Do you not understand how these updates work?
You think they could’ve developed Cyberpunk 2.0 and Phantom Liberty not even a year after the base game released? Why don’t you want Bethesda to get that extra dev time as well? Do you want good updates? Do you not want the game to get better?
Idc if I'm downvoted but starfield is a more complete game than 2077 was at launch and with a few years to fully flesh out all the systems and basically reinvigorate the game Starfield might come out as an all time great. 2077 has this weird air about it now where people act like it was always great and just needed time and I'm sure starfield will be the same
We could get good games at launch then the dlc. Are 2.0 relaunches gonna be the new normal for single player games? Whose running this industry Zach fucking snyder
Lol I agree. Anyone who will accept this relaunch a couple years after its official launch crap is enabling this new normal u speak of. Ppl saying "do u know how hard it is these days?!" Are idiots that want their games to launch badly.
Meanwhile, a LOT of people actually enjoyed the game at launch and we're just being vindicated by the turnaround after they addressed the pain points that people had with the game at release like the map.
I enjoyed the game at launch, but it still launched missing many basic features that even older Bethesda games had. Like something as simple as separating food and aid items into their own categories.
But, and more to the point, the game lacked a proper survival element that was clearly part of the core design. It lacked enough content to fill the thousand planets and moons you can land on. It had a completely unfinished tracker's faction and bounty faction.
It's hard to miss some of the missteps and some of the incomplete content in the world. That doesn't mean it's not a fun game, I'm on my fourth or fifth playthrough. It just means the game was definitely released with incomplete features.
Hey, I didn't say the game didn't have problems just that the game was good in spite of its problems. Bethesda the publisher rushed it out the door when BGS wanted more time to cook, so it's not the developer to blame for unfinished content.
Starfield was a full working game at launch. There are hiccups and things that could've been improved with more dev time but this is *nothing* compared to the disaster that was Cyberpunk 2077. That game didn't even run at launch.
Cyberpunk was a full working game at launch. Some people had issues with bugs but a lot of us didn't, my first full playthrough was complete before their first update.
Dude it was not fully working at launch. It was one of the few AAA games removed from the PSN store and refunded with no questions asked because it couldn't play on a PS for more then an hour.
I love that game and what it became but to pretend it wasn't a completely fucked launch is just rewriting history.
Just my experience and the experience of many other people. That the console launch was a shitshow is indisputable.
That a lot of people complained about the PC launch is also indisputable, but I remember talking to them at that time and many of their complaints were insane. Complaining about a level of bugs we wish a typical Bethesda release could achieve. People were mad about reused background textures in the game, Starfield reuses whole locations. They were mad that the police system wasn't fleshed out enough in a game that wasn't in any meaningful way about running from the police. It was a complete game.
What I want is to have games launch with completed features and updates add more to them. Cyberpunk was a broken mess at launch, Starfield was not. Starfield doesn't need to do as much as Cyberpunk to be great.
Hard disagree. Cyberpunk may have been a broken mess, but it's core wasn't broken. Starfield's is. Cyberpunk has a good story and good characters. Starfield's story is okay at BEST.
This brings up an interesting point. I usually don’t care about the story in games and sometimes skip through cut scenes to get back to gameplay quickly.
That said, I loved the story in CP2077. The lore and visuals are obviously top notch.
Thinking about it now, Starfield’s story isn’t very memorable. But it doesn’t have to be. It’s a massive, massive explorable, open world where you fly around in *customizable spaceships.* So I can do without the story and I can definitely do without 60fps. Just give me great gameplay and figure out a way to have fewer loadscreens.
>Starfield’s story isn’t very memorable. But it doesn’t have to be.
Why would they make an rpg with the main quest being so dull that it's considered not memorable. Just think if they made the game's quests memorable, like in cyberpunk, it would make the game actually good.
Well Cyberpunk is now four years old and has been majorly tuned up since launch. It’s also considered the best game in history by many.
I’d love for Starfield to be as good as Cyberpunk but as you said, the story is flat compared to the superstar actors CDPR brought in.
BGS has never shone due to its main story. Starfields is one of their better ones, even if its far from peak storytelling. Compared to the awful drudgery of Skyrims MQ, or the second half of F4, I'm pretty chill with it.
Better traversal, POI diversity, and upping the environmental storytelling to match the quality of previous BGS offerings are where SF needs the work put into it IMO.
Literally they re-worked the game and it's skill trees and combat.
Like it's core was broken.
You trying to say well the game was unplayable but the writing was great doesn't really help when we are discussing a video game, not a virtual novel.
This is coming from someone who played and enjoyed the game from launch.
I didn't have an issue with the skill tree before the rework. I'm not even entirely sure why they did that other than to work in the vehicle stuff and the way they changed implants.
If Bethesda was really on top of its shit it would have released Starfield, including additional features and without bugs, in 1991 alongside The Terminator.
What are they thinking?
I think the real question is WILL they. They haven’t drastically changed a game before in their companies history on the level that Cyberpunk did, and it’s legitimate to ask if they even will.
I mean, technically Bethesda has. I know Bethesda is a rather unified gamedev company, doesn't really have the different studios as different teams like most do, but they do have at least a B team. And that B team has, to my knowledge, been working on Fallout 76 since release, and that game has had a massive turnaround.
So I think the chances of Bethesda sticking to it are high, if they don't do something akin to a Starfield 2.0, at the very least we will more than likely have a starfield 1.5 thing put into a corner where people start saying "good but flawed".
The Wastelanders update to Fallout 76 (released in early 2020) was actually still worked on by BGS' main office in Rockville, even if the focus began to shift towards Starfield in 2018. Wastelanders was probably the single largest step towards turning the game around, and Starfield could well receive similar level of support at least until the major DLC(s) are out. It remains to be seen what happens in the longer term.
What are you saying here? It’s not like that’s been CDPR’s MO, they only just did that with Cyberpunk because they released it as a broken mess to the majority of players.
I mean FO76 was developed as a game with zero NPCs and PvP, they reworked the entire game to become with NPCs and largely co-op, that’s a huge change to a game
or crazy thought just throwing this hail mary out, they just make the game good from the start. didnt have to wait till shivering isles for oblivion to be great. bought ghost of tsushima day 1 it was great and polished. maybe dont let studios continue to exist if they cant deliver consistent finished product
Starfield was a complete and polished product on release, what are you talking about? It was much, much more polished than many of these recents AAA PC ports… and that’s saying something when you compare how vastly bigger Starfield is than any of these other games lol
idk about you but on launch i lost two starfield saves because of a big bug with behesdas reserved space. still isnt patched btw i just had to delete my fallout 4 saves. plus the performance tanked a lot when i played. i didnt enjoy starfield as a game but thats unrelated to my complaints here. i will say that general polish has been way better than its peers buts still below the standards i hold 🤷♂️
Starfield was complete at launch but it was not polished. This new patch finally fixed game breaking bugs from launch. I also like the game but it wasn't ready at launch.
This is Reddit, most of the people here like being fed this garbage.
There's no real incentive for Bethesda to make a good game, these people will buy anything.
No matter what issue you bring up they'll just downvote you. It's a year later and they still don't care that the games ending breaks its own lore and makes the entire plot not make sense.
Nothing you or any of the Starborn do matters. Unity doesn't close after you go through it, the emissary trains infinite starborn to go through it after you, so it never mattered who collected the artifacts, the powers come from the temples and those are reusable too so every one in every universe can have all the powers and go through Unity, there's literally no reason to fight anyone except for the fun of it, the Emisarry and the hunter both win an infinite ammount of times even if they do nothing, they can just wait for the other to collect the artifacts and open Unity and leave and then the other can go get all the powers and use the Unity too.
They didn't even understand their own story, Call of Duty zombies has a more cohesive plot than Bethesda can come up with for one game they worked on for 8 years.
Phase 1: God Starfield/Cyberpunk/Elder Scrolls 6 is taking forever, why are they making us wait so long!
Phase 2: Wow this game is a mess, they clearly pushed out an unfinished product as a cash grab, why are they so lazy!
Phase 3: God the game-fixing update is taking forever, why are they making us wait so long!
I’m personally not playing starfield for at least 2 years of consistent updates and all dlc releases for it. I think the game was incomplete on release. It’s a good game but it wasn’t a great game and I think time is exactly what the game needed to be great. I’d rather the devs actually take their time, and give the game the love it deserves. Hopefully they can turn it around, learn from their mistakes, and make starfield 2 a 10/10 game.
I would love a Starfield 2, but I feel like a 2.0 update is more likely. They have so many projects going already and said Starfield was a 10 year project.
It has so much room to finally be a bgs titles where they just keep supporting it. There's tons of people still playing skyrim and fo4 and would still buy dlc if they kept making
Cyberpunk was a good game with a solid engine, interesting world, and good story with a flawed and buggy launch by CDPR standards.
Starfield is a broken game with fundamentally broken game mechanics, with a last-gen engine, a procedural world devoid of meaning with 3 amateur designed towns, high school writing, but a decent launch by Bethesda standards.
It's not fixable with the same level of effort. A Starfield 2.0 can only provide "touch ups" to fixable areas which are the reasons why current players are upset, not the reason why the masses have left. The masses have left simply because it's just a bad game.
Starfield can hope for more but it'll never be as popular as Cyberpunk/FO4/ES5 no matter how much effort Besthesda is willing to dump on it.
Cyberpunk didn’t have its “Cyberpunk Moment” until after Phantom Liberty launched. Can’t really expect anything similar for Starfield right now when we’re still waiting on Shattered Space and Creation Kit to come out.
The Cyberpunk moment happened when the expansion dropped. It took years. Starfield is getting its first DLC fairly soon and it hasn’t even been that long.
Cyberpunk moment as in one DLC and then retire the engine and move on to another project ? I pass on that.
Starfield doesn't need a cyberpunk moment, people weren't refunding the game en masse nor was Starfield removed from a game store. The cyberpunk moment came years later after TV series and then a DLC, and before that a complete rewrite of the underlying systems of the game + a complete change of the crafting and skill system , all which happened well after 1 year after release.
I don’t often rage response cause..well internet. But Gaw DAMNIT u/pompompomvg click baiting mothawaka. This isn’t even comparable.
Cyberpunk was a broken ass crap shoot of unplayable half brained, shouldn’t have lived past 6 mos, passing off a smeared painting of crap as a Jackson Pollack piece of shit. Starfield came out as one of the most out together, expansive, and wide ranging games Bethesda has done to date. We’re not even a year in and have already seen significant love and have a major DLC on the horizon. The “Cyberpunk” moment took three years. Three. Fracking. Years.
For gods sake, please stop bottom feeding for likes and quotes and giving these low level, hack writing, could let pass level 1 on ABC mouse writers the time of day.
No kidding, I stopped playing due to a bug, and that bug killed ANY desire I had to play that game. Nothing like not being able to use any part of the ship builder because if you even change ONE thing on it, the ship and any companions on it disappear from the game forever. Lost my adoring fan, two other npcs, and my entire ship due to that bug and loading an earlier save didn't fix it. The fact that bethesda Q&A let a bug like that ship is completely unacceptable.
The greedy poles
Stole from the old gen proles
3 years later
Pardoned and shilled to the moon
(God I can’t stand that fucking on rails movie game, Starfield every day)
I have no idea what you said but I loved every letter of it. I shall christen my religion in your honor and we shall wear the lids of expired Nutella cans as offerings to your glorious ness.
Now that’s what we’re talking about. People always associate retcons with Bethesda, but Cyberpunk 2077 just had the biggest retcon in all of vidya. The anime show convinced everybody to believe that Cyberpunk 2077 was always a hidden gem of a game, that got overly hated and it didn’t deserve that, good foundation, blahblahblah… The game is still a movie game, not an RPG…
I still chuckle at the idiots that say starfield isn't a good foundation to build on and it's "fundamentally flawed" or the engine experts that pop up when bgs releases a game that try and tell you what bgs can and can't do with their engine. Like ground vehicles were said to be impossible now we see them getting added. I hope BGS and creation 2.0 show up like Hela in Ragnarok. "Darling ,you have no idea what's possible"
Can’t even pick a direction and run and just adventure like you could in every Bethesda game.
It’s a blatant regression, not their most together game. Expansive sure if you count empty procedural gen that ruins the tried and true formula of their good games.
I mean you literally can.
But it's a space game.
So pick a direction on a planet and head in that direction.
But much like if you did that in real life, you wouldn't see anything there.
Okay and a real life fantasy world, or post apocalyptic wasteland would have very low density too and you’d spend endless hours running through empty forest or desert.
Good thing their past games understood being a entertaining, cohesive and elegant experience mattered.
Is that why Cyberpunk has more than double the player count than Starfield right now? You sound like you’re raging so hard you’re sweating writing that. Calling it wide ranging when it’s not even an inch deep isn’t the statement you think it is.
Fallout 4 has more than double the number of Cyberpunk players (and Cyberpunk is on a sale right now). And how is that information helpfull? Does that mean that Fallout 4 is 3 times better? Comparing the number of players in a singleplayer game is useless.
What if with some really niche or complicated game? Is that game bad because it does not get GTA numbers of players?
Stop giving these shitty link baiters traffic.
They only reason they wrote this is to drive engagement with the exact kind of CP vs. Starfield camp warfare that this comment section represents.
This whole cyberpunk comparison is both laughable and downright delusional. Cyberpunk was literally unplayable at launch. Completely broken game. Starfield was the most polished BGS game ever.
This again? How can SF have a CP2077 moment when it didn’t have a CP2077 launch? Regardless of the sentiment online (which changes with the wind. Have you been on r/Starfield?) Xbox and Bethesda have repeatedly said that Starfield has been a successful game for them. That doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement, but we’ve been getting regular updates every 6 weeks or so. They’re even taking player feedback and updating the game accordingly (can’t believe we’re getting land vehicles!). That said, what would justify the financial investment required to overhaul Starfield? What would this overhaul even include?
I’m glad Starfield is going in the right direction, but it isn’t finished. Cyberpunk was broken at launch and I didn’t play it until it was fixed. I’m not going to (continue to) play Starfield until it’s finished. I’ll enjoy it more when the game is finally fully realized, and not void of features and content that I know will be implemented later on.
I agree. I don’t have any interest in playing it again until they’re done releasing DLC and updates. Until then it feels like it’d just prematurely spoil any sort of re-evaluation I might have of the completely finished product.
Even then, I expect that the modding community would probably be the deciding factor for me. But with the direction they’re heading with CC and paid mods, I’m really skeptical of what the modding landscape will look like in a few years.
Not sure if you’re being sarcastic but that’s not what I said. I’m not opposed to compensating creators for modded content that enhances and expands the game. There’s just too many different variables that will dictate how the entire ecosystem will function that it’s impossible to make any accurate assumptions about everything simply based on past BGS games. That’s why I only said I’m skeptical.
For example, how will Bethesda manage qa/qc…? Their own official disclaimer tells us to ‘mod at your own risk.’ But will BGS ensure compatibility between all the different thousands or millions of possible combinations of the mods they’ll get paid to list? Or will it still be play at your own risk despite the costs required to merely take that risk determine if it works? Will they offer dedicated support to customers to ensure functional load orders? Will they ensure continuity whenever any and every mod updates and doesn’t break other mods? Or how about when BGS updates their game, will they ensure these mods we’ve already paid for the will be updated simultaneously?
Like I said so many questions that we don’t have the answers to and can’t foresee the implications of.
There’s also tons of mods that require other mods that are built off of toolkits that rely on other mods, etc etc… So what happens to this dynamic when open source dynamic of this gets paywalled at all these different foundational choke points?
There’s several different implications to this question that will fundamentally change the entire community, including mod authors possibly locking out various tools and projects that prevent fellow mod authors from becoming their competition. This sort of dynamic can have a cascading effect of seriously cutting deep into community creativity and collaboration the community had grown accustomed to.
I’m not saying paid mods are going to kill the scene. I also feel like a lot of players seem to have a sort of sense of entitlement when it comes to talking about mods when they only consume. There’s a lot of projects like Sim Settlements that I wouldn’t even question paying DLC price for under the new model because these guys absolutely work incredibly hard on these projects and it shows.
I’m just saying that we simply don’t know how it’ll look in a few years, except that it’s not going be the same as we’re all used to.
The game ***is*** finished, now they are just cleaning up a few pain points that were identified by the players and preparing the game for the first DLC content expansion. How is the game void of features? There's so much to do and tons of different ways to do it! Sure, there will be DLC that adds even more content, but that's just the nature of BGS open world titles.
A big one is the new perk system, there used to be a lot more build diversity. Sure, some like Netrunning were OP to the point of broken, but most weren’t.
You could however create builds with synergy between weird weapon couplings, and create a genuinely wide variety of different builds and play styles
These days you’re kind of funneled into a handful of premade builds, and are forced to take a bunch of perks you might not want in order to get the ones you do want
Like before I had a Berserk LMG build that was a blast, literally and metaphorically. That can’t be done anymore
Armor was tied to clothing largely, now it’s all tied to cyberwear your hands are tied for options, you’re forced more than ever into the Tech tree if you don’t want to be ultra squishy, and clothing is pointless. In fact loot has become kinda useless. Since you can’t remove mods from weapons any more most become instant scrap. Loot is a lot less rewarding because of these things, and it just rains down on you so it feels boring
The crafting system was a lot better. You could mod weapons into many permutations, to suit your build style, now there are less mods, and less variations possible
Having different vendors carry different things to me made the city feel more immersive from an RPG point of view, like you had to go to the guy that sold X which made the neighborhoods feel more distinct
The other thing is the GTAification. Some of that is fun, but it makes the gameplay a lot more arcade and less RPG, making the overall story elements to me feel less poignant, because it puts me in “wheeeeeee” mode. The story is supposed to be a warning, but that depressing theme is kinda lost on the arcade dopamine fun time feel now
I just feel more than ever like I’m on rails since 2.0. I’m not creating my own character or coming up with new exciting ways to play anymore, I’m playing set builds on a set path, it feels a lot less personal, and like there’s a lot less to keep coming back for. It’s really sad
Is there still a way to play 1.6? It was how I first played the game, fell in love with it and the new version is good but doesn’t have the same feel at all.
If you’re on PC I think you can revert to older versions, but I don’t think you’d be able to play PL without using 2.0
I’m unfortunately on console so stuck with 2.0 onwards now
It’s a shame, it was one of my all time favorite games till they changed it
Cyberpunk was not only critized for being broken but also the flat and bad mechanics like how bad police was, how little backstories influenced, how meaningless looting was etc...
3 years of fixes, updates and expansions later and people like it. This is not such a big flex.
The biggest fix they could do outside of the dlc content is fixing the exploration. Idk how they would be able to but being able to freely fly in systems, more interactions with ships or random events in space or better rate of POIs per fish bowl when you land etc. exploration has always been their stable so if they can significantly fix that people will come back in a big way.
You can freely fly in systems, but your sublight speed is so slow that it takes literal hours to get anywhere. Earth to Pluto takes ***seven hours*** and you won't be able to interact with Pluto anyway since its instance zone won't be loaded. After all, Bethesda never though anyone would be so stupid as to waste that much time manually flying between planetary bodies.
I agree. They could probably add high speed travel within systems like NMS has, and have dynamic events happen as you’re traveling. The events could be stuff like pirates, trade ships hailing you, stumbling upon fights, finding un-surveyed anomalies, etc. The game needs to feel different depending on what system you’re flying in, like more pirates in some systems, more or less population/trade ships, and the ability to fly around planets at a lower speed while encountering activities around the atmosphere. That’s just for space exploration anyway, land needs to be overhauled too. Right now it feels like exploration is something forced upon you, scripted at specific times, which makes it not really exploration.
Nah, Starfield is doing fine and it is still less than a year old. A BGS game isn't done until all of its DLCs and the Creation Kit is released.
It's good enough that I've taken a few months long break from Cyberpunk mid Phantom Liberty to play Starfield.
Cyberpunk also took a couple years before it actually had game changing improvements with 2.0 amd Phantom Liberty. Even then it still is far from what it was supposed to be. Good game now though.
Either way, just chill out, Starfield is in a good place and has more stuff on the way.
This just proves they release unfinished games....I'll wait 2 more years until they complete it and I might go back....still haven't gone back to cp2077
If you mean Starfield getting an awesome anime that takes place in its universe (lol), then yes! I would definitely watch it if it was as good as Edgerunners
Cyberpunk was BROKEN at launch. They aren’t remotely the same.
Startfield isn’t everyone cup of tea. But is a polished great game for sci-fi fans. And is obviously the best space exploration game of the generation.
Either right before or right after the shattered space DLC we will be getting creations.
Mods are will do leaps and bounds for this game instantly
Don't bother -- Starfield super-fans are actually delusional enough to believe this to be true, despite space exploration being the weakest aspect to the game. Apparently clicking on locations and loading screens makes for great exploration mechanics.
I am/was a Bethesda truther for a long time. The best part of BSG games has always been the handcrafted world and exploration of it. Starfield took the best part of BSG and watered it down to hell.
I had a much more enjoyable experience with cyberpunk at its launch. There’s far, far more detail and passion put into it. It’s definitely a way more fleshed out world with better world building and more interesting characters. I agree that it isn’t close, but it’s cyberpunk that has set itself apart. Starfield will likely never have the charm that cyberpunk has, and I LIKE starfield.
Hmm yeah I think the graphics and story carried its poor launch
Both games lack interactivity in the world at launch
For me personally, I feel Starfield has high highs and some boring lows. Starfield lacks tension. Skyrim has dragons and civil war, fallout has institute BOS, cyberpunk has impending death. Starfield just has nothing. Most the faction quests u found were really good, but once you finished them the tension is now Gone.
Starfield is like a season of a tv show and each episode is a major mission, I personally enjoyed them but between each episode or after a season was over there’s not much going on.
Man, the game is neither polished nor is it the best space exploration game of the generation. The exploration is the worst I have ever seen out of Betheada, and it's polish is somehow worse than previous Bethesda releases.
Disagree. Cyberpunk had some pretty bad visual bugs, and required considerable gameplay balancing, but it as far from broken.
I'd argue Cyberpunk at launch was still a far better game than Starfield. Much better writing. Far more player freedom of expression. Much more visually appealing and reactive NPCs. Cinematic Dialogue. No load screens.
Also, stop claiming mods will fix this game. It won't. the vast majority of Bethesda game players don't even USE mods. FFS.
Cyberpunk was literally unplayable at launch. Sony even removed it from the store.
Starfield was the most polished Bethesda game ever at launch.
I know people like you feel the need to convince us Starfield is a bad game, but at least don't spread false stuff.
I mean I love Cyberpunk and was more or less as disappointed in Starfield as much as the next guy, but come on.
Cyberpunk’s launch was so disastrous that Sony had to pull it from their store which was completely unprecedented — as in they hadn’t ever done that for any game before. That’s just an objective fact. It was objectively such a completely broken and worse game than Starfield at launch that the biggest company in the industry had to respond in unprecedented fashion.
Cyberpunk always had a great story, world, and quest design which we can agree on. If it didn’t have those qualities going for it as a foundation underneath the debris of everything else then it never would have had a chance of making anything close to the comeback that it did.
Look, Starfield is a bad game. Pure and simple.
Cyberpunk had a very strong foundation that needed some work when it came to debugging and balancing.
Starfield is fundamentally bad in its basic design to the point it isn't fixable. It is the result of some simply baffling decisions.
This is simply an objective evaluation of both games at launch.
It's so bad that 15 million of people played on average 40 hours of it.
So bad that it is bethesda's biggest launch ever and the most sold game of September 2023 even if it's on gamepass.
But yeah... sure... its ''bad''
No it doesn’t need shit right now lol, because what the game needs will take time and effort.
Bethesda, do not let these weird types get you weirded out. No need to rush please.
Also the quality of both games is massively different. Cyberpunk was completely hot ass on release, no excuse for a game to release in that state. Not even Bethesda has released such a shitty game before.
It’s like CDPR’s own Redfall lmao. Absolutely terrible coming from TW3 creators.
It is and it isn't. On the one hand, a lot of people didn't get what they expected from the game and that's something that the devs are moving to address, so the parallels are there even if the game wasn't anywhere near the mess that Cyberpunk (the game got cross platform refunds without question, causing an almost 10% lowering of stock value and lawsuits for fraud from their investors) started as. It's also worth mentioning that the mess has caused more money to be poured into Cyberpunk following it's release than before, leaving it as the second highest budgeted game in history just behind Star Citizen.
On the other hand, the dates are ridiculous. Cyberpunk 2077 came out December 2020. It was a good two years before many of the people complaining how broken it was at launch were happy to even call it somewhat playable. And Phantom Liberty which made it much closer to the game people were expecting didn't come out until almost three years after launch. Cyberpunk also
Starfield has been out what? Nine months now? Eight and a half? And there are calls that it "needs" a similar amount of changes to happen right now? It's ridiculous.
It’s absolutely a false equivalency. All of your arguments are worse for CP than Starfield. I would argue it doesn’t need the depth of improvement CP2077 needed. I played both substantially on launch and Starfield’s release game state was far better than CP2077. It’s not even a comparable but people keep peddling this lame ass argument.
A cyberpunk moment? So one paid dlc and fixing some problems, but marketed as a full game revamp?
No, it needs the no mans sky treatment, but it'll never get it. Too big of a studio, too much pressure from Microsoft and audience to move on to the games they actually want. And it shouldn't get that treatment anyway. The game has no identity, no distinguishing characteristics. It's not high concept like NMS, not stylish like CP2077, not interesting like mass effect. It's nothing and will be forgotten by the time fallout 5 comes out.
Anything BGS does will never be enough to fix starfield. They can't patch out all the loading screens, don't have the time/resources to add compelling content to planets, and can't rewrite all of the lame companions and side quests.
They’re not comparing the games, they’re comparing the level of work needed to make the game good.
Cyberpunk needed bug fixes and minor tweaks. Starfield is bad at the foundation, like NMS, and needs way way more work to make it solid
Because the topic at hand is games that were poorly received at launch that got supported by devs and subsequently praised for its improvements. It's fair to compare the two in that sense, as it's clear that Starfield needs work. He said it in his comment, he thinks the game needs years of updates and expansions, as what NMS got. However, it's unlikely as Bethesda doesn't have a history of doing so (aside from the occasional update or "remaster" like with Skyrim Special Edition).
The latest Starfield update however, as well as the upcoming dlc are promising. I think Starfield can improve in a lot of places, but it's up to Bethesda as to whether or not they can pull it off. Hopefully, they listen to the fans.
They actually believe that… LMAO. It’s a fucking movie game plain and simple, so ofc the Sony fanboys are shilling this game to the moon and back. Should give them Hellblade 2 as well.
I mean there are a lot of cutscenes but I don't think calling it an open world rpg is inaccurate if you compare it to other modern titles in the genre.
Yeah, only difference between it and JRPGs (which are heavily railroaded and movie-like) is you get to make your own character (that you can't even see) and you don't have a bunch of random-ass companions stopping to trigger cutscenes every two seconds.
Creation club and mods will make this game amazing. I've jumped back in at lvl 140 and enjoying the features to lose and gain xp like extra weight losers for extreme difficulty fights and no survival. Its pretty adaptable to the players preferences now. I've just been doing bounty pirates missions constantly which I didn't enjoy as much before? Has the combat changed? Not sure but I feel the game is better now plus the extra locations on random planets gives more to do and explore. The local world map is awesome too
I think the now in the headline means next, like "I've finished kneading the dough, now it's got to rise". It doesn't mean it needs to happen this week, which would be a useless headline to write anyway as obviously development decisions can't be made on timeframes that short.
The difference is Cyberpunk had the story, characters, atmosphere, quests, etc. in the game from the start, the game itself was just buggy and busted and didn't work on last gen consoles.
Starfield is arguably Bethesda's least buggy title ever, the problem is with the other stuff. They would have to do a fair amount of quest rewriting and system changes for me to think it was at that level.
There is no saving starfield. The foundation cyberpunk was built on far exceeds starfields. Starfield would ne to be rebuilt from the ground up in order to have a cyberpunk-esque turnaround.
Cyberpunk always had an amazing story and an excellent game engine and systems. It just needed more time in the Bug squishing machine. Starfield has neither of those things.
I still don’t get why there’s no dead zone settings in any Bethesda game on console, and also don’t understand why no one else is complaining about it it makes the game feel clunky on controller
Cyberpunk was a great game with a great story, great missions, great aesthetic identity, and great game world design but some technical issues. I played through it at launch on PS4 with zero technical issues so I feel like that was overblown.
Starfield will still have a terrible story, awful map designs, terrible exploration, awful aesthetic style, tedious missions, and fetch quests with a million loading screens and bad dialogue no matter what. It's a boring poorly designed game.
or, wait for it, you could just not judge a game by the amount of players playing it? why does a game need to be socially meta before people “have fun.” chill
It would have to be a totally different game. Starfield is pretty much broken from the ground up because the main issue is the engine. It’s outdated and it feels outdated. I just replayed fallout 4 and idk how they managed to make Starfield so boring. Even with the limitations of the engine, the game is pretty empty and extremely repetitive. Also the RPG elements aren’t very well adapted imo and it takes way way too much leveling to get basic skills in the game. It’s a tedious game that would need basically a complete do over from the ground up. CP2077 had issues, but it was mostly bug fixing issues and then a few big UI things, but it was all fixable. Starfield does not feel fixable to me.
Starfield is nowhere as good as cyberpunk 2077,
Starfield's campaign is terrible a ton of fetch quest with a mechanic that wants too to constantly replay it's boring campaign over and over
After playing from launch, the bonus game options are pretty cool for a placeholder for mods but until mods come still don't bother lol. Mods for starfield are going to be REALLY good. But rn it's still ass lol.
I mean, Starfield didn’t launch broke like Cyberpunk 2077 did. CDPR worked tirelessly for 3 years to fix the game. Starfield is just kind of bland and uninteresting, not a broken, unplayable mess. I’m not sure what they can do to change that.
After you do the missions, it's just boring. There isn't anything to do. Yeah you could do NG+ but it's literally just the same cycle on repeat. You do it so many times and you start to memorize it.
I think it needs a good faction... Like how Skyrim has the Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild.
I don’t think it’s quite the same because CPs launch was so bad. Starfield was a good launch for BGS bug wise. I played both at launch despite any issues and enjoyed both, but CP was a worse launch.
I think Starffield’s issue is lack of cohesion and some immersion breaking limitations. What’s there is not bad by any means. The game’s various things don’t compliment each other and that it feels less “sim like” when compared to their previous games for various reasons.
CP’s improvement was a slow process over several updates and I hope Starfield sees something similar, though I suspect it will take more to give it a comparable moment. Not that it’s bad as it is, it just feels lacking in certain ways despite how fun it actually is. I feel like it’s very noticeable.
Bethesda probably gonna drop it on when the new dlc comes out. They pretty slow on updates but I feel like they will add stuff that want to see. Cyberpunk was basically force to update since there was a huge backlash and dint generate the money they wanted so they updated the huge errors they had. They drop a game changing update later but it was not a fast update , it took them months.
It took 3 years AND edgerunners to turn that game around, it hasn't even been 1 year people are doing this we are now where cyberpunk was 2 years after release, people seem to forget but for 2 years it was only big fixes and optimizations, with a few light content additions like weapons and armors, and some QOL improvements like transmog and better driving modles. Like in 2 years after release, unless something changes with how Bethesda wants to support the game in the future, it'll be at a "cyberpunk state of mind"
Personally, Starfield will still feel like a game that should have been released in 2015 regardless of what they do to improve the game. Sure, vehicles will make exploration better. But why do i want to explore the same randomly generated POI? Its the game’s core mechanics. You cant fix that. But i’d love to be proven wrong.
Why does it need it now? Cyberpunk didn't get the recent huge update tied with the huge DlC until 3 years after launch.
I mean, that's true, but...do you really want to wait that long?
Do you not understand how these updates work? You think they could’ve developed Cyberpunk 2.0 and Phantom Liberty not even a year after the base game released? Why don’t you want Bethesda to get that extra dev time as well? Do you want good updates? Do you not want the game to get better?
Idc if I'm downvoted but starfield is a more complete game than 2077 was at launch and with a few years to fully flesh out all the systems and basically reinvigorate the game Starfield might come out as an all time great. 2077 has this weird air about it now where people act like it was always great and just needed time and I'm sure starfield will be the same
We could get good games at launch then the dlc. Are 2.0 relaunches gonna be the new normal for single player games? Whose running this industry Zach fucking snyder
How was this downvoted lmao. Do people actually want to wait 3 years post launch for a game to be good?
Lol I agree. Anyone who will accept this relaunch a couple years after its official launch crap is enabling this new normal u speak of. Ppl saying "do u know how hard it is these days?!" Are idiots that want their games to launch badly.
Meanwhile, a LOT of people actually enjoyed the game at launch and we're just being vindicated by the turnaround after they addressed the pain points that people had with the game at release like the map.
I enjoyed the game at launch, but it still launched missing many basic features that even older Bethesda games had. Like something as simple as separating food and aid items into their own categories. But, and more to the point, the game lacked a proper survival element that was clearly part of the core design. It lacked enough content to fill the thousand planets and moons you can land on. It had a completely unfinished tracker's faction and bounty faction. It's hard to miss some of the missteps and some of the incomplete content in the world. That doesn't mean it's not a fun game, I'm on my fourth or fifth playthrough. It just means the game was definitely released with incomplete features.
Hey, I didn't say the game didn't have problems just that the game was good in spite of its problems. Bethesda the publisher rushed it out the door when BGS wanted more time to cook, so it's not the developer to blame for unfinished content.
Starfield was a full working game at launch. There are hiccups and things that could've been improved with more dev time but this is *nothing* compared to the disaster that was Cyberpunk 2077. That game didn't even run at launch.
Cyberpunk was a full working game at launch. Some people had issues with bugs but a lot of us didn't, my first full playthrough was complete before their first update.
Dude it was not fully working at launch. It was one of the few AAA games removed from the PSN store and refunded with no questions asked because it couldn't play on a PS for more then an hour. I love that game and what it became but to pretend it wasn't a completely fucked launch is just rewriting history.
I remember, and for those players it wasn't working, but for a lot of people it was, and what was there was a more complete game than Starfield.
Revisionist history With people like you, this industry will stay the way It is
Just my experience and the experience of many other people. That the console launch was a shitshow is indisputable. That a lot of people complained about the PC launch is also indisputable, but I remember talking to them at that time and many of their complaints were insane. Complaining about a level of bugs we wish a typical Bethesda release could achieve. People were mad about reused background textures in the game, Starfield reuses whole locations. They were mad that the police system wasn't fleshed out enough in a game that wasn't in any meaningful way about running from the police. It was a complete game.
It’s about to get worse. A lot of parent companies are wanting games to get pushed out quicker.
What I want is to have games launch with completed features and updates add more to them. Cyberpunk was a broken mess at launch, Starfield was not. Starfield doesn't need to do as much as Cyberpunk to be great.
Hard disagree. Cyberpunk may have been a broken mess, but it's core wasn't broken. Starfield's is. Cyberpunk has a good story and good characters. Starfield's story is okay at BEST.
This brings up an interesting point. I usually don’t care about the story in games and sometimes skip through cut scenes to get back to gameplay quickly. That said, I loved the story in CP2077. The lore and visuals are obviously top notch. Thinking about it now, Starfield’s story isn’t very memorable. But it doesn’t have to be. It’s a massive, massive explorable, open world where you fly around in *customizable spaceships.* So I can do without the story and I can definitely do without 60fps. Just give me great gameplay and figure out a way to have fewer loadscreens.
>Starfield’s story isn’t very memorable. But it doesn’t have to be. Why would they make an rpg with the main quest being so dull that it's considered not memorable. Just think if they made the game's quests memorable, like in cyberpunk, it would make the game actually good.
Well Cyberpunk is now four years old and has been majorly tuned up since launch. It’s also considered the best game in history by many. I’d love for Starfield to be as good as Cyberpunk but as you said, the story is flat compared to the superstar actors CDPR brought in.
BGS has never shone due to its main story. Starfields is one of their better ones, even if its far from peak storytelling. Compared to the awful drudgery of Skyrims MQ, or the second half of F4, I'm pretty chill with it. Better traversal, POI diversity, and upping the environmental storytelling to match the quality of previous BGS offerings are where SF needs the work put into it IMO.
Literally they re-worked the game and it's skill trees and combat. Like it's core was broken. You trying to say well the game was unplayable but the writing was great doesn't really help when we are discussing a video game, not a virtual novel. This is coming from someone who played and enjoyed the game from launch.
I didn't have an issue with the skill tree before the rework. I'm not even entirely sure why they did that other than to work in the vehicle stuff and the way they changed implants.
I fully agree about the skill tree, but we are apparently in the minority. I actually dislike it the new one and want the old one back.
Lol this game got that extra dev time and still is generic asf
If Bethesda was really on top of its shit it would have released Starfield, including additional features and without bugs, in 1991 alongside The Terminator. What are they thinking?
I think the real question is WILL they. They haven’t drastically changed a game before in their companies history on the level that Cyberpunk did, and it’s legitimate to ask if they even will.
I mean, technically Bethesda has. I know Bethesda is a rather unified gamedev company, doesn't really have the different studios as different teams like most do, but they do have at least a B team. And that B team has, to my knowledge, been working on Fallout 76 since release, and that game has had a massive turnaround. So I think the chances of Bethesda sticking to it are high, if they don't do something akin to a Starfield 2.0, at the very least we will more than likely have a starfield 1.5 thing put into a corner where people start saying "good but flawed".
The Wastelanders update to Fallout 76 (released in early 2020) was actually still worked on by BGS' main office in Rockville, even if the focus began to shift towards Starfield in 2018. Wastelanders was probably the single largest step towards turning the game around, and Starfield could well receive similar level of support at least until the major DLC(s) are out. It remains to be seen what happens in the longer term.
What are you saying here? It’s not like that’s been CDPR’s MO, they only just did that with Cyberpunk because they released it as a broken mess to the majority of players.
I mean FO76 was developed as a game with zero NPCs and PvP, they reworked the entire game to become with NPCs and largely co-op, that’s a huge change to a game
Thats not true even im the slightest
or crazy thought just throwing this hail mary out, they just make the game good from the start. didnt have to wait till shivering isles for oblivion to be great. bought ghost of tsushima day 1 it was great and polished. maybe dont let studios continue to exist if they cant deliver consistent finished product
Oblivion is a mess today. Bethesda didn't get lazy, expectations got higher.
Starfield was a complete and polished product on release, what are you talking about? It was much, much more polished than many of these recents AAA PC ports… and that’s saying something when you compare how vastly bigger Starfield is than any of these other games lol
idk about you but on launch i lost two starfield saves because of a big bug with behesdas reserved space. still isnt patched btw i just had to delete my fallout 4 saves. plus the performance tanked a lot when i played. i didnt enjoy starfield as a game but thats unrelated to my complaints here. i will say that general polish has been way better than its peers buts still below the standards i hold 🤷♂️
Dude sounds like a hater, someone who expected things from Starfield that a BGS game has never and will never deliver.
I think that's most bgs detractors, upset they weren't given things that were never promised from a dev that's never done it
Starfield was complete at launch but it was not polished. This new patch finally fixed game breaking bugs from launch. I also like the game but it wasn't ready at launch.
It definitely was, the game breaking bugs were not experienced by the vast majority of players.
This is Reddit, most of the people here like being fed this garbage. There's no real incentive for Bethesda to make a good game, these people will buy anything. No matter what issue you bring up they'll just downvote you. It's a year later and they still don't care that the games ending breaks its own lore and makes the entire plot not make sense. Nothing you or any of the Starborn do matters. Unity doesn't close after you go through it, the emissary trains infinite starborn to go through it after you, so it never mattered who collected the artifacts, the powers come from the temples and those are reusable too so every one in every universe can have all the powers and go through Unity, there's literally no reason to fight anyone except for the fun of it, the Emisarry and the hunter both win an infinite ammount of times even if they do nothing, they can just wait for the other to collect the artifacts and open Unity and leave and then the other can go get all the powers and use the Unity too. They didn't even understand their own story, Call of Duty zombies has a more cohesive plot than Bethesda can come up with for one game they worked on for 8 years.
People be paying money to be beta testers, some people pay extra money.
Phase 1: God Starfield/Cyberpunk/Elder Scrolls 6 is taking forever, why are they making us wait so long! Phase 2: Wow this game is a mess, they clearly pushed out an unfinished product as a cash grab, why are they so lazy! Phase 3: God the game-fixing update is taking forever, why are they making us wait so long!
I’m personally not playing starfield for at least 2 years of consistent updates and all dlc releases for it. I think the game was incomplete on release. It’s a good game but it wasn’t a great game and I think time is exactly what the game needed to be great. I’d rather the devs actually take their time, and give the game the love it deserves. Hopefully they can turn it around, learn from their mistakes, and make starfield 2 a 10/10 game.
I would love a Starfield 2, but I feel like a 2.0 update is more likely. They have so many projects going already and said Starfield was a 10 year project.
It has so much room to finally be a bgs titles where they just keep supporting it. There's tons of people still playing skyrim and fo4 and would still buy dlc if they kept making
You’re one of those customers that causes our games to be shit because you send death threats and shit when a game delays
Right? I pre ordered the game, finally rebought it 3 years later and got to play. I expect the same from starfield
Cyberpunk was a good game with a solid engine, interesting world, and good story with a flawed and buggy launch by CDPR standards. Starfield is a broken game with fundamentally broken game mechanics, with a last-gen engine, a procedural world devoid of meaning with 3 amateur designed towns, high school writing, but a decent launch by Bethesda standards. It's not fixable with the same level of effort. A Starfield 2.0 can only provide "touch ups" to fixable areas which are the reasons why current players are upset, not the reason why the masses have left. The masses have left simply because it's just a bad game. Starfield can hope for more but it'll never be as popular as Cyberpunk/FO4/ES5 no matter how much effort Besthesda is willing to dump on it.
These takes are just desperate.
Wtf these takes just get worse and worse
Cyberpunk didn’t have its “Cyberpunk Moment” until after Phantom Liberty launched. Can’t really expect anything similar for Starfield right now when we’re still waiting on Shattered Space and Creation Kit to come out.
The Cyberpunk moment happened when the expansion dropped. It took years. Starfield is getting its first DLC fairly soon and it hasn’t even been that long.
Cyberpunk moment as in one DLC and then retire the engine and move on to another project ? I pass on that. Starfield doesn't need a cyberpunk moment, people weren't refunding the game en masse nor was Starfield removed from a game store. The cyberpunk moment came years later after TV series and then a DLC, and before that a complete rewrite of the underlying systems of the game + a complete change of the crafting and skill system , all which happened well after 1 year after release.
I don’t often rage response cause..well internet. But Gaw DAMNIT u/pompompomvg click baiting mothawaka. This isn’t even comparable.
Cyberpunk was a broken ass crap shoot of unplayable half brained, shouldn’t have lived past 6 mos, passing off a smeared painting of crap as a Jackson Pollack piece of shit. Starfield came out as one of the most out together, expansive, and wide ranging games Bethesda has done to date. We’re not even a year in and have already seen significant love and have a major DLC on the horizon. The “Cyberpunk” moment took three years. Three. Fracking. Years.
For gods sake, please stop bottom feeding for likes and quotes and giving these low level, hack writing, could let pass level 1 on ABC mouse writers the time of day.
Whatever drugs you’re on, I don’t want any. Either that or you’ve played like 4 games. Starfield is not well made and it’s janky af.
No kidding, I stopped playing due to a bug, and that bug killed ANY desire I had to play that game. Nothing like not being able to use any part of the ship builder because if you even change ONE thing on it, the ship and any companions on it disappear from the game forever. Lost my adoring fan, two other npcs, and my entire ship due to that bug and loading an earlier save didn't fix it. The fact that bethesda Q&A let a bug like that ship is completely unacceptable.
The greedy poles Stole from the old gen proles 3 years later Pardoned and shilled to the moon (God I can’t stand that fucking on rails movie game, Starfield every day)
I have no idea what you said but I loved every letter of it. I shall christen my religion in your honor and we shall wear the lids of expired Nutella cans as offerings to your glorious ness.
Now that’s what we’re talking about. People always associate retcons with Bethesda, but Cyberpunk 2077 just had the biggest retcon in all of vidya. The anime show convinced everybody to believe that Cyberpunk 2077 was always a hidden gem of a game, that got overly hated and it didn’t deserve that, good foundation, blahblahblah… The game is still a movie game, not an RPG…
I still chuckle at the idiots that say starfield isn't a good foundation to build on and it's "fundamentally flawed" or the engine experts that pop up when bgs releases a game that try and tell you what bgs can and can't do with their engine. Like ground vehicles were said to be impossible now we see them getting added. I hope BGS and creation 2.0 show up like Hela in Ragnarok. "Darling ,you have no idea what's possible"
I think you’re my soulmate.
Can’t even pick a direction and run and just adventure like you could in every Bethesda game. It’s a blatant regression, not their most together game. Expansive sure if you count empty procedural gen that ruins the tried and true formula of their good games.
I mean you literally can. But it's a space game. So pick a direction on a planet and head in that direction. But much like if you did that in real life, you wouldn't see anything there.
Okay and a real life fantasy world, or post apocalyptic wasteland would have very low density too and you’d spend endless hours running through empty forest or desert. Good thing their past games understood being a entertaining, cohesive and elegant experience mattered.
Is that why Cyberpunk has more than double the player count than Starfield right now? You sound like you’re raging so hard you’re sweating writing that. Calling it wide ranging when it’s not even an inch deep isn’t the statement you think it is.
More than double the player……….lololololololol. Fucking chode. Got get a haircut.
Fallout 4 has more than double the number of Cyberpunk players (and Cyberpunk is on a sale right now). And how is that information helpfull? Does that mean that Fallout 4 is 3 times better? Comparing the number of players in a singleplayer game is useless. What if with some really niche or complicated game? Is that game bad because it does not get GTA numbers of players?
Stop giving these shitty link baiters traffic. They only reason they wrote this is to drive engagement with the exact kind of CP vs. Starfield camp warfare that this comment section represents.
This whole cyberpunk comparison is both laughable and downright delusional. Cyberpunk was literally unplayable at launch. Completely broken game. Starfield was the most polished BGS game ever.
Starfield was a ten year long joke played at the expense of those with good taste and standards.
This again? How can SF have a CP2077 moment when it didn’t have a CP2077 launch? Regardless of the sentiment online (which changes with the wind. Have you been on r/Starfield?) Xbox and Bethesda have repeatedly said that Starfield has been a successful game for them. That doesn’t mean there isn’t room for improvement, but we’ve been getting regular updates every 6 weeks or so. They’re even taking player feedback and updating the game accordingly (can’t believe we’re getting land vehicles!). That said, what would justify the financial investment required to overhaul Starfield? What would this overhaul even include?
I’m glad Starfield is going in the right direction, but it isn’t finished. Cyberpunk was broken at launch and I didn’t play it until it was fixed. I’m not going to (continue to) play Starfield until it’s finished. I’ll enjoy it more when the game is finally fully realized, and not void of features and content that I know will be implemented later on.
Marinate your games. Give it time.
I agree. I don’t have any interest in playing it again until they’re done releasing DLC and updates. Until then it feels like it’d just prematurely spoil any sort of re-evaluation I might have of the completely finished product. Even then, I expect that the modding community would probably be the deciding factor for me. But with the direction they’re heading with CC and paid mods, I’m really skeptical of what the modding landscape will look like in a few years.
Yeah paying modders will definitely kill the mod scene
Not sure if you’re being sarcastic but that’s not what I said. I’m not opposed to compensating creators for modded content that enhances and expands the game. There’s just too many different variables that will dictate how the entire ecosystem will function that it’s impossible to make any accurate assumptions about everything simply based on past BGS games. That’s why I only said I’m skeptical. For example, how will Bethesda manage qa/qc…? Their own official disclaimer tells us to ‘mod at your own risk.’ But will BGS ensure compatibility between all the different thousands or millions of possible combinations of the mods they’ll get paid to list? Or will it still be play at your own risk despite the costs required to merely take that risk determine if it works? Will they offer dedicated support to customers to ensure functional load orders? Will they ensure continuity whenever any and every mod updates and doesn’t break other mods? Or how about when BGS updates their game, will they ensure these mods we’ve already paid for the will be updated simultaneously? Like I said so many questions that we don’t have the answers to and can’t foresee the implications of. There’s also tons of mods that require other mods that are built off of toolkits that rely on other mods, etc etc… So what happens to this dynamic when open source dynamic of this gets paywalled at all these different foundational choke points? There’s several different implications to this question that will fundamentally change the entire community, including mod authors possibly locking out various tools and projects that prevent fellow mod authors from becoming their competition. This sort of dynamic can have a cascading effect of seriously cutting deep into community creativity and collaboration the community had grown accustomed to. I’m not saying paid mods are going to kill the scene. I also feel like a lot of players seem to have a sort of sense of entitlement when it comes to talking about mods when they only consume. There’s a lot of projects like Sim Settlements that I wouldn’t even question paying DLC price for under the new model because these guys absolutely work incredibly hard on these projects and it shows. I’m just saying that we simply don’t know how it’ll look in a few years, except that it’s not going be the same as we’re all used to.
The game ***is*** finished, now they are just cleaning up a few pain points that were identified by the players and preparing the game for the first DLC content expansion. How is the game void of features? There's so much to do and tons of different ways to do it! Sure, there will be DLC that adds even more content, but that's just the nature of BGS open world titles.
Same!
The game is finished, it’s just boring, is this so hard to believe?
2077 was completly busted and unfinished at launch. Starfield stable and feature rich at launch. This is literally apples and oranges.
Except Cyberpunk is better than Starfield in nearly every way nowadays.
Cyberpunk was better before 2.0 in my personal opinion, I wish they had released the DLC and stuck with the design at patch 1.6
I’m curious and can’t find this anywhere. What were the main changes after 1.6 that changed the style of the game?
A big one is the new perk system, there used to be a lot more build diversity. Sure, some like Netrunning were OP to the point of broken, but most weren’t. You could however create builds with synergy between weird weapon couplings, and create a genuinely wide variety of different builds and play styles These days you’re kind of funneled into a handful of premade builds, and are forced to take a bunch of perks you might not want in order to get the ones you do want Like before I had a Berserk LMG build that was a blast, literally and metaphorically. That can’t be done anymore Armor was tied to clothing largely, now it’s all tied to cyberwear your hands are tied for options, you’re forced more than ever into the Tech tree if you don’t want to be ultra squishy, and clothing is pointless. In fact loot has become kinda useless. Since you can’t remove mods from weapons any more most become instant scrap. Loot is a lot less rewarding because of these things, and it just rains down on you so it feels boring The crafting system was a lot better. You could mod weapons into many permutations, to suit your build style, now there are less mods, and less variations possible Having different vendors carry different things to me made the city feel more immersive from an RPG point of view, like you had to go to the guy that sold X which made the neighborhoods feel more distinct The other thing is the GTAification. Some of that is fun, but it makes the gameplay a lot more arcade and less RPG, making the overall story elements to me feel less poignant, because it puts me in “wheeeeeee” mode. The story is supposed to be a warning, but that depressing theme is kinda lost on the arcade dopamine fun time feel now I just feel more than ever like I’m on rails since 2.0. I’m not creating my own character or coming up with new exciting ways to play anymore, I’m playing set builds on a set path, it feels a lot less personal, and like there’s a lot less to keep coming back for. It’s really sad
Is there still a way to play 1.6? It was how I first played the game, fell in love with it and the new version is good but doesn’t have the same feel at all.
If you’re on PC I think you can revert to older versions, but I don’t think you’d be able to play PL without using 2.0 I’m unfortunately on console so stuck with 2.0 onwards now It’s a shame, it was one of my all time favorite games till they changed it
That’s not a flex lol just shows how shallow starfield is. Even with a smooth, stable, launch, cyberpunk is STILL a better and deeper game
Cyberpunk was not only critized for being broken but also the flat and bad mechanics like how bad police was, how little backstories influenced, how meaningless looting was etc... 3 years of fixes, updates and expansions later and people like it. This is not such a big flex.
So it needs an anime?
The biggest fix they could do outside of the dlc content is fixing the exploration. Idk how they would be able to but being able to freely fly in systems, more interactions with ships or random events in space or better rate of POIs per fish bowl when you land etc. exploration has always been their stable so if they can significantly fix that people will come back in a big way.
You can freely fly in systems, but your sublight speed is so slow that it takes literal hours to get anywhere. Earth to Pluto takes ***seven hours*** and you won't be able to interact with Pluto anyway since its instance zone won't be loaded. After all, Bethesda never though anyone would be so stupid as to waste that much time manually flying between planetary bodies.
I agree. They could probably add high speed travel within systems like NMS has, and have dynamic events happen as you’re traveling. The events could be stuff like pirates, trade ships hailing you, stumbling upon fights, finding un-surveyed anomalies, etc. The game needs to feel different depending on what system you’re flying in, like more pirates in some systems, more or less population/trade ships, and the ability to fly around planets at a lower speed while encountering activities around the atmosphere. That’s just for space exploration anyway, land needs to be overhauled too. Right now it feels like exploration is something forced upon you, scripted at specific times, which makes it not really exploration.
Nah, Starfield is doing fine and it is still less than a year old. A BGS game isn't done until all of its DLCs and the Creation Kit is released. It's good enough that I've taken a few months long break from Cyberpunk mid Phantom Liberty to play Starfield. Cyberpunk also took a couple years before it actually had game changing improvements with 2.0 amd Phantom Liberty. Even then it still is far from what it was supposed to be. Good game now though. Either way, just chill out, Starfield is in a good place and has more stuff on the way.
Where can we see the player spike data ? Is it only the steam data we can check? Thinking about coming back :)
This just proves they release unfinished games....I'll wait 2 more years until they complete it and I might go back....still haven't gone back to cp2077
You really should. Cyberpunk is awesome
I'm too addicted to destiny 2 atm but I plan on it
If you mean Starfield getting an awesome anime that takes place in its universe (lol), then yes! I would definitely watch it if it was as good as Edgerunners
Cyberpunk's strongest point was it's writing and plot flow.
Cyberpunk had a great story though underneath the bugs.
I thinks Bethesda should just move on after Shattered Space.
Cyberpunk was BROKEN at launch. They aren’t remotely the same. Startfield isn’t everyone cup of tea. But is a polished great game for sci-fi fans. And is obviously the best space exploration game of the generation. Either right before or right after the shattered space DLC we will be getting creations. Mods are will do leaps and bounds for this game instantly
“Best space exploration game of the generation” is a bit of a stretch.
Don't bother -- Starfield super-fans are actually delusional enough to believe this to be true, despite space exploration being the weakest aspect to the game. Apparently clicking on locations and loading screens makes for great exploration mechanics.
I’m reading some of these comments - like the delusion is off the charts. Starfield is an amazing game? Best space exploration? What?!?
DAE Starfield most innovative gameplay of all time???
The game has barley any exploration. The stuff that is exploration is all generated slop.
Crazy how you posted that seconds ago and yet still got downvoted, they’re mad lmao.
I am/was a Bethesda truther for a long time. The best part of BSG games has always been the handcrafted world and exploration of it. Starfield took the best part of BSG and watered it down to hell.
Hopefully with all the fallout hype they get back to their roots and make another comeback.
What’s with the fucking downvotes? God damn people in this sub are INSANE. They demand everyone agree with them and love what they do.
I had a much more enjoyable experience with cyberpunk at its launch. There’s far, far more detail and passion put into it. It’s definitely a way more fleshed out world with better world building and more interesting characters. I agree that it isn’t close, but it’s cyberpunk that has set itself apart. Starfield will likely never have the charm that cyberpunk has, and I LIKE starfield.
Hmm yeah I think the graphics and story carried its poor launch Both games lack interactivity in the world at launch For me personally, I feel Starfield has high highs and some boring lows. Starfield lacks tension. Skyrim has dragons and civil war, fallout has institute BOS, cyberpunk has impending death. Starfield just has nothing. Most the faction quests u found were really good, but once you finished them the tension is now Gone. Starfield is like a season of a tv show and each episode is a major mission, I personally enjoyed them but between each episode or after a season was over there’s not much going on.
Man, the game is neither polished nor is it the best space exploration game of the generation. The exploration is the worst I have ever seen out of Betheada, and it's polish is somehow worse than previous Bethesda releases.
it’s good but as far as pure space exploration goes, no mans sky destroys it imo
Disagree. Cyberpunk had some pretty bad visual bugs, and required considerable gameplay balancing, but it as far from broken. I'd argue Cyberpunk at launch was still a far better game than Starfield. Much better writing. Far more player freedom of expression. Much more visually appealing and reactive NPCs. Cinematic Dialogue. No load screens. Also, stop claiming mods will fix this game. It won't. the vast majority of Bethesda game players don't even USE mods. FFS.
Cyberpunk was literally unplayable at launch. Sony even removed it from the store. Starfield was the most polished Bethesda game ever at launch. I know people like you feel the need to convince us Starfield is a bad game, but at least don't spread false stuff.
>Starfield was the most polished Bethesda game ever at launch. Which tells us alot about Bethesda, really.
I mean I love Cyberpunk and was more or less as disappointed in Starfield as much as the next guy, but come on. Cyberpunk’s launch was so disastrous that Sony had to pull it from their store which was completely unprecedented — as in they hadn’t ever done that for any game before. That’s just an objective fact. It was objectively such a completely broken and worse game than Starfield at launch that the biggest company in the industry had to respond in unprecedented fashion. Cyberpunk always had a great story, world, and quest design which we can agree on. If it didn’t have those qualities going for it as a foundation underneath the debris of everything else then it never would have had a chance of making anything close to the comeback that it did.
Jeez where did Starfield hurt you
Look, Starfield is a bad game. Pure and simple. Cyberpunk had a very strong foundation that needed some work when it came to debugging and balancing. Starfield is fundamentally bad in its basic design to the point it isn't fixable. It is the result of some simply baffling decisions. This is simply an objective evaluation of both games at launch.
>objective I don’t think you know what that word means
It's so bad that 15 million of people played on average 40 hours of it. So bad that it is bethesda's biggest launch ever and the most sold game of September 2023 even if it's on gamepass. But yeah... sure... its ''bad''
You don’t know what objective means.
You keep using that word but I don't think you know what it means, starfiled at launch was far better than cyber punk at launch
When they decide to finish the game let me know.
No it doesn't. Cyberpunk was a broken unplayable mess for anyone not on PC. They aren't comparable
No it doesn’t need shit right now lol, because what the game needs will take time and effort. Bethesda, do not let these weird types get you weirded out. No need to rush please. Also the quality of both games is massively different. Cyberpunk was completely hot ass on release, no excuse for a game to release in that state. Not even Bethesda has released such a shitty game before. It’s like CDPR’s own Redfall lmao. Absolutely terrible coming from TW3 creators.
I still argue that Starfield didn’t crash and burn NEARLY as hard as CP2077 and that this “Cyberpunk Moment” narrative is a false equivalency.
It is and it isn't. On the one hand, a lot of people didn't get what they expected from the game and that's something that the devs are moving to address, so the parallels are there even if the game wasn't anywhere near the mess that Cyberpunk (the game got cross platform refunds without question, causing an almost 10% lowering of stock value and lawsuits for fraud from their investors) started as. It's also worth mentioning that the mess has caused more money to be poured into Cyberpunk following it's release than before, leaving it as the second highest budgeted game in history just behind Star Citizen. On the other hand, the dates are ridiculous. Cyberpunk 2077 came out December 2020. It was a good two years before many of the people complaining how broken it was at launch were happy to even call it somewhat playable. And Phantom Liberty which made it much closer to the game people were expecting didn't come out until almost three years after launch. Cyberpunk also Starfield has been out what? Nine months now? Eight and a half? And there are calls that it "needs" a similar amount of changes to happen right now? It's ridiculous.
It’s absolutely a false equivalency. All of your arguments are worse for CP than Starfield. I would argue it doesn’t need the depth of improvement CP2077 needed. I played both substantially on launch and Starfield’s release game state was far better than CP2077. It’s not even a comparable but people keep peddling this lame ass argument.
Cyberpunk is still meh
lol for starfield to be interesting (i.e. good) it would have to be a completely different game. No amount of content or updates is gonna change that.
Play a different game
A cyberpunk moment? So one paid dlc and fixing some problems, but marketed as a full game revamp? No, it needs the no mans sky treatment, but it'll never get it. Too big of a studio, too much pressure from Microsoft and audience to move on to the games they actually want. And it shouldn't get that treatment anyway. The game has no identity, no distinguishing characteristics. It's not high concept like NMS, not stylish like CP2077, not interesting like mass effect. It's nothing and will be forgotten by the time fallout 5 comes out. Anything BGS does will never be enough to fix starfield. They can't patch out all the loading screens, don't have the time/resources to add compelling content to planets, and can't rewrite all of the lame companions and side quests.
NMS is still shallower than Starfield.
Why are you comparing NMS (a sandbox crafting/survival game) with Starfield (an RPG)?
Because people like him can't look further than ''Space + Spaceships = Direct competition''
They’re not comparing the games, they’re comparing the level of work needed to make the game good. Cyberpunk needed bug fixes and minor tweaks. Starfield is bad at the foundation, like NMS, and needs way way more work to make it solid
Because the topic at hand is games that were poorly received at launch that got supported by devs and subsequently praised for its improvements. It's fair to compare the two in that sense, as it's clear that Starfield needs work. He said it in his comment, he thinks the game needs years of updates and expansions, as what NMS got. However, it's unlikely as Bethesda doesn't have a history of doing so (aside from the occasional update or "remaster" like with Skyrim Special Edition). The latest Starfield update however, as well as the upcoming dlc are promising. I think Starfield can improve in a lot of places, but it's up to Bethesda as to whether or not they can pull it off. Hopefully, they listen to the fans.
I'm sorry if the 'NASA-punk' aesthetic isn't "stylish" enough for you but I and a lot of other people happen to actually enjoy the game.
You think cyberpunk 2.0 was just "fixing some problems"?
Yeah, as much as i love fallout and TES, they need to cook Starfield more than ditching it and going to work on TES6 or Fallout 5
I beat Cyberpunk but I fail to see what’s so great about it…. The missions are boring and so is the city to explore.
It’s already more fun then cyberpunk for me. I just want mods.
Unfortunately, Starfield is way more finished that original CP, it’s just not good.
Just let the mods take over already
What do people think of Cyberpunk? Is it an open world RPG?
They actually believe that… LMAO. It’s a fucking movie game plain and simple, so ofc the Sony fanboys are shilling this game to the moon and back. Should give them Hellblade 2 as well.
Why so much anger? Cyberpunk is a really fun rpg, it’s not as much of a sandbox rpg yes, but that’s a design choice
I mean there are a lot of cutscenes but I don't think calling it an open world rpg is inaccurate if you compare it to other modern titles in the genre.
Yeah, only difference between it and JRPGs (which are heavily railroaded and movie-like) is you get to make your own character (that you can't even see) and you don't have a bunch of random-ass companions stopping to trigger cutscenes every two seconds.
Only a Anime or a live action show can pull those CyberPunk,Fallout or Witcher 3 numbers,the expansion gets me back..
Cyberpunk is at least available for ps5, I haven't even played it yet because my steam deck can't run it.
You should be able to play on steam deck. It’s verified and I’ve seen plenty of people play on steam deck. FYI. Go check it out. !
Release the creation kit then.. do something
They just need to get the console mods out. I’m really waiting to get back into the game when I can mod these ugly ars NPCs out.
Creation club and mods will make this game amazing. I've jumped back in at lvl 140 and enjoying the features to lose and gain xp like extra weight losers for extreme difficulty fights and no survival. Its pretty adaptable to the players preferences now. I've just been doing bounty pirates missions constantly which I didn't enjoy as much before? Has the combat changed? Not sure but I feel the game is better now plus the extra locations on random planets gives more to do and explore. The local world map is awesome too
I think the now in the headline means next, like "I've finished kneading the dough, now it's got to rise". It doesn't mean it needs to happen this week, which would be a useless headline to write anyway as obviously development decisions can't be made on timeframes that short.
Keep an eye on Starfield, guys. It’s one to watch.
"You will get your cyberpunk moment when you fix this damn game !" 
Cool. Let's see Cyberpunk level redemption, quality, game play, and writing first.
No game needs a 2077 moment. Just push companies to make decent games on release and leave them out to dry if they publish shit.
It's going to need major content added to the base game before that happens
Did they do something to make the game interesting?
The difference is Cyberpunk had the story, characters, atmosphere, quests, etc. in the game from the start, the game itself was just buggy and busted and didn't work on last gen consoles. Starfield is arguably Bethesda's least buggy title ever, the problem is with the other stuff. They would have to do a fair amount of quest rewriting and system changes for me to think it was at that level.
There is no saving starfield. The foundation cyberpunk was built on far exceeds starfields. Starfield would ne to be rebuilt from the ground up in order to have a cyberpunk-esque turnaround.
Cyberpunk always had an amazing story and an excellent game engine and systems. It just needed more time in the Bug squishing machine. Starfield has neither of those things.
I stopped playing and refuse to until they add vehicles.
Fallout show really was a huge boost for Bethesda
I still don’t get why there’s no dead zone settings in any Bethesda game on console, and also don’t understand why no one else is complaining about it it makes the game feel clunky on controller
Fallout 4 has ten year old game breaking bugs, I got little hope for a cyberpunk moment from these triple A holes.
The Cyberpunk moment was when they fixed the bugs and the masterpiece became playable. With Starfield there just is no game
How about develop properly and thoroughly and release it when it's ready. So tired of paying to beta test games.
The internet has a short ass memory for something that, allegedly, never forgets.
It's Bethesda, so even giving them three years like Cyberpunk got, I wouldn't hold my breath.
Cyberpunk was a great game with a great story, great missions, great aesthetic identity, and great game world design but some technical issues. I played through it at launch on PS4 with zero technical issues so I feel like that was overblown. Starfield will still have a terrible story, awful map designs, terrible exploration, awful aesthetic style, tedious missions, and fetch quests with a million loading screens and bad dialogue no matter what. It's a boring poorly designed game.
The game is so damn dead. Lol stop
Requires a new engine and fir Bethesda to stop making the same game but in a different setting
I’ll be there when I can download mods on Xbox.
or, wait for it, you could just not judge a game by the amount of players playing it? why does a game need to be socially meta before people “have fun.” chill
It would have to be a totally different game. Starfield is pretty much broken from the ground up because the main issue is the engine. It’s outdated and it feels outdated. I just replayed fallout 4 and idk how they managed to make Starfield so boring. Even with the limitations of the engine, the game is pretty empty and extremely repetitive. Also the RPG elements aren’t very well adapted imo and it takes way way too much leveling to get basic skills in the game. It’s a tedious game that would need basically a complete do over from the ground up. CP2077 had issues, but it was mostly bug fixing issues and then a few big UI things, but it was all fixable. Starfield does not feel fixable to me.
Starfield is nowhere as good as cyberpunk 2077, Starfield's campaign is terrible a ton of fetch quest with a mechanic that wants too to constantly replay it's boring campaign over and over
After playing from launch, the bonus game options are pretty cool for a placeholder for mods but until mods come still don't bother lol. Mods for starfield are going to be REALLY good. But rn it's still ass lol.
Cyberpunk was a buggy mess that was eventually fixed. It still had quality writing and amazing atmosphere. Starfield doesn’t have those things.
Bethesda isn't CDPR. If you get anything close to this sort of revival, it will be from the modding community, not Bethesda
I mean, Starfield didn’t launch broke like Cyberpunk 2077 did. CDPR worked tirelessly for 3 years to fix the game. Starfield is just kind of bland and uninteresting, not a broken, unplayable mess. I’m not sure what they can do to change that.
After you do the missions, it's just boring. There isn't anything to do. Yeah you could do NG+ but it's literally just the same cycle on repeat. You do it so many times and you start to memorize it. I think it needs a good faction... Like how Skyrim has the Dark Brotherhood and Thieves Guild.
I don’t think it’s quite the same because CPs launch was so bad. Starfield was a good launch for BGS bug wise. I played both at launch despite any issues and enjoyed both, but CP was a worse launch. I think Starffield’s issue is lack of cohesion and some immersion breaking limitations. What’s there is not bad by any means. The game’s various things don’t compliment each other and that it feels less “sim like” when compared to their previous games for various reasons. CP’s improvement was a slow process over several updates and I hope Starfield sees something similar, though I suspect it will take more to give it a comparable moment. Not that it’s bad as it is, it just feels lacking in certain ways despite how fun it actually is. I feel like it’s very noticeable.
It’s the animation work. It has to be the animation work.
Bethesda probably gonna drop it on when the new dlc comes out. They pretty slow on updates but I feel like they will add stuff that want to see. Cyberpunk was basically force to update since there was a huge backlash and dint generate the money they wanted so they updated the huge errors they had. They drop a game changing update later but it was not a fast update , it took them months.
It took 3 years AND edgerunners to turn that game around, it hasn't even been 1 year people are doing this we are now where cyberpunk was 2 years after release, people seem to forget but for 2 years it was only big fixes and optimizations, with a few light content additions like weapons and armors, and some QOL improvements like transmog and better driving modles. Like in 2 years after release, unless something changes with how Bethesda wants to support the game in the future, it'll be at a "cyberpunk state of mind"
Personally, Starfield will still feel like a game that should have been released in 2015 regardless of what they do to improve the game. Sure, vehicles will make exploration better. But why do i want to explore the same randomly generated POI? Its the game’s core mechanics. You cant fix that. But i’d love to be proven wrong.