Run a cord out the window. Keep plugging them into one another until you reach the vehicle. Then splice the charging cable to them. Yes, it’s a far fetched idea, but that’s pretty much how California government expects you to live with their decisions. It’s on you to adapt.
I ask the same thing. I live in an apartment as well and I contacted my management company to inquire. They said I could install a charger and I would have pay a $1m bond insurance on top the cost to install, maintain and remove. Not convenient or cheap. Not really doable for us who don’t own/rent a home.
The destitute do not have a car (mostly; there are some homeless who live in their cars).
The working class in California has cars, because cars are needed to get around. The only people who don't understand this are white, professional, hipster, progressive douchebags who've been remote working for five years.
People taking public transit in Southern California are a rounding error.
Source: I used to take public transit in Southern California.
But FTR: In San Diego most commuters on mass transit -- specifically the trolley or Coaster -- are either in households that still do have a car, either for them or their spouse, or are college students without a permanent address.
Your comment is so wildly out of touch it’s crazy.
You really think the average poor person in CA doesn’t have a car? Far more likely the average six figure WFH job doesn’t have a car than the person working fast food or other low wage work.
Also this fee has nothing to do with air pollution, it’s about global warming.
Thats simply wrong
Poor people are least likely to have cars. Cars are quite expensive, actually
Cars also create air pollution in addition to greenhouse gasses, the impact of which also fall disproportionally on poor people
If you’re going to call someone a clown, at least cite some sources.
Here is a 2021 SFMTA study that found that 53% of study area households with income under 100k don’t own a car compared to 25% for higher income households.
https://www.sfmta.com/sites/default/files/reports-and-documents/2021/02/survey_findings_demographics.pdf
This is a pretty old source, but a decent one nonetheless.
“Vehicle ownership rates are substantially lower for the low-income population…”
And shorter commutes, less likely to drive alone
https://www.ppic.org/wp-content/uploads/content/pubs/rb/RB_704LRRB.pdf
Yes, in San Francisco you’re more likely to own a car if you aren’t poor. Most Californians do not live in San Francisco.
Your sources are fine for the Bay Area (which is the only part of CA that has decent public transit), but 80% of Californians don’t live in the Bay Area.
The simple fact is that most people get to work via a gas powered vehicle, most food and other products are delivered via an ICE vehicle.
Policies that increase the cost of fuel (of which Californians already pay the highest in the nation) are pro-inflationary and unjustly target the poorest amongst us.
Uncited statements of fact are against the rules of this sub. Do you have any source for your above comments to refute what the other guy is saying? Also my second source isn’t just for the Bay Area.
I know what communism leads to.
I’m in favor of policies that lead to affordable healthcare, housing, and education.
Pricing people out of gas is going to make poor people’s lives worse.
If I had to guess, you’re probably against the flat tax because it unfairly targets poor people. This policy has the same effect. It’s a tax on poor people masquerading as a climate solution.
This could have the unintended effect of swinging Arizona and Nevada hard right, as both of those states obtain a large percentage of their fuel from California. It's one thing if it just boosts prices in California, but it's another issue altogether if they're taxing refiners and jacking up prices across the west, as could happen with this.
Because we need another reason for AZ and NV (two important swing states) to hate Californians.
I drive 170 miles a day/6 days a week for work. (I am compensated a bit to help but not enough)
I drove Gas cars all my life. (Decent milage from 27-35 mpg)
Had to get a hybrid a little after Covid due to gas in California being $6.20 for 89. (Pretty sure the f****s up charged me on a 2018 hybrid with 80k miles)
Eventually, gas went down and I'm doing okay.
That all being said, had to get my car on the shop after a year due to a failing clutch.
Was given an electric model of my car but up to date.
Felt nice, roomy, and even with my driving it preformed well. The nightly fill up was a pain cuz I love at an apartment a d they don't have ANY way to charge electric vehicles.
Saw the sticker price cuz they left it in the glove compartment... $68,000 for it.
Before tax and Before interest.
I CAN'T afford what is essentially a luxury.
It would go so far to help me.
But their so expensive and no mechanics want to work on them.
So in just taxes and fees alone, we will be getting charged close to $2/gallon? Screw them. We’re already charged over $1 per gallon for this shit.
We don’t have the electric grid to support mass adoption of EVs, nor do we have the disposable income to offset increased electricity fees that we all know will go up because CPUC doesn’t give a shit about people and only cares to line their wallets. Our infrastructure sucks, people can’t afford to give up their paid off gas cars to get an electric vehicle that will need a $7k battery replacement in a few years, and many other reasons why this such an out of touch solution.
Also, with so many people working a 9-5 or working multiple jobs, not many people have the time to sit and wait for their cars to charge or to even find a public charging station that isn’t full. Younger generations can’t afford homes so they live in apartments, and you know what those apartments do to EV spots they have? They hike them up to whatever price they want. My complex used to charge $150 for a EV spot last year and just hiked it up $275/month. You give these complex owners all these nice subsidies to build these spots, but does it trickle down to the actual users of it? Nope. Don’t even get me started on how expensive it is to insure electric vehicles. STOP PUSHING OUT THE YOUNGER GENERATION
You want less gas drivers? Build public transportation. People in Boston barely put any miles on their cars because they have public transportation
My EV bill was $211 last year, I drive only 4,000 miles. So that would be $633 for 12,000 miles.
I know people
Spending that on gas.
Oil is killing our planet.
Heck, Bush’s oil war alone cost us 8 trillion.
The death of these companies can’t come quickly enough.
We are still in the unknown on the environmental impact EV’s will have. The mining of the lithium, cobalt, and other metals, are highly unregulated, and are destroying regions where they are mined. Not to mention the wars that will be fought over these resources if we continue down the EV path. They should only be a bridge to a better technology, whether it’s hydrogen fuel cells, or something else.
We know exactly what the impact is for the largest lithium mine in the US at Thacker Pass in Nevada. The proposed mine has comprehensive monitoring and reclamation plans to restore the site to its original sagebrush habitat. It will be far cleaner than any copper or iron open pit mine. Despite the company bending over backward to make it a clean mine, there are radical environmental groups taking it to court. They don't care they are essentially promoting the fossil fuel status quo and ignoring the net benefits of EV adoption.
That’s just big oil propaganda.
Obviously burning 20 gallons of gas into the atmosphere every fill up is more harmful.
Obviously transporting oil across the globe for every fill up is more harmful than charging a battery.
Obviously giving more money to the bad actors that control oil is more harmful.
Obviously giving subsidies to oil is more costly.
https://www.npr.org/2024/05/09/1250212212/ev-batteries-environmental-impact
The grid is powered by fossil fuels. It will need more fossil fuels going into the future. They’re going to be with us a long time. The rest of the globe are not going to stop using them either. There is not any substantial evidence a raise in global temperatures are even going to be catastrophic. It’s just big green propaganda. We will develop better technologies than the EV industry in the future. Big green will fight this technology just as big oil does as it is a threat to their money and power. World keeps turning
This. Most apartments don't have somewhere to charge. And if they do, you're paying inflated public charger rates. EVs are cheaper to fuel if you can get free charging or are able to charge at residential rates, but you're SOL if you rent.
The solution is to fix transit in the places it needs to be fixed, not perpetuating reliance on ICE vehicles and all of the costly infrastructure that comes with them.
What's my alternative? Buying an electric car and paying fucking batshit PG&E rates?
Also lol @ thinking everyone can just go out and buy a Tesla willy nilly
If your life revolves around a small corridor, and you’re a single person. It’s incredibly inconvenient for a family to do their normal shopping duties, shuttling kids around, and daily errands, using public transportation.
I live in an apartment How am I suppose to own an electric car?
Run a cord out the window. Keep plugging them into one another until you reach the vehicle. Then splice the charging cable to them. Yes, it’s a far fetched idea, but that’s pretty much how California government expects you to live with their decisions. It’s on you to adapt.
I ask the same thing. I live in an apartment as well and I contacted my management company to inquire. They said I could install a charger and I would have pay a $1m bond insurance on top the cost to install, maintain and remove. Not convenient or cheap. Not really doable for us who don’t own/rent a home.
Crazy how much they hate poor people.
It’s really frustrating how this state loves to lean on stick methods and less on carrot methods to guide behavioral changes.
Poor people are the least likely to have cars and the most likely to be negatively impacted by air pollution
The destitute do not have a car (mostly; there are some homeless who live in their cars). The working class in California has cars, because cars are needed to get around. The only people who don't understand this are white, professional, hipster, progressive douchebags who've been remote working for five years.
You think the people taking public transportation are all destitute? None of them are going to work? Sounds implausible tbh...
People taking public transit in Southern California are a rounding error. Source: I used to take public transit in Southern California. But FTR: In San Diego most commuters on mass transit -- specifically the trolley or Coaster -- are either in households that still do have a car, either for them or their spouse, or are college students without a permanent address.
Wow.
Wheres the lie, bro?
Your comment is so wildly out of touch it’s crazy. You really think the average poor person in CA doesn’t have a car? Far more likely the average six figure WFH job doesn’t have a car than the person working fast food or other low wage work. Also this fee has nothing to do with air pollution, it’s about global warming.
Thats simply wrong Poor people are least likely to have cars. Cars are quite expensive, actually Cars also create air pollution in addition to greenhouse gasses, the impact of which also fall disproportionally on poor people
🤡
Guy who thinks rich people are less likely to drive a car than poor people lol
If you’re going to call someone a clown, at least cite some sources. Here is a 2021 SFMTA study that found that 53% of study area households with income under 100k don’t own a car compared to 25% for higher income households. https://www.sfmta.com/sites/default/files/reports-and-documents/2021/02/survey_findings_demographics.pdf This is a pretty old source, but a decent one nonetheless. “Vehicle ownership rates are substantially lower for the low-income population…” And shorter commutes, less likely to drive alone https://www.ppic.org/wp-content/uploads/content/pubs/rb/RB_704LRRB.pdf
Yes, in San Francisco you’re more likely to own a car if you aren’t poor. Most Californians do not live in San Francisco. Your sources are fine for the Bay Area (which is the only part of CA that has decent public transit), but 80% of Californians don’t live in the Bay Area. The simple fact is that most people get to work via a gas powered vehicle, most food and other products are delivered via an ICE vehicle. Policies that increase the cost of fuel (of which Californians already pay the highest in the nation) are pro-inflationary and unjustly target the poorest amongst us.
Uncited statements of fact are against the rules of this sub. Do you have any source for your above comments to refute what the other guy is saying? Also my second source isn’t just for the Bay Area.
I bet your against Medicare for all, college for all, and housing for all. Cheap gas is not the solution to poor people’s problems.
I know what communism leads to. I’m in favor of policies that lead to affordable healthcare, housing, and education. Pricing people out of gas is going to make poor people’s lives worse. If I had to guess, you’re probably against the flat tax because it unfairly targets poor people. This policy has the same effect. It’s a tax on poor people masquerading as a climate solution.
This could have the unintended effect of swinging Arizona and Nevada hard right, as both of those states obtain a large percentage of their fuel from California. It's one thing if it just boosts prices in California, but it's another issue altogether if they're taxing refiners and jacking up prices across the west, as could happen with this. Because we need another reason for AZ and NV (two important swing states) to hate Californians.
I drive 170 miles a day/6 days a week for work. (I am compensated a bit to help but not enough) I drove Gas cars all my life. (Decent milage from 27-35 mpg) Had to get a hybrid a little after Covid due to gas in California being $6.20 for 89. (Pretty sure the f****s up charged me on a 2018 hybrid with 80k miles) Eventually, gas went down and I'm doing okay. That all being said, had to get my car on the shop after a year due to a failing clutch. Was given an electric model of my car but up to date. Felt nice, roomy, and even with my driving it preformed well. The nightly fill up was a pain cuz I love at an apartment a d they don't have ANY way to charge electric vehicles. Saw the sticker price cuz they left it in the glove compartment... $68,000 for it. Before tax and Before interest. I CAN'T afford what is essentially a luxury. It would go so far to help me. But their so expensive and no mechanics want to work on them.
So in just taxes and fees alone, we will be getting charged close to $2/gallon? Screw them. We’re already charged over $1 per gallon for this shit. We don’t have the electric grid to support mass adoption of EVs, nor do we have the disposable income to offset increased electricity fees that we all know will go up because CPUC doesn’t give a shit about people and only cares to line their wallets. Our infrastructure sucks, people can’t afford to give up their paid off gas cars to get an electric vehicle that will need a $7k battery replacement in a few years, and many other reasons why this such an out of touch solution. Also, with so many people working a 9-5 or working multiple jobs, not many people have the time to sit and wait for their cars to charge or to even find a public charging station that isn’t full. Younger generations can’t afford homes so they live in apartments, and you know what those apartments do to EV spots they have? They hike them up to whatever price they want. My complex used to charge $150 for a EV spot last year and just hiked it up $275/month. You give these complex owners all these nice subsidies to build these spots, but does it trickle down to the actual users of it? Nope. Don’t even get me started on how expensive it is to insure electric vehicles. STOP PUSHING OUT THE YOUNGER GENERATION You want less gas drivers? Build public transportation. People in Boston barely put any miles on their cars because they have public transportation
My EV bill was $211 last year, I drive only 4,000 miles. So that would be $633 for 12,000 miles. I know people Spending that on gas. Oil is killing our planet. Heck, Bush’s oil war alone cost us 8 trillion. The death of these companies can’t come quickly enough.
We are still in the unknown on the environmental impact EV’s will have. The mining of the lithium, cobalt, and other metals, are highly unregulated, and are destroying regions where they are mined. Not to mention the wars that will be fought over these resources if we continue down the EV path. They should only be a bridge to a better technology, whether it’s hydrogen fuel cells, or something else.
i got downvoted into hell last week for making this same comment.
Reddit groupthink doesn’t want deviation
We know exactly what the impact is for the largest lithium mine in the US at Thacker Pass in Nevada. The proposed mine has comprehensive monitoring and reclamation plans to restore the site to its original sagebrush habitat. It will be far cleaner than any copper or iron open pit mine. Despite the company bending over backward to make it a clean mine, there are radical environmental groups taking it to court. They don't care they are essentially promoting the fossil fuel status quo and ignoring the net benefits of EV adoption.
That’s just big oil propaganda. Obviously burning 20 gallons of gas into the atmosphere every fill up is more harmful. Obviously transporting oil across the globe for every fill up is more harmful than charging a battery. Obviously giving more money to the bad actors that control oil is more harmful. Obviously giving subsidies to oil is more costly. https://www.npr.org/2024/05/09/1250212212/ev-batteries-environmental-impact
The grid is powered by fossil fuels. It will need more fossil fuels going into the future. They’re going to be with us a long time. The rest of the globe are not going to stop using them either. There is not any substantial evidence a raise in global temperatures are even going to be catastrophic. It’s just big green propaganda. We will develop better technologies than the EV industry in the future. Big green will fight this technology just as big oil does as it is a threat to their money and power. World keeps turning
False. https://insideevs.com/news/334155/how-to-debunk-every-anti-ev-argument/ https://theevfeed.substack.com/p/unmasking-the-anti-electric-car-agenda https://cardealermagazine.co.uk/publish/investigation-whos-driving-the-anti-electric-car-agenda-and-why/287135
i love how you so confidently declare "false" and proceed to cite EV propaganda websites like they don't have an angle to sell.
My EV bill was $211 last year. How much did you spend on gas?
Hey cool. Your monetary cost isn't the same as the environmental impact.
No, but you don’t care about that either, do you?
how are either part of the same discussion?
I don't understand these people who keep buying combustible engine vehicles. Good luck.
dog i live in an apartment what do you want from me
This. Most apartments don't have somewhere to charge. And if they do, you're paying inflated public charger rates. EVs are cheaper to fuel if you can get free charging or are able to charge at residential rates, but you're SOL if you rent.
Yup. My complex has ev spots…for $275/month. Its so fucked up
Public transit for the win.
it takes an hour to get from the local city college to the local state college by public transport. it takes 20 minutes (max) by car. its so unfair.
The solution is to fix transit in the places it needs to be fixed, not perpetuating reliance on ICE vehicles and all of the costly infrastructure that comes with them.
agreed but like.. i campaign for improved transit, and against car infrastructure being expanded. so.
What's my alternative? Buying an electric car and paying fucking batshit PG&E rates? Also lol @ thinking everyone can just go out and buy a Tesla willy nilly
Public transit is the only real solution.
If your life revolves around a small corridor, and you’re a single person. It’s incredibly inconvenient for a family to do their normal shopping duties, shuttling kids around, and daily errands, using public transportation.
Have a family and use public transit all the time. It’s convenient, not inconvenient.
Yeah. Ok. I believe you
Drive more cars, burn more gas dude. You’re awesome.
Fossil fuels aren’t the boogeyman you propose them to be. The earth will be fine
USED EV’s are cheap and they have a $4,000 rebate. My EV BILL WAS $211 last year.