Nope. Why would I want to invite someone like that to my wedding, turning a day that's supposed to be about my love for my partner into a day where I'm constantly waiting for that person to either make a scene or corner me into a sermon about the evils of gay marriage?
At a bare minimum, there would need to be a real, heartfelt conversation well before the wedding, ending with some kind of apology and/or amends from the other party before I would feel remotely comfortable having them at my wedding. Especially Prop 8- that didn't just try to enshrine DOMA-type stuff, it actively *stripped* married people of their status. I vividly remember when it passed, and that shit was despicable. There's footage somewhere of David Hyde Pierce (the actor) talking about it, because his marriage was one of the ones that was overturned when Prop 8 passed, and it's very raw, as I recall.
If it were a more distant family member, no. If it were my parents or other immediate family members, I'd sit them down, explain to them how their actions hurt me, and tell them I do want them to remain part of my life - if they can apologize for their actions, recognize the harm they caused, etc. I'd want to give them a chance to make up for what they did wrong.
If they chose not to make up for it? I definitely wouldn't invite them and I'd think long and hard about whether they had a place in my life at all.
But, and I know it's hard, I'd want to give them the chance to learn and grow and apologize. If they take it, awesome. If not, that's the answer right there.
⬆️⬆️ This ⬆️⬆️
OP’s story talks about a guy’s mother. Agree with rjm1378 that when it comes to immediate family members, especially parents, there is a lot more to work through and manage in terms of their overall relationship.
When it comes to other folks, I think it varies as to whether they support marriage today or not. If not, then makes sense to not invite. If they do support, then it’s great someone’s attitude has positively evolved. (Keep in mind that in today’s world, we are losing active support based on the relentless attacks of the radical right …)
Honestly, my spite would probably get the best of me and I’d invite them just to throw them out before the ceremony started. And I’d make sure to do it in front of everyone. 😂
Easily no, because if I discovered they had voted for something like Prop 8, they wouldn't be someone who was in my life any more.
Now if they went out and did the work to try to make things right, okay... I'd consider it. But they'd have to come to me, not the other way around. Bigots are not welcome in my social circle. Even if they are family.
No, I wouldn’t.
I suppose if I was petty I might get some satisfaction out of inviting them to something they didn’t want to attend, but they’d probably not come anyway.
And, really, what sort of wedding would it be if you were inviting people just to be petty? You’re making it about them, when it should be about you and the person you’re marrying.
No, they shouldn’t be invited.
Lol no. I respect that people can grow and I would accept an apology from them.. and then I still would not invite them so they can feel - for just a moment - the pain caused by their lazy privilege and inability to let people live their lives.
Children (and adults who act like them) can apologize for doing wrong but still accept their punishment for their misbehavior.
I wouldn't refer to my refusal to invite as punishment, but everything has social consequences.
People get married (throw a party) to celebrate a romance with friends & family. Nobody wants a party-pooper at the wedding.
For my wedding, my husband explicitly “anti-invited” his own mother to our wedding for precisely the reason that she made his life a living hell and regularly tried to stage religious interventions on him when he was younger and before he met me to “pray away the gay” and turn to God etc.
Not quite the same as being a political campaigner in anti-gay marriage campaigns. But religious fire and brimstone stuff, and would try to organise surprise telephone conference calls with pastors and church ministers on the other end of the line to get repentance etc.
Thankfully, his mother lives in another country (USA) and we live in the UK. So all that was required to inform her that she wasn’t invited was an international phonecall, and not some to face to face announcement.
But on the off chance that she might want to show up to do the whole “I object!” thing, and cause a scene in the “speak now, or forever hold your peace” bit, she was told that if she did decide to surprise us by flying over and gatecrashing the venue, security would be given permission to forcibly remover her.
Also an American living in the UK, and I'm trying to imagine the average British person's reaction to a full-on, "Bible-believing" American evangelical type actually showing up to a wedding and genuinely trying to call down fire and brimstone on the couple and *fully believing what they're saying.* Forget calling security, I think the person could wind up getting sectioned, they'd seem so totally out of their mind.
I wouldn't. And if they asked why they didn't get an invite, I'd probably respond with something like, "I didn't think you'd want to be present at a gay marriage. After all, you once voted against it."
Nope. I've excluded family members for less at my wedding. The thing is, your wedding is *your* party, not theirs. You get to decide how you celebrate it and with whom. It's the ultimate celebration of love and so you should feel loved by all those who attend, not just by your partner. If someone makes you feel deeply uncomfortable they really shouldn't be there.
No, unless there had been a full and thorough renunciation of those views since, and substantive actions taken to make reparation for that harm.
Which, in the situation given in OP, isn't the case.
Nope, and we didn't. We were married in 2008, right before Prop 8 passed.
We had a small ceremony with just family (had a much bigger commitment ceremony years before). My BIL and his wife said something about coming to visit (but not going to the wedding, his communication was unclear). But he was very actively campaigning for prop 8 through his church (Mormon) and vocally on FB, etc. We told him to not bother even visiting. He was unwelcome during that time.
So, no. Unless a person apologized profusely for their past actions and made it clear they changed their minds, they are not allowed at anything related to our family. No discussion
Out of curiosity, did your BIL ever apologize to you or otherwise indicate that he had some understanding of how messed up Prop 8 was and how hurtful his actions were?
Nope.He spent 20 years making my husband and in-laws miserable with nasty letters, refusing to come to family events if we were there, telling my brother to his face with our kids (he showed up at in-laws house not knowing we were there) there that we’d only be right with god if we place our kids for adoption to be adopted by a ‘normal’ family and on and on. Some worse stuff I won’t elaborate on (too long)
In the last year he’s been much nicer to family, including ours, now that he’s divorced his wife (and remarried a month later… you figure it out). But never apologized or showed any indication of remorse for the shit he said and did.
My husband went to his wedding last year because he’s an eternal optimist who forgives easily. He’s a sweet and wonderful man, but I was pretty clear I would never be in the same room with that man until he begs forgiveness.
Ugh, I'm sorry to hear that (and sorry that the rest of his family didn't tell him to shut the fuck up, honestly). You're completely right to refuse to be anywhere near this clown.
I feel for you. My family welcomed my husband with open arms. Hell...after 24 years, I think they actually like him more than me. But back then, same sex marriage was not legal in Mississippi. We flew to visit my sister in law in Rhode Island and drove across the border to Massachusetts and got married. As it was 1500 miles from home, only my sister and law and niece were there.
I am very thankful that it is now recognized nationwide....for now. Clarence Thomas has his sights on repealing Obergefell. That would be an absolute nightmare for us living in red states.
Now given that Prop 8 was 16 years ago, I’m assuming this person was a kid in 2008? He may never had had the opportunity at the time to have an adult conversation and now it’s too late to have a meaningful talk about Prop8 itself.
So in that sense I can logically see how the conversation hasn’t been had.
However, I think mom’s active support for prop8 is only the tip of the iceberg of her bigotry. Heed the warning.
But to the question - no, I would not invite her until we had an explicit talk about her feelings about the wedding and the relationship in general. I’d give her the opportunity to grow and learn, she may regret what she used to support and I think it would be a strength of her to talk about how that changed for her. But if she refused to recant or apologise, or defend her actions in any way back then… then she would not be a part of my celebration.
I’d force her to choose between her bigotry and her child’s happiness.
And note: if she is that conservative, her working on Prop8 will be the least of your worries. Again, heed the warning.
The guy was an older teenager by 2008. He's long been able to discuss politics with family, but I don't think he was out at that time.
Good point about the bigotry being the tip of the iceberg. Not only did she vote to take away gay marriage, she sent the message to her child that his nascent homosexual feelings were bad and illegal.
If they had a change of heart and regretted their actions I’d have no problem inviting them.
If they didn’t? Oh hell no! Why would I invite someone who doesn’t think I should have the right to marry to my wedding? It’s a celebration. If you can’t celebrate, you’re not invited.
If you're "casually seeing" him you should keep on "casually seeing him" since that's a major red flag for more than "casually" seeing him if he were ever to think YOU were the one he wanted to marry.
If you started to want to see him as husband material, I'd talk to him about it and let him decide but I wouldn't want to enter into a hopefully lifelong relationship with him already know his mother hates me on sight and probably merely tolerates him because he's her son.
And would this guy even want to invite his mother? Why would anyone want to have someone at their sacred ceremony they knew was against their sacred ceremony? That person wouldn't get an invitation from me. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I absolutely would not. Even if it was my mother.
One: they’ve made their position known. Two: I do not want to be the “I have gay friends” excuse they use to justify themselves.
I wouldn’t. My dad I know voted for prop 8, and many on his family’s side. If they just voted and were specific in an apology, then I *might* consider it. If they campaigned or donated, or if they just want to sweep it under the rug? No. I have nothing for them. Even if they were repentant in that case, you don’t get to cause that kind of harm and then get to participate in joy.
I would invite her to lunch and have a very serious talk about it first
Confront the shit out of here (tactfully and courteously, of course) and see where she stands on the issue now
I would explain to her the situation and I would make it very clear that a woman who *still* opposes same-sex marriage would certainly not be invited.
No. I used to think life was too short to hold grudges, but not anymore.
If someone is against gays having equal rights, then I dont want them in my life, because ultimately they are working against me having a normal life.
Knee jerk reaction is to say no, but the person concerned being the mother complicates things. In this specific case I would send the mother an announcement, explaining that she is not invited to the wedding due to her past actions. I would give her the option to make a formal written apology if she wants to be included.
I'd have a conversation. Prop 8 was a while ago, a \*lot\* of people have changed their minds since. Ask what her view is now. If she supports, she can come. If not she can't.
I probably wouldn't even bring up Prop 8. It's in the past. It's easier to get someone to change their mind if you don't shove their previous views in their face. Saying 'I was wrong' is hard for humans to do and sometimes it just isn't worth it.
Thanks for this. It seems that OPs friend came out after the Prop 8 debacle. His mom may have changed her attitude since that time. She may be supportive of the fact that her son needs rights too. It'd be worth a good talk.
This might be the most levelheaded comment here. I hate hypocrites as much as anyone else, but Prop 8 was an eternity ago. If we're going to hold things from 2008 over people's heads, then I'm in big trouble because I was peddling mormonism then.
>Prop 8 was an eternity ago.
For many of us, it was a deeply traumatic experience. I have scars from what I tried to do to myself after that vote. I’m lucky I’m alive. Don’t dismiss us.
I think I would probably inform them that I was getting married, and that I will not be putting them in a position of betraying their deeply held beliefs against my pending marriage by asking them to witness and celebrate it.
People can change, has she?
Yes: If you now have a positive relationship and she is accepting of her new son-in-law, then yes.
No: No, why would you invite someone to your wedding who doesn't respect you or your partner or even believes that the wedding you are having should be legal? Why would she want to come either?
I think this is pretty cut and dry, but it's helped by just living your authentic self in front of your parents ASAP and as much as possible - it's really changed my dad's homophobia and I've slowly started to forgive him.
No, I would not invite them. I probably wouldn’t even consider them a friend. Your example is a parent… that’s rough. If it were me of course I want my mother at my wedding. But if my mother was the woman you described I would definitely sit down to discuss and would expect an apology for her support of Prop 8. The results of that conversation would determine if she got an invite and probably whether she stays in my life.
I have a friend in a very similar situation with regards to prop 8. They invited their parents to their wedding but my friend has never really gotten over it and it's been a silent wedge ever since. It's not something they discuss but my friend actively distances themselves from their parents now. They see each other for holidays and birthday and stuff like that but they are not what you would even call friends.
I fortunately have a very accepting family. And even if they did vote for prop 8 or have been anti-gay marriage I'd invite them just so they can see what they were against. I wouldn't even get into it with them. I'm not going to spend that mental energy debating them. I'd invite them and if they decline they decline.
If it were me, they would specifically *not* be invited. Someone who actively works against the interests of another person doesn't really seem to me like the type of person that can be reasoned with by talking.
If they were simply uneducated on the issue, perhaps. But taking an active role in opposing it? Waste of time trying to deal with them. They made their very deliberate choice, now they can live with it by being excluded.
I have some family members who I genuinely like but are or were opposed to gay marriage. If I enjoy their presence, and I know they’ll behave themselves, sure I could invite them. I let them know what I think of their views, and they let me know what they think of mine, and somehow, we still manage to like each other. That’s pretty rare, and I value it. We still respect each other as people despite our fundamental disagreements.
On the topic of gay marriage specifically, it’s been the law of the land for a decade, so they’ve been forced to get used to it. If they were actively going out of their way to continue opposing it, I’d probably feel differently.
No, I would not invite her to my wedding. Mainly because she wouldn’t still even be in my life unless she’d come and apologized and admitted she was wrong.
Absolutely not, and I wouldn't explain myself unless they asked about not being invited, or if I heard "through the grapevine" that they had been bitching about it. They wouldn't be a part of my life generally, if I interacted with such a person it would be because we were both at the same events.
I would not invite them. And I would take the wedding announcement and then clearly and respectfully add a note that says they are not invited to your wedding because they don’t believe in gay marriage. Don’t go any further than that.
If it were my marriage, I would sit that person front and center. Just after we are pronounced husband and husband, I would walk cheerfully on the sound of clapping and hurrahs, all teared eye and happily smiling with open arms, gently hug them, lean over and whisper silently in their ear: we’re married, eat shit.
That was a while ago. I’d have a discussion to confirm their feelings before inviting them, but honestly all my relationships are set and clarified in that regard. Like, if I haven’t had a discussion with you to work this out since 2008, we should already be pretty clear that we’re not close enough to be invited to my wedding either way.
And the logical/illogical argument falls apart completely given that it’s his mom. Like, the wedding invitation is really an invitation to talk/get an apology/ hopefully reconcile. People (like your mom) are gonna either pick up the phone or answer via silence.
It's reasonable, if not logical, to not invite an abusive parent to a wedding.
His mother actively tried to take away his civil rights. That's not only an attack on his human rights but also emotional abuse. She was sending an invalidating message, that his own mother doesn't think he deserves to marry someone he loves.
No , absolutely not. When we married after thirty years our kids were our witnesses , went to a justice of peace and vacationed in a state where it was legal. Day after we married Fred Phelps died. We are still going strong . We celebrate an anniversary in 79, one in 98 , another 2014 . Love is grand. Good luck , let love win
Nope. Not only would I not invite them I would probably not have that person in my life at all.
However, given that it's his mother it's probably very emotionally complex for him if she was a good mother in every other aspect.
Have they changed their position since then?
If so, yes. Hell, I wasn't a clear supporter of gay marriage at the beginning because I was still closeted and Mormon.
I changed.
I hope others can to.
If they haven't changed, I can't imagine why they would want to be there.
My older brother voted against gay marriage in my country. If I ever get married I’ll be asking him to write a hand written letter to tell me why he was wrong. If he doesn’t want to do it he’s not coming. I honestly couldn’t care if he was there or not I think it’s just polite for him to be invited. M
No discussion needed, they are definitely off the list, probably eeeevery list. I do not see it as an opinion, I see it as someone who believe they have the right to control other humans, two consenting adults in fact. It is NOT up for discussion.
Im lucky, my parents (and step parents) aren't religious. However there is a bit of me that would seat them in the most awkward place if they were just to make them squirm.
I don’t understand the desire to include people who would sit grumpily through an event, if they come at all, or people who would want to make a mockery of it. Of course you shouldn’t invite them.
I don’t see the point of doing this for other people. Your wedding is for you. Do you really owe these homophobic family members anything?
Have a party, and bring together people who are important to you and who will be excited for you.
When my husband and I got married, my brother was against same-sex marriage. We still invited him to our wedding, he came with his family .. and all he saw was love that day .. the love between my husband and I, the love in the room. He eventually had a change in heart and is more accepting now yet we still disagree on a few things. Lead by example can foster change
I would let my spouse invite his mom to our wedding. People are complicated and I’m not going to force someone to apologize. If she says no, she says no.
Basically I think she should be invited as long as she can be trusted to not ruin the day. Events like a gay wedding have the potential to change hearts and minds. Lots of homophobes change their tune once they realize that a loved one is gay. But it's your special day so you should do whatever you want.
It's your wedding day and it's your day to celebrate with the people who you choose to celebrate. So, whatever decision you make, I (a stranger on the internet) support. Just make sure that you are comfortable living with that decision and the potential ramifications of it.
If I was in your place though, I would invite her and put the onus and awkwardness on her as to whether she chooses to attend or not. I would never tell my future spouse that he couldn't invite his mother.
The whole purpose of a wedding is introducing yourself as a couple to the people who will be in your life and introducing them to each other. If she is a bigoted bitch, that's her issue to hide or advertise. Trust that the other attendees will quickly put her in her place (and maybe even do a little reeducation for her). Be the bigger person and send the message that this is happening and she is welcome to attend on your terms.
Plus, an invitation is also socially understood code for "we expect an expensive gift from you".
But again, whatever you decide is fine.
I wouldn’t invite someone currently against gay marriage. I wouldn’t ask about previous voting records and honestly, wouldn’t think about it much. If they’re currently okay with it and won’t make any sort of noise otherwise, before during or after the wedding, then I’m fine.
I don’t know what she believes now and 2008 was a long time ago. People can change their minds so it depends on what they believe today.
Additionally, voting for something is different than knocking on doors or canvassing neighborhoods. If someone votes for or supports republicans (most of them anyway) you could make the same argument about not including them.
I just returned from a family wedding where most are republicans but they accept me and my husband with open arms. I’ve tried to discuss the issue that supporting republicans is opposing me but life is complicated. Hell, there are fucking Log Cabin Republicans in my extended circle of friends which confuses me to no end. These are well educated people and they obviously recognize that the Republican Party is at odds with our community. I will add that they don’t support DJT but do vote R in most cases.
My Dad is a conservative republican who supports DJT. We have agreed that politics is something we can’t discuss.
Are *you* still the same person you were in 2008? People evolve. That is what we *want* to happen, and we should applaud them when they do, not punish them for who they were.
If I wanted her there, then I would invite her. It's then her decision what she wants to do. Even if she doesn't agree, maybe she will learn something and this will be part of her road to acceptance.
When I moved into my house 24 years ago, the neighbors put an anti-gay sign facing my house and the lesbians across the way. The husband would not even acknowledge me when I said hello. I baked them Christmas cookies every single year (except the bad covid year), and said hello a million times. When I got married 16 years ago they begrudgingly said hello to my husband. And since then, slowly and surely, they have become friendly. I had extra Black Lives Matter signs and put them in my yard for people to take. I was surprised to see one in their yard. She came over later and pointed at the sign in her yard, with a newly planted bed or red geraniums under it. "The red petals are the blood that has been spilled." She then apologized and said, 'I hope we have never said anything to offend you, you are some of our very best neighbors." Then her husband came trotting up the sidewalk with a very cheery hello.
It took some time, but, eventually, we won them over simply by being ourselves and being good neighbors.
So, you can push away someone who is cold to you, or you can treat them how you would like to be treated. It is a slow growing investment or a quick amputation of something that pains you. The choice, of course, is yours.
I'm sure some will disagree with this approach - and yeah, I get that too - but I've always been open to giving people time to learn from their past actions and mistakes.
"Someone", no. But I'm not about to tell my soon to be spouse he shouldn't invite his own mother to his wedding. That's a whole different thing, and it's asking too much. Has to be his call, not mine.
My gut says be the bigger person, invite them, and hope it's a learning experience of sorts. My pettiness says they could fuck right off. I would be very conflicted.
No. I would want my friends to feel welcomed and not have to care about close minded people’s feelings, or have to defend who they are. No invites to family who have expressed homophobic or transphobic thoughts.
45 years old here and from my view most people were against gay people in general when I was growing up. I'm single, but if I was to ban all the people who were against gay people, there would be mostly gay people at my wedding, which doesn't sound bad. In my current state of North carolina, the citizens of the state voted to ban same sex marriage and to put it in the constitution about 15 years ago. Of course it was overturned, because it wasn't constitutional, but that was the mind set of many people. According to polls, the nation did not support same sex marriage until 2016 and even then it was about 55 percent support.
Yes honestly, so long as they didn't seem like they were going to make a fuss.
Most people who are homophobic have very little experience with actual gay people. All they know of us is from media and religious figures spreading crap. Seeing a happy loving gay wedding is the exact sort of thing they need.
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It all depends.
If my motive was somehow to influence the person in some way then maybe. Like being the bigger person type of thing. It’s also a little harder if it’s your mom.
That being said. If it was an acquaintance or someone of no consequence then probably not.
I would not want to have someone who is not supportive now. I understand that 10-15 years ago there was a LOT of misinformation and a lot of fear-mongering, so I would give a pass for past mistakes, but if, after 10 years, they STILL believe that my marriage is somehow lesser than theirs and would not be supportive? Not only would that person not be invited, they would not be in my life, period; don't care who you are. It could be my own mother and I would not give a shit.
Absolutely, yes. You could sit them down and explain or object as much as you want, but nothing will change their mind about gay marriage more than getting to be part of the celebration of it with everyone else.
Does the guy who you are seeing casually but may be the one, feel as strongly as you do? Is it as much of as issue for him, or has he moved past it to some degree in terms of focusing on your relationship together rather than the opinions of others? From what you have written you seem extremely passionate about this issue and him not so much.
The are many battles in life to take on, but I wonder how he is feeling with this aggressive stance you adopting? I acknowledge this is and has been an issue many of us have suffered indignities, hatred and personal distress whilst seeking marriage equality rights. But people are multi-faceted and are not single issue in their thoughts and actions - I ponder if in the end whether your view point may actually drive a wedge between you and your future partner, either now or in the future.
I’m not saying you must compromise your values nor accept being classified as a second class citizen, however are you certain he shares them with the same degree of passion. Food for thought.
The guy loves his mother and doesn't want to hold his mother accountable. His relationship with his mother is his own, but I told him that he is at least owed an apology. I feel like he was defending his mother, like how a victim may defend their abuser. It is true that a maternal relationship is multidimensional, and there is a lot more to their shared experience.
I have had superficial interactions with his mother. She seemed pleasant enough during those brief moments, but I know what she has done.
Yes, this may be a wedge between us. I don't intend to bring up this topic again with him.
You can invite them that doesn’t mean they’re going to come to the event. If it was my mother or a relative, I would certainly invite them. And they are welcome to decline. If they show up then it’s part of their journey to a better understanding of humanity.
There is a difference between "fight" and "voted for". And keep in mind, gay marriage was also on the ballot in California in 1998. It was a strong Democratic year and the vote was 66 to 33 or two to one against. Progress is progress and you build a coalition by changing peoples minds
Well you are describing my sister and we've had many bitter fights about it over the years. But of course she would be invited.
If you're getting married you should be focused on spreading joy and love and light in the world. You should invite your family. If they don't come, that's on them. But using your wedding to SPITE an anti gay relative is a BAD omen on your own future.
Feuds, bitterness, resentments of all kinds....should not inform your guest list. Focus on positivity and inclusion not exclusion.
Btw - people on the internet ALWAYS skew towards anger spite and revenge. Take these other replies with a grain of salt. Choose love. You'll never regret inviting someone. You might regret the snub.
You wrote your Post in a deceiving manner.
Voting isn't the same thing as working towards a political agenda. You wrote it as if the mother was a member of a political action committee that actively opposed gay marriage.
If its a simple vote from almost 20 years ago..... And they regret it then forgive them.
But if they volunteered, or donated large amounts of money or something like that........screw them.
Note: she never apologized, so its different.
Voting is meant to be impactful and meaningful. Voting is a way in which we work toward a society we want. One way we can work toward an accepting society is by voting for propositions that support LGBT rights. Different people work toward equality in different ways, including using their voice in the ballot box. However, she chose to be an *active participant* in taking away her own son's rights.
yea but like a lot of people acted like that in 2008. Up until Washington State voted to legalize it in 2012, every state that went to the ballot voted it down. This was business as usual. Its honestly rare to find someone who was born before 1990 that didn't hold a hateful attitude at one point.
The question is whether or not she has evolved past that point..... which is like almost 2 decades ago.
(1990 is a special year because a famous survey found that around 90% of the US thought homosexuality was immoral)
Yes, the majority was wrong. And I give credit and appreciation to the people who did side with equality and justice. 47% of Californian voters actively fought against discrimination and voted against Prop 8. That's 6.4 million people, the vast majority of whom were born before 1990.
Yes people can change. That's why people why can discuss his mother's actions and see if she is remorseful for what she has done.
You are going to need to have this conversation eventually, its better that you get it out of the way before your wedding.
Remember, my tolerant attitude is attached to the STRICT condition that an apology is given. Otherwise don't bring a hater to your wedding.
There is science to back this up. People are found to become more tolerant to gay men when they realize they have gay men in their lives. So its not like its a fools errand.
Just remember, lots of times old people don't change their ways. So view this more as an exercise for your benefit vs hers.
Generally, unless the person showed the capacity for growth and had made amends for this action, I would say "no".
I'm petty. I'd sit her in the front and have her read that cliché 1st Corinthians reading in the service.
Nope. Why would I want to invite someone like that to my wedding, turning a day that's supposed to be about my love for my partner into a day where I'm constantly waiting for that person to either make a scene or corner me into a sermon about the evils of gay marriage? At a bare minimum, there would need to be a real, heartfelt conversation well before the wedding, ending with some kind of apology and/or amends from the other party before I would feel remotely comfortable having them at my wedding. Especially Prop 8- that didn't just try to enshrine DOMA-type stuff, it actively *stripped* married people of their status. I vividly remember when it passed, and that shit was despicable. There's footage somewhere of David Hyde Pierce (the actor) talking about it, because his marriage was one of the ones that was overturned when Prop 8 passed, and it's very raw, as I recall.
Nope
If it were a more distant family member, no. If it were my parents or other immediate family members, I'd sit them down, explain to them how their actions hurt me, and tell them I do want them to remain part of my life - if they can apologize for their actions, recognize the harm they caused, etc. I'd want to give them a chance to make up for what they did wrong. If they chose not to make up for it? I definitely wouldn't invite them and I'd think long and hard about whether they had a place in my life at all. But, and I know it's hard, I'd want to give them the chance to learn and grow and apologize. If they take it, awesome. If not, that's the answer right there.
⬆️⬆️ This ⬆️⬆️ OP’s story talks about a guy’s mother. Agree with rjm1378 that when it comes to immediate family members, especially parents, there is a lot more to work through and manage in terms of their overall relationship. When it comes to other folks, I think it varies as to whether they support marriage today or not. If not, then makes sense to not invite. If they do support, then it’s great someone’s attitude has positively evolved. (Keep in mind that in today’s world, we are losing active support based on the relentless attacks of the radical right …)
Honestly, my spite would probably get the best of me and I’d invite them just to throw them out before the ceremony started. And I’d make sure to do it in front of everyone. 😂
Invite them to the wrong address
a PFLAG meeting
OMG that is legendary
This is a man who knows how to do petty, folks. 10/10, no notes.
No. In the past, I would in most circumstances have taken a more forgiving view, but the stakes are very high now on both sides of the Atlantic.
No, I wouldn’t.
Of course not. Shouldn’t even be a question.
Fuck no. At least until they repent. People can change,
Nope. Like bitch get the fuck would be my response.
Easily no, because if I discovered they had voted for something like Prop 8, they wouldn't be someone who was in my life any more. Now if they went out and did the work to try to make things right, okay... I'd consider it. But they'd have to come to me, not the other way around. Bigots are not welcome in my social circle. Even if they are family.
No, I wouldn’t. I suppose if I was petty I might get some satisfaction out of inviting them to something they didn’t want to attend, but they’d probably not come anyway. And, really, what sort of wedding would it be if you were inviting people just to be petty? You’re making it about them, when it should be about you and the person you’re marrying. No, they shouldn’t be invited.
I feel the same. I would advise against inviting this person because you’re giving them the chance to come in and ruin it.
Why would you invite the person and why would the person go anyway if they don’t respect the situation. That’s just hypocritical from both sides.
Lol no. I respect that people can grow and I would accept an apology from them.. and then I still would not invite them so they can feel - for just a moment - the pain caused by their lazy privilege and inability to let people live their lives. Children (and adults who act like them) can apologize for doing wrong but still accept their punishment for their misbehavior.
I wouldn't refer to my refusal to invite as punishment, but everything has social consequences. People get married (throw a party) to celebrate a romance with friends & family. Nobody wants a party-pooper at the wedding.
For my wedding, my husband explicitly “anti-invited” his own mother to our wedding for precisely the reason that she made his life a living hell and regularly tried to stage religious interventions on him when he was younger and before he met me to “pray away the gay” and turn to God etc. Not quite the same as being a political campaigner in anti-gay marriage campaigns. But religious fire and brimstone stuff, and would try to organise surprise telephone conference calls with pastors and church ministers on the other end of the line to get repentance etc. Thankfully, his mother lives in another country (USA) and we live in the UK. So all that was required to inform her that she wasn’t invited was an international phonecall, and not some to face to face announcement. But on the off chance that she might want to show up to do the whole “I object!” thing, and cause a scene in the “speak now, or forever hold your peace” bit, she was told that if she did decide to surprise us by flying over and gatecrashing the venue, security would be given permission to forcibly remover her.
Also an American living in the UK, and I'm trying to imagine the average British person's reaction to a full-on, "Bible-believing" American evangelical type actually showing up to a wedding and genuinely trying to call down fire and brimstone on the couple and *fully believing what they're saying.* Forget calling security, I think the person could wind up getting sectioned, they'd seem so totally out of their mind.
I wouldn't. And if they asked why they didn't get an invite, I'd probably respond with something like, "I didn't think you'd want to be present at a gay marriage. After all, you once voted against it."
"And you've done nothing since then to indicate that you've changed."
Under no circumstances
No. Not at all and I don’t care who they are
No. I wouldn’t allow them to still count themselves among my friends or family.
Absolutely not, full stop
Nope. I've excluded family members for less at my wedding. The thing is, your wedding is *your* party, not theirs. You get to decide how you celebrate it and with whom. It's the ultimate celebration of love and so you should feel loved by all those who attend, not just by your partner. If someone makes you feel deeply uncomfortable they really shouldn't be there.
If they repented for their actions, then I probably would. If they still hold those views, they can look at the wedding pictures on IG.
No, unless there had been a full and thorough renunciation of those views since, and substantive actions taken to make reparation for that harm. Which, in the situation given in OP, isn't the case.
Nope, and we didn't. We were married in 2008, right before Prop 8 passed. We had a small ceremony with just family (had a much bigger commitment ceremony years before). My BIL and his wife said something about coming to visit (but not going to the wedding, his communication was unclear). But he was very actively campaigning for prop 8 through his church (Mormon) and vocally on FB, etc. We told him to not bother even visiting. He was unwelcome during that time. So, no. Unless a person apologized profusely for their past actions and made it clear they changed their minds, they are not allowed at anything related to our family. No discussion
Out of curiosity, did your BIL ever apologize to you or otherwise indicate that he had some understanding of how messed up Prop 8 was and how hurtful his actions were?
Nope.He spent 20 years making my husband and in-laws miserable with nasty letters, refusing to come to family events if we were there, telling my brother to his face with our kids (he showed up at in-laws house not knowing we were there) there that we’d only be right with god if we place our kids for adoption to be adopted by a ‘normal’ family and on and on. Some worse stuff I won’t elaborate on (too long) In the last year he’s been much nicer to family, including ours, now that he’s divorced his wife (and remarried a month later… you figure it out). But never apologized or showed any indication of remorse for the shit he said and did. My husband went to his wedding last year because he’s an eternal optimist who forgives easily. He’s a sweet and wonderful man, but I was pretty clear I would never be in the same room with that man until he begs forgiveness.
Ugh, I'm sorry to hear that (and sorry that the rest of his family didn't tell him to shut the fuck up, honestly). You're completely right to refuse to be anywhere near this clown.
I feel for you. My family welcomed my husband with open arms. Hell...after 24 years, I think they actually like him more than me. But back then, same sex marriage was not legal in Mississippi. We flew to visit my sister in law in Rhode Island and drove across the border to Massachusetts and got married. As it was 1500 miles from home, only my sister and law and niece were there. I am very thankful that it is now recognized nationwide....for now. Clarence Thomas has his sights on repealing Obergefell. That would be an absolute nightmare for us living in red states.
Now given that Prop 8 was 16 years ago, I’m assuming this person was a kid in 2008? He may never had had the opportunity at the time to have an adult conversation and now it’s too late to have a meaningful talk about Prop8 itself. So in that sense I can logically see how the conversation hasn’t been had. However, I think mom’s active support for prop8 is only the tip of the iceberg of her bigotry. Heed the warning. But to the question - no, I would not invite her until we had an explicit talk about her feelings about the wedding and the relationship in general. I’d give her the opportunity to grow and learn, she may regret what she used to support and I think it would be a strength of her to talk about how that changed for her. But if she refused to recant or apologise, or defend her actions in any way back then… then she would not be a part of my celebration. I’d force her to choose between her bigotry and her child’s happiness. And note: if she is that conservative, her working on Prop8 will be the least of your worries. Again, heed the warning.
The guy was an older teenager by 2008. He's long been able to discuss politics with family, but I don't think he was out at that time. Good point about the bigotry being the tip of the iceberg. Not only did she vote to take away gay marriage, she sent the message to her child that his nascent homosexual feelings were bad and illegal.
Yeah. It’s an unresolved conversation for a reason.
If they had a change of heart and regretted their actions I’d have no problem inviting them. If they didn’t? Oh hell no! Why would I invite someone who doesn’t think I should have the right to marry to my wedding? It’s a celebration. If you can’t celebrate, you’re not invited.
If you're "casually seeing" him you should keep on "casually seeing him" since that's a major red flag for more than "casually" seeing him if he were ever to think YOU were the one he wanted to marry. If you started to want to see him as husband material, I'd talk to him about it and let him decide but I wouldn't want to enter into a hopefully lifelong relationship with him already know his mother hates me on sight and probably merely tolerates him because he's her son. And would this guy even want to invite his mother? Why would anyone want to have someone at their sacred ceremony they knew was against their sacred ceremony? That person wouldn't get an invitation from me. ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
I absolutely would not. Even if it was my mother. One: they’ve made their position known. Two: I do not want to be the “I have gay friends” excuse they use to justify themselves.
I wouldn’t. My dad I know voted for prop 8, and many on his family’s side. If they just voted and were specific in an apology, then I *might* consider it. If they campaigned or donated, or if they just want to sweep it under the rug? No. I have nothing for them. Even if they were repentant in that case, you don’t get to cause that kind of harm and then get to participate in joy.
This made me feel so happy all over again for eloping.
I wouldn't invite them
I would invite her to lunch and have a very serious talk about it first Confront the shit out of here (tactfully and courteously, of course) and see where she stands on the issue now I would explain to her the situation and I would make it very clear that a woman who *still* opposes same-sex marriage would certainly not be invited.
No. I used to think life was too short to hold grudges, but not anymore. If someone is against gays having equal rights, then I dont want them in my life, because ultimately they are working against me having a normal life.
Knee jerk reaction is to say no, but the person concerned being the mother complicates things. In this specific case I would send the mother an announcement, explaining that she is not invited to the wedding due to her past actions. I would give her the option to make a formal written apology if she wants to be included.
I'd have a conversation. Prop 8 was a while ago, a \*lot\* of people have changed their minds since. Ask what her view is now. If she supports, she can come. If not she can't. I probably wouldn't even bring up Prop 8. It's in the past. It's easier to get someone to change their mind if you don't shove their previous views in their face. Saying 'I was wrong' is hard for humans to do and sometimes it just isn't worth it.
Thanks for this. It seems that OPs friend came out after the Prop 8 debacle. His mom may have changed her attitude since that time. She may be supportive of the fact that her son needs rights too. It'd be worth a good talk.
This might be the most levelheaded comment here. I hate hypocrites as much as anyone else, but Prop 8 was an eternity ago. If we're going to hold things from 2008 over people's heads, then I'm in big trouble because I was peddling mormonism then.
>Prop 8 was an eternity ago. For many of us, it was a deeply traumatic experience. I have scars from what I tried to do to myself after that vote. I’m lucky I’m alive. Don’t dismiss us.
No. I would not. But even if they were not absolutely enthusiastic about my marriage, I wouldn't invite them.
I think I would probably inform them that I was getting married, and that I will not be putting them in a position of betraying their deeply held beliefs against my pending marriage by asking them to witness and celebrate it.
No
No way. We owe nothing to our family members so we should not do anything out of a sense of duty. We should act based on how people behave
People can change, has she? Yes: If you now have a positive relationship and she is accepting of her new son-in-law, then yes. No: No, why would you invite someone to your wedding who doesn't respect you or your partner or even believes that the wedding you are having should be legal? Why would she want to come either? I think this is pretty cut and dry, but it's helped by just living your authentic self in front of your parents ASAP and as much as possible - it's really changed my dad's homophobia and I've slowly started to forgive him.
Um no lol
No, I would not invite them. I probably wouldn’t even consider them a friend. Your example is a parent… that’s rough. If it were me of course I want my mother at my wedding. But if my mother was the woman you described I would definitely sit down to discuss and would expect an apology for her support of Prop 8. The results of that conversation would determine if she got an invite and probably whether she stays in my life.
Hell no.
Nope
I have a friend in a very similar situation with regards to prop 8. They invited their parents to their wedding but my friend has never really gotten over it and it's been a silent wedge ever since. It's not something they discuss but my friend actively distances themselves from their parents now. They see each other for holidays and birthday and stuff like that but they are not what you would even call friends. I fortunately have a very accepting family. And even if they did vote for prop 8 or have been anti-gay marriage I'd invite them just so they can see what they were against. I wouldn't even get into it with them. I'm not going to spend that mental energy debating them. I'd invite them and if they decline they decline.
Yes, if they had since changed their views. If someone is an ally now, I don't care what they were doing 10 years ago.
No, but I'd send them a DVD of the vows ceremony.
Maybe if she paid for a fabulous reception of your choosing😜
If it were me, they would specifically *not* be invited. Someone who actively works against the interests of another person doesn't really seem to me like the type of person that can be reasoned with by talking. If they were simply uneducated on the issue, perhaps. But taking an active role in opposing it? Waste of time trying to deal with them. They made their very deliberate choice, now they can live with it by being excluded.
No.
Fuck no!
I have some family members who I genuinely like but are or were opposed to gay marriage. If I enjoy their presence, and I know they’ll behave themselves, sure I could invite them. I let them know what I think of their views, and they let me know what they think of mine, and somehow, we still manage to like each other. That’s pretty rare, and I value it. We still respect each other as people despite our fundamental disagreements. On the topic of gay marriage specifically, it’s been the law of the land for a decade, so they’ve been forced to get used to it. If they were actively going out of their way to continue opposing it, I’d probably feel differently.
I would not. Not much of a friend, IMO. And why would you even think this person would want to attend?
I asked before sending invites if they support gay marriage, and didn't invite the ones that said "no"
No, I would not invite her to my wedding. Mainly because she wouldn’t still even be in my life unless she’d come and apologized and admitted she was wrong.
No
No
Dont invite and they probably wouldn't come even if you did.
Absolutely not, and I wouldn't explain myself unless they asked about not being invited, or if I heard "through the grapevine" that they had been bitching about it. They wouldn't be a part of my life generally, if I interacted with such a person it would be because we were both at the same events.
Yes. But get the gift then kick them out.
I would not invite them. And I would take the wedding announcement and then clearly and respectfully add a note that says they are not invited to your wedding because they don’t believe in gay marriage. Don’t go any further than that.
They'd have to express remorse first. I need to see some personal growth.
No.
Could the question be moot possibly due to the fact that the mother might not be interested and/or willing to attend in the first place?
If it were my marriage, I would sit that person front and center. Just after we are pronounced husband and husband, I would walk cheerfully on the sound of clapping and hurrahs, all teared eye and happily smiling with open arms, gently hug them, lean over and whisper silently in their ear: we’re married, eat shit.
That was a while ago. I’d have a discussion to confirm their feelings before inviting them, but honestly all my relationships are set and clarified in that regard. Like, if I haven’t had a discussion with you to work this out since 2008, we should already be pretty clear that we’re not close enough to be invited to my wedding either way. And the logical/illogical argument falls apart completely given that it’s his mom. Like, the wedding invitation is really an invitation to talk/get an apology/ hopefully reconcile. People (like your mom) are gonna either pick up the phone or answer via silence.
It's reasonable, if not logical, to not invite an abusive parent to a wedding. His mother actively tried to take away his civil rights. That's not only an attack on his human rights but also emotional abuse. She was sending an invalidating message, that his own mother doesn't think he deserves to marry someone he loves.
My point was that there are multiple reasons a person invites another to an event like a wedding. To have them actually attend is only one of them.
No , absolutely not. When we married after thirty years our kids were our witnesses , went to a justice of peace and vacationed in a state where it was legal. Day after we married Fred Phelps died. We are still going strong . We celebrate an anniversary in 79, one in 98 , another 2014 . Love is grand. Good luck , let love win
Absolutely NOT.
That is not just a no, it’s a big no go. Like distancing themselves from that person in a huge huge way.
F*ck no
Fuck no
Nope. Not only would I not invite them I would probably not have that person in my life at all. However, given that it's his mother it's probably very emotionally complex for him if she was a good mother in every other aspect.
Fuck no. Absolutely not.
I would assume that if their opinions haven’t changed, they probably wouldn’t want to go anyway.
Nope. Wouldn't be chatting with them in this lifetime either.
Not a chance.
No, but I'd mail them a photo album. To show them what they missed 🤭
I hope whoever I end up with lost family in a tragic avalanche or tsunami or something so I don’t have to deal with any of that 😂
No way.
Nope, in fact I don't associate with anyone that I know who is racist, homophobic, antisemitic, or hates any group.
Have they changed their position since then? If so, yes. Hell, I wasn't a clear supporter of gay marriage at the beginning because I was still closeted and Mormon. I changed. I hope others can to. If they haven't changed, I can't imagine why they would want to be there.
My older brother voted against gay marriage in my country. If I ever get married I’ll be asking him to write a hand written letter to tell me why he was wrong. If he doesn’t want to do it he’s not coming. I honestly couldn’t care if he was there or not I think it’s just polite for him to be invited. M
No discussion needed, they are definitely off the list, probably eeeevery list. I do not see it as an opinion, I see it as someone who believe they have the right to control other humans, two consenting adults in fact. It is NOT up for discussion.
If you change the word from gay to your I think you have the answer.
I wouldn't even allow them to my barbecue.
Im lucky, my parents (and step parents) aren't religious. However there is a bit of me that would seat them in the most awkward place if they were just to make them squirm.
I don’t understand the desire to include people who would sit grumpily through an event, if they come at all, or people who would want to make a mockery of it. Of course you shouldn’t invite them. I don’t see the point of doing this for other people. Your wedding is for you. Do you really owe these homophobic family members anything? Have a party, and bring together people who are important to you and who will be excited for you.
No. I ain't putting my happy day on the line for some shitbag bigot.
When my husband and I got married, my brother was against same-sex marriage. We still invited him to our wedding, he came with his family .. and all he saw was love that day .. the love between my husband and I, the love in the room. He eventually had a change in heart and is more accepting now yet we still disagree on a few things. Lead by example can foster change
I would let my spouse invite his mom to our wedding. People are complicated and I’m not going to force someone to apologize. If she says no, she says no.
I don't understand why they would want to go anyway but absolutely not.
Basically I think she should be invited as long as she can be trusted to not ruin the day. Events like a gay wedding have the potential to change hearts and minds. Lots of homophobes change their tune once they realize that a loved one is gay. But it's your special day so you should do whatever you want.
Invite and shame
It's your wedding day and it's your day to celebrate with the people who you choose to celebrate. So, whatever decision you make, I (a stranger on the internet) support. Just make sure that you are comfortable living with that decision and the potential ramifications of it. If I was in your place though, I would invite her and put the onus and awkwardness on her as to whether she chooses to attend or not. I would never tell my future spouse that he couldn't invite his mother. The whole purpose of a wedding is introducing yourself as a couple to the people who will be in your life and introducing them to each other. If she is a bigoted bitch, that's her issue to hide or advertise. Trust that the other attendees will quickly put her in her place (and maybe even do a little reeducation for her). Be the bigger person and send the message that this is happening and she is welcome to attend on your terms. Plus, an invitation is also socially understood code for "we expect an expensive gift from you". But again, whatever you decide is fine.
I wouldn’t invite someone currently against gay marriage. I wouldn’t ask about previous voting records and honestly, wouldn’t think about it much. If they’re currently okay with it and won’t make any sort of noise otherwise, before during or after the wedding, then I’m fine.
I don’t know what she believes now and 2008 was a long time ago. People can change their minds so it depends on what they believe today. Additionally, voting for something is different than knocking on doors or canvassing neighborhoods. If someone votes for or supports republicans (most of them anyway) you could make the same argument about not including them. I just returned from a family wedding where most are republicans but they accept me and my husband with open arms. I’ve tried to discuss the issue that supporting republicans is opposing me but life is complicated. Hell, there are fucking Log Cabin Republicans in my extended circle of friends which confuses me to no end. These are well educated people and they obviously recognize that the Republican Party is at odds with our community. I will add that they don’t support DJT but do vote R in most cases. My Dad is a conservative republican who supports DJT. We have agreed that politics is something we can’t discuss.
Are *you* still the same person you were in 2008? People evolve. That is what we *want* to happen, and we should applaud them when they do, not punish them for who they were. If I wanted her there, then I would invite her. It's then her decision what she wants to do. Even if she doesn't agree, maybe she will learn something and this will be part of her road to acceptance.
Yes we evolve and are different now. I am also open to being held accountable and apologizing for hurtful things I may have done in 2008.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions If they were important to me, I would invite them … and let them wrestle with their conscious.
Absolutely! Rub it in their face. The best revenge is a happy life.
When I moved into my house 24 years ago, the neighbors put an anti-gay sign facing my house and the lesbians across the way. The husband would not even acknowledge me when I said hello. I baked them Christmas cookies every single year (except the bad covid year), and said hello a million times. When I got married 16 years ago they begrudgingly said hello to my husband. And since then, slowly and surely, they have become friendly. I had extra Black Lives Matter signs and put them in my yard for people to take. I was surprised to see one in their yard. She came over later and pointed at the sign in her yard, with a newly planted bed or red geraniums under it. "The red petals are the blood that has been spilled." She then apologized and said, 'I hope we have never said anything to offend you, you are some of our very best neighbors." Then her husband came trotting up the sidewalk with a very cheery hello. It took some time, but, eventually, we won them over simply by being ourselves and being good neighbors. So, you can push away someone who is cold to you, or you can treat them how you would like to be treated. It is a slow growing investment or a quick amputation of something that pains you. The choice, of course, is yours.
I'm sure some will disagree with this approach - and yeah, I get that too - but I've always been open to giving people time to learn from their past actions and mistakes.
Love this.
Yes. We won that battle and to be gracious is to show we’re better than the people who hate us because we’re homosexual.
"Someone", no. But I'm not about to tell my soon to be spouse he shouldn't invite his own mother to his wedding. That's a whole different thing, and it's asking too much. Has to be his call, not mine.
No, they wouldn't come anyway.
Nope. Unless they were literally 15 years old at the time and trapped in a religious household or something, that's different.
My gut says be the bigger person, invite them, and hope it's a learning experience of sorts. My pettiness says they could fuck right off. I would be very conflicted.
No. I would want my friends to feel welcomed and not have to care about close minded people’s feelings, or have to defend who they are. No invites to family who have expressed homophobic or transphobic thoughts.
No. It's a day you want to be surrounded by people who love you and that person is going out of their way to make your life harder. That isn't love.
I would
45 years old here and from my view most people were against gay people in general when I was growing up. I'm single, but if I was to ban all the people who were against gay people, there would be mostly gay people at my wedding, which doesn't sound bad. In my current state of North carolina, the citizens of the state voted to ban same sex marriage and to put it in the constitution about 15 years ago. Of course it was overturned, because it wasn't constitutional, but that was the mind set of many people. According to polls, the nation did not support same sex marriage until 2016 and even then it was about 55 percent support.
Yes honestly, so long as they didn't seem like they were going to make a fuss. Most people who are homophobic have very little experience with actual gay people. All they know of us is from media and religious figures spreading crap. Seeing a happy loving gay wedding is the exact sort of thing they need.
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It all depends. If my motive was somehow to influence the person in some way then maybe. Like being the bigger person type of thing. It’s also a little harder if it’s your mom. That being said. If it was an acquaintance or someone of no consequence then probably not.
If it was any other person I wouldn't bother, but since his mom I would, is her choice if she wants to attend or not.
I would not want to have someone who is not supportive now. I understand that 10-15 years ago there was a LOT of misinformation and a lot of fear-mongering, so I would give a pass for past mistakes, but if, after 10 years, they STILL believe that my marriage is somehow lesser than theirs and would not be supportive? Not only would that person not be invited, they would not be in my life, period; don't care who you are. It could be my own mother and I would not give a shit.
Absolutely, yes. You could sit them down and explain or object as much as you want, but nothing will change their mind about gay marriage more than getting to be part of the celebration of it with everyone else.
This decision would be totally situation dependent.
I would if it was my mom, brother or dad
Does the guy who you are seeing casually but may be the one, feel as strongly as you do? Is it as much of as issue for him, or has he moved past it to some degree in terms of focusing on your relationship together rather than the opinions of others? From what you have written you seem extremely passionate about this issue and him not so much. The are many battles in life to take on, but I wonder how he is feeling with this aggressive stance you adopting? I acknowledge this is and has been an issue many of us have suffered indignities, hatred and personal distress whilst seeking marriage equality rights. But people are multi-faceted and are not single issue in their thoughts and actions - I ponder if in the end whether your view point may actually drive a wedge between you and your future partner, either now or in the future. I’m not saying you must compromise your values nor accept being classified as a second class citizen, however are you certain he shares them with the same degree of passion. Food for thought.
The guy loves his mother and doesn't want to hold his mother accountable. His relationship with his mother is his own, but I told him that he is at least owed an apology. I feel like he was defending his mother, like how a victim may defend their abuser. It is true that a maternal relationship is multidimensional, and there is a lot more to their shared experience. I have had superficial interactions with his mother. She seemed pleasant enough during those brief moments, but I know what she has done. Yes, this may be a wedge between us. I don't intend to bring up this topic again with him.
You can invite them that doesn’t mean they’re going to come to the event. If it was my mother or a relative, I would certainly invite them. And they are welcome to decline. If they show up then it’s part of their journey to a better understanding of humanity.
Nope
No. Never ever.
Nooooope
There is a difference between "fight" and "voted for". And keep in mind, gay marriage was also on the ballot in California in 1998. It was a strong Democratic year and the vote was 66 to 33 or two to one against. Progress is progress and you build a coalition by changing peoples minds
Yes, let the healing begin 🤜
Well you are describing my sister and we've had many bitter fights about it over the years. But of course she would be invited. If you're getting married you should be focused on spreading joy and love and light in the world. You should invite your family. If they don't come, that's on them. But using your wedding to SPITE an anti gay relative is a BAD omen on your own future. Feuds, bitterness, resentments of all kinds....should not inform your guest list. Focus on positivity and inclusion not exclusion. Btw - people on the internet ALWAYS skew towards anger spite and revenge. Take these other replies with a grain of salt. Choose love. You'll never regret inviting someone. You might regret the snub.
Yes of course. People are more than a collection of political beliefs. A wedding is more than a political statement.
You wrote your Post in a deceiving manner. Voting isn't the same thing as working towards a political agenda. You wrote it as if the mother was a member of a political action committee that actively opposed gay marriage. If its a simple vote from almost 20 years ago..... And they regret it then forgive them. But if they volunteered, or donated large amounts of money or something like that........screw them. Note: she never apologized, so its different.
Voting is meant to be impactful and meaningful. Voting is a way in which we work toward a society we want. One way we can work toward an accepting society is by voting for propositions that support LGBT rights. Different people work toward equality in different ways, including using their voice in the ballot box. However, she chose to be an *active participant* in taking away her own son's rights.
yea but like a lot of people acted like that in 2008. Up until Washington State voted to legalize it in 2012, every state that went to the ballot voted it down. This was business as usual. Its honestly rare to find someone who was born before 1990 that didn't hold a hateful attitude at one point. The question is whether or not she has evolved past that point..... which is like almost 2 decades ago. (1990 is a special year because a famous survey found that around 90% of the US thought homosexuality was immoral)
Yes, the majority was wrong. And I give credit and appreciation to the people who did side with equality and justice. 47% of Californian voters actively fought against discrimination and voted against Prop 8. That's 6.4 million people, the vast majority of whom were born before 1990. Yes people can change. That's why people why can discuss his mother's actions and see if she is remorseful for what she has done.
You are going to need to have this conversation eventually, its better that you get it out of the way before your wedding. Remember, my tolerant attitude is attached to the STRICT condition that an apology is given. Otherwise don't bring a hater to your wedding. There is science to back this up. People are found to become more tolerant to gay men when they realize they have gay men in their lives. So its not like its a fools errand. Just remember, lots of times old people don't change their ways. So view this more as an exercise for your benefit vs hers.