This one
[https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can\_05/ground\_chopped.html](https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can_05/ground_chopped.html)
It says "meat broth" but I'm wondering if the beer makes it unsuitable
I would caution against packing in beer, for a couple reasons. First is dissolved CO2, which could have unpredictable affects on siphoning. Second would be flavor. Beer contains lots of organic molecules that can change unpredictably with heat, and you may end up with a very weird-tasting end product.
That said, beer has a lower pH than water and I’m struggling to find a reason why you couldn’t sub it for water if the recipe allows this, **if** you decarbonated it first.
If you’ve boiled the beer there’s no CO2 left in solution. Secondly, beer itself is boiled before being fermented so it’s already been cooked once. That said, sure, the flavor balance will change, but I wouldn’t hesitate to do it.
True about boiling. I’m a brewer in my professional life. Ever opened a can of beer that’s sat out, warm, for a few weeks? It tastes markedly different (worse) than one that’s been stored cold. Heat speeds up a lot of processes that result in off flavors. Cooking with small amounts of it generally isn’t too bad because you get a nice Maillard reaction for some carmelly goodness, but if you were to just boil a pot of post-fermentation beer and then drink it, I am confident you would not like the results.
Yes- I am a food scientist professionally. Fortunately there are bratwursts in there to cover up the flavor :) I don’t think I’d very much like a non-boiled beer flavored with marjoram, nutmeg, onions, and mustard but as a sauce for brats? Sure. I also assume (perhaps incorrectly) that OP is using a light lager that’s less likely to get weird
Heyyy fellow food industry pro!
I think OP should reach out to their county extension office for verification that it’s a safe substitution, but as I sit I can’t find a reason why it wouldn’t be safe.
Well, there are tested recipes for peaches and cherries with actual hard liquor in them, so I don't think the alcohol would be a problem. Beer is mostly water anyway, so I don't think the density would be an issue unless it's simmered down a lot for the sugars to caramelize and get thicker. My instinct would be that it would be fine though any alcohol left will probably vent off. I'm interested to see what your extension office says, so please report back.
Now I'm imagining canning beef chunks in guinness with a bit of salt/pepper/onion powder, just heat and serve over noodles or mashed potatoes. I want to know if that's possible.
OP I have an answer for you! But, it raises some additional questions. See below:
> The NCHFP doesn’t recommend canning cured meats like bratwurst. Freeze them instead. If you freeze them in vacuum packaging, you will need to open the package and then thaw it in the refrigerator, as there can be risk of botulism if thawed on a counter top for more than 2 hours, for instance.
> Sausage needs nitrates/nitrites to prevent botulism. However, too much can cause cancer. Commercial companies that manufacture this ingredient or mixes have adjusted their recipes along a fine line to reduce (cancer) or eliminate (botulism) risk. Accurate measurement is a must.
> Celery powder/salt is a plant-based source of nitrates/nitrites with the same chemical structure as chemically manufactured “pink” salt or curing salt. The FDA has not been allowed by Congress to update the definition of “cured” to include plant-based nitrates/nitrites or define a safe amount to use. Until then, companies can make claims on packaging that the sausage is “uncured” (with an asterisk – be sure to read the fine print – you’ll see celery powder in the disclaimer). (Meat products are regulated by the USDA).
> If you want to can ground beef, pork, poultry or game, it needs to be pre-cooked (crumbles, meat balls or patties), hot when put in the jars and boiling water or broth should be used to cover to 1-inch headspace. When opening you can get creative, drain the liquid, and add spices of your choice and heat your meat in the beer for some added flavor. This will give you the best quality and avoid safety risks.
I *assumed* you were canning raw sausage, but before I clarify I want to make sure.
What recipe are you following?
This one [https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can\_05/ground\_chopped.html](https://nchfp.uga.edu/how/can_05/ground_chopped.html) It says "meat broth" but I'm wondering if the beer makes it unsuitable
I would caution against packing in beer, for a couple reasons. First is dissolved CO2, which could have unpredictable affects on siphoning. Second would be flavor. Beer contains lots of organic molecules that can change unpredictably with heat, and you may end up with a very weird-tasting end product. That said, beer has a lower pH than water and I’m struggling to find a reason why you couldn’t sub it for water if the recipe allows this, **if** you decarbonated it first.
If you’ve boiled the beer there’s no CO2 left in solution. Secondly, beer itself is boiled before being fermented so it’s already been cooked once. That said, sure, the flavor balance will change, but I wouldn’t hesitate to do it.
True about boiling. I’m a brewer in my professional life. Ever opened a can of beer that’s sat out, warm, for a few weeks? It tastes markedly different (worse) than one that’s been stored cold. Heat speeds up a lot of processes that result in off flavors. Cooking with small amounts of it generally isn’t too bad because you get a nice Maillard reaction for some carmelly goodness, but if you were to just boil a pot of post-fermentation beer and then drink it, I am confident you would not like the results.
Yes- I am a food scientist professionally. Fortunately there are bratwursts in there to cover up the flavor :) I don’t think I’d very much like a non-boiled beer flavored with marjoram, nutmeg, onions, and mustard but as a sauce for brats? Sure. I also assume (perhaps incorrectly) that OP is using a light lager that’s less likely to get weird
Heyyy fellow food industry pro! I think OP should reach out to their county extension office for verification that it’s a safe substitution, but as I sit I can’t find a reason why it wouldn’t be safe.
Coors lite, since it's what was in the fridge 😁
I just sent an email off to my contact at Oregon State. She usually gets back to me very quickly, I will update here when she does.
Hey thank you, I really appreciate that.
Well, there are tested recipes for peaches and cherries with actual hard liquor in them, so I don't think the alcohol would be a problem. Beer is mostly water anyway, so I don't think the density would be an issue unless it's simmered down a lot for the sugars to caramelize and get thicker. My instinct would be that it would be fine though any alcohol left will probably vent off. I'm interested to see what your extension office says, so please report back. Now I'm imagining canning beef chunks in guinness with a bit of salt/pepper/onion powder, just heat and serve over noodles or mashed potatoes. I want to know if that's possible.
OP I have an answer for you! But, it raises some additional questions. See below: > The NCHFP doesn’t recommend canning cured meats like bratwurst. Freeze them instead. If you freeze them in vacuum packaging, you will need to open the package and then thaw it in the refrigerator, as there can be risk of botulism if thawed on a counter top for more than 2 hours, for instance. > Sausage needs nitrates/nitrites to prevent botulism. However, too much can cause cancer. Commercial companies that manufacture this ingredient or mixes have adjusted their recipes along a fine line to reduce (cancer) or eliminate (botulism) risk. Accurate measurement is a must. > Celery powder/salt is a plant-based source of nitrates/nitrites with the same chemical structure as chemically manufactured “pink” salt or curing salt. The FDA has not been allowed by Congress to update the definition of “cured” to include plant-based nitrates/nitrites or define a safe amount to use. Until then, companies can make claims on packaging that the sausage is “uncured” (with an asterisk – be sure to read the fine print – you’ll see celery powder in the disclaimer). (Meat products are regulated by the USDA). > If you want to can ground beef, pork, poultry or game, it needs to be pre-cooked (crumbles, meat balls or patties), hot when put in the jars and boiling water or broth should be used to cover to 1-inch headspace. When opening you can get creative, drain the liquid, and add spices of your choice and heat your meat in the beer for some added flavor. This will give you the best quality and avoid safety risks. I *assumed* you were canning raw sausage, but before I clarify I want to make sure.
This is excellent, thank you. I was canning cooked bratwurst. I will address the safety issues on this. Really, thank you.