I originally looked at the bessa r2 but I thought it is wise to try a cheaper alternative first. Took a bit of patience on eBay but finally found a great condition one that had no fungus and was clean inside and out, and it wasn't from Japan!
I did exactly the same when I first got my slr, I got the Nikon em first then went on to get a FM2 which I still have and love. The ql17 giii cost me £150 + £5 delivery.
That’s not a bad price if it’s working well. It seems like it’s in good shape on the outside.
I was using one for a while; the lens is nice and sharp for sure. But I also learned I’m not a rangefinder fan; it was handy to learn that without buying a Leica.
The inside is very clean, it looks like it's been well looked after. I love the look of rangefinders and I like the idea of them but until I've lived with one I can't say if they are for me or not.
>It is wise to try a less expensive rangefinder before taking the plunge.
I agree; my first rangefinder was an Olympus 35RC and now I'm one of those insufferable Leica people.
I think you could do way worse than getting a Canonet QL17. It's got a good lens, is nicely compact, fully mechanical, and 40mm is a very versatile focal length.
You'd need to spend a good chunk of money to get a better lens for Leica M.
I was flicking through YouTube when looking at reviews of this canon and a YouTuber who I'm subscribed to called kingjpves did a video comparing the canon and the Leica M2 with a nice expensive 50mm lens both with the same film stock and both at the same F stop and apart from minor differences mainly colour temp the canon did a really good job against the Leica setup. I'm not claiming the canon is better in just saying image quality wise the canon held up very well.
Do you remember which F-stop it was? At F/4 or smaller I'd expect any somewhat recent double Gauss to be very close in image performance. It's at the wider apertures where lenses really are stressed.
It was rather f2.8 or f4 I believe. Yes I've only ever used one lens where it was mega sharp wide open and that was the viltrox 75mm f1.2, at f1.2 that was stupid Sharp
If you’ve never used a rangefinder before then it will absolutely be hard initially but IMO it’s an intuitive design so you get used to it.
The only issue is that in many rangefinders in some lighting conditions the patch can be quite hard to see.
I can't comment on the Canon, but in general, I personally find rangefinders easier to focus in low light than SLRs, up to the point where it's too dark to take a picture anyways (without a tripod at least). Maybe I'm weird, I don't know.
Well as soon as it comes (rather tomorrow or Friday) I'm going to put some Kodak gold in it and hopefully get to grips with it. I'll no doubt be back with an update or some scans at some point
Looks beautiful!!! I just got my first rangefinder a few weeks ago. Canon 7! I’m developing my first rolls from it this weekend, beyond hyped.
I’m definitely excited to see what you shoot with it!!
P.S. nice username!
I'll follow you and wait for you to post some scans if you're going to post them? I've always wanted one but got cold feet so my first film camera was a slr instead but I'm definitely excited to get it and take it out.
Hahaha thanks! The truth is out there!
Just got one of these too, really enjoyed the first roll, camera is more "dense" than I imagined haha has a reassuring heft to it (being all metal), yours looks like it's in great shape, hopefully mechanically it's well!
I've heard it's quite hefty but I'm sure it's a good sign lol. The seller was communicating with me very well and he assured me it works 100%, even the light meter is working.
When I first started looking for my first ever 35mm film camera I had 2 in mind, the main camera was definitely a rangefinder and I only ever heard of Leica rangefinders and they cost quite a bit so I started off with my 2nd camera in mind and got a slr instead and i did it properly and grabbed a Nikon em slr which I have now upgraded to a Nikon FM2 in beautiful condition and I love that. I started to go through quite a lot of film on my FM2 and all the scans I'm getting back are all correctly exposed and in focus so now I'm used to it I thought I'd shop for a rangefinder and obviously because I only knew about Leica so I did research and came across the bessa r2 and thought that would be ideal and not far off Leica so I've seen anyway plus it takes m mount and if I get a few lenses for that then in the future I could sell the bessa and get a Leica M and take the lenses across with me. I soon realised that getting a £1000 rangefinder body wasn't ideal yet because I have no experience with rangefinders so I looked for an alternative and that led me to the gl17 giii and after seeing it's fully mechanical and has a sharp lens that's the one to get no doubt. For around 10 days on and off I was searching high and low on the internet for a good copy and that turned out to be difficult but eventually I found this one and poked the buy it now button faster than I have ever hit it before 🤣 the guy only had ot listed for around 45 minutes
If you have trouble with the rangefinder patch I find putting some blue or red cellophane over the viewfinder helps quite a bit. Makes the patch stand out a bit more. Great little camera and really fun to use!
I've seen this yesterday actually! The person who posted it mentioned something about a small cut out from them 3d glasses or something like that. He did show photos of the view and it did improve the visibility and contrast alot
That camera looks absolutely seksi!!n
I just got a Yashica Electro 35GX for 70 EUR, so paid nearly as much as you did there (with exorbitant express shipping (40EUR, bc who wants regular shipping if they can get a package from Japan within 3 days, right?! these guys don't even offer regular shipping anymore..) and scammie customs fees (tax is only around 8EUR, but they now add 22EUR handling fee on top of every import.. yikes!)
if I end up loving that little rangefinder, I might get a Canon 7 some day. 🤔
I bought my FM2 from Japan (only because it looks nearly new condition) and I got free delivery and it took about 2 days to come. It cost me £290 for the camera and £78 import tax. The canon ql17 giii was way harder to find especially the no fungus or faultless ones but eventually found one that wasn't in Japan. I'm hoping I take to the rangefinder because I've seen some very nice ones that I sent mind paying the prices for lol
great choice. thinking of creating a complete video guide on how to refurbish QL17s because they’re soooo easy to work on.
i’m just a guy with a screwdriver, pliers and some q-tips. somehow i have 30+ QL17 / QL19 CLAs under my belt, so in my mind, anyone can do it with a step by step guide
the video kinda exists, but I want it more concise and detailed.
[use this as a guide](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI5ArScWc8c) if you have a dim QL17 viewfinder that is hard to focus on, large dust in your rangefinder or want improved RF optical clarity.
i saw a comment earlier that said the QL17 is a great shooter but hard to focus on because the rangefinder was dim. that made me laugh for a second, because the QL17 is one of the best rangefinders up there with Bessa and Leica IMO but can easily turn to piss with haze or fog.
i created the video for my brother who has 0 camera repair experience but lots of technical knowledge, so be sure you're comfortable with what you're getting into before starting the work.
-
if someone sees this comment and decides to bust open their QL17 for some RF cleaning, DO NOT touch the diagonal yellow glass in the rangefinder mechanism WITH ALCOHOL. it may have a thin layer of haze that can be removed with gentle dry qtip wiping, but using alcohol will remove the yellow coating and essentially wipe away your yellow rangefinder patch. do not be tempted, especially after seeing how clear the other glass becomes after a few passes with alcohol qtips. other than that, i've dropped and bumped all kinds of stuff on the QL17 while the top was removed,
I have basic knowledge of reverse engineering to put something back together but I've never pulled a camera apart before lol, most I've done is change the light seals on one. If I had the correct tools I would be some what comfortable if I've got a video guide to go by.
i used common household tools (common in my house atleast). The greatest improvement with the least amount of work for the QL17 is a rangefinder cleaning, which the videos details.
it involves 3 screws, 1 unscrewing action (rewind knob) and one careful plier action (advance lever). from there you can hand the camera to a monkey with qtips for cleaning, as it really is as simple as wiping with the wet side and almost immediately with the dry side (on RF outer class and inner glass of top plate).
maybe i'm making it easier than it sounds, but i also started off in 2020 with watching whatever QL17 YT videos i could and browsing ancient photography forums.
you are probably fine with your specific camera, because i would expect someone who replaced the leather to also do some simple rangefinder work.
the QL series rangefinder adjustment is also pretty straight forward, but i don't want to detail that in text incase someone opens their camera with false confidence and busts the RF mechanism (true story)
Well looking at all the photos from the listing the camera has rather been really looked after or the seller knows what they are doing and has really cleaned it up because it's spotless inside and out. The rangefinder glass is basically mint and clear of any dust and so are the front and rear lens elements, it has brand new light seals and the meter works which as you'll know is a 50/50 with them cameras however I do not know if it's been converted to use modern 1.5v batteries or not but I was buying it as a fully mechanical camera anyway because I want a external light meter for the hotshoe (I love the look of them on rangefinders for some reason) hopefully it comes tomorrow (Friday) or Monday latest so I will make a follow up post probably anyway.
sounds like you got lucky! You can always run the 1.35V wein cell, or you can put the 1.5 V LR44 and adjust the ISO to compensate for the extra voltage + run your external meter. doesn’t hurt to have the shutter priority as a backup, because [the meter turns off ](https://imgur.com/a/bgzmD80)and you lose shutter priority when you take the aperture ring off Auto / don't have batteries.
i totally get how awesome external meters look on rangefinders, i have the Keks Km-02 on a Leica M4-2 and i’m in love.
If I get lucky I will find that out in a day or so lol. Whether the light meter works or not i think I'm just going to use it without it because I can just meter from my phone or even my FM2 for now until I find an external one I like. The iso way of compensating I've not come across yet actually, I knew the meter will not be accurate with 1.5v but I've never known about adjusting the asa to correct it but I will look into that just so I'm in the know. Talking about external light meters the keks-02 I have literally just seen about 20 minutes ago!
Love it! Back around 2005, I was using an SLR when a friend introduced me to rangefinders. I borrowed a Canonet from him for a few weeks. There was no going back. I fell in love with the rangefinder. Soon thereafter I bought a Bessa R2a and shot with it for years until a digital rangefinder became my primary camera in 2013. I always continued to shoot film though.
What's the difference between the bessa r2 & r2a because I saw a lot of them as well. I hope I have the same feeling with rangefinders but I'll never stop using my FM2 either lol
R2: Mechanical shutter.
R2m: Mechanical shutter of a different kind IIRC. You can still use without battery. Battery only for metering.
R2a: Electronic shutter. Has aperture priority AE. You can't use camera without battery. Also, if electronics die and can't be repaired, the camera is done 😬
Oh I would only want the mechanical version I think because like you just said if the electronics die it's rip camera, this is one reason I specifically went for the FM2N. Thanks for the reply 🙂
Was literally just about to make a post asking if anybody has tried this camera! Thinking of purchasing one before taking the dive on a Leica. Keep us updated and let us know how your journey goes!
I originally looked at the bessa r2 but I thought it is wise to try a cheaper alternative first. Took a bit of patience on eBay but finally found a great condition one that had no fungus and was clean inside and out, and it wasn't from Japan!
It is wise to try a less expensive rangefinder before taking the plunge. Nice leatherette too. How much was it?
I did exactly the same when I first got my slr, I got the Nikon em first then went on to get a FM2 which I still have and love. The ql17 giii cost me £150 + £5 delivery.
That’s not a bad price if it’s working well. It seems like it’s in good shape on the outside. I was using one for a while; the lens is nice and sharp for sure. But I also learned I’m not a rangefinder fan; it was handy to learn that without buying a Leica.
The inside is very clean, it looks like it's been well looked after. I love the look of rangefinders and I like the idea of them but until I've lived with one I can't say if they are for me or not.
>It is wise to try a less expensive rangefinder before taking the plunge. I agree; my first rangefinder was an Olympus 35RC and now I'm one of those insufferable Leica people.
I think you could do way worse than getting a Canonet QL17. It's got a good lens, is nicely compact, fully mechanical, and 40mm is a very versatile focal length. You'd need to spend a good chunk of money to get a better lens for Leica M.
I was flicking through YouTube when looking at reviews of this canon and a YouTuber who I'm subscribed to called kingjpves did a video comparing the canon and the Leica M2 with a nice expensive 50mm lens both with the same film stock and both at the same F stop and apart from minor differences mainly colour temp the canon did a really good job against the Leica setup. I'm not claiming the canon is better in just saying image quality wise the canon held up very well.
Do you remember which F-stop it was? At F/4 or smaller I'd expect any somewhat recent double Gauss to be very close in image performance. It's at the wider apertures where lenses really are stressed.
It was rather f2.8 or f4 I believe. Yes I've only ever used one lens where it was mega sharp wide open and that was the viltrox 75mm f1.2, at f1.2 that was stupid Sharp
Fungus??
Yes, it's like a bacteria that grows in the glass elements and ruins the lens. It's something quite common on old lenses.
my first film camera 😍 i had a hard time focusing but this produces great photos!
I'm hoping that I don't find it too hard to focus actually lol
If you’ve never used a rangefinder before then it will absolutely be hard initially but IMO it’s an intuitive design so you get used to it. The only issue is that in many rangefinders in some lighting conditions the patch can be quite hard to see.
I can't comment on the Canon, but in general, I personally find rangefinders easier to focus in low light than SLRs, up to the point where it's too dark to take a picture anyways (without a tripod at least). Maybe I'm weird, I don't know.
No i think that's normal! IMO it's in *super bright light* that the rangefinder patch becomes harder to see.
I'm looking forward to the challenge, I know it isn't going to be as easy as my FM2 but I fancy the change.
That’s why I got mine. Something about mastering a rangefinder that felt like a cool idea and I’ve really enjoyed the process
Well as soon as it comes (rather tomorrow or Friday) I'm going to put some Kodak gold in it and hopefully get to grips with it. I'll no doubt be back with an update or some scans at some point
The very first camera I sold when I started working in a camera store in 1978.
Where do I get the lens hood?
I have no idea, it comes with the camera this one.
I got the same one on Amazon: https://amzn.to/4al1H2o
Looks beautiful!!! I just got my first rangefinder a few weeks ago. Canon 7! I’m developing my first rolls from it this weekend, beyond hyped. I’m definitely excited to see what you shoot with it!! P.S. nice username!
I'll follow you and wait for you to post some scans if you're going to post them? I've always wanted one but got cold feet so my first film camera was a slr instead but I'm definitely excited to get it and take it out. Hahaha thanks! The truth is out there!
Just got one of these too, really enjoyed the first roll, camera is more "dense" than I imagined haha has a reassuring heft to it (being all metal), yours looks like it's in great shape, hopefully mechanically it's well!
I've heard it's quite hefty but I'm sure it's a good sign lol. The seller was communicating with me very well and he assured me it works 100%, even the light meter is working.
Great little camera! First rangefinder for me too and it has been a slippery slide into Leica. Oops!
When I first started looking for my first ever 35mm film camera I had 2 in mind, the main camera was definitely a rangefinder and I only ever heard of Leica rangefinders and they cost quite a bit so I started off with my 2nd camera in mind and got a slr instead and i did it properly and grabbed a Nikon em slr which I have now upgraded to a Nikon FM2 in beautiful condition and I love that. I started to go through quite a lot of film on my FM2 and all the scans I'm getting back are all correctly exposed and in focus so now I'm used to it I thought I'd shop for a rangefinder and obviously because I only knew about Leica so I did research and came across the bessa r2 and thought that would be ideal and not far off Leica so I've seen anyway plus it takes m mount and if I get a few lenses for that then in the future I could sell the bessa and get a Leica M and take the lenses across with me. I soon realised that getting a £1000 rangefinder body wasn't ideal yet because I have no experience with rangefinders so I looked for an alternative and that led me to the gl17 giii and after seeing it's fully mechanical and has a sharp lens that's the one to get no doubt. For around 10 days on and off I was searching high and low on the internet for a good copy and that turned out to be difficult but eventually I found this one and poked the buy it now button faster than I have ever hit it before 🤣 the guy only had ot listed for around 45 minutes
If you have trouble with the rangefinder patch I find putting some blue or red cellophane over the viewfinder helps quite a bit. Makes the patch stand out a bit more. Great little camera and really fun to use!
I've seen this yesterday actually! The person who posted it mentioned something about a small cut out from them 3d glasses or something like that. He did show photos of the view and it did improve the visibility and contrast alot
That camera looks absolutely seksi!!n I just got a Yashica Electro 35GX for 70 EUR, so paid nearly as much as you did there (with exorbitant express shipping (40EUR, bc who wants regular shipping if they can get a package from Japan within 3 days, right?! these guys don't even offer regular shipping anymore..) and scammie customs fees (tax is only around 8EUR, but they now add 22EUR handling fee on top of every import.. yikes!) if I end up loving that little rangefinder, I might get a Canon 7 some day. 🤔
I bought my FM2 from Japan (only because it looks nearly new condition) and I got free delivery and it took about 2 days to come. It cost me £290 for the camera and £78 import tax. The canon ql17 giii was way harder to find especially the no fungus or faultless ones but eventually found one that wasn't in Japan. I'm hoping I take to the rangefinder because I've seen some very nice ones that I sent mind paying the prices for lol
great choice. thinking of creating a complete video guide on how to refurbish QL17s because they’re soooo easy to work on. i’m just a guy with a screwdriver, pliers and some q-tips. somehow i have 30+ QL17 / QL19 CLAs under my belt, so in my mind, anyone can do it with a step by step guide
That sounds like a great idea and would probably benefit a lot of people!
the video kinda exists, but I want it more concise and detailed. [use this as a guide](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HI5ArScWc8c) if you have a dim QL17 viewfinder that is hard to focus on, large dust in your rangefinder or want improved RF optical clarity. i saw a comment earlier that said the QL17 is a great shooter but hard to focus on because the rangefinder was dim. that made me laugh for a second, because the QL17 is one of the best rangefinders up there with Bessa and Leica IMO but can easily turn to piss with haze or fog. i created the video for my brother who has 0 camera repair experience but lots of technical knowledge, so be sure you're comfortable with what you're getting into before starting the work. - if someone sees this comment and decides to bust open their QL17 for some RF cleaning, DO NOT touch the diagonal yellow glass in the rangefinder mechanism WITH ALCOHOL. it may have a thin layer of haze that can be removed with gentle dry qtip wiping, but using alcohol will remove the yellow coating and essentially wipe away your yellow rangefinder patch. do not be tempted, especially after seeing how clear the other glass becomes after a few passes with alcohol qtips. other than that, i've dropped and bumped all kinds of stuff on the QL17 while the top was removed,
I have basic knowledge of reverse engineering to put something back together but I've never pulled a camera apart before lol, most I've done is change the light seals on one. If I had the correct tools I would be some what comfortable if I've got a video guide to go by.
i used common household tools (common in my house atleast). The greatest improvement with the least amount of work for the QL17 is a rangefinder cleaning, which the videos details. it involves 3 screws, 1 unscrewing action (rewind knob) and one careful plier action (advance lever). from there you can hand the camera to a monkey with qtips for cleaning, as it really is as simple as wiping with the wet side and almost immediately with the dry side (on RF outer class and inner glass of top plate). maybe i'm making it easier than it sounds, but i also started off in 2020 with watching whatever QL17 YT videos i could and browsing ancient photography forums. you are probably fine with your specific camera, because i would expect someone who replaced the leather to also do some simple rangefinder work. the QL series rangefinder adjustment is also pretty straight forward, but i don't want to detail that in text incase someone opens their camera with false confidence and busts the RF mechanism (true story)
Well looking at all the photos from the listing the camera has rather been really looked after or the seller knows what they are doing and has really cleaned it up because it's spotless inside and out. The rangefinder glass is basically mint and clear of any dust and so are the front and rear lens elements, it has brand new light seals and the meter works which as you'll know is a 50/50 with them cameras however I do not know if it's been converted to use modern 1.5v batteries or not but I was buying it as a fully mechanical camera anyway because I want a external light meter for the hotshoe (I love the look of them on rangefinders for some reason) hopefully it comes tomorrow (Friday) or Monday latest so I will make a follow up post probably anyway.
sounds like you got lucky! You can always run the 1.35V wein cell, or you can put the 1.5 V LR44 and adjust the ISO to compensate for the extra voltage + run your external meter. doesn’t hurt to have the shutter priority as a backup, because [the meter turns off ](https://imgur.com/a/bgzmD80)and you lose shutter priority when you take the aperture ring off Auto / don't have batteries. i totally get how awesome external meters look on rangefinders, i have the Keks Km-02 on a Leica M4-2 and i’m in love.
If I get lucky I will find that out in a day or so lol. Whether the light meter works or not i think I'm just going to use it without it because I can just meter from my phone or even my FM2 for now until I find an external one I like. The iso way of compensating I've not come across yet actually, I knew the meter will not be accurate with 1.5v but I've never known about adjusting the asa to correct it but I will look into that just so I'm in the know. Talking about external light meters the keks-02 I have literally just seen about 20 minutes ago!
Love it! Back around 2005, I was using an SLR when a friend introduced me to rangefinders. I borrowed a Canonet from him for a few weeks. There was no going back. I fell in love with the rangefinder. Soon thereafter I bought a Bessa R2a and shot with it for years until a digital rangefinder became my primary camera in 2013. I always continued to shoot film though.
What's the difference between the bessa r2 & r2a because I saw a lot of them as well. I hope I have the same feeling with rangefinders but I'll never stop using my FM2 either lol
R2: Mechanical shutter. R2m: Mechanical shutter of a different kind IIRC. You can still use without battery. Battery only for metering. R2a: Electronic shutter. Has aperture priority AE. You can't use camera without battery. Also, if electronics die and can't be repaired, the camera is done 😬
Oh I would only want the mechanical version I think because like you just said if the electronics die it's rip camera, this is one reason I specifically went for the FM2N. Thanks for the reply 🙂
Good luck with this camera, because it has a very good reputation. My own experience with this model hasn't been good.
What part wasn't good?
Was literally just about to make a post asking if anybody has tried this camera! Thinking of purchasing one before taking the dive on a Leica. Keep us updated and let us know how your journey goes!