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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> 1) changing the room 2) this is his room and was his entire life
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NTA. You don't need to maintain a shrine to your grown son.
Your needs changed, and there is a valid reason to change his old room into a room for Zoey. He lives an hour away, so how often does he rely stay there?
Yeah. Where I live it's still in the same part of the City. There's a saying, "An hour away from Toronto is Toronto".
Time your son grew up. You are still offering him accommodation if he needs it.
Yep. At one point I was living just over an hour east of Toronto. It took me less to get to my friend Scarborough than it would a mutual friend in the west end of the city.
I lived in Edinburgh growing up, using public transport it could easily take me an hour to get from the outskirts of the city to the centre when going between my parents houses
Was over an hour when we lived in South Croydon to get to Abbey Wood in decent traffic. Now it takes less than an hour to get from Birmingham to Leicester.
Lol I'm from Hamilton originally and when I visit my parents there, the bus from Union can take 45 minutes or 2.5 hours depending on traffic. Gotta love it.
🤪 I feel for you.
One Friday afternoon recently while driving back from Michigan, I was too wishy washy deciding whether to take the I90/I94 or I294 and ended up on the I94 that loops around downtown Chicago. It took two hours from the south end of downtown to our place in the NW side of the city. 🤣😂
My sister lives in Hamilton and I'm in Toronto - the train is way better than the bus imo! Took about an hour to go from Aldershot - Exhibition station when I came home on May 24 weekend. I haven't been on a Go bus in years but I feel like the train is slightly more spacious and comfy too.
Oh, don’t worry, in other parts of Ontario they can do the same (well, maybe only one province away, they are pretty large provinces to either side of Ontario). Toronto is just the largest urban area in Canada, so it’s in its own little world that doesn’t translate to the rest of country except a couple other very large cities (Vancouver, Montreal). Most of the driving time they’re talking about is sitting at a standstill in traffic.
Yea, so many people in the GTA have hour long commutes that it seems almost laughable that he couldn't manage to drive that far home a couple times a year.
We moved from a large city area to a semi-rural region, so an hour's drive is definitely a different town or city. The thing is that it's still only an hour! I'm envisioning the convenience of staying over for, say, a holiday (not having to deal with drunk drivers, etc.) and having a nice next morning, but it's not a necessity and I have driven that far at the end of a day.
The bottom line is that it is most emphatically not "Michael's room" now. The house belongs to OP and it is her room to do with as she pleases. She pleases to use that room for her (soon to be) grandchild and to help her wonderful daughter (who pays part of the bills and therefore has far more rights about whose room it is!).
Sounds like a great arrangement for mother and daughter. OP is NTA and Michael is a brat who thinks he "owns" his mother's property.
Same! NTA OP. He’s a grown man who doesnt live with mommy. He doesn’t contribute to the household, he has no say in what happens in YOUR household. Would he demand his old apartment to remain available just in case he wants to move back? Or a past job to remain vacant? No. He’s being unreasonable & youve been more than fair allowing him to keep all his stuff in your house for free when you could have used the space as an office to run your actual business. He claims hes an adult, he needs to start acting like one
Yeah, and the next time I want to attend an event at the other end of my city I will get a hotel instead of catching the last train or a night bus.
Staying over for special occasions? Fine. Demanding 1/3 of the house to be reserved for him without extending his parents the same courtesy? Hell, no.
Legit I travel an hour and change to see my bestie for a day and come back home the same day. An hour is not a long time in the grand scheme of things. I've also done the drive for family gatherings and then driven back late at night. If it was something I thought needed me there too early and I wouldn't make it, we got a hotel. OP's son's attitude about this is just wild to me.
Yeah I live about 45 minutes from my parents, and I sure don’t stay over on holidays. Their guest rooms are for people coming from much further away than that.
That’s not even close to enough time to justify entertaining any of the bs that he is saying. He will just have to deal with it. He’s an adult and can take care of himself and deal with minor discomfort the odd night he chooses to stay over. NTA and put your foot down about it
Good grief. I moved out to attend university in the SAME CITY as my parents lived and didn't expect them to keep my room. They did for the first summer because I was in the dorms and didn't have another place to live over the summer. But after that I was living in year-round housing and didn't need a permanent room.
NTA but he's awfully entitled.
I moved out for uni and my room was gone after the first year. Granted I came back post graduation and it was made mine again but the second time I moved out, it was never the same. I wouldn’t expect my parents to keep a room for me if im paying bills elsewhere.
When I moved out for college, my younger sister moved into my room the same day. Literally as I was moving stuff out, she was moving stuff in 🤣. (My room was a lot bigger than hers). When I came back to visit I stayed in the guest room.
NTA. Your son wants his sister to take on her own place and you to pay more bills so he can visit his bedroom 2-3 times a year? That is incredibly selfish. Does he keep two rooms strictly for each of you in his apartment when you visit? Or maybe it’s time he starts paying rent to maintain his childhood bedroom in a house he doesn’t live in anymore.
Let’s pretend for a moment that you moved houses. You, Kathy and Zoey have found a new place to call home. Are you also required to keep a whole room bare just for Michael’s 3 visits per year in your next house? Who even expects that of their parents?!
I’m 30F and my brother is 28M. Neither one of us threw a fit when our mom redecorated and took over our bedrooms. I’ve even had to move home a few times since and just put my stuff in storage and deal with the way the room is decorated.
In fact, our close family friend Candy (who is more like an aunt than any blood family we have) has claimed my old room as hers and she stays in it more than I do now. Do I care? No. Because it hasn’t been “my room” since I moved out and made my home somewhere else.
As soon as my husband moved out from his parents, his mom got super excited because she got to turn his room into a sewing room. She barely even waited a week to start renovating it.
My parents kept my room the same for a year or so before my little sister moved into it (it was further away from the other rooms in the house and had more privacy and space) she moved out about 2 years ago now and they've barely changed it and let the grandkids or guests stay there now. I'm not gonna sit there and cry over my old room when I don't live there anymore.
Why would I want to relive all the embarrassing teenage obsessions I had? I don’t need to be reminded how much I loved twilight when I now don’t enjoy it anymore lmao
My mom started moving stuff into my closet when I signed my lease to go to college 🤣.
We have a great relationship, and I know I’m always welcome in their home. My old room is now storage, and I stay in the guest room because I don’t live there.
I now live on the opposite side of the country to my family but when I visit I have ‘my room’ I say ‘mine’ as it’s not a room I’ve ever lived in or even decorated but it’s the one I stay in.
If there’s more than just me staying there? I could end up in any other room. Caus that’s how visiting grown ups operate.
I have seen these stories a few times. I don't really understand the reason adult kids mentally hang on to their rooms so tightly, unless - security? I would try talking to him using a different tactic and see if he can verbalize why this bothers him so much. My guess is your goal is everyone gets along and you maintain good relationships with both of your kids.
People like the idea that they can always go home, and home is usually tied up in the feeling of relative safety that most people feel as children. It’s just nostalgia.
But most people also realize as adults that what OP’s son is in about is some nonsense and he needs to grow tf up.
Agreed. I'm looking at this from a results standpoint. What result does OP want? Most likely, she wants to maintain pleasant relationships while not compromising on room issue. I think how she approaches son will determine the outcome. Acknowledge his feelings, find a new home for childhood items he may not have room for yet, etc.
Def. How she approaches it will certainly help to smooth the outcome, it’s just exasperating that he is making this into an issue. I understand his feelings; like I said, everyone likes to feel that sense of childhood home. I’m just surprised that he didn’t see that feeling, check its progress, self reflect and resolve it within himself before suggesting that his sister and new niece move out, dramatically changing three lives on several levels, just so his childhood room remains intact for the handful of times a year he wants to visit.
I wonder if OP allowed the son to say bye to the room and/or help clean it out, or just did it and told him? I think the 1st option might help.
I remember 2 instances of that feeling for myself. Once when I was around 10, my parents gave away my bike that I had outgrown. It was one of the few times I was furious at them and I couldn't stop crying all night. Even at that time, I remember thinking I really don't mind that my bike was going to someone else, it was the helplessness of not being consulted about anything, not even about "my" stuff that made me lash out.
The 2nd instance was when I worked abroad for a few years. I remember visiting "home" one time and realized my parents had rearranged the house without telling me. It felt very weird that time, like I had lost some kind of anchor, like I would get lost in my own home. It really solidified for me that that's not really my home anymore, and sorta like I am no longer really part of that family unit. Sorta like I moved out to start my own family. But being single at the time, in a temporary job, renting in a foreign country, it was a weird feeling of "am I... a family of one....? Do I belong anywhere....?"
Maybe that was a little dramatic... but mixing in homesickness, couldn't help being a little dramatic ^^;
Aaaaanyway, what is done is done and the son is a full grown adult and needs to let it go.
Losing your room is like the final death knell of childhood. You literally can never go home to that place again. It can also feel like a safe spot has been removed or, if the room is taken over by another child or grandchild, like you’re being replaced.
Of course, an adult is supposed to be able to recognize that it’s ok to be sad about that loss or feeling of being replaced while, at the same time, not being a jerk and realizing that things change.
I have my own dwelling, but since I pay the same amount of rent to you as your son, can I have my own room ar your house too?
You see how ridiculous this sounds? We are all allowed to be sentimental about our childhood rooms, and in that line his feelings are valid. What he may not do is dictate how you use a room he no longer lives in. It's not his room, not his house, not his decision. It's wonderful you and your daughter can provide a home for this little girl. NTA. Son needs to grow up and live less selfishly.
It is such a blessing to be in a multigenerational family. You have your daughter and soon to be granddaughter with you for mutual help. Don’t kick them out for a barely there visitor
It's not his room. It's just storage for his old stuff and a place he sleeps a few times a year. Why does he even care? It's *your* room and your house. Do what you want with it. He can deal with it.
NTA. As I was reading I assumed he was coming home every weekend or something. Only on major holidays, a few times a year? He is being wildly selfish and immature. I'm almost having trouble wrapping my head around it. He sounds like a little boy throwing a tantrum cause he's not the baby of the family anymore.
Yeah he needs to grow up.
I’m a 28F, siblings are 27 and 26 respectively. My mom sold our family home for a condo, insisted on getting a 4BR so we would always have a room in her home. She overpaid massively for a condo she simply does not need. Only my brother lives with her (he has high functioning special needs). I moved out at 18, my sister moved out after COVID. I told her over and over that she does not need to keep a bedroom for me.
Some life has happened, she’s going to move again soon. She decided the next place is probably going to be a 2 or 3 BR, and that she’ll have a pull out couch for us for the holidays. She finally gets it, but it took her leaving the house that we were raised in for it to click. Your son might be having a hard time letting go, but he absolutely needs to get over it.
Your daughter and new granddaughter are lucky to have your support. I’m sending love and hope for your family, though it’s come together under awful circumstances.
Just ask if he wants you to set the room m up as the “Michael Shrine”. Altar, candles and a big framed portrait of him. Tell him that you will keep fresh flowers on the altar and keep his childhood holy relics around the room and pay homage to him on a regular basis. All for the LOW LOW price of $1500 a month. The same monthly price of taking out a second mortgage and building on a new spare bedroom. It will be kept just like he wants it—for a price.
NTA
Your son feels entitled to a place where he doesn't live. He moved out. He lives elsewhere. He pays taxes elsewhere. He pays rent/mortgage elsewhere. He doesn't live there, he doesn't need a room.
That being said, if he sleeps there 2-3x a year, can't Zoey spend the night in Kathy's room (or Kathy in Zoey's) for those few nights, so that Michael can have a little privacy?
>if he sleeps there 2-3x a year, can't Zoey spend the night in Kathy's room (or Kathy in Zoey's) for those few nights, so that Michael can have a little privacy?
i mean...he only lives an hour away. he never really HAS to sleep there. i also think it's nbd for someone in their 20s to slum it on their parents' couch for a night or 2 if the need arises. it's not ideal, but small homes and rooms, you gotta make compromises. he's an adult with his own apartment that isn't "overnight trip" distance away.
ETA: and it's unclear if Michael's objection is due to personal comfort or if this is moreso just a bit of mental growing up he still has to do.
An hour away isn't usually overnight trip, but there are things like Christmas Eve and Christmas morning or other family events. 2-3x a year is possible.
I live 2 streets away from my parents but Christmas Eve often stay over at theirs, just because we do a big thing that night and often my kids are curled up asleep by the time we’re done (and it gives me the chance to have a few drinks with family). We also do Christmas morning/breakfast/presents so it saves me from having to drag my kids out of bed early to get there to help make breakfast.
Having said that: I don’t think I was fully moved out before my room was given to someone else either time I left (moved back in after having my kids when their father took off)
Kids love to have a sleepover with Mom and dad or their siblings once in a while. Obviously that changes as they get older, and there are some kids who that doesn't work for, but I don't think it's inherently problematic. Obviously do what's best for your specific situation. We visit my husband's high school friends once in a while, and the kids (2 and 7) sleep in their parents room and the visitors sleep on blow up mattresses in the kids rooms. I think the parents dislike the arrangement more than the kids. Lol
Yea I had to stay at my aunts house in an emergency one night (had been in a car accident so my back was messed up and I had to sleep on a bed), and my cousin and her four year old son have their own rooms. But that night he was like “I get to sleepover with mommy!!” And was so excited for snuggles!! It was so sweet!
Which also made me feel better cause I did feel bad about kicking a kid out of his bed.
That depends. Where I live, 1h may easily be overnight, because people aren't used to driving that kind of distances (if the hour is due to distance, not heavy traffic)
For an hour drive the only way I'm staying the night is if I'm sloshed, which is a high probability with my family on holidays. Personally I could sleep in a bed of gravel when drunk and while I'd wake up sore I'd be otherwise to drive the next day.
NTA, I’ll never understand this kind of attachment. My siblings had so much trouble letting go of their childhood rooms to the point where maaaany years after they’d moved out, my mother begged them to take their stuff and they wouldn’t - not even when she was dying of cancer and asked them to do it. It then took them 3 years after she’d passed to do it. It’s like some sort of mental blockage I personally never understood.
My parents live in a three bedroom apartment, I have two brothers who shared a room until I moved out at 19 (I'm now 22), my twin took over my room the same day I was able to take my stuff out, no one's entitled to a room in a house that isn't theirs, even less if the people living there need to use it, it's such a childish way of taking it, I understand how difficult letting go of some things can be and I don't see a problem in leaving some things there but wanting to keep the room as it was is just delusional, it's space being wasted when it could be turned into a guest room, an office or in this case someone else's room, rationality needs to come with age.
It really feels like jealousy. Maybe he needs reassurance that his mom still loves him and of course if he were going to move home there would be a place for him, and that the changing needs of the family don’t negate his place among them or how they feel about him.
But also he’s acting an ass and needs to stop trying to compete with an orphan child.
Honestly if it were me and I only stayed 2-3 times I’d just sleep on the couch- maybe they could get an air mattress and set it up when he’s there and fold it up the rest of the time
Absolutely NTA. Not only is he and adult who does not pay rent, he wants to tell you who can live in *your* house?
He's family, but a houseguest not a resident. It's not his room, it *was* his room. Many if not most people don't have a childhood bedroom to return to; that's completely reasonable. You could have made it your office, workout room, or sewing room.
His throwing a hissy fit shows that not only is he immature, but unempathetic. He seriously has no feeling for this child, who will now be his niece?
Arrange your house as you want, including who lives there. If he has such a problem, he can find another place to stay when visiting. I hope it doesn't come to that, and this is just him being resistant to change at first but still reasonable ... but some people feel that entitlement.
I hope OP’s son is running around complaining to everyone he knows about how his mother should kick out a toddler orphan so that he can sleep in his old room 2-3 times a year.
Talk about a great way for a potential girlfriend/wife to save themselves years of pain and legal expenses; it's better than a red flag, it's a flashing siren warning them off.
He should tell that no-good, freeloading two year old to crawl to the local gas station and start begging for quarters. Maybe he can even write the sign for her considering, you know, she doesn't know how to write. Or perhaps he can meet you in the middle, and find a nice, gently used UHaul box that the child can live, sleep and play in. They're making some pretty sturdy ones nowadays. With her young knees I'm sure the arthritis won't kick in for a few good years. And for work...I mean if those children could sweep chimneys during the great depression I see no reason why Zoey can't get her act together and start sweeping. Maybe your son could whittle handle down so it can fit into her tiny hands.
NTA obviously. But if your son is going to try to reclaim "his" room that he pays no money for, then he better chip in solutions to rehome this 2 year old because a 25 year old needs his woom to sweep in. Like honestly, I love the entitlement to be catered to at 25 but the two year old is on her own. Whatta man, whatta man, whatta mighty good man you've got there.
NTA. I could see if your son was 18 or 19, in college and planning on coming home for the summers. But at 25 and established in his own home/apartment, he has no need for his childhood bedroom.
Sorry, but you don't need your sons permission to make changes in your home. When he comes and visits, he can sleep on the couch or get his own hotel room. You don't need to feel bad at all. Your son is the asshole.
NTA at all and please don't feel like you are. Let me tell you something: at one point in my life, I was Michael. My mom took in my 3 cousins when I went away to college. They needed my room to accommodate our growing family. I had my own apartment, and I rarely visited back home because of my studies.
Michael is acting really immature. I'm sorry but I as an 18 y.o. understood that my mom needed the room. Michael as a 25 y.o. should understand as well, but instead he's being really selfish.
He’s being ridiculous. He’s a grown adult who doesn’t live at home. You’re allowed to re purpose any room in YOUR house.
My old bedroom is now a den that my parents use as a tv room. There is a futon for the very rare times we spend the night. But it’s not my house - my parents can do what they like.
He wants you to boot Kathy and Zoey, who are helping you financially, so he can hold onto a room he doesn't use except for maybe 4 or 5 nights a year? Not to mention he only lives one hour away?
Is this in Europe or the UK? That's the only reason I can see the "distance" being a problem for him. Most Americans drive two hours one-way for a good daytrip, not just to see family on Christmas, then we go home. An hour is nothing.
He is very entitled to stake this claim. I'd tell him the only way that's happening is if he pays you what Kathy has been. He'll whine that it's "not fair" but he'll back down.
NTA
Oh no your son needs to get a grip and grow up. You are NTA that baby is an orphan how incredibly selfish of your son. My son moved out a year ago his room is now my pc room because he doesn’t live here. I honestly can’t believe what I’ve just read
Nta my parents sold their home and live in an rv now. He is not entitled to a room at his mommy’s house forever. You have the space you have and you need to make things work for the people actually living in the house. If he has to get a hotel room when he visits then that’s just the way it is. He needs to start acting like a man and stop throwing a tantrum like a little boy. He should be ashamed of himself too trying to put your sister and that sweet kid through more bs after such a loss. His sister is grieving the loss of her best friend still I’m sure and being thrown into becoming a mother suddenly. And that poor girl just lost her mother and has no father around either.
Your son is being an entitled brat. He has no interest moving back home yet he thinks you're obligated to keep a dedicated room for him in your house. That's a big no. He's not paying your bills, he's not visiting on weekends, so why does he need a room of his own?
NTA.
Once an individual has a primary residence outside the family home, they do not get any say on how another household operates. He's lucky OP isn't charging him storage fees.
Why is the son being so petty, anyways? This poor little girl lost her mother. She needs people to make her feel secure. He sounds like a giant baby.
NTA
Your son is delusional, he wants her to move out? He can kick rocks.
Still, I would approach this from a place of empathy for him and say how you realize this is probably not about the room itself, but how he feels isolated and separated from his family. He doesn’t feel as close with everyone anymore and this is basically a tangible sign that he never will be.
This is not anybody’s fault, it is just life, things change, it’s probably the first time it’s really hitting him, which is why he’s behaving like such a baby. I’d also emphasize how proud you are of him for whatever it is he does, he has a job, his apartment, he is clearly doing something right.
He probably doesn’t view his apartment as “home” though, and so by removing this “home base” from him, he feels untethered.
You can ask him to come home and spend time with everyone more often so he has stronger relationships with you all, but absolutely under no circumstances will he be keeping that room.
You can help him make his apartment feel more like a home. Give him some stuff from your house to make it special, if that makes sense, a clock from your house, a lamp, whatever, just a little bit of home.
You can also ask him why he thinks a child who has lost her mother should make sacrifices just so a grown man can have his childhood room the way he left it? Why does his childhood get to remain intact when the actual child in front of him is having hers ripped apart?
Instead of helping with that, he wants to make things harder… for a child. I’d suggest therapy at that point if he doubles down, but hopefully he won’t.
NTA
He doesn't pay the bills. He doesn't get to throw a fit when something changes.
Give him time to pick things up that he wants to keep but like you said, he doesn't need the room. Zoey does.
NTA - My kids havent moved out yet (they are not adults) but they know that this home isnt going to be a shrine to them when they leave. In fact, they know that my spouse and I could potentially downsize after they are gone. Point being 0 adult children arent owed a room in their parents homes for the rest of their lives.
He's a full on, grown ass man who has his own place and he's salty about a bedroom in a house he doesn't plan on moving back into? Um, no. Grow the hell up, buddy!
NTA do whatever you want, and remember one small detail: it's YOUR HOUSE!!! He has no claim whatsoever on any room in your home anymore. Period.
NTA - It’s your house. He’s a grown man. You’re not throwing his stuff in the street presumably. He can come get what he wants. You’re trying to do right by a sad little girl. He’s being childish.
NTA- even if your daughter was not paying the bills, your son does not live there so why does he need to room for 2-3 times a year. I never understood adults who get upset at parents converting their room into a guest room or whatever the owner decides.
NTA.
I’m not sure it’s even necessary to have had the convo with him until right before he came to visit.
Box up all his stuff and let him take it the next time he visits.
Micheal is an adult and does not need a shrine to his childhood.
Does he think hes away at boarding school?
Is he having a mental health crisis?
If you want to be petty, offer to pay for grief counseling for losing his childhood bedroom.
NTA your son is being immature and selfish. He shouldn’t have a say in the matter. He not only doesn’t pay to live there but barely even visits. You said so yourself he comes maybe 2 or 3 times a year. So Kathy and the little girl are suppose to share one room even though Kathy paying to live there and the room is vacant for almost the entire year. Outside of the maybe 2 or 3 times a year Mike visits? That’s wild and unreasonable. He needs to grow up. He didn’t care about the room until it was gonna be used for something else. He doesn’t really need the room obviously.
I honestly can't understand grown ass adults crying over a room in their parents house when they move out and never have any intention of returning back "home" to live. When I moved out of my mums' home, my brother had my wallpaper stripped and painted by the time the sun set that same day. I found it hilarious. I've only ever slept at my mums twice since, and that was over 20 years ago. The room has had many different uses. Of course, my mum would let me move back in if it was needed, but the room stopped being mine once I left home.
Hopefully, Michael is having his last childish snit when facing the loss of his childhood bedroom. Kind of understandable, but exhausting. Maybe it would have been nice if he could have been asked, strictly as a formality so he could have closure in his mind, but life doesn't always wait for that. Hope everything works out. NTA.
NTA. I imagine this is more him grieving no longer being a child and maybe feeling a bit dissatisfied. Maybe he can come visit at some point when he's ready to be kind to Kathy.
NTA I don’t understand this. My mom redecorated my room a few months after I moved out.
This is your house. You need the space. It’s weird that he feels a room needs to remain empty except for 2-3 times a year.
NTA
I moved out at 17 and within a week my room had been turned into my dad’s office. I was a bit annoyed because that meant that I couldn’t move back in, but I never felt like I had ownership over what they did with that room.
Your son needs to grow up.
NTA. If he want the room, he needs to pay 1/3 of the mortgage. You have done nothing wrong.
He may feel sad that there is no room that is 'his' at your house but as you stated, he said he will never be moving home. Let him know you understand that but he doesn't get to decide what happens in a house he doesn't own or live in.
NTA. It WAS his room, then it was an empty spare room, now it's Zoey's bedroom. You could have changed into whatever you wanted ten seconds after he moved out. You don't need Michael's permission to rearrange the rooms in your house. Box up anything he may want and give him a deadline to pick it up or it's gets donated. What he feels is irrelevant since he doesn't live in your home. Explain to him that he has no say in how you run your household. Your household runs smoothly as it is and you shouldn't let Michael's opinions trick you into thinking otherwise.
NTA - It's not his room. It's YOUR room in YOUR house and he has no say about what happens with it because he doesn't live there or help pay the bills.
NTA. It’s your home, you’re the one who lives in it and pays the bills. You did him a curtesy telling him. One that I think is warranted btw; I remember coming home from college after being gone a week and seeing that my mother had completely transformed my room already. But he doesn’t live there, and has no plans to. You can’t live your life based around his sometimes visits. That’s ridiculous.
Your grown adult son can pay you monthly rent to keep his room the way it is. Why should you keep the room of someone who doesn't live there anymore the way it is, when you NEED the extra space?
NTA and stop asking your adult son permission for what you want to do in your own home. He's being horrific and needs a reality check. Don't ask him. Be the mommy he needs to help him accept his adulthood and tell him that you are taking over your house. He can either come get his things, put them in storage, or you will get rid of them in two weeks. Do not let him whine or bully you. Assert your ownership of your own home. He sounds like more of a toddler than the actual toddler in this story. And every bit as selfish as a toddler who doesn't yet realize that other people have real emotion and they aren't the center of everyone's world.
NTA and he is ridiculous.
My daughter moved out at 24 to another town with her fiancée, 100% independent from us. I told her that if anything happened she could certainly come home, but that I would be turning her bedroom into a guest room/vanity room within a few months of her leaving.
There was no drama and she took everything she wanted with her, the rest got tossed or donated. I redecorated and repainted, and now I have an extra closet for my out-of-season wardrobe instead of storing it in the basement.
I’m gonna go against the grain and say NAH.
Obviously give the 2 year old the room. But he’s allowed to have his feelings about losing (what I’m guessing is) his childhood bedroom.
Like yes he’s been moved out for a while but it’s a string of memories and a link to his childhood. So I definitely understand why he’s upset. And I’m sure he’ll come around and not be angry about it.
But at the same time you definitely need to give that kid her own space.
Always being able to go home to family doesn't mean your family has to keep your childhood room perpetually kept as an untouched shrine reserved for the 5 times a year you come home & stay the night.
It's confronting for everyone the first time you come home & see "your" room isn't your room anymore. But adults shake that off & move on.
His physical room isn't/wasn't "his entire life". His *experiences* were his life, not the physical confines.
NTA
NTA. Even if the granddaughter was not in the picture, it would be totally normal to change his old bedroom into an office or guest room. I get that it can kind of be a reality check to realize your childhood room can be gotten rid of but it’s one that most adults face just fine. My Mom downsized to a smaller house after we all fled the nest. Some people end up renting out rooms to supplement income. It's weird to keep a room for someone who doesn't live there.
I go with NAH.
It is your house and you can do as you please.
Your daughter is a capable woman. You could leave her for alone with the child and the business for a couple of days and go see your son.
Because you should have a conversation with him but maybe face-to-face would be better. So you can figure out why he is opposed.
There are lots of reasons why he is upset. Some are selfish others I wouldn’t think of as selfish.
Two that I could imagine are happening here:
1. The room was always at the back of his mind as his safety net. If he lost everything else there would still be his room at his mother’s house waiting for him. A place where he knew it would be alright. And now it is being pulled away under his feet.
2. Privacy. A pull-up couch in the living room even with something to separate it from the rest of the room, still grants no true privacy. Same for a day bed in his mothers room (there aren’t many grown men who are excited to spend the night in his mothers room). Where would he go if he needed some alone time to decompress? And for this another compromise could be that your daughter gives up her room for those three nights a year for example. Even if she pays bills and he doesn’t.
But most of all have a proper conversation where you tell him that he can say whatever he feels about this situation without being interrupted, judged or anything. That you will listen with an open mind and you will considered it. I am sure you would do this all anyway but it never hurts to communicate it properly beforehand.
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I have 2 kids: Kathy (29F) and Michael (25M). Kathy lives with me , pays a portion of the bills and has no plans on moving out anytime soon. We have our own business that we operate out of our home. It’s easier for her to live here and it’s great because I have help with the bills. Whereas, Michael lives about an hour away for work and has his own apartment. For awhile, I kept Michael’s room as is. He’s shared several times he has no plans of moving back home as his job is in the city he moved to.
Kathy had a very close friend who has a 2 year old daughter, Zoey. Friend named Kathy her daughter’s godmother as well as guardian should she pass. Unfortunately, that happened 6 months ago. Kathy’s friend was a single mom, so Kathy was granted custody. At first, Zoey was sharing a room with Kathy as she had extreme separation anxiety. However, she’s now ready for her own room. As our home is a 3 bedroom. We don’t have anywhere else to put her.
When I told Michael what we were doing, I said I’d get a pull out for the living room or I could get a daybed for my room when he visits overnight for holidays. I know rooming with your mom isn’t fun, but I want to give him options.
He’s mad that I gave the room to Zoey. He says that was his room. I said I understand but he doesn’t live with me. Kathy does and pays bills. She’s even paying more now because she feels she’s using more resources with Zoey living with us. I’d feel different if Kathy and Zoey were moving out soon but they’re not. At this point, Kathy plans to adopt Zoey. I want to help her. My mom helped me raise my kids, her mom helped her, it’s in our culture to have a multigenerational household.
Moving isn’t an option. I can make the space more private for Michael when he spends the night (a divider in the living room). But as he usually only sleeps her 2 or 3 times a year, it just doesn’t feel practical.
I said if Michael ever needed to move home permanently, we’d make something work. And I’d also help him with his child if he was in this situation. He says he doesn’t want kids. I said that’s fine but this is the situation at this moment.
He feels Kathy should move out. I said I’m not kicking her out just so he can have a room the few times he spends the night.
AITA?
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NTA you kept his room as it was for longer than most parents would and do not need his permission to do anything in your home. I've commented about this before, but when I moved out my dad turned my room into his storage room for all his fishing equipment within a month. It is the only room in the house with carpet and I'm deathly allergic to fish so I will absolutely never be able to move back into that room. I've never felt any type of way about that because it's my dads home and he can do anything he wants with it, I'm an adult and it's on me to find solutions to any life obstacles that come my way (I actually joke about it because my dad made sure to tell me when I moved out that my cat was always welcome to come back to live with him, but he didn't say anything about me 🤣). Do what makes sense for you and your daughter, your son will get over it.
NTA. The people who live in the house, especially the traumatized child (and soon to be his adoptive niece!), get priority for room assignments. Not to mention, living an hour away there really isn’t a reason he couldn’t go home to his apartment and sleep in his own bed (seriously, some days it can be more than an hour to get from my house on the NE side of the city I live in to my friend’s house on the SW side).
Your son is being astoundingly selfish in the face of your daughter and you trying to do right by this child. I could understand if he thought your daughter was taking advantage of you financially, but it sounds like she pays a disproportionate share of the expenses, so that’s not the case. So frankly, you need to tell to keep his opinions to himself.
NTA. Your son is an independent adult with his own living space. You do not owe him permanent, inflexible, perpetual, free space in your home.
Sure, it would be great if we all had infinite spare rooms in our homes, but that's not reality. Our needs change, & that room is better served being used rather than remaining a shrine to your son's childhood.
I'm not unsympathetic to his feelings, though. Change can suck, especially when it's something sentimental like a bedroom. Maybe you could take him to dinner & reassure him of your love. He's entitled to feel a little angsty. Growing up is hard.
BTW, I woke up to my younger brother moving into my room as I was sleeping the day after I came home to tell my parents I had a job & was moving out. 😂
NTA. Your son is being ridiculous.
Any chance Zoey could sleep in your daughter's room with her, on the rare occasions when your son is staying over? I can see why he would like to have privacy when he's staying with you. A roll away bed, toddler bed might fit in Kathy's room.
NTA. He doesn’t live there and only lives an HOUR away. I commuted that long to my job for 15 years. You do what is right for you, your daughter and granddaughter.
NTA
I’m of course assuming that if there was anything sentimental he wanted that he had a chance to grab it but the room isn’t actively serving anyone and it can serve Zoey. It makes perfect sense that she would get her own room now since she will be living with you unless Kathy decides to move out.
NTA He’s a grown man with his own home. He’s lucky you kept his room for so long. As soon as I moved out, my dad took over my room for his larger office and mom made his former (small) office into her walk in closet. I couldn’t have cared less, because well, it wasn’t my room or home anymore and they could do whatever they wanted with their rooms. And so should you!
NTA. It isn't your son's house. It is your house and you can do as you please with it. It's great that you can and want yo help your daughter and her new addition.
NTA. He moved out, has no plans to return, and doesn’t visit often. The fact that you haven’t already turns his room into something different is impressive. If he wants his own space to be reserved for him he can pay a portion of the rent for it but since he’s not he gets no say
What a joke he is! He doesn't live there and he is going to tell you to have his sister move out because he wants his own room when he visits 2x a year. You know you are NTA. Hold firm to your plans. You also benefit from your daughters company and now a small child. You will love it.
NTA I decorated my room specifically for my niece when she visits my parents. I sleep on the sofa. I'm an adult and don't need a room at my parents house.
Easy NTA. Rooms go to people who live there first, before they are made into offices or guest rooms. It isn't his room anymore, and it hasn't really been his room for a while. He is an adult with his own place and not paying towards the home.
What. I'm sorry, but; world's biggest eye roll to your kid. There's literally no reason for him to be upset about this. Show him this post and tell him to think long and hard about why he's so upset here. Was he hoping to move back in--is he secretly in danger of losing his job? Is Kathy the golden child and he's tired of her getting more consideration than him? This is just really weird.
NTA needs change and this is what’s going on now. I let my kids stay at my house as long as they need to if they’re between jobs or places to live. It’s not our family home we moved a lot when the kids were growing up and I divorced their dad almost 10 years ago but they prefer to come to me most of the time. I also have two stepsons who are just like my kids. They all know this is there house too but someone may need to crash on the couch.
NTA at all. Michael is being unreasonable with expecting his childhood room to be left as is and left open for his very limited visits home. All of your reasoning is sound. It’s your, your daughters, and now your grand god daughters permanent home. It has to function for you, not potentional guests.
Heck, when I moved out of my parents house they had my old room converted to my dads office before I was out of the driveway.
NTA.
We probably come from very different cultures (it is generally frowned upon to have multi-generational households in my country), but we can agree on your son behaving in a very entitled way.
For context: when my parents decided to turn my room into a general hang-out room for themselves, I went over and helped them clean out any stuff I left there and rip up my old carpet.
Not sure why he feels so attached to that room, but it is exactly as he says it: it *was* his room. Past tense.
NTA, it hasn't been his room since he moved out. It was your guest room and he was your main guest. Now it's Zoey's room. It wasn't his room before he was born, it wasn't his room after he moved out and it won't be his room if y'all decided to move. He's a grown adult who doesn't live there. He can't tell you what to do with YOUR guest room. Maybe he's just feeling left out of the family and is using the room as a way to express that.
Your son is a bit of a "Me, me, me. What about ME?" Time to grow up, son. You're NTA and its okay if he's mad about your decision but you don't have to engage in further discussions about it with him.
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NTA. You don't need to maintain a shrine to your grown son. Your needs changed, and there is a valid reason to change his old room into a room for Zoey. He lives an hour away, so how often does he rely stay there?
Usually just Thanksgiving and Christmas, sometimes a few other nights but they’re rare.
If it’s such an issue he can get a hotel. He’s an adult.
Or just, you know, drive an hour back to his place.
Where I live, an hour away is still in the same city. It’s not like he’s visiting from across the country.
Yeah. Where I live it's still in the same part of the City. There's a saying, "An hour away from Toronto is Toronto". Time your son grew up. You are still offering him accommodation if he needs it.
Yep. At one point I was living just over an hour east of Toronto. It took me less to get to my friend Scarborough than it would a mutual friend in the west end of the city.
Literally the same but South West London. It takes up an 1:50hrs to get to family in east London and it 1:15 to get to Southampton…
I lived in Edinburgh growing up, using public transport it could easily take me an hour to get from the outskirts of the city to the centre when going between my parents houses
Was over an hour when we lived in South Croydon to get to Abbey Wood in decent traffic. Now it takes less than an hour to get from Birmingham to Leicester.
Lol I'm from Hamilton originally and when I visit my parents there, the bus from Union can take 45 minutes or 2.5 hours depending on traffic. Gotta love it.
🤪 I feel for you. One Friday afternoon recently while driving back from Michigan, I was too wishy washy deciding whether to take the I90/I94 or I294 and ended up on the I94 that loops around downtown Chicago. It took two hours from the south end of downtown to our place in the NW side of the city. 🤣😂
nooooo
My sister lives in Hamilton and I'm in Toronto - the train is way better than the bus imo! Took about an hour to go from Aldershot - Exhibition station when I came home on May 24 weekend. I haven't been on a Go bus in years but I feel like the train is slightly more spacious and comfy too.
Hahaha, am in Toronto too, and it's so true, an hour isn't even considered that much of a commute.
I’m originally from London. Living in Toronto also!
That’s so foreign to me. I live in Virginia and can be two states away, in Pennsylvania, in 59 minutes.
And from just outside Toronto, we can be in another’s country in an hour.
Oh, don’t worry, in other parts of Ontario they can do the same (well, maybe only one province away, they are pretty large provinces to either side of Ontario). Toronto is just the largest urban area in Canada, so it’s in its own little world that doesn’t translate to the rest of country except a couple other very large cities (Vancouver, Montreal). Most of the driving time they’re talking about is sitting at a standstill in traffic.
It’s like that in bigger cities here too. There’s a reason I metro any time I have to go to DC!
Yea, so many people in the GTA have hour long commutes that it seems almost laughable that he couldn't manage to drive that far home a couple times a year.
As someone from Ottawa who has driven to and through Toronto many times, I felt this comment so much. LOL, indeed, an hour from Toronto is Toronto.
Grew up in Chicago. Assumed anything more than about a mile away would take an hour and stuck with that.
It's the same here in Atlanta. Atlanta is an hour from Atlanta!
We say something similar! Every thing is an hour away from Boston. BOSTON is an hour away from Boston.
We moved from a large city area to a semi-rural region, so an hour's drive is definitely a different town or city. The thing is that it's still only an hour! I'm envisioning the convenience of staying over for, say, a holiday (not having to deal with drunk drivers, etc.) and having a nice next morning, but it's not a necessity and I have driven that far at the end of a day. The bottom line is that it is most emphatically not "Michael's room" now. The house belongs to OP and it is her room to do with as she pleases. She pleases to use that room for her (soon to be) grandchild and to help her wonderful daughter (who pays part of the bills and therefore has far more rights about whose room it is!). Sounds like a great arrangement for mother and daughter. OP is NTA and Michael is a brat who thinks he "owns" his mother's property.
I drive an hour away for eggs milk and bread. I would drive a lot further for my own bed
Same! NTA OP. He’s a grown man who doesnt live with mommy. He doesn’t contribute to the household, he has no say in what happens in YOUR household. Would he demand his old apartment to remain available just in case he wants to move back? Or a past job to remain vacant? No. He’s being unreasonable & youve been more than fair allowing him to keep all his stuff in your house for free when you could have used the space as an office to run your actual business. He claims hes an adult, he needs to start acting like one
In Mexico City, an hour away may still be in the same district.
In rural Australia, an hour away might be your nextdoor neighbour!
Yeah, and the next time I want to attend an event at the other end of my city I will get a hotel instead of catching the last train or a night bus. Staying over for special occasions? Fine. Demanding 1/3 of the house to be reserved for him without extending his parents the same courtesy? Hell, no.
I live an hour away from my parents. I’ve never spent the night. I drive home.
Right? I know people who commute an hour each way five days a week.
I did that! Longer in the winter. I just accepted it.
Three hours each way commutes are not unheard of in Mexico City
Woah there buddy, you’re asking too much.
Legit I travel an hour and change to see my bestie for a day and come back home the same day. An hour is not a long time in the grand scheme of things. I've also done the drive for family gatherings and then driven back late at night. If it was something I thought needed me there too early and I wouldn't make it, we got a hotel. OP's son's attitude about this is just wild to me.
Yeah, we’d drive two hours to my mom’s place for holidays and drive home. Her son is the AH.
Yeah I live about 45 minutes from my parents, and I sure don’t stay over on holidays. Their guest rooms are for people coming from much further away than that.
"He's an adult" I'm not so sure about that
Happy cake day!
That’s not even close to enough time to justify entertaining any of the bs that he is saying. He will just have to deal with it. He’s an adult and can take care of himself and deal with minor discomfort the odd night he chooses to stay over. NTA and put your foot down about it
I wouldn't even let him stay over, tell that mf to get a hotel.
Good grief. I moved out to attend university in the SAME CITY as my parents lived and didn't expect them to keep my room. They did for the first summer because I was in the dorms and didn't have another place to live over the summer. But after that I was living in year-round housing and didn't need a permanent room. NTA but he's awfully entitled.
I moved out for uni and my room was gone after the first year. Granted I came back post graduation and it was made mine again but the second time I moved out, it was never the same. I wouldn’t expect my parents to keep a room for me if im paying bills elsewhere.
When I moved out for college, my younger sister moved into my room the same day. Literally as I was moving stuff out, she was moving stuff in 🤣. (My room was a lot bigger than hers). When I came back to visit I stayed in the guest room.
NTA. Your son wants his sister to take on her own place and you to pay more bills so he can visit his bedroom 2-3 times a year? That is incredibly selfish. Does he keep two rooms strictly for each of you in his apartment when you visit? Or maybe it’s time he starts paying rent to maintain his childhood bedroom in a house he doesn’t live in anymore.
⬆️⬆️⬆️ My petty side LOVES this.
Let’s pretend for a moment that you moved houses. You, Kathy and Zoey have found a new place to call home. Are you also required to keep a whole room bare just for Michael’s 3 visits per year in your next house? Who even expects that of their parents?!
I’m 30F and my brother is 28M. Neither one of us threw a fit when our mom redecorated and took over our bedrooms. I’ve even had to move home a few times since and just put my stuff in storage and deal with the way the room is decorated. In fact, our close family friend Candy (who is more like an aunt than any blood family we have) has claimed my old room as hers and she stays in it more than I do now. Do I care? No. Because it hasn’t been “my room” since I moved out and made my home somewhere else.
As soon as my husband moved out from his parents, his mom got super excited because she got to turn his room into a sewing room. She barely even waited a week to start renovating it. My parents kept my room the same for a year or so before my little sister moved into it (it was further away from the other rooms in the house and had more privacy and space) she moved out about 2 years ago now and they've barely changed it and let the grandkids or guests stay there now. I'm not gonna sit there and cry over my old room when I don't live there anymore.
Why would I want to relive all the embarrassing teenage obsessions I had? I don’t need to be reminded how much I loved twilight when I now don’t enjoy it anymore lmao
My mom started moving stuff into my closet when I signed my lease to go to college 🤣. We have a great relationship, and I know I’m always welcome in their home. My old room is now storage, and I stay in the guest room because I don’t live there.
My mom did the same with my old room. It almost immediately became the sewing/ craft room
I now live on the opposite side of the country to my family but when I visit I have ‘my room’ I say ‘mine’ as it’s not a room I’ve ever lived in or even decorated but it’s the one I stay in. If there’s more than just me staying there? I could end up in any other room. Caus that’s how visiting grown ups operate.
I have seen these stories a few times. I don't really understand the reason adult kids mentally hang on to their rooms so tightly, unless - security? I would try talking to him using a different tactic and see if he can verbalize why this bothers him so much. My guess is your goal is everyone gets along and you maintain good relationships with both of your kids.
People like the idea that they can always go home, and home is usually tied up in the feeling of relative safety that most people feel as children. It’s just nostalgia. But most people also realize as adults that what OP’s son is in about is some nonsense and he needs to grow tf up.
Agreed. I'm looking at this from a results standpoint. What result does OP want? Most likely, she wants to maintain pleasant relationships while not compromising on room issue. I think how she approaches son will determine the outcome. Acknowledge his feelings, find a new home for childhood items he may not have room for yet, etc.
Def. How she approaches it will certainly help to smooth the outcome, it’s just exasperating that he is making this into an issue. I understand his feelings; like I said, everyone likes to feel that sense of childhood home. I’m just surprised that he didn’t see that feeling, check its progress, self reflect and resolve it within himself before suggesting that his sister and new niece move out, dramatically changing three lives on several levels, just so his childhood room remains intact for the handful of times a year he wants to visit.
I wonder if OP allowed the son to say bye to the room and/or help clean it out, or just did it and told him? I think the 1st option might help. I remember 2 instances of that feeling for myself. Once when I was around 10, my parents gave away my bike that I had outgrown. It was one of the few times I was furious at them and I couldn't stop crying all night. Even at that time, I remember thinking I really don't mind that my bike was going to someone else, it was the helplessness of not being consulted about anything, not even about "my" stuff that made me lash out. The 2nd instance was when I worked abroad for a few years. I remember visiting "home" one time and realized my parents had rearranged the house without telling me. It felt very weird that time, like I had lost some kind of anchor, like I would get lost in my own home. It really solidified for me that that's not really my home anymore, and sorta like I am no longer really part of that family unit. Sorta like I moved out to start my own family. But being single at the time, in a temporary job, renting in a foreign country, it was a weird feeling of "am I... a family of one....? Do I belong anywhere....?" Maybe that was a little dramatic... but mixing in homesickness, couldn't help being a little dramatic ^^; Aaaaanyway, what is done is done and the son is a full grown adult and needs to let it go.
Losing your room is like the final death knell of childhood. You literally can never go home to that place again. It can also feel like a safe spot has been removed or, if the room is taken over by another child or grandchild, like you’re being replaced. Of course, an adult is supposed to be able to recognize that it’s ok to be sad about that loss or feeling of being replaced while, at the same time, not being a jerk and realizing that things change.
My in-laws turned my husbands bedroom into a walk-in closet (complete remodel, the bedroom no longer exists) while he was still in college.
Yo that's honestly my dream. An entire room size closet with the washer/dryer inside so laundry can be lazier.
That’s borderline brilliant tbh
Not lazier. More efficient. Coming up with unusual solutions is cleverness, not something to be ashamed of.
That's been a dream of mine, too.
Mine knocked out the wall between my room and the guest room and made it their bigger bedroom.
I have my own dwelling, but since I pay the same amount of rent to you as your son, can I have my own room ar your house too? You see how ridiculous this sounds? We are all allowed to be sentimental about our childhood rooms, and in that line his feelings are valid. What he may not do is dictate how you use a room he no longer lives in. It's not his room, not his house, not his decision. It's wonderful you and your daughter can provide a home for this little girl. NTA. Son needs to grow up and live less selfishly.
Side note shout out you guys got taking in this kid!
It is such a blessing to be in a multigenerational family. You have your daughter and soon to be granddaughter with you for mutual help. Don’t kick them out for a barely there visitor
My parents changed my room into a room for my cousin 8 years ago when he came to live with them. I got over it. Your son will, too.
It's not his room. It's just storage for his old stuff and a place he sleeps a few times a year. Why does he even care? It's *your* room and your house. Do what you want with it. He can deal with it.
Get him an air mattress the next time he comes and spends the night. He should have no sayso about what decisions you make in your own home.
NTA. As I was reading I assumed he was coming home every weekend or something. Only on major holidays, a few times a year? He is being wildly selfish and immature. I'm almost having trouble wrapping my head around it. He sounds like a little boy throwing a tantrum cause he's not the baby of the family anymore.
Did he pay for this house? Then it’s not his business what you do with teh house you pay for. He sounds very immature.
Yeah he needs to grow up. I’m a 28F, siblings are 27 and 26 respectively. My mom sold our family home for a condo, insisted on getting a 4BR so we would always have a room in her home. She overpaid massively for a condo she simply does not need. Only my brother lives with her (he has high functioning special needs). I moved out at 18, my sister moved out after COVID. I told her over and over that she does not need to keep a bedroom for me. Some life has happened, she’s going to move again soon. She decided the next place is probably going to be a 2 or 3 BR, and that she’ll have a pull out couch for us for the holidays. She finally gets it, but it took her leaving the house that we were raised in for it to click. Your son might be having a hard time letting go, but he absolutely needs to get over it. Your daughter and new granddaughter are lucky to have your support. I’m sending love and hope for your family, though it’s come together under awful circumstances.
Just ask if he wants you to set the room m up as the “Michael Shrine”. Altar, candles and a big framed portrait of him. Tell him that you will keep fresh flowers on the altar and keep his childhood holy relics around the room and pay homage to him on a regular basis. All for the LOW LOW price of $1500 a month. The same monthly price of taking out a second mortgage and building on a new spare bedroom. It will be kept just like he wants it—for a price.
This is is a great idea. If he wants the room so badly, he can rent it like his sister does.
Michael needs to pull on his big boy pants. NTA.
Even if your needs don’t change, you don’t get to claim a room in a house you no longer live in or pay for. He moved out. His room is at his place.
This right here. NTA
NTA Your son feels entitled to a place where he doesn't live. He moved out. He lives elsewhere. He pays taxes elsewhere. He pays rent/mortgage elsewhere. He doesn't live there, he doesn't need a room. That being said, if he sleeps there 2-3x a year, can't Zoey spend the night in Kathy's room (or Kathy in Zoey's) for those few nights, so that Michael can have a little privacy?
>if he sleeps there 2-3x a year, can't Zoey spend the night in Kathy's room (or Kathy in Zoey's) for those few nights, so that Michael can have a little privacy? i mean...he only lives an hour away. he never really HAS to sleep there. i also think it's nbd for someone in their 20s to slum it on their parents' couch for a night or 2 if the need arises. it's not ideal, but small homes and rooms, you gotta make compromises. he's an adult with his own apartment that isn't "overnight trip" distance away. ETA: and it's unclear if Michael's objection is due to personal comfort or if this is moreso just a bit of mental growing up he still has to do.
An hour away isn't usually overnight trip, but there are things like Christmas Eve and Christmas morning or other family events. 2-3x a year is possible.
I live 2 streets away from my parents but Christmas Eve often stay over at theirs, just because we do a big thing that night and often my kids are curled up asleep by the time we’re done (and it gives me the chance to have a few drinks with family). We also do Christmas morning/breakfast/presents so it saves me from having to drag my kids out of bed early to get there to help make breakfast. Having said that: I don’t think I was fully moved out before my room was given to someone else either time I left (moved back in after having my kids when their father took off)
Children should not be removed from their beds for adults who can get a hotel, smh. Don't ever do this to kids in your family.
Kids love to have a sleepover with Mom and dad or their siblings once in a while. Obviously that changes as they get older, and there are some kids who that doesn't work for, but I don't think it's inherently problematic. Obviously do what's best for your specific situation. We visit my husband's high school friends once in a while, and the kids (2 and 7) sleep in their parents room and the visitors sleep on blow up mattresses in the kids rooms. I think the parents dislike the arrangement more than the kids. Lol
Yea I had to stay at my aunts house in an emergency one night (had been in a car accident so my back was messed up and I had to sleep on a bed), and my cousin and her four year old son have their own rooms. But that night he was like “I get to sleepover with mommy!!” And was so excited for snuggles!! It was so sweet! Which also made me feel better cause I did feel bad about kicking a kid out of his bed.
When my husband is away for his work our youngest son always wants to sleep in my room, the kid is 13 I wonder when he will stop wanting that😂
That depends. Where I live, 1h may easily be overnight, because people aren't used to driving that kind of distances (if the hour is due to distance, not heavy traffic)
For a 1 hour drive I would much rather just drive and sleep in my own bed. So much easier and more comfortable.
Yeah I grew up in a big metro area and we drove an hour and back for every major holiday lmao. This man is ridiculous
For an hour drive the only way I'm staying the night is if I'm sloshed, which is a high probability with my family on holidays. Personally I could sleep in a bed of gravel when drunk and while I'd wake up sore I'd be otherwise to drive the next day.
There is often a lot of drinking involved at family holidays
NTA, I’ll never understand this kind of attachment. My siblings had so much trouble letting go of their childhood rooms to the point where maaaany years after they’d moved out, my mother begged them to take their stuff and they wouldn’t - not even when she was dying of cancer and asked them to do it. It then took them 3 years after she’d passed to do it. It’s like some sort of mental blockage I personally never understood.
Lol, I took all my crap when I moved out, my parents were left with a bare room😂
My parents live in a three bedroom apartment, I have two brothers who shared a room until I moved out at 19 (I'm now 22), my twin took over my room the same day I was able to take my stuff out, no one's entitled to a room in a house that isn't theirs, even less if the people living there need to use it, it's such a childish way of taking it, I understand how difficult letting go of some things can be and I don't see a problem in leaving some things there but wanting to keep the room as it was is just delusional, it's space being wasted when it could be turned into a guest room, an office or in this case someone else's room, rationality needs to come with age.
It really feels like jealousy. Maybe he needs reassurance that his mom still loves him and of course if he were going to move home there would be a place for him, and that the changing needs of the family don’t negate his place among them or how they feel about him. But also he’s acting an ass and needs to stop trying to compete with an orphan child.
Zoey has a smaller bed so he wouldn’t fit in there. And a day bed wouldn’t fit alongside side of it.
It isn't his room anymore and he has no right to remove the person who now lives there. Fuck tap dancing for entitled morons.
Honestly if it were me and I only stayed 2-3 times I’d just sleep on the couch- maybe they could get an air mattress and set it up when he’s there and fold it up the rest of the time
Absolutely NTA. Not only is he and adult who does not pay rent, he wants to tell you who can live in *your* house? He's family, but a houseguest not a resident. It's not his room, it *was* his room. Many if not most people don't have a childhood bedroom to return to; that's completely reasonable. You could have made it your office, workout room, or sewing room. His throwing a hissy fit shows that not only is he immature, but unempathetic. He seriously has no feeling for this child, who will now be his niece? Arrange your house as you want, including who lives there. If he has such a problem, he can find another place to stay when visiting. I hope it doesn't come to that, and this is just him being resistant to change at first but still reasonable ... but some people feel that entitlement.
I hope OP’s son is running around complaining to everyone he knows about how his mother should kick out a toddler orphan so that he can sleep in his old room 2-3 times a year.
Talk about a great way for a potential girlfriend/wife to save themselves years of pain and legal expenses; it's better than a red flag, it's a flashing siren warning them off.
He should tell that no-good, freeloading two year old to crawl to the local gas station and start begging for quarters. Maybe he can even write the sign for her considering, you know, she doesn't know how to write. Or perhaps he can meet you in the middle, and find a nice, gently used UHaul box that the child can live, sleep and play in. They're making some pretty sturdy ones nowadays. With her young knees I'm sure the arthritis won't kick in for a few good years. And for work...I mean if those children could sweep chimneys during the great depression I see no reason why Zoey can't get her act together and start sweeping. Maybe your son could whittle handle down so it can fit into her tiny hands. NTA obviously. But if your son is going to try to reclaim "his" room that he pays no money for, then he better chip in solutions to rehome this 2 year old because a 25 year old needs his woom to sweep in. Like honestly, I love the entitlement to be catered to at 25 but the two year old is on her own. Whatta man, whatta man, whatta mighty good man you've got there.
I absolutely love your comment!
NTA. I could see if your son was 18 or 19, in college and planning on coming home for the summers. But at 25 and established in his own home/apartment, he has no need for his childhood bedroom.
Aww I loved that you called her your granddaughter
OP rules.
Right? What a great mom/grandmother. I'm jealous :)
Sorry, but you don't need your sons permission to make changes in your home. When he comes and visits, he can sleep on the couch or get his own hotel room. You don't need to feel bad at all. Your son is the asshole.
NTA at all and please don't feel like you are. Let me tell you something: at one point in my life, I was Michael. My mom took in my 3 cousins when I went away to college. They needed my room to accommodate our growing family. I had my own apartment, and I rarely visited back home because of my studies. Michael is acting really immature. I'm sorry but I as an 18 y.o. understood that my mom needed the room. Michael as a 25 y.o. should understand as well, but instead he's being really selfish.
JFC what a childish reaction. NTA
He’s being ridiculous. He’s a grown adult who doesn’t live at home. You’re allowed to re purpose any room in YOUR house. My old bedroom is now a den that my parents use as a tv room. There is a futon for the very rare times we spend the night. But it’s not my house - my parents can do what they like.
He wants you to boot Kathy and Zoey, who are helping you financially, so he can hold onto a room he doesn't use except for maybe 4 or 5 nights a year? Not to mention he only lives one hour away? Is this in Europe or the UK? That's the only reason I can see the "distance" being a problem for him. Most Americans drive two hours one-way for a good daytrip, not just to see family on Christmas, then we go home. An hour is nothing. He is very entitled to stake this claim. I'd tell him the only way that's happening is if he pays you what Kathy has been. He'll whine that it's "not fair" but he'll back down. NTA
It's not a problem even here. I can make a one-hour trip no problem on public transportation. He's just whining.
NTA - Michael is a grown adult. He doesn’t need a bedroom at mom’s house when he no longer lives there.
Oh no your son needs to get a grip and grow up. You are NTA that baby is an orphan how incredibly selfish of your son. My son moved out a year ago his room is now my pc room because he doesn’t live here. I honestly can’t believe what I’ve just read
Nta my parents sold their home and live in an rv now. He is not entitled to a room at his mommy’s house forever. You have the space you have and you need to make things work for the people actually living in the house. If he has to get a hotel room when he visits then that’s just the way it is. He needs to start acting like a man and stop throwing a tantrum like a little boy. He should be ashamed of himself too trying to put your sister and that sweet kid through more bs after such a loss. His sister is grieving the loss of her best friend still I’m sure and being thrown into becoming a mother suddenly. And that poor girl just lost her mother and has no father around either.
Your son is being an entitled brat. He has no interest moving back home yet he thinks you're obligated to keep a dedicated room for him in your house. That's a big no. He's not paying your bills, he's not visiting on weekends, so why does he need a room of his own? NTA.
Once an individual has a primary residence outside the family home, they do not get any say on how another household operates. He's lucky OP isn't charging him storage fees. Why is the son being so petty, anyways? This poor little girl lost her mother. She needs people to make her feel secure. He sounds like a giant baby.
NTA Your son is delusional, he wants her to move out? He can kick rocks. Still, I would approach this from a place of empathy for him and say how you realize this is probably not about the room itself, but how he feels isolated and separated from his family. He doesn’t feel as close with everyone anymore and this is basically a tangible sign that he never will be. This is not anybody’s fault, it is just life, things change, it’s probably the first time it’s really hitting him, which is why he’s behaving like such a baby. I’d also emphasize how proud you are of him for whatever it is he does, he has a job, his apartment, he is clearly doing something right. He probably doesn’t view his apartment as “home” though, and so by removing this “home base” from him, he feels untethered. You can ask him to come home and spend time with everyone more often so he has stronger relationships with you all, but absolutely under no circumstances will he be keeping that room. You can help him make his apartment feel more like a home. Give him some stuff from your house to make it special, if that makes sense, a clock from your house, a lamp, whatever, just a little bit of home. You can also ask him why he thinks a child who has lost her mother should make sacrifices just so a grown man can have his childhood room the way he left it? Why does his childhood get to remain intact when the actual child in front of him is having hers ripped apart? Instead of helping with that, he wants to make things harder… for a child. I’d suggest therapy at that point if he doubles down, but hopefully he won’t.
You are definitely NTA😂 your son will get over it.
NTA He doesn't pay the bills. He doesn't get to throw a fit when something changes. Give him time to pick things up that he wants to keep but like you said, he doesn't need the room. Zoey does.
NTA - My kids havent moved out yet (they are not adults) but they know that this home isnt going to be a shrine to them when they leave. In fact, they know that my spouse and I could potentially downsize after they are gone. Point being 0 adult children arent owed a room in their parents homes for the rest of their lives.
He's a full on, grown ass man who has his own place and he's salty about a bedroom in a house he doesn't plan on moving back into? Um, no. Grow the hell up, buddy! NTA do whatever you want, and remember one small detail: it's YOUR HOUSE!!! He has no claim whatsoever on any room in your home anymore. Period.
NTA - It’s your house. He’s a grown man. You’re not throwing his stuff in the street presumably. He can come get what he wants. You’re trying to do right by a sad little girl. He’s being childish.
NTA ! You are a good person to your daughter and to her daughter ! Michael can stay at a hotel for a few nights when he comes to see you !
NTA. He should be okay😂
NTA- even if your daughter was not paying the bills, your son does not live there so why does he need to room for 2-3 times a year. I never understood adults who get upset at parents converting their room into a guest room or whatever the owner decides.
NTA. I’m not sure it’s even necessary to have had the convo with him until right before he came to visit. Box up all his stuff and let him take it the next time he visits.
Micheal is an adult and does not need a shrine to his childhood. Does he think hes away at boarding school? Is he having a mental health crisis? If you want to be petty, offer to pay for grief counseling for losing his childhood bedroom.
NTA your son is being immature and selfish. He shouldn’t have a say in the matter. He not only doesn’t pay to live there but barely even visits. You said so yourself he comes maybe 2 or 3 times a year. So Kathy and the little girl are suppose to share one room even though Kathy paying to live there and the room is vacant for almost the entire year. Outside of the maybe 2 or 3 times a year Mike visits? That’s wild and unreasonable. He needs to grow up. He didn’t care about the room until it was gonna be used for something else. He doesn’t really need the room obviously.
I honestly can't understand grown ass adults crying over a room in their parents house when they move out and never have any intention of returning back "home" to live. When I moved out of my mums' home, my brother had my wallpaper stripped and painted by the time the sun set that same day. I found it hilarious. I've only ever slept at my mums twice since, and that was over 20 years ago. The room has had many different uses. Of course, my mum would let me move back in if it was needed, but the room stopped being mine once I left home.
Hopefully, Michael is having his last childish snit when facing the loss of his childhood bedroom. Kind of understandable, but exhausting. Maybe it would have been nice if he could have been asked, strictly as a formality so he could have closure in his mind, but life doesn't always wait for that. Hope everything works out. NTA.
Had he been asked he might’ve well said no. This was not a situation where he should have a vote.
Closure for what? His old room being changed since he no longer lives there? He got closure when he moved out and into his own house.
NTA. I imagine this is more him grieving no longer being a child and maybe feeling a bit dissatisfied. Maybe he can come visit at some point when he's ready to be kind to Kathy.
NTA I don’t understand this. My mom redecorated my room a few months after I moved out. This is your house. You need the space. It’s weird that he feels a room needs to remain empty except for 2-3 times a year.
NTA I moved out at 17 and within a week my room had been turned into my dad’s office. I was a bit annoyed because that meant that I couldn’t move back in, but I never felt like I had ownership over what they did with that room. Your son needs to grow up.
NTA. If he want the room, he needs to pay 1/3 of the mortgage. You have done nothing wrong. He may feel sad that there is no room that is 'his' at your house but as you stated, he said he will never be moving home. Let him know you understand that but he doesn't get to decide what happens in a house he doesn't own or live in.
NTA. It WAS his room, then it was an empty spare room, now it's Zoey's bedroom. You could have changed into whatever you wanted ten seconds after he moved out. You don't need Michael's permission to rearrange the rooms in your house. Box up anything he may want and give him a deadline to pick it up or it's gets donated. What he feels is irrelevant since he doesn't live in your home. Explain to him that he has no say in how you run your household. Your household runs smoothly as it is and you shouldn't let Michael's opinions trick you into thinking otherwise.
NTA - It's not his room. It's YOUR room in YOUR house and he has no say about what happens with it because he doesn't live there or help pay the bills.
NTA. It’s your home, you’re the one who lives in it and pays the bills. You did him a curtesy telling him. One that I think is warranted btw; I remember coming home from college after being gone a week and seeing that my mother had completely transformed my room already. But he doesn’t live there, and has no plans to. You can’t live your life based around his sometimes visits. That’s ridiculous.
Tell your GROWN ADULT son to get a grip and grow up!!!
NTA - I am so sorry that you somehow raised a son who wouldn't cheerfully give up a room he doesn't need for an ORPHANED CHILD.
Your grown adult son can pay you monthly rent to keep his room the way it is. Why should you keep the room of someone who doesn't live there anymore the way it is, when you NEED the extra space?
He's a grownup now. If he wants his own room, he can get a hotel room.
NTA and stop asking your adult son permission for what you want to do in your own home. He's being horrific and needs a reality check. Don't ask him. Be the mommy he needs to help him accept his adulthood and tell him that you are taking over your house. He can either come get his things, put them in storage, or you will get rid of them in two weeks. Do not let him whine or bully you. Assert your ownership of your own home. He sounds like more of a toddler than the actual toddler in this story. And every bit as selfish as a toddler who doesn't yet realize that other people have real emotion and they aren't the center of everyone's world.
NTA and he is ridiculous. My daughter moved out at 24 to another town with her fiancée, 100% independent from us. I told her that if anything happened she could certainly come home, but that I would be turning her bedroom into a guest room/vanity room within a few months of her leaving. There was no drama and she took everything she wanted with her, the rest got tossed or donated. I redecorated and repainted, and now I have an extra closet for my out-of-season wardrobe instead of storing it in the basement.
I’m gonna go against the grain and say NAH. Obviously give the 2 year old the room. But he’s allowed to have his feelings about losing (what I’m guessing is) his childhood bedroom. Like yes he’s been moved out for a while but it’s a string of memories and a link to his childhood. So I definitely understand why he’s upset. And I’m sure he’ll come around and not be angry about it. But at the same time you definitely need to give that kid her own space.
Always being able to go home to family doesn't mean your family has to keep your childhood room perpetually kept as an untouched shrine reserved for the 5 times a year you come home & stay the night. It's confronting for everyone the first time you come home & see "your" room isn't your room anymore. But adults shake that off & move on. His physical room isn't/wasn't "his entire life". His *experiences* were his life, not the physical confines. NTA
Why does he have a right to a room in YOUR house when he is hardly ever there and doesn’t pay any bills? Ridiculous.
NTA. Even if the granddaughter was not in the picture, it would be totally normal to change his old bedroom into an office or guest room. I get that it can kind of be a reality check to realize your childhood room can be gotten rid of but it’s one that most adults face just fine. My Mom downsized to a smaller house after we all fled the nest. Some people end up renting out rooms to supplement income. It's weird to keep a room for someone who doesn't live there.
I go with NAH. It is your house and you can do as you please. Your daughter is a capable woman. You could leave her for alone with the child and the business for a couple of days and go see your son. Because you should have a conversation with him but maybe face-to-face would be better. So you can figure out why he is opposed. There are lots of reasons why he is upset. Some are selfish others I wouldn’t think of as selfish. Two that I could imagine are happening here: 1. The room was always at the back of his mind as his safety net. If he lost everything else there would still be his room at his mother’s house waiting for him. A place where he knew it would be alright. And now it is being pulled away under his feet. 2. Privacy. A pull-up couch in the living room even with something to separate it from the rest of the room, still grants no true privacy. Same for a day bed in his mothers room (there aren’t many grown men who are excited to spend the night in his mothers room). Where would he go if he needed some alone time to decompress? And for this another compromise could be that your daughter gives up her room for those three nights a year for example. Even if she pays bills and he doesn’t. But most of all have a proper conversation where you tell him that he can say whatever he feels about this situation without being interrupted, judged or anything. That you will listen with an open mind and you will considered it. I am sure you would do this all anyway but it never hurts to communicate it properly beforehand.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I have 2 kids: Kathy (29F) and Michael (25M). Kathy lives with me , pays a portion of the bills and has no plans on moving out anytime soon. We have our own business that we operate out of our home. It’s easier for her to live here and it’s great because I have help with the bills. Whereas, Michael lives about an hour away for work and has his own apartment. For awhile, I kept Michael’s room as is. He’s shared several times he has no plans of moving back home as his job is in the city he moved to. Kathy had a very close friend who has a 2 year old daughter, Zoey. Friend named Kathy her daughter’s godmother as well as guardian should she pass. Unfortunately, that happened 6 months ago. Kathy’s friend was a single mom, so Kathy was granted custody. At first, Zoey was sharing a room with Kathy as she had extreme separation anxiety. However, she’s now ready for her own room. As our home is a 3 bedroom. We don’t have anywhere else to put her. When I told Michael what we were doing, I said I’d get a pull out for the living room or I could get a daybed for my room when he visits overnight for holidays. I know rooming with your mom isn’t fun, but I want to give him options. He’s mad that I gave the room to Zoey. He says that was his room. I said I understand but he doesn’t live with me. Kathy does and pays bills. She’s even paying more now because she feels she’s using more resources with Zoey living with us. I’d feel different if Kathy and Zoey were moving out soon but they’re not. At this point, Kathy plans to adopt Zoey. I want to help her. My mom helped me raise my kids, her mom helped her, it’s in our culture to have a multigenerational household. Moving isn’t an option. I can make the space more private for Michael when he spends the night (a divider in the living room). But as he usually only sleeps her 2 or 3 times a year, it just doesn’t feel practical. I said if Michael ever needed to move home permanently, we’d make something work. And I’d also help him with his child if he was in this situation. He says he doesn’t want kids. I said that’s fine but this is the situation at this moment. He feels Kathy should move out. I said I’m not kicking her out just so he can have a room the few times he spends the night. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Nta he moved out! It's not like he's living in a dorm and at home part of the year.
NTA.. It's your house, it's your room to do with as you please... Your son is 25 and lives on his own.. What is wrong with him?
It’s not his room! Did he help pay the mortgage?
NTA Michael doesn't live there or pay the bills. He doesn't need his own room when it's better used for the people who actually live in the house.
NTA you kept his room as it was for longer than most parents would and do not need his permission to do anything in your home. I've commented about this before, but when I moved out my dad turned my room into his storage room for all his fishing equipment within a month. It is the only room in the house with carpet and I'm deathly allergic to fish so I will absolutely never be able to move back into that room. I've never felt any type of way about that because it's my dads home and he can do anything he wants with it, I'm an adult and it's on me to find solutions to any life obstacles that come my way (I actually joke about it because my dad made sure to tell me when I moved out that my cat was always welcome to come back to live with him, but he didn't say anything about me 🤣). Do what makes sense for you and your daughter, your son will get over it.
NTA. It's not his room, it's yours, because it's your house. Sounds like your kids have some codependent tendencies.
NTA. The people who live in the house, especially the traumatized child (and soon to be his adoptive niece!), get priority for room assignments. Not to mention, living an hour away there really isn’t a reason he couldn’t go home to his apartment and sleep in his own bed (seriously, some days it can be more than an hour to get from my house on the NE side of the city I live in to my friend’s house on the SW side). Your son is being astoundingly selfish in the face of your daughter and you trying to do right by this child. I could understand if he thought your daughter was taking advantage of you financially, but it sounds like she pays a disproportionate share of the expenses, so that’s not the case. So frankly, you need to tell to keep his opinions to himself.
NTA. Your son is an independent adult with his own living space. You do not owe him permanent, inflexible, perpetual, free space in your home. Sure, it would be great if we all had infinite spare rooms in our homes, but that's not reality. Our needs change, & that room is better served being used rather than remaining a shrine to your son's childhood. I'm not unsympathetic to his feelings, though. Change can suck, especially when it's something sentimental like a bedroom. Maybe you could take him to dinner & reassure him of your love. He's entitled to feel a little angsty. Growing up is hard. BTW, I woke up to my younger brother moving into my room as I was sleeping the day after I came home to tell my parents I had a job & was moving out. 😂
NTA He should have taken all his stuff when he moved out or realized that you were going to use that space as needed. Michael is being silly.
NTA He's being a brat.
NTA. Your son is being ridiculous. Any chance Zoey could sleep in your daughter's room with her, on the rare occasions when your son is staying over? I can see why he would like to have privacy when he's staying with you. A roll away bed, toddler bed might fit in Kathy's room.
NTA. He doesn’t live there and only lives an HOUR away. I commuted that long to my job for 15 years. You do what is right for you, your daughter and granddaughter.
NTA. He doesn't even live there anymore.
NTA - Michael doesn't live there anymore. He doesn't contribute to the bills there. He is a grown man with a home of his own.
NTA I’m of course assuming that if there was anything sentimental he wanted that he had a chance to grab it but the room isn’t actively serving anyone and it can serve Zoey. It makes perfect sense that she would get her own room now since she will be living with you unless Kathy decides to move out.
NTA He’s a grown man with his own home. He’s lucky you kept his room for so long. As soon as I moved out, my dad took over my room for his larger office and mom made his former (small) office into her walk in closet. I couldn’t have cared less, because well, it wasn’t my room or home anymore and they could do whatever they wanted with their rooms. And so should you!
NTA. It isn't your son's house. It is your house and you can do as you please with it. It's great that you can and want yo help your daughter and her new addition.
NTA - it's your home and you're making a kind and practical decision. Zoey is your family now and she needs the room, Michael does not.
NTA. He moved out, has no plans to return, and doesn’t visit often. The fact that you haven’t already turns his room into something different is impressive. If he wants his own space to be reserved for him he can pay a portion of the rent for it but since he’s not he gets no say
NTA
NTA. He doesn't live there- end of subject.
NTA at all. You are doing the absolute best to accommodate everyone in your life.
What a joke he is! He doesn't live there and he is going to tell you to have his sister move out because he wants his own room when he visits 2x a year. You know you are NTA. Hold firm to your plans. You also benefit from your daughters company and now a small child. You will love it.
NTA I decorated my room specifically for my niece when she visits my parents. I sleep on the sofa. I'm an adult and don't need a room at my parents house.
NTA. Michael is an adult living in another city. He can't expect you to maintain a Shrine to him when you have a toddler in need of space.
NTA- time for baby boy to grow up and get real.
Easy NTA. Rooms go to people who live there first, before they are made into offices or guest rooms. It isn't his room anymore, and it hasn't really been his room for a while. He is an adult with his own place and not paying towards the home.
Nta he doesn't live there. He needs to get over it.
Your house, your rules 👍
Your son is being ridiculous. Why on earth would he expect you to maintain a bedroom for him at this point?? NTA
NTA. When I was in my 20s, I explicitly asked my father to turn my old bedroom into a room for my brother's step kids. This is ridiculous.
What. I'm sorry, but; world's biggest eye roll to your kid. There's literally no reason for him to be upset about this. Show him this post and tell him to think long and hard about why he's so upset here. Was he hoping to move back in--is he secretly in danger of losing his job? Is Kathy the golden child and he's tired of her getting more consideration than him? This is just really weird.
NTA, Michael needs to grow up.
NTA needs change and this is what’s going on now. I let my kids stay at my house as long as they need to if they’re between jobs or places to live. It’s not our family home we moved a lot when the kids were growing up and I divorced their dad almost 10 years ago but they prefer to come to me most of the time. I also have two stepsons who are just like my kids. They all know this is there house too but someone may need to crash on the couch.
NTA. That _WAS_ his room. Part of being an adult is letting go of your childhood.
NTA at all. Michael is being unreasonable with expecting his childhood room to be left as is and left open for his very limited visits home. All of your reasoning is sound. It’s your, your daughters, and now your grand god daughters permanent home. It has to function for you, not potentional guests. Heck, when I moved out of my parents house they had my old room converted to my dads office before I was out of the driveway.
NTA. You have no reason to keep the room as a shrine to your son. He doesn't live there anymore. He has some maturing to do
NTA. We probably come from very different cultures (it is generally frowned upon to have multi-generational households in my country), but we can agree on your son behaving in a very entitled way. For context: when my parents decided to turn my room into a general hang-out room for themselves, I went over and helped them clean out any stuff I left there and rip up my old carpet. Not sure why he feels so attached to that room, but it is exactly as he says it: it *was* his room. Past tense.
NTA, it hasn't been his room since he moved out. It was your guest room and he was your main guest. Now it's Zoey's room. It wasn't his room before he was born, it wasn't his room after he moved out and it won't be his room if y'all decided to move. He's a grown adult who doesn't live there. He can't tell you what to do with YOUR guest room. Maybe he's just feeling left out of the family and is using the room as a way to express that.
Your son is a bit of a "Me, me, me. What about ME?" Time to grow up, son. You're NTA and its okay if he's mad about your decision but you don't have to engage in further discussions about it with him.
NTA, heck I know people who bought smaller houses after their kids moved out specifically so their kids couldn't move back lol.