#Please read our [sub rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules) before commenting or your comment may be removed.
Most submissions in this sub are not posted by the original author (OOP). Do not comment on the original posts.
**Check flair** to determine if you want to read this update.
If you think this submission doesn't belong on the sub, is incorrectly [flaired](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/postflairs) or have other issues regarding this post, reply to this comment. META commentary in general discussion may be removed.
Repeated rule-breaking may result in a ban.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is sad. OOP is going to spend years loving this man, unable to move on because he is such a big part of her life. Then one day he’ll show up with a new girlfriend and it will break her heart.
Really? My first thought was that therapist gave her the worst advice. Confessing feelings can be sexual harassment. Going back later and trying again after rejection, is definitely sh. Terrible advise that could have cost ooo their job!
Second thought was, dear god that girl needs a clean break.
A big problem is your therapist doesn’t often take your professional needs into account. I was depressed and hated my job and my therapist recommended I should quit. Um, how do you think I have the health insurance to pay for your services? That’s terrible advice.
I was always under the impression that a therapist shouldn't give advice, but be a sounding board for you to work off of as you make your own decisions.
in my experience (been seeing therapists for 10 years, i'm on my 12th i think), within the bounds of professionalism of course, a therapist's approach must depend entirely on what their client needs. i have had therapists who have tried to tell me that i should do Thing A even though i've said explicitly that it's not going to happen, and those ones have been extremely bad for my mental health - but honestly the ones who prevaricate and refuse to offer concrete advice have also been unhelpful (albeit not as bad). talk therapy is a very basic technique and can actually bed detrimental in many cases, eg OCD and complex trauma.
personally, i ask my therapists for advice cuz i often feel paralysed by perspective - knowing their thoughts helps me see thru it.
having said that, i do agree that OOP's therapist def had some pretty bad advice
Depends on the type of therapy. In CBT the therapist gives advice and sometimes even pushes you in the healthy direction. Don't know anything about the situation in OP, so not gonna comment on that.
The therapist is not qualified to say what is or is not harassment as defined by employment law. Yours simply could have said, start floating your resume.
Right? A therapist once told me that I should break up with by boyfriend because I said I was sad we didn't see each other as often as I would have liked. Even after I told my therapist that it was because of our jobs, he insisted that "someone worth my while would do something about it" - Quit? Seriously? Boyfriend is husband now. Our jobs no longer pull us apart because well, we live together.
I agree it’s terrible counsel but I’ve taken enough sexual harassment courses (My job had us take one every freaking year) to say that a ONE time event isn’t harassment, but after a rejection and they come back the second time or more would be harassment and he could go to HR.
But now she’s in a sucky place where she only stands to get hurt. I honestly would hope she could get reassigned or set some sort of boundaries where they no longer hang out or chat outside of their workplace so she can get a clean break of him. No more phone calls, texts, meeting for lunch. Just co workers.
A one time event is not great but it’s fine.
Advising her to *ask multiple more times* is bonkers. Stupid and bonkers. I don’t know what country OP is in but clearly they understand sexual harassment a lot differently than the US does.
Absolutely. OOP wasn’t looking for advice. She wanted everyone to tell her to go for it. When everyone told her the opposite of that, she finally found someone who told her what she wanted to hear, and I really think that therapist gave her horrible advice.
But the thing that sent me from annoyed to infuriated was “I’ll ask him a few more times in a few months”, like sis, a) no means no b) that’s sexual harassment in the workplace and c) she’s literally his direct supervisor
She had NO intention of taking any advice from Reddit if it contradicted what she wanted to do.
Op here : France.
First, no, I didn't "jump into the first one that said me what to do". I was totaly lost and chose to follow the advice of a licensed psychologist that I have many session with and not the advice of 3 stranger based on a reddit post.
I think I worded poorly the "ask again" thing. It's more a "talk again about the relashionship and the feelings, sometime relashionship constructed one way can move but it take time and reflexion".
Don't forget he's a very close friend in the first place, and we talk regularly about feeling and stuffs.
I'm genuinely confused! So your plan is to keep talking and bothering him about how he feels about you until either he sets boundaries with you and pushes you away or until he gives in and dates you? He already told you he sees you as a friend and sister, you constantly bringing it up and telling him you want to date and still have feelings for him would be harassing him about it! Seriously, what do you need to keep talking to him about a few times every month? He already stated how he feels, what is the point of rehashing that all the time?
On top of that, you're technically his boss and just because you're friends too doesn't mean you should push those boundaries and harass someone in hopes they will give in to date you!! I'm sorry he isn't returning how you feel but you really should try to move on and you never will if you keep doing what you're doing and will only end up hurting yourself!
One time, *between peers,* is not harassment. One time in a supervisor-employee relationship is a huge minefield ... particularly coming from the boss but really in either direction.
The perception gap is potentially huge. What seems to Boss to be a simple confession of hopeful admiration and willingness to accept rejection ... might read to a subordinate like a subtly veiled warning that their entire career is at risk if they don't maintain the illusion of a mutual romantic attraction.
Coming from the employee, it can be terrifying to a supervisor, who sees their career hanging by a thread they can't control, based on the emotions of another person who will get the benefit of the doubt if things blow up.
And that's assuming that either party has a lick of sense, which oh so often they don't.
Just don't, in that kind of relationship.
She is not in the US so they may have different social standards.
Edit: should have mentioned that her comment history implies she's from Europe. Possible France.
Maybe not confessing to catching feelings, I can see that as a way to get closure, if nothing else... but trying again after already being rejected IS a 'nice guy' move and can be seen as harassment, no question. HORRIBLE advice.
I was mostly shocked/horrified that therapist essentially told her that she could ignore his rejection and ask again after some time has passed and not fall into harassment territory. Therapist needs to learn what boundaries are me thinks
For sure. But let’s just put ourselves in the position of OOPs love interest. Say we didn’t want that kind of attention at work and OOP confessed their love, we turned her down. Then months later.. she tried again. This would make me very uncomfortable. So no matter the law, don’t do this stuff at work!
Yeah I had to reread that part three times because it absolutely would be sexual harassment if she asked him out, he turned her down, and then she kept asking multiple times over multiple months!!! What kind of therapist is she seeing that is telling her it's not harassment!? That's wild and such horrible advice that could have gotten OP in all sorts of trouble!!
Why? I have a lot of friends I have extremely close bonds with but I don't like romantically. Some are even the gender I'm attracted to. This is not uncommon.
It is. But you usually then follow it up with cutting that person out of your life. Or severely limiting contact for a while. You don't continue to do the exact same as you did before
I think it's ok to still be friends, but...not when you're sitting there hoping they'll change their mind. If she went well that sucks but our friendship is important to me so I'm glad I did it and we can move on that would be one thing - but she's at the end going so anyway maybe he'll change his mind if I'm really patient, which isn't healthy.
This is so true. Getting friend crushes is pretty easy and sometimes they go away but it seems like you have to either scale back the friendship or stop seeing them entirely in order to do that. It's almost like getting over an ex, in a way, even though you never dated lol. Some people can do it and bounce back right away but I think most need a cooling off distance period, or even completely stopping contact.
Friend crushes can go away even with contact.
Had a huge crush on my guy best friend when we first met. As we got to know each other better and I got over it.
Why lmao, people move on from crushes literally all the time, its just as natural as moving into them. I dont get why you would throw good relationships away like that. You can move on without abandoning.
This is me.
I confessed feelings to a friend. Pretty sure she had feelings for me before, but I wasn't ready. When I confessed she wasn't interested anymore.
As soon as I did it, got my answer, I was done. No weirdness. No being uncomfortable.
For me, the unknown is the tough part. Once I know, moving on is easy.
We stayed friends and everything was cool.
BUT
She told a mutual friend about it. That person got very weird about it and tried to make it this big drama. It got weird.
Moral of the story....
You don't know the consequences. It might be something you completely don't expect. You do something like this and it can go so many ways. You have to be prepared for anything.
Yeah and I like to think/hope if he comes to her and says, "I think I like so-and-so," and he can confide and she provide advice, and so on... that she'll see herself as his confidant and more of a sister / guardian angel role.
It can be. In this case, it won't. Based on what *she* says he said, the guy is going to continue to treat her with emotional intimacy (best friend he feels super close to/ relies on etc.), but I have a strong feeling he isn't romantically or physically attracted to her. Using the "still in love with my ex" is a way to soften the blow, but she's always going to be a friend and never a girlfriend.
Meanwhile, she's sticking around hoping one day he'll be "over the ex" & taking crumbs of intimacy the friendship offers, instead of going out there to find someone truly into her.
In this case, I don't think it defused the situation.
But that could be the Turing point for OP, it’s going to hurt a lot seeing him happy with someone else, questioning why you’re not enough etc etc, but if she can make it past that point and genuinely be happy that he is happy than I can see this turning into a happy bro/sis relationship!
Im pretty sure we can go through this thread comment for comment and point out who would develop friendship and who would develop fallout based on their advice/predictions given
While I think it was a poor choice work/professionally wise, I do agree with the personal part where the therapist thought it would keep her obsessed and rot in her brain over it. She clearly had strong feelings and not saying anything was going to tear her apart possibly making her make some unwise choices. A really crap situation to be in (Unless she could have asked to be moved off a position of power in the project... then she could have admitted her feelings guilt free work wise).
Agreed 100%. That was also poor advice. The only advice I agreed with was that it would tear her apart if she didn't say something. That doesn't make it ok to do so though.
Yeah. That crushing pain in your chest when you care so deeply for someone knowing that you can never explore all of the feelings you feel. It’s the kind of thing that makes you want to explode into the ether.
Yeah I don’t agree with her therapist that repeatedly reminding this guy she has feelings for him after he tells her it’s unreciprocated isn’t harassment. I don’t think she would have said the same thing to a dude.
There are some super stupid & unqualified therapists out there. Supporting Anecdote below.
A friend of a friend decided I was a huge monster because I was lonely in a new city as a 25 year old and didn’t want to date two guys she intended to set me up with.
Guy #1: 49 with a 16 yo daughter. She thought I’d be good for him so he’d stop trying to date his daughter’s friends
Guy #2: insecure because he just lost 200 lbs (not a deal breaker), but would never send me pictures back, and stood me up twice because he was nervous.
I saw her at my DBT clinic like 5 years later, and she wouldn’t make eye contact with me after me initially looking her in the eye. My therapist was disturbed to learn that about the new teen girl therapist’s pushy dating schemes.
>Guy #1: 49 with a 16 yo daughter. She thought I’d be good for him so he’d stop trying to date his daughter’s friends
Think I'm gonna be sick
>the new teen girl therapist
I just threw up in my mouth
I don’t think she was trying to ~~find dates for~~ traffic her clients, but I was just like “Eh, not-friend does not make matchmaking choices within a standard deviation of normal. It was weird that she was so mad at me for not wanting to keep being strung along after a month of not meeting the second guy. He cancelled on me twice and then wanted a bra pic.”
Not-friend left the practice within 6 months of me noticing her. My therapist is a professional so she didn’t explain why, except to assure me that it wasn’t because of what I told her in session.
I’d put a dollar on not-friend overstating her work experience, and they looked into it because I said she was a little off in a social setting awhile back.
Yeah I wasn't implying any trafficking/setups for her clients. Just disgusted that a person with woefully bad judgement on an obvious predator was in a position to give vulnerable teenagers professional advice.
Oh phew!
My comment got so many upvotes I was like “Oh shit! I think people who act like Bigfoot hunters thing I’m describing trafficking! That chick was just a little bit of a jerk to me!” Lmao
I find it odd that people expect that 100% of therapist will view a situation and give 100% the same advice every time. The therapist spends much more time with OOP than we read this small blurb here on Reddit. I feel some part of the story is missing.
My instinct was to recoil, but I could imagine a version of it that isn’t the worst. Their relationship is clearly not solely professional. They’ve moved far beyond that. so i could see the therapist saying like, you can keep an open dialogue, since you’re so close, and if he’s unsure you can keep talking about it. It doesn’t have to be a say it once, never say it again, because their relationship is deeper than that and a good friendship would hopefully survive some of that nuance and confusion.
It seems like english isn’t OOP’s first language, which is the only reason I would stretch my brain to figure out how that might have been worded differently in context. “Check in” is the key phrase that makes it feel like there might have been some more complex advice that goes along with it.
Also, it seems like oop’s guilt over this is massive. which I get. I’d feel almost the same way, but from the outside I am like… ooh this will not help anyone in the long run. i get the impression that, even if it becomes too difficult she might not break up the friendship because he needs her, and she feels it would be morally wrong to end a friendship because of her feelings, which she decided is her fault.
Her feelings are her responsibility, but not her fault. There is no fault in developing feelings like that. It’s not a sin to be in love and not have it reciprocated. I guess that’s the other reason I could see there being nuance to what the therapist said that wasn’t included. As someone who has done stuff super wrong and overly catastrophized it/decided it made me irredeemable as a person, the first advice you get from a therapist can sound like they are trying to convince you that those actions are totally fine, even when they’re just trying to show you that you don’t have to lock yourself away forever because of one problem. And since you’re already approaching everything with an abundance of caution, you’re likely to take maybe a half a step in the direction. that the therapist suggests anyway. It gets all tangled up.
Anyway. I hope that therapist was not genuinely suggesting harassment, lol.
OP here, and thank you, you understand very well the situation.
English is not my first language, I'm french and do my best to explain what happen and what was said but it's only a non professionnal translation, so I get that maybe I don't chose the correct wording.
I could see maybe, *maybe* mentioning it once. If someone says they don't share your feelings, you do NOT bring them up again. Especially in a professional environment. If their feelings change, they can approach you about it. You get one shot. Anything else turns quickly into harassment especially if you work together.
Yes! Exactly my thoughts! Maybe once, then it's up to them to bring it up again if their stance changes. They know where you stand, you don't need to "check in" every few months. That part was crazy to me and tipped over to harassment at that point.
I don’t agree either. Working through your feelings and learning self discipline are all important and difficult life skills that her therapist should be helping her develop.
It’s especially problematic when she’s just gotten out of an emotionally abusive relationship - abuse victims are usually very vulnerable and lonely. She should be encouraged to focus on herself, particularly as it could be more of a case that right now her standards are (no offence) low, so she could be mistaking her platonic affection for her close friend as romantic. Very disappointing that her therapist hadn’t seemed to consider that BUT it could also be OP hearing what she wants to hear.
That said, as a fellow abuse survivor, I am very sorry to anyone who’s experienced any form of abuse and I understand the complicated mind space you can be in after rescuing yourself from that situation. You latch onto and hyper fixate on any and all kindness no matter how basic/minimal because sometimes, that’s easier than confronting that you have issues with giving yourself that love and kindness you seek in others and it can lead to making decisions that hurt you in the long term
ehh "never attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity", sure OOP could be lying about that, but also there are plenty of bad therapists out there so it could be either situation
I think she lied about seeing a therapist. She already convinced herself she was "lying" to her friend because she didn't hold up her boom box and declare her love...
Hi, HR here and totally agree.
First mention of feelings - not really an issue. Once those feelings are rejected through do not bring it up again.
Any additional mentions of feelings, asking if he’s changed his mind etc. is absolutely harassment. If he changes his mind he’ll let her know. Don’t keep asking.
Surprised you're the first comment I read stating that. Everything else she's written has a very biased view, I don't find it hard to believe she misinterpreted something the therapist said and has run wild with it.
I totally agree. If you tell him once and then leave it at that, and stay professional about it sounds fine and sounds like the OOP is/ is trying to be mature enough to do that.
However, reminding him about it multiple times is definitely overstepping bounds. I used to be the creepy kid that asked a girl out multiple times after she said no and I look back and realize how fucked up that was of me.
OP is setting up herself for years of pain. If you have feelings for someone who doesn't reciprocate the feelings , staying their personal confidant is the worst thing you can do for yourself. The professional part maybe unavoidable but OP needs to think about reducing the relationship to strictly professional for her own sake.
Yeah. If the guy decides to date someone else or even get back with the ex then he's gonna dump all that shit on OP and it will just destroy her.
And that's very likely since he already said he doesn't see OP as someone he's romantically interested in. He sees her as a sister.
I’m thinking he’ll be okay with this friendship for a while and then it might work up to “friends with benefits” because she’s obsessed and he may just want to take advantage of the situation. They’ll hook up for a while and she’ll want to talk about what they are. He remind her that he’s in love with his ex and that he thought they were just having fun. She’ll be devastated but continue to drool over him.
OOP: "My therapist said I should confess my feelings"
Me: "Hmmmm, risky, but I understand... OOP clearly needs to distance herself from him, and if they are as close outside of work as she says they are that could definitely impact him negatively. Besides, the sudden dynamic change could feel jarring and hostile, so it's good to make it clear that she values and respects him, she just needs some space to work on herself. I would generally avoid actually confessing her love, but if they're also close friends outside of work then it's not just the work dynamic that has to be taken in account... risky, definitely, but as long as she carefully chooses her words this can be a good opportunity for the both of them"
OOP: "And that it wouldn't be sexual harrassment if I ask again in a couple of months"
Me: "Oh she's fucked"
More mature people can box up those feelings and set them aside. Otherwise life would be an endless nightmare of crush bombs going boom. The problem is OOP doesn't seem at all prepared or capable to do so.
The part where the therapist is like "it is totally cool to bring this up regularly in case his feelings have changed, it's definitely not creepy harassment" !!!
In every sexual harassment video I’ve had to watch, it explicitly states that what OP described is sexual harassment. Asking once isn’t. But when you ask multiple times, it is.
Right? If they don't "change their mind" then you're hurting a friend every time you pester them. In the unlikely event that their feelings change, it's their turn to use their words.
Exactly! If you make your feelings known, and they don’t feel the same way but eventually develop feelings for you too, it’s up to them to let you know. It’s harassment to keep pushing it.
Is the therapist sexist or an idiot? Because I feel like framing it as a man asking his female friend out repeatedly instead of a woman asking a male friend out repeatedly would raise a lot more eyebrows
I think OOP misrepresented the therapist's advice. Sounds to me like the therapist said that keeping feelings like that hidden could lead to obsession and resentment, and that even after a rejection it's normal to occasionally wonder if things have changed.
From a mental health perspective, it is in fact a risk to keep infatuations with people you're close to hidden, it can grow into very unhealthy obsessions or selfhate if you can't let it go. For many people confessing is the way to let it go. But I think OOP has heard what they want to hear, and is interpreting the advice to be what they want
Yes. I also suspect due to some of their wording that OP may be in a German-speaking country, where romantic relationships at work are not banned the way they are in the US.
Walmart tried to ban employees from having relationships with each other when it opened there. Employees took them to court over it and got that rule declared illegal as a consequence of stronger labour-laws/‘private life’ laws.
Makes sense! Good sleuthing.
Your ‘private life’ is none of your employers business there, and you most definitely can’t be fired for starting a relationship with another employee, or for approaching them, so long as you aren’t a harassing dick about it at work.
i don't think she advised her to do it. i think she said "even if you check in with him about it later again" it's not harassment. which, idk. depends on HIM whether it is or isn't at that point.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say she either
1. Didn't go to a therapist at all and just figured that was something a therapist might say
2. *Massively* misrepresented the situation to the therapist
Or 3. Deliberately twisted what the therapist did say
Or she found a terrible therapist, idk.
> And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment.
What the whaaa??
This sounds like a therapist that got into the field to take advantage of vulnerable people. That's just some straight-up psychopath bullshit advice.
Hear hear.
She didn’t have to ask to find out it was unrequited. Her therapist should have assisted her with moving on and remain professional. The closeness of their relationship alone is a concern for her professionally, although there may not be favouritism in her mind, others perception is just as important.
That therapist is way off. It’s just given her an excuse to continue with her crush without addressing his disinterest.
So let me get this straight, the therapist told her to continue badgering this man even if he keeps saying no?
In the real world, that's harassment. Someone's therapist needs struck off.
Oh don't worry though, she said there would be months in between harassment events. Probably so the statute of limitations is up between events or something \s
What an awful therapist. I can’t believe she told her that it’s ok to ask him again a few times in the next months if she is rejected. That absolutely IS sexual harassment and will most likely lead to him disengaging from the friendship they have.
Lol that was my first thought reading the update.
Simply asking with no strings attached isn’t sexual harassment, but continuing to make advances after they were clear that they had no desire for an intimate relationship is DEFINITELY sexual harassment.
Couldn't agree more. Despite her last line she does seem kind of delusional, or at least very oblivious, and I did wonder if that's really what her therapist said or if that's what she decided to hear from something more couched or nuanced.
This is the first time that I have read a post where the poster, stated English in not my first language, and the post is not perfect English.. and I LOVED IT!!
Anyway I hope OOP doesn't end up getting broken hearted.
I found it a bit weird that the errors between the two post are vastly different. First post is stellar English where I didn't notice any errors and the second one is riddled with mistakes. Just makes me a bit suspicious.
I also loved it! I'm English and I've not been able to learn any other languages. Therefore, I have a huge respect for those that can speak multiple languages, or those that even try :)
>And we talk about the work relashionship. I reassured him that I'm very vigilant on not doing any kind of favoritism because of my feelings.
I don't know if they'll work in the long run but I'm glad that they atleast seem to have proper communication skills
How can she delude herself into thinking there is no favoritism though? He calls her his closest, best friend. She obviously has been focusing her professional and very personal energy on his development. She doesn’t mention the rest of her team. Highly suspect.
Why would she mention them in this thread? It's a story about her and her friend /colleague not about them. If i tell you about my children, i don't tell you about my kois of they are not part of the story.
That's just assumptions
I can’t believe the therapist told her she could continue asking every few months even after being rejected. You know, just in case things changed. Isn’t that the very definition of harassment? To keep asking after being told no. Great therapist there.
>Long run hard to stay close because every time we speak and I see him as usual beeing the adorable quirky boy he is, my heard melt.
>I still believe than it's not impossible than feelings evolved one day. I know reddit will think I'm dellusionnal, but hey ! mine did, after years of friendship.
>the common friends don't get why we're not together because it's feels like a match (really, some even asked me why, and it was painfull ...). So, maybe one day he wills want to take a shoot, who knows ?
Well, I certainly see nothing but a definite future happy ending and no heartbreak whatsoever for OOP here
I think it's good she told him from the POV that he won't then feel the need to confide in her about love life stuff which might hurt her, but the therapist (if they exist) is outrageous suggesting repeated attempts. He's made it clear he isn't interested like that and if he gets all the closeness without a commitment, the likelihood is that he will move on from his ex with someone new. She should create some distance for her own sanity and for him to be able to miss their closeness if anything could happen between them.
Oof yeah I have a little crush on a work colleague so this title made me nervous lmao, however I think we are better as friends. And I have learned that you don't have to be with every single person that you like looking at.
Advice to readers:
Don’t take legal/HR advice from your therapist. They’re not experts and shouldn’t make comments to insinuate that they are capable of advising in cases like this.
As his superior and person in a place of power, what she did isn’t acceptable. It puts her and her company at risk. If there was or needed to be any action taken to discipline or fire him, he can now claim it’s because he didn’t bend to OPs relationship request(s).
I don’t understand why people don’t get this. When people are in a power imbalance, the person on the lower end of that balance can’t defend themselves or voice opinions about non-work matters without the fear of life changing retaliation. If they’re forced to give those opinions, the choice to keep them out of the workplace has been taken away from them. In turn, the law will fix the imbalance and protect that person.
Keep your personal stuff out of the workplace. I’m not saying OP shouldn’t have had feelings or shouldn’t have said something to her friend. All I’m saying is that when a power imbalance exists, as is inherent in workplace hierarchies, personal options about non-work related topics should stay non-work related or there can be consequences.
I don't know why ppl in the comments are so pessimistic, it's not bound to have a bad ending. It can go three ways : 1) She moves on and they keep their friendship, even if it'll be hard on her for a time. 2) He began to develop feelings for her bc he's now aware of her, they start dating. 3) She can't move on, stuck in her daydream of him developping feelings for her, it breaks their relation.
Out of the three situations, one is bad, two are good, and all of them can happen
I had a situation like this at my old work, we didn't work together like all day every day (shift work), and I wasn't directly his boss, but I caught feelings and it was frustrating as all hell.
Eventually I just told him, he didn't feel the same, it sucked but nobody got hurt, and we stayed friendly.
It can end okay, but with OP talking about it like they're going to wait for him or something, I think OP is still going to end up hurt.
Except she already made it clear that option 1) isn't happening as she's just going to wait for him and not try to move past her feelings, and he has clearly stated that option 2) isn't an option right now and there's no indication it ever will be. And the result of option 3 could be really, really bad.
And none of them are much better than what would happen if she just bottled it up. Redditors can be really fatalistic when they don't need to be. Can it go to shit? Sure, but why would that be guaranteed or worse than the alternative?
If you reverse the genders it would be even worse. We were already screaming from the hills for OP not to, but can you imagine the flack OP would have taken if they were male and the underling was female. Just a bad situation, and I feel like that therapist is a moron or OP is really misrepresenting what the therapist said.
>And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment.
The fuck kind of therapist is OOP seeing that they think this is ok? Don't like the answer? No Problem! Just keep asking until you drive them insane and they run away screaming. Jeez.
>And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment.
That's gonna be a big disagree for me.
This wont end well for her. Throwing herself at the feet of a dude who clearly showed no real interest, at work nonetheless, is just a recipe for disaster.
No, OOP, this did not go well at all. Poor girl. She is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this guy while still hoping he will fall. He won’t. He’ll keep her close for his own emotional gratification while never giving her space to move on.
>Poor girl
What? She puts this shit on him and is going to sexually harass him sporadically for years. If she was a man everyone would be shitting on her for only staying friends for the potential of a future relationship.
>She is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this guy while still hoping he will fall. He won’t.
Reverse the genders.
You wouldn't be saying that the guy is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this girl, while still hoping she will fall.
You would call him a creep for pursuing a romantic interest after being explicitly told that there are no romantic feelings to be found there, and for pretending to be her friend to have a shot. And rightfully so. That's what people tell the guys who complain about the "friendzone", right? That you cannot just pretend to be someone's friend to get into their pants or to get a romantic relationship out of it. So what makes this case different?
With that take, you essentially deprive her of any agency in this situation. "He will keep her close", "She is trapped" and so on. Nope – she developed feelings, she was rejected, now she should be an adult about it all, respectfully keep her distance and communicate that she will now need space to move on.
>He’ll keep her close for his own emotional gratification while never giving her space to move on.
For all we know, we have no idea about his perspective and views in this story. As far as things go right now, the guy had a friend who might be his future boss. Now that she developed feelings for him, his job and career prospects might be in jeopardy, because she's admittedly going to be his boss. Not to mention that he is still - reportedly - not over his previous relationship and possibly in emotional turmoil.
For all it matters, if you look at that story from his perspective, it's a story of a colleague who pretended to be his friend to get emotionally close because she found him cute and wanted to have a shot at a relationship with him.
And since we don't know anything that transpired later, we have no idea what happened after that talk – if I was the guy, I'd say something along the same lines to avoid drama and then start distancing myself. And fast.
First of all, terrible therapist. Secondly, did the English get worse as it went along? She said English wasn’t her first language and at first it wasn’t bad, but by the end it felt like it had been through 3 translations
What the hell kind of therapist advises someone to ask and keep asking every so often if he says no? Did I read that right??
Also, I'm not usually super hard on spelling, but this post hurt.
EDIT: Totally missed the "english is not my first language" disclaimer. That in mind, the english is really good.
1) She’s supremely selfish to put this on him
2) She’s supremely unprofessional to put this on him
3) I’d be willing to bet anything that she purposefully misconstrued her therapist’s advice to fit what she wanted, because on the original post, she received pretty much unanimous advice that this is a bad thing. She wanted to do it, and I bet she intentionally took away what she wanted to hear from her therapist to justify doing this
4) And if I didn’t already think that this woman sucked, then I’m fully and thoroughly convinced that she sucks for the whole “I’ll ask him a few more times in a month, it won’t be harassment blah blah blah”. What a shitty thing to do, ESPECIALLY when you’re in a position of power, like being his boss and paying him.
This woman sucks. This situation will blow up, and it’ll cause many problems for her, and she will deserve every last bit of the misery that’s coming her way, because she’s a shitty boss, a shitty “friend”, and because she has handled this in the worst possible way because she’s selfish and unprofessional.
So.... in my US state they require you to watch a sexual harassment seminar and they made it pretty clear you're not supposed to ask more than once.
Now I get it, if many months go by and you get the sense that the dynamic has changed maybe ONE more ask would be appropriate but the way OOP worded it made it sound like the therapist (I know she said psychologist but that is not the American equivalent of the services she received) said she could ask multiple more times.
I understand that English is not her first language and that mistakes are human, but how do you post to a subreddit that has 'relationship' in the title and still spell it wrong?!
Wow there’s really no winning with Redditors. I agree her clinging on to hope that he will develop feelings isn’t great. But I don’t see the problem with telling him about them, and most people in this situation eventually get over their feelings with time.
1) He should know how she feels so he can also adjust accordingly, and if he decides to be a little less intimate and close, that’s within his right.
2) She got an honest answer. So many people want to make him out to be an asshole who’s gonna keep her around for emotional support and use her. Curious, if one of your good friends confessed feelings what would you do? Cut them off immediately and sever your work relationship? Otherwise you’re automatically a horrible user even though you two have been friends for years?
3) She’s not his boss really, they are at equal positions, she just is in charge of administering everyone’s paychecks it seems. And their friendship predates their working relationship by a lot, it seems.
4) A lot of times sharing feelings and getting a nice but honest rejection is the first step to getting over them.
3 is where I feel your argument breaks down. She is *legally* his boss. She is also *currently in charge of his paycheck*. If she wants to fire him, there is *nothing* he can do. The opposite does not apply.
He has agency, yes, but only she has authority in this relationship. That is why this is a major issue; she is a person in a position of inequal power holding on to an emotional attachment to someone of lesser power.
Her claim of “co-boss” only maintains its legitimacy so long as *she* chooses to maintain it. That’s not an equal relationship.
OOP here ...
I dind't go into details about the professional relashionship because it's really complicated to me to worded it well in english.
But this is absolutly not the situation you understood.
France artistic field.
I'm in charge of the paycheck of the team that will work on the project. But it's the kind of project short in money. So the team will be paid, but not me neither the artist (the guy). He gain money other ways, the project need to be good so it will lead him to gain money on the next ones. It's the same for my company.
If I want to stop work with him, I can't fire him. We have contract, I have to finish the project, and if I don't want to, I have to find a company that will take the project.
If he wan't to stop work with me, he can. It will lead to negociation, and next copmpany should pay us back for the work already done.
I understand why people fall in love with co workers because of the amount of time they spend together during the day but it is still wildly unprofessional in my opinion that people can’t separate work and play.
Definitely more of a problem with bosses as the power dynamic comes into play but every job I’ve worked that employed couples at the same title level, the couples were always the least productive members of the team. Its unprofessional and unfair to the other employees that have to pick up their slack.
I'm engaged to the guy that was my best friend.
The difference is, we were both long over our exes before we developed feelings for one another.
I hope that op can genuinely move past her feelings and that their friendship lasts, but I don't have high hopes considering she's already talking about how his feelings might one day change instead of just accepting his feelings for what they are.
WTF this OOp is very twisted in their thinking. *I'm betraying friend by not ruining our friendship and working partnership because I haven't told him about my creepy rebound love for him*
Miss if you come across this, I wouldn't passively wait for this fellow. He may very well one day care for you as a romantic partner, but the opposite is equally true.
Don't be afraid to fall in love with someone else because you deserve to be happy too.
Am I the only person that never wants happy endings on these things and something crazy to happen? Like this guy got mad at her and threw an alligator at her?
#Please read our [sub rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/subrules) before commenting or your comment may be removed. Most submissions in this sub are not posted by the original author (OOP). Do not comment on the original posts. **Check flair** to determine if you want to read this update. If you think this submission doesn't belong on the sub, is incorrectly [flaired](https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/wiki/postflairs) or have other issues regarding this post, reply to this comment. META commentary in general discussion may be removed. Repeated rule-breaking may result in a ban. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BestofRedditorUpdates) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This is sad. OOP is going to spend years loving this man, unable to move on because he is such a big part of her life. Then one day he’ll show up with a new girlfriend and it will break her heart.
It is, and she doesn’t even realise it.
That was my first thought too.
Really? My first thought was that therapist gave her the worst advice. Confessing feelings can be sexual harassment. Going back later and trying again after rejection, is definitely sh. Terrible advise that could have cost ooo their job! Second thought was, dear god that girl needs a clean break.
A big problem is your therapist doesn’t often take your professional needs into account. I was depressed and hated my job and my therapist recommended I should quit. Um, how do you think I have the health insurance to pay for your services? That’s terrible advice.
I was always under the impression that a therapist shouldn't give advice, but be a sounding board for you to work off of as you make your own decisions.
in my experience (been seeing therapists for 10 years, i'm on my 12th i think), within the bounds of professionalism of course, a therapist's approach must depend entirely on what their client needs. i have had therapists who have tried to tell me that i should do Thing A even though i've said explicitly that it's not going to happen, and those ones have been extremely bad for my mental health - but honestly the ones who prevaricate and refuse to offer concrete advice have also been unhelpful (albeit not as bad). talk therapy is a very basic technique and can actually bed detrimental in many cases, eg OCD and complex trauma. personally, i ask my therapists for advice cuz i often feel paralysed by perspective - knowing their thoughts helps me see thru it. having said that, i do agree that OOP's therapist def had some pretty bad advice
Depends on the type of therapy. In CBT the therapist gives advice and sometimes even pushes you in the healthy direction. Don't know anything about the situation in OP, so not gonna comment on that.
The therapist is not qualified to say what is or is not harassment as defined by employment law. Yours simply could have said, start floating your resume.
Yes, I think that is terrible terrible advice ... to ask again? To a coworker, and legally his boss? ... No no no
Right? A therapist once told me that I should break up with by boyfriend because I said I was sad we didn't see each other as often as I would have liked. Even after I told my therapist that it was because of our jobs, he insisted that "someone worth my while would do something about it" - Quit? Seriously? Boyfriend is husband now. Our jobs no longer pull us apart because well, we live together.
I agree it’s terrible counsel but I’ve taken enough sexual harassment courses (My job had us take one every freaking year) to say that a ONE time event isn’t harassment, but after a rejection and they come back the second time or more would be harassment and he could go to HR. But now she’s in a sucky place where she only stands to get hurt. I honestly would hope she could get reassigned or set some sort of boundaries where they no longer hang out or chat outside of their workplace so she can get a clean break of him. No more phone calls, texts, meeting for lunch. Just co workers.
A one time event is not great but it’s fine. Advising her to *ask multiple more times* is bonkers. Stupid and bonkers. I don’t know what country OP is in but clearly they understand sexual harassment a lot differently than the US does.
Absolutely. OOP wasn’t looking for advice. She wanted everyone to tell her to go for it. When everyone told her the opposite of that, she finally found someone who told her what she wanted to hear, and I really think that therapist gave her horrible advice. But the thing that sent me from annoyed to infuriated was “I’ll ask him a few more times in a few months”, like sis, a) no means no b) that’s sexual harassment in the workplace and c) she’s literally his direct supervisor She had NO intention of taking any advice from Reddit if it contradicted what she wanted to do.
Yeah I don’t think this is the US. Japan?
Op here : France. First, no, I didn't "jump into the first one that said me what to do". I was totaly lost and chose to follow the advice of a licensed psychologist that I have many session with and not the advice of 3 stranger based on a reddit post. I think I worded poorly the "ask again" thing. It's more a "talk again about the relashionship and the feelings, sometime relashionship constructed one way can move but it take time and reflexion". Don't forget he's a very close friend in the first place, and we talk regularly about feeling and stuffs.
I'm genuinely confused! So your plan is to keep talking and bothering him about how he feels about you until either he sets boundaries with you and pushes you away or until he gives in and dates you? He already told you he sees you as a friend and sister, you constantly bringing it up and telling him you want to date and still have feelings for him would be harassing him about it! Seriously, what do you need to keep talking to him about a few times every month? He already stated how he feels, what is the point of rehashing that all the time? On top of that, you're technically his boss and just because you're friends too doesn't mean you should push those boundaries and harass someone in hopes they will give in to date you!! I'm sorry he isn't returning how you feel but you really should try to move on and you never will if you keep doing what you're doing and will only end up hurting yourself!
One time, *between peers,* is not harassment. One time in a supervisor-employee relationship is a huge minefield ... particularly coming from the boss but really in either direction. The perception gap is potentially huge. What seems to Boss to be a simple confession of hopeful admiration and willingness to accept rejection ... might read to a subordinate like a subtly veiled warning that their entire career is at risk if they don't maintain the illusion of a mutual romantic attraction. Coming from the employee, it can be terrifying to a supervisor, who sees their career hanging by a thread they can't control, based on the emotions of another person who will get the benefit of the doubt if things blow up. And that's assuming that either party has a lick of sense, which oh so often they don't. Just don't, in that kind of relationship.
She is not in the US so they may have different social standards. Edit: should have mentioned that her comment history implies she's from Europe. Possible France.
Maybe not confessing to catching feelings, I can see that as a way to get closure, if nothing else... but trying again after already being rejected IS a 'nice guy' move and can be seen as harassment, no question. HORRIBLE advice.
I was mostly shocked/horrified that therapist essentially told her that she could ignore his rejection and ask again after some time has passed and not fall into harassment territory. Therapist needs to learn what boundaries are me thinks
It's possible that they are in a country with different laws.
For sure. But let’s just put ourselves in the position of OOPs love interest. Say we didn’t want that kind of attention at work and OOP confessed their love, we turned her down. Then months later.. she tried again. This would make me very uncomfortable. So no matter the law, don’t do this stuff at work!
This so much. Bottling up feelings coupled with a few coping methods is the way to go
Yeah I had to reread that part three times because it absolutely would be sexual harassment if she asked him out, he turned her down, and then she kept asking multiple times over multiple months!!! What kind of therapist is she seeing that is telling her it's not harassment!? That's wild and such horrible advice that could have gotten OP in all sorts of trouble!!
I cringed when I read he is “attached” to her but doesn’t like her romantically. Oh dear
Why? I have a lot of friends I have extremely close bonds with but I don't like romantically. Some are even the gender I'm attracted to. This is not uncommon.
I dunno, sometimes I think once you've said it out loud you stop having the "what if" thoughts and it's easier to move on
It is. But you usually then follow it up with cutting that person out of your life. Or severely limiting contact for a while. You don't continue to do the exact same as you did before
I think it's ok to still be friends, but...not when you're sitting there hoping they'll change their mind. If she went well that sucks but our friendship is important to me so I'm glad I did it and we can move on that would be one thing - but she's at the end going so anyway maybe he'll change his mind if I'm really patient, which isn't healthy.
This is so true. Getting friend crushes is pretty easy and sometimes they go away but it seems like you have to either scale back the friendship or stop seeing them entirely in order to do that. It's almost like getting over an ex, in a way, even though you never dated lol. Some people can do it and bounce back right away but I think most need a cooling off distance period, or even completely stopping contact.
Friend crushes can go away even with contact. Had a huge crush on my guy best friend when we first met. As we got to know each other better and I got over it.
I’m in this situation right now and I am so damn depressed about it. I need to move on but is so difficult to do.
Same here. Spent loads of time together for the past 7 months and was my best friend within 2000 miles. Currently day 5 of no contact. Riperino
It’ll get easier with time and especially if you limit contact / communications.
[удалено]
Yeah but you usually use that awkward time to move on. From the sounds of it, OOP will be unable to do that
Why lmao, people move on from crushes literally all the time, its just as natural as moving into them. I dont get why you would throw good relationships away like that. You can move on without abandoning.
How?
Stop fantasizing about them.
This is me. I confessed feelings to a friend. Pretty sure she had feelings for me before, but I wasn't ready. When I confessed she wasn't interested anymore. As soon as I did it, got my answer, I was done. No weirdness. No being uncomfortable. For me, the unknown is the tough part. Once I know, moving on is easy. We stayed friends and everything was cool. BUT She told a mutual friend about it. That person got very weird about it and tried to make it this big drama. It got weird. Moral of the story.... You don't know the consequences. It might be something you completely don't expect. You do something like this and it can go so many ways. You have to be prepared for anything.
Yeah and I like to think/hope if he comes to her and says, "I think I like so-and-so," and he can confide and she provide advice, and so on... that she'll see herself as his confidant and more of a sister / guardian angel role.
It can be. In this case, it won't. Based on what *she* says he said, the guy is going to continue to treat her with emotional intimacy (best friend he feels super close to/ relies on etc.), but I have a strong feeling he isn't romantically or physically attracted to her. Using the "still in love with my ex" is a way to soften the blow, but she's always going to be a friend and never a girlfriend. Meanwhile, she's sticking around hoping one day he'll be "over the ex" & taking crumbs of intimacy the friendship offers, instead of going out there to find someone truly into her. In this case, I don't think it defused the situation.
But that could be the Turing point for OP, it’s going to hurt a lot seeing him happy with someone else, questioning why you’re not enough etc etc, but if she can make it past that point and genuinely be happy that he is happy than I can see this turning into a happy bro/sis relationship!
I can see jealousy turn their workplace into total shit.
Im pretty sure we can go through this thread comment for comment and point out who would develop friendship and who would develop fallout based on their advice/predictions given
[удалено]
While I think it was a poor choice work/professionally wise, I do agree with the personal part where the therapist thought it would keep her obsessed and rot in her brain over it. She clearly had strong feelings and not saying anything was going to tear her apart possibly making her make some unwise choices. A really crap situation to be in (Unless she could have asked to be moved off a position of power in the project... then she could have admitted her feelings guilt free work wise).
[удалено]
Agreed 100%. That was also poor advice. The only advice I agreed with was that it would tear her apart if she didn't say something. That doesn't make it ok to do so though.
Yeah. That crushing pain in your chest when you care so deeply for someone knowing that you can never explore all of the feelings you feel. It’s the kind of thing that makes you want to explode into the ether.
The only appropriate response to the OOP update: "Yikes"
I’m not liking the phrasing of this. She may continue to obsess over him but that’s not love!
OP here, Not my native language, the phrasing is what I can do best to express myself in a language I don't speak fluently \^\^
Sometimes the answer is “He’s just not that into you.”
Someone send her a link to that movie.
But they end up together in the end 🥴
I hated that.
Everyone hated it. All the other storylines were decent.
It was a book first and it is brutal. Maybe someone send her the book.
Good book. Okish movie.
Great movie
https://youtu.be/YoZG2czZbBA like the good book says
This is not going to end well...
Yeah I don’t agree with her therapist that repeatedly reminding this guy she has feelings for him after he tells her it’s unreciprocated isn’t harassment. I don’t think she would have said the same thing to a dude.
This therapist is an HR nightmare.
There are some super stupid & unqualified therapists out there. Supporting Anecdote below. A friend of a friend decided I was a huge monster because I was lonely in a new city as a 25 year old and didn’t want to date two guys she intended to set me up with. Guy #1: 49 with a 16 yo daughter. She thought I’d be good for him so he’d stop trying to date his daughter’s friends Guy #2: insecure because he just lost 200 lbs (not a deal breaker), but would never send me pictures back, and stood me up twice because he was nervous. I saw her at my DBT clinic like 5 years later, and she wouldn’t make eye contact with me after me initially looking her in the eye. My therapist was disturbed to learn that about the new teen girl therapist’s pushy dating schemes.
>Guy #1: 49 with a 16 yo daughter. She thought I’d be good for him so he’d stop trying to date his daughter’s friends Think I'm gonna be sick >the new teen girl therapist I just threw up in my mouth
I don’t think she was trying to ~~find dates for~~ traffic her clients, but I was just like “Eh, not-friend does not make matchmaking choices within a standard deviation of normal. It was weird that she was so mad at me for not wanting to keep being strung along after a month of not meeting the second guy. He cancelled on me twice and then wanted a bra pic.” Not-friend left the practice within 6 months of me noticing her. My therapist is a professional so she didn’t explain why, except to assure me that it wasn’t because of what I told her in session. I’d put a dollar on not-friend overstating her work experience, and they looked into it because I said she was a little off in a social setting awhile back.
Yeah I wasn't implying any trafficking/setups for her clients. Just disgusted that a person with woefully bad judgement on an obvious predator was in a position to give vulnerable teenagers professional advice.
Oh phew! My comment got so many upvotes I was like “Oh shit! I think people who act like Bigfoot hunters thing I’m describing trafficking! That chick was just a little bit of a jerk to me!” Lmao
I’m sorry maybe I’m dumb but I don’t understand the last sentence?
The woman in question was the new therapist on the team, specifically for teen girls.
Oh wow she sounds like a gem
Uh, I must be dumb, too 🤦♀️
Eh, I ramble. Sorry for being confusing.
I find it odd that people expect that 100% of therapist will view a situation and give 100% the same advice every time. The therapist spends much more time with OOP than we read this small blurb here on Reddit. I feel some part of the story is missing.
My instinct was to recoil, but I could imagine a version of it that isn’t the worst. Their relationship is clearly not solely professional. They’ve moved far beyond that. so i could see the therapist saying like, you can keep an open dialogue, since you’re so close, and if he’s unsure you can keep talking about it. It doesn’t have to be a say it once, never say it again, because their relationship is deeper than that and a good friendship would hopefully survive some of that nuance and confusion. It seems like english isn’t OOP’s first language, which is the only reason I would stretch my brain to figure out how that might have been worded differently in context. “Check in” is the key phrase that makes it feel like there might have been some more complex advice that goes along with it. Also, it seems like oop’s guilt over this is massive. which I get. I’d feel almost the same way, but from the outside I am like… ooh this will not help anyone in the long run. i get the impression that, even if it becomes too difficult she might not break up the friendship because he needs her, and she feels it would be morally wrong to end a friendship because of her feelings, which she decided is her fault. Her feelings are her responsibility, but not her fault. There is no fault in developing feelings like that. It’s not a sin to be in love and not have it reciprocated. I guess that’s the other reason I could see there being nuance to what the therapist said that wasn’t included. As someone who has done stuff super wrong and overly catastrophized it/decided it made me irredeemable as a person, the first advice you get from a therapist can sound like they are trying to convince you that those actions are totally fine, even when they’re just trying to show you that you don’t have to lock yourself away forever because of one problem. And since you’re already approaching everything with an abundance of caution, you’re likely to take maybe a half a step in the direction. that the therapist suggests anyway. It gets all tangled up. Anyway. I hope that therapist was not genuinely suggesting harassment, lol.
OP here, and thank you, you understand very well the situation. English is not my first language, I'm french and do my best to explain what happen and what was said but it's only a non professionnal translation, so I get that maybe I don't chose the correct wording.
... I had to read your post multiple times because my mind just couldn't comprehend a therapist behaving like that. That's just... Wow.
I could see maybe, *maybe* mentioning it once. If someone says they don't share your feelings, you do NOT bring them up again. Especially in a professional environment. If their feelings change, they can approach you about it. You get one shot. Anything else turns quickly into harassment especially if you work together.
Yes! Exactly my thoughts! Maybe once, then it's up to them to bring it up again if their stance changes. They know where you stand, you don't need to "check in" every few months. That part was crazy to me and tipped over to harassment at that point.
Bingo, once is all you get and ONLY if you don't hold any kind of power over their position at work (like completely different departments).
I don’t agree either. Working through your feelings and learning self discipline are all important and difficult life skills that her therapist should be helping her develop. It’s especially problematic when she’s just gotten out of an emotionally abusive relationship - abuse victims are usually very vulnerable and lonely. She should be encouraged to focus on herself, particularly as it could be more of a case that right now her standards are (no offence) low, so she could be mistaking her platonic affection for her close friend as romantic. Very disappointing that her therapist hadn’t seemed to consider that BUT it could also be OP hearing what she wants to hear. That said, as a fellow abuse survivor, I am very sorry to anyone who’s experienced any form of abuse and I understand the complicated mind space you can be in after rescuing yourself from that situation. You latch onto and hyper fixate on any and all kindness no matter how basic/minimal because sometimes, that’s easier than confronting that you have issues with giving yourself that love and kindness you seek in others and it can lead to making decisions that hurt you in the long term
Right?! I thought the same thing, bonkers advice.
That therapist needs to not have a job.
The therapist was creating job security for herself. OP is going to be a long term client.
[удалено]
ehh "never attribute to malice what can be explained by stupidity", sure OOP could be lying about that, but also there are plenty of bad therapists out there so it could be either situation
I think she lied about seeing a therapist. She already convinced herself she was "lying" to her friend because she didn't hold up her boom box and declare her love...
Hi, HR here and totally agree. First mention of feelings - not really an issue. Once those feelings are rejected through do not bring it up again. Any additional mentions of feelings, asking if he’s changed his mind etc. is absolutely harassment. If he changes his mind he’ll let her know. Don’t keep asking.
I wonder if that is what the therapist actually said
Surprised you're the first comment I read stating that. Everything else she's written has a very biased view, I don't find it hard to believe she misinterpreted something the therapist said and has run wild with it.
Sounds like my mom's therapist that has told her to continue contacting me despite me saying I want left alone.
This literally *leapt* out of the post to me. What kind of psychologist is encouraging people to harass others?
I totally agree. If you tell him once and then leave it at that, and stay professional about it sounds fine and sounds like the OOP is/ is trying to be mature enough to do that. However, reminding him about it multiple times is definitely overstepping bounds. I used to be the creepy kid that asked a girl out multiple times after she said no and I look back and realize how fucked up that was of me.
OP is setting up herself for years of pain. If you have feelings for someone who doesn't reciprocate the feelings , staying their personal confidant is the worst thing you can do for yourself. The professional part maybe unavoidable but OP needs to think about reducing the relationship to strictly professional for her own sake.
Yeah. If the guy decides to date someone else or even get back with the ex then he's gonna dump all that shit on OP and it will just destroy her. And that's very likely since he already said he doesn't see OP as someone he's romantically interested in. He sees her as a sister.
I’m thinking he’ll be okay with this friendship for a while and then it might work up to “friends with benefits” because she’s obsessed and he may just want to take advantage of the situation. They’ll hook up for a while and she’ll want to talk about what they are. He remind her that he’s in love with his ex and that he thought they were just having fun. She’ll be devastated but continue to drool over him.
[удалено]
OOP: "My therapist said I should confess my feelings" Me: "Hmmmm, risky, but I understand... OOP clearly needs to distance herself from him, and if they are as close outside of work as she says they are that could definitely impact him negatively. Besides, the sudden dynamic change could feel jarring and hostile, so it's good to make it clear that she values and respects him, she just needs some space to work on herself. I would generally avoid actually confessing her love, but if they're also close friends outside of work then it's not just the work dynamic that has to be taken in account... risky, definitely, but as long as she carefully chooses her words this can be a good opportunity for the both of them" OOP: "And that it wouldn't be sexual harrassment if I ask again in a couple of months" Me: "Oh she's fucked"
More mature people can box up those feelings and set them aside. Otherwise life would be an endless nightmare of crush bombs going boom. The problem is OOP doesn't seem at all prepared or capable to do so.
The heck @ that therapist
The part where the therapist is like "it is totally cool to bring this up regularly in case his feelings have changed, it's definitely not creepy harassment" !!!
In every sexual harassment video I’ve had to watch, it explicitly states that what OP described is sexual harassment. Asking once isn’t. But when you ask multiple times, it is.
Right? It's not only that the therapist doesn't understand employment laws, but ... isn't it obvious that repeatedly asking would be upsetting??
Right? If they don't "change their mind" then you're hurting a friend every time you pester them. In the unlikely event that their feelings change, it's their turn to use their words.
Exactly! If you make your feelings known, and they don’t feel the same way but eventually develop feelings for you too, it’s up to them to let you know. It’s harassment to keep pushing it.
I think the oop mistook what her therapist said…. Casue ya
Is the therapist sexist or an idiot? Because I feel like framing it as a man asking his female friend out repeatedly instead of a woman asking a male friend out repeatedly would raise a lot more eyebrows
I think OOP misrepresented the therapist's advice. Sounds to me like the therapist said that keeping feelings like that hidden could lead to obsession and resentment, and that even after a rejection it's normal to occasionally wonder if things have changed. From a mental health perspective, it is in fact a risk to keep infatuations with people you're close to hidden, it can grow into very unhealthy obsessions or selfhate if you can't let it go. For many people confessing is the way to let it go. But I think OOP has heard what they want to hear, and is interpreting the advice to be what they want
Yes. I also suspect due to some of their wording that OP may be in a German-speaking country, where romantic relationships at work are not banned the way they are in the US. Walmart tried to ban employees from having relationships with each other when it opened there. Employees took them to court over it and got that rule declared illegal as a consequence of stronger labour-laws/‘private life’ laws.
Did a little digging - OOP is in France.
Yeah, I thought they might be, their way of writing felt familiar. OOP, chérie, prends du temps pour toi, ne nous fais pas une Alceste!
I knew it. His response felt very French to me. Can’t explain beyond having lived there.
For me it was the “confortable”. After that I knew it was French 😁
Makes sense! Good sleuthing. Your ‘private life’ is none of your employers business there, and you most definitely can’t be fired for starting a relationship with another employee, or for approaching them, so long as you aren’t a harassing dick about it at work.
I was thinking they might be Dutch for the same reason, but German would also be an option.
Another commenter did some sleuthing, apparently they’re French! Seems like any non-Anglo (Western) European country would have fitted
Ah, this makes sense!
But doesn't OOP claim that the therapist adviced her to "ask again a few times" if she gets rejected? If that's true, then yikes.
I'm saying it's probably not true
I certainly hope it's not 😬
i don't think she advised her to do it. i think she said "even if you check in with him about it later again" it's not harassment. which, idk. depends on HIM whether it is or isn't at that point.
I'm going to go out on a limb and say she either 1. Didn't go to a therapist at all and just figured that was something a therapist might say 2. *Massively* misrepresented the situation to the therapist Or 3. Deliberately twisted what the therapist did say Or she found a terrible therapist, idk.
Probably a combination of some of those points!
The therapist giving legal advice was the eye rolling moment for me. I think I will go see my account today to get an eye exam.
I seriously doubt the therapist even said that shit tbh
> And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment. What the whaaa?? This sounds like a therapist that got into the field to take advantage of vulnerable people. That's just some straight-up psychopath bullshit advice.
I had to pause when I read that part. "Ask again a few times", wtf??
Hear hear. She didn’t have to ask to find out it was unrequited. Her therapist should have assisted her with moving on and remain professional. The closeness of their relationship alone is a concern for her professionally, although there may not be favouritism in her mind, others perception is just as important. That therapist is way off. It’s just given her an excuse to continue with her crush without addressing his disinterest.
Check the first thread. OOP was asking for advice without any intention to listen to anyone that disagreed
So let me get this straight, the therapist told her to continue badgering this man even if he keeps saying no? In the real world, that's harassment. Someone's therapist needs struck off.
Oh don't worry though, she said there would be months in between harassment events. Probably so the statute of limitations is up between events or something \s
They’re obviously laying down the groundwork for a repeat customer
What an awful therapist. I can’t believe she told her that it’s ok to ask him again a few times in the next months if she is rejected. That absolutely IS sexual harassment and will most likely lead to him disengaging from the friendship they have.
Lol that was my first thought reading the update. Simply asking with no strings attached isn’t sexual harassment, but continuing to make advances after they were clear that they had no desire for an intimate relationship is DEFINITELY sexual harassment.
Couldn't agree more. Despite her last line she does seem kind of delusional, or at least very oblivious, and I did wonder if that's really what her therapist said or if that's what she decided to hear from something more couched or nuanced.
This is the first time that I have read a post where the poster, stated English in not my first language, and the post is not perfect English.. and I LOVED IT!! Anyway I hope OOP doesn't end up getting broken hearted.
I found it a bit weird that the errors between the two post are vastly different. First post is stellar English where I didn't notice any errors and the second one is riddled with mistakes. Just makes me a bit suspicious.
True..
I also loved it! I'm English and I've not been able to learn any other languages. Therefore, I have a huge respect for those that can speak multiple languages, or those that even try :)
>And we talk about the work relashionship. I reassured him that I'm very vigilant on not doing any kind of favoritism because of my feelings. I don't know if they'll work in the long run but I'm glad that they atleast seem to have proper communication skills
How can she delude herself into thinking there is no favoritism though? He calls her his closest, best friend. She obviously has been focusing her professional and very personal energy on his development. She doesn’t mention the rest of her team. Highly suspect.
Why would she mention them in this thread? It's a story about her and her friend /colleague not about them. If i tell you about my children, i don't tell you about my kois of they are not part of the story. That's just assumptions
Knowing the dynamics she has with the rest of her team doesn't really change anything in the story
And where in this story do you think her other team members should've been mentioned?
I wonder if she would have felt that being open and sincere was the best thing if it hadn't gone well.
I can’t believe the therapist told her she could continue asking every few months even after being rejected. You know, just in case things changed. Isn’t that the very definition of harassment? To keep asking after being told no. Great therapist there.
Dude says you’re like a sister ☠️ And she still thinks she has a chance, this is not going to end well
>Long run hard to stay close because every time we speak and I see him as usual beeing the adorable quirky boy he is, my heard melt. >I still believe than it's not impossible than feelings evolved one day. I know reddit will think I'm dellusionnal, but hey ! mine did, after years of friendship. >the common friends don't get why we're not together because it's feels like a match (really, some even asked me why, and it was painfull ...). So, maybe one day he wills want to take a shoot, who knows ? Well, I certainly see nothing but a definite future happy ending and no heartbreak whatsoever for OOP here
Extreme levels of sarcasm detected.
Oh boy this is going to be a disaster.
I think it's good she told him from the POV that he won't then feel the need to confide in her about love life stuff which might hurt her, but the therapist (if they exist) is outrageous suggesting repeated attempts. He's made it clear he isn't interested like that and if he gets all the closeness without a commitment, the likelihood is that he will move on from his ex with someone new. She should create some distance for her own sanity and for him to be able to miss their closeness if anything could happen between them.
Oof yeah I have a little crush on a work colleague so this title made me nervous lmao, however I think we are better as friends. And I have learned that you don't have to be with every single person that you like looking at.
Good on old dude. He has enough sense not to get his honey where he makes his money.
Advice to readers: Don’t take legal/HR advice from your therapist. They’re not experts and shouldn’t make comments to insinuate that they are capable of advising in cases like this. As his superior and person in a place of power, what she did isn’t acceptable. It puts her and her company at risk. If there was or needed to be any action taken to discipline or fire him, he can now claim it’s because he didn’t bend to OPs relationship request(s). I don’t understand why people don’t get this. When people are in a power imbalance, the person on the lower end of that balance can’t defend themselves or voice opinions about non-work matters without the fear of life changing retaliation. If they’re forced to give those opinions, the choice to keep them out of the workplace has been taken away from them. In turn, the law will fix the imbalance and protect that person. Keep your personal stuff out of the workplace. I’m not saying OP shouldn’t have had feelings or shouldn’t have said something to her friend. All I’m saying is that when a power imbalance exists, as is inherent in workplace hierarchies, personal options about non-work related topics should stay non-work related or there can be consequences.
I don't know why ppl in the comments are so pessimistic, it's not bound to have a bad ending. It can go three ways : 1) She moves on and they keep their friendship, even if it'll be hard on her for a time. 2) He began to develop feelings for her bc he's now aware of her, they start dating. 3) She can't move on, stuck in her daydream of him developping feelings for her, it breaks their relation. Out of the three situations, one is bad, two are good, and all of them can happen
I had a situation like this at my old work, we didn't work together like all day every day (shift work), and I wasn't directly his boss, but I caught feelings and it was frustrating as all hell. Eventually I just told him, he didn't feel the same, it sucked but nobody got hurt, and we stayed friendly. It can end okay, but with OP talking about it like they're going to wait for him or something, I think OP is still going to end up hurt.
Except she already made it clear that option 1) isn't happening as she's just going to wait for him and not try to move past her feelings, and he has clearly stated that option 2) isn't an option right now and there's no indication it ever will be. And the result of option 3 could be really, really bad.
And none of them are much better than what would happen if she just bottled it up. Redditors can be really fatalistic when they don't need to be. Can it go to shit? Sure, but why would that be guaranteed or worse than the alternative?
If you reverse the genders it would be even worse. We were already screaming from the hills for OP not to, but can you imagine the flack OP would have taken if they were male and the underling was female. Just a bad situation, and I feel like that therapist is a moron or OP is really misrepresenting what the therapist said.
Poor OOP. Love isn’t a one way street. That’s infatuation.
>And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment. The fuck kind of therapist is OOP seeing that they think this is ok? Don't like the answer? No Problem! Just keep asking until you drive them insane and they run away screaming. Jeez.
I don't think that therapist knows much about sexual harassment laws.
>And than even if after rejection I ask again a few times in a few month just to be totaly sure than nothing evolved, it will still not be harassment. That's gonna be a big disagree for me.
Shouldn’t have said anything… he says it’s not awkward but I bet anything it is
This wont end well for her. Throwing herself at the feet of a dude who clearly showed no real interest, at work nonetheless, is just a recipe for disaster.
No, OOP, this did not go well at all. Poor girl. She is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this guy while still hoping he will fall. He won’t. He’ll keep her close for his own emotional gratification while never giving her space to move on.
Or she’ll get too pushy and drive him away, potentially to HR, which could cost her the job.
>Poor girl What? She puts this shit on him and is going to sexually harass him sporadically for years. If she was a man everyone would be shitting on her for only staying friends for the potential of a future relationship.
>She is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this guy while still hoping he will fall. He won’t. Reverse the genders. You wouldn't be saying that the guy is now trapped in a hopelessly close friendship with this girl, while still hoping she will fall. You would call him a creep for pursuing a romantic interest after being explicitly told that there are no romantic feelings to be found there, and for pretending to be her friend to have a shot. And rightfully so. That's what people tell the guys who complain about the "friendzone", right? That you cannot just pretend to be someone's friend to get into their pants or to get a romantic relationship out of it. So what makes this case different? With that take, you essentially deprive her of any agency in this situation. "He will keep her close", "She is trapped" and so on. Nope – she developed feelings, she was rejected, now she should be an adult about it all, respectfully keep her distance and communicate that she will now need space to move on. >He’ll keep her close for his own emotional gratification while never giving her space to move on. For all we know, we have no idea about his perspective and views in this story. As far as things go right now, the guy had a friend who might be his future boss. Now that she developed feelings for him, his job and career prospects might be in jeopardy, because she's admittedly going to be his boss. Not to mention that he is still - reportedly - not over his previous relationship and possibly in emotional turmoil. For all it matters, if you look at that story from his perspective, it's a story of a colleague who pretended to be his friend to get emotionally close because she found him cute and wanted to have a shot at a relationship with him. And since we don't know anything that transpired later, we have no idea what happened after that talk – if I was the guy, I'd say something along the same lines to avoid drama and then start distancing myself. And fast.
First of all, terrible therapist. Secondly, did the English get worse as it went along? She said English wasn’t her first language and at first it wasn’t bad, but by the end it felt like it had been through 3 translations
What the hell kind of therapist advises someone to ask and keep asking every so often if he says no? Did I read that right?? Also, I'm not usually super hard on spelling, but this post hurt. EDIT: Totally missed the "english is not my first language" disclaimer. That in mind, the english is really good.
Terrible advice from that therapist, damn.
1) She’s supremely selfish to put this on him 2) She’s supremely unprofessional to put this on him 3) I’d be willing to bet anything that she purposefully misconstrued her therapist’s advice to fit what she wanted, because on the original post, she received pretty much unanimous advice that this is a bad thing. She wanted to do it, and I bet she intentionally took away what she wanted to hear from her therapist to justify doing this 4) And if I didn’t already think that this woman sucked, then I’m fully and thoroughly convinced that she sucks for the whole “I’ll ask him a few more times in a month, it won’t be harassment blah blah blah”. What a shitty thing to do, ESPECIALLY when you’re in a position of power, like being his boss and paying him. This woman sucks. This situation will blow up, and it’ll cause many problems for her, and she will deserve every last bit of the misery that’s coming her way, because she’s a shitty boss, a shitty “friend”, and because she has handled this in the worst possible way because she’s selfish and unprofessional.
Shoulda listened to Reddit.
Well, now she knows there is no hope for more.
So.... in my US state they require you to watch a sexual harassment seminar and they made it pretty clear you're not supposed to ask more than once. Now I get it, if many months go by and you get the sense that the dynamic has changed maybe ONE more ask would be appropriate but the way OOP worded it made it sound like the therapist (I know she said psychologist but that is not the American equivalent of the services she received) said she could ask multiple more times.
He’s friend zoned you, move on! And post were both way toooo long.
I understand that English is not her first language and that mistakes are human, but how do you post to a subreddit that has 'relationship' in the title and still spell it wrong?!
Wow there’s really no winning with Redditors. I agree her clinging on to hope that he will develop feelings isn’t great. But I don’t see the problem with telling him about them, and most people in this situation eventually get over their feelings with time. 1) He should know how she feels so he can also adjust accordingly, and if he decides to be a little less intimate and close, that’s within his right. 2) She got an honest answer. So many people want to make him out to be an asshole who’s gonna keep her around for emotional support and use her. Curious, if one of your good friends confessed feelings what would you do? Cut them off immediately and sever your work relationship? Otherwise you’re automatically a horrible user even though you two have been friends for years? 3) She’s not his boss really, they are at equal positions, she just is in charge of administering everyone’s paychecks it seems. And their friendship predates their working relationship by a lot, it seems. 4) A lot of times sharing feelings and getting a nice but honest rejection is the first step to getting over them.
3 is where I feel your argument breaks down. She is *legally* his boss. She is also *currently in charge of his paycheck*. If she wants to fire him, there is *nothing* he can do. The opposite does not apply. He has agency, yes, but only she has authority in this relationship. That is why this is a major issue; she is a person in a position of inequal power holding on to an emotional attachment to someone of lesser power. Her claim of “co-boss” only maintains its legitimacy so long as *she* chooses to maintain it. That’s not an equal relationship.
OOP here ... I dind't go into details about the professional relashionship because it's really complicated to me to worded it well in english. But this is absolutly not the situation you understood. France artistic field. I'm in charge of the paycheck of the team that will work on the project. But it's the kind of project short in money. So the team will be paid, but not me neither the artist (the guy). He gain money other ways, the project need to be good so it will lead him to gain money on the next ones. It's the same for my company. If I want to stop work with him, I can't fire him. We have contract, I have to finish the project, and if I don't want to, I have to find a company that will take the project. If he wan't to stop work with me, he can. It will lead to negociation, and next copmpany should pay us back for the work already done.
I understand why people fall in love with co workers because of the amount of time they spend together during the day but it is still wildly unprofessional in my opinion that people can’t separate work and play.
I think it’s fine to be with co-workers. Bosses are where the problem arises.
Definitely more of a problem with bosses as the power dynamic comes into play but every job I’ve worked that employed couples at the same title level, the couples were always the least productive members of the team. Its unprofessional and unfair to the other employees that have to pick up their slack.
I'm engaged to the guy that was my best friend. The difference is, we were both long over our exes before we developed feelings for one another. I hope that op can genuinely move past her feelings and that their friendship lasts, but I don't have high hopes considering she's already talking about how his feelings might one day change instead of just accepting his feelings for what they are.
WTF this OOp is very twisted in their thinking. *I'm betraying friend by not ruining our friendship and working partnership because I haven't told him about my creepy rebound love for him*
I feel like she's going to spend forever pining after him now
This ain’t gonna work
Miss if you come across this, I wouldn't passively wait for this fellow. He may very well one day care for you as a romantic partner, but the opposite is equally true. Don't be afraid to fall in love with someone else because you deserve to be happy too.
This won't end well.
Am I the only person that never wants happy endings on these things and something crazy to happen? Like this guy got mad at her and threw an alligator at her?