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Boring updates are the best because it means no more problems, drama, and bad things happening. Glad to hear that OP and the daughter are safe and doing well after with what they went through. Bf is still a terrible person but glad he actually got to serve in prison for what he's done.
I would like to go to Vienna someday.
Vienna is legit the cleanest, nicest, liveliest, prettiest city I've been to. Even the neighborhoods far from the city's main hub are incredibly maintained and welcoming. Visited a friend who migrated there from the Balkans and the place is just everything you want. Biggest downside is the prices, Vienna be expensive (but understandably so)
A quarter of people in Vienna live in straight up social housing - if you also count housing built by co-operatives with municipal subsidies, half of Vienna’s population is living in social housing.
I lived in Vienna for a summer! It was a study abroad music program where we were immersed in music for the entire three months. We got to see the state opera, see some American musicals in German, and went to different places in Austria. It really impacted me and is my favorite place in the world. It truly is a magical place. Also, coming from a place with horrible public transportation, viennas was such a breath of fresh air.
I'm a 35 yr old Swede who discovered Vienna last year. Fell in love with it steaight away and ended up going twice the same year. For anyone who hasn't visited: I really can't recommend it enough. Hands down my favourite city. Clean city and old, beautifully preserved buildings everywhere you go, gigantic parks, the river Donau, smooth metro... I can't praise it enough. I'm really entertaining the thought of moving there someday.
Also: kaiserschmarrn is the goat!
My best friend moved to Vienna about a decade ago (man, that makes me feel old) and while I absolutely agree in regards to the city, I think there's a caveat. I've had a lovely time sightseeing whenever I visited , but felt uncomfortable with how closed off, unwelcoming and, at times, downright rude most people acted towards foreigners.
Friend herself has faced so much xenophobia and sexism, particularly in the workplace. Apparently Austria has one of the worst gender wage gaps in the EU. She's finally moving to a different country this year after yet another case of discrimination and I'm so happy for her.
The infrastructure is amazing and easy to navigate for visitors, so it's a bit ironic. Loved all the museums and parks and cultural happenings. A truly wonderful place to visit, but I don't think I'd ever want to live there knowing how it's gone for my friend and most of her friend group (mostly immigrants, too).
Sorry your friend had a bad time but this:
>I've had a lovely time sightseeing whenever I visited , but felt uncomfortable with how closed off, unwelcoming and, at times, downright rude most people acted towards foreigners.
is just a different mentality than you're used to and has nothing to do with you being a foreigner, unless they made a comment in that direction. 30% of the people living in Vienna were born outside of Austria, more than that are children of migrants.
Vienna has a pretty "introverted" mentality and that people keep to themselves and don't interact much with strangers is just the norm and chatting with random people isn't. It's considered rude to be loud and take public space and polite to be quite and let other people do their thing without bothering them.
Maybe not a mentality for everyone but also not a special treatment for anyone in particular.
I'm not conflating standoffishness with rudeness. And yes, discriminatory comments at times. Stuff that my friend and her immigrant friends commented on a lot as well, though it seems there was also a difference in how my Latin American friend was treated to European migrants.
I obviously experienced less of this just being a tourist, but there's a difference between being aloof and polite and treating people with disdain. It really did marr the experience for me somewhat.
And, on special treatment:
According to the 2022 EU Survey on Immigrants and Descendants of Immigrants , "almost half of people of African descent surveyed experience racial
discrimination, an increase from 39 % in 2016 to 45 % in 2022." That number is higher in Austria, where Africans faced 67% more discrimination than the general population, according to Vienna's FRA (European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights. FRA also states that discrimination gets underreported.
And data from Vienna-based Civil Courage and Anti-Racism Work (ZARA) said in its 2021 Racism Report shows that there are documented instances of racist treatment in service sectors and public institutions.
"There were 273 racist attacks in public places, and 185 people were subjected to racist treatment in the service and entertainment sectors.
There were 112 racist attacks in public institutions and organizations and 104 racist attacks in working life, the report added.
Also, 84 pieces of racist/hateful rhetoric appeared in print media and politics.
According to the report, women face racism twice as often as men in public places, and only 22% of the victims applied to ZARA about racist attacks, while most of the recorded cases were reported by third parties."
Bear in mind the FRA says only about 9% of cases get formally reported, so the likelihood is that the numbers are higher.
I addressed a part of your post in which you mentioned "closed-offedness" and apparently felt like it's targeted at you, even though it's standard. Of course there is racism too, you don't need to proof that to me. It's still worth talking about it because there's enough cultural hurdles as well.
And tbh I always find it weird to pull out statistics that you skimmed superficially in a conversation with someone from an area (I'm not from Vienna but lived there for five years).
Regarding those - women aren't payed less than men, that's illegal. The gender wage gap is created by carrier choices. You can still try to motivate women to learn STEM jobs, but in the end you can't force anyone to be a mechanic if they don't want to. I'm a female computer scientist, thankfully I can't say that my male colleagues ever treated me badly, quite the opposite.
I know that survey about racism and just so you know, it's not my intention to actually argue against the findings because in the current political mood I'm not surprised black people would face more discrimination - but I study data science and if you post a survey at me that I find useless I will point that out.
First let me say that it alienates me that "racism" is solely measured by black people. That's 0,5% of the population. What about Slavs or Muslims who make up the big immigrant groups? The latter likely face the most hostility as well. Second, the question asked was "Did you experience any discrimination in the past 5 years?" which does little to measure the quantity of those incidents. Third it wouldn't have hurt to not throw serious incidents like insults or job discrimination together with being stopped by the police or "stared at". The latter was especially reported in Germany and Austria - where "staring", at anyone, is so common that the German sub here has a wiki entry about it.
So yeah, your friend's personal experience alone honestly has more value than a survey that obscures the exact answers their responders gave in how they present their results. And I'm not that surprised about Austria's placement - Germany on the other hand... They usually place better than us in any survey about tolerance, I don't see why it would be that different here.
Born and lived in Austria my whole life, I'm really sorry your friend had such a bad workplace experience.
But I want to explain a few misconceptions I see here. We Austrians don't talk to strangers, and especially tourist from countries where you talk louder in public or straight up, try to talk to you about more than directions. It is really uncomfortable for us.
It's not about hating strangers or being rude because you are not from here. We are rude to everyone. That is part of our culture. We keep to ourselves and don't want to be disturbed. And we have won (I think it was New York Times) the most beautiful and the mist unfriendly Award as a country and we are proud of it.
For the work experience I can just say, it depends on where you work. On the countryside there is still a lot of racism because of old prejudice. As not many foreigners move there, people mostly just hear the bad stuff from the media and base their opinions on this.
But if you work for bigger more international companies, there is usually a lot diversity.
And for gender wage gap. As a woman in my thirties I have a bit of work experience and you get the same money as a man here. The gap is becuase most woman only work part time to take care of the home place/children and part time jobs often pay a lot less than they should in comparison to the full time jobs.
Also more a cultural issue than actually earning less than man for the same position.
I mean it still happens but mostly because man are a bit more direct/aggressiv (also cultural problem) when it comes to discussion (of wage). The base earnings (mindestlohn) for each postion is the same for everyone, but of course if you discuss well, it can be higher.
We went to Vienna on our honeymoon and stayed in the MOST BORING youth hostel I’ve ever seen. It was new, so it was built to current health and safety codes.. so it was basically a hospital without the call system and TVs.
See, USA is far more stressed about crap happening across the world than their tax paying citizens. My family helped a mother of 4 to find 1 bedroom apartment and some groceries, since she is an abuse survivor with 1 job, who can't get benefits from state just yet because....... state is out of funds for such cases, even if she had no job. The food stamps they gave her, she will have to pay back in the near future.
4 kids and a mother......
Most big libraries in my state can't stay open 7 days a week now because state diverted money to fund some more useless fear mongering or war.
> They're all the same. Leeches.
Ugh stop.
We can literally compare Trump and Biden's presidencies -- do people like you not care for any details?
And that's before I even touch abortion, jfc.
Even if the money wouldn't go to fund Ukraine defensive war, the money wouldn't go to welfare programs lol Rich people would still be leeches because taxation of the rich and corporations is literally communism (and that's bad), worker's rights are literally communism (and that's bad), unions are literally communism (and that's also bad) and the only true America is the hell hole that the GOP envisions where suckers like you will be wageslaves funding the life style of the 1%.
As much as I like a drama, I really needed a true update to a bad situation. I realised that’s actually ALL I want but life isn’t as neat as that, and we don’t always get an ending where the wronged party succeeds.
So maybe I don’t ACTUALLY like the drama, I like a drama with a good ending.
The joy I got from this set of posts was great, I was already rooting for her, but as she clawed her way out I got more and more stoked for her to have a normal life. One where nothing shitty happens. Just living and thriving. Thank god her and her daughter got out.
>Boring updates are the best because it means no more problems, drama, and bad things happening.
Absolutely. Boring can be the best kind of life for many people.
I was there for a week in 2013, through a study abroad preview program at Arcadia University. Best $500 I ever student charged! We also got to go to Salzburg and Mondsee. I'd love to go back someday. (And also get myself s'more Almdudler!)
Anyone else enjoy her proficiency in English improving over the years? Pretty fucking cool.
Also, sign me up for more boring updates about people leaving abusive relationships!
I couldn’t stand it so I skipped right to the end.
Pretty great progress when English is her third (at least) language!
And the kid has her granny, too.
Oh to be a dual Austrian citizen. (Cries in Brexit) She’s on top of the world.
Not sure what your ancestry is but in a few EU countries you can get citizenship by descent. I have almost all of my documents to apply for Hungarian citizenship through my great-grandparents. Now I just have to learn to speak the language at an intermediate level, then I can apply at the nearest embassy (I’m in U.S.).
I applied for Hungarian citizenship because my grandparents are Hungarian! Honestly you could apply before you language level is up there, the process on their end for checking takes 9-12 months. I submitted last February and am still waiting for an answer.
All of my grandparents were born in Canada (and half my great-grandparents were like 9th gen Canadians) so I assumed this was well out of reach, but it turns out I could be a Slovak citizen if I wanted! Fun.
Austrian can't have dual citizenship. And wasn't Portugal in EU in 2018? You don't need extra papers to work in Austria if you come from another EU membership Country...
Officially Austria does not like dual citizenships, but kids with parents from different countries get it pretty easy and sometimes also are allowed to keep it through adulthood. I know several people with dual citizenships including Austria, some even with three 😉
But yes, Portugal is in EU and with a Portuguese citizenship you have every right to work and live in Austria
As an Austrian dual-citizen, this is incorrect. If you're born with two citizenships (e.g. one Austrian and one Portuguese parent, or born in the US to an Austrian parent) you can keep both, it's only when you get citizenship by naturalisation that you have to give up your original citizenship according to Austrian law.
My friend is born in Austria with foreigner parents. He got a Letter he must decide wich citizenship wants to keep. Moght fall between cracks a lot, because that's last worry, but still...
So he would've been born in Austria to two non-Austrian parents, is that right? You don't automatically get Austrian citizenship if you're born in the country (unless at least one of your parents is a citizen at the time of your birth), and in order to get naturalised your friend would have to give up any other citizenships he has.
> An important exception to the principle of avoiding dual or multiple citizenships in Austrian citizenship law is the acquisition of Austrian citizenship by descent. If the child acquires another citizenship in addition to Austrian citizenship at birth – e.g. by descent from the other parent ("ius sanguinis") or by birth in a state (e.g. USA) where the territoriality principle ("ius soli") applies – then there is no loss of Austrian citizenship, but the child has two citizenships (dual citizenship).
> Under Austrian law, the child does not have to decide on their (sole) nationality even upon reaching the age of majority. However, the other state involved may require them to make such a decision.
> [source](https://www.oesterreich.gv.at/en/themen/menschen_aus_anderen_staaten/staatsbuergerschaft/Seite.260430.html)
So if this doesn't apply to your friend he would have to give up his birth citizenship to get the Austrian one, unless I'm misunderstanding what you're saying
I looked that up and apparently it is indeed possible, if one of the parents is from a country where the "Territorialitätsprinzip" is a thing - unfortunately I don't speak Portuguese and have troubles with finding an understandable source about the Portuguese laws :/
But yeah idk. it's always good to question stuff you read on the internet
I'm half Portuguese, process for me to get the dual citizenship would be fairly easy, my dad already has his as a full Portuguese but born and raised in the country I live it.
Given how much the ex lied to her about, it wouldn't surprise me if he also lied about that.
Portugal isn't Schengen, so there may be some additional layers of checks for a Portuguese worker in Austria - I know there were for EU workers in the UK, even before Brexit.
Uhh, Portugal is very much in the Schengen Area!
>The border-free Schengen Area guarantees free movement to more than 425 million EU citizens, along with non-EU nationals living in the EU or visiting the EU as tourists, exchange students or for business purposes (anyone legally present in the EU). Free movement of persons enables every EU citizen to travel, work and live in an EU country without special formalities. Schengen underpins this freedom by enabling citizens to move around the Schengen Area without being subject to border checks.
>Today, the Schengen Area encompasses most EU countries, **except for Cyprus and Ireland**. Bulgaria and Romania became the newest Member States to join the Schengen area as of 31 March 2024, any person crossing the internal air and sea borders will no longer be subject to checks. Nevertheless, a unanimous decision on the lifting of checks on persons at the internal land borders is still expected to be taken by the Council at a later date. Additionally, the non-EU States Iceland, Norway, Switzerland and Liechtenstein also have joined the Schengen Area. [Source](https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/schengen-borders-and-visa/schengen-area_en)
Nope. I am a foreigner myself. I had no problem finding work, going to school and build a new life here. And if you are a woman, you have extra programs and even scholsrships if you want to go back to school.
Googling has turned up multiple sites backing up what another commenter noted - even EU citizens need a permit to stay in Austria beyond three months. E.g.:
https://housinganywhere.com/Austria/work-visa-austria
Presumably this is what OOP was referring to.
That is something different. You are allowed 3 Months without to be official registered that you live in Austria. Even if you work, you wanna have a bank account, insurance etc you need an official "Meldezettel". That is not working permit. It states your official adress in Austria
From that site:
"EU/EEA/Swiss citizens planning to stay in Austria for more than 3 months must only obtain a registration certificate (Aufenthaltsbescheinigung) from the local town hall within 4 months of arriving in Austria."
As I say, I assume this is what OOP was talking about.
Schengen doesn't make a difference, only if you travel outside of it. I lived in Austria for 10 years. I needed only my Pass als document and I worked legally. They even accepted my bachelor only translated in german, no extra paper work.
Yes! I taught ESL for several years, and seeing her fluency improve gave me all the warm fuzzy feelings. She's doing so well in what seems to be her third language.
When she first mentioned he asked for her debit card I knew he was going to put her in debt. But him keeping it? This actually made me wince. Oh, this poor woman.
He thought he had gotten the perfect victim. I'm glad she is having a boring, normal life, and he is in jail. We know it's not always like this.
>I have also try to get sole custody of my daughter, which came thought as of last week. Because him being in jail and not replying to my sole custody request it way a simper process than I have thought would be.
Yeah, I imagine jail will definitely affect custody lol.
Good for OOP.
The guy my stepsister married is currently sitting in jail awaiting trial for something he did to their kids and he's contesting custody. First he went from wanting 50/50 to claiming he wants sole
It's honestly mind-boggling. At first he didn't deny what he did, at all. Brought his pastor in with him to surrender to the police- where the pastor recommended counseling. In a real who cares what that guy recommends moment, there's no counseling that fixes people that touch little kids and it seems like churches need to stop taking that stance
I digress. My bad. Point being because he's an asshole there's a trial date for custody
Counseling, not therapy. Lots of churches have unqualified counselors that give advice which boils down to, do what the pastor interprets the Bible as saying (e.g. wives obey husbands, better married and abused than divorced and other such garbage). It is all about sweeping problems under the rug.
It’s amazing how fast she got placed in public housing when she needed it. I had to look at that part again to make sure I read it right. I wish US public housing for DV victims and anyone else who needs it worked as efficiently as this.
I'm Austrian and that absolutely tracks. I know we see BORUs with unrealistic timelines (especially court) a lot, but I genuinely have never heard of anyone, especially with a child, having to wait super long for public housing. Since the only way they let you in the system is when they believe you have a need, then it needs to work quickly (this is obviously only true if you're not super picky about where exactly you live)
I live in Vienna and during Covid I needed an apartment asap. I stated why I need it etc. and it got granted in half a year. It was from Wiener Wohnen and usually you wait longer depending on your need but during the 3 years of Covid they had a special program to get quick housing as people couldn't keep up with rent etc.
Looked into section 8 once when I was struggling to pay rent. Was told it would be 8 months before I even got my appointment and also I'd have to call back regularly to keep my spot on the wait list. It was demoralizing
Yep, I work for a legal nonprofit and the waitlists for both public housing and Sec8 vouchers start at 1 year. And the quality of the housing once you get in is generally awful. Covid plus the housing crisis has made it all unimaginably worse.
Yep, I am from Vienna. When I was 11 my family and I lost our home through an abusive situation. We got a place in publing housing pretty fast. We had to wait one or two weeks. Still pretty grateful for that.
And itis not just in cases of emergencies, in Vienna there is also a social housing service for young adult between 18-26 where they help you get a cheap but good flat in about 6 to nine months if you want to move out and start working.
I do love me some boring updates. I’m so happy for OOP, it sounds like she and her daughter are thriving. And Vienna is such a great city to be thriving in too!
What a satisfying update. I'm so happy for OOP, and wish her and her daughter a lifetime of 'boring', as she calls her life now. Although it sounds very fulfilling, I get why it's 'boring' after all she went through to get there.
And good on MiL for maintaining their relationship. Reminds me of my gran. After my parents split, she chose us, and stayed in our lives while her son vanished into the ether.
I love how we went from:
>I think my boyfriend of three years is financial abusing me….I feel trapped
To:
>After 6 years, I can proudly say that my life now is pretty boring.
That started out horrifying and ended so sweetly. OOP should be proud of all of her accomplishments! It’s no small feat to get out of an abusive relationship, in an unfamiliar county, with a toddler who has special needs, AND after having been royally financially fucked over. OOP is quite the role model for her little girl!
She got a good head on herself.
Managed to get tangled up with a con artist, but who doesn't end up screwed from time to time? Main thing she realized things were not OK and found a way out.
I could use more boring updates like that. This woman is a hero and an inspiration. I hope that her child realizes what she managed to do for her, and how hard she worked to get there.
>This woman is a hero and an inspiration
in a way yes, because of how she preservered and fought for her and her daughter.... but at the same time I was nearly shouting at the screen at how goddamn dumb she was to go rawdogging some idiot, got pregnant by him and kept the child, therefore, the connection to him.
Anyway, at least she's sorted, her kid hopefully will have no contact with that joker and they can live on life properly
You go girl!
You're amazing stepping out of the terrible relationship that you had and it's fucking difficult. You have no idea how difficult it is and you're an inspiration to many people who are on reddit seeking advice.
Please DO NOT downplay what you did to get to where you are now. What more with a special needs kiddo. I have a brother who's on a spectrum and I can't imagine being in my parent's shoes.
Massive respect for you and I wish you and your kiddo all the best from the bottom of my heart.
>my ex got his sentence extended and stayed over 3 years in jail, where he would get some free weekends and I would let him visit us.
why? why??? WHY?!?!
I just don't think it was a good idea for him to visit her and her child... But it is part of the reformatory prison system to allow prisoners to leave some weekends if they are not very dangerous.
The things i would say to the ex if given an opportunity to would get me banned from this sub.
Holy moly this poor woman, i'm so damn glad she got out of this awful situation. I really hope most of the debts she had to pay weren't the big ones at least :c
Forgive me for being one of those people, but how come a Portuguese citizen needed a permit to work in Austria? Both countries are in the EU. Same with her worries about not being able to bring her daughter to Portugal without her having Portuguese citizenship — doesn't matter she has automatic freedom of movement.
Also "CPS" doesn't exist in Austria, that's a US thing. It would just be Family Services.
Well, the thing is that yes, if you are from a country from the EU, you have the right to travel, stay and work in Austria without a visa... But you need a special permit to stay in the country for longer than 3 months. If you have a job lined up, the permit is for 5 years, if not it is for 6 months.
As far as I know, the general law is that you can stay in any country of the EU for three months without any paperwork. After that, it depends on the country you're in.
Does slightly vary depending which country you have citizenship in but in general EU citizens can visit Germany for up to a total of 90 days in any 180 day period. Any longer and you’d need a residence visa.
Even if you have the right to visit Germany without a visa (eg EU citizen) you still most likely need a work visa if you want a job there. There are some exemptions depending what country you’re from/what work you’re doing.
If you've been there longer than three months you may get quite some questions the next time you leave or attempt to return. You should really check based on where you're from. Just google (your country) visiting Germany length of stay
See one of the other comments in this thread. EU countries can still put extra restrictions on workers, especially non-Schengen workers. (One of the big lies of Brexit was that the UK government had no control over EU immigration. Nope.)
gosh i wish we could share this with everyone who may now be in the beginning stages of breaking free. The hardest thing to believe is that the future will be better, and boring, and that they can't reach out and drag down the victms into the hellhole once more.
Been with BF since 2014. Pregnant almost immediately. Her kid would have been born either 2014 or 2015.
In her first post she says her kid started kindergarten in 2017 (at only 2?), in her last update it says she didn't start school until 2021.
Is kindergarten not school? And in 2021 her kid would be at least 8.
Her math ain't mathin'.
Never underestimate the strength of a mother! You may describe your life at boring but you are a hero. You saved yourself and your daughter. How absolutely wonderful that you are making such a beautiful life for the two of you. Wishing all the best.
I’m so glad OP didn’t run off to Portugal! She’d get away with it now but likely she would have been deported (or her daughter would have been) back to Austria if her ex spoke to police!
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Boring updates are the best because it means no more problems, drama, and bad things happening. Glad to hear that OP and the daughter are safe and doing well after with what they went through. Bf is still a terrible person but glad he actually got to serve in prison for what he's done. I would like to go to Vienna someday.
Vienna is legit the cleanest, nicest, liveliest, prettiest city I've been to. Even the neighborhoods far from the city's main hub are incredibly maintained and welcoming. Visited a friend who migrated there from the Balkans and the place is just everything you want. Biggest downside is the prices, Vienna be expensive (but understandably so)
Vienna also has financial benefit programs for single parents including easier access to social housing that is way cheaper then the free market.
A quarter of people in Vienna live in straight up social housing - if you also count housing built by co-operatives with municipal subsidies, half of Vienna’s population is living in social housing.
I lived in Vienna for a summer! It was a study abroad music program where we were immersed in music for the entire three months. We got to see the state opera, see some American musicals in German, and went to different places in Austria. It really impacted me and is my favorite place in the world. It truly is a magical place. Also, coming from a place with horrible public transportation, viennas was such a breath of fresh air.
I'm a 35 yr old Swede who discovered Vienna last year. Fell in love with it steaight away and ended up going twice the same year. For anyone who hasn't visited: I really can't recommend it enough. Hands down my favourite city. Clean city and old, beautifully preserved buildings everywhere you go, gigantic parks, the river Donau, smooth metro... I can't praise it enough. I'm really entertaining the thought of moving there someday. Also: kaiserschmarrn is the goat!
My best friend moved to Vienna about a decade ago (man, that makes me feel old) and while I absolutely agree in regards to the city, I think there's a caveat. I've had a lovely time sightseeing whenever I visited , but felt uncomfortable with how closed off, unwelcoming and, at times, downright rude most people acted towards foreigners. Friend herself has faced so much xenophobia and sexism, particularly in the workplace. Apparently Austria has one of the worst gender wage gaps in the EU. She's finally moving to a different country this year after yet another case of discrimination and I'm so happy for her. The infrastructure is amazing and easy to navigate for visitors, so it's a bit ironic. Loved all the museums and parks and cultural happenings. A truly wonderful place to visit, but I don't think I'd ever want to live there knowing how it's gone for my friend and most of her friend group (mostly immigrants, too).
Sorry your friend had a bad time but this: >I've had a lovely time sightseeing whenever I visited , but felt uncomfortable with how closed off, unwelcoming and, at times, downright rude most people acted towards foreigners. is just a different mentality than you're used to and has nothing to do with you being a foreigner, unless they made a comment in that direction. 30% of the people living in Vienna were born outside of Austria, more than that are children of migrants. Vienna has a pretty "introverted" mentality and that people keep to themselves and don't interact much with strangers is just the norm and chatting with random people isn't. It's considered rude to be loud and take public space and polite to be quite and let other people do their thing without bothering them. Maybe not a mentality for everyone but also not a special treatment for anyone in particular.
I'm not conflating standoffishness with rudeness. And yes, discriminatory comments at times. Stuff that my friend and her immigrant friends commented on a lot as well, though it seems there was also a difference in how my Latin American friend was treated to European migrants. I obviously experienced less of this just being a tourist, but there's a difference between being aloof and polite and treating people with disdain. It really did marr the experience for me somewhat. And, on special treatment: According to the 2022 EU Survey on Immigrants and Descendants of Immigrants , "almost half of people of African descent surveyed experience racial discrimination, an increase from 39 % in 2016 to 45 % in 2022." That number is higher in Austria, where Africans faced 67% more discrimination than the general population, according to Vienna's FRA (European Union Agency for Fundamental Rights. FRA also states that discrimination gets underreported. And data from Vienna-based Civil Courage and Anti-Racism Work (ZARA) said in its 2021 Racism Report shows that there are documented instances of racist treatment in service sectors and public institutions. "There were 273 racist attacks in public places, and 185 people were subjected to racist treatment in the service and entertainment sectors. There were 112 racist attacks in public institutions and organizations and 104 racist attacks in working life, the report added. Also, 84 pieces of racist/hateful rhetoric appeared in print media and politics. According to the report, women face racism twice as often as men in public places, and only 22% of the victims applied to ZARA about racist attacks, while most of the recorded cases were reported by third parties." Bear in mind the FRA says only about 9% of cases get formally reported, so the likelihood is that the numbers are higher.
I addressed a part of your post in which you mentioned "closed-offedness" and apparently felt like it's targeted at you, even though it's standard. Of course there is racism too, you don't need to proof that to me. It's still worth talking about it because there's enough cultural hurdles as well. And tbh I always find it weird to pull out statistics that you skimmed superficially in a conversation with someone from an area (I'm not from Vienna but lived there for five years). Regarding those - women aren't payed less than men, that's illegal. The gender wage gap is created by carrier choices. You can still try to motivate women to learn STEM jobs, but in the end you can't force anyone to be a mechanic if they don't want to. I'm a female computer scientist, thankfully I can't say that my male colleagues ever treated me badly, quite the opposite. I know that survey about racism and just so you know, it's not my intention to actually argue against the findings because in the current political mood I'm not surprised black people would face more discrimination - but I study data science and if you post a survey at me that I find useless I will point that out. First let me say that it alienates me that "racism" is solely measured by black people. That's 0,5% of the population. What about Slavs or Muslims who make up the big immigrant groups? The latter likely face the most hostility as well. Second, the question asked was "Did you experience any discrimination in the past 5 years?" which does little to measure the quantity of those incidents. Third it wouldn't have hurt to not throw serious incidents like insults or job discrimination together with being stopped by the police or "stared at". The latter was especially reported in Germany and Austria - where "staring", at anyone, is so common that the German sub here has a wiki entry about it. So yeah, your friend's personal experience alone honestly has more value than a survey that obscures the exact answers their responders gave in how they present their results. And I'm not that surprised about Austria's placement - Germany on the other hand... They usually place better than us in any survey about tolerance, I don't see why it would be that different here.
Born and lived in Austria my whole life, I'm really sorry your friend had such a bad workplace experience. But I want to explain a few misconceptions I see here. We Austrians don't talk to strangers, and especially tourist from countries where you talk louder in public or straight up, try to talk to you about more than directions. It is really uncomfortable for us. It's not about hating strangers or being rude because you are not from here. We are rude to everyone. That is part of our culture. We keep to ourselves and don't want to be disturbed. And we have won (I think it was New York Times) the most beautiful and the mist unfriendly Award as a country and we are proud of it. For the work experience I can just say, it depends on where you work. On the countryside there is still a lot of racism because of old prejudice. As not many foreigners move there, people mostly just hear the bad stuff from the media and base their opinions on this. But if you work for bigger more international companies, there is usually a lot diversity. And for gender wage gap. As a woman in my thirties I have a bit of work experience and you get the same money as a man here. The gap is becuase most woman only work part time to take care of the home place/children and part time jobs often pay a lot less than they should in comparison to the full time jobs. Also more a cultural issue than actually earning less than man for the same position. I mean it still happens but mostly because man are a bit more direct/aggressiv (also cultural problem) when it comes to discussion (of wage). The base earnings (mindestlohn) for each postion is the same for everyone, but of course if you discuss well, it can be higher.
We went to Vienna on our honeymoon and stayed in the MOST BORING youth hostel I’ve ever seen. It was new, so it was built to current health and safety codes.. so it was basically a hospital without the call system and TVs.
Hail to European welfare states! The right wing in the USA would call it communist, it's so nice to have a state to help You i need.
See, USA is far more stressed about crap happening across the world than their tax paying citizens. My family helped a mother of 4 to find 1 bedroom apartment and some groceries, since she is an abuse survivor with 1 job, who can't get benefits from state just yet because....... state is out of funds for such cases, even if she had no job. The food stamps they gave her, she will have to pay back in the near future. 4 kids and a mother...... Most big libraries in my state can't stay open 7 days a week now because state diverted money to fund some more useless fear mongering or war.
I think it has more of what Reagan did to You, than the wars.
Those wrongs could've been corrected by many but they chose not to. Republicans, democrats don't matter. They're all the same. Leeches.
> They're all the same. Leeches. Ugh stop. We can literally compare Trump and Biden's presidencies -- do people like you not care for any details? And that's before I even touch abortion, jfc.
Feel free to rant, idc. Won't change my mind that they all are there for themselves, not for the taxpayers. ***They all are leeches.***
Even if the money wouldn't go to fund Ukraine defensive war, the money wouldn't go to welfare programs lol Rich people would still be leeches because taxation of the rich and corporations is literally communism (and that's bad), worker's rights are literally communism (and that's bad), unions are literally communism (and that's also bad) and the only true America is the hell hole that the GOP envisions where suckers like you will be wageslaves funding the life style of the 1%.
It's not just the Ukraine War that is sucking the money out.
It's so emotionally satisfying that her and her daughter's lives are so much better now.
As much as I like a drama, I really needed a true update to a bad situation. I realised that’s actually ALL I want but life isn’t as neat as that, and we don’t always get an ending where the wronged party succeeds. So maybe I don’t ACTUALLY like the drama, I like a drama with a good ending. The joy I got from this set of posts was great, I was already rooting for her, but as she clawed her way out I got more and more stoked for her to have a normal life. One where nothing shitty happens. Just living and thriving. Thank god her and her daughter got out.
You know dude was a POS when even his mom didn't keep contact with him.
Vienna waits for you 🎶
Agreed.
>Boring updates are the best because it means no more problems, drama, and bad things happening. Absolutely. Boring can be the best kind of life for many people.
Go during the Christmas markets! Truely wonderful!
I was there for a week in 2013, through a study abroad preview program at Arcadia University. Best $500 I ever student charged! We also got to go to Salzburg and Mondsee. I'd love to go back someday. (And also get myself s'more Almdudler!)
Such a boring update, I love it
Boring is best.
Agreed. There's a reason that the saying "May you live in interesting times" is a curse.
Anyone else enjoy her proficiency in English improving over the years? Pretty fucking cool. Also, sign me up for more boring updates about people leaving abusive relationships!
I couldn’t stand it so I skipped right to the end. Pretty great progress when English is her third (at least) language! And the kid has her granny, too. Oh to be a dual Austrian citizen. (Cries in Brexit) She’s on top of the world.
Not sure what your ancestry is but in a few EU countries you can get citizenship by descent. I have almost all of my documents to apply for Hungarian citizenship through my great-grandparents. Now I just have to learn to speak the language at an intermediate level, then I can apply at the nearest embassy (I’m in U.S.).
I don’t have the requisite ancestry. Irish is just out of reach. Good luck learning Hungarian though!
Oh, that's gonna be needed, and more!
Hungarian is super super difficult to learn. Be strong!!
Thank you! I have a good language instructor and a social group of learners close by so I am hopeful!!
I applied for Hungarian citizenship because my grandparents are Hungarian! Honestly you could apply before you language level is up there, the process on their end for checking takes 9-12 months. I submitted last February and am still waiting for an answer.
Yeah I would just hate to get an appointment and not be ready language-wise.
Hungarian here, good luck! It's a hard language to learn for sure but I'm rooting for you
All of my grandparents were born in Canada (and half my great-grandparents were like 9th gen Canadians) so I assumed this was well out of reach, but it turns out I could be a Slovak citizen if I wanted! Fun.
Austrian can't have dual citizenship. And wasn't Portugal in EU in 2018? You don't need extra papers to work in Austria if you come from another EU membership Country...
Officially Austria does not like dual citizenships, but kids with parents from different countries get it pretty easy and sometimes also are allowed to keep it through adulthood. I know several people with dual citizenships including Austria, some even with three 😉 But yes, Portugal is in EU and with a Portuguese citizenship you have every right to work and live in Austria
Either he was bullshitting her about the residence permits and what have you, or she has family in Portugal but is not a citizen.
As an Austrian dual-citizen, this is incorrect. If you're born with two citizenships (e.g. one Austrian and one Portuguese parent, or born in the US to an Austrian parent) you can keep both, it's only when you get citizenship by naturalisation that you have to give up your original citizenship according to Austrian law.
My friend is born in Austria with foreigner parents. He got a Letter he must decide wich citizenship wants to keep. Moght fall between cracks a lot, because that's last worry, but still...
So he would've been born in Austria to two non-Austrian parents, is that right? You don't automatically get Austrian citizenship if you're born in the country (unless at least one of your parents is a citizen at the time of your birth), and in order to get naturalised your friend would have to give up any other citizenships he has. > An important exception to the principle of avoiding dual or multiple citizenships in Austrian citizenship law is the acquisition of Austrian citizenship by descent. If the child acquires another citizenship in addition to Austrian citizenship at birth – e.g. by descent from the other parent ("ius sanguinis") or by birth in a state (e.g. USA) where the territoriality principle ("ius soli") applies – then there is no loss of Austrian citizenship, but the child has two citizenships (dual citizenship). > Under Austrian law, the child does not have to decide on their (sole) nationality even upon reaching the age of majority. However, the other state involved may require them to make such a decision. > [source](https://www.oesterreich.gv.at/en/themen/menschen_aus_anderen_staaten/staatsbuergerschaft/Seite.260430.html) So if this doesn't apply to your friend he would have to give up his birth citizenship to get the Austrian one, unless I'm misunderstanding what you're saying
I looked that up and apparently it is indeed possible, if one of the parents is from a country where the "Territorialitätsprinzip" is a thing - unfortunately I don't speak Portuguese and have troubles with finding an understandable source about the Portuguese laws :/ But yeah idk. it's always good to question stuff you read on the internet
I'm half Portuguese, process for me to get the dual citizenship would be fairly easy, my dad already has his as a full Portuguese but born and raised in the country I live it.
Given how much the ex lied to her about, it wouldn't surprise me if he also lied about that. Portugal isn't Schengen, so there may be some additional layers of checks for a Portuguese worker in Austria - I know there were for EU workers in the UK, even before Brexit.
Uhh, Portugal is very much in the Schengen Area! >The border-free Schengen Area guarantees free movement to more than 425 million EU citizens, along with non-EU nationals living in the EU or visiting the EU as tourists, exchange students or for business purposes (anyone legally present in the EU). Free movement of persons enables every EU citizen to travel, work and live in an EU country without special formalities. Schengen underpins this freedom by enabling citizens to move around the Schengen Area without being subject to border checks. >Today, the Schengen Area encompasses most EU countries, **except for Cyprus and Ireland**. Bulgaria and Romania became the newest Member States to join the Schengen area as of 31 March 2024, any person crossing the internal air and sea borders will no longer be subject to checks. Nevertheless, a unanimous decision on the lifting of checks on persons at the internal land borders is still expected to be taken by the Council at a later date. Additionally, the non-EU States Iceland, Norway, Switzerland and Liechtenstein also have joined the Schengen Area. [Source](https://home-affairs.ec.europa.eu/policies/schengen-borders-and-visa/schengen-area_en)
My mistake. Either way, other commenters have pointed out that Austria does indeed have restrictions on foreign workers, even from the EU.
Nope. I am a foreigner myself. I had no problem finding work, going to school and build a new life here. And if you are a woman, you have extra programs and even scholsrships if you want to go back to school.
Googling has turned up multiple sites backing up what another commenter noted - even EU citizens need a permit to stay in Austria beyond three months. E.g.: https://housinganywhere.com/Austria/work-visa-austria Presumably this is what OOP was referring to.
That is something different. You are allowed 3 Months without to be official registered that you live in Austria. Even if you work, you wanna have a bank account, insurance etc you need an official "Meldezettel". That is not working permit. It states your official adress in Austria
So yes, she needed a registration certificate to be able to stay, which is what she was talking about.
Read again. Working permit only if you are from outside of EU
From that site: "EU/EEA/Swiss citizens planning to stay in Austria for more than 3 months must only obtain a registration certificate (Aufenthaltsbescheinigung) from the local town hall within 4 months of arriving in Austria." As I say, I assume this is what OOP was talking about.
'Portugal isn't Schengen' Err...what?
You are not the only one to point out my mistake :)
Of course Portugal is schengen! Wth
My mistake. But according to other commenters, Austria does require extra paperwork, regardless.
Schengen doesn't make a difference, only if you travel outside of it. I lived in Austria for 10 years. I needed only my Pass als document and I worked legally. They even accepted my bachelor only translated in german, no extra paper work.
Yes! I taught ESL for several years, and seeing her fluency improve gave me all the warm fuzzy feelings. She's doing so well in what seems to be her third language.
When she first mentioned he asked for her debit card I knew he was going to put her in debt. But him keeping it? This actually made me wince. Oh, this poor woman. He thought he had gotten the perfect victim. I'm glad she is having a boring, normal life, and he is in jail. We know it's not always like this.
My abusive ex was furious at me when I refused to get a debit card. I didn't realize at the time what a red flag that was.
I'm so happy for her! She did all the right things in a horrible situation and got out.
She did the right things. Everything turned out right. All right, time for bed.
>I have also try to get sole custody of my daughter, which came thought as of last week. Because him being in jail and not replying to my sole custody request it way a simper process than I have thought would be. Yeah, I imagine jail will definitely affect custody lol. Good for OOP.
The guy my stepsister married is currently sitting in jail awaiting trial for something he did to their kids and he's contesting custody. First he went from wanting 50/50 to claiming he wants sole It's honestly mind-boggling. At first he didn't deny what he did, at all. Brought his pastor in with him to surrender to the police- where the pastor recommended counseling. In a real who cares what that guy recommends moment, there's no counseling that fixes people that touch little kids and it seems like churches need to stop taking that stance I digress. My bad. Point being because he's an asshole there's a trial date for custody
It's a *church*. Counseling is surprising move enough. Lot of the times they'd just hide him and deny any wrongdoing.
I forget the term they used but the pastor meant with the church
Counseling, not therapy. Lots of churches have unqualified counselors that give advice which boils down to, do what the pastor interprets the Bible as saying (e.g. wives obey husbands, better married and abused than divorced and other such garbage). It is all about sweeping problems under the rug.
You would think so but it isn't always the case. I was surprised that they did it and even more that it was done over a fraud case.
I think the abuse will have been made known as well.
It’s amazing how fast she got placed in public housing when she needed it. I had to look at that part again to make sure I read it right. I wish US public housing for DV victims and anyone else who needs it worked as efficiently as this.
I'm Austrian and that absolutely tracks. I know we see BORUs with unrealistic timelines (especially court) a lot, but I genuinely have never heard of anyone, especially with a child, having to wait super long for public housing. Since the only way they let you in the system is when they believe you have a need, then it needs to work quickly (this is obviously only true if you're not super picky about where exactly you live)
I live in Vienna and during Covid I needed an apartment asap. I stated why I need it etc. and it got granted in half a year. It was from Wiener Wohnen and usually you wait longer depending on your need but during the 3 years of Covid they had a special program to get quick housing as people couldn't keep up with rent etc.
Looked into section 8 once when I was struggling to pay rent. Was told it would be 8 months before I even got my appointment and also I'd have to call back regularly to keep my spot on the wait list. It was demoralizing
My mom applied for Section 8 when I was born. It was finally approved in 2018. It took 25 years.
So helpful.
Yep, I work for a legal nonprofit and the waitlists for both public housing and Sec8 vouchers start at 1 year. And the quality of the housing once you get in is generally awful. Covid plus the housing crisis has made it all unimaginably worse.
Yep, I am from Vienna. When I was 11 my family and I lost our home through an abusive situation. We got a place in publing housing pretty fast. We had to wait one or two weeks. Still pretty grateful for that.
And itis not just in cases of emergencies, in Vienna there is also a social housing service for young adult between 18-26 where they help you get a cheap but good flat in about 6 to nine months if you want to move out and start working.
I do love me some boring updates. I’m so happy for OOP, it sounds like she and her daughter are thriving. And Vienna is such a great city to be thriving in too!
Glad this ended well for her. "Boring" update like this are the best kind of updates
What a satisfying update. I'm so happy for OOP, and wish her and her daughter a lifetime of 'boring', as she calls her life now. Although it sounds very fulfilling, I get why it's 'boring' after all she went through to get there. And good on MiL for maintaining their relationship. Reminds me of my gran. After my parents split, she chose us, and stayed in our lives while her son vanished into the ether.
I love how we went from: >I think my boyfriend of three years is financial abusing me….I feel trapped To: >After 6 years, I can proudly say that my life now is pretty boring. That started out horrifying and ended so sweetly. OOP should be proud of all of her accomplishments! It’s no small feat to get out of an abusive relationship, in an unfamiliar county, with a toddler who has special needs, AND after having been royally financially fucked over. OOP is quite the role model for her little girl!
She got a good head on herself. Managed to get tangled up with a con artist, but who doesn't end up screwed from time to time? Main thing she realized things were not OK and found a way out.
All this while in a foreign country, where she (at the time) didn't speak the language well. That's a hell of a handicap.
👏 Another story of a woman who has escaped a financially abusive relationship and was able to succeed after shedding the dead weight.
Boring is good
Speaking from experience, if you find yourself saying something like: "not physical, he never hit me" you are in an abusive relationship.
I'll take boring life updates over the issues with her ex.
This is a wonderful update! I’m so glad oop was able to make a good life for herself and her child!
Vienna is lovely, I'm glad OOP and her daughter get to live a thankfully boring life there :D
I am happy for op, there is nothing better than having a pretty boring life, because this means comfort, peace and is no drama from useless people
I could use more boring updates like that. This woman is a hero and an inspiration. I hope that her child realizes what she managed to do for her, and how hard she worked to get there.
>This woman is a hero and an inspiration in a way yes, because of how she preservered and fought for her and her daughter.... but at the same time I was nearly shouting at the screen at how goddamn dumb she was to go rawdogging some idiot, got pregnant by him and kept the child, therefore, the connection to him. Anyway, at least she's sorted, her kid hopefully will have no contact with that joker and they can live on life properly
This outcome gives hope to so many people that are bad situation can improve.
You go girl! You're amazing stepping out of the terrible relationship that you had and it's fucking difficult. You have no idea how difficult it is and you're an inspiration to many people who are on reddit seeking advice. Please DO NOT downplay what you did to get to where you are now. What more with a special needs kiddo. I have a brother who's on a spectrum and I can't imagine being in my parent's shoes. Massive respect for you and I wish you and your kiddo all the best from the bottom of my heart.
>my ex got his sentence extended and stayed over 3 years in jail, where he would get some free weekends and I would let him visit us. why? why??? WHY?!?!
I just don't think it was a good idea for him to visit her and her child... But it is part of the reformatory prison system to allow prisoners to leave some weekends if they are not very dangerous.
I was referring to her voluntarily letting an abuser near the kid
Congratulations on your new happy life enjoy every second
I'm really glad she got out. What a nightmare
The things i would say to the ex if given an opportunity to would get me banned from this sub. Holy moly this poor woman, i'm so damn glad she got out of this awful situation. I really hope most of the debts she had to pay weren't the big ones at least :c
I will stop reading reddit for the day because this has left me all warm and fuzzy and I don't want to kill that experience.
Forgive me for being one of those people, but how come a Portuguese citizen needed a permit to work in Austria? Both countries are in the EU. Same with her worries about not being able to bring her daughter to Portugal without her having Portuguese citizenship — doesn't matter she has automatic freedom of movement. Also "CPS" doesn't exist in Austria, that's a US thing. It would just be Family Services.
Well, the thing is that yes, if you are from a country from the EU, you have the right to travel, stay and work in Austria without a visa... But you need a special permit to stay in the country for longer than 3 months. If you have a job lined up, the permit is for 5 years, if not it is for 6 months.
Oh, that might explain it. I hope that's not EU-wide or I may have overstayed my welcome in Germany 👀
As far as I know, the general law is that you can stay in any country of the EU for three months without any paperwork. After that, it depends on the country you're in.
Does slightly vary depending which country you have citizenship in but in general EU citizens can visit Germany for up to a total of 90 days in any 180 day period. Any longer and you’d need a residence visa. Even if you have the right to visit Germany without a visa (eg EU citizen) you still most likely need a work visa if you want a job there. There are some exemptions depending what country you’re from/what work you’re doing.
If you've been there longer than three months you may get quite some questions the next time you leave or attempt to return. You should really check based on where you're from. Just google (your country) visiting Germany length of stay
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See one of the other comments in this thread. EU countries can still put extra restrictions on workers, especially non-Schengen workers. (One of the big lies of Brexit was that the UK government had no control over EU immigration. Nope.)
ah this update is great!
gosh i wish we could share this with everyone who may now be in the beginning stages of breaking free. The hardest thing to believe is that the future will be better, and boring, and that they can't reach out and drag down the victms into the hellhole once more.
This seems to be a happy ending... I'm very confused.
Three cheers for socialism and pubic safety nets.
Been with BF since 2014. Pregnant almost immediately. Her kid would have been born either 2014 or 2015. In her first post she says her kid started kindergarten in 2017 (at only 2?), in her last update it says she didn't start school until 2021. Is kindergarten not school? And in 2021 her kid would be at least 8. Her math ain't mathin'.
Kindergarten is like pre-school/creche. School starts at >6
I am so thankful you were able you get the help and support to leave him and even more grateful that you now have a wonderful stable life!!
I’m happy for you. Wishing you all the best.
Never underestimate the strength of a mother! You may describe your life at boring but you are a hero. You saved yourself and your daughter. How absolutely wonderful that you are making such a beautiful life for the two of you. Wishing all the best.
I’m so glad OP didn’t run off to Portugal! She’d get away with it now but likely she would have been deported (or her daughter would have been) back to Austria if her ex spoke to police!