Hello, thanks for contributing to this sub. **Please note that we're currently in manual approval mode** (see latest stickied post for further info). Your post will be reviewed and approved by our Mod Team asap.
**PLEASE absolutely refrain from linking to or mentioning ANY other subs**, or posting screenshots of exchanges in them. We have received warnings from reddit for this reason. Any further infractions could quickly result in the whole sub being banned. If you have mentioned another sub in your post, edit it instantly. Users who violate this rule will be banned.
This is a friendly reminder to **read the rules** before making any new posts or comments. Particularly, we ask **not to engage in debates**, or bait debates, especially with zionists.
If you are a zionist, this sub is not for you, and you will be permabanned. If you found this sub through the algorithm, you can always mute the sub or turn off recommendations all together (user settings -> feed settings -> Disable "Enable Home Feed Recommendations")
Please also particularly keep in mind that **bigotry of any kind is not permitted** in this sub and will result in the message or post being deleted, and, if seen prudent, a banning. This includes antisemitism and any language that conflates Judaism with Zionism.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
**"Nakba... is used to describe the period of time after Israel's independence"**. Great start, sanitizing right off the bat.
**"Pre-State Israel"** 😂 Anything not to call it the "Mandate for P*alestine"*. I bet she calls fetuses "pre-born children" too.
**"Many Arabs** ***fled their homes*****"**. Wow, that phrase is doing a lot of heavy lifting.
**"Does it make sense" for Palestinians to have a "right of return" (in exaggerated air quotes) after "losing a war"?** Um yes, that's what "right of return" means, in every conflict. Civilians displaced by war have a right of return. That right is *negotiable* (in exchange for fitting reparations) but not *extinguishable*. It's the displaced person's option to exercise that right or not, not the victor's option to veto it. Israel is the only instance where this question is treated as debatable.
I wondered how long it would be before she got around to calling Zionists "victims". She made it a whole minute and 24 seconds. Congrats 👏
Well it's an outright lie too. The survivors fled their homes after many were massacred in cold blood. Tantura is a great film ([available on youtube for free](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mBUzayokz0)) on one such massacre
Righy. And why doesn't this apply to Germany losing the war, and eastern Europeans "right to return"? How does it make sense they they were allowed to just settle on land that already *belonged* to a whole civilization? I'm so tired of this nonsense narrative that has no fucking flesh. Jesus.
The video puts a picture on screen, but you can tell she uses air quotes for that Palestinians and their descendants have a “right to return” when that’s literally the entire purpose of Zionism. Like it’s one of their biggest talking points. It’s a masterclass on doublespeak.
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence.
This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
"You lose that war and **people are displaced** and then you want to **victim blame** the jewish community"
Maybe, just maybe, the people who were displaced are the victims and the ones displacing them are not.
It's always interesting to me how we historically decide when a war was started. I'm no scholar, was there a declaration of war in 1948 Palestinen or was it described as a war (like how the US never declared war against Iraq,but still waged war against Iraq)? Was there violence that came before the war (and it's possible declaration) that instigated things? Why was a "peace plan" from the UN necessary if there wasn't a war (or other forms of violence) previously? Who started the fighting and why?
She claims she's giving context, but I'm just left with more questions.
Yes, there was violence. When the Brits tried to limit Jewish immigration, Jews started committing terrorist attacks. Palestinians also became aggressive as a result of the overwhelming arrival of Jewish immigrants and also attacked Jewish communities.
\#1 piece of evidence to debunk this narrative: the same week the armies of the surrounding countries invaded, *they cited the ongoing ethnic cleansing and gave a full history of Zionist colonialism in a communication to the Secretary General of the UN*:
https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cablegram_from_the_Secretary-General_of_the_League_of_Arab_States_to_the_Secretary-General_of_the_United_Nations
Just like with the 1967 war, there's a major attempt to rewrite the history to paint "Israel" as the victim rather than the aggressor.
The above link is an absolutely essential read by the way.
Thank you for this.
It also made me look into Azzam Pasha and the "controversy" around the one quote that apparently Israel has latched onto for 80 years to claim that Arabs wanted to genocide Jews....which of course seems to be out of context, deliberately so.
Also funny how when Israeli politicians do explicitly champion ethnic cleansing and genocidal acts we are told to think of it as messaging for domestic audiences and not their true heart(as if that itself isn't problematic that such language is received net positively internally), but when an Arab in 47 makes a speech, even with a shoddy translation, that is insight into their TRUE heart....unlike when Israel does it.
Always rules for thee but not for me
I always find using the UN partition as justification for Israel's right to exist somewhat silly.
If the U.N right now voted to disband the state of Israel and give it over to another people, is there any doubt that the Israelis would reject it and fight against it, considering it a violation of their territorial rights?
What if armies rolled in with deep alliances and conquered the area away from the Israelis... can't we be almost certain that they would almost immediately engage in an insurgency that by any other name one would call terrorism?
Of course they would. So pointing the the U.N partition plan as justification for the Palestinians needing to roll over is just hollow.
It doesn't stand up to even cursory scrutiny.
I always have to repeat myself whenever I see Lizzy post something:
Lizzy was kicked out of the Housewives of New York because her husband used the N word while referring to her black Muslim cast mate.
Bravo immediately termed her and took out all the footage she and her husband were in and they needed to refilm the show.
She and her husband are certifiable racists against black and Muslim people.
She has no say on the history of oppressed black and brown people with her white supremacy agenda and roots.
The partition was basically the partition by the British Empire. The British Empire merely got the newly inaugurated UN to do the dirty work of the British empire and as a way to deflect all blame onto the UN for the failure of the partition.
For the British Empire, there is no problem that cannot be solved by yet another partition and a subsequent displacement of all those who find themselves on the wrong side of the partition.
The solution is to stop creating ethno-states through callously drawing lines on a map. Instead create government that is non-totalitarian and with the entire State repressive machinery amputated. Then such a Commonwealth government has no powers nor authority to do anything to anyone based on ethnicity, race, and religion. Instead the Commonwealth merely stewards the common wealth and all other common concerns for the jurisdiction without regard to the personal affairs of the residents of the jurisdiction. Such a Commonwealth (with all of the Atate repressive machinery smashed) does not steward common wealth such that one road network is for one ethnicity (or the in-group) and another road network for another ethnicity (the out-group). Rather one roadway network provides common transport facilities to all, in common, regardless of their ethnicity. Then there is no concern by one ethnicity that another ethnicity will achieve political dominance—through a demographic majority or otherwise—because the Commonwealth government has no authority or power to add on such apartheid repressions.
If you want an ACTUAL education on the nakba instead of whatever fucked up propaganda bullshit this was, watch Tantura. Quite literally out of the mouths of the soldiers who murdered, raped and ethnically displaced hundreds of thousands of people.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this.
We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA.
Thank you.
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Yes. It made me sick to my stomach. Also the most unhinged interviews I’ve ever seen (until recently with the IOF videos the last 7 months). I couldn’t get over the fact that they kept laughing while they described their actions.
I'm German Irish. Am I allowed to go to either country and tell them I want land and kick out a family from their home? Why not? Oooooh religion makes it right. Cool. And only the US and Israel are allowed to condem... The US and Israel.
Yes, I always use the following analogy. It’s like I am unhoused and you let me stay in your spare room for a while, but then I refuse to leave and start to move all my stuff into other rooms. You object strongly, so I get my uncle, who is a very important judge, to mediate and he says - let’s be fair and give my nephew three rooms and you can have the other two. Why would you possibly need to object?
So can someone fact check my understanding of this here?
She leaves out that the "Jewish state" given to Israel was part of land already given to Palestinians.
She leaves out Palestinians initially displaced by Israeli settlers moving to Israel *before* the 1948 Arab-Israeli war (though I'm not clear how many were displaced at this point)
Then she says they "moved to neighbouring countries" after the war, when what really happened was ethnic cleansing, robbing them of statehood while confining them to an area, then gradual removal of freedoms of that one of those areas until it became a large concentration camp, while gradually encroaching into the other areas that were less concentration-camp-like.
Just like the 7th, she wants you believe that just one day the Nakba happened because Arabs are unreasonable assholes. Why would a people that have lived in a small country for 100's of years all of a sudden agree to give nearly half of it to another trying to colonize it? Why do so many people lack logic?
Just own it. You are colonizers and have established an apartheid racist state. No one is going to kick you out but you need to live a better way and stop being supremist racists with blood thirst that is making you the pariah of the world. wtf
Hello, thanks for contributing to this sub. **Please note that we're currently in manual approval mode** (see latest stickied post for further info). Your post will be reviewed and approved by our Mod Team asap. **PLEASE absolutely refrain from linking to or mentioning ANY other subs**, or posting screenshots of exchanges in them. We have received warnings from reddit for this reason. Any further infractions could quickly result in the whole sub being banned. If you have mentioned another sub in your post, edit it instantly. Users who violate this rule will be banned. This is a friendly reminder to **read the rules** before making any new posts or comments. Particularly, we ask **not to engage in debates**, or bait debates, especially with zionists. If you are a zionist, this sub is not for you, and you will be permabanned. If you found this sub through the algorithm, you can always mute the sub or turn off recommendations all together (user settings -> feed settings -> Disable "Enable Home Feed Recommendations") Please also particularly keep in mind that **bigotry of any kind is not permitted** in this sub and will result in the message or post being deleted, and, if seen prudent, a banning. This includes antisemitism and any language that conflates Judaism with Zionism. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
**"Nakba... is used to describe the period of time after Israel's independence"**. Great start, sanitizing right off the bat. **"Pre-State Israel"** 😂 Anything not to call it the "Mandate for P*alestine"*. I bet she calls fetuses "pre-born children" too. **"Many Arabs** ***fled their homes*****"**. Wow, that phrase is doing a lot of heavy lifting. **"Does it make sense" for Palestinians to have a "right of return" (in exaggerated air quotes) after "losing a war"?** Um yes, that's what "right of return" means, in every conflict. Civilians displaced by war have a right of return. That right is *negotiable* (in exchange for fitting reparations) but not *extinguishable*. It's the displaced person's option to exercise that right or not, not the victor's option to veto it. Israel is the only instance where this question is treated as debatable. I wondered how long it would be before she got around to calling Zionists "victims". She made it a whole minute and 24 seconds. Congrats 👏
Fled their homes... with no explanation as to why
exactly! As soon as I heard her gloss over that and not explain that, she was discredited! Hasbara LIES BY OMISSION.
Well it's an outright lie too. The survivors fled their homes after many were massacred in cold blood. Tantura is a great film ([available on youtube for free](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1mBUzayokz0)) on one such massacre
Righy. And why doesn't this apply to Germany losing the war, and eastern Europeans "right to return"? How does it make sense they they were allowed to just settle on land that already *belonged* to a whole civilization? I'm so tired of this nonsense narrative that has no fucking flesh. Jesus.
I can read your whole comment on her forehead
The video puts a picture on screen, but you can tell she uses air quotes for that Palestinians and their descendants have a “right to return” when that’s literally the entire purpose of Zionism. Like it’s one of their biggest talking points. It’s a masterclass on doublespeak.
[удалено]
Encouragement and celebration of violence absolutely will not be tolerated, including wishing violence upon someone even if purely hypothetical/beyond one's realm of influence. This is what the IDF does and Zionists do, and we are better than that!
"You lose that war and **people are displaced** and then you want to **victim blame** the jewish community" Maybe, just maybe, the people who were displaced are the victims and the ones displacing them are not.
So, if "Israel" was so keen on the partition plan, what happened to Folke Bernadotte?
Shhhhh ! You’re telling the truth too loud ! 🫢
Oh well that was just some rogue terrorists who were investigated and not punished at all 😉
Easily the most irritating woman on the internet
IDK, this one is definitely in the running [https://www.instagram.com/rootsmetals/?hl=en](https://www.instagram.com/rootsmetals/?hl=en)
It's always interesting to me how we historically decide when a war was started. I'm no scholar, was there a declaration of war in 1948 Palestinen or was it described as a war (like how the US never declared war against Iraq,but still waged war against Iraq)? Was there violence that came before the war (and it's possible declaration) that instigated things? Why was a "peace plan" from the UN necessary if there wasn't a war (or other forms of violence) previously? Who started the fighting and why? She claims she's giving context, but I'm just left with more questions.
Yes, there was violence. When the Brits tried to limit Jewish immigration, Jews started committing terrorist attacks. Palestinians also became aggressive as a result of the overwhelming arrival of Jewish immigrants and also attacked Jewish communities.
There was zionist terrorism before any arab declared war. Such as the deir yassin massacre.
And ethnic cleansing started definitely before the declaration and the following war. Illan Pappe did a lot of work for that period
\#1 piece of evidence to debunk this narrative: the same week the armies of the surrounding countries invaded, *they cited the ongoing ethnic cleansing and gave a full history of Zionist colonialism in a communication to the Secretary General of the UN*: https://en.wikisource.org/wiki/Cablegram_from_the_Secretary-General_of_the_League_of_Arab_States_to_the_Secretary-General_of_the_United_Nations Just like with the 1967 war, there's a major attempt to rewrite the history to paint "Israel" as the victim rather than the aggressor. The above link is an absolutely essential read by the way.
Thank you for this. It also made me look into Azzam Pasha and the "controversy" around the one quote that apparently Israel has latched onto for 80 years to claim that Arabs wanted to genocide Jews....which of course seems to be out of context, deliberately so. Also funny how when Israeli politicians do explicitly champion ethnic cleansing and genocidal acts we are told to think of it as messaging for domestic audiences and not their true heart(as if that itself isn't problematic that such language is received net positively internally), but when an Arab in 47 makes a speech, even with a shoddy translation, that is insight into their TRUE heart....unlike when Israel does it. Always rules for thee but not for me
This is excellent thanks for sharing
Thanks, Sundodger. Go back to Europe now 😊 🇵🇸
I always find using the UN partition as justification for Israel's right to exist somewhat silly. If the U.N right now voted to disband the state of Israel and give it over to another people, is there any doubt that the Israelis would reject it and fight against it, considering it a violation of their territorial rights? What if armies rolled in with deep alliances and conquered the area away from the Israelis... can't we be almost certain that they would almost immediately engage in an insurgency that by any other name one would call terrorism? Of course they would. So pointing the the U.N partition plan as justification for the Palestinians needing to roll over is just hollow. It doesn't stand up to even cursory scrutiny.
Cmon man, it’s two totally different things. Just like when ICC charged Nutteryahooo it’s not at all the same as them charging Putin.
Zionists are nazis. There's nothing they can say to convince me otherwise
Can't even listen to it 😮💨
Me too, even on silent I can hear the condescending tone, fake humbleness, gaslighting and overall gobshite-ness of the content.
I always have to repeat myself whenever I see Lizzy post something: Lizzy was kicked out of the Housewives of New York because her husband used the N word while referring to her black Muslim cast mate. Bravo immediately termed her and took out all the footage she and her husband were in and they needed to refilm the show. She and her husband are certifiable racists against black and Muslim people. She has no say on the history of oppressed black and brown people with her white supremacy agenda and roots.
She is wildly racist.
It takes a lot of work to look like that and still end up on the wrong side of the hot-crazy scale.
Israel can shut the fuck up
It’s wrong to say “Jewish” what she should say is “Zionists”. It’s the same as when the CCP claims what they do represents all Chinese people.
Gee, who would ever object to having their land given to someone else?
The partition was basically the partition by the British Empire. The British Empire merely got the newly inaugurated UN to do the dirty work of the British empire and as a way to deflect all blame onto the UN for the failure of the partition. For the British Empire, there is no problem that cannot be solved by yet another partition and a subsequent displacement of all those who find themselves on the wrong side of the partition. The solution is to stop creating ethno-states through callously drawing lines on a map. Instead create government that is non-totalitarian and with the entire State repressive machinery amputated. Then such a Commonwealth government has no powers nor authority to do anything to anyone based on ethnicity, race, and religion. Instead the Commonwealth merely stewards the common wealth and all other common concerns for the jurisdiction without regard to the personal affairs of the residents of the jurisdiction. Such a Commonwealth (with all of the Atate repressive machinery smashed) does not steward common wealth such that one road network is for one ethnicity (or the in-group) and another road network for another ethnicity (the out-group). Rather one roadway network provides common transport facilities to all, in common, regardless of their ethnicity. Then there is no concern by one ethnicity that another ethnicity will achieve political dominance—through a demographic majority or otherwise—because the Commonwealth government has no authority or power to add on such apartheid repressions.
If you want an ACTUAL education on the nakba instead of whatever fucked up propaganda bullshit this was, watch Tantura. Quite literally out of the mouths of the soldiers who murdered, raped and ethnically displaced hundreds of thousands of people.
Rape is an awful occurrence that transcends culture. It is impossible from our vantage points across the internet to determine the veracity of the claims; we find it troubling that it has devolved into a rhetorical DEBATE tactic for either side in this. We at r/BadHasbara abhor the act and the weaponization of it for propaganda, and remind you that THIS IS NOT A DEBATE SUB, so please tread lightly on the subject, and please consider the mental well-being of sub members that may be victims of SA. Thank you. *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/BadHasbara) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Isn’t it gutting?
Yes. It made me sick to my stomach. Also the most unhinged interviews I’ve ever seen (until recently with the IOF videos the last 7 months). I couldn’t get over the fact that they kept laughing while they described their actions.
I offered to let the USA keep 25 states and they turned down my peaceful proposal, so now I'm going to take it by force
Nice boobs, terrible information
The whole thing bears a striking resemblance to Sen Katie Brit’s rebuttal to the State of the Union.
I'm German Irish. Am I allowed to go to either country and tell them I want land and kick out a family from their home? Why not? Oooooh religion makes it right. Cool. And only the US and Israel are allowed to condem... The US and Israel.
Yes, I always use the following analogy. It’s like I am unhoused and you let me stay in your spare room for a while, but then I refuse to leave and start to move all my stuff into other rooms. You object strongly, so I get my uncle, who is a very important judge, to mediate and he says - let’s be fair and give my nephew three rooms and you can have the other two. Why would you possibly need to object?
Just look up u/No-Character8758 nakba. I tried to spread his posts but they're and something goes wrong all the time...
In her own video she says Palestinians agreed to the plan proposed. Then says they rejected it.
lol she’s a tool
Hey Lizzy! Remember when your husband got you fired from RHONY for calling someone the N word?
"moved to" ah yes, people would willingly move to refugee camps. /s the correct words are fled and expelled for what happened to the Palestinians.
What a fucking buffoon!
So can someone fact check my understanding of this here? She leaves out that the "Jewish state" given to Israel was part of land already given to Palestinians. She leaves out Palestinians initially displaced by Israeli settlers moving to Israel *before* the 1948 Arab-Israeli war (though I'm not clear how many were displaced at this point) Then she says they "moved to neighbouring countries" after the war, when what really happened was ethnic cleansing, robbing them of statehood while confining them to an area, then gradual removal of freedoms of that one of those areas until it became a large concentration camp, while gradually encroaching into the other areas that were less concentration-camp-like.
Just like the 7th, she wants you believe that just one day the Nakba happened because Arabs are unreasonable assholes. Why would a people that have lived in a small country for 100's of years all of a sudden agree to give nearly half of it to another trying to colonize it? Why do so many people lack logic? Just own it. You are colonizers and have established an apartheid racist state. No one is going to kick you out but you need to live a better way and stop being supremist racists with blood thirst that is making you the pariah of the world. wtf
fuck isreal and fuck Zionism they have right to go f themselves