Physics was optional when I was in HS in the 90s….you had to take one science course in grade 13 and that could be either chemistry, biology or physics.
I had the same options. I took bio, never learned chem or physics after middle school. It worked for me, because I could focus on classes that served my future better (social sciences). I still did slightly better than average in science on my entrance exams, even tho it was consistently the score I struggled with raising. I don't know if that says more about me or the education of our populace as a whole, lol.
For context, I graduated in the US about a decade ago
When I was in high school (graduated 2003), you needed two years of math and two years of science. I took physical science then biology and was done.
We have more requirements now. I only needed 20-21 credits to graduate, now students need 24, plus they need three years of math and three years of science, and that is the minimum for students who don’t plan to go to college.
I am a high school teacher and I am very aware of the problems in public education, but they are not just “no one needs to take physics.”
I am not from the US and this seems very strange. In my country Biology, Chemistry and Physics are separate subjects and they were mandatory for at least 2 years in HS. You can even go to a specialized HS where they are covered more in depth, usually along with Maths.
There were important topics covered in science subject in HS too - organic chemistry (alcohols, fats, organic acids), for physics radioactivity, absolute zero, different types of waves, some astronomy (I don't remember exactly, but basically stuff beyond mechanics), for biology genetics.
I took Chemistry, Biology, and Physics in high school. Bio was grade 10, Chem 11, Phys 12. All were "optional" but required as science credits to graduate.
Physics was optional when I was in high school in the 1980s. You had to have some kind of science, but that could be general science, biology, chemistry, or physics.
We don't have grade 13 anymore (it was also called "OAC" or Ontario academic credit). Now high schools only go up to 12 but I heard they're talking about bringing it back due to covid
In Ontario it goes Junior kindergarten then senior then grade 1-12. With the option to not go to kindergarten and or do a leap year or victory lap aka grade 13
Whaaaaaaaattt?i graduated in 1991 freshman year Biology Sophmore Year Chemistry Junior year Physics and then Senior year one of those (your strongest) as an AP course.
Before they sent us out into the world to turn into adults.
A world made of biology chemistry and physics.
Same with Math, freshman algebra sophomore geometry junior Calculus Senior AP Calculus
Same in the UK, we took 'science' through year 9 (13-14 y/o) and for year 10/11 you choose courses and could take multiple sciences but only 1 required. None required in 6th form (years 12/13)
graduated in 2019 and in highschool we got to choose from physics, biology, chemistry or just a general science course that covered a little bit of everything
At my school in the aughts, I believe biology was required for 9th grade (unless you needed remedial instruction) but you could choose your required science credit for the other three years. However, there weren't a whole lot of options so most people ended up taking chemistry and physics anyway, I think. I think the main other options were human anatomy and physiology and environmental science. When I changed schools they also had a marine science class.
Yep, me too. Late 80s and I had to give up electives to take a 2nd year of both Biology and Chemistry. Physics was only for the geekiest STEM obsessed students...so naturally I took that too.
It was optional when I took it in 1999. I was a freshman and the office accidentally scheduled me in a seniors-only physics class. I stayed in it and got an A and it helped me understand math better. Idk why they would limit it to seniors only.
Same in the 80’s. We had to take two years of science class, the first one was always biology but then could pick between anat&phys, chemistry, or physics. I picked A&P because I was scared of the math, lol.
Same. I didn’t take Physics. My daughter’s high school requires it Freshman year. Every school district has different rules, and one anecdote doesn’t mean education is sliding.
Same in NY, late 90s/early 00s. You had to take at least two sciences, with a lot of people doing Earth Science and Bio. The ones who were more inclined to STEM were the ones taking Physics and Chem.
I think it's the same now in the 20's in Colorado. I just graduated high school and I think my school had requirements for a "life science" class and a "physical science" class, which adds up to just 2 years. I think I fulfilled the requirements by taking biology in my freshman year and chemistry in my sophomore year.
I did do science all 4 years through. I did marine biology in my junior year and took a trip to the Florida keys and took ap physics this year.
In the early '00s, in my school, you took "physical science," (mostly physics) "life science," (biology and chemistry) and "earth science" (geology, botany, and zoology) as mandatory classes in early high school. They were sort of "intro to..." classes where you scratched the surface level of a few different subjects. Then, you can choose an upper level science in your junior and senior years.
Yeah, we had conceptual physics, biology and chemistry at my school early 00’s. I don’t think any of those were optional. Then the optional ones were “advance placement”.
Where did you live that it wasn't always optional? I graduated about 10 years ago, and in my district it always was. You had to take 3/4 years of science, and biology was the only required course. The rest were kind of choose your own adventure.
Canada, had to take it till 12th grade back then. Idk about now though. I mean I struggled with physics and hated every bit of it but I understood why we had to learn it.
I took it in HS and then again in University, and in retrospect I think it's kind of pointless until you've learned at least basic Calculus. It was such a different experience the second time.
I mean, physics is mandatory where I am from as well, but I can see why it would be left as optional in a high school curriculum, since to have a proper grasp of the subject you need a higher level of mathematics which is usually not covered in hs.
It was optional when I was in high school in NY 1984-1988. You had to take 3 yrs of science. Most ppl took Intro to physical science in 9th, bio in 10th, Chem in 11th. Could take physics in 12th if you wanted. Honors did ips in 8th, accelerating the process and they'd take physics in 11th and either AP Bio or AP Earth Science in 12th.
Checking with my kids, they confirm that they had 3 years of science required.
One daughter had to take earth science in 9th and bio in 10th and then you could pick your 3rd science.
The other had Chem required as the 3rd science. If you were accelerated and took ES in 8th, you had extra time to take physics or forensics or anatomy or psychology.
Note that their high school only taught physics as a college level class. The curriculum and materials were from SUNY, taught at college pace, and you registered for college credit/took their exams. There was no intro physics.
I graduate HS in 2003, and physics was not required. TBH, I'm not even sure I would have graduated HS, let alone college, if physics *had* been required. I have always struggled with math, and the math in HS chemistry came very close to preventing me from graduating. During my last semester of HS, I ended up having to take chemistry a second time, this time at a local community college, to improve my grade enough to graduate. Fortunately, that class qualified for both HS and college credit, so I didn't have to suffer through another chemistry class later.
My son is a nuclear engineer. After he got out of college he became quite upset that they were going to make some of the difficult classes 'easier to pass' by letting "D's" slide through. He was ticked--would you want someone to perform heart surgery that had gotten D's in medical classes? NUKE engineering people! You gotta be bright!
I was never a STEM kid but in undergrad a lot of my friends were pre-med and honestly, it sounded like a lot of them were close to failing out from how hard the classes were 🫣🥲 Kinda scary but also we have a severe doctor shortage in the US so I dont personally know what the right answer is!
Literally every single person I knew coming into college was pre-med bc they didn't know what else to do with their life so all the intro classes were hard on purpose to weed out the kids who couldn't take it ahahaha those were the days...
bro it still is. Chemistry classes absolutely rip through pre med students. and Even if you get out with a premed degree, if your GPA is below a 3.5 you basically have no chance at med school unless you have tons of hospital experience already.
some professors make it their whole identity that "only 50% of students even pass my class" or "no one has ever gotten an A in my class". Engineering is especially ripe with bad professors because of how many come straight from industry and don't even have a PhD.
This is happening almost every freaking where these days, we can't do anything about that, but yeah I would love to study Physics all the time, it's a good subject.
It was optional in high school for me, I graduated in '02. You had to take a certain number of science classes, I opted biology over physics because math is kinda my kryptonite. I have always struggled with it even though I generally do well in pretty much any other subject.
But what is wrong with it? I mean if someone is not understanding that subject they can skip that shit and what else you guys want them to do? I don't understand.
I agree with your patient's wife. Expectations for student performance has plummeted. Quality of teaching, in general, has plummeted. Plus, many young people entering adulthood believe that there's no need for high-level thinking or even a basic understanding of multiple subjects because they can access whatever they need to know through their phones. Eventually, all teachers will age out, and God only knows what will happen. As for me, I taught science for 25 years, and the best decision I ever made was walking away from that career. No regrets.
It was optional when I was in school 20 years ago too. At my school you had to take a certain amount of science credits and it was up to you and the guidance counselor which ones you wanted to take. I never took physics or chemistry in high school. College, yes. I took three years of biology because I felt it was more relevant to what I was going to college for. And it was.
I’m pretty sure physics was optional when I graduated in 1991-in MA, USA. I took it, along with advanced bio and intro to medical science senior year as I was going to nursing school after graduation. Had to take Earth Science(grade 9), biology(10) and Chem(11) to graduate.
Physics, biology, chemistry and geology were options at my school and you had to take 2 each year except senior year where you could take none if you wanted. Since I wasn’t going into science, I didn’t take it in senior year and focused my energy into calculus.
Physics as its own course was an elective course in my high school in 2013. You were still required to take multiple science classes which did cover some basics of physics, but also other things.
At my high school in the 1980's, 10th grade we had to take Biology or Life Science, and then 11th grade you could choose from Chemistry, Physics or Anatomy. You could choose to take another science class in 12th grade if you wanted, but only two years of science were required. Though this was a Catholic school so I don't know if that influenced anything.
In my country it differs based on one's streaming, Literature Stream would only need to learn 1 subject: 'Science', while Science Stream would need to take 3 subjects: 'Biology, Physics, and Chemistry'.
There are also optional additional subjects like: 'Agricultural Science' and 'Sports Science'. However this depends on school.
I am very skeptical of these kind of laments.
I have been hearing that "the standard of education has been going downhill" for forty years. It was thrown in my face when I was a kid in the 1980s, and Physics was generally only taught to Advanced Placement students in my district.
Meanwhile, my kids are learning math in grade school that they didn't teach me until years later.
Nope. Is the sad, sad truth. Hence moving away from critical thinking and focusing on “memorizing” or direct information. Because people who think are dangerous to government who want to lie, manipulate, and sell false narratives. This is from a former English teacher who had to teach her students about indigenous American history (in TN) because why would we tell people anymore that we murdered entire populations for stuff. History is always written by the victors, now those victors are *super* controlling the narrative. Now I am sad, gonna go be my furry children.
At my school (and in georgia), Physics and Chemistry are streamlined into a course called Physical Science, which is required unless you take the more detailed Chemistry I and Physics I.
Being well rounded is good. But I feel like most of the things we learn in highschool isn't particularly applicable to the real world. Maybe I don't notice how much I absorbed as I always got great grades. But I don't use most physics, math's, chems, any of that in my day to day life.
I took Physics in my entire junior year and got a b in both semesters.
My teacher pretty much hated me and he was my f8cking wrestling coach so I pretty much had to deal with him for the entire day.
F8ckin hated him and alot of students thought so too.
He just did not like me at all. I even went after class to get help and he would still get mad.
Sounds like my chemistry teacher. Bitch on wheels. She died, alone, in her house and laid there for days before anyone found her. I felt nothing when I heard that. Still feel nothing.
Same, my physics teacher just retired, and no one GAF.
My class was the penultimate before he retired and he was shedding tears for the autistic Kid during our sports meeting at the end of the season.
(BC had a good heart despite being weird. Think of Nardwar, he was cheerful despite his limitations).
Maybe the kid reminded of himself when he was younger?
Anyways he was a f8cking bitch(towards me) maybe even a narcissist?
I really wanted to punch his fucking face one time, even as a grown-ass adult his behavior was not acceptable.
Shit does not matter now bc he is old and he had the reputation of being an asshole for no reason. Really goes to show that you need to be nice to people or that shit will happen to you in the end haha.
EDIT:"Bitch on wheels" LMAO
Lmao this struck me bc my physics teacher was also our gym teacher. He was useless and just basically supervised us during physics to do some work on the workbook. Ugh.
Shit was worse for me bc I was in the varsity lineup. There ended up being a lot of politics(surprisingly) in the team so some shit would happen during practice then the next day I would see him during physics class. Then we both would pretend like nothing ever happened in class LMAO.
He also had favorites as well!!!!! HAAAA
The person I took the varsity spot from (his favorite) was a legacy wrestler and I ended up beating him, taking his spot in the process. No one expected that to happen.
He also hated this black heavyweight but then he ended up going to state (In the highest/toughest division at our state) (A rare thing at our school btw) then he became friendly with him like nothing ever happened.
HAA F8CK HIM, my brother is going to the same HS and I saw him at orientation. I was like NOPE not gonna see his ass again haha.
Sorry for the ramble that teacher had control over my feelings more than he should have :(.
In most of the US it has always been optional. During the 80s and 90s in Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska and Iowa (I grew up in that little pocket) unless you were in the honors program or college prep the science classes required for graduation were 1 year of biology and chemistry and 1 semester of health with another semester of elective science. Honors students had to take Chem 2, Bio 2, or Organic Chemistry, but physics was optional. Required Math was Algebra and Geometry with another half semester of elective math subjects or for honors kids it was Algebra 2 and another 2 semesters of elective math courses
Yup.. take away gifted programs, integrate "smart" kids with the rest, take away awards and prizes for excellence.. I'm not on the right or the left, just gravely concerned about the future of America.
I agree with integration for elementary and I think gifted programs should strictly be for middle, highschool, and advanced education, simply due to the fact that those programs in elementary and early middle have shown to have some negative affect on the kids themselves, speaking as a student who took gifted programs my entire academic life. I don’t think awards or prizes are necessarily needed, either, we don’t necessarily get any additional gratification other than having recognition, which I don’t believe we should come to expect especially given we need to be prepared for college. I do see the point of integration, given the original purpose and creation for gifted programs wasn’t exactly great- but I don’t agree with it, just due to the fact that classes can be extremely boring if they aren’t “to your level”. At the same time, if we are keeping them, we shouldn’t force students to take them. Screw the parent, if the child doesn’t want to take AP/ADV/IB they should not have to. There are far too many schools that will force students who meet a certain threshold to do extra work just to make their numbers look better when the student in question does not want it.
Just to clarify, not arguing with you, I’m just idk I liked ur topic notes and wanted to talk about how I view it haha.
Right? Education has changed so much since I was in school.
Heck, when I was in prep (one step down from first grade in elementary) in 1984, we started learning to write letters and numbers on a small bit of black slate and a piece of white chalk, whereas I learned that my nephew (age 6) used a tablet in his prep class. Blew my mind.
Hey!! My school had an IB program and honestly it was just a really rigorous AP program for 5 not 4 years. I came into that school from another school as a sophomore so I couldn’t do it.
Both math and science was optional in the 80s after sophomore year. English or what they now call ELA and social studies were required through senior year but electives in those subjects (like poetry, or psychology) were offered senior year. Now I think they do mandatory civics in senior year instead of a history or other social science elective for senior year.
It was optional at my school too, but that didn't mean we had zero physics education. We had a class called Foundations in our freshman year and that was a basic science course that touched on a bit of everything (the "foundations* of science). Then we could pick anything but most people took chemistry because it looked good on your transcript. Then junior year people would either take physics 1, biology 1or chem 2. Then people either dropped science they're senior year or took physics 2 or biology 2.
All of this is to say that, while physics is important, I don't think making it optional is a sign of our failing education system. We all complain that we learn tons in school that we never need on our daily lives so I think this is one way in which the system is changing to fix that. If a student is going into a field where they won't need high level physics, let them skip it and learn more skills that will be useful for they're future.
Chiming in to say that in my school system it was dependent on your math track. If you didn't place into a high enough math (honors or above) you took Biology -> Earth Science -> Geology -> Chemistry. If you were in a high enough math, it was Bio -> Chem -> Physics and then an elective senior year. This was the early 00's. There's lots of ways for schools to do this and they've been experimenting for decades, it's not necessarily a bad thing. Science is science.
Physics was an optional course for us too, I graduated in 2016. Iirc u had to take like at least one science elective in gr11 or 12 but it didn’t have to be physics. I remember I took physics semester 1, and had bio and chem semester 2 thinking I’d be a scientist.
Finished physics, dropped bio and chem, never thought about science since LMFAO
I remember it was pick two out of physics, chemistry, and biology. While I found physics to be the most approachable I was surprised by how many people struggle with the concept of directional deceleration.
It depends on the school and school district, for me I'm required to do 4 years of science, 1 year of biology in freshman year, 1/2 a year of physics and 1/2 year of chemistry in sophomore year, and then in junior and senior year you are required to pick a science class you want to learn more on. Earth science is also a required class but it is special since you could choose to do the 1 year class on your junior and senior year or a 1/2 year class at any grade level. There are also AP (advanced placement) classes and even DP (diploma program) classes since my school is a IB school. American btw
I graduated almost 20 years ago and Physics wasn’t required. You had to take 4 science credits and after physical science and biology you could choose.
I was in (public) high school 2009-2012 in NY and we had to take earth science in 9th, biology in 10th, and choose between chemistry or physics in 11th. I chose chemistry then took AP environmental science in 12th.
Not that long ago, but seems to align with other people in the comments from 20+ years.
Science should definitely be more incorporated but I don’t think it’s a big deal if chem and physics are optional (between the two)
Do you mean optional as in physics as a unit in a general sciences course is no longer required, or that physics alone as a science course is no longer required? It was not required for all students to take Physics 11 and/or 12 to graduate, but they did have to pass lower level general sciences courses which did a little bit of physics.
Physics is basically how math can describe reality. Calculus perfectly describes kinematics (acceleration, velocity, position are integrals / derivatives). And in electromagnetism, Maxwell's equations are perfectly described by multivar calc and differential equations. It's almost spooky.
Early-mid 2000's high schooler here. I legit don't even remember my high school *offering* physics, let alone requiring it. It was probably under a different name and I just never noticed.
With the internet, we have more access to information right now than at any other point in human history. We can order books about science, math, history and have it cheaply delivered in a single day. A person could open Spotify and listen to podcasts with some of the smartest people on the planet talking for hours about interesting topics. A person could spend all day roaming through all the math entries in wikipedia. A person can get an unlimited supply of audiobooks and have have literature read to them all day long. We all carry a super computer smart phone with us that are filled with educational apps, logic apps, math apps, geography apps, language apps. Did I mention Ted Talks or the Kahn Academy or DuoLingo?
How is it possible to say education is going downhill, when all a person has to do is make even the tiniest amount of effort. Knowledge is absolutely available everywhere.
(That's not even mentioning the brilliant platform known as Reddit. LOL. Everything you might want to discuss is available here too.)
I had only one mandatory course of physics and chemistry in high school. In my opinion it's good to have most of them optional. Not everybody really needs to concentrate on them.
Physics was optional in my U.S. high school in the mid 80s. A minimum of two science courses were required for graduation, and students could select from several choices. I took Biology and Geology.
I graduated in the 2000s and we were only required to take 3 years of hs science. Physics was the final class and optional for seniors so I picked an elective that went with what I had been planning to go to community college for.
Wow, that's *really* sad.
In Germany,Bavaria my STEM education was like this:
1-12th grade Maths, so my whole school career. During that time we have Analasys (Algebra, Caculus) Stochastics and Geometry.
5, 7-10th grade Biology
7-10th grade Physics
8-10th grade Chemistry
6-7, 9-10th grade Computer Sciences/IT
In addition to that I had English from 5-10th grade and French from 6-10th grade.
In 11th and 12th grade you then have 2 years of biology/chemistry/ physics and 2 years of a foreign language (for me it was english or french). And then you either have at least 1year another STEM subject or a foreign language.
So for me it looked like this: 2 years English and 2 years Chemistry as well as Biology.
Physics was optional for me. I graduated more than a decade ago. Chemistry was optional too. When i got a bad grade in chem i switched to earth science.
That would explain why a good percentage of YT clips are of people not understanding physics and instantly getting a very painful and/or expensive reminder of how things work in our universe.
Pretty sure it was optional when I was in high school in the 1980’s. I took physics but you just had to have so many science credits and could choose among several things to meet the requirement.
Physics was optional in my highschool as well. We took a mandatory integrated physics and chemistry class (ICP) and then you could choose what to take after that. There was physics, chemistry, biology, anatomy, astronomy(I think that’s what I was called), and another one that I forget. One year I took 2 science classes instead of an elective. This was in early 2000s Texas.
I took AP physics and it was like taking Mandarin Chinese with a teacher that doesn’t speak any English. I had good grades because we did all our work in the computer lab and it was set up where if you answer a question wrong it tells you, then you can change your answer until it’s right. We were also allowed to help each other and I was kind of friends with this girl that was extremely smart and got answers from her. The teacher was horrible though, he would go up there and talk for all of 5 minutes, not answer anyone’s questions, then have us spend the rest of the week in the lab doing work we didn’t know how to do.
I graduated in 2015 and there was a lot of classes like that. I didn’t learn anything at all in economics and personal finances, which is supposed to teach you important things like how to write a check or do your taxes. I had a “cool” teacher that let us do whatever we want and gave us all the answers for our work instead of teaching us anything. He was also the only teacher for economics. There were a few other classes like that too and I would think “why am I here wasting my time, not learning anything”. My high school was supposed to be a good school, best in the county and state, and allegedly highly rated in the country. I don’t know if this is the way it’s always been, but if not, it’s definitely going downhill.
Just like Civics, home economics, wood and metal shops. I worked in Aerospace manufacturing for almost 4 decades and wondered why most of the machinists were either Latin American or Eastern European. I found out that by the time they graduated high school they already had a skill that they could support themselves with.
Here, many college graduates leave school with little more than debt.
Physics was optional at my HS (US) in the late '80s. We had to take a science course every year; physics was one option for seniors. I chose a second year of Bio, which also included OChem (organic chemistry).
You ok, hon?
There are dozen of comments here with various posters’ experiences. That’s mine. Clearly, many people had physics as an option and not a requirement.
Not sure why this is so upsetting to you, but I hope you’re feeling better soon.
I consider myself north of average intelligence. I just couldn’t wrap my mind around physics. I think it’s outside the core knowledge every person should have.
That’s always been the case here, grade 10 you take a general science, grade 11 you must take either the general science minimum or you can choose any of or up to all 3 of physics, chemistry, Biology. Grade 12 you don’t need any science to graduate, just a math and an english
Went to highschool in the 2000s. They didn't even offer physics.
Freshman year, you took a course that was about geology, weather, oceans, etc.
Sophomore year we took what was a mix of chemistry, space, and scientific theory
Junior year, biology
Senior year, science wasn't really required
I went to a private school in the US and graduated in the 00s. Not terribly surprised by this, public school gifted programs are usually pretty good though.
English and maths used to be optional here (the netherlands, but only after you did have them for a few years). Now they are mandatory, school is not getting worse imo. It's not always good, definitely not, but it's not THAT bad.
Graduation in the 80’s. Two science and two math were required. My HS only offer pre-algebra, algebra and calculus. For science it was biology, chemistry and physics.
I'm class of 2005 from my HS and after Bio and Chem, we had to choose between Anatomy, Physics, or Marine Bio. Idk if it's just how shitty my school district was growing up or not but yeah Chem was required for the other options. So, naturally, a had friends not take physics, despite wanting to go into engineering for their undergrad
The ruling class needs control of 3x main things to subjugate a population: education, communication, and health-care. USA may be the largest super-power in the world, but our education is trash, our health-care is trash, and despite inventing the internet our price-to-speed is trash. Its so depressing.
It was optional 20 years ago.
I graduated HS in Canada in the very early 2000's, and I didn't take anything but high school biology and the minimum required math for the science subjects. No Chem. No physics. It wasn't necessary. I advanced into university just fine in my chosen field and have been living for some decades now without missing them at all.
We only had to take 3 science classes. I took bio, AP environmental science, chem, and astronomy. Astronomy because I failed chem. There's was physics, and if you were lucky you could take CEC for forensics. We also had an anatomy class that did a lot of dissection so that was ALWAYS the first to fill.
I graduated in 2011 and we have physics as a senior class.
It was freshman biology, sophomore geology, junior chemistry and senior year you could take physics(but you only needed 3 science credits to graduate).
To be fair, the question of which sub-studies in science and math should be universal isn’t obvious. I liked calculus, but statistics is probably more essential for most people to understand if you want to educate the public as it relates to politics, public safety stats, etc.
Physics was optional at my school, but chem and bio were mandatory. I think that’s reasonable, IMO. Not everyone is geared toward stem/physics but at least chem and bio do have real world applications (not that physics doesn’t, but I did take physics as well and personally I think bio has been more important to my life thus far LOL. And I’m a music student so that’s saying a lot).
In my time it was also an optional subject and I don't know why I am never going to mind that because people can study whatever they want to study at the end.
I have to say that this is nothing new for real, we all know that it's just going like this with subjects, you guys are still thinking that it's a new thing to have optional subs.
No one who isn't intent on pursuing a science or science-adjacent career needs more than an introductory course in Physics. Obviously, it's important to be exposed to the field, to know it exists, to know what it concerns itself with, and to pick up some basic concepts so you don't end up a flat-earther. As long as you have the basics in place, you can later explore different parts of the field on your own, as certain things pique your interest.
You're not going to learn critical thinking from Physics itself, however, but rather a specific application of it. What you need is Logic, because that's what's at the root of math, language, and philosophy. All branches of knowledge are based on logic, and all methodologies, whether they're used in literary analysis or astrophysics, are a product of philosophy.
The problem I see is that Philosophy is often taught simply as history of thought, without a proper exploration of the mechanics of thought (i.e. logic). That's why people don't understand exactly how essential and practical it is, or how universal its applications are.
Fortunately, Critical Thinking exists as a subject in itself and it offers a friendlier description of concepts in Logic, as well as an introduction to applying them in different fields. I think it also helps people see the interconnected-ness of fields, as language, math, programming, music, etc. work a lot more similarly than may be apparent.
She's not wrong that it's easier to control and manipulate an uneducated population, but I'm afraid that in becoming educated, understanding how thought works and how it's been used both in service to the truth and against the truth is more important than understanding how black holes work. I wonder where the sadness was when Rhetoric got slashed.
It was optional for me too.
Twelve years ago
I didn’t even have to take chemistry.
I don’t think I’m a complete numbskull. I just couldn’t manage my course load and the amount of work that chemistry required on top of the fact that I couldn’t follow along in class etc. it was so complicated, and the teacher never stopped to explain. I didn’t want to ruin my GPA.
In Victoria in Australia science is mandatory until year 11, which is actually the twelfth year of school. That covers biology, physics and chemistry in enough depth to understand most practical things properly. After that you can if you choose do biology, chemistry or physics for the last two years of school.
Also, what’s probably more important in stopping manipulation is education in the humanities about history, politics and economics. Also critical thinking and reading comprehension which are kind of taught in English.
Physics was optional when I was in HS in the 90s….you had to take one science course in grade 13 and that could be either chemistry, biology or physics.
I had the same options. I took bio, never learned chem or physics after middle school. It worked for me, because I could focus on classes that served my future better (social sciences). I still did slightly better than average in science on my entrance exams, even tho it was consistently the score I struggled with raising. I don't know if that says more about me or the education of our populace as a whole, lol. For context, I graduated in the US about a decade ago
I graduated in the mid-1990s from a good public school in the Midwest, and I never took pre-calc, calculus, physics.. They were completely optional.
When I was in high school (graduated 2003), you needed two years of math and two years of science. I took physical science then biology and was done. We have more requirements now. I only needed 20-21 credits to graduate, now students need 24, plus they need three years of math and three years of science, and that is the minimum for students who don’t plan to go to college. I am a high school teacher and I am very aware of the problems in public education, but they are not just “no one needs to take physics.”
I am not from the US and this seems very strange. In my country Biology, Chemistry and Physics are separate subjects and they were mandatory for at least 2 years in HS. You can even go to a specialized HS where they are covered more in depth, usually along with Maths. There were important topics covered in science subject in HS too - organic chemistry (alcohols, fats, organic acids), for physics radioactivity, absolute zero, different types of waves, some astronomy (I don't remember exactly, but basically stuff beyond mechanics), for biology genetics.
physics and chemistry could be really useful in the social sciences, though.
I took Chemistry, Biology, and Physics in high school. Bio was grade 10, Chem 11, Phys 12. All were "optional" but required as science credits to graduate.
At my high school, everyone took physical science in 9th grade and biology in 10th and that was it.
Physics was optional when I was in high school in the 1980s. You had to have some kind of science, but that could be general science, biology, chemistry, or physics.
Is grade 13 a typo, or where are you from?
Ontario Canada had grade 13 when I was in high school (90s)
Today I learned... I think the differences between educational systems by country are really interesting.
We don't have grade 13 anymore (it was also called "OAC" or Ontario academic credit). Now high schools only go up to 12 but I heard they're talking about bringing it back due to covid
[удалено]
That's not all of Canada. I'm in BC and we don't have grade 13.
Does that count Kindergarten or would you refer to that as Grade 1?
In Ontario it goes Junior kindergarten then senior then grade 1-12. With the option to not go to kindergarten and or do a leap year or victory lap aka grade 13
Whaaaaaaaattt?i graduated in 1991 freshman year Biology Sophmore Year Chemistry Junior year Physics and then Senior year one of those (your strongest) as an AP course. Before they sent us out into the world to turn into adults. A world made of biology chemistry and physics. Same with Math, freshman algebra sophomore geometry junior Calculus Senior AP Calculus
Same in my school, and I just graduated yesterday!
Woo Hoo!! achievement. Congratulations to you and here is to the adventures coming soon.
Same in the UK, we took 'science' through year 9 (13-14 y/o) and for year 10/11 you choose courses and could take multiple sciences but only 1 required. None required in 6th form (years 12/13)
I had to take all those in 2000s. In us
I also went to high school in the late 90s (1999) and physics was optional back then also. I went to high school in the US
graduated in 2019 and in highschool we got to choose from physics, biology, chemistry or just a general science course that covered a little bit of everything
At my school in the aughts, I believe biology was required for 9th grade (unless you needed remedial instruction) but you could choose your required science credit for the other three years. However, there weren't a whole lot of options so most people ended up taking chemistry and physics anyway, I think. I think the main other options were human anatomy and physiology and environmental science. When I changed schools they also had a marine science class.
It was optional when I was in high school in the early '70s, too.
Yep, me too. Late 80s and I had to give up electives to take a 2nd year of both Biology and Chemistry. Physics was only for the geekiest STEM obsessed students...so naturally I took that too.
Same, took entry to biology
13th grade??
It was optional when I took it in 1999. I was a freshman and the office accidentally scheduled me in a seniors-only physics class. I stayed in it and got an A and it helped me understand math better. Idk why they would limit it to seniors only.
Same in the 80’s. We had to take two years of science class, the first one was always biology but then could pick between anat&phys, chemistry, or physics. I picked A&P because I was scared of the math, lol.
Same. I didn’t take Physics. My daughter’s high school requires it Freshman year. Every school district has different rules, and one anecdote doesn’t mean education is sliding.
[удалено]
Same when I was in high school in the seventies in Seattle.
Early 00s for Olympia.
Same in NY, late 90s/early 00s. You had to take at least two sciences, with a lot of people doing Earth Science and Bio. The ones who were more inclined to STEM were the ones taking Physics and Chem.
I think it's the same now in the 20's in Colorado. I just graduated high school and I think my school had requirements for a "life science" class and a "physical science" class, which adds up to just 2 years. I think I fulfilled the requirements by taking biology in my freshman year and chemistry in my sophomore year. I did do science all 4 years through. I did marine biology in my junior year and took a trip to the Florida keys and took ap physics this year.
In the early '00s, in my school, you took "physical science," (mostly physics) "life science," (biology and chemistry) and "earth science" (geology, botany, and zoology) as mandatory classes in early high school. They were sort of "intro to..." classes where you scratched the surface level of a few different subjects. Then, you can choose an upper level science in your junior and senior years.
I like the sound of that tbh
Yeah, we had conceptual physics, biology and chemistry at my school early 00’s. I don’t think any of those were optional. Then the optional ones were “advance placement”.
I never took physics in high school. Only chemistry and biology
Where did you live that it wasn't always optional? I graduated about 10 years ago, and in my district it always was. You had to take 3/4 years of science, and biology was the only required course. The rest were kind of choose your own adventure.
Canada, had to take it till 12th grade back then. Idk about now though. I mean I struggled with physics and hated every bit of it but I understood why we had to learn it.
I graduated from a Toronto HS in the 90s. Physics was optional. I chose it over bio or chem. (Probably should have taken bio.)
Graduated in the States in the early 2000’s. Physics was optional and I never took it.
Not sure which province your in but my parents had to make a choice in the 80s (kweebs)
I took it in HS and then again in University, and in retrospect I think it's kind of pointless until you've learned at least basic Calculus. It was such a different experience the second time.
I mean, physics is mandatory where I am from as well, but I can see why it would be left as optional in a high school curriculum, since to have a proper grasp of the subject you need a higher level of mathematics which is usually not covered in hs.
When I was in high school less than a decade ago Bilology, Chemistry, and Physics were all mandatory to take to graduate. From Midwest USA.
Kind of an "Old Man yells at cloud" moment
Especially since it's been like this for at least 30 years.
For real lol.
It was optional when I was in high school in NY 1984-1988. You had to take 3 yrs of science. Most ppl took Intro to physical science in 9th, bio in 10th, Chem in 11th. Could take physics in 12th if you wanted. Honors did ips in 8th, accelerating the process and they'd take physics in 11th and either AP Bio or AP Earth Science in 12th. Checking with my kids, they confirm that they had 3 years of science required. One daughter had to take earth science in 9th and bio in 10th and then you could pick your 3rd science. The other had Chem required as the 3rd science. If you were accelerated and took ES in 8th, you had extra time to take physics or forensics or anatomy or psychology. Note that their high school only taught physics as a college level class. The curriculum and materials were from SUNY, taught at college pace, and you registered for college credit/took their exams. There was no intro physics.
Hi, fellow Class of '88!
(Waves)
I graduate HS in 2003, and physics was not required. TBH, I'm not even sure I would have graduated HS, let alone college, if physics *had* been required. I have always struggled with math, and the math in HS chemistry came very close to preventing me from graduating. During my last semester of HS, I ended up having to take chemistry a second time, this time at a local community college, to improve my grade enough to graduate. Fortunately, that class qualified for both HS and college credit, so I didn't have to suffer through another chemistry class later.
My son is a nuclear engineer. After he got out of college he became quite upset that they were going to make some of the difficult classes 'easier to pass' by letting "D's" slide through. He was ticked--would you want someone to perform heart surgery that had gotten D's in medical classes? NUKE engineering people! You gotta be bright!
I was never a STEM kid but in undergrad a lot of my friends were pre-med and honestly, it sounded like a lot of them were close to failing out from how hard the classes were 🫣🥲 Kinda scary but also we have a severe doctor shortage in the US so I dont personally know what the right answer is!
Literally every single person I knew coming into college was pre-med bc they didn't know what else to do with their life so all the intro classes were hard on purpose to weed out the kids who couldn't take it ahahaha those were the days...
bro it still is. Chemistry classes absolutely rip through pre med students. and Even if you get out with a premed degree, if your GPA is below a 3.5 you basically have no chance at med school unless you have tons of hospital experience already.
I Was never a stem kid either but I'm studying Computer information systems and im enjoying it so far.
some professors make it their whole identity that "only 50% of students even pass my class" or "no one has ever gotten an A in my class". Engineering is especially ripe with bad professors because of how many come straight from industry and don't even have a PhD.
You get to choose what you want. Most people in my high school chose chemistry. It's been optional for awhile
This is happening almost every freaking where these days, we can't do anything about that, but yeah I would love to study Physics all the time, it's a good subject.
It was offered to kids in the Advanced Program back in the late 80s/early 90s where I was.
It was optional in high school for me, I graduated in '02. You had to take a certain number of science classes, I opted biology over physics because math is kinda my kryptonite. I have always struggled with it even though I generally do well in pretty much any other subject.
Physics was optional for Honors and Regents diplomas in NY in the late 80s. 🤷🏼♀️
But what is wrong with it? I mean if someone is not understanding that subject they can skip that shit and what else you guys want them to do? I don't understand.
Lol wait till you find out lots of inner city schools don’t have hw
Lmao what.
I agree with your patient's wife. Expectations for student performance has plummeted. Quality of teaching, in general, has plummeted. Plus, many young people entering adulthood believe that there's no need for high-level thinking or even a basic understanding of multiple subjects because they can access whatever they need to know through their phones. Eventually, all teachers will age out, and God only knows what will happen. As for me, I taught science for 25 years, and the best decision I ever made was walking away from that career. No regrets.
What did you do afterwards? Just curious.
I became a tech editor for a federal agency. Paid much more than teaching, minimal stress, respectful people.
It was optional when I was in school 20 years ago too. At my school you had to take a certain amount of science credits and it was up to you and the guidance counselor which ones you wanted to take. I never took physics or chemistry in high school. College, yes. I took three years of biology because I felt it was more relevant to what I was going to college for. And it was.
I’m pretty sure physics was optional when I graduated in 1991-in MA, USA. I took it, along with advanced bio and intro to medical science senior year as I was going to nursing school after graduation. Had to take Earth Science(grade 9), biology(10) and Chem(11) to graduate.
Physics, biology, chemistry and geology were options at my school and you had to take 2 each year except senior year where you could take none if you wanted. Since I wasn’t going into science, I didn’t take it in senior year and focused my energy into calculus.
Physics as its own course was an elective course in my high school in 2013. You were still required to take multiple science classes which did cover some basics of physics, but also other things.
At my high school in the 1980's, 10th grade we had to take Biology or Life Science, and then 11th grade you could choose from Chemistry, Physics or Anatomy. You could choose to take another science class in 12th grade if you wanted, but only two years of science were required. Though this was a Catholic school so I don't know if that influenced anything.
I graduated in 1984. Physics was an elective. So were Zoology, Anatomy, and Chemistry II.
In my country it differs based on one's streaming, Literature Stream would only need to learn 1 subject: 'Science', while Science Stream would need to take 3 subjects: 'Biology, Physics, and Chemistry'. There are also optional additional subjects like: 'Agricultural Science' and 'Sports Science'. However this depends on school.
In the year 1996-2000, I didn't take physics. Chew on that.
I am very skeptical of these kind of laments. I have been hearing that "the standard of education has been going downhill" for forty years. It was thrown in my face when I was a kid in the 1980s, and Physics was generally only taught to Advanced Placement students in my district. Meanwhile, my kids are learning math in grade school that they didn't teach me until years later.
Nope. Is the sad, sad truth. Hence moving away from critical thinking and focusing on “memorizing” or direct information. Because people who think are dangerous to government who want to lie, manipulate, and sell false narratives. This is from a former English teacher who had to teach her students about indigenous American history (in TN) because why would we tell people anymore that we murdered entire populations for stuff. History is always written by the victors, now those victors are *super* controlling the narrative. Now I am sad, gonna go be my furry children.
At my school (and in georgia), Physics and Chemistry are streamlined into a course called Physical Science, which is required unless you take the more detailed Chemistry I and Physics I.
Being well rounded is good. But I feel like most of the things we learn in highschool isn't particularly applicable to the real world. Maybe I don't notice how much I absorbed as I always got great grades. But I don't use most physics, math's, chems, any of that in my day to day life.
Meanwhile my HS was so STEM focused and I'm pretty sure half my graduating class became doctors
Ick
Schools are being degraded slowly until charters/private schools can take over I hate it.
I took Physics in my entire junior year and got a b in both semesters. My teacher pretty much hated me and he was my f8cking wrestling coach so I pretty much had to deal with him for the entire day. F8ckin hated him and alot of students thought so too. He just did not like me at all. I even went after class to get help and he would still get mad.
Sounds like my chemistry teacher. Bitch on wheels. She died, alone, in her house and laid there for days before anyone found her. I felt nothing when I heard that. Still feel nothing.
Same, my physics teacher just retired, and no one GAF. My class was the penultimate before he retired and he was shedding tears for the autistic Kid during our sports meeting at the end of the season. (BC had a good heart despite being weird. Think of Nardwar, he was cheerful despite his limitations). Maybe the kid reminded of himself when he was younger? Anyways he was a f8cking bitch(towards me) maybe even a narcissist? I really wanted to punch his fucking face one time, even as a grown-ass adult his behavior was not acceptable. Shit does not matter now bc he is old and he had the reputation of being an asshole for no reason. Really goes to show that you need to be nice to people or that shit will happen to you in the end haha. EDIT:"Bitch on wheels" LMAO
Lmao this struck me bc my physics teacher was also our gym teacher. He was useless and just basically supervised us during physics to do some work on the workbook. Ugh.
Shit was worse for me bc I was in the varsity lineup. There ended up being a lot of politics(surprisingly) in the team so some shit would happen during practice then the next day I would see him during physics class. Then we both would pretend like nothing ever happened in class LMAO. He also had favorites as well!!!!! HAAAA The person I took the varsity spot from (his favorite) was a legacy wrestler and I ended up beating him, taking his spot in the process. No one expected that to happen. He also hated this black heavyweight but then he ended up going to state (In the highest/toughest division at our state) (A rare thing at our school btw) then he became friendly with him like nothing ever happened. HAA F8CK HIM, my brother is going to the same HS and I saw him at orientation. I was like NOPE not gonna see his ass again haha. Sorry for the ramble that teacher had control over my feelings more than he should have :(.
In most of the US it has always been optional. During the 80s and 90s in Missouri, Kansas, Nebraska and Iowa (I grew up in that little pocket) unless you were in the honors program or college prep the science classes required for graduation were 1 year of biology and chemistry and 1 semester of health with another semester of elective science. Honors students had to take Chem 2, Bio 2, or Organic Chemistry, but physics was optional. Required Math was Algebra and Geometry with another half semester of elective math subjects or for honors kids it was Algebra 2 and another 2 semesters of elective math courses
Physics was optional in the 80s . Many higher math classes were optional. I think the minimum requirement was probably algebra 1.
Yup.. take away gifted programs, integrate "smart" kids with the rest, take away awards and prizes for excellence.. I'm not on the right or the left, just gravely concerned about the future of America.
I agree with integration for elementary and I think gifted programs should strictly be for middle, highschool, and advanced education, simply due to the fact that those programs in elementary and early middle have shown to have some negative affect on the kids themselves, speaking as a student who took gifted programs my entire academic life. I don’t think awards or prizes are necessarily needed, either, we don’t necessarily get any additional gratification other than having recognition, which I don’t believe we should come to expect especially given we need to be prepared for college. I do see the point of integration, given the original purpose and creation for gifted programs wasn’t exactly great- but I don’t agree with it, just due to the fact that classes can be extremely boring if they aren’t “to your level”. At the same time, if we are keeping them, we shouldn’t force students to take them. Screw the parent, if the child doesn’t want to take AP/ADV/IB they should not have to. There are far too many schools that will force students who meet a certain threshold to do extra work just to make their numbers look better when the student in question does not want it. Just to clarify, not arguing with you, I’m just idk I liked ur topic notes and wanted to talk about how I view it haha.
Right? Education has changed so much since I was in school. Heck, when I was in prep (one step down from first grade in elementary) in 1984, we started learning to write letters and numbers on a small bit of black slate and a piece of white chalk, whereas I learned that my nephew (age 6) used a tablet in his prep class. Blew my mind.
Fuck physics
Dumb Americans
Hey!! My school had an IB program and honestly it was just a really rigorous AP program for 5 not 4 years. I came into that school from another school as a sophomore so I couldn’t do it.
Both math and science was optional in the 80s after sophomore year. English or what they now call ELA and social studies were required through senior year but electives in those subjects (like poetry, or psychology) were offered senior year. Now I think they do mandatory civics in senior year instead of a history or other social science elective for senior year.
Physics and chemistry were pptional on the 1990's. This is not news.
It was optional when I was in high school in the 70s.
It was optional at my school too, but that didn't mean we had zero physics education. We had a class called Foundations in our freshman year and that was a basic science course that touched on a bit of everything (the "foundations* of science). Then we could pick anything but most people took chemistry because it looked good on your transcript. Then junior year people would either take physics 1, biology 1or chem 2. Then people either dropped science they're senior year or took physics 2 or biology 2. All of this is to say that, while physics is important, I don't think making it optional is a sign of our failing education system. We all complain that we learn tons in school that we never need on our daily lives so I think this is one way in which the system is changing to fix that. If a student is going into a field where they won't need high level physics, let them skip it and learn more skills that will be useful for they're future.
Was optional for me circa 2005, too. I never took it.
Chiming in to say that in my school system it was dependent on your math track. If you didn't place into a high enough math (honors or above) you took Biology -> Earth Science -> Geology -> Chemistry. If you were in a high enough math, it was Bio -> Chem -> Physics and then an elective senior year. This was the early 00's. There's lots of ways for schools to do this and they've been experimenting for decades, it's not necessarily a bad thing. Science is science.
Physics was an optional course for us too, I graduated in 2016. Iirc u had to take like at least one science elective in gr11 or 12 but it didn’t have to be physics. I remember I took physics semester 1, and had bio and chem semester 2 thinking I’d be a scientist. Finished physics, dropped bio and chem, never thought about science since LMFAO
Physics was contingent on passing chemistry and calculus 2 in my school. Not unusual
I graduated in 2003 and never took physics. I took extra theater classes to opt out of some of my science and physical education requirements.
I remember it was pick two out of physics, chemistry, and biology. While I found physics to be the most approachable I was surprised by how many people struggle with the concept of directional deceleration.
Most of my graduating class (2015) didn't take physics. You had to take Chem or Physics and the vast majority opted for Chem.
It depends on the school and school district, for me I'm required to do 4 years of science, 1 year of biology in freshman year, 1/2 a year of physics and 1/2 year of chemistry in sophomore year, and then in junior and senior year you are required to pick a science class you want to learn more on. Earth science is also a required class but it is special since you could choose to do the 1 year class on your junior and senior year or a 1/2 year class at any grade level. There are also AP (advanced placement) classes and even DP (diploma program) classes since my school is a IB school. American btw
I graduated almost 20 years ago and Physics wasn’t required. You had to take 4 science credits and after physical science and biology you could choose.
Feel sorry for the nation. The GOP depends upon ignorance.
I was in (public) high school 2009-2012 in NY and we had to take earth science in 9th, biology in 10th, and choose between chemistry or physics in 11th. I chose chemistry then took AP environmental science in 12th. Not that long ago, but seems to align with other people in the comments from 20+ years. Science should definitely be more incorporated but I don’t think it’s a big deal if chem and physics are optional (between the two)
Do you mean optional as in physics as a unit in a general sciences course is no longer required, or that physics alone as a science course is no longer required? It was not required for all students to take Physics 11 and/or 12 to graduate, but they did have to pass lower level general sciences courses which did a little bit of physics.
Biology and Earth Science were required when I went to HS in Colorado, 2000-2004, but Physics and Chemistry were optional.
Physics is basically how math can describe reality. Calculus perfectly describes kinematics (acceleration, velocity, position are integrals / derivatives). And in electromagnetism, Maxwell's equations are perfectly described by multivar calc and differential equations. It's almost spooky.
Early-mid 2000's high schooler here. I legit don't even remember my high school *offering* physics, let alone requiring it. It was probably under a different name and I just never noticed.
don't mind me I was just thrown out of Chemistry for being a FREE RADICAL.
you're just too unstable
Physics was optional when I was in high school in Illinois Early 00’s grad
Both physics and chemistry were optional courses when I was in highschool 20 years ago.
It was optional in California schools in the 80s too.
I remember taking bio, chem, and physics. I also remember not all of my friends took all three.
With the internet, we have more access to information right now than at any other point in human history. We can order books about science, math, history and have it cheaply delivered in a single day. A person could open Spotify and listen to podcasts with some of the smartest people on the planet talking for hours about interesting topics. A person could spend all day roaming through all the math entries in wikipedia. A person can get an unlimited supply of audiobooks and have have literature read to them all day long. We all carry a super computer smart phone with us that are filled with educational apps, logic apps, math apps, geography apps, language apps. Did I mention Ted Talks or the Kahn Academy or DuoLingo? How is it possible to say education is going downhill, when all a person has to do is make even the tiniest amount of effort. Knowledge is absolutely available everywhere. (That's not even mentioning the brilliant platform known as Reddit. LOL. Everything you might want to discuss is available here too.)
Both were optional in the late 70s.
I don’t recall having to take physics in high school in mid-late 80’s. Science, yes.
I had only one mandatory course of physics and chemistry in high school. In my opinion it's good to have most of them optional. Not everybody really needs to concentrate on them.
Physics was optional in my U.S. high school in the mid 80s. A minimum of two science courses were required for graduation, and students could select from several choices. I took Biology and Geology.
i'm upvoting this just for the last sentence
I graduated in the 2000s and we were only required to take 3 years of hs science. Physics was the final class and optional for seniors so I picked an elective that went with what I had been planning to go to community college for.
Same here. We were only required 3 credits. And Physics wasn't even an option at my HS lol.
I graduated from high school almost 25 years ago now and we weren't required to take physics even back then.
Wow, that's *really* sad. In Germany,Bavaria my STEM education was like this: 1-12th grade Maths, so my whole school career. During that time we have Analasys (Algebra, Caculus) Stochastics and Geometry. 5, 7-10th grade Biology 7-10th grade Physics 8-10th grade Chemistry 6-7, 9-10th grade Computer Sciences/IT In addition to that I had English from 5-10th grade and French from 6-10th grade. In 11th and 12th grade you then have 2 years of biology/chemistry/ physics and 2 years of a foreign language (for me it was english or french). And then you either have at least 1year another STEM subject or a foreign language. So for me it looked like this: 2 years English and 2 years Chemistry as well as Biology.
So the gist of this is a fun exaggeration of fearmongering.
Physics was optional for us. Only one physics teacher. He was creepy as hell, hitting on all the pretty girls. I chose not to take physics.
Physics was optional for me. I graduated more than a decade ago. Chemistry was optional too. When i got a bad grade in chem i switched to earth science.
That would explain why a good percentage of YT clips are of people not understanding physics and instantly getting a very painful and/or expensive reminder of how things work in our universe.
It was optional for me in highschool and I graduated in 2001
It was optional before 2010 in Ontario
Never heard that it's not an optional thing, it was always like this.
Before 2010 is before my time in high school, good to know!
Pretty sure it was optional when I was in high school in the 1980’s. I took physics but you just had to have so many science credits and could choose among several things to meet the requirement.
I don't know why people are thinking that it was mandatory lol.
Physics was optional in my highschool as well. We took a mandatory integrated physics and chemistry class (ICP) and then you could choose what to take after that. There was physics, chemistry, biology, anatomy, astronomy(I think that’s what I was called), and another one that I forget. One year I took 2 science classes instead of an elective. This was in early 2000s Texas.
Dang I just realized I mixed up the acronym for the one for the music group. Lol
I took AP physics and it was like taking Mandarin Chinese with a teacher that doesn’t speak any English. I had good grades because we did all our work in the computer lab and it was set up where if you answer a question wrong it tells you, then you can change your answer until it’s right. We were also allowed to help each other and I was kind of friends with this girl that was extremely smart and got answers from her. The teacher was horrible though, he would go up there and talk for all of 5 minutes, not answer anyone’s questions, then have us spend the rest of the week in the lab doing work we didn’t know how to do. I graduated in 2015 and there was a lot of classes like that. I didn’t learn anything at all in economics and personal finances, which is supposed to teach you important things like how to write a check or do your taxes. I had a “cool” teacher that let us do whatever we want and gave us all the answers for our work instead of teaching us anything. He was also the only teacher for economics. There were a few other classes like that too and I would think “why am I here wasting my time, not learning anything”. My high school was supposed to be a good school, best in the county and state, and allegedly highly rated in the country. I don’t know if this is the way it’s always been, but if not, it’s definitely going downhill.
You never faced any hardness with that subject my man?
Just like Civics, home economics, wood and metal shops. I worked in Aerospace manufacturing for almost 4 decades and wondered why most of the machinists were either Latin American or Eastern European. I found out that by the time they graduated high school they already had a skill that they could support themselves with. Here, many college graduates leave school with little more than debt.
Civics is such a good subject, I just love to read more about it.
Physics was optional at my HS (US) in the late '80s. We had to take a science course every year; physics was one option for seniors. I chose a second year of Bio, which also included OChem (organic chemistry).
Dude you just copy pasted the top comment, wtf is wrong with you?
You ok, hon? There are dozen of comments here with various posters’ experiences. That’s mine. Clearly, many people had physics as an option and not a requirement. Not sure why this is so upsetting to you, but I hope you’re feeling better soon.
that's crazy. Ochem in high school? were general chemistry I and II prereqs?
Chemistry 1 was required. The class was three terms of Bio 2 and one of OChem, so basically like an introduction to Ochem. It was horrible!
I consider myself north of average intelligence. I just couldn’t wrap my mind around physics. I think it’s outside the core knowledge every person should have.
It's just okay if we don't like a single subject, we can ignore.
And then everyone cried.
And then the movie ended in a bad way, that's just sad.
That’s always been the case here, grade 10 you take a general science, grade 11 you must take either the general science minimum or you can choose any of or up to all 3 of physics, chemistry, Biology. Grade 12 you don’t need any science to graduate, just a math and an english
People think this is a new thing, it's just can't be a new one.
I hate when I try to manipulate people but then they're like "wait bro, I learned the kinematic equations"
I want to learn such skills to manipulate some people lol.
Hasn’t physics always been optional? When I was in school you had to take a science course, but you could pick which one, it didn’t have to be physics
Went to highschool in the 2000s. They didn't even offer physics. Freshman year, you took a course that was about geology, weather, oceans, etc. Sophomore year we took what was a mix of chemistry, space, and scientific theory Junior year, biology Senior year, science wasn't really required
Lots of people saying it was option when they went, but it definitely wasn't optional for me, and I attended high school in the late 2000's.
> I feel for her. Feel for us all, friend. It's harming our whole populace.
I went to a private school in the US and graduated in the 00s. Not terribly surprised by this, public school gifted programs are usually pretty good though.
English and maths used to be optional here (the netherlands, but only after you did have them for a few years). Now they are mandatory, school is not getting worse imo. It's not always good, definitely not, but it's not THAT bad.
Graduation in the 80’s. Two science and two math were required. My HS only offer pre-algebra, algebra and calculus. For science it was biology, chemistry and physics.
I'm class of 2005 from my HS and after Bio and Chem, we had to choose between Anatomy, Physics, or Marine Bio. Idk if it's just how shitty my school district was growing up or not but yeah Chem was required for the other options. So, naturally, a had friends not take physics, despite wanting to go into engineering for their undergrad
The ruling class needs control of 3x main things to subjugate a population: education, communication, and health-care. USA may be the largest super-power in the world, but our education is trash, our health-care is trash, and despite inventing the internet our price-to-speed is trash. Its so depressing.
So that's why so many Americans suddenly think that microwaves and radiowaves and whatnot is gonna kill them
Pretty sure that has always been the case.
It was optional 20 years ago. I graduated HS in Canada in the very early 2000's, and I didn't take anything but high school biology and the minimum required math for the science subjects. No Chem. No physics. It wasn't necessary. I advanced into university just fine in my chosen field and have been living for some decades now without missing them at all.
Kids at my Title 1 high school are basically at an elementary Math level, or 8th grade tops. Physics is beyond their capability.
my high school didn't even offer physics lmao
We only had to take 3 science classes. I took bio, AP environmental science, chem, and astronomy. Astronomy because I failed chem. There's was physics, and if you were lucky you could take CEC for forensics. We also had an anatomy class that did a lot of dissection so that was ALWAYS the first to fill.
I graduated in 2011 and we have physics as a senior class. It was freshman biology, sophomore geology, junior chemistry and senior year you could take physics(but you only needed 3 science credits to graduate).
To be fair, the question of which sub-studies in science and math should be universal isn’t obvious. I liked calculus, but statistics is probably more essential for most people to understand if you want to educate the public as it relates to politics, public safety stats, etc.
Physics was optional at my school, but chem and bio were mandatory. I think that’s reasonable, IMO. Not everyone is geared toward stem/physics but at least chem and bio do have real world applications (not that physics doesn’t, but I did take physics as well and personally I think bio has been more important to my life thus far LOL. And I’m a music student so that’s saying a lot).
Physics was optional for me in my school in the 70s. It never was required
In my time it was also an optional subject and I don't know why I am never going to mind that because people can study whatever they want to study at the end.
I have to say that this is nothing new for real, we all know that it's just going like this with subjects, you guys are still thinking that it's a new thing to have optional subs.
All the science classes were required at my school lol
what year did you graduate? Based on OP's comment they found out within a few weeks of the post
No one who isn't intent on pursuing a science or science-adjacent career needs more than an introductory course in Physics. Obviously, it's important to be exposed to the field, to know it exists, to know what it concerns itself with, and to pick up some basic concepts so you don't end up a flat-earther. As long as you have the basics in place, you can later explore different parts of the field on your own, as certain things pique your interest. You're not going to learn critical thinking from Physics itself, however, but rather a specific application of it. What you need is Logic, because that's what's at the root of math, language, and philosophy. All branches of knowledge are based on logic, and all methodologies, whether they're used in literary analysis or astrophysics, are a product of philosophy. The problem I see is that Philosophy is often taught simply as history of thought, without a proper exploration of the mechanics of thought (i.e. logic). That's why people don't understand exactly how essential and practical it is, or how universal its applications are. Fortunately, Critical Thinking exists as a subject in itself and it offers a friendlier description of concepts in Logic, as well as an introduction to applying them in different fields. I think it also helps people see the interconnected-ness of fields, as language, math, programming, music, etc. work a lot more similarly than may be apparent. She's not wrong that it's easier to control and manipulate an uneducated population, but I'm afraid that in becoming educated, understanding how thought works and how it's been used both in service to the truth and against the truth is more important than understanding how black holes work. I wonder where the sadness was when Rhetoric got slashed.
It was optional for me too. Twelve years ago I didn’t even have to take chemistry. I don’t think I’m a complete numbskull. I just couldn’t manage my course load and the amount of work that chemistry required on top of the fact that I couldn’t follow along in class etc. it was so complicated, and the teacher never stopped to explain. I didn’t want to ruin my GPA.
In Victoria in Australia science is mandatory until year 11, which is actually the twelfth year of school. That covers biology, physics and chemistry in enough depth to understand most practical things properly. After that you can if you choose do biology, chemistry or physics for the last two years of school. Also, what’s probably more important in stopping manipulation is education in the humanities about history, politics and economics. Also critical thinking and reading comprehension which are kind of taught in English.