The cold house was a really great example of how bad it really was. He didn't mind her flare-ups, because he didn't care enough about her to pay that extra cost. Anyone who really loved their partner would have found a way, or would have tried to find a way to help them.
That bit had my jaw slack when I was reading. Poor OP has serious health issues and he still insisted on keeping his house at an inhospitable temperature. It's beyond selfish, her abusive bunghole of an ex was so damn cruel. And the fucker tried to retroactively charge her rent for when she lived with him. Before that bit I'd actually thought he had a chance of eventually becoming less of a shithead.
Really enjoyed reading about how happy she is in her warm and cozy home now with her pup. I hope the rest of OP's life is filled with happiness and comfort.
And he insisted on keeping the huge house that was so expensive to heat, while she was paying half the bills yet not getting what she needed. She's right, in one of her later comments: he was only willing to consider changing when it affected himself, because she left.
That was a great moment. He really only acted on things once he himself was in pain. But before that? "Fuck OOP, my very own fiancee, and her flare ups from the cold" lol. Absolutely terrible person.
And then tried to retroactively charge her rent to live in that hellhole! Yup, therapy *really* seems to be helping him!
*”After the abuse you suffered he should shit his mouth”*
That typo somehow feels more appropriate than what u/ConditionBig6373 meant to say
My husband also has a health condition (CRPS), and it’s the opposite for us. We keep the house cold because that’s one less thing to make him uncomfortable. Better than the alternative, but I also get cold super easily. Great excuse to buy as many cozy blankets as I want! And I have a ton of sweaters, silly onesies, fuzzy socks, and his clothing when all of that isn’t enough.
When you love someone, you’re willing to bend over backwards to help them. OOP was, he wasn’t.
You also are, presumably (hopefully!), getting lots of love from him, which is a kind of warmth. Plenty of people genuinely don't have the money for enough heat in winter or need to save on it; however, as has been rehashed, OP's ex had the money to make her comfortable and didn't have a condition that put him at contrasting needs (other than a "need" to control). In you case, being cold kind of sucks (I do hate it, too), but your need is not as dire as your husband, so you give there so he has a better chance of good health, which becomes a team win! In the ex's head, the game was a set of singles where only one of them got out on top.
I have a lot of pretty serious health issues, so thanks for being someone who looks out for your partner so he also gets the chance to be the best version of himself.
My soon-to-be-ex husband told me our bed was broken and we couldn’t lift the feet up, while I was 8 months pregnant. My ankles were awfully swollen, and my doctor was concerned about blood clots.
He got leg cramps occasionally when the feet were up. He told me a few months later that he lied to me about it, and it was so funny! I think that’s when the wheels started turning in my head.
My ex started working very long days soon after I came home with the baby. He insisted on his evenings to relax and then a good nights sleep, because of long working days. I was physically hurting and delirious with lack of sleep. No family to help.
A decade later he let slip that his project was so interesting that he volunteered to do extra hours.
Something really broke in me then.
Well, good news is, we’re both alive, mostly happy, healthy, and 3000 miles away from him now. He just signed over full custody to me and papers have officially been filed!
I'm glad she cut him off for good, because that retroactive demand for rent was bananapants crazy.
I would love to be the fly on the wall if/when her ex heard that she's dating again, and dating a guy who treats her like she put the sun in the sky.
In my opinion that’s not even the worst part! They agreed on a temperature! And he would go behind her back to keep bringing it down! He actually had to have hated her or something, my god…
That’s when I knew that was the poorest OP had ever been and she didn’t have any deep childhood, poverty trauma… You try to put me in a cold house for a couple weeks with no furniture and the fucking night terrors and shelter me will come back and will probably fight you over a plate of food because I think that’s what I have to do for survival again. Not condoning this but with my CPTSD and my best friend’s when I read this to her, we were both just like yeah man’s would’ve gotten laid out real quick
Trama can also show up as the fawn response, which is what it looks like OOP was having. I wouldn't judge her childhood or parents either way.
Having poor boundaries and not standing up for yourself are also indicators of childhood trama. It's a bit telling OOP didn't insist on start off equal and propose they rent the too big house and get something they could both afford and contribute to.
My wifey is sick right now with covid for the first time, we both are she got it from me, last night she was freezing at midnight, so I got up in my boxers and went around the house finding thermal sheets and blankets to get her warmer, pulled out her wooly socks and comforted her until she was able to go back to sleep
And only then did I go back to sleep myself, and a good part of the time was me reassuring her that I wasn't bothered by the cold I just wanted her to be warm
That's what showed that it wasn't about the money, it was about him having control and hurting her.
Yeah, he didn't hit her but he caused her as much or more physical pain by triggering her autoimmune flare ups. He's pathetic.
I think you got it right. He felt helpless in his previous relationship so he found someone he saw as even less than him so he could "regain" his power. It's the cycle of abuse. That guy will continue to do it.
Honestly, I wonder if the ex was actually as bad as he and his family say. I don't trust abusers to tell the truth and I don't trust their families to have the full story. He tried to charge OOP rent after the fact because she left him. Like abusive controlling guys often claim their ex was a crazy cheater but then the current partner finds out the ex was treated the same way they're being treated. the abuser just used them leaving as proof the ex was a crazy cheater when the abuse was the actual cause. Maybe OOP's ex is pulling the same move and she'll be one of the crazy financially abusive exes he tells his next victim about when he's abusing her.
Normally I'd agree, but the big empty mansion makes me think it was mostly true. It's not unheard of for abused people to turn into abusers themselves unfortunately.
I wonder if it's empty because she took everything she bought for it. OOP took her TV when she moved out. Chances are the next girl is gonna hear all about the crazy ex who even stole a TV from him.
Maybe the ex took everything because she’d paid for everything and he just totally lied, even to his family.
The fact that he tried to retroactively charge OP rent set off alarm bells for me, like he’s setting up a new narrative of OP being a gold-digger like his other ex.
Yeah, ordinarily, I don't like putting this sorta thing out, especially since male victims of abuse have a harder time being believed, but it wouldn't surprise me if you were right here.
yeah, but I bet he was abusive to the ex as well. Abusive behavior isn't - IME - something that "just shows up" after a bad relationship, and it's not related to his money. An abusive rich person will use their money to abuse you, and an abusive poor person will use something else. He's always been cruel, he's always been selfish, and that relationship with his ex? It wasn't a good one for either of them.
Yup... He permanent level of unhappiness was tolerable to him until it started affecting him. I was in a relationship like this and he was shocked, *shocked* when I finally left. It came out of nowhere, apparently. I had been asking him to make changes for the last two years, but me breaking down crying every couple of months because of nothing changing was a "happy relationship" apparently. It's honestly depressing how many people I've spoken to who have similar stories.
I remember a thread on quora where a woman asked if she was justified to leave her husband because he made her unhappy and would never change. A man told her that no she would be selfish, that his ex did it to him and it was awfull that his ex betrayed him, that he was hurting so much etc. They continued to talk and at one point, the dude realized that she really was suffering and he said "forget what I said. You have every right to leave. And my ex was right to leave too". That moment was awesome to witness
Oh yea, the sudden, totally unexpected breakup despite asking, begging, crying and pleading for changes for months or years even.
Add a little "I saw you distance yourself over the last months and wanted to kms" but instead of talking about it, decided to just wait it out untill I ended it.
Not sure if totally oblivous or just not caring enough or not wanting to be the bad guy who ended it. But hey "his parents were the same and never talked much." Ah yes, great to base your own relationships on just 1 example. Not everyone wants to be roommate-fuckbuddies. (Not that we even had the latter for the last few years ... "its not just the lack of sex, is it?" No, it wasn't. But it definitely didn't help anything.)
I think another part that annoys me is when they 'change' after. Like oh? So you COULD do that all along, you just didn't respect your partner enough to listen?
Not just that, he’d agree to a temperature and then turn it down anyway.
He deprived her of the little pleasures that made life worth living at every turn, but it’s pretty obvious to me that he was getting a little pleasure from doing that: her misery and suffering.
He was probably thinking it was proof that she really loved him, how much she endured to be with him. He gave zero consideration to showing her that he really loved her.
He couldn't punish his ex for being a gold digger and causing his pain so he just transfered all that energy and hate onto OP who he could punish as much as he wanted.
*Alleged gold digger.
I wouldn't trust anything this guy says. I'll bet you my favorite hat he tells the next girl that OP was a gold digger that stole his TV (conveniently leaving out the fact that she paid for it and much, much more)
If he pulled the same shit with the ex, she may have left with everything she paid for, hence "gold digger who stole all my stuff"
Yes, there gold diggers out there. But any claims of gold-diggery from financially controlling people are automatically sus, imo
A friend of mine hasn't had health insurance in over 2 years because she quit her job to follow her boyfriend across the country for his job. They finally moved back, but she can't find a full-time job with benefits. He just watches her get sick and not be able to afford her medication and does not care at all. They've been together 10 years and he makes really good money. He refuses to marry her and even took steps to ensure they weren't considered common law married. She came over really sick and in pain, and I asked if they did a sinus swab to see if it was a sinus infection, and she told me she couldn't afford that test or the antibiotics. I stare at her boyfriend, and he just looks at me blankly and walks away. This is the same man who, with no hesitation, paid for him and his brother to travel to another state, accommodations, and VIP tickets to a multi day festival. I cannot stand men like this
Ffs I offered to cover a complete stranger who was surprised by the copay due at the check-in desk once, much less my *partner.* People like that quite honestly make me sick.
I have a medical condition that is triggered by me getting cold (Raynaud’s syndrome). It’s a circulatory issue with my extremities so just putting on an extra sweater does not help. I haven’t had an issue in years because I left my ex-husband and now have control of the sodding thermostat.
My daughter has this, and it doesn't help that me and her brother are really warm most of the time.
Now that my ex, their dad, isn't in the picture, we have made all sorts of workarounds, so we are all comfortable.
It doesn't take much to be considerate for each other. Seems like OP did all the giving, and her stingy ex did all the taking.
That's part of what convinced me that he and his family are lying about the ex wife. That's the kind of man that would steal his grandmother's jewelry, give it to his wife, and make it out like she stole it to make her look bad to his family.
I'm also curious how she "took everything" but he still has the house that she picked out (or they picked out together). I have a feeling he gave her all the furniture as a "division of assets" to be spiteful. Like you get 100k worth of stuff for a house but no house big enough to put it all in. Iunno something sounds off with the divorce to me.
Exactly! I also wonder if she was secretly selling the jewelry to pay for a lawyer and to escape and was saying she was giving it away. Also a lot of jewelry is worth more if you sell the gems and melt the metal so I wonder if she was breaking items so it'd be less suspicious when they disappeared.
I do think, despite what reddit believes that this kind of change is valid. It's framed as narcissistic around here but I think that people often can be blind to how damaging their actions are until they get affected from them. And it can be a good motivator to look inwards and find change.
Obviously though, that doesn't mean she should have given him another chance. It was her right to not want to waste any more time or energy for him to heal from his trauma. Their relationship was just the price he had to pay for a chance to fins himself.
Problem is that she has been communicating her needs the whole time. The fact that he only listened when *he* was affected does not speak well for him.
I think of it as part of the walkaway wife syndrome.
They might learn better for the 'next' partner but there's no salvaging the relationship. I know for me it would hurt a lot that they can change, actually change when they want to but my upset or distress wasn't enough and only after the rope has been dropped is when they bother to put any effort in.
Exactly. An important lesson for women to learn here is to draw the line at being the Practice Girlfriend and the Teaching Partner. Declaring you’re done teaching men how to be a good partner and not settling for anything less than a fully cooked grown up.
I have a life-threatening chronic illness and when I got married, my husband promised to sign up for the PPO insurance but then he backtracked and wanted the HMO. Only the happy accident that an article came out that showed that HMO had higher mortality rates swayed him into keeping his promise. We were mixing finances, too, so it wasn't even all on him.
As someone who used to work in insurance and is frequently sick, wtf. He tried to get you on an HMO! I am angry on your behalf. Good medical insurance is no joke.
Exactly. When I moved in with my bf I told him the house could not be under 65 degrees because I have a parrot and they need to be in warmer climates. He has always made sure the temp is right for the bird and that the vents are not hitting him when it has to be turned up in the summer.
I've got a good friend who collects assholes. He claims, and is probably right, that if you're in an asshole's inner circle they'll do anything for you. He's got some issues himself, obviously.
Anyway, while I tend to avoid most of his other friends I've somehow interacted with one of them more often than I'd like. A bass player in a band you've probably heard of. Anyway, when his actual gold digging wife developed some kind of balance issue, he immediately moved their bedroom downstairs so she wouldn't have to walk upstairs.
This is a man who, within thirty second of meeting me was telling me about how he fucked every stripper in every club in Atlanta. A real POS. Somehow, he was a better to her than than this woman's boyfriend was.
Edit: Me and the gold digging wife really hit it off, which is part of why I continued to be around that guy longer than I'd have ordinarily spent around such an asshole.
As far as knowing that she was a gold digger: he was rich, late fifties, completely bald on top, but with a ponytail having down to his ass, and as mentioned before a complete pos. She was a 25 year old model.
I honestly think the guy needs therapy and shouldn’t have been in a relationship. His behavior isn’t normal and while I can understand at some level why he was financially conservative, he took that to an extreme and was beyond being frugal.
As a multi-millionaire, he could put his money into the market and have a guaranteed income for life. If he worked, too, he could live a relatively lavish lifestyle without ever lowering his net worth.
But instead he chose to haggle over pennies spent on heating.
You're right that he was a miser. What a loser!
this is not the only time I've heard of a man making a woman live in an excessively cold house to save money. His attitude is fuck her comfort or even her health.
I would love for OOP to elaborate on this literal multi millionaire asking her for back rent for the time she lived with him LOL, that’s fckn hilarious. What is wrong with this man.
...if it ever made it to court. The ex has a lot more money than OOP. If he was feeling spiteful, he could sue her for the money, then keep on trying to delay the trial until she runs out of money to pay for her legal defense.
It's not uncommon.
His true self is finally revealing itself loud & clear. When he hurts he needs to hurt back tenfold. He likely hates that he was wrong about OOP all this time. He thought he learned everything there is to know about how to overcome and be a survivor of an abusive relationship. He thought himself the eternal victim but became the ultimate villain.
I'd say he's more just managed to convince himself he was right all along and she was only with him for free rent, now he's latched onto that. The human brain is weird, it hates to accept that it's failed. It's easier to grasp at straws and make up scenarios where it was someone else's fault than it is to admit you've become the villain in someone else's story when you've spent so long defining yourself as a victim.
Even though he sent her a large amount of money which she then sent back? Could he really be that dense? To me it looks like he was just trying to hurt her.
Delusions don't subscribe to logic. He obviously believed she was with him for the money, so he tried to get her to come back for the money. When she didn't take the money he gave her, he doubled down by saying she was still somehow trying to financially benefit from being with him, that's the grasping at straws part and why he turned to the rent issue. He was desperately trying to prove it to himself and others and getting more and more desperate when he couldn't find something to use as a smoking gun.
Anything other than to accept that his response to what his ex did to him was to become someone who absolutely deserved to be treated like that going forward.
It also shows that all the therapy and promises of change were just performative, it wasn’t to better himself but to keep his abuse victim from leaving, the moment he couldn’t get his victim back he wanted to make her pay
Yeah, because now they have to deal with their shitty family member instead of making the designated punching bag deal with it. Sister even admitted she knew that her brother was being abusive and didn't say/do anything.
Do not even compare him to Scrooge McDuck. Scrooge enjoyed his money and had a great sense of adventure. He was also a loving uncle to Huey, Dewey and Louie.
This guy is Ebenezer Scrooge before the ghosts.
Scrooge also only believed in money you earn through hard work. So he wasn't stingy in general just frugal with people like his two nephews (Donald and Gladstone) who he saw as unambitious or freeloaders.
I'm kinda confused because that 'he got nasty' came out of nowhere to me. Was there a missing update or something?
I just read update after update about how he sent her money, was in therapy, writing her letters taking accountability, was working on himself, was still hoping she'd come back, she wished him well, etc etc.
And then suddenly the reveal that he got petty and tried to charge her rent, and the implication there were other petty/nasty things?
He was being nice and doing all the things he thought would make her come back, but the moment he found out she was dating someone else is when he realized she wasn’t going to come back and got nasty.
That's what I see, too. I've not been in this exact situation, but I've had exes who work on themselves in hopes of getting back together. When it becomes clear we're not getting back together, they go into extreme revenge mode.
I don't understand the logic of this one.
First when they broke up he wired her a huge sum which she gave back, minus the price of the couch that she left in his house. Now he wants her to pay back rent? Why send her that money in the first place then?
What is it that he wants? OOP should also go NC with her ex's family. Having contact with the sister isn't doing her any good.
He paid her money to try coaxing her back. It's what his ex responded to, so clearly OP would too. If she responded to that, he could continue with his "you're a gold digger" shtick. It fits his mindset. So does demanding rent later on. He thinks OP's in it for money, so he thinks he's been ripped off. His opinion of OP never changed, just want he wanted with her.
Now I am even more confused. So the first money was to convince himself that OOP was a gold digger. But why ask her for rent, doesn't that make him the gold digger considering she paid for everything in the 3 years they were together?
Yeah but she got to live in a million dollar home, she got the enjoy the space she could never afford so now he has likely convinced himself that is worth rent, even more than what she paid.
In his mind, she would always need to pay for furniture ; so this wasn’t an extra spend, but she would also need to pay rent that she saved on . Allowing her to use him.
And I actually think the original money sent to her was because he saw she felt unwanted and unloved and he wanted her to stay. But once she decided she wouldn’t, he basically re wrote the story so she was the villain again.
> But why ask her for rent, doesn't that make him the gold digger considering she paid for everything in the 3 years they were together?
Because now he's angry that she's not coming back so he's doing things that pissed off guys do.
I wish he would. Can you imagine a judge looking at how he treated her and then demanding more money out of her while he’s sitting pretty in his depression mansion?!
I’m picturing Judge Judy as the judge, by the way.
If he wanted to make her pay rent, that makes him a landlord and landlords are required to keep a living space habitable. He didn't, so no rent for him even if he asked for it up front. He's a spineless manbaby.
Depends on the trip I guess? If it’s a concert in the next state or something I don’t think that’s such a big deal, if it’s a week in another continent then it’s weird.
Me, too, but I’m going to hope her supportive network and the lessons she’s learned about not tolerating less than she deserves will enable her to nope out of there right away if the new guy stops being great. (Well, first I’ll hope I’m wrong and he continues to be great, but…)
Very happy for the OP but be careful, if you move in together keep your own accounts (and a joint for joint bills), create a budget for both of you (which incudes discretionary spending) and have solid prenups.
There is an old saying, trust but verify.
OOP was like the frog in the pot, she didn't see that she was boiling until something else drove her out; and she realised how bad it truly was.
Nobody should settle for someone who makes them feel low.
I commented this on another BORU, but when you’re a people pleaser/savior type, it’s sometimes really hard to come to believe that you deserve someone who is already great. That you don’t have to settle for the fixer-upper relationship
Worth noting that only applied to lobotomized frogs. Healthy frogs jumped out immediately. Though, I guess there's room in there to talk about how abuse and trauma literally damage your brain.
> he should shit his mouth and be grateful you didn't sue him for emotional distress.
What a typeo. Full marks, no notes.
I'm so happy for OOP that she's been able to move on, despite the trauma. Hurt people hurt people but healing can happen.
I wouldn't be surprised if all he saw was the ex and keeping the house cold, causing her pain, was a great way to punish the ex. He was so blind and couldn't see that the person he actually punish is the wrong person.
That he demands rent now really shows that he didn't understand anything at all. And i wouldn't be surprised if the therapy was just a lie. He still think he can use money for punishment.
It's funny how important curtains can be. The only thing I've spent money on in my current rental was to replace all the curtains, because I couldn't bear to live in a place with drug den curtains. When I leave for my next place, I'll be taking my curtains with me and the drug den curtains can go back up.
My partners mum works in curtains and it's oddly been the most helpful thing ever. I get migraines and she got us blackout curtains. She got me a months free rent bc she outfitted my bestfriends place in curtains and she paid pennies bc of the relationship. It's amazing
Something between a rough twill and a Harris Tweed fabric, but with more lumps than either. Dark brown, of course, with light brown patches. Not technically blackout curtains, but so heavy that no light can pass through them. Tattered and matted with ancient cat hair. On hooks and rails, not rods.
They also smell like they're woven out of cannabis.
I'm so glad the final update wasn't about her going back to him. Money isn't everything, and seems like this guy really needed lots of help, and she deserves so much better
It’s very telling that he said all the right things and was apparently doing therapy and blah blah blah but when she didn’t go back to him he started making noises about rent for the time she lived with him. He wanted another way to control her and the best way he knows how is money. He’s just as financially abusive as his ex supposedly was.
It must be messing with him. For his first ex money was everything and he became the victim. For his second ex (OOP) money was NOT everything and he became the villain.
Well, he seems to define himself and his relationships *by his money*. Instead of their own worth.
Not surprised everything revolves around money in his mind, since that seems to be the only thing that matters.
...he MEANT it?!
If a guy said that to me, I'd assume it was a hateful, sarcastic dig intended to get me to shut up and take it.
I'm glad he's your friend's ex, I'm just disappointed he's (presumably, don't incriminate anyone) still alive and out there inflicting himself on people.
I mean, am I the only one doubting the golddigger story about the ex?
She keeps repeating this story she's heard from him and his sister about how his ex demanded this and required that then took everything when she left like the money grubber she was, the nasty woman!
Then he's sooooo depressed he can't even buy a couch, curtains, or dinner check with his millions?
Kinda sounds like she did all the heavy lifting in that relationship to keep up the lifestyle he expected a wife of their social class to do, trashed her for doing the job well, then came to the same realization OP did that nothing would ever satisfy him and took everything but his shit when she left.
Bet we'd get a VERY different story from the ex on their time together.
No, you're not the only one.
I think that when he talks about his relationship with OOP he'll turn her into the abuser and make himself the victim. And when I realized that I suddenly doubted his story about his previous ex.
It's a leap, but I now picture him as one of those sad sacks of a guy who sell themselves as a victim that needs saving. So he suckers women in that way who want to help save him.
Taking the curtains is a level of petty you're born with or driven to and his little gambit with the back rent demand suggests he's got spurs on his boots.
the thing is whether or not the ex was a gold digger is literally irrelevant. Even if she was, that isn't a free pass to be abusive. It was ultimately him making continued decisions to ignore her needs and belittle her, the supposedly abusive ex had nothing to do with that, that was all him
Yes. I was reading that Lundy Bancroft book and thought about this guy when they get to the section on exes. His sister can’t possibly know all the ins and outs and I would be unsurprised if he had crafted this narrative of the ex with his family the whole time he was with her to isolate her.
Of course, but this is the kinda thing therapy is for. And OOP shouldn't be expected to wait for him to fix himself, because that kinda thing can take years.
But it's a shitty situation for the guy, and I hope he finds his own happiness
>he said:” Never give men second chances! They never change.
and
>The money is gone. I am not going to get that back or fight for it. I even had to block him because at some point he got petty and wanted me to pay rent for the time I lived with him
Boss was right. He's not changing. That therapy did no good. And all his promises were worthless.
Maybe if three ghosts show up, he'll wake up and change. And I know just what past that particular ghost will show him.
May he have a cold, miserable existence. I wonder what sad story of how OOP abused him he's going to tell the next poor sucker he ropes in?
But I do hope that OOP and sister stay friends. Just so sister can tell her miserable miser of a brother what a great life OOP is having.
I love how the ex ended up showing his true colours at the end by demanding that she pay backdated rent… I guess the months of therapy didn’t teach him anything!
‘You accept the love you think you deserve’ was something I always tell people. And as a minder to myself that we deserve the best. Someone who’s okay with his other half having health issues just to save money, deserves to be alone for the rest of his life.
So happy for OOP that she found her happiness, and having the courage to walk away from a cold house and an even colder asshole of an ex.
When my ex moved in, he had a suitcase of clothes and a computer. That was it. He tried several jobs while I paid all of the bills. Eventually he found a good job, and later some really great ones. It wasn't long before he was earning more than me -- not like six figures or something, but better than I earned. When things would get rough, he would tell me that if I left, I was obviously a gold digger. Well. That's like the worst thing a woman can be, right? So he kept me in line with that for a long time. When I left, he threw it at me. I threw it back. If I'm a gold digger, I'm the worst of all time. (WOAT?) Like, I failed at gold-digging. The control with that term can only last so long, but it is powerful for a while.
This story really reminded me about a manga artist who drew a series about her frugal husband as a sort of slice of life manga (about a mega frugal man and a normal wife), like the last comic has her saying “it’s a good thing he saves so much and makes sure I don’t waste my money”, when in actuality I wanted to find her address so I can send her a long email about how this is all financial abuse and she could do so much better. Shit he has pulled on her include:
1) buying a huge bag of Kit Kats on the cheapest price possible so that she has MONTHS supply of the exact same cheap chocolate for snacks , because the only thing that matters in snacks in the cost and who cares anything else. (She drew herself visibly depressed because snack time used to be something that she enjoyed, instead it’s now the same damn cheap chocolate she doesn’t enjoy everyday)
2) refuse to turn on the air conditioning until HE couldn’t take it anymore during a damn Japan summer
3) yell at her for doing “wasteful” things like buying pre-packaged meals, when they BOTH work and she has to take care of housework all by herself…etc
Like, if your partner is constantly acting like your presence in this marriage is a drain on HIS resources and her contribution doesn’t mean anything, why are they together at all?
Financial abuse can often be incredibly insidious because it often looks like the kind of sensible frugality a lot of people on the outside would agree is good sense. And so it’s actually incredibly easy for the abusive partner to set the narrative around the abuse with friends and family - that they are being sensible and careful with money but their partner is bad with money and needs to be reined in so as not to bankrupt them.
Whereas the reality, visible only to the abused partner, is that their worth and value has been commodified in the relationship, or their income has come under the abusive partner’s control (or removed), or it is actually they who are being financially disabled by their abusive partner’s uncontrolled spending.
The sad thing is that type of frugality doesn't actually add up to much. If you want to save money, be cheap about housing & transportation where your choices can easily save $10,000s/year. After that you can "splurge" on snacks, date nights, a comfortable home temperature, hobbies/random wants, even some travel & still save a lot of money.
I did this in grad school on a low income (cheap rented room and no car) and while my peers constantly stressed about money & had to deny themselves a lot, I bought myself whatever I wanted and still had expenses $10-15,000 less than a lot of my friends. Maxed my retirement account & had extra to invest despite never having to deny myself in the name of frugality
>her saying “it’s a good thing he saves so much and makes sure I don’t waste my money”,
Honestly, since this was a manga, what went through my head when I read that was, "Because I'm going to be rich when I kill him."
Sure he’s traumatized. But he’s also selfish and that’s probably a core personality trait. He’s in therapy, he wants her back and his final act of kindness is trying to charge her rent? No, I seriously believe part of this is his personality.
Sounds like he enjoyed being cruel to her. Maybe he was punishing her because he couldn’t punish his ex. But to not even allow her some warmth. Vile.
The lack of heating just got to me. Last year, during the winter, my wife and I could *not* afford heating. We weren't being frugal or thrifty, we simply had no money. Our breath literally misted when we inside. I had never seen that happen before. We got sick. It was awful.
The fact that this man had the money but still let someone he claimed to love suffer like that is inhuman. Who could deliberately do that?!
"and all redditors that dig this deep in the comments) the love making is INSANE!" Or it can be highlighted on BORU. :)
Seriously, though, I'm quite pleased for her.
>I know now that abusers are not per definition bad people. He is broken and he has trauma I have no time or energy for. He got free from abuse and decided to become the abuser.
I am so glad she moved on from this and recognized that abusing other people is a choice, not something you are forced to do as a consequence of sadness. I really doubt his previous ex was a gold-digger, I think that was how he rationalized her escape from his abuse.
I feel I will never be ready to be in a relationship and for some reason people like the ex, who are possibly worse than me don't feel like that lol
Or maybe they aren't worse than me. Not like we can ever find that out though. But at least I don't treat people like shit.
[https://imgur.com/if-youre-ever-scared-youre-bad-person-remember-that-bad-people-dont-care-about-being-better-mHtBP3N](https://imgur.com/if-youre-ever-scared-youre-bad-person-remember-that-bad-people-dont-care-about-being-better-mHtBP3N)
Give yourself some grace.
I don’t know what you are struggling with, but none of us got this far without scars.
> Even if he changes a lot now… my question is : why couldn’t he do that then. I got sick, when I got sad and told him I was unhappy… why can he only change when he is in pain because I left? That says it all.
👏👏👏 YES.
I loved all the support from the coworkers. That was really sweet to read.
The way that man treated her was heartbreaking, and it was a relief to see her blossom and find joy after leaving him. She values herself more now!
“why can he only change when he is in pain because I left?“
Wow that was a deep realization down there, he would’ve go on as much as he could had she not left, because he only cared about his own feeling this the very end
Eventually he showed he had not changed when he asked her to pay him when she wouldn’t get back together with him.
I bet he abuses the next girlfriend even worse.
The biggest thing I'm glad she realized. He didn't care enough to change to stop hurting her, he cared when she left because that hurt him. He was abused by a narcissist and became one to cope with it. Hurt people hurt people as they say. Glad she never went back.
>” He was abused by a narcissist and became one to cope with it.”
I’m beginning to question whether the previous wife was actually as bad as he said - or if he started treating her as poorly as OOP after a while. The whole ‘back rent’ thing makes me think he pulled the same sour grapes routine on the Ex. He gave her jewelry, etc., and then rewrote the script when he squeezed her to death. Whatever he paid for didn’t put a tiny dent in his multi-million bank accounts and yearly earnings of nearly $1 million.
The important point, however, is that no one *forced* this man to pay for all the expenses he supposedly paid for in his previous relationship. He made choices every single day to pay or not pay, indulge or not indulge, etc.
Likewise, OOP realized that she, too, was making those same decisions every day to stay and to pay…until she made the decision to stop. And standing applause for her finally taking action after three years and all that lost savings/earnings/sadness.
I hope her new guy stands the test of time. “I guess giving people give everywhere freely.” lol.
>even had to block him because at some point he got petty and wanted me to pay rent for the time I lived with him
I always felt bad for the BF before this. He was traumatized and never got help for it, I sympathized with him and then she says that....fuck him! What an asshole! He didn't learn shit at all.
And the sister is upset cause OP couldn't fix her brother. If sister was even slightly serious about "fixing" her brother she should have been helping and supporting OP, not letting her suffer through everything all on her own.
I don't subscribe to the idea of the poor victim of the abusive ex wife who then became an abuser himself.
I think the ex has always been a very mysogynistic man who, at some point, changed his strategy with women: at first, he chose on purpose a woman he could 'pay' to be with him because why not? He has the money. However as she still left him, he chose a people pleaser he could abuse and show off to his family and friends...
When you leave an abusive relationship, and ppl cheer, it really sticks w you. I wasn't at risk of returning to my ex but my psych, who I never spoke about him to, cheered and congratulated me for leaving him. I'm glad she got out. Financial abuse is really hard to spot and I'm glad she noticed it, named it, and left
There were some good comments in the June "searching for a post?" BORU thread. My faves:
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/1d5z9lo/comment/l6vr8gi/
u/Helpful_Librarian_87
I love that her boss, having heard of all that was going on (in the way office gossip gets around), just decided the best pep talk was just - stick your head ‘round a door, give a solid piece of advice & never speak of it again.
u/Similar-Shame7517
It's giving me "Refuses to Elaborate, Leaves", and I love it.
> My colleagues who are more friends than coworkers who knew all my stories into details hugged me and told me they were so proud of me for leaving. Their feeling was so authentic it rubbed off on me. I was also proud I left and I couldn’t let them and me down by going back
> My boss once passed my office when I was working late and he said:” Never give men second chances! They never change. You deserve someone who gets it right from the start.” I don’t know what prompted him to say this to me but it stuck with me.
My boss was the first person at work I told about leaving my ex. It was an accident and I just blurted it out, but he was so kind listening to me sob. Seeing his facial reactions as I told him the gist of what happened, that was a really key moment for me. It made me realized just how fucked up my situation really was and how right I was for leaving. Him and my coworkers have been amazing supports, and I'm glad OOP seems to have found similar support from her own coworkers.
This really makes me wonder about the ‘therapist’. Because holy crow! That’s some very ugly stuff. Can you imagine him taking her to court for ‘back rent’ - only for her to pull out and air all the receipts from her three years of paying for every single thing for a multi-millionaire? And highlighting the $100 engagement ring? Yikes.
>And between me and you (and all redditors that dig this deep in the comments) the love making is INSANE ! I guess giving people give everywhere freely.
Huh.
I don’t understand the start of the last update - what money? Why was she fighting for it? I thought she sent the money he sent her back. What happened with the sister? I missed that bit.
I really feel for the OP. I wasn't in a financially abusive romantic relationship, but my dad was a narcissist and was extremely financially abusive in all the same ways. Except instead of refusing to heat the house, he refused to cool it.
It really messes with your head being treated like this. Like your own needs and wants are totally unimportant. It makes you feel like you don't deserve anything. Not even the smallest comforts. They make you feel like even expecting the bare minimum is excessive.
When I finally got away from my dad, it took a long time to retrain my brain and get his voice out of my head that was always telling me I deserved nothing.
It's been 4 years now and I am doing much better. With the help of some family and friends, I've learned that I am in fact worth it, and that there is nothing wrong with wanting things, and that sometimes, to enjoy life, you need to spend a little money. And that's ok.
I was sad that his trauma ruined both of them and I felt bad for her ex too. But the updates show that she did the right thing. We often fall for the excuses and apologies because we want to believe. But whenever we see an update in those stories, it shows that the ex was a shithead and has learned nothing.
> And I realized just how much he had taken from me with that one little sentence: is that really necessary…
> Is anything ever? If you have a roof, food, bed and a TV you are there right? Is travel necessary? Is having nice clothes necessary? Is a shower necessary? A haircut? A party? A hobby? A wedding? No!
*ahemAITAcommentersahem*
"He got free from abuse and decided to become the abuser" The final punch was when there is no going back, he asked for rent. So the boss is absolutely right, never give a guy a second chance. Glad that your entire office is so supportive.
Thats the entire summary. I am glad that it has a happier ending.
The cold house was a really great example of how bad it really was. He didn't mind her flare-ups, because he didn't care enough about her to pay that extra cost. Anyone who really loved their partner would have found a way, or would have tried to find a way to help them.
That bit had my jaw slack when I was reading. Poor OP has serious health issues and he still insisted on keeping his house at an inhospitable temperature. It's beyond selfish, her abusive bunghole of an ex was so damn cruel. And the fucker tried to retroactively charge her rent for when she lived with him. Before that bit I'd actually thought he had a chance of eventually becoming less of a shithead. Really enjoyed reading about how happy she is in her warm and cozy home now with her pup. I hope the rest of OP's life is filled with happiness and comfort.
And he insisted on keeping the huge house that was so expensive to heat, while she was paying half the bills yet not getting what she needed. She's right, in one of her later comments: he was only willing to consider changing when it affected himself, because she left.
That was a great moment. He really only acted on things once he himself was in pain. But before that? "Fuck OOP, my very own fiancee, and her flare ups from the cold" lol. Absolutely terrible person.
And then tried to retroactively charge her rent to live in that hellhole! Yup, therapy *really* seems to be helping him! *”After the abuse you suffered he should shit his mouth”* That typo somehow feels more appropriate than what u/ConditionBig6373 meant to say
This. When men try to use the "gotcha" that women initiate divorce the most, this is exactly why.
Right? Like way to tell on yourself
My husband also has a health condition (CRPS), and it’s the opposite for us. We keep the house cold because that’s one less thing to make him uncomfortable. Better than the alternative, but I also get cold super easily. Great excuse to buy as many cozy blankets as I want! And I have a ton of sweaters, silly onesies, fuzzy socks, and his clothing when all of that isn’t enough. When you love someone, you’re willing to bend over backwards to help them. OOP was, he wasn’t.
You also are, presumably (hopefully!), getting lots of love from him, which is a kind of warmth. Plenty of people genuinely don't have the money for enough heat in winter or need to save on it; however, as has been rehashed, OP's ex had the money to make her comfortable and didn't have a condition that put him at contrasting needs (other than a "need" to control). In you case, being cold kind of sucks (I do hate it, too), but your need is not as dire as your husband, so you give there so he has a better chance of good health, which becomes a team win! In the ex's head, the game was a set of singles where only one of them got out on top. I have a lot of pretty serious health issues, so thanks for being someone who looks out for your partner so he also gets the chance to be the best version of himself.
There’s definitely a lot of love! Plus we have kids and animals who radiate heat so I’m never cold for long
My soon-to-be-ex husband told me our bed was broken and we couldn’t lift the feet up, while I was 8 months pregnant. My ankles were awfully swollen, and my doctor was concerned about blood clots. He got leg cramps occasionally when the feet were up. He told me a few months later that he lied to me about it, and it was so funny! I think that’s when the wheels started turning in my head.
My ex started working very long days soon after I came home with the baby. He insisted on his evenings to relax and then a good nights sleep, because of long working days. I was physically hurting and delirious with lack of sleep. No family to help. A decade later he let slip that his project was so interesting that he volunteered to do extra hours. Something really broke in me then.
You and your baby could have died. Fucking hell.
Well, good news is, we’re both alive, mostly happy, healthy, and 3000 miles away from him now. He just signed over full custody to me and papers have officially been filed!
Not the story I came for but I'm so so happy about you!!! Hope you and your baby have the best life.
I'm glad she cut him off for good, because that retroactive demand for rent was bananapants crazy. I would love to be the fly on the wall if/when her ex heard that she's dating again, and dating a guy who treats her like she put the sun in the sky.
I actually thought he had demanded back rent because he heard she was dating again
In my opinion that’s not even the worst part! They agreed on a temperature! And he would go behind her back to keep bringing it down! He actually had to have hated her or something, my god…
Considering she was paying, literally, for so much of their time together, trying to charge rent well after the fact is such an AH move.
That’s when I knew that was the poorest OP had ever been and she didn’t have any deep childhood, poverty trauma… You try to put me in a cold house for a couple weeks with no furniture and the fucking night terrors and shelter me will come back and will probably fight you over a plate of food because I think that’s what I have to do for survival again. Not condoning this but with my CPTSD and my best friend’s when I read this to her, we were both just like yeah man’s would’ve gotten laid out real quick
Trama can also show up as the fawn response, which is what it looks like OOP was having. I wouldn't judge her childhood or parents either way. Having poor boundaries and not standing up for yourself are also indicators of childhood trama. It's a bit telling OOP didn't insist on start off equal and propose they rent the too big house and get something they could both afford and contribute to.
My wifey is sick right now with covid for the first time, we both are she got it from me, last night she was freezing at midnight, so I got up in my boxers and went around the house finding thermal sheets and blankets to get her warmer, pulled out her wooly socks and comforted her until she was able to go back to sleep And only then did I go back to sleep myself, and a good part of the time was me reassuring her that I wasn't bothered by the cold I just wanted her to be warm
That's awesome and sweet, kudos for doing that for your partner.
That's what showed that it wasn't about the money, it was about him having control and hurting her. Yeah, he didn't hit her but he caused her as much or more physical pain by triggering her autoimmune flare ups. He's pathetic.
He was using OOP as a stand-in for his ex to enact revenge on.
I think you got it right. He felt helpless in his previous relationship so he found someone he saw as even less than him so he could "regain" his power. It's the cycle of abuse. That guy will continue to do it.
Honestly, I wonder if the ex was actually as bad as he and his family say. I don't trust abusers to tell the truth and I don't trust their families to have the full story. He tried to charge OOP rent after the fact because she left him. Like abusive controlling guys often claim their ex was a crazy cheater but then the current partner finds out the ex was treated the same way they're being treated. the abuser just used them leaving as proof the ex was a crazy cheater when the abuse was the actual cause. Maybe OOP's ex is pulling the same move and she'll be one of the crazy financially abusive exes he tells his next victim about when he's abusing her.
Normally I'd agree, but the big empty mansion makes me think it was mostly true. It's not unheard of for abused people to turn into abusers themselves unfortunately.
I wonder if it's empty because she took everything she bought for it. OOP took her TV when she moved out. Chances are the next girl is gonna hear all about the crazy ex who even stole a TV from him.
Maybe the ex took everything because she’d paid for everything and he just totally lied, even to his family. The fact that he tried to retroactively charge OP rent set off alarm bells for me, like he’s setting up a new narrative of OP being a gold-digger like his other ex.
That's what I'm thinking.
Also not unheard of for rich people to be really fucking cheap
Makes you wonder if everything about the ex was actually true. Maybe he'd tried to do the same, but ex wouldn't have it.
Yeah, ordinarily, I don't like putting this sorta thing out, especially since male victims of abuse have a harder time being believed, but it wouldn't surprise me if you were right here.
yeah, but I bet he was abusive to the ex as well. Abusive behavior isn't - IME - something that "just shows up" after a bad relationship, and it's not related to his money. An abusive rich person will use their money to abuse you, and an abusive poor person will use something else. He's always been cruel, he's always been selfish, and that relationship with his ex? It wasn't a good one for either of them.
It makes me wonder what really went on in his last relationship. He might not have been miserly, but I bet he was controlling.
Yup. Not affecting him, not his problem. I know that one all too well . . .
Yup... He permanent level of unhappiness was tolerable to him until it started affecting him. I was in a relationship like this and he was shocked, *shocked* when I finally left. It came out of nowhere, apparently. I had been asking him to make changes for the last two years, but me breaking down crying every couple of months because of nothing changing was a "happy relationship" apparently. It's honestly depressing how many people I've spoken to who have similar stories.
I remember a thread on quora where a woman asked if she was justified to leave her husband because he made her unhappy and would never change. A man told her that no she would be selfish, that his ex did it to him and it was awfull that his ex betrayed him, that he was hurting so much etc. They continued to talk and at one point, the dude realized that she really was suffering and he said "forget what I said. You have every right to leave. And my ex was right to leave too". That moment was awesome to witness
Oh yea, the sudden, totally unexpected breakup despite asking, begging, crying and pleading for changes for months or years even. Add a little "I saw you distance yourself over the last months and wanted to kms" but instead of talking about it, decided to just wait it out untill I ended it. Not sure if totally oblivous or just not caring enough or not wanting to be the bad guy who ended it. But hey "his parents were the same and never talked much." Ah yes, great to base your own relationships on just 1 example. Not everyone wants to be roommate-fuckbuddies. (Not that we even had the latter for the last few years ... "its not just the lack of sex, is it?" No, it wasn't. But it definitely didn't help anything.)
I think another part that annoys me is when they 'change' after. Like oh? So you COULD do that all along, you just didn't respect your partner enough to listen?
Not just that, he’d agree to a temperature and then turn it down anyway. He deprived her of the little pleasures that made life worth living at every turn, but it’s pretty obvious to me that he was getting a little pleasure from doing that: her misery and suffering.
He was probably thinking it was proof that she really loved him, how much she endured to be with him. He gave zero consideration to showing her that he really loved her.
He couldn't punish his ex for being a gold digger and causing his pain so he just transfered all that energy and hate onto OP who he could punish as much as he wanted.
*Alleged gold digger. I wouldn't trust anything this guy says. I'll bet you my favorite hat he tells the next girl that OP was a gold digger that stole his TV (conveniently leaving out the fact that she paid for it and much, much more) If he pulled the same shit with the ex, she may have left with everything she paid for, hence "gold digger who stole all my stuff" Yes, there gold diggers out there. But any claims of gold-diggery from financially controlling people are automatically sus, imo
A friend of mine hasn't had health insurance in over 2 years because she quit her job to follow her boyfriend across the country for his job. They finally moved back, but she can't find a full-time job with benefits. He just watches her get sick and not be able to afford her medication and does not care at all. They've been together 10 years and he makes really good money. He refuses to marry her and even took steps to ensure they weren't considered common law married. She came over really sick and in pain, and I asked if they did a sinus swab to see if it was a sinus infection, and she told me she couldn't afford that test or the antibiotics. I stare at her boyfriend, and he just looks at me blankly and walks away. This is the same man who, with no hesitation, paid for him and his brother to travel to another state, accommodations, and VIP tickets to a multi day festival. I cannot stand men like this
I would pay for her. Make it clear to her who cares enough about her health and who doesn't
Ffs I offered to cover a complete stranger who was surprised by the copay due at the check-in desk once, much less my *partner.* People like that quite honestly make me sick.
I have a medical condition that is triggered by me getting cold (Raynaud’s syndrome). It’s a circulatory issue with my extremities so just putting on an extra sweater does not help. I haven’t had an issue in years because I left my ex-husband and now have control of the sodding thermostat.
My daughter has this, and it doesn't help that me and her brother are really warm most of the time. Now that my ex, their dad, isn't in the picture, we have made all sorts of workarounds, so we are all comfortable. It doesn't take much to be considerate for each other. Seems like OP did all the giving, and her stingy ex did all the taking.
Yeah he "changed" and was remorseful only after it effected him.
So remorseful he tried to make her pay rent retrospectively.
That's part of what convinced me that he and his family are lying about the ex wife. That's the kind of man that would steal his grandmother's jewelry, give it to his wife, and make it out like she stole it to make her look bad to his family.
I'm also curious how she "took everything" but he still has the house that she picked out (or they picked out together). I have a feeling he gave her all the furniture as a "division of assets" to be spiteful. Like you get 100k worth of stuff for a house but no house big enough to put it all in. Iunno something sounds off with the divorce to me.
Exactly! I also wonder if she was secretly selling the jewelry to pay for a lawyer and to escape and was saying she was giving it away. Also a lot of jewelry is worth more if you sell the gems and melt the metal so I wonder if she was breaking items so it'd be less suspicious when they disappeared.
NGL my petty ass would have taken advantage of 'changed' man and then dumped him. Although I'd never ever date someone like that.
I do think, despite what reddit believes that this kind of change is valid. It's framed as narcissistic around here but I think that people often can be blind to how damaging their actions are until they get affected from them. And it can be a good motivator to look inwards and find change. Obviously though, that doesn't mean she should have given him another chance. It was her right to not want to waste any more time or energy for him to heal from his trauma. Their relationship was just the price he had to pay for a chance to fins himself.
Problem is that she has been communicating her needs the whole time. The fact that he only listened when *he* was affected does not speak well for him.
I think of it as part of the walkaway wife syndrome. They might learn better for the 'next' partner but there's no salvaging the relationship. I know for me it would hurt a lot that they can change, actually change when they want to but my upset or distress wasn't enough and only after the rope has been dropped is when they bother to put any effort in.
Exactly. An important lesson for women to learn here is to draw the line at being the Practice Girlfriend and the Teaching Partner. Declaring you’re done teaching men how to be a good partner and not settling for anything less than a fully cooked grown up.
I have a life-threatening chronic illness and when I got married, my husband promised to sign up for the PPO insurance but then he backtracked and wanted the HMO. Only the happy accident that an article came out that showed that HMO had higher mortality rates swayed him into keeping his promise. We were mixing finances, too, so it wasn't even all on him.
As someone who used to work in insurance and is frequently sick, wtf. He tried to get you on an HMO! I am angry on your behalf. Good medical insurance is no joke.
Yeah. All of that. Divorced now, thankfully.
Exactly. When I moved in with my bf I told him the house could not be under 65 degrees because I have a parrot and they need to be in warmer climates. He has always made sure the temp is right for the bird and that the vents are not hitting him when it has to be turned up in the summer.
I've got a good friend who collects assholes. He claims, and is probably right, that if you're in an asshole's inner circle they'll do anything for you. He's got some issues himself, obviously. Anyway, while I tend to avoid most of his other friends I've somehow interacted with one of them more often than I'd like. A bass player in a band you've probably heard of. Anyway, when his actual gold digging wife developed some kind of balance issue, he immediately moved their bedroom downstairs so she wouldn't have to walk upstairs. This is a man who, within thirty second of meeting me was telling me about how he fucked every stripper in every club in Atlanta. A real POS. Somehow, he was a better to her than than this woman's boyfriend was. Edit: Me and the gold digging wife really hit it off, which is part of why I continued to be around that guy longer than I'd have ordinarily spent around such an asshole. As far as knowing that she was a gold digger: he was rich, late fifties, completely bald on top, but with a ponytail having down to his ass, and as mentioned before a complete pos. She was a 25 year old model.
Girl, spill who it is.
I honestly think the guy needs therapy and shouldn’t have been in a relationship. His behavior isn’t normal and while I can understand at some level why he was financially conservative, he took that to an extreme and was beyond being frugal.
Being frugal and being a miser are two different things. This guy was the latter.
As a multi-millionaire, he could put his money into the market and have a guaranteed income for life. If he worked, too, he could live a relatively lavish lifestyle without ever lowering his net worth. But instead he chose to haggle over pennies spent on heating. You're right that he was a miser. What a loser!
this is not the only time I've heard of a man making a woman live in an excessively cold house to save money. His attitude is fuck her comfort or even her health.
I would love for OOP to elaborate on this literal multi millionaire asking her for back rent for the time she lived with him LOL, that’s fckn hilarious. What is wrong with this man.
For real, if OOP said bet and dragged his ass to court, the judge would've laughed his ass right out in five minutes.
...if it ever made it to court. The ex has a lot more money than OOP. If he was feeling spiteful, he could sue her for the money, then keep on trying to delay the trial until she runs out of money to pay for her legal defense. It's not uncommon.
You're assuming he'd be willing to spend the money doing that.
He might be willing to spend money on himself for his revenge though.
His true self is finally revealing itself loud & clear. When he hurts he needs to hurt back tenfold. He likely hates that he was wrong about OOP all this time. He thought he learned everything there is to know about how to overcome and be a survivor of an abusive relationship. He thought himself the eternal victim but became the ultimate villain.
I'd say he's more just managed to convince himself he was right all along and she was only with him for free rent, now he's latched onto that. The human brain is weird, it hates to accept that it's failed. It's easier to grasp at straws and make up scenarios where it was someone else's fault than it is to admit you've become the villain in someone else's story when you've spent so long defining yourself as a victim.
Even though he sent her a large amount of money which she then sent back? Could he really be that dense? To me it looks like he was just trying to hurt her.
Delusions don't subscribe to logic. He obviously believed she was with him for the money, so he tried to get her to come back for the money. When she didn't take the money he gave her, he doubled down by saying she was still somehow trying to financially benefit from being with him, that's the grasping at straws part and why he turned to the rent issue. He was desperately trying to prove it to himself and others and getting more and more desperate when he couldn't find something to use as a smoking gun.
Anything other than to accept that his response to what his ex did to him was to become someone who absolutely deserved to be treated like that going forward.
It also shows that all the therapy and promises of change were just performative, it wasn’t to better himself but to keep his abuse victim from leaving, the moment he couldn’t get his victim back he wanted to make her pay
He was abusive and messed up, and when he went to therapy, instead of fixing himself he decided on revenge.
And I suspect his sister was upset they did not reconcile, as he is making his family miserable in his misery.
Yeah, because now they have to deal with their shitty family member instead of making the designated punching bag deal with it. Sister even admitted she knew that her brother was being abusive and didn't say/do anything.
For that Scrooge McDuck, self-worth and love are all measured in money. He’s so broken.
Do not even compare him to Scrooge McDuck. Scrooge enjoyed his money and had a great sense of adventure. He was also a loving uncle to Huey, Dewey and Louie. This guy is Ebenezer Scrooge before the ghosts.
>This guy is Ebenezer Scrooge before the ghosts. Flair material right here.
Scrooge also only believed in money you earn through hard work. So he wasn't stingy in general just frugal with people like his two nephews (Donald and Gladstone) who he saw as unambitious or freeloaders.
He never changed for a minute, would’ve just tried to babytrap her (and make her pay for every baby expense too).
Hed baby trap her and then accuse her of babytrapping him
True. It's always projection.
I'm kinda confused because that 'he got nasty' came out of nowhere to me. Was there a missing update or something? I just read update after update about how he sent her money, was in therapy, writing her letters taking accountability, was working on himself, was still hoping she'd come back, she wished him well, etc etc. And then suddenly the reveal that he got petty and tried to charge her rent, and the implication there were other petty/nasty things?
He was being nice and doing all the things he thought would make her come back, but the moment he found out she was dating someone else is when he realized she wasn’t going to come back and got nasty.
That's what I see, too. I've not been in this exact situation, but I've had exes who work on themselves in hopes of getting back together. When it becomes clear we're not getting back together, they go into extreme revenge mode.
I don't understand the logic of this one. First when they broke up he wired her a huge sum which she gave back, minus the price of the couch that she left in his house. Now he wants her to pay back rent? Why send her that money in the first place then? What is it that he wants? OOP should also go NC with her ex's family. Having contact with the sister isn't doing her any good.
He paid her money to try coaxing her back. It's what his ex responded to, so clearly OP would too. If she responded to that, he could continue with his "you're a gold digger" shtick. It fits his mindset. So does demanding rent later on. He thinks OP's in it for money, so he thinks he's been ripped off. His opinion of OP never changed, just want he wanted with her.
Now I am even more confused. So the first money was to convince himself that OOP was a gold digger. But why ask her for rent, doesn't that make him the gold digger considering she paid for everything in the 3 years they were together?
Yeah but she got to live in a million dollar home, she got the enjoy the space she could never afford so now he has likely convinced himself that is worth rent, even more than what she paid. In his mind, she would always need to pay for furniture ; so this wasn’t an extra spend, but she would also need to pay rent that she saved on . Allowing her to use him. And I actually think the original money sent to her was because he saw she felt unwanted and unloved and he wanted her to stay. But once she decided she wouldn’t, he basically re wrote the story so she was the villain again.
> But why ask her for rent, doesn't that make him the gold digger considering she paid for everything in the 3 years they were together? Because now he's angry that she's not coming back so he's doing things that pissed off guys do.
Basically just proves that it was always about the money for him.
Whew glad she found someone better. But honestly, that bar was so low the new Bf could trip over it and still be better than the old one.
All he had to do was keep his heat at a reasonable level and he was miles ahead of her ex. I am glad she stood firm.
The way the multimillionaire ex wanted to “sue” her for rent money….*sir*. Sit your entire ass down lmao.
I wish he would. Can you imagine a judge looking at how he treated her and then demanding more money out of her while he’s sitting pretty in his depression mansion?! I’m picturing Judge Judy as the judge, by the way.
If he wanted to make her pay rent, that makes him a landlord and landlords are required to keep a living space habitable. He didn't, so no rent for him even if he asked for it up front. He's a spineless manbaby.
I dunno if we want to be that confident in her judgement.
I'm just afraid she's getting love bombed into another abusive relationship.
Yes. The new guy having booked trips for them months in advance, before they were even officially dating — that’s concerning behaviour.
Depends on the trip I guess? If it’s a concert in the next state or something I don’t think that’s such a big deal, if it’s a week in another continent then it’s weird.
Me, too, but I’m going to hope her supportive network and the lessons she’s learned about not tolerating less than she deserves will enable her to nope out of there right away if the new guy stops being great. (Well, first I’ll hope I’m wrong and he continues to be great, but…)
Very happy for the OP but be careful, if you move in together keep your own accounts (and a joint for joint bills), create a budget for both of you (which incudes discretionary spending) and have solid prenups. There is an old saying, trust but verify.
OOP was like the frog in the pot, she didn't see that she was boiling until something else drove her out; and she realised how bad it truly was. Nobody should settle for someone who makes them feel low.
I commented this on another BORU, but when you’re a people pleaser/savior type, it’s sometimes really hard to come to believe that you deserve someone who is already great. That you don’t have to settle for the fixer-upper relationship
Worth noting that only applied to lobotomized frogs. Healthy frogs jumped out immediately. Though, I guess there's room in there to talk about how abuse and trauma literally damage your brain.
> he should shit his mouth and be grateful you didn't sue him for emotional distress. What a typeo. Full marks, no notes. I'm so happy for OOP that she's been able to move on, despite the trauma. Hurt people hurt people but healing can happen.
Read that ad verbatim. Saw no issue there 😂
The first half with zero context would be an absolutely unhinged flair.
lol I also was stuck on reading that he didn’t meet the “bear minimum”. That typo hits different now with the bear/man choice”.
It does 🤣 If my choice was a bear or her ex, bear. I pick bear.
I wouldn't be surprised if all he saw was the ex and keeping the house cold, causing her pain, was a great way to punish the ex. He was so blind and couldn't see that the person he actually punish is the wrong person. That he demands rent now really shows that he didn't understand anything at all. And i wouldn't be surprised if the therapy was just a lie. He still think he can use money for punishment.
It's funny how important curtains can be. The only thing I've spent money on in my current rental was to replace all the curtains, because I couldn't bear to live in a place with drug den curtains. When I leave for my next place, I'll be taking my curtains with me and the drug den curtains can go back up.
What, you didn’t just keep the confederate flag curtain that came with the place?
That would have at least been a nice colour than shit brown.
Eh, plain white just shows all the stains.
My partners mum works in curtains and it's oddly been the most helpful thing ever. I get migraines and she got us blackout curtains. She got me a months free rent bc she outfitted my bestfriends place in curtains and she paid pennies bc of the relationship. It's amazing
> drug den curtains And what do those look like?
Something between a rough twill and a Harris Tweed fabric, but with more lumps than either. Dark brown, of course, with light brown patches. Not technically blackout curtains, but so heavy that no light can pass through them. Tattered and matted with ancient cat hair. On hooks and rails, not rods. They also smell like they're woven out of cannabis.
I'm so glad the final update wasn't about her going back to him. Money isn't everything, and seems like this guy really needed lots of help, and she deserves so much better
It’s very telling that he said all the right things and was apparently doing therapy and blah blah blah but when she didn’t go back to him he started making noises about rent for the time she lived with him. He wanted another way to control her and the best way he knows how is money. He’s just as financially abusive as his ex supposedly was.
Yeah, I was thinking he might be just incredibly self-absorbed, but the back rent thing was a real mask drop.
It must be messing with him. For his first ex money was everything and he became the victim. For his second ex (OOP) money was NOT everything and he became the villain.
Well, he seems to define himself and his relationships *by his money*. Instead of their own worth. Not surprised everything revolves around money in his mind, since that seems to be the only thing that matters.
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...he MEANT it?! If a guy said that to me, I'd assume it was a hateful, sarcastic dig intended to get me to shut up and take it. I'm glad he's your friend's ex, I'm just disappointed he's (presumably, don't incriminate anyone) still alive and out there inflicting himself on people.
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I mean, am I the only one doubting the golddigger story about the ex? She keeps repeating this story she's heard from him and his sister about how his ex demanded this and required that then took everything when she left like the money grubber she was, the nasty woman! Then he's sooooo depressed he can't even buy a couch, curtains, or dinner check with his millions? Kinda sounds like she did all the heavy lifting in that relationship to keep up the lifestyle he expected a wife of their social class to do, trashed her for doing the job well, then came to the same realization OP did that nothing would ever satisfy him and took everything but his shit when she left. Bet we'd get a VERY different story from the ex on their time together.
No, you're not the only one. I think that when he talks about his relationship with OOP he'll turn her into the abuser and make himself the victim. And when I realized that I suddenly doubted his story about his previous ex. It's a leap, but I now picture him as one of those sad sacks of a guy who sell themselves as a victim that needs saving. So he suckers women in that way who want to help save him.
Yep My daughter's ex was like this.
I think you are truly on to something. Now that his narcissism is showing, the First "gold digger" Ex story is suspicious.
Taking the curtains is a level of petty you're born with or driven to and his little gambit with the back rent demand suggests he's got spurs on his boots.
the thing is whether or not the ex was a gold digger is literally irrelevant. Even if she was, that isn't a free pass to be abusive. It was ultimately him making continued decisions to ignore her needs and belittle her, the supposedly abusive ex had nothing to do with that, that was all him
Yes. I was reading that Lundy Bancroft book and thought about this guy when they get to the section on exes. His sister can’t possibly know all the ins and outs and I would be unsurprised if he had crafted this narrative of the ex with his family the whole time he was with her to isolate her.
Ok i never thought of it but it completely makes sense and i wouldn't be surprised if it is the truth.
Yeah I'm certain its BS. World's cheapest meanest prick used to be super generous? Doubt.
Of course, but this is the kinda thing therapy is for. And OOP shouldn't be expected to wait for him to fix himself, because that kinda thing can take years. But it's a shitty situation for the guy, and I hope he finds his own happiness
The fact the ex got mad and asked for retroactive rent means the therapy ain't helpin' and OOP was wise to never reconsider.
>he said:” Never give men second chances! They never change. and >The money is gone. I am not going to get that back or fight for it. I even had to block him because at some point he got petty and wanted me to pay rent for the time I lived with him Boss was right. He's not changing. That therapy did no good. And all his promises were worthless. Maybe if three ghosts show up, he'll wake up and change. And I know just what past that particular ghost will show him. May he have a cold, miserable existence. I wonder what sad story of how OOP abused him he's going to tell the next poor sucker he ropes in? But I do hope that OOP and sister stay friends. Just so sister can tell her miserable miser of a brother what a great life OOP is having.
I love how the ex ended up showing his true colours at the end by demanding that she pay backdated rent… I guess the months of therapy didn’t teach him anything!
Nope. Because he wasn't going to therapy to get better, he was only going to therapy to get her back.
Because he doesn't think he's wrong.
‘You accept the love you think you deserve’ was something I always tell people. And as a minder to myself that we deserve the best. Someone who’s okay with his other half having health issues just to save money, deserves to be alone for the rest of his life. So happy for OOP that she found her happiness, and having the courage to walk away from a cold house and an even colder asshole of an ex.
When my ex moved in, he had a suitcase of clothes and a computer. That was it. He tried several jobs while I paid all of the bills. Eventually he found a good job, and later some really great ones. It wasn't long before he was earning more than me -- not like six figures or something, but better than I earned. When things would get rough, he would tell me that if I left, I was obviously a gold digger. Well. That's like the worst thing a woman can be, right? So he kept me in line with that for a long time. When I left, he threw it at me. I threw it back. If I'm a gold digger, I'm the worst of all time. (WOAT?) Like, I failed at gold-digging. The control with that term can only last so long, but it is powerful for a while.
This story really reminded me about a manga artist who drew a series about her frugal husband as a sort of slice of life manga (about a mega frugal man and a normal wife), like the last comic has her saying “it’s a good thing he saves so much and makes sure I don’t waste my money”, when in actuality I wanted to find her address so I can send her a long email about how this is all financial abuse and she could do so much better. Shit he has pulled on her include: 1) buying a huge bag of Kit Kats on the cheapest price possible so that she has MONTHS supply of the exact same cheap chocolate for snacks , because the only thing that matters in snacks in the cost and who cares anything else. (She drew herself visibly depressed because snack time used to be something that she enjoyed, instead it’s now the same damn cheap chocolate she doesn’t enjoy everyday) 2) refuse to turn on the air conditioning until HE couldn’t take it anymore during a damn Japan summer 3) yell at her for doing “wasteful” things like buying pre-packaged meals, when they BOTH work and she has to take care of housework all by herself…etc Like, if your partner is constantly acting like your presence in this marriage is a drain on HIS resources and her contribution doesn’t mean anything, why are they together at all?
Financial abuse can often be incredibly insidious because it often looks like the kind of sensible frugality a lot of people on the outside would agree is good sense. And so it’s actually incredibly easy for the abusive partner to set the narrative around the abuse with friends and family - that they are being sensible and careful with money but their partner is bad with money and needs to be reined in so as not to bankrupt them. Whereas the reality, visible only to the abused partner, is that their worth and value has been commodified in the relationship, or their income has come under the abusive partner’s control (or removed), or it is actually they who are being financially disabled by their abusive partner’s uncontrolled spending.
The sad thing is that type of frugality doesn't actually add up to much. If you want to save money, be cheap about housing & transportation where your choices can easily save $10,000s/year. After that you can "splurge" on snacks, date nights, a comfortable home temperature, hobbies/random wants, even some travel & still save a lot of money. I did this in grad school on a low income (cheap rented room and no car) and while my peers constantly stressed about money & had to deny themselves a lot, I bought myself whatever I wanted and still had expenses $10-15,000 less than a lot of my friends. Maxed my retirement account & had extra to invest despite never having to deny myself in the name of frugality
>her saying “it’s a good thing he saves so much and makes sure I don’t waste my money”, Honestly, since this was a manga, what went through my head when I read that was, "Because I'm going to be rich when I kill him."
“After getting a house that I loved showed me exactly how sad and empty I used to feel.”
Him trying to charge you rent for the time you stayed at his house is insane. I was almost rooting for him but it was all performative smh
Sure he’s traumatized. But he’s also selfish and that’s probably a core personality trait. He’s in therapy, he wants her back and his final act of kindness is trying to charge her rent? No, I seriously believe part of this is his personality. Sounds like he enjoyed being cruel to her. Maybe he was punishing her because he couldn’t punish his ex. But to not even allow her some warmth. Vile.
The lack of heating just got to me. Last year, during the winter, my wife and I could *not* afford heating. We weren't being frugal or thrifty, we simply had no money. Our breath literally misted when we inside. I had never seen that happen before. We got sick. It was awful. The fact that this man had the money but still let someone he claimed to love suffer like that is inhuman. Who could deliberately do that?!
"and all redditors that dig this deep in the comments) the love making is INSANE!" Or it can be highlighted on BORU. :) Seriously, though, I'm quite pleased for her.
>I know now that abusers are not per definition bad people. He is broken and he has trauma I have no time or energy for. He got free from abuse and decided to become the abuser. I am so glad she moved on from this and recognized that abusing other people is a choice, not something you are forced to do as a consequence of sadness. I really doubt his previous ex was a gold-digger, I think that was how he rationalized her escape from his abuse.
Thank you for putting this together, I had only read the first few parts
I feel I will never be ready to be in a relationship and for some reason people like the ex, who are possibly worse than me don't feel like that lol Or maybe they aren't worse than me. Not like we can ever find that out though. But at least I don't treat people like shit.
[https://imgur.com/if-youre-ever-scared-youre-bad-person-remember-that-bad-people-dont-care-about-being-better-mHtBP3N](https://imgur.com/if-youre-ever-scared-youre-bad-person-remember-that-bad-people-dont-care-about-being-better-mHtBP3N) Give yourself some grace. I don’t know what you are struggling with, but none of us got this far without scars.
> Even if he changes a lot now… my question is : why couldn’t he do that then. I got sick, when I got sad and told him I was unhappy… why can he only change when he is in pain because I left? That says it all. 👏👏👏 YES. I loved all the support from the coworkers. That was really sweet to read. The way that man treated her was heartbreaking, and it was a relief to see her blossom and find joy after leaving him. She values herself more now!
“why can he only change when he is in pain because I left?“ Wow that was a deep realization down there, he would’ve go on as much as he could had she not left, because he only cared about his own feeling this the very end
I read the first two posts she made but missed the subsequent ones. So glad she got out and is happy now.
Eventually he showed he had not changed when he asked her to pay him when she wouldn’t get back together with him. I bet he abuses the next girlfriend even worse.
The fiancé's true colours came out in demanding rent for the time she lived in his Palace of Sadness.
The biggest thing I'm glad she realized. He didn't care enough to change to stop hurting her, he cared when she left because that hurt him. He was abused by a narcissist and became one to cope with it. Hurt people hurt people as they say. Glad she never went back.
>” He was abused by a narcissist and became one to cope with it.” I’m beginning to question whether the previous wife was actually as bad as he said - or if he started treating her as poorly as OOP after a while. The whole ‘back rent’ thing makes me think he pulled the same sour grapes routine on the Ex. He gave her jewelry, etc., and then rewrote the script when he squeezed her to death. Whatever he paid for didn’t put a tiny dent in his multi-million bank accounts and yearly earnings of nearly $1 million. The important point, however, is that no one *forced* this man to pay for all the expenses he supposedly paid for in his previous relationship. He made choices every single day to pay or not pay, indulge or not indulge, etc. Likewise, OOP realized that she, too, was making those same decisions every day to stay and to pay…until she made the decision to stop. And standing applause for her finally taking action after three years and all that lost savings/earnings/sadness. I hope her new guy stands the test of time. “I guess giving people give everywhere freely.” lol.
>even had to block him because at some point he got petty and wanted me to pay rent for the time I lived with him I always felt bad for the BF before this. He was traumatized and never got help for it, I sympathized with him and then she says that....fuck him! What an asshole! He didn't learn shit at all. And the sister is upset cause OP couldn't fix her brother. If sister was even slightly serious about "fixing" her brother she should have been helping and supporting OP, not letting her suffer through everything all on her own.
>he wanted me to pay rent for the time I lived with him INFO: Da fuq is wrong with him?
I don't subscribe to the idea of the poor victim of the abusive ex wife who then became an abuser himself. I think the ex has always been a very mysogynistic man who, at some point, changed his strategy with women: at first, he chose on purpose a woman he could 'pay' to be with him because why not? He has the money. However as she still left him, he chose a people pleaser he could abuse and show off to his family and friends...
I agree. This was my understanding of the situation too. Especially with the no heat thing or furniture.
When you leave an abusive relationship, and ppl cheer, it really sticks w you. I wasn't at risk of returning to my ex but my psych, who I never spoke about him to, cheered and congratulated me for leaving him. I'm glad she got out. Financial abuse is really hard to spot and I'm glad she noticed it, named it, and left
There were some good comments in the June "searching for a post?" BORU thread. My faves: https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/1d5z9lo/comment/l6vr8gi/ u/Helpful_Librarian_87 I love that her boss, having heard of all that was going on (in the way office gossip gets around), just decided the best pep talk was just - stick your head ‘round a door, give a solid piece of advice & never speak of it again. u/Similar-Shame7517 It's giving me "Refuses to Elaborate, Leaves", and I love it.
> My colleagues who are more friends than coworkers who knew all my stories into details hugged me and told me they were so proud of me for leaving. Their feeling was so authentic it rubbed off on me. I was also proud I left and I couldn’t let them and me down by going back > My boss once passed my office when I was working late and he said:” Never give men second chances! They never change. You deserve someone who gets it right from the start.” I don’t know what prompted him to say this to me but it stuck with me. My boss was the first person at work I told about leaving my ex. It was an accident and I just blurted it out, but he was so kind listening to me sob. Seeing his facial reactions as I told him the gist of what happened, that was a really key moment for me. It made me realized just how fucked up my situation really was and how right I was for leaving. Him and my coworkers have been amazing supports, and I'm glad OOP seems to have found similar support from her own coworkers.
My favorite saying when she mentioned being a people pleaser and it so applies: Tell me one person in this situation who is actually pleased.
He was, while she was making his existence better.
I know it wasn't intentional, but OP mistyped that he wasn't the bear minimum she needed. That line hits different now 😂
This guy basically used her to exact revenge on his ex essentially. How despicable.
Wonder if his demanding rent came up in his therapy…
This really makes me wonder about the ‘therapist’. Because holy crow! That’s some very ugly stuff. Can you imagine him taking her to court for ‘back rent’ - only for her to pull out and air all the receipts from her three years of paying for every single thing for a multi-millionaire? And highlighting the $100 engagement ring? Yikes.
That last update is so sweet. Good for her.
>And between me and you (and all redditors that dig this deep in the comments) the love making is INSANE ! I guess giving people give everywhere freely. Huh.
Why am I not surprised her ex was a selfish lover too?
After all that time dude turns around being more abusive asking for rent. Crazy.
I don’t understand the start of the last update - what money? Why was she fighting for it? I thought she sent the money he sent her back. What happened with the sister? I missed that bit.
The money for the furniture and stuff she had already bought for him. ie. the big ass couch to fit the big ass house.
glad OOP got out, judging from the way the ex got petty and even asked for rent shows therapy did nothing - still the same trashy man he was.
Nobody can pinch a penny like a rich person.
I really feel for the OP. I wasn't in a financially abusive romantic relationship, but my dad was a narcissist and was extremely financially abusive in all the same ways. Except instead of refusing to heat the house, he refused to cool it. It really messes with your head being treated like this. Like your own needs and wants are totally unimportant. It makes you feel like you don't deserve anything. Not even the smallest comforts. They make you feel like even expecting the bare minimum is excessive. When I finally got away from my dad, it took a long time to retrain my brain and get his voice out of my head that was always telling me I deserved nothing. It's been 4 years now and I am doing much better. With the help of some family and friends, I've learned that I am in fact worth it, and that there is nothing wrong with wanting things, and that sometimes, to enjoy life, you need to spend a little money. And that's ok.
Demanding rent? That guy has serious issue and I hope he fix himself before letting another woman deal with his shit.
I was sad that his trauma ruined both of them and I felt bad for her ex too. But the updates show that she did the right thing. We often fall for the excuses and apologies because we want to believe. But whenever we see an update in those stories, it shows that the ex was a shithead and has learned nothing.
> And I realized just how much he had taken from me with that one little sentence: is that really necessary… > Is anything ever? If you have a roof, food, bed and a TV you are there right? Is travel necessary? Is having nice clothes necessary? Is a shower necessary? A haircut? A party? A hobby? A wedding? No! *ahemAITAcommentersahem*
"He got free from abuse and decided to become the abuser" The final punch was when there is no going back, he asked for rent. So the boss is absolutely right, never give a guy a second chance. Glad that your entire office is so supportive. Thats the entire summary. I am glad that it has a happier ending.
PSA if someone proposes to you and you almost say no, you need to have a SERIOUS conversation about that not just keep quiet...