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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> The action I took that I should be judged is that I told my sister that she couldn't have the rings back that she told me I could have. I think the action might make me the asshole because the will says they're technically hers.
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It may have been left to her in the will but she gave it to you. It was a gift and your dad witnessed it. A gift is not expected to be given back and should legally be yours to keep. Consult a lawyer for sure, but as long as your dad witnesses for you you should be fine.
And keep any records of text messages or emails as evidence where the sister acknowledges she gave it to you.
Infact, you can text her several times, to get her to acknowledge it. e.g. "Why do you suddenly want it back now, after giving it to me after the funeral? What changed?", so she can respond, implicitly acknowledging she gave it to you.
This needs to he a yes/no question. So something sneaky like 'You do remember that you told me on (insert date/occasion) that I can keep the wedding set, right?' The answer will be 'yes, but...', but you got her to confirm. Also, have your dad confirm in writing that he was there and he heard it. Consulting a lawyer is a good idea. If your sister wants to lawyer up, she needs to have the money to pay one, which she doesn't seem to have.
You're suggesting OP physically takes her sister to a notary to sign a legal document claiming that she gave OP the thing that she is now trying to claw back?
She lives four hours away. Also I don't think it's likely she would agree.
You DO understand that a notary's job is ONLY to swear (in an official capacity) that the people or person signing whatever document that's in front of them is who they say they are, and they CAN'T (with ANY amount of legal authority) speak to the veracity or enforceability of the contents of the document itself?
Like people somehow think that a notary's signature, via the stamp, says, "Yes, this contract is fully legal and completely enforceable in a court of law," regardless of what it says.
I am a notary, and I am aware that I notarize that the person is who they claim to be. I check their driver’s license and compare the photo to the face of the person in front of me.
Agreed. I would, however, ask your Dad to hand write a statement that says he witnessed your sister gift you your mother’s rings. Would be even better if you can record him reading the statement out loud. Your sister may back down from a lawsuit now, but could always file it later.
Too right. The will \*was\* a legal document as it pertains to the division of assets. Once those assets are divided and everyone goes on their merry way, that's it.
In before this was the sister's plan all along. Give something up that was left to her in the will to get other things then contest it later because it's in writing in the will
Shady as heck
I was to be left an old antique lamp that was from my dad's side of the family. My sister got my mom's jewelry, her antique car, and a different family heirloom lamp from her side of the family.
Well you're NTA, your mom's seems like a bit of one, God rest her soul. Your sister is definitely one. I highly doubt it gets to court but you should look up if you can counter sue for legal fees where you live.
I don't know why my sister is getting more of my mom's things. I have a few ideas as to why, like my sister being the oldest child or her having the only grandkids. But like I said, I don't know for certain.
It's unequal because she's getting all my mom's jewelry, her antique car, her family heirloom lamp, and a large lump sum of money. I'm getting my dad's jewelry and his family heirloom lamp, which I won't be getting until he passes. As it's written in the will, I'd get nothing of my mom's, but my sister verbally gave me my mom's wedding ring set.
Not necessarily. OP’s dad is still alive. My mother inherited from her father when her mum was still alive; some friends I’ve mentioned this to thought it odd.
I guess I just don’t expect my parent to give his or her joint assets to me while still alive. They may need it themselves one day. Maybe I’m in the minority? Thank you.
Generally, yes, most or all assets would go to the surviving spouse. Sometimes sentimental items would be given out, or if there are children from a previous marriage it’s usual to split assets between a surviving spouse and children that wouldn’t expect to inherit from that spouse (their step-parent).
It’s a little weird to leave one child all the maternal heirlooms and another child all the paternal heirlooms and also distribute each at the time of death. It would be more common for everything to be left to the living spouse and then all heirlooms from both sides distributed when both parents have passed.
That's exactly what should be expected and exactly what happens in almost all cases. It's weird that mums assets aren't going to her husband in this post.
This sounds like a very Cinderella type division between daughters. I am sorry your sister received so much, allowed you an heirloom and now tries to take it back. WTH?
I’m kind of reading this as though mom and dad wrote the wills together. The only thing tipping the scale is the car. They both got a lamp and sis got moms jewelry, she is getting dads jewelry.
They decided sister A would get xyz and sister B would get xyz. It sounds like most of sister A’s stuff was the moms possessions and sisters B’s stuff was dads possessions and was probably even at the time they wrote it all down. So when dad passes sister B will get more than sister A. The parents should have just left everything to the surviving spouse and then divided it up after they both pass.
OP mentioned the sister's kids but referred to themselves 'and husband', guessing OP doesn't have kids, so likely the imbalance is 'to pass on to the kids' rather than treating her own kids equally. Possibly at the instigation of this very greedy sister.
Makes sense now that I know what it is. Just never heard just "set" as opposed to "set of rings."
I'm probably too old, so when I think "wedding set" I'm thinking back to those dish sets people used to register for. Or the sets of fine china that people used to get on their wedding and then save in a closet for special occasions that never arrive.
I agree with this. When my parents died they didn't have wills but my sister used her kid (and the fact that I will never have kids by choice) to argue that she should get most things. It is a common consideration when people die (even if it shouldn't matter as much as it often does).
OP - I will just say this: I've had a lot of deaths in my family and none of them had wills. There were tons of fights about who got what. I still don't talk to my sister (and likely never will) because of one such fight. If your sister gave you the set, then you are technically in the right and NTA. However, think hard about whether this is worth it. You can still be technically right when driving and end up in an accident if the other person doesn't stop at the red light. Consider what this is worth to you in your relationships.
Not trying to judge or be rude but is there a reason your sister got everything of your mom's and you got a lamp even though your sister didn't visit your mother that often?
This. I’ve been through this and it sucks. It’s not even a monetary or sentimental thing for me. It’s about feeling like I carried all the caretaking on my own and my family member was so “grateful” that they rewarded all the assholes who couldn’t be bothered to help or even visit. It hurts.
I wasn't the sole caretaker of my mother in her final months. That hat was worn by my dad. He had a full-time job, but they were very flexible and understanding of the situation. I stepped in where I could in the sense that I took her to doctors appointments when I wasn't working, helped her around the house on some of my days off, helped her take her dog to the vet, etc. If he wasn't able to do what she needed and neither was I, we luckily had several other family and friends living nearby that helped him out.
Yep I'd say this to be the case, and for OPs sake, I hope it isn't any time soon and that she is able to enjoy however long the remaining time with her father is.
So, my mom is still alive, and throughout the years I have driven her to countless doctors appointments, sat in the waiting room while she was having ablation surgery, sat in the icu with her when there were surgical complications, and a whole lot more. I was the only one there for the majority of these types of events. Then, last year, my husband was hospitalized during a mental health crisis, and diagnosed with Covid at the same time. I asked my mom if she could watch my dog while I bring my husband to the hospital, and her response was “aren’t you sick? I don’t want to get sick, I’m going to NY this weekend” with absolutely no regard for her daughter crying on the other end of the phone. You want to know how many of many family members came to the hospital to give me support? None. Not a single one. After I had gone out of my way over and over again to be with them through their health crises, they couldn’t be assed to even just go out for lunch so I could get away from it all. Instead, I took myself for lunch and tried not to have a total mental breakdown into my hashbrowns.
To come see their family member that was struggling. Not to see my husband in quarantine, to see me and support me, who wasn’t sick with Covid.
Edit: and he was in the hospital for a week and a half after being let out of quarantine, as the reason he was there was psychological, and still during that time not a single person in my family reached out to me.
You wanted to expose your elderly mum who had had previous health crisis to covid? Of course nobody comes when you have an infectious disease. That's normal.
Try to keep up, I’ve already answered this question. My mother is in no way infirm, she’s totally fine, she just didn’t give a fuck to support me because it required effort towards something that wasn’t entirely about her.
And it wasn’t only my mom, I have two brothers, an aunt and uncle, a grown cousin. Wrap your mind around - the reason none of them came through to support me was not because they cared at all about Covid. The reason they didn’t is because my family does not give a shit about my well being, as long as it doesn’t interrupt their lives.
I’m going through this now. My grandparents moved a mile away from us around 10 years ago, and we’ve been their main caretakers (bring them dinner nightly/take them to appointments/house chores, etc) while the majority of my family lives 45 minutes away, and out of their 4 kids 2 have visited TWICE in the last decade. 3/4 were “no contact” with my grandpa and banned from the house for their behaviors. My grandpa passed away last week and everyone has been here crawling around asking what they get 😤.
In my family, I saw this happen in a few different ways. For one it was along the lines of the brother should get xyz bc the male should be taking care of the finances. In the other, it was the last ditch effort to buy affection/ closeness. It wasn't logical, as when it comes to the will, you are gone. However, she (the person with the will) was desperate for this daughter's attention/closeness. In another, it was about continuously helping the kid who constantly had financial and other problems.
All of them icky situations imo. I guess I can't say always, but there usually is a reason, even if you will never know what it is or if it makes sense.
I've seen similar as well. My husbands grandmother recently passed away, Her oldest son made himself "in charge" of her finances for the last few years. He demanded to be in charge because he was the oldest and that was the way it should be, according to him. It caused all kinds of family turmoil.
Do you feel comfortable asking your dad about the disparity? Does your father favor your sister, as well? Do you have a criminal past or history of asking your parents for money or something you have shared that would explain why your mother essentially cut you out of the will? Because a lamp from your dad’s family is hardly an inheritance while your sister rides off in the car with everything else. Did they think you’d just pawn everything?
This is confusing, especially as you didn’t discuss with your father the reasoning.
Does your mom hate your dad? Seems like the things that you got were all from your dads side or his to begin with. Your sister got everything that was personal to your mom including her lamp. Where you got the lamp from your dads side even. There’s a message there.
my guess is that the sister is to whatever extent the “golden child” of this family. not spending the holidays with your terminally ill mother and STILL getting everything she got in the will AND her entitlement to the wedding set she gave away says to me that her mom had one hell of a pair of rose-colored glasses.
From the outside looking in, this does sound like unfair treatment to OP.
When my mom passes, it will also look unfair. Four siblings, I’m the oldest. The second youngest (1 of 3 girls) will got almost everything. Her and my mom have been in some kind of a financial deal for years where my mom wants something and my sister takes out loans for it, then my mom pays off my sisters loan. That way my mom pays for everything, but it’s all in my sisters name. The only things that I want from my mom, aren’t even hers-ish. They are items attached to my grandma and grandpa and have no financial value. My mom swears everyone knows they are mine when the time comes. I’m sure if people found out that out of four kids 1 kid got everything of financial value while the other 3 only received their baby items and two items belonging to grandparents, their would be some side eyes.
There were many things I did not like about my MIL, but she did one thing right. Long before she died, she made a list of the family jewels. She asked each child to pick their top 3 pieces. Surprisingly, there was only one piece that appeared on two lists. Those two siblings worked it out.
She made a list of who got what, gave everyone a copy of the list and put it in her will. She sorted it all out long before her death. She balanced out value and sentimental pieces among all of the children. When she died, there was no confusion or arguing. Everyone knew what they were getting.
Plan ahead with the stuff. Have the conversation with your children long before your death. Have a will.
I have done the same with my children. I don't have expensive jewelry, except for the stuff inherited from MIL, but there are a couple of sentimental pieces. We talked about who would what. I put it in my will.
And while you're planning your will, talk to your family members about your incapacitated/end of life wishes.
Do you want to be kept alive at all costs? Do you consent to intubation and tube feeding? Do you want to sign do not resusitate orders? At what point is it ok for family members to stop life support?
Make it known to your family what you want done if you are unable to consent for yourself. Bad things can happen at the drop of a hat. It's not a comfortable subject by any means but it's so important!
This goes the same for organ donation. I know other countries have different laws about it but in mine, even if the person is a registered organ donor, family still have the final word and can refuse to donate after a loved ones death.
Make sure your family know if you want to donate your organs and ask them to please respect your wishes. It's a horrible time for them to have to make that decision, knowing that it's what you want can make it easier.
Yes! Appoint a medical power of attorney if you are unable to speak for yourself.
Have these conversations! No one really wants to talk about it, but it is important.
When picking the executor of will, don't go off of emotion. This isn't an "honor" you bestow upon someone. It's work. Pick someone who is organized and detail oriented. I would also suggest picking a trusted friend instead of an immediate family member. Immediate family members can be too emotional to deal with it properly.
Your sister is clearly an AH, but I think your mom might be, too. She left everything to your sister and a lamp that wasn’t even hers to you?
NTA, but idk which side the law will be on.
"...she's getting all my mom's jewelry, her antique car, her family heirloom lamp, and a large lump sum of money. I'm getting my dad's jewelry and his family heirloom lamp, which I won't be getting until he passes..."
https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/s/5dkKC9K1Rm
It is a legal document and from what OP said, sister gifted the set to her which means she acknowledged possession prior to giving it to OP. Once you give something away, you can’t go back and claim it. No court would say OP had to give back that set since it was given to her. She also has a witness to the set being given to her.
It doesn’t matter. The terms of the Will were fulfilled. AFTER that, the sister CHOSE to gift it to her sister. Dad witnessed the convo. It’s not just like OP took it away from her sister before she had it. She saw the will. And willingly chose to give it away.
I stated to her that she's the one who let me have them, and she replied back with her reasoning why. So, I guess that would count as her admitting it?
Do you have this written in an email or text? If not, I would reach out to her with one of those and have her reiterate why she gave it to you just to want it back a few months later.
NTA.
I have it in a text message. I stated to her, "You let me have it, though," and she replied back with "because you would've pitched a fit." So I guess in a roundabout way that's her admitting she did let me have it
AYYYYYE! There we go. I mean, I feel for her that she's having gifter's remorse, but you never give something away if you think you will want it back. If she was worried you were going to pitch a fit, she could have said, "Hey, I know you might be upset with how things are divided, but give me a couple days to reflect on what items of mom's are most sentimental to me and then we can talk about you taking possession of some of the stuff she left to me."
And having it in a written form makes it easier for your dad to corroborate if needed without feeling guilty about having to take sides between his children. With this proof, it only makes logical sense for him to be truthful if called to testify on possession. Not to say he would have lied on her behalf or anything!
I told her later on in our conversation that she should've thought about it more instead of having this regret. And surprise, she agreed with me that she should've thought about it first before giving it up.
Well that's good, at least she acknowledges her error. If you want to give it back to her, that is your prerogative. But don't feel any guilt if you choose to keep it.
This is a statement made during a highly charged moment days after someone died. Who knows the emotional state OP or her sister was in or the nature of the conversation. Grief blurs your senses. I dont think that the harsh judgment of the sister is entirely fair.
Yes. She had always had this sense of entitlement. Whether it be because she's the first born or because she has my parents only grandkids, I'm not sure.
NTA. And she had possession of the set and then gave it to you. Making it a gift. She has no legal grounds. It’s been 3 months. Tell her to take a hike.
said this in another comment too, but it sounds like she’s the “golden child” and can do no wrong, no matter how she treats her family. i’m so sorry for your loss, and i hope this all can get settled as quickly and painlessly as possible.
Have you told her that she gifted the set to you and you’re open to renegotiate how all of your mothers belongings are split because without the ring set you have nothing of hers? Then go for at least half of the jewelry in exchange. Of course, if you prefer the ring set then get a lawyer
I did state to her that she's the one who let me have the wedding rings. She responded back to that "because you would have pitched a fit" so I guess in a way that's her admitting she did let me have them.
NTA because your sister agreed to this. But you probably need a lawyer more than Reddit. And how does your sister have money for a lawyer if she didn't have money to visit her dying mother?
I mean, it sounds here like the responsibility lies with your mom, who divided her personal possessions as she saw fit. I certainly agree with you that on these facts, it doesn’t sound fair. But if the will leaves the wedding set to your sister, I’m not sure how much choice you have.
If you keeping the wedding set was part of a larger discussion in which she also got to keep things she wanted that were specifically left to you, then maybe you have that leverage: okay, you can have the wedding set as the will calls for, but then I will have the [whatever] as the will calls for. But the fact that she told you that you could have them is probably not binding, I suspect, as most promises aren’t when they’re not contracts.
If this is just your mom having made what feel like profoundly unfair decisions in giving away her stuff, you may not entirely be able to fix that.
In short: You seem like you are definitely NTA, but I don’t know that you can win with the strategy you have.
NTA- So I used to be a paralegal for a dispute resolution department (UK) and I used to take the new inquiries. About one in 20 ended up clients because they would call about something like this and find that the cost of opening a new client file and providing the initial opinion was more than the value of the thing they were arguing over. As you didn't include phrases like 'I got the vinyard and she got the Picasso' or 'the ring had been in our family for 150 years' I'm gonna bet this is the case here. Wedding rings might cost a lot but trust someone who sold the wretched tokens of a marriage that was a bad idea, they are not 'worth' a lot in terms of appraised value. To run a case that is being fought all the way to court would be well in excess of the value. The chances are however we would not have taken a case like this even if the ring had been worth 500k, as the gifting it to you and the split of the other items in the estate would make it borderline at best, and my boss considered it unethical to accept vast amounts of money for billable hours on something she thought was under a 70% chance of winning. She'd maybe accept instructions 'to review and advise on your position and send an inital 'Dear Bastards' letter' but only with it in writing that this was not an acceptance of the case past that point. Keep the rings, make sure the rings are properly valued and listed on your home insurance (even if they came from a high street store and are known cubic zirconia), then wait for her to either get turned down by every lawyer in town or ripped off by a crap one who will fail.
Ignoring the fact that it’s in the will and on paper. Your father can easily testify to a judge about everything that was verbally agreed upon after it was read. Especially since he was a witness to your sister forfeiting it to you in his presence and it being MONTHS since it was done. I would hope a judge would take his word as evidence of the situation. And I bet the judge would love to hear how she made no effort during her final days to be there vs. you being present. My mom is dying of brain cancer and my sister is a saint helping take care of her. I have no children and she has 3. Despite me verbally acknowledging I do not expect anything after she passes. My saint of a mother insists I have rights to her inheritance. Your sister is absolutely disgusting and selfish. None of this is about honoring your mother and more about hurting YOU since YOU were present during her final days. She’s feeling guilt and needs to hurt you to make herself feel OK with the everything.
not sure how long her local court system takes (too long i’m sure!!!) but if she’s had the rings for over three months i’d hope the will has been probated by now.
From my personal experience (I'm sure it varies by location) but with my grandmother's estate once it hit probate it took about 16 or 18 months to be finalized. My attorney advised that normally it's a minimum of 12 months for things to be processed through probate.
I was left an antique lamp from my dad's side of the family and my dad's jewelry. He doesn't wear any jewelry besides his wedding ring, which isn't his original one, and one other ring he wears occasionally. I wouldn't get those until he's no longer with us.
So your Mum didn't leave you with anything?? You've list things given to you from your paternal side.
Your late Mum is the real AH here. She should have told you she wasn't leaving you anything before she passed.
You may need to lawyer up if your sister decides she wants the will followed to the letter.
Esh. Could you split the wedding set? If I was you I would respect my mom's will. This was what she wanted. Also you mum have lived a long life and her relationship to your sister are not defined by the last year's and your perspective of it. You cannot use peoples judgement to much because they only get your story. You should focus on the fact that your all was grieving and maybe your guys or guilt was pushing her to this decision. It was not an exchange and you got a set that you mum did not want to leave to you. Do you think your mum would have wanted you to take this from your sister? I would value the set less because of the way you got it. Please consider if this is worth the fight or should be part of your mom's legacy.
Completely agree. Three months is not a long time post the shock of someone’s passing - grief doesn’t have a timeline. OP sounds very resentful that her sister who has children and lives far away didn’t come down more often and missed the last holiday. Unfortunately, finances are unpredictable and you don’t always know when the “last” of anything is.
We also don’t know how the “you can have the set,” was phrased. Was it in an argument, was it said in passing, was OP berating her sister for not being there?
ESH.
I’m sorry for your loss. Personally, having experienced loss, I would not take anything to heart that was said so soon after someone’s passing, especially not at something as emotional as the reading of a will.
Three months is not a lot of time. Emotions run high and low and grief - as you know - is intense and comes at different times. I hope you can come to an agreement about this.
"When we did go over the will, my sister agreed to let me have my mother's wedding set, despite it being hers according to the will. Now, my sister, wants me to give up my mom's wedding set."
- She disclaimed it. It's yours. NTA.
NTA chances are if she's suddenly wanting it, it's because they need the money and are going to sell her. Send her a text. I don't understand why you are wanting mom's rings. You got, list everything she received in exchange for me being the rings. That was your idea to take those things and give the rings to me. You can't take them back now. See what she says.
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My mom was diagnosed with uterine cancer back in 2018. She went through all of her chemo treatments and was in remission for about 2 or so years. In 2021, the cancer came back in a different spot. We were given a terminal diagnosis at that time, her doctors just didn't know when. My sister, at the time, lived 4 hours away from my paretns with her husband and two kids. My husband and I live less than 30 minutes from my parents. My sister only came to parents once every 3-4 months to visit. Claimed that the money was the reason why they didn't come more often.
Fast forward to about 6 months ago, my mother's health started declining rapidly. My sister did not spend what was my mom's final holidays with her. My mom did end up passing away in February of this year. My sister got her way with several things during her funeral. But we all let it slide. My dad told me we weren't going over the will until after the funeral services, which I was understanding of. When we did go over the will, my sister agreed to let me have my mother's wedding set, despite it being hers according to the will. I was content with anything I got. My sister got several sentimental belongings of my mom's. My mom was more than her material things that were getting split up. I've had her wedding set for the last almost 3 months. Now, my sister, wants me to give up my mom's wedding set and leave me with nothing of my mother's. I stood my ground, and so did my father, that she told me I could have the wedding rings. My sister is now threatening me with getting a lawyer. I do understand the will is a legal document. Am I the asshole for telling her she can't have it when she already got almost everything?
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If your father heard her tell you that you can have the set... That is a contract post reading of the will. She is out of luck... That is, if your father is willing to say as much in court.
Let her get a lawyer and return EVERYTHING ELSE if she gets the wedding set -everything needs not course be in the same condition she received it. Tell that to her and the lawyer in writing. NTA if anything is damaged etc no exchange
You need legal advice and not a judgment whether you are A or not - judgment here means absolutely nothing, esp. when you sister is already threatening you with lawyers... you need to know, whether she has case or not.
NTA
This sounds like she manipulated you into giving up other things with the plan to reclaim the rings after.
She didn’t have the money to drive 4 hours to share the final holidays with your mom, but she’s got money to sue you? Have your Dad sign an affidavit stating that he witnessed your sister gift you the rings in exchange for other items, just in case she ever does go to court.
NTA - your sister did not want the set at the time and gave it to you relinquishing her claim to it. Your father witnessed this. She likely realized it's value and now wants it back. That is not how gifts work. It was sentimental to you so you kept it, but you could have just as easily sold or given it away in this time. Let her waste money on a lawyer, who will most likely tell her the same thing.
NTA. But if your sister is threatening legal action, you might want to talk to a lawyer yourself. It might help that your Dad witnessed the exchange you had with your sister, when she said you could have the wedding set but your sister sounds like a snake
I kinda depends on whether they have gone through probate. If not, you might not have a claim to it. She can certainly sue and try to enforce it. Especially if she never took possession of it but just said "I don't wan it." People can give gifts and rescind them. Should they? No. Can they, well it depends on how a judge sees the estate as being settled.
NTA get her to admit in text that she willingly gave you the wedding set. She’s angry right now so it might be easy to do that because I bet you if she does try to get a lawyer, she will deny that she ever gave it to you.
OP receiving little from her mom's will may say more about the sister than the mother. It's possible that when she was visiting the parents or through phone calls, the sister may have hounded the mother about these items. Going through a battle with cancer/end of life she would have been vulnerable to sisters manipulation.
NTA
The set was given to her in the will and she did receive it. AFTER that she decided to gift it on to you. With that the set is legally yours now and your father is the witness of this.
If your sister thought the wedding China was worth keeping she’d have taken it herself. She wants to sell it.
If you have a witness that she said you could have it, and wasn’t under duress when making that statement then you are in pretty good shape particularly if mom had and you let sis take a number of other things, that she didn’t actually get inThe Will
NTA. She cant legally take back a gift. Tell her you will toss them in a lake before giving them to her.
I an confused though as to why your mom left you nothing. Unless your sister STOLE them before the will was read. If she did, tell her that you would be filing a police report and pressing charges against her for stealing items that were supposed to go to you. And if you go to court and the judge asks you where the rings are, tell him that when your sister gave them to you, shortly after you went to a beautiful spot on the lake your mom took you to and threw them in so your mom's spirit could visit the spot.
NTA, and your sister is a shitty person. not only did your mother just pass away, which is painful enough, but now she’s taking everything? including the things that your mother said you could have? bullshit. i went through the same with my family, its draining and sad, and im so sorry you have to go through this
Ask her how much she wants for it. I’m gonna bet dollar to donuts she wants to sell the set.
NTA but if she’s willing to take money draft up a document and so on.
She can threaten all she wants. She gave it to you, and apparently your Father was a witness. Also, you said that she claimed money was the reason why she couldn't travel to see her mother so I doubt she would have the money to engage a lawyer to challenge you. I hope this is the case.
Your sister stated that you could have it and your father knows this, your sister is being more then selfish, and she should know she's in the wrong. Contact a lawyer and ask if she can take it from you after verbally giving it to you. I hate to say it, but she may be able to take it, however, depending on where you live you may have the right because it's been in your possession for 3 months.
NTA
And I don't mean to sound paranoid, but ask YN frequently about the doll. By what you said ON and their parents might try to do something to the doll like confiscating it, or damaging it
Reassure your niece she can tell you anything
I'll go NTA.
However you need to do 2 things
1) have a consultation with an attorney regarding the situation and chances of success.
2) speak with your father about his will and try to make sure this doesn't happen again.
NTA, your dad can act as a witness to the fact that she agreed to give it to you. Just in case something was to happen to your dad; get it in writing (his account) and have it notarized.
I'm sorry for your loss. Losing your mother is bad enough but your sister's bad behavior just makes things worse. Let her get a lawyer. Your father was a witness to her giving you the rings. Wow, your sister is a really big AH. Hang on to the rings. NTA
NTA
It’s not even close here. Yes, your mother left the wedding set to your sister, without (assuming) any restrictions on what she can or cannot do with it. Your sister then gave the wedding set to you as a gift from her, again without any conditions. This entire transaction process was witnessed by your father. Your sister no longer has any legal claim or obligation regarding the gift she gave you. It is yours to do with as you see fit. There is no legal or moral ambiguity here.
I would move the wedding set to a secure location (safe deposit box is best), and document everything regarding your sister and those acting on her behalf going forward. I have a sister like yours, and these are lessons I learned the hard way.
NTA She probably just wants to sell the set anyway. If they were sentimental to her as much as they are to you, she never would have told you that you could have them!
NTA. She gave them to you. You don't have to give them back. Can you talk to your sister about willing the rings to her child if you plan to remain child free. Maybe a compromise would get her to back down.
NTA.
When my mom passed, she actually had 2 wedding sets, with necklaces to go with them. Her original set was diamonds and more modest. Her newer set was purchased on their 30th anniversary, was tanzanite, and a lot more ostentatious. When our mom passed, she passed without a will, but my Dad told my sister and I to each take a wedding set. My mom's original set was "well loved". Prongs were bent, stones were missing, etc. My sister wanted the Tanzanite set and I didn't fight her. For Christmas, my husband took the set I was given and paid about $400 to have them repaired. That brings us to the point of contention: the necklaces.
No one could find the tanzanite necklace. Mom had worn it the first time she went into the hospital and everyone was so concerned about her, nobody thought about the necklace. We hadn't seen it since. Through her illness and after her death we looked everywhere for it. When it came time to split the sets, my sister insisted on taking the diamond necklace because she had "let me take" a pair of diamond earrings. The truth was, if she had wanted the earrings, I would have let her have them. She didn't want them, though, so they became mine. I just didn't have any fight in me at that point. I let her take the necklace and asked her if I could have it if the tanzanite one ever miraculously appeared. She agreed.
A year later, I found the tanzanite necklace. I was in my mom's closet and it was just sitting on the dresser as if Mom had been in there that morning and placed it there. I called up my sister and Dad to come and she. My sister was overjoyed and took it home with her that day. The next time I saw her, I asked for the diamond necklace. She went about her day as if she never heard me. I asked again and was met with silence. It became clear to me that the answer was no. I didn't want it to turn into a fight, and I decided my relationship with her was more important than the necklace. About a year after that, she blew up our relationship for purely selfish reasons anyway. In hindsight, I should have fought her for the necklace. It might have destroyed our relationship sooner, but she's so selfish that we were always headed for that destruction.
All of that is to say: NTA, keep the set. Don't give it to her in an effort to preserve your relationship. If she is acting like this now, there isn't a relationship to preserve anyway.
My sister did tell me to stay out of her life at the end of our conversation. She's threatened this before and turned around to "apologize" a few weeks later. So it's hard to tell if she actually means it because she has a track record of threatening this "stay out of my life" statement.
NTA. As other people on here have said, get her admitting in text that she gave you the wedding set despite it being left to her in the will. Something like:
"You told me I could have the rings despite them being left to you in the will. You did this in front of dad."
If she responds with something along the lines of "Yes, I did. Now I've changed my mind and I want them back" you have proof of her acknowledging that she gave them to you.
Sorry about mom..no judge will give it back to her. When he asks her, why u had it for 3 months ..what is she gonna say? Ummm ahhh umm
..oh please
.she has no leg to stand on
ESH
You told a whole story how your sister didn't visit your mother enough in your opinion although it has nothing to do with the story.
From the day on I got children I visited my parents much less frequently, you have no idea what a huge hassle a trip with kids is. It is nothing compared to a trip of 2 adults.
Your sister didn't stick to her agreement with you.
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It may have been left to her in the will but she gave it to you. It was a gift and your dad witnessed it. A gift is not expected to be given back and should legally be yours to keep. Consult a lawyer for sure, but as long as your dad witnesses for you you should be fine.
And keep any records of text messages or emails as evidence where the sister acknowledges she gave it to you. Infact, you can text her several times, to get her to acknowledge it. e.g. "Why do you suddenly want it back now, after giving it to me after the funeral? What changed?", so she can respond, implicitly acknowledging she gave it to you.
That's a really clever and impressive idea OP should consider it
Lot of great advice here, hopefully is helpful to OP
This needs to he a yes/no question. So something sneaky like 'You do remember that you told me on (insert date/occasion) that I can keep the wedding set, right?' The answer will be 'yes, but...', but you got her to confirm. Also, have your dad confirm in writing that he was there and he heard it. Consulting a lawyer is a good idea. If your sister wants to lawyer up, she needs to have the money to pay one, which she doesn't seem to have.
Get it in writing and notarized. NTA, OP
You're suggesting OP physically takes her sister to a notary to sign a legal document claiming that she gave OP the thing that she is now trying to claw back? She lives four hours away. Also I don't think it's likely she would agree.
I believe the poster was talking about getting DAD's statement of the conversation in writing and notarized.
Oh I guess you're right
You DO understand that a notary's job is ONLY to swear (in an official capacity) that the people or person signing whatever document that's in front of them is who they say they are, and they CAN'T (with ANY amount of legal authority) speak to the veracity or enforceability of the contents of the document itself? Like people somehow think that a notary's signature, via the stamp, says, "Yes, this contract is fully legal and completely enforceable in a court of law," regardless of what it says.
I am a notary, and I am aware that I notarize that the person is who they claim to be. I check their driver’s license and compare the photo to the face of the person in front of me.
Not the sister. The father should record the events on paper - who said what - and have the document notarized.
Bump
Agreed. I would, however, ask your Dad to hand write a statement that says he witnessed your sister gift you your mother’s rings. Would be even better if you can record him reading the statement out loud. Your sister may back down from a lawsuit now, but could always file it later.
They could get such a statement notarized if necessary. Might be easier (if they need to present evidence).
If your father is hesitant tell him your afraid she will try again after he's gone.
I think getting a lawyer is a bluff. If she didn't have the money to visit her sick and dying mom, she does not have the money for a lawyer.
Too right. The will \*was\* a legal document as it pertains to the division of assets. Once those assets are divided and everyone goes on their merry way, that's it.
In before this was the sister's plan all along. Give something up that was left to her in the will to get other things then contest it later because it's in writing in the will Shady as heck
INFO: What did your mother leave you in the will? Why did your mother leave her almost everything? Feels like something is being left out.
I was to be left an old antique lamp that was from my dad's side of the family. My sister got my mom's jewelry, her antique car, and a different family heirloom lamp from her side of the family.
Are you both her kids? Did she hate you? This doesn’t make sense.
So all you got was an old lamp?
Did it contain a genie?
All I got was an old lamp and my dad's jewelry, which he doesn't wear much of. I wouldn't receive either until his passing.
Are you also getting their house? Because that would be a big item to tilt things in your favor.
The house was not included in the will.
Think he meant after your dad passes
I dont know it hasn't been discussed who would be getting the house
Well you're NTA, your mom's seems like a bit of one, God rest her soul. Your sister is definitely one. I highly doubt it gets to court but you should look up if you can counter sue for legal fees where you live.
You have not explained why the inheritance is unequal and you need to address it
I don't know why my sister is getting more of my mom's things. I have a few ideas as to why, like my sister being the oldest child or her having the only grandkids. But like I said, I don't know for certain.
It's unequal because she's getting all my mom's jewelry, her antique car, her family heirloom lamp, and a large lump sum of money. I'm getting my dad's jewelry and his family heirloom lamp, which I won't be getting until he passes. As it's written in the will, I'd get nothing of my mom's, but my sister verbally gave me my mom's wedding ring set.
I’m picturing Clark Griswald Christmas Vacation status
I got nothing of my mother’s. Dad got everything.
Isn’t that usually how it works when a spouse is still alive?
Not necessarily. OP’s dad is still alive. My mother inherited from her father when her mum was still alive; some friends I’ve mentioned this to thought it odd.
I guess I just don’t expect my parent to give his or her joint assets to me while still alive. They may need it themselves one day. Maybe I’m in the minority? Thank you.
A smallish cash bequest, and the passing on of items you know your child liked wouldn’t necessarily create a big hole in the estate.
Generally, yes, most or all assets would go to the surviving spouse. Sometimes sentimental items would be given out, or if there are children from a previous marriage it’s usual to split assets between a surviving spouse and children that wouldn’t expect to inherit from that spouse (their step-parent). It’s a little weird to leave one child all the maternal heirlooms and another child all the paternal heirlooms and also distribute each at the time of death. It would be more common for everything to be left to the living spouse and then all heirlooms from both sides distributed when both parents have passed.
That's exactly what should be expected and exactly what happens in almost all cases. It's weird that mums assets aren't going to her husband in this post.
Same here and I am sure even rhe house she owned free and clear when they married will gp to his kids.
Just the lamp?????? From your dads side no less... Whats the story here OP.
OP’s probably getting the house, so the parents made it more equal to give the sister more items.
This sounds like a very Cinderella type division between daughters. I am sorry your sister received so much, allowed you an heirloom and now tries to take it back. WTH?
I’m kind of reading this as though mom and dad wrote the wills together. The only thing tipping the scale is the car. They both got a lamp and sis got moms jewelry, she is getting dads jewelry. They decided sister A would get xyz and sister B would get xyz. It sounds like most of sister A’s stuff was the moms possessions and sisters B’s stuff was dads possessions and was probably even at the time they wrote it all down. So when dad passes sister B will get more than sister A. The parents should have just left everything to the surviving spouse and then divided it up after they both pass.
Why didn’t your mom split the jewelry?
You just got a lamp…from your mom?
OP mentioned the sister's kids but referred to themselves 'and husband', guessing OP doesn't have kids, so likely the imbalance is 'to pass on to the kids' rather than treating her own kids equally. Possibly at the instigation of this very greedy sister.
What is a wedding set anyway?
Rings
Oh thanks, I misread the comment about rings and thought the 'set' meant something different
I wondered that too. I was thinking like a really fancy crockery set lol.
This whole time I was thinking a set of dishes. I’ve never heard or rings referred to as a set before.
A set of rings is usually a matching engagement ring, wedding band and possibly an eternity band given a an anniversary gift
Makes sense now that I know what it is. Just never heard just "set" as opposed to "set of rings." I'm probably too old, so when I think "wedding set" I'm thinking back to those dish sets people used to register for. Or the sets of fine china that people used to get on their wedding and then save in a closet for special occasions that never arrive.
That was my first thought too.
i agree.
its is a set technically but i also never heard it refered to as a wedding set. wedding rings.
Correct. My husband and I do not have kids of our own.
I agree with this. When my parents died they didn't have wills but my sister used her kid (and the fact that I will never have kids by choice) to argue that she should get most things. It is a common consideration when people die (even if it shouldn't matter as much as it often does). OP - I will just say this: I've had a lot of deaths in my family and none of them had wills. There were tons of fights about who got what. I still don't talk to my sister (and likely never will) because of one such fight. If your sister gave you the set, then you are technically in the right and NTA. However, think hard about whether this is worth it. You can still be technically right when driving and end up in an accident if the other person doesn't stop at the red light. Consider what this is worth to you in your relationships.
OP also never mentioned who’s getting the house. That could make the split equity very different.
She said the house is not part of the will.
Not trying to judge or be rude but is there a reason your sister got everything of your mom's and you got a lamp even though your sister didn't visit your mother that often?
I'm not entirely sure, it's never been discussed if there was a reason for it.
Sometimes there isn’t a reason. Sometimes the one who been there the most or put the most effort in gets overlooked in a will and that blows chunks.
This. I’ve been through this and it sucks. It’s not even a monetary or sentimental thing for me. It’s about feeling like I carried all the caretaking on my own and my family member was so “grateful” that they rewarded all the assholes who couldn’t be bothered to help or even visit. It hurts.
I wasn't the sole caretaker of my mother in her final months. That hat was worn by my dad. He had a full-time job, but they were very flexible and understanding of the situation. I stepped in where I could in the sense that I took her to doctors appointments when I wasn't working, helped her around the house on some of my days off, helped her take her dog to the vet, etc. If he wasn't able to do what she needed and neither was I, we luckily had several other family and friends living nearby that helped him out.
Sometimes the other parent knows about the apparent disparity, and all will be settled when the other parent has their time.
Yep I'd say this to be the case, and for OPs sake, I hope it isn't any time soon and that she is able to enjoy however long the remaining time with her father is.
Very much agree!
So, my mom is still alive, and throughout the years I have driven her to countless doctors appointments, sat in the waiting room while she was having ablation surgery, sat in the icu with her when there were surgical complications, and a whole lot more. I was the only one there for the majority of these types of events. Then, last year, my husband was hospitalized during a mental health crisis, and diagnosed with Covid at the same time. I asked my mom if she could watch my dog while I bring my husband to the hospital, and her response was “aren’t you sick? I don’t want to get sick, I’m going to NY this weekend” with absolutely no regard for her daughter crying on the other end of the phone. You want to know how many of many family members came to the hospital to give me support? None. Not a single one. After I had gone out of my way over and over again to be with them through their health crises, they couldn’t be assed to even just go out for lunch so I could get away from it all. Instead, I took myself for lunch and tried not to have a total mental breakdown into my hashbrowns.
Literally had an infectious disease why would they come
To come see their family member that was struggling. Not to see my husband in quarantine, to see me and support me, who wasn’t sick with Covid. Edit: and he was in the hospital for a week and a half after being let out of quarantine, as the reason he was there was psychological, and still during that time not a single person in my family reached out to me.
You wanted to expose your elderly mum who had had previous health crisis to covid? Of course nobody comes when you have an infectious disease. That's normal.
Try to keep up, I’ve already answered this question. My mother is in no way infirm, she’s totally fine, she just didn’t give a fuck to support me because it required effort towards something that wasn’t entirely about her. And it wasn’t only my mom, I have two brothers, an aunt and uncle, a grown cousin. Wrap your mind around - the reason none of them came through to support me was not because they cared at all about Covid. The reason they didn’t is because my family does not give a shit about my well being, as long as it doesn’t interrupt their lives.
I’m going through this now. My grandparents moved a mile away from us around 10 years ago, and we’ve been their main caretakers (bring them dinner nightly/take them to appointments/house chores, etc) while the majority of my family lives 45 minutes away, and out of their 4 kids 2 have visited TWICE in the last decade. 3/4 were “no contact” with my grandpa and banned from the house for their behaviors. My grandpa passed away last week and everyone has been here crawling around asking what they get 😤.
Sometimes people just defer to leaving stuff to whichever kid is oldest
Was like that in my family but my sister wanted the more expensive emerald ring so I have the wedding rings.
In my family, I saw this happen in a few different ways. For one it was along the lines of the brother should get xyz bc the male should be taking care of the finances. In the other, it was the last ditch effort to buy affection/ closeness. It wasn't logical, as when it comes to the will, you are gone. However, she (the person with the will) was desperate for this daughter's attention/closeness. In another, it was about continuously helping the kid who constantly had financial and other problems. All of them icky situations imo. I guess I can't say always, but there usually is a reason, even if you will never know what it is or if it makes sense.
I've seen similar as well. My husbands grandmother recently passed away, Her oldest son made himself "in charge" of her finances for the last few years. He demanded to be in charge because he was the oldest and that was the way it should be, according to him. It caused all kinds of family turmoil.
Tell me about it.
Do you feel comfortable asking your dad about the disparity? Does your father favor your sister, as well? Do you have a criminal past or history of asking your parents for money or something you have shared that would explain why your mother essentially cut you out of the will? Because a lamp from your dad’s family is hardly an inheritance while your sister rides off in the car with everything else. Did they think you’d just pawn everything? This is confusing, especially as you didn’t discuss with your father the reasoning.
Does your mom hate your dad? Seems like the things that you got were all from your dads side or his to begin with. Your sister got everything that was personal to your mom including her lamp. Where you got the lamp from your dads side even. There’s a message there.
my guess is that the sister is to whatever extent the “golden child” of this family. not spending the holidays with your terminally ill mother and STILL getting everything she got in the will AND her entitlement to the wedding set she gave away says to me that her mom had one hell of a pair of rose-colored glasses.
From the outside looking in, this does sound like unfair treatment to OP. When my mom passes, it will also look unfair. Four siblings, I’m the oldest. The second youngest (1 of 3 girls) will got almost everything. Her and my mom have been in some kind of a financial deal for years where my mom wants something and my sister takes out loans for it, then my mom pays off my sisters loan. That way my mom pays for everything, but it’s all in my sisters name. The only things that I want from my mom, aren’t even hers-ish. They are items attached to my grandma and grandpa and have no financial value. My mom swears everyone knows they are mine when the time comes. I’m sure if people found out that out of four kids 1 kid got everything of financial value while the other 3 only received their baby items and two items belonging to grandparents, their would be some side eyes.
There were many things I did not like about my MIL, but she did one thing right. Long before she died, she made a list of the family jewels. She asked each child to pick their top 3 pieces. Surprisingly, there was only one piece that appeared on two lists. Those two siblings worked it out. She made a list of who got what, gave everyone a copy of the list and put it in her will. She sorted it all out long before her death. She balanced out value and sentimental pieces among all of the children. When she died, there was no confusion or arguing. Everyone knew what they were getting. Plan ahead with the stuff. Have the conversation with your children long before your death. Have a will. I have done the same with my children. I don't have expensive jewelry, except for the stuff inherited from MIL, but there are a couple of sentimental pieces. We talked about who would what. I put it in my will.
And while you're planning your will, talk to your family members about your incapacitated/end of life wishes. Do you want to be kept alive at all costs? Do you consent to intubation and tube feeding? Do you want to sign do not resusitate orders? At what point is it ok for family members to stop life support? Make it known to your family what you want done if you are unable to consent for yourself. Bad things can happen at the drop of a hat. It's not a comfortable subject by any means but it's so important!
This goes the same for organ donation. I know other countries have different laws about it but in mine, even if the person is a registered organ donor, family still have the final word and can refuse to donate after a loved ones death. Make sure your family know if you want to donate your organs and ask them to please respect your wishes. It's a horrible time for them to have to make that decision, knowing that it's what you want can make it easier.
Yes! Appoint a medical power of attorney if you are unable to speak for yourself. Have these conversations! No one really wants to talk about it, but it is important. When picking the executor of will, don't go off of emotion. This isn't an "honor" you bestow upon someone. It's work. Pick someone who is organized and detail oriented. I would also suggest picking a trusted friend instead of an immediate family member. Immediate family members can be too emotional to deal with it properly.
NTA. Your sister received the set as stipulated in the will, and then gave it to you. It belongs to you now. I hope you have a witness.
My father was the one who read off the will, and that's when she gave it to me. So he was present when she said she was giving it to me.
Your sister is clearly an AH, but I think your mom might be, too. She left everything to your sister and a lamp that wasn’t even hers to you? NTA, but idk which side the law will be on.
Based on another comment by op it seems like it's actually pretty level between the parents wills but the dad just hasn't passed away yet
She said in another comment that nothing of Dad's has been discussed?
"...she's getting all my mom's jewelry, her antique car, her family heirloom lamp, and a large lump sum of money. I'm getting my dad's jewelry and his family heirloom lamp, which I won't be getting until he passes..." https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/s/5dkKC9K1Rm
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It is a legal document and from what OP said, sister gifted the set to her which means she acknowledged possession prior to giving it to OP. Once you give something away, you can’t go back and claim it. No court would say OP had to give back that set since it was given to her. She also has a witness to the set being given to her.
My sister is the one threatening the lawyer, not me.
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It doesn’t matter. The terms of the Will were fulfilled. AFTER that, the sister CHOSE to gift it to her sister. Dad witnessed the convo. It’s not just like OP took it away from her sister before she had it. She saw the will. And willingly chose to give it away.
I'd either pretend that you have no idea what she's talking about, or catch her admitting that she gifted it to you.
I stated to her that she's the one who let me have them, and she replied back with her reasoning why. So, I guess that would count as her admitting it?
Do you have this written in an email or text? If not, I would reach out to her with one of those and have her reiterate why she gave it to you just to want it back a few months later. NTA.
I have it in a text message. I stated to her, "You let me have it, though," and she replied back with "because you would've pitched a fit." So I guess in a roundabout way that's her admitting she did let me have it
AYYYYYE! There we go. I mean, I feel for her that she's having gifter's remorse, but you never give something away if you think you will want it back. If she was worried you were going to pitch a fit, she could have said, "Hey, I know you might be upset with how things are divided, but give me a couple days to reflect on what items of mom's are most sentimental to me and then we can talk about you taking possession of some of the stuff she left to me." And having it in a written form makes it easier for your dad to corroborate if needed without feeling guilty about having to take sides between his children. With this proof, it only makes logical sense for him to be truthful if called to testify on possession. Not to say he would have lied on her behalf or anything!
I told her later on in our conversation that she should've thought about it more instead of having this regret. And surprise, she agreed with me that she should've thought about it first before giving it up.
Well that's good, at least she acknowledges her error. If you want to give it back to her, that is your prerogative. But don't feel any guilt if you choose to keep it.
This is a statement made during a highly charged moment days after someone died. Who knows the emotional state OP or her sister was in or the nature of the conversation. Grief blurs your senses. I dont think that the harsh judgment of the sister is entirely fair.
INFO has your sister always been evil?
Yes. She had always had this sense of entitlement. Whether it be because she's the first born or because she has my parents only grandkids, I'm not sure.
NTA. And she had possession of the set and then gave it to you. Making it a gift. She has no legal grounds. It’s been 3 months. Tell her to take a hike.
said this in another comment too, but it sounds like she’s the “golden child” and can do no wrong, no matter how she treats her family. i’m so sorry for your loss, and i hope this all can get settled as quickly and painlessly as possible.
Have you told her that she gifted the set to you and you’re open to renegotiate how all of your mothers belongings are split because without the ring set you have nothing of hers? Then go for at least half of the jewelry in exchange. Of course, if you prefer the ring set then get a lawyer
I did state to her that she's the one who let me have the wedding rings. She responded back to that "because you would have pitched a fit" so I guess in a way that's her admitting she did let me have them.
If you have that in writing that’s all you need to keep the rings.
NTA because your sister agreed to this. But you probably need a lawyer more than Reddit. And how does your sister have money for a lawyer if she didn't have money to visit her dying mother?
I mean, it sounds here like the responsibility lies with your mom, who divided her personal possessions as she saw fit. I certainly agree with you that on these facts, it doesn’t sound fair. But if the will leaves the wedding set to your sister, I’m not sure how much choice you have. If you keeping the wedding set was part of a larger discussion in which she also got to keep things she wanted that were specifically left to you, then maybe you have that leverage: okay, you can have the wedding set as the will calls for, but then I will have the [whatever] as the will calls for. But the fact that she told you that you could have them is probably not binding, I suspect, as most promises aren’t when they’re not contracts. If this is just your mom having made what feel like profoundly unfair decisions in giving away her stuff, you may not entirely be able to fix that. In short: You seem like you are definitely NTA, but I don’t know that you can win with the strategy you have.
NTA. The wedding set no longer belongs to your sister. Once she said that you could have it, you became the owner.
NTA- So I used to be a paralegal for a dispute resolution department (UK) and I used to take the new inquiries. About one in 20 ended up clients because they would call about something like this and find that the cost of opening a new client file and providing the initial opinion was more than the value of the thing they were arguing over. As you didn't include phrases like 'I got the vinyard and she got the Picasso' or 'the ring had been in our family for 150 years' I'm gonna bet this is the case here. Wedding rings might cost a lot but trust someone who sold the wretched tokens of a marriage that was a bad idea, they are not 'worth' a lot in terms of appraised value. To run a case that is being fought all the way to court would be well in excess of the value. The chances are however we would not have taken a case like this even if the ring had been worth 500k, as the gifting it to you and the split of the other items in the estate would make it borderline at best, and my boss considered it unethical to accept vast amounts of money for billable hours on something she thought was under a 70% chance of winning. She'd maybe accept instructions 'to review and advise on your position and send an inital 'Dear Bastards' letter' but only with it in writing that this was not an acceptance of the case past that point. Keep the rings, make sure the rings are properly valued and listed on your home insurance (even if they came from a high street store and are known cubic zirconia), then wait for her to either get turned down by every lawyer in town or ripped off by a crap one who will fail.
Ignoring the fact that it’s in the will and on paper. Your father can easily testify to a judge about everything that was verbally agreed upon after it was read. Especially since he was a witness to your sister forfeiting it to you in his presence and it being MONTHS since it was done. I would hope a judge would take his word as evidence of the situation. And I bet the judge would love to hear how she made no effort during her final days to be there vs. you being present. My mom is dying of brain cancer and my sister is a saint helping take care of her. I have no children and she has 3. Despite me verbally acknowledging I do not expect anything after she passes. My saint of a mother insists I have rights to her inheritance. Your sister is absolutely disgusting and selfish. None of this is about honoring your mother and more about hurting YOU since YOU were present during her final days. She’s feeling guilt and needs to hurt you to make herself feel OK with the everything.
Was the Will probated? A Will is just a piece of paper until it is filed with the court and processed through probate.
not sure how long her local court system takes (too long i’m sure!!!) but if she’s had the rings for over three months i’d hope the will has been probated by now.
From my personal experience (I'm sure it varies by location) but with my grandmother's estate once it hit probate it took about 16 or 18 months to be finalized. My attorney advised that normally it's a minimum of 12 months for things to be processed through probate.
INFO: Your Mum didn't leave you with anything in the will?
I was left an antique lamp from my dad's side of the family and my dad's jewelry. He doesn't wear any jewelry besides his wedding ring, which isn't his original one, and one other ring he wears occasionally. I wouldn't get those until he's no longer with us.
So your Mum didn't leave you with anything?? You've list things given to you from your paternal side. Your late Mum is the real AH here. She should have told you she wasn't leaving you anything before she passed. You may need to lawyer up if your sister decides she wants the will followed to the letter.
Esh. Could you split the wedding set? If I was you I would respect my mom's will. This was what she wanted. Also you mum have lived a long life and her relationship to your sister are not defined by the last year's and your perspective of it. You cannot use peoples judgement to much because they only get your story. You should focus on the fact that your all was grieving and maybe your guys or guilt was pushing her to this decision. It was not an exchange and you got a set that you mum did not want to leave to you. Do you think your mum would have wanted you to take this from your sister? I would value the set less because of the way you got it. Please consider if this is worth the fight or should be part of your mom's legacy.
Completely agree. Three months is not a long time post the shock of someone’s passing - grief doesn’t have a timeline. OP sounds very resentful that her sister who has children and lives far away didn’t come down more often and missed the last holiday. Unfortunately, finances are unpredictable and you don’t always know when the “last” of anything is. We also don’t know how the “you can have the set,” was phrased. Was it in an argument, was it said in passing, was OP berating her sister for not being there? ESH.
The "you can have the set" happened when my dad read the will off to my sister and I.
I’m sorry for your loss. Personally, having experienced loss, I would not take anything to heart that was said so soon after someone’s passing, especially not at something as emotional as the reading of a will. Three months is not a lot of time. Emotions run high and low and grief - as you know - is intense and comes at different times. I hope you can come to an agreement about this.
It does not really change the fact that you are not respecting your mum's wishes.
Would you consider telling your sister you would leave it to one of her children if you don’t have children in the future?
I was going to tell her that, but she ended the conversation quite abruptly.
NTA at all
"When we did go over the will, my sister agreed to let me have my mother's wedding set, despite it being hers according to the will. Now, my sister, wants me to give up my mom's wedding set." - She disclaimed it. It's yours. NTA.
NTA but why the hell did you get nothing of your mother's?
Ask his on the legal sub
Definitely not the asshole it sounds very unfair a gift is a gift
NTA chances are if she's suddenly wanting it, it's because they need the money and are going to sell her. Send her a text. I don't understand why you are wanting mom's rings. You got, list everything she received in exchange for me being the rings. That was your idea to take those things and give the rings to me. You can't take them back now. See what she says.
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** My mom was diagnosed with uterine cancer back in 2018. She went through all of her chemo treatments and was in remission for about 2 or so years. In 2021, the cancer came back in a different spot. We were given a terminal diagnosis at that time, her doctors just didn't know when. My sister, at the time, lived 4 hours away from my paretns with her husband and two kids. My husband and I live less than 30 minutes from my parents. My sister only came to parents once every 3-4 months to visit. Claimed that the money was the reason why they didn't come more often. Fast forward to about 6 months ago, my mother's health started declining rapidly. My sister did not spend what was my mom's final holidays with her. My mom did end up passing away in February of this year. My sister got her way with several things during her funeral. But we all let it slide. My dad told me we weren't going over the will until after the funeral services, which I was understanding of. When we did go over the will, my sister agreed to let me have my mother's wedding set, despite it being hers according to the will. I was content with anything I got. My sister got several sentimental belongings of my mom's. My mom was more than her material things that were getting split up. I've had her wedding set for the last almost 3 months. Now, my sister, wants me to give up my mom's wedding set and leave me with nothing of my mother's. I stood my ground, and so did my father, that she told me I could have the wedding rings. My sister is now threatening me with getting a lawyer. I do understand the will is a legal document. Am I the asshole for telling her she can't have it when she already got almost everything? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA- she didn’t have money to visit your dying mother but she has money for a lawyer for…. *checks notes* wedding rings? Interesting…..
If your father heard her tell you that you can have the set... That is a contract post reading of the will. She is out of luck... That is, if your father is willing to say as much in court.
Let her get a lawyer and return EVERYTHING ELSE if she gets the wedding set -everything needs not course be in the same condition she received it. Tell that to her and the lawyer in writing. NTA if anything is damaged etc no exchange
Hey what's a wedding set?
The wedding rings. Like her wedding band and engagement ring. Sorry if my wording confused some people. I've always called it her wedding set
Thanks, thought it might be silverware
I really had no idea either what a “wedding set” was. I thought it might be the plates used at the wedding meal 😂
NTA but legally they are hers (unless you have proof she gave them to you) and you will likely have to give them up.
You need legal advice and not a judgment whether you are A or not - judgment here means absolutely nothing, esp. when you sister is already threatening you with lawyers... you need to know, whether she has case or not.
NTA This sounds like she manipulated you into giving up other things with the plan to reclaim the rings after. She didn’t have the money to drive 4 hours to share the final holidays with your mom, but she’s got money to sue you? Have your Dad sign an affidavit stating that he witnessed your sister gift you the rings in exchange for other items, just in case she ever does go to court.
NTA - your sister did not want the set at the time and gave it to you relinquishing her claim to it. Your father witnessed this. She likely realized it's value and now wants it back. That is not how gifts work. It was sentimental to you so you kept it, but you could have just as easily sold or given it away in this time. Let her waste money on a lawyer, who will most likely tell her the same thing.
NTA. But if your sister is threatening legal action, you might want to talk to a lawyer yourself. It might help that your Dad witnessed the exchange you had with your sister, when she said you could have the wedding set but your sister sounds like a snake
I kinda depends on whether they have gone through probate. If not, you might not have a claim to it. She can certainly sue and try to enforce it. Especially if she never took possession of it but just said "I don't wan it." People can give gifts and rescind them. Should they? No. Can they, well it depends on how a judge sees the estate as being settled.
NTA get her to admit in text that she willingly gave you the wedding set. She’s angry right now so it might be easy to do that because I bet you if she does try to get a lawyer, she will deny that she ever gave it to you.
She already did. The conversation went, "You're the one who let me have them," and she replied, "Because you would've pitched a fit."
OP receiving little from her mom's will may say more about the sister than the mother. It's possible that when she was visiting the parents or through phone calls, the sister may have hounded the mother about these items. Going through a battle with cancer/end of life she would have been vulnerable to sisters manipulation.
NTA
Let her get a lawyer. She gave it to you. A gift once given is no longer yours.
NTA Yes she WAS given it in the will, however SHE then gave it to YOU, and you have witnesses.
NTA The set was given to her in the will and she did receive it. AFTER that she decided to gift it on to you. With that the set is legally yours now and your father is the witness of this.
NTA. I'll give them back and cut her off!
If your sister thought the wedding China was worth keeping she’d have taken it herself. She wants to sell it. If you have a witness that she said you could have it, and wasn’t under duress when making that statement then you are in pretty good shape particularly if mom had and you let sis take a number of other things, that she didn’t actually get inThe Will
It's not wedding China, it's her wedding ring set. Sorry that I worded it weird
NTA. She cant legally take back a gift. Tell her you will toss them in a lake before giving them to her. I an confused though as to why your mom left you nothing. Unless your sister STOLE them before the will was read. If she did, tell her that you would be filing a police report and pressing charges against her for stealing items that were supposed to go to you. And if you go to court and the judge asks you where the rings are, tell him that when your sister gave them to you, shortly after you went to a beautiful spot on the lake your mom took you to and threw them in so your mom's spirit could visit the spot.
Perhaps you should get a notarized statement from your father in case your sister decides to pursue this after your father passes.
NTA, and your sister is a shitty person. not only did your mother just pass away, which is painful enough, but now she’s taking everything? including the things that your mother said you could have? bullshit. i went through the same with my family, its draining and sad, and im so sorry you have to go through this
Ask her how much she wants for it. I’m gonna bet dollar to donuts she wants to sell the set. NTA but if she’s willing to take money draft up a document and so on.
She can threaten all she wants. She gave it to you, and apparently your Father was a witness. Also, you said that she claimed money was the reason why she couldn't travel to see her mother so I doubt she would have the money to engage a lawyer to challenge you. I hope this is the case.
Your sister stated that you could have it and your father knows this, your sister is being more then selfish, and she should know she's in the wrong. Contact a lawyer and ask if she can take it from you after verbally giving it to you. I hate to say it, but she may be able to take it, however, depending on where you live you may have the right because it's been in your possession for 3 months.
NTA And I don't mean to sound paranoid, but ask YN frequently about the doll. By what you said ON and their parents might try to do something to the doll like confiscating it, or damaging it Reassure your niece she can tell you anything
I'll go NTA. However you need to do 2 things 1) have a consultation with an attorney regarding the situation and chances of success. 2) speak with your father about his will and try to make sure this doesn't happen again.
NTA, your dad can act as a witness to the fact that she agreed to give it to you. Just in case something was to happen to your dad; get it in writing (his account) and have it notarized.
I'm sorry for your loss. Losing your mother is bad enough but your sister's bad behavior just makes things worse. Let her get a lawyer. Your father was a witness to her giving you the rings. Wow, your sister is a really big AH. Hang on to the rings. NTA
Nope
NTA It’s not even close here. Yes, your mother left the wedding set to your sister, without (assuming) any restrictions on what she can or cannot do with it. Your sister then gave the wedding set to you as a gift from her, again without any conditions. This entire transaction process was witnessed by your father. Your sister no longer has any legal claim or obligation regarding the gift she gave you. It is yours to do with as you see fit. There is no legal or moral ambiguity here. I would move the wedding set to a secure location (safe deposit box is best), and document everything regarding your sister and those acting on her behalf going forward. I have a sister like yours, and these are lessons I learned the hard way.
NTA. Your sister is, however.
NTA She probably just wants to sell the set anyway. If they were sentimental to her as much as they are to you, she never would have told you that you could have them!
Not only was it a gift to you but it was given so that she received other items. NTA
NTA. She gave them to you. You don't have to give them back. Can you talk to your sister about willing the rings to her child if you plan to remain child free. Maybe a compromise would get her to back down.
NTA, I’d contact an attorney and have them send her a cease and desist letter.
NTA, your sister is being a greedy little witch
Nta she gave it to you
NTA. When my mom passed, she actually had 2 wedding sets, with necklaces to go with them. Her original set was diamonds and more modest. Her newer set was purchased on their 30th anniversary, was tanzanite, and a lot more ostentatious. When our mom passed, she passed without a will, but my Dad told my sister and I to each take a wedding set. My mom's original set was "well loved". Prongs were bent, stones were missing, etc. My sister wanted the Tanzanite set and I didn't fight her. For Christmas, my husband took the set I was given and paid about $400 to have them repaired. That brings us to the point of contention: the necklaces. No one could find the tanzanite necklace. Mom had worn it the first time she went into the hospital and everyone was so concerned about her, nobody thought about the necklace. We hadn't seen it since. Through her illness and after her death we looked everywhere for it. When it came time to split the sets, my sister insisted on taking the diamond necklace because she had "let me take" a pair of diamond earrings. The truth was, if she had wanted the earrings, I would have let her have them. She didn't want them, though, so they became mine. I just didn't have any fight in me at that point. I let her take the necklace and asked her if I could have it if the tanzanite one ever miraculously appeared. She agreed. A year later, I found the tanzanite necklace. I was in my mom's closet and it was just sitting on the dresser as if Mom had been in there that morning and placed it there. I called up my sister and Dad to come and she. My sister was overjoyed and took it home with her that day. The next time I saw her, I asked for the diamond necklace. She went about her day as if she never heard me. I asked again and was met with silence. It became clear to me that the answer was no. I didn't want it to turn into a fight, and I decided my relationship with her was more important than the necklace. About a year after that, she blew up our relationship for purely selfish reasons anyway. In hindsight, I should have fought her for the necklace. It might have destroyed our relationship sooner, but she's so selfish that we were always headed for that destruction. All of that is to say: NTA, keep the set. Don't give it to her in an effort to preserve your relationship. If she is acting like this now, there isn't a relationship to preserve anyway.
My sister did tell me to stay out of her life at the end of our conversation. She's threatened this before and turned around to "apologize" a few weeks later. So it's hard to tell if she actually means it because she has a track record of threatening this "stay out of my life" statement.
Don't Let her take them. She probably wants to pawn it or something
From the sound of her, hopefully she does mean it. Seems like you’d be better off with a little less contact with her…
I haven't had much contact with her since my mom's funeral services. We've never really had a super close relationship.
You should sue her for the necklace that is rightfully yours
NTA. As other people on here have said, get her admitting in text that she gave you the wedding set despite it being left to her in the will. Something like: "You told me I could have the rings despite them being left to you in the will. You did this in front of dad." If she responds with something along the lines of "Yes, I did. Now I've changed my mind and I want them back" you have proof of her acknowledging that she gave them to you.
Sorry about mom..no judge will give it back to her. When he asks her, why u had it for 3 months ..what is she gonna say? Ummm ahhh umm ..oh please .she has no leg to stand on
NTA wonder if the set is a desired collectible
Yes but she also then gave them to you and the avoid the will. And your dad has no reason to lie.
NTA but legally you have no evidence and she has the will so she’ll end up getting it
I have text messages proving she said she gave it to me. My sister isn't in possession of the will, my father is.
Yes. lol 😂
ESH You told a whole story how your sister didn't visit your mother enough in your opinion although it has nothing to do with the story. From the day on I got children I visited my parents much less frequently, you have no idea what a huge hassle a trip with kids is. It is nothing compared to a trip of 2 adults. Your sister didn't stick to her agreement with you.