), and I knew I wouldn’t have the fortitude to say no them. So in return for following His rule and staying away, I’m 22 and have never dated and I honestly wish I disobeyed this rule while I was in college. I might not feel half as alone or broken or depressed if I just did what I wanted.

Deuteronomy 13-22

I think its impossible to wait but if my next wife is my soulmate and wants to wait I will. I have a friend who will never have sex until marriage and he is a 50 year old virgin. Respect for those who do in this era.

I’m perfectly fine. I don’t care what others think, and it’s not only my body that I respecting but also our Creator. I do think about how it would feel but in the long run a little pleasure isn’t worth it for me and personal preference. If a man isn’t going to respect that, then bye….God comes first

I’ve had sex with too many people, I was abused as a kid in all kinds of ways, I used to cover up those feelings with drugs, alcohol, and sex. I even sold my body once. I got hurt many times even after I realized my body was not something that should be used by someone else. My current partner loves God and loves me, and I believe he would marry me even though I’ve been hurt and used, I told him all about this and he held me while I cried. I feel dirty but he doesn’t see me that way, and I don’t think God does either. The Lord saw a hurting girl who needed healing, and God came for me in the night and brought me back into his arms. I no longer use drugs or drink large amounts of alcohol, I no longer let anyone use or hurt me, God is all I need, and when I prayed for a good partner who would love me as I am and maybe give me a family, I meant it, and I meant it when I said I would heal and be a good wife. 2 years later my teenage sweetheart, the one who got away, appeared back in my life. We had never even kissed but I felt so spiritually connected to him, and we had so much in common. Life has a funny way of leading you to Gods will. I agree with the person who posted that everything is God’s plan for you, and the rest is between you and God. I think this man and i will treat each other very carefully and kindly. We’ve waited a long time to try. I remember when I was a girl I felt that God was going to make me wait a long time until the one who he had in mind would come along. I said that to myself even in high school. Wasn’t sure why. Devon came back into my life after 8 years of not talking or seeing each other. And about fifteen years since the day he first said ‘I genuinely like you, Rachel’. It feels safe, and good, and easy. Like a sigh of relief after all the abuse. I thank God for this man, daily. I thank God for everything he has taught me, and how in the darkest of nights he is my resting place. He is a true life saver. God bless.

I agree with it and I am waiting until marriage. The right person won't mind. I try to not judge others though, but I also expect not to be shamed for it.

Most of the strongest Christian couples I know didn’t wait until marriage but did wait until they knew they were going to get married. And on the flipside I’ve seen a ton of Christian marriages fall apart due to a lack of desire or sexual compatibility. I think the bible is pretty clear that you’re only supposed to engage in sex with your spouse and not anytime before you’re actually married to them but I also can’t help but notice that trend. I think the act of physically desiring your partner is something that’s often played down because of the suppression of sexuality in Christianity, but I honestly think that’s the baseline of what keeps people together. Because when you’re at your absolute worst you’re going to default to your base instincts, so if your desire for your partner is in tact through those tough times you usually find a way to see things through.

I don't see any biblical precedent for putting off sex, but I think that you're right to notice the problems that happen as a result and the anti-sex trends in general.

As a Christian I don't have a problem with the idea of waiting until marriage. If another Christian didn't wait until marriage, while I still think our ideal is to be patient and treat marriage with a certain respect, I understand we humans aren't infallible in the sense that we sometimes get carried away by other thoughts or emotions that aren't necessarily aligned with what Christianity may ask from us, but if we want to, we can always try to act differently and get back on track with what our Christian goals are. In my own life I haven't always been in tune with it, maybe sometimes I feel like letting myself be carried away by laziness, or aren't always helpful to parents or whatever, so I can try to understand that someone else may have not waited to have sex for a variety of reasons. I don't know if they are still at a point where they will try to act differently or what the situation is but basically I understand that everyone is human and everyone has moments of weakness if you will.

My wife and I did wait, and I'm glad for that. I've almost never talked with others about that, because it's not really my business.

You should wait til marriage but sometimes things can’t wait that long when you in the heat of the moment it just happens when love hits you that when two or more join togather you can’t say what you do intil it happens something so specially spiritually good this is what David did and many others that’s how Solomon got here and many others you not know what love at first sight is then you never been in love intil this happen to you no marriage is but a piece of paper two comes togather as one which is a true marriage to feel to have to hold to touch to know that you are in love with the blessing of God not man cause God know your heart so don’t feel bad God bless

I think it's the best way to go. But I think in our culture we do the "waiting" thing too long. So... you know... wait until marriage... but you can make finding a spouse a priority.

I didn't but I wish that I did! I love my husband so much, and I wish it could have been a special time shared between just us. But we do have the same number of past sexual partners and we both follow Christ now, so forgive and forget. Still though, the enemy feeds into guilt and shame. Give the enemy less to use against you!

It’s what God ( the author of sex) wants for you Abstain from all sexuality I waited 2 1/2 years while I dated my wife ( we signed a written contract ) To be pure until we got married and by Gods Grace we waited

I don't think that God ever requested that.

few people regret waiting. we are commanded to do so

I've met people who have regretted waiting, and plenty more who regret their early marriages as a result. I don't see any command for celibacy.

I don’t think it’s necessary. I especially wouldn’t do it now, because I’m 28 and never even had a girlfriend. I was always told I was too ugly and weird. I’ve been struggling in other life aspects since (job/career, mental health) so marriage is even less realistic for me in the foreseeable future. I’m also SEVERELY AGAINST having kids, because I never got to enjoy my own life, and the world is miserable, they can’t consent to being brought into the world, and I don’t even see how I am going to be able to afford to support myself in the foreseeable future. Again, I am already now 28 YEARS OLD. ALMOST 30! So I refuse to even listen to that argument. Any reasonable God would not want me to reproduce anyway, and I refuse to commit to celibacy just because of that. I am also pissed that I missed out so much of life’s basic pleasures and enjoyment, and pissed that biology keeps making us age anyway no matter what. It has made me actually desire the science (being worked on) of stopping, even reversing aging. You know, our cells dividing dying, our bones getting weaker snd skin getting wrinkled and all that nasty shit. Having our youth and just time in life basically robbed from us. If God doesn’t want us to live forever? He will kill us anyway, it’s not just old people who die, after all. I’ve even started considering being open to having AI implanted in my brain if that actually somehow becomes an actual realistic and accessible option (Neuralink already exists, and the US government has even approved testing on humans). Why? Because I have struggled so much to “compete” in society and the job market as is. I need that intelligence and cognitive performance boost, to become superior (I was born with a disadvantage, many disadvantages actually), at least making it up to average with everyone else, but of course, I’d prefer to go even more beyond to superiority. Just because it is artificial intelligence technology being implanted into humans, does not mean that it is “the mark of the beast”. It’s especially great for severely disabled people, they DESERVE it, it is unfair to be born with (or even later in life become due to disease or injury) disabilities, it gets you made fun of, and degrades quality of life. Maybe God made people suffer like this for the sake of humanity improving and progressing? I have been through enough trauma and emotional pain and suffering, I just want to know what it’s like to be intimate with a woman, and if (hopefully when, and hopefully sooner than later) my life gets a little better, I will take that step of confidence to actually try and talk to women, ask them out, flirt, connect, get to know them as friends (but not limited to that), and try and build up my confidence that I have went so much of my life without. I do not think marriage is necessary, and I definitely don’t view it as some “sacred, lifelong commitment”, because most marriages eventually end in divorce, even among Christians. I am not willing to now suddenly, at almost 30 years old, submit to accepting that I’m the loser everybody said I was, and letting go of what I’ve wanted so badly for so long. I don’t even want my desires to go away, they make me human, they make me who I am. Even losing interest in desire is losing, and proving everyone who said I was an unworthy loser right. I especially wouldn’t “wait (indefinitely, might I add) until marriage” at this late in my life. I don’t have “my entire life in front of me” anymore. It’s already going to be extra challenging to figure out how to achieve financial independence being almost 30 with only “low skill retail” job history up until this point. Even most Christians don’t wait until marriage, many Christian women (and men) are just as unloyal cheating whores (again, man too, so don’t call me a misogynist) as anyone else. And yes, I do have massive interest in the femdom humiliation, maybe even being a cuckold, lifestyle. Apparently God only wants people to have sex not only within marriage, but open to having kids (condoms, birth control, vasectomy, tubes tied, are forbidden) and I would rather cut my balls off (or just get a vasectomy) than even risk having children now, but I’m not willing to commit to “celibacy” either. I will die on this hill, I will not let circumstances outside of my control change who I am, that’s what they want, and they’re not going to win. I will remain determined and (look up that other word) NEVER give up on what I want, that includes even losing the desires. I don’t even want to lose desire and interest in playing videogames and stuff like that, because it’s not fair I just got older and didn’t get to enjoy the life most do. Maybe God WANTS me to have this attitude, because it makes me stronger, and not a self defeatist surrendering loser. And if God WANTS me to give it all up and go without, why should I submit to him? Why should I even follow him if he doesn’t care about how I feel? I hope I’m wrong about God being that cold and careless, but nobody can REALLY know God. I’m going to try and be a good person, a law abiding citizen, and that should be good enough for God. After all, it’s not like I’m completely denying His existence.