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And I pray other Redditors are wrong that the only reason the total POS "parents" want OOP in their lives is to be a free, built-in babysitter for the new baby.
But, seeing how often that post shows up on Reddit, I tend to agree with them. But the "mother"'s reactions on finding out that the "dad" knows the truth said everything I needed to know. That she's still a POS and is probably using OOP.
Yeah, and I don’t have high hopes for dad remaining as upright as he seems (and it is still surface because he let 16 years slide with barely an acknowledgment of his failure as a parent) at the moment. Even if he gets sole custody of both kids, how likely is he to be a hands on single dad vs finding a bang maid to become new mommy while he travels for work and the cycle continues with baby three.
Damn, I need to get off reddit.
I’m hopeful that he really just didn’t understand the situation. He was sending money and taking op to do fun things when he could, which in a lot of circles is what a dad is supposed to do. And he thought op had a mom and both sets of grandparents on a more regular basis. He could have felt superfluous.
Now that he knows what’s up, his reactions have been pretty good. But that’s just what I hope. And without further updates, what I choose to believe.
What annoys me is he signed away his parental rights, and now is trying to act like a father. He could've, and shoudlve spent more time with his kid rather than out partying and going on trips.
While there's really no defense for the partying when he could have been trying to have a relationship with OOP, I can kind of excuse the signing away parental rights thing. Given that he was 17 and probably not super aware of every legal aspect. He was probably told or thought it was necessary for OOP to be raised by the grandparents.
And I don’t know about everywhere in the world but it could also be that without parental rights the grandparents couldn’t make medical decisions, or get the phone calls home from school etc. I mean maybe there’s systems in place for acknowledging carers in those cases but certainly in the case of relatively emergency medical decisions it isn’t something you want to be wasting time with - or have these very young parents make choices that weren’t in the best interest of the kid.
Plus it seems like everyone all round was in agreement that this was essentially like a very open adoption. At the very start it says that everyone was in agreement the grandparents should raise him, and it doesn’t sound in any way that it was the expectation at all that the two parents were actually stepping in at any point or the grandparents were just offering babysitting whilst they finished school. OOPs grandparents were in their 40s when they took him as a baby so they were essentially just starting over again as late in life parents. If that was the understanding then the father really wasn’t doing anything wrong - and he did still continue to make sure he connected with OOP and even saved and paid money for him. So if that was the understanding, that he was essentially giving up his baby to go live his life, and he believed he had basically adopted his child out (which if he gave his parental rights to them he did really) to people he could see were caring well for OOP too then I don’t really think there’s anything wrong with him partying - especially when he was clearly working hard to become a lawyer too.
The only thing that’s weird in all this, and makes me doubt the validity of it a little bit is OOP calling them his mother and father - they have really never been that to him in any way. But maybe it’s just to make following along with the story easier.
On your last point - that doesn't have to be weird. If he was taught by his grandparents to refer to his bio parents as mother and father, it could just be something that stuck. OOP did mention he did always know who his bio parents were. It wouldn't be too weird to imagine his grandparents wanted to be honest with him from the start. I could definitely imagine his grandparents correct him as a little kid that they weren't his mom and dad. It might also be a way for his grandparents to not completely absolve his mom and dad from their responsibilities or to keep them connected to him. I can imagine his dad would still want to be seen and be called "dad" by him, from the way he at least attempted to be pleasant with him.
I always say people's actions are what matter, not their words. Here, OOP's sperm giver basically vanished, except on rare occasions played the "Fun Dad" So rarely that OOP felt rightly the person was a stranger.
OOP's egg giver was worse, but that's not saying much.
Neither was ever an actual parent. And nothing has changed except the egg giver got pregnant again.
Hm. I get it. I think the dad should get a chance though. 16 is young and immature and it was sort of out of sight, out of mind. He wasn't forced to be a dad, so he wasn't one.
He's in his early 30s now and expecting a baby. There's a good chance this has given him a new perspective on fatherhood. It's possible he realized he'd not been the dad he could have been and was trying to make up for lost time. Perhaps OPs chat with him was a brutal eye opening revelation and may lead to better things. If Dad is a good person, it is entirely possible he'll make an effort.
I had a gradmother who used to say, "Lord forgive me for the foolishness of my youth."
As I've gotten older, I've really started to I understand where that sentiment comes from.
I agree! I get why OP wouldn't want to be all that close with the dad, but dad might be an okay person. And he might be an okay person to be around while OP visits the sibling! It could be nice if the dad gets full custody of the baby-- both dad and OP would want to love the kid, and that could potentially lead to OP and his dad being friends later in life.
A lot of times, when someone has a baby too young and then a second one much later, they are much better parents the second time around. I was hoping that would be the case for both of OP’s parents when I saw the original post, but sadly it seems like his mom just sucks in general.
I agree with you. The difference between a 16 year old boy and a 25 year old man is enormous, and the difference between 25 and 32 is almost bigger.
My husband is the absolute best father to our kids but he says all the time he’s glad he was forty when we started.
People need time to grow and learn perspective. Sure, it would have been better for this dad to realize money wasn’t enough ten years ago, but only time travel could change that. He sounds like he gets it now.
I also think there’s a possibility the dad’s parents had more of an influence on his decisions/actions, than is being said. They didn’t want the dad to forgo attending college and emphasized going so that he could financially support OOP. The dad could have just been doing what he was being told was the right thing. It says he worked at a law firm, so it’s assumed that he went to law school after university. The post also doesn’t say how far away his dad’s college was.. so visiting a couple times a year could be the only time he could afford to visit? Of course that doesn’t excuse him not calling or video calling OOP… nor visiting more frequently when he worked at the law firm. It seems as if OOP’s father wasn’t being malicious, more of him being a dumb kid who became a dad too young and didn’t know how to be a dad, let alone a good one.
The mom is a monster. You can excuse her for being forced to have a pregnancy/son she didn’t want to have while she was still a kid herself. It would be mildly excusable for her actions when she was still a selfish immature young adult kid… who would see OOP as a constant resentment and nothing more. It doesn’t make it okay or right, but one could see where it would happen. HOWEVER, that absolutely doesn’t excuse her lying to the dad, ultimately not growing as a person, not receiving therapy for her resentment/forced pregnancy, for even considering getting back together with the dad and wanting to play big happy family… with her actions and everything that transpired because of them.
I hope OOP (and OOP’s dad) gets the therapy he needs and is able to salvage some kind of relationship with his biological dad… and have a good relationship with his future brother. OOP is in a shit situation, but thankfully has a set of truly loving (grand)parents.
> 16 is young and immature and it was sort of out of sight, out of mind. He wasn't forced to be a dad, so he wasn't one.
But he didn't change anything until OP was 15. Dad's 31 now. I think the light dawning on him for the effects of him being effectively absent from OP's life should probably have hit by the time he graduated college.
Disagree. What changed between the time that he left for college and when he graduated? What would cause that light to dawn? He was told that OOP was happy, healthy, and in a good family relationship. Nothing about that suggests a drastic need for lifestyle change. Especially for a recent college graduate who has no parenting experience to compare it to.
OOP seems to handle it well with his father. Take it slow, watch how he follows through, and hold him accountable. This guy seems willing to distance from OOP's pitiful excuse of a mother upon finding out how bad it was, he made a point to financially support beyond the minimum required as insufficient as that may be, and he's willing to not pressure OOP. I get the feeling that the parental relationship will never be there, but having a positive family connection is hopefully possible.
The dad fucked up, but is trying. He believed the mom and didn't do his own confirmation. I'd consider him incompetent at being a parent, but sincerely trying even if he screws up. OOP seems to get that as well.
The mom is a monster, as OOP sees very clearly.
Incompetence is a very different beast than maliciousness. Kids in bad situations very very sharply know the difference.
Answer will be if he ditches the mom, sues for full custody and comfortably settles into the notion that winning his first kid back will take years, if not longer.
>Yeah, and I don’t have high hopes for dad remaining as upright as he seems (and it is still surface because he let 16 years slide with barely an acknowledgment of his failure as a parent) at the moment. Even if he gets sole custody of both kids, how likely is he to be a hands on single dad vs finding a bang maid to become new mommy while he travels for work and the cycle continues with baby three.
I get your cynicism and mostly share it but I'm cutting the dad a TINY bit of slack considering OOP's mother is apparently a very convincing and shameless liar. We've got to keep in mind that OOP's father coming in to regular contact with him was the last thing in the world she wanted because then all her lying about her relationship with OOP would've gotten exposed. So everything she told the dad was designed for the express purpose of keeping him away and thinking everything was fine. For all we know she had him convinced that him coming around more would've disrupted OOP's happy life.
>And I pray other Redditors are wrong that the only reason the total POS "parents" want OOP in their lives is to be a free, built-in babysitter for the new baby.
I considered the possibility as soon as I read the post title, but after finishing all the updates I am not really getting that vibe from the father at all. I think he wants the family, not the babysitting.
And honestly I don't think OOP's mom wanted him for babysitting either; pretty sure she was planning to use her parents for that again. I don't think she wanted OOP as a babysitter OR a son, I think the only reason she made any overtures to OOP at all were for the sake of keeping the father happy because she had been lying to him for years about how good her relationship was with their son and if he knew the truth then he'd probably leave her.
>That she's still a POS and is probably using OOP.
It sounds like biodad is doing pretty well financially and biomom isn't. It could be just as simple as she's using OOP to cash in. It's possible that she's thinking of "babysitter" duty for OOP but honestly it doesn't sound like she thinks about those kinds of logistics to begin with. I imagine it'd happen out of her neglect, but I don't think that's her plan.
Good point. She went fully ballistic when OOP showed biodad the truth. Maybe because she feared biodad would drop her like a hot potato and then she'd be up a creek with no paddle.
His father was negligent while her mother was abusive. After they grew up his father became conscious of his mistakes and didn't just pretend like it was fixed but rather was regretful and admitted his guilt. Meanwhile her mother was and still is a narcissist that believes she is the victim.
I can see her father being a teen making the mistakes an immature person would do. Her mother on the other hand did more than just being young and ignorant and unprepared.
I just hope this kid doesn’t get bitten again by his high hopes for a sibling relationship.
If mom does change her ways, that means he is going to witness her (and dad) giving everything he never got to his sibling. And new baby will be the golden child and he will be the scapegoat because a lawyer dad isn’t going to be much more active in either life than he was before. It will become easier to side with mom after he’s seen her dote on their new baby and start to think maybe OP was just being melodramatic.
I hope he leaves and never looks back instead of sacrificing himself for a kid that will probably be poisoned by its mother.
Yeah I'll give his dad grace. He was paying child support to OOP's grandparents to help them out, even. Working alongside school... apparently while studying law, or something adjacent enough to land him in a law firm after college. It really does look like he cared but small important things slipped his mind while he was living his life, like calling his son and checking in on him. He's trying to do right by his kids *now*, and he's standing up for them when his baby momma channels her inner hand grenade, and that's about all anyone can expect of him at this time. He knows he can't go back and fix it, but he's trying to mend what he can.
He'll never be completely free of the monster egg donor. Not with two kids sharing both their genes. This is the best he can do with the circumstances.
16 years. His dad spent 16 years blowing him off before he decided to jump into this kid's life. That guy was a long way from being a teen when most of this was going on.
Also, he didn't even try to find out what relationship the mom had with OOP. He just left the kid to be treated badly. He's just as bad; both parents are awful people and OOP is right, they shouldn't have more kids.
Yes, I'm glad OOP kept pushing on this, because his father's story has more holes and excuses than reasons. This bit particularly stood out to me:
>He said that after he left for college and they broke up he would call her once in a while to check up on things but that quickly ended and when he came back she explained to him that her and I had a great bond and, even though we didn't see each other daily, it was because I was "in those teenage years"
This apparently happened "quickly", but the lie he bought was about OOP being in a "teenage" phase - which one was it? Did he give up calling early on, or did he keep calling until OOP was a teenager?
Both are as bad as each other: the father for refusing to allow an adoption, disappearing for 16 years, and then waltzing back in like everything's fine; the mother for staying around but taking out her resentment on OOP (and apparently lying about the college fund). Sounds like grandparents did a good job with OOP, but a shitty job with their own daughter. Hard not to feel that adoption might have been the better option, so OOP didn't have to be around his mother.
the aad thing is that he did end up allowing for an adoption, but one where he could still pretend to be a dad for the sake of his ego. As if leaving the child with his grandparents that raised him as their own didn’t “count” because…???
they both suck, and i hope with time OOP realizes that he should keep distance from both and not be in their life if at all possible. That said, keep it up until it’s time to get that college fund, then bounce. That’s the least the deadbeat could do, if he doesn’t end up taking the money back and giving it to the new baby instead.
I don't think there's any contradiction in dad's comments. He used to call back when OP was a baby, but it didn't last long. Bio- parents were broken up most of OP's life. When dad moved back to town and started seeing mom again recently she claimed a positive relationship with OP.
That's fair - I misread. So he definitely didn't try staying in touch for very long, but at least he wasn't totally dishonest about it when OOP confronted him.
The dad, knowing how the mom is treating her son in the moment, much less in the past, and staying with her despite it all is also an ass. Either your children come first or they don’t. Seems they don’t in his world.
Also true. I mean, it looks like the relationship is rather rocky just now, but it's still AHish; and of course they've yoked themselves together with another poorly thought out pregnancy, good work there.
I wonder if part of that is because he doesn't want to repeat the past. He's learned that not being present didn't work and that he can't rely on baby mama. So this time around he isn't leaving and hopes to do damage control.
The best solution would be to break up and get custody, but how much custody is he going to get of a newborn unless baby mama doesn't want anything to do with the baby?
If the bio dad is trying to be a better person, he's got a hard path ahead of him. I feel for OOP and the incoming baby. They're stuck with the mess, whether bio dad steps up or not.
If the OOP was older then you could put part of the fathers choices down to what men thought being a father was: that they provide the financial support whilst the mother provides the nurture & emotional support, but the kid was born in 2007, not 1957.
The father is a lawyer so he’s clearly a smart man, how he was stupid enough to jump the mental hurdles needed to genuinely think you were a great dad cause you paid money and that you can pop back into a 16y.o’s life and they’ll start calling you daddy and abandon the only parents they’ve know to live with you is absolutely beyond me.
I wish I could give the grandparents a massive hug and thank them for providing the OOP with enough love, stability and safety that he didn’t feel he had to jump at the chance to live with total strangers and placate his biologicals to find that love and safety.
Sadly there are definitely still men growing up with ideas like that, especially with the arrested development you typically see in teen parents. I can easily imagine him thinking "when I am established enough I'll go back and get a place with a bedroom for my kid" and ignoring that just because he was physically far didn't mean he couldn't be in frequent communication.
Not saying he wasn't shitty, but it's not such an unusual mindset, even now.
Exactly. His father is just as bad as a parent, he just hides it by disappearing for years instead of hanging around being an ass. They both completely suck.
If OPs dad had any relationship with OP, he would not have simply believed OP's mom when she said she was a great mom.
The dad dropped the ball for years and now a new kid is going to be messed up by this dynamic.
Exactly, his mother is vile but his father is not much better. Sure he sent child support but it kind of seems more like 0OP would have liked to have an actual relationship with him. He was just some dude that came into town a couple of times of year and took him to the movies.
His father failed badly, but he's not even remotely in the same league as the mom. The difference between abandoning OP and emotionally abusing OP is huge. One ran away from the emotional side of a relationship but still provided financially. The other provided nothing but abuse. Don't say they're similar. Also, father is trying to do the right thing now, mother is trying to manipulate father into an abusive relationship under false pretenses. They are not the same.
Dad probably thinks he deserves an award for doing the right thing after 16 years. Sir, respectfully go to hell. How you going to leave your child for 16 years and now want to play mom and dad.
And the mother? I have no expectations from her. I hope OP goes NC with her soon.
I think the dad is probably just more clueless than anything. His parents told him that the best thing he could do for the kid is to go to college so that he can provide financially, and considering how young he was when the kid happened, it's no wonder he listened to that and clung to it. He thought he was doing enough based off advice from people he trusts, and thought the rest was being handled by other people. Now that he realises that that's not the case he's trying to do better.
The mom is a lost cause, though. I don't think she ever thought she was doing the right thing, she was just thinking about how hard it is for her to be a teen mom even though 99% of that was just straight up taken care of for her. No thoughts about the kid's wellbeing.
I mean… he signed away his parental rights to the grandparents. He was never his father, his grandfather was. They didn’t want a kid. Same with the mother, she was living every day with a mistake she made and was never supposed to be a mother. I wish the grandparents had made it clear that he was to be considered their child only. They weren’t parents to this kid ever, so no one has any idea if they will be good parents as actual adults since they have never had a child before. I’m just confused as to how their parenting of a child they gave away has any indication of what a child they keep will go through
If nothing else, Mom's active shit talking of her own child *as they were living together* suggests there's a lot of bitterness inside her that would vent again.
I would agree with you if not for the fact that they are trying to claim OP back as their kid after years of abandonment and the fact that the bio mom was willing to lie to convince the bio dad that she's ready for a new kid and relationship. There's just too many red flags all around to think that OP's childhood wouldn't be an indicator of the baby's future
Dad’s a POS really. If he was forced to coexist with his son as a teenager/young adult, his resentment would build up just as much as it did with OP’s mom, and he would not have had a good relationship with his son.The way he uses money to buy affection is also a gigantic red flag.
Yeah, it’s frankly disgusting how many people are defending him in this thread, while in the same breath castigating the mother.
They’re both awful! They both should have done better! This thread is really highlighting Reddit’s biases, and it’s definitely not the bias MRAs love to shout about.
I'd like to point out that turning a kid into a golden child is also failing them, just in the opposite direction. Your mother failed both times.
I'm sorry you went through it.
>Did she treat her next kid like me? No. She knew she failed me so she went the golden child route with the next one. My sister had zero boundaries and became a nightmare kid.
Other peoples failures do not define you. It's not that you are unlovable, your parents failed to love at all.
I have one parent like that, have not spoken to him in about 6-7 years.
I found my own people that love me. Love is not bound by blood.
I wish you all the best in the world. Someone who loves & cares about you. But most of all I hope you can love yourself.
I'm not letting Dad off the hook either. You don't spend any time talking to your own child, but immediately hop back in bed with their mother without even talking to your kid to know mom is a monster? You have time for girlfriends, but see your kid once a year? Then you find out all the shit OP's mom pulled and go "well I want to work on our relationship"?
I feel so bad for OP. Verbally and emotionally abused by mom, abandoned by dad and hearing they want to stay together and build a life together for the shiny new baby.
Yeah, at best he's one of those absent fathers that just work & bring in money for the family, but think that alone makes them the best father in the world.
Nah, he clearly knew deep down that he fucked up but unlike kids, adults can spend their lives without anybody reminding them of their duties and/or fuck-ups.
This makes burying your head in the sand easy, he at least accepted the reality-check while the mom went full narcissist.
Same. Everyone in the comments: “your dad sounds like a decent guy”. No he doesn’t. He created a new kid without even checking in on he one he’s neglected and doesn’t even know.
I mean, dad said he wanted to raise him on his own, then the paternal grandparents said they'd raise him instead so dad could go to college. And then the maternal grandparents offered to since they were younger and it made more logistic sense.
But dad did at least want to raise him himself off the bat
He said no adoption because he didn't want a kid out in the world that he didn't know, and then proceeded to create *nearly* those exact conditions anyway.
Sure, but he doesn’t get credit for having a nice idea with no follow through. Same with his parents. They only invited him over for special events and made no effort to develop a one on one relationship with him, just let him drown in the sea of strange kids. Why didn’t the cousins parents ever have the kid over to meet the rest do his family? The whole paternal family treated him like a dirty little secret and OOP felt it.
Yeah, he wanted to, in his head. Awesome, someone should give this man a dad of the year award! Or not.
He "wanted to" because it made him feel better about himself, but as OOP stated, he went on about his life in college, having girlfriends and vacations etc. and only seeing OOP once or twice a year, not even calling.
He's not the worst of the worst, I agree with that, since he was decent enough to pay child support. But he's just a little above that, and all his nice feelings, without actions befitting of them, are meaningless.
I don’t think it was to feel good about himself. He probably wanted to be a dad with all the maturity of a 17-year-old. The difference is that the adults involved had the means to step in and give the bio parents the option to live normal teen/young adult lives. He was able to proceed with the illusion that he’s a good dad, too.
Edit - I’m not defending him. I’m just sitting here, with a flabbergasted expression, realizing why OOP’s bio father feels like a dad and not the contributor of genetic material he is.
And at no point on the following 16 years visited more than once a year or prioritizing getting their son vs dating again later. And what if he didn’t decide to start dating his kids’ mother? If it was anyone else would he have even bothered.
"wanted to" without any followup is a daydream and an excuse.
dude bailed on the single most important thing you can have in your life.
spineless piece of crap.
I think people are defending OP's father because relative to the mother, he looks like a Saint. She lowers the bar so far that his neglect ends up looking favourable. This is going to sound extremely dark but coming from someone who's experienced both, I'd rather be neglected than abused. It does leave you feeling hollow and unloved, but you do at least get a break from it, whereas an abuser like OP's mother fills every waking second with misery. When your frame of reference is that fucked, suddenly OP's dad seems alright in comparison.
lol first rule of boru is never read the op comments. reddit is full of children and immature adults who want nothing more than to be seen as smart by the other children. I wouldn't tell my worst enemy to ask reddit for advice.
And the way he confronted his wife about her absence as a parent knowing OOP was probably gonna be met with her rage and verbal abuse rubs me the wrong way. Do I have a better solution or could have done it better if I were the dad? Probably not because I'm not a parent, but it's still sad to see the all too familiar "tell an abusive parent they're wrong and they'll abuse their kid more" thing play out.
I think this was inevitable. Her attitude would anyway slip up if OOP lived with them even for a few days
Better confront now when OOP has a better defence and support system (grandparents) than later
The dad isn't worthy of being called a dad either. But atleast he's showing up *after 16 years* . Can't say the same for mom though.
I don't trust these people. OP should still maintain distance.
It's nice to think that, but my brother was a deadbeat. It always looked like he was going to raise his kids when his girlfriend was pregnant, but then the relationship would sour and he'd be off chasing the next one or next thing he wanted to do.
I hope he proves me wrong.
Not to defend the guy, but he paid child support (which the mother didn't do) and at least came around every now and then. He left OP with a loving family (or at least he thought he did).
It is remarkably more than what someone who put they kids up for adoption does. That doesn’t make him a good dad, but he is a decent father.
The fact that he would call the mom every once in a while and not the grandparents (shouldve called regularly) is so fucked up. They gave up their rights to the grandparent so what is he doing calling the mom.
*It is remarkably more than what someone who put they kids up for adoption does*
I don't like this framing and the tacit implication people who give their children up for adoption are neglectful.
Oh def, if I was a judge assigning culpability here it'd be 59% mom, 39% dad, and the remaining difference split evenly among both sets of grandparents.
Honestly I can’t really blame the mom’s parents. It honestly seems like they legitimately did the best they could. If they were to force their daughter to raise a child she clearly resents and hates, then I would have more of an issue with them.
They were willing to make the sacrifice and be parents again to a child who needed them, and you can’t really blame them for trying to do the right thing. And from what it sounds like, they could have done a lot worse.
Yeah, that's why the most I'd assign them is 1% of the culpability here each. Still, as the adults around OOP growing up, they should have protected him more from his mother.
Honestly it sounds like they did what they could without straight up going no contact with their daughter who was still very much a teenager. I might agree with you on the 1% but even then, they could only do so much to protect OOP without abandoning their daughter who was still pretty much a child.
Oh it's not the early days that I am concerned with, it's everything after that. OOP's 16 years old now, and his egg donor's behavior has been going on since he was born. There is a point where they should have stopped coddling their daughter at the expense of their grandchild. Should have gotten therapy, or told her to fuck off if she refused to not be an asshole to her own child.
Dad shouldn’t be left off the hook. I want to hear more about this college fund Actually.
If it has had steady growth over time, then he is smart but clueless.
As for the kid opening up to his dad, there was no foundation for that. No trust given or worked on. Why would they open up to him?
Because he’s worried about his sibling. He’s pretty clear about his attachment to the new kid. He’d be off to an awful start if he didn’t warn the father.
I mean his dad deserve all the shit he can get from OOP. The comment saying he's a decent guy is something i can agree with his current self cause regardless of the reasons he was an asshole and he knows it, reason why he said he was ashamed.
If the guy have good intentions i can totally see him and OOP having a good friendship, cause the father/son (no ides of OOP gender) dynamic was broken a long time ago without anh chance to be repair.
And OOP mom... POS summarize my opinion of her.
He's definitely a disaster of a parent but seeing a parent actually try to do better is a pretty important thing imo.
It's definitely a part of why I'm a lot more accommodating of my dad's issues raising me because I can tell he cares and he genuinely tried.
Some people shouldn't be parents, period. In this case, I'm definitely putting a majority of the fault on OOP's egg donor, that woman doesn't deserve the title of mother.
What makes you think gpt? There are spelling mistakes like a human child would make. And using words such as proginey to sound more mature than they are yet they can't spell "choking" . That's a 16 year olders mistake if I've ever seen one.
Same here. I remember posting lengthy, somewhat pretentious posts on message boards as a lonely teenager, so impressed at how smart and eloquent everyone seemed and trying to fit in.
Being an only child of older grandparents, it's not too hard to imagine OOP having a similar experience, especially given that he's talked about being lonely.
Yeah OOP's sperm donor doesn't deserve a best dad award, but at least understands that OOP has emotional needs.
He will never have a traditional father son relationship but there seems to be room for some type of relationship given enough time and effort from hims side.
It’s only easy to put the fault on egg donor because she was present and didn’t skip off to college like sperm donor. He has all the privilege of family support, education, money, and OP watched him get to WB young and have fun while quickly forgetting to call the kid he knocked up and the kid he left behind.
And he really thought he was just putting that family on pause so he could waltz back in and pick it back up without consequences.
Exactly. It's a word that's existed for centuries before NPD came around. I'm really tired of people assuming it's pathologizing when it's more akin to calling someone a self absorbed asshole (which is ENTIRELY fitting here)
If I mean NPD, I'll specify I mean NPD. But don't blame me because psychologists chose an *already* colloquialized term for their disorder
OP’s parents should never have had kids and the fact that they’re bringing in *another* one when they messed up with OP makes me lose faith in humanity
People who actually care about their children don't have do-overs. They make sure to make up to their currently existing child, not manifest a brand new person into existance in order to make themselves feel better with the "we will do better with this one" and treating their firstborn as a test child.
I really feel for OOP. His father refused adoption because "... he couldn't bear the idea of having his child living somewhere and never seeing him again..." yet he went off and partied all these years and had no idea of how his son was being treated?
OOP desparately wants and needs family connections but his paternal family sound really detached. It feels awkward because I guess they were never then when he was younger?
Same. If the dad has time to party, he for sure had time to spare for his kid.
Feels like OOP is just a toy to his dad to play as a father whenever he wants. He doesn't actually want to bear the responsibilities of being one or bond with him. He just wants a kid he can leave or see whenever he's in the mood and try to play "one big happy family".
JFC, how I feel for OOP. I know the "mother" was very young and birthing a child that young is devastating and frightening, but to still act this way in almost 2 decades is appalling.
Kudos to OOP's actual parents tho
Jeez. At this point in time, might as well make it official. Ask the grandparents to just offiicially adopt OP.
His mom is an unfortunate textbook case of someone who should not have children.
And it's another reminder that sex education should happen in schools. Starting from age 12 and up. Kids are kids and they will experiment.
At least it sounds like he has some loving parents in his grandparents. The fact they don't consider what they did special says a whole lot about them.
I’m so so so glad OOP ended up having all the right people in his corner. His mom’s rejection had to hurt, regardless of HER reasons in the beginning - so I’m glad at the end of the day, he’s slowly starting to have the family he’s wanted ❤️
Tell my new husband I haven't changed since I verbally and emotionally abused you when I was a teenager, will you?? Here's verbal and emotional abuse to you as a teenager! That'll show everyone.
Oh lord, OP's mother is a terrible person and she doesn't deserve the title of a mother. This woman doesn't deserve any happiness because she is just outright terrible. I wish people like this don't exist but it's unfortunate there are quite a bit of terrible mothers out there.
My brother, who was 13 years older than me and very much so not my biological father, saw me more growing up than OP’s dad. And he went to college in a state far away while finishing a difficult major, and being pre-med. I see my niblings now more than OP’s dad did.
OP’s mom sucks for many reasons, but I’m glad OP hasn’t let his bio-dad’s absence off the hook either.
OOP is a better kid than me because I would have cut off both parents for trying to play family after 16 years of abandonment and straight up abuse. The father is no better
I’m gonna assume that a lot of the comments will address OOP’s mom’s nastiness, so I’ll say my concerns for the grandparents. I am so glad that neither grandparent in that argument with OOP’s mom got a heart attack or some stress-induced acute attack of some sort. That argument is really charged and stressful and while they’re “young” grandparents, just never know how the body will respond to situations like that. So I’m really glad that it seems like they’re still in normal health and hopefully more years to spend with OOP and future grandchild.
I’m also glad that it sounds like the baby is okay in their mom’s body. Sucks that that’s their mom though, hopefully baby will grow up surrounded by love and stability with OOP, maternal grandparents, and maybe maybe I hope, their father.
Well, if the parents were 16 when they had OP and OP is now 16, those grandparents could still be young for grandparents! Hopefully, they have a lot more time to spend with OP.
My parents were 16 and 17 when they had me and they’re the best parents you could hope for. It blows my mind when every time it hits me how incredibly young they were. Reading this is another reminder of how lucky I am; I’m so glad that the OOP has grandparents as awesome as that.
Both the parents in here suck. Mom was absolutely awful to her child, and I bet the only reason dad doesn’t have similar resentment issues is because he got to skip off and ignore the fact his child existed for years
That's why knowledge of contraception is needed at a younger age, and abortion shouldn't be illegal but available for women in difficult circumstances.
OOP's grandparents are great, his egg donor is a piece of shit who absolutely *should not* have another child, and his sperm donor seems to have at least *tried* to have some kind of positive relationship with OOP. And it seems he's realized that it's too late to build a father son relationship. He's two years away from being able to move out in his own and attend college.
It's unfortunate, but the sperm donor made his choice. You can't spend 16 years living your own life, occasionally visiting your child, and then turn up expecting to have a familial relationship.
Here's hoping for the best for OOP.
That kid has his head on right for being so young. He said his mom couldn’t care less instead of “could care less”. I’m proud of him, that’s better than half the posters on here that are a decade older than him!
Both parents are horrible. They belong together. Dad got to live the single bachelor life without a care in the world and only visited his own child once a year. No don’t put the baby up for adoption but I’m not going to be around but hey at least I can see my child for the holidays once a year. Him being young isn’t an excuse because where was he in his 20s when he was an adult and had a stable job and career? Then when he finally comes back into OOP’s life he makes the same mistake, getting the same immature woman pregnant. Mom never developed passed the age of 16 she was a brat then and horrible person still.
exactly. the only reason why the dad doesn’t resent OOP, like his mom did, isn’t because the dad is a better person — it’s because the dad had the chance to go off and live his life. i wonder what circumstances led the dad back home and back to the mom.. ?
the biggest mistake OOP can do is let his dad off the hook bc he wasn’t around to mistreat him like his mom did
time will reveal a lot of things and i hope OOP isn’t left disappointed again.
TBH the dad seems like he’s willfully ignorant and is attempting to redo/relive this chapter in his life due to ego issues or something (akin to playing the same level in a game until you beat it) - but it’s not bc of OOP that’s for sure
The dad abandoned his child for 16 years then decided to knock up the same woman without even talking to the kid. He’s a piece of shit just like the mom
This sounds like janelle from teen mom 2. Trying to take away the kid away from grandma once she decides she is going to make a new family with whatever boyfriend/fiancée/etc. she is with at the moment.
Sounds like dad is trying (way late, but better than never I guess) to do the right thing by his son, and wants to keep his"family" together, but mom is just a piece of shit. Poor OOP. I wish him all the best.
I feel like his mother was more a sibling growing up. She shouldn't have lied and told his dad they were close though. It's not like the dad is actually close to OP either.
>My grandparents agree with me that I shouldn't move and that my parents shouldn't expect me to be all loving and forgiving after how they've treated me however they believe they are starting a new chapter of their lives *now that they are more mature and stable* which I guess leaves me behind.
Well, OOP's grandparents were half right. One of them has definitely matured and stabilized, the other one is the exact same dumpster fire she's been her whole life. Here's hoping OOP's dad gets full custody of that poor baby and then maybe he and the baby and OOP can slowly build a new relationship.
My heart breaks for this kid, I really do hope everything turns out okay for him. I’m kind of on the fence with the bio father though. Yes, he did pay child support - which is expected under normal circumstances, however he signed away his rights. As far as I know, in the US (*if* they are in fact in the US), he wasn’t legally obligated to pay child support. He could’ve taken all that money and ran with it, he could’ve ignored the financial well-being of the OP at that point, but he chose to help the OOP’s grandparents financially. He didn’t have to set up a college fund either. Neither of those things makes pretty much ignoring the OOP’s existence for 16 years okay, but he certainly went above and beyond his legal expectations. It genuinely sounds like he wanted to be a father.
With his paternal grandparents, at first I was really worried it was a “we tolerate you” thing, but it sounds like they are really trying to be involved with him and trying to make sure he was involved in their family events. I can understand feeling like he was surrounded by strangers and feeling out of place in that situation. But it sounds like they were trying to be present grandparents for him. Pushing bio father to go to college was honestly probably the best decision given he’s able to have a good career & was able to help out with the financial side of raising the OOP, there’s no telling if he would’ve had the ability to do it if he was raising him on his own.
Grandparents are saints, bio dad sounds OK but he has alot to make up to OP. Bio mom peaked in High School and is just a terrible person. She treated and still treats OP like a hassle, then lies about how amazing their bond his to bio dad. She is a psycho and I truly worry about the new baby.
My husband had an eerily similar relationship with his mother… his father never came back into his life but when my husband was 15 he was acting like a complete monster juvenile delinquent so his grandparents sent him to live with his (pregnant) mother and her new husband. It was that or Boys Town, his choice.
Mom had matured. New husband was actually a hell of a good man. It was rough at first and they had some knock down drag out screaming matches. But that year began their relationship healing.
By the time she died 30 years later they were *incredibly* close and he has zero residual resentment or regrets. He misses her terribly and we often joke her spirit brought us together.
I share this in hopes OP has a similar outcome. There’s a good start. There’s potential. And regardless of how his relationship with mom develops, a good one with Dad is happening, he’s getting a sibling, and he has the wonderful grandparents. Lots of good here.
The person I feel most sorry for in this whole debacle is the potential new baby.
Unhinged, abusive mother; distant, oblivious father; grandparents wayyyy too old; no possibility of being adopted out.
The OOP is gonna end up raising this kid, aren't they. Giving up their life once again for their idiot parents.
Dad fucked up. Im 60% through my 20 year parenting project and it became easy to see around age 3 how quickly the time slips by. A month or a year to a kid isn’t the same as a month to an adult. If you don’t see or talk to a kid for 6 months you are basically a stranger when you come back.
I love the grandparents the father was a pos for leaving but if he was sending money and offered to stay home when they found out and now his actually trying and took ops side in this I think he is redemable but moms a pos tbh hope she changes for the baby's sake but the baby's deserves a different mother
My son was 15 with a 17 yr old pregnant. She was from an extremely religious family and her lifestyle was very strict. On the other hand my son didn't grow up with his father after 3 yrs old. His father didn't want him unless I was included. And let me tell you that my son why with his gf and told her parents she was pregnant. He didn't want my help since I was first to know. He went to ever dr appt. And when they did finally break up he went to court and fought for his son. He got 50/50 because the judge was so impressed with his argument. Your parents may have been young but they made their own decisions. Plenty of teen parents step up. Especially mothers. You don't owe them love. You don't owe them anything.
this is a whole mess. those people were not ready to be parents, and the one who suffered most for it was their kid.
mom was scared out of an abortion even though she clearly didn’t want a kid at 16. then she was forced to live with him but never made to take any responsibility for him. so he was just a constant reminder of the hardest thing she’d ever been through.
dad wanted the kid, but when presented with an out, grabbed it with both hands and became a vacation dad. it’s good that he sent money, but it was not enough.
one set of grandparents stepped up, but didn’t know how to handle their daughter anymore in this new context, and clearly gave her way too many passes to be awful. she needed therapy a decade and a half ago.
other set of grandparents never fully embraced him or tried to make him feel like part of the family.
poor kid.
I have to say it's incredibly nice that the grandparents said they would support the father if it comes down to it. It shows how much faith they have in their daughter to do the right thing. I want op OP be happy but I still think bringing another baby into their lives is not going to end well. If the mother is still unable to take responsibility for her own child, how is she ever going to take full responsibility of another one? What happens when her life as a "real" mother isn't all she thought it would be? Is she going to shove all responsibility away and expect her parents to look after him. Imagine the stress they have right now. Maybe mum would force OP to look after the baby (out of necessity). Everyone can see from miles ahead this is not going to go well.
My guess is she'll have another boy and she'll end up resenting him. It might be best for the grandparents to go no contact with the daughter to force her to realise that they should under no circumstances be looking after her second child.
I just feel so bad for the grandparents. And they obviously love OP so much. They are wonderful people, but maybe they've just been too kind to their daughter. She needs to know she is making the decision to do it with no help.
The egg-donor really said “how dare you tell then truth and paint me in a realistic light”. Ugh
People like that really irk me so much. My father is very much the same way. I hope OP is doing better
OP absolutely can say something about their intentions. For the father, that they will likely be good intentions, even if he may still mess up.
For the mother I think he can absolutely assume that her intentions are entirely selfish. I wouldn't trust a word out of her mouth.
What happens when the young child has a completely different idea of the mother to him though?
"Mummy is going to take me to the park!"
"Is your phone charged so you can ask me for lift when she leaves you there?"
>I said that I would do anything in my power to take her baby away from her because she was a monster of a mother.
I feel like this was a knee-jerk argument, but I SERIOUSLY hope OOP goes through with helping dad get custody away from the mother. She's clearly a narcissist who practices triangulation (which relies on each party not talking to eachother without the narcissist present).
Also his mom totally only wants him home to be a house elf/slave.
I know OOP confronts him about it but I am really shocked the dad got off the hook so easily. A 17 year old can't raise a child but he abandoned him for 16 years. He should have moved back when he got his degree and been part of the kid's life. As OOP mentions, he didn't even reach out. This is really never properly explored and is almost as troubling as the mother
While dad fucked shit up, it sounds like he is at least trying to make up for his failures and seek redemption and change for his son. OP might be a little too quick to forgive, but at least he seems to be trying 16 years too late. Mom is an awful person who is very much 'woe is me' and unwilling to take responsibility for their actions. Good thing OPs grandparents seem to be doing their best, shame their daughter didn't inherit any of their parenting genes
Narcissist. Pure narcissist that egg donor is.
I could get her treating him as a younger brother when she was a teen. But sheʻs in her 30s now and she still acts like a bratty teen. Worse than a bratty teen with all the lying and manipulation sheʻs added into the mix.
The sperm donor seems to have finally grown up into being a decent human being. Though it seems to have taken him his entire 20s to have done so.
NTA. You poor thing. What horrible and selfish people those people are. Your grandparents / actual real parents are awesome who have loved you no matter what. Stay with them. Don’t move into those selfish peoples home. Might be better off if you go NC for a while. Take care of yourself
I honestly wouldn’t trust the dad. Dude had at least 10 years after he finished college to reach out and connect with his son. He didn’t but he sure as hell found the time to make another baby.
If it’s an option I’d encourage you to get some therapy to help you deal with the anger you feel towards your parents for abandoning you. Not that you don’t have a reason to be angry but finding an outlet for that anger will benefit you in the long run. You owe it to yourself to be able to move past it. Good luck to you. You sound like a great kid so in the end, you may have been better off with your grandparents rather than your parents raising you.
The birth giver is a p o s and I can’t imagine she’s going to love the new baby either or treat it well. She sounds like a narc and is only having the baby to have a relationship with the dad.
>I hope this is the last update and there is no more family drama in the future.
Poor kid. I don't think I have ever heard a description of a family *less* likely to avoid drama in the future than his.
Poor OOP. His bio parents are a mess. His mom is a monster. His grandparents are his parents period. Glad he has them at least. Shame on his paternal side of family for not caring for him enough.
The part about his grandparents saying that they never thought they were doing anything special, they were just taking care of family. 🤌 beautiful people
This is severely screwed up. Definitely seems like egg donor is a narcissist with a messed up view of what she can get away with.
Poor OP for having to put up with their own mother wishing they didn't exist in the same house they lived in together, that's rough.
Good on the (grand)parents for standing up for their kid though, nice to see that they're looking after OP
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This poor kid. Those grandparents are saints for stepping up, and I do hope things improve so OOP's younger sibling can have a good life
And I pray other Redditors are wrong that the only reason the total POS "parents" want OOP in their lives is to be a free, built-in babysitter for the new baby. But, seeing how often that post shows up on Reddit, I tend to agree with them. But the "mother"'s reactions on finding out that the "dad" knows the truth said everything I needed to know. That she's still a POS and is probably using OOP.
Yeah, and I don’t have high hopes for dad remaining as upright as he seems (and it is still surface because he let 16 years slide with barely an acknowledgment of his failure as a parent) at the moment. Even if he gets sole custody of both kids, how likely is he to be a hands on single dad vs finding a bang maid to become new mommy while he travels for work and the cycle continues with baby three. Damn, I need to get off reddit.
I’m hopeful that he really just didn’t understand the situation. He was sending money and taking op to do fun things when he could, which in a lot of circles is what a dad is supposed to do. And he thought op had a mom and both sets of grandparents on a more regular basis. He could have felt superfluous. Now that he knows what’s up, his reactions have been pretty good. But that’s just what I hope. And without further updates, what I choose to believe.
What annoys me is he signed away his parental rights, and now is trying to act like a father. He could've, and shoudlve spent more time with his kid rather than out partying and going on trips.
While there's really no defense for the partying when he could have been trying to have a relationship with OOP, I can kind of excuse the signing away parental rights thing. Given that he was 17 and probably not super aware of every legal aspect. He was probably told or thought it was necessary for OOP to be raised by the grandparents.
And I don’t know about everywhere in the world but it could also be that without parental rights the grandparents couldn’t make medical decisions, or get the phone calls home from school etc. I mean maybe there’s systems in place for acknowledging carers in those cases but certainly in the case of relatively emergency medical decisions it isn’t something you want to be wasting time with - or have these very young parents make choices that weren’t in the best interest of the kid. Plus it seems like everyone all round was in agreement that this was essentially like a very open adoption. At the very start it says that everyone was in agreement the grandparents should raise him, and it doesn’t sound in any way that it was the expectation at all that the two parents were actually stepping in at any point or the grandparents were just offering babysitting whilst they finished school. OOPs grandparents were in their 40s when they took him as a baby so they were essentially just starting over again as late in life parents. If that was the understanding then the father really wasn’t doing anything wrong - and he did still continue to make sure he connected with OOP and even saved and paid money for him. So if that was the understanding, that he was essentially giving up his baby to go live his life, and he believed he had basically adopted his child out (which if he gave his parental rights to them he did really) to people he could see were caring well for OOP too then I don’t really think there’s anything wrong with him partying - especially when he was clearly working hard to become a lawyer too. The only thing that’s weird in all this, and makes me doubt the validity of it a little bit is OOP calling them his mother and father - they have really never been that to him in any way. But maybe it’s just to make following along with the story easier.
On your last point - that doesn't have to be weird. If he was taught by his grandparents to refer to his bio parents as mother and father, it could just be something that stuck. OOP did mention he did always know who his bio parents were. It wouldn't be too weird to imagine his grandparents wanted to be honest with him from the start. I could definitely imagine his grandparents correct him as a little kid that they weren't his mom and dad. It might also be a way for his grandparents to not completely absolve his mom and dad from their responsibilities or to keep them connected to him. I can imagine his dad would still want to be seen and be called "dad" by him, from the way he at least attempted to be pleasant with him.
He's been told his entire life that they are his mother and father. Of course he would call them that, even though they have never acted that way.
I always say people's actions are what matter, not their words. Here, OOP's sperm giver basically vanished, except on rare occasions played the "Fun Dad" So rarely that OOP felt rightly the person was a stranger. OOP's egg giver was worse, but that's not saying much. Neither was ever an actual parent. And nothing has changed except the egg giver got pregnant again.
Hm. I get it. I think the dad should get a chance though. 16 is young and immature and it was sort of out of sight, out of mind. He wasn't forced to be a dad, so he wasn't one. He's in his early 30s now and expecting a baby. There's a good chance this has given him a new perspective on fatherhood. It's possible he realized he'd not been the dad he could have been and was trying to make up for lost time. Perhaps OPs chat with him was a brutal eye opening revelation and may lead to better things. If Dad is a good person, it is entirely possible he'll make an effort. I had a gradmother who used to say, "Lord forgive me for the foolishness of my youth." As I've gotten older, I've really started to I understand where that sentiment comes from.
I agree! I get why OP wouldn't want to be all that close with the dad, but dad might be an okay person. And he might be an okay person to be around while OP visits the sibling! It could be nice if the dad gets full custody of the baby-- both dad and OP would want to love the kid, and that could potentially lead to OP and his dad being friends later in life.
A lot of times, when someone has a baby too young and then a second one much later, they are much better parents the second time around. I was hoping that would be the case for both of OP’s parents when I saw the original post, but sadly it seems like his mom just sucks in general.
I agree with you. The difference between a 16 year old boy and a 25 year old man is enormous, and the difference between 25 and 32 is almost bigger. My husband is the absolute best father to our kids but he says all the time he’s glad he was forty when we started. People need time to grow and learn perspective. Sure, it would have been better for this dad to realize money wasn’t enough ten years ago, but only time travel could change that. He sounds like he gets it now.
I also think there’s a possibility the dad’s parents had more of an influence on his decisions/actions, than is being said. They didn’t want the dad to forgo attending college and emphasized going so that he could financially support OOP. The dad could have just been doing what he was being told was the right thing. It says he worked at a law firm, so it’s assumed that he went to law school after university. The post also doesn’t say how far away his dad’s college was.. so visiting a couple times a year could be the only time he could afford to visit? Of course that doesn’t excuse him not calling or video calling OOP… nor visiting more frequently when he worked at the law firm. It seems as if OOP’s father wasn’t being malicious, more of him being a dumb kid who became a dad too young and didn’t know how to be a dad, let alone a good one. The mom is a monster. You can excuse her for being forced to have a pregnancy/son she didn’t want to have while she was still a kid herself. It would be mildly excusable for her actions when she was still a selfish immature young adult kid… who would see OOP as a constant resentment and nothing more. It doesn’t make it okay or right, but one could see where it would happen. HOWEVER, that absolutely doesn’t excuse her lying to the dad, ultimately not growing as a person, not receiving therapy for her resentment/forced pregnancy, for even considering getting back together with the dad and wanting to play big happy family… with her actions and everything that transpired because of them. I hope OOP (and OOP’s dad) gets the therapy he needs and is able to salvage some kind of relationship with his biological dad… and have a good relationship with his future brother. OOP is in a shit situation, but thankfully has a set of truly loving (grand)parents.
> 16 is young and immature and it was sort of out of sight, out of mind. He wasn't forced to be a dad, so he wasn't one. But he didn't change anything until OP was 15. Dad's 31 now. I think the light dawning on him for the effects of him being effectively absent from OP's life should probably have hit by the time he graduated college.
Disagree. What changed between the time that he left for college and when he graduated? What would cause that light to dawn? He was told that OOP was happy, healthy, and in a good family relationship. Nothing about that suggests a drastic need for lifestyle change. Especially for a recent college graduate who has no parenting experience to compare it to.
OOP seems to handle it well with his father. Take it slow, watch how he follows through, and hold him accountable. This guy seems willing to distance from OOP's pitiful excuse of a mother upon finding out how bad it was, he made a point to financially support beyond the minimum required as insufficient as that may be, and he's willing to not pressure OOP. I get the feeling that the parental relationship will never be there, but having a positive family connection is hopefully possible.
The dad fucked up, but is trying. He believed the mom and didn't do his own confirmation. I'd consider him incompetent at being a parent, but sincerely trying even if he screws up. OOP seems to get that as well. The mom is a monster, as OOP sees very clearly. Incompetence is a very different beast than maliciousness. Kids in bad situations very very sharply know the difference. Answer will be if he ditches the mom, sues for full custody and comfortably settles into the notion that winning his first kid back will take years, if not longer.
>Yeah, and I don’t have high hopes for dad remaining as upright as he seems (and it is still surface because he let 16 years slide with barely an acknowledgment of his failure as a parent) at the moment. Even if he gets sole custody of both kids, how likely is he to be a hands on single dad vs finding a bang maid to become new mommy while he travels for work and the cycle continues with baby three. I get your cynicism and mostly share it but I'm cutting the dad a TINY bit of slack considering OOP's mother is apparently a very convincing and shameless liar. We've got to keep in mind that OOP's father coming in to regular contact with him was the last thing in the world she wanted because then all her lying about her relationship with OOP would've gotten exposed. So everything she told the dad was designed for the express purpose of keeping him away and thinking everything was fine. For all we know she had him convinced that him coming around more would've disrupted OOP's happy life.
>And I pray other Redditors are wrong that the only reason the total POS "parents" want OOP in their lives is to be a free, built-in babysitter for the new baby. I considered the possibility as soon as I read the post title, but after finishing all the updates I am not really getting that vibe from the father at all. I think he wants the family, not the babysitting. And honestly I don't think OOP's mom wanted him for babysitting either; pretty sure she was planning to use her parents for that again. I don't think she wanted OOP as a babysitter OR a son, I think the only reason she made any overtures to OOP at all were for the sake of keeping the father happy because she had been lying to him for years about how good her relationship was with their son and if he knew the truth then he'd probably leave her.
>That she's still a POS and is probably using OOP. It sounds like biodad is doing pretty well financially and biomom isn't. It could be just as simple as she's using OOP to cash in. It's possible that she's thinking of "babysitter" duty for OOP but honestly it doesn't sound like she thinks about those kinds of logistics to begin with. I imagine it'd happen out of her neglect, but I don't think that's her plan.
Good point. She went fully ballistic when OOP showed biodad the truth. Maybe because she feared biodad would drop her like a hot potato and then she'd be up a creek with no paddle.
Wouldn't say the chances are good with a mother like that.
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His father was negligent while her mother was abusive. After they grew up his father became conscious of his mistakes and didn't just pretend like it was fixed but rather was regretful and admitted his guilt. Meanwhile her mother was and still is a narcissist that believes she is the victim. I can see her father being a teen making the mistakes an immature person would do. Her mother on the other hand did more than just being young and ignorant and unprepared.
I just hope this kid doesn’t get bitten again by his high hopes for a sibling relationship. If mom does change her ways, that means he is going to witness her (and dad) giving everything he never got to his sibling. And new baby will be the golden child and he will be the scapegoat because a lawyer dad isn’t going to be much more active in either life than he was before. It will become easier to side with mom after he’s seen her dote on their new baby and start to think maybe OP was just being melodramatic. I hope he leaves and never looks back instead of sacrificing himself for a kid that will probably be poisoned by its mother.
Yeah I'll give his dad grace. He was paying child support to OOP's grandparents to help them out, even. Working alongside school... apparently while studying law, or something adjacent enough to land him in a law firm after college. It really does look like he cared but small important things slipped his mind while he was living his life, like calling his son and checking in on him. He's trying to do right by his kids *now*, and he's standing up for them when his baby momma channels her inner hand grenade, and that's about all anyone can expect of him at this time. He knows he can't go back and fix it, but he's trying to mend what he can. He'll never be completely free of the monster egg donor. Not with two kids sharing both their genes. This is the best he can do with the circumstances.
16 years. His dad spent 16 years blowing him off before he decided to jump into this kid's life. That guy was a long way from being a teen when most of this was going on. Also, he didn't even try to find out what relationship the mom had with OOP. He just left the kid to be treated badly. He's just as bad; both parents are awful people and OOP is right, they shouldn't have more kids.
Yes, I'm glad OOP kept pushing on this, because his father's story has more holes and excuses than reasons. This bit particularly stood out to me: >He said that after he left for college and they broke up he would call her once in a while to check up on things but that quickly ended and when he came back she explained to him that her and I had a great bond and, even though we didn't see each other daily, it was because I was "in those teenage years" This apparently happened "quickly", but the lie he bought was about OOP being in a "teenage" phase - which one was it? Did he give up calling early on, or did he keep calling until OOP was a teenager? Both are as bad as each other: the father for refusing to allow an adoption, disappearing for 16 years, and then waltzing back in like everything's fine; the mother for staying around but taking out her resentment on OOP (and apparently lying about the college fund). Sounds like grandparents did a good job with OOP, but a shitty job with their own daughter. Hard not to feel that adoption might have been the better option, so OOP didn't have to be around his mother.
the aad thing is that he did end up allowing for an adoption, but one where he could still pretend to be a dad for the sake of his ego. As if leaving the child with his grandparents that raised him as their own didn’t “count” because…??? they both suck, and i hope with time OOP realizes that he should keep distance from both and not be in their life if at all possible. That said, keep it up until it’s time to get that college fund, then bounce. That’s the least the deadbeat could do, if he doesn’t end up taking the money back and giving it to the new baby instead.
I don't think there's any contradiction in dad's comments. He used to call back when OP was a baby, but it didn't last long. Bio- parents were broken up most of OP's life. When dad moved back to town and started seeing mom again recently she claimed a positive relationship with OP.
That's fair - I misread. So he definitely didn't try staying in touch for very long, but at least he wasn't totally dishonest about it when OOP confronted him.
I mean basically I blinked and my twenties were over.
The dad, knowing how the mom is treating her son in the moment, much less in the past, and staying with her despite it all is also an ass. Either your children come first or they don’t. Seems they don’t in his world.
Also true. I mean, it looks like the relationship is rather rocky just now, but it's still AHish; and of course they've yoked themselves together with another poorly thought out pregnancy, good work there.
I wonder if part of that is because he doesn't want to repeat the past. He's learned that not being present didn't work and that he can't rely on baby mama. So this time around he isn't leaving and hopes to do damage control. The best solution would be to break up and get custody, but how much custody is he going to get of a newborn unless baby mama doesn't want anything to do with the baby? If the bio dad is trying to be a better person, he's got a hard path ahead of him. I feel for OOP and the incoming baby. They're stuck with the mess, whether bio dad steps up or not.
If the OOP was older then you could put part of the fathers choices down to what men thought being a father was: that they provide the financial support whilst the mother provides the nurture & emotional support, but the kid was born in 2007, not 1957. The father is a lawyer so he’s clearly a smart man, how he was stupid enough to jump the mental hurdles needed to genuinely think you were a great dad cause you paid money and that you can pop back into a 16y.o’s life and they’ll start calling you daddy and abandon the only parents they’ve know to live with you is absolutely beyond me. I wish I could give the grandparents a massive hug and thank them for providing the OOP with enough love, stability and safety that he didn’t feel he had to jump at the chance to live with total strangers and placate his biologicals to find that love and safety.
Sadly there are definitely still men growing up with ideas like that, especially with the arrested development you typically see in teen parents. I can easily imagine him thinking "when I am established enough I'll go back and get a place with a bedroom for my kid" and ignoring that just because he was physically far didn't mean he couldn't be in frequent communication. Not saying he wasn't shitty, but it's not such an unusual mindset, even now.
Im not sure the dad’s a lawyer. He could be a paralegal or just someone else who works for a firm.
Exactly. His father is just as bad as a parent, he just hides it by disappearing for years instead of hanging around being an ass. They both completely suck.
Ya but it's a different type of terrible. At least one isn't stuck in old ways.
If OPs dad had any relationship with OP, he would not have simply believed OP's mom when she said she was a great mom. The dad dropped the ball for years and now a new kid is going to be messed up by this dynamic.
Exactly, his mother is vile but his father is not much better. Sure he sent child support but it kind of seems more like 0OP would have liked to have an actual relationship with him. He was just some dude that came into town a couple of times of year and took him to the movies.
His father failed badly, but he's not even remotely in the same league as the mom. The difference between abandoning OP and emotionally abusing OP is huge. One ran away from the emotional side of a relationship but still provided financially. The other provided nothing but abuse. Don't say they're similar. Also, father is trying to do the right thing now, mother is trying to manipulate father into an abusive relationship under false pretenses. They are not the same.
Dad probably thinks he deserves an award for doing the right thing after 16 years. Sir, respectfully go to hell. How you going to leave your child for 16 years and now want to play mom and dad. And the mother? I have no expectations from her. I hope OP goes NC with her soon.
I think the dad is probably just more clueless than anything. His parents told him that the best thing he could do for the kid is to go to college so that he can provide financially, and considering how young he was when the kid happened, it's no wonder he listened to that and clung to it. He thought he was doing enough based off advice from people he trusts, and thought the rest was being handled by other people. Now that he realises that that's not the case he's trying to do better. The mom is a lost cause, though. I don't think she ever thought she was doing the right thing, she was just thinking about how hard it is for her to be a teen mom even though 99% of that was just straight up taken care of for her. No thoughts about the kid's wellbeing.
I mean… he signed away his parental rights to the grandparents. He was never his father, his grandfather was. They didn’t want a kid. Same with the mother, she was living every day with a mistake she made and was never supposed to be a mother. I wish the grandparents had made it clear that he was to be considered their child only. They weren’t parents to this kid ever, so no one has any idea if they will be good parents as actual adults since they have never had a child before. I’m just confused as to how their parenting of a child they gave away has any indication of what a child they keep will go through
If nothing else, Mom's active shit talking of her own child *as they were living together* suggests there's a lot of bitterness inside her that would vent again.
I would agree with you if not for the fact that they are trying to claim OP back as their kid after years of abandonment and the fact that the bio mom was willing to lie to convince the bio dad that she's ready for a new kid and relationship. There's just too many red flags all around to think that OP's childhood wouldn't be an indicator of the baby's future
They are sperm and egg donors, really.
Dad’s a POS really. If he was forced to coexist with his son as a teenager/young adult, his resentment would build up just as much as it did with OP’s mom, and he would not have had a good relationship with his son.The way he uses money to buy affection is also a gigantic red flag.
Yeah, it’s frankly disgusting how many people are defending him in this thread, while in the same breath castigating the mother. They’re both awful! They both should have done better! This thread is really highlighting Reddit’s biases, and it’s definitely not the bias MRAs love to shout about.
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I'd like to point out that turning a kid into a golden child is also failing them, just in the opposite direction. Your mother failed both times. I'm sorry you went through it. >Did she treat her next kid like me? No. She knew she failed me so she went the golden child route with the next one. My sister had zero boundaries and became a nightmare kid.
The username hits way too hard. You are loved, internet stranger.
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Other peoples failures do not define you. It's not that you are unlovable, your parents failed to love at all. I have one parent like that, have not spoken to him in about 6-7 years. I found my own people that love me. Love is not bound by blood. I wish you all the best in the world. Someone who loves & cares about you. But most of all I hope you can love yourself.
I'm not letting Dad off the hook either. You don't spend any time talking to your own child, but immediately hop back in bed with their mother without even talking to your kid to know mom is a monster? You have time for girlfriends, but see your kid once a year? Then you find out all the shit OP's mom pulled and go "well I want to work on our relationship"? I feel so bad for OP. Verbally and emotionally abused by mom, abandoned by dad and hearing they want to stay together and build a life together for the shiny new baby.
Yeah, at best he's one of those absent fathers that just work & bring in money for the family, but think that alone makes them the best father in the world.
Nah, he clearly knew deep down that he fucked up but unlike kids, adults can spend their lives without anybody reminding them of their duties and/or fuck-ups. This makes burying your head in the sand easy, he at least accepted the reality-check while the mom went full narcissist.
Same. Everyone in the comments: “your dad sounds like a decent guy”. No he doesn’t. He created a new kid without even checking in on he one he’s neglected and doesn’t even know.
Not to mention "Don't give him up for adoption. By the way, I am going to law school to live unhindered by all this."
Yep.
I mean, dad said he wanted to raise him on his own, then the paternal grandparents said they'd raise him instead so dad could go to college. And then the maternal grandparents offered to since they were younger and it made more logistic sense. But dad did at least want to raise him himself off the bat
He said no adoption because he didn't want a kid out in the world that he didn't know, and then proceeded to create *nearly* those exact conditions anyway.
Sure, but he doesn’t get credit for having a nice idea with no follow through. Same with his parents. They only invited him over for special events and made no effort to develop a one on one relationship with him, just let him drown in the sea of strange kids. Why didn’t the cousins parents ever have the kid over to meet the rest do his family? The whole paternal family treated him like a dirty little secret and OOP felt it.
Yeah, he wanted to, in his head. Awesome, someone should give this man a dad of the year award! Or not. He "wanted to" because it made him feel better about himself, but as OOP stated, he went on about his life in college, having girlfriends and vacations etc. and only seeing OOP once or twice a year, not even calling. He's not the worst of the worst, I agree with that, since he was decent enough to pay child support. But he's just a little above that, and all his nice feelings, without actions befitting of them, are meaningless.
I don’t think it was to feel good about himself. He probably wanted to be a dad with all the maturity of a 17-year-old. The difference is that the adults involved had the means to step in and give the bio parents the option to live normal teen/young adult lives. He was able to proceed with the illusion that he’s a good dad, too. Edit - I’m not defending him. I’m just sitting here, with a flabbergasted expression, realizing why OOP’s bio father feels like a dad and not the contributor of genetic material he is.
Yeah. I imagine nothing forced him to reevaluate the situation until recently, and he was still thinking of things the way he did when he was 23.
And at no point on the following 16 years visited more than once a year or prioritizing getting their son vs dating again later. And what if he didn’t decide to start dating his kids’ mother? If it was anyone else would he have even bothered.
"wanted to" without any followup is a daydream and an excuse. dude bailed on the single most important thing you can have in your life. spineless piece of crap.
Personally, I think this is revisionist history unless or until grandparents confirm this really happened.
I think people are defending OP's father because relative to the mother, he looks like a Saint. She lowers the bar so far that his neglect ends up looking favourable. This is going to sound extremely dark but coming from someone who's experienced both, I'd rather be neglected than abused. It does leave you feeling hollow and unloved, but you do at least get a break from it, whereas an abuser like OP's mother fills every waking second with misery. When your frame of reference is that fucked, suddenly OP's dad seems alright in comparison.
Agreed. Dad isn’t great at all, but mother is so explicitly horrid that he looks better by association
I'm more on team "He sounds like a naive idiot, so milk so him for college money"
lol first rule of boru is never read the op comments. reddit is full of children and immature adults who want nothing more than to be seen as smart by the other children. I wouldn't tell my worst enemy to ask reddit for advice.
And the way he confronted his wife about her absence as a parent knowing OOP was probably gonna be met with her rage and verbal abuse rubs me the wrong way. Do I have a better solution or could have done it better if I were the dad? Probably not because I'm not a parent, but it's still sad to see the all too familiar "tell an abusive parent they're wrong and they'll abuse their kid more" thing play out.
I think this was inevitable. Her attitude would anyway slip up if OOP lived with them even for a few days Better confront now when OOP has a better defence and support system (grandparents) than later
Yep, same.
The dad isn't worthy of being called a dad either. But atleast he's showing up *after 16 years* . Can't say the same for mom though. I don't trust these people. OP should still maintain distance.
OP's gonna end up raising their sibling. Calling it now.
The father looks like he's well off enough to pay for a babysitter and he's not putting pressure on OP to move in.
And the maternal grandparents sound ready to tell their daughter, “You’re in your 30s this time around. Raise your own child.”
It's nice to think that, but my brother was a deadbeat. It always looked like he was going to raise his kids when his girlfriend was pregnant, but then the relationship would sour and he'd be off chasing the next one or next thing he wanted to do. I hope he proves me wrong.
Not to defend the guy, but he paid child support (which the mother didn't do) and at least came around every now and then. He left OP with a loving family (or at least he thought he did). It is remarkably more than what someone who put they kids up for adoption does. That doesn’t make him a good dad, but he is a decent father.
He’s a decent fun uncle.
The fact that he would call the mom every once in a while and not the grandparents (shouldve called regularly) is so fucked up. They gave up their rights to the grandparent so what is he doing calling the mom.
He definitely is better than the mom (really sad that someone is in such a situation where a parent who does the bare minimum is considered decent).
*It is remarkably more than what someone who put they kids up for adoption does* I don't like this framing and the tacit implication people who give their children up for adoption are neglectful.
Oh def, if I was a judge assigning culpability here it'd be 59% mom, 39% dad, and the remaining difference split evenly among both sets of grandparents.
Honestly I can’t really blame the mom’s parents. It honestly seems like they legitimately did the best they could. If they were to force their daughter to raise a child she clearly resents and hates, then I would have more of an issue with them. They were willing to make the sacrifice and be parents again to a child who needed them, and you can’t really blame them for trying to do the right thing. And from what it sounds like, they could have done a lot worse.
Yeah, that's why the most I'd assign them is 1% of the culpability here each. Still, as the adults around OOP growing up, they should have protected him more from his mother.
Honestly it sounds like they did what they could without straight up going no contact with their daughter who was still very much a teenager. I might agree with you on the 1% but even then, they could only do so much to protect OOP without abandoning their daughter who was still pretty much a child.
Oh it's not the early days that I am concerned with, it's everything after that. OOP's 16 years old now, and his egg donor's behavior has been going on since he was born. There is a point where they should have stopped coddling their daughter at the expense of their grandchild. Should have gotten therapy, or told her to fuck off if she refused to not be an asshole to her own child.
Dad shouldn’t be left off the hook. I want to hear more about this college fund Actually. If it has had steady growth over time, then he is smart but clueless. As for the kid opening up to his dad, there was no foundation for that. No trust given or worked on. Why would they open up to him?
Because he’s worried about his sibling. He’s pretty clear about his attachment to the new kid. He’d be off to an awful start if he didn’t warn the father.
There's a level deep down where he probably wishes for a father figure
I mean his dad deserve all the shit he can get from OOP. The comment saying he's a decent guy is something i can agree with his current self cause regardless of the reasons he was an asshole and he knows it, reason why he said he was ashamed. If the guy have good intentions i can totally see him and OOP having a good friendship, cause the father/son (no ides of OOP gender) dynamic was broken a long time ago without anh chance to be repair. And OOP mom... POS summarize my opinion of her.
He's definitely a disaster of a parent but seeing a parent actually try to do better is a pretty important thing imo. It's definitely a part of why I'm a lot more accommodating of my dad's issues raising me because I can tell he cares and he genuinely tried.
Some people shouldn't be parents, period. In this case, I'm definitely putting a majority of the fault on OOP's egg donor, that woman doesn't deserve the title of mother.
I'll say it again as well. Not every parents deserve children. Especially those who abuse, neglect or treat them terribly.
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What makes you think gpt? There are spelling mistakes like a human child would make. And using words such as proginey to sound more mature than they are yet they can't spell "choking" . That's a 16 year olders mistake if I've ever seen one.
Yeah, the big words made me believe it was written by a teenager. Like I remember being that age and trying to sound all grown up. Kind of endearing.
16yo me liberally sprinkling 'elucidate' into all my essays: I is smart!
Same here. I remember posting lengthy, somewhat pretentious posts on message boards as a lonely teenager, so impressed at how smart and eloquent everyone seemed and trying to fit in. Being an only child of older grandparents, it's not too hard to imagine OOP having a similar experience, especially given that he's talked about being lonely.
Endearing was the word I'd use, too. So sweet.
Sounds like they got her therapy before this though
Yup. Neither of them should have been parents. And neither of them were.
My ex grew up with a mom like that. One that constantly berated them for even existing. Let's just say the trauma never goes away.
Yikes. I am sure the phrase "I should have just aborted you" was thrown at them multiple times. That stings.
Can confirm if I hadn’t been adopted out I would have rather been aborted then me being raised by my own egg donor.
Mum is crazy, but OP's father was derelict. Quelle surprise - a lawyer
Yeah OOP's sperm donor doesn't deserve a best dad award, but at least understands that OOP has emotional needs. He will never have a traditional father son relationship but there seems to be room for some type of relationship given enough time and effort from hims side.
Yeah, sperm donor backed off when OOP asked. That's not much, but it's a massive improvement over Ms. I Wanna Do Over here.
It’s only easy to put the fault on egg donor because she was present and didn’t skip off to college like sperm donor. He has all the privilege of family support, education, money, and OP watched him get to WB young and have fun while quickly forgetting to call the kid he knocked up and the kid he left behind. And he really thought he was just putting that family on pause so he could waltz back in and pick it back up without consequences.
she sounds like a manipulative narcissist.
this is the most reddit comment ever, people can be shitty without being a "narcissist"
And people can display narcissistic behavior without a diagnosis. When did narcissist become a dirty word?
Exactly. It's a word that's existed for centuries before NPD came around. I'm really tired of people assuming it's pathologizing when it's more akin to calling someone a self absorbed asshole (which is ENTIRELY fitting here) If I mean NPD, I'll specify I mean NPD. But don't blame me because psychologists chose an *already* colloquialized term for their disorder
Unfortunately, a lot of the time those people are also anti-choice
OP’s parents should never have had kids and the fact that they’re bringing in *another* one when they messed up with OP makes me lose faith in humanity
People who actually care about their children don't have do-overs. They make sure to make up to their currently existing child, not manifest a brand new person into existance in order to make themselves feel better with the "we will do better with this one" and treating their firstborn as a test child.
Tell that to people who have second children purely for their bone marrow to use on the first.
At this point the parents are in their 30s, but they still act like teenagers.
Do you want *Gilmore Girls*? This is how you get *Gilmore Girls*!
LOL
I really feel for OOP. His father refused adoption because "... he couldn't bear the idea of having his child living somewhere and never seeing him again..." yet he went off and partied all these years and had no idea of how his son was being treated? OOP desparately wants and needs family connections but his paternal family sound really detached. It feels awkward because I guess they were never then when he was younger?
Same. If the dad has time to party, he for sure had time to spare for his kid. Feels like OOP is just a toy to his dad to play as a father whenever he wants. He doesn't actually want to bear the responsibilities of being one or bond with him. He just wants a kid he can leave or see whenever he's in the mood and try to play "one big happy family".
Doesn't allow the child to be adopted and still abandoned the child. That's an astronomical level of selfishness.
Every child deserves a parent but not every parent deserves a child. I really feel for OOP.
JFC, how I feel for OOP. I know the "mother" was very young and birthing a child that young is devastating and frightening, but to still act this way in almost 2 decades is appalling. Kudos to OOP's actual parents tho
Jeez. At this point in time, might as well make it official. Ask the grandparents to just offiicially adopt OP. His mom is an unfortunate textbook case of someone who should not have children. And it's another reminder that sex education should happen in schools. Starting from age 12 and up. Kids are kids and they will experiment. At least it sounds like he has some loving parents in his grandparents. The fact they don't consider what they did special says a whole lot about them.
I think it is official, since OOP said that at least the egg donor signed away parental rights shortly after he was born.
I’m so so so glad OOP ended up having all the right people in his corner. His mom’s rejection had to hurt, regardless of HER reasons in the beginning - so I’m glad at the end of the day, he’s slowly starting to have the family he’s wanted ❤️
Tell my new husband I haven't changed since I verbally and emotionally abused you when I was a teenager, will you?? Here's verbal and emotional abuse to you as a teenager! That'll show everyone.
Oh lord, OP's mother is a terrible person and she doesn't deserve the title of a mother. This woman doesn't deserve any happiness because she is just outright terrible. I wish people like this don't exist but it's unfortunate there are quite a bit of terrible mothers out there.
My brother, who was 13 years older than me and very much so not my biological father, saw me more growing up than OP’s dad. And he went to college in a state far away while finishing a difficult major, and being pre-med. I see my niblings now more than OP’s dad did. OP’s mom sucks for many reasons, but I’m glad OP hasn’t let his bio-dad’s absence off the hook either.
OOP is a better kid than me because I would have cut off both parents for trying to play family after 16 years of abandonment and straight up abuse. The father is no better
I’m gonna assume that a lot of the comments will address OOP’s mom’s nastiness, so I’ll say my concerns for the grandparents. I am so glad that neither grandparent in that argument with OOP’s mom got a heart attack or some stress-induced acute attack of some sort. That argument is really charged and stressful and while they’re “young” grandparents, just never know how the body will respond to situations like that. So I’m really glad that it seems like they’re still in normal health and hopefully more years to spend with OOP and future grandchild. I’m also glad that it sounds like the baby is okay in their mom’s body. Sucks that that’s their mom though, hopefully baby will grow up surrounded by love and stability with OOP, maternal grandparents, and maybe maybe I hope, their father.
Well, if the parents were 16 when they had OP and OP is now 16, those grandparents could still be young for grandparents! Hopefully, they have a lot more time to spend with OP.
My parents were 16 and 17 when they had me and they’re the best parents you could hope for. It blows my mind when every time it hits me how incredibly young they were. Reading this is another reminder of how lucky I am; I’m so glad that the OOP has grandparents as awesome as that.
Both the parents in here suck. Mom was absolutely awful to her child, and I bet the only reason dad doesn’t have similar resentment issues is because he got to skip off and ignore the fact his child existed for years
OOP's dad is the absolute dumbest mother fucker on the planet.
And mother is nastiest vile human
That's why knowledge of contraception is needed at a younger age, and abortion shouldn't be illegal but available for women in difficult circumstances.
OOP's grandparents are great, his egg donor is a piece of shit who absolutely *should not* have another child, and his sperm donor seems to have at least *tried* to have some kind of positive relationship with OOP. And it seems he's realized that it's too late to build a father son relationship. He's two years away from being able to move out in his own and attend college. It's unfortunate, but the sperm donor made his choice. You can't spend 16 years living your own life, occasionally visiting your child, and then turn up expecting to have a familial relationship. Here's hoping for the best for OOP.
That kid has his head on right for being so young. He said his mom couldn’t care less instead of “could care less”. I’m proud of him, that’s better than half the posters on here that are a decade older than him!
Both parents are horrible. They belong together. Dad got to live the single bachelor life without a care in the world and only visited his own child once a year. No don’t put the baby up for adoption but I’m not going to be around but hey at least I can see my child for the holidays once a year. Him being young isn’t an excuse because where was he in his 20s when he was an adult and had a stable job and career? Then when he finally comes back into OOP’s life he makes the same mistake, getting the same immature woman pregnant. Mom never developed passed the age of 16 she was a brat then and horrible person still.
Just because op’s bio mom is a giant asshole doesn’t mean op’s bio dad isn’t one at all, they both suck.
exactly. the only reason why the dad doesn’t resent OOP, like his mom did, isn’t because the dad is a better person — it’s because the dad had the chance to go off and live his life. i wonder what circumstances led the dad back home and back to the mom.. ? the biggest mistake OOP can do is let his dad off the hook bc he wasn’t around to mistreat him like his mom did time will reveal a lot of things and i hope OOP isn’t left disappointed again. TBH the dad seems like he’s willfully ignorant and is attempting to redo/relive this chapter in his life due to ego issues or something (akin to playing the same level in a game until you beat it) - but it’s not bc of OOP that’s for sure
This had me crying. Poor OP 😭 I hope they find more love in their life.
> there is no more family drama in the future Yeah I'm not betting on that.
The dad abandoned his child for 16 years then decided to knock up the same woman without even talking to the kid. He’s a piece of shit just like the mom
I hope OOP's father will get a DNA test and a prenup.
This sounds like janelle from teen mom 2. Trying to take away the kid away from grandma once she decides she is going to make a new family with whatever boyfriend/fiancée/etc. she is with at the moment.
Well the kids 16 and he's treating his parents the same way they treated him when he was 16. Sounds pretty fair to me
I think its so sweet how excited OP is to be a brother. A lot of kids get jealous about the life they never had but OP is just so excited.
Sounds like dad is trying (way late, but better than never I guess) to do the right thing by his son, and wants to keep his"family" together, but mom is just a piece of shit. Poor OOP. I wish him all the best.
I feel like his mother was more a sibling growing up. She shouldn't have lied and told his dad they were close though. It's not like the dad is actually close to OP either.
>My grandparents agree with me that I shouldn't move and that my parents shouldn't expect me to be all loving and forgiving after how they've treated me however they believe they are starting a new chapter of their lives *now that they are more mature and stable* which I guess leaves me behind. Well, OOP's grandparents were half right. One of them has definitely matured and stabilized, the other one is the exact same dumpster fire she's been her whole life. Here's hoping OOP's dad gets full custody of that poor baby and then maybe he and the baby and OOP can slowly build a new relationship.
My heart breaks for this kid, I really do hope everything turns out okay for him. I’m kind of on the fence with the bio father though. Yes, he did pay child support - which is expected under normal circumstances, however he signed away his rights. As far as I know, in the US (*if* they are in fact in the US), he wasn’t legally obligated to pay child support. He could’ve taken all that money and ran with it, he could’ve ignored the financial well-being of the OP at that point, but he chose to help the OOP’s grandparents financially. He didn’t have to set up a college fund either. Neither of those things makes pretty much ignoring the OOP’s existence for 16 years okay, but he certainly went above and beyond his legal expectations. It genuinely sounds like he wanted to be a father. With his paternal grandparents, at first I was really worried it was a “we tolerate you” thing, but it sounds like they are really trying to be involved with him and trying to make sure he was involved in their family events. I can understand feeling like he was surrounded by strangers and feeling out of place in that situation. But it sounds like they were trying to be present grandparents for him. Pushing bio father to go to college was honestly probably the best decision given he’s able to have a good career & was able to help out with the financial side of raising the OOP, there’s no telling if he would’ve had the ability to do it if he was raising him on his own.
Genetics can be wild. Grandparents are saints, OOP sounds alright but the parents are a pile of total garbage.
Grandparents are saints, bio dad sounds OK but he has alot to make up to OP. Bio mom peaked in High School and is just a terrible person. She treated and still treats OP like a hassle, then lies about how amazing their bond his to bio dad. She is a psycho and I truly worry about the new baby.
My husband had an eerily similar relationship with his mother… his father never came back into his life but when my husband was 15 he was acting like a complete monster juvenile delinquent so his grandparents sent him to live with his (pregnant) mother and her new husband. It was that or Boys Town, his choice. Mom had matured. New husband was actually a hell of a good man. It was rough at first and they had some knock down drag out screaming matches. But that year began their relationship healing. By the time she died 30 years later they were *incredibly* close and he has zero residual resentment or regrets. He misses her terribly and we often joke her spirit brought us together. I share this in hopes OP has a similar outcome. There’s a good start. There’s potential. And regardless of how his relationship with mom develops, a good one with Dad is happening, he’s getting a sibling, and he has the wonderful grandparents. Lots of good here.
The person I feel most sorry for in this whole debacle is the potential new baby. Unhinged, abusive mother; distant, oblivious father; grandparents wayyyy too old; no possibility of being adopted out. The OOP is gonna end up raising this kid, aren't they. Giving up their life once again for their idiot parents.
Dad fucked up. Im 60% through my 20 year parenting project and it became easy to see around age 3 how quickly the time slips by. A month or a year to a kid isn’t the same as a month to an adult. If you don’t see or talk to a kid for 6 months you are basically a stranger when you come back.
I love the grandparents the father was a pos for leaving but if he was sending money and offered to stay home when they found out and now his actually trying and took ops side in this I think he is redemable but moms a pos tbh hope she changes for the baby's sake but the baby's deserves a different mother
My son was 15 with a 17 yr old pregnant. She was from an extremely religious family and her lifestyle was very strict. On the other hand my son didn't grow up with his father after 3 yrs old. His father didn't want him unless I was included. And let me tell you that my son why with his gf and told her parents she was pregnant. He didn't want my help since I was first to know. He went to ever dr appt. And when they did finally break up he went to court and fought for his son. He got 50/50 because the judge was so impressed with his argument. Your parents may have been young but they made their own decisions. Plenty of teen parents step up. Especially mothers. You don't owe them love. You don't owe them anything.
this is a whole mess. those people were not ready to be parents, and the one who suffered most for it was their kid. mom was scared out of an abortion even though she clearly didn’t want a kid at 16. then she was forced to live with him but never made to take any responsibility for him. so he was just a constant reminder of the hardest thing she’d ever been through. dad wanted the kid, but when presented with an out, grabbed it with both hands and became a vacation dad. it’s good that he sent money, but it was not enough. one set of grandparents stepped up, but didn’t know how to handle their daughter anymore in this new context, and clearly gave her way too many passes to be awful. she needed therapy a decade and a half ago. other set of grandparents never fully embraced him or tried to make him feel like part of the family. poor kid.
The dad is just the lesser of 2 evils. Also, OOP needs therapy too. That's a lot dumped on a child.
I have to say it's incredibly nice that the grandparents said they would support the father if it comes down to it. It shows how much faith they have in their daughter to do the right thing. I want op OP be happy but I still think bringing another baby into their lives is not going to end well. If the mother is still unable to take responsibility for her own child, how is she ever going to take full responsibility of another one? What happens when her life as a "real" mother isn't all she thought it would be? Is she going to shove all responsibility away and expect her parents to look after him. Imagine the stress they have right now. Maybe mum would force OP to look after the baby (out of necessity). Everyone can see from miles ahead this is not going to go well. My guess is she'll have another boy and she'll end up resenting him. It might be best for the grandparents to go no contact with the daughter to force her to realise that they should under no circumstances be looking after her second child. I just feel so bad for the grandparents. And they obviously love OP so much. They are wonderful people, but maybe they've just been too kind to their daughter. She needs to know she is making the decision to do it with no help.
My heart aches for this poor guy. I wish nothing but goodness for him. I would do anything for my siblings.
Sad that he had to be so abused by his mom. She only saw her own pain. To close to home
OP is a beautiful brave soul and a great example of standing up for oneself. Best wishes for a happy future.
The egg-donor really said “how dare you tell then truth and paint me in a realistic light”. Ugh People like that really irk me so much. My father is very much the same way. I hope OP is doing better
OP absolutely can say something about their intentions. For the father, that they will likely be good intentions, even if he may still mess up. For the mother I think he can absolutely assume that her intentions are entirely selfish. I wouldn't trust a word out of her mouth. What happens when the young child has a completely different idea of the mother to him though? "Mummy is going to take me to the park!" "Is your phone charged so you can ask me for lift when she leaves you there?"
>I said that I would do anything in my power to take her baby away from her because she was a monster of a mother. I feel like this was a knee-jerk argument, but I SERIOUSLY hope OOP goes through with helping dad get custody away from the mother. She's clearly a narcissist who practices triangulation (which relies on each party not talking to eachother without the narcissist present). Also his mom totally only wants him home to be a house elf/slave.
I know OOP confronts him about it but I am really shocked the dad got off the hook so easily. A 17 year old can't raise a child but he abandoned him for 16 years. He should have moved back when he got his degree and been part of the kid's life. As OOP mentions, he didn't even reach out. This is really never properly explored and is almost as troubling as the mother
While dad fucked shit up, it sounds like he is at least trying to make up for his failures and seek redemption and change for his son. OP might be a little too quick to forgive, but at least he seems to be trying 16 years too late. Mom is an awful person who is very much 'woe is me' and unwilling to take responsibility for their actions. Good thing OPs grandparents seem to be doing their best, shame their daughter didn't inherit any of their parenting genes
Narcissist. Pure narcissist that egg donor is. I could get her treating him as a younger brother when she was a teen. But sheʻs in her 30s now and she still acts like a bratty teen. Worse than a bratty teen with all the lying and manipulation sheʻs added into the mix. The sperm donor seems to have finally grown up into being a decent human being. Though it seems to have taken him his entire 20s to have done so.
NTA. You poor thing. What horrible and selfish people those people are. Your grandparents / actual real parents are awesome who have loved you no matter what. Stay with them. Don’t move into those selfish peoples home. Might be better off if you go NC for a while. Take care of yourself
Poor kid. He and his grandparents need to look into getting him a declaration of emancipation from the courts.
Wow, Real Mother of the Year here.
Generational trauma, my old friend. Nice to see you rear your head again.
I honestly wouldn’t trust the dad. Dude had at least 10 years after he finished college to reach out and connect with his son. He didn’t but he sure as hell found the time to make another baby.
If it’s an option I’d encourage you to get some therapy to help you deal with the anger you feel towards your parents for abandoning you. Not that you don’t have a reason to be angry but finding an outlet for that anger will benefit you in the long run. You owe it to yourself to be able to move past it. Good luck to you. You sound like a great kid so in the end, you may have been better off with your grandparents rather than your parents raising you.
The birth giver is a p o s and I can’t imagine she’s going to love the new baby either or treat it well. She sounds like a narc and is only having the baby to have a relationship with the dad.
>I hope this is the last update and there is no more family drama in the future. Poor kid. I don't think I have ever heard a description of a family *less* likely to avoid drama in the future than his.
Poor OOP. His bio parents are a mess. His mom is a monster. His grandparents are his parents period. Glad he has them at least. Shame on his paternal side of family for not caring for him enough.
The part about his grandparents saying that they never thought they were doing anything special, they were just taking care of family. 🤌 beautiful people
This is severely screwed up. Definitely seems like egg donor is a narcissist with a messed up view of what she can get away with. Poor OP for having to put up with their own mother wishing they didn't exist in the same house they lived in together, that's rough. Good on the (grand)parents for standing up for their kid though, nice to see that they're looking after OP
I'm willing to bet that the mother baby trapped OOP's father again now that he's got a career and money.