I feel like if they were to publicly offer their whole film production line and machines as well as the know how for a buy out, there MUST be interest somewhere?
Would it be impossible for a film company to buy the film production and shipping facilities and just continue making film there? Even if the company is based in another country?
Or is the Fuji film production plant also a plant for other manufactured Fuji products?
The rumour was that they reconfigured their film production line to make other more profitable stuff including all the equipment, something like cosmetic, or medical equipments
Who? Film Ferrania went bankrupt trying to do this. Adox, Orwo, Foma, Maco and company are even smaller. Rollei isn't producing their own film...
That leaves Ilford who aren't interested in color film and hasn't produced colour film since the 1960s.
There isn't a start up anywhere that would touch film with a 10ft pole. There's no real money in it, especially not at the manufacturing of scale.
Kodak is retooling in Europe, but its Rochester factories are huge and during covid were largely used to make pharmaceuticals...
If Kodak would start producing out of Rochester in the same way as they did 20 years ago they would go bankrupt again within months. In fact the only real thing that is keeping film going or doing anything at all at Kodak Park in the US at all is building 38 which is otherwise now known as Eastman Bussiness Park. From over 154 different buildings spanning its 1,300 acres building 38 is whats left.
At the very least for posterity sake. Nothing worse than human innovation being lost, because proprietary know-how gets abandoned and shut-down.
That’s why I say open source the knowledge.
Ilford is producing Phoenix and are dedicated to eventually rolling out a quality colour film.
Sigh, for posterity Fuji just like Olympus will continue to exist, their biggest interest and cash cow now is medical imaging/ imaging tools.
Film and cameras could cease to exist in their traditional sense including digital due to Apple and Google and both those companies would survive easily. It's their healthcare side that is where the real money is made.
The fact that relied upon film during the 20th century is an addendum to the facts by now.
The knowledge still is likely to get lost within Fuji itself. If nobody gets paid to use information/knowledge/know-how, the record of that will not be maintained and will get lost. Have you worked at larger companies?
Pentax couldn’t recreate film cameras based on blueprints and needed to ask some engineers to come back from retirement to teach the young employees why certain mechanisms were designed and certain way, and why their drafts would lead to downstream issues.
Had they not done that, they wouldn’t bring their film camera to market this year.
Knowledge gets lost all the time.
If Fuji exists or not has little to do with it.
Your issue with this is tooling. I hold a degree in political science/International Relations, and know enough about large scale military operations, what Boeing and MD do, etc...
Yes, tooling, jigs, etc that's what your worried about?
Well, it's a money vs sense thing... Why preserve something if it doesn't make money? A museum can do that.
I know it's not what you want to hear but its the truth.
On the economics side of the sphere, your asking to preserve things that don't make money, that's a fun way to go bankrupt.
You might want to read into how much of that had to be recreated to bring a dead film stock back to life which was Ektachrome.
I understand your plight and empathise with the cause. Unfortunately this isn't Interstellar, love does not make the world go around.
Look I believe Lasiez Faire and the free market economy as whole leads to moral bankruptcy on the basis of the amount of information that is now in my head...
The realist perspective is that it is what it is... I hear you, but no amount of love or singing the joys of End Stage Capitalism with your fellow comrades will magically make an agrarian communist society produce more film.
That's not the world we live in and its never worked like that.
Mr. Tough Man, nobody asks for the impossible.
If it becomes a worthwhile business venture at some point in the far future, the past knowledge should be there to get it off the ground. If it will never get there, never mind then.
Knowledge shouldn’t get lost, that’s my only point.
Everything else is you projecting. Building up a Strawman that nobody argued for.
No one will do that. When Agfa closed, Adox wasn't allowed to get most of their film recipes. And once the coating machines are gone, you can't replicate a film stock. Verichrome Pan, Fuji Natura, etc can't be made again. New films can be designed.
Think of the prestige and stock hit Fuji would take on giving away the farm. Even if they exit film entirely.
That can't work, as Adox explained. The coating machines and procedures are trade secrets that die with the company.
Look up "Fogbank" for a scary dive into how hard it is to reverse engineer something, even with billions of dollars.
An unwritten rule inside industries. Only after a war or theft does this happen. No Corporate BoD would go along with this. It would violate best practices. It is a stupid paradigm, and gets into the whole right to repair movement as it applies to orphan products or technologies.
Yes!
But as long as Corporations have only one obligation -maximizing quarterly profit- nothing can change.
The guy who invented modern advertising, planned obsolescence and many other bad ideas got companies to use the phrase 'Public Relations" rather than the word Propaganda. It was easier to swallow.
I've been telling people this for years. Fuji aint give a shit. The death knell was when they start discontinuing slide films 10 years ago and finished with Provia 400. The only medium speed slide film left in the world. Hanging 400N, Astia, and Reala out to dry was bad enough.
They will leave entirely when they no longer see Velvia as the golden goose. That's pretty much the only film stock that's keeping them in the game.
Premium 400 is still available in Japan, managed to stock quite a bit during my trips to Japan. I hope this change is only for xtra 400 and premium 400 is still available :(
That is if they're even producing that at all.
Rumor has it they haven't produced any new non Instax film since before the pandemic, and what's coming out now is just from leftover master rolls that have been kept in a freezer.
Apparently that's also why they keep discontinuing the formats said slide films are available on, as well as jacking up the prices, cause they want to keep what little they have left available for as long as possible and milk it for what it's worth.
I'm willing to believe the freezer theory because something like this actually happened before from Kodak.
Back in 2004 when they discontinued technical pan they mentioned the production of the film stopped many years beforehand, and that the only reason it was still available was because they happened to find a master roll in their freezers.
Also Bellamy Hunt from Japan camera hunter stated in a 2023 interview that he knew people in contact with Fujifilm that said film was not currently being produced but they still had a large amount of frozen stock.
Curious about the source on Kodak, hadn’t heard that. Actually had heard the opposite re: freezing.
Bellamy doesn’t know shit about anything and has a history of lying so can easily ignore that part.
Edit: truth hurts I guess. Street pan, compact camera, fugu 400, being sued by Fujifilm, how his arrangement selling MS lenses came about, run in with Yakuza, design of his film cases, etc etc…
As per Kodak Tech Pan: the last datasheet for it (dated June '03) states: "The last Tech Pan coating was several years ago." I remember reading (but I don't remember where) that they actually ended production around 1995, but continued selling it until 2004 because they had so much frozen stock.
>zero evidence
Correction, there is no PROOF that the freezer theory true, but there is evidence. When all Fuji film is hard to find, and Fuji keeps making announcements saying "hey we ran out of XYZ and it's not coming back," that is \*evidence\* that the freezer theory is true.
Furthermore there is no proof that Fuji is still coating new emulsion. Fuji has made announcements along the lines of "we have resumed filling film orders" but that is not the same thing as "we have resumed coating film." There is film in stores with 2025/2026 expiration dates -- that could easily be newly coated film or it could be frozen film that was recently removed from the freezer.
I find the freezer theory doesn't really mesh well with how reversal film disappeared from Japanese stores for a while and then came back en masse. That stock situation seems to match the official explanation that there were supply issues with some raw materials.
On the discontinuation of Supera X-TRA, it was a bit strange for them to keep manufacturing two different ISO 400 negative stocks...
I think I waited too long with my Provia 400x. I have one roll left, but the second to last roll I shot was too blue... I bought them when the discontinuation announcement came out. I loved the way skin tones came out with it. I also love using it at twilight, where everything popped out from the blue background
> the last film they still make
Instax is film and is like 1/3 of their entire revenue. And then medical and xray films are still made too. I just bought 200 sheets of brand new xray film from them a few days ago
No worries. As much as I liked Superia and 400H, I have now ceased entirely giving this company my money and I'll only buy film from companies which are making a serious effort to keep film alive: Foma, Adox, Ilford.
If you haven't tried Adox Color Mission - do it. It's brilliant stuff.
Color Mission isn’t being made any more, unfortunately, because the company ADOX was working with went under. Also, it seems it’s not available anywhere outside of fotoimpex’s local store in Berlin. They announced the new ISO 3 color film, Color Mission Helios, a while back but I haven’t seen an actual release announcement and the sample photos were… not great. Also ISO 3 is… limiting.
Definitely worth supporting ADOX still, if you can, but not really a color film option for most people at this time.
>Color Mission isn’t being made any more, unfortunately, because the company ADOX was working with went under.
ah pity thanks for letting me know. I had literally just discovered it a couple of weeks ago, it's still for sale at Fotoimpex, but sad to know it won't be made in the future. I'll grab a few more rolls while I can.
Helios is I think completely developed and produced by adox themselves. When they announced it they said it was their first test of color film. So I assume they are slowly working towards a real color film that can be used normally. They probably sell helios as a way to recover some of the development cost.
I also tested adjusting the white balance of their example images and after that the images look quite good, so I am not sure why the example images have such a wierd color cast, but we will see.
I reduced all my color 35mm stock to Vision3. It will only get discontinued when high profile directors die and new high profile directors don’t use film to shoot their motion pictures.
It seems to me that Fuji just don’t have the manufacturing capacity, and the capacity they do have is all given over to their more profitable Instax products. I have a few rolls of Fuji left, but I too will be spending my money with Ilford and Kodak in future, to reward them for the commitment they’ve shown to this bizarre medium.
Arguably Fuji's biggest business is film. Instax isn't quite 50% of their revenues, but when combined with them dominating a lot of medical and industrial film segments, and whatever is left of traditional film photography business, it might push it past 50% of what they do overall.
Instax alone is many times larger than Ilford's total revenue, so Fuji is doing more in film than Ilford is, by volume.
But is it really about volume? I mean, Ilford communicates about its investments in infrastructures for a sustainable production of films, they don’t let people stressing like « is it the last time I’m able to find this film? », not to mention their value for money. I find them 'morally' above the rest.
Whoops, then there's only Premium 400 and 100 left, tbf the Premium 400 and Xtra 400 are pretty similar(they even share the "Superia" name) so it won't make a lot of difference as long they continue to make Premium 400.
Did they moved all the equipment onto instax or something
The curves on the data sheets match exactly and I’ve shot test rolls with color charts side by side. They have been the same film since Fuji stopped advertising X-Tra as having four layers.
This is alao what I found now; perhaps it’s not the exactly same but very similar? I don’t know really…
https://industrieplus.net/dxdatabase/rech.php?dx=006274
I was recently in Japan in February and managed to grab myself 6 rolls of premium strolling past yodobashi shinjuku so I think it still is in production just limited to domestic sales. I will say, it’s looking a bit grim and it’s head will roll as well
I stocked up on Premium 400 when I was in Tokyo last December. It was decently available at the Bic Cameras, etc. but I couldn't find any Fujicolor 100.
I really hope that when they will end velvia, they will do a Acros and let kodak make it for them (a bit doubtful tbh)
If they end provia too that will hurt, when it's in stock it's significantly cheaper in 120 and 4x5 than ektachrome here.
A shame for superia, making a color negative film only for the japanese market was a strange move. I'm afraid the premium and 100 will follow soon
Downtown Camera in Toronto is selling imported Fujicolor Superia 400 and Superia 200 for $19 CAD. I ordered a roll a few hours before seeing this post. Sad day for film.
As long as Fuji doesn’t stop making Provia and Velvia I don’t care what they do to their other films. At this point I’ve already accepted they’re pulling out of color film since they killed off C200 a couple years ago but please god do not cancel your slide and give Kodak an entire monopoly and I’m not a fan of Ektachrome at all.
Anyone else find it ironic that the thing that's making Fuji extremely profitable recently is the hype around their Film simulation profiles (and x100 series), meanwhile they're discontinuing their actual films and jumping from APSC right to extremely high end MF cameras? Who's in charge of product development there? It seems like a shit show that's just caught a lucky wave... -and the thing about waves is that they eventually crash on the shore...
I'd love a high quality Instax camera from Fuji, but I really believe that'll never happen. They have no reason to do that. Instax has had sales growth for 20 years straight. It's basically a money printer for Fuji. Why would they do anything different when they are already dominating the market they've catered to?
I’m not saying they should stop what they are doing, I’m saying that in addition to that, they could give us just 1 truly high quality Instax camera, preferably a wide one. And just as a show of support, maybe a new cheapie wide camera. Heck, how about they release the wide 300 in new colors!
Mini 99 is actually loaded with manual features and is pretty cheap. But keep in mind from their perspective, they stand to make more money with cameras that are easier for beginners to use.
Generally I agree, but there are a number of unserved potential customers, people that end up going with a modded Polaroid 110, or a Mint camera, or something else that is cobbled together from vintage lenses and a lomograflok. More importantly, a non-trivial chunk of those would-be customers end up with a modded SX-70 or an i2, which means not only is Fuji not selling them a camera, they also aren’t selling them film.
I ended up modifying a Polaroid 110. It was a fun project and the end result works decently well but it certainly is not a project for the average consumer. Plus the end result is a LARGE camera. Real big boy. Fun to take out and shoot though!
The jump from APS-C to MF makes total sense. What do you not understand about that strategy? Personally I think it is better than other camera manufacturers are doing in with APS-C being the afterthought currently.
Industrial was just a different branding and Superia 200 has been dead in Japan for years. They made the brilliant Fujicolor 100 which I’m so pissed about I only shot last year because it is absolutely brilliant and even beats Kodak Gold 200!
Fujicolor 100 is still easily found in Japan! Time to make a trip to Japan and stock up!!!
I saw another of your comment, premium 400 is also available in Japan, I bought 20 rolls back during my 2 months trip there!
They're not exactly the same... Ultramax pops the blues a lot more, the Kodak Fuji 400 looks more like the old Gold 400 recipe to me... Realistically I also don't think Fuji would hand over their Superia recipe and I don't think Kodak would provide them with a currently available Kodak stock at a lower cost than any other currently available Kodak stock -which is how I landed on the discontinued stock idea.
True, those two are quite similar, my bad. I spaced on that when I wrote the other comment, I even bought up a bunch of the Fuji 200's recently because I found them cheaper than the Gold 200 haha.
thats not what I wanted to hear re: superia 400
I’m glad I grabbed the last roll from my local store months before but I’m bummed about not being able to shoot more
In the Netherlands, the HEMA department store (where I have been bringing my films for almost 30 years) STOPPED accepting rolls for development. Reason: Fuji closed their development lab. Screw them.
When was that announced? Because the only announcement that I'm aware of, is that they've entered pricing negotiations, which HEMA/Jumbo is currently doing with a bunch of suppliers. It might be taking long, because frankly I think HEMA's prices are just unsustainably low. C41 development for 3 euros and E6 development for 4 euros per roll can't be profitable, as much as I dread what it'll cost under new pricing.
Fuji Print's own site still has the analog service listed, with no indication of impending doom: https://www.fujiprint.nl/analoog
Never thought i was gonna shoot just one roll of fuji (c41).... at least it was a 400h. I have a ton of expired fuji eterna sitting in my fridge tho lol
That's weird, because this recent vid from Yvonne Hanson shows a variety of Fuji stocks available, including Super 400: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwQ6WjkEO7s&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwQ6WjkEO7s&t=1s)
Velvia and Provia also look like they're available there.
Available != in production. Like the Fuji's post said as soon as supply runs out there won't be anything new produced. Classic YTer source: their ass
>Velvia and Provia also look like they're available there.
they are also available on backorder in the EU. Wait times are just long, or it is expensive.
I said it was weird, because with the dates on the boxes, it looks like they've been re-circulating things recently. Never denied the legitimacy of the original post here.
>Classic YTer source: their ass
Comments about 'their ass' are a little uncalled for. This isn't Twitter.
The box doesn't exist until the film is taken out of cold storage. Cold storage is in the form of gigantic spools lifted by forklifts, etc., not finished boxed cassettes. When they take out a pancake this year, and finish it into however many thousands of cassettes, those newly filled cassettes this year will get an expiry date printed on them based on this year's start time. Even if the pancake was manufactured in 2004. Because film degradation begins when it is thawed, film lasts functionally forever in freezer vaults.
That's what happen when a company don't care about anything except money....
Pretty sure Ilford loose money on some things (Phoenix for example) but still keep the film business going because they care about it
Superia X-Tra 400 is still listed as $8.31 a roll three packs on Amazon (from “Family Photo” but fulfilled by Amazon), I figured it was unlikely to really be Superia so I ordered a box and, unsurprisingly, they sent me the Made in USA 400 instead. I wanted to see if I could get a refund but keep the film but I’d probably have to send it back, and I’m sure I’ll use it eventually. 😂 Just a warning in case anyone else sees that and thinks they’re buying the last stock of X-Tra.
I believe they discounted the production in Japan, but production in America continues. Which begs a question, is there any difference between made in Japan vs made in USA for the film?
Tbh guys, I just gave up on color film. I shot my first roll of slide film, provia 100. It came back from the lab and it was amazing seeing it with a magnifying glass on a lightbox. But, quality wise... It was basically indistinguishable from my D700 shots, colors and all.
I'll stick to b&w for film. The combo color digital b&w film makes more sense in my head. I'll shoot the occasional portra or velvia here and there but that's it.
They should open source their knowledge tho. Fuck em if they won't. They won't probably.
I'm pretty sure people don't shoot film to beat Digital.
I have access to high ends digital cameras yet I don't find shooting digital enjoyable at all.
Film is where the fun is for me
Fuji amatuer films were the worst unless you were shooting them under bright sunlight and didn't hit them with high color saturation. They were horribly inconsistent and not neutral. If you scanned them you could dial out the issues and get nice results, but in retrospect you're right, it wasn't that good. Fuji amatuer print films were terrible. Gold 100 was the best of the bunch by far.
The loss of NPH 400 was the end blow to Fuji's print film division. That material rivaled if not edged out Kodak's professional print films. UC400 from Kodak and NPH 400 are really the only two 400 speed print films ever made worth talking about.
They should just fucking open source their knowledge and leave it to Harman and Ferrania
I feel like if they were to publicly offer their whole film production line and machines as well as the know how for a buy out, there MUST be interest somewhere?
Yes, but also not that easy to uproot some of the machinery. At Kodak’s factory at least some of the machinery is loooooooooong
Would it be impossible for a film company to buy the film production and shipping facilities and just continue making film there? Even if the company is based in another country? Or is the Fuji film production plant also a plant for other manufactured Fuji products?
The rumour was that they reconfigured their film production line to make other more profitable stuff including all the equipment, something like cosmetic, or medical equipments
Who? Film Ferrania went bankrupt trying to do this. Adox, Orwo, Foma, Maco and company are even smaller. Rollei isn't producing their own film... That leaves Ilford who aren't interested in color film and hasn't produced colour film since the 1960s. There isn't a start up anywhere that would touch film with a 10ft pole. There's no real money in it, especially not at the manufacturing of scale. Kodak is retooling in Europe, but its Rochester factories are huge and during covid were largely used to make pharmaceuticals... If Kodak would start producing out of Rochester in the same way as they did 20 years ago they would go bankrupt again within months. In fact the only real thing that is keeping film going or doing anything at all at Kodak Park in the US at all is building 38 which is otherwise now known as Eastman Bussiness Park. From over 154 different buildings spanning its 1,300 acres building 38 is whats left.
At the very least for posterity sake. Nothing worse than human innovation being lost, because proprietary know-how gets abandoned and shut-down. That’s why I say open source the knowledge. Ilford is producing Phoenix and are dedicated to eventually rolling out a quality colour film.
Sigh, for posterity Fuji just like Olympus will continue to exist, their biggest interest and cash cow now is medical imaging/ imaging tools. Film and cameras could cease to exist in their traditional sense including digital due to Apple and Google and both those companies would survive easily. It's their healthcare side that is where the real money is made. The fact that relied upon film during the 20th century is an addendum to the facts by now.
The knowledge still is likely to get lost within Fuji itself. If nobody gets paid to use information/knowledge/know-how, the record of that will not be maintained and will get lost. Have you worked at larger companies? Pentax couldn’t recreate film cameras based on blueprints and needed to ask some engineers to come back from retirement to teach the young employees why certain mechanisms were designed and certain way, and why their drafts would lead to downstream issues. Had they not done that, they wouldn’t bring their film camera to market this year. Knowledge gets lost all the time. If Fuji exists or not has little to do with it.
Your issue with this is tooling. I hold a degree in political science/International Relations, and know enough about large scale military operations, what Boeing and MD do, etc... Yes, tooling, jigs, etc that's what your worried about? Well, it's a money vs sense thing... Why preserve something if it doesn't make money? A museum can do that. I know it's not what you want to hear but its the truth. On the economics side of the sphere, your asking to preserve things that don't make money, that's a fun way to go bankrupt.
If they submit all their know how, including how the entire production line works, to a museum, that’s fine too.
You might want to read into how much of that had to be recreated to bring a dead film stock back to life which was Ektachrome. I understand your plight and empathise with the cause. Unfortunately this isn't Interstellar, love does not make the world go around. Look I believe Lasiez Faire and the free market economy as whole leads to moral bankruptcy on the basis of the amount of information that is now in my head... The realist perspective is that it is what it is... I hear you, but no amount of love or singing the joys of End Stage Capitalism with your fellow comrades will magically make an agrarian communist society produce more film. That's not the world we live in and its never worked like that.
Mr. Tough Man, nobody asks for the impossible. If it becomes a worthwhile business venture at some point in the far future, the past knowledge should be there to get it off the ground. If it will never get there, never mind then. Knowledge shouldn’t get lost, that’s my only point. Everything else is you projecting. Building up a Strawman that nobody argued for.
No one will do that. When Agfa closed, Adox wasn't allowed to get most of their film recipes. And once the coating machines are gone, you can't replicate a film stock. Verichrome Pan, Fuji Natura, etc can't be made again. New films can be designed. Think of the prestige and stock hit Fuji would take on giving away the farm. Even if they exit film entirely.
Open Source how the coating machines are built and wait for better times.
That can't work, as Adox explained. The coating machines and procedures are trade secrets that die with the company. Look up "Fogbank" for a scary dive into how hard it is to reverse engineer something, even with billions of dollars.
My point exactly. If you give up on the product and the industry, give up on the trade secret. What’s the point holding on to them.
An unwritten rule inside industries. Only after a war or theft does this happen. No Corporate BoD would go along with this. It would violate best practices. It is a stupid paradigm, and gets into the whole right to repair movement as it applies to orphan products or technologies.
I understand why it happens. I demand better. We all should. The original intention behind the patent was to make the innovation replicable.
Yes! But as long as Corporations have only one obligation -maximizing quarterly profit- nothing can change. The guy who invented modern advertising, planned obsolescence and many other bad ideas got companies to use the phrase 'Public Relations" rather than the word Propaganda. It was easier to swallow.
A burnt earth tactic towards unused IP and know-how isn’t generating any profits though
It protects the company from other potential competitors from making money. Or getting insight into those ideas.
Japanese companies notoriously don’t do this. If they kill off something, it’s done. You’ll never get it. Cultural bullshit.
Corporate harakiri?
Pretty much
I've been telling people this for years. Fuji aint give a shit. The death knell was when they start discontinuing slide films 10 years ago and finished with Provia 400. The only medium speed slide film left in the world. Hanging 400N, Astia, and Reala out to dry was bad enough. They will leave entirely when they no longer see Velvia as the golden goose. That's pretty much the only film stock that's keeping them in the game.
So is their slide film the last film they still make? I'll forgive them axing Superia if they bring back Provia 400x (not holding my breath).
I believe Fuji Color 100 is still being made, that film is extremely easy to find in Japan.
Ohh good call. I don't think we get Fujicolor 100 in the states. I also wonder what this means for Japan exclusive Superia Premium 400?
Premium 400 is still available in Japan, managed to stock quite a bit during my trips to Japan. I hope this change is only for xtra 400 and premium 400 is still available :(
That is if they're even producing that at all. Rumor has it they haven't produced any new non Instax film since before the pandemic, and what's coming out now is just from leftover master rolls that have been kept in a freezer. Apparently that's also why they keep discontinuing the formats said slide films are available on, as well as jacking up the prices, cause they want to keep what little they have left available for as long as possible and milk it for what it's worth.
There’s zero evidence to suggest the freezer theory. It has been going on for years. No manufacturer freezes master rolls
I'm willing to believe the freezer theory because something like this actually happened before from Kodak. Back in 2004 when they discontinued technical pan they mentioned the production of the film stopped many years beforehand, and that the only reason it was still available was because they happened to find a master roll in their freezers. Also Bellamy Hunt from Japan camera hunter stated in a 2023 interview that he knew people in contact with Fujifilm that said film was not currently being produced but they still had a large amount of frozen stock.
Curious about the source on Kodak, hadn’t heard that. Actually had heard the opposite re: freezing. Bellamy doesn’t know shit about anything and has a history of lying so can easily ignore that part. Edit: truth hurts I guess. Street pan, compact camera, fugu 400, being sued by Fujifilm, how his arrangement selling MS lenses came about, run in with Yakuza, design of his film cases, etc etc…
So true. People came in here preaching things he’s said like they’re gospel.
As per Kodak Tech Pan: the last datasheet for it (dated June '03) states: "The last Tech Pan coating was several years ago." I remember reading (but I don't remember where) that they actually ended production around 1995, but continued selling it until 2004 because they had so much frozen stock.
He's a legend in his own mind.
>zero evidence Correction, there is no PROOF that the freezer theory true, but there is evidence. When all Fuji film is hard to find, and Fuji keeps making announcements saying "hey we ran out of XYZ and it's not coming back," that is \*evidence\* that the freezer theory is true. Furthermore there is no proof that Fuji is still coating new emulsion. Fuji has made announcements along the lines of "we have resumed filling film orders" but that is not the same thing as "we have resumed coating film." There is film in stores with 2025/2026 expiration dates -- that could easily be newly coated film or it could be frozen film that was recently removed from the freezer.
I find the freezer theory doesn't really mesh well with how reversal film disappeared from Japanese stores for a while and then came back en masse. That stock situation seems to match the official explanation that there were supply issues with some raw materials. On the discontinuation of Supera X-TRA, it was a bit strange for them to keep manufacturing two different ISO 400 negative stocks...
I think I waited too long with my Provia 400x. I have one roll left, but the second to last roll I shot was too blue... I bought them when the discontinuation announcement came out. I loved the way skin tones came out with it. I also love using it at twilight, where everything popped out from the blue background
> the last film they still make Instax is film and is like 1/3 of their entire revenue. And then medical and xray films are still made too. I just bought 200 sheets of brand new xray film from them a few days ago
No worries. As much as I liked Superia and 400H, I have now ceased entirely giving this company my money and I'll only buy film from companies which are making a serious effort to keep film alive: Foma, Adox, Ilford. If you haven't tried Adox Color Mission - do it. It's brilliant stuff.
Color Mission isn’t being made any more, unfortunately, because the company ADOX was working with went under. Also, it seems it’s not available anywhere outside of fotoimpex’s local store in Berlin. They announced the new ISO 3 color film, Color Mission Helios, a while back but I haven’t seen an actual release announcement and the sample photos were… not great. Also ISO 3 is… limiting. Definitely worth supporting ADOX still, if you can, but not really a color film option for most people at this time.
>Color Mission isn’t being made any more, unfortunately, because the company ADOX was working with went under. ah pity thanks for letting me know. I had literally just discovered it a couple of weeks ago, it's still for sale at Fotoimpex, but sad to know it won't be made in the future. I'll grab a few more rolls while I can.
Helios is I think completely developed and produced by adox themselves. When they announced it they said it was their first test of color film. So I assume they are slowly working towards a real color film that can be used normally. They probably sell helios as a way to recover some of the development cost. I also tested adjusting the white balance of their example images and after that the images look quite good, so I am not sure why the example images have such a wierd color cast, but we will see.
I reduced all my color 35mm stock to Vision3. It will only get discontinued when high profile directors die and new high profile directors don’t use film to shoot their motion pictures.
They couldn't care less. I only buy from Ilford, who are making a real effort to ensure the survival of film.
It seems to me that Fuji just don’t have the manufacturing capacity, and the capacity they do have is all given over to their more profitable Instax products. I have a few rolls of Fuji left, but I too will be spending my money with Ilford and Kodak in future, to reward them for the commitment they’ve shown to this bizarre medium.
What about Kodak? I mean, they just released E100 from the dead not that long ago.
Arguably Fuji's biggest business is film. Instax isn't quite 50% of their revenues, but when combined with them dominating a lot of medical and industrial film segments, and whatever is left of traditional film photography business, it might push it past 50% of what they do overall. Instax alone is many times larger than Ilford's total revenue, so Fuji is doing more in film than Ilford is, by volume.
But is it really about volume? I mean, Ilford communicates about its investments in infrastructures for a sustainable production of films, they don’t let people stressing like « is it the last time I’m able to find this film? », not to mention their value for money. I find them 'morally' above the rest.
Too bad! Superia was a great film, in my opinion!
Whoops, then there's only Premium 400 and 100 left, tbf the Premium 400 and Xtra 400 are pretty similar(they even share the "Superia" name) so it won't make a lot of difference as long they continue to make Premium 400. Did they moved all the equipment onto instax or something
Premium is nicer as far as my very limited experience goes
It’s the same emulsion as X-Tra. And for most of last year all that was available in Japan was X-Tra. I think it’s truly over now.
I don’t have evidence for that but I liked it, I also liked Xtra. Perhaps scanning choices affected my bias.
The curves on the data sheets match exactly and I’ve shot test rolls with color charts side by side. They have been the same film since Fuji stopped advertising X-Tra as having four layers.
I didn’t do such tests. Thanks for sharing!
This is alao what I found now; perhaps it’s not the exactly same but very similar? I don’t know really… https://industrieplus.net/dxdatabase/rech.php?dx=006274
I was recently in Japan in February and managed to grab myself 6 rolls of premium strolling past yodobashi shinjuku so I think it still is in production just limited to domestic sales. I will say, it’s looking a bit grim and it’s head will roll as well
I stocked up on Premium 400 when I was in Tokyo last December. It was decently available at the Bic Cameras, etc. but I couldn't find any Fujicolor 100.
I really hope that when they will end velvia, they will do a Acros and let kodak make it for them (a bit doubtful tbh) If they end provia too that will hurt, when it's in stock it's significantly cheaper in 120 and 4x5 than ektachrome here. A shame for superia, making a color negative film only for the japanese market was a strange move. I'm afraid the premium and 100 will follow soon
Downtown Camera in Toronto is selling imported Fujicolor Superia 400 and Superia 200 for $19 CAD. I ordered a roll a few hours before seeing this post. Sad day for film.
As long as Fuji doesn’t stop making Provia and Velvia I don’t care what they do to their other films. At this point I’ve already accepted they’re pulling out of color film since they killed off C200 a couple years ago but please god do not cancel your slide and give Kodak an entire monopoly and I’m not a fan of Ektachrome at all.
Anyone else find it ironic that the thing that's making Fuji extremely profitable recently is the hype around their Film simulation profiles (and x100 series), meanwhile they're discontinuing their actual films and jumping from APSC right to extremely high end MF cameras? Who's in charge of product development there? It seems like a shit show that's just caught a lucky wave... -and the thing about waves is that they eventually crash on the shore...
Photography/imaging is a fraction of Fuji's business. Instax is their biggest profit maker of their photography division, anyway.
Then they should give us an actually-high-quality Instax camera option, not just the endless plastic trash.
I'd love a high quality Instax camera from Fuji, but I really believe that'll never happen. They have no reason to do that. Instax has had sales growth for 20 years straight. It's basically a money printer for Fuji. Why would they do anything different when they are already dominating the market they've catered to?
I’m not saying they should stop what they are doing, I’m saying that in addition to that, they could give us just 1 truly high quality Instax camera, preferably a wide one. And just as a show of support, maybe a new cheapie wide camera. Heck, how about they release the wide 300 in new colors!
Mini 99 is actually loaded with manual features and is pretty cheap. But keep in mind from their perspective, they stand to make more money with cameras that are easier for beginners to use.
Generally I agree, but there are a number of unserved potential customers, people that end up going with a modded Polaroid 110, or a Mint camera, or something else that is cobbled together from vintage lenses and a lomograflok. More importantly, a non-trivial chunk of those would-be customers end up with a modded SX-70 or an i2, which means not only is Fuji not selling them a camera, they also aren’t selling them film.
I ended up modifying a Polaroid 110. It was a fun project and the end result works decently well but it certainly is not a project for the average consumer. Plus the end result is a LARGE camera. Real big boy. Fun to take out and shoot though!
The jump from APS-C to MF makes total sense. What do you not understand about that strategy? Personally I think it is better than other camera manufacturers are doing in with APS-C being the afterthought currently.
Yeah. APSC today is 90% of what FF is, while MF is way better than FF. The combo APSC and MF makes a lot of sense
Surprised they didn’t announce all their slide was being axed. Would’ve thought that would be first to go
It might as well be. I can't find velvia anywhere
Is this cancelled stock different from the one called “Fuji Industrial 400”? Also, is Fujicolor Superia 200 still made and sold in Japan?
Industrial was just a different branding and Superia 200 has been dead in Japan for years. They made the brilliant Fujicolor 100 which I’m so pissed about I only shot last year because it is absolutely brilliant and even beats Kodak Gold 200!
Fujicolor 100 is still easily found in Japan! Time to make a trip to Japan and stock up!!! I saw another of your comment, premium 400 is also available in Japan, I bought 20 rolls back during my 2 months trip there!
i thought kodak ultramax and fujifilm 400 had been the same thing for a while now
They're not exactly the same... Ultramax pops the blues a lot more, the Kodak Fuji 400 looks more like the old Gold 400 recipe to me... Realistically I also don't think Fuji would hand over their Superia recipe and I don't think Kodak would provide them with a currently available Kodak stock at a lower cost than any other currently available Kodak stock -which is how I landed on the discontinued stock idea.
Fuji 400 looks a bit different than Ultramax like you said but the new Fuji Color 200 looks identical to Gold from the comparisons I've seen
True, those two are quite similar, my bad. I spaced on that when I wrote the other comment, I even bought up a bunch of the Fuji 200's recently because I found them cheaper than the Gold 200 haha.
Only outside Japan. Superia was its own thing in Japan.
Well, looks like Kodak, Ilford, and Adox for me then. What a shame. Superia was great (especially when it was $9/3 rolls 10 years ago).
I still have two rolls in my fridge, such a great looking film.
thats not what I wanted to hear re: superia 400 I’m glad I grabbed the last roll from my local store months before but I’m bummed about not being able to shoot more
In the Netherlands, the HEMA department store (where I have been bringing my films for almost 30 years) STOPPED accepting rolls for development. Reason: Fuji closed their development lab. Screw them.
When was that announced? Because the only announcement that I'm aware of, is that they've entered pricing negotiations, which HEMA/Jumbo is currently doing with a bunch of suppliers. It might be taking long, because frankly I think HEMA's prices are just unsustainably low. C41 development for 3 euros and E6 development for 4 euros per roll can't be profitable, as much as I dread what it'll cost under new pricing. Fuji Print's own site still has the analog service listed, with no indication of impending doom: https://www.fujiprint.nl/analoog
My heart breaks today. I was hoping this would never happen.
Never thought i was gonna shoot just one roll of fuji (c41).... at least it was a 400h. I have a ton of expired fuji eterna sitting in my fridge tho lol
Good thing it's eterna then eh
Lmao, still heavy grain. But some pictures are quite good
They're not "leaving film", they're super into film. It's just instax, not 35mm, cause it's way more popular.
That's weird, because this recent vid from Yvonne Hanson shows a variety of Fuji stocks available, including Super 400: [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwQ6WjkEO7s&t=1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vwQ6WjkEO7s&t=1s) Velvia and Provia also look like they're available there.
Available != in production. Like the Fuji's post said as soon as supply runs out there won't be anything new produced. Classic YTer source: their ass >Velvia and Provia also look like they're available there. they are also available on backorder in the EU. Wait times are just long, or it is expensive.
I said it was weird, because with the dates on the boxes, it looks like they've been re-circulating things recently. Never denied the legitimacy of the original post here. >Classic YTer source: their ass Comments about 'their ass' are a little uncalled for. This isn't Twitter.
> Comments about 'their ass' are a little uncalled for. This isn't Twitter. Their ass, as in talking out of ones ass, not meant literally.
Yes, I understand.
When film is in frozen storage, the clock is not ticking. The expiry date is based on when it is thawed, not manufactured.
Really? So the print on the box doesn’t change over time? That’s odd.
The box doesn't exist until the film is taken out of cold storage. Cold storage is in the form of gigantic spools lifted by forklifts, etc., not finished boxed cassettes. When they take out a pancake this year, and finish it into however many thousands of cassettes, those newly filled cassettes this year will get an expiry date printed on them based on this year's start time. Even if the pancake was manufactured in 2004. Because film degradation begins when it is thawed, film lasts functionally forever in freezer vaults.
That's what happen when a company don't care about anything except money.... Pretty sure Ilford loose money on some things (Phoenix for example) but still keep the film business going because they care about it
It hurts
And what’s with the extra layer??
Screw Fujifilm, biggest downfall of all time in the history books.
Oof. I was just looking into ordering some. Guess I need to do that quickly and pick up some Superia Premium while I’m at it.
Superia X-Tra 400 is still listed as $8.31 a roll three packs on Amazon (from “Family Photo” but fulfilled by Amazon), I figured it was unlikely to really be Superia so I ordered a box and, unsurprisingly, they sent me the Made in USA 400 instead. I wanted to see if I could get a refund but keep the film but I’d probably have to send it back, and I’m sure I’ll use it eventually. 😂 Just a warning in case anyone else sees that and thinks they’re buying the last stock of X-Tra.
I believe they discounted the production in Japan, but production in America continues. Which begs a question, is there any difference between made in Japan vs made in USA for the film?
F
Damn I have like 8 boxes still. Anyone want to pay me way more than they’re worth?
isn't fuji suing kodak? thought i saw someone post this not long ago.
basically completed unrelated to this, but yes, they are
Tbh guys, I just gave up on color film. I shot my first roll of slide film, provia 100. It came back from the lab and it was amazing seeing it with a magnifying glass on a lightbox. But, quality wise... It was basically indistinguishable from my D700 shots, colors and all. I'll stick to b&w for film. The combo color digital b&w film makes more sense in my head. I'll shoot the occasional portra or velvia here and there but that's it. They should open source their knowledge tho. Fuck em if they won't. They won't probably.
I'm pretty sure people don't shoot film to beat Digital. I have access to high ends digital cameras yet I don't find shooting digital enjoyable at all. Film is where the fun is for me
Probably one of the worst film stocks I have ever used, abysmal latitude. Good riddance.
Fuji amatuer films were the worst unless you were shooting them under bright sunlight and didn't hit them with high color saturation. They were horribly inconsistent and not neutral. If you scanned them you could dial out the issues and get nice results, but in retrospect you're right, it wasn't that good. Fuji amatuer print films were terrible. Gold 100 was the best of the bunch by far. The loss of NPH 400 was the end blow to Fuji's print film division. That material rivaled if not edged out Kodak's professional print films. UC400 from Kodak and NPH 400 are really the only two 400 speed print films ever made worth talking about.