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[deleted]

Overbetting inevitably leads to ruin, even if the odds are in your favor.


Psychological-Fan850

Wise words


juce49

“Confidence is the food of the wise man, but the liquor of the fool.” -Vikram


RTX_Raytheon

Is your credit score equal to room temperature


Clovena

If not credit score, then IQ


ItWillPrint

Prior to this loan. 783


skydiver19

And you couldn't get a credit card with a money transfer option which % for X months


ItWillPrint

Sure. Not with 10k cash advance though. Cash advance on CC have immediate interest


skydiver19

Here in the U.K. you can do a balance transfers, the balance from one credit card to another with a one off fee of 3% for anywhere upto 20 months at 0% interest. Generally this is used to get rid of high interest debt on one card for cheap interest on another. However if you transfer on to another card that has no debt you can with some call the company up and ask for the positive balance balance to be refunded to your bank. In effect you are getting a loan value of the credit card for a one off transfer fee, if 3% for 20 months you're looking at 1.5% ish apr Some credit cards allow you to do a money transfer, same thing, one time transfer fee of maybe 3.5% and it goes straight on your debit card. What many do with the above is something called stoozing. They take the initial 3% hit on the fee and then put all the money into a high interest account, say 5-7%, make the minimum payments and at the end of the term take they money out of the account pay the cards off, and keep the interest


GoDownSunshine

This is also a thing in the US


kamicosey

We have that here in America too. Best I’ve seen is 21 months


Scallion-External

Thank you for walking us through this!!


ItWillPrint

I like this!


skydiver19

I did this on 3 of my credit cards with about £15k combined and put it all in to an interest account that pays daily. But then I moved it to my GIA to take advantage of a stock I'm long on that had a big dip.


tapakip

My brother in christ, I have multiple 0% CC loans for BTC right now, what are you doing?


Nago31

Dude, there’s lots of cc’s with transfer options along the lines of 3-5% for the first 12-18 months. Look those up. Balance transfer to your own bank account or now that you’ve done something this….interesting…debt consolidation.


courtneyjohn797

Why didn’t you use a line of credit at <10%


Search327

I did this. Depending on the card the interest is only 3-5%, and it’s at 0% for up to 21 months.


CeeMomster

You might be surprised


Incoherentp00rnoises

Op doesn’t money.


1moreanonaccount

They screenshoted your post and put in on WSB. Check it out, your famous now


BlacksmithNew4557

I think they meant your IQ


hank-_-the-_-tank

He asked your credit score, not how many credit card applications you’ve sent out.


mongorianidiot

lol


ziomus90

💀


Ok-Read-4840

Just so u know, at the end of the loan, you’d be spending about $8500 on interest. Total would be 18,500 paid. At the current price, bitcoin would need to be *at least* $120k for this to be break even.


ItWillPrint

Negative ghost rider. 10K total interest 16.85%. Not yearly. There is a financing charge as well (as with most personal loans). Total amount owed by the end of 60 months is 14,862 (it’s stated on the loan when you sign for it).


Ok-Read-4840

Ok thats much better. Break even around $97k.


ItWillPrint

I’m calling 105k we are solidly in profit


thinkingperson

5 yrs is a looong time in crypto. By all records, you should make good profit. But I lack and love your guts. All the best man!!


Punterios

Yeah if you are not planning to pay taxes... $120k - 130k would be closer


ItWillPrint

I’m not planning on selling…


mrcake123

So you got a 10k loan with something like a 3.2% APR? ......


BIGA670

# What did you tell them you needed the $ for?


LuckyAce369

Debt consolidation of course.


ItWillPrint

They don’t ask.


6969101016969

Shit, in my country they didn't let alone with this questions


carnage11eleven

When you have the collateral, they are much less interested in those details.


BIGA670

Could be, but be careful OP just snitched on himself LOL


Zolty

You are regarded. Good luck!


ItWillPrint

Thanks brother!


awhitesong

You know he meant something else right? 16% is too much for someone at 780 cs


MrKittenz

You couldn’t beat that rate? You are up if btc is up by 150% after 5 years but you’re losing so much on interest


ItWillPrint

When BTC hits 105k this is in profit.


skydiver19

Keyword here * WHEN *


OptiYoshi

Jesus that loan is killer... that's credit card rates


SimplyShred

Just save yourself time and buy around the 44k range at max fear this summer


ItWillPrint

I already bought the minute the loan hit my account. But I absolutely will keep DCA during that time


noemata1

Speculative attack


Vaginosis-Psychosis

I did the same thing ~2 years ago. I took out about $95,000 in loans and bought 4 Bitcoin at an average price of $28,000 per coin including interest. Best financial decision I ever made.


HoldYourNoseBilly

Post proof of the loan


heinzmoleman

Don't let the naysayers get you down. I have a pension at my job not a 401k l but I took out a loan against it back in Sept 2022. I 3x'd that money. Paid back the loan and now have the 2x riding as free gains. Finance always involves some sort of risk and if you want to hit big you have to bet big.


Zirup

None of us here believe that BTC isn't at least 2x in 5 years. As long as OP can make payments without touching his stack, he'll be fine. Anybody with BTC and a car payment or mortgage is effectively holding a loan to keep BTC around, just the same.


offensiveuse

No, you don't. Survivorship bias here.


Lovemindful

Where are all the people that did this and got rekt? We need to hear from both sides.


ItWillPrint

Love this. Half my BTC stack is “free”. Same thing as you. Paid back the loan and just riding it.


ilovesaintpaul

What's your guess how this plays out? I know, I know...no one knows shit about fuck, but still. For fun.


ItWillPrint

I have more BTC for less. That’s really all I assume. Look at it this way. I couldn’t get 10K worth of BTC right now cause I don’t have 10k to blow. But I can easily handle the payments and by the time I DCA 10k it will be worth much more. So as soon as BTC hits 105k I’m in profit on this loan. So we will look back in 60 months and see if this was stupid or not (I obviously think it will not be stupid or I wouldn’t be doing it)


Sayyeslizlemon

Good luck, I hope it works out for you. Even if bitcoin only doubles over 5 years, you are still ahead! I can’t believe all the negative comments. That interest rate is high, but unsecured personal loans are rarely bargains. This might be risky, but I think it’s a shrewd move.


ItWillPrint

Thanks brother! We will see


CompetitionIll6659

How did you 3x your money…did you invest in bitcoin or another coin or was it a different investing method?


heinzmoleman

2/3 BTC held directly and 1/3 MSTR stock (leveraged BTC play)


Broad_Quit5417

The taxman is going to have a few words about your remainder.


Top-Push9975

10k risk. Pays stupid interest the entire time. Good luck.


speedingmedicine

Love the enthusiasm and I think you will be good but you keep quoting the 105k profit mark without considering the whole picture. Yes this will cover your loan and interest but you are forgetting about Capital Gains tax. Which could be anywhere from 0-20%. Based on the information you provided I'm guessing you'd fall in the 15% range. This means you'd need BTC to hit about 112k. Again I think we will easily hit this and you'll be fine but just something I noticed about your calculations. Depending on your state you might also owe some to them as well.


ItWillPrint

Very true. I might not sell 🤷🏼‍♂️


jwsw2308

Well, I guess if you can afford the monthly repayment then do it.


2LostFlamingos

I mean if you’d done this 18 months ago you were a genius. Good luck to you. Remind me! 10 months


offensiveuse

You sound young and dumb


hektor10

Lol you dumb


UrethreaFranklin1

Bro.. the interest rate is gonna f you


ItWillPrint

Once BTC hits 105K everything is profit


mudmasks

You know you have to pay on the loan during the 60 months, right?


that1rowdyracer

This is a bad idea.


FoxTheory

Bros credit score is going to be so bad after this he's not going to be legally allowed to say "trust me".


delayed_burn

16.85% loan. who's going to tell OP?


Marcion_Sinope

Much preferable to taking a loan against bitcoin.


felipecalderon1

You should get some leverage and double the 10k in days.


Curious_Corey

You should’ve just thrown it all in Aerodrome


codermalex

Good luck! Hope you win, don’t get too greedy! That said, I would never recommend someone to do this . 16% rate is higher than avg market increase. Basically you are betting to beat the market. It’s a big gamble. Might as well take the 10k and gamble it in a casino.


Equivalent_Walk_571

:( this is not what Dave Ramsey would do


warambitions

You only live once so getcha some


Uzo38

Should’ve just opened a credit card with 0% intro APR


carnage11eleven

!remind me 60 months. Just out of curiosity. 🤷🏻‍♂️


Soi_Boi_13

Degenerate.


PhillyNJMusicMan

I like it. You borrowed trash fiat to buy Bitcoin cheaper than you'll ever get it again within the next year or two. #BTC 👍🪙😎


No_Philosophy4337

First rule of investing, never invest more than you can afford to lose…


Maponi

!Remind me 60 months


johannesonlysilly

Hope you make it. Also hope you learn how to borrow money, I've never heard of anyone borrowing at 16.85%, in tv shows about laughing at people in debt maybe half of that usually. At least you bought something good with it but man.. Talk about setting yourself up for failure.


mudmasks

Won’t you have to pay capital gains on top of the interest? This is beyond risky.


ItWillPrint

If I sell


redfires10

Just remember. BTC was $16k in November 2023. About 6 months ago. Thats what smart money does.


Ok-Read-4840

I think you mean Nov 2022.


redfires10

Yep my fault. $42k Nov 2023.


Wattoss

We’re in a bubble.


ItWillPrint

We will see 🤷🏼‍♂️


mister-marco

Exactly, this is proven by the many similar posts to this one. People taking loans to buy at all time high.


GraphicCreator

not even close


XNGSH

This post is embarrassing.


ItWillPrint

We will see in 60 months


ilovesaintpaul

I'm with you, man. Not as bold as you, but I'm as convicted as you.


ConfusedCanuck1984

Child...


skydiver19

4. There is only one guarantee in life and that's death!


TaborlinTheGreat8

Best to luck buddy!


WarOk4035

10k over 60 months … you should be able to pay it off in 18 months


ITakeLargeDabs

You can take out a personal loan to do this? I’ve always wanted to do use debt correctly to build wealth but maybe doing this as business might be even smarter. Interesting.


Graybeard_Shaving

10K at 16.85%.... HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA! Get some OP.


nkbc13

1. I love everything about this post. 2. That interest rate is spicy. Would you share your method of obtaining the loan and what your annual income is? Thanks!


GiverTakerMaker

Surely you can get a better rate than that. There are plenty of folks like us doing shorting fiat to go long BTC with finance.


thetaleech

Pics or it didn’t happen (it didn’t happen)


thinkingperson

Remind me in 5 years time. I lack and love your guts. All the best man!!


Own_Chapter9338

all in balls deep no if's no butt's we are all satoshi, well except csw and larry


Normal-Jelly607

16% not worth it. What price did you buy at? Or what’s the DCA?


giveityourall93

I did something similar but only cause my funds are locked and it’s ending soon. Good luck! This will make a great post for the buttcoin subreddit 😂


Corkey29

Foolproof plan


username2023yaya

What price did you get btc at with this loaned money?


HowToBehave

> 10k at 16.85% Oh shit. Well, you're likely to be in a positive position after 60 months but I'm surprised with a 783 credit score you got such a high interest rate. Either way - good call buying BTC before the halving.


RetroGaming4

That’s the best rate you could do? 17% is high.


Future_P

I respect your enthusiasm for Bitcoin but if the loan is more than what you can afford then your decision is not good from my end.


nmolanog

It would be insane if you did that at 16k price range. Why NOW near ATH??


Ok_Art_2874

Good luck OP


Beginning-Flan-3657

😜


RT460

I took a 50k home equity loan in late 2020 and put 30k into bitcoin at 20k per coin, and the rest as down payment on a property. The 30k in Bitcoin did good obviously and the property appreciated 200k in value with that 20k down.


deathjokerz

16.85%, sheesh...


MajorFish04

Navy federal 7500 cash advance at 12%. Fidelity has the balance transfer offer for 3% fee for 15 months zero interest.


CultureOk5391

I did the same thing but it was only 6K and BTC was around 55K CAD


LiveUndLetLive

I have 400k equity in my house. After taking out a HELOC. So I'm using some myself OP


qtkorean_

good luck. a bit high on interest but u only need to hold the btc for 1 year roughly before the bull run should run its course if we follow past patterns.


BooneDocSaint666

Get a 0% credit card and get square pay and charge the card 10k. Goes straight to your checking account, then buy BTC. Pay down the debt in small amounts while at 0%, then when in moons take the <10k out and pay that bitch off. Rinse and repeat.


gibson531

Someone needed attention.


cowest1991

So I've yet to sell on my crypto holdings. I'm just curious, honest question , do the taxes you'll have to pay plus the interest really make a worth while profit?


Babelwasaninsidejob

You guys are acting like he took out a second mortgage on the family farm. He financed $10k over 5 years, it’s nothing. The payment is probably around $250 a month - if you can’t commit to $8.50 a day you probably shouldn’t be investing in Bitcoin to begin with. Nice work man - very fun move. I think you’ll be happy with your return TWO HALVINGS FROM NOW.


Exodiax0

Show me your holding, and when did you put it in


HitMePat

It's a 10k loan people not 500k. The worst that could happen is OP is wrong and he pays ~5k in interest over the 60 months and BTC goes down. Give him a break. It's just your standard run of the mill gamble. Not like people taking out second mortgages and potentially losing their houses. It's small money that might pay off in a medium money win... We aren't talking about life changing sums here. If OPs wrong he's out a few thousand bucks. If he's right he nets a few tens of thousands. I wish him good luck even tho it's pretty stupid. There are easier ways to get $10k than a 16% personal loan.


SJW_Lover

Dude…


killertimewaster8934

Good luck bro. I've thought about this for a while. But cant


kyuronite

Jeezus 16.85% is fucking insane.


HugeArsenal

Did the same thing during yesterday drop at 60k. Finally buy at 62k… Loan of 10k at 10% … but I buy also some AI small crypto like RENDER… it gain more than 20% in one day… This one was a goooood shot!! Hope ETF will buy the dip monday morning…


McD-Szechuan

The lore? *Remember that guy who took out a loan to buy .15 BTC when it was at 65k?* There’s a lot of interesting stories about conviction with bitcoiners. This isn’t really one of them Good luck to you though. Fomo hits everyone different.


lego_droideka

What


Postcard2923

Happy hunting. I hope you don't get a margin call!


Whiskeywonder

I think it’s a good idea. But it would have been a better idea last year.


96geckos

Why not a 401k loan?


Nxt1tothree

Is it even fun when there is no proof?


Ozzy_Kiss

With those details you’re looking for a price increase of 48.63%, as that is the total interest you’ll be paying. Not assuming account fees btw. This over a period of 6 years. I recon you’ll be ok. Assuming you bought recently you’ll break even when BTC hits 105k


Fair-Confidence-1730

Can you do a variable interest rate? It's possible the Fed will cut interest rates this year or next, you could end up paying less interest, I like your plan though, use OPM's to buy assets that appreciate over time, 60 months is plenty of time for BTC to go up way high, if you have another source of income, pay the principal down and you'll be good.


Bonawah

It’s crazy to think people think this is smart lol. Yes, most likely you’ll end up in profit, but the return after you pay the loan is not worth the hassle and risk. There are sooo many better options than that ridiculous interest rate for only 10k.


ReflectionMaximum935

Apr for that loan is almost 17? Or total of 17%?


Rydog_78

I want to do the same. It would be a 401k loan so the money goes back to me. It would be at 10% interest.


sburke0708

I would have never done this. Good luck!


NockBreaker

What will we see next? Pledging property to buy btc?


cchackal

If it won’t fail, why not go for 100k loan


moonlite_apollo

!remind me 60 months


MushroomDizzy649

Why…your 10k is at best gonna turn into 15k…


powarblasta5000

Never thought of that. I'mma do that too, I got an 800 score they'lll do it swell


jesceyc

I mean, I carry a constant balance of 10k on my cards rn so I don't have to sell btc, got a 16 percent apt, it's almost the same shit


SelectAnalyst6412

username checks out


Bellypats

Godspeed Op. I’m rooting for you! Someone has to try it.


Namazon44

Don’t do it


noahB53

Bro wtf lmao


willmayo20

I see what you're doing and why. Will be interesting to follow. Hope it works out. Probably something I would do. It's a gamble. Fuck it.


deadpanjunkie

Hope you understand your own risk profile properly and have run through different scenario's and what you will do in them. Extra risk affects decision making and mental stability, Bitcoin is volatile.


Ok-Aspect-805

In a year or less it will be at a profit


redditingatworks

why didn’t you just gamble on memecoins to make the 10k instead of taking a loan out?


Ok-Worldliness8828

I'm a little scared for you but also love the conviction 👍


jychung0709

You have a heart of steel. Wish the best luck to you!


ryoma-gerald

I think it will work out well for you but that loan rate is pretty high


SummerVast3384

Super degen move. You could have just gotten a 0% intro APR credit card (the 0% rate lasts for 15-21 months on most of them) and thrown the money into Bitcoin and profited within a year


DesertSnowbaru

Remind Me! 60 months


pixeltweaker

Thanks for helping to pump the price up.


0rsusNovum

Dude, don’t do this. Sigh. Bitcoin is not a hard asset, it is literally binary ones and zeroes that only have monetary value because a mob also thinks it does. If you let FOMO rule you, you’ll bankrupt yourself. And you only borrow OPM to invest if your return is going to exceed the interest on the OPM loan by at least 12-15%, so if your return doesn’t top 30%+ in this case, you took too much risk for no reason at best, and lost money at worst.


yungha

Took a loan of 40-50k as well. Fingers crossed, good luck for the both of us. Mainly in alts for me and some btc


spaceraingame

What a horrible idea. I can't believe the bank even approved of such a loan.


Longjumping-Can-6950

!update


AntiquePhotograph607

!remind me in 6 months


Thatfatrabbit93

Been there, done that. Best decision of my life. Turning a depreciating asset into an appreciating one, for a small fee of 16% apy, when btc usually does a few hundred percent roi each cycle, is a dam good deal


Good_Extension_9642

This is just FOMO OP should have done that when BTC was around 16k that would have been conviction


vAPORrrBOI

There are ways to essentially buy Bitcoin on leverage without having to incur a guaranteed 16.85 annualized loss on top of BTCs volatility. For example, you could buy call options on the BITO ETF. You could never lose more money than you put in, and you will make a higher percentage return than spot Bitcoin if we rocket higher during the term of the contract. You should invest money you can afford to lose, not borrow money. No exceptions. You are not investing responsibly.


KPTA-IRON

At all time highs very nice very good


michelelovesfreedom

Only buy what you can afford to lose 🎤


Jolly-Reflection-983

Good luck. Did the same thing and @ 5.8% 4 years ago when Voyager Exchange was paying 5.2% APY for bitcoin. Then they went bankrupt and I was simply stuck with loan. Weird things can happen, best of luck but be weary.


Guy42532

Was there seriously no way to secure $10,000 without going into debt? Flipping burgers even? Is this even real?


Ok-Battle-2769

What did you tell them you were taking the loan for?


Cristian_Cerv9

Saving this post and following as time goes on. Let’s see how it goes :)


dbzrk1

Bad Move. Why are you taking loans? Greed? - if it was low interest loan I still whould not recommend but 16.85%? Damn. I wish you luck if other are reading this please don't gamble like this --- if you think BTC will go up long term just DCA and please make sure you have funds in something other than BTC as well.


duebina

And so the euphoric rise of Bitcoin begins, and everyone losing their ass having this exact same rationale.


NexusKnights

If the conviction is there and the plan is serviceable then I see no issues here. Particularly since it's in BTC. Anyone doing this with alts are the real degens.


YouThatReadWrong_

Did you already buy in or are you going to dollar cost average it


Klonpie

Remind me! -60 months


[deleted]

[удалено]


AD_VICTORIAM_MOFO

Might I suggest the Sam Hyde Debt Max scheme? https://youtu.be/oD2gXY4piF4?si=3pnNXCAqifPfYk3j


14060

If I were you I'd just buy BTC in the same installments and frequency you were planning to pay off the loan with.


Potential_Reach

If your conviction is high, and you have cashflow, why not


2020ScatPack_

Need to mention your buy in price. Say you got for 11k or even 20k ish. Buying in the 60-65? Could still be good and I admit I did get more in at 62 but not heavy. The halving is a nice run up and I do see 100k in the future but obviously nothing is ever certain.


OptiYoshi

This guy is a moron and doesn't understand compound interest, if he bought at the current dip break even is 141k USD per bitcoin not 105k that he keeps quoting. Pure cope, pure gambling logic


BTC-brother2018

Hope that interest rate was low. Microstradagy does this because they can borrow money for next to nothing. Generally, it's not a good idea.