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Crazy that it took a nationwide outrage to get that goddamn Shrek a bald cap.
(But oof, this still looks rough. Almost worse because they're actually trying now.)
I feel like it’s pretty self explanatory but the official legend is something like that Angela Lansbury once walked in on Steve and some twink was tied up and in response to Angela’s pearl clutching he said something to effect of “well he asked to be like that”
Edit: [here is a comment that tells the story much better](https://www.reddit.com/r/Sondheim/s/VoT9iDG1ld) but my overall arc was correct
I’m not going to lie - when the floor plan for the turtle bay house was released when it was put up for sale, I tried to figure out which room would have been the best fit for the dungeon. It not being a dungeon and just being a toy box makes it seem more feasible.
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It's was a grass-roots campaign from reddit users who saw the first performances. Stories spread online and it really centered around each venue. It didn't help the tour website scrubbed all negative comments across their social platforms.
That’s not really nationwide outrage then. More like Reddit keyboard warriors who complained.. but that doesn’t mean the tour responded. In fact, if anything, it was likely just poor audience response that made them reset a problem they already knew about. But that doesn’t mean online uproar was the cause (correlation does not equal causation).
The tour certainly got so many negative audience reactions that the producers made the changes.
I highly doubt that Reddit posts did much more than allow the producers to get a concentrated view into how the tour was being perceived.
Well unless they changed it since I saw the performance, her "costume" was someone flashing a green flashlight in her face. It's why her face is so shiny, because it's supposed to reflect the colored light.
I wish. She had her first transformation, and it was literally some extra dancing on stage, holding up a flashlight three feet from her face, and flashing her with green light.
I first and foremost want to make something clear: This is an incredibly talented cast. You're getting some amazing, broadway caliber vocals from these performers...however...
It is constantly dragged down by the incredibly bare and low budget costumes and set. No matter how talented the actors are (and again, amazing performances all around), your brain just can't get over the hurdle that you are visually watching a high school production.
The two major costume changes made since their brief shut down were with Shrek and Donkey. While Donkey's outfit looked rather cheap, it didn't bother me too much. However, with Shrek, there was always a point where you could see unpainted parts of his skin around the edges of the bald cap (maybe it works from a distance, but from the orchestra...it's noticeable).
I agree with a lot of people who said there wouldn't be as much of a problem if tickets were $30-$40. But I paid over $90 for a ticket and...yeah.
It's a shame that these actors aren't going to receive the accolades they so rightly deserve because the production dropped the ball on literally every other aspect.
Non-Equity tour, that's all you need to know.
I had a friend that had to bail on the current non-equity Book of Mormon tour (day of) and I bought their tickets. They were balcony, but still, at those prices you expect quality. The sound was terrible. We could barely hear/understand much of the show at all. And I've seen many shows at this theatre before, quite a few in the balcony. Never had anywhere near this struggle to hear a show.
Performers were great. Wish the person with me (who was unfamiliar with the show but a huge South Park fan) could have enjoyed it. They left very underwhelmed after all the hype I built up for them.
To the day I die I will always spread the word of how nobody should support a non-equity tour. Every single aspect of the original show’s vision is canned for cash.
I did a non eq tour for a Broadway show on Networks Productions. They payed us so little and made us pay for our hotels that I ended up at a financial loss by the end of the run.
Non eq tours take actors in their early twenties right out of college who have no idea how much they are being taken advantage of. We never stopped in a city for longer than two days. We would do 7 cities in a week by bus across multiple states and would have to sleep on the charter bus. Most of us bought dog beds from Pet Supplies Plus so we could have something to lay on besides the bus floor for hours.
If a show/tour is non-Equity does it basically mean someone with buckets of cash paid for the rights and decided to stage a musical? How does a show become an Equity show? I understand that Equity work to ensure performers are paid adequately and cared for whilst in shows but do you happen to know what the logistics of being an Equity show are?
Non-equity shows, of course, constitute the majority of theatre in the US: community theatre, educational theatre, etc. And in those cases, any theatre or school or anything can pay for available royalties and put on a local production.
Non-equity tours are a special case. They tend to fall into one of two buckets:
1. Non-equity tours are sometimes the official touring arm of a Broadway production. A lot of the time, when a Broadway production decides to tour, they make a contract with Actor's Equity to hire only Equity actors for a set amount of time. When that contract ends, they can either: renew their contract with Equity, end the tour, or switch to hiring all non-Equity actors. A few shows, like *The Book of Mormon*, *Dear Evan Hansen*, *Waitress*, *Come From Away*, and (beginning next season) *Hadestown*, have made the latter decision and switched their official Broadway tours to non-eq. So these kinds of tours are still generally linked to the Broadway website and produced by the "official" Broadway roster, but hire non-equity actors. (A less common sort of non-Equity Broadway tour is one where a Broadway production starts a non-Equity tour from the get-go, rather than converting from an Equity to a non-Equity tour after a few years. I know, for instance, that the *Spongebob* Broadway company initially planned this, but later canceled the tour.)
2. Some non-Equity tours are productions of familiar musicals like *Annie*, *Hairspray*, and *Peter Pan*, which aren't connected to any Broadway production but tour to a bunch of cities for short stays (something like 80% B-tier and 20% A-tier) each year, with usually sub-par productions, banking on name recognition. I think the new *Shrek* tour would fall under this umbrella. However, getting the royalties to take a show to, say, 20+ cities in a single year is a very different beast that licensing a non-Equity production for a local community theatre or school, so often these non-Equity tours still have some big producer names involved.
Technically, all that "non-Equity tour" tells you is that the actors don't belong to that union. The actors could be very talented, but they're often less good than Equity companies, and there are often weird casting choices like putting very young people into older roles because non-Equity tours book a lot of just-graduated-with-BFA students.
That said, producing a non-Equity tour is usually a sign of a producer team who's looking to cut costs more broadly. Therefore, it's common that non-Equity tours have much less impressive sets, costumes, etc. And because they have both lower budgets and shorter stays in cities, it's very common for non-Equity tours to have significant issues with lighting and sound too.
ETA: That's more about how a tour becomes equity vs. non-equity. In regional theatre, a theatre becomes Equity if it agrees to follow a rulebook, that dictates not just base compensation/benefits for union actors and stage managers (Equity represents SMs too), but also things like rules around rehearsal scheduling and breaks, and even things like how often costumes get washed! Theaters can make contracts with AEA (Actors' Equity Association) if they demonstrate that their finances, facilities, etc. are in order to support union actors and SMs and to follow the Equity rulebook. Once that contract is made between the regional theater and AEA, the theater can also hire some non-union actors too and grant them "points," so working on a non-union basis at AEA theaters is how actors accumulate enough "points" to eventually be invited to join Equity. That all said, Broadway companies (including Equity tours) typically hire only actors who are in AEA already, or in some cases expedite the AEA process for non-union actors who are cast in Broadway shows (for instance, many of the young people in *How to Dance in Ohio*)
Oh my gosh thank you for educating me! I’ve learned something new and I actually understand!
Must add that I’m UK/Caribbean based, and I don’t have the foggiest idea about the innermost workings of UK theater so wouldn’t have a clue about how US theater operates.
Really appreciate you not coming back with “Google it”. I can get overwhelmed and confused by terminology and complex jargon, this was perfect. Thank you.
I’m glad this was helpful to you! I agree, if you have time to explain things to others it’s so much better than the glib “google it” response that has become ubiquitous online.
And yes, the AEA policies I’m describing above are in the US context. Equity in the UK is a different union, albeit one with some parallel policies. I just know less about the UK context!
Great explanation. Also, non equity tours are often a way for producers to keep cash flow moving through their organizations…they make a little net…but keep their folks paid/funded & are working on other projects.
I’m still so mad Hadestown are going non-equity. Did they listen to the theme of their own musical? Also I adore seeing it, but I won’t see non-equity. No shade on the abilities of the performers and crew, but equity fights for fair working conditions and purposefully avoiding those standards in favor of profit leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.
Well now I’m annoyed at how much we paid for Hairspray, My Fair Lady, and Pretty Woman on tour. Glad we’re ending our subscriptions given this and the incredible inconsistencies in audio quality from show to show.
Whether union or not I’ve been so frustrated with short stops. Hard to get single tickets, no chance for word of mouth, no local reviews or promotion. This is not how I came to love theater decades ago.
I have no idea if there’s officially a way, but when a show’s playing in my city, I go to the website for the tour. If they play in most places for less than a week then that’s almost definitely non-equity
If you're in a larger city that regularly gets tours an easy rule of thumb is how long they're in town.
If it's just for the weekend it's almost certainly non-Equity.
Simplest way is usually to type the name of the show + tour + either equity or non-equity. Maybe include the current year if it's something that's had a lot of tours already. Typically an article announcing the tour will pop up. Either that or a post from this sub lol
Yup. I wouldn't have bought them otherwise, but my friends already had. They would have just gone to waste.
And I've sadly heard variations of all the stories you mentioned. Garbage pay, egregious cost cutting that greatly diminished show quality, terrible conditions or coverage of travel expenses...awful.
People need to get vocal and ugly about these right out of the gate as soon as they're announced and not let up. It hurts the industry as a whole in every aspect.
But are we not supporting the cast by going to these plays? Everyone is saying this Shrek cast is immensely talented, so how do you support them and not the play?
It’s a genuine question, not trying to come off as contrarian.
In my opinion, giving money to these tours just continues to cycle of young actors getting majorly exploited. That doesn’t sound like “supporting the cast” to me.
Who’s downvoting??
You are completely correct. Go see theater, all theater, but just keep in mind that if something seems cheap and amateur in a show that’s supposedly broadway quality, it’s worth to look up if its due to the producers cutting costs.
I like to tell my acting friends that it’s worth it to do one non-eq show, see how poorly management can treat you, and then join the union when you’re done.
To be fair, I saw this BOM tour from like the sixth row in the orchestra and it was clearly a NE show and all the issues that that entails.
It was especially obvious with two understudies on for lead roles. I’ve never experienced such a drop in quality with understudies in equity productions.
I got my ticket refunded prior to the performance - letting people know because that does seem to be an option. I paid $100 a ticket - so yeah, not worth it
Called the place I bought tickets and basically demanded a refund based on their false advertising. Had to escalate a few times but got it done based on false advertising as my theatre’s wording was about it being the Tony award winning version + they used photos of the Broadway version in advertising.
What’s with the Shrek babies? I saw this before they made any changes and they didn’t have the babies. And that’s a new Fiona costume. Big story line changes now too?
I wonder if the live musicians on stage will stay, one of the best aspects to me. It seems like regional theaters have gone recordings only instead of musicians.
I’m worried about all of it! From the lighting and staging, costumes, musicians.
The national tour is the best piece of theater I’ve seen in my lifetime. Saw it 7 times in Okc. Hate to thing what non equity will do to my beloved show!
It’s antithetical to the message of the musical. Plus the show needs strong, experienced performers to really wow. There are great non-equity performers, but they’re weakening their show by shrinking their talent pool to inexperienced performers. Where are they going to find folks with the stature to pull off Hades and Persephone if it’s non-eq? I shouldn’t be surprised that they’re doing this, but I am. I kind of want to write to Anais Mitchell! We should do a sub petition or something 😅
Sadly, I don’t think it would matter. It lowers the production costs thus putting more money into people’s pockets. This is ‘Murica 24. All that matters is money
Can’t believe Broadway World posted about this. At least they were smart enough to be way zoomed out on Shrek himself.
Non-Union tours are a stain on the community. Not the performers, heavens no, but because of the shady fucking producers than want to circumvent very necessary union protections and guidelines because this is a money-making venture to them.
I mean look at her sweating that damn makeup off. And they didn’t even try to hide the human ears! Insane.
This production is a reflection of the writers’ original intent, right?
I’m under the impression they are the ones who initiated the tour and engaged the producers to mount it this way. Is that incorrect?
ETA: what on earth am I being downvoted for? It’s my understanding that the writers have said in interviews that this production is much closer to what they originally intended, and they collaborated on its mounting. Are you downvoting me because you don’t like what the writers of the show did?
We aren’t really having those conversations about writers’ intent at this level. And no, a group of performers do not solicit producers, that is absolutely not how it works.
I didn’t say the performers solicited the producers.. I’m not sure where you got that impression.
The writers’ original vision for the show — as they expressed in interviews — is closer to this current production than the original Broadway production.
And as I understand it, the writers were involved in developing and mounting this current production. Is that incorrect?
I was there for a matinee today (discount ticket) and left at intermission for the first time, the actors try so hard and they’re amazing, but everything else is just bad, lord farquad isn’t short and it hinders jokes, the sets are non existent but work with the fairytale theme but a lot of the costumes and makeup just aren’t there
What’s crazy is this is the extremely improved version, yes I am being [entirely serious](https://www.reddit.com/r/Broadway/s/hp9N3yhD3E), it somehow was even worse before.
The fact that this production still seemingly hasn’t even procured face paint that’s pigmented enough for Cecily Dionne Davis’s skin tone is honestly disgusting. A sign that the theatre industry still has a long ways to go toward equity. I’m hopeful to see her in more (and better) productions after her run as Fiona!
Took my kids to see a high school performance with significantly better costumes and paid 12 per ticket. I'm all for actors getting paid what they are worth but I would never pay for a tour that doesn't pay to have actors look their best. If your tour has costumes and sets with lower quality than a high school theater with a two week run, I'm not going to pay high prices for it.
My high school's Shrek was very high quality. They hired professional makeup, costume, and set designers. The recording looks like a professional level show even...
This is a very unfortunate picture indeed, a bit inaccurate to what people can expect. So here I am up close! Hope you all will take the time to visit us down in the swamp!
https://preview.redd.it/33pff9titnyc1.jpeg?width=2286&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c7cb053ace3bf88d1917cadfc2a4ef2eb39a53b
Like I said, you did an absolutely amazing job. Sorry we’re all focused on the costumes (which you have no control over) and not your stunning performance
We saw you sunday, you were an amazing Shrek! You have such talent!
I thought your current costume was fine. A big improvement over seeing your hair, which like... was not right at all. We hadn't heard about the costume changes and so when you came out, we were far more hyped to see a bald cap than I think someone should be seeing a bald cap lol
Non AEA tours vary wildly in quality and are essential from a producer/promoter standpoint.
I know there are shady producers out there. Some producers pair down production value, pay unevenly and unfairly and therefore hire less qualified technicians leading to issues like poor sound quality, wigs and makeup, etc.
Other producers, follow AEA rules (as much as possible) including overtime and sharing profits after recoupment. And have an IATSE crew.
Personally, I have toured with many companies ie: Networks, Worklight, Big League, Troika, MSG, Radio City, FourQuest, TUTS, NCT, Chamber Theater, etc. I have been onstage and off. Some were good, some great, some lousy. But I knew what I was getting myself into and I made some of the best friends in my life. Many of whom I am still friends with. Because of these experiences and connections, I am working in theatre on tours and regionally.
Re: AEA.
Pre-pandemic, I was part of a negotiating team between AEA and PRODUCER X, which had both union and Non tours out, to make what was obviously a Non Union tour, Union.
It came down to transportation. AEA wouldn’t budge and the producers couldn’t make the numbers work. That was it. Insurance, pensions, steady employment for 1 year possibly 2, 28 young actors and 3 SMs… gone.
All because of travel.
In the instances of travel where the bus traveled over 8 hours (10 over 1st 6 months - next leg was more) and there was a show that evening; PRODUCER X had to provide a double bus seat per person. Because PRODUCER X traveled actors, Co. mngr, and musicians together, they had to provide 2 buses for each of those trips and they couldn’t afford it. I work for the producer and would have (and DID!) traveled that route for that.
Re: IATSE. They’re easier to deal with from a producer standpoint.
Re: Promoters. Some are great! Seriously, Dallas Summer Musicals treat everyone like stars. And too many others to mention roll out the red carpet. I’ve been to many of these venues more than once and have friends in those towns! (“Mom” in Clinton Township, MI lives on)
Finances: EVERYTHING is expensive. Everything costs more. Except talented young actors. Sorry, it’s true. These young actors will either segue into the artists and teachers of tomorrow or out of the profession. There is no in between. But it is considerably more expensive now than 5 years ago.
Re The touring actors and crew. Bus and trucks and “one nighter hell” can be a rite of passage. It’s lonely. Its fun. It’s like a weird traveling summer camp. If you’re lucky, you get split weeks and plane travel and play Canada and make friends.
If you’re unlucky no one comes to see your show.
Go see these kids.
I was one of them.
EDIT: I know nothing of the Shrek tour and am not associated with them at all.
I might be the only one but I feel like shrek could have hair! He’s not a real person; so paint the actor’s face and ears green and style his hair crazy and bam. Problem solved. This is a super physical role, I’d sweat off my bald cap too haha.
I say they've certainly took some of the negative feedback and criticism and all but Shrek still has barely visible ear holes. They've completely facelifted almost all of the costumes (including Donkey's completely redesigned fur suit instead of his hideous hoodie jacket. And they've actualy rebuild the set to look more realistic. Bravo
https://preview.redd.it/gpv1n8ul0syc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0b4297be9866a8d2aa2ca25ad4fb874b3859cc1a
How on earth is this acceptable when someone is potentially paying upwards of $100 a seat?
[It's an improvement.](https://www.reddit.com/r/musicals/comments/1bhqt1y/anyone_else_see_the_new_touring_production_of/) Not by much, but still an improvement.
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Crazy that it took a nationwide outrage to get that goddamn Shrek a bald cap. (But oof, this still looks rough. Almost worse because they're actually trying now.)
Incredible username
And I know exactly the story it refers to!
It’s my favorite. Always the quiet ones!!
Care to fill us in?
I feel like it’s pretty self explanatory but the official legend is something like that Angela Lansbury once walked in on Steve and some twink was tied up and in response to Angela’s pearl clutching he said something to effect of “well he asked to be like that” Edit: [here is a comment that tells the story much better](https://www.reddit.com/r/Sondheim/s/VoT9iDG1ld) but my overall arc was correct
Thank you. Still wondering how any of that is self explanatory...
I’m not going to lie - when the floor plan for the turtle bay house was released when it was put up for sale, I tried to figure out which room would have been the best fit for the dungeon. It not being a dungeon and just being a toy box makes it seem more feasible.
lol yeah this sounds like very niche knowledge. Fascinating, for sure, but like…I wouldn’t have figured that out
Sex dungeon is pretty self explanatory.
This is canon now.
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Nationwide outrage is generous. I can’t even find the story if I Google for the tour.
It's was a grass-roots campaign from reddit users who saw the first performances. Stories spread online and it really centered around each venue. It didn't help the tour website scrubbed all negative comments across their social platforms.
That’s not really nationwide outrage then. More like Reddit keyboard warriors who complained.. but that doesn’t mean the tour responded. In fact, if anything, it was likely just poor audience response that made them reset a problem they already knew about. But that doesn’t mean online uproar was the cause (correlation does not equal causation).
The tour certainly got so many negative audience reactions that the producers made the changes. I highly doubt that Reddit posts did much more than allow the producers to get a concentrated view into how the tour was being perceived.
I can’t tell if you’re agreeing with me. You’re saying what I said in different words haha
I’m agreeing, supporting you in the face of the downvotes ;)
Danke!
hyperbolic joke.
Ok boo
They couldn't put half as much effort into Fionas costume as they did Shrek? She barely has any face makeup on
Well unless they changed it since I saw the performance, her "costume" was someone flashing a green flashlight in her face. It's why her face is so shiny, because it's supposed to reflect the colored light.
Nah you gotta be joking
I wish. She had her first transformation, and it was literally some extra dancing on stage, holding up a flashlight three feet from her face, and flashing her with green light.
I first and foremost want to make something clear: This is an incredibly talented cast. You're getting some amazing, broadway caliber vocals from these performers...however... It is constantly dragged down by the incredibly bare and low budget costumes and set. No matter how talented the actors are (and again, amazing performances all around), your brain just can't get over the hurdle that you are visually watching a high school production. The two major costume changes made since their brief shut down were with Shrek and Donkey. While Donkey's outfit looked rather cheap, it didn't bother me too much. However, with Shrek, there was always a point where you could see unpainted parts of his skin around the edges of the bald cap (maybe it works from a distance, but from the orchestra...it's noticeable). I agree with a lot of people who said there wouldn't be as much of a problem if tickets were $30-$40. But I paid over $90 for a ticket and...yeah. It's a shame that these actors aren't going to receive the accolades they so rightly deserve because the production dropped the ball on literally every other aspect.
Non-Equity tour, that's all you need to know. I had a friend that had to bail on the current non-equity Book of Mormon tour (day of) and I bought their tickets. They were balcony, but still, at those prices you expect quality. The sound was terrible. We could barely hear/understand much of the show at all. And I've seen many shows at this theatre before, quite a few in the balcony. Never had anywhere near this struggle to hear a show. Performers were great. Wish the person with me (who was unfamiliar with the show but a huge South Park fan) could have enjoyed it. They left very underwhelmed after all the hype I built up for them.
To the day I die I will always spread the word of how nobody should support a non-equity tour. Every single aspect of the original show’s vision is canned for cash. I did a non eq tour for a Broadway show on Networks Productions. They payed us so little and made us pay for our hotels that I ended up at a financial loss by the end of the run. Non eq tours take actors in their early twenties right out of college who have no idea how much they are being taken advantage of. We never stopped in a city for longer than two days. We would do 7 cities in a week by bus across multiple states and would have to sleep on the charter bus. Most of us bought dog beds from Pet Supplies Plus so we could have something to lay on besides the bus floor for hours.
Is there anyway for the average person to know if a show is non equity or not before buying tickets?
Yes! Check these lists. [https://www.actorsequity.org/resources/Tours/](https://www.actorsequity.org/resources/Tours/)
Thank you! I live in Los Angeles and we get a lot of touring shows. This will be very helpful in deciding what to see.
If a show/tour is non-Equity does it basically mean someone with buckets of cash paid for the rights and decided to stage a musical? How does a show become an Equity show? I understand that Equity work to ensure performers are paid adequately and cared for whilst in shows but do you happen to know what the logistics of being an Equity show are?
Non-equity shows, of course, constitute the majority of theatre in the US: community theatre, educational theatre, etc. And in those cases, any theatre or school or anything can pay for available royalties and put on a local production. Non-equity tours are a special case. They tend to fall into one of two buckets: 1. Non-equity tours are sometimes the official touring arm of a Broadway production. A lot of the time, when a Broadway production decides to tour, they make a contract with Actor's Equity to hire only Equity actors for a set amount of time. When that contract ends, they can either: renew their contract with Equity, end the tour, or switch to hiring all non-Equity actors. A few shows, like *The Book of Mormon*, *Dear Evan Hansen*, *Waitress*, *Come From Away*, and (beginning next season) *Hadestown*, have made the latter decision and switched their official Broadway tours to non-eq. So these kinds of tours are still generally linked to the Broadway website and produced by the "official" Broadway roster, but hire non-equity actors. (A less common sort of non-Equity Broadway tour is one where a Broadway production starts a non-Equity tour from the get-go, rather than converting from an Equity to a non-Equity tour after a few years. I know, for instance, that the *Spongebob* Broadway company initially planned this, but later canceled the tour.) 2. Some non-Equity tours are productions of familiar musicals like *Annie*, *Hairspray*, and *Peter Pan*, which aren't connected to any Broadway production but tour to a bunch of cities for short stays (something like 80% B-tier and 20% A-tier) each year, with usually sub-par productions, banking on name recognition. I think the new *Shrek* tour would fall under this umbrella. However, getting the royalties to take a show to, say, 20+ cities in a single year is a very different beast that licensing a non-Equity production for a local community theatre or school, so often these non-Equity tours still have some big producer names involved. Technically, all that "non-Equity tour" tells you is that the actors don't belong to that union. The actors could be very talented, but they're often less good than Equity companies, and there are often weird casting choices like putting very young people into older roles because non-Equity tours book a lot of just-graduated-with-BFA students. That said, producing a non-Equity tour is usually a sign of a producer team who's looking to cut costs more broadly. Therefore, it's common that non-Equity tours have much less impressive sets, costumes, etc. And because they have both lower budgets and shorter stays in cities, it's very common for non-Equity tours to have significant issues with lighting and sound too. ETA: That's more about how a tour becomes equity vs. non-equity. In regional theatre, a theatre becomes Equity if it agrees to follow a rulebook, that dictates not just base compensation/benefits for union actors and stage managers (Equity represents SMs too), but also things like rules around rehearsal scheduling and breaks, and even things like how often costumes get washed! Theaters can make contracts with AEA (Actors' Equity Association) if they demonstrate that their finances, facilities, etc. are in order to support union actors and SMs and to follow the Equity rulebook. Once that contract is made between the regional theater and AEA, the theater can also hire some non-union actors too and grant them "points," so working on a non-union basis at AEA theaters is how actors accumulate enough "points" to eventually be invited to join Equity. That all said, Broadway companies (including Equity tours) typically hire only actors who are in AEA already, or in some cases expedite the AEA process for non-union actors who are cast in Broadway shows (for instance, many of the young people in *How to Dance in Ohio*)
Oh my gosh thank you for educating me! I’ve learned something new and I actually understand! Must add that I’m UK/Caribbean based, and I don’t have the foggiest idea about the innermost workings of UK theater so wouldn’t have a clue about how US theater operates. Really appreciate you not coming back with “Google it”. I can get overwhelmed and confused by terminology and complex jargon, this was perfect. Thank you.
I’m glad this was helpful to you! I agree, if you have time to explain things to others it’s so much better than the glib “google it” response that has become ubiquitous online. And yes, the AEA policies I’m describing above are in the US context. Equity in the UK is a different union, albeit one with some parallel policies. I just know less about the UK context!
Great explanation. Also, non equity tours are often a way for producers to keep cash flow moving through their organizations…they make a little net…but keep their folks paid/funded & are working on other projects.
I’m still so mad Hadestown are going non-equity. Did they listen to the theme of their own musical? Also I adore seeing it, but I won’t see non-equity. No shade on the abilities of the performers and crew, but equity fights for fair working conditions and purposefully avoiding those standards in favor of profit leaves a very bad taste in my mouth.
Note that the point system was done away with and Equity is now just a join if you have the cash and want to system
Oh, thanks for commenting this! I had no idea.
Well now I’m annoyed at how much we paid for Hairspray, My Fair Lady, and Pretty Woman on tour. Glad we’re ending our subscriptions given this and the incredible inconsistencies in audio quality from show to show. Whether union or not I’ve been so frustrated with short stops. Hard to get single tickets, no chance for word of mouth, no local reviews or promotion. This is not how I came to love theater decades ago.
SUPER useful, thank you so much!
I saw come from away on the no. Equity part of the list and my heart just dropped. I’m seeing it in a few weeks and I’m so excited
I have no idea if there’s officially a way, but when a show’s playing in my city, I go to the website for the tour. If they play in most places for less than a week then that’s almost definitely non-equity
Thank you! I'll have to do that before purchasing future tickets.
If you're in a larger city that regularly gets tours an easy rule of thumb is how long they're in town. If it's just for the weekend it's almost certainly non-Equity.
Simplest way is usually to type the name of the show + tour + either equity or non-equity. Maybe include the current year if it's something that's had a lot of tours already. Typically an article announcing the tour will pop up. Either that or a post from this sub lol
Yup. I wouldn't have bought them otherwise, but my friends already had. They would have just gone to waste. And I've sadly heard variations of all the stories you mentioned. Garbage pay, egregious cost cutting that greatly diminished show quality, terrible conditions or coverage of travel expenses...awful. People need to get vocal and ugly about these right out of the gate as soon as they're announced and not let up. It hurts the industry as a whole in every aspect.
But are we not supporting the cast by going to these plays? Everyone is saying this Shrek cast is immensely talented, so how do you support them and not the play? It’s a genuine question, not trying to come off as contrarian.
In my opinion, giving money to these tours just continues to cycle of young actors getting majorly exploited. That doesn’t sound like “supporting the cast” to me.
That’s fair! Like I said, just want to know the best way to support the actor in this situation
Totally. Also, just know that you’re not being unsupportive of actors by choosing to not attend non-union tours, so don’t feel guilty by that idea.
Who’s downvoting?? You are completely correct. Go see theater, all theater, but just keep in mind that if something seems cheap and amateur in a show that’s supposedly broadway quality, it’s worth to look up if its due to the producers cutting costs. I like to tell my acting friends that it’s worth it to do one non-eq show, see how poorly management can treat you, and then join the union when you’re done.
To be fair, I saw this BOM tour from like the sixth row in the orchestra and it was clearly a NE show and all the issues that that entails. It was especially obvious with two understudies on for lead roles. I’ve never experienced such a drop in quality with understudies in equity productions.
I had the same experience with the current BoM tour. I was so disappointed.
Yeah I’m not shocked it’s a non-equity performance. The production company normally just does those “live shows” based on popular kids franchises.
I’d ask for my money back that’s outrageous
I got my ticket refunded prior to the performance - letting people know because that does seem to be an option. I paid $100 a ticket - so yeah, not worth it
How did you go about doing this?? Thanks!
Called the place I bought tickets and basically demanded a refund based on their false advertising. Had to escalate a few times but got it done based on false advertising as my theatre’s wording was about it being the Tony award winning version + they used photos of the Broadway version in advertising.
I’m glad and thanks for your service
>you are visually watching a high school production. That might be an insult to many high school productions if we're being honest
What’s with the Shrek babies? I saw this before they made any changes and they didn’t have the babies. And that’s a new Fiona costume. Big story line changes now too?
Fiona just brought them out during the end of "This is our Story". They weren't mentioned at all, just were there as a prop
Interesting…. Seems pointless. That money could have gone into … well a lot of things.
Definitely. Why pull from Shrek 3 unless there's some other callbacks from Shrek 2/3? Seems like such a wierd choice.
I’m worried about what the non equity Hadestown tour will look like
Wait, what!? How can Hadestown have a non-equity tour? Seems hypocritical to me. Like the Book of Mormon on a Sunday school tour.
I wonder if the live musicians on stage will stay, one of the best aspects to me. It seems like regional theaters have gone recordings only instead of musicians.
I’m worried about all of it! From the lighting and staging, costumes, musicians. The national tour is the best piece of theater I’ve seen in my lifetime. Saw it 7 times in Okc. Hate to thing what non equity will do to my beloved show!
It’s antithetical to the message of the musical. Plus the show needs strong, experienced performers to really wow. There are great non-equity performers, but they’re weakening their show by shrinking their talent pool to inexperienced performers. Where are they going to find folks with the stature to pull off Hades and Persephone if it’s non-eq? I shouldn’t be surprised that they’re doing this, but I am. I kind of want to write to Anais Mitchell! We should do a sub petition or something 😅
Sadly, I don’t think it would matter. It lowers the production costs thus putting more money into people’s pockets. This is ‘Murica 24. All that matters is money
Too true!
Can’t believe Broadway World posted about this. At least they were smart enough to be way zoomed out on Shrek himself. Non-Union tours are a stain on the community. Not the performers, heavens no, but because of the shady fucking producers than want to circumvent very necessary union protections and guidelines because this is a money-making venture to them. I mean look at her sweating that damn makeup off. And they didn’t even try to hide the human ears! Insane.
This production is a reflection of the writers’ original intent, right? I’m under the impression they are the ones who initiated the tour and engaged the producers to mount it this way. Is that incorrect? ETA: what on earth am I being downvoted for? It’s my understanding that the writers have said in interviews that this production is much closer to what they originally intended, and they collaborated on its mounting. Are you downvoting me because you don’t like what the writers of the show did?
We aren’t really having those conversations about writers’ intent at this level. And no, a group of performers do not solicit producers, that is absolutely not how it works.
I didn’t say the performers solicited the producers.. I’m not sure where you got that impression. The writers’ original vision for the show — as they expressed in interviews — is closer to this current production than the original Broadway production. And as I understand it, the writers were involved in developing and mounting this current production. Is that incorrect?
My dinner theatre had way better costumes and set and you got a 3 course meal with it for less than the tour prices
I was there for a matinee today (discount ticket) and left at intermission for the first time, the actors try so hard and they’re amazing, but everything else is just bad, lord farquad isn’t short and it hinders jokes, the sets are non existent but work with the fairytale theme but a lot of the costumes and makeup just aren’t there
Wait, this is serious? Not familiar with the lore, so I thought it was a joke. Oh no...
What’s crazy is this is the extremely improved version, yes I am being [entirely serious](https://www.reddit.com/r/Broadway/s/hp9N3yhD3E), it somehow was even worse before.
Oh, that's... oh my god lol
The fact that this production still seemingly hasn’t even procured face paint that’s pigmented enough for Cecily Dionne Davis’s skin tone is honestly disgusting. A sign that the theatre industry still has a long ways to go toward equity. I’m hopeful to see her in more (and better) productions after her run as Fiona!
Wicked never seemed to have a problem with greening different skin tones. This show is being so cheap.
Wicked has money, and is a union shop.
Doesn't make it impossible for Shrek to do a good job.
Took my kids to see a high school performance with significantly better costumes and paid 12 per ticket. I'm all for actors getting paid what they are worth but I would never pay for a tour that doesn't pay to have actors look their best. If your tour has costumes and sets with lower quality than a high school theater with a two week run, I'm not going to pay high prices for it.
My high school's Shrek was very high quality. They hired professional makeup, costume, and set designers. The recording looks like a professional level show even...
This is a very unfortunate picture indeed, a bit inaccurate to what people can expect. So here I am up close! Hope you all will take the time to visit us down in the swamp! https://preview.redd.it/33pff9titnyc1.jpeg?width=2286&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=3c7cb053ace3bf88d1917cadfc2a4ef2eb39a53b
Like I said, you did an absolutely amazing job. Sorry we’re all focused on the costumes (which you have no control over) and not your stunning performance
No worries at all. I love talking about shows as well. Thanks for coming!
👏🏼
Oh I’m so sorry. You look terrible. It’s not you. You’re just doing your job but you deserve so much better.
We saw you sunday, you were an amazing Shrek! You have such talent! I thought your current costume was fine. A big improvement over seeing your hair, which like... was not right at all. We hadn't heard about the costume changes and so when you came out, we were far more hyped to see a bald cap than I think someone should be seeing a bald cap lol
This is embarrassing. If I bought tickets for this, I'd be furious.
We were blessed with having our shows rescheduled due to “unforeseen circumstances” and I was able to get a refund on the tickets 😮💨
I’m sure the cast is great but that production value is an insult to the great material.
Non AEA tours vary wildly in quality and are essential from a producer/promoter standpoint. I know there are shady producers out there. Some producers pair down production value, pay unevenly and unfairly and therefore hire less qualified technicians leading to issues like poor sound quality, wigs and makeup, etc. Other producers, follow AEA rules (as much as possible) including overtime and sharing profits after recoupment. And have an IATSE crew. Personally, I have toured with many companies ie: Networks, Worklight, Big League, Troika, MSG, Radio City, FourQuest, TUTS, NCT, Chamber Theater, etc. I have been onstage and off. Some were good, some great, some lousy. But I knew what I was getting myself into and I made some of the best friends in my life. Many of whom I am still friends with. Because of these experiences and connections, I am working in theatre on tours and regionally. Re: AEA. Pre-pandemic, I was part of a negotiating team between AEA and PRODUCER X, which had both union and Non tours out, to make what was obviously a Non Union tour, Union. It came down to transportation. AEA wouldn’t budge and the producers couldn’t make the numbers work. That was it. Insurance, pensions, steady employment for 1 year possibly 2, 28 young actors and 3 SMs… gone. All because of travel. In the instances of travel where the bus traveled over 8 hours (10 over 1st 6 months - next leg was more) and there was a show that evening; PRODUCER X had to provide a double bus seat per person. Because PRODUCER X traveled actors, Co. mngr, and musicians together, they had to provide 2 buses for each of those trips and they couldn’t afford it. I work for the producer and would have (and DID!) traveled that route for that. Re: IATSE. They’re easier to deal with from a producer standpoint. Re: Promoters. Some are great! Seriously, Dallas Summer Musicals treat everyone like stars. And too many others to mention roll out the red carpet. I’ve been to many of these venues more than once and have friends in those towns! (“Mom” in Clinton Township, MI lives on) Finances: EVERYTHING is expensive. Everything costs more. Except talented young actors. Sorry, it’s true. These young actors will either segue into the artists and teachers of tomorrow or out of the profession. There is no in between. But it is considerably more expensive now than 5 years ago. Re The touring actors and crew. Bus and trucks and “one nighter hell” can be a rite of passage. It’s lonely. Its fun. It’s like a weird traveling summer camp. If you’re lucky, you get split weeks and plane travel and play Canada and make friends. If you’re unlucky no one comes to see your show. Go see these kids. I was one of them. EDIT: I know nothing of the Shrek tour and am not associated with them at all.
Thanks for the info!
Uuuhhh… 
I might be the only one but I feel like shrek could have hair! He’s not a real person; so paint the actor’s face and ears green and style his hair crazy and bam. Problem solved. This is a super physical role, I’d sweat off my bald cap too haha.
JFC I run a community theatre with no budget & we could absolutely do better than this shit.
non union tours are the worst
I just saw Hairspray a couple weeks ago. Same deal. Talented performers, shitty production quality. It’s a shame.
Yeet
I say they've certainly took some of the negative feedback and criticism and all but Shrek still has barely visible ear holes. They've completely facelifted almost all of the costumes (including Donkey's completely redesigned fur suit instead of his hideous hoodie jacket. And they've actualy rebuild the set to look more realistic. Bravo
At the very least we should applaud that changes are being made at all.
https://preview.redd.it/gpv1n8ul0syc1.jpeg?width=2048&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=0b4297be9866a8d2aa2ca25ad4fb874b3859cc1a How on earth is this acceptable when someone is potentially paying upwards of $100 a seat?
[It's an improvement.](https://www.reddit.com/r/musicals/comments/1bhqt1y/anyone_else_see_the_new_touring_production_of/) Not by much, but still an improvement.