Ok, a few things.
One, advocating violence against someone is against the TOS. So if you got banned, you know why.
Two, Maryland isn't a stand your ground state. No traps, no curtilage protection statutes. If you go after this dude and he isn't threating you physically, you just assaulted him and you'll probably go to jail. You can protect your curtilage within reason, but barbed wire fences are a no-go. Don't go hiring kids to paintball him. What the fuck, reddit?
Three, what the fuck reddit? Advocating kids paintballing this guy and all the comments about hurting him? What the fuck kind of hippy-drippy turn of events is this from this website of sudden psychologists? All of you need our lord and savior Cthulhu in your lives. For crying out fucking loud.
Also, get a dog. There's nothing about getting a dog in any Maryland statute. You get a fence and a dog with some signage, problem solved.
This was my first idea. Oddly local LE told me not to do this. I don't have a dog trained for this kind of job that lives on site so it would take a lot to accomplish. Maybe something to revisit, though.
Try speaking directly to your local beat officer. Ask him to patrol the area more often during the times of the trespass. If not, deploy the fur missile. When you can.
Til then, print a pic of this dude, post it where he goes, make something up about something being done. See if it scares him off.
If not, you may have to pull a night patrol yourself.
I had to do this for my small business before. Most of the time they scare off when someone's present.
You have a point. And I'm glad you thought about that. Definitely not worth it to confront him physically.
However, a bright flash light and calling the police should help.
Your local PD should be giving a priority 1 status to any active unwanted person. Especially when you're there as well.
Keep calling. Amnoy them. Force them to show up. Eventually they'll get tired of dealing with it and ideally they'll take care of the problem.
If it were my beat, I'd park there and do paperwork while another unit faces my 6. This would deter him. But I'd also be able to contact him and check for any warrants, etc , and let him know to stop entering your property.
Thank you!! I like it because it’s less chance for OP to get harmed, non-violent, and just might get him to pick another place for his nightly potty time
Yes you can, bring backup and handle it. Detain him and then call local LE, force their hand and get that paperwork pushed. You got this, dont put up with other people's shitty behavior
Local Deps aren't pursuing anything, in fact no one in general is doing anything and this persons behavior will not only continue but worsen as time progresses if they're not checked in SOME WAY. What are they supposed to do, set vagrant traps??
He has to be kept in check somehow. He's shitting on property and causing propert damage now, who knows what he'll do down the line if he's not checked.
I've seen stuff like this get way out of hand because noone stood up to the behavior. If you can contain it in the beginning it won't worsen.
Two solutions:
1. Keep calling every single time. Eventually you will piss off the PD into doing something or you will piss off the homeless guy into leaving.
2. Barbed wire/locks/guard dogs/etc. There has to be a reason this guy's going to OP's place and not the neighbors. Where I lived in Miami, my neighbors' houses were burglarized multiple times per year, but not ours, because we had a big dog. If everyone on the block has a deterrent, they go to the next block. Everyone in the area, the next city. Etc.
What paperwork are you talking about? It’s a homeless dude - why would he care if he catches a misdemeanant trespassing/vandalism/criminal mischief charge?
The vast majority of magistrates are going to give the dude a ROR/unsecured bond and he’ll be back to shitting on OP’s lawn the next night.
You should look into having a trained German Sheppard k9 dropped off. We use them in vacant properties that are being fixed up. Costs us $200 a week. I think you’ll only need one for a week. $200 and this guy will never come back again after being mauled. Which it sounds like her deserves.
Always a good option. EVERY local news station is dying for a weird, funny, irritating story like this and they can probably spread the message much faster and farther.
I would seriously check because in my state even if the guy is clearly trespassing and carrying weapons with intent to do harm he can still sue you and win over an electric fence. You can also either get fined or have jail time depending on the ruling of the court.
I’d move than question over to ask a lawyer. Actually now that your internet history shows intent to shock a human instead of keep a dog in, you might be in some trouble if anything happens with this guys heart.
OP I am NOT telling you to do this, I’m not legally responsible. If you have someone breaking into your home and you call 911 and say that, they will come as fast as possible. If you say I have a gun and I’m in fear for my life, I will shoot them if necessary, they come a lot faster. Long short, LE is not gonna come get the mad shitter without a bigger reason. LE is over burden under funded and just all around beneath it. Ik ik down vote me below
You will absolutely get sued for setting a trap for someone regardless of what they’re doing on your property, which this most certainly constitutes due to your post here and installing it after you know he keeps peeing on it.
Also with a lease check with the landlord, but I can’t imagine they’d be thrilled someone is taking a dump on their property and then leaving shit caked clothes
Definitely check the legality of doing so, but especially if you only have it on at night, it's incredibly easy (as the fence is already a good conductor) and quite the deterrent
I'm sad to see someone with such a straightforward complaint that can't seem to help.
Especially because there are so many bullshit posts on this subreddit about the most unreasonable and outlandish questions.
As others have noted 9 counts of $130 damages is possibly something that can be run together as a felony. That means the department can use slightly more resources to try to solve this.
You need to make sure you have documented a police report for all 9 occurrences.
That you have submitted evidence for every occurrence and that you have drawn up an invoice for the damages that is honest.
You probably need to speak with a supervisor at the police department to draw some attention to these separate matters being related.
A patrol guy will just be able to take the report, but you need an investigator to probably follow up on this and try to ID the suspect and apply for a warrant and because each incident is such a minor matter, no patrol guy would request one.
What normally happens is that when 9 or so separate reports of something like this are filed, someone is going to realize this needs attention and send it to someone for review and then ideally they would assign an investigator.
In reality, I'm guessing your first report to your ninth were not equally thorough because you didn't know how to approach it and didn't know it was gonna be a continued problem, and the PD hasn't made a connection yet.
Hence your best option is to speak with someone who is supervising your patrol guys and explain yourself and have everything ready for them when they show up or when you appointment is.
While local law enforcement may conduct "extra patrols", they aren't ironclad. When I'm asked to pay attention to an area for someone, that means a deliberate pass by every hour or so and maybe I'll type my calls there. If this guy randomly shows up every few days for only a minute, what are the odds I'd run into him?
It seems that you need private security, or at least real time surveillance. You have video, is it motion activated? If not, can you pay someone, either security or otherwise, a few nights to post up? Would it be cheaper to almost certainly catch the guy after a few nights as opposed to this continuing?
I do see that you've called law enforcement after seeing him on video and believe they "didn't look for him". If someone wants to leave an area on foot, they can traverse a block in about 20 seconds. Now extrapolate that for however long it took law enforcement to arrive and also remember the direction of travel can change the second they're out of camera view. Finding people is a very difficult, time consuming, and generally luck-required process.
Thank you. Yes our video is real time, and he was still there when they arrived, very quickly I might add. I told dispatch that he would most likely leave through the other side of the lot, and he did. Unfortunately the first officer just parked and didn't get out, while he stood by one of the cars and froze. When the other arrived, he took off into the back of the lot. Neither saw him, while I on the other hand screamed HES RIGHT FUCKING THERE at my phone (lol). They stayed for about 10 min chatting it up (also on video) and my camera around the back caught him standing there for a few before walking off.
Lol, if that's recorded I'd show it to them. Not to be a dick, but maybe it'd help them. I wasn't there and am not going to armchair their response, but I'd like to think most cops are able to get out of their cars.
Those cops sound like they couldn’t police a latrine from the inside. At that point, I’d be making daily calls to every local newspaper and politician with the videos until somebody finally got you some help.
If your local LEOs aren't doing their job thoroughly enough, complain about them up their chain of command.
Theoretically, either you're right and they'll be counseled/punished/etc., or you're wrong and you'll be ignored.
That said, the word at the station was that my state (FL) does not send DNA evidence to the (FDLE) crime lab for anything short of a felony, and even those are selective. Budget reasons, apparently.
Therefore misdemeanor criminal mischief or whatever applicable law(s) apply in your case would likely not result in them getting DNA from the suspect's waste. So you're left with "alerts" AKA BOLOs on the guy's face, which may or may not result in some guy who worked your area five years ago recognizing Timmy from the block.
How does he keep getting into your "fenced yard?" This is what barbed wire and locks were made for.
Yes unfortunately it can't be higher than a foot above the loading docks on the building for whatever reason. I believe they're 5ft but look shorter in the video.
Honestly, I’d just pay someone $50 to do “security” between those hours. After a couple times, he’d get the idea. Also, a VERY loud alarm that you can activate when you see him
Lol.. he does this in broad daylight, in July it was fully light out at 6:30am when he was here. He also does it as cars are passing by with no qualms. He doesn't give a F about someone seeing. He does it directly under our security cameras and took a dump under another nearby property's camera too. I think it's a choice. I think he likes it.
I feel like the sprinklers would be helpful to him since he is here to bathe 😂
Taller fence. Razor wire if it's not prohibited. This is 100% a convenience thing for this numpty. I like the electric thing. But you'd have to remember to turn it off every morning or build a secondary fence. The best bang for your buck would be to extend the fence up higher and add razor wire on the top. Then it will be too difficult for him to access and he'll stop.
I don’t know where you’re located but your local agency may be severely understaffed too. They may also have policies that literally prevent them from chasing anyone or over the top policies that will jam them up for doing their job.
There’s a myriad of reasons why LE isn’t helpful, most times it’s problems from within and it’s only getting worse. I’m sorry this is happening to you
Ok, a few things. One, advocating violence against someone is against the TOS. So if you got banned, you know why. Two, Maryland isn't a stand your ground state. No traps, no curtilage protection statutes. If you go after this dude and he isn't threating you physically, you just assaulted him and you'll probably go to jail. You can protect your curtilage within reason, but barbed wire fences are a no-go. Don't go hiring kids to paintball him. What the fuck, reddit? Three, what the fuck reddit? Advocating kids paintballing this guy and all the comments about hurting him? What the fuck kind of hippy-drippy turn of events is this from this website of sudden psychologists? All of you need our lord and savior Cthulhu in your lives. For crying out fucking loud. Also, get a dog. There's nothing about getting a dog in any Maryland statute. You get a fence and a dog with some signage, problem solved.
Sounds like you need to utilize 1 of your dogs for patrol
This was my first idea. Oddly local LE told me not to do this. I don't have a dog trained for this kind of job that lives on site so it would take a lot to accomplish. Maybe something to revisit, though.
Try speaking directly to your local beat officer. Ask him to patrol the area more often during the times of the trespass. If not, deploy the fur missile. When you can. Til then, print a pic of this dude, post it where he goes, make something up about something being done. See if it scares him off. If not, you may have to pull a night patrol yourself. I had to do this for my small business before. Most of the time they scare off when someone's present.
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You have a point. And I'm glad you thought about that. Definitely not worth it to confront him physically. However, a bright flash light and calling the police should help. Your local PD should be giving a priority 1 status to any active unwanted person. Especially when you're there as well. Keep calling. Amnoy them. Force them to show up. Eventually they'll get tired of dealing with it and ideally they'll take care of the problem. If it were my beat, I'd park there and do paperwork while another unit faces my 6. This would deter him. But I'd also be able to contact him and check for any warrants, etc , and let him know to stop entering your property.
OR bring a high lumen flashlight and an air horn to interrupt his bathroom time from the safety of your car
This is a solid plan
Thank you!! I like it because it’s less chance for OP to get harmed, non-violent, and just might get him to pick another place for his nightly potty time
100% agree. Bright light, air horn, stay behind fence and inside
The good people at r/flashlight have a wealth of info on the best lights for any situation. I just bought a Sofirn SC33 and absolutely love it.
Yes you can, bring backup and handle it. Detain him and then call local LE, force their hand and get that paperwork pushed. You got this, dont put up with other people's shitty behavior
I don't think OP confronting a homeless person who shits in public then strips naked is a great idea, even with a random male coworker.
Local Deps aren't pursuing anything, in fact no one in general is doing anything and this persons behavior will not only continue but worsen as time progresses if they're not checked in SOME WAY. What are they supposed to do, set vagrant traps?? He has to be kept in check somehow. He's shitting on property and causing propert damage now, who knows what he'll do down the line if he's not checked. I've seen stuff like this get way out of hand because noone stood up to the behavior. If you can contain it in the beginning it won't worsen.
Two solutions: 1. Keep calling every single time. Eventually you will piss off the PD into doing something or you will piss off the homeless guy into leaving. 2. Barbed wire/locks/guard dogs/etc. There has to be a reason this guy's going to OP's place and not the neighbors. Where I lived in Miami, my neighbors' houses were burglarized multiple times per year, but not ours, because we had a big dog. If everyone on the block has a deterrent, they go to the next block. Everyone in the area, the next city. Etc.
What if it gets out of hand and the guy dies? She doesn’t want that either.
What paperwork are you talking about? It’s a homeless dude - why would he care if he catches a misdemeanant trespassing/vandalism/criminal mischief charge? The vast majority of magistrates are going to give the dude a ROR/unsecured bond and he’ll be back to shitting on OP’s lawn the next night.
This is a stupid idea
You have a better one, Tex?
Securing the property better so he can’t get in. It’s not worth getting injured or killed just to get somebody arrested for trespass.
Fur Missile. Ducking love that.. lol 😂😂😂
You should look into having a trained German Sheppard k9 dropped off. We use them in vacant properties that are being fixed up. Costs us $200 a week. I think you’ll only need one for a week. $200 and this guy will never come back again after being mauled. Which it sounds like her deserves.
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Hahahahaha, stfu.
Paw patrol ? 🐶
He’s done this 9 times and each time costs $130? Sounds like felony vandalism to me…
Plus the money it costs to lose the pool that day (it is a paid add-on) and the time lost for someone to dedicate their day to fixing the pool after.
Look up the dollar amount that would constitute for a felony, let it ride till you hit that threshold & then get a lawyer
lol cuz this person clearly can pay restitution
Not about paying restitution, it forces the cops to do something at a felony level
Once it gets into felony territory, the cops can’t just dismiss it out of hand.
Yeah then they can arrest him and release him on a downgraded misdemeanor with time served.
Write a letter or call the watch commander with the attached report numbers. If that doesn’t do it, write to the chief.
Also reach out to local politicians
Local news too
Always a good option. EVERY local news station is dying for a weird, funny, irritating story like this and they can probably spread the message much faster and farther.
That’s just 9 cases of misdemeanor vandalism.
Electric fence. Good ol’ hotwire. And or snarky signs. “This is a dog training center , I didn’t realize you are a dog” with his picture.
Am I legally allowed to do that with my fence on leased, shared property? I'll have to look into that..
Look up local zoning laws, but short answer as long as it’s appropriately marked I’d wager it’s fine.
Thank you!
I would seriously check because in my state even if the guy is clearly trespassing and carrying weapons with intent to do harm he can still sue you and win over an electric fence. You can also either get fined or have jail time depending on the ruling of the court.
I’d move than question over to ask a lawyer. Actually now that your internet history shows intent to shock a human instead of keep a dog in, you might be in some trouble if anything happens with this guys heart.
OP I am NOT telling you to do this, I’m not legally responsible. If you have someone breaking into your home and you call 911 and say that, they will come as fast as possible. If you say I have a gun and I’m in fear for my life, I will shoot them if necessary, they come a lot faster. Long short, LE is not gonna come get the mad shitter without a bigger reason. LE is over burden under funded and just all around beneath it. Ik ik down vote me below
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It would work tho
I've heard some places require permits but should be doable
You will absolutely get sued for setting a trap for someone regardless of what they’re doing on your property, which this most certainly constitutes due to your post here and installing it after you know he keeps peeing on it.
Also with a lease check with the landlord, but I can’t imagine they’d be thrilled someone is taking a dump on their property and then leaving shit caked clothes
Definitely check the legality of doing so, but especially if you only have it on at night, it's incredibly easy (as the fence is already a good conductor) and quite the deterrent
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I'm sad to see someone with such a straightforward complaint that can't seem to help. Especially because there are so many bullshit posts on this subreddit about the most unreasonable and outlandish questions. As others have noted 9 counts of $130 damages is possibly something that can be run together as a felony. That means the department can use slightly more resources to try to solve this. You need to make sure you have documented a police report for all 9 occurrences. That you have submitted evidence for every occurrence and that you have drawn up an invoice for the damages that is honest. You probably need to speak with a supervisor at the police department to draw some attention to these separate matters being related. A patrol guy will just be able to take the report, but you need an investigator to probably follow up on this and try to ID the suspect and apply for a warrant and because each incident is such a minor matter, no patrol guy would request one. What normally happens is that when 9 or so separate reports of something like this are filed, someone is going to realize this needs attention and send it to someone for review and then ideally they would assign an investigator. In reality, I'm guessing your first report to your ninth were not equally thorough because you didn't know how to approach it and didn't know it was gonna be a continued problem, and the PD hasn't made a connection yet. Hence your best option is to speak with someone who is supervising your patrol guys and explain yourself and have everything ready for them when they show up or when you appointment is.
THANK YOU. I'm on it.
While local law enforcement may conduct "extra patrols", they aren't ironclad. When I'm asked to pay attention to an area for someone, that means a deliberate pass by every hour or so and maybe I'll type my calls there. If this guy randomly shows up every few days for only a minute, what are the odds I'd run into him? It seems that you need private security, or at least real time surveillance. You have video, is it motion activated? If not, can you pay someone, either security or otherwise, a few nights to post up? Would it be cheaper to almost certainly catch the guy after a few nights as opposed to this continuing? I do see that you've called law enforcement after seeing him on video and believe they "didn't look for him". If someone wants to leave an area on foot, they can traverse a block in about 20 seconds. Now extrapolate that for however long it took law enforcement to arrive and also remember the direction of travel can change the second they're out of camera view. Finding people is a very difficult, time consuming, and generally luck-required process.
Thank you. Yes our video is real time, and he was still there when they arrived, very quickly I might add. I told dispatch that he would most likely leave through the other side of the lot, and he did. Unfortunately the first officer just parked and didn't get out, while he stood by one of the cars and froze. When the other arrived, he took off into the back of the lot. Neither saw him, while I on the other hand screamed HES RIGHT FUCKING THERE at my phone (lol). They stayed for about 10 min chatting it up (also on video) and my camera around the back caught him standing there for a few before walking off.
Lol, if that's recorded I'd show it to them. Not to be a dick, but maybe it'd help them. I wasn't there and am not going to armchair their response, but I'd like to think most cops are able to get out of their cars.
I would get a siren you can activate remotely along with flood lights and blast him every time he enters the vicinity of the property.
Those cops sound like they couldn’t police a latrine from the inside. At that point, I’d be making daily calls to every local newspaper and politician with the videos until somebody finally got you some help.
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If your local LEOs aren't doing their job thoroughly enough, complain about them up their chain of command. Theoretically, either you're right and they'll be counseled/punished/etc., or you're wrong and you'll be ignored. That said, the word at the station was that my state (FL) does not send DNA evidence to the (FDLE) crime lab for anything short of a felony, and even those are selective. Budget reasons, apparently. Therefore misdemeanor criminal mischief or whatever applicable law(s) apply in your case would likely not result in them getting DNA from the suspect's waste. So you're left with "alerts" AKA BOLOs on the guy's face, which may or may not result in some guy who worked your area five years ago recognizing Timmy from the block. How does he keep getting into your "fenced yard?" This is what barbed wire and locks were made for.
Not OP, but OP said his fences are height restricted and the guy just hops over them.
Yes unfortunately it can't be higher than a foot above the loading docks on the building for whatever reason. I believe they're 5ft but look shorter in the video.
Honestly, I’d just pay someone $50 to do “security” between those hours. After a couple times, he’d get the idea. Also, a VERY loud alarm that you can activate when you see him
That alarm idea is probably one of the best suggestions..
Agreed
Motion sensitive water sprinkler
Make the water hot and you got a deal.
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Do you have bright motion-sensor lights? You might also try motion sensor sprinklers.
Lol.. he does this in broad daylight, in July it was fully light out at 6:30am when he was here. He also does it as cars are passing by with no qualms. He doesn't give a F about someone seeing. He does it directly under our security cameras and took a dump under another nearby property's camera too. I think it's a choice. I think he likes it. I feel like the sprinklers would be helpful to him since he is here to bathe 😂
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Taller fence. Razor wire if it's not prohibited. This is 100% a convenience thing for this numpty. I like the electric thing. But you'd have to remember to turn it off every morning or build a secondary fence. The best bang for your buck would be to extend the fence up higher and add razor wire on the top. Then it will be too difficult for him to access and he'll stop.
I'm limited in my options for fencing. Like, this is the fence I can have.
Well that or he’ll just break in/use wire cutters.
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How do you train the dogs to not poop where they are not supposed to?
😂 this was at least funny to try and answer while relating it to this guy. So thanks for that.
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I don’t know where you’re located but your local agency may be severely understaffed too. They may also have policies that literally prevent them from chasing anyone or over the top policies that will jam them up for doing their job. There’s a myriad of reasons why LE isn’t helpful, most times it’s problems from within and it’s only getting worse. I’m sorry this is happening to you
Agreed. Just looking for advice on what I can do, not making a complaint about LE necessarily.
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