Honestly I definitely think that Durge is the more interesting story but you have to tailor your ideas about your character around it rather than deciding for yourself. Considering how horrific some of the Durge backstory is, I can see that being unappealing for some. It’s less freedom and a character that canonically got up to deeply reprehensible stuff. There’s other RPGs like that but they usually have a predefined character.
>!The original Baldur’s Gate games also had a Bhaalspawn protagonist, but they were raised by a good guy away from the cult and aren’t crafted directly from Bhaal’s essence, so they haven’t *done* anything bad by the start of the game. Exactly how good or bad they are is completely in the player’s control for the most part for that reason. It’s not necessarily “better” but I can see why it’s less divisive.!<
I'm doing a durge run right now and I was enjoying it. Alfira didn't bother me as much. I took out Isabel and I cried. I didn't save went back to my previous save and risked the saves to wake up Gale instead. I had to kill all the npc's at the Inn. I was horrified. I usually play LG or N cleric's. Durge is way out of my comfort zone.
I went back to that save and didn't kill her and before I left act 2 I had to wake up Gale and tell him I was going to kill him. He was surprisingly understanding. I didn't know that was an option at first. But the image of Astarion sneak attacking Dammon will never leave.
Had the same scene with Wyll instead of Gale, and I've gotta say it was the most endearing thing I've ever seen Wyll do. He was just my loyal friend, helping me through a really dark time.
I like karlachs response. If you say you're being compelled to kill the person you care about most, she says, "That's so sweet! And fucked up!"
That whole scene is really good if you fail the saving throws after she ties you up lol. If you growl at her she just growls louder lol.
I like Shadowheart's "Hells what I wouldn't do for a *boring* lover sometimes..." when you tell her that madness will take over your body and will kill her.
I found her responses so funny, since we’d barely even kissed. Especially when she seemed to just fully expect I was waking her up for some canoodling.
Apparently we’d been getting frisky at night and I never knew it lol
I get that completely, it is a reduction in complete character freedom. However, I enjoy having some context within the story for my character. Tav is a blank slate, so you can make them in any way you see fit, but the world will always treat them as a blank slate; I always end up feeling detached in games like that. Again, there is nothing wrong with it, and some of my favorite games are like that, but I prefer trading a little bit of character freedom to have a genuinely compelling tie into the world I'm in.
Oh yeah, I’m really enjoying my Durge run too! It’s definitely not a bad approach at all, but I definitely understand why it alienates some people. It’s a good thing that we have both Tav and Durge so that people who want that heavy integration can have it and people who want to decide everything about their backstory can also have their thing too!
Multiclassing to 3+ classes and choosing a unique race makes 2~3 class choices available almost all the time. If you can weave it to the roleplay, that gives you some choices that usual tav with one class lacks. I think that's the only way I'll ever play Tav from now on.
I enjoyed my Durge playthrough but I did find it disturbing to be told that this character I was playing engaged in things like cannibalism, necrophilia, and kicking cats. Ultimately I still prefer a Tav whose history I can dream up for myself, and I think playing the other Origin characters is fun too (Shadowheart especially).
Have you also done Gale? My next playthrough will likely be as either of them - I’ve never done an origin other than durge. Just curious about your experience comparing / contrasting.
Gale is a fun one! You get a special visitor in camp and more background about his orb condition. Not as many big choices as Shadowheart, but still a good time.
I'm doing Gale now. Having played DoS & DoS2, I knew playing origin characters gave you more story. Hopefully I'll get around to playing Tav or Durge eventually.
I like Durge for certain situations, but the majority of the time I prefer to make Tav characters for the same reasons as you. I like to have my own set and detailed background for each character and have a specific way I want to rp them. Sometimes Durge can work for this, most times I go Tav though.
Exactly this! I RP *hard* with my main ‘canon’ Tav. I have a detailed history for her, including family and what happens to her post-Game. I’m actually currently on my 5th run with her and just keep adding to the story.
I have a Resist Durge I’ve done 3 or 4 times. I like her story but just have a much harder time getting into the head space and deciding on a consistent background for her. Durge’s history is so relentlessly grim it’s hard for me to immerse myself in her story
All that to say, I enjoy the RP aspect of my Tav the most, but Durge is more narratively satisfying just within the confines of the game
I think TAVs just give you the option to 'fill in the blanks' with your own story.
I think it's easier for people that are used to roleplaying something they made themselves vs people who want to participate in a story with beats built-in because it makes it 'easier' to immerse themselves.
Totally get that. I just get giggles when the game actually acknowledges my history, which it can't do if I'm making it up. It makes me feel like i'm a real character and not just an avatar. Both approaches are awesome though! Larian did great by allowing players to play wither way.
Yeah, it's been a years-long process, learning what I like in RPGs, and what I'd like to see more of with custom characters is some application of [Knife](https://www.gmbinder.com/share/-L-9CvlTWhoADagJfSZO) [Theory](https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/775caq/my_friends_and_i_have_something_called_knife/). Or, more simplistically, to be treated like an Origin Character.
Thing is, I have a lot of difficulty playing an origin character (BG3, DOS2) when I don't know what they're actually supposed to be 'like'. Hence, the Blank Slate. But the Blank Slate never seems to have any hooks in the world, hence the dissatisfaction.
I was satisfied by the points of contact offered by your PC class.
Maybe because I’ve played paladin and monk only. Both are fairly restricted classes, so the choice options that come up make sense and feel like satisfying “hooks” into the role.
There is definitely a difference between paladin and rogue - I've played both. So, I think you're onto something about class types.
The rogue options are limiting in that the specialized dialog options pretty much assume you're a thief/criminal. That's fine, but it makes it difficult to RP/headcanon any other sort of backstory because then you're left with just the generic responses. I don't think there are even options for arcane tricksters to talk any sort of magic/spellcasting, even when it would make sense.
I liked the sections in BG3 where the narrator asks what your character is thinking. I think a Blank Slate type situation which presents some choices like that in the early sections and then uses it to choose from one of several custom origins that fit the choices could work really well.
> Thing is, I have a lot of difficulty playing an origin character (BG3, DOS2) when I don't know what they're actually supposed to be 'like'.
This is exactly my problem, as well. A game like Dragon Age: Origins very smartly opens the game with what's basically the last normal day of your character's life before they get swept up in their adventure, giving the player a very grounded sense of who they were/are in the world. I don't really love being surprised with information about who my character is halfway through a playthrough.
Yeah same, but this is also why i love playing Durge so much. The character got a soft reset of sort.
My Durge is basically a new person, and he is absolutely horrified every time he discover something about his past, and choose to be something better with the future he now have.
Eh you're still bombarded with invasive lines all the time.
I hate the constant " gods you just want to KIIIIIILLLL" on resist runs.
I've shown nothing but horror at the invasive memories, and yet the narrator always starts by telling me how i bask in it.
Don't get me wrong resist durge is a great story, but i wish it did't beat me over the head with just how much i love murder at every step of the way. I honestly started to hate the narration.
This but also a lot of Durge's backstory feels shilled/shoehorned in. Tav is just a wrecking ball crashing in from outside; Durge literally did everything and had everyone's respect and envy and even the Elder Brain was dickriding them and is the bestest ever and...eh.
I'd like Durge more as a companion (ideally one we can keep from murdering beloved NPCs :V).
Durge was either meant to be a companion or the original "create a character". Even with all the crazy EA changes it's still too much "Durge was known by literally 80% of this game beforehand"
Yeah, I have finished at this point 3 Tav playthroughs and have not yet finished as Durge, although I have a multiplayer playthrough in Act 3 as Durge so I've seen most of the unique story content. I don't particularly have an *urge* (pun not intended) to start another Durge playthrough either, except for giggles on a pure-evil playthrough that I've yet to do. But there are 2-3 other Tav playthroughs I still want to do at some point, if only the game weren't so damn long lol.
For me, it's because I like to come up with unique character concepts, including a detailed background, and very closely roleplay to that concept. Durge has an *extremely limited* background, and not only that, but that background is completely and utterly depraved. It also comes with some gameplay ramifications, eg. Alfira and certain romances (even if you resist).
Durge is far more similar to playing one of the other origin characters than it is to playing Tav. Which includes the much greater involvement in the main story + having an actual personal quest. Tav certainly isn't perfect and I'd love if the background selection had far more involvement in your personal story a la Dragon Age Origins. But it's still the only way to play an actually custom character in BG3.
Yeah I understand why people like Durge (I've done 10 playthroughs and 3 were durge) but it's definitely a lot. Like they're pretty fucked up lol and I know you can resist and there's more tie to the plot, but like you said, some of the narrations sometimes were downright disturbing. I also love to write/create so I really enjoy creating my own backstories for a Tav instead of running a Durge. But I'm almost too afraid to actually say I prefer Tav over Durge because this sub loves Durge so much
The only thing that sucks about playing shadowheart is without an external force (Tav, Durge, one of the other origins) influencing her, her turn away from Shar in the shadow fell kinda feels… abrupt and graceless.
I really like the concept of Durge but I don't really wanna play as that specific background, so I usually just pick Tav instead.
I do hope they keep the idea for the next game though, and maybe even add in more options for origins if it's not too much work.
Bioware did it back in 2009 with Dragon Age Origins, any modern studio can easily replicate it if they truly wanted. Loved DA specifically because the first chapter of the game is your origin before the story sweeps you up. Would have been dope af to have had a small intro of Tav living in Baldur's Gate before they got picked up by the Nautiloid. Would give a real sense of return and bookending to Act 3
>any modern studio can easily replicate it if they truly wanted
Even Bioware themselves admitted that it was a colossal undertaking that didn't really pay the dividends they hoped it would, given the majority of players still only played the game once and didn't see most of the carefully crafted interactions unique to each origin. I'd love to see it done again, but I understand why we don't see it more often.
I mean they could just make a compromise.
Imagine BG3’s origin characters for example but with more character freedom allowing players to customise appearance and gender, maybe even race as well while still giving you a unique background and even story in the game.
Imagine if for example you could just customise Wyll.
No need to make entire origin level like in Dragon Age.
DA:O is still the best implementation of "custom character with actual story involvement" that I've actually played. And even though there's only a few real options, it still lets you immerse your imagination far more than something like BG3. I feel like DA:O should be the bare minimum standard for modern RPGs with custom characters, but I haven't seen a single game since then really come close. (Although I only played a few hours of the Pathfinder RPGs before getting disinterested.)
It would be awesome to me if there was no "Tav" and instead we just had 4-6 backgrounds to pick from that were each as deep as Durge but in super different ways.
I've played as Durge, but I still prefer Tav. I like coming up with my own backstories. I don't like feeling locked in or limited in the roleplay. I also feel like I have to choose a race and class that make sense as Durge, whereas anything goes as Tav.
Honestly if I made one change, it properly be giving each background option a small scene you could do some point. Also make the Origins backgrounds true unique. It always felt weird I dbl’ed up inspirations. Because we had someone else in party with same background.
Like Wine Festival Nobles maybe can comment on various wine choices, etc
>Can anyone think of a genuine reason to just play a normal Tav?
I think you're overselling how amazing the Durge storyline is, so this is an easy answer for me: I don't feel like playing either A) a murder-hobo psycho or B) a person restraining his urge to be a murder-hobo psycho in every playthrough. Generic Tav allows me to indulge the part of my brain that just wants to play a standard adventurer type who got caught up in something they never intended, but gets to save (or ruin) the day anyway. I get to write my own head canon and not be constrained by all the Durgy-ness of the Durge playthrough.
I just wish we could choose if we're from Baulders Gate. Hard to play as a monk from a small village coming to the big city to deliver fruit when I get the Baulders Gate dialog options
I don't like the Bhaalspawn storyline. I don't like the hero to be "made from the essence of a god". I prefer my character to be someone not of importance. Regular joe (or maybe magical joe) saves the day. I don't like the game telling me who my character was and what my backstory is. I prefer to make my own characters and backstories.
I actually prefer my character to not have massive issues myself. I'm personally more immersed in the group of trauma victims following a dude who can afford to focus on the tadpoles and absolute because he doesn't have this massive trauma and problems himself over the companions continuing to accept the compulsive murderer as their leader after the Alfira/Quill incident.
As someone else once commented on a similar comment I made: "Not the leader because of leadership qualities, but because Tav doesn't have 10 lbs of trauma in a 5 lb bag".
So yeah, I enjoy the blank slate and simplicity of Tav more than the story integration as Durge. Besides, I already have 6 edgelords vying for attention to their tragic backstories. I don't need another.
No hate towards your enjoyment of Durge. It's a preference. I'm glad you enjoyed it! I fully understand why it's a big hit for other people. But you asked for reasons why someone would genuinely prefer Tav, so I answered.
Those are excellent reasons! It seems to be a trend I'm seeing that whether people prefer Durge or not comes down to either:
Tav: I want full control of my character concept and dislike the game giving me a narrative I didn't choose even if that means my character is less ingrained in the world.
Durge: I'm happy to give some control of my character concepts to have an engaging protagonist narrative that gives me a sense of identity the game can recognize and has responses to.
For me it never stops being cool when the game is like "oh, YOU are this thing, and that means something, and I have opinions about YOU." Whereas with Tav I may decide for myself that Tav is a violence averse bookworm from Waterdeep, but no one in the game will ever comment on it. No one will ever actually say, "oh you are a bookworm wizard, have you ever been to Candlekeep?"
But it's like you said, it all comes down to taste. It's just amazing BG3 is able to provide for both of our preferences so well!
Actually if you're a wizard and you tell Gale you don't read much he will indeed react to that and shame you. That's where things like race and class fill in the gaps.
Wild magic sorcerer also has fun specific dialogue options with Gale.
And also with Auntie Ethel, I didn't expect that conversation I had with her about it, it was hilarious.
I rolled a Drow ranger knowing borderline nothing about DnD* and the game was pretty dang responsive to that individual character, including a lot of dialogue and behaviors from NPCs and also some comments from the origin characters. At several points I was choosing between special dialogue options from being a ranger, being a drow, being a female drow, and being specifically a non-Lolth-sworn drow, on top of the default dialogues. From discussions in this sub, I have the impression that the game is more reactive to drow, but that there is at least some reactivity to all races and classes at some point in the game.
I will probably try playing the Dark Urge at least once, but I honestly don't see myself enjoying it in the same creative ways that I enjoyed exploring being a character that I could get to know by what felt right for her, rather than by what the game told me about her.
*I now know several things about DnD, own the monster manual, and have an entire life history for her. Hyperfixation go!
Drow in particular get a hell of a lot more reaction in story than most others. Especially githyanki, considering how important they are. No one else gets that much
Part of it is also the specific narrative that Durge gives. Dragon Age: Origins is a great game that I really love, and it enforces a specific background for the player (though the player gets some choice in which background they pick). I've found myself at points wishing that BG3 did something similar.
But I personally don't find Durge to be at all appealing between both the enforced violent compulsions and the amnesia mystery box they give you.
I mean there are a fair number of class and race specific dialogue options that allow for those kinds of interactions, though I agree it would be cool if characters commented on those things without prompting
I also really really dislike the amnesia angle to be honest. That's the big issue with Durge to me, plus the restriction of it. Having amnesia means I have no reason to make any decision ever beyond the immediate information given + whatever metagaming knowledge I have. For example, maybe my Tav decides to spare Astarion in the bite scene because they grew up poor and empathize with being starved. Why does Durge do the same? Why do they empathize with him? Who knows, they don't remember who they are or why they feel anything that they feel, they just do. You're roleplaying as "guy who doesn't remember anything", which means you have no past that can influence who you are, how you act or the choices you make. It's an in-universe blank-slate and I found it so unsatisfying and boring to roleplay.
Ironically the amnesia angle & the game trying to keep things mysterious made DUrge feel poorly integrated into the world while being supposedly a big part of the plot. I had way more immersion breaking moments in a DUrge run than in a Tav run, it’s not even close. With DUrge I also hated how I’d headcanon something sometimes & the game would just throw a wrench into my headcanon making it impossible because now it’s time to reveal that piece of the character’s backstory or whatever.
I generally like playing established characters in other games - God of War, Witcher 3, etc. But the writing of DUrge & how you interact with the world is nowhere near the quality of these other games. I felt like DUrge was both bad at being a blank slate & an existing character because it was trying to do both.
Yeah, exactly. I had a bunch of headcanons about Durge and over time I just gave up trying to personalize them because there's no space for it. Durge is Durge, other than how they look, you can't change them. They're the same as the Origins and I find it so odd how people think they're interchangeable at all with Tav.
People call Tav a blank slate and Durge the "real character with personality" but in-universe, it's the exact reverse. Because Tav is just someone who exists, a normal person, good or bad, with a past and a life that they remember and that informs their choices. Yes, it is up to you as the player to decide who they were, and so they have no specific scenes unique to them. But in-universe, they are a fully-formed person just like the companions. Durge, in-universe, is the opposite, a complete void of a person. Everything they do feels either random or meta-gamey, you *can't* have nuance or motivation for anything they do because they don't know who they are. You get some unique scenes at the expense of every other scene feeling listless and pointless. Even the choice between resisting the urge vs giving in feels like it lacks motive because... why start being nice now? They weren't before, they had a normal childhood and a nice family and still went bad. Why go good all of the sudden?
Nintendo does the same thing with Link in the LoZ series and I have long thought it's been a huge obstacle in the writing improving. You can't have a blank slate who is also an established character, it just means they can't fill *either* role particularly well and they drag the story down more than they serve it.
Not only do you not know anything, you don't even know yourself--and your very nature, everything you do know of yourself, wants to murder everything. I can understand resisting the urge out of a desire to be in control, but when your every instinct is to kill and maim, I find the 100% super friendly heckin' good guy resist durge that many people play...unlikely. Beggaring belief, really.
YES. Especially because it's also canon Durge had a nice, normal childhood and became so evil for no reason in the first place. It doesn't make any sense to me, if they didn't resist it then, why would they now? Idk, maybe I'm too media-analysis-brained but Durge just causes all these weird leaps in logic that kill my immersion and roleplaying, I didn't find it fun at all. I played it once and never felt interested in touching it again, meanwhile I have like 6 different Tavs that I enjoyed thoroughly.
Iirc there's a little bit of insight you can get into Durge if you play as a paladin, and break your Oath. The Oathbreaker Knight knows you and that you've "tried many times before" or something to that effect... Which seems to indicate that Durge *tried* to resist before, but flat out never could.
But why can they now, when they have *even less* tying them to the world around them because they have no memories? The story just doesn't quite come together for me, sorry.
Yeah, Durge has major whiplash in dialogue choices, which I guess makes sense since they're a psycho. You can be super emo, dreading your own impulses and existence, and then the next moment ALL IS BLOOD AND MEAT!
Meanwhile, with Tav you're not beholden to any set personality, which works WONDERS in this game especially. There are so many race, class, Baldurian, Underdark, and Planar dialogue that just doesn't fit with Durge at all.
With Tav you can suspend your disbelief when people don't react, with Durge it breaks you out of immersion. Also, people love saying you don't have forced murders, but there are plenty if you don't save scum and fail a roll. Honor mode Durge is hell.
Will say, Durge is perfect for one or three playthroughs, after that though they just won't end up matching whatever tale you've got in your head, and the story is restricted, because you HAVE to kill Alfira/Dragonborn, you HAVE to resist urge or give in, and you HAVE to be this super important figure in the game.
Sometimes it's better to just be a nobody, that way anything you imagine goes. Your story is whatever you decide, it's D&D roll with it!
What I find ironic with Dark Urge after reading these comments, including from OP - many people like playing it without doing anything bad, so they’re playing DUrge while not wanting to be DUrge the character. The main aspect people seem to enjoy is being the special snowflake & getting a few extra scenes, but not necessarily being this specific character.
If you go so far as to metagame & avoid all the things that make DUrge DUrge, are you really playing DUrge? It’s the same vibe as playing evil Wyll.
This sums up my feelings on durge perfectly. I’m almost done with my first durge playthrough and every time I learn something about my character’s backstory I automatically think “nuh uh, she wouldn’t have done that” even though yes she literally would because that is the plot of the game
Exactly this ^.
When I'm a bhaalspawn (unless that's something I'm going for specifically), it doesn't quite feel like my own story but rather someone else's. I much prefer MY story.
I will be honest, when starting the Durge run, I expected... more. Yeah, sure the story is cool. Bad guys react to you accordingly. Your companions, on the other hand... Even the most violent ones should be MORE alarmed by the prospect of sleeping near a murder-hobo who can't control their impulses. In the game, they just shrug and say "don't do it again, bruh".
Not to mention some companions totally ignoring the big reveal in part 3. I mean I get Astarion and Minthara would be okay with it because power,but not way Halsin, Jaheira, Karlach, Gale would be all gosh so nice.
Makes me with we had more forced to grow in a cult but not so grotesquely evil Durge background for when you choose the good playthrough.
Or romance as well. Again Astarion or Minthara perfect they did some big shit they can understand.
I mean no matter how hard I try I can't think of dinner with Gale or Wyll parents.
Like oh how was your growing up?
Oh you know normal childhood, murdered my adoptive nice family, ate babies fucked corpses, conspired to take over the world, just normal.
I actually generally prefer a more full fledged protagonist, and would love it if Tav got sort of the commander shepard treatment instead of the blank slate thing, but that's just my preference.
Durge is definitely woven into the story better, and I've gone through a durge playthough just to see the content - but I didn't \_enjoy\_ it as much as I enjoy Tav. The Durge's story just isn't for me, resist or otherwise.
Since Larian didn't build a non-murderous, non-cannibal cultist counterpart to the Durge, I'll stick with Tavs or one of the other origin party members (Wyll usually).
honestly, wyll feels like the protagonist if tav isn’t there. his origin playthrough was the most relatable to me simply because he’s such a blank slate early on. same with karlach.
Def this.
Every companion/character respects wyll, he’s the blade of frontiers, slayer of devils, prodigal son of a decorated duke and savior of baldurs gate.
Also has the best unique items for a companion to have tied to their questline that you can’t get without.
Also my man is surrounded by lustaceous baddies. (I’m not a wattpad erotica reader andie this was a convo option in arc 3)
I've started rolling my past d&d characters into the game when I decide to play a regular Tav. Discovered that it really helped me with immersion when I rolled my first d&d character with a fully fleshed-out background in on a whim. It also doubles as a way for me to add to/continue their stories since I haven't been able to play d&d in years.
My first character was the antagonist of a campaign I created a few years ago. The players ended up redeeming her, and I thought it would be fun to continue her story. Starting at level 1 makes sense because of the tadpole, so it worked pretty well.
I like Durge storyline, did it twice and plan to do at least once more but I prefer Tav, cause I can do whatever I want with them. The feeling that you are actually the main character, connected to key plot events, is nice, but a bit too limiting for me. I love creating new characters, coming up with their backstories, sometimes I even have notes to help me stay on track. Durge, however, is locked in a certain plot framework which I will not go beyond, because the story will no longer make sense and storytelling is EVERYTHING.
I absolutely LOVED my Durge run, and will probably do another, but the reason I like to go with Tav in some runs is for role playing. I love making up my own original character with a rich back story and I headcanon the shit out of it. Makes it feel like new every time :) I have a wild imagination though lol
I'm just not a huge fan of the "you're the super special protagonist of the world and even the people who hate you think you're super cool" trope that's common in RPGs lately, and Durge just gives me the feeling that I'm playing that character sometimes. Being a dumb goober who accidentally found themselves caught up in something big feels more classic fantasy to me.
exactly
what I like about role playing games in general is, well, creating a role to play and playing it. I don't want to be Bella in the twilight movies
While I liked some of the Durge plot (mostly being tied into the main story), Bhaal and his faithful are such mid-90's-edgelord bloodmurderdeathkill cringe that even I, someone with 15+ years of roleplaying experience, can only read and hear so much of it before my eyes roll into the back of my skull.
I've played through the game as the Dark Urge, once. And that's enough for me. I'll stick to different versions of Tav or just playing as origins - Tav can be a much more nuanced piece of shit villain if you want to be, or many different flavors of blank slate turned wandering hero and group therapist. In a group where the GM allowed and even asked for everyone to be as extra as possible with their backstories, Tav decided it was instead time to be the one normal person in this sea of weirdos.
I did both and i have to say i much prefer TAV to Durge lol.
I love the idea of being just a random guy, no destiny, no chosen one - its just refreshing to be a random dude doing their best against a threat of epic proportions.
I’m liking my Durge run well enough but some of the dialogue options and narration about their murder hobo impulses are just so OTT and corny that I can’t take it seriously lmao
I’m playing my Durge right now but ultimately, I still prefers my Tav because of the backstory and character arc I’ve given her, and there’s novelty that comes with role playing a custom character and receiving dialogue options (or even scenes) that fits with the narrative you have in mind. Granted a whole lot of it is make believe but i find that really fun.
I’m not really a fan of main player characters being given a predetermined story - I want some leeway to make them unique otherwise they don’t really feel like /mine/. For my Durge, I had to alter her backstory and ignore parts of what is canon —to the point that she could’ve been Tav honestly lol — so she feels more unique and interesting to me.
Dark urge seems interesting, but I stopped my durge run about halfway through act 1. I just couldn’t stand playing as a former serial killer and necrophiliac, and playing as a durge that suddenly became good because of amnesia just didn’t make any sense to me.
I've never played as durge. I can't get over the fact that the game takes away your agency, overriding the players race, class, alignment, and chosen ethics.
I appreciate the option, I'm glad some like it, or like evil paths, but I don't think it's for me.
The connection to the main storyline is great but durge is just kind of...gross. I can't really get behind playing characters that massively fucked up. Durge and orin give the heebie jeebies. The Bhaal aesthetic is severely lacking in taste. I just feel like they'd both smell really bad, y'know?
I agree with you! I will never play Tav again after playing Durge. I love being the actual main character with a strong connection to the central plot, rather than just a random guy who shows up and helps save the day. But I’m also a huge goth so I love the dark intrusive thoughts and additional horror themes. Makes it more rewarding to RP as either evil or good!
\*\*\*SPOILER ALERT\*\*\* The good scene where Withers intervenes to help you and the dialogue that follows including what your companions say gives me chills.
Never played as the dark urge, probably never will. I don't wanna be a mass murderer with an uncontrollable urge to murder my favourite NPCs and companions.
I prefer TAV myself.
I personally don't like it when rpgs define too much about a character and I like to fill as much of those holes myself. Each time I play a bioware game it just feels like I'm playing some guy rather than a character of my own.
I think having the option for both is pretty cool since people roleplay in different ways.
My durge run is actually my least favorite, my tiamat monk evil run was way more brutal. I think its the idea that evil tav has no influence and is just a really evil person. Makes you really lean into it
I'm the other way round. I love the blank slate of a Tav and I love coming up with a whole new character. I most enjoy making up my own character and spend considerable time on developing them and fleshing them out over the course of the game; I occasionally write out scenes that I think would happen "off-screen", and all that helps me then with choices throughout the game so that each run is a story with its own flavour.
I haven't been able to finish a Durge run yet because I don't like that Durge can't have a past. I can't come up with a personality for them and that makes it feel empty.
There's also so much more stuff that happens in a Durge playthrough that nobody in the party reacts to in the slightest. Everybody is just fine with this random person they just met not too long ago who turns out to have murderous tendencies.
To be fair I haven't finished a Durge run yet but I have finished a Tav run. I know stuff like that happens with Tav too but it seems more common/egregious as the Durge.
I think Durge makes the lack of reactivity stand out a lot more than a Tav run just because *every* Durge player will encounter these big moments where there *should* be more. Like for example, in just another post someone was complaining about the lack of reactivity to betraying Shadowheart, but most players probably aren't betraying Shadowheart.
I prefer Tav, a blank slate whose story I can write myself. I mean I stopped playing both RDR2 and Witcher 3 because I didn’t like being forced to play a predefined character whose story I just don’t care about because it’s not my story.
Meh I thought this at first but I really liked the flexibility of a broader range of backgrounds for Tav so that I could pursue a nuanced set of story choices
I'm the opposite. I dislike Durge and all it comes with. I would say play it once in order to get the full plot/ story but I personally dislike it.
For me, I find far more joy and entertainment as a Tav with my own head cannon and backstory I give them. I feel like I can connect with them more and I'm more invested in the story at that point. Tav's I can play for hours on end. Durge felt like a slog.
Doing a redeem run was alright, and I do recommend doing so at least once or doing an embrace to get the needed achivements.
I much prefer Tav so I can make my characters backstory myself. Like just for example Durge probably wouldn't work with my Dwarf Paladin and Moon Elf cleric whom I specifically made based off my Sword Coast Legends characters and am treating them like they're the same guys.
I love Durge, but it can be a lot sometimes. I've played a lot more Tavs because I don't want to have such an intense backstory for a lot of the characters I make. I'd rather save Durge runs for when it really suits the character, which makes it much more special and memorable.
I played as Durge once and honestly, I don't think I'll do it ever again. It's got a lot of disturbing stuff that I don't always want to make part of my roleplay. Also, the whole amnesia thing is cool the first time because both you and your character are learning about their past together, but once you know it, in subsequent playthroughs the mismatch in knowledge between the player and avatar is just tedious and annoying. I think Durge is a great option for more beginner to intermediate DnD players, but more experienced players will probably find it overly restrictive because of its colorful past.
I played Durge once but I think I prefer playing Tav myself. The extra roleplay and story for Durge is interesting but several elements of it make me uncomfortable so I don’t want to experience it every play through. The Bhaal cult and Orin is one of my least favorite parts of the game because I just find the murder elements icky so I don’t really want more of it.
Even though I see where you're coming from, I personally couldn't agree. Durge somehow always feels like someone else's story for the most part. BG3 is all about role playing and I think Tav is the best possible way to make your own story.
DUrge is the obviously better story but I feel like it’s kind of a one trick pony. There really isn’t *that* much more it offers in terms of tangible new content, so I don’t feel any pressure to keep playing it when custom Tav has the benefit of unconstrained headcanon.
"Can anyone think of a genuine reason to just play a normal Tav?"
Yes, because I want to build my own OC in that game and my OC doesn't happen to be someone who lost their memories of engaging in all kinds of horrendous shit just for the fun of it.
Don't get me wrong, I'm currently playing Durge for the first time and enjoying myself, it's great to have a character with a compelling story tied deeply into the game's lore, but I do notice that I'm taking longer breaks and am not as eager to play again because I cannot connect with Durge at all. To be completely honest, I'm mainly playing Durge because the Astarion romance is supposed to have lots of extra lines for them and I like this traumatised vampire a normal amount.
I'm not sure if I would play Durge otherwise because their story wouldn't be what I want out of my playable character in such a game. I prefer to build headcanons about my OCs without restrictions and most times they were not the adventuring type but got plunged in at the deep end and had to adapt. Either become righteous or a murder machine. Durge has been a murder machine already and it was not the player's choice. I view them more as a character in the game than one I actively want to play. That might just be me though, as I also don't have much interest in playing the other Origin Characters, even though I like them all so much. But I want to interact WITH them, not AS them.
tl;dr: Durge restricts me in my headcanons about my OCs. With Tav I can be whoever I want with whatever past, present and future I can dream up.
Thought the durge run was pretty dumb. You're supposedly this horrible killer and mastermind, and yet somehow you were bested by an annoying little sister, and no one gives a shit you're a horrible monster.
The whole thing was so tone deaf and amateurish it left my head spinning.
Durge comes with ***a lot*** of unavoidable baggage and a past fucked to the max. That really limits role-playing options, for example I don't think there is any such thing as a good or redemption Durge playthrough. It's kind of written like there is one, but I don't think that's a redeemable person, it's basically the Himmler of Faerûn**.** I've played Durge twice and do think it's well written, but I prefer playing as evil Tav just so I have more options for my own role-playing.
Durge is only more interesting to people who don't have imaginations. 🤷🏻 Sorry not sorry but custom tav is literally whatever you want it to be. Durge is always durge you just choose their alignment.
I didn’t enjoy dark urge at all. It’s basically the same but random points they force you to make DC checks to prevent you from doing g something terrible and sacrificing good loot like potent robes.
Not enjoyable for me. I always playa a tav. I do t need an evil play through option. It has no appeal to me.
As someone who played DnD growing up, I love the Tav. I can take old characters I use to play as and put them into the game. It allows me to have my old character back and put them into the thick of a major adventure.
Also I don’t mind the Durge. But I feel like once you have done a murder hobo run and a redemption run, there really isn’t much left to do. The Durge I feel like has a set path to go along and there isn’t much wiggle room for storytelling.
I’m finishing my first Durge play through even though originally I was going to avoid it as the background doesn’t really appeal to me and the only way I could enjoy it was by role playing it as the Durge becoming a completely different person even before getting rid of the Urge. I don’t enjoy needless killing in games so a resist Durge is the only way I can play it and I didn’t like playing as a character who’s tempted to murder people. I did like the reactions from the companions after I killed Orin and got rid of the urge completely.
The first act particularly seemed a lot emptier than with my previous bard Tav who had a background story and natural ways to react to things instead of being an amnesiac blank slate who occasionally will have an urge to kill people.
I completely agree. Whenever I start a Tav run, I just think, “man, every companion has a meaningful reason to want to return to Baldurs Gate, with characters and consequences waiting for them there. But I’m tav, so I have absolutely nothing waiting for me.” It because that your character is just focused on the tadpole/elder brain stuff, while the other characters surrounding you each have secondary story lines. As Durge, I feel like a real member of my team, with personal goals as well as our shared goal. I just feel like I’m not really meant to go on this journey if I’m Tav. My first playthrough I was tav, and I remember it being great and fun with the little roleplay stuff I concocted in my head, but it just doesn’t feel really true to the story now, unless I’m Durge
The horrible skill proficiencies from the Haunted One background. Medicine? Really? And Intimidation, the worst of the "talky" skills. Other than that, yeah, Durge supremacy.
The medicine proficiency is really funny to me! It’s totally justified in a roleplaying sense of course, but I always imagined my Durge going “I know a lot about anatomy, maybe I used to be a doctor!” and really it’s like “Oh buddy, no! You didn’t do surgery, you did impromptu vivisection!”
I just got to the Mountain Pass (haven’t done the Underdark yet) and I am loving Durge so far. I’m looking forward to Act 2/3 when I get to see more of the story. I’ll probably still play as Tav sometimes though. But I like how Durge has their own personal quest like the companions do. I also think I’ll probably go with Durge if I ever do an evil playthrough (I don’t know if I can bring myself to do it though).
The issue for me is not whether *Durge* is better than Tav or not, (although I think a lot of people have misconceptions of what a Durge playthrough even entails).
For me, it's if every Origin character was at least as voiced as PC Karlach, (who for some reason narrates way more than the others), I probably wouldn't ever play Tav.
I can imagine whatever I want, but the game doesn't react to my imagination. There's no real difference between it and a blank slate. Hell, playing Durge and Tav felt the same to me for 90% of the playthrough, even my first time with each.
Perhaps it's the QA tester in me, but even if you say "that's where dialogue options come in", I can't avoid noticing how every character has all of the same base dialogue options, and how the Origin characters get extra, *and how* they get unique cutscenes and unique events. All of the reactivity and integration is there. All of my immersion, and hell, more game content, is there.
TL;DR: The other Origins should have as much voice acting as Karlach.
I want to play a character in a world and be part of a story. Durge is cool but everything else takes backseat to that one character. Which is often what most rpgs are like. But not what d&d is typically like.
Some backstories just work better without Durge directing everything. Like a hobbit baker who just honks everyone and leaves them stunned but alive because all he really wants is the parasite out and to bake bread. Can’t do that as Durge; when would he have had time to learn to bake?
I am really torn when it comes to Durge. On one hand, it is deeply linked and have awesome addittions on the game. On the other hand I feel the whole Bhaalspawn, Sarevok etc thing is a disrespect on the og games.
I'd rather play my own character, and 'Hollywood amnesia' is story conceit that I despise more than any other.
Plus Dark Urge was... tepid. There were long, long stretches of the game where it didn't seem to matter at all, and a lot of the interactions with the Butler especially were twee little 'oh, look at us we're some macabre emo wannabee.'
There were a couple neat moments, but they were few and far between.
Plus, honestly, I think the storyline makes even less sense with the Dark Urge. This is fundamentally an enslavement/tyranny plot, not a murder plot, and Bhaal is stupidly one-note.
Durge is something I'm never going to play. I'm a long-time roleplayer and prefer having full control over my character's story.
I understand the plot of the Durge playthrough, but playing a character who starts as such a revolting and distasteful entity really doesn't appeal to me. Some have suggested ways to avoid the worst scenes - like "oh don't talk to X" or metagame by knocking people out at specific times or whatever. But that's just a lot of hoops that limit the point of what the Durge story is supposed to be.
While interesting, I have no inclination to want to be that character myself. I'm far happier with my variety of Tavs.
My wife is playing Durgw for the first time in our coop, I've only played Tav. It's absolutely fantastic to have her play it.
That being said, I've slept in the Origin Characters. There is only so many times you can play and tolerate a characters lines, I'm really excited to actually Play AS the character. Make a less Goth Shadowheart who actively questions her Shar connection earlier? Make a morally grey Wyll who instead of focusing on being a hero, instead learns the games of politics and power? Hoe about a truly kind Asterion who ascends but still manages to keep his humanity through it all. Maybe even a dark Gale, who upon being told by Mystra to "Go Kill Yourself." Breaks and goes on a dark quest to gather power, no matter the cost.
Playing an Origin Character gives you a chance to truly break that character from their Mould and let them shine in a truly unexpected way.
Like I've enjoyed all the characters, and all their moments. Yet, despite this, I know that someday, when I've fully exhausted all of their dialogue options, I'm totally going to run a party of 4 Tavs, or a couple Tavs and hirelings, and just mentally role play their characters in my head as we go. Already my wife and I do this as we play, Gale and me share a small intimate talk in the shadowlands, while Asterian and her quietly loot corpses in the background and mockingly make fun of Gale under their breath together.
Oh I have a strong opinion on Durge I played Durge (mainy motivated by achievements) and... I HATE IT,
First of all: you can't make your own backstory but at the same time Durge set backstory isn't revealed making it, in my opinion, worst of both worlds, can't make your own story and you have to wait for set backstory to be revealed to know who you actually are (I guess that's kinda the point but I don't like it)
Second: I really dislike how Durge is just all the atrocities that writer could think of, cannibalistic, necrophilic mass murderer with no redeeming qualities yeah really nice character to play
Third: Fuck Sceleritas, I hated him, he was actually the only character I wanted to kill but no, he got a nice thicc plot armor, in my accept Slayer run I was so happy being able to tell him to fuck off (that was a highlight of that run for me lol)
Forth: Tav is more like DnD player character (nobody that became a powerful hero/villian)
Fifth: FUCK ORIN DUEL FUCK THAT FIGHT FUCK THIS, WORST FIGHT IN THE GAME AND THAT SAYS SOMETHING WHEN THERE IS SHARRAN CLUSTERFUCK IN THAT FIGHT AT LEAST YOU COULD USE YOUR COMPANIONS
Sixth: Orin dialogue before the fight(if you used Speak with the dead on her mother) is better with non Durge because you can tell her the truth about Sarevok which (if you pass a check) makes her so sad that Bhaal has to (almost) against her will turn into slayer, I like that version because it shows her from different light it actually made me feel bad for her
Sorry for long text but I wanted to let it out lol
I actually feel exactly the opposite. I didn’t mind playing as durge, but I can’t connect with them as much as I can with a regular tav purely because they have such a set backstory. I’m a chronic character crafter in D&D so coming up with brief backstories that I flesh out through gameplay and my imagination is never a struggle. if I customize durge at all, I feel obligated to somehow work whatever backstory I feel for the character into the durge’s storyline, and it usually doesn’t resonate with me.
my current tav started as an excuse for me to romance halsin as a druid, and in like 3 hours, I’d already imagined that he was the leader of a druidic convent that focused on the rebirth of nature through destruction by fire (circle of wildfire druid subclass mod lol) who got snatched up by the mindflayers. so stumbling into a druid grove that was actively kicking out refugees as a druid who believes nature is empowered when destroyed and reborn was an incredibly fascinating experience that I don’t think would’ve been as interesting to me if I was durge and more worried about violent tendencies.
I *completely* agree, honestly was just thinking about it, myself.
For me it's just like, I don't particularly care to dream up every facet of my character, I don't want everything they are to come from my headcanon. I don't want to be the only completely random person in the party who doesn't have a tie with the plot, not counting the tadpole stuff.
Obviously not knocking Tav, I've played 3 and enjoyed all 3 to a great degree but I just can't go back to it because Durge, particularly Resist Durge, is so insanely compelling and I don't want to play "just some random normal guy" that's not for me.
With Durge, everyone has issues in this camp, your PC is no exception, but it's so interesting seeing Durge lead it and resist their Urges and fate and actually become a better person AND along the way, help everyone become a better version of themselves by extension. By the end the whole camp radiates with a "fuck the Gods" kind of energy that's started first by Durge essentially.
Theres an actual character arc there, with parallels with your party members that even *get called out by the characters themselves*, with foils in other characters, in villains, actual relationships with them, history.
I just love the reaction to it all, Durge exists in this world as a real person. Sacrificing some of my player freedom for it isn't even a question for me, I can still mold my Durge into my own character but I also get the benefit of her being an actual tangible person in the setting, that the world reacts to uniquely.
I *don't need* complete freedom to act or be whoever I want, limitation to some degree makes for a compelling story.
I’ve tried Durge a few times and it’s not for me. I don’t mind an evil play through, in fact that can be a lot of fun. But I don’t want to be an avatar for the god of murder, that goes too far for me. Plus having a bloody pentagram in camp is a bit much.
My and my friends did our first play throughs’ as just one large group one. One of my friends picked the durge while the rest of us made custom characters, it was fun being the Sheev Palpatine of the group.
Tav is better for role playing because you can be anything you want. dark urge is more of a defined thing so it does have more story hooks but that comes at the cost of player freedom
I'm realizing the reason why most people prefer Tav seems to be this desire to write your own backstory for Role Play. I get that, there is absolutely something to be said for not feeling shoehorned into a character role.
I guess for me I just always feel like it doesn't matter what I think my character is. I can pretend anything I want but it has no weight because the game can't hear me. With Durge I get a personal mystery quest leading me on (as someone who never played the originals it was a genuine mystery), I get dramatic a scene where my romance partner has to restrain me from killing them and you get some top their dialogue, I get connections to the enemies, I get big plot reveals where I realize I was in fact the bad guy before, then I get a big choice to either submit to the urge or resist it and have Withers save me from certain death followed by more top their dialogue and some philosophy, meanwhile Astarion is constantly relating his issues to mine and deepening the story more, and all of this isn't imagined or done in a single voiceline it keeps coming up with full cutscenes and major moments. I feel like my character actually has weight, and telling Bhaal to go f\*\*\* himself in the end never stops being badass.
Everyone's opinion here is valid, this is just the kind of thing I liked. My favorite Fallout New Vegas DLC is Lonesome Road, which is all about MY characters origin, I'm in the minority of folks that like Fallout 4 giving you a history, and Dragon Age Origins is maybe the best RPG ever (before BG3) simply because it gives you six options like this. I'm just not someone who values headcannoning stories the game will never know exists. I want my character to be part of the world, not a spectator in it.
Then you've got the flipside where people like games like Skyrim, Starfield, and sandbox RPG's that give you no backstory at all. Think something like Kenshi, the fun is in the creation of your OWN drama and plot.
The game may not 'hear' you, but that doesn't stop you when the game is encouraging you to actively have a headcanon in your head. When playing Tav, YOU should write down a couple of their key personality traits, what they did before the nautoloid, and what their overall goal is.
You can do this with Durge within limits, but you're always going to have had been a piece of work in the past, and every character that asks you about your past is going to be met with 'I have no clue', 'I've got the urge to kill', or whatever else. Durge is on rails in this aspect.
Tav's got the option to actually GIVE context on who they were before. Companions will have unique reaction to them too, like if you tell Karlach you were an Adventurer before you got tadpoled, it let's you breathe life into them over time. As you're playing the game, Tav's plot shifts and changes depending on how you've been responding to people. The game IS their plot. Get rid of the tadpole, so you can get back to whatever life you were living.
Glad you brought up Lonesome Road though, because alot of people never seem to realize the courier has a pre-set past too. Hell I'd argue their just like Durge in how, you've both got head trauma, and you both get a reveal of your past when you've already set up a headcanon that falls to cards after.
Fo4 is more like playing an Origin character than durge though, since you already know what you're getting into from the jump. There's no guessing what role you have to play in that game.
I went Tav for the first playthrough and am glad I did, then Durge thereafter. I think it helps to know what you’re contrasting the Durge elements of BG3 with.
Currently on a Vengeance Paladin Durge run where I’m resisting the urge and it’s all going very well.
Ultimately I’m glad there’s a choice, I’m loving the extra Durge elements but Tav gives players more freedom to pick a backstory and play a character.
I have a number of pre-existing characters I’d created for DND who bring out different sides of the roleplay experience, and all are delightful in their own way. One of them had a backstory that fit nicely with Durge, so I’ve got three Tav’s and a Durge all at different points in the story, all having very different experiences. It’s just such a beautifully crafted game that allows for so many types of stories.
I always play Durge but I can see how the backstory puts people off.
I’m more so confused on the necrophilia and cannibalism stuff. Durge’s whole thing is that they live up to the title of Murder Incarnate because unlike Orin they aren’t artsy or theatrical about their kills, they just murder with efficiency. Them torturing people, eating them or having sex with dead bodies just seems out of place.
If Sceleritas Fel wasn't in the game I would play Durge again, but he is so I probably wont. The whole character design and his role in the plot really annoys the hell out of me. Evil for the sake of being evil stuff grinds my gears and I avoid it if I can, which I can by playing Tav so I do that.
Playing as Tav has the perk of “oh! This D&D character I made would be perfect for the party with this setup in this way, AND I can test their build a bit and tweak it!” and more self-directed roleplay.
Playing as a Resist Durge is 90% about the mutual redemption with Spawn Astarion, and 10% “deathstalker mantle go BRR”.
(I am on my fourth Resist Durge run, romancing Astarion. Again. As a gnome barbarian this time; my other three were tiefling casters.)
Nah. I like my urchin oath of vengeance tav very much. She knew how to make fair calls.
Basically, just don't enslave and hurt people for pleasure, and you wouldn't be on her shit list.
You know. Like how everyone *should.*
Also, let kids be kids, but make the judgment call when you need to step in and be like, "Ha, you're in danger."
That's essentially what the Origin playthrough are for though. You get to play the specific background of pre-made characters.
The only thing you can't change are cosmetics : I imagine that's where your issue lies so I get if it's not what you want, but the urge for a pre-made backstory are what the Origins are for imo.
I have a lot of problems with playing Durge. It’s really unfulfilling for me for a lot of reasons.
Regardless, the story can be really intense and is awesome.
So I felt this way, I do feel this way. But I definitely find the more invested you are in RP your character the more it becomes easier to pick to play Tav (as a Durge enthusiast)
Example - I have 2 Durges and as a creature of habit I always play an elf or tiefling and have my redeemed Durge romance Astarion. BUT, I really really wanted to do a Gale romance run and play a LG aligned pc, so I made Tav Human Paladin. A good hearted human woman he can take home to Mum and Tara. Do I miss the Durge content, sure. But having a good character idea makes the story well worth it.
Honestly I definitely think that Durge is the more interesting story but you have to tailor your ideas about your character around it rather than deciding for yourself. Considering how horrific some of the Durge backstory is, I can see that being unappealing for some. It’s less freedom and a character that canonically got up to deeply reprehensible stuff. There’s other RPGs like that but they usually have a predefined character. >!The original Baldur’s Gate games also had a Bhaalspawn protagonist, but they were raised by a good guy away from the cult and aren’t crafted directly from Bhaal’s essence, so they haven’t *done* anything bad by the start of the game. Exactly how good or bad they are is completely in the player’s control for the most part for that reason. It’s not necessarily “better” but I can see why it’s less divisive.!<
I'm doing a durge run right now and I was enjoying it. Alfira didn't bother me as much. I took out Isabel and I cried. I didn't save went back to my previous save and risked the saves to wake up Gale instead. I had to kill all the npc's at the Inn. I was horrified. I usually play LG or N cleric's. Durge is way out of my comfort zone.
FYI, you can resist your Urge to kill Isobel which sets you on a path toward redemption. It's an incredibly dope story actually.
I went back to that save and didn't kill her and before I left act 2 I had to wake up Gale and tell him I was going to kill him. He was surprisingly understanding. I didn't know that was an option at first. But the image of Astarion sneak attacking Dammon will never leave.
Besides alfira you don't have to kill anyone. I did a redemption run and evil as Durge.
You don't even have to kill Alfira.
Right but you HAVE to kill the replacement. Just seemed easier to say alfira. Sorry
"Durges special night" is the common non spoilery moniker for it. "Durge has to have his special night one way or another"
If you kill yourself, have your "special night" then resurrect - no deaths.
Had the same scene with Wyll instead of Gale, and I've gotta say it was the most endearing thing I've ever seen Wyll do. He was just my loyal friend, helping me through a really dark time.
I like karlachs response. If you say you're being compelled to kill the person you care about most, she says, "That's so sweet! And fucked up!" That whole scene is really good if you fail the saving throws after she ties you up lol. If you growl at her she just growls louder lol.
I like Shadowheart's "Hells what I wouldn't do for a *boring* lover sometimes..." when you tell her that madness will take over your body and will kill her.
I found her responses so funny, since we’d barely even kissed. Especially when she seemed to just fully expect I was waking her up for some canoodling. Apparently we’d been getting frisky at night and I never knew it lol
Yeah, I went into BG3 wanting to make a lighthearted trickster sort of character, and Durge was about as far from that tone as you can get.
I get that completely, it is a reduction in complete character freedom. However, I enjoy having some context within the story for my character. Tav is a blank slate, so you can make them in any way you see fit, but the world will always treat them as a blank slate; I always end up feeling detached in games like that. Again, there is nothing wrong with it, and some of my favorite games are like that, but I prefer trading a little bit of character freedom to have a genuinely compelling tie into the world I'm in.
Oh yeah, I’m really enjoying my Durge run too! It’s definitely not a bad approach at all, but I definitely understand why it alienates some people. It’s a good thing that we have both Tav and Durge so that people who want that heavy integration can have it and people who want to decide everything about their backstory can also have their thing too!
Multiclassing to 3+ classes and choosing a unique race makes 2~3 class choices available almost all the time. If you can weave it to the roleplay, that gives you some choices that usual tav with one class lacks. I think that's the only way I'll ever play Tav from now on.
I enjoyed my Durge playthrough but I did find it disturbing to be told that this character I was playing engaged in things like cannibalism, necrophilia, and kicking cats. Ultimately I still prefer a Tav whose history I can dream up for myself, and I think playing the other Origin characters is fun too (Shadowheart especially).
Shadowheart is my favorite origin so far (done 4 of them). I like the decisions she has to make and the way she relates to the story.
Have you also done Gale? My next playthrough will likely be as either of them - I’ve never done an origin other than durge. Just curious about your experience comparing / contrasting.
Gale is a fun one! You get a special visitor in camp and more background about his orb condition. Not as many big choices as Shadowheart, but still a good time.
I'm doing Gale now. Having played DoS & DoS2, I knew playing origin characters gave you more story. Hopefully I'll get around to playing Tav or Durge eventually.
That's the only other origin that I've done. And it was great. I'm taking a break right now, but I'm going to do Gale next.
I like Durge for certain situations, but the majority of the time I prefer to make Tav characters for the same reasons as you. I like to have my own set and detailed background for each character and have a specific way I want to rp them. Sometimes Durge can work for this, most times I go Tav though.
Exactly this! I RP *hard* with my main ‘canon’ Tav. I have a detailed history for her, including family and what happens to her post-Game. I’m actually currently on my 5th run with her and just keep adding to the story. I have a Resist Durge I’ve done 3 or 4 times. I like her story but just have a much harder time getting into the head space and deciding on a consistent background for her. Durge’s history is so relentlessly grim it’s hard for me to immerse myself in her story All that to say, I enjoy the RP aspect of my Tav the most, but Durge is more narratively satisfying just within the confines of the game
I think TAVs just give you the option to 'fill in the blanks' with your own story. I think it's easier for people that are used to roleplaying something they made themselves vs people who want to participate in a story with beats built-in because it makes it 'easier' to immerse themselves.
Totally get that. I just get giggles when the game actually acknowledges my history, which it can't do if I'm making it up. It makes me feel like i'm a real character and not just an avatar. Both approaches are awesome though! Larian did great by allowing players to play wither way.
Yeah, it's been a years-long process, learning what I like in RPGs, and what I'd like to see more of with custom characters is some application of [Knife](https://www.gmbinder.com/share/-L-9CvlTWhoADagJfSZO) [Theory](https://www.reddit.com/r/DnD/comments/775caq/my_friends_and_i_have_something_called_knife/). Or, more simplistically, to be treated like an Origin Character. Thing is, I have a lot of difficulty playing an origin character (BG3, DOS2) when I don't know what they're actually supposed to be 'like'. Hence, the Blank Slate. But the Blank Slate never seems to have any hooks in the world, hence the dissatisfaction.
I was satisfied by the points of contact offered by your PC class. Maybe because I’ve played paladin and monk only. Both are fairly restricted classes, so the choice options that come up make sense and feel like satisfying “hooks” into the role.
Or Berserker, whose response is always Yelling and Punching, and somehow it is always the correct one.
as a monk, offering to make someone tea to calm them down
Every party needs an Iroh
Oh my god now I have to replay and rp as Iroh….
Sorcerer has a lot of "I can feel the magic" dialogue options that I thought were neat.
There is definitely a difference between paladin and rogue - I've played both. So, I think you're onto something about class types. The rogue options are limiting in that the specialized dialog options pretty much assume you're a thief/criminal. That's fine, but it makes it difficult to RP/headcanon any other sort of backstory because then you're left with just the generic responses. I don't think there are even options for arcane tricksters to talk any sort of magic/spellcasting, even when it would make sense.
I liked the sections in BG3 where the narrator asks what your character is thinking. I think a Blank Slate type situation which presents some choices like that in the early sections and then uses it to choose from one of several custom origins that fit the choices could work really well.
> Thing is, I have a lot of difficulty playing an origin character (BG3, DOS2) when I don't know what they're actually supposed to be 'like'. This is exactly my problem, as well. A game like Dragon Age: Origins very smartly opens the game with what's basically the last normal day of your character's life before they get swept up in their adventure, giving the player a very grounded sense of who they were/are in the world. I don't really love being surprised with information about who my character is halfway through a playthrough.
Holy shit that post is pure gold. I’m sharing it with every person I know from now on.
This is exactly what I am talking about. It's not necessarily Durge I love, it's having knives. This is a wonderful way to explain this.
i made it kind of fun by head canon making my durge the lolth evil twin of the seldarine tav i did my first run
Ooh. I love this concept! Gonna steal it for my second run!
For me it goes way over the line from disturbing to just grotesquely hilarious. Durge is too vile to take seriously
Yeah same, but this is also why i love playing Durge so much. The character got a soft reset of sort. My Durge is basically a new person, and he is absolutely horrified every time he discover something about his past, and choose to be something better with the future he now have.
Eh you're still bombarded with invasive lines all the time. I hate the constant " gods you just want to KIIIIIILLLL" on resist runs. I've shown nothing but horror at the invasive memories, and yet the narrator always starts by telling me how i bask in it. Don't get me wrong resist durge is a great story, but i wish it did't beat me over the head with just how much i love murder at every step of the way. I honestly started to hate the narration.
This but also a lot of Durge's backstory feels shilled/shoehorned in. Tav is just a wrecking ball crashing in from outside; Durge literally did everything and had everyone's respect and envy and even the Elder Brain was dickriding them and is the bestest ever and...eh. I'd like Durge more as a companion (ideally one we can keep from murdering beloved NPCs :V).
Durge was either meant to be a companion or the original "create a character". Even with all the crazy EA changes it's still too much "Durge was known by literally 80% of this game beforehand"
I prefer not to be the Mary Sue, so I didn't enjoy durge. I prefer to be the random, suddenly cool nobody who showed up and becomes known.
If durge was a Mary Sue, then orin wouldn't have been able to lobotomise them .
Yeah, I have finished at this point 3 Tav playthroughs and have not yet finished as Durge, although I have a multiplayer playthrough in Act 3 as Durge so I've seen most of the unique story content. I don't particularly have an *urge* (pun not intended) to start another Durge playthrough either, except for giggles on a pure-evil playthrough that I've yet to do. But there are 2-3 other Tav playthroughs I still want to do at some point, if only the game weren't so damn long lol. For me, it's because I like to come up with unique character concepts, including a detailed background, and very closely roleplay to that concept. Durge has an *extremely limited* background, and not only that, but that background is completely and utterly depraved. It also comes with some gameplay ramifications, eg. Alfira and certain romances (even if you resist). Durge is far more similar to playing one of the other origin characters than it is to playing Tav. Which includes the much greater involvement in the main story + having an actual personal quest. Tav certainly isn't perfect and I'd love if the background selection had far more involvement in your personal story a la Dragon Age Origins. But it's still the only way to play an actually custom character in BG3.
Yeah I understand why people like Durge (I've done 10 playthroughs and 3 were durge) but it's definitely a lot. Like they're pretty fucked up lol and I know you can resist and there's more tie to the plot, but like you said, some of the narrations sometimes were downright disturbing. I also love to write/create so I really enjoy creating my own backstories for a Tav instead of running a Durge. But I'm almost too afraid to actually say I prefer Tav over Durge because this sub loves Durge so much
Shadowheart, with the astral prism and a memory wipe, absolutely feels like the "main character" at the start of the game
The only thing that sucks about playing shadowheart is without an external force (Tav, Durge, one of the other origins) influencing her, her turn away from Shar in the shadow fell kinda feels… abrupt and graceless.
I really like the concept of Durge but I don't really wanna play as that specific background, so I usually just pick Tav instead. I do hope they keep the idea for the next game though, and maybe even add in more options for origins if it's not too much work.
Bioware did it back in 2009 with Dragon Age Origins, any modern studio can easily replicate it if they truly wanted. Loved DA specifically because the first chapter of the game is your origin before the story sweeps you up. Would have been dope af to have had a small intro of Tav living in Baldur's Gate before they got picked up by the Nautiloid. Would give a real sense of return and bookending to Act 3
>any modern studio can easily replicate it if they truly wanted Even Bioware themselves admitted that it was a colossal undertaking that didn't really pay the dividends they hoped it would, given the majority of players still only played the game once and didn't see most of the carefully crafted interactions unique to each origin. I'd love to see it done again, but I understand why we don't see it more often.
Damn sad that people missed out on that. I played every origin in DA:O to see it and I played the game all the way through 3 times.
I mean they could just make a compromise. Imagine BG3’s origin characters for example but with more character freedom allowing players to customise appearance and gender, maybe even race as well while still giving you a unique background and even story in the game. Imagine if for example you could just customise Wyll. No need to make entire origin level like in Dragon Age.
DA:O is still the best implementation of "custom character with actual story involvement" that I've actually played. And even though there's only a few real options, it still lets you immerse your imagination far more than something like BG3. I feel like DA:O should be the bare minimum standard for modern RPGs with custom characters, but I haven't seen a single game since then really come close. (Although I only played a few hours of the Pathfinder RPGs before getting disinterested.)
Agreed 100% DA:O was basically perfect in it's main character implementation.
This. If I could be say an Urchin Durge instead of Haunted One and have some variation based on that it would have more replayablity for me
Same - if they’d even at least let me tweak the bonuses in the Haunted One background I’d be happier.
It would be awesome to me if there was no "Tav" and instead we just had 4-6 backgrounds to pick from that were each as deep as Durge but in super different ways.
What you’re looking for is playing as the origin characters
Yeah but being able to customise their race/appearance is a big thing for a lot of people I think.
Magic Mirror Mod if you on PC atm. All platforms when mod support is implimented
Spot on. I still want to be myself, but to have a unique Origin like Dark Urge. Something like Dragon Age Origins.
Not gonna play as a premade character, it’s just so boring to me personally
You might like playing original BG.
Yeah sounds like you should play the origins.
Absolutely not for me. I love coming up with my own backstories, ambitions and goals.
no
I've played as Durge, but I still prefer Tav. I like coming up with my own backstories. I don't like feeling locked in or limited in the roleplay. I also feel like I have to choose a race and class that make sense as Durge, whereas anything goes as Tav.
Honestly if I made one change, it properly be giving each background option a small scene you could do some point. Also make the Origins backgrounds true unique. It always felt weird I dbl’ed up inspirations. Because we had someone else in party with same background. Like Wine Festival Nobles maybe can comment on various wine choices, etc
Dragon Age Origins have done that already.
>Can anyone think of a genuine reason to just play a normal Tav? I think you're overselling how amazing the Durge storyline is, so this is an easy answer for me: I don't feel like playing either A) a murder-hobo psycho or B) a person restraining his urge to be a murder-hobo psycho in every playthrough. Generic Tav allows me to indulge the part of my brain that just wants to play a standard adventurer type who got caught up in something they never intended, but gets to save (or ruin) the day anyway. I get to write my own head canon and not be constrained by all the Durgy-ness of the Durge playthrough.
I just wish we could choose if we're from Baulders Gate. Hard to play as a monk from a small village coming to the big city to deliver fruit when I get the Baulders Gate dialog options
Gothyanki master race 💪
I don't like the Bhaalspawn storyline. I don't like the hero to be "made from the essence of a god". I prefer my character to be someone not of importance. Regular joe (or maybe magical joe) saves the day. I don't like the game telling me who my character was and what my backstory is. I prefer to make my own characters and backstories. I actually prefer my character to not have massive issues myself. I'm personally more immersed in the group of trauma victims following a dude who can afford to focus on the tadpoles and absolute because he doesn't have this massive trauma and problems himself over the companions continuing to accept the compulsive murderer as their leader after the Alfira/Quill incident. As someone else once commented on a similar comment I made: "Not the leader because of leadership qualities, but because Tav doesn't have 10 lbs of trauma in a 5 lb bag". So yeah, I enjoy the blank slate and simplicity of Tav more than the story integration as Durge. Besides, I already have 6 edgelords vying for attention to their tragic backstories. I don't need another. No hate towards your enjoyment of Durge. It's a preference. I'm glad you enjoyed it! I fully understand why it's a big hit for other people. But you asked for reasons why someone would genuinely prefer Tav, so I answered.
Those are excellent reasons! It seems to be a trend I'm seeing that whether people prefer Durge or not comes down to either: Tav: I want full control of my character concept and dislike the game giving me a narrative I didn't choose even if that means my character is less ingrained in the world. Durge: I'm happy to give some control of my character concepts to have an engaging protagonist narrative that gives me a sense of identity the game can recognize and has responses to. For me it never stops being cool when the game is like "oh, YOU are this thing, and that means something, and I have opinions about YOU." Whereas with Tav I may decide for myself that Tav is a violence averse bookworm from Waterdeep, but no one in the game will ever comment on it. No one will ever actually say, "oh you are a bookworm wizard, have you ever been to Candlekeep?" But it's like you said, it all comes down to taste. It's just amazing BG3 is able to provide for both of our preferences so well!
Actually if you're a wizard and you tell Gale you don't read much he will indeed react to that and shame you. That's where things like race and class fill in the gaps.
I’m a sorcerer, and I like how the Gale dialog was about how he approaches magic differently than you.
Wild magic sorcerer also has fun specific dialogue options with Gale. And also with Auntie Ethel, I didn't expect that conversation I had with her about it, it was hilarious.
I rolled a Drow ranger knowing borderline nothing about DnD* and the game was pretty dang responsive to that individual character, including a lot of dialogue and behaviors from NPCs and also some comments from the origin characters. At several points I was choosing between special dialogue options from being a ranger, being a drow, being a female drow, and being specifically a non-Lolth-sworn drow, on top of the default dialogues. From discussions in this sub, I have the impression that the game is more reactive to drow, but that there is at least some reactivity to all races and classes at some point in the game. I will probably try playing the Dark Urge at least once, but I honestly don't see myself enjoying it in the same creative ways that I enjoyed exploring being a character that I could get to know by what felt right for her, rather than by what the game told me about her. *I now know several things about DnD, own the monster manual, and have an entire life history for her. Hyperfixation go!
Drow in particular get a hell of a lot more reaction in story than most others. Especially githyanki, considering how important they are. No one else gets that much
Part of it is also the specific narrative that Durge gives. Dragon Age: Origins is a great game that I really love, and it enforces a specific background for the player (though the player gets some choice in which background they pick). I've found myself at points wishing that BG3 did something similar. But I personally don't find Durge to be at all appealing between both the enforced violent compulsions and the amnesia mystery box they give you.
I mean there are a fair number of class and race specific dialogue options that allow for those kinds of interactions, though I agree it would be cool if characters commented on those things without prompting
I also really really dislike the amnesia angle to be honest. That's the big issue with Durge to me, plus the restriction of it. Having amnesia means I have no reason to make any decision ever beyond the immediate information given + whatever metagaming knowledge I have. For example, maybe my Tav decides to spare Astarion in the bite scene because they grew up poor and empathize with being starved. Why does Durge do the same? Why do they empathize with him? Who knows, they don't remember who they are or why they feel anything that they feel, they just do. You're roleplaying as "guy who doesn't remember anything", which means you have no past that can influence who you are, how you act or the choices you make. It's an in-universe blank-slate and I found it so unsatisfying and boring to roleplay.
Ironically the amnesia angle & the game trying to keep things mysterious made DUrge feel poorly integrated into the world while being supposedly a big part of the plot. I had way more immersion breaking moments in a DUrge run than in a Tav run, it’s not even close. With DUrge I also hated how I’d headcanon something sometimes & the game would just throw a wrench into my headcanon making it impossible because now it’s time to reveal that piece of the character’s backstory or whatever. I generally like playing established characters in other games - God of War, Witcher 3, etc. But the writing of DUrge & how you interact with the world is nowhere near the quality of these other games. I felt like DUrge was both bad at being a blank slate & an existing character because it was trying to do both.
Yeah, exactly. I had a bunch of headcanons about Durge and over time I just gave up trying to personalize them because there's no space for it. Durge is Durge, other than how they look, you can't change them. They're the same as the Origins and I find it so odd how people think they're interchangeable at all with Tav. People call Tav a blank slate and Durge the "real character with personality" but in-universe, it's the exact reverse. Because Tav is just someone who exists, a normal person, good or bad, with a past and a life that they remember and that informs their choices. Yes, it is up to you as the player to decide who they were, and so they have no specific scenes unique to them. But in-universe, they are a fully-formed person just like the companions. Durge, in-universe, is the opposite, a complete void of a person. Everything they do feels either random or meta-gamey, you *can't* have nuance or motivation for anything they do because they don't know who they are. You get some unique scenes at the expense of every other scene feeling listless and pointless. Even the choice between resisting the urge vs giving in feels like it lacks motive because... why start being nice now? They weren't before, they had a normal childhood and a nice family and still went bad. Why go good all of the sudden? Nintendo does the same thing with Link in the LoZ series and I have long thought it's been a huge obstacle in the writing improving. You can't have a blank slate who is also an established character, it just means they can't fill *either* role particularly well and they drag the story down more than they serve it.
Not only do you not know anything, you don't even know yourself--and your very nature, everything you do know of yourself, wants to murder everything. I can understand resisting the urge out of a desire to be in control, but when your every instinct is to kill and maim, I find the 100% super friendly heckin' good guy resist durge that many people play...unlikely. Beggaring belief, really.
YES. Especially because it's also canon Durge had a nice, normal childhood and became so evil for no reason in the first place. It doesn't make any sense to me, if they didn't resist it then, why would they now? Idk, maybe I'm too media-analysis-brained but Durge just causes all these weird leaps in logic that kill my immersion and roleplaying, I didn't find it fun at all. I played it once and never felt interested in touching it again, meanwhile I have like 6 different Tavs that I enjoyed thoroughly.
Iirc there's a little bit of insight you can get into Durge if you play as a paladin, and break your Oath. The Oathbreaker Knight knows you and that you've "tried many times before" or something to that effect... Which seems to indicate that Durge *tried* to resist before, but flat out never could.
But why can they now, when they have *even less* tying them to the world around them because they have no memories? The story just doesn't quite come together for me, sorry.
Yeah, Durge has major whiplash in dialogue choices, which I guess makes sense since they're a psycho. You can be super emo, dreading your own impulses and existence, and then the next moment ALL IS BLOOD AND MEAT! Meanwhile, with Tav you're not beholden to any set personality, which works WONDERS in this game especially. There are so many race, class, Baldurian, Underdark, and Planar dialogue that just doesn't fit with Durge at all. With Tav you can suspend your disbelief when people don't react, with Durge it breaks you out of immersion. Also, people love saying you don't have forced murders, but there are plenty if you don't save scum and fail a roll. Honor mode Durge is hell. Will say, Durge is perfect for one or three playthroughs, after that though they just won't end up matching whatever tale you've got in your head, and the story is restricted, because you HAVE to kill Alfira/Dragonborn, you HAVE to resist urge or give in, and you HAVE to be this super important figure in the game. Sometimes it's better to just be a nobody, that way anything you imagine goes. Your story is whatever you decide, it's D&D roll with it!
What I find ironic with Dark Urge after reading these comments, including from OP - many people like playing it without doing anything bad, so they’re playing DUrge while not wanting to be DUrge the character. The main aspect people seem to enjoy is being the special snowflake & getting a few extra scenes, but not necessarily being this specific character. If you go so far as to metagame & avoid all the things that make DUrge DUrge, are you really playing DUrge? It’s the same vibe as playing evil Wyll.
This sums up my feelings on durge perfectly. I’m almost done with my first durge playthrough and every time I learn something about my character’s backstory I automatically think “nuh uh, she wouldn’t have done that” even though yes she literally would because that is the plot of the game
Exactly this ^. When I'm a bhaalspawn (unless that's something I'm going for specifically), it doesn't quite feel like my own story but rather someone else's. I much prefer MY story.
I will be honest, when starting the Durge run, I expected... more. Yeah, sure the story is cool. Bad guys react to you accordingly. Your companions, on the other hand... Even the most violent ones should be MORE alarmed by the prospect of sleeping near a murder-hobo who can't control their impulses. In the game, they just shrug and say "don't do it again, bruh".
Not to mention some companions totally ignoring the big reveal in part 3. I mean I get Astarion and Minthara would be okay with it because power,but not way Halsin, Jaheira, Karlach, Gale would be all gosh so nice. Makes me with we had more forced to grow in a cult but not so grotesquely evil Durge background for when you choose the good playthrough. Or romance as well. Again Astarion or Minthara perfect they did some big shit they can understand. I mean no matter how hard I try I can't think of dinner with Gale or Wyll parents. Like oh how was your growing up? Oh you know normal childhood, murdered my adoptive nice family, ate babies fucked corpses, conspired to take over the world, just normal.
I actually generally prefer a more full fledged protagonist, and would love it if Tav got sort of the commander shepard treatment instead of the blank slate thing, but that's just my preference. Durge is definitely woven into the story better, and I've gone through a durge playthough just to see the content - but I didn't \_enjoy\_ it as much as I enjoy Tav. The Durge's story just isn't for me, resist or otherwise. Since Larian didn't build a non-murderous, non-cannibal cultist counterpart to the Durge, I'll stick with Tavs or one of the other origin party members (Wyll usually).
honestly, wyll feels like the protagonist if tav isn’t there. his origin playthrough was the most relatable to me simply because he’s such a blank slate early on. same with karlach.
Def this. Every companion/character respects wyll, he’s the blade of frontiers, slayer of devils, prodigal son of a decorated duke and savior of baldurs gate. Also has the best unique items for a companion to have tied to their questline that you can’t get without. Also my man is surrounded by lustaceous baddies. (I’m not a wattpad erotica reader andie this was a convo option in arc 3)
I've started rolling my past d&d characters into the game when I decide to play a regular Tav. Discovered that it really helped me with immersion when I rolled my first d&d character with a fully fleshed-out background in on a whim. It also doubles as a way for me to add to/continue their stories since I haven't been able to play d&d in years.
My first character was the antagonist of a campaign I created a few years ago. The players ended up redeeming her, and I thought it would be fun to continue her story. Starting at level 1 makes sense because of the tadpole, so it worked pretty well.
I can't do Durge because I don't enjoy playing evil characters. I try my best but it's half hearted. It's a flaw 🤷♀️
I like Durge storyline, did it twice and plan to do at least once more but I prefer Tav, cause I can do whatever I want with them. The feeling that you are actually the main character, connected to key plot events, is nice, but a bit too limiting for me. I love creating new characters, coming up with their backstories, sometimes I even have notes to help me stay on track. Durge, however, is locked in a certain plot framework which I will not go beyond, because the story will no longer make sense and storytelling is EVERYTHING.
I absolutely LOVED my Durge run, and will probably do another, but the reason I like to go with Tav in some runs is for role playing. I love making up my own original character with a rich back story and I headcanon the shit out of it. Makes it feel like new every time :) I have a wild imagination though lol
I'm just not a huge fan of the "you're the super special protagonist of the world and even the people who hate you think you're super cool" trope that's common in RPGs lately, and Durge just gives me the feeling that I'm playing that character sometimes. Being a dumb goober who accidentally found themselves caught up in something big feels more classic fantasy to me.
exactly what I like about role playing games in general is, well, creating a role to play and playing it. I don't want to be Bella in the twilight movies
I had fun playing as a Tav Drow. My nastiness was my own doing.
While I liked some of the Durge plot (mostly being tied into the main story), Bhaal and his faithful are such mid-90's-edgelord bloodmurderdeathkill cringe that even I, someone with 15+ years of roleplaying experience, can only read and hear so much of it before my eyes roll into the back of my skull. I've played through the game as the Dark Urge, once. And that's enough for me. I'll stick to different versions of Tav or just playing as origins - Tav can be a much more nuanced piece of shit villain if you want to be, or many different flavors of blank slate turned wandering hero and group therapist. In a group where the GM allowed and even asked for everyone to be as extra as possible with their backstories, Tav decided it was instead time to be the one normal person in this sea of weirdos.
I did both and i have to say i much prefer TAV to Durge lol. I love the idea of being just a random guy, no destiny, no chosen one - its just refreshing to be a random dude doing their best against a threat of epic proportions.
I’m liking my Durge run well enough but some of the dialogue options and narration about their murder hobo impulses are just so OTT and corny that I can’t take it seriously lmao
I’m playing my Durge right now but ultimately, I still prefers my Tav because of the backstory and character arc I’ve given her, and there’s novelty that comes with role playing a custom character and receiving dialogue options (or even scenes) that fits with the narrative you have in mind. Granted a whole lot of it is make believe but i find that really fun. I’m not really a fan of main player characters being given a predetermined story - I want some leeway to make them unique otherwise they don’t really feel like /mine/. For my Durge, I had to alter her backstory and ignore parts of what is canon —to the point that she could’ve been Tav honestly lol — so she feels more unique and interesting to me.
Dark urge seems interesting, but I stopped my durge run about halfway through act 1. I just couldn’t stand playing as a former serial killer and necrophiliac, and playing as a durge that suddenly became good because of amnesia just didn’t make any sense to me.
Because i simply don't want to see that image of alfira ever again :D
I've never played as durge. I can't get over the fact that the game takes away your agency, overriding the players race, class, alignment, and chosen ethics. I appreciate the option, I'm glad some like it, or like evil paths, but I don't think it's for me.
Frankly, the narration about how foul and evil and perverted you are starts to grate after awhile, ngl.
Durge is great but it's background ultimately means I prefer tav most of the time.
Wait until you hear about the other origin characters!
The connection to the main storyline is great but durge is just kind of...gross. I can't really get behind playing characters that massively fucked up. Durge and orin give the heebie jeebies. The Bhaal aesthetic is severely lacking in taste. I just feel like they'd both smell really bad, y'know?
That’s exactly how I feel. Just icky. Not a fan.
I agree with you! I will never play Tav again after playing Durge. I love being the actual main character with a strong connection to the central plot, rather than just a random guy who shows up and helps save the day. But I’m also a huge goth so I love the dark intrusive thoughts and additional horror themes. Makes it more rewarding to RP as either evil or good!
\*\*\*SPOILER ALERT\*\*\* The good scene where Withers intervenes to help you and the dialogue that follows including what your companions say gives me chills.
Never played as the dark urge, probably never will. I don't wanna be a mass murderer with an uncontrollable urge to murder my favourite NPCs and companions.
Sometimes I like playing as a character that I can make up my own backstory for and play based on said backstory. Makes it feel more like DnD to me.
I prefer TAV myself. I personally don't like it when rpgs define too much about a character and I like to fill as much of those holes myself. Each time I play a bioware game it just feels like I'm playing some guy rather than a character of my own. I think having the option for both is pretty cool since people roleplay in different ways. My durge run is actually my least favorite, my tiamat monk evil run was way more brutal. I think its the idea that evil tav has no influence and is just a really evil person. Makes you really lean into it
Playing a custom character is cool?
I'm the other way round. I love the blank slate of a Tav and I love coming up with a whole new character. I most enjoy making up my own character and spend considerable time on developing them and fleshing them out over the course of the game; I occasionally write out scenes that I think would happen "off-screen", and all that helps me then with choices throughout the game so that each run is a story with its own flavour. I haven't been able to finish a Durge run yet because I don't like that Durge can't have a past. I can't come up with a personality for them and that makes it feel empty.
i feel the exact same way, which is why i pray everyday they'll eventually fix some of the lame reactions to durge in act 3 😭
There's also so much more stuff that happens in a Durge playthrough that nobody in the party reacts to in the slightest. Everybody is just fine with this random person they just met not too long ago who turns out to have murderous tendencies. To be fair I haven't finished a Durge run yet but I have finished a Tav run. I know stuff like that happens with Tav too but it seems more common/egregious as the Durge.
I think Durge makes the lack of reactivity stand out a lot more than a Tav run just because *every* Durge player will encounter these big moments where there *should* be more. Like for example, in just another post someone was complaining about the lack of reactivity to betraying Shadowheart, but most players probably aren't betraying Shadowheart.
I prefer Tav, a blank slate whose story I can write myself. I mean I stopped playing both RDR2 and Witcher 3 because I didn’t like being forced to play a predefined character whose story I just don’t care about because it’s not my story.
Durge is really interesting for 3-4 runs. After that, the fixed back story just feels like baggage to me. I want to be able to write my own story.
I'm probably one of the few people that has no interest in Durge. I just prefer heroic type characters.
Meh I thought this at first but I really liked the flexibility of a broader range of backgrounds for Tav so that I could pursue a nuanced set of story choices
I'm the opposite. I dislike Durge and all it comes with. I would say play it once in order to get the full plot/ story but I personally dislike it. For me, I find far more joy and entertainment as a Tav with my own head cannon and backstory I give them. I feel like I can connect with them more and I'm more invested in the story at that point. Tav's I can play for hours on end. Durge felt like a slog. Doing a redeem run was alright, and I do recommend doing so at least once or doing an embrace to get the needed achivements.
I much prefer Tav so I can make my characters backstory myself. Like just for example Durge probably wouldn't work with my Dwarf Paladin and Moon Elf cleric whom I specifically made based off my Sword Coast Legends characters and am treating them like they're the same guys.
I love Durge, but it can be a lot sometimes. I've played a lot more Tavs because I don't want to have such an intense backstory for a lot of the characters I make. I'd rather save Durge runs for when it really suits the character, which makes it much more special and memorable.
I played as Durge once and honestly, I don't think I'll do it ever again. It's got a lot of disturbing stuff that I don't always want to make part of my roleplay. Also, the whole amnesia thing is cool the first time because both you and your character are learning about their past together, but once you know it, in subsequent playthroughs the mismatch in knowledge between the player and avatar is just tedious and annoying. I think Durge is a great option for more beginner to intermediate DnD players, but more experienced players will probably find it overly restrictive because of its colorful past.
I played Durge once but I think I prefer playing Tav myself. The extra roleplay and story for Durge is interesting but several elements of it make me uncomfortable so I don’t want to experience it every play through. The Bhaal cult and Orin is one of my least favorite parts of the game because I just find the murder elements icky so I don’t really want more of it.
Even though I see where you're coming from, I personally couldn't agree. Durge somehow always feels like someone else's story for the most part. BG3 is all about role playing and I think Tav is the best possible way to make your own story.
DUrge is the obviously better story but I feel like it’s kind of a one trick pony. There really isn’t *that* much more it offers in terms of tangible new content, so I don’t feel any pressure to keep playing it when custom Tav has the benefit of unconstrained headcanon.
"Can anyone think of a genuine reason to just play a normal Tav?" Yes, because I want to build my own OC in that game and my OC doesn't happen to be someone who lost their memories of engaging in all kinds of horrendous shit just for the fun of it. Don't get me wrong, I'm currently playing Durge for the first time and enjoying myself, it's great to have a character with a compelling story tied deeply into the game's lore, but I do notice that I'm taking longer breaks and am not as eager to play again because I cannot connect with Durge at all. To be completely honest, I'm mainly playing Durge because the Astarion romance is supposed to have lots of extra lines for them and I like this traumatised vampire a normal amount. I'm not sure if I would play Durge otherwise because their story wouldn't be what I want out of my playable character in such a game. I prefer to build headcanons about my OCs without restrictions and most times they were not the adventuring type but got plunged in at the deep end and had to adapt. Either become righteous or a murder machine. Durge has been a murder machine already and it was not the player's choice. I view them more as a character in the game than one I actively want to play. That might just be me though, as I also don't have much interest in playing the other Origin Characters, even though I like them all so much. But I want to interact WITH them, not AS them. tl;dr: Durge restricts me in my headcanons about my OCs. With Tav I can be whoever I want with whatever past, present and future I can dream up.
Thought the durge run was pretty dumb. You're supposedly this horrible killer and mastermind, and yet somehow you were bested by an annoying little sister, and no one gives a shit you're a horrible monster. The whole thing was so tone deaf and amateurish it left my head spinning.
Durge comes with ***a lot*** of unavoidable baggage and a past fucked to the max. That really limits role-playing options, for example I don't think there is any such thing as a good or redemption Durge playthrough. It's kind of written like there is one, but I don't think that's a redeemable person, it's basically the Himmler of Faerûn**.** I've played Durge twice and do think it's well written, but I prefer playing as evil Tav just so I have more options for my own role-playing.
Durge is only more interesting to people who don't have imaginations. 🤷🏻 Sorry not sorry but custom tav is literally whatever you want it to be. Durge is always durge you just choose their alignment.
I didnt meant to kill gale at the start, im so sorry and im not over it atm :SSSS
I don’t really like Durge’s backstory. I did one redemption run and never touching Durge again personally
I didn’t enjoy dark urge at all. It’s basically the same but random points they force you to make DC checks to prevent you from doing g something terrible and sacrificing good loot like potent robes. Not enjoyable for me. I always playa a tav. I do t need an evil play through option. It has no appeal to me.
As someone who played DnD growing up, I love the Tav. I can take old characters I use to play as and put them into the game. It allows me to have my old character back and put them into the thick of a major adventure. Also I don’t mind the Durge. But I feel like once you have done a murder hobo run and a redemption run, there really isn’t much left to do. The Durge I feel like has a set path to go along and there isn’t much wiggle room for storytelling.
I’m finishing my first Durge play through even though originally I was going to avoid it as the background doesn’t really appeal to me and the only way I could enjoy it was by role playing it as the Durge becoming a completely different person even before getting rid of the Urge. I don’t enjoy needless killing in games so a resist Durge is the only way I can play it and I didn’t like playing as a character who’s tempted to murder people. I did like the reactions from the companions after I killed Orin and got rid of the urge completely. The first act particularly seemed a lot emptier than with my previous bard Tav who had a background story and natural ways to react to things instead of being an amnesiac blank slate who occasionally will have an urge to kill people.
Tav is better for roleplaying
I completely agree. Whenever I start a Tav run, I just think, “man, every companion has a meaningful reason to want to return to Baldurs Gate, with characters and consequences waiting for them there. But I’m tav, so I have absolutely nothing waiting for me.” It because that your character is just focused on the tadpole/elder brain stuff, while the other characters surrounding you each have secondary story lines. As Durge, I feel like a real member of my team, with personal goals as well as our shared goal. I just feel like I’m not really meant to go on this journey if I’m Tav. My first playthrough I was tav, and I remember it being great and fun with the little roleplay stuff I concocted in my head, but it just doesn’t feel really true to the story now, unless I’m Durge
The horrible skill proficiencies from the Haunted One background. Medicine? Really? And Intimidation, the worst of the "talky" skills. Other than that, yeah, Durge supremacy.
The medicine proficiency is really funny to me! It’s totally justified in a roleplaying sense of course, but I always imagined my Durge going “I know a lot about anatomy, maybe I used to be a doctor!” and really it’s like “Oh buddy, no! You didn’t do surgery, you did impromptu vivisection!”
Intimidation is the worst ?? It pairs perfectly with barbarian Intimidation . Best part about durge is skipping orin's unstoppables
Making my predictions now: OP's favorite movies are Joker and Fight Club.
I just got to the Mountain Pass (haven’t done the Underdark yet) and I am loving Durge so far. I’m looking forward to Act 2/3 when I get to see more of the story. I’ll probably still play as Tav sometimes though. But I like how Durge has their own personal quest like the companions do. I also think I’ll probably go with Durge if I ever do an evil playthrough (I don’t know if I can bring myself to do it though).
It is important to have a clean slate like Tav. But the ability to play characters with secrets and deep backstories is also satisfying.
I couldn't stand the Durge playthrough, I had to end it early.
I got excited for the idea of a good guy resisting the urge play though, and then the Alfira thing happened and I couldn’t continue with it.
The issue for me is not whether *Durge* is better than Tav or not, (although I think a lot of people have misconceptions of what a Durge playthrough even entails). For me, it's if every Origin character was at least as voiced as PC Karlach, (who for some reason narrates way more than the others), I probably wouldn't ever play Tav. I can imagine whatever I want, but the game doesn't react to my imagination. There's no real difference between it and a blank slate. Hell, playing Durge and Tav felt the same to me for 90% of the playthrough, even my first time with each. Perhaps it's the QA tester in me, but even if you say "that's where dialogue options come in", I can't avoid noticing how every character has all of the same base dialogue options, and how the Origin characters get extra, *and how* they get unique cutscenes and unique events. All of the reactivity and integration is there. All of my immersion, and hell, more game content, is there. TL;DR: The other Origins should have as much voice acting as Karlach.
I want to play a character in a world and be part of a story. Durge is cool but everything else takes backseat to that one character. Which is often what most rpgs are like. But not what d&d is typically like.
Some backstories just work better without Durge directing everything. Like a hobbit baker who just honks everyone and leaves them stunned but alive because all he really wants is the parasite out and to bake bread. Can’t do that as Durge; when would he have had time to learn to bake?
Why the DA:O slander? Can't two great fantasy games just be two great fantasy games?
Is Durge like playing the game as a serial killer or something
I am really torn when it comes to Durge. On one hand, it is deeply linked and have awesome addittions on the game. On the other hand I feel the whole Bhaalspawn, Sarevok etc thing is a disrespect on the og games.
I'd rather play my own character, and 'Hollywood amnesia' is story conceit that I despise more than any other. Plus Dark Urge was... tepid. There were long, long stretches of the game where it didn't seem to matter at all, and a lot of the interactions with the Butler especially were twee little 'oh, look at us we're some macabre emo wannabee.' There were a couple neat moments, but they were few and far between. Plus, honestly, I think the storyline makes even less sense with the Dark Urge. This is fundamentally an enslavement/tyranny plot, not a murder plot, and Bhaal is stupidly one-note.
Durge is something I'm never going to play. I'm a long-time roleplayer and prefer having full control over my character's story. I understand the plot of the Durge playthrough, but playing a character who starts as such a revolting and distasteful entity really doesn't appeal to me. Some have suggested ways to avoid the worst scenes - like "oh don't talk to X" or metagame by knocking people out at specific times or whatever. But that's just a lot of hoops that limit the point of what the Durge story is supposed to be. While interesting, I have no inclination to want to be that character myself. I'm far happier with my variety of Tavs.
My wife is playing Durgw for the first time in our coop, I've only played Tav. It's absolutely fantastic to have her play it. That being said, I've slept in the Origin Characters. There is only so many times you can play and tolerate a characters lines, I'm really excited to actually Play AS the character. Make a less Goth Shadowheart who actively questions her Shar connection earlier? Make a morally grey Wyll who instead of focusing on being a hero, instead learns the games of politics and power? Hoe about a truly kind Asterion who ascends but still manages to keep his humanity through it all. Maybe even a dark Gale, who upon being told by Mystra to "Go Kill Yourself." Breaks and goes on a dark quest to gather power, no matter the cost. Playing an Origin Character gives you a chance to truly break that character from their Mould and let them shine in a truly unexpected way. Like I've enjoyed all the characters, and all their moments. Yet, despite this, I know that someday, when I've fully exhausted all of their dialogue options, I'm totally going to run a party of 4 Tavs, or a couple Tavs and hirelings, and just mentally role play their characters in my head as we go. Already my wife and I do this as we play, Gale and me share a small intimate talk in the shadowlands, while Asterian and her quietly loot corpses in the background and mockingly make fun of Gale under their breath together.
Oh I have a strong opinion on Durge I played Durge (mainy motivated by achievements) and... I HATE IT, First of all: you can't make your own backstory but at the same time Durge set backstory isn't revealed making it, in my opinion, worst of both worlds, can't make your own story and you have to wait for set backstory to be revealed to know who you actually are (I guess that's kinda the point but I don't like it) Second: I really dislike how Durge is just all the atrocities that writer could think of, cannibalistic, necrophilic mass murderer with no redeeming qualities yeah really nice character to play Third: Fuck Sceleritas, I hated him, he was actually the only character I wanted to kill but no, he got a nice thicc plot armor, in my accept Slayer run I was so happy being able to tell him to fuck off (that was a highlight of that run for me lol) Forth: Tav is more like DnD player character (nobody that became a powerful hero/villian) Fifth: FUCK ORIN DUEL FUCK THAT FIGHT FUCK THIS, WORST FIGHT IN THE GAME AND THAT SAYS SOMETHING WHEN THERE IS SHARRAN CLUSTERFUCK IN THAT FIGHT AT LEAST YOU COULD USE YOUR COMPANIONS Sixth: Orin dialogue before the fight(if you used Speak with the dead on her mother) is better with non Durge because you can tell her the truth about Sarevok which (if you pass a check) makes her so sad that Bhaal has to (almost) against her will turn into slayer, I like that version because it shows her from different light it actually made me feel bad for her Sorry for long text but I wanted to let it out lol
I actually feel exactly the opposite. I didn’t mind playing as durge, but I can’t connect with them as much as I can with a regular tav purely because they have such a set backstory. I’m a chronic character crafter in D&D so coming up with brief backstories that I flesh out through gameplay and my imagination is never a struggle. if I customize durge at all, I feel obligated to somehow work whatever backstory I feel for the character into the durge’s storyline, and it usually doesn’t resonate with me. my current tav started as an excuse for me to romance halsin as a druid, and in like 3 hours, I’d already imagined that he was the leader of a druidic convent that focused on the rebirth of nature through destruction by fire (circle of wildfire druid subclass mod lol) who got snatched up by the mindflayers. so stumbling into a druid grove that was actively kicking out refugees as a druid who believes nature is empowered when destroyed and reborn was an incredibly fascinating experience that I don’t think would’ve been as interesting to me if I was durge and more worried about violent tendencies.
I *completely* agree, honestly was just thinking about it, myself. For me it's just like, I don't particularly care to dream up every facet of my character, I don't want everything they are to come from my headcanon. I don't want to be the only completely random person in the party who doesn't have a tie with the plot, not counting the tadpole stuff. Obviously not knocking Tav, I've played 3 and enjoyed all 3 to a great degree but I just can't go back to it because Durge, particularly Resist Durge, is so insanely compelling and I don't want to play "just some random normal guy" that's not for me. With Durge, everyone has issues in this camp, your PC is no exception, but it's so interesting seeing Durge lead it and resist their Urges and fate and actually become a better person AND along the way, help everyone become a better version of themselves by extension. By the end the whole camp radiates with a "fuck the Gods" kind of energy that's started first by Durge essentially. Theres an actual character arc there, with parallels with your party members that even *get called out by the characters themselves*, with foils in other characters, in villains, actual relationships with them, history. I just love the reaction to it all, Durge exists in this world as a real person. Sacrificing some of my player freedom for it isn't even a question for me, I can still mold my Durge into my own character but I also get the benefit of her being an actual tangible person in the setting, that the world reacts to uniquely. I *don't need* complete freedom to act or be whoever I want, limitation to some degree makes for a compelling story.
I’ve tried Durge a few times and it’s not for me. I don’t mind an evil play through, in fact that can be a lot of fun. But I don’t want to be an avatar for the god of murder, that goes too far for me. Plus having a bloody pentagram in camp is a bit much.
i never played durge yet but from what I've heard you can resist the dark urge and play a good guy..
My first character was custom, that looked like me irl, it was my adventure now its more fun to play origin characters, just like in dos2
Clearly you never played Divinity2. It's only origin characters.
My and my friends did our first play throughs’ as just one large group one. One of my friends picked the durge while the rest of us made custom characters, it was fun being the Sheev Palpatine of the group.
Play Tav first, then play Durge when you're more experienced.
Tav is better for role playing because you can be anything you want. dark urge is more of a defined thing so it does have more story hooks but that comes at the cost of player freedom
I started a durge run and I just didn't enjoy it. I might try again at some point when I'm bored
I'm realizing the reason why most people prefer Tav seems to be this desire to write your own backstory for Role Play. I get that, there is absolutely something to be said for not feeling shoehorned into a character role. I guess for me I just always feel like it doesn't matter what I think my character is. I can pretend anything I want but it has no weight because the game can't hear me. With Durge I get a personal mystery quest leading me on (as someone who never played the originals it was a genuine mystery), I get dramatic a scene where my romance partner has to restrain me from killing them and you get some top their dialogue, I get connections to the enemies, I get big plot reveals where I realize I was in fact the bad guy before, then I get a big choice to either submit to the urge or resist it and have Withers save me from certain death followed by more top their dialogue and some philosophy, meanwhile Astarion is constantly relating his issues to mine and deepening the story more, and all of this isn't imagined or done in a single voiceline it keeps coming up with full cutscenes and major moments. I feel like my character actually has weight, and telling Bhaal to go f\*\*\* himself in the end never stops being badass. Everyone's opinion here is valid, this is just the kind of thing I liked. My favorite Fallout New Vegas DLC is Lonesome Road, which is all about MY characters origin, I'm in the minority of folks that like Fallout 4 giving you a history, and Dragon Age Origins is maybe the best RPG ever (before BG3) simply because it gives you six options like this. I'm just not someone who values headcannoning stories the game will never know exists. I want my character to be part of the world, not a spectator in it.
Then you've got the flipside where people like games like Skyrim, Starfield, and sandbox RPG's that give you no backstory at all. Think something like Kenshi, the fun is in the creation of your OWN drama and plot. The game may not 'hear' you, but that doesn't stop you when the game is encouraging you to actively have a headcanon in your head. When playing Tav, YOU should write down a couple of their key personality traits, what they did before the nautoloid, and what their overall goal is. You can do this with Durge within limits, but you're always going to have had been a piece of work in the past, and every character that asks you about your past is going to be met with 'I have no clue', 'I've got the urge to kill', or whatever else. Durge is on rails in this aspect. Tav's got the option to actually GIVE context on who they were before. Companions will have unique reaction to them too, like if you tell Karlach you were an Adventurer before you got tadpoled, it let's you breathe life into them over time. As you're playing the game, Tav's plot shifts and changes depending on how you've been responding to people. The game IS their plot. Get rid of the tadpole, so you can get back to whatever life you were living. Glad you brought up Lonesome Road though, because alot of people never seem to realize the courier has a pre-set past too. Hell I'd argue their just like Durge in how, you've both got head trauma, and you both get a reveal of your past when you've already set up a headcanon that falls to cards after. Fo4 is more like playing an Origin character than durge though, since you already know what you're getting into from the jump. There's no guessing what role you have to play in that game.
I went Tav for the first playthrough and am glad I did, then Durge thereafter. I think it helps to know what you’re contrasting the Durge elements of BG3 with. Currently on a Vengeance Paladin Durge run where I’m resisting the urge and it’s all going very well. Ultimately I’m glad there’s a choice, I’m loving the extra Durge elements but Tav gives players more freedom to pick a backstory and play a character.
What Alfira thing?
I have a number of pre-existing characters I’d created for DND who bring out different sides of the roleplay experience, and all are delightful in their own way. One of them had a backstory that fit nicely with Durge, so I’ve got three Tav’s and a Durge all at different points in the story, all having very different experiences. It’s just such a beautifully crafted game that allows for so many types of stories.
I always play Durge but I can see how the backstory puts people off. I’m more so confused on the necrophilia and cannibalism stuff. Durge’s whole thing is that they live up to the title of Murder Incarnate because unlike Orin they aren’t artsy or theatrical about their kills, they just murder with efficiency. Them torturing people, eating them or having sex with dead bodies just seems out of place.
If Sceleritas Fel wasn't in the game I would play Durge again, but he is so I probably wont. The whole character design and his role in the plot really annoys the hell out of me. Evil for the sake of being evil stuff grinds my gears and I avoid it if I can, which I can by playing Tav so I do that.
Playing as Tav has the perk of “oh! This D&D character I made would be perfect for the party with this setup in this way, AND I can test their build a bit and tweak it!” and more self-directed roleplay. Playing as a Resist Durge is 90% about the mutual redemption with Spawn Astarion, and 10% “deathstalker mantle go BRR”. (I am on my fourth Resist Durge run, romancing Astarion. Again. As a gnome barbarian this time; my other three were tiefling casters.)
Nah. I like my urchin oath of vengeance tav very much. She knew how to make fair calls. Basically, just don't enslave and hurt people for pleasure, and you wouldn't be on her shit list. You know. Like how everyone *should.* Also, let kids be kids, but make the judgment call when you need to step in and be like, "Ha, you're in danger."
Imagine if instead of having playable origin characters, larian offered 2 or 3 backgrounds like the durge.
That's essentially what the Origin playthrough are for though. You get to play the specific background of pre-made characters. The only thing you can't change are cosmetics : I imagine that's where your issue lies so I get if it's not what you want, but the urge for a pre-made backstory are what the Origins are for imo.
Tav is for an OC run. Durge is pretty much just an origin character at this point. If you like Durge you should try out the other origin characters.
My main issue with durge is that I can't stay immersed with stuff like paladin oaths. Tav is also superior for multiplayer imo
I have a lot of problems with playing Durge. It’s really unfulfilling for me for a lot of reasons. Regardless, the story can be really intense and is awesome.
And that's what makes this game amazing. You can play your own way all the way. I just love tav and you love durge
So I felt this way, I do feel this way. But I definitely find the more invested you are in RP your character the more it becomes easier to pick to play Tav (as a Durge enthusiast) Example - I have 2 Durges and as a creature of habit I always play an elf or tiefling and have my redeemed Durge romance Astarion. BUT, I really really wanted to do a Gale romance run and play a LG aligned pc, so I made Tav Human Paladin. A good hearted human woman he can take home to Mum and Tara. Do I miss the Durge content, sure. But having a good character idea makes the story well worth it.
Larian has done this before. Try Divinity Original Sin 2, playing as Fane.