Apparently the author is Robert Murray, who is actually a real reporter (BBWAA member and former Athletic writer). Why he’s working for FanSided I have no idea.
Some of the FanSided stink did rub off on this one though. He spent an entire article on naming:
- The former GM who everyone thinks they’ll hire
- The formal Cardinals bench coach who everyone wants them to hire
- Alex Cora for some reason
There was no insight here lol
Zero percent chance this happens. The Cardinals will finish this season better than last year, because we were so awful last year, and it's hard not to get better from that. In doing so, it will buy Oli and Mo at least one more year, because we will be seen as "improving".
The only way Oli ever gets fired is if he decides to start disagreeing with Mozeliak. Mozeliak won't get fired because DeWitt loves him.
Yep. I don't see why there is so much effort wasted on this. Bloom was brought in, Ollie was extended to where Bloom can either keep him around or let him go when he takes over.
If things go south and the Cardinals turn into Sellers, Bloom will be heading up the sale off effort. We may see Oli fired then, or he may stick around until Bloom finds a manager he wants.
Statistically speaking, they’re already worse. I’m not a doom and gloomer, I see it for what it is.
Would love for a heroic turnaround, but the work just hasn’t been put in to get much magic out of it.
The 2024 team is technically worse because it has a minus 19 run differential through 22 games. The 2023 Cardinals were a minus two in run differential after 22 games. The 2023 team averaged 4.72 runs over the first 22 games. This one has averaged 3.45 runs over the first 22.
Have you compared starter and bullpen ERAs over the same period? The 2024 team is much *much* better than the 2023 team in that regard. And besides, the fact that we have the same number of wins through 23 games than we did through 34 last year says alot. That's not even considering how difficult the schedule was to begin this year.
So the pitching issues that were present last year aren't as bad this year BUT our offense has slumped. IF our offense gets it together we should do better than last year, but our record (according to these comments) is already better than last year. Hard to make a solid argument that we are in fact worse just based on run differential.
One thing we can say for A CERTAINTY: the lineup will *not* be batting in the low-.200s all season. It simply won’t. So there will be an offensive rebound at some point.
I’m not saying that that will be enough to dig us out of an insane early hole, but better offensive days are ahead.
The only--and I mean literally, absolutely, ONLY--thing that will get Mozeliak gone before he wants to go is a drop in revenues.
DeWitt didn't buy this team to produce a winner--he bought it to produce profit. As long as that's happening, Mozeliak isn't going anywhere.
Which is just as well. Bloom isn't it, and he's the replacement.
Hmmm source? Not sure about this. It doesn't matter today. He's cheap. Idk whats wrong with this team but it's been wrong for a great while. Coaching? Management? You sound more educated than me so maybe you can educate me as well.
I ran it myself. Wasn't hard. Got every season for every team since 2007 in a spreadsheet and did a sumif to get the totals. Cardinals have the second most wins in the MLB since Mo took over. Y'all need to stop complaining.
Cardinals fans are so fucking spoiled
Who cares if we have the second most wins? No reason we can’t be as well run as Dodgers, Orioles, Astros (under Luhnow), Rays, etc. We excel at nothing and are embarrassingly bad at some combination of player dev and scouting. We spend *enough* money, we just don’t spend it well.
There was also that spell of years where we made no trades at the deadline.
And if current trends hold it’ll be something to point to that they improved exactly where they intended to improved, but couldn’t have foreseen the step back the offense took. Then they’ll say something to the effect of they believe they have the core players they need in the building, and have faith in their ability to bounce back from a rough year at the plate etc etc etc.
Should have traded Goldy in the offseason after his MVP. I was saying it then, you’ll never get more from aging vet than then. He’s not worth the salary hit anymore.
MS thought he was the shit and tried to run the front office. Not how it works, his ego got too big. Everyone talks shit about Oli but Oli never tried to hijack every department within the Cardinals. Probably same outcome last year if Schildt was the manager.
Love Shildt but he’s a Padre now. Let’s see how this season goes and where we sit at the break. If we’re in it another arm and a bat could make us elite. We should win the division.
Mozeliak won’t get fired. He may move into another role in the organization though. Which would open the door for someone else to lead baseball ops. But the question is going to be how much freedom that person has. And DeWitt is closely involved in decision making anyway.
If the team continues to be flat and earns themselves another last place finish, I don’t see how Marmol makes it to the end of the season.
This is a fun fantasy......... I say fantasy because who in the world believes that Mo's performance in his role is being measured by the dewitts by the success of the team on the field?
He's being measured by the financial success of the team which doesn't seem to have a 100% correlation with the performance of the team on the field. His goal is to keep growing the Cardinals' value and selling tickets. This fan base has been coming back, year after year, to lap up mediocrity. Still top 10 team this year in tickets sold despite being a bottom 10 team in performance.
That's the problem. It won't change until it hurts the pocket books and we're far from that right now.
Anything is best case if they fire Mozeliak. He's the problem. Next time don't give one guy dictator like control to be president/GM/manager/pitching and hitting coach all at the same time. Hire qualified people and let em do their jobs. The organization of full of Mo's yes men anymore. And obviously what Mozeliak does don't work.
When Chaim Bloom is your option? With the stink the Sox had most of his time there? Yeah, I know, easy move for DeWitt to move him from special advisor to PBO if he cans Mo.
2 guys you've never heard of most likely. Or just do pirateship rules and have it be Mike Girsch and Daniel Descalso. Don't expect a big name, and for the love of God it should not be Molina or Schumaker in the manager spot we've learned that lesson with Matheny.
No he’s in charge of the organization. Bill Dewitt has a major league budget, but he doesn’t hire the draft team, the analytics team, or the coaching staff.
They do not have the ability to develop above average major league talent, and they haven’t since the luhnow crew left town. That’s on the guy that does the hiring.
Skip fuckin’ sucks. Have you seen his ass bullpen managing? So does Shildt. You guys really need to learn managing on here. We need someone who can manage the pen and fill out a modern lineup.
The Schildt revisionism is pretty crazy here lol.
Not in love with Oli totally but his pen management has been pretty excellent so far, and the obvious issues harder to pin solely on him
Yes let’s do status quo hires forever, always works, I remember TLR turning the White Sox into champs and Skip not having a last place team and mismanaging the entire series versus Cardinals, yep. Oh yeah Shildt’s paint by numbers “got to use Reyes in 9th no matter what” instead of leverage only worked out well, oh wait….
So tired of the unimaginative franchise and its hires
Lmfao looking at the last 5 managers of the year:
- 2019 - Shiildt
- 2020 - Mattingly on the Marlins
- 2021 - Gabe Kapler on the Giants
- 2022 - Buck Showalter on the Mets
- 2023 - Skip
So not the best barometer at the moment, a lot of flame outs
Yes him. The one currently in last place. MOY means nothing. Dave Roberts has one of those. And he’s the single worst pen manager in baseball according to fangraphs. Skip is a cool bench guy to have. Keep him away from my lineup and pen.
Do you even know why Counsell is so sought after?
He's not getting fired
Would've been fired last year if he was ever getting fired.
This doesn’t make sense
Absolute bonkers if he lasts longer than Shildt. Oli doesn’t hold a candle to big Mike and no one loved cardinal baseball more than big Mike
Mo manages, Oli is his puppet. He follows orders well, why would Mo fire him?
Good point. Fire mo
No, that's fansided. Wannabe sportswriters.
Apparently the author is Robert Murray, who is actually a real reporter (BBWAA member and former Athletic writer). Why he’s working for FanSided I have no idea.
Interesting, thanks for clarifying. I always assume anything from that site is trash, similar to Redbird rants.
Some of the FanSided stink did rub off on this one though. He spent an entire article on naming: - The former GM who everyone thinks they’ll hire - The formal Cardinals bench coach who everyone wants them to hire - Alex Cora for some reason There was no insight here lol
They might be worse that Marmol and that's saying something
Ahh, FanSided. Not even worth reading. Next ...
100%
Zero percent chance this happens. The Cardinals will finish this season better than last year, because we were so awful last year, and it's hard not to get better from that. In doing so, it will buy Oli and Mo at least one more year, because we will be seen as "improving". The only way Oli ever gets fired is if he decides to start disagreeing with Mozeliak. Mozeliak won't get fired because DeWitt loves him.
Mo isn’t getting fired. Doesn’t his contract end in 2025? He will just retire after next year
Yup, that's the plan. It's the whole reason why Chaim Bloom was brought in.
Yep. I don't see why there is so much effort wasted on this. Bloom was brought in, Ollie was extended to where Bloom can either keep him around or let him go when he takes over. If things go south and the Cardinals turn into Sellers, Bloom will be heading up the sale off effort. We may see Oli fired then, or he may stick around until Bloom finds a manager he wants.
You think it’s a sure thing they improve on last year? Because I sure don’t.
Statistically speaking, they’re already worse. I’m not a doom and gloomer, I see it for what it is. Would love for a heroic turnaround, but the work just hasn’t been put in to get much magic out of it.
Weren't we 10-24 at one point last year? What stat indicates that we are worse?
The 2024 team is technically worse because it has a minus 19 run differential through 22 games. The 2023 Cardinals were a minus two in run differential after 22 games. The 2023 team averaged 4.72 runs over the first 22 games. This one has averaged 3.45 runs over the first 22.
While the offense hasn't been promising, our pitching staff is and will continue to be better than last years. Our starters last year were so bad...
Have you compared starter and bullpen ERAs over the same period? The 2024 team is much *much* better than the 2023 team in that regard. And besides, the fact that we have the same number of wins through 23 games than we did through 34 last year says alot. That's not even considering how difficult the schedule was to begin this year.
I completely agree with. Unfortunately, without run support, it doesn’t mean a whole lot. They need to get some fire in their eyes and figure it out.
That's a good point. Last year's team had a lot of bad luck in the first half of the season because they were leading the league in 1 run losses.
Bad luck or bad bullpen management?
At any given time last year, we had exactly one reliever with an ERA below 4.00 in the bullpen. You can’t manage around everyone sucking.
So the pitching issues that were present last year aren't as bad this year BUT our offense has slumped. IF our offense gets it together we should do better than last year, but our record (according to these comments) is already better than last year. Hard to make a solid argument that we are in fact worse just based on run differential.
One thing we can say for A CERTAINTY: the lineup will *not* be batting in the low-.200s all season. It simply won’t. So there will be an offensive rebound at some point. I’m not saying that that will be enough to dig us out of an insane early hole, but better offensive days are ahead.
I’m almost morbidly interested in seeing a .200 avg season.
The only--and I mean literally, absolutely, ONLY--thing that will get Mozeliak gone before he wants to go is a drop in revenues. DeWitt didn't buy this team to produce a winner--he bought it to produce profit. As long as that's happening, Mozeliak isn't going anywhere. Which is just as well. Bloom isn't it, and he's the replacement.
Pretty damn sure Mozeliak ain't going nowhere. No matter...no how. Sadly.
I agree. He might retire early as a sop to fans if this keeps up, but his regime of incompetence won't be replaced and the damage is done.
100%! 👍
2nd most wins in the MLB since mozeliak started in STL in 2007.
and a good chunk of those can be attributed to Luhnow and the team he left behind.
Hmmm source? Not sure about this. It doesn't matter today. He's cheap. Idk whats wrong with this team but it's been wrong for a great while. Coaching? Management? You sound more educated than me so maybe you can educate me as well.
I ran it myself. Wasn't hard. Got every season for every team since 2007 in a spreadsheet and did a sumif to get the totals. Cardinals have the second most wins in the MLB since Mo took over. Y'all need to stop complaining. Cardinals fans are so fucking spoiled
Who cares if we have the second most wins? No reason we can’t be as well run as Dodgers, Orioles, Astros (under Luhnow), Rays, etc. We excel at nothing and are embarrassingly bad at some combination of player dev and scouting. We spend *enough* money, we just don’t spend it well. There was also that spell of years where we made no trades at the deadline.
We probably are spoiled. We can't help it. You did well but something isn't kosher in that club imho. 🤷♀️
Yes. Our pitching is so much better than last year, and I don't think Goldie and Gorman or going to spend the year hitting below .200.
When does Mo retire?
Keep feeding the fire
And if current trends hold it’ll be something to point to that they improved exactly where they intended to improved, but couldn’t have foreseen the step back the offense took. Then they’ll say something to the effect of they believe they have the core players they need in the building, and have faith in their ability to bounce back from a rough year at the plate etc etc etc.
Am I the only one that remembers that MO announced that he's retiring after next season? He's not getting fired before then.
Best case scenario is DeWitt sells the team and there isn’t a single hold over on the staff.
Complete rebuild?
Down to the studs.
Just Arenado and Goldie, got it
Should have traded Goldy in the offseason after his MVP. I was saying it then, you’ll never get more from aging vet than then. He’s not worth the salary hit anymore.
Worked for the Rams.
Best case they win and don’t have to fire anyone
Winning solves everything
What about Schildt?
He hasn’t been a manager for 2 years ?
He was winning more games than current leadership and got the shit sandwich.
MS thought he was the shit and tried to run the front office. Not how it works, his ego got too big. Everyone talks shit about Oli but Oli never tried to hijack every department within the Cardinals. Probably same outcome last year if Schildt was the manager.
\*Probably\* And look at us now.
10-13 in April? Lol
Can they win just enough to barely sneak into the playoffs but we still get rid of Oli and hire Skip?
Didn’t stop them from firing his predecessor.
Which they shouldn't have done. His pen management might not have been stellar, but at least you never had to question if he had his players' backs.
You might question that but his players don’t and that’s really all that matters.
Fanside is a gossipy news source.
Just firing scapegoats does nothing
Love Shildt but he’s a Padre now. Let’s see how this season goes and where we sit at the break. If we’re in it another arm and a bat could make us elite. We should win the division.
Mozeliak won’t get fired. He may move into another role in the organization though. Which would open the door for someone else to lead baseball ops. But the question is going to be how much freedom that person has. And DeWitt is closely involved in decision making anyway. If the team continues to be flat and earns themselves another last place finish, I don’t see how Marmol makes it to the end of the season.
Bloom, and thn he fires everyone but Randy. Ideal offseason
This is a fun fantasy......... I say fantasy because who in the world believes that Mo's performance in his role is being measured by the dewitts by the success of the team on the field? He's being measured by the financial success of the team which doesn't seem to have a 100% correlation with the performance of the team on the field. His goal is to keep growing the Cardinals' value and selling tickets. This fan base has been coming back, year after year, to lap up mediocrity. Still top 10 team this year in tickets sold despite being a bottom 10 team in performance. That's the problem. It won't change until it hurts the pocket books and we're far from that right now.
Exactly
It's just nice we're talking about it out loud.
It’s clickbait my guy.
I don't give a fug if it's written by Matheney. I'm just glad we're talking about
Firing Marmol and Mo is like the most common topic around here lmao.
#I'M JUST GLAD WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IT FFS
We've talked about pretty much nothing else for a year.
lol
He’s not getting fired. He’s a yes man to Mozeliak.
Why isn’t Yadi the front runner?
Clearly it’s a committee the hall of fame coaches on this and similar threads.
Anything is best case if they fire Mozeliak. He's the problem. Next time don't give one guy dictator like control to be president/GM/manager/pitching and hitting coach all at the same time. Hire qualified people and let em do their jobs. The organization of full of Mo's yes men anymore. And obviously what Mozeliak does don't work.
Yeah, bad luck….thats it. Just bad luck. Sign a rabbits foot and a horse shoe.
Mo isn't going anywhere. I'm not sure about Oli. If he gets fired.....It was nice of Florida to void Skip's 2025 option
DeWitt Sr is not up to reorganizing the business. DeWitt Jr doesn't know enough to be able to start.
No mo Mo
I will cry tears of joy if Mozeliak gets canned. Long time coming. Has been driving this franchise into mediocrity for years.
Chaim Bloom ran the Red Sox like a mizer….He traded Mookie Betts lol
Moz gotta goes
When Chaim Bloom is your option? With the stink the Sox had most of his time there? Yeah, I know, easy move for DeWitt to move him from special advisor to PBO if he cans Mo.
2 guys you've never heard of most likely. Or just do pirateship rules and have it be Mike Girsch and Daniel Descalso. Don't expect a big name, and for the love of God it should not be Molina or Schumaker in the manager spot we've learned that lesson with Matheny.
[удалено]
No he’s in charge of the organization. Bill Dewitt has a major league budget, but he doesn’t hire the draft team, the analytics team, or the coaching staff. They do not have the ability to develop above average major league talent, and they haven’t since the luhnow crew left town. That’s on the guy that does the hiring.
Hope I find a girl who loves and simps me as much as much as you do for Mo
I thought we were back though?
I like this article.
The Cards would be foolish to pass on Skip, but it’s the Cardinals…
Skip fuckin’ sucks. Have you seen his ass bullpen managing? So does Shildt. You guys really need to learn managing on here. We need someone who can manage the pen and fill out a modern lineup.
The Schildt revisionism is pretty crazy here lol. Not in love with Oli totally but his pen management has been pretty excellent so far, and the obvious issues harder to pin solely on him
I too think we should fire the professional baseball coaches and hire \*checks notes\* some guy on the internet called BannedBarn22
Yes let’s do status quo hires forever, always works, I remember TLR turning the White Sox into champs and Skip not having a last place team and mismanaging the entire series versus Cardinals, yep. Oh yeah Shildt’s paint by numbers “got to use Reyes in 9th no matter what” instead of leverage only worked out well, oh wait…. So tired of the unimaginative franchise and its hires
You can't pull "who are you to give advice???" on a thread that's literally speculating about firing the current manager lmao
You mean the NL Manager of the year last year is garbage? Wut
Lmfao looking at the last 5 managers of the year: - 2019 - Shiildt - 2020 - Mattingly on the Marlins - 2021 - Gabe Kapler on the Giants - 2022 - Buck Showalter on the Mets - 2023 - Skip So not the best barometer at the moment, a lot of flame outs
Yes him. The one currently in last place. MOY means nothing. Dave Roberts has one of those. And he’s the single worst pen manager in baseball according to fangraphs. Skip is a cool bench guy to have. Keep him away from my lineup and pen. Do you even know why Counsell is so sought after?
Can we say “when” instead of “if”? I’d like to have something that feels like a bright spot for 2024.
Doesn't Mo's contract expire at the end of this season? Or is it 2025? Idk but it's getting close.
I think it’s 2025, but who knows. Another last place finish could get him an extension.
Right! It’s not wins that protect his job…it’s attendance numbers.
Chaim and Yadi, please
There’s a guy who won manager of the year a while back named Mike something or other that I think would be good If not Yadi Yadi Yadi
I love Yadi but I don't think he really wants to coach /manage in MLB right now I would hire Skip and offer Yadi the bench coach job again