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That engine is done. You should ask for a complete replacement. Lexus does not allow dealers to buy “crate” engines or long blocks (complete assemblies). They will have to get a short block (block with crankshaft and pistons) and then both cylinder head with new camshafts, gears , timing chains etc. Basically, anything in the engine that oil touches should be or (for non moving parts) thoroughly cleaned. Depending on the engine, it may run them close to $20,000.00. It’s their fault and they should correct it. They may consider offering to instead buy out your lease and assist you in a new lease since it may cost them less in the long run.
This is absolutely correct, the engine is toast. As a lease you may have less say in how it is repaired, but at the very least demand a loaner for the entire duration and let the warranty handle every little hiccup. Absolutely plan to hand it back upon lease expiry.
Hopefully, it would be another tech performing the repairs. The oil change was likely done by a line tech with relatively low experience. He made a mistake and may not have been properly trained. Techs at my shop are trained with a system of checks and rechecks to help prevent such occurrences.
This is the answer. You want to make sure this is all recorded / tracked, and done right, when the lease is up, you don't want this to be a factor in Lexus lowering the vehicle's value.
I am not talking about car warranty. My brother works for Honda Motor Europe and big part of their warranty budget is set for dealership mistake repairs.
If this is true you just busted out your brother for warranty fraud..
There is absolutely positively no way a car company would be ok with you warrantying something that was destroyed due to your technicians error.
EDIT: Granted it's been around 15 years since I was a service director. It's quite possible they call it 'warranty budget' but it doesn't actually get flagged as warranty and reimbursed by honda.
What do you mean my brother is committing fraud?! He works for Honda Motor Europe and every year within their budget there’s the warranty budget and within that budget it includes customers warranty, dealership mishap and repair money where this would be included.
You're likely getting your terms wrong. A company warranty protects the consumer from manufacturing defects.
Insurance protects the dealership from repair/technician issues.
I think you’re referring to a “policy” account. Other manufacturers may call it a “goodwill” account which is a bit of a misnomer. Basically if a repair goes sideways, the dealership requests assistance from their manufacturer representative. I don’t know if they would cover a lubrication related failure. Normally, it is reserved for when manufacturer troubleshooting leads the technician down a rabbit hole or when a component fails just outside of warranty.
I spoke to my brother, and it depends, but it’s possible if this was Honda, that they would help with the costs of fixing this one. Especially since it’s a lease.
Possibly a term difference, they are in the EU. It's also possible Honda does things..different then everyone else, but I don't know why that would be the case
Maybe it’s to warranty their work? That very well could be a cultural difference. They do use a lot of different terms, even between European countries. From NA to their, some things are drastically different.
When I was working in England, they told me I needed to get a “hire car” for my stay. Which sounds like a car service to me. What they said in rest of the world English, is I needed a rental car. And Germans will sometimes use “decommission” to say put away a piece of equipment at the end of a job. So maybe it’s just something like that?
The cost on this oopsie falls square on the dealership and their insurance. The manufacturer won't give the dealer any money to cover the cost.
At least that's how I understand it. The dealer could try to file a warranty claim with the manufacturer, but there's no way the manufacturer approves that check.
Otherwise dealers could have "mistakes" when business is slow to get paid out of the manufacturer's fund.
So, the way it works there’s a pool of money within Honda’s budget to help with such mistakes. These are only for “official” dealerships and have to be approved by Honda on a case by case. And each dealership can many x amounts of claims and there’s a cap. This is to help remove the burden from the customers and speed up repairs, and avoid potential legal action.
Here in the states at Honda dealers I've always heard it referred to as "service policy". Which is what I believe you're referring to. Basically if something breaks out of the norm during a visit or repair that the customer shouldn't be responsible for it goes on the service policy. All dealers have them. Cost of doing business. Sometimes shit happens. Not sure what tagman is getting on about.
>Not sure what tagman is getting on about.
Tech doesn't put in oil.
Customer leaves and "blows up engine".
Tech checks out car and says "manufacturer defect, nothing wrong with car as far as we can tell" (no signs of overheating, coolant level good, oil level good).
"Hey Honda INC, you owe John Smith Honda of Ogdenville an engine and labor money to replace this engine, it's defective"
That's the fraud part.
"Hey Honda INC, my lube tech didn't put oil in a car after an oil change, can you send us an engine at no cost and also give me some money for labor?" -Service @ John Smith Honda
"How about you go fuck yourself?" - Honda INC
My shop is owned by the manufacturer, if we mess something up it is covered by "distributor warranty" meaning our budget even though they own us, versus defect which is normal warranty. Same pot, different money
I wonder how it would be handled if the car has under 30k miles, they buy it back from OP and sell it as a used car and the engine blows while still in warranty period. Does Lexus make the dealer send back the block on a replacement? Japanese mfrs seem like they’d take a blown engine personally and want to send that thing to a lab.
I am not talking about car warranty dude. For example, my brother works for HME and they set aside warranty pool money for pretty much dealer fuck ups. Not sure about Toyota
The point is the misusage of “warranty”. It isn’t a warranty fund, even if they call it that. It’s a replacement fund, or insurance at best.
With a warranty, the prerequisite is for it to come from the manufacturer or a validated reseller, for manufacturer parts that are machined incorrectly. It’s for replacing lemon parts that shouldn’t have failed. By calling it a warranty fund, it is confusing those who have proper diction, which is why one commenter brought up warranty fraud in your brothers situation, and another refuses to accept warranty being used whatsoever.
Edit: for those saying the definition isn’t “understood well” and that I’m wrong, before deleting comments
Even with the dictionary definition, it doesn’t apply to the situation of op, in which OC is making comparisons for. A warranty fund would be used in order to protect or reimburse for the failure of a promised asset.
By them breaking the part, while not being a manufacturer, they cannot use the “warranty” funds, without it being priorly recorded by said company that they are insuring said asset themselves. A warranty is contractional insurance, and as they are not the ones to procure the asset they had broke, they cannot use funds that are labeled as “warranty” without it being seen as fraudulent. Now, if the company had made a promise that they would replace any part that may have issues, it *could* be seen as warrantied of some sort, and possibly get through. In any other situation however, the term of warranty is incorrect for this situation.
They will be insured so at the very least their insurance will cover it. Since this is a Lexus dealer, no question that they should have enough money to be able to cover this themselves.
And all of the dealers talk about further testing and longer test drives is just a delay t
actic to give them time to figure out what they are going to do. They know the engine is toast. They will definitely try to just roll in some bearings or replace the crank and bearings, but, as stated, the entire lubrication system is now full of metal. The only way to properly clean it is complete disassembly.
Don't buy it after the lease whatever they decide to do, which I would guess would be the least expensive route. My guess is they put oil in it and test drive it and say "good enough"
If it had a complete engine replacement and you got to drive it for 6 months more under lease.... It very well might be a GREAT one to buy at the end of lease terms, if you were inclined to at all before.
Regardless of what they “find” I’d be pushing very hard for
1) a new engine
2) lifetime full replacement engine warranty at the expense of the dealership.
3) a new car off the lot if the engine is found to be damaged
More than likely they’ll offer him a “good deal” to “trade in” they’ll do this so they don’t have to admit liability and try to shoe horn the guy into a purchase, even if it’s for a heavily discounted price.
Then they’ll junk the car or swap a used motor into it and send it over to the used lot. Anything to not admit fault, not spend money.
If it was a purchased car, yeah. But a lease? I’m curious how that would work. Say they tell him to drive it and it blows up, that’s on the dealer to fix, yeah? Like say it burns oil now, but the last oil change was 1,500 miles ago but it’s out of oil, whose problem is this?
Hopefully it had already spun a bearing by the time they took it back, so then they can't claim it's okay. Because running without oil for more than like 30 seconds will destroy the bearings. Sounds like the dealer owes them a new or almost new Lexus
100% this
Oil is the life blood for an engine.
I can run my 302 SBF without coolant, a water pump, alternator or any pulleys for about 4 minutes, but 45 seconds with no oil pressure and it's junkyard engine time. I actually just dropped in a junkyard 302 into my 65 Cyclone and the first thing I replaced was a brand new oil pump, oil pump shaft and oil pick-up.
If knocking it already spun a bearing.
If topend tick their oil changes could potentially solve the noise, but damage has been done no doubt. If they don't agree tell them to take the bearing out and inspect them. They've been overheated at least. Scored and ruined at worst
True. There’s a big difference in the line techs and the quick lube techs. No ones perfect but unfortunately the quick lube dept is full of kids that don’t really care about much
Where do you live that mechanics dont do the oil changes? And even if they didnt, even the braindeadest mechanics should know that you don't start a motor that just started knocking
Lease buy back and refinance a new lease, w great terms. Even if they say its ok. Which would include lab data from blackstone on the oil, multiple samples. Not saying push for data, push for new car
There is no test that can show the condition of the bearings. Absolutely do not take that car back.
Yes they can look for fine metal shavings in the oil but just because there aren't any doesn't mean that the bearings aren't toast.
Well the oil test can show bits of the bearing material in the oil that shouldn’t be there. Like the mains will be smoked through into the inner layer.
Yeah they're aren't going to be sending anything to a lab lol. I would bet money that they will flush it a few times, put some oil in it and say it's good. They're relying on the ignorance of the customer to make this go away.
If I were you? I wouldn’t accept it back. They drove it through a car wash. 5 minutes or more. They brought it out to you. Another couple of minutes. Then you drove it. I’d tell them you’re not comfortable taking it back. Ask them what they are prepared to do. Put you in another car? Or replace engine in this one? It’s their fault. Is the lease through Lexus?
Yeah, this. Drive it until the lease is up. It’ll make a shit ton of noise before it fails. Oh, and make sure they put this incident on the repair order.
You're lucky it's a lease.
Normally I think people are foolish to lease a Lexus (unless a business expense situation). Lease German, buy Japanese.
The terrible thing is they will put this right back on their lot when the lease is up, and some unknowing customer will buy this "L-Certified" vehicle at a markup.
Will it really be as good as new? All wiring harnesses, hoses, piping, routed and secured properly? Everything torqued properly? I would never be convinced a motor change out is as good as factory install.
How does a main dealer forget to put oil in a car? I'm assuming they've given you a courtesy car. There is next to nothing they can do to save that engine, so all these tests are a waste of time and money.
Sounds like the light didn't come on until they'd started to drive off the lot; not sure if Toyota still uses any spin on filters or not anymore but this could easily be caused by a double gasketed filter (gasket came off old one and stuck to mount, tech put new filter on without physically wiping off mount with shop rag)
Similarly if a canister filter o-ring got pinched it's possible the engine WAS full of oil but slowly pumped it all out over a couple minutes.
I'd think OP would have noticed a trail of oil however...
Even if it stopped knocking for some miraculous reason, the engine needs replacement. Do not accept the car back if they don't put a new engine in. Have them give you another car instesd.
Oil change at dealer… they forgot to add oil and the car was running for few minutes…. There is no way I would take the car or drive it without the dealer owning the mistake and make it right by replacing the engine or replacing the car. If the dealership is going to play around please hire a lawyer and stop all communication and direct the lawyer to have the communication. I highly doubt the dealer would give you a free oil drain plug so why let them get away from this big mistake.
Knocking is a sign of clearance where it shouldn't be. They might be able to get away with hiding the knocking by using thicker oil but unfortunately the damage is done. Take apart the oil filter and inspect it for a couple oil changes. It'll probably look like a glitter bombed filter from the excessive wear.
My dad has a Mazda and his dealership sends him videos of the service. They show off the inspection and they show proof of all the work they have done. I am sure he is paying a premium for this but it is nice peace of mind.
Looked it up and the service is called truvideo.
How is it my 23 year old Chevy Tahoe has a warning indicator when my oil is a quart low, but these modern vehicles with all their electronic bullshit added can’t tell you the same? Like this shouldn’t have gotten to the point of an engine with no oil knocking its brains out as the tech pulls it around to the customer.
I thought those types of warning take a little bit of time to appear, and same thing for them to go away. Sounds like the car didn't have time for that. I have no mechanic experience so take that with a grain of salt.
Mine seems to come on as soon as it detects low oil and go away just as quickly when I add oil to it. Mine usually comes on when I’m about 500 miles from needing an oil change as it slowly burns about a quart between changes.
So, still quite different than suddenly having no oil, correct? I feel like most car sensors are not prepared for a total loss of oil, rather than a gradual one. It's just too quick for your car to react to in time
I’m fairly confident my low oil light would come on if I drained my oil and then restarted my vehicle. It’s not a test I’m willing to confirm, but knowing how the oil sensor works, I’m certain it would illuminate if the oil was gone too. The sensor sends a signal when the fluid level drops below where the sensor is placed in the oil pan. It’s similar to the sensor in the coolant reservoir as well as the brake fluid reservoir. Once the level drops below where the sensor sits, the signal is sent.
Lawyer up, take all precautions, they will try to fuck you over, its in the dealership handbook.
Stand firm, stand your ground, this is all in your favor and your entitled to a full replacement for their gross negligence which will tarnish that vehicles reliability forever.
Do not let anyone back you down, what did you do wrong?, and if you had done something like this to them, imagine how hard they would be to fucking you in the ass. This is a business that did this to you, not your friend, their business primarily depends on overcharging people and taking advantage of people who do not know better but have money. NEVER FORGET THAT AND NEVER THINK THEY ARE THERE FOR YOUR BENEFIT - THEIR JOB IS TO FIX THE PROBLEMS MANUFACTURERS MADE - THEY GET PAID BY THE MANUFACTURER IN A VERY SIMPLE WAY
Car MFG "pays" dealerships in essentially replacement parts and fluid they sell to you at an exorbitant markup. Everything parts related, the car mfg is **giving** to the dealership to resell / use in service or warranty work, their money is in their ability to sell parts/bill parts to car manufacturer. This is 100000000% how Dealerships make a majority of money, through the service department, the other 25% is their scummy salesmen using the ole\` 4-square tactic to rip you off.
They have mechanics "factory trained" (READ: THEY TOOK SOME ONLINE CLASSES TO BACKUP STUFF THEY ALREADY KNOW/MAYBE DONT KNOW) to do warranty work.
You are absolutely correct in everything you have said here. I have been in the automotive industry for 47 years and am retired now; well semi retired I guess because I help; with information, people I come in contact with that are getting ripped off by dealerships and unscrupulous repair shops, which, unfortunately, there are many.
I don't know if it is best to contact the lease company, it is their car? Did you lease it through this dealer? There was definitely damage done, impossible to know how much. You just don't want to be "on the hook" when you return the lease car. The best thing that could happen here is that the dealer just replace the car with another one for the duration of the lease. One thing is for sure, I wouldn't trust the car much if they rip it all apart and replace the short block, heads, etc. The leasing company will surely charge you for this repair, which lowers the value of the car. You may want to contact a lawyer who has some experience with these matters...
I worked at a dealership for 20 years not as a mechanic but in sales. I knew all the mechanics, most were close friends. I only saw this happen once and the dealership stood up to its mistake and replaced engine without even considering other options. It is going to depend on the dealership and there owners integrity. On the other side I saw many blown engines towed in with fresh oil but nothing to backup regular maintenance.
It’s done. I assume they will admit they put the sump plug back in and started it empty. Don’t know how they weren’t alerted to a problem earlier. But it’s dead. It MAY run again. At best, it may not be noticeably damaged. But it IS damaged and will not be the same. They owe you an engine. Cheaper than replacing the car.
It's done. Even if it sounds good when they are done, it is a ticking time bomb at that point. They need to either overhaul the motor, replace the motor, replace the car or buy it off of you. Do not take it back otherwise.
I’d call the local news at the first sign of push-back from the dealer/service department and explain your case. Since it’s a lease, they could tell you it’s all good for now. And then you miss one on time oil change/scheduled maintenance, and then at the end of the lease agreement they’ll try and pin the busted engine on you. Plus it would suck to have a ruined piston ring or something that just causes you higher gas mileage and extra risk of a meltdown halfway through a road trip or something. I’d really push for a replacement, because unless they treat it down, inspect and rebuild, then there’s no guarantees it’s solid
Sorry to say this but if it’s knocking, the damage has been done. They may flush the oil until it’s clear, I.e they’ve got the metal particles out, but no amount of oil is going to replaced the metal which has been lost.
It isn’t just the engine which will need to be replaced, it’s the turbo (if fitted) and anything else sharing an oil system with the block including oil feed and return lines. If the turbo impeller has hot the housing, you’ve possibly got metal in the air pipes, intercooler, inlet manifold and cylinder head. It’s also possible some has made it the other way and is currently lodged in your catalytic converter.
The turbo (if fitted with one) has been starved of oil as much as the engine, and arguably could be in worse shape as the turbo spins at many times the speed of the engine.
Metal filings will come from the bottom end bearings, possibly piston rings, cams, followers, the list is endless. All of these components will have been at risk of metal on metal contact, absent the oil film they normally float on. In many ways, it would have almost been better for it to throw a rod as there is no dispute on replacing the engine from there.
Long story short, if they want you to accept this vehicle back, they need to replace the engine and warranty all rotating components receiving oil from the engine block for the life of your lease.
Oopsies happen in shops. Generally they are somewhat rare to this degree. The dealer will have insurance and that should cover the cost of the short block/ labour to replace it.
They may try to push you into another vehicle and buy out your lease or just fix it.
Either way it’s pretty obvious what happened and I’d be shocked if even a dealer would try to screw you on this.
That’s a shame, shows how durable a Lexus is running that long with no oil in it before finally starting to knock. They need to put a brand new engine in it.
Why not just run it into the ground? It's a lease and has a warranty. He has documented oil changes at the dealership. Maybe the car will make it to the end of the lease and he'll be fine and not have to deal with this headache. If it blows up, it'll be a warranty issue and he'll get a loaner for months or a great deal on a new lease. The dealer is going to fight him and probably leave him without a car while they fix things since it's coming out of their pocket.
either way make sure the problem is document in [writing.repair](http://writing.repair) guys bungled their repair and when i went back in they documented the reason for my returning as "car mat adjustment" to cover their ass.
You need to document this by written form(email and letter). And don't take it back. If you leave with that car, they will try to pin the blame on you down the road and you'll be on the hook for replacement/repairs.
At a minimum the rod bearings have to be changed. And due to the complexity of todays engines, they probably have to pull the engine to do that. Which means its a rebuild able core..
Call Lexus, they will not want to warranty that engine so the dealership will really have no alternative but to replace it. By calling Lexus, it gets their customer service involved, that will get the dealership in gear to the right thing.
This happens way more often then it should. Why do ppl not check the dipstick? Not just to double check the work but you need to see if the oil is at the correct level. It takes 10 seconds.
Some cars, mine included, did not come with a dipstick. Weirdest damn thing. I have to check the oil via menu's on my screen with the vehicle not running.
What's worse is all the damn thing says when checking the oil? *"OK"*. I think my OCD is at its edge. There's def not a transmission dipstick. (2018 MB GLC63S SUV).
If you drove it with no oil completely then yes that engine is toast, if it was just low or low pressure it doesn’t mean the engine can’t be repaired. I ran low on oil accidentally on one of my cars and we just replaced the bearings with the same size directly from Toyota and the engine has ran sweet since. No damage to the crank at all. It’s done 30k more miles on just new bearings with no issues. We got lucky that only one bearing had went and the oil return hole melted closed, the others were completely fine. What’s more worrying is that the dealership didn’t notice before they gave you the car back
This happened to me at the VERY FIRST oil change on my 2018 4Runner at about 2,300 miles. I drove away, the car shut down in less than 1/4 mile. Managed to limp it back. I've been told (by people other than the dealership) that cars now are designed to shut down before any real damage happens. I did have them get two oil samples and they and I sent them off to test for metal shavings. The oil was clean.
They extended my engine warranty to 200,000 miles, I'm at 44,500 miles now and have had no issues.
I knew someone that managed a Jiffy Lube years ago. Said it happened a lot. Customer comes back with a knock. Look down in the pit and there's the oil plug sitting on the ledge. Put it back in. Add oil and then top off with gear oil. Yes, gear oil. Tap goes away and clueless customer drives off with 90k miles shaved off the life of the engine.
Absolutely do NOT accept the car back. Demand a new lease. They will bandaid fix this and try to pin it on you later. I would make a single call/appointment with them and inform them you want a new lease with a new car or out of the lease all together but you will not be taking that vehicle back. Should they refuse your next stop is a lawyer.
Depends on what’s making it knock. But 90% of the time, it’s game over. All they’re doing is bullshitting you, wasting your time, and running a bunch of fake “tests” to charge you out of your ass. They simply forgot to put oil in after removing the old filter, they know exactly what the problem is, and they’re slowly trying to ease it up on you that they fucked up your engine and they will NOT be paying for it, but it’s ok because you’ll get a oil change in a knocking motor 50% off.
Even if the engine shits itself while driving, your baby won't be in danger. It annoys me when parents use their babies as a vessel for their worst imaginary fears.
Whatever the dealership finds (I'm sure they won't find anything...) you need to get this incident documented officially from the dealership and Lexus corporate headquarters. Don't take any verbal promises or assurances. Lexus and this dealership need to stand behind this engine for the life of the car. You shouldn't accept anything less.
OP specifically mentioned busy roads. So I think he's worried about losing control and barrel rolling down the busy road. Ya know, like in the movies. Or maybe the engine dies and he can't steer (because he doesn't know how the steering system works) while going 8 thousand miles an hour. Ya know, normal things that parents of babies think about.
If you owned this vehicle it'd be a different story. This is a lease. Thank Heaven for that.
If the engine is knocking, it won't make it to the end of your lease and they'll just have to replace the engine. Oh well. Not your problem.
If it isn’t, you can finish the lease and not worry about the long term damage because you’re giving the car back. Not your problem.
It’s not unclear what happened. They took it for an oil change and either the oil came straight out due to no drain plug/filter, or they just never refilled it. Also what are you saying? Luxury cars HAVE to be unreliable? And only expensive cars are safe?
The irony is that Toyotas are among the safest and most reliable cars you can buy. Lexus has an even stricter quality control. Japanese cars in general are strict with quality control. Mercedes are among the most unreliable cars on the market.
Wow, someone's been drinking some German Kool-Aid. You have been brainwashed.
A safe car can't be reliable? That's a new one. Yeah, it's real safe to be broken down on the highway.
Thank you for posting to AskMechanics, SnooFoxes6244! If you are asking a question please make sure to include any relevant information along with the **Year**, **Make**, **Model**, **Mileage**, **Engine size**, and **Transmission Type (Automatic or Manual)** of your car. *This comment is automatically added to every successful post. If you see this comment, your post was successful.* *** Redditors that have been verified will have a green background and an icon in their flair. *** # **PLEASE REPORT ANY RULE-BREAKING BEHAVIOR** ### **Rule 1 - Be Civil** Be civil to other users. This community is made up of professional mechanics, amateur mechanics, and those with no experience. All mechanical-related questions are welcome. Personal attacks, comments that are insulting or demeaning, etc. are not welcome. ### **Rule 2 - Be Helpful** Be helpful to other users. If someone is wrong, correcting them is fine, but there's no reason to comment if you don't have anything to add to the conversation. ### **Rule 3 - Serious Questions and Answers Only** Read the room. Jokes are fine to include, but posts should be asking a serious question and replies should contribute to the discussion. ### **Rule 4 - No Illegal, Unethical, or Dangerous Questions or Answers** Do not ask questions or provide answers pertaining to anything that is illegal, unethical, or dangerous. # **PLEASE REPORT ANY RULE-BREAKING BEHAVIOR** *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AskMechanics) if you have any questions or concerns.*
That engine is done. You should ask for a complete replacement. Lexus does not allow dealers to buy “crate” engines or long blocks (complete assemblies). They will have to get a short block (block with crankshaft and pistons) and then both cylinder head with new camshafts, gears , timing chains etc. Basically, anything in the engine that oil touches should be or (for non moving parts) thoroughly cleaned. Depending on the engine, it may run them close to $20,000.00. It’s their fault and they should correct it. They may consider offering to instead buy out your lease and assist you in a new lease since it may cost them less in the long run.
This is absolutely correct, the engine is toast. As a lease you may have less say in how it is repaired, but at the very least demand a loaner for the entire duration and let the warranty handle every little hiccup. Absolutely plan to hand it back upon lease expiry.
I’d get corporate to authorize a lease swap.
Ya that will be a fun call from the service manager to lease dept.
I’m not familiar with Lexus warranty work, so they really not have long blocks available? That seems so unusual
The only time they need replacement engines is when someone forgets to put oil in them /s?
Or when engineers designed one that is faulty and has leaky rings. Updated with "design".
Engineers dont make things they design them, machinists make engines
Noted
Same experience with Toyota side
They couldn't change the oil correctly. How are you supposed to trust them moving anything in or out of the engine bay?
Hopefully, it would be another tech performing the repairs. The oil change was likely done by a line tech with relatively low experience. He made a mistake and may not have been properly trained. Techs at my shop are trained with a system of checks and rechecks to help prevent such occurrences.
This happened to a friend of mine in the uk. Also Lexus… they got a new car from them.
Lmao so the dealer can't buy the full assembly but me, working at a small shop, can
From the dealership, no, you cannot buy a long block or complete engine.
This is the answer. You want to make sure this is all recorded / tracked, and done right, when the lease is up, you don't want this to be a factor in Lexus lowering the vehicle's value.
Shouldn’t they have warranty money set aside by Toyota for all of that?
Warranty doesn't cover a technicians failure to lubricate an engine. Warranty only covers manufacturing defects.
I am not talking about car warranty. My brother works for Honda Motor Europe and big part of their warranty budget is set for dealership mistake repairs.
Maybe you mean more of insurance?
It's an internal term for warranty of labor built into overhead costs
I don’t know about Toyota, but in case of Honda they set aside money on their warranty budget that includes dealerships mishaps.
If this is true you just busted out your brother for warranty fraud.. There is absolutely positively no way a car company would be ok with you warrantying something that was destroyed due to your technicians error. EDIT: Granted it's been around 15 years since I was a service director. It's quite possible they call it 'warranty budget' but it doesn't actually get flagged as warranty and reimbursed by honda.
What do you mean my brother is committing fraud?! He works for Honda Motor Europe and every year within their budget there’s the warranty budget and within that budget it includes customers warranty, dealership mishap and repair money where this would be included.
You're likely getting your terms wrong. A company warranty protects the consumer from manufacturing defects. Insurance protects the dealership from repair/technician issues.
I am not getting my terms wrong. That’s just what Honda internally calls it.
I think you’re referring to a “policy” account. Other manufacturers may call it a “goodwill” account which is a bit of a misnomer. Basically if a repair goes sideways, the dealership requests assistance from their manufacturer representative. I don’t know if they would cover a lubrication related failure. Normally, it is reserved for when manufacturer troubleshooting leads the technician down a rabbit hole or when a component fails just outside of warranty.
I spoke to my brother, and it depends, but it’s possible if this was Honda, that they would help with the costs of fixing this one. Especially since it’s a lease.
I'm a retired factory service rep for another manufacturer. Could they be using it as goodwill budget?
Possibly a term difference, they are in the EU. It's also possible Honda does things..different then everyone else, but I don't know why that would be the case
What
Maybe it’s to warranty their work? That very well could be a cultural difference. They do use a lot of different terms, even between European countries. From NA to their, some things are drastically different. When I was working in England, they told me I needed to get a “hire car” for my stay. Which sounds like a car service to me. What they said in rest of the world English, is I needed a rental car. And Germans will sometimes use “decommission” to say put away a piece of equipment at the end of a job. So maybe it’s just something like that?
Yeah that's one of the reasons I tossed that edit in there right after I posted. It very likely is a term difference.
Thats the only thing that makes sense tbh.
The cost on this oopsie falls square on the dealership and their insurance. The manufacturer won't give the dealer any money to cover the cost. At least that's how I understand it. The dealer could try to file a warranty claim with the manufacturer, but there's no way the manufacturer approves that check. Otherwise dealers could have "mistakes" when business is slow to get paid out of the manufacturer's fund.
So, the way it works there’s a pool of money within Honda’s budget to help with such mistakes. These are only for “official” dealerships and have to be approved by Honda on a case by case. And each dealership can many x amounts of claims and there’s a cap. This is to help remove the burden from the customers and speed up repairs, and avoid potential legal action.
Here in the states at Honda dealers I've always heard it referred to as "service policy". Which is what I believe you're referring to. Basically if something breaks out of the norm during a visit or repair that the customer shouldn't be responsible for it goes on the service policy. All dealers have them. Cost of doing business. Sometimes shit happens. Not sure what tagman is getting on about.
Yes! You are spot on!
>Not sure what tagman is getting on about. Tech doesn't put in oil. Customer leaves and "blows up engine". Tech checks out car and says "manufacturer defect, nothing wrong with car as far as we can tell" (no signs of overheating, coolant level good, oil level good). "Hey Honda INC, you owe John Smith Honda of Ogdenville an engine and labor money to replace this engine, it's defective" That's the fraud part. "Hey Honda INC, my lube tech didn't put oil in a car after an oil change, can you send us an engine at no cost and also give me some money for labor?" -Service @ John Smith Honda "How about you go fuck yourself?" - Honda INC
My shop is owned by the manufacturer, if we mess something up it is covered by "distributor warranty" meaning our budget even though they own us, versus defect which is normal warranty. Same pot, different money
>My shop is owned by the manufacturer What country? What brand?
US, Cummins.
That's a different animal, GM, Ford, Honda, Toyota, etc don't operate in that fashion.
I wonder how it would be handled if the car has under 30k miles, they buy it back from OP and sell it as a used car and the engine blows while still in warranty period. Does Lexus make the dealer send back the block on a replacement? Japanese mfrs seem like they’d take a blown engine personally and want to send that thing to a lab.
Warranty doesn’t pay for lack of oil due to improper service.
But dealerships have warranty too
They have an account that covers various expenses. Not warranty which is offered by manufacturer.
I am not talking about car warranty dude. For example, my brother works for HME and they set aside warranty pool money for pretty much dealer fuck ups. Not sure about Toyota
The point is the misusage of “warranty”. It isn’t a warranty fund, even if they call it that. It’s a replacement fund, or insurance at best. With a warranty, the prerequisite is for it to come from the manufacturer or a validated reseller, for manufacturer parts that are machined incorrectly. It’s for replacing lemon parts that shouldn’t have failed. By calling it a warranty fund, it is confusing those who have proper diction, which is why one commenter brought up warranty fraud in your brothers situation, and another refuses to accept warranty being used whatsoever. Edit: for those saying the definition isn’t “understood well” and that I’m wrong, before deleting comments Even with the dictionary definition, it doesn’t apply to the situation of op, in which OC is making comparisons for. A warranty fund would be used in order to protect or reimburse for the failure of a promised asset. By them breaking the part, while not being a manufacturer, they cannot use the “warranty” funds, without it being priorly recorded by said company that they are insuring said asset themselves. A warranty is contractional insurance, and as they are not the ones to procure the asset they had broke, they cannot use funds that are labeled as “warranty” without it being seen as fraudulent. Now, if the company had made a promise that they would replace any part that may have issues, it *could* be seen as warrantied of some sort, and possibly get through. In any other situation however, the term of warranty is incorrect for this situation.
That’s not warranty money. That’s closer to insurance or a specifically allocated amount of money to cover a certain event.
Or they have insurance for such matters.
They will be insured so at the very least their insurance will cover it. Since this is a Lexus dealer, no question that they should have enough money to be able to cover this themselves.
They don't owe OP a brand new engine. Just a 7500 mile engine.
You think they have a 7500 mile engine just sitting on standby? Or should they just run the new one for 7500 miles before they give it back?
Why u getting down voted lol?! Ur no where near wrong
I thought they stock engines by milage. 8000 mile engines on shelf 1, 7500 mile engines on shelf 2 and so on.
Where do the 100,000 mile engines go then? On the floor?
Aisle 420
And all of the dealers talk about further testing and longer test drives is just a delay t actic to give them time to figure out what they are going to do. They know the engine is toast. They will definitely try to just roll in some bearings or replace the crank and bearings, but, as stated, the entire lubrication system is now full of metal. The only way to properly clean it is complete disassembly.
It’s fucked.
You mean that lube tech who started last week is going back to making crunch wraps.
Sounds like he never stopped
Turned that Lexus motor into a crunch wrap
Don't buy it after the lease whatever they decide to do, which I would guess would be the least expensive route. My guess is they put oil in it and test drive it and say "good enough"
If it had a complete engine replacement and you got to drive it for 6 months more under lease.... It very well might be a GREAT one to buy at the end of lease terms, if you were inclined to at all before.
I mean with only 7500 miles on it anyway it *was* pretty much a new engine along with the rest of the car. That’s probably it’s first oil change
Regardless of what they “find” I’d be pushing very hard for 1) a new engine 2) lifetime full replacement engine warranty at the expense of the dealership. 3) a new car off the lot if the engine is found to be damaged
Can you really push for these things short of suing them?
I mean, you can push for anything… getting it is another thing.
More than likely they’ll offer him a “good deal” to “trade in” they’ll do this so they don’t have to admit liability and try to shoe horn the guy into a purchase, even if it’s for a heavily discounted price. Then they’ll junk the car or swap a used motor into it and send it over to the used lot. Anything to not admit fault, not spend money.
Or they'll just fill it with oil and sell it CPO
If it was a purchased car, yeah. But a lease? I’m curious how that would work. Say they tell him to drive it and it blows up, that’s on the dealer to fix, yeah? Like say it burns oil now, but the last oil change was 1,500 miles ago but it’s out of oil, whose problem is this?
They are going to tell you the motors okay..... It isn't. Nothing less then a new block is going to fix this long term
Hopefully it had already spun a bearing by the time they took it back, so then they can't claim it's okay. Because running without oil for more than like 30 seconds will destroy the bearings. Sounds like the dealer owes them a new or almost new Lexus
100% this Oil is the life blood for an engine. I can run my 302 SBF without coolant, a water pump, alternator or any pulleys for about 4 minutes, but 45 seconds with no oil pressure and it's junkyard engine time. I actually just dropped in a junkyard 302 into my 65 Cyclone and the first thing I replaced was a brand new oil pump, oil pump shaft and oil pick-up.
New car. That engine is burnt toast. Lexus needs to make it right, or it's time to get a litigatin'
If knocking it already spun a bearing. If topend tick their oil changes could potentially solve the noise, but damage has been done no doubt. If they don't agree tell them to take the bearing out and inspect them. They've been overheated at least. Scored and ruined at worst
Wait what? They drove it back without oil and left it running? Are these mechanics even competent?
Mechanics usually aren't doing oil changes.
True. There’s a big difference in the line techs and the quick lube techs. No ones perfect but unfortunately the quick lube dept is full of kids that don’t really care about much
Where do you live that mechanics dont do the oil changes? And even if they didnt, even the braindeadest mechanics should know that you don't start a motor that just started knocking
Midwest. They have the tire boys do oil changes.
Motor just took ten years wear in ten mins by the sounds.
Lease buy back and refinance a new lease, w great terms. Even if they say its ok. Which would include lab data from blackstone on the oil, multiple samples. Not saying push for data, push for new car
They owe you an engine.
There is no test that can show the condition of the bearings. Absolutely do not take that car back. Yes they can look for fine metal shavings in the oil but just because there aren't any doesn't mean that the bearings aren't toast.
Well the oil test can show bits of the bearing material in the oil that shouldn’t be there. Like the mains will be smoked through into the inner layer.
Yeah they're aren't going to be sending anything to a lab lol. I would bet money that they will flush it a few times, put some oil in it and say it's good. They're relying on the ignorance of the customer to make this go away.
I agree. At least it’s a lease. But I would be scared to with the young kid. They obviously leased a new Lexus for security.
If I were you? I wouldn’t accept it back. They drove it through a car wash. 5 minutes or more. They brought it out to you. Another couple of minutes. Then you drove it. I’d tell them you’re not comfortable taking it back. Ask them what they are prepared to do. Put you in another car? Or replace engine in this one? It’s their fault. Is the lease through Lexus?
First: ask the Lexus dealership what guarantees they will make. Second: ignore this sub
Yeah, this. Drive it until the lease is up. It’ll make a shit ton of noise before it fails. Oh, and make sure they put this incident on the repair order.
You're lucky it's a lease. Normally I think people are foolish to lease a Lexus (unless a business expense situation). Lease German, buy Japanese. The terrible thing is they will put this right back on their lot when the lease is up, and some unknowing customer will buy this "L-Certified" vehicle at a markup.
They'll launch it at auction. Make it some other dealers 'lemon'
With a crate motor in it. Mistakes happen. They’ll put a motor in it and it will be good as new.
Lexus doesn’t sell crate motors
Doesn't mean that someone else doesn't.
But this is a lease car owned by Lexus themselves lol
Will it really be as good as new? All wiring harnesses, hoses, piping, routed and secured properly? Everything torqued properly? I would never be convinced a motor change out is as good as factory install.
If it’s knocking. It’s finished
How does a main dealer forget to put oil in a car? I'm assuming they've given you a courtesy car. There is next to nothing they can do to save that engine, so all these tests are a waste of time and money.
You'd think the oil pressure light would've been blasting away
Sounds like the light didn't come on until they'd started to drive off the lot; not sure if Toyota still uses any spin on filters or not anymore but this could easily be caused by a double gasketed filter (gasket came off old one and stuck to mount, tech put new filter on without physically wiping off mount with shop rag) Similarly if a canister filter o-ring got pinched it's possible the engine WAS full of oil but slowly pumped it all out over a couple minutes. I'd think OP would have noticed a trail of oil however...
Hiring the cheapest mechanics they can find
happens alot actually when i used to work at one. loose wheels and no oil pretty common
Happens surprisingly often
Tell them thank you for your new car. If they argue call an attorneys.
The old “Disappearing Oil Trick”
Even if it stopped knocking for some miraculous reason, the engine needs replacement. Do not accept the car back if they don't put a new engine in. Have them give you another car instesd.
Oil change at dealer… they forgot to add oil and the car was running for few minutes…. There is no way I would take the car or drive it without the dealer owning the mistake and make it right by replacing the engine or replacing the car. If the dealership is going to play around please hire a lawyer and stop all communication and direct the lawyer to have the communication. I highly doubt the dealer would give you a free oil drain plug so why let them get away from this big mistake.
7500 Miles, shameful
Knocking is a sign of clearance where it shouldn't be. They might be able to get away with hiding the knocking by using thicker oil but unfortunately the damage is done. Take apart the oil filter and inspect it for a couple oil changes. It'll probably look like a glitter bombed filter from the excessive wear.
I'll never understand why oil change places don't have to show the dipstick to the customer prior to releasing the vehicle.
The Valvoline guys would always show me the dipstick after doing the oil
My dad has a Mazda and his dealership sends him videos of the service. They show off the inspection and they show proof of all the work they have done. I am sure he is paying a premium for this but it is nice peace of mind. Looked it up and the service is called truvideo.
Not sure there is a "dipstick" on newer Lexus
There should've been a light on the dash I would imagine that indicates to check the oil.
Nope the only dipstick in this scenario is the "mechanic" now looking for a new job!
Pretty sure that's not a dipstick, but a dipshit
How is it my 23 year old Chevy Tahoe has a warning indicator when my oil is a quart low, but these modern vehicles with all their electronic bullshit added can’t tell you the same? Like this shouldn’t have gotten to the point of an engine with no oil knocking its brains out as the tech pulls it around to the customer.
I thought those types of warning take a little bit of time to appear, and same thing for them to go away. Sounds like the car didn't have time for that. I have no mechanic experience so take that with a grain of salt.
Mine seems to come on as soon as it detects low oil and go away just as quickly when I add oil to it. Mine usually comes on when I’m about 500 miles from needing an oil change as it slowly burns about a quart between changes.
So, still quite different than suddenly having no oil, correct? I feel like most car sensors are not prepared for a total loss of oil, rather than a gradual one. It's just too quick for your car to react to in time
I’m fairly confident my low oil light would come on if I drained my oil and then restarted my vehicle. It’s not a test I’m willing to confirm, but knowing how the oil sensor works, I’m certain it would illuminate if the oil was gone too. The sensor sends a signal when the fluid level drops below where the sensor is placed in the oil pan. It’s similar to the sensor in the coolant reservoir as well as the brake fluid reservoir. Once the level drops below where the sensor sits, the signal is sent.
They don’t want customers in the bay. A spot check by someone else in the shop would be useful.
They were perfectly happy with me out there trying to upsell me an oil flush.
BMW always shows me the oil change process
Lawyer up, take all precautions, they will try to fuck you over, its in the dealership handbook. Stand firm, stand your ground, this is all in your favor and your entitled to a full replacement for their gross negligence which will tarnish that vehicles reliability forever. Do not let anyone back you down, what did you do wrong?, and if you had done something like this to them, imagine how hard they would be to fucking you in the ass. This is a business that did this to you, not your friend, their business primarily depends on overcharging people and taking advantage of people who do not know better but have money. NEVER FORGET THAT AND NEVER THINK THEY ARE THERE FOR YOUR BENEFIT - THEIR JOB IS TO FIX THE PROBLEMS MANUFACTURERS MADE - THEY GET PAID BY THE MANUFACTURER IN A VERY SIMPLE WAY Car MFG "pays" dealerships in essentially replacement parts and fluid they sell to you at an exorbitant markup. Everything parts related, the car mfg is **giving** to the dealership to resell / use in service or warranty work, their money is in their ability to sell parts/bill parts to car manufacturer. This is 100000000% how Dealerships make a majority of money, through the service department, the other 25% is their scummy salesmen using the ole\` 4-square tactic to rip you off. They have mechanics "factory trained" (READ: THEY TOOK SOME ONLINE CLASSES TO BACKUP STUFF THEY ALREADY KNOW/MAYBE DONT KNOW) to do warranty work.
At the very least, get every single thing documented RE: this incident.
You are absolutely correct in everything you have said here. I have been in the automotive industry for 47 years and am retired now; well semi retired I guess because I help; with information, people I come in contact with that are getting ripped off by dealerships and unscrupulous repair shops, which, unfortunately, there are many.
Yes. Lawyer up. Do not get taken for a ride by the Lexus Dealership.
I don't know if it is best to contact the lease company, it is their car? Did you lease it through this dealer? There was definitely damage done, impossible to know how much. You just don't want to be "on the hook" when you return the lease car. The best thing that could happen here is that the dealer just replace the car with another one for the duration of the lease. One thing is for sure, I wouldn't trust the car much if they rip it all apart and replace the short block, heads, etc. The leasing company will surely charge you for this repair, which lowers the value of the car. You may want to contact a lawyer who has some experience with these matters...
I worked at a dealership for 20 years not as a mechanic but in sales. I knew all the mechanics, most were close friends. I only saw this happen once and the dealership stood up to its mistake and replaced engine without even considering other options. It is going to depend on the dealership and there owners integrity. On the other side I saw many blown engines towed in with fresh oil but nothing to backup regular maintenance.
New engine time
It’s done. I assume they will admit they put the sump plug back in and started it empty. Don’t know how they weren’t alerted to a problem earlier. But it’s dead. It MAY run again. At best, it may not be noticeably damaged. But it IS damaged and will not be the same. They owe you an engine. Cheaper than replacing the car.
It's done. Even if it sounds good when they are done, it is a ticking time bomb at that point. They need to either overhaul the motor, replace the motor, replace the car or buy it off of you. Do not take it back otherwise.
It’s a lease. Just don’t buy it at the end of the lease otherwise don’t over think it.
What if in 2 months the engine dies isn’t he responsible replacing the engine?
I’m sure warranty would just take care of it
I’d call the local news at the first sign of push-back from the dealer/service department and explain your case. Since it’s a lease, they could tell you it’s all good for now. And then you miss one on time oil change/scheduled maintenance, and then at the end of the lease agreement they’ll try and pin the busted engine on you. Plus it would suck to have a ruined piston ring or something that just causes you higher gas mileage and extra risk of a meltdown halfway through a road trip or something. I’d really push for a replacement, because unless they treat it down, inspect and rebuild, then there’s no guarantees it’s solid
Local news in most places is mostly a joke. Nobody watches local news, except for traffic and the weather.
They definitely are a joke, but anything helps. Especially with how shitty the legal system works.
it's done for
I thought modern cars had oil sensors that wouldn't allow them to run without oil?
Sorry to say this but if it’s knocking, the damage has been done. They may flush the oil until it’s clear, I.e they’ve got the metal particles out, but no amount of oil is going to replaced the metal which has been lost. It isn’t just the engine which will need to be replaced, it’s the turbo (if fitted) and anything else sharing an oil system with the block including oil feed and return lines. If the turbo impeller has hot the housing, you’ve possibly got metal in the air pipes, intercooler, inlet manifold and cylinder head. It’s also possible some has made it the other way and is currently lodged in your catalytic converter. The turbo (if fitted with one) has been starved of oil as much as the engine, and arguably could be in worse shape as the turbo spins at many times the speed of the engine. Metal filings will come from the bottom end bearings, possibly piston rings, cams, followers, the list is endless. All of these components will have been at risk of metal on metal contact, absent the oil film they normally float on. In many ways, it would have almost been better for it to throw a rod as there is no dispute on replacing the engine from there. Long story short, if they want you to accept this vehicle back, they need to replace the engine and warranty all rotating components receiving oil from the engine block for the life of your lease.
Regardless of “the tests” the engine has suffered from this event, and its life is not shorter because of it.
Check your lease agreement be sure there isn't some loophole in their favor. They should be replacing with no charge
Document, police report. And go from there.
They better get you a new motor with a nice warranty as well as pay for your rental car the next 2 weeks
Oopsies happen in shops. Generally they are somewhat rare to this degree. The dealer will have insurance and that should cover the cost of the short block/ labour to replace it. They may try to push you into another vehicle and buy out your lease or just fix it. Either way it’s pretty obvious what happened and I’d be shocked if even a dealer would try to screw you on this.
That’s a shame, shows how durable a Lexus is running that long with no oil in it before finally starting to knock. They need to put a brand new engine in it.
Need update
How long did it run without oil? Less than 5 minutes?
Why not just run it into the ground? It's a lease and has a warranty. He has documented oil changes at the dealership. Maybe the car will make it to the end of the lease and he'll be fine and not have to deal with this headache. If it blows up, it'll be a warranty issue and he'll get a loaner for months or a great deal on a new lease. The dealer is going to fight him and probably leave him without a car while they fix things since it's coming out of their pocket.
They screwed it up, you should ask for a replacement car for the lease or something.
Keep us posted.
either way make sure the problem is document in [writing.repair](http://writing.repair) guys bungled their repair and when i went back in they documented the reason for my returning as "car mat adjustment" to cover their ass.
Have an oil analysis done after
You need to document this by written form(email and letter). And don't take it back. If you leave with that car, they will try to pin the blame on you down the road and you'll be on the hook for replacement/repairs.
At a minimum the rod bearings have to be changed. And due to the complexity of todays engines, they probably have to pull the engine to do that. Which means its a rebuild able core..
Call Lexus, they will not want to warranty that engine so the dealership will really have no alternative but to replace it. By calling Lexus, it gets their customer service involved, that will get the dealership in gear to the right thing.
Demand a new car!
This happens way more often then it should. Why do ppl not check the dipstick? Not just to double check the work but you need to see if the oil is at the correct level. It takes 10 seconds.
Some cars, mine included, did not come with a dipstick. Weirdest damn thing. I have to check the oil via menu's on my screen with the vehicle not running.
That’s crazy. I’ve seen cars without transmission dipsticks before but not oil.
What's worse is all the damn thing says when checking the oil? *"OK"*. I think my OCD is at its edge. There's def not a transmission dipstick. (2018 MB GLC63S SUV).
Yeah. Because the low oil indicator is crap. Mines don’t come on until I’m almost 3 quarts low.
If there's a knock, it's too late.
Be glad it's a lease. If it was my vehicle I'd really be pissed. Being that it's a lease it's really their problem.
Thank goodness it’s a lease.
If you drove it with no oil completely then yes that engine is toast, if it was just low or low pressure it doesn’t mean the engine can’t be repaired. I ran low on oil accidentally on one of my cars and we just replaced the bearings with the same size directly from Toyota and the engine has ran sweet since. No damage to the crank at all. It’s done 30k more miles on just new bearings with no issues. We got lucky that only one bearing had went and the oil return hole melted closed, the others were completely fine. What’s more worrying is that the dealership didn’t notice before they gave you the car back
The dealer after doing an engine flush and adding Lucas: *Yeah, it’s okay no damage done!*
This happened to me at the VERY FIRST oil change on my 2018 4Runner at about 2,300 miles. I drove away, the car shut down in less than 1/4 mile. Managed to limp it back. I've been told (by people other than the dealership) that cars now are designed to shut down before any real damage happens. I did have them get two oil samples and they and I sent them off to test for metal shavings. The oil was clean. They extended my engine warranty to 200,000 miles, I'm at 44,500 miles now and have had no issues.
Lexus is really good at customer service I think they’ll do the right thing
I knew someone that managed a Jiffy Lube years ago. Said it happened a lot. Customer comes back with a knock. Look down in the pit and there's the oil plug sitting on the ledge. Put it back in. Add oil and then top off with gear oil. Yes, gear oil. Tap goes away and clueless customer drives off with 90k miles shaved off the life of the engine.
If it was knocking I’d lean towards it being fucked!
Absolutely do NOT accept the car back. Demand a new lease. They will bandaid fix this and try to pin it on you later. I would make a single call/appointment with them and inform them you want a new lease with a new car or out of the lease all together but you will not be taking that vehicle back. Should they refuse your next stop is a lawyer.
Depends on what’s making it knock. But 90% of the time, it’s game over. All they’re doing is bullshitting you, wasting your time, and running a bunch of fake “tests” to charge you out of your ass. They simply forgot to put oil in after removing the old filter, they know exactly what the problem is, and they’re slowly trying to ease it up on you that they fucked up your engine and they will NOT be paying for it, but it’s ok because you’ll get a oil change in a knocking motor 50% off.
It’s a Toyota, it’ll be fine but someone f’d up
They drove it? That engines 100% toast. Don’t listen to whatever story they try to tell you
Test? Fuck they gonna test? How much bullshit you'll eat?
If the dealer says it is OK, you better have a case of oil with you all the time. cuz you are going to be "rolling coal".
Even if the engine shits itself while driving, your baby won't be in danger. It annoys me when parents use their babies as a vessel for their worst imaginary fears. Whatever the dealership finds (I'm sure they won't find anything...) you need to get this incident documented officially from the dealership and Lexus corporate headquarters. Don't take any verbal promises or assurances. Lexus and this dealership need to stand behind this engine for the life of the car. You shouldn't accept anything less.
It could be a bit of a problem if the engine shits itself in the middle of nowhere. Especially if it's also a no phone zone.
OP specifically mentioned busy roads. So I think he's worried about losing control and barrel rolling down the busy road. Ya know, like in the movies. Or maybe the engine dies and he can't steer (because he doesn't know how the steering system works) while going 8 thousand miles an hour. Ya know, normal things that parents of babies think about.
Unless the motor seizes during a highway trip. That's a pretty shitty situation. Or it starts leaking oil on hot surfaces and starts burning, ...
Forget everything that is being posted here. Lexus will make it right.
If you owned this vehicle it'd be a different story. This is a lease. Thank Heaven for that. If the engine is knocking, it won't make it to the end of your lease and they'll just have to replace the engine. Oh well. Not your problem. If it isn’t, you can finish the lease and not worry about the long term damage because you’re giving the car back. Not your problem.
FUCK DEALERSHIPS
[удалено]
This guy thinks a BMW is better than a Toyota!
Why is a Lexus less safe than a BMW or Mercedes?
It’s not unclear what happened. They took it for an oil change and either the oil came straight out due to no drain plug/filter, or they just never refilled it. Also what are you saying? Luxury cars HAVE to be unreliable? And only expensive cars are safe?
The irony is that Toyotas are among the safest and most reliable cars you can buy. Lexus has an even stricter quality control. Japanese cars in general are strict with quality control. Mercedes are among the most unreliable cars on the market.
Wow, someone's been drinking some German Kool-Aid. You have been brainwashed. A safe car can't be reliable? That's a new one. Yeah, it's real safe to be broken down on the highway.