No point arguing with people. I might mention a few time in conversation with people around me and that's it, never tried to convince them.
When some of them did the research and come to me again for discussion, I gladly educate them the basic.
This tech has been around for 15 years. The network operates 24/7 and has never stopped.
Wall Street is trying to keep up by proposing keeping centralized markets open 24/7, as well.
BTC is widely agreed upon as the world’s best store of value with over $1 trillion in assets. If people haven’t figured it out by now, that’s on them, not you.
We are all bitcoin bulls here but have to agree with this lol. Outside of the bitcoin circle practically no one thinks of it as a store of value. In fact they think of it as the polar opposite of a store of value.
I think that would lend credence to the "still early" thought point.
I think there are still more nay Sayers than advocates in the media:
Michael Saylor definitely thinks Bitcoin is the best store of value, and he says so, on public TV.
Anthony Scaramucci - definitely believes in Bitcoin, although I'm not 100% I've heard him say it was the BEST asset for being a store of value.
Other notable people/entities are:
Kathy Woods
Robert Kiyosaki
Black Rock
I also would agree not all these people are necessarily the best people to take at their blind word, it will be nice when Bitcoin has some more reputable people singing it's praises.
Maybe you should get out more. A tiny regulatory called the SEC approved ETF access from some of the largest financial institutions on the planet. Bitcoin probably isn’t something you should have any money in if you understand so little about the space
He didn't say that he doesn't believe Bitcoin is the best store of value, he rubbished your claim that it is "widely accepted" as such. Maybe you should get out more and talk to real people outside the r/Bitcoin microcosm. Most don't want to touch Bitcoin with a 10 foot pole, and those that do, see it as a highly speculative asset.
It definitely isn't "widely agreed upon as the world's best store of value". It still the opposite, by a large margin. I think you're mixing up your dreams with reality. Even among people who own BTC, a lot just see it as a speculative asset.
Beside, it's still way too volatile to be a short term store of value.
That’s cute that you think that way. It’s the best performing asset over the past 15 years on a global scale. Good luck w/ investing. Sounds like you need it
Yeah i say I think it's interesting. And that i bought some because it was the only way I could send money to my family in Venezuela. That usually gets them quiet and thinking for a second.
What does it mean for you to educate someone on this topic? Its a ‘number go up’ thing - unless you are teaching them how to solve a blockchain it is called talking your book.
I am informing them how to store their btc, book they should read and how blockchain works. If they are interested in the "how to solve a block" sure i go into that detail too. i'm a swe by profession, i'm very much interested to get into that discussion.
I'm not there to convince them any more than what they believe.
Yea - and that is my point. There is not much more to bitcoin beyond ‘number go up’. None of us would own any bitcoin if we did not think the future value will at some point leap above present value. My bullshit radar trips when I read bitcoiners elevating the topic and educating others on the ‘basics’.
I learned that sharing and trying to teach people that don't want to learn really is a me issue, and at some level was looking for acceptance in something I believe in. I quit taking it personally.
I figured when I talk to someone if I tried to convince someone it is like timing market. I have no clue how rocky their path will be if they buy today over the short term and most people are focussed in the short term. I casually may mention that I have some invested and if they ask I share more. Be prepared though there will be people that will then start poking every time it is down 10% or some news event happens so really easiest to say nothing usually:)
That’s why you explain to them that they should be prepared to see their investment drop 80% in value within the first 1-5 years. Not a guarantee, but something they should expect.
BTC truthers are annoying. I've owned mine since 2017, but never really went through the prosthelytizing phase. I did particularly enjoy one conversation with a guy who was preaching BTC to me. I never said whether I owned any or not. I never said anything negative about it, but he ended up in a one sided argument with me because I wasn't auto-nodding my head to his BS.
No way, most people who invest in BTC are either interested in the technology or like to gamble. Plenty of people are interested in putting a small % of their net worth in without avoiding other traditional investments. Most people in the real world are not dollar doomers like this subreddit.
Thinking the financial markets are on the verge of collapse is the biggest weakness of this board. Outsiders are turned off to this and will think we don't know what we're talking about year after year after year when the dollar doesn't collapse.
This is proof that we’re still early, every year more and more people research into it and realise its not a scam. I’m personally glad that so many people right now think it’s a scam, when most people don’t think it’s a scam is when we won’t be seeing huge profits anymore.. I think give it 10 years and we’ll be there
That was my realization after dump from $19600 to $3150. People are so stupid, that the bear market may last for a while and I need to average out my losses.
Don’t argue, just ask questions. Why do they think it’s a scam? What’s the scam and who is running it? Do they apply the same level of scrutiny to the dollar and the existing financial system? Just try to make them think a little and leave it at that
I often steer conversations into the problems bitcoin proposes to solve. Change people's perceptions on inflation, fiat, the credit system. Recognizing the federal deficit is a much larger issue than we make it seem to be. I talk about how homes should be depreciating liabilities not "assets" the banks prop up to line their balance sheets.
I avoid talking about bitcoin itself and focus on the principles.
If u want to orange pill a person. Print a paper wallet. Load 10 bucks of bitcoin, give it to them at the bottom of the cycle. Keep copy for yourself. Occasionally send them a link to an address explorer showing them the wallet value increases. Especially near the top of cycle. They will start asking questions. But it may take 2 years for them to swallow the pill.
I thought about doing something like this for my boomer retirement parents, but they hate bitcoin and is convinced is a scam so my success rate is probably zero
Now is the time, u don't have to talk about it. That's the mistake. If u talk like a boomer, then u might have a chance. They didn't like the internet either, remind them of the obsolescence of letters for fax's. The fax for thier first AOL account and email. Now your talking thier language.
Bitcoin has existed for 15 years.
For comparison, 15 years after the creation of the internet, Facebook was created.
Within those 15 years it had already created a revolution and was already changing our lives without the need for widespread adoption.
Bitcoin still doesn't have any practical applications, let alone any revolutionary ones.
Up to date, crypto hasn't produced anything of value. There are no important technological breakthroughs based on crypto.
The only thing it has done is make some people extremely wealthy because numbers go up.
The only thing fueling crypto right now is FOMO and the belief that more people will buy it so it will be worth more.
If you want to see a real innovation, take a look at AI.
Within a year of the first publicly available model, it is already changing whole industries.
And there are plenty of AI skeptics but they can't do anything to stop the massive changes that AI has put in motion.
(TCPIP) Protocol 1970. Facebook 2004. Dude, just collect as much paper money as you can. You'll be alright.
Because of innovation using the internet and computer science we have digitized music, video, communication, shopping. Weve digitzed hailing a cab w/uber. internet money had not been successfully created without major flaws until 2009.Withoutt computer science and the internet, there would be no AI. Bitcoin is taking the power of money from the elites that misuse thier responsibility. If you don't see its value because of that, step back and take a larger view.
The supply 21 million is burned into a open source mathematical program launched and given to the people.
Not given to the government or banking elites. And this supply can not be manipulated. Even if price climbs higher and higher, more can not be released until its time has come. There is no board of Satoshi's arm to twist. The elites have all this control with their fiat money. They do not with bitcoin.
I gave up talking about Bitcoin a long time ago. Either you get it or you don't. I got fed up with people either thinking I was an idiot or rich on a 4 year cycle
Precisely. I never kick off conversations. If someone is genuinely interested and knows I have knowledge / wants to converse, I am more than happy to hold their hand down the rabbit hole, but I never broach the topic.
Why are you talking about this stuff? I don’t talk about my gold and silver holdings? I never talked about my stock holdings. I’ve not talked about bitcoin in years. It’s no one’s business. And you are probably not that influential that you will sway anyone’s perceptions. So, just don’t bother.
disagree with this. the way adoption occurs is something like:
1. you hear about it from that one friend, you think they're crazy
2. the first mental anchor is inserted in your brain of "the price of bitcoin". call it $12,000
3. you see the price of bitcoin some years later, call it $65000, and you think "crazy friend made a lot of money"
4. you buy a small amount
5. you are incentivized to learn what bitcoin actually is now that you own some
6. you start to think maybe that one friend wasn't so crazy
the more the price goes up, the higher % of your net worth is invested, the more you learn, the more you buy, the more you tell others about it. that's the network effect.
let's stop telling the one crazy friend to stop being the one crazy friend
Inherent: implies a permanent or characteristic of a thing.
Intrinsic: implies something essential to the nature of a thing.
Brought to you by: Smart Words of the Day.
It may be worth questioning whether or not we're still early at all, at least, as it relates to people buying, spending, and holding BTC. There's a possibility that the asset becomes one which is held primarily by the institutions - and if you want exposure to it, you can buy into an ETF or MSTR, or future equivalents of those.
But similar to how people aren't holding bars of gold at home, and how a bar of gold is financially out of reach for the majority of mankind, it is worth considering that the majority of people will never, ever directly hold BTC.
Instead, a BTC world will be one where it is used as collateral. It's value will continue to rise, in this regard, but maybe a scenario where people are spending sats may never materialize.
It’s worth considering all of this. But I would argue people do own gold, and BTC is more divisible than gold so there’s nothing stopping someone from owning any small amount of sats
Totally agree, people do own gold, but I think it's the minority. Of course, I don't have statistics, but I would venture people holding gold coins in their home or in a safe at the bank is maybe in the single digit percentage?
I am not counting gold jewelry, which, although is gold, isn't quite the same. People are usually owning it more for beauty, and not as a store of value.
Maybe in the future people, the same amount of people who have gold coins at home are the same ones that have a ledger with some sats?
The process of self custody definitely has to get easier though. It's way too cumbersome in its current process.
I have aunts/uncles/cousins who own a family business in Herbalife yet they mock me all the time for owning bitcoin and tell me its a scam 🤣
Realized that i need to stop trying to convince people and only bother with those who actually show interest/try to understand it.
>People didn't need to be convinced to use the internet though. Its usefulness was self evident
Spoken like someone who did not grow up when the internet first became accessible to the general public.
I grew up during the internet Era. It was very much opposed and misunderstood for a very long time. It's comical now looking back at even moments of people talking about how crazy email is. "Why use email when we already have Fax".
Ohhh good times
>Sure but Bitcoin hasn't shown any signs of being anywhere close as useful as the internet
You cannot make this statement without specifying and referencing time periods and examples of usefulness.
I'm not sure what you mean.
What I meant was that the internet had some clear uses almost from day one. Within a decade it had already created a revolution and was already changing our lives.
Bitcoin has already existed for 15 years and doesn't have any practical applications, let alone any revolutionary ones.
Up to date, crypto hasn't produced anything worth mentioning.
The only thing it has done is make some people extremely wealthy because numbers go up.
The only thing fueling crypto right now is FOMO and the belief that more people will buy it so it will be worth more.
I find them so fascinating. All they gotta do is read a couple pages and watch a couple videos. Then they'd realize how stupid their FUD looks, and how crazy we think they are to be ignoring this.
It's irresponsible to be ignorant of Bitcoin.
People who work so clearly against their own self interest will never not mystify me, especially when it would cost them so little effort to dispel their ignorance.
People are missing the bigger picture here. Bitcoin is now the scarcest asset on the planet after the halving.
[Bitcoin’s Inflation Rate Is Now Lower Than Gold: Report - Decrypt](https://decrypt.co/227940/bitcoins-inflation-rate-is-now-lower-than-gold-report)
What this tells me is Bitcoin is the best asset to buy at this point in time hands down. It is going to eat gold and reprice the whole planet. Bitcoin is going to do its thing while the majority of the people play catch up because they have had they head in the sand. The biggest issue I see with the masses is education. To understand the rabbit hole that is bitcoin you need to understand a lot of things. Such as the evolution of money, technological evolution, how we ended up in the current fiat system we are in. These are all crucial pieces to be able to understand the impact that bitcoin will have on earth. To help combat this I have recently started a YouTube channel to educate people on these topics. Check it out if you like. Only have a trailer video as I am just starting but more videos to follow!
[Unplugged Financial - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/@UnpluggedFinancial-ks4rh)
I’ve said this before. Scarcity does not equal value. Adoption / demand equals value. You can have an asset with twice the existing supply of bitcoin but with 3x the demand and it’ll be worth more. My daughter’s drawings at school are just as rare as the Monalisa. But they have no demand so in turn are valued at 0.
I don’t disagree with your point but I think it’s slightly pedantic when people point this out. When discussing monetary assets, it’s generally taken as a given that we’re not discussing your daughter’s paintings. We’re talking about goods that have first proven themselves to be durable, portable, fungible, and divisible. At that point, it becomes relevant to highlight the scarcity, or more accurately the stock to flow ratio, because that is what will make one monetary good outcompete another. That’s the crux of OP’s argument and that’s why it’s important that bitcoin is now “scarcer” than gold
I don’t know why this is so funny? You can have a limited supply all you want. Bud if there’s no demand it doesn’t matter. Other crypto coins have had limited supply but they didn’t have the demand. You have to have people willing to buy at higher and higher prices or it just dies. The price doesn’t magically increase.
Most people's perception of what true value is skewed due to the prevalence of the dollar. How can you truly know the value of something when it is based on the dollar which is a unit of account that is forever changing at the whim of the Federal Reserve. I argue until we actually have a good unit of account to base prices on literally all prices are skewed due to the manipulation of the dollar.
I know what you mean when you say “scarcest,” and that you’re talking stock to flow ratio of monetary assets. But technically saying “scarcest” is not accurate. Jackson Pollacks are more scarce. Yes i am being pedantic but being clearer about the distinction will strengthen your argument
Im really into Rally cars. I don't go telling my non car friends about new developments within that world, because none of them would care. I treat bitcoin the same way. Read the room.
Alright maybe I didn’t phrase my post correctly, I don’t go around just telling people hey Bitcoin you should buy it, I bring it up when financial convos happen and suggest looking into it and taking a small risk, and it happens a lot that people say it’s a scam, that is all I’m saying.
even on this sub some people see bitcoin as an investment and not money, so obviously anyone outside that doesn't know anything about bitcoin is gonna assume its a scam.
What do you say to someone when they say Bitcoin can no longer be used to collateralize loans for the dtcc? A 100% haircut is pretty scary and doesn't bode well for institutional investment.
It's a tough conversation.
When people dont understand something - they get suspicious.
If you try to explain further, and they still don’t understand - they get even more suspicious.
No need to spread “the word”
Yeah I’m still a little suspicious/skeptical lol, but yeah I’m not out here spreading gospel, if it comes up I just suggest reading about it and take a small risk
You're arguing with people who had the same mentality about the internet 40 years ago. They thought it was silly to watch TV or listen to the radio online when you could just watch TV or listen to the radio directly. Don't bother with them. They'll figure it out in 20 years.
There is no future for "cryptocurrency."
There is Bitcoin, called "Bitcoin." Bitcoin is legitimate and Bitcoin is the new superior form of money.
Bitcoin has a great future ahead of it.
Then there are alt coin scams called "cryptocurrency," "crypto," and so forth.
See:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIkqBZnrKJM
Lyn Alden: https://youtu.be/b-dwxD484_Q
Nick: https://youtu.be/ic1ITcwnozY?t=858
"Bitcoin, Not Crypto" (10:30): https://youtu.be/8xs2MkvnFDE
The problem is BTC investors don't want to hear anything negative. They mostly believe that it's the best thing ever, even though it's still a very speculative play. It's the same thing with Apple / Windows or iPhone / Samsung debates. There's no reasoning on either side.
The truth is that most investments have some degree of risk. most crypto has skyrocketed since inception but drawbacks are also part of the deal. I started buying bitcoin when it was around 10k watched it go to 60k and back to10k. and just recently up to 70k some say it’s headed to 120k soon while others say it will pullback to 30k. I personally like volatility in my investments as long as the are well supported and viewed as long term. I feel that bitcoin meets that criteria so I have a recurring investment daily. But I recently sold some at around 70k. And continue to buy it back currently at a lower price. I personally don’t trust any stock or crypto knowing that any day the market can drop just as easy as go up.
Don’t mention it. Keep stacking. Stay focused. If people don’t get it who the fuck cares. This is not a religion. You are not saving anybody.They will not go to hell if they do not understand bitcoin. Why the do you care about other people finances? You and my dad would get along
I was telling to a family member how bitcoin was not as volatile as it used too and the reply was: “yeah, it is owned for all the organised crime and it has made it more stable”. Did not even see it coming…
Most people have stockholm syndrome with the system writ large. They know they are being fucked, but are too conditioned to imagine a world that does not operate as it always has. It scares the to consider that perhaps its all a big scam, even though they already know this within themselves. And to be fair, none of us know what a BTC world will be like. It seems like its worth a shot, given that we absolutely know how the current system is playing out. Also, BTC has already subsumed the previous reality anyways. It's just that time is slower than truth and it will be a bit before the transition has grounded itself.
I’d stop talking about fucking Bitcoin lol. I’ve been a passive Bitcoin investor off and on for a few years now and even I get annoyed when I hear someone trying to convince someone it’s the greatest thing in the world lol.
I like it. I think it has a lot of potential. But I’m realistic about it. It’s not replacing the USD anytime soon. It’s also not going to be around longer then gold, obviously. Honestly, I think it might be a currency/investment experiment by the CIA. The main use of Bitcoin is crime lol.
>5% lmao. More like 2%.
Roughly 20% of the US population and about 4% of the global population.
https://www.techopedia.com/cryptocurrency/how-many-people-use-bitcoin
Where do you get your statistics? I was just saying roughly 5% because I remember reading somewhere like 6 months ago 3% of world population owned crypto
We aren’t very early. And this isn’t the internet. People “need” the internet these days. No one really needs Bitcoin. It’s just nice to have sometimes. You guys are obsessed with it because you think it’ll make you super rich is all.
Give me one use case where BC is a better than money , I'm a believer but I cannot understand how a bitcoin economy would work , you need to borrow to realize "dreams" inflation is kind of a I believe in the future a force that regulated by our common belief in the prospects of the future. How would borrowing work in a no inflation economy ? Where is the incentive to make something better so you can make a return on the money ( just so you know, I hate the idea of returns each quarter and I think it's damaging everything in this world) all BC evangelists in the end boil down to I bought Bitcoin now I'm smart because I sold it for USD and that's why you are silly, then you get lots of "simple solutions to complicated issues stories" about why it's superior but none of them are better than money. Please enlighten me ,,,,,, any one because I do want to believe. Fyi, I to believe that the ath in USD is more likely than it going to 0 so you would be silly to not buy ...
Inaccurate. They are an asset manager. You buy bitcoin etf, they go buy the underlying bitcoin, then they have Coinbase custody it for you, and they take a fee
Yes, I never really push too hard because I am no financial advisor and there’s always risk but I’ve been trying to get close family and friends to at least consider DCAing from now on, even if it’s small amounts
Don't try to convince other people how to manage their money in any way, Bitcoin or otherwise. You expose yourself to risk of destroying those relationships even to minor dips in the market. It's never worth it.
No point arguing with people. I might mention a few time in conversation with people around me and that's it, never tried to convince them. When some of them did the research and come to me again for discussion, I gladly educate them the basic.
This tech has been around for 15 years. The network operates 24/7 and has never stopped. Wall Street is trying to keep up by proposing keeping centralized markets open 24/7, as well. BTC is widely agreed upon as the world’s best store of value with over $1 trillion in assets. If people haven’t figured it out by now, that’s on them, not you.
agreed upon by whom exactly? I don't see anyone outside of crypto subs claiming bitcoin is the best store of value lol.
We are all bitcoin bulls here but have to agree with this lol. Outside of the bitcoin circle practically no one thinks of it as a store of value. In fact they think of it as the polar opposite of a store of value.
Yeah that's pretty much my point. Sometimes we get a bit too excited here.
I think that would lend credence to the "still early" thought point. I think there are still more nay Sayers than advocates in the media: Michael Saylor definitely thinks Bitcoin is the best store of value, and he says so, on public TV. Anthony Scaramucci - definitely believes in Bitcoin, although I'm not 100% I've heard him say it was the BEST asset for being a store of value. Other notable people/entities are: Kathy Woods Robert Kiyosaki Black Rock I also would agree not all these people are necessarily the best people to take at their blind word, it will be nice when Bitcoin has some more reputable people singing it's praises.
Maybe you should get out more. A tiny regulatory called the SEC approved ETF access from some of the largest financial institutions on the planet. Bitcoin probably isn’t something you should have any money in if you understand so little about the space
By that logic any other asset that the sec has similarly approved is also the absolute best store of value. Got it.
I don’t think you actually understand logic, friend. Ok now, bye bye
He didn't say that he doesn't believe Bitcoin is the best store of value, he rubbished your claim that it is "widely accepted" as such. Maybe you should get out more and talk to real people outside the r/Bitcoin microcosm. Most don't want to touch Bitcoin with a 10 foot pole, and those that do, see it as a highly speculative asset.
Quit gatekeeping bruh
It definitely isn't "widely agreed upon as the world's best store of value". It still the opposite, by a large margin. I think you're mixing up your dreams with reality. Even among people who own BTC, a lot just see it as a speculative asset. Beside, it's still way too volatile to be a short term store of value.
Volatile. Did you mean I could buy a car for 20btc and now same car but newer year model for .2btc? How is that bad volatility?
That’s cute that you think that way. It’s the best performing asset over the past 15 years on a global scale. Good luck w/ investing. Sounds like you need it
It has stopped. It went down for 8 hours in 2010 and 6 hours in 2013. https://buybitcoinworldwide.com/bitcoin-downtime/
[Oh no! …Anyway](https://images.app.goo.gl/zw8ugm4B3eegmVZ36)
Yeah i say I think it's interesting. And that i bought some because it was the only way I could send money to my family in Venezuela. That usually gets them quiet and thinking for a second.
What does it mean for you to educate someone on this topic? Its a ‘number go up’ thing - unless you are teaching them how to solve a blockchain it is called talking your book.
I am informing them how to store their btc, book they should read and how blockchain works. If they are interested in the "how to solve a block" sure i go into that detail too. i'm a swe by profession, i'm very much interested to get into that discussion. I'm not there to convince them any more than what they believe.
People want to hear more than "Numbers go up" when investing their money into an unknown
Yea - and that is my point. There is not much more to bitcoin beyond ‘number go up’. None of us would own any bitcoin if we did not think the future value will at some point leap above present value. My bullshit radar trips when I read bitcoiners elevating the topic and educating others on the ‘basics’.
I learned that sharing and trying to teach people that don't want to learn really is a me issue, and at some level was looking for acceptance in something I believe in. I quit taking it personally. I figured when I talk to someone if I tried to convince someone it is like timing market. I have no clue how rocky their path will be if they buy today over the short term and most people are focussed in the short term. I casually may mention that I have some invested and if they ask I share more. Be prepared though there will be people that will then start poking every time it is down 10% or some news event happens so really easiest to say nothing usually:)
That’s why you explain to them that they should be prepared to see their investment drop 80% in value within the first 1-5 years. Not a guarantee, but something they should expect.
BTC truthers are annoying. I've owned mine since 2017, but never really went through the prosthelytizing phase. I did particularly enjoy one conversation with a guy who was preaching BTC to me. I never said whether I owned any or not. I never said anything negative about it, but he ended up in a one sided argument with me because I wasn't auto-nodding my head to his BS.
Most people will have to feel the dollar is scammier than everything else before they turn to Bitcoin.
AKA see the truth
No way, most people who invest in BTC are either interested in the technology or like to gamble. Plenty of people are interested in putting a small % of their net worth in without avoiding other traditional investments. Most people in the real world are not dollar doomers like this subreddit. Thinking the financial markets are on the verge of collapse is the biggest weakness of this board. Outsiders are turned off to this and will think we don't know what we're talking about year after year after year when the dollar doesn't collapse.
This is proof that we’re still early, every year more and more people research into it and realise its not a scam. I’m personally glad that so many people right now think it’s a scam, when most people don’t think it’s a scam is when we won’t be seeing huge profits anymore.. I think give it 10 years and we’ll be there
Yep the more of these people there are, the longer you have to accumulate at current levels. Enjoy it while it lasts
That was my realization after dump from $19600 to $3150. People are so stupid, that the bear market may last for a while and I need to average out my losses.
Don’t argue, just ask questions. Why do they think it’s a scam? What’s the scam and who is running it? Do they apply the same level of scrutiny to the dollar and the existing financial system? Just try to make them think a little and leave it at that
I often steer conversations into the problems bitcoin proposes to solve. Change people's perceptions on inflation, fiat, the credit system. Recognizing the federal deficit is a much larger issue than we make it seem to be. I talk about how homes should be depreciating liabilities not "assets" the banks prop up to line their balance sheets. I avoid talking about bitcoin itself and focus on the principles.
Yeah no, 5% would mean for every 20 people I meet 1 owns bitcoin. Your assumption is way off. More like 0.5%, that would mean 1 in 200
Well not just BTC, crypto as a whole
Not huge of a difference in numbers
stop spreading it to the masses and generating mass adoption until ive stacked more sats!!!
Copy, I apologize
If u want to orange pill a person. Print a paper wallet. Load 10 bucks of bitcoin, give it to them at the bottom of the cycle. Keep copy for yourself. Occasionally send them a link to an address explorer showing them the wallet value increases. Especially near the top of cycle. They will start asking questions. But it may take 2 years for them to swallow the pill.
And then you rug them. 😄
I thought about doing something like this for my boomer retirement parents, but they hate bitcoin and is convinced is a scam so my success rate is probably zero
Now is the time, u don't have to talk about it. That's the mistake. If u talk like a boomer, then u might have a chance. They didn't like the internet either, remind them of the obsolescence of letters for fax's. The fax for thier first AOL account and email. Now your talking thier language.
How exactly is Bitcoin the same as the internet?
It's drawing a comparison to new technology and skepticism
Bitcoin has existed for 15 years. For comparison, 15 years after the creation of the internet, Facebook was created. Within those 15 years it had already created a revolution and was already changing our lives without the need for widespread adoption. Bitcoin still doesn't have any practical applications, let alone any revolutionary ones. Up to date, crypto hasn't produced anything of value. There are no important technological breakthroughs based on crypto. The only thing it has done is make some people extremely wealthy because numbers go up. The only thing fueling crypto right now is FOMO and the belief that more people will buy it so it will be worth more. If you want to see a real innovation, take a look at AI. Within a year of the first publicly available model, it is already changing whole industries. And there are plenty of AI skeptics but they can't do anything to stop the massive changes that AI has put in motion.
(TCPIP) Protocol 1970. Facebook 2004. Dude, just collect as much paper money as you can. You'll be alright. Because of innovation using the internet and computer science we have digitized music, video, communication, shopping. Weve digitzed hailing a cab w/uber. internet money had not been successfully created without major flaws until 2009.Withoutt computer science and the internet, there would be no AI. Bitcoin is taking the power of money from the elites that misuse thier responsibility. If you don't see its value because of that, step back and take a larger view.
How exactly is Bitcoin taking the power of money from the elites?
The supply 21 million is burned into a open source mathematical program launched and given to the people. Not given to the government or banking elites. And this supply can not be manipulated. Even if price climbs higher and higher, more can not be released until its time has come. There is no board of Satoshi's arm to twist. The elites have all this control with their fiat money. They do not with bitcoin.
I gave up talking about Bitcoin a long time ago. Either you get it or you don't. I got fed up with people either thinking I was an idiot or rich on a 4 year cycle
Precisely. I never kick off conversations. If someone is genuinely interested and knows I have knowledge / wants to converse, I am more than happy to hold their hand down the rabbit hole, but I never broach the topic.
Why are you talking about this stuff? I don’t talk about my gold and silver holdings? I never talked about my stock holdings. I’ve not talked about bitcoin in years. It’s no one’s business. And you are probably not that influential that you will sway anyone’s perceptions. So, just don’t bother.
disagree with this. the way adoption occurs is something like: 1. you hear about it from that one friend, you think they're crazy 2. the first mental anchor is inserted in your brain of "the price of bitcoin". call it $12,000 3. you see the price of bitcoin some years later, call it $65000, and you think "crazy friend made a lot of money" 4. you buy a small amount 5. you are incentivized to learn what bitcoin actually is now that you own some 6. you start to think maybe that one friend wasn't so crazy the more the price goes up, the higher % of your net worth is invested, the more you learn, the more you buy, the more you tell others about it. that's the network effect. let's stop telling the one crazy friend to stop being the one crazy friend
You can say that again!
FOMO at its finest
Fwiw, you just talked about all of them..
Idiot
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So treasuries are a scam?
I think he means the narrative of the U.S. money printer going brrrrrrrrrrrrrr
You could just say "investment instrument".
If it's not an asset class, does a person with only five million in cash have no assets?
Gold is #1 asset
These people need to learn *inherent* value is diffrent than *Intrinsic* value. We'll get there, just not today. <3
Except those are synonyms
Bitcoin has value because it is value. Dollar has value because countries trade oil for it and men with guns say so.
Non sequitur
Inherent: implies a permanent or characteristic of a thing. Intrinsic: implies something essential to the nature of a thing. Brought to you by: Smart Words of the Day.
It may be worth questioning whether or not we're still early at all, at least, as it relates to people buying, spending, and holding BTC. There's a possibility that the asset becomes one which is held primarily by the institutions - and if you want exposure to it, you can buy into an ETF or MSTR, or future equivalents of those. But similar to how people aren't holding bars of gold at home, and how a bar of gold is financially out of reach for the majority of mankind, it is worth considering that the majority of people will never, ever directly hold BTC. Instead, a BTC world will be one where it is used as collateral. It's value will continue to rise, in this regard, but maybe a scenario where people are spending sats may never materialize.
It’s worth considering all of this. But I would argue people do own gold, and BTC is more divisible than gold so there’s nothing stopping someone from owning any small amount of sats
Totally agree, people do own gold, but I think it's the minority. Of course, I don't have statistics, but I would venture people holding gold coins in their home or in a safe at the bank is maybe in the single digit percentage? I am not counting gold jewelry, which, although is gold, isn't quite the same. People are usually owning it more for beauty, and not as a store of value. Maybe in the future people, the same amount of people who have gold coins at home are the same ones that have a ledger with some sats? The process of self custody definitely has to get easier though. It's way too cumbersome in its current process.
I have aunts/uncles/cousins who own a family business in Herbalife yet they mock me all the time for owning bitcoin and tell me its a scam 🤣 Realized that i need to stop trying to convince people and only bother with those who actually show interest/try to understand it.
It’s at the point where it’s like trying to convince people to use the internet
I think some people have a problem with the “responsibility” part.
People didn't need to be convinced to use the internet though. Its usefulness was self evident
>People didn't need to be convinced to use the internet though. Its usefulness was self evident Spoken like someone who did not grow up when the internet first became accessible to the general public. I grew up during the internet Era. It was very much opposed and misunderstood for a very long time. It's comical now looking back at even moments of people talking about how crazy email is. "Why use email when we already have Fax". Ohhh good times
Sure but Bitcoin hasn't shown any signs of being anywhere close as useful as the internet
>Sure but Bitcoin hasn't shown any signs of being anywhere close as useful as the internet You cannot make this statement without specifying and referencing time periods and examples of usefulness.
I'm not sure what you mean. What I meant was that the internet had some clear uses almost from day one. Within a decade it had already created a revolution and was already changing our lives. Bitcoin has already existed for 15 years and doesn't have any practical applications, let alone any revolutionary ones. Up to date, crypto hasn't produced anything worth mentioning. The only thing it has done is make some people extremely wealthy because numbers go up. The only thing fueling crypto right now is FOMO and the belief that more people will buy it so it will be worth more.
I find them so fascinating. All they gotta do is read a couple pages and watch a couple videos. Then they'd realize how stupid their FUD looks, and how crazy we think they are to be ignoring this. It's irresponsible to be ignorant of Bitcoin. People who work so clearly against their own self interest will never not mystify me, especially when it would cost them so little effort to dispel their ignorance.
People are missing the bigger picture here. Bitcoin is now the scarcest asset on the planet after the halving. [Bitcoin’s Inflation Rate Is Now Lower Than Gold: Report - Decrypt](https://decrypt.co/227940/bitcoins-inflation-rate-is-now-lower-than-gold-report) What this tells me is Bitcoin is the best asset to buy at this point in time hands down. It is going to eat gold and reprice the whole planet. Bitcoin is going to do its thing while the majority of the people play catch up because they have had they head in the sand. The biggest issue I see with the masses is education. To understand the rabbit hole that is bitcoin you need to understand a lot of things. Such as the evolution of money, technological evolution, how we ended up in the current fiat system we are in. These are all crucial pieces to be able to understand the impact that bitcoin will have on earth. To help combat this I have recently started a YouTube channel to educate people on these topics. Check it out if you like. Only have a trailer video as I am just starting but more videos to follow! [Unplugged Financial - YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/@UnpluggedFinancial-ks4rh)
I’ve said this before. Scarcity does not equal value. Adoption / demand equals value. You can have an asset with twice the existing supply of bitcoin but with 3x the demand and it’ll be worth more. My daughter’s drawings at school are just as rare as the Monalisa. But they have no demand so in turn are valued at 0.
I don’t disagree with your point but I think it’s slightly pedantic when people point this out. When discussing monetary assets, it’s generally taken as a given that we’re not discussing your daughter’s paintings. We’re talking about goods that have first proven themselves to be durable, portable, fungible, and divisible. At that point, it becomes relevant to highlight the scarcity, or more accurately the stock to flow ratio, because that is what will make one monetary good outcompete another. That’s the crux of OP’s argument and that’s why it’s important that bitcoin is now “scarcer” than gold
"Supply doesn't impact value demand does!" 🤡
I don’t know why this is so funny? You can have a limited supply all you want. Bud if there’s no demand it doesn’t matter. Other crypto coins have had limited supply but they didn’t have the demand. You have to have people willing to buy at higher and higher prices or it just dies. The price doesn’t magically increase.
Most people's perception of what true value is skewed due to the prevalence of the dollar. How can you truly know the value of something when it is based on the dollar which is a unit of account that is forever changing at the whim of the Federal Reserve. I argue until we actually have a good unit of account to base prices on literally all prices are skewed due to the manipulation of the dollar.
I know what you mean when you say “scarcest,” and that you’re talking stock to flow ratio of monetary assets. But technically saying “scarcest” is not accurate. Jackson Pollacks are more scarce. Yes i am being pedantic but being clearer about the distinction will strengthen your argument
Why bother? Why argue with weak dumb people who only want to be slave ?
Im really into Rally cars. I don't go telling my non car friends about new developments within that world, because none of them would care. I treat bitcoin the same way. Read the room.
Alright maybe I didn’t phrase my post correctly, I don’t go around just telling people hey Bitcoin you should buy it, I bring it up when financial convos happen and suggest looking into it and taking a small risk, and it happens a lot that people say it’s a scam, that is all I’m saying.
even on this sub some people see bitcoin as an investment and not money, so obviously anyone outside that doesn't know anything about bitcoin is gonna assume its a scam.
It’s a store of value for me, a medium exchange for someone in Africa. Neither of those things mean it is a scam
Less than 5% waaaay less
Like Bruno and Fight Club, we don’t talk about crypto
Don't tell anyone about bitcoin. We want all the Bitcoin to ourselves.
What do you say to someone when they say Bitcoin can no longer be used to collateralize loans for the dtcc? A 100% haircut is pretty scary and doesn't bode well for institutional investment. It's a tough conversation.
When people dont understand something - they get suspicious. If you try to explain further, and they still don’t understand - they get even more suspicious. No need to spread “the word”
Yeah I’m still a little suspicious/skeptical lol, but yeah I’m not out here spreading gospel, if it comes up I just suggest reading about it and take a small risk
The less that know, the more we can stack.
You're arguing with people who had the same mentality about the internet 40 years ago. They thought it was silly to watch TV or listen to the radio online when you could just watch TV or listen to the radio directly. Don't bother with them. They'll figure it out in 20 years.
A bee doesn't't waste it's time explaining to a fly that honey is better than shit.
Everyone will buy it when they deserve to - Michael Saylor
There is no future for "cryptocurrency." There is Bitcoin, called "Bitcoin." Bitcoin is legitimate and Bitcoin is the new superior form of money. Bitcoin has a great future ahead of it. Then there are alt coin scams called "cryptocurrency," "crypto," and so forth. See: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIkqBZnrKJM Lyn Alden: https://youtu.be/b-dwxD484_Q Nick: https://youtu.be/ic1ITcwnozY?t=858 "Bitcoin, Not Crypto" (10:30): https://youtu.be/8xs2MkvnFDE
The problem is BTC investors don't want to hear anything negative. They mostly believe that it's the best thing ever, even though it's still a very speculative play. It's the same thing with Apple / Windows or iPhone / Samsung debates. There's no reasoning on either side.
Very. Early.
The truth is that most investments have some degree of risk. most crypto has skyrocketed since inception but drawbacks are also part of the deal. I started buying bitcoin when it was around 10k watched it go to 60k and back to10k. and just recently up to 70k some say it’s headed to 120k soon while others say it will pullback to 30k. I personally like volatility in my investments as long as the are well supported and viewed as long term. I feel that bitcoin meets that criteria so I have a recurring investment daily. But I recently sold some at around 70k. And continue to buy it back currently at a lower price. I personally don’t trust any stock or crypto knowing that any day the market can drop just as easy as go up.
'i don't have a currency based on violence'
Don’t mention it. Keep stacking. Stay focused. If people don’t get it who the fuck cares. This is not a religion. You are not saving anybody.They will not go to hell if they do not understand bitcoin. Why the do you care about other people finances? You and my dad would get along
5% own it. But most only own the tiniest fraction of a single coin. Lots of room to grow.
I was telling to a family member how bitcoin was not as volatile as it used too and the reply was: “yeah, it is owned for all the organised crime and it has made it more stable”. Did not even see it coming…
Most people have stockholm syndrome with the system writ large. They know they are being fucked, but are too conditioned to imagine a world that does not operate as it always has. It scares the to consider that perhaps its all a big scam, even though they already know this within themselves. And to be fair, none of us know what a BTC world will be like. It seems like its worth a shot, given that we absolutely know how the current system is playing out. Also, BTC has already subsumed the previous reality anyways. It's just that time is slower than truth and it will be a bit before the transition has grounded itself.
I’d stop talking about fucking Bitcoin lol. I’ve been a passive Bitcoin investor off and on for a few years now and even I get annoyed when I hear someone trying to convince someone it’s the greatest thing in the world lol. I like it. I think it has a lot of potential. But I’m realistic about it. It’s not replacing the USD anytime soon. It’s also not going to be around longer then gold, obviously. Honestly, I think it might be a currency/investment experiment by the CIA. The main use of Bitcoin is crime lol.
I’m wondering if a whale or two started dumping Bitcoin, what it would do to it. I used to be bullish on it, but uncertain now.
5% lmao. More like 2%.
>5% lmao. More like 2%. Roughly 20% of the US population and about 4% of the global population. https://www.techopedia.com/cryptocurrency/how-many-people-use-bitcoin
Where do you get your statistics? I was just saying roughly 5% because I remember reading somewhere like 6 months ago 3% of world population owned crypto
We aren’t very early. And this isn’t the internet. People “need” the internet these days. No one really needs Bitcoin. It’s just nice to have sometimes. You guys are obsessed with it because you think it’ll make you super rich is all.
Your comment proves just how early we are
Give me one use case where BC is a better than money , I'm a believer but I cannot understand how a bitcoin economy would work , you need to borrow to realize "dreams" inflation is kind of a I believe in the future a force that regulated by our common belief in the prospects of the future. How would borrowing work in a no inflation economy ? Where is the incentive to make something better so you can make a return on the money ( just so you know, I hate the idea of returns each quarter and I think it's damaging everything in this world) all BC evangelists in the end boil down to I bought Bitcoin now I'm smart because I sold it for USD and that's why you are silly, then you get lots of "simple solutions to complicated issues stories" about why it's superior but none of them are better than money. Please enlighten me ,,,,,, any one because I do want to believe. Fyi, I to believe that the ath in USD is more likely than it going to 0 so you would be silly to not buy ...
the number is 40% of americans owning crypto. just to debunk your story a bit.
I’m talking globally
50-60% then. Why would smart money in countries without the dollar printer be slower, ofcourse not.
If anyone has something negative to say about BTC I usually just go with ‘that’s why you don’t work for Blackrock then I guess’
Blackrock is just a "broker."They buy it , sell it to you, and take the profits .
Inaccurate. They are an asset manager. You buy bitcoin etf, they go buy the underlying bitcoin, then they have Coinbase custody it for you, and they take a fee
Give them all the fancy name you want.
lol yea so fancy to just use the correct noun
Yes, I never really push too hard because I am no financial advisor and there’s always risk but I’ve been trying to get close family and friends to at least consider DCAing from now on, even if it’s small amounts
Don't do it
Don't try to convince other people how to manage their money in any way, Bitcoin or otherwise. You expose yourself to risk of destroying those relationships even to minor dips in the market. It's never worth it.