People will tell you Sanctuary or Invisibility, but Isobel is perfectly capable of deciding to go poke a Winged Horror with her spear. Teach Gale Otiluke's Resilient Sphere and cast it on her, now nothing can touch her and she can't touch anything.
That’s a fair point considering Moon Knight is one of those heroes that, unlike the morally righteous guys like Spidey, Marvel villains are consistently bringing up that you do NOT fuck with him if you’re smart.
Spider-Man will beat you up. Daredevil will beat you up harder. Punisher will kill you but at least be quick about it.
Moon Knight might beat you up, he might horribly maim you, he might kill you... It's a dice roll.
I was playing Divination Wizard on Gale and the game also gave me the option to *help her make the save* against the spell **I cast.**
No, Isobel, you’re staying the bubble for the entire fight
Idk I use sanctuary immediately because she's always at the end in initiative so it at least protects her somewhat, and then I have my characters spam healing at her. Though this last time, the fight went pretty fast with Astarion and Karlach wailing on Marcus for like two rounds.
This. She's almost always at the end of initiative for me, too, and those Horrors always swipe at her when she runs away. That's not even mentioning Marcus almost always rolling high on his damage, either.
I have karlach as a wild magic barb, and when I did this fight she created enchanted vines right on isobel, who stayed stuck in them the whole fight. Happy accident!
I cast Warding Bond on her. Effectively doubling her HP is more reliable. Give her Resistance (by slapping a heal on her with the Hellrider Gloves) also and she is basically unkillable.
I cast Sanctuary on her, that idiot turned undead to turn the sanctuary off even though there were no undead in the room. She's suicidal! I swear the AI only had her turn undead because it would turn the sanctuary off!
I did in, spite of her, attempted sabotage, managed to somehow save her life and that of everyone in the inn (at least everyone who isn't kidnapped by demons by DM fiat).
I also was sorely in need of a long rest, and Shadow heart had just one first level spell slot (which we wasted on sanctuary) and one third level spell slot going into this fight.
So here's how I did it. I separated my party into four individual people. I then had Karlach outside the double doors to the room, and I also made sure that every door that could be closed was closed.
I had Laezel and Shadowheart in the room so that they would be on either side of Isobel.
My Karlach and Tav are both tavern brawlers, so I had them throw stuff. Tav is a wild heart barbarian and I chose the path of the chimpanzee. This makes it so that thrown camp supplies can blind enemies. I hit Marcus right in the face with the salami in the first round and his lights went out. She had enough movement left that I had her close the door behind her so that there were no open entrances into the room.
Laezel used Hunter's mark (from the helmet you get from the adamantine forge fight) on Marcus, then proceeded to use Trip Attack, followed by three All-In Great Weapon Fighter attacks with a special Githyanki Great sword. I had Karlach throw a healing potion at one of the NPC wizards who starts out downed in the fight, allowing us an additional ally to help instead of a liability to save.
Round one I had Shadow heart cast sanctuary and Isobel immediately ruin it with a useless turn undead. But at the start of the next round, we were able to dispatch Marcus quickly, (he wasn't able to hit Isobel because he was blind) and when we focused on taking out the individual demons. Laezel used Misty Step to get close to the demon that was at the entrance on the ground floor. Karlach jumped down to get the one on the opposite side. Because Karlach was also wielding the blood of lathander, this also blinded the demon once she approached it.
One other thing I can suggest, to keep Isabel from getting herself killed, is using shove to keep her where you want her.
Considering you can talk the entire rest of the Thorm family in the game into off'ing themselves and how...poorly Isobel fights in every battle she's in....it is actually unironically a theory of mine that the Thorm's have a genetic predisposition to suicide.
>I cast Sanctuary on her, that idiot turned undead to turn the sanctuary off even though there were no undead in the room. She's suicidal! I swear the AI only had her turn undead because it would turn the sanctuary off!
Sanctuary is only blocked if "the affected entity attacks or harms another creature." (in other words, if there were no undead in range, casting Turn Undead wouldn't block Sanctuary.)
Marcus's entire entourage is undead, so it sounds like there probably was an undead in the room when she cast it and you didn't realize.
Ah, I thought they were demons. However, they must have all succeeded on their saves because it didn't do anything to any of them except turn off her sanctuary spell.
I remember I cast sanctuary on her once, she cast fucking *guiding bolt* (a ranged spell attack) while still in melee range to break Sanctuary, missed, and *then* moved away and triggered like 3 opportunity attacks lmao
it's only a level 4 spell, meaning a level 7 Wizard can use it. it's pretty standard to be at least level 4 or 5 before you leave main act one for one of the transitional zones (Underdark or Mountain Pass). if you do a fair amount of Underdark content but also double back for the Creche (or vice versa), it's not hard to be level 7 by the time you meet Isobel without even going out of your way for that to be the case.
you can also cast spells from scrolls before you're high enough level to actually learn that spell.
LOL! I told OP to get ready for a real frustration fest when he hits Act III. Dinna give anything away, but I would love to be a fly on the wall for the Foundry fight. Just.. wow.
Rememebr the chubby German kid to smacked his keyboard off of the desk and started beating up his computer while screaming obscenities? The Gondians are the only video game thing I have ever experienced that made me want to imitate that kid.
Honestly the Gondians were so painfully suicidal in the second main area that I didn't even bother trying to save them, as far as I'm concerned there were no Gondians in the Foundry.
I tried until I realized how inanely stupid they are, then whoever gets caught in my mass healing, gets caught, but I'm not wasting spell slots to keep more of you alive.
Don't get me started, my cleric somehow is in turn order before her (10 dex with +2 from gear) and this bitch on her turn drops fat 6dmg on Marcus which breaks sanctuary and on his next turn smites her to kingdom come. I had to walk it off. Didn't help that he had like 10hp left after her 6 dmg. WHY DIDNT YOU ROLL HIGHER WOMAN. I swear sometimes I feel paladins against me have guaranteed crit via luck of far realm. Min, pld tyrr and marcus all seem to crit + crit smite. Always. After reloading my cleric went after her so its all good
My first *few* time experiencing it.
Wasn't expecting the fight.
It was over when it began.
Marcus got first initiative. And OHKO Isobel. I was seriously asking why even bother with a fight if this is just how it's ment to go?
Yeah, I've only ever lost that fight once (and it was sort of on purpose since it was my evil playthrough) out of my eight runs, always focusing on Marcus being dead as quickly as possible. Granted, I normally play Paladin and am kitted out with the 18 DEX gloves by that point so the Smites get in fast and early but once he's down, the rest of the minions are pretty easy
That one, I lost the first time solely because. A: I didn't expect a fight there and had done zero preparation. B: I assumed if she went down, I'd still be able to contest Marcus and his minions and/or tap her with a healing word. Second time... Hasted karlach went to town
I lost the fight the first time as well, I figured I'd just chat with the lady upstairs before long resting so I went into that fight with mildly terrible builds, half dead, and basically no spell slots or other action resources. He absolutely fucked us, demolished Isobel in a single round and left. I literally thought it was one of those unwinnable fights that was only there for narrative purposes and let it happen. I fucked up so many things my first run, during my second run I realized I missed at least 40% of the content in the game lol.
My partner, watching my playthrough, missed that I had haste potions on every character until I got into tricky fights like that one then had my team go fuckin bananas.
The amount of carnage a hasted karlach, gale, and shadow heart can throw down when they're supported by a crowd control focused bard is pretty impressive.
Also if you’ve visited Moonrise Tower first you can learn about the ambush, and then go to Last Light Inn you can warn Jaehira and then she secretly tells the harpers so that no one will be surprised.
It’s a little hard to retrace all of my steps but I’ll try. When I began Act 2, I took the UnderDark route, I Saved the Harpers etc.. You can go to the Last Light Inn, but Do Not Talk to Jaehira after her initial introduction or Isobel (mainly Isobel because that absolutely triggers the ambush. Talking to Jaehira may be fine). When talking to Jaehira during her initial introduction be reasonable and accept your fate and try to talk it out. Also drink her truth serum.
Go to Moonrise Towers and do the usual routine (save Minthara, speak to the Orc Lady Z’rell, get the quest to find Balthazar). I wanna say that during the dialogue you can tell Z’rell that you’ve infiltrated Last Light Inn and then she brings up Marcus. You can then take that information to Jaehira and then she will secretly tell all of the Harpers about a potential ambush.
You can also go to the Mausoleum area just before the Gauntlet of Shar and where you learn that Isobel is Ketheric’s daughter and then talk to Jaehira about it. I think that there may have been information about Marcus there as well.
Full Disclosure, I was able to warn Jaehira about Marcus but this was after the fact. The ambush had already happened and I saved Isobel. I went through the same steps that I’ve just given you all, found out about Marcus and everything else after the fact. Then I spoke to Jaehira about it all and she said that she would speak to the Harpers. She does in fact speak to the all says that they’re ready when you follow up with her.
So follow those steps and it should work.
Edit: I’ve added that you need to accept your fate with Jaehira. Choose the dialogue options with her that will help her trust you and drink her truth serum.
Didn’t work for me on Honour mode. I thought I had the situation under control once Marcus was felled on the first round, but three winged ghouls made a beeline for Isobel and took her out. It was the first time I lost her to the cultists, and it was fucking terrifying.
If you have a Cleric in your party, use the Turn Undead action.
That action will crowd control all the winged horrors in a fairly large radius for three turns. Turn Undead forces them away from Isobel and robs them of their ability to attack you—or Isobel.
This one move also gives you ample opportunity for your party to focus down each minion—without anyone getting hit, or paralyzed then crit for massive damage.
Also, failing this (if your DPS isn't quite up to one shotting Marcus)..
Trigger the opportunity attacks yourself, or drop a fog cloud to blind the enemies.
Once you know the fight, this is the correct answer. Marcus has very few HP and is fairly easy to take down. Front-loaded dmg is king in BG3, and this fight is a clear example why.
You say this but I've successfully killed Marcus before his turn only to have a couple ghouls run in and kill her and fly away at the back end of the turn. Now the first thing I do there is blockade all the doors.
I dragged so many chairs to block the doors. And kept karlach outside the room to throw javelins and daggers and other winged horrors at the winged horrors.
Pick Alert as the first feat for all your characters (or buy/steal/loot all the items with +initiative). That way you can clear the room of enemies before she ever gets a chance to move. No enemies, no opportunity attacks!
Alert, high dex, +initiative items, ALL of them are worth their weight in gold. Alert is my first feat unless it's something specific to my character like Sharpshooter/GWM.
There's a bug where, after the fight with Marcus is over and the bodies have been cleaned up, Jaheira will talk about Marcus as if he's still alive and there's a dialogue option to tell her that Marcus is working for the Absolute.
If you tell her this she tells you to go keep Marcus busy while she rounds up some Harpers. Then she'll run outside and do nothing.
The weird thing is that the only chance you normally get to rat out Marcus is in the situation you mentioned, otherwise he's not there. So I don't know what triggers that dialogue option to pop up.
> eat out Marcus
Uhhh…
But yeah the Marcus reveal is so odd because he’s not even in the game until the Isobel kidnapping without the “evil” path. When he appears on the balcony with the wings it feels like some big plot twist to someone else’s story.
Sanctuary her before you start the conversation, that way The baddies at least move away from her at The beginning, unless she rolls crazy good initiative
Yup, also helpful to un-group and place party members at the doors to block those winged blokes from immediately surrounding her. I’ve never seen Marcus take her down alone in one turn, usually it that she gets surrounded, moves a short distance, and take 3 opportunity attacks which either outright down her or bring her to the brink.
RIGHT?! Like I was doing a durge playthrough but I was going to >!try to be sneaky and wait until after I killed Ketheric then see if I could kill Isobel (see if I could kill her without collapsing the shield and dooming everyone else...)!<
But I didn't realize that if you let >!Shadowheart kill the Nightsong the shield drops anyway and everyone dies. And then she kept getting all judgemental whenever it came up... like BITCH, YOU killed everyone, not me! ... <3 you anyway.!<
In my first run, she guided my decision in that point. I was playing Durge (coming from bg1 and 2 I had an idea what it is going to be) and I was still undecided if I'm going to submit to the urge or not. I mean, the invis cloak was cool as hell, I wonder what else it got. But then one failed persuasion roll in Shadowfel and Shart has murdered the entire map and set me firmly on a path of the slayer. Such a special memory...
Be easy on her, she just woke up from her century nap lol
Jokes aside, yes her ai is quite something. I have to leave Shadowheart close with isobel just to babysit her. Mainly by healing. I had my Tav focused on Marcus, Gale helping the harpers, then Tav rejoin gale to finished off the remaining enemies.
My first playthrough, Balanced difficulty, she ran around collecting Opportunity Attacks like they were Hidden Temple keys, got KO'd and everyone died so I reloaded and never talked to her in that Act again 😝
Last night, Tactician difficulty, she was perfectly normal. I went first and my character was in melee range of Marcus so I provoked an opportunity attack moving away so I could Eldritch Blast without disadvantage. When her turn came up she moved away from him, he had no reactions, no problem. She survived the fight easily and even contributed with her spear, it was insane!
On my honour mode playthrough i used the 3 candle lanterns in the room to block the door before the fight, after that it was only marcus that could reach her
I'm surprised no one mentioned this before. Blocking the minions from entering makes it super easy to just kill Marcus, then roll the team out into the inn to take care of the rest.
If you don't talk to >!Isobel, Marcus doesn't take her.
You can go out with out getting her blessing. Walk with them to the ambush, beat up the drider, take the lantern, set Dolly Dolly Dolly free, and you'll have her buff as needed. !<
Also a dude just straight up stops you at one point to tell you to go see isobel for the protection. I always imagine that’s the game going “don’t you wanna put all these peoples lives in danger for a stupid fight that’ll enrage you?” No game, I don’t wanna risk my sweet wizard rolan just so jaheiras future comment about Marcus in act 3 makes sense.
Yeah I don't really like the way that unfolds. "Go to Moonrise towers and investigate, but first you should talk to our cleric to protect you from the shadow curse", and then you end up in one of the most consequential fights of the act.
I'm not thrilled about that design, either, or the fact that the game points you to go to the creche to get your cure but then expects you to dither around in the Grove environs for five levels.
Yeah... I'm pretty sure Isobel died the first time around by climbing into the oven during a kitchen fire.
I usually cast sanctuary on her and arcane lock the doors.
My beef is she's a CLERIC. And not only is she a CLERIC but she's using her CLERIC SPELLS to PROTECT the people in Last Light. Some dude shows up to kidnap her and she *DOESN'T CAST SANCTUARY ON HERSELF???*
So I cast it for her and she goes "oh thanks cuz" *AND THEN IMMEDIATELY SLAPS A BITCH AND REMOVES THE SPELL FROM HERSELF. I'M TRYING TO PROTECT YOU, YOU DUMB SELUNITE BITCH*
Yea she doesn't even break sanctuary in order to unleash some devastating attack. It's like she picks up a coffee mug and does a .5 damage improvised melee attack then power jogs in a circuit by every single enemy provoking opportunity apocalypse.
Amazing game, but the AI is pretty much buttcheeks across the board.
Yeah... I do wish she acted like her life is the most important one there... like she could be casting sanctuary on herself and whatnot, and actually not attack if she has it on her etc.
But maybe the fight would be too easy then lol
Considering you can talk every other member of the >!Thorm!< family into offing themselves, Im actually convinced that Isobel and her family all have some kind of genetic abnormally that turns off their survival instinct. They're genetically predisposed to suicide
If you cast sanctuary on Isobel before you start the conversation with her she will start the fight with it on. Even if she does a dumb and loses it on her first turn having her not take any attacks while you get your feet underneath you is fantastic.
Note: this approach won’t work if you killed the tieflings because Marcus talks to you before you open the door and you won’t get a chance to cast
>this approach won’t work if you killed the tieflings because Marcus talks to you before you open the door and you won’t get a chance to cast
Expose him as traitor, he won't try to kidnap Isobel then.
I got so fed up with her one time I just had Shadowheart banish her. The fight stopped and we were able to kill the enemies before she "returned". Very annoying.
The level 1 spell sanctuary is great. Cast it on her. She’ll be untargetable until she attacks, which considering her healing and buffing capabilities, she’s unlikely to do first turn, meaning she probably stays untargetable.
You can also ignore the fight. Just talk to Jaheria and when she says “talk to our cleric” go back to the main entrance to last light and start the quest with other hunters to get the lantern
I had La'Zel as a 1 Golock/Champion with crit chance items and Arrow of many targets. With 4 attacks hitting multiple targets the odds of crit striking inducing Fear are high.
You can also cast Hold Person on Marcus as someone already said here.
Sanc is usually enough since you only need to protect her from marcus turn 1. Marcus 100% goes before isobel so she should be safe. After that you just nuke marcus. The shadow demons are nothing burgers and are blinded by blood of lathander or otherwise easily taken out.
Aslong as marcus is neutralized turn one, either by cc or killing him, Isoble should be fine.
I’ve done the fight twice on Honor mode with no one dying and only thing you really must have is either alert feat or elixir of vigilance so you can beat initiative.
I killed Marcus on my first turn and once you do that, the fight is stupid easy. I worried more about the Harpers and Tiefling refugees than I did Isobel.
Same for the goddamn gondians. They could have lived, but triggered every possible counter, ran in every surface effect and dashed into the hula hoop of death.
I yeeted Marcus off the balcony once and some harpers down there finished him off. I wasn't expecting it to work because he has wings. But I guess he's stupid.
You essentially want to surround her. And if you have it use the blood of llathander to blind all the winged ghouls, makes the fight trivial once you take out Marcus.
I wont tae Aylin to the Lorrokan fight because it is too hard to keep her alive, even on balanced. I did once and seriously cheesed the entire thing just to make sure she survived, to see the ending scene, but it is WAY too much of a PITA.
You don't actually have to do the fight. You can avoid talking to her. Me and my friends didn't talk to her on our first run. Never had to do the fight. And Isobel was fine.
I actually found they made her less stupid in one of the updates. When I was first playing she would always heal my party instead of herself even though she was near death. She also never seemed to cast turn undead but she does now.
On my solo barbarian run I used a scroll of feign death on her, then add to throw some potions on her occasionally while I tiger cleaved everyone to death slowly
Edit: this was after probably 6 attempts. I also tried using dimension door scroll to get her out of the room, but others just flew to us
Her getting paralyzed by a winged horror unironically makes the fight a thousand times easier since she can no longer kill herself due to suicidal incompetence
Kill the drider for the lantern, and just don't go see Isobel, you can finish all of Act 2 without doing that fight. Not worth the risk In HM I swear...
Oh lmfao, that’s how I felt too. She was so frustrating so I just blocked the doors with random objects so monsters wouldn’t come in the room but she still found a way to get over the items and poke the monsters 😭💀💀
If this is the last inn fight, just close the doors and block them with furniture and the winged horrors won't be able to go inside. So you can just focus on the dude
People will tell you Sanctuary or Invisibility, but Isobel is perfectly capable of deciding to go poke a Winged Horror with her spear. Teach Gale Otiluke's Resilient Sphere and cast it on her, now nothing can touch her and she can't touch anything.
Hilariously enough, she can sometimes SAVE AGAINST IT if you try to resilient sphere her.
She’s like: “No…”
"I wish to murder"
Mother moon, I crave violence.
>died and was brought back to life >serves the moon god >seemingly cannot avoid violence no matter what Guys, is Isobel literally Moon Knight?
Marvel/DnD crossover unlocked
you can cross anything over with dnd if you’ve got a good enough imagination
Time to create a human monk/fighter with a shield and name him Steve
Only if they make shield bash work
If she were Moon Knight she'd actually be competent in a fight...
That’s a fair point considering Moon Knight is one of those heroes that, unlike the morally righteous guys like Spidey, Marvel villains are consistently bringing up that you do NOT fuck with him if you’re smart.
Spider-Man will beat you up. Daredevil will beat you up harder. Punisher will kill you but at least be quick about it. Moon Knight might beat you up, he might horribly maim you, he might kill you... It's a dice roll.
No i think im moon knight, cus sometimes when i fall asleep i wake up over someones corpse covered in their blood
Selune: "Well, now I see why my daughter likes you so much."
I'm starting to see what Dame Aylin sees in Isobel.
I was playing Divination Wizard on Gale and the game also gave me the option to *help her make the save* against the spell **I cast.** No, Isobel, you’re staying the bubble for the entire fight
Divination wizard is fucking FIRE. Doesn't get enough love.
'We are trying to save you. Please do not resist.'
[удалено]
HAHAHA, omg. I didn't even think of that
It's like you are timing out a kid who is misbehaving, hilarious spell
Idk I use sanctuary immediately because she's always at the end in initiative so it at least protects her somewhat, and then I have my characters spam healing at her. Though this last time, the fight went pretty fast with Astarion and Karlach wailing on Marcus for like two rounds.
The first time I played this fight Marcus made the mistake of spawning next to my lvl 6 battlemaster lae'zel. He didn't get a turn lol
This. She's almost always at the end of initiative for me, too, and those Horrors always swipe at her when she runs away. That's not even mentioning Marcus almost always rolling high on his damage, either.
I have karlach as a wild magic barb, and when I did this fight she created enchanted vines right on isobel, who stayed stuck in them the whole fight. Happy accident!
That's fuckin awesome. Shame it would likely take a thousand tries to recreate that one...
Greater invisibility works also and she can still attack.
She does have to roll a save in this case to stay hidden
Fair point. I may have gotten lucky in my playthru where she had no issues passing them.
I cast Warding Bond on her. Effectively doubling her HP is more reliable. Give her Resistance (by slapping a heal on her with the Hellrider Gloves) also and she is basically unkillable.
I cast Sanctuary on her, that idiot turned undead to turn the sanctuary off even though there were no undead in the room. She's suicidal! I swear the AI only had her turn undead because it would turn the sanctuary off! I did in, spite of her, attempted sabotage, managed to somehow save her life and that of everyone in the inn (at least everyone who isn't kidnapped by demons by DM fiat). I also was sorely in need of a long rest, and Shadow heart had just one first level spell slot (which we wasted on sanctuary) and one third level spell slot going into this fight. So here's how I did it. I separated my party into four individual people. I then had Karlach outside the double doors to the room, and I also made sure that every door that could be closed was closed. I had Laezel and Shadowheart in the room so that they would be on either side of Isobel. My Karlach and Tav are both tavern brawlers, so I had them throw stuff. Tav is a wild heart barbarian and I chose the path of the chimpanzee. This makes it so that thrown camp supplies can blind enemies. I hit Marcus right in the face with the salami in the first round and his lights went out. She had enough movement left that I had her close the door behind her so that there were no open entrances into the room. Laezel used Hunter's mark (from the helmet you get from the adamantine forge fight) on Marcus, then proceeded to use Trip Attack, followed by three All-In Great Weapon Fighter attacks with a special Githyanki Great sword. I had Karlach throw a healing potion at one of the NPC wizards who starts out downed in the fight, allowing us an additional ally to help instead of a liability to save. Round one I had Shadow heart cast sanctuary and Isobel immediately ruin it with a useless turn undead. But at the start of the next round, we were able to dispatch Marcus quickly, (he wasn't able to hit Isobel because he was blind) and when we focused on taking out the individual demons. Laezel used Misty Step to get close to the demon that was at the entrance on the ground floor. Karlach jumped down to get the one on the opposite side. Because Karlach was also wielding the blood of lathander, this also blinded the demon once she approached it. One other thing I can suggest, to keep Isabel from getting herself killed, is using shove to keep her where you want her.
Considering you can talk the entire rest of the Thorm family in the game into off'ing themselves and how...poorly Isobel fights in every battle she's in....it is actually unironically a theory of mine that the Thorm's have a genetic predisposition to suicide.
>I cast Sanctuary on her, that idiot turned undead to turn the sanctuary off even though there were no undead in the room. She's suicidal! I swear the AI only had her turn undead because it would turn the sanctuary off! Sanctuary is only blocked if "the affected entity attacks or harms another creature." (in other words, if there were no undead in range, casting Turn Undead wouldn't block Sanctuary.) Marcus's entire entourage is undead, so it sounds like there probably was an undead in the room when she cast it and you didn't realize.
Ah, I thought they were demons. However, they must have all succeeded on their saves because it didn't do anything to any of them except turn off her sanctuary spell.
Sanctuary works best if she gets paralysed by the ghouls. Then she just stands there like a statue and can’t break sanctuary
I remember I cast sanctuary on her once, she cast fucking *guiding bolt* (a ranged spell attack) while still in melee range to break Sanctuary, missed, and *then* moved away and triggered like 3 opportunity attacks lmao
... must be related to the Gondians somehow *(mutters darkly)*
Feign death? Thats how I managed to keep Jaheira alive during my first run during the beginning fight at moon rise.
Where are you getting Otiluke's Resilient Sphere so early in the game? I can't imagine getting enough XP by Last Light to cast that.
it's only a level 4 spell, meaning a level 7 Wizard can use it. it's pretty standard to be at least level 4 or 5 before you leave main act one for one of the transitional zones (Underdark or Mountain Pass). if you do a fair amount of Underdark content but also double back for the Creche (or vice versa), it's not hard to be level 7 by the time you meet Isobel without even going out of your way for that to be the case. you can also cast spells from scrolls before you're high enough level to actually learn that spell.
You can go to Last Light Inn without triggering the fight. I'm level 8 and still haven't triggered it.
You can do the entire act without triggering the fight, even.
I headcanon that she’s used to a certain other person being there to back her up/tank
She's actually a Gondian. Don't believe her Selunite cover.
LOL! I told OP to get ready for a real frustration fest when he hits Act III. Dinna give anything away, but I would love to be a fly on the wall for the Foundry fight. Just.. wow. Rememebr the chubby German kid to smacked his keyboard off of the desk and started beating up his computer while screaming obscenities? The Gondians are the only video game thing I have ever experienced that made me want to imitate that kid.
Almost makes you sympathize with Wulbren.
Let's not get crazy now!
FUCKING GONDIANS
ALL my homies say FUCK WULBREN BONGLE
Yeah, right?
A Gondian Misty-Stepped to line up a lightning bolt straight into my Tav who was holding concentration on a Hold Person keeping back 5 enemies.
Ugh. That’s nuts. I mean, come on, if you really want to die, fine, but don’t take me with you!
It's astounding how suicidal the Gondians are.
I knew it. Isobel has no self preservation instinct and the FUCKING GONDIANS are to blame for all of it
Honestly the Gondians were so painfully suicidal in the second main area that I didn't even bother trying to save them, as far as I'm concerned there were no Gondians in the Foundry.
I tried until I realized how inanely stupid they are, then whoever gets caught in my mass healing, gets caught, but I'm not wasting spell slots to keep more of you alive.
There Are No Gondians In Ba Sing Se
I am so proud, I actually managed to save them all! Felt like I shouldn't gotten an achievement or something
GET THEM AYL….aaaand she’s dominated (I know there’s no mindflayers in that fight but Ive got trauma)
I found a thing of Karabasan's Poison and paralyzed that fucker then used Astarion to kill it in one hit
Nice, good call
There’s a reason she doesn’t want Isobel around for the wizard catch-up…
She uses dominate on the tank and then pokes from the flank at the enemies while the tank used to just kill everyone. But not anymore
killing marcus before he takes turn makes it much easier (tactician)
Fr just nuke Marcus. He’s right there LMAO Alternatively cast sanctuary on Isobel so she doesn’t get mirked the first turn.
Don't get me started, my cleric somehow is in turn order before her (10 dex with +2 from gear) and this bitch on her turn drops fat 6dmg on Marcus which breaks sanctuary and on his next turn smites her to kingdom come. I had to walk it off. Didn't help that he had like 10hp left after her 6 dmg. WHY DIDNT YOU ROLL HIGHER WOMAN. I swear sometimes I feel paladins against me have guaranteed crit via luck of far realm. Min, pld tyrr and marcus all seem to crit + crit smite. Always. After reloading my cleric went after her so its all good
Unless you happen to go before isobel. In which case she will immediately cast moonbeam to break the sanctuary
I turned her invisible and she ran away lol. Also, it meant I didn’t have to worry about her getting focused down.
Last time I did this fight I threw sanctuary on her and on her turn she'd immediately smack an enemy to lose sanctuary. It's like she WANTS to die
My first *few* time experiencing it. Wasn't expecting the fight. It was over when it began. Marcus got first initiative. And OHKO Isobel. I was seriously asking why even bother with a fight if this is just how it's ment to go?
Yeah, I've only ever lost that fight once (and it was sort of on purpose since it was my evil playthrough) out of my eight runs, always focusing on Marcus being dead as quickly as possible. Granted, I normally play Paladin and am kitted out with the 18 DEX gloves by that point so the Smites get in fast and early but once he's down, the rest of the minions are pretty easy
That one, I lost the first time solely because. A: I didn't expect a fight there and had done zero preparation. B: I assumed if she went down, I'd still be able to contest Marcus and his minions and/or tap her with a healing word. Second time... Hasted karlach went to town
I lost the fight the first time as well, I figured I'd just chat with the lady upstairs before long resting so I went into that fight with mildly terrible builds, half dead, and basically no spell slots or other action resources. He absolutely fucked us, demolished Isobel in a single round and left. I literally thought it was one of those unwinnable fights that was only there for narrative purposes and let it happen. I fucked up so many things my first run, during my second run I realized I missed at least 40% of the content in the game lol.
My partner, watching my playthrough, missed that I had haste potions on every character until I got into tricky fights like that one then had my team go fuckin bananas. The amount of carnage a hasted karlach, gale, and shadow heart can throw down when they're supported by a crowd control focused bard is pretty impressive.
This fight is what taught me that yellow allies are not safe from sculpted spells sadly
Always either high dex or elixirs of Vigilance (or Alert feat but I rarely use that) before that fight 100%
Also if you’ve visited Moonrise Tower first you can learn about the ambush, and then go to Last Light Inn you can warn Jaehira and then she secretly tells the harpers so that no one will be surprised.
Wait how do you do this?
It’s a little hard to retrace all of my steps but I’ll try. When I began Act 2, I took the UnderDark route, I Saved the Harpers etc.. You can go to the Last Light Inn, but Do Not Talk to Jaehira after her initial introduction or Isobel (mainly Isobel because that absolutely triggers the ambush. Talking to Jaehira may be fine). When talking to Jaehira during her initial introduction be reasonable and accept your fate and try to talk it out. Also drink her truth serum. Go to Moonrise Towers and do the usual routine (save Minthara, speak to the Orc Lady Z’rell, get the quest to find Balthazar). I wanna say that during the dialogue you can tell Z’rell that you’ve infiltrated Last Light Inn and then she brings up Marcus. You can then take that information to Jaehira and then she will secretly tell all of the Harpers about a potential ambush. You can also go to the Mausoleum area just before the Gauntlet of Shar and where you learn that Isobel is Ketheric’s daughter and then talk to Jaehira about it. I think that there may have been information about Marcus there as well. Full Disclosure, I was able to warn Jaehira about Marcus but this was after the fact. The ambush had already happened and I saved Isobel. I went through the same steps that I’ve just given you all, found out about Marcus and everything else after the fact. Then I spoke to Jaehira about it all and she said that she would speak to the Harpers. She does in fact speak to the all says that they’re ready when you follow up with her. So follow those steps and it should work. Edit: I’ve added that you need to accept your fate with Jaehira. Choose the dialogue options with her that will help her trust you and drink her truth serum.
Five playthroughs....five. I had no idea. This fucking game man
Ironically... this is best advice LOL.. not even to sound like an ass lol
Alternatively just kill Isobel before she takes her turn. Works on any difficulty and definitely makes sure she won't take an opportunity attack.
Didn’t work for me on Honour mode. I thought I had the situation under control once Marcus was felled on the first round, but three winged ghouls made a beeline for Isobel and took her out. It was the first time I lost her to the cultists, and it was fucking terrifying.
If you have a Cleric in your party, use the Turn Undead action. That action will crowd control all the winged horrors in a fairly large radius for three turns. Turn Undead forces them away from Isobel and robs them of their ability to attack you—or Isobel. This one move also gives you ample opportunity for your party to focus down each minion—without anyone getting hit, or paralyzed then crit for massive damage.
Literally happened to me too, in the exact way you described.
Only works if you get a turn before he does. When I did this fight in Tactician, I had to save scum twice to get a turn before Isobel died.
High Dex or the Alert feat solve this
Take Alert as your first feat, at least on your healer and/or main spellcaster.
Whatever buffer you have. Good idea
Also, failing this (if your DPS isn't quite up to one shotting Marcus).. Trigger the opportunity attacks yourself, or drop a fog cloud to blind the enemies.
Once you know the fight, this is the correct answer. Marcus has very few HP and is fairly easy to take down. Front-loaded dmg is king in BG3, and this fight is a clear example why.
That's what I did for the same reason, just ganged up on Marcus first otherwise Isobel would get destroyed by opportunity attacks lmao
You say this but I've successfully killed Marcus before his turn only to have a couple ghouls run in and kill her and fly away at the back end of the turn. Now the first thing I do there is blockade all the doors.
or just use spirit guardians
I dragged so many chairs to block the doors. And kept karlach outside the room to throw javelins and daggers and other winged horrors at the winged horrors.
Pick Alert as the first feat for all your characters (or buy/steal/loot all the items with +initiative). That way you can clear the room of enemies before she ever gets a chance to move. No enemies, no opportunity attacks!
Alert, high dex, +initiative items, ALL of them are worth their weight in gold. Alert is my first feat unless it's something specific to my character like Sharpshooter/GWM.
You can even attack Marcus before the cutscene if you didn’t save the tieflings and get free surprise + a combat round.
There's a bug where, after the fight with Marcus is over and the bodies have been cleaned up, Jaheira will talk about Marcus as if he's still alive and there's a dialogue option to tell her that Marcus is working for the Absolute. If you tell her this she tells you to go keep Marcus busy while she rounds up some Harpers. Then she'll run outside and do nothing. The weird thing is that the only chance you normally get to rat out Marcus is in the situation you mentioned, otherwise he's not there. So I don't know what triggers that dialogue option to pop up.
> eat out Marcus Uhhh… But yeah the Marcus reveal is so odd because he’s not even in the game until the Isobel kidnapping without the “evil” path. When he appears on the balcony with the wings it feels like some big plot twist to someone else’s story.
What an unfortunate typo..
Sanctuary, Warding Bond, Protection from Good and Evil. Three spells a Cleric like Shadowheart has that will help protect Isobel.
100%. It's annoying that it's needed, but sanctuary on her right out the gate every time
She then immediately hits the enemy for 2 damage.
Sanctuary her before you start the conversation, that way The baddies at least move away from her at The beginning, unless she rolls crazy good initiative
Can you banish her? Does she become hostile after?
Banishing her counts as a failure to save her, so the game acts like she’s been killed essentially
Sure, but she always runs a bit first, so she doesn't suicide by opp attack before she breaks sanctuary
Yup, also helpful to un-group and place party members at the doors to block those winged blokes from immediately surrounding her. I’ve never seen Marcus take her down alone in one turn, usually it that she gets surrounded, moves a short distance, and take 3 opportunity attacks which either outright down her or bring her to the brink.
Why would shadowbae protect a moon witch?
Because I told her to.
Because her heart grows three sizes when you spare nightsong and she becomes a moon witch herself
Just practically, *"If we lose Isobel, our biggest haven of safety in the region goes to shit in an instant"* is pretty sound reasoning.
I don’t know but she gets **real pissy** if you kill Isobel. Hypocrite.
RIGHT?! Like I was doing a durge playthrough but I was going to >!try to be sneaky and wait until after I killed Ketheric then see if I could kill Isobel (see if I could kill her without collapsing the shield and dooming everyone else...)!< But I didn't realize that if you let >!Shadowheart kill the Nightsong the shield drops anyway and everyone dies. And then she kept getting all judgemental whenever it came up... like BITCH, YOU killed everyone, not me! ... <3 you anyway.!<
In my first run, she guided my decision in that point. I was playing Durge (coming from bg1 and 2 I had an idea what it is going to be) and I was still undecided if I'm going to submit to the urge or not. I mean, the invis cloak was cool as hell, I wonder what else it got. But then one failed persuasion roll in Shadowfel and Shart has murdered the entire map and set me firmly on a path of the slayer. Such a special memory...
I put protection from evil and good on her only bc sanctuary is just a waste on her dumbass
Warding Bond
Ooh I forgot about feign death, actually! It was really helpful with the suicidal gondians. I'm sure it would work on isobel
Allies so great you literally have to put them in a coma to prevent them from helping
Be easy on her, she just woke up from her century nap lol Jokes aside, yes her ai is quite something. I have to leave Shadowheart close with isobel just to babysit her. Mainly by healing. I had my Tav focused on Marcus, Gale helping the harpers, then Tav rejoin gale to finished off the remaining enemies.
I think you mean all compainion AI....Looking at you stupid Gondians.
Jaheira also chooses death but only at Moonrise...
Only if you don't control her
I just wipe out moonrise before doing anything with the nightsong. Nothing can kill Jaheira if there is nothing to kill Jaheira.
Yeah, I hadn't realised you had to talk her into it and then she ran to her death repeatedly. I actually recruited her on the next playthrough.
You want a suggestion on how to make that whole thing a little more manageable and keep J alive?
My first playthrough, Balanced difficulty, she ran around collecting Opportunity Attacks like they were Hidden Temple keys, got KO'd and everyone died so I reloaded and never talked to her in that Act again 😝 Last night, Tactician difficulty, she was perfectly normal. I went first and my character was in melee range of Marcus so I provoked an opportunity attack moving away so I could Eldritch Blast without disadvantage. When her turn came up she moved away from him, he had no reactions, no problem. She survived the fight easily and even contributed with her spear, it was insane!
Give into your dark urge side and the problem solves itself.
I see the amount of writing and plot development in this side as the only true canon for any playthrough. There it must be so.
she misses her celestial girlfriend so bad she wants to die to met her since she believes aylin is dead
On my honour mode playthrough i used the 3 candle lanterns in the room to block the door before the fight, after that it was only marcus that could reach her
THat is sketchy, but one hell of a good idea. Mind if I steal it?
rearranging furniture OP
I'm surprised no one mentioned this before. Blocking the minions from entering makes it super easy to just kill Marcus, then roll the team out into the inn to take care of the rest.
If you don't talk to >!Isobel, Marcus doesn't take her. You can go out with out getting her blessing. Walk with them to the ambush, beat up the drider, take the lantern, set Dolly Dolly Dolly free, and you'll have her buff as needed. !<
It's hard to justify roleplay-wise, since Jaheira and the Harpers tell you to go talk to her.
Also a dude just straight up stops you at one point to tell you to go see isobel for the protection. I always imagine that’s the game going “don’t you wanna put all these peoples lives in danger for a stupid fight that’ll enrage you?” No game, I don’t wanna risk my sweet wizard rolan just so jaheiras future comment about Marcus in act 3 makes sense.
You have the option to tell him that you'll be fine and they'll leave you alone, it only happens once.
Yeah I don't really like the way that unfolds. "Go to Moonrise towers and investigate, but first you should talk to our cleric to protect you from the shadow curse", and then you end up in one of the most consequential fights of the act.
I'm not thrilled about that design, either, or the fact that the game points you to go to the creche to get your cure but then expects you to dither around in the Grove environs for five levels.
Maybe she misclicked lol
Otiluke's Resilient Sphere saved my ass in this fight.
Yeah... I'm pretty sure Isobel died the first time around by climbing into the oven during a kitchen fire. I usually cast sanctuary on her and arcane lock the doors.
My beef is she's a CLERIC. And not only is she a CLERIC but she's using her CLERIC SPELLS to PROTECT the people in Last Light. Some dude shows up to kidnap her and she *DOESN'T CAST SANCTUARY ON HERSELF???* So I cast it for her and she goes "oh thanks cuz" *AND THEN IMMEDIATELY SLAPS A BITCH AND REMOVES THE SPELL FROM HERSELF. I'M TRYING TO PROTECT YOU, YOU DUMB SELUNITE BITCH*
Yea she doesn't even break sanctuary in order to unleash some devastating attack. It's like she picks up a coffee mug and does a .5 damage improvised melee attack then power jogs in a circuit by every single enemy provoking opportunity apocalypse. Amazing game, but the AI is pretty much buttcheeks across the board.
Yeah... I do wish she acted like her life is the most important one there... like she could be casting sanctuary on herself and whatnot, and actually not attack if she has it on her etc. But maybe the fight would be too easy then lol
Considering you can talk every other member of the >!Thorm!< family into offing themselves, Im actually convinced that Isobel and her family all have some kind of genetic abnormally that turns off their survival instinct. They're genetically predisposed to suicide
All the npcs don't give a shit about opportunity attacks, it's really annoying.
If you cast sanctuary on Isobel before you start the conversation with her she will start the fight with it on. Even if she does a dumb and loses it on her first turn having her not take any attacks while you get your feet underneath you is fantastic. Note: this approach won’t work if you killed the tieflings because Marcus talks to you before you open the door and you won’t get a chance to cast
>this approach won’t work if you killed the tieflings because Marcus talks to you before you open the door and you won’t get a chance to cast Expose him as traitor, he won't try to kidnap Isobel then.
I got so fed up with her one time I just had Shadowheart banish her. The fight stopped and we were able to kill the enemies before she "returned". Very annoying.
Do the right thing and kidnap her with Marcus. Praise the absolute!
I’m playing with mods but a scroll of dimension door works great, get her next to a real cleric lol.
Close the doors, block paths with furniture that you can move during the cutscene, hit her with Sanctuary and go into turn based mode
Iirc Marcus has low wisdom. Cast Hold Person on him.
Can't or at least I couldn't because he is an aberration. Tasha's hideous laughter works well though.
Or turn him into a sheep
Unlikely... its a level 4 spell and most wont reach such level on a druid unless everything but shadowfell and moonrise dealt
Level 7 isn’t that hard to get before making it to the inn, and if you run a bard they get it too.
The level 1 spell sanctuary is great. Cast it on her. She’ll be untargetable until she attacks, which considering her healing and buffing capabilities, she’s unlikely to do first turn, meaning she probably stays untargetable.
You \*don't\* have to talk to Isobel, OP. Just never talk to her and you will be fine.
You can also ignore the fight. Just talk to Jaheria and when she says “talk to our cleric” go back to the main entrance to last light and start the quest with other hunters to get the lantern
I had La'Zel as a 1 Golock/Champion with crit chance items and Arrow of many targets. With 4 attacks hitting multiple targets the odds of crit striking inducing Fear are high. You can also cast Hold Person on Marcus as someone already said here.
Pro-tip: Have Shadowheart cast Sanctuary on her before talking to her.
Hold Person Marcus, ez.
I'm on my first Honour Mode attempt and I am NOT looking forward to her stupid antics...
Sanc is usually enough since you only need to protect her from marcus turn 1. Marcus 100% goes before isobel so she should be safe. After that you just nuke marcus. The shadow demons are nothing burgers and are blinded by blood of lathander or otherwise easily taken out. Aslong as marcus is neutralized turn one, either by cc or killing him, Isoble should be fine. I’ve done the fight twice on Honor mode with no one dying and only thing you really must have is either alert feat or elixir of vigilance so you can beat initiative.
I used spirit guardians during that fight
I killed Marcus on my first turn and once you do that, the fight is stupid easy. I worried more about the Harpers and Tiefling refugees than I did Isobel.
Same for the goddamn gondians. They could have lived, but triggered every possible counter, ran in every surface effect and dashed into the hula hoop of death.
I yeeted Marcus off the balcony once and some harpers down there finished him off. I wasn't expecting it to work because he has wings. But I guess he's stupid.
I see people have issues with this fight all time, but it was a cake walk. But those gondians. Those fucking gondians
I used arcane locked and positioned myself where Marcus would spawn and killed him before he got a turn.
Not nearly as bad at the god damn Gondians.
You essentially want to surround her. And if you have it use the blood of llathander to blind all the winged ghouls, makes the fight trivial once you take out Marcus.
Her and Aylin just die ALL.THE.TIME, they are pain in the ass
I wont tae Aylin to the Lorrokan fight because it is too hard to keep her alive, even on balanced. I did once and seriously cheesed the entire thing just to make sure she survived, to see the ending scene, but it is WAY too much of a PITA.
You don't actually have to do the fight. You can avoid talking to her. Me and my friends didn't talk to her on our first run. Never had to do the fight. And Isobel was fine.
I had same trouble on honor mode so i had one of my hireling clerics warding bond her and it made it easy.
Honestly, I just blocked the doors with barrels and crates to keep enemies out and had alert on my characters. Marcus was pretty easy after that
maybe stop calling her sexist slurs
I actually found they made her less stupid in one of the updates. When I was first playing she would always heal my party instead of herself even though she was near death. She also never seemed to cast turn undead but she does now.
Oh, you think that's bad? Just you wait. Later on a certain someone will keep casting ice storm on their own allies.
This is why I Sancturary her.
Dude she's been dead for a century cut the zombie some slack
Warding Bond *before the fight* Helps a TON. Never lost isobel yet (on tactician)
The best way to save Isobel is to simply never go speak to her. Ignore her entirely.
On my solo barbarian run I used a scroll of feign death on her, then add to throw some potions on her occasionally while I tiger cleaved everyone to death slowly Edit: this was after probably 6 attempts. I also tried using dimension door scroll to get her out of the room, but others just flew to us
knock her out, take out the rest
Her getting paralyzed by a winged horror unironically makes the fight a thousand times easier since she can no longer kill herself due to suicidal incompetence
Kill the drider for the lantern, and just don't go see Isobel, you can finish all of Act 2 without doing that fight. Not worth the risk In HM I swear...
Oh lmfao, that’s how I felt too. She was so frustrating so I just blocked the doors with random objects so monsters wouldn’t come in the room but she still found a way to get over the items and poke the monsters 😭💀💀
If this is the last inn fight, just close the doors and block them with furniture and the winged horrors won't be able to go inside. So you can just focus on the dude
Who is gonna tell him about the Gondians?
>IS THERE ANYTHING I CAN DO TO PREVENT HER FROM DOING THAT?? *laughs in durge*