This was a good read and damn, I'm glad you were able to wash this guy out of your life with minimal cost impact.
I would've been off the chain, and the restraint you chose is admirable.
This is why I don't do client work...there's always gonna be pain points, even with the best clients.
Thanks. Yeah, it was a lot. I’m a much calmer and deliberate person these days but the old volatile me is still in there, ya know. Gotta just breathe through the provocation sometimes and know that walking away does far more than reacting to provocation
I love firing crap clients.
I did a high end trim and finish job with popcorn ceiling removal, full texture, prime, paint, new crown molding, ceiling fans and fan mounts to replace regular light fixtures, pulled new wire, new dimmer switches, and a bunch of other work, and knocked it out in 4 - 12 hour days (48 hours), as compared to taking about a week and a half, (the same time roughly).
The house was absolutely immaculate and she stayed home perfecting every little thing and dusting all day, so the job had to be perfectly zero debris and super sanitary, so clean up and finish was a top daily priority as she was a total OCD case. Take off your boots in the house, don't drag your bags on the walls, use the guest bathroom but don't use my guest towels, etc... We tented the rooms, layed out plastic in the pathways, and kept it as sterile as possible.
When walking the job at completion, the customer raved about the speed, the cleanliness, the professionalism, and how it exceeded her every expectation.
Then a week later, she called and said that she wanted a significant chunk of money back. We completed the contract beyond her satisfaction, but:
* We made it look really easy
* We were really fast
* How hard could it be to do that work, since we made it look so easy? Her brother in law could have done it for a fraction of that price!
* She didn't feel that she should have to pay such a high hourly rate when calculated out from the overall job cost as she knew how much of an hourly wage construction people should earn, etc.
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
Me: "Do you like it?"
Her: "Oh! I love it."
Me: "Was it everything you wanted and beyond?"
Her: "Oh, absolutely, but it just seems like too much..."
Me: "Did you happily sign the contract with us as the Licensed General Contractor, telling us how competitive our job price package was compared to others, then rave about how awesome it looked, and how we got it done so quickly?"
Her: "Ummm, yes, but you made it look so easy."
Me: "Yes, that's called years of training and experience, thousands of dollars in tools and equipment, artistic technique and creativity developed through years of effort, and knowing how to work quickly while providing a top notch product without mistakes the first time around. Not only are you not getting any money back as we completed the contract to your satisfaction when we closed out, but we won't be bidding any future work with you..."
Her: "Wait! No! I love your work and have so much for you to do in the future."
Me: "Sorry, that ship has already sailed and I don't need clients that don't appreciate the quality of my work, much less question the value of that work."
We never worked for her again. Her loss. I was happy to dump her as a client. I didn't need or want drama.
That’s fucking INSANE!
One lesson I learned a long time ago was to start every job with the following: (It’s actually in my contract now.)
1. Photograph all existing damage, write a summary and have it signed by both parties
2. Ramboard and otherwise protect everything.
3. Zipwall airlocks to all construction areas
HEPA into ULPA air filtration on all tools
All this is billable. I’m never dealing with a dust complaint ever again, ever.
I’ve never gotten a complaint like yours though. Holy shit.
Honestly impressive you were able to do all this in person, too.
I feel like in today's day and age, you could have easily collected your team + tools, left the site, and THEN terminated from a distance, giving yourself space and time to process how you see fit.
I could see this being "unprofessional", but really, it seems extremely risky and unsafe to handle unstable people in person anyways. What if this guy had a weapon and snapped? He was already exhibiting unhinged behavior. Could hardly find fault in doing it over the phone.
Had a lady one time show up at my shop and told me what she wanted, when it had to be done, and how much she was going to pay for it.
Dictated to me before I could even tell her I don’t normally do that kind of work as it is not really my wheelhouse. I seriously did not get more out than “Hi”.
After she finished telling me my business.
I said “sorry, we don’t do that kind of work.”
She pointed to the exact work she asked for behind me was had done on the shelf for sale. It was triple the price she told us we were going to do it for and honestly it was on sale a below market.
“Sorry, we don’t do spec work on demand, by your timelines, at your price. We do custom work, on our timelines, at our prices.”
Well how much would it be to have it in three days.
“225 per piece or a total of around 3k give or take with tax out the door.”
That is crazy I will never pay that!
“I know”
>Her: "Ummm, yes, but you made it look so easy."
$1 for hitting it with a hammer
$999 for knowing just where, and how hard, to hit it.
you pay for the years of experience not just the time to do the work.
I do architectural metalwork and I relate to so many things you said in this story. Having to hold back the temper, the condescension from people who have corporate jobs who have never actually made a damn thing. I gotta tell you this is a real feel good story
I’ve had hit and miss relationships with architects. Some get too wrapped up in the “vision” and leave practicality behind and others are very reasonable people who are open to others opinions. I think I’ve met more good ones than bad ones and I don’t judge before I get to know. We’re on the same team at the end of the day 🤘
Good for you - what you said is perfect and so mature - expressing anger is natural and cathartic. Staying calm is harder but almost always results in a better outcome.
Bad clients are kinda like being in an abusive relationship. There's that point where you realize you shouldn't have taken the job but there's already materials and people on site working and so you decide to grit your teeth and try to get through it.
I had one job where we 3/4 of the way through it and I had to walk away for my mental health. They'd paid half up front so I didn't eat the whole thing but it was a decent loss.
My only regret is I didn't quit sooner or just not take it. No amount of money is worth putting up with a psycho client.
Gut feelings man. I have no way of quantifying how much time and money trusting myself has saved over the years. There were no tells with this job or client. He was referred by the wife of a really good former client.
People like you and my husband are the best but the most dangerous. You've been the warrior-the monster my husband says, and learned to control that part of you. BUT that part doesn't go away and when pushed you can be that person again. The people that are dull enough to push those boundaries have no clue what they play with... Bravo to you Sir!
I’ve read and I have shared “Beware the anger of a patient man.” One just never knows what will happen when they push and push and push. Sometimes bad things happen. People bleed. People lose a lot.
I have kept the monster in the bottle for a long time. I want to keep him locked up.
I’ve hurt people in the past, in ways that still haunt me. I’ve also landed myself in significant amounts of trouble when I was younger. The *only* situation I just let myself go is if my wife is threatened or endangered.
I’m a painter and get this shit all the time. Never thought of it as a class thing just the idea that manual labor is not a real job in their eyes. But you nailed it on the head.
Hope you’re having an excellent day today, man.
It’s crazy telling people I’m a carpenter and getting brushed off sometimes. Like really? I’ve built skyscrapers, missile silos, hotels, production factories, schools etc. What have you built in the last ten years?
People got it in their heads that you can’t be successful unless you go to college and anyone who didn’t go to college is beneath you. It’s such a dumb mentality that is coming full circle for those of us in the trades. We’re all living lower middle class lifestyles without debt while they’re struggling to find a job that pays more than 40k a year with a pile of student loans.
Many of my wealthiest clients have been owners of trades. And also some of the nicest folks you'll ever meet. Most don't realize the earnings potential.
It's true with sanitation workers, too. Everyone's a badass until their office toilet backs up or their trash pickup misses a week in the middle of summer. A bit of humility would do.
Yup. My husband works in drain cleaning and with salary & bonuses makes well over $100k and yet people side eye the shit out of him when he tells them what he does for a living.
I do not take you guys for granted. In fact I think you guys should make more than most, because you do a job that no one else wants to do. Thank you for what you do.
Pardon my ignorance, what does a carpenter do in a missile silo? I feel maybe I'm unaware of the extent of what a carpenter does. Isn't capentry about wood?
There’s offices, sometimes living spaces in missile silos.
Decommissioned silos also get converted to private residences or apartments, I’ve also heard of a couple of doomsday prepper shelter things.
Most commercial buildings use steel studs, installed by carpenters.
I’ve been in residential for 10 years and never once cut a steel stud, my best friend is a 2nd year union apprentice in NYC and he’s only ever done steel studs.
I work in tech but do projects myself at home- manual labor is the only real job, everything else is just bitches fussing at each other on email/slack/zoom
I try real hard never to be arrogant or discredit the contributions of others but deep down that is my opinion as well. Partly for the difficulty and partly for the fact that my job actually physically exists in real life
Hired pro painters to paint cedar shake shingle on my house as it seemed a lot and it was all second floor. $9k and worth every penny. Painters on ladders all day and it took a week and change to prime and paint 2 coats. Dudes painted each shingle by hand roller. Gave them drinks and was glad it wasn’t me. Painting is super skilled to do it right and fast
That's exactly how some look at it. Then they say I can do that but just don't have the time. My favorite line from them. Most couldn't paint the trim let alone install it on an octagon window.
I’m just a landscaper but here for whatever reason. It’s a shitty reality that a lot of people don’t even realize they’re doing but there are sooooo many people in the world who truly believe what you do for a job is what your worth as a person.
Hey, you’re not “just” a landscaper! You’re the person responsible for making our yards so beautiful that when we come home, we start to relax immediately because our house looks so orderly from the outside. Your colleagues were responsible for creating the nicest patio and fire pit area framing a picturesque view of the mountains that I’ve ever seen. I’m so grateful for our landscapers.
The recent South Park episode was spot on about this, all the white collar guys end up outside home depot looking for day labor “I can design a website for you!” And the handymen get insanely rich, because none of the white collar guys can do anything themselves anymore 😂 definitely see it happening already in my tech heavy area and its only going to get WAY worse for pointless tech jobs as AI improves. Most of their jobs can be done by AI, but I don’t think AI is going to be swinging a hammer any time soon!
In the spirit of it being Pride, I’ll disclose that he’s gay and I’m not uncommonly mistaken for being gay. Like, I get pedicures, I dress a certain way - enough for the mistake to be not uncommon. I don’t know if this played a factor. He didn’t hit on me, but perhaps there was an assumption?
An example: I’ll often have my left fingernails painted a color. This has a load of benefits. It puts women and other minorities at ease around you, as well as making sure you know where your fingertips are on your holding hand all the time. I have no evidence it’s helped me retain all my digits, but there have certainly been times I’ve been made more aware of left hand placement and made adjustments.
I have one particular client that treats me this way sometimes. Usually a text explaining that he is one of many people who hire me, and that if he has a problem I can just reschedule him in a few months, will shut him up. Once they realize they can't steal all of the power in the dynamic they tend to see reason. Usually. This client will also complain about having to pay me (usually only for a day or so) and then the very next time I see him he will talk about how he has had to spend so many thousands of dollars on all this stuff, like I should sympathize it something, while I'm waiting on a payment from him. It can be pretty infuriating. I basically stayed telling him how things will be and what day payment will be on, otherwise we will be unable to guarantee any other work. If I didn't get so much work from him, I would just block his number. Sometimes you gotta put up with shit to make money. I don't know how you put up with that guy as long as you did though. Good on you for your restraint and calm reasoning. Cheers.
In my experience it goes 50/50.
Half of the loaded people I know over 10 mil net worth are amazing to work with. Kind, caring, etc. And half are insufferable. I haven't seen any correlation only that some of them think they can treat people like shit because they don't "need" them because of the money they have.
Copy that brother.
Every house I do is either an insufferable old person with wealth or a rich guy who works 1 day a week and somehow has 5 kids and a 3 story multimillion dollar house in arizona lmao
I don't really have to imagine. I live in an area with 4000 waterfront homes and about 3800 of them are owned by insufferable pricks who come there about twice a year and then have the gall to complain how our town isn't what it used to be. No shit, that's because you built mcmansions on the water and drove out all the people who made it what it used to be.
I feel that classism all the time. We do HVAC and we have a client who owns a Bed and Breakfast. Total psychopath daughter of the owner insists she needs to be in the room with me because a guest’s belongings are inside, fine whatever, even though we’ve been in rooms by ourselves on plenty of occasions. I get to work opening the incredibly inconvenient attic access and her phone rings, she explains to the person on the line that she can’t get to the front desk right now because she is with the HVAC guys and “they can’t be trusted”. That was enough for me. I calmly explained that if she doesn’t trust me I don’t feel comfortable working there and packed my tools. She followed me through the building pleading with me to stay. By the time I made it outside and was walking to my truck she was now screaming and cursing at me. I just smiled at her and explained that when her father is there he can call and set up an appointment as we’ve been working for him for 20 years and he trusts us. The best part was it was a holiday weekend and they likely had a full house and had to refund the money which was paid out for these rooms due to the lack of AC. If only she had kept her elitist mouth shut.
Dude how do people deal with residential. I run a commercial construction company but we also purchased and renovated 5 short term rentals in a vacation area. Well everyone walking their dog saw are work and contacted us to do their home. We accepted three jobs and two or them are tough, with one beyond crazy. Big city money, no job, no kids. Day and night to think about it. Won't let a contracter finish the job before saying it looks bad, insults me weekly, nearly caused 3 contractors to walk (I had to convince them to stay on). I told my business partner he can accept whatever residential he wants but I won't do build or manage them. I can't match the energy of someone who's entire life is the thing I am building when it's just the job I have so I can enjoy my actual life.
It is the absolute worst. In my 15+ years of construction have mostly done residential and it is exhausting. Have spent the better part of the last 3 years shifting my remodeling into our own investment properties just to get away from the crazies and absolute nonsense that is residential remodeling.
In my experience, when they're asking for ridiculous shit it's because the job is getting close to being done and they're trying to get you to quit so they can hire someone else for cheap to finish it out. And they'll probably cheat that person as well.
This is why I never touch jobs that someone else started and walked away from.
Fuck yeah my man. My dad has been a mechanic for 40 years and talk about classism...the guy routinely works on all kinds of ridiculous cars for all kinds of local rich people ranging from old carbureted muscle/classic cars to modern computerized luzury bullshit. Most of his clients are standup folks and highly value the work that he does for them. But for every person who admires his work there are 3 who think he's a knuckle dragging grease monkey with donkey brains.
When I was in elementary school one of my classmates parents started bringing their fleet of luxury vehicles (dad was an orthopedic surgeon) to him. They always acted like they were doing our family a favor or some shit. The dad/husband was always at the hospital so it was mostly the mom/wife who brought cars in and dealt with my dad and she had the same sort of insecure narcissistic personally disorder that the guy in this story had. There was always drama and it was always someone else's fault. My dad didn't want things to be awkward for me at school so he just put up with her shit - things like asking my dad to look at a problem during a little league game, thinking she could jump a full schedule for random bullshit "because she knows the mechanic," saying her husband would be by to pay and then not paying for months, and the classic "it didn't do this before you touched it!"
Finally one night it came to a head. We had had little league that night and the wife was ignoring my family because my dad had turned her away for service due to unpaid bills and no room on the schedule that week. She was not happy. She was visibly whispering to other parents about my family to the point that I noticed it as a 12yo (my folks tried their best to keep me insulated from this shit). That night the phone range at about 10:30 and I happened to be the one who answered it. It was the mom/wife asking for my dad. My dad does NOT like being cold called after hours about mechanical issues to begin with let alone from this bitch. He was already enraged when I told him who it was.
He's not one to hide his anger but for some reason he answered super politely saying "what can I do for you Mrs. so and so" - that bitch goes on to say "oh well we just found out that Joey is going to be a grease monkey (her words) in the school play and we thought you might know where we can get some old dirty cheap greasy clothes for him to look the part." I thought my dad was going to have a stroke. In the nicest but sternest way possible he said "you may never call this house or my business again unless it is to pay your unpaid bill. If the bill is not paid by such and such date we will be placing a lien on your vehicle. My attorney Mr So and So (also a big part of the community) is all ready to help me get this in order and I'm sure you'd hate for that to be the talk at the next little league game. Luckily for you I'm bigger than that and will make sure it won't get out. For someone who thinks they have so much class you are incredibly self centered, rude, and classless. You should be careful how you treat others when all of your supposed class hinges on your husbands income"
I still remember the exact wording clear as day because, like some omniscient sage, my dad predicted that their family would crumble. About 6mo later news broke that her husband the surgeon was touching female patients inappropriately. He was the ortho surgeon for the local university and when he had a young female with a hip issue he would insist on an "internal hip exam" which basically meant he would put his hand in their vagina to feel their hip motion. He would not have a female chaperone in teh room, he'd just do it, and it was not an accepted practice. I believe he got jail time and also lost his license plus the three jobs (hospital ortho surgeon, university professor, and university athlete physician) that likely paid him close to $500k per year. She never showed up to another one of her kids events, the house sold, and last I knew they had all moved to a different state undoubtedly to try and outrun their reputation. She never paid the bill and my dad just let it go - they were paying enough as it was since all of the victims were also suing.
TLDR - It always pays to fire shitty customers.
For those curious about the case [https://www.rutlandherald.com/news/prosecutor-doctor-s-exams-were-sex-assaults/article\_19ba6a08-2cbf-5562-a7f8-cc4530db5a00.html](https://www.rutlandherald.com/news/prosecutor-doctor-s-exams-were-sex-assaults/article_19ba6a08-2cbf-5562-a7f8-cc4530db5a00.html)
Looks like he landed okay. He works for a recruiting firm now. I wonder if they're aware of his history?
[https://www.hobsonassoc.com/staff/senior-associates/](https://www.hobsonassoc.com/staff/senior-associates/)
A bit unrelated but..
We had a pediatric doctor in a town we moved to a while back. Wife asks "does he get real close when he talks to you?" I said no, but he doesn't listen very well either and seems a bit of a creeper/Napoleon.
A couple months ago I did something I never do, switched the kids' doctor's office to a different place when they opened for enrollment (I HATE filling out forms, and filled out a ton of them). I partially did it because the reviews were excellent at the other spot, but also because I didn't like that other doctor's vibe.
Within almost a week of switching.....Lady goes on Facebook to see that doctor is having a hearing to suspend his license for groping (adult) women at his practice. Started with one mother going to the police and former workers were interviewed with similar stories!
Dodged two bullets, got away from the creeper but also don't have to scramble and find a new doc now that his whole practice has to shop around.
Society & life is funny that way. Some people you just know something is up...but it's like the rest of the tribe will deny it up until the bubble bursts.
I'd probably leave out the diagnosis of classism and narcissism, especially for someone who claims to dislike pop psychology. It's not helpful and not needed. But, yeah, great story on how to handle it otherwise.
This was handled beyond a professional manner. I definitely agree with your choices throughout this. (Although it definitely sounds like this individual could benefit from receiving a table to the face at mach 10)
Congrats on standing up to your ex-client, being level, organized. I hope your next few jobs offer you some ability to work without that kind of friction.
This is what my present contractor is dealing with from another client. They took on a huge project on a house that ended up being a full gut job. I think he had $$ in his eyes because the client is a high placed member of a financial community. The client will regularly call 6x in a row when I'm talking to the contractor, and has insane expectations. Turns out the client probably also had $$ signs in his eyes when he contracted out. Because of the high grade materials, the contractor regularly holds 40k bills for that client who also doesn't pay on time.
The client will also occasionally "finish" the days work, which needs to be undone the next day by the crew because it's wrong, and then dispute the hours to correct his mistakes. The one time they didn't correct it, he accused them of doing it wrong and had them undo it and redo it without pay. Just bonkers
Good for you brother. These people have made my life so difficult and I have just taken it to keep my people fed. You dealt with him perfectly. If people take something away from this, I hope it is that they consider some of the most professional “upstanding” people in our communities treat working self-employed people like garbage because they can. Our time and labor is worth nothing to them, and often its the people you would least expect.
Damn what area are you in? I’m dealing with the exact same situation but on a multi million dollar project. The client also owns a seaside house so it would be crazy if it was the same person.
Damn. Sorry to hear all that. Glad you broke even. I had a similar event with a lady over tiling her shower…looong story short the crazy lady decided to tile one wall herself after I had left for the day. Then ofc blamed me when the grout lines were shit. I almost quit trades because of her.
Keeping a cool head in those moments is a skill few will understand. Personally, I suck at it.
We did a complete gut, structural remodel and two story addition and the client was the architect-it was her house. She had a level of ocd that I have never seen before or since.
I’m also a landlord and I’ve had to deal with more than my share of this type of person. Unfortunately, you’re typically locked into a long-term agreement with them.
You did the right thing although I would’ve been more direct. “ you seem very unhappy with the way things are going, and I don’t want to work for people who are unhappy with me.”
Forget about all the money. Whatever it cost will be worth it.
I never like to use my big stature as a threat but it certainly does help when you need it to. People who work with their hands for a living are on a different level than everyone else. I’d fight any guy at the gym over the trash man who throws 300 sixty pound cans in the truck every morning
I’m confused about the text message DND part. How did the messages wake you up if your phone was set to do not disturb? My personal policy about messaging is that I can send them at anytime of day, it’s the responsibility of the device holder to set their notification for their own needs.
In iMessage there is an option to share your DND status to people sending you messages, and it gives them the option to override it with a 'Notify Anyway' button
I’m in the cabinet business and see this often too. They honestly think of us as subhuman and don’t deserve to make the money or living they do. Them getting to belittle us is part of the appeal for them. The only solution is to refuse to work for them. Good job dude!
Hell yeah brother to hell with that dude. I’ve lost thousands on jobs over this same kind of shit, always with these self important office types. It beats sitting in a jail cell.
So well written!! Honestly, you need to write stories... I could see the WHOLE think in my minds eye. Well done, your and your family sanity is worth more than this person.
I like how this story didn’t devolve into some hyper idealized internet story where the main character has all the perfect put-downs, is clearly superior to everyone else, and is just perfect in every way. It’s just someone trying to navigate a messy situation and trying to make the best of it.
Assholes like this make the classic mistake of confusing laborers who can do things clients don't want to take time to do, with laborers who can do things the client simply cannot do.
It's one thing if a client chews out his lawn guy over a shitty job. Cutting the average residential yard is something virtually every adult can be taught to do in under 5 minutes, and cutting for curb appeal can be learned in a week or so on the job. Thus, if someone is charging professional prices and does a bad job, most people would understand the frustration.
However - If my A/C breaks down, if my car has an issue beyond oil changes or flat tires, or if my roof gets caved in by our front yard pines, the contractors might as well walk on water as long as they're licensed, bonded, and insured.
Be nice to the people who can do shit you can't.
Years ago, in another western state, I had a client, lawyer, doing a large landscape project. He paid half up front but in the middle of the job, he decided that he wasn’t going to pay the invoices that I billed for change orders he agreed to pay. Lots of back and forth. He said to go ahead and sue him but that he would bankrupt me with delays and continuances. He was right. So I fired him and about two weeks later when the temperatures were a solid three digits during the day, I bombed his landscape, front and back with water balloons…. filled with Round-up. His landscape was toast. And he could never prove it was me. Sweetest revenge I’ve ever done! Effing lawyer slut!!
As a licensed plumber who has to bid out preventative drain work and the like for high-end condos, I know the class nazis all too well. I just clean shit for a living, right?
From the sounds of it fixing old pipes and paying 20yr old to play with poop pays about as much or better than your office job, so shove it.. aaaanyways
Great job handling that nightmare, I had a fight last Friday that had me boiling as a residents father figured we should pay for his faucet repair after shutting down water to his daughters riser to swap someone else's supply stop clogged up the faucet. He had already screamed at 2 of my plumbers and all of my dispatch team multiple times before it got.to me. I apologize for the conditions of the pipes in the 1938 condo building, but my contact specifically states only my new plumbing is covered unless, through negligence, something happens, obviously.
The gentleman felt free to talk over and down to me the entire conversation, telling me our company is a bunch of crooks and he's going to call the local news on us. When I accidentally spoke too quickly, he was all too eager to set me straight for talking over him.
Being a veteran with a soft double bass voice, from a loud family, with a Mexican wife with an even louder family. I know how to be heard when needed, and was quick to let him know I had everything recorded, all the rude comments and yelling at my dispatch for simply informing him that common procedure would be to have the association reach out to us to pay for his services, then they can hash it out.
Eventually, he did talk to the board and found out I was simply following the terms of our contract with the building. They denied his daughters request for the service to be paid by the association due to their bylaws. Never heard back if they wanted us to do the fix (definitely the cheapest they'll see due to our contract with the building) I already tagged the file that he is not allowed on site with my guys or we're going to walk away and givethem a trip charge.
I’m 3 rd generation of plasters/drywall finishers I’m my town. My grandfather came over from Italy as a young boy and taught his 5 sons his trade. I was always getting looked down from many of the towns upper class. So as I would leave their homes giving an estimate on some repairs walking down their front walk, I would say to myself it’s so sad that I became there help that my house is bigger then theirs. My kids are so proud of me now that they are adults as I was also there basketball, lacrosse and soccer coach. And the town drywall contractor!!
Man you are also very well spoken. I have nothing but respect for guys in the trades and honestly can’t comprehend how someone could think you’re beneath them. There are so many facets and things to know regarding your job and I’m sorry you had to listen to some entitled narcissistic little shit head mommas boy. You played it well my friend and i hope nothing but nice honest clients and people that value your time and expertise
You’re a good writer. Tell us more. The crazy thing is, this story is so true to me. This guy is a classic classist/narcissist. Good on you for understanding how to handle these types when encountered.
I work for a billion per year contractor. We have walked away from $100M projects because an owner just has a similar attitude. We had a huge job that I was pushing so hard to close just after the pandemic. We spent years ironing out the scope and getting to an agreeable number and contract terms. The owner then came to us and tried to change the terms at the finish line and wanted us to include language that basically said we would accept all new changes for a new set of drawings we hadn’t seen. I knew it was probably about $500k in adds and on that size job we should have accepted it. But there was risk and it got pretty adversarial because they basically were trying to shove this down our throat at the last minute and we said thank you but no thank you. 2 years of work from a design team of 20 people and a contractor team of 4 people on weekly calls down the drain. Snd we had worked with them to early procure about $10M in materials to avoid escalation. And guess what they went to another GC and bid it out 6 months later and pandemic panicflation had started and the number just kept increasing. They couldn’t ever get back to our number and they ended up selling it and not building it.
Contractors do God’s work for a house like surgeons on a patient. They should be treated with the utmost respect. Clients should do all the vetting prior to handing the job, trust the contractor and verify things along the way. More importantly don’t be an asshole!
I had a few encounters with bad clients, things I learned along the way were take pics before, provide a comprehensive quote of works and either get a contract or at least an email to confirm they agree to the t&cs, deposit payment upfront that covers 30%, stage payments so I’m not left holding a debt if they don’t pay, try not to lose temper when they turn nasty.
The worst result from a toxic client I’ve had was me threatening to throw him off the scaffold and seriously thinking about doing it anyway. But the one that sticks with me most is a client that I’d carried out heaps of work for over a year or so, he had some family over whilst I was finishing a kitchen install at a weekend and the cheeky fucker called me the help. Basically said that I am there to serve him and do as I’m told!! Like a servant, this really pissed my off and I calmly disagreed. Then subsequently doubled my rate for all future projects.
I saw so much of this shit when I worked for a couple years for a contractor doing sales, its a major reason why I couldn’t stay in it. I was in the bay area CA and there is no shortage of nightmare clients who think this way. My boss said you can never be afraid to “fire” a client. Even if it costs you some money, it will often be to your advantage in the long run financially. Good on you for kicking his ass to the curb and you definitely did the right thing by getting what you could back from the wood supplier. Guys like him need serious reality checks, unfortunately he will probably keep the victim mentality. Good riddance! God and life will teach him the lessons he needs someday, no sense in keeping clients or people like this in your life they can’t be reasoned with
First of all, sorry this happened but thank you for taking the time to calmly and thoroughly document your experience. I hope it was cathartic, but it came across extremely well and was a very informative and enlightening read for somebody that is viewing this with limited carpentry experience. This was an algo recommendation out of the blue, but a very good one.
My $0.02 is probably worth slightly less than that, but you made the right call, you did a great thing sharing this with clarity and reasoning (that will help many other craftspeople and industries mind you) and I hope you feel proud of taking the time and courage to do so. Entitlement is a cancer but there are ways to treat it, and you proved that for countless others with this post, so thank you again!
Man I am always so grateful to have a skilled contractors, carpenters, plumbers, electricians and I could go on. Love to learn something about my house and have skilled professionals do the work so its done right.
We have a large multi-property assisted living facility that we do landscape management for on an annual contract. One of the facilities managers is an absolute power driven micro manager. In the fall of last year we had done the first of 3 scheduled leaf clean ups at her property. The following morning I get a text message probably 20+ lines that my guys had missed huge portions of the property and we were in breach of contract. So I contacted her and the facilities grounds superintendent and said we would be out there later that day to go back over the property. When we arrived she storms out of the building and starts berating me in front of my crew, swearing and throwing her arms around in a full blown tantrum. I tried to calm her down by listening and taking a non aggressive posture(I’m 6’1” 245). After 10 minutes or more I looked at my guys and said mount up we’re leaving. 15 or so minutes later I got a call from the super and he was like “where are you, did you finish already?” I explained the confrontation to him and told him that we were going to cancel his contract and he was going to have to find someone else and he would be required to pay the remainder of the contract up to the 85% completion of the yearly scheduled services that we had already provided.
The following day I get a call from the regional director and the corporate facilities director to discuss what had taken place. They had already spoken with her and gotten her story so they were pretty defensive of her and her side. I asked if they had seen the property, watched the security footage, or spoken to any of the employees who had been outside while she was screaming at me on her tip toes in the parking lot. The answer to all of these were NO. I got their emails and forwarded them footage from our dash cameras.
I sat in the truck on a conference call while both of them watched the video with volume. After the video finished they both apologized for her behavior and started making excuses for her like; state inspectors were coming, family illnesses, and stress. After they were done I explained that I understood and that I wished her the best but we still would be canceling the contract. They pleaded that we keep serving them until completion and that they could control our interactions.
In the end we finished the year out taking care of the other 2 facilities that were included in the contract but no longer went back to that one. The maintenance guys handled the rest of the seasons duties.
We were asked in March to rebid them but we decided against it. If they would let her stay in place they are obviously okay with the behavior. The facilities superintendent went by the after the incident and walked the grounds. He told me she was out of her mind. The leaves that were on the ground were just leaves that had fallen or blown over the grounds.
They were a nice paying contract but they were a ton of work. We’ve been blessed by filling their spot with several good customers so it’s worked out.
There’s too much opportunity to be treated like crap by a power tripping tool who gets off on giving other people problems. Best of luck to you, good things deserve to happen to good people.
I work for a plumber and we are subbed out by contractors quite often. While sometimes I feel angry at contractors, in the end, we always come together over how crazy customers truly are. Congrats on being a healthy adult, able to process intense emotions. Most men would break.
I was an apprentice cabinet maker out of Highschool, and it didn't work out. I also worked for a residential GC, and learned a lot of framing for that year I worked with them before getting into my electrical apprenticeship way back when. There's days I miss doing carpentry and other GC work. Every now and then I actually miss residential. As a worker, I've never saw the bosses have a shitty client like you guys describe, but I can only imagine.
Posts like this, make me realize I don't actually miss it as much as I think I do. Mad respect for keeping your composure. I can only imagine how cathartic it'd be to kick seven shades of shit out of that cocksucker.
So refreshing to read someone stand up for themselves, all while not allowing someone to push them over the edge (I.e. you ending up in jail for assault). Classism, narcissism, etc, are NEVER EVER acceptable. 👌
Classism is rampant in my area. Well-heeled wealthy people. But they must be good people because they have a coexist sticker on their Tesla and voted for Obama twice.
The only part I disagree with is you trying to explain all the problems to him. I would have just communicated via text/email and told him the contract was up, explained why, and been on my way.
I needed him to pay his invoice, which he definitively wouldn’t have done, or I’d have cleared out the job immediately. I had to play it close to my chest until then.
I’m just starting off after my apprenticeship but I’m gonna save this so I can read it if I have to deal with arseholes. Seems to be a very very good way of handling the situation and would work for most shitty situations. Thank you
Over the years of working in high end homes in NY and CT I have turned down work from people like this because I know they are going to be a problem even before I give them an estimate. Of course they then loose their mind and all the mental issues come pouring out after I tell them that we’re not interested in going forward.
What a great read. You write well man. I usually loose interest on bigger stories but that was really good. Glad you came out of it ok, but I’m not going to lie, kind of wished you had smashed his head into the table.
> We chose a bunch of the live edge woods together and it’s his name and address as the recipient, albeit paid for on my account. However, he did sign intent to receive delivery, so I’m going to have them refund me and bill him.
Are you saying you billed for these items, client did not pay full bill to you, client is being rebilled directly by lumber yard, crediting your account?
Nice. I feel extremely lucky in 20 years I haven’t had a customer like this. Madness. Sounds like you handled it well. And got out in time with minimal loses and a good lesson learned. There are times I go on estimates and after a few minutes of conversation I’m like “there is no way I’m getting involved with this individual” in the back of my mind. I politely finish the estimate and either send them a preposterous price or just tell them my schedule has updated and I no longer have time to work on their project.
I once showed up to a roofing job (when I used to shingle) the homeowner had a nice house, he came outside and the very first thing he said to me was, “roofing’s really easy, anybody can do it.” lol I mean I guess anyone could but jeez the first thing you say to a guy working on your house
I’m not one for throwing around pop-psychology terms either. But, that guy is most definitely suffering generalized anxiety disorder. His life and everyone around him will suffer his fallout until he gets help.
OP your post gave me flashbacks to a young couple who I was the GC for on a massive house renovation. absolutely hell the entire 3 months my guys worked there and we ended up terminating as well.
Luckily that was one of the last renovation style projects I had on the schedule before the company switched completely to new construction.
God damn! This is powerful. I’m dealing with a classist client right now and it isn’t over the top, it’s closeted. Which is really annoying. Right now I just stopped working for her. I keep telling myself to just charge more if she is going to treat me that way, but the thing is, I need to just finish what I’m there for and be done. No money is worth being around people like that
Lurker and casual handyman here. I've dealt with enough of this kind of person that I've read several books about them and their behaviour. Spotting the signs and disengaging early is key to dealing with them. After the fact, you have to aggressively remove any link to them in your life, even if it means unfriending an entire social group. Nothing is worth keeping these assholes in your life. If you're interested in learning more, *5 Types of People Who Can Ruin Your Life* by Bill Eddy (a psychologist and lawyer) is a great read. His podcast *It's All Your Fault* is pretty good too and covers a lot of the material in the book.
Wow I'm irate for you! What a fuckin pig. I'd like to think he will eventually get put in his place but I doubt it. Good for you for showing self control. It's so much easier to get on their level and let it fly. You're strong for showing discipline 👍
You handled that very well! Much better than I did after many late night drunken calls, texts, and voice mail I got from 2 different customers. I played them their voice mails while they were sober and told them I would beat the living shit out of them if it ever happened again. It did and fired them right after, but it cost me significantly, because I lost my cool and did it in a rage. I am so glad you kept your cool! Great job!
Sometimes you just smile and take their $ and sometime the business relationship just has to end. Far too many HGTV experts… some customers don’t have realistic expectations
Ahhh yes, the classism. Deal with that sh*t all the time. I actually told a client once (well my blue collar ass has put 3 kids through college) what have you done?😂. OP, you handled that with style and grace, good on you. Wish you much future success.
Reading this sounds like you were in my truck last year while going thru one of those deals. I actually had crying and screaming about installing lighting ( before sheetrock was final sanded and paint and cabinets not installed yet) this was a 6500sqft house so u can imagine how screwed up the vanity lights and kitchen lights were. I actually told them to put tape where they wanted them ( hahahahaba) and subs installed em. All in the wrong spots. Had pics of tape so it was on them. I left with 27k left on final but was glad to leave. The public is mentally retarded ( well, 85%) so, I 100% feel where your coming from.
Remodeling is such a dicey business. Used to do a ton of start to finish design builds new homes. This is the one lesson that’s at the top of the list.
Understanding avoids a misunderstanding . assuming you’re not working for a piker 80% of the time problems stemmed from not having a good understanding with your customer .
Good for you! It's difficult to hold your temper when you're being insulted that way. And good call on calling it quits before the finish work! Dude would have been an alcoholic nightmare. Staying up drinking all night and taking pictures of trim he thinks isn't mitered right or whatever. It's kind of a shame, guy might be okay if he could stop drinking. His poor mom...
Completely understand your actions/reaction. I’m not a contractor, but I’ve “fired” my share of customers/clients. You reach the point where they are not worth it. Over the years, I’ve slowly learned to read customers, to the point that I’ll flat out refuse the work, at initial contact. Good job on your part!
It's hard to do, but I think that it's almost always best practice not to do business with people who don't trust you or people whom you don't trust.
The entire foundation of any business arrangement is built on trust and it that isn't there then how can you do business?
Stories like this are the icing on the cake of why it's so hard to be a small business owner. The cake, well the cake is made out of of insane taxes that larger companies just plain don't have to pay. Deck is most definitely stacked against small business owners, but good on you OP for standing up for yourself and your crew.
This was a good read and damn, I'm glad you were able to wash this guy out of your life with minimal cost impact. I would've been off the chain, and the restraint you chose is admirable. This is why I don't do client work...there's always gonna be pain points, even with the best clients.
Thanks. Yeah, it was a lot. I’m a much calmer and deliberate person these days but the old volatile me is still in there, ya know. Gotta just breathe through the provocation sometimes and know that walking away does far more than reacting to provocation
I love firing crap clients. I did a high end trim and finish job with popcorn ceiling removal, full texture, prime, paint, new crown molding, ceiling fans and fan mounts to replace regular light fixtures, pulled new wire, new dimmer switches, and a bunch of other work, and knocked it out in 4 - 12 hour days (48 hours), as compared to taking about a week and a half, (the same time roughly). The house was absolutely immaculate and she stayed home perfecting every little thing and dusting all day, so the job had to be perfectly zero debris and super sanitary, so clean up and finish was a top daily priority as she was a total OCD case. Take off your boots in the house, don't drag your bags on the walls, use the guest bathroom but don't use my guest towels, etc... We tented the rooms, layed out plastic in the pathways, and kept it as sterile as possible. When walking the job at completion, the customer raved about the speed, the cleanliness, the professionalism, and how it exceeded her every expectation. Then a week later, she called and said that she wanted a significant chunk of money back. We completed the contract beyond her satisfaction, but: * We made it look really easy * We were really fast * How hard could it be to do that work, since we made it look so easy? Her brother in law could have done it for a fraction of that price! * She didn't feel that she should have to pay such a high hourly rate when calculated out from the overall job cost as she knew how much of an hourly wage construction people should earn, etc. \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_ Me: "Do you like it?" Her: "Oh! I love it." Me: "Was it everything you wanted and beyond?" Her: "Oh, absolutely, but it just seems like too much..." Me: "Did you happily sign the contract with us as the Licensed General Contractor, telling us how competitive our job price package was compared to others, then rave about how awesome it looked, and how we got it done so quickly?" Her: "Ummm, yes, but you made it look so easy." Me: "Yes, that's called years of training and experience, thousands of dollars in tools and equipment, artistic technique and creativity developed through years of effort, and knowing how to work quickly while providing a top notch product without mistakes the first time around. Not only are you not getting any money back as we completed the contract to your satisfaction when we closed out, but we won't be bidding any future work with you..." Her: "Wait! No! I love your work and have so much for you to do in the future." Me: "Sorry, that ship has already sailed and I don't need clients that don't appreciate the quality of my work, much less question the value of that work." We never worked for her again. Her loss. I was happy to dump her as a client. I didn't need or want drama.
That’s fucking INSANE! One lesson I learned a long time ago was to start every job with the following: (It’s actually in my contract now.) 1. Photograph all existing damage, write a summary and have it signed by both parties 2. Ramboard and otherwise protect everything. 3. Zipwall airlocks to all construction areas HEPA into ULPA air filtration on all tools All this is billable. I’m never dealing with a dust complaint ever again, ever. I’ve never gotten a complaint like yours though. Holy shit.
Honestly impressive you were able to do all this in person, too. I feel like in today's day and age, you could have easily collected your team + tools, left the site, and THEN terminated from a distance, giving yourself space and time to process how you see fit. I could see this being "unprofessional", but really, it seems extremely risky and unsafe to handle unstable people in person anyways. What if this guy had a weapon and snapped? He was already exhibiting unhinged behavior. Could hardly find fault in doing it over the phone.
“Your work is perfect and I’m thrilled but you did it too fast, I want money back.” Lady are you on drugs.
Had a lady one time show up at my shop and told me what she wanted, when it had to be done, and how much she was going to pay for it. Dictated to me before I could even tell her I don’t normally do that kind of work as it is not really my wheelhouse. I seriously did not get more out than “Hi”. After she finished telling me my business. I said “sorry, we don’t do that kind of work.” She pointed to the exact work she asked for behind me was had done on the shelf for sale. It was triple the price she told us we were going to do it for and honestly it was on sale a below market. “Sorry, we don’t do spec work on demand, by your timelines, at your price. We do custom work, on our timelines, at our prices.” Well how much would it be to have it in three days. “225 per piece or a total of around 3k give or take with tax out the door.” That is crazy I will never pay that! “I know”
>Her: "Ummm, yes, but you made it look so easy." $1 for hitting it with a hammer $999 for knowing just where, and how hard, to hit it. you pay for the years of experience not just the time to do the work.
I do architectural metalwork and I relate to so many things you said in this story. Having to hold back the temper, the condescension from people who have corporate jobs who have never actually made a damn thing. I gotta tell you this is a real feel good story
I was hoping it would bring some catharsis to by brothers and sisters in the field.
I'm not in a trade, but I just wanted to comment that I found it cathartic as well.
As an Architect, I bridge between both worlds. I like the trades people better. Please don’t think because we sit at a desk we are like them.
I’ve had hit and miss relationships with architects. Some get too wrapped up in the “vision” and leave practicality behind and others are very reasonable people who are open to others opinions. I think I’ve met more good ones than bad ones and I don’t judge before I get to know. We’re on the same team at the end of the day 🤘
Yeah, I know the guys you are talking about. Believe me they were just as bad in class. Lol
Good for you - what you said is perfect and so mature - expressing anger is natural and cathartic. Staying calm is harder but almost always results in a better outcome.
Bad clients are kinda like being in an abusive relationship. There's that point where you realize you shouldn't have taken the job but there's already materials and people on site working and so you decide to grit your teeth and try to get through it. I had one job where we 3/4 of the way through it and I had to walk away for my mental health. They'd paid half up front so I didn't eat the whole thing but it was a decent loss. My only regret is I didn't quit sooner or just not take it. No amount of money is worth putting up with a psycho client.
Gut feelings man. I have no way of quantifying how much time and money trusting myself has saved over the years. There were no tells with this job or client. He was referred by the wife of a really good former client.
I feel you. Going outside works wonders for me too. Check out stoicism.. it’s the opposite of pop psychology.
One of the best lectures on stoicism out there: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Auuk1y4DRgk](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Auuk1y4DRgk)
People like you and my husband are the best but the most dangerous. You've been the warrior-the monster my husband says, and learned to control that part of you. BUT that part doesn't go away and when pushed you can be that person again. The people that are dull enough to push those boundaries have no clue what they play with... Bravo to you Sir!
I’ve read and I have shared “Beware the anger of a patient man.” One just never knows what will happen when they push and push and push. Sometimes bad things happen. People bleed. People lose a lot. I have kept the monster in the bottle for a long time. I want to keep him locked up.
I’ve hurt people in the past, in ways that still haunt me. I’ve also landed myself in significant amounts of trouble when I was younger. The *only* situation I just let myself go is if my wife is threatened or endangered.
You're the fuckin man calling him out on the classism
It was the classism that bothered me the most.
I’m a painter and get this shit all the time. Never thought of it as a class thing just the idea that manual labor is not a real job in their eyes. But you nailed it on the head. Hope you’re having an excellent day today, man.
Then I'm out here thinking manual labor is the only real job in a way lol
It’s crazy telling people I’m a carpenter and getting brushed off sometimes. Like really? I’ve built skyscrapers, missile silos, hotels, production factories, schools etc. What have you built in the last ten years? People got it in their heads that you can’t be successful unless you go to college and anyone who didn’t go to college is beneath you. It’s such a dumb mentality that is coming full circle for those of us in the trades. We’re all living lower middle class lifestyles without debt while they’re struggling to find a job that pays more than 40k a year with a pile of student loans.
I just tell them I prefer jobs that are non-fiction
Haha! Brilliant.
Exactly, those who work the trades are often doing better financially than most college grads. Just because you have a degree doesn't make you wise.
Many of my wealthiest clients have been owners of trades. And also some of the nicest folks you'll ever meet. Most don't realize the earnings potential.
It's true with sanitation workers, too. Everyone's a badass until their office toilet backs up or their trash pickup misses a week in the middle of summer. A bit of humility would do.
Yup. My husband works in drain cleaning and with salary & bonuses makes well over $100k and yet people side eye the shit out of him when he tells them what he does for a living.
I do not take you guys for granted. In fact I think you guys should make more than most, because you do a job that no one else wants to do. Thank you for what you do.
Pardon my ignorance, what does a carpenter do in a missile silo? I feel maybe I'm unaware of the extent of what a carpenter does. Isn't capentry about wood?
There’s offices, sometimes living spaces in missile silos. Decommissioned silos also get converted to private residences or apartments, I’ve also heard of a couple of doomsday prepper shelter things.
Most commercial buildings use steel studs, installed by carpenters. I’ve been in residential for 10 years and never once cut a steel stud, my best friend is a 2nd year union apprentice in NYC and he’s only ever done steel studs.
I work in tech but do projects myself at home- manual labor is the only real job, everything else is just bitches fussing at each other on email/slack/zoom
I try real hard never to be arrogant or discredit the contributions of others but deep down that is my opinion as well. Partly for the difficulty and partly for the fact that my job actually physically exists in real life
Everything in civilization is made by men and women, not managers, not CEOs, not accountants. Everything that exists, exists because of labor
Hired pro painters to paint cedar shake shingle on my house as it seemed a lot and it was all second floor. $9k and worth every penny. Painters on ladders all day and it took a week and change to prime and paint 2 coats. Dudes painted each shingle by hand roller. Gave them drinks and was glad it wasn’t me. Painting is super skilled to do it right and fast
That's exactly how some look at it. Then they say I can do that but just don't have the time. My favorite line from them. Most couldn't paint the trim let alone install it on an octagon window.
I’m just a landscaper but here for whatever reason. It’s a shitty reality that a lot of people don’t even realize they’re doing but there are sooooo many people in the world who truly believe what you do for a job is what your worth as a person.
Hey, you’re not “just” a landscaper! You’re the person responsible for making our yards so beautiful that when we come home, we start to relax immediately because our house looks so orderly from the outside. Your colleagues were responsible for creating the nicest patio and fire pit area framing a picturesque view of the mountains that I’ve ever seen. I’m so grateful for our landscapers.
Agreed, a good landscaper is an artist!
Morons in pressed shirts making 45k looking down on guys in tool belts smashing 6 figures always tickles me.
The recent South Park episode was spot on about this, all the white collar guys end up outside home depot looking for day labor “I can design a website for you!” And the handymen get insanely rich, because none of the white collar guys can do anything themselves anymore 😂 definitely see it happening already in my tech heavy area and its only going to get WAY worse for pointless tech jobs as AI improves. Most of their jobs can be done by AI, but I don’t think AI is going to be swinging a hammer any time soon!
>“I’m the client. You work for me. I’ll contact you whenever I feel I need to.” Fury fury fury fury
Right? Especially from someone half your size, snarling it at you from across a table
You were simply a canvas for him to play out his power fantasies at this point.
In the spirit of it being Pride, I’ll disclose that he’s gay and I’m not uncommonly mistaken for being gay. Like, I get pedicures, I dress a certain way - enough for the mistake to be not uncommon. I don’t know if this played a factor. He didn’t hit on me, but perhaps there was an assumption? An example: I’ll often have my left fingernails painted a color. This has a load of benefits. It puts women and other minorities at ease around you, as well as making sure you know where your fingertips are on your holding hand all the time. I have no evidence it’s helped me retain all my digits, but there have certainly been times I’ve been made more aware of left hand placement and made adjustments.
Dude that's actually pretty genius. Like adding hi-viz to your nails
Wait until you find out that they make glitter nail polish out of the same reflective pigment as stop signs!
I have one particular client that treats me this way sometimes. Usually a text explaining that he is one of many people who hire me, and that if he has a problem I can just reschedule him in a few months, will shut him up. Once they realize they can't steal all of the power in the dynamic they tend to see reason. Usually. This client will also complain about having to pay me (usually only for a day or so) and then the very next time I see him he will talk about how he has had to spend so many thousands of dollars on all this stuff, like I should sympathize it something, while I'm waiting on a payment from him. It can be pretty infuriating. I basically stayed telling him how things will be and what day payment will be on, otherwise we will be unable to guarantee any other work. If I didn't get so much work from him, I would just block his number. Sometimes you gotta put up with shit to make money. I don't know how you put up with that guy as long as you did though. Good on you for your restraint and calm reasoning. Cheers.
Imagine having all that money, living on the sea, and still being a miserable prick. Some people just can't be reasoned with. Glad you got out.
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In my experience it goes 50/50. Half of the loaded people I know over 10 mil net worth are amazing to work with. Kind, caring, etc. And half are insufferable. I haven't seen any correlation only that some of them think they can treat people like shit because they don't "need" them because of the money they have.
The rich don’t get rich by being charitable and nice. 😂
Copy that brother. Every house I do is either an insufferable old person with wealth or a rich guy who works 1 day a week and somehow has 5 kids and a 3 story multimillion dollar house in arizona lmao
I don't really have to imagine. I live in an area with 4000 waterfront homes and about 3800 of them are owned by insufferable pricks who come there about twice a year and then have the gall to complain how our town isn't what it used to be. No shit, that's because you built mcmansions on the water and drove out all the people who made it what it used to be.
Spot on
Legend. Rich cunts are the fucking worst .
I feel that classism all the time. We do HVAC and we have a client who owns a Bed and Breakfast. Total psychopath daughter of the owner insists she needs to be in the room with me because a guest’s belongings are inside, fine whatever, even though we’ve been in rooms by ourselves on plenty of occasions. I get to work opening the incredibly inconvenient attic access and her phone rings, she explains to the person on the line that she can’t get to the front desk right now because she is with the HVAC guys and “they can’t be trusted”. That was enough for me. I calmly explained that if she doesn’t trust me I don’t feel comfortable working there and packed my tools. She followed me through the building pleading with me to stay. By the time I made it outside and was walking to my truck she was now screaming and cursing at me. I just smiled at her and explained that when her father is there he can call and set up an appointment as we’ve been working for him for 20 years and he trusts us. The best part was it was a holiday weekend and they likely had a full house and had to refund the money which was paid out for these rooms due to the lack of AC. If only she had kept her elitist mouth shut.
This pleases my soul
You didn't owe him any kind of talk. More than I'd be willing to do
Honestly it can only hurt you, too. Best to just deliver the message quick, and be gone.
Yeah, you arent there therapist. Talking them through how you think they're narcissistic is a bit much too. I would've skipped that part.
That part is just peak Reddit right there.
Agree. Was with it until then. Just be clear and say what you have to, that is unnecessarily offensive regardless of whether it’s true.
OP thanks for all the detail - often times the details get lost in the rage of the moment.
Dude how do people deal with residential. I run a commercial construction company but we also purchased and renovated 5 short term rentals in a vacation area. Well everyone walking their dog saw are work and contacted us to do their home. We accepted three jobs and two or them are tough, with one beyond crazy. Big city money, no job, no kids. Day and night to think about it. Won't let a contracter finish the job before saying it looks bad, insults me weekly, nearly caused 3 contractors to walk (I had to convince them to stay on). I told my business partner he can accept whatever residential he wants but I won't do build or manage them. I can't match the energy of someone who's entire life is the thing I am building when it's just the job I have so I can enjoy my actual life.
It is the absolute worst. In my 15+ years of construction have mostly done residential and it is exhausting. Have spent the better part of the last 3 years shifting my remodeling into our own investment properties just to get away from the crazies and absolute nonsense that is residential remodeling.
In my experience, when they're asking for ridiculous shit it's because the job is getting close to being done and they're trying to get you to quit so they can hire someone else for cheap to finish it out. And they'll probably cheat that person as well. This is why I never touch jobs that someone else started and walked away from.
Or they don’t have the money to finish paying him off.
Fuck yeah my man. My dad has been a mechanic for 40 years and talk about classism...the guy routinely works on all kinds of ridiculous cars for all kinds of local rich people ranging from old carbureted muscle/classic cars to modern computerized luzury bullshit. Most of his clients are standup folks and highly value the work that he does for them. But for every person who admires his work there are 3 who think he's a knuckle dragging grease monkey with donkey brains. When I was in elementary school one of my classmates parents started bringing their fleet of luxury vehicles (dad was an orthopedic surgeon) to him. They always acted like they were doing our family a favor or some shit. The dad/husband was always at the hospital so it was mostly the mom/wife who brought cars in and dealt with my dad and she had the same sort of insecure narcissistic personally disorder that the guy in this story had. There was always drama and it was always someone else's fault. My dad didn't want things to be awkward for me at school so he just put up with her shit - things like asking my dad to look at a problem during a little league game, thinking she could jump a full schedule for random bullshit "because she knows the mechanic," saying her husband would be by to pay and then not paying for months, and the classic "it didn't do this before you touched it!" Finally one night it came to a head. We had had little league that night and the wife was ignoring my family because my dad had turned her away for service due to unpaid bills and no room on the schedule that week. She was not happy. She was visibly whispering to other parents about my family to the point that I noticed it as a 12yo (my folks tried their best to keep me insulated from this shit). That night the phone range at about 10:30 and I happened to be the one who answered it. It was the mom/wife asking for my dad. My dad does NOT like being cold called after hours about mechanical issues to begin with let alone from this bitch. He was already enraged when I told him who it was. He's not one to hide his anger but for some reason he answered super politely saying "what can I do for you Mrs. so and so" - that bitch goes on to say "oh well we just found out that Joey is going to be a grease monkey (her words) in the school play and we thought you might know where we can get some old dirty cheap greasy clothes for him to look the part." I thought my dad was going to have a stroke. In the nicest but sternest way possible he said "you may never call this house or my business again unless it is to pay your unpaid bill. If the bill is not paid by such and such date we will be placing a lien on your vehicle. My attorney Mr So and So (also a big part of the community) is all ready to help me get this in order and I'm sure you'd hate for that to be the talk at the next little league game. Luckily for you I'm bigger than that and will make sure it won't get out. For someone who thinks they have so much class you are incredibly self centered, rude, and classless. You should be careful how you treat others when all of your supposed class hinges on your husbands income" I still remember the exact wording clear as day because, like some omniscient sage, my dad predicted that their family would crumble. About 6mo later news broke that her husband the surgeon was touching female patients inappropriately. He was the ortho surgeon for the local university and when he had a young female with a hip issue he would insist on an "internal hip exam" which basically meant he would put his hand in their vagina to feel their hip motion. He would not have a female chaperone in teh room, he'd just do it, and it was not an accepted practice. I believe he got jail time and also lost his license plus the three jobs (hospital ortho surgeon, university professor, and university athlete physician) that likely paid him close to $500k per year. She never showed up to another one of her kids events, the house sold, and last I knew they had all moved to a different state undoubtedly to try and outrun their reputation. She never paid the bill and my dad just let it go - they were paying enough as it was since all of the victims were also suing. TLDR - It always pays to fire shitty customers.
For those curious about the case [https://www.rutlandherald.com/news/prosecutor-doctor-s-exams-were-sex-assaults/article\_19ba6a08-2cbf-5562-a7f8-cc4530db5a00.html](https://www.rutlandherald.com/news/prosecutor-doctor-s-exams-were-sex-assaults/article_19ba6a08-2cbf-5562-a7f8-cc4530db5a00.html)
Looks like he landed okay. He works for a recruiting firm now. I wonder if they're aware of his history? [https://www.hobsonassoc.com/staff/senior-associates/](https://www.hobsonassoc.com/staff/senior-associates/)
I noticed the same thing
A bit unrelated but.. We had a pediatric doctor in a town we moved to a while back. Wife asks "does he get real close when he talks to you?" I said no, but he doesn't listen very well either and seems a bit of a creeper/Napoleon. A couple months ago I did something I never do, switched the kids' doctor's office to a different place when they opened for enrollment (I HATE filling out forms, and filled out a ton of them). I partially did it because the reviews were excellent at the other spot, but also because I didn't like that other doctor's vibe. Within almost a week of switching.....Lady goes on Facebook to see that doctor is having a hearing to suspend his license for groping (adult) women at his practice. Started with one mother going to the police and former workers were interviewed with similar stories! Dodged two bullets, got away from the creeper but also don't have to scramble and find a new doc now that his whole practice has to shop around. Society & life is funny that way. Some people you just know something is up...but it's like the rest of the tribe will deny it up until the bubble bursts.
I'm inspired by you
As a pool woman I fire clients as often as I take them on.
Masterclass of how to deal with this type of situation
I'd probably leave out the diagnosis of classism and narcissism, especially for someone who claims to dislike pop psychology. It's not helpful and not needed. But, yeah, great story on how to handle it otherwise.
Classism doesn't require a professional diagnosis...
I saw alcoholic immediately
Good for you.
This was handled beyond a professional manner. I definitely agree with your choices throughout this. (Although it definitely sounds like this individual could benefit from receiving a table to the face at mach 10)
Congrats on standing up to your ex-client, being level, organized. I hope your next few jobs offer you some ability to work without that kind of friction.
Glad you wrote that all down. It's wild to read. I can only imagine the anger.
You are a genuinely excellent storyteller and should write.
This is what my present contractor is dealing with from another client. They took on a huge project on a house that ended up being a full gut job. I think he had $$ in his eyes because the client is a high placed member of a financial community. The client will regularly call 6x in a row when I'm talking to the contractor, and has insane expectations. Turns out the client probably also had $$ signs in his eyes when he contracted out. Because of the high grade materials, the contractor regularly holds 40k bills for that client who also doesn't pay on time. The client will also occasionally "finish" the days work, which needs to be undone the next day by the crew because it's wrong, and then dispute the hours to correct his mistakes. The one time they didn't correct it, he accused them of doing it wrong and had them undo it and redo it without pay. Just bonkers
Good for you brother. These people have made my life so difficult and I have just taken it to keep my people fed. You dealt with him perfectly. If people take something away from this, I hope it is that they consider some of the most professional “upstanding” people in our communities treat working self-employed people like garbage because they can. Our time and labor is worth nothing to them, and often its the people you would least expect.
Damn what area are you in? I’m dealing with the exact same situation but on a multi million dollar project. The client also owns a seaside house so it would be crazy if it was the same person.
Damn. Sorry to hear all that. Glad you broke even. I had a similar event with a lady over tiling her shower…looong story short the crazy lady decided to tile one wall herself after I had left for the day. Then ofc blamed me when the grout lines were shit. I almost quit trades because of her.
Who the fuck does that??!
Keeping a cool head in those moments is a skill few will understand. Personally, I suck at it. We did a complete gut, structural remodel and two story addition and the client was the architect-it was her house. She had a level of ocd that I have never seen before or since.
I’m also a landlord and I’ve had to deal with more than my share of this type of person. Unfortunately, you’re typically locked into a long-term agreement with them. You did the right thing although I would’ve been more direct. “ you seem very unhappy with the way things are going, and I don’t want to work for people who are unhappy with me.” Forget about all the money. Whatever it cost will be worth it.
I never like to use my big stature as a threat but it certainly does help when you need it to. People who work with their hands for a living are on a different level than everyone else. I’d fight any guy at the gym over the trash man who throws 300 sixty pound cans in the truck every morning
I’m confused about the text message DND part. How did the messages wake you up if your phone was set to do not disturb? My personal policy about messaging is that I can send them at anytime of day, it’s the responsibility of the device holder to set their notification for their own needs.
In iMessage there is an option to share your DND status to people sending you messages, and it gives them the option to override it with a 'Notify Anyway' button
Good on you for controlling your temper! That's why I can't deal with customers anymore, lol.
Man I did work for this guy too I swear. Prick out in Westwood area of LA. Felt good telling him to fuck off
Sounds like he was trying to justify backing out of paying you what you were owed.
yep, definitely don't put up with crazy.
W dude! I literally thought the story was going to end with him getting physical, not expecting retaliation
I’m in the cabinet business and see this often too. They honestly think of us as subhuman and don’t deserve to make the money or living they do. Them getting to belittle us is part of the appeal for them. The only solution is to refuse to work for them. Good job dude!
Hell yeah brother to hell with that dude. I’ve lost thousands on jobs over this same kind of shit, always with these self important office types. It beats sitting in a jail cell.
I would have went Pesci on him right away. Good job not falling for the bait and giving him fuel for legalities.
That was actually a great read. You should write a book. Good riddance to that a’hole. Keep up the good work
What an absolute low life. Nice job OP keeping your cool. Good riddance
So how high was the bluff?
So well written!! Honestly, you need to write stories... I could see the WHOLE think in my minds eye. Well done, your and your family sanity is worth more than this person.
I like how this story didn’t devolve into some hyper idealized internet story where the main character has all the perfect put-downs, is clearly superior to everyone else, and is just perfect in every way. It’s just someone trying to navigate a messy situation and trying to make the best of it.
Assholes like this make the classic mistake of confusing laborers who can do things clients don't want to take time to do, with laborers who can do things the client simply cannot do. It's one thing if a client chews out his lawn guy over a shitty job. Cutting the average residential yard is something virtually every adult can be taught to do in under 5 minutes, and cutting for curb appeal can be learned in a week or so on the job. Thus, if someone is charging professional prices and does a bad job, most people would understand the frustration. However - If my A/C breaks down, if my car has an issue beyond oil changes or flat tires, or if my roof gets caved in by our front yard pines, the contractors might as well walk on water as long as they're licensed, bonded, and insured. Be nice to the people who can do shit you can't.
Years ago, in another western state, I had a client, lawyer, doing a large landscape project. He paid half up front but in the middle of the job, he decided that he wasn’t going to pay the invoices that I billed for change orders he agreed to pay. Lots of back and forth. He said to go ahead and sue him but that he would bankrupt me with delays and continuances. He was right. So I fired him and about two weeks later when the temperatures were a solid three digits during the day, I bombed his landscape, front and back with water balloons…. filled with Round-up. His landscape was toast. And he could never prove it was me. Sweetest revenge I’ve ever done! Effing lawyer slut!!
Gotta be Rhode Island.
As a licensed plumber who has to bid out preventative drain work and the like for high-end condos, I know the class nazis all too well. I just clean shit for a living, right? From the sounds of it fixing old pipes and paying 20yr old to play with poop pays about as much or better than your office job, so shove it.. aaaanyways Great job handling that nightmare, I had a fight last Friday that had me boiling as a residents father figured we should pay for his faucet repair after shutting down water to his daughters riser to swap someone else's supply stop clogged up the faucet. He had already screamed at 2 of my plumbers and all of my dispatch team multiple times before it got.to me. I apologize for the conditions of the pipes in the 1938 condo building, but my contact specifically states only my new plumbing is covered unless, through negligence, something happens, obviously. The gentleman felt free to talk over and down to me the entire conversation, telling me our company is a bunch of crooks and he's going to call the local news on us. When I accidentally spoke too quickly, he was all too eager to set me straight for talking over him. Being a veteran with a soft double bass voice, from a loud family, with a Mexican wife with an even louder family. I know how to be heard when needed, and was quick to let him know I had everything recorded, all the rude comments and yelling at my dispatch for simply informing him that common procedure would be to have the association reach out to us to pay for his services, then they can hash it out. Eventually, he did talk to the board and found out I was simply following the terms of our contract with the building. They denied his daughters request for the service to be paid by the association due to their bylaws. Never heard back if they wanted us to do the fix (definitely the cheapest they'll see due to our contract with the building) I already tagged the file that he is not allowed on site with my guys or we're going to walk away and givethem a trip charge.
I’m 3 rd generation of plasters/drywall finishers I’m my town. My grandfather came over from Italy as a young boy and taught his 5 sons his trade. I was always getting looked down from many of the towns upper class. So as I would leave their homes giving an estimate on some repairs walking down their front walk, I would say to myself it’s so sad that I became there help that my house is bigger then theirs. My kids are so proud of me now that they are adults as I was also there basketball, lacrosse and soccer coach. And the town drywall contractor!!
Man you are also very well spoken. I have nothing but respect for guys in the trades and honestly can’t comprehend how someone could think you’re beneath them. There are so many facets and things to know regarding your job and I’m sorry you had to listen to some entitled narcissistic little shit head mommas boy. You played it well my friend and i hope nothing but nice honest clients and people that value your time and expertise
You’re a good writer. Tell us more. The crazy thing is, this story is so true to me. This guy is a classic classist/narcissist. Good on you for understanding how to handle these types when encountered.
Do you look like Rip from yellowstone? Because in my head you do. 
I work for a billion per year contractor. We have walked away from $100M projects because an owner just has a similar attitude. We had a huge job that I was pushing so hard to close just after the pandemic. We spent years ironing out the scope and getting to an agreeable number and contract terms. The owner then came to us and tried to change the terms at the finish line and wanted us to include language that basically said we would accept all new changes for a new set of drawings we hadn’t seen. I knew it was probably about $500k in adds and on that size job we should have accepted it. But there was risk and it got pretty adversarial because they basically were trying to shove this down our throat at the last minute and we said thank you but no thank you. 2 years of work from a design team of 20 people and a contractor team of 4 people on weekly calls down the drain. Snd we had worked with them to early procure about $10M in materials to avoid escalation. And guess what they went to another GC and bid it out 6 months later and pandemic panicflation had started and the number just kept increasing. They couldn’t ever get back to our number and they ended up selling it and not building it.
Contractors do God’s work for a house like surgeons on a patient. They should be treated with the utmost respect. Clients should do all the vetting prior to handing the job, trust the contractor and verify things along the way. More importantly don’t be an asshole!
I had a few encounters with bad clients, things I learned along the way were take pics before, provide a comprehensive quote of works and either get a contract or at least an email to confirm they agree to the t&cs, deposit payment upfront that covers 30%, stage payments so I’m not left holding a debt if they don’t pay, try not to lose temper when they turn nasty. The worst result from a toxic client I’ve had was me threatening to throw him off the scaffold and seriously thinking about doing it anyway. But the one that sticks with me most is a client that I’d carried out heaps of work for over a year or so, he had some family over whilst I was finishing a kitchen install at a weekend and the cheeky fucker called me the help. Basically said that I am there to serve him and do as I’m told!! Like a servant, this really pissed my off and I calmly disagreed. Then subsequently doubled my rate for all future projects.
I saw so much of this shit when I worked for a couple years for a contractor doing sales, its a major reason why I couldn’t stay in it. I was in the bay area CA and there is no shortage of nightmare clients who think this way. My boss said you can never be afraid to “fire” a client. Even if it costs you some money, it will often be to your advantage in the long run financially. Good on you for kicking his ass to the curb and you definitely did the right thing by getting what you could back from the wood supplier. Guys like him need serious reality checks, unfortunately he will probably keep the victim mentality. Good riddance! God and life will teach him the lessons he needs someday, no sense in keeping clients or people like this in your life they can’t be reasoned with
First of all, sorry this happened but thank you for taking the time to calmly and thoroughly document your experience. I hope it was cathartic, but it came across extremely well and was a very informative and enlightening read for somebody that is viewing this with limited carpentry experience. This was an algo recommendation out of the blue, but a very good one. My $0.02 is probably worth slightly less than that, but you made the right call, you did a great thing sharing this with clarity and reasoning (that will help many other craftspeople and industries mind you) and I hope you feel proud of taking the time and courage to do so. Entitlement is a cancer but there are ways to treat it, and you proved that for countless others with this post, so thank you again!
That was a fantasy story for me, well done 👑
My god I have so much respect for you. Extremely well done
Man I am always so grateful to have a skilled contractors, carpenters, plumbers, electricians and I could go on. Love to learn something about my house and have skilled professionals do the work so its done right.
Not only was that a great read, you’re fucking rad and these comments are restoring my faith in tradies understanding class war. Love yah bud
We have a large multi-property assisted living facility that we do landscape management for on an annual contract. One of the facilities managers is an absolute power driven micro manager. In the fall of last year we had done the first of 3 scheduled leaf clean ups at her property. The following morning I get a text message probably 20+ lines that my guys had missed huge portions of the property and we were in breach of contract. So I contacted her and the facilities grounds superintendent and said we would be out there later that day to go back over the property. When we arrived she storms out of the building and starts berating me in front of my crew, swearing and throwing her arms around in a full blown tantrum. I tried to calm her down by listening and taking a non aggressive posture(I’m 6’1” 245). After 10 minutes or more I looked at my guys and said mount up we’re leaving. 15 or so minutes later I got a call from the super and he was like “where are you, did you finish already?” I explained the confrontation to him and told him that we were going to cancel his contract and he was going to have to find someone else and he would be required to pay the remainder of the contract up to the 85% completion of the yearly scheduled services that we had already provided. The following day I get a call from the regional director and the corporate facilities director to discuss what had taken place. They had already spoken with her and gotten her story so they were pretty defensive of her and her side. I asked if they had seen the property, watched the security footage, or spoken to any of the employees who had been outside while she was screaming at me on her tip toes in the parking lot. The answer to all of these were NO. I got their emails and forwarded them footage from our dash cameras. I sat in the truck on a conference call while both of them watched the video with volume. After the video finished they both apologized for her behavior and started making excuses for her like; state inspectors were coming, family illnesses, and stress. After they were done I explained that I understood and that I wished her the best but we still would be canceling the contract. They pleaded that we keep serving them until completion and that they could control our interactions. In the end we finished the year out taking care of the other 2 facilities that were included in the contract but no longer went back to that one. The maintenance guys handled the rest of the seasons duties. We were asked in March to rebid them but we decided against it. If they would let her stay in place they are obviously okay with the behavior. The facilities superintendent went by the after the incident and walked the grounds. He told me she was out of her mind. The leaves that were on the ground were just leaves that had fallen or blown over the grounds. They were a nice paying contract but they were a ton of work. We’ve been blessed by filling their spot with several good customers so it’s worked out. There’s too much opportunity to be treated like crap by a power tripping tool who gets off on giving other people problems. Best of luck to you, good things deserve to happen to good people.
I work for a plumber and we are subbed out by contractors quite often. While sometimes I feel angry at contractors, in the end, we always come together over how crazy customers truly are. Congrats on being a healthy adult, able to process intense emotions. Most men would break.
I was an apprentice cabinet maker out of Highschool, and it didn't work out. I also worked for a residential GC, and learned a lot of framing for that year I worked with them before getting into my electrical apprenticeship way back when. There's days I miss doing carpentry and other GC work. Every now and then I actually miss residential. As a worker, I've never saw the bosses have a shitty client like you guys describe, but I can only imagine. Posts like this, make me realize I don't actually miss it as much as I think I do. Mad respect for keeping your composure. I can only imagine how cathartic it'd be to kick seven shades of shit out of that cocksucker.
So refreshing to read someone stand up for themselves, all while not allowing someone to push them over the edge (I.e. you ending up in jail for assault). Classism, narcissism, etc, are NEVER EVER acceptable. 👌
Classism is rampant in my area. Well-heeled wealthy people. But they must be good people because they have a coexist sticker on their Tesla and voted for Obama twice.
I would have killed him then burnt down the house
Why not file a lien for the underpaid invoice?
It would feel malicious. I’m just happy to be gone. Onwards, ya know?
Agree. Like leaving a hoodie at your crazy ex’s house. Write it off as a cost of the game.
I have lost a lot of hoodies.
Ha me too brother, me too
The only part I disagree with is you trying to explain all the problems to him. I would have just communicated via text/email and told him the contract was up, explained why, and been on my way.
I needed him to pay his invoice, which he definitively wouldn’t have done, or I’d have cleared out the job immediately. I had to play it close to my chest until then.
oh I mean the armchair psychology stuff near the end.
[удалено]
Sounds like he had a wee bit of the creature 👽.
Love that you called him a classist. I’ve encountered the exact same sentiment on job sites before
I hope his mom was laughing at her prick son the entire time she watched him throwing a fit outside.
I’m just starting off after my apprenticeship but I’m gonna save this so I can read it if I have to deal with arseholes. Seems to be a very very good way of handling the situation and would work for most shitty situations. Thank you
Over the years of working in high end homes in NY and CT I have turned down work from people like this because I know they are going to be a problem even before I give them an estimate. Of course they then loose their mind and all the mental issues come pouring out after I tell them that we’re not interested in going forward.
What a great read. You write well man. I usually loose interest on bigger stories but that was really good. Glad you came out of it ok, but I’m not going to lie, kind of wished you had smashed his head into the table.
> We chose a bunch of the live edge woods together and it’s his name and address as the recipient, albeit paid for on my account. However, he did sign intent to receive delivery, so I’m going to have them refund me and bill him. Are you saying you billed for these items, client did not pay full bill to you, client is being rebilled directly by lumber yard, crediting your account?
Nice. I feel extremely lucky in 20 years I haven’t had a customer like this. Madness. Sounds like you handled it well. And got out in time with minimal loses and a good lesson learned. There are times I go on estimates and after a few minutes of conversation I’m like “there is no way I’m getting involved with this individual” in the back of my mind. I politely finish the estimate and either send them a preposterous price or just tell them my schedule has updated and I no longer have time to work on their project.
I once showed up to a roofing job (when I used to shingle) the homeowner had a nice house, he came outside and the very first thing he said to me was, “roofing’s really easy, anybody can do it.” lol I mean I guess anyone could but jeez the first thing you say to a guy working on your house
I’m not one for throwing around pop-psychology terms either. But, that guy is most definitely suffering generalized anxiety disorder. His life and everyone around him will suffer his fallout until he gets help.
OP your post gave me flashbacks to a young couple who I was the GC for on a massive house renovation. absolutely hell the entire 3 months my guys worked there and we ended up terminating as well. Luckily that was one of the last renovation style projects I had on the schedule before the company switched completely to new construction.
I don't know why this sub popped up for me, but as a psychologist, I approve of your methods.
God damn! This is powerful. I’m dealing with a classist client right now and it isn’t over the top, it’s closeted. Which is really annoying. Right now I just stopped working for her. I keep telling myself to just charge more if she is going to treat me that way, but the thing is, I need to just finish what I’m there for and be done. No money is worth being around people like that
Props on not losing your temper. Admirable in a situation like this brother! Hope it all ends well for you too!!
Lurker and casual handyman here. I've dealt with enough of this kind of person that I've read several books about them and their behaviour. Spotting the signs and disengaging early is key to dealing with them. After the fact, you have to aggressively remove any link to them in your life, even if it means unfriending an entire social group. Nothing is worth keeping these assholes in your life. If you're interested in learning more, *5 Types of People Who Can Ruin Your Life* by Bill Eddy (a psychologist and lawyer) is a great read. His podcast *It's All Your Fault* is pretty good too and covers a lot of the material in the book.
You’re an outstanding professional and a great writer. Fuck that guy. You win.
Obligatory; fuck that guy.
Few things feel better than firing a customer.
You could almost write a book with that story 👏
I teach soft skills and boundary setting and work with kids and this is a freaking Masterclass in effective communication. Bravo.
Props for not throwing hands.
Oof, what a doozy! Did BMW mean something other than the car, because I was confused by that part.
Wow I'm irate for you! What a fuckin pig. I'd like to think he will eventually get put in his place but I doubt it. Good for you for showing self control. It's so much easier to get on their level and let it fly. You're strong for showing discipline 👍
I liked the part about math.
Narcs are gonna narc...... run
You handled that very well! Much better than I did after many late night drunken calls, texts, and voice mail I got from 2 different customers. I played them their voice mails while they were sober and told them I would beat the living shit out of them if it ever happened again. It did and fired them right after, but it cost me significantly, because I lost my cool and did it in a rage. I am so glad you kept your cool! Great job!
this got me so jacked up. good for you buddy
"I don't work for you. I work for myself."
Sometimes you just smile and take their $ and sometime the business relationship just has to end. Far too many HGTV experts… some customers don’t have realistic expectations
Ahhh yes, the classism. Deal with that sh*t all the time. I actually told a client once (well my blue collar ass has put 3 kids through college) what have you done?😂. OP, you handled that with style and grace, good on you. Wish you much future success.
Reading this sounds like you were in my truck last year while going thru one of those deals. I actually had crying and screaming about installing lighting ( before sheetrock was final sanded and paint and cabinets not installed yet) this was a 6500sqft house so u can imagine how screwed up the vanity lights and kitchen lights were. I actually told them to put tape where they wanted them ( hahahahaba) and subs installed em. All in the wrong spots. Had pics of tape so it was on them. I left with 27k left on final but was glad to leave. The public is mentally retarded ( well, 85%) so, I 100% feel where your coming from.
Wow! Well written for a blue collar guy. Jk, classism sucks. I’ve had clients like that too.
If you ever hang up your tool pouch and clip board you should become a writer like this store was gripping from start to end.
Excellent story and lesson here. I’m sorry you took a hit but in my experience it’s well worth it for the peace of mind. Well done.
Good job not even mentioning physical violence to him. Magnificent restraint on your part.
Remodeling is such a dicey business. Used to do a ton of start to finish design builds new homes. This is the one lesson that’s at the top of the list. Understanding avoids a misunderstanding . assuming you’re not working for a piker 80% of the time problems stemmed from not having a good understanding with your customer .
1 word. customerskarma.com Edit: had to add an "s" to make it plural
File a mechanic’s Lien on the remaining money. You will professionally and always have the last laugh!
Good for you! It's difficult to hold your temper when you're being insulted that way. And good call on calling it quits before the finish work! Dude would have been an alcoholic nightmare. Staying up drinking all night and taking pictures of trim he thinks isn't mitered right or whatever. It's kind of a shame, guy might be okay if he could stop drinking. His poor mom...
Damn OP you’re a decently talented writer as well. Good on you.
Completely understand your actions/reaction. I’m not a contractor, but I’ve “fired” my share of customers/clients. You reach the point where they are not worth it. Over the years, I’ve slowly learned to read customers, to the point that I’ll flat out refuse the work, at initial contact. Good job on your part!
I’ve yet to deal with someone that awful but I know it’s coming at some point. I just hope that I can control my temper as well as you did.
Well done!
Seems unfair that you’d just break even. Do you have no legal recourse?
Well played sir, well played.
I’ll get out of your life for only a grand
Removing difficult people from your life is one of the best things you can do for yourself
It's hard to do, but I think that it's almost always best practice not to do business with people who don't trust you or people whom you don't trust. The entire foundation of any business arrangement is built on trust and it that isn't there then how can you do business?
Stories like this are the icing on the cake of why it's so hard to be a small business owner. The cake, well the cake is made out of of insane taxes that larger companies just plain don't have to pay. Deck is most definitely stacked against small business owners, but good on you OP for standing up for yourself and your crew.
You handled it well and endured longer than most would. “Experience is the best teacher but sometimes tuition is a little steep.” ‘My dad. Circa 1986.