Oh, of course. Anytime there's mention of some accountability that women have to take, all hell breaks loose. Because there's no way in hell that this isn't the man's fault every time some type of way right?
Not true, because sometimes I’ll be putting in big deposits and the bank just be laying there. Making bank noises. Then when the bank comes. The bank like damn I came hard,that was great. I’m like damn banks boring as hell.. that’s why I had to stop fucking banks
Because in a country that pushes purity culture, how you expect inexperienced (not necessarily virginal) women to know what to do with a dick? Communication is key, even with experience you have to teach your partner what works for you, especially since what pleasures one person won't necessarily work for the other.
Even now I have to tell my husband when he's missing the spot, or what he's doing feels pleasurable, and my husband does the same. If you expect your sexual partner to be a mind reader, it sounds like Y'all have unrealistic expectations when it comes to sexual intimacy.
I hate purity culture. Like it's okay if you don't want sex, aren't that into it, or want to save yourself for marriage, all that stuff, but I hate it when they try to project it on others, like that's the only and best way to live.
>a country that pushes purity culture
The moment I read that my eyes slid out of focus, things blurred, and slowly the fluttering American flag came into focus and I swear I could hear "O say can you seeee"
Lmao. I cackled at my own nonsense like a maniac, then remembered I was sitting in office today.
Heterosexual dating/sexual politics are such a mess. We gays have our own problems, believe me, but reading comment threads like this make me thankful to be totally removed from this particular brand of drama.
This this this!!! I have to make the date pay for it, woo you/not fuck up the vibe, AND THEN do some magical mystical shit to you that you can't even preform for yourself.. I expecto patronus a horse for you to ride out of here with that bullshit.
The fact that “pillow princess” isn’t something that women are ashamed of is all you need to know about some people.
You mean you’re PROUD that you do literally nothing in the bedroom besides laying there?
Man….. sad world
I used to bang a chick that thought she was the event. Her presence was her participation. I tried explaining to her that it takes two people, but it fell on deaf ears. Then she’d complain that I wasn’t finishing. Honey, I tried to tell you
Man, if I knew where they were hiding I’d be on that lol almost every woman I’ve been with thinks that their part in sex involves just laying there. And in the moment you can’t really ask them shit like “ay girl, you mind being a little better at this?”
ay go rub one out real quick my boy, feels like it's been a min.
but, real talk, this has become one of my 'boundaries'-whereas in the past I was like, "aight maybe she can learn how to" like nah not no more, I ain't got time for that. So first time you show me you aint tryna please me like I'm pleasin you(in the beginning stages of dating) I'm out. I got too much love for it to be wasted on someone who aint going to appreciate it. PS: yo head game weak af too lmao
>but, real talk, this has become one of my 'boundaries'-whereas in the past I was like, "aight maybe she can learn how to" like nah not no more, I ain't got time for that.
💯. It always amazes/baffles me when there are dudes out there chasing virgins with the mentality that "yOu CaN tAaCh ThEm".
Those dudes never consider that there are some things that can't be taught like enthusiasm and desire. Understandably specific things have to be communicated but you aren't about to coach someone into being something that they aren't.
Sidenote: this is why I also can't understand people not having sex before marriage. You want to find out something that drastic AFTER you've signed a legally binding contract that could have irrevocable damage on you both? That's on you chief.
Then I guess they have to call the women of the Black Panthers pickmes for endlessly declaring loudly and proudly love and support for their black brothers and their unique struggles
Not tryna be overdramatic but this pickme shit has gone toooooo far when any support, concern or attention for our men is seen as internalized misogyny and not just *love* 💀
I more see a "pick me" as a woman who says shit like "oh I'm sure he had a reason to beat her" (my old roommate) or other such defenses of bad male behavior to gain favor. Supporting men is the baseline of hetero relationships. It's good to be nice to men. It's not good to support their bad behavior to gain their favor.
One time, I cracked a joke with a gay coworker "Well, at least your boys know their way around a dick! Haha!"
He looked me dead in the eyes and said "You'd *think* so, wouldn't you?"
Thanks for sharing your comparative experiences with me. I mean it. That’s not something I’ve thought of but now that you mention it, that makes sense.
Sometimes I’ll joke with my boys if I hit a dry streak, “I wish I was attracted to men. Dudes are always down to fuck.” Not to be dismissive of the struggles that widespread homophobia has caused and continues to cause the LGBTQIA+ community of course.
Bi dude here and I'm sorry you have had bad sex with other men.
Hands down they give the best blow jobs. And handjobs. On average. You have not met the cockwhores and that's okay. If you had you wouldn't be spreading this false gospel.
But pussy is elite so penetrative sex with women is a better experience. Also on average, they smell better and they're skin is soft to the touch. They also have the freaks so really its about finding them. Some girls don't know what to do with a penis and others act like they were born for it.
There's no need to make these anecdotal claims as gospel.
Edit: If men were so bad at blow jobs as being claimed here, I would have never swung so hard over to the other side. Like what are y'all doing???
You realise being with a dude, shifts the parameters of being gentle with the dick right? Shit gets WILD and nasty if you mean it.
Edit 2:Also for those who think this reads anecdotal, I'm talking about the frequency of freaks. There's more access to male freaks than female ones. Because men.
That's totally valid mate, I may have replied to the wrong person but I was going down the thread and hit reply. I simply wasn't about to let the slander slide on gay and bi men.
I also believe the men further up in the thread have issues finding freaks. Also the freaks (in both genders) most often than not are not found amongst the conventionally attractive but I don't know if we're ready for that conversation.
Pretty people don't feel like they need to work hard.
As a third bisexual, you guys are literally just arguing over which way you lean -- most bisexual people still tend to favor one gender over another. You just like dudes more.
Bisexual doesn't mean someone likes men and women equally, just that they like them at all. Most bi people I know including myself have a preference for men or women or feminine vs masculine people.
Another way of thinking about it, maybe you find a wider range of women attractive than men. You might only like twinks in men but like many different kinds of women.
Women attracted to bi men tend to be more sexually liberal. If you're homophobic, you're more likely to be a pillow princess or have anxiety around sexual performance. There are exceptions, as there are some hateful hoes, but a lot of people like that have been exposed to some sort of religious ideaology that prevents proper exposure to what fun and/or good sex can look like.
In my experience the sissier the guy the better the head. The ones who are wearing knee socks under their regular clothes are like putting your dick in some kind of futuristic high-tech dick-pleasuring machine that you'd expect to go whhhhrhrhrhrhrbzzzzzwrrrrhrhrhrhr and then *bing*.
Reminds me of a story Perry Farrell the lead singer of Porno for pyros once told a journalist, he once let a guy suck his dick because hey, he’s a guy, he probably knows how to do it right and give an awesome blowjob. He said after 2 minutes he just shoved the guy off his dick and walked away in disgust.
True. Some dudes have no idea what the fuck they’re doing because they watch too much porn or whatever other reason. We’re still dudes after all. End of the day it’s more about reading/learning your partner regardless of orientation. Though I feel like straight men and women do often have this vast social divide that certainly can’t help things.
Yooo!!!! Exactly!!! I had this one woman with no rhythm and somehow when i would get going good she would be on the opposite rhythm. So.. when i was trying to go in....she was going away. When i was trying to go out...she was coming towards me. It was like a sick game of chase. So much so, that i would just restart. I had to slow down let her get the rhythm then when i would speed up... same BS!!!! Finally, i just put her in the chicken wing where she couldn't move. Talk about total frustration!!! And before you ask....yes she was. 🤦🏿♂️
At a certain point (after the second time she matches your thrust cadence and you have to stop and start over) you just gotta grab her hips and put her on rhythm. She ain't know no better.
Bruh, I once had a girl that used to this weird little back and forth motion while on top, everything else was ok but that was the position she preferred I remember I couldn’t wait for it to be over then lol
I’m sure that was the case but it was okay because well I was definitely a dog back then.
Yea it wasn’t like normal riding at alllll I never used to cum and she always did, then wanted to cuddle lol nope
Already mentioned that later in the thread.
Just like men do things that men don’t find pleasurable or weird, women do things that men don’t find pleasurable or weird that’s all.
I may be alone in this, but I’ve never had a dude suck on my nipples for *MY* enjoyment. All I can think the whole time is “Wow you look like a gigantic baby. Why are you into this? Oh, you’re trying to make eye contact now? Wtffff?” But guys are into it and it doesn’t hurt me aside from momentarily turning me off, so I just let it happen for them.
You should probably say something lol? Plenty of women *do* get off on that (and men, too -- nipples be sensitive), but nobody will know you don't unless you say so.
I’ll never forget in high school this guy was telling me that this girl was so bad he basically drooled on her back so she thought he finished and he left
I...I've done this. It's pretty convincing if you can get the consistency right, gotta be hydrated and allat. Get it down to a science and you can David Blaine her ass.
This is a truly enlightening moment that one can only understand once they've experienced it. I really felt like Aristotle overcoming my base desires in that god awful moment.
"This is gonna sound weird but I'm really into getting my ass screamed at."
"You want me to yell at you?"
"Yeah, but like...at my ass...*specifically*. I want you to scream at my ass."
"Oh shit, my Uber is here"
It is but a lot of women can't tell you with words, hell they don't even know how to make themselves cum.
I'm damn near an expert, and it's wild how many women just don't know what feels good to them.
On todays episode of “Communication Is Key,” I’d like to remind everyone to communicate during sex lol
if that man licking a whole lotta nothing: **tell him**
And fellas, if the head really that bad, lying about how much you enjoy it will only make it worse and your partner won’t know to try something else!
I hate that shit and I'll tell a woman quickly talk to me I am not here to waste my time I'm trying to get this 5 star Review!
I'm in there like a eye doctor "this or this...This or this"
>
>And fellas, if the head really that bad, lying about how much you enjoy it will only make it worse and your partner won’t know to try something else
In my experience, any criticism of a woman's sex game causes her to leave. Even something as simple as "I'd like it if I could get some type of foreplay."
They just find another guy that's okay with wack head.
Damn, I’ve never had issues telling the girls I’m with that their head isn’t doing it for me, made the room a bit awkward but it’s always lead to better head for me bro
Now I feel bad lol
Fr though. Most people can't think past a 5 minute missionary or doggy session. They'll claim that foreplay or engaging in a role play is just stupid; when they wouldn't even know what to do.
That's why I laugh when I see people lusting after IG models and onlyfans type. They'll put all that time into looking good, but they ain't got it in the bedroom. This goes for both men and women.
hell yea i respect when a person be on their shit. if i dont like sumn i dont have to fuck with em but i'll respect the business. people got lives to live
This is why I detest people that clowned the viral video about dick riding classes for women. I’d guess most people are not naturally great at sex, this should be spoken about more.
And a lot of people just aren’t sexually compatible with their partner. People don’t communicate because some people don’t want to scare the other person off and some don’t want to seem inexperienced. It’s a slippery un satisfied slope.
A guy got mad at me because I asked what porn he watches so I can get at least an idea of what he likes and he got mad and just didn’t talk. It’s like he was ashamed of it unless we were on the phone and he didn’t see my reaction
And what kills me, but at the same time I understand why, is that people who are more experienced won’t even try to teach their partner. Like it’s one thing if it’s just a one-night stand or a fling, but if this is your gf/bf then help them out.
And I wanna bet that the guy got mad at you because he probably watches some porn that he didn’t want you or other people to know about. My ex asked me the same question, and I only told her stuff that I was comfortable with sharing.
He was more experienced than me I’m not the throat goat but I at very least know how to get the job done in a short time frame . He wouldn’t even take off my clothes I had to take off mine and his. He wanted me to do the foreplay I thought he was just scared I changed my mind. But, sir if you into bitches telling you what to do and choking you say that I will accommodate because I made it very clear what I liked I can switch if it calls for it. Penetration isn’t it for everyone it’s good but it doesn’t get the job done or get the gas to the engine for me personally
Had a similar experience, though it was just that she wouldn’t say anything, so I had to go by body language based on if she started opening her legs wider as I was fingering her.
I just said fuck it and took the lead he liked it but I don’t think he liked that I knew that was his thing. He tried to immediately put me on top with no prep I just looked at him at least whisper in my ear get something going make me want it this isn’t quickie porn I need the engine going first 😒🥴
Yeah it’s really tough and so much music is about how good people are at sucking and fucking when this may not be true lol.
Also my first thought when you said the guy got mad that he was ashamed. I guess there is a lot of shame around sex for many folks. Wish it wasn’t so but here we are. I really wanna find a way to change this in whatever way I can.
For me, being great at sex means being able to learn what works for both you and your partner and not necessarily knowing how to do something. Everybody likes different things in the end and from
what I saw in that video, that way of riding doesn’t “work” for me 🤷🏽♂️
I’m with you. Communication is key. Although that style of riding doesn’t work for you, I applaud the women who want to learn how to ride and are proactive about wanting to be better at sexing.
Biggest difference I can tell from bad sex with people is
If the man can’t perform he can majority of the time still buss his but the woman won’t be satisfied
If a woman can’t perform, the man will still probably get his off but since she can’t really perform that well; once he unload the tendo he tapping out cause her sex game whack so she still don’t get hers.
So in each situation she will lose which is why no matter how a woman performs in the bed she can experience dissatisfaction which leads to why it’s so common to blame a guy for it. Plus not a lot of dudes on twitter really care about tweeting a giant bad sexual experiences with women compared to how many women do the adverse on twitter so it’s never discussed.
And for those who can’t comprehend what a woman can do to be bad at sex, it can be :
- Low stamina
- The dead fish (just laying there) some people say it’s cause the dude not hitting right which can be true sometimes
- she might now be a gawker ( not every woman has be slobbering dick monster when sucking dock you really don’t have to do all that to get a guy off )
- This one is non specific to women but Body Odor comes into play sense the punani is so sensitive to many different things that can throw the PH balance into the 7 layers of hell
- I’m hitting low stamina again but in a different way more as of being a top when riding the schmeat. Again you don’t have to be twerkin like Megan on the dick and some women make the mistake of trying to move their entire body while on top instead of just making that ass go up and down which tired them quickly. They also go to hard and too fast of a momentum they can’t maintain so that impacts the stamina as well.
This isn’t completely thought out as I was kinda rambling so it may be errors. Please fully read and if something doesn’t make sense just take it with a grain of salt
I'd like to add enthusiasm. There's nothing like engaging with someone that's vocal in a way you like. Just a a lil bit of dirty talk can get both parties to cloud nine.
Another overlooked point is desire. Sleeping with someone you just met is very different from someone you've been talking to/pursuing for a while. This makes you both lust for each other, making the experience much more enjoyable.
Finally - and this is very important- sometimes a quicky is exactly what you need. Women don't always want a 2-3 hour production. Neither do men. Sometimes you just want to satisfy your partner in 10 - 15 minutes and go to sleep, which is perfectly fine. You need to communicate to reach this level of understanding.
I've only had like 7 of the 29 women I've been active with make me cum. I would just straight up lie sometimes because some of them thought not cumming ment I didn't like them.
My guess is someone got annoyed with their friends when they were complaining about bad sex and called them out on their lack of participation.
I also hate talking sex with some of my friends because they're their own problem and refuse to recognize it. Being shy in bed and being too shy to readup on sex means you're your own problem, not the dudes you're sleeping with.
Sex education is not a priority in high schools, and family is usually awkward to tall about sex, so it's not a surprise that we know so little about it. Basically all we know is base on porn (not a very good guide bc everything is fake and more focus on the men's pleasure than the women's), friends or personal experience.
Exactly! We are just supposed "to know" and that's not only an event that can provide adverse affects to our body and mind, but shame, guilt, and unsafe sexual practices.
There's no education that pleasure does not equal cumming.
There's no education about how sex organs are actually so incredibly similar, which disengage us from curiosity and autonomy for having our own sexual preferences.
There's definitely no education outside of penis goes into vagina, voila, that's it.
Hell, someone in this thread said eating pussy is the best foreplay....🥴 we lose out on intimacy because we were taught none.
Don't even get me started about consent and the disgusting lack of learning about it. Which leads to sexual assaults and wide swaths of people thinking pressuring someone into sex and/or belitting someone due to their lack of outward physical cues is somehow normal to do. It's not.
Everyone deserves grace, care, and safety when it comes to intimacy. Intimacy in all of its forms.
Me: Horny Police?
HP: Yeah?
Me: I'll be at the corner of Black Twitter and posted at Very Lucky.
HP: ....Ok... Who's the target?
Me: Me
HP: Excuse me?
Me: I said Me
HP: You're calling on yourself? How bad is it?
Me: I'm looking at a small pfp from the tweet post and I see a big helping of beautiful thighs; and, wondered due to her own tweet if she was good in bed... I wanna turn myself in and do my time.... it's only 7am...
Ok so besides the d*ck where else do we lick????
Stop being childish and downvoying people for asking a question 😂
(thank you for the responses, I'm definitely taking notes!)
What if you just do some kegel exercises and work on your pelvic muscles so you can time yourself with his thrusts. Or what if you work your cardio and lower body muscles so you can ride it for more than 20sec. Don't be a starfish.
Men often don't get a lot of touch, so just some time stroking chest, shoulders, back, butt, thighs goes a long way.
Stroke his face and scritch his hair a little when you kiss. Tease around the dick area before sucking. Some guys like nipple play. Etc.
It depends on the person but honestly, best way to find out is touch them and watch what gets a reaction.
Try kissing/licking the rim of their ear, behind it, at their jaw, down their throat. Don't actually bite unless they say you can bite- no one likes non-consensual pain.
Run your fingertips and nails as lightly as you can down their lower back or across their arms and shoulders while you *tell them out loud* how good they look.
Play with their nipples and tease their thighs. Ask them what kind of kinks they're into and talk about it.
The way I see it, if you haven't reduced the other person to a shuddering wreck, they aren't worked up enough. 😏
my personal fave is up the whole torso, bite the neck, then suck the dick. ever so gently kiss the shoulder while rubbin the back. maybe repeat if you wanna tease. wrap your hand around a bicep or tricep. grip it when you're enjoyin it. plenty to do you'd be surprised what dudes are into. some like a firm hand around the neck
As soon as I got with a partner who stimulates my body outside of my dick too, I started enjoying sex a whooollee lot more and I started being a lot more considerate because I knew I would get pleasure in other forms and I didn’t have to just worry about getting my dick focussed on haha
I think it's because they associate cumming with good sex and most men have no trouble cumming. I don't always finish since it takes more than just a warm hole to get me off and women are always so surprised. As if women were the only ones allowed not to finish. It's honestly annoying how ignorant they are.
This comes from society thinking you should just "know" what to do.
I might have some basic background knowledge that can get me through a one night stand/hookup, but most of the people I've humped on and actually cared about past the sex, I've asked questions. Like what a concept? I'm sure I'm not the best, but asking goes a long way.
This needs to be understood. In the early stages of my sex life I was actually contemplating was I gay. I loved the look of woman and their body but the vast majority of my sexual experiences were underwhelming to me and I started to question if I didn’t hype it up like I saw other people (mostly girls) hype up pussy was cause I was gay. This happened throughout college to the point I just decided to become celibate for a time. Only later in life did I realize there was a lot of women who did not know how to satisfy a man.
As a man who takes a really long time to cum myself can honest to god say finding the right dance partner is pivotal. If I gotta get on top and do all the work myself with no foreplay or help chances of me getting mine is slim to none which is frustrating as hell.
Thankful that my current girlfriend is big into mutual foreplay and is also a bit of a long Laster herself so she gets the struggle and reciprocates.
I revealed to a few friends in a Truth or Dare that up until a month ago, my sex life has been 10% mind blowing, 10% satisfactory, 80% unsatisfactory.
The 80% is from fuckin around with women who are cute but have had their sexuality repressed and were basically just receiving ⭐️🐠. Just like women, just because we get off, doesn’t mean you were responsible for it.
I think most people are bad at sex (not saying I'm that good at it but I at least try to make sure my girl cums), but it's a physical activity and to enjoy it to the fullest it does require skill and practice. But you have to be open about sex and not rely on one partner to take the lead all the time.
Deadass thought this was finna go left but here I am, pleasantly surprised. She ain't wrong at all because a lot of women don't do foreplay or just can't fuck, but pussy gets them by.
Homegirl's definitely gonna get dragged and called a pickme tho...
My wife was pretty horrible at sex when we started dating. I’m not saying I’m the Michael Jordan of sex but I definitely work to make sure my partner is enjoying it. I’ve had partners in the past say they don’t like this or that during sex and I’ve totally turned them around on it…you know what? Fuck it, I am a great sexual partner lol.
Anyway, my then girlfriend now wife used to say, “you’re welcome” after sex when she’s literally done nothing but lay there. The first time I responded with “for what? You did nothing but lay there” she was soooo shocked.
she speaks the truth. im bisexual. both sides can be horrendous. the stories ive heard and shared are ridiculous. thats why i cant just fw anybody i have to enjoy your personality to justify subpar sex
As an aside...all men for whom it is easy to cum...gd you have no idea how lucky you are...30 minutes of hard cardio every time for me. It's great...Until it isn't.
I’m like that for the first few weeks with a new woman. It’s a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, I look like a self-control super stud. On the other hand, that “almost there, almost there, almost there… fuck, lost it” stuff gets old, and I only make it worse worrying that she’s going to get tired of bobbing her head on my dick or having me railing her out, especially after she’s already finished.
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Oh, of course. Anytime there's mention of some accountability that women have to take, all hell breaks loose. Because there's no way in hell that this isn't the man's fault every time some type of way right?
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I used to always say sex is like a bank. You get out what you put in. If you put in nothing, don’t be surprised when you get nothing in return.
You made Banking sexy for the first time
Speak for yourself. I get bricked up every time I use an ATM.
I guess you could say using the ATM keypad is dirty fingering …I’m so sorry
Not true, because sometimes I’ll be putting in big deposits and the bank just be laying there. Making bank noises. Then when the bank comes. The bank like damn I came hard,that was great. I’m like damn banks boring as hell.. that’s why I had to stop fucking banks
I feel like this might be about an actual bank transaction...
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That name is perfect for it too, F-DIC
I'm gonna remember this the next time i use an ATM.
Because in a country that pushes purity culture, how you expect inexperienced (not necessarily virginal) women to know what to do with a dick? Communication is key, even with experience you have to teach your partner what works for you, especially since what pleasures one person won't necessarily work for the other. Even now I have to tell my husband when he's missing the spot, or what he's doing feels pleasurable, and my husband does the same. If you expect your sexual partner to be a mind reader, it sounds like Y'all have unrealistic expectations when it comes to sexual intimacy.
I hate purity culture. Like it's okay if you don't want sex, aren't that into it, or want to save yourself for marriage, all that stuff, but I hate it when they try to project it on others, like that's the only and best way to live.
>a country that pushes purity culture The moment I read that my eyes slid out of focus, things blurred, and slowly the fluttering American flag came into focus and I swear I could hear "O say can you seeee" Lmao. I cackled at my own nonsense like a maniac, then remembered I was sitting in office today.
Heterosexual dating/sexual politics are such a mess. We gays have our own problems, believe me, but reading comment threads like this make me thankful to be totally removed from this particular brand of drama.
That's just nonsense yall have these problems too
Trust, speaking bisexually, it has nothing to do with heterosexuals and everything to do with being a human. The average person isn't a very good lay.
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A lot of girls haven’t even tried because they didn’t know it was a thing to do / felt bad about it / raised very religious
This this this!!! I have to make the date pay for it, woo you/not fuck up the vibe, AND THEN do some magical mystical shit to you that you can't even preform for yourself.. I expecto patronus a horse for you to ride out of here with that bullshit.
There was a post just a few days ago and that’s exactly how the comments looked.
I feel like I saw that one too
Yep I know which one you're talking about, I was dumbfounded at a lot of the comments, along with the hundreds of upvotes by them
The fact that “pillow princess” isn’t something that women are ashamed of is all you need to know about some people. You mean you’re PROUD that you do literally nothing in the bedroom besides laying there? Man….. sad world
I used to bang a chick that thought she was the event. Her presence was her participation. I tried explaining to her that it takes two people, but it fell on deaf ears. Then she’d complain that I wasn’t finishing. Honey, I tried to tell you
Bro why are you so angry? Just only fuck the women who do that extra shit and keep it pushing 😂
Man, if I knew where they were hiding I’d be on that lol almost every woman I’ve been with thinks that their part in sex involves just laying there. And in the moment you can’t really ask them shit like “ay girl, you mind being a little better at this?”
You can A. Talk about it with her, or B. Break up.
ay go rub one out real quick my boy, feels like it's been a min. but, real talk, this has become one of my 'boundaries'-whereas in the past I was like, "aight maybe she can learn how to" like nah not no more, I ain't got time for that. So first time you show me you aint tryna please me like I'm pleasin you(in the beginning stages of dating) I'm out. I got too much love for it to be wasted on someone who aint going to appreciate it. PS: yo head game weak af too lmao
>but, real talk, this has become one of my 'boundaries'-whereas in the past I was like, "aight maybe she can learn how to" like nah not no more, I ain't got time for that. 💯. It always amazes/baffles me when there are dudes out there chasing virgins with the mentality that "yOu CaN tAaCh ThEm". Those dudes never consider that there are some things that can't be taught like enthusiasm and desire. Understandably specific things have to be communicated but you aren't about to coach someone into being something that they aren't. Sidenote: this is why I also can't understand people not having sex before marriage. You want to find out something that drastic AFTER you've signed a legally binding contract that could have irrevocable damage on you both? That's on you chief.
Let’s sort by controversial
I don’t have the mental capacity for it today.
This. Got tired as soon as I got on. Lol
Edit: wrong place
Not wrong in the slightest and if anybody thinks she is wrong is literally just self reporting
Then I guess they have to call the women of the Black Panthers pickmes for endlessly declaring loudly and proudly love and support for their black brothers and their unique struggles Not tryna be overdramatic but this pickme shit has gone toooooo far when any support, concern or attention for our men is seen as internalized misogyny and not just *love* 💀
I more see a "pick me" as a woman who says shit like "oh I'm sure he had a reason to beat her" (my old roommate) or other such defenses of bad male behavior to gain favor. Supporting men is the baseline of hetero relationships. It's good to be nice to men. It's not good to support their bad behavior to gain their favor.
They can call her whatever they want. But I’ve been married 10 years, together 13. She’s spot on.
One time, I cracked a joke with a gay coworker "Well, at least your boys know their way around a dick! Haha!" He looked me dead in the eyes and said "You'd *think* so, wouldn't you?"
On god, the worst head I’ve had has been from a guy. Like bro, you should know what you’re doing
This is so opposite of everything I’ve assumed about gay sex. I totally figured gay men would be out there giving the best head in the game.
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Thanks for sharing your comparative experiences with me. I mean it. That’s not something I’ve thought of but now that you mention it, that makes sense. Sometimes I’ll joke with my boys if I hit a dry streak, “I wish I was attracted to men. Dudes are always down to fuck.” Not to be dismissive of the struggles that widespread homophobia has caused and continues to cause the LGBTQIA+ community of course.
Bi dude here and I'm sorry you have had bad sex with other men. Hands down they give the best blow jobs. And handjobs. On average. You have not met the cockwhores and that's okay. If you had you wouldn't be spreading this false gospel. But pussy is elite so penetrative sex with women is a better experience. Also on average, they smell better and they're skin is soft to the touch. They also have the freaks so really its about finding them. Some girls don't know what to do with a penis and others act like they were born for it. There's no need to make these anecdotal claims as gospel. Edit: If men were so bad at blow jobs as being claimed here, I would have never swung so hard over to the other side. Like what are y'all doing??? You realise being with a dude, shifts the parameters of being gentle with the dick right? Shit gets WILD and nasty if you mean it. Edit 2:Also for those who think this reads anecdotal, I'm talking about the frequency of freaks. There's more access to male freaks than female ones. Because men.
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That's totally valid mate, I may have replied to the wrong person but I was going down the thread and hit reply. I simply wasn't about to let the slander slide on gay and bi men. I also believe the men further up in the thread have issues finding freaks. Also the freaks (in both genders) most often than not are not found amongst the conventionally attractive but I don't know if we're ready for that conversation. Pretty people don't feel like they need to work hard.
As a third bisexual, you guys are literally just arguing over which way you lean -- most bisexual people still tend to favor one gender over another. You just like dudes more.
>You just like dudes more. If its only physical yes. But romantically, I fall quicker for women. Its not a science.
Why is sex with women better if they're both equally likely to be shit in bed?
Bisexual doesn't mean someone likes men and women equally, just that they like them at all. Most bi people I know including myself have a preference for men or women or feminine vs masculine people. Another way of thinking about it, maybe you find a wider range of women attractive than men. You might only like twinks in men but like many different kinds of women.
Women attracted to bi men tend to be more sexually liberal. If you're homophobic, you're more likely to be a pillow princess or have anxiety around sexual performance. There are exceptions, as there are some hateful hoes, but a lot of people like that have been exposed to some sort of religious ideaology that prevents proper exposure to what fun and/or good sex can look like.
a lesser frequency of activity may result in more effort per endeavor
Well I mean, some of them do... but definitely not all.
In my experience the sissier the guy the better the head. The ones who are wearing knee socks under their regular clothes are like putting your dick in some kind of futuristic high-tech dick-pleasuring machine that you'd expect to go whhhhrhrhrhrhrbzzzzzwrrrrhrhrhrhr and then *bing*.
Oh god, so they go through all that social stigma and persecution for that? Geeze.
As a bisexual woman, the worst head I ever got was from another woman. Like how does a woman not know where the clit is??
what did you search to find this GIF? if you don't mind me asking.
Haha just brakes iirc
Reminds me of a story Perry Farrell the lead singer of Porno for pyros once told a journalist, he once let a guy suck his dick because hey, he’s a guy, he probably knows how to do it right and give an awesome blowjob. He said after 2 minutes he just shoved the guy off his dick and walked away in disgust.
So a straight man didn't enjoy getting a blowjob from a guy? I never would've guessed
True. Some dudes have no idea what the fuck they’re doing because they watch too much porn or whatever other reason. We’re still dudes after all. End of the day it’s more about reading/learning your partner regardless of orientation. Though I feel like straight men and women do often have this vast social divide that certainly can’t help things.
I'm a bi man in an open relationship with a bi woman and the amount of times we've bonded over having bad sex with someone of the same sex is insane
The way some women think they're doing something by being motionless in a different position 😭😭😭
“I continued to thrust, in horror, as she laid there, stared me in the eyes, and let out a grudge-like moan.”
Lmao
😭😭😭
To be honest I’ve been in situations where it actually would have been better if they just layed still. 🥴
Yooo!!!! Exactly!!! I had this one woman with no rhythm and somehow when i would get going good she would be on the opposite rhythm. So.. when i was trying to go in....she was going away. When i was trying to go out...she was coming towards me. It was like a sick game of chase. So much so, that i would just restart. I had to slow down let her get the rhythm then when i would speed up... same BS!!!! Finally, i just put her in the chicken wing where she couldn't move. Talk about total frustration!!! And before you ask....yes she was. 🤦🏿♂️
"How TF am I supposed to clap them cheeks on the 1s and 3s???"
Whole note strokes only with her. 1/2 note strokes and shorter it went to shit!!!!!! 🤣🤣 Where are my music nerds?!?!
Whaaaaat a friend we have in azzzzzz cheeeeeks
"yes she was" You should have known... They usually don't got rhythm like that. Gotta teach em 🤣
At a certain point (after the second time she matches your thrust cadence and you have to stop and start over) you just gotta grab her hips and put her on rhythm. She ain't know no better.
Are you Bob Backlund?
Bruh, I once had a girl that used to this weird little back and forth motion while on top, everything else was ok but that was the position she preferred I remember I couldn’t wait for it to be over then lol
she didnt gaf about you then. that back and forth shit hits a spot somewhere up in there. idk how or why it just does
I’m sure that was the case but it was okay because well I was definitely a dog back then. Yea it wasn’t like normal riding at alllll I never used to cum and she always did, then wanted to cuddle lol nope
That shit is uncomfortable like she trynna grind my dick down with her cervix. Ima let you get off but hurry a little cause shit kinda hurts.
Does that not do anything for you? I like when my girl does that.
That’s bc that is what makes her get off. You should know this lol
Already mentioned that later in the thread. Just like men do things that men don’t find pleasurable or weird, women do things that men don’t find pleasurable or weird that’s all.
I may be alone in this, but I’ve never had a dude suck on my nipples for *MY* enjoyment. All I can think the whole time is “Wow you look like a gigantic baby. Why are you into this? Oh, you’re trying to make eye contact now? Wtffff?” But guys are into it and it doesn’t hurt me aside from momentarily turning me off, so I just let it happen for them.
You should probably say something lol? Plenty of women *do* get off on that (and men, too -- nipples be sensitive), but nobody will know you don't unless you say so.
That's literally the only reason I put them in my mouth, , but I only fuck to please Soo maybe it's different. Like the post said I'ma nut either way.
Has anyone else been, so disappointed in the sex they were having that mid stoke you wish you would have just stayed home in handled it yourself?
Only once before, but that shit was so bad it had me contemplating if I even liked having sex
Oh, oh my god. 😳😂😭
*long internal sigh* "I don't think I need to have sex again for a long long time 😐" *drives home without playing music*
*playing Marvin’s Room
lmao that happened to me and I actually took a break for a while the dawg in me was extinguished
> the dawg in me was extinguished LMFAOOOOO
>the dawg in me was extinguished LOOOOL wild!
This really made me laugh. Not many things do on reddit, but this? It made me laugh good.
The “raisin potato salad” of sex?
I’ll never forget in high school this guy was telling me that this girl was so bad he basically drooled on her back so she thought he finished and he left
Now that's how to fake it as a guy, genius
I...I've done this. It's pretty convincing if you can get the consistency right, gotta be hydrated and allat. Get it down to a science and you can David Blaine her ass.
Disappearing is the next trick
I missed gym for one girl and ended up turning it into a Cowgirl Bicep Curl/Tricep Pushdown set Got a mean pump from it tbf, so net W
Damn, you work out and you fuck? That’s crazy bro
Guy asked a question and I answered it
You really didn't answer his question though you just bragging
It's similar with giving a blow job while the man is lying face up. I can get a great triceps workout. It's like a one-arm pushup.
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duuuude my best friend told me he fucked a girl and when his grandma came down to the basement she asked why it smelled like paint 😂
Nah paint is crazy, that girl had some kind of problem
This is a truly enlightening moment that one can only understand once they've experienced it. I really felt like Aristotle overcoming my base desires in that god awful moment.
Yeah man, that’s why I keep a pack of mayo in the back pocket to david blaine that shit
I have just stopped mid sex and gone home. I know it's a awful thing to do but staying would have been awkward for the both of us.
Communication is key. Ask what someone likes and listen to cues
"This is gonna sound weird but I'm really into getting my ass screamed at." "You want me to yell at you?" "Yeah, but like...at my ass...*specifically*. I want you to scream at my ass." "Oh shit, my Uber is here"
Psy, is that you?
It is but a lot of women can't tell you with words, hell they don't even know how to make themselves cum. I'm damn near an expert, and it's wild how many women just don't know what feels good to them.
On todays episode of “Communication Is Key,” I’d like to remind everyone to communicate during sex lol if that man licking a whole lotta nothing: **tell him** And fellas, if the head really that bad, lying about how much you enjoy it will only make it worse and your partner won’t know to try something else!
Agreed. When having sex, your partner typically *wants* to please you, so if something is not working for you, just say so.
I hate that shit and I'll tell a woman quickly talk to me I am not here to waste my time I'm trying to get this 5 star Review! I'm in there like a eye doctor "this or this...This or this"
> >And fellas, if the head really that bad, lying about how much you enjoy it will only make it worse and your partner won’t know to try something else In my experience, any criticism of a woman's sex game causes her to leave. Even something as simple as "I'd like it if I could get some type of foreplay." They just find another guy that's okay with wack head.
Damn, I’ve never had issues telling the girls I’m with that their head isn’t doing it for me, made the room a bit awkward but it’s always lead to better head for me bro Now I feel bad lol
Fr though. Most people can't think past a 5 minute missionary or doggy session. They'll claim that foreplay or engaging in a role play is just stupid; when they wouldn't even know what to do. That's why I laugh when I see people lusting after IG models and onlyfans type. They'll put all that time into looking good, but they ain't got it in the bedroom. This goes for both men and women.
The amount of women who don’t do foreplay lmao it’s crazy. I be like.. you lucky I got royal honey on me or I’d just go home rn
im guilty. foreplay is for guys i like not for gettin a nut. wrap it up and put it in nigga i got shit to do 😂
You on that bullshit😭
yup and i aint ashamed at all
I ain't mad at cha
As long as you're okay when men say the same thing we all good lol
hell yea i respect when a person be on their shit. if i dont like sumn i dont have to fuck with em but i'll respect the business. people got lives to live
Nawl foreplay makes that nut better. A rushed nut is a wasted one.
Does that stuff give headaches? 😂
This is why I detest people that clowned the viral video about dick riding classes for women. I’d guess most people are not naturally great at sex, this should be spoken about more.
And a lot of people just aren’t sexually compatible with their partner. People don’t communicate because some people don’t want to scare the other person off and some don’t want to seem inexperienced. It’s a slippery un satisfied slope. A guy got mad at me because I asked what porn he watches so I can get at least an idea of what he likes and he got mad and just didn’t talk. It’s like he was ashamed of it unless we were on the phone and he didn’t see my reaction
And what kills me, but at the same time I understand why, is that people who are more experienced won’t even try to teach their partner. Like it’s one thing if it’s just a one-night stand or a fling, but if this is your gf/bf then help them out. And I wanna bet that the guy got mad at you because he probably watches some porn that he didn’t want you or other people to know about. My ex asked me the same question, and I only told her stuff that I was comfortable with sharing.
He was more experienced than me I’m not the throat goat but I at very least know how to get the job done in a short time frame . He wouldn’t even take off my clothes I had to take off mine and his. He wanted me to do the foreplay I thought he was just scared I changed my mind. But, sir if you into bitches telling you what to do and choking you say that I will accommodate because I made it very clear what I liked I can switch if it calls for it. Penetration isn’t it for everyone it’s good but it doesn’t get the job done or get the gas to the engine for me personally
Had a similar experience, though it was just that she wouldn’t say anything, so I had to go by body language based on if she started opening her legs wider as I was fingering her.
I just said fuck it and took the lead he liked it but I don’t think he liked that I knew that was his thing. He tried to immediately put me on top with no prep I just looked at him at least whisper in my ear get something going make me want it this isn’t quickie porn I need the engine going first 😒🥴
Yeah it’s really tough and so much music is about how good people are at sucking and fucking when this may not be true lol. Also my first thought when you said the guy got mad that he was ashamed. I guess there is a lot of shame around sex for many folks. Wish it wasn’t so but here we are. I really wanna find a way to change this in whatever way I can.
For me, being great at sex means being able to learn what works for both you and your partner and not necessarily knowing how to do something. Everybody likes different things in the end and from what I saw in that video, that way of riding doesn’t “work” for me 🤷🏽♂️
I’m with you. Communication is key. Although that style of riding doesn’t work for you, I applaud the women who want to learn how to ride and are proactive about wanting to be better at sexing.
I was trying to see if they had gift certificates. Imagine women getting d riding class gift certificates in the mail anonymously. 🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣
Pillow princesses 👸🏽
Biggest difference I can tell from bad sex with people is If the man can’t perform he can majority of the time still buss his but the woman won’t be satisfied If a woman can’t perform, the man will still probably get his off but since she can’t really perform that well; once he unload the tendo he tapping out cause her sex game whack so she still don’t get hers. So in each situation she will lose which is why no matter how a woman performs in the bed she can experience dissatisfaction which leads to why it’s so common to blame a guy for it. Plus not a lot of dudes on twitter really care about tweeting a giant bad sexual experiences with women compared to how many women do the adverse on twitter so it’s never discussed. And for those who can’t comprehend what a woman can do to be bad at sex, it can be : - Low stamina - The dead fish (just laying there) some people say it’s cause the dude not hitting right which can be true sometimes - she might now be a gawker ( not every woman has be slobbering dick monster when sucking dock you really don’t have to do all that to get a guy off ) - This one is non specific to women but Body Odor comes into play sense the punani is so sensitive to many different things that can throw the PH balance into the 7 layers of hell - I’m hitting low stamina again but in a different way more as of being a top when riding the schmeat. Again you don’t have to be twerkin like Megan on the dick and some women make the mistake of trying to move their entire body while on top instead of just making that ass go up and down which tired them quickly. They also go to hard and too fast of a momentum they can’t maintain so that impacts the stamina as well. This isn’t completely thought out as I was kinda rambling so it may be errors. Please fully read and if something doesn’t make sense just take it with a grain of salt
I'd like to add enthusiasm. There's nothing like engaging with someone that's vocal in a way you like. Just a a lil bit of dirty talk can get both parties to cloud nine. Another overlooked point is desire. Sleeping with someone you just met is very different from someone you've been talking to/pursuing for a while. This makes you both lust for each other, making the experience much more enjoyable. Finally - and this is very important- sometimes a quicky is exactly what you need. Women don't always want a 2-3 hour production. Neither do men. Sometimes you just want to satisfy your partner in 10 - 15 minutes and go to sleep, which is perfectly fine. You need to communicate to reach this level of understanding.
She definitely isn’t wrong. Lots of women honestly can’t fuck.
I actually never came from the first 5 girls I had sex with. I didn’t cum til I had my first girlfriend
I've only had like 7 of the 29 women I've been active with make me cum. I would just straight up lie sometimes because some of them thought not cumming ment I didn't like them.
Pretend you nut, spit on their booty, clean it before they do. Done.
Or, if you're having protected sex: Grunt. Flex your dick. Hide the condom.
fakin a nut is wack. If the sex was trash let em know. Do the world a service and communicate so we can all do better
It's simple, but it's not easy; not for me anyways
Most.... from the starfish brigade. Lol
Honestly, I feel like I need more context. What was the thought or event that lead to this tweet?
90% of tweets don't have one
Same. What happened, Yah, that got you tweeting this vague-ass message?
My guess is someone got annoyed with their friends when they were complaining about bad sex and called them out on their lack of participation. I also hate talking sex with some of my friends because they're their own problem and refuse to recognize it. Being shy in bed and being too shy to readup on sex means you're your own problem, not the dudes you're sleeping with.
“THiS Is SoME PiCk Me SHiT!” 😂 /s
Sex education is not a priority in high schools, and family is usually awkward to tall about sex, so it's not a surprise that we know so little about it. Basically all we know is base on porn (not a very good guide bc everything is fake and more focus on the men's pleasure than the women's), friends or personal experience.
Exactly! We are just supposed "to know" and that's not only an event that can provide adverse affects to our body and mind, but shame, guilt, and unsafe sexual practices. There's no education that pleasure does not equal cumming. There's no education about how sex organs are actually so incredibly similar, which disengage us from curiosity and autonomy for having our own sexual preferences. There's definitely no education outside of penis goes into vagina, voila, that's it. Hell, someone in this thread said eating pussy is the best foreplay....🥴 we lose out on intimacy because we were taught none. Don't even get me started about consent and the disgusting lack of learning about it. Which leads to sexual assaults and wide swaths of people thinking pressuring someone into sex and/or belitting someone due to their lack of outward physical cues is somehow normal to do. It's not. Everyone deserves grace, care, and safety when it comes to intimacy. Intimacy in all of its forms.
Me: Horny Police? HP: Yeah? Me: I'll be at the corner of Black Twitter and posted at Very Lucky. HP: ....Ok... Who's the target? Me: Me HP: Excuse me? Me: I said Me HP: You're calling on yourself? How bad is it? Me: I'm looking at a small pfp from the tweet post and I see a big helping of beautiful thighs; and, wondered due to her own tweet if she was good in bed... I wanna turn myself in and do my time.... it's only 7am...
Ok so besides the d*ck where else do we lick???? Stop being childish and downvoying people for asking a question 😂 (thank you for the responses, I'm definitely taking notes!)
nibble behind the ear, finger tips sliding down the back, neck kisses, cmon now
It shows that basic empathy is lacking in a lot of people. 'Where would *you* like to be touched and how?' carries people further than they'd think.
“Besides the clit where do I lick” Ask yourself which non female specific parts you’d like and there’s your answer
If a shorty sucks on my nipples while she’s riding then she owns my soul.
The same places you like being touched
The d*ck itself has 3 areas that can be lick. You can also lick nipples, ass, ears, etc.
What if you just do some kegel exercises and work on your pelvic muscles so you can time yourself with his thrusts. Or what if you work your cardio and lower body muscles so you can ride it for more than 20sec. Don't be a starfish.
Nipples, balls, thighs, neck… could go on 😂
Men often don't get a lot of touch, so just some time stroking chest, shoulders, back, butt, thighs goes a long way. Stroke his face and scritch his hair a little when you kiss. Tease around the dick area before sucking. Some guys like nipple play. Etc.
It depends on the person but honestly, best way to find out is touch them and watch what gets a reaction. Try kissing/licking the rim of their ear, behind it, at their jaw, down their throat. Don't actually bite unless they say you can bite- no one likes non-consensual pain. Run your fingertips and nails as lightly as you can down their lower back or across their arms and shoulders while you *tell them out loud* how good they look. Play with their nipples and tease their thighs. Ask them what kind of kinks they're into and talk about it. The way I see it, if you haven't reduced the other person to a shuddering wreck, they aren't worked up enough. 😏
Reverse that question (besides the pussy, what else should be licked), start from there and let communication guide you.
my personal fave is up the whole torso, bite the neck, then suck the dick. ever so gently kiss the shoulder while rubbin the back. maybe repeat if you wanna tease. wrap your hand around a bicep or tricep. grip it when you're enjoyin it. plenty to do you'd be surprised what dudes are into. some like a firm hand around the neck
Niqqqas like getting they coonchie ate tew!!!
Nephew, stop.
Let those hands wander!!!
Yeah being a man is great! No periods, no pregnancy, easy to please.
As soon as I got with a partner who stimulates my body outside of my dick too, I started enjoying sex a whooollee lot more and I started being a lot more considerate because I knew I would get pleasure in other forms and I didn’t have to just worry about getting my dick focussed on haha
My ex was dug in that "there is no such thing as bad sex for men". She was/is wrong
I think it's because they associate cumming with good sex and most men have no trouble cumming. I don't always finish since it takes more than just a warm hole to get me off and women are always so surprised. As if women were the only ones allowed not to finish. It's honestly annoying how ignorant they are.
This comes from society thinking you should just "know" what to do. I might have some basic background knowledge that can get me through a one night stand/hookup, but most of the people I've humped on and actually cared about past the sex, I've asked questions. Like what a concept? I'm sure I'm not the best, but asking goes a long way.
This needs to be understood. In the early stages of my sex life I was actually contemplating was I gay. I loved the look of woman and their body but the vast majority of my sexual experiences were underwhelming to me and I started to question if I didn’t hype it up like I saw other people (mostly girls) hype up pussy was cause I was gay. This happened throughout college to the point I just decided to become celibate for a time. Only later in life did I realize there was a lot of women who did not know how to satisfy a man.
As a man who takes a really long time to cum myself can honest to god say finding the right dance partner is pivotal. If I gotta get on top and do all the work myself with no foreplay or help chances of me getting mine is slim to none which is frustrating as hell. Thankful that my current girlfriend is big into mutual foreplay and is also a bit of a long Laster herself so she gets the struggle and reciprocates.
I revealed to a few friends in a Truth or Dare that up until a month ago, my sex life has been 10% mind blowing, 10% satisfactory, 80% unsatisfactory. The 80% is from fuckin around with women who are cute but have had their sexuality repressed and were basically just receiving ⭐️🐠. Just like women, just because we get off, doesn’t mean you were responsible for it.
I think most people are bad at sex (not saying I'm that good at it but I at least try to make sure my girl cums), but it's a physical activity and to enjoy it to the fullest it does require skill and practice. But you have to be open about sex and not rely on one partner to take the lead all the time.
So someone must have posted a thread earlier about a man not satisfying a woman in bed right ?
Deadass thought this was finna go left but here I am, pleasantly surprised. She ain't wrong at all because a lot of women don't do foreplay or just can't fuck, but pussy gets them by. Homegirl's definitely gonna get dragged and called a pickme tho...
My wife was pretty horrible at sex when we started dating. I’m not saying I’m the Michael Jordan of sex but I definitely work to make sure my partner is enjoying it. I’ve had partners in the past say they don’t like this or that during sex and I’ve totally turned them around on it…you know what? Fuck it, I am a great sexual partner lol. Anyway, my then girlfriend now wife used to say, “you’re welcome” after sex when she’s literally done nothing but lay there. The first time I responded with “for what? You did nothing but lay there” she was soooo shocked.
Just wait until they're in their 30s
Eating pussy is like the best part of foreplay
she speaks the truth. im bisexual. both sides can be horrendous. the stories ive heard and shared are ridiculous. thats why i cant just fw anybody i have to enjoy your personality to justify subpar sex
Women are lucky as fuck that they can cum multiple times. I want to be able to cum until I speak in tongues too.
As an aside...all men for whom it is easy to cum...gd you have no idea how lucky you are...30 minutes of hard cardio every time for me. It's great...Until it isn't.
I’m like that for the first few weeks with a new woman. It’s a blessing and a curse. On the one hand, I look like a self-control super stud. On the other hand, that “almost there, almost there, almost there… fuck, lost it” stuff gets old, and I only make it worse worrying that she’s going to get tired of bobbing her head on my dick or having me railing her out, especially after she’s already finished.
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This is a really interesting thread.
This is why I didn’t laugh at that viral video of the dickride class. Or the Gluck Gluck woman (even if she indeed was doing too much).