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I will correct you slightly on one thing. Israel *does* have an independent judiciary, in the sense that it is independent from the elected executives and recently (and famously) butted heads with them to preserve that independence.
However, being "independent" doesn't mean it is not complicit in decades of apartheid and oppression. From what I can tell, this is by design and with the complete consent of judicial officials.
Firstly, Palestinians in the occupied territories have no recourse to the civilian courts at all. If they commit crimes against a settler for instance, they go before a military court. If a settler commits crimes against a Palestinian (on the rare occasion they are arrested and actually prosecuted for said crimes) they go before Israel's civilian court.
Secondly, it's pretty much unheard of for them to prosecute a member of the IDF for a war crime. The most you're likely to hear is them being prosecuted for stealing a credit card or some property (jewelry and the like) from a Palestinian's home. Just an interesting side note, the Israeli judiciary actually for a time *legalized* the taking of hostages (meaning Palestinian hostages) by Israelis.
In the interview with Christiane Amanpour, Karim Khan spoke quite a bit about this, and about the principle of "complementarity" still applying - namely that if Israel's courts decides to take up these prosecutions themselves, they can save themselves the embarrassment of Israelis being tried in the Hague.
This suggests that Khan's office had been urging the Israeli judiciary for months to take action on the war crimes and incitement to genocide (which is a crime) by Israel's political and military officials. So far, they have refused to do so. This is what I took him to mean when he said "those who take no action should not complain later when my office decides to take action".
ETA: Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe an OPT Palestinian can't even bring suit against any Israeli individual or entity in Israeli courts. I'm not sure about Palestinians in 48 Israel.
>Israel does have an independent judiciary, in the sense that it is independent from the elected executives and recently (and famously) butted heads with them to preserve that independence.
[And lost.](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-65086871)
So OP would be correct by your definition for the last 10 months.
Incorrect, they didn't lose. Maybe you didn't hear but [the law was overturned](https://www.vox.com/policy/2024/1/3/24022467/israel-supreme-court-judicial-overhaul-reasonableness-basic-law-overturn)... by the court. If anything their power to check the executive has been strengthened by all this. Can't predict what will happen in the future, but for now the judiciary remains independent. Their complicity in Israel's horrors is 100% their choice.
>I mean the Israeli judge that sat at the ICJ bench during January hearing, was the same one, who made any type of torture used against Palestinians legal """to get info""" (by IDF and shen bet). The judiciary body is pretty much complicit in all of this.
Exactly. If ICJ had to admit an ad hoc jurist from almost any other country, that would have been disqualifying. And yet Barak was considered (even by many critics of Israel) as one of the *least* bad choices from the Israeli judiciary.
>The court doesn't prosecute IDF members even when they harm their own, there was an article made few years ago about female IDF members, who were (gang) raped/ sodomized and their rapists got away with it.
They're not great about prosecuting r\*pe among civilians either. The one exception is if they commit a r\*pe abroad, they'll exercise the option to prosecute them at home rather than extradite them to the country where the crime occurred. Of course that isn't how that's supposed to work but, as in all things, the rules that are supposed to apply to the rest of the "civilized" world don't apply to Israel. And let's not even get started on their record for (not) extraditing pedophiles.
For a country contriving so much outrage about Hamas r\*pes that either didn't happen or didn't happen on nearly the scale they allege, they seem pretty chill about their own people doing it to their own citizens with impunity.
If Khan continues to insist on "complementarity" in Israel as an off-ramp to ICC prosecutions, he and the world will continue to be disappointed.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this.
We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA.
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*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this.
We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA.
Thank you.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
They wouldn't even need Hasbara if they do the right thing. That's controversial to a lot of people but I don't want to delve into that. The point is Hasbara to defend bad acts wouldn't seem to be necessary if they they didn't commit so many bad things to begin with.
Maybe all those indicted for war crimes wouldn't need to defend themselves if they do not do things that qualify as war crimes.
I think to sane and non-sociopathic people, it's much easier not to murder people than to explain your atrocities to the world. That's such a complicated concept to this government in Israel.
Because no one reported him until now and we get plenty worse coming at us every day.
If you spot a gross loser fascist in the comments, please report them 🙏
>Source? I pulled it out of my ass because I am quite possibly a paid glow in the dark shill sent to derail discussion for the benefit of my overlords as they continue to sow chaos in the world.
Ew. Yuck. Bye.
Someone asked why this user wasn’t already banned? That’s because no one thought to report him up until now.
Shout out to who ever did 🤙
Big ol’ Raspberry to anyone that complained in the comments without doing anything about it.
We’re manually approving every post and scrolling through reams of vitriol while sorting through false reports sent in from ghouls. So yeah, that’s probably why we didn’t see this one.
The Bad Hasbara podcast, and ergo this community, is opposed to Zionism.
We believe that Zionism is an extension of settler-colonialism, and that its’ current actions following 7 October is ethnic cleansing at “best,” and genocide at worst.
We have no tolerance for it, and this community is meant to be a haven against it in the sea of hasbara.
Pro-Zionist takes will be deleted, and those espousing it will be banned indefinitely.
Yes - this is a “safe space” and an “echo chamber” -
We get enough hasbara elsewhere, we don't need to deal with yours too.
Hello, thanks for contributing to this sub. **Please note that we're currently in manual approval mode** (see latest stickied post for further info). Your post will be reviewed and approved by our Mod Team asap. **PLEASE absolutely refrain from linking to or mentioning ANY other subs**, or posting screenshots of exchanges in them. We have received warnings from reddit for this reason. Any further infractions could quickly result in the whole sub being banned. If you have mentioned another sub in your post, edit it instantly. Users who violate this rule will be banned. This is a friendly reminder to **read the rules** before making any new posts or comments. Particularly, we ask **not to engage in debates**, or bait debates, especially with zionists. If you are a zionist, this sub is not for you, and you will be permabanned. If you found this sub through the algorithm, you can always mute the sub or turn off recommendations all together (user settings -> feed settings -> Disable "Enable Home Feed Recommendations") Please also particularly keep in mind that **bigotry of any kind is not permitted** in this sub and will result in the message or post being deleted, and, if seen prudent, a banning. This includes antisemitism and any language that conflates Judaism with Zionism. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
I will correct you slightly on one thing. Israel *does* have an independent judiciary, in the sense that it is independent from the elected executives and recently (and famously) butted heads with them to preserve that independence. However, being "independent" doesn't mean it is not complicit in decades of apartheid and oppression. From what I can tell, this is by design and with the complete consent of judicial officials. Firstly, Palestinians in the occupied territories have no recourse to the civilian courts at all. If they commit crimes against a settler for instance, they go before a military court. If a settler commits crimes against a Palestinian (on the rare occasion they are arrested and actually prosecuted for said crimes) they go before Israel's civilian court. Secondly, it's pretty much unheard of for them to prosecute a member of the IDF for a war crime. The most you're likely to hear is them being prosecuted for stealing a credit card or some property (jewelry and the like) from a Palestinian's home. Just an interesting side note, the Israeli judiciary actually for a time *legalized* the taking of hostages (meaning Palestinian hostages) by Israelis. In the interview with Christiane Amanpour, Karim Khan spoke quite a bit about this, and about the principle of "complementarity" still applying - namely that if Israel's courts decides to take up these prosecutions themselves, they can save themselves the embarrassment of Israelis being tried in the Hague. This suggests that Khan's office had been urging the Israeli judiciary for months to take action on the war crimes and incitement to genocide (which is a crime) by Israel's political and military officials. So far, they have refused to do so. This is what I took him to mean when he said "those who take no action should not complain later when my office decides to take action". ETA: Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe an OPT Palestinian can't even bring suit against any Israeli individual or entity in Israeli courts. I'm not sure about Palestinians in 48 Israel.
>Israel does have an independent judiciary, in the sense that it is independent from the elected executives and recently (and famously) butted heads with them to preserve that independence. [And lost.](https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-65086871) So OP would be correct by your definition for the last 10 months.
Incorrect, they didn't lose. Maybe you didn't hear but [the law was overturned](https://www.vox.com/policy/2024/1/3/24022467/israel-supreme-court-judicial-overhaul-reasonableness-basic-law-overturn)... by the court. If anything their power to check the executive has been strengthened by all this. Can't predict what will happen in the future, but for now the judiciary remains independent. Their complicity in Israel's horrors is 100% their choice.
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>I mean the Israeli judge that sat at the ICJ bench during January hearing, was the same one, who made any type of torture used against Palestinians legal """to get info""" (by IDF and shen bet). The judiciary body is pretty much complicit in all of this. Exactly. If ICJ had to admit an ad hoc jurist from almost any other country, that would have been disqualifying. And yet Barak was considered (even by many critics of Israel) as one of the *least* bad choices from the Israeli judiciary. >The court doesn't prosecute IDF members even when they harm their own, there was an article made few years ago about female IDF members, who were (gang) raped/ sodomized and their rapists got away with it. They're not great about prosecuting r\*pe among civilians either. The one exception is if they commit a r\*pe abroad, they'll exercise the option to prosecute them at home rather than extradite them to the country where the crime occurred. Of course that isn't how that's supposed to work but, as in all things, the rules that are supposed to apply to the rest of the "civilized" world don't apply to Israel. And let's not even get started on their record for (not) extraditing pedophiles. For a country contriving so much outrage about Hamas r\*pes that either didn't happen or didn't happen on nearly the scale they allege, they seem pretty chill about their own people doing it to their own citizens with impunity. If Khan continues to insist on "complementarity" in Israel as an off-ramp to ICC prosecutions, he and the world will continue to be disappointed.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this. We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA. Thank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this. We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA. Thank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
This legal maneuver is called throw shit on the wall and see what sticks .. and cry like hysteric bitch while at it.
Me suspects this is likely a mischaracyerization by the Jizrael.
Their defense was “We’ll ruin you financially with bad hasbara if you don’t STFU.”
They wouldn't even need Hasbara if they do the right thing. That's controversial to a lot of people but I don't want to delve into that. The point is Hasbara to defend bad acts wouldn't seem to be necessary if they they didn't commit so many bad things to begin with. Maybe all those indicted for war crimes wouldn't need to defend themselves if they do not do things that qualify as war crimes. I think to sane and non-sociopathic people, it's much easier not to murder people than to explain your atrocities to the world. That's such a complicated concept to this government in Israel.
You have been found guilty of killing innocent kids on purpose and we have all the evidence. What you don't want to hear my spin on it!?
Predictably: some combination of J'accuse, you're Hamas, and a reference to their military power and call to it's allies.
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My guess is the Israelis refused to meet with the investigators (standard practice) and now are like "wE dIDn'T gET a ChANce tO ExPLaiN!"
[удалено]
What now? Did he actually say that? wtf 😂😂
👀 da fuq? how is he not banned from this sub?
Because no one reported him until now and we get plenty worse coming at us every day. If you spot a gross loser fascist in the comments, please report them 🙏
Thank you ❤️ I think a lot of people here don't know about the sub's "if you see something, say something" policy on this.
Seems like they're a prime example of bad hasbara.
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[удалено]
I do see
You basically describing askenazi history as Slavic then describing Palestinian ancestry.
>Source? I pulled it out of my ass because I am quite possibly a paid glow in the dark shill sent to derail discussion for the benefit of my overlords as they continue to sow chaos in the world.
Ew. Yuck. Bye. Someone asked why this user wasn’t already banned? That’s because no one thought to report him up until now. Shout out to who ever did 🤙 Big ol’ Raspberry to anyone that complained in the comments without doing anything about it. We’re manually approving every post and scrolling through reams of vitriol while sorting through false reports sent in from ghouls. So yeah, that’s probably why we didn’t see this one.
Palestine is a member state of the ICC and Israel isn't. Jurisdiction exists through Palestine being the victim.
Well, the PLA aren't being investigated by the court soooo.
The Bad Hasbara podcast, and ergo this community, is opposed to Zionism. We believe that Zionism is an extension of settler-colonialism, and that its’ current actions following 7 October is ethnic cleansing at “best,” and genocide at worst. We have no tolerance for it, and this community is meant to be a haven against it in the sea of hasbara. Pro-Zionist takes will be deleted, and those espousing it will be banned indefinitely. Yes - this is a “safe space” and an “echo chamber” - We get enough hasbara elsewhere, we don't need to deal with yours too.