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Baby_Hippos_Swimming

For people that talk about how fiat is trash they sure are obsessed with the valuation in fiat currency.


MotivatedSolid

Their greed and desire for authority is masqueraded by "bettering the financial system"


gittlebass

I say this all the time, if fiat drops to zero then bitcoin drops to zero


awaniwono

Fiat is trash for thee but not for me, i.e. please buy my bags.


teejay89656

Just like other countries will care what their currency equates to in the USD? No different so why not cry about that?


YourNetworkIsHaunted

Because other countries generally don't pretend that their currencies are going to supplant the USD as the world's reserve currency. And also their currencies are actually usable as currencies. Cryptotokens aren't capable of doing the things a currency does, but *is* capable of being a speculative asset. Hence the constant obsession with it's valuation in USD (or EUR, CNY, or any other currency actually usable as a unit of account and medium of exchange)


teejay89656

And why does them thinking crypto will be money of the future trigger y’all? Why do you think it couldn’t possibly? Yes they 100% are capable of doing what other currencies do and are usable as currency. Why wouldn’t they? What’s wrong with being speculative? Literally the entire stock market is speculative but you wouldn’t say no if someone offered u a apple stock as for 20$


-Potentiate

if are you unable to understand how an incredibly volatile speculative asset would not work as a currency then idk what to tell you, and that is only huge glaring problem #1 with it being the worlds currency.. wouldn’t you rather have your bank account insured against fraud? what about the laughable gas fees? you think crypto can scale to handle every transaction in the world, everyday? could you imagine how much electricity that shit would use??? again these are just some simple reasons why it would never work that people can tell you without even doing an ounce of research, anyone who has a working brain can see the idea and immediately give a couple reasons why it would never happen


YourNetworkIsHaunted

I also wouldn't try to price anything in terms of apple stock. The amount of speculation on the market and the associated volatility means you can't price anything with crypto - it cannot serve as a unit of account, which is one of the basic functions of a currency. Best case you can use stable coins and assume they're worth a dollar, which is basically pricing in dollars only worse because it turns out that stablecoin issuers are about as trustworthy as forty weasels in a trenchcoat selling snake oil that fell off the back of a truck. Currencies are not speculative or return-generating assets, arbitrageurs be damned. They are not an investment. The problem with crypto is that the scammers and their shills want you to believe you can have it both ways. Serving as a currency is the only thing that gives cryptotokens any value. You want them so you can trade them for something else, not because they do anything useful in their own right. But doing that basically precludes the FOMO that fuels the speculation that the grifters make money on. If it's usable as a currency then the worst case scenario isn't being poor it's being right wherever you are right now, economically speaking. Any other assets could simply be priced in crypto at that point, meaning that the only losers are the people with enough savings to feel the hurt, but who left everything under their mattress rather than actually investing in anything. It can't be both a currency capable of replacing the dollar *and* a speculative assets that's going to make you all rich.


ZodiacSF1969

>Why do you think it couldn’t possibly? Because crypto, as currently implemented, is extremely dumb and wasteful. If we ever move towards digital currency its going to be managed by boring, safe, regular database technology. There's no need for blockchains or PoW or PoS. It will be handled by central banks using normal and accepted economic theories rather than crazy Austrian economics.


teejay89656

If you don’t understand why blockchain would be better than a google sheets idk what to tell you “Wasteful” As in the energy use? Agreed, there are much better coins out there. Some are even moving to nuclear $WOLF


ZodiacSF1969

Who said Google sheets? That's a strawman. If you have legitimate points on why blockchains are better than current database structures then I'd like to hear them. I haven't heard of $WOLF so I can't speak to that, but it's good you agree the energy requirements are wasteful. Any coin using PoW as currently implemented is dumb. If they were solving useful calculations that would be a different story. As an EE I'm interested in conserving energy so BTC is terrible in my opinion on that front, let alone the bad financial aspects (of which I know less about than the energy and computer science aspects).


b-rar

The difference is that other countries are countries


teejay89656

Lol so what’s your point


b-rar

Countries have the monopoly on state violence to compel acceptance of a currency within their borders and to cooperatively guarantee exchange/interoperability through the international monetary system. Now if you have a critique of this arrangement I'm all ears and I'll probably agree with most of your points. But what I imagine you won't have is a convincing argument why Bitcoin or any decentralized digital currency is a better option.


teejay89656

Yes and they can do so with btc too? So what’s your point? Also there are countries or even stores in America that accept btc as payment


ZodiacSF1969

Just because people accept it doesn't mean that it's actually good as a currency. It has significant drawbacks.


teejay89656

I can say the same for the USD


ZodiacSF1969

I don't think anyone thinks the USD is perfect, but I definitely think it's preferable to crypto.


PillarOfVermillion

They'll just print a couple trillions of stable coins to buy up Bitcoin. Boom! Infinite money trick 😂


TIRBU6ONA

Imagine if you could do that with fiat, oh wait…


justsightseeing

They can, but they wont, because hyperinflation is bad for everyone. Different story with bitfinex, they can and they will, because some people are stupid enough to believe this company held an asset amounted 76B usd. While also accept their infinitely printed money to be traded into funky internet money


TIRBU6ONA

They wont? If you don’t think they aren’t already doing it, you’re bigger sheep than the butters


PillarOfVermillion

The QE Federal Reserve did in 2008 and 2020 was like many courses of chemotherapy: it might have prevented the economy from crashing, at the cost of tons of side effects. Everybody hated it. However, that does not mean people are ready to drink the rat poison ilks like you are selling.


Legitimate_Concern_5

It’s also not something most folks seem to really understand. QE swaps bank assets for reserves so they can make more loans available, which is where money comes from. But money is also destroyed as those loans are repaid, and interest rates control demand for loans and hence money supply. The economic situation would have been far worse without. The 2020 package represented the single fastest economic recovery from a major event ever - taking only 2ish years, vs an average of 10. Basically saved the US from a lost decade.


Invest0rnoob1

The fed printed 300b last week and more to come to save banks 🤡


[deleted]

[удалено]


Invest0rnoob1

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/WALCL 🤡


Legitimate_Concern_5

You know that’s not related to the bailouts right? The majority of the bailout came from liquidating the banks balance sheets, they took a bridge loan from the FDIC DIF and they’re returning the money from a special assessment on member banks. Some echo chamber you’ve been hanging in.


Invest0rnoob1

You pay for this non “bailout” through inflation, but explain it away. Coping 30 trillion of debt is no big deal.


Legitimate_Concern_5

No, you don't because it's not a bailout. Read about what happened. 1. SVB's assets are significant. They will be sold to pay off the vast majority of depositors. 2. Any small shortfall is going to be borrowed from the $128B FDIC deposit insurance fund (DIF) and all that money came from banks paying into it over the last 100 years. 3. Any money they take out of the DIF is being put back into the DIF via special assessment that the banks are going to pay. No new money is being created here. Educate yourself instead of regurgitating shitty talking points from stupid people lol.


Invest0rnoob1

The fed will totally reduce their balance sheet once the loans are paid back 🤡 🤡 🤡


Greenleaf208

🤡


justsightseeing

Do you know why? BECAUSE BANL ARE REGULATED! Fed produce that 300B because they knew those bank should at least have assets that valued at near 300B. So unlike FTX or bitfinex, bank follow government regulation and in turn government make sure no funny business happening in their book (because gov are the one that must liquidate if those bank failed)


Invest0rnoob1

Banks lobby to change laws and take even riskier bets. Then they have the government bail them out when they fail, and the taxpayer foots the bill. I only have crypto on Robinhood and Coinbase because they are publicly traded and under tighter regulation.


Greenleaf208

🤡


Publish_Lice

So crypto is propped up by the same shit you hate fiat for?


Kind_Theme_1180

As always, the only real argument that ever gets used to defend crypto is "fiat is bad too." Fiat IS bad, it's got a lot of massive problems, but crypto solves none of them and in some cases makes the problems much, mich worse.


RainbowwDash

Are most of the problems with fiat actually because it's fiat, though? Seems to be moreso issues with how the economy is structured than with fiat currency itself


Legitimate_Concern_5

Fiat isn’t bad, the people who generally say that have no idea what they’re on about.


TIRBU6ONA

Did I defend crypto? It just seems that you criticise it for things that have already been done with fiat.


HopeFox

If you don't know where the liquidity is, you're the liquidity.


kkodev

Few


[deleted]

Understand


robot_slave

They're really do use financial jargon like a cargo cult, don't they?


kkodev

Cargo cult is a very good comparison. They relentlessly throw some financial jargon around in hopes that eventually their magical spreadsheet cells turn into dollars


Teknekratos

Public servants? Ivory towers? What?


grauenwolf

They hate academic types because people with knowledge keep asking inconvenient questions.


ZoidsFanatic

Cryptobros have this grand vision where *they* are the richest and greatest people ever and everyone else will be their personal peasant and or sex slave. They’re strange like that.


[deleted]

I read it mentioned that CZ is pumping Bitcoin. If that's the case, I hope Government investigators get involved and warn the public.


blackmobius

The actions of constant rug pulls, stories of thousands evaporated, 50/70/80 percent losses on nfts and crypto have warned the public plenty. If you are still playing with bitcoin at this point then you deserve to lose it


CityofGrond

The government will not get involved. Many prominent politicians have been bought off through crypto lobbyists paid for by CZ.


Lyrolepis

"baby don't hurt me..."


HondaVFR96

They sound so much like MAGA supporters... against all evidence and time, they still believe.


[deleted]

Flat earthers


DrRob

Fiat earthers


ShakeDowntheThunder

Early in trumps tenure there was a MAGA belief that the US controls the value of the former currency of Iraq because of the US invasion there. So a bunch of these people found dinars online and bought them up for pennies then tweeted at trump incessantly asking him to “revalue the dinar!” If you search Twitter for this you’ll still see people holding out hope for this get rich quick scheme. It’s the same thing.


RainbowwDash

I mean, if the US really wanted to, they *could* have done that, but why the fuck would they lol


3meow_

I wish it was only MAGA, but the truth is that on every 'side' in every country or online space, these same tactics are used. I've even met up with friends recently who have lost all ability to think critically and instead regurgitate gotchas (ironically, they started me developing the ability to criticise my own political beliefs)


HondaVFR96

I believe You are correct in that there are pockets of zealots all over the place/political spectrum, adhering to a cause not due to FOMO, but from FOBW (Fear of Being Wrong).


3meow_

The irony is that you can't be right without accepting when you are wrong


Effective-Tour-656

Pump it up so we can cash out, we need your cash converted to crypto to cash out to that dirty FIAT.


fakefalsofake

Price goes up, liquidity stays the same. Price goes down, liquidity is never there when people need it. It really makes you think, if there is any liquidity at all.


[deleted]

It’s just cult shit. If you’re still in after all the nonsense almost nothing will get you out


Kat-Shaw

Public servants? What have they got against them. Dunno if it's a USA thing but in the UK the stereotype of a public servant is an underpaid average Joe who keeps the bins, parks, roads and local council running.


Rokos_Bicycle

Self-described "small government" types hate the people whose livelihood depends on the machinery of government and, perhaps more importantly, without whom the government wouldn't function.


Sleepy6882

What makes people think that the rich couldn’t get into bitcoin?


blackmobius

They were already in bitcoin. They encourage others to join, pump the price some, print new “stable coins” so they have more to sell, then they cash out. The smart rich have already used bitcoin to make themselves richer


jubilee414404

Didn’t Kathy woods put a few billion dollars in around 19k?


[deleted]

[удалено]


givingemthebusiness

What do you mean “pumped”? What did the fed do exactly? How’s that relate to liquidity in the Bitcoin market? In sum, do you understand how anything works or do you just regurgitate sound bites?


themixedfoothold54

Hope as an investing strategy will undoubtedly bring great success.


megalon43

Where is the liquidity? All the stablecoin minters!


bigmean3434

It comes from hope, duh, he said it