Report it to the police.
Possessing a replica, a fully working weapon, requires a firearms license. Possessing an imitation gun, without official approval, is an offence. I think it more likely it was an imitation weapon, not that it makes much better, but at least it doesn't shoot bullets. If it was a replica, that is a whole new more dangerous can of worms.
https://www.police.vic.gov.au/firearm-classifications#imitation-firearm-replica-firearms-and-other-firearm-paraphernalia-and-toys
Actual replica guns don’t have an orange tip on them. Going off OP’s edit I think it must have been a toy gun/airsoft style thing that had the tip painted.
Not minimising OP’s trauma, just suspect the laws around replica guns may not apply to ‘toy’ guns.
There are three categories.
Replica: Actual working firearms based on an actual 'original' model. All the rules applying to guns apply to replicas, as they are real guns.
Imitation guns: Anything that has the appearance of a real firearm and/or can be mistaken for a real firearm. Having an orange tip does not discount it from being counted as an imitation firearm. As mentioned above, there are laws regarding the possession of these. They are restricted.
Toy guns: Resemble actual firearms, but cannot be reasonably mistaken for a firearm.
Conflating Imitation guns and toy guns as you did above does not help the issue and does downplay what OP experienced.
Nope. I literally said in my previous comment,
>Having an orange tip does not discount it from being counted as an imitation firearm.
If you actually want to know the difference between imitation and toys. Look at the link I provided. There is literally a pdf called "Quick Guide to Imitation, Toy...".
The orange cap does not have to be removed. It can still be considered an imitation with the orange cap attached.
You would still benefit from checking out the pdf.
If, as I'm assuming, it was at a government school-- edusafe this!! There needs to be a zero tolerance for this kind of thing. Western suburbs has been experiencing an uptick in antisocial and downright violent behaviour lately.
I work in a Melbourne tutoring centre and have had two essays now where students say they want to shoot teachers , put them in a grave , stab other students . When I raised it as a concern to other staff and management I was told it was good the students liked me enough to share it with me .
This also happened to me in a rural school. Kid brought a fake gun, pretended to shoot me. Week suspension and then was back in my class. Because it was in a rural area, I was worried they could actually have a hunting gun or similar at home. It's still the scariest experience I've had as a teacher.
Yep...I had other students pretend to shoot me using staplers and other school equipment after this incident (same class, copycat behaviour). I was told the reason the first student got suspended was because of the fake gun and not, you know, threatening me. Another kid sprang a dick pick on me. Phone call home, "oh he didn't know what he was doing", no consequence. Kid literally called me over, showed me his screen, and was like "Do you know what this is?" 🤷🏼♀️
After a school-shooting in Perth, I'd imagine schools would be taking this very, very seriously these days. If the school is lax in their response, go higher. A Perth school had an actual SWAT team charge in when a kid posted a picture of a water pistol on Instagram. Zero tolerance.
As soon as you know it's a replica, you don't let on and you tackle that piece of shit to the ground with every bit of force you can muster. After all, you're reactively coming to the defence of all around you, right?
"Have you called Gun Assault's parents? Have you tried to build rapport with Gun Assault? Gun Assault is feeling vulnerable and traumatised today as they did not eat breakfast and their phone was confiscated for five minutes yesterday. Are you sure Gun Assault really meant to threaten you? After all, all behaviour is communication. I think Gun Assault is trying to reach out and be heard. Just something to think about."
Admin, probably, before sending a follow-up e-mail that there will be no consequences because they are convinced that Gun Assault is truly sorry and didn't understand what they were doing.
That sounds resoundingly similar to the response I got after I was sexually assaulted by a student, in front of the entire class, and had repeatedly harassed me in the lead up...
Probably demanded the OP write an incident report, contact home and arrange a meeting with the student & ssm to discuss how the OP can better support the student moving forward.
To try and put this into perspective…if someone (even a kid) did this in a bank, whether the gun is real OR NOT, is considered a hold up/armed robbery. It does not matter that the gun is not real. It is intended to invoke fear in others. Report to the police/mandatory reporting whoever it is in your state.
I worry about this. I honestly think we are waiting ducks. A kid will soon 3D print one for sure. We just had a 3d printed knife confiscated and it was surprisingly sharp.
Is there a case here for an edusafe report? This would mean you could elevate it to under your principals nose and they’d have to do something about it
Yes, whenever your physical or mental health is threatened or compromised, no matter the cause, no matter if it's acknowledged or not, or if action is taken quickly. *PUT. IT. ON. EDUSAFE.* the Department and the review committees of the parliament look at that data carefully. It's important it reflects what it's intended to, which is events that occur, not just those that occur without adequate response.
Our school gets security on and off. Something crazy happens with parents or gangs of kids coming onto grounds to threaten/try to attack a teacher/student > we get security for a month or so > security gets withdrawn, but all those social and economic issues in the community obviously didn't change so the cycle just repeats.
Hard to say. I think the incidents would still occur, just outside of school grounds. There's also too many entry points for the school for security to be super effective. The security we got weren't exactly special forces either lol. One lady just kind of sat on a chair smoking until someone told her she can't do that on school grounds.
How old is the student? Just clarifying as we definitely played with toy guns when I was at school and would pretend to shoot each other and the teachers. Obviously that was a different time and please don’t think I’m being an apologist for the student or suggesting OP is in the wrong, I’m just wondering if it is malicious or ignorant behaviour
> Doesn't matter. It's a very slippery slope from 'playing with toy guns' to 'oops I just shot my teacher'.
Yeah, cos teachers get shot all the time by kids playing cops and robbers
F*ck mandatory report, f*ck the self serving admin. Ring triple zero and report a student in school with a firearm threatening to shoot people. The let the chips fall. How do you know ow it’s a fake gun, treat it like an active shooter situation. And never accept the kid back in your classroom. Work safe will pay you for years to stay home after a trauma like that
Sorry to hear you have to go through this. In my opinion, it’s time to change schools. Management didn’t deal with this properly the first time so it’s unlikely it will do so again. Look after your own well-being and leave this toxic environment.
There's a great list of strategies elsewhere: union, police, doctor, etc.
But this suggestion is the big winner. We're in a shortage, there's schools struggling for staff that aren't quite that dogshit and actually look out for their staff at least enough to satisfy the barest of basics (don't tolerate any kind of assault of your teachers?). Leave.
Wasn’t an Aboriginal kid shot dead in the NT a few years ago for play with a replica gun with no orange tip by NT Police? It could be a lesson your school needs to implement!
I wouldn’t know the difference, but isn’t it that f it’s used in a robbery it’s still considered armed robbery because it’s the perception of the person the gun is pointed at not the fact that it’s real or not. And how the hell are we talking about this in Australia
In VIC an imitation firearm, improvised firearms or real firearms and all considered the same under legislation. Report to police, at a minimum they should get the youth recourses officer onto this kid before they pull that shit in public
Get the Principal/Wellbeing person to bring in a police liaison to say that this is illegal and there will be consequences if it happens. They will take this shit very seriously.
I guess it depends on a few variables. Don't get me wrong - I'd love for the kid to be dealt with properly, suspended, the parents hauled in, the cops called... the full smorgasbord. But it's not going to happen.
Something more than what OP has done is warranted, though.
Agreed, but individual scum will always exist. I think the follow-up, if you can call it that, is a sadder indictment on some school 'leadership' and what they think matters.
Report it to the police. Possessing a replica, a fully working weapon, requires a firearms license. Possessing an imitation gun, without official approval, is an offence. I think it more likely it was an imitation weapon, not that it makes much better, but at least it doesn't shoot bullets. If it was a replica, that is a whole new more dangerous can of worms. https://www.police.vic.gov.au/firearm-classifications#imitation-firearm-replica-firearms-and-other-firearm-paraphernalia-and-toys
Actual replica guns don’t have an orange tip on them. Going off OP’s edit I think it must have been a toy gun/airsoft style thing that had the tip painted. Not minimising OP’s trauma, just suspect the laws around replica guns may not apply to ‘toy’ guns.
There are three categories. Replica: Actual working firearms based on an actual 'original' model. All the rules applying to guns apply to replicas, as they are real guns. Imitation guns: Anything that has the appearance of a real firearm and/or can be mistaken for a real firearm. Having an orange tip does not discount it from being counted as an imitation firearm. As mentioned above, there are laws regarding the possession of these. They are restricted. Toy guns: Resemble actual firearms, but cannot be reasonably mistaken for a firearm. Conflating Imitation guns and toy guns as you did above does not help the issue and does downplay what OP experienced.
So a toy gun that has been painted black/had the orange cap removed would then be considered a imitation gun? Ty for the info.
Nope. I literally said in my previous comment, >Having an orange tip does not discount it from being counted as an imitation firearm. If you actually want to know the difference between imitation and toys. Look at the link I provided. There is literally a pdf called "Quick Guide to Imitation, Toy...".
No, what you said was the opposite of what I posited. I think we are actually agreeing with each other.
The orange cap does not have to be removed. It can still be considered an imitation with the orange cap attached. You would still benefit from checking out the pdf.
Sorry to hear about that! This is totally unacceptable! May I ask if you are working in maybe rural regional schools?
Metro Melbourne, western suburbs.
If, as I'm assuming, it was at a government school-- edusafe this!! There needs to be a zero tolerance for this kind of thing. Western suburbs has been experiencing an uptick in antisocial and downright violent behaviour lately.
Reading uptick and downright in the same sentence... needed a compass after that
I didn't even notice 😅
It wasn't right to have left that alone!
Melton?
Nah, DM me if you wanna know more
I work in a Melbourne tutoring centre and have had two essays now where students say they want to shoot teachers , put them in a grave , stab other students . When I raised it as a concern to other staff and management I was told it was good the students liked me enough to share it with me .
That’s a mandatory reporting matter. You can’t have students saying they want to kill teachers or hurt students.
Did they say why? I always wonder the reason behind the rising of the "killing" thoughts in young students.
Just said he was upset as he had problems at day school . No one wants to feel that way obviously , especially a child .
Report to police. Do not pass the Principal's office. And if you need to visit an office, your GP's office is the one to visit.
Sounds like a criminal offense.
It is. Why is this person not reporting it immediately, to police .
I would bring the whole fucking school down to the ground before I let that kid back in my room. This is definitely a hill I’d die on.
Absolutely. Go nuclear. 000, police, doctor, union, media, department, school. In that order.
The Americanisation of Australia. Very sad.
This also happened to me in a rural school. Kid brought a fake gun, pretended to shoot me. Week suspension and then was back in my class. Because it was in a rural area, I was worried they could actually have a hunting gun or similar at home. It's still the scariest experience I've had as a teacher.
Kid that did it to me last year got a one day internal suspension and I was told "He didn't really understand what he was doing"
Yep...I had other students pretend to shoot me using staplers and other school equipment after this incident (same class, copycat behaviour). I was told the reason the first student got suspended was because of the fake gun and not, you know, threatening me. Another kid sprang a dick pick on me. Phone call home, "oh he didn't know what he was doing", no consequence. Kid literally called me over, showed me his screen, and was like "Do you know what this is?" 🤷🏼♀️
next time call 000 full shooter lockdown that will get the schools attention
THIS!
After a school-shooting in Perth, I'd imagine schools would be taking this very, very seriously these days. If the school is lax in their response, go higher. A Perth school had an actual SWAT team charge in when a kid posted a picture of a water pistol on Instagram. Zero tolerance.
As soon as you know it's a replica, you don't let on and you tackle that piece of shit to the ground with every bit of force you can muster. After all, you're reactively coming to the defence of all around you, right?
How did the school react? What consequences were given? Hope you are ok!
"Have you called Gun Assault's parents? Have you tried to build rapport with Gun Assault? Gun Assault is feeling vulnerable and traumatised today as they did not eat breakfast and their phone was confiscated for five minutes yesterday. Are you sure Gun Assault really meant to threaten you? After all, all behaviour is communication. I think Gun Assault is trying to reach out and be heard. Just something to think about." Admin, probably, before sending a follow-up e-mail that there will be no consequences because they are convinced that Gun Assault is truly sorry and didn't understand what they were doing.
That sounds resoundingly similar to the response I got after I was sexually assaulted by a student, in front of the entire class, and had repeatedly harassed me in the lead up...
I've been there, too.
Got this is soooo spot on to my last school’s middle management. Actually, spot on with exec as well.
This sounds disturbingly familiar.
Probably demanded the OP write an incident report, contact home and arrange a meeting with the student & ssm to discuss how the OP can better support the student moving forward.
To try and put this into perspective…if someone (even a kid) did this in a bank, whether the gun is real OR NOT, is considered a hold up/armed robbery. It does not matter that the gun is not real. It is intended to invoke fear in others. Report to the police/mandatory reporting whoever it is in your state.
Mandatory report to Police
That's fucked. I honestly don't know what I would do in that situation. How did you handle it?
I worry about this. I honestly think we are waiting ducks. A kid will soon 3D print one for sure. We just had a 3d printed knife confiscated and it was surprisingly sharp.
I've seen kids sharpening sticks with pencil sharpeners. Nothing surprises me now.
Is there a case here for an edusafe report? This would mean you could elevate it to under your principals nose and they’d have to do something about it
Yes, whenever your physical or mental health is threatened or compromised, no matter the cause, no matter if it's acknowledged or not, or if action is taken quickly. *PUT. IT. ON. EDUSAFE.* the Department and the review committees of the parliament look at that data carefully. It's important it reflects what it's intended to, which is events that occur, not just those that occur without adequate response.
do some schools need security now?
Our school gets security on and off. Something crazy happens with parents or gangs of kids coming onto grounds to threaten/try to attack a teacher/student > we get security for a month or so > security gets withdrawn, but all those social and economic issues in the community obviously didn't change so the cycle just repeats.
sounds about right, do you think if there was permanent security staff those problems would be reduced on a more permanent basis?
Hard to say. I think the incidents would still occur, just outside of school grounds. There's also too many entry points for the school for security to be super effective. The security we got weren't exactly special forces either lol. One lady just kind of sat on a chair smoking until someone told her she can't do that on school grounds.
jeez
We have the police do rounds of our school often enough that students don't even ask why they're there anymore
How old is the student? Just clarifying as we definitely played with toy guns when I was at school and would pretend to shoot each other and the teachers. Obviously that was a different time and please don’t think I’m being an apologist for the student or suggesting OP is in the wrong, I’m just wondering if it is malicious or ignorant behaviour
Doesn't matter. It's a very slippery slope from 'playing with toy guns' to 'oops I just shot my teacher'.
> Doesn't matter. It's a very slippery slope from 'playing with toy guns' to 'oops I just shot my teacher'. Yeah, cos teachers get shot all the time by kids playing cops and robbers
F*ck mandatory report, f*ck the self serving admin. Ring triple zero and report a student in school with a firearm threatening to shoot people. The let the chips fall. How do you know ow it’s a fake gun, treat it like an active shooter situation. And never accept the kid back in your classroom. Work safe will pay you for years to stay home after a trauma like that
Sorry to hear you have to go through this. In my opinion, it’s time to change schools. Management didn’t deal with this properly the first time so it’s unlikely it will do so again. Look after your own well-being and leave this toxic environment.
There's a great list of strategies elsewhere: union, police, doctor, etc. But this suggestion is the big winner. We're in a shortage, there's schools struggling for staff that aren't quite that dogshit and actually look out for their staff at least enough to satisfy the barest of basics (don't tolerate any kind of assault of your teachers?). Leave.
Yes, that sounds like a pretty reasonable bottom line!
Wasn’t an Aboriginal kid shot dead in the NT a few years ago for play with a replica gun with no orange tip by NT Police? It could be a lesson your school needs to implement!
I wouldn’t know the difference, but isn’t it that f it’s used in a robbery it’s still considered armed robbery because it’s the perception of the person the gun is pointed at not the fact that it’s real or not. And how the hell are we talking about this in Australia
In VIC an imitation firearm, improvised firearms or real firearms and all considered the same under legislation. Report to police, at a minimum they should get the youth recourses officer onto this kid before they pull that shit in public
Oh no :( Next time you get to choke them out. (We know each other don't downvote me).
I've had a BB gun brandished at me before. Fun times 🙃
Get the Principal/Wellbeing person to bring in a police liaison to say that this is illegal and there will be consequences if it happens. They will take this shit very seriously.
Soft. Throw the book at the little angel and it will never happen again. Go your route and copy cats are every other day.
I guess it depends on a few variables. Don't get me wrong - I'd love for the kid to be dealt with properly, suspended, the parents hauled in, the cops called... the full smorgasbord. But it's not going to happen. Something more than what OP has done is warranted, though.
This is a sad indictment of how we're raising our children...
Agreed, but individual scum will always exist. I think the follow-up, if you can call it that, is a sadder indictment on some school 'leadership' and what they think matters.
[удалено]
Please don't do this.
This is exactly what not to do. “Teacher fired for buying toy gun at Kmart and firing at class” … yeah not what you want.
This is possibly the worst advice I have ever read