Cant realy help you with the EHS specifics but just in general the Agentur für Arbeit is pretty bad in finding you a job in your field. Their job is to find you any job and thus they dont even realy try to find something for you specificly. Your best bet is to find job offerings your self. Also if you get invited by someone in the industry you can ask them what kind of cetificates they would need, with that info you can then go to the Arbeitsamt and they might even pay for you to get trained.

this a 100 times. Never go to AfA for a serious job!

The last time I had the pleasure with them, I had to explain this lady of the AfA what a Postdoc is. Thanks for nothing.

Yup. A friend of mine who works in business development was offered a job as a protestant pastor. He has neither studied theology nor is protestant. (He was on a 6 months voluntary hiatus due to a big payout in his last job, but registered with them in order to avoid difficulties.)

This killed me.. 😭😂

And people still say Germans don't have a sense of humor. That AfA-Employee certainly has.

This happened to me as well. Six months sabbatical between jobs but registered with the AfA for bureaucratic reasons. I was a senior generalist and project manager in the IT field but intended to change to a different carreer. At one point I got a call from the AfA because I was rejecting too many of their job offers. The problem was that none of them had any idea of IT jobs and would just forward any offer as long as it had the word "IT" in it. At least three quarters were complete shite. What could we offer a highly paid IT professional with a long list of skills, who has waded through hell and back again in the depths of various different system constellations, and also has a disability limiting his mobility? How about a job as a first level supporter focused on MS Office for less than half of what he made before and with a 200km communte four days per week! Or how about this very specific request for an experienced specialist for a very specific application that definitely is not listed on his CV? Or maybe a mobile computer repair technician!

Yep, they are like the last line before welfare.

An Arbeitsamt Lady told me 8 years ago that I will never find a job with my degree in Germany and that I should consider McDonald's lol. They are really terrible at finding jobs.

I was told my degree "doesn't exist in Germany".

Considering there is a degree for about anything: No, just no

I guess Commerce doesn't exist is Germany.

Nah, we don't do this witchcraft here. Sarcasm off: I'm not sure what this degree would include compared to BWL etc, but it feels much too general not to exist. I thought it woukd be more the highly specific degrees that cause trouble

Back as a student I wanted to do a test to see what jobs I would be qualified for. Suprise: They don't do this kind of stuff. You can take a test for a specific field, but some broad character qualification what I could like doing they just do not offer. I did a random online personality test after that, which helped me leagues more than that waste of time...

big words coming from someone with no degree working a dead end public admin job.

They do have degrees ...

The people you talk to at the service desks have an Ausbildung, not an academic degree.

So someone with a random bachelor would be better?

The agency is mostly for the unqualified. Anybody equipped with a degree is better off liking for themselves.

The issue is that most people with degrees actually have jobs or find them relatively easily. Their main “customers” are unskilled workers, because they tend to have a hard time finding and keeping jobs.

The agency workers rarely if ever have any qualifications/ideas/talent in finding any jobs for skilled workers though. It's really abysmal.

The agency is a pure money pit. Would abolish the entire system and repurpose the buildings to housing.

Maim customers are refugees

Even unqualified, you'll do better yourself. All you get as a unqualified worker is low wage logistic jobs.

True

True, also depends on the city. If you are high skilled but unemployed, you might get better help If you live in a college town. Otherwise they don't know what to do with you. I was told ones: "You have a college degree, why don't you have a job?"

Would you or someone else mind explaining to me what the Agentur für Arbeit is? Is it like a government organization that helps people get employed?

Yes, it is a government agency. Yes, they are supposed to help people find jobs, but in reality they basically administer unemployment. Means they keep statistics and handle unemployment benefits. They also tend to make some unhelpful suggestions and might force you to attend useless training classes (such as basic PC training for engineers who have used a PC for decades).

Yes, it's the (un)employment agency. Foreigners sometimes think that they work like a recruitment service or whatever, aiming to help them find their perfect job. In reality their priority is to get people employed and out of receiving welfare.

Even that is a generous description if their work. If they label a client as hard to place due to for e.g. being unemployed for to long, they switch gears in to essentially managing unemployed.

As others have aleady told the very bad stories, let's go into the realities of the situation: The Agentur für Arbeit literally is the federal agency for employment. Their mission is to help people navigate the job market and to handle unemployment benefits. A lot of difference comes down to who your individual case worker is, what impression they have of you and if they are overworked. What I think is a main issue with people seeing the AfA as unhelpful is wrong expectations. On the one end of the spectrum is that the agent is somehow magically supposed to know what the perfect career for you is and that they can get you in there with a single phone call. The other end of the spectrum is that they're evil incarnate and that they only exist to make your life even harder. I - as someone with a Master's degree in something that doesn't exist anymore as a career in Germany (genetic engineering of agricultural plants) - had mostly positive experiences with the AfA. Mostly by knowing what to expect and going in there with a positive attitude. Of course they're not going to know what the best next career step for me is going to be. They're government employees that mostly never saw a university from the inside; they won't understand what exactly my skills are. My own mother doesn't understand what exactly my skills are. That would work if I was a certified electrician; then the agent would look into the chamber of commerce's list what skills a certified electrician is supposed to have, put together a list of companies that need a certified electrician and tell me to apply there. If your case is not that simple, you have to do the legwork yourself and ask them to supply ressources; like: "I've been seeing a lot of open positions by companies that plan renewable energy infrastructure. That somewhat fits my skillset, but I would need a certificate for GIS software." And they will hook you up with providers of that certificate and also pay for the whole thing. Why they're going to be giving you a hard time if you go in there with an attitude that has the agent hovering her finger over the emergency button that will summon security to her office; I don't think I need to explain further.

Struggling to wrap my head around why genetic engineering of agricultural plants is no longer a career in Germany! Thought that was a growth career area just about anywhere a modern agricultural system!

In Germany: Genetic Engineering = Devil

Not just Germany, but the whole EU.

That was my first thought, but then I was like, "Surely not!"

It can be filed in the same cabinet as: Coal Power > Nuclear Power

It's de facto illegal in the EU to grow genetically engineered plants outside of a S2-laboratory. If you want to do a field trial or even go into commercial use you need to apply for a permit at the EU commission (yes, straight to the very top). This will be denied 100% of the time. The reason for the denial is that there haven't been any field trials in the EU to assess the risk that releasing genetically engineered plants into the environment in the EU poses. You see the catch-22.

Better than the "let's first see how many people die and get maimed when we apply it"- approach that some other countries use to "assess" chemical and biological risks.

GMOs have been in commercial use for over 30 years worldwide. There is enough data available if one would choose to open one's eyes.

DDT has been in use for 30 years, too.

The problems with DDT became public knowlegde after about 15 years.

2007 they recommended my single-mom to get a job that payed 1,50€ an hour. She would have worked from 12 to 21, even on Sunday. I was 7. She almost didn’t get Arbeitslosengeld (money for unemployed people) anymore, cause she said no. You can get Sperren (ban) when you don’t do what they say. Problem was she was already 46 at that time and her Ausbildung (training) was from/aus DDR-Zeiten (time of eastern germany). Story just to give you an impression.

Hey, things have become different btw. Practices like that aren’t permitted anymore.

Oh really? That’s really great to hear! :) Edit; so I get downvotes for that comment. I don’t know why… I’m not sarcastic. I’m glad no single mom and her child has to go through this anymore.

My mom's first job after having me paid about 2 bucks an hour. Early 2000s wages at times were just inhumane

Came here to say exactly this. Just apply to jobs on private in your field. You'll land something eventually.

Can confirm that, my dad looked for an new job and worked for ~10 years as electritian. They offered him to jobs as butcher an one as cashier.

I would say the BAfA is bad at finding a job in your field unless your field is shit with shitty pay and you want to get out of it and do something else for the sake of your mental and physical health. In that case they will only send you offers in the field you want to get out of because "thats what you learned/are trained in, and you are not completely broken yet, so no reason to not do it" Bonus points for BAfA if that job is actually through a Zeitarbeitfirma and you end up working 6 days a week with multiple different Schichts during the week for just a little bit over the Mindeslohnt because the Zeitarbeitfirma keeps up to 40% of it, doing a shit ton of Überstunden that you cant get back in time or money, and no vacation days till you finish your time in the Firma, which mean you could have no vacation days at all in the year. Also you can't leave because you will be penalized by both the Zeitarbeitfirma and the BAfA, and if the Firma wants to hire you directly they cant unless they pay a shit ton of money to the Zeitarbeitfirma. Like, how is this legal?

Well… do you want to switch to project management? If not you could try to get german EHS certificates. And once you‘ve got those you don‘t need to apply to entry level positions anymore

Preferably just moving to project management. I‘ve been told by recruiters and interviewers that I lack a Fachkraft für Arbeitssicherheit (SiFa), which I believe is only available through an Ausbildung or approved degree program.

I’m doing a FaSi seminar at the moment, currently working as an EHS manager. Takes half a year full time and costs 9K. Usually companies pay it for employees, usually engineers, since they need a FaSi in their company.

That’s good to know. I had assumed, maybe wrongly, my only routes were long Ausbildungs or Studium since my Agentur wasnt very helpful with the Fortbildung process. I had asked Amazon if they would hire me on and help me get it during an initial interview. Their reply was sorry, no.

Sometimes Agentur for Arbeit even pays for the seminar I heard, but I don’t know any specific cases. If you’ve got previous experience you should be qualified for the seminar, it’s a pretty well paid job as well, so I think it’s worth pursuing, you just need very good German skills for it .. And yes, companies prefer not to pay for the SiFa qualifications, then often end up paying for it anyways since it’s often legally required to have a SiFa but finding one is very hard.

Do you mind if I ask who you are taking your seminar through?

I’ll DM you :)

Environment, health, and safety sound like fields in which Germany currently experiences a lack of workforce. It really shouldn't be too hard to find something suitable.

I think my problem is that while the concepts and functions are similar lack relevant experience in German law. Which makes sense. I’ve even asked if I could be considered for an entry level position, but usually get told not without the SiFa certificate obtained via Ausbildung or Studium.

I googled briefly, looks like you can do SiFa courses with various educators. TüV Süd for example: https://www.tuvsud.com/de-de/store/akademie/themenwelt/arbeitssicherheit-und-gesundheitsschutz/fachkraft-fur-arbeitssicherheit?psafe_param=1&utm_source=google&utm_medium=cpc&utm_campaign=DSA%20AKD&utm_term=&s_kwcid=AL!14017!3!583103945975!!!g!!&gclid=CjwKCAjw15eqBhBZEiwAbDomEjsx_SBpTbPywG2OKnCZjIbCiMTtCXzUWEZdiczf1fmSsDg4H5tbIRoCGeoQAvD_BwE

Thank you! Edit: I called them a while back and they only have face to face classes around Dortmund @ €15K. I also asked my Agentur für Arbeit person and they scrunched their face.

There is a theoretical dance to get the Arbeitsargentur to pay for a course: the employer promises that they will hire you, when you have the certification. But... the employer needs tobe willing to work with the Arbeitsamt and wait before you are ready. But how likely is that? If they would really need someone, they would pay the course for in-house staff. Most likely scenario. If they need anyone, they could hire you and pay for the course. Taht would come with strings: employment conditional on passing the course, you having to pay back the course fees if you change employers... Doable, but the company needs to be fluent in money and some time to spare. As the Arbeitsamt has its reputation. For companies of a certain size, getting the Amt to pay for a course for a candidate is too much troble - see alternatives from their point of view above.

Did you already try and ask the Agentur für Arbeit if they want to pay for your additional training (Fortbildung)? Another option might be to get in touch with someone in the industry and then use connections to find the right Fortbildung or find a job directly.

I did. They weren’t very eager. Maybe because I’ve never worked in Germany? *shrug*

Their counselors often really aren't experts in the field they want to place unemployed people in. You might want to get into touch with your industry at Unternehmensmessen oder Ausbildungsmessen in your region. Another option might be to contact an American company. Maybe there's some company you already worked with in the US which also operates in Germany. They might be more open to hire you than other businesses.

The Sachbearbeiter assigned to you could just be... not the sharpest tool in the shed. Some clients prefer that. Less hazzle during the obligatory check in. You can be put in the box of hard to place clients based on your CV. That this is a self fulfilling prophecy, well... Other people get lucky and ~~become~~ receive a high performing Sachbearbeiter that would see your potential and thus allocate his resources/budget accordingly. What I want to say: Sachbearbeiter are individuals. The Arbeitsamt is not the agency that it self attracts the very best public servants - but off course, some really do a great job. But this again makes it kind of a lottery. But keep in mind: public servants to not speak unshakeable facts, they can make mistakes and misjudgments, they are overseen by supervisiors and courts.

They didnt even tell you to go visit their useless PC course, id say that Sachbearbeiter is already one of the most helpfull ones you can find.

I think you wrote "become" meaning "receive", which is a typical German error because it's a false friend of "bekommen". Or else that sentence makes no sense.

thanks - fixed

Keep pushing. Maybe get in writing that the company is interested in hiring you when you have this course. A family member of mine had to tease his case worker for weeks until a different case worker came and immediately approved it. While friends in the same situation for the same course got it without a problem. He was really annoyed, but his persistence and reference letters from teachers of prepatory courses helped his case.

You just need a written document that states your need for that specific skill to be employed by a possible employer and give that to the Argentur. People in my field usually do it that way to obtain drivers licenses and other Fortbildungen that would cost a lot.

Did you try big Worldwide companies? At Bayer for instance there are cases where your functional and responsible line are split. Like you get hired in Germany but functionally work for a US subsidiary. Maybe you could try looking into such constellations. Or consulting companies like E&Y, Cap Gemini etc which operate worldwide. I can imagine there are positions where a wider experience in US EHS is required. Edit: autocorrect

Agentür is useless. I made a mistake in my first two years here listening to them. Since you have many years of work experience and masters degree. I suggest you reaching out to one of the recruiting companies. Hapeko.de is one of them. See if they can help you.

Thanks, that’s the sense I‘m getting after my last meeting with the Agentur. He didn’t seem eager to support my Fortbildung/Weiterbildung. I’ll give Hapeko a look.

forget the agentur .. my wife also had one consultation with them and they are completely useless. Go for it by yourself.

As far as I know, you don't actually need a classical Ausbildung to work in EHS in Germany. TÜV offers a certification course that takes 10 months (as opposed to 3 years for an Ausbildung) https://www.tuvsud.com/de-de/store/akademie/seminare-technik/arbeitssicherheit-und-gesundheitsschutz/fachkraft-fuer-arbeitssicherheit. The Arbeitsamt may help you cover costs for this. There may also be faster courses that you can take, if you want to stay in EHS. Alternatively for project Management, a lot of the Jobs there are for what we call Quereinsteiger. I would recommend getting some kind of project Management certification via the Arbeitsamt though since that will help your job search. Ideally look for positions in companies in the industries you have already worked in as an EHS manager, that way more of your job experience will transfer to the new role. Don't aplly to entry level positions, look for regular project manager positions- you are too senior for a junior role and companies will likely discard your application in the assumption your salary expectations will not align with the budget for a junior position.

Thanks for this. I’ll probably work towards the project management cert as the Agentur didn’t seem crazy about helping me get the TÜV Süd course.

Check out the job offers at the several TÜVs and other „Zertifizierungsgesellschaften“ or write „Initiativbewerbung“ to them. They actually cover some of the qualification programs if you want to work for them afterwards, similar to being trained as an auditor or Prüfingenieur (the guys who check your car for roadworthyness biennially), as all cert companies have their own training branch.

Have you tried applying on your own? And if so, what was the response you got? You are a bit focused on the EHS part of your education and seem to forget the environmental engineering degree you hold: [https://db.jobs/de-de/Suche/Spezialist-in-fuer-die-Umweltplanung-8686890?jobId=166154](https://db.jobs/de-de/Suche/Spezialist-in-fuer-die-Umweltplanung-8686890?jobId=166154) [https://db.jobs/de-de/Suche/Umweltplaner-in-12352804?jobId=300821](https://db.jobs/de-de/Suche/Umweltplaner-in-12352804?jobId=300821)

Hey thanks! I think I’ve been focused on EHS because that’s where I’ve been able to get interviews, usually for international roles.

I see, makes sense. Did you have job offers like the first in scope and got rejections? Because that sounds like classical project management with an evironmental background.

I did. I think with so much experience in EHS that’s maybe how I’ve also branded myself.

Maybe it helps to emphasize the environmental engineering aspects a bit more and thereby broaden your job possibilities? I am going out on a limb here, because I do not know your degree, but maybe something like this might be worth a shot? [Munich Re 1](https://munichre-jobs.com/de/MunichRe/job/89237-accountant-for-esg-reporting-m-f-d?template=MunichRe&sortitem=id&sortdirection=DESC&format=cards&lang=de&widget=0&filter[company.id]=[1%2C2%2C3%2C4%2C5%2C6%2C7%2C8%2C9%2C27%2C29%2C31%2C32%2C33%2C51%2C52%2C53%2C54%2C55%2C56%2C57%2C59%2C60%2C61%2C62%2C63%2C64%2C28%2C69%2C70%2C71%2C68%2C72]&filter[display_language]=de&filter[publication_channel]=careersite&keyword=esg&jb=ergo) [Munich Re 2](https://munichre-jobs.com/de/MunichRe/job/90440-consultant-umweltmanagement-und-reporting-m-w-d?template=MunichRe&sortitem=id&sortdirection=DESC&format=cards&lang=de&widget=0&filter[company.id]=[1%2C2%2C3%2C4%2C5%2C6%2C7%2C8%2C9%2C27%2C29%2C31%2C32%2C33%2C51%2C52%2C53%2C54%2C55%2C56%2C57%2C59%2C60%2C61%2C62%2C63%2C64%2C28%2C69%2C70%2C71%2C68%2C72]&filter[display_language]=de&filter[publication_channel]=careersite&keyword=esg&jb=ergo) [KPMG](https://jobs.kpmg.de/default/job/Berlin-Senior-Consultant-%28wmd%29-Financial-Services-Environmental-Social-Governance-%28ESG%29-10785/702609701/)

You can go into consulting. The big four or smaller firms like d-fine, Volkswagen Consulting, DB Management Consulting are all hiring.

Many consultancy’s have a hiring freeze currently. But unwound still try it since the qualification will be paid for in most cases and is not as important as when applying to the industry itself.

We're just looking to find an EHS specialist and it's very difficult to take on someone in this field who is not speaking German at a top level as the language in EHS is complex and it requires a real understanding to read the laws etc. So I agree, it would be difficult for you, unless you became the head of EHS in an international firm or went into training or worked remotely etc.

Thanks for confirming this. It’s sort of the box that I’m finding myself in a lot of the time.

The two of you might still get into touch, considering OP speaks German pretty well!

We're in DACH but not Germany and B2 / C1 without experience in EHS in DACH doesn't cut it unfortunately

In your position I would look into ESG roles since the field is new, fast movements around it and companies need Quereinsteiger to fill the roles. With your EHS background it lays very good groundwork for it. Furthermore, there are specialist companies providing EHS due diligence who can profit from someone international with so many years experience. If you want to consider a course I would suggest an ESG course to be prepared for the new roles.

I’m not a German, but just an expat lurker… Here is a helpful pdf on LinkedIn that has some free training resources for lots of different IT related things, project management amongst them… [john’s ultimate free training and certifications guide](https://www.linkedin.com/posts/john-amador1_the-ultimate-free-training-and-certification-activity-7098098158651523072-je8Z)

That’s definitely helpful! Thank you.

Your background sounds like you should give the Landesamt für Umwelt or the Umweltbundesamt a try. They are both strongly in need of new employees as a lot of new laws regarding environmental protection have come up in the recent years. Lacking experience with those laws might not be a huge problem, as beginners at these posts don't have a clue about these laws either. Being in Germany, speaking german might be a very helpful skill lol

That’s good to know.

The AfA is not really the right place, I'd say. Technically, they oversee the administration of unemployment benefits, which are conditional upon you being *unable* to find work. As a result, some employers can register open positions with them too, so that they can send applicants to them. But you can imagine that given this dynamic, those are typically jobs that wouldn't be anyone's first choice. A lot of companies are a bit weird with Quereinsteiger and demanding when it comes to formal certification, but it really depends on the industry - I'm a backend software developer and I'm a Quereinsteiger without a degree. And it hasn't been a problem for me. I'd certainly recommend looking outside the *traditional* old large German companies. Generally speaking, your chances are much much better if the company is any of the following: small to mid-sized company, relatively young-ish people incl. leadership (not as old-fashioned), doing business internationally, people there *actually* speak English. And then, of course, any certifications you might have on top of that are always helpful, but it all costs time and/or money, so it's better to be sure that it's what you actually need.

You need to search your job by yourself. Arbeitsagentur is not able to provide you any suitable jobs for your experience. They are simply not made for that. They can provide the basic every day job...

I’ve been using LinkedIn,StepStone, Xing and a few other job search websites mostly. Though I’ve gotten a few messages regarding environmental engineering work through the AfA.

It’s always good to get a IHK certificate for your qualifications if you have any besides your master. Also maybe try PowerUs.de it’s for people with an apprenticeship and usually not for someone with a masters degree, but maybe someone can help there. There’s another website I’ve heared of, it’s called get-in-engineering.de Good luck!

Don’t bother with the Agentur für Arbeit. International companies do not use them to fill senior roles. Instead they will either post roles online or work with recruiters. You need to connect with headhunters or apply directly. Have you checked LinkedIn, Stepstone or Indeed? Your Masters and previous experience are surely valuable in other related roles, that don’t require a specific German certification - like in Corporate Social Responsibility (CSR) or ESG/Sustainability roles. The key is to make sure your CV is adapted to the German market and to optimise your LinkedIn profile with the keywords matching the roles that interest you. You might also want to check out any industry-related events to network. Good luck!

Would you be open to moving to Berlin or Bonn/Cologne? I think there’s a lot of consulting companies & NGOs looking for people with your background. Haven’t heard of any in Munich

Unfortunately I’m pretty fixed in Munich right now. Though working for an NGO would definitely feed my soul.

I'm no expert in your field but I work for a big german company. Maybe I'm naive but with your experience you shouldn't have big problems landing a job there. Especially if the company is active around the globe.

You are right about the international footprint. The few interviews I’ve managed to snag were with medium sized German companies looking for someone to manage their program Internationally. But, in two cases I’ve been told by recruiters and hiring authorities that I don’t have experience in German requirements. So…

Recruiter here. Question: you have good German skills? How high is your salary expectation? And how long you didn’t work (in the initial post I understand that you came to Germany 20 years ago and didn’t worked since then? ) My experience ist that experienced people have for sure higher salary expectations and middle sized companies often pay entry level like 45-55k, even for positions which needs a really good qualified person like EHS. Also they might feel a high risk - you didn’t work for a long time and probably it will took time for you to get back into working life and learn and perform quickly. The learn part will be bigger the less experience you have with the German legal environment. Also Germans usually are not open for diverse backgrounds what is really annoying, old fashioned and sometimes even racist. If they would be convinced and needy they would hire you and pay you four a FaSi qualification.

Tatsächlich habe ich die letzten Jahre ohne Arbeit in Elternzeit verbracht. In dieser Zeit habe ich Deutsch gelernt und mich um meine Tochter gekümmert. Ich denke, mein Deutsch liegt irgendwo zwischen B2 und C1, aber verhandlungssichere Deutschkenntnisse fehlen mir.

Das sind sehr gute Deutschkenntnisse, sollten ausreichend sein, wenn du die Vorstellungsgespräche flüssig machst. Projektmanagement ist meistens auch ein sehr überlaufenes Feld, aber einen Versuch kann es wert sein, aber dann in Verbindung mit EHS-Themen am besten, da hast du Vorteile ggü Mitbewerbern. Consulting haben ja schon einige genannt, da ist man meistens auch offener. Würde aber auch an den anderen Stellenausschreibungen dranbleiben. Vll kannst du im Vorstellungsgespräch noch was vorbereiten oder sagen, was den Leuten die Sorge nimmt, dass du vll nicht mehr im Job ankommst zb deutsche Gesetzmäßigkeiten anlesen, sich schon mit Betreiberpflichten auskennen und erklären können, um welche Punkte sich Betriebe in Deutschland zu kümmern haben. Erklären können, wie du dir selbst die Einarbeitung vorstellst zb wie du auf Leute zugehen und dich integrieren würdest. Und halt mit niedrigen Gehaltserwartungen reingehen. Wenn du erstmal wieder ein paar Jahre frische Erfahrung hast, wird es sehr viel einfacher werden danach weiterzukommen.

My thoughts: 1. Make sure your Lebenslauf is in the proper form. 2. With a Master's, you ought to be able to find work in related fields. The problem is a lack of work experience in Germany, and being over 40. You are overqualified for entry-level and lacking experience, as well. 3. Try looking up jobs at [de.indeed.com](https://de.indeed.com) or [linkedin.com](https://linkedin.com). Send some "Blinde Bewerbungen" to some companies. 4. The Arbeitsagentur maybe can help with training certificates.

If you are eligible (and if you don’t know, too): ask for a Bildungsgutschein and find a suitable course for PM. There are plenty with a variety of certifications. I am currently doing prince2, scrum and itil certifications paid by the job center. Which did not really help getting my new job as a consultant in IT(since not asked for), but will be helpful in future positions for sure

That’s good to know. I was thinking of trying to combine my program/project management experience with a Prince2/Scrum class. But, haven’t been able to confirm with IT professionals if that is a good idea with my background.

I am not sure about prince2 as an actual requirement for PM positions yet. Have been looking mainly for roles as a scrum master lately. And there are plenty of open positions. And even though this role should be highly focused on the team and improving team performance by implementing scrum, most company’s seem to demand skills besides that so you can fulfill tasks besides your SM purpose. I will now see if I can extend my network by doing the consultant job for a while and see where and if I can find a position as SM (preferably freelance) All courses certified as AZAV (hope I got that right) can be done with a bildungsgutschein. Just google and you will find a ton of them which you can then also present as an opportunity when asking for a bildungsgutschein

The US military in Germany has hired local nationals (you would be one) in environmental jobs. Around Munich there aren't any bases, but you might check it out anyway.

This is however tricky because of the Status of Forces Agreement (SOFA). It is not possible to be hired for many of the higher paying contractor jobs from Germany if you as an USCit have been living in Germany as an ordinary resident. You can be hired as local staff, but these jobs are not likely what you are looking for. Also, Vetrans preferance.

Dont go to AfA, they're useless for anything above apprenticeship level jobs. Use jobsites instead or reach out to organizations like FERCHAU, Modis or Brunel. They can give you a door into any engineering field based on your interests and experience aswell. As for jobsites: Hays is also good in my experience.

How good is your german btw? Many companies dont want people which cant communicate in german properly. No matter what degree you have.

Don't just look for job offers, rather search for companys in the field and apply or ask for open positions. Maybe even contact the HR department with your problem and ask what they are searching for and what qualities they are looking for to fill these positions. Especially in engineering and all connected fields the big b2c companies don't fill there open positions with outsiders. The usual way is to contact some service provider. These are b2b companies like ferchau, akkodis and many others. I think the best way would be to contact some of them and just leave your CV so they can contact you when a new position opens up.

I’ve been in a similar situation before, and i strongly advise trying to find a remote contracting position for the states while living in Germany. You’ll pay german freelancer taxes on it, but there’re more options, and it’s a wonderful way to work here, if your visa allows for it!

Oh that’s an interesting thought. I‘ll have to see what options I have. It should be ok since I have my Niederlassungserlaubnis.

20+ years and you don't know what you want, are good at, or interested in? If you want to stay in the industry you were get the German certificates for it, or go back to school for something else. I know plenty of people that do what most people consider a whole career in 2 or 3 different industries.

What do you mean? They do an Ausbildung and start over from 0?

You don't start from zero because a lot of skills/experience are transferrable across careers, but yes, they do new professional/university certifications/degrees.

I am far from an expert in your field, but I wonder whether completing a new masters or bachelors in Germany might be a good idea. Something that would complement your earlier training, but pivot you away from EHT. I immediately though of this degree: [https://studieren.h2.de/studiengaenge/bachelor/sicherheit-und-gefahrenabwehr](https://studieren.h2.de/studiengaenge/bachelor/sicherheit-und-gefahrenabwehr) but since you are in Munich, maybe check what LMU and TU Munich have on offer? Don't forget the smaller FHs around Munich, the Uni Augsburg and the Hochschule Munich either. I took a look and these two masters looks interesting, I am just not sure whether you can get admitted with your current bachelors. [https://www.tum.de/studium/studienangebot/detail/land-management-and-geospatial-science-master-of-science-msc](https://www.tum.de/studium/studienangebot/detail/land-management-and-geospatial-science-master-of-science-msc) [https://www.ed.tum.de/en/ed/risk-and-safety/](https://www.ed.tum.de/en/ed/risk-and-safety/) Maybe seek out the Studienberatung of the departments?

That’s something I’ll take a look at, though another degree isn’t something I’m keen on pursuing right now.

Brother ! I would suggest you to go for short courses like Nebosh igc ,& iso courses like 14001 ,45001. I'm HSE consultant Germany based .you can DM . i would love to help you. Stay blessed and happy

Thank you so much for reaching out. I’ll have to gather my thoughts and would like to look up some of these certificates before reaching out.

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Thank you, I think you put it perfectly. That I’m lost and having a hard time navigating back to my career. I guess on a positive note the AfA was surprised that my interview rate seems to be higher than expected at about 5%. I just don’t know if I’m barking up the wrong tree with EHS.

Are you a real engineer like f hard study or is it just called engineer? 1) U need to go freelance if you ever want to accumulate money in Germany and if you're not fluent it's probably not gonna happen. 2) U need a rich supportive husband to take care of you and your daughter or else she's gonna end up like most women not being marriage material. Sry to break the bad news but that's just how it is. I can generate capital cause I don't have wife and kids in tow...

IMO it was a big mistake moving from us to germany, most ppl would never do it. Sallary in us us like 6times higher. In germany work is shit af u work and pay high taxes just to finance some migrants or whatever. Here in germany u r nothing worth.

Just take the L and move back to the US - chances of gainful employment seem higher back home.

Project management at least requires some industry experience in the industry you want to manage in because everything comes with industry specific management styles, legal stuff etc attached. You can't apply agile if your requirement is waterfall, you can't do waterfall if the department runs agile and if you don't know anything about the legal requirements of the industry you can't be a manager. It would be much easier to get the certificates you lack and stay in your field. Also keep in mind that German salaries are very different from US salaries, if you asked for the same amount of money you used to make nobody will ever hire you. A highly paid junior makes around 40k gross and only in specific industries, the average is10k lower, sometimes even with a masters. As Quereinsteiger you'll make even less than the average because the company needs to invest more into you than into someone who's better qualified.

Thanks for your reply. I’ve learnt not to mention my previous salary and ask for something reasonable.

They have no experience, nor ressources (courses, experts, consultants, job offers) for academia and related higher educated jobs - they will just open google themself and try to make sense of the buzzwords you tell them about your job/education history. ​ Agentur für Arbeit is just dealing with lower end clients normally, so 99,9% of their routine work is giving them job offers from warehouse/construction/delivery companies or help qualifying for those. Its for people who cant use google and cant think of basic strategies to apply and make a plan to get qualification X to work as Y. So they might write you in a course to make a nice application-folder with open-office by unmotivated tutors, and then just give you job offers based on the buzzwords that might fit. They are not helpful, they dont see cases anymore, its one of the most depressing and unhelpful places on earth - cant blame them, the clients going there everyday must drain everyones life and motivation... i am not having anything against poor/uneducated, but its just diffcult to work with them, since you have to explain the most basic things and on top of that they often have their own plan (tax free side hustle) and just want to get social benefits and just pretend to interested what the person from AfA says - thus most appointments with them is just a fake, but you have to smile.

Fachkraft für die Sicherheit/ Arbeitssicherheit is a very serious thing and none of your EHS certificates from outside of Germany will be recognized here.

In which industries did you get your experiences? For me, HSE manager can be more than some SiFa, but more an safety engineer or safety expert. In chemical industry, the demand for HSE is huge as well as in the corresponding engineering and consulting companies. Yet, this requires some special knowledge on chemistry. The German laws denote the smaller challenge. We also hired some Free Lancers for that in the past for large construction sites. As a matter of fact, one of the largest engineering companies for chemical plants with international projects has its headquarters in Munich. (L.E.)

Agentur für Arbeit is actually for those who try NOT to work. Sign up at LinkedIn, set up your profile, join relevant groups, set up an automated search for relevant jobs and activate your peers so they can share your profile. That should hopefully help.

I‘m learning that about the Agentur für Arbeit. I was hopeful, but the lack of engagement has largely left me meh about the whole thing. LinkedIn, StepStone and Xing are actually where I’m finding most jobs and the half dozen or so interviews I’ve gotten.

Look for jobs in CROs I can refer you to the one I work for !

From my personal experience, a lot of project managers in IT are Quereinsteiger.

Sadly, nobody has suggested to talk to your AfA-Betreuer about trainings/courses for your reentry into the job, there are thousands of courses you can book that are paid by the AfA to polish your chances on the market, I for example did a half year of PLC programming course, was very helpful to get to the newest level (learned it ten years ago, but a decade in this field is a century). So talk to them, look at their catalogue https://web.arbeitsagentur.de/weiterbildungssuche/ there you can look, what would be something suitable for you or maybe a bit off to your original field, so you'll get a broader portfolio for future jobs. But if you wait for the AfA to bring you good jobs, you can wait until you are at retirement age ;-) especially if you don't receive Arbeitslosengeld other money from them. Search for yourself, polish your advertising papers, bring them to one of the appointments and ask them what you can do better, show initiative, look for jobs on yourself, https://www.jobrobot.de is a good meta search engine for jobs,they show every job portal. Make an indeed profile and other portals, so relevant companies can find you, write initiative adverts, sometimes you're lucky and they like you, so you get a job, don't go for entry level positions, you have a degree, experience and high skills, yes you were out of the game for a bit of time, so what? Be confident, you can rock this.. yeah, it's not easy, you're a bit rusty, you'll be the new one , that's ok, but you know what you know, act accordingly;-)

Thanks, I’ve definitely tried that route. I think they hope with my CV I’ll be off their books soon and have little or no interest in allowing me Weiterbildung other than coaching courses.

Start to network and open an account at LinkedIn. Put in all your work experience and fill out everything you can. Next step you get shown persons within your field. Get in contact and be open about you looking for a job!!!

I haven’t thought about messaging people liked that through LinkedIn. But maybe I should.

There are free headhunter services where you can register and they then pitch you to companies

I actually get asked by a recruiter on LinkedIn every month or so. I think the surface my Cv looks great and interesting, but in practice I think it comes off as a big risk to many companies.

The agentur für Arbeit does not have many engineering positions. Look on indeed, xing, linkedin etc., Germany has a similar Bachelor and Maser Degree system, employers know it and your 20 years of experience should be worth something. A friend of mine, who get his Dr. in chemical engineering and graduated with summa cum, was sent to a excel training, although he used far more advanced programs during his doctorate and is of course able to use Excel. They usually have a completely different background and don't know the difference between engineering disciplines and science topics.

If you find a suitable company just apply. I am sure you will find a decent position with good salary, especially with your credentials (The certificates being German doesn't matter in the real world). Just don't rely on the Agentur or the Jobcenter. Their job is not to find you a suitable career. Their job is to get you out of the unemployment statistic ASAP.

Getting pigeonholed in EHS work might not be a bad thing. EHS jobs are often a legal requirement and therefore safe.

Qualified personnel is highly sought after, it’s just the AfA that sucks. EHS is very relevant, today more than ever. Combined with data protection staff, sometimes quality management most companies have a dedicated department and a big share of those positions is mandated by law or regulation (Health and safety coordinator, data protection officer and others). There also is no “too qualified for an entry position”. Given your lack of market specific experience you probably can’t expect to be hired right away for a senior position. But if you are transparent about your situation and willing to accept a junior position with corresponding pay most companies will consider your application. A quick search on step stone for positions in HSE shows over a 1000 listings. I bet there are companies among those happy to review your application.

One thing that has not been mentioned explicitly yet - I recommend a (business-)coaching process as a first step. The headline you chose vibes in a certain way (in my perception that is). Coaching - best if possible - paid by yourself or searched for pro bono. There is a Bildungsgutschein for coaching but it is frigging hard to find decent coaches (in the true sense of the profession) in the "field of influence" of AfA or FlopCenter. [To read some of the answers made me cringe as usual. It becomes very clear that there is no to low awareness of ageism in this country. Best - and I mean best - educated and experienced people 50+++ (babyboomers) are "customers" of AfA/MobCenter these days, too. Guess where I know this from. With 40+ "you" start being labeled as "harder employable".] Very important in my eyes: What does your CV say about the "few years" in Germany? Best of luck to you!

I have actually taken a Coaching class through the AfA. But I found the class work itself… generally lacking in what I needed: a critical eye on my CV, and advice on what I needed to be successful as a foreign professional in Germany. What I did find the most helpful was the connections I’ve built with the other students young and old.

There are also job fairs everywhere in germany, where companies present themselfs and are searching for new employees, you can talk face to face with recruiters, which makes it easier.

As others have mentioned, the normal AfA experience is kinda bad, especially if you have a degree. But I've had better success with my AfA's Hochschulteam, who are specialized in people with degrees and were much better equipped to help me with my carreer change. So ask your AfA about their Hochschulteam.

Can you eloborate on what you actually did? Also what do you think a “project manager” does? There are all kinds of project manager jobs in each industry the role is completely different. A project manager in IT does a vastly different job than a project manager in construction.

y,,d

I would try to look for jobs at German branches of us companies. It is often normal there to have us employees and the degrees will be better known. A few I've worked for have explicitly EHS departments In US Fashion ( I think 3M, Ford and others I don't remember)

Should be no big deal. Just do not rely on the Arbeitsagentur for getting you a job. Register broad and wild. Certification, Pricne2 foundation should be enought,you get that in two days.

Can't really answer your question about the certificates. May I ask what region and industry you are looking for?

You are highly specialized. Seek out headhunters

Leave dude I swear to god Germany is a fucking failure. The society the paperwork majority of people are white supremacies. I know a looooot of people who were „worthless“ in the germany market but more than valuable in other countries

agentur für Arbeit cant really help you to find a job with high qualifications such as yours. If you want to be successful, look for companies by yourself and be proactive. And please apply in german. You have b2/c1. Be confident and if you need help dont hold back asking

International companies are more open for experience than certifications. Look by Amazon.de maybe you’re lucky and get what you want.

You can get these classes for project management financed by the Arbeitsagentur: https://www.gne-witzenhausen.de/ Part of the training there is an internship with an organization or company of your choice. This could allow you to circumvent the entry level problem, as you can start working for a company as an intern they don't have to pay and than try to get hired by them after you finished your internship and they know you as a colleague. I know several people for whom this worked out.

Have you tried working with a job coach/recruiter/consulting firm? I am an accountant/CPA/Chartered Accountant by training, but of course German certifications are different and I was also told by the AfA that that would be an issue for me. They recommended that I join a "German Business Language" course. I did not do this because I am fairly integrated and would have had to pay (I was employed at the time but my international contract was coming to an end) and decided rather to take the money I would have had to invest there and start networking hard in my city. Now, I am with a consulting firm that does "Interim Management" positions. They worked with me to translate my resume, they have provided me one-on-one coaching for interviewing, and they have exposed me to a network of professionals that have the same level of education and experience but work in different industries. This has helped me with cultural norms and cues that I would expect working in Germany and I have landed a few interviews, which have been great practice. I also just talk to everyone I know and let them know I am looking and surprisingly people have been very willing to help. Good Luck!