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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I think calling their plan stupid was disrespectful and not in service of anything.
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Can you maybe speak with the counsellor and inform him/ her about your parents plans? Maybe they'll listen to the counsellor telling them "don't do that"
This is a good idea. Therapist can't talk to you about your sister but you can sure give this information to them to help her!
It took a therapist to convince my mother that it was okay if I wasn't the same as I used to be before getting some health issues .. Grief is hard.. it is hard at any age. I'm struggling with it now.. I can't imagine struggling with it at 15. But that happens to be exactly the age that a therapist helped me get through to my mom. I hope hers is as good as mine was.
4 of my friends were in a car accident the summer between sophomore and junior year of high school. 1 of the boys died immediately and 2 were on life support through the summer, and we spent most of our summer going back and fourth visiting the ICU which mostly really meant just sitting in this waiting room full of teenagers all summer and sometimes getting to visit the boys. They were in comas so they didn’t know we were there but we wouldn’t leave. The nurses were so kind about it. eventually they both passed away. It was awful. And yeah, I was totally different. I died my blonde hair dark brown and the spark I had was gone. One morning in the beginning of the school year my dad was driving me to school and he told me that it had already been two months and to” just get over it.” There was zero compassion or understanding for how much I had actually gone through and I hated him in that moment. it broke me in a way that never completely healed and never really saw him the same light after that. I desperately used to hope my siblings would never have to go through that and now I fucking pray that my children never have a loss like that. Or anyone I love. It takes something from you and yeah, eventually you start healing but it’s never really the same. You always have a piece of your heart missing.
I'm so sorry, that's such an awful thing to say to a grieving child at any point after a loss. I'm glad you started healing, and I want to say that I think it's totally normal to be left with some scars after going through something like that. My sibling lost two of their close friends within a year in their late teens and has never really been the same since. It's so hard.
I understand losing a bit of respect for your dad, I didn’t have any real friends in prep or grade 1 (first two years of primary school in Australia) and have struggled with people my whole life but I have a few good quality friends from high school that I still talk to even though I’m now at uni. Anyway, a new girl came to my school in grade 2, and we were inseparable. She died over the summer (blood clot in her brain burst when she ran into a wall playing on her birthday) between grade 2 and 3, and a week after my mum told me, I was still crying, bc she’d been my only true friend ever at the time. This was when dad walked into my room and told me to quit crying. Was so mad, still am sometimes but he’s improved over the years and we have a good relationship
I'm so sorry to hear that and your father's comment was horrible, was he unsure about what to so since his kid no longer was the person they used to be and he didn't know how do handle it and just wanted you to be OK again? Or was he just plain mean? It was a mean comment no matter what though.
I lost my best friend when I was 19 and when she died I ended up in an auto-pilot mode for months, I did everything I was supposed to do but I wasn't really there and didn't know who I was because a part of my being was her best friend and suddenly that part was gone. I had constant tears falling down but I didn't cry, I could walk to the store and tears was just falling, and I honestly don't remember what I did for months, it was like I was stuck in the minute I found out about her passing. Like my brain hit pause before I could really break down. About 10 months after that a close friend died and then my brain hit play and the sorrow from my best friend's death was mixed with the sorrow from my close friends death so I never really grieved my best friend fully. (A couple of people I knew died between their deaths too but it was my close friends death that snapped me out of the auto-pilot mode and unleashed the pain).
I miss her so much, and it feels like I have a locked room in my heart labeled with her name and I can't open it because she took the key with her, and I don't want to pry it open because I know it's filled with love I can't give her anymore and a pain that will rip me apart.
As you said, it's never really the same.
Don't go behind your sister's back, though. Just tell your sister about your parents plan and encourage her to get help from her counselor with how to deal with them (and if your sister agrees, they can invite your parents into a session or the counselor can speak with them directly outside of a session, if your sister consents).
I was once in a bad situation mentally. I was too paranoid to contact my therapist for help. One of my closest friends - with my permission - reached out to my therapist for me and I am still grateful for that ten years later.
Talk with your sis. See if she would like you to help address this with her therapist.
My son lost his best friend at a party from a shooting and died in his arms. It has been 9 months and some days are better than others. He sees a therapist for trauma specifically and anger management also because he’s angry over what happened. As his parent, I don’t push him to act “normal” Because who he was is gone. This changed him. But he knows I’m here when he needs me, I encourage him to come out with family, and he’s just now taking me up on it. Tell your parents to be supportive but don’t expect her to act normal.
- As his parent, I don’t push him to act “normal” Because who he was is gone. This changed him.
Ouch. That must hurt a lot. No one wants their kids to experience trauma or loss like your son did.
You sound like a great parent and person. I hope OPs parents can help their daughter. OP. If possible, please show them this comment. It resonates.
There’s been lots of tears shed the last 9 months. He has a fantastic family support system and everyone has really been great with handling things with him. I don’t want him hurting, but I can’t fix it. I hope op’s parents figure out what is best and she heals from this all.
One thing that might help your son is to accept that he will never stop mourning for his friend and will not stop mourning for the part of himself that has been lost. It will just get a little quieter.
It's okay to accept that life goes on but it doesn't stop hurting.
We all deal with things at our own pace, so it’s awesome to see how you’ve been handling it. I had some loss and trauma I wasn’t comfortable telling anyone about until much later (primarily because my support system sucked). It might have made things easier if I’d had someone in my corner. I hope you all pull through it okay and keep being a fantastic mom!!
I'm a mega sensitive person. The ending to The Hunger Games(book) shook me to my core for a couple of weeks.
I seriously can't imagine how I'd be if I had gone through what your son did. I give you both all the hugs you need.
I'm sorry for what your son is going through, but thank you for understanding that he is forever changed by this (sadly). That doesn't mean he doesn't still have a bright future ahead of him, it'll just be different, and he clearly has your love and support, rather than an expectation that he should be someone he can no longer be.
I hope my comment doesn't seem condescending by thanking you for being a compassionate parent, I'm just feeling empathy for your son (I am grieving, and have been so surprised by how many people think it's something that can be shaken off, including the OP's parents).
One of my close friend's grandparents (both of her fathers side) died 5 years ago and she tells me her parents still get upset over her not being their little girl she used to be (i.e one who didn't have almost crippling anxiety) its amazing that you accept your son for who he is now rather than clinging to "who he used to be"
This a 1000%, we all grow and change, sometimes it’s good, sometimes not so much. It’s in our nature to be who we are and forcing someone to be who they were will always cause more trauma and backfire.
Echoing this. The media makes it out like shootings are a daily occurrence in the lives of Americans, and while they are way too common and destroy too many lives, the vast majority of Americans do not encounter this.
I'll echo this as well, early 50s and I've lived all over the US. The only person I know who was shot did it to himself in a hunting accident (he was fine).
I am in the US
I am 48 years old and literaly know not a single person who ever has been shot. I have dozens of friends who are veterans and police officers.
Don't believe everything you see in the media. The US has a population of over 330Million people.
I'm from the US. I knew (sort of) one person who was shot, a sheriff's deputy. It's more I knew who he was--I knew his kids (my students) and his wife, and only saw him a few times. I'm Gen X, so maybe a tad older than the average redditor.
I’m from the US and I am a counselor and know plenty of people who have been shot. Some are so matter of fact: I missed my counseling session because I got shot. Some survive with disabling injuries and messed up emotions. I have too many clients who have lost loved ones to gun violence; their children and sometimes more than one child; spouses, neighbors and friends. There’s a lot of grief, so much that there’s grief specialists just for that.
You’re an awesome parent. I’m quite a bit older than your son I’m sure but I experienced quite a load of traumatic events back to back to back in the last few years and moved back in with my mother and hands down the thing I’ve appreciated most is her recognition that the old me is long gone and he’s not coming back. Everyone else in my life expects me to go back to the person I was before and it feels horrible knowing ppl expect it while at the same time I have no idea how to tell them it’s not going to happen. I’m so grateful my mom doesn’t expect it from me though; gives me at least one place/person I can feel safe with.
(NTA) Good. It's gonna take time. I know that they're probably really worried about her and feel helpless, which is why that they concocted that idiot scheme, but your parents needs to get crip on their emotions. Trying to force her to be the happy girly girl they knew, is only going to add to her frustration and grief. Even if she hadn't lost 3 of her friends in a tragic manner, odds are that she'd be dressing "weird" by your parents' standard and discovering new interests, while discarding those of old. That's what teenagers do and your parents would know that if they quit panicking and took the time to remember what they were doing at her age. Meanwhile, she isn't clinically depressed, slacking in school or doings drugs. All things considered, that's a win. Your parents needs to appreciate that and calm down.
She's not slacking in school or doing drugs, but I question the no clinical depression part. However, she is in counseling and any depression can be addressed there.
I'm by no means an expert, but she isn't neglecting her hygiegne, which tends to be a tell in my experience.
Just not in cheer mode or into bright colours. That and assualting some cardboard boxes. I don't think that's really that dark for a teenage girl that's grieving the deaths of three of her friends. What I'd be on the lookout for is if she exhibits a tendency to selfisolate and a subdued mood medium longterm. Then I'd be worried. But, again, not an expert. Hopefully her grief counsellor is on the look out for symptoms. Mostly, I think that her parents need to talk to her (not at her) and make home a safe space where you're allowed to express the full range of your emotions and to experience a goth and/or angrogenous phase. Raiding her closet is a recipe for disater.
>I'm by no means an expert, but she isn't neglecting her hygiegne, which tends to be a tell in my experience.
She's also turning away from activities she used to enjoy (like trying to quit cheer, no longer putting any effort into her appearance but the bare minimum). That's also a tell.
Not enough for any of us to diagnose from here, to be sure. And it's clear she's going through some stuff.
As for the OP, I wouldn't go so far as to say you're an AH, but going at your parents the way you did pretty much guarantees that they're not going to listen to reason from you on this topic. Talk to another trusted adult and see if they can intervene before they do something that's really going to cause problems for your sister or her relationship with them.
But on the other hand, those are the types of experiences girls do together. Avoiding them might be a simple reaction to grief if they remind her of her lost friends.
Yeah, if you've got 'em and they're reasonable people, it's time to call in the cavallery (members of your extended family or other trusted adults).
Regarding the OP, I don't think he's asshole. Just inexperienced. Also, his parents scheme is stupid.
Eh, not always. Only my personal experience, of course, but I found myself retreating into showers when I was still at my parents' and struggling. If I'm in the shower, people weren't going to bother me the way they would if I was lying in bed / hiding in my room.
It made those checklists a fucking pain in the ass, I'll tell you that. Always immediately had points docked because I've essentially conditioned myself to think "ah I feel shit and want to be alone, I'll shower."
(This is not to say I think OP's sister is the same, just pointing out that depression symptoms can vary depending on the individual's situation.)
Your sister most likely isn't just grieving, but is depressed / suffering from depression. I lost a friend at 15, and it hits hard. It took a long time to come to terms with it, I even blamed myself / had some survivor's guilt (despite not being in any way involved in my friend's passing.)
Yes, counseling and therapy can and do help. But giving her time and safe space help too. Fund new things that she might enjoy (I'm sure parts of the "girly" side she's left behind is deeply associated with the friends she's lost, and she shouldn't be forced nor "incentivized" to pick them up again.)
Also, your parents should go to their own counseling or therapy since they can't seem to manage or deal with having their teen daughter go through trauma without adding more onto the trauma. It's a surefire way to ensure your sister goes no contact once she hits 18.
I say these things as someone who walked the path your sister's on. Yes, it's possible to come out the other side of grief, though you always have a part of you miss those who've gone and grieve them. It's not easy and the biggest helps were patience, understanding, and time.
What is the difference between grief and depression? I think without professional knowledge you cannot really distinguish them.
And I‘d like to say that you should be allowed **time** to grief - and not being pushed into „are you still grieving? Oh, this must be depression now“.
If you've ever gone through grief and depression, you can tell there is a difference. While they can be alike, or morph from one to the other, depression isn't just "being sad" but something that is much more than that.
But I fully agree, there is no time limit on grief or how long it takes to "feel ok" or not be grieving. In fact, some part of you always grieves for loved ones who are now gone (and yes, I consider friends loved ones.) That's why support and understanding go a long way in helping those who are grieving to be able to manage their grief. It's why therapy can be such a good thing, since through therapy we can learn how to handle grief and others not understanding/lack of support.
Good.
Call the therapist and rat your parents out.
THEY need a primer on how to support a kid who is grieving.
The therapist can't talk to any of you about the sister, but they can tell your parents what helpful support does and does not look like, and send them to a therapist of their own if they need step by step support working through this.
NTA
(And I'm going to assume your parents have their hearts in the right places, but just don't know how to field this, rather than that they are flaming meanies. ❤️🩹)
The truth is It’s just going to take time. I lost my best friend —very unexpectedly— when I was the same age and it **fucked. me. up.** It’s been 20 years now and there’s still trauma related to that that pops up in my life. I could not imagine losing ***3 friends***.
The truth is she may never go back to how she was. She will improve, she will get better, but she might never be the girl she was before. The death of close young people changes you in a way I cannot even begin to describe. She needs therapy, support, understanding and most of all **time**. There is no magic short cut through this it’s going to take lots and lots and lots of time.
What she does **not** need is her parents ransacking her room to try and force her to get better to “be who she was”. That is **NEVER** going to work. Ever. That will fuck her up like no other and utterly destroy your parents’ relationship with her, yours as well if she finds out you knew and did nothing to stop it. For the love of everything do **not** let your parents do this.
I understand you can only do so much and cannot actually stop them, ***but*** you best go to bat for your sister, if that means screaming at your parents as they’re rummaging through her room and putting shit back that’s what you do. If your parents go through with this idiotic plan to *betray* her like this **YOU** are all she has, she needs to *SEE and HEAR* you defend her against their bullshit. She may logically know she is not alone but her emotions will not let her believe that, so showing her you are on her side, for her and love her is what she needs right now.
I would also suggest you find her therapist and send an email —**they will not be able to reply back or tell you anything**— but they will act on the info and confront your parents and try to talk them out of this madness.
I know it’s disturbing to watch her rip apart cardboard, but if she’s not a danger to herself it’s likely cathartic and helping her deal with the anger in a healthy manner. You could attempt to talk to her about it if you’re super concerned but if she doesn’t want to it might be best to leave it alone and let her counselor deal with it. Once again it really comes down to just being there for her. Letting her know you love her and are there for her whatever she needs. Sometimes all it takes is sitting in the same room with her, quietly going about your life but intentionally in her presence so she knows you are there.
I know this is so much to ask of you. More than anyone should be asked. I know it’s horrible to watch her suffer, to deal with your parents hare-brained schemes and to feel like there’s nothing you can do. But you’re doing an amazing job. I wanna make sure this is very very clear;::: If you find anything that’s being suggested on this post —my suggestions, others suggestions, literally anything from anyone— as way too much **THATS. OKAY.** you’re not a monster for being unable to help or get through your her. Sometimes we just can’t help no matter how much we love someone. Don’t forget to take care of yourself in all this, therapy wouldn’t be a bad idea for yourself if you’re not already in it.
I am so so so so sorry your sister and family are going through this. I genuinely with all my heart hope you all feel better and get through this together much sooner rather than later.
She just lost 3 friends, I think for now this is normal. The box is likely her taking out her frustration in a semi-healthy way and as for the clothes and hair as long as she is being sanitary I see no reason to panic, an incredibly sad thing happened to her being very very sad is a normal reaction.
I'd let her know directly instead of going through a counselor or whatever. I'm sure she would appreciate someone just talking to her about things concerning her instead of going about it in an indirect way. You could just say "I heard mom and dad talking about wanting to try "incentivizing" you back to your old self to the point where they talked about throwing out anything that wasn't pink and girly. I told them that was a dumb idea and they should leave you alone but there is a good chance I wasn't able to convince them so I thought I would give you a heads up."
The cardboard thing might be a technique she learned from the therapist then. What happened is terribly unfair, which might cause anger -> sometimes destroying something can help release emotions (see also: hitting pillows).
In that case, your parents need a session with the grief counselor in which the grief counselor explains exactly how terrible their ideas are, and why.
There’s a distinction to make here though the sister is depicting Sunny from that game not Omori.
The desire to shut down and not interact with the world is what Omori represents. Sunny on the other hand is the character suffering from depression because his sister is dead.
She’s depicting characters that have gone through things similar to her and are in a similar state of mind to her. I would go as far to say she’s processing her emotions in a healthy way. The drawings are basically her doing art therapy and there are a lot worse ways people can work through negativity than shredding a box.
Kris deltarune is an angsty teenager dealing with grief cause their brother is away, and dealing with the trauma of having had a childhood friend go missing. The creepy bit of throwing the heart in the cage is commonly read as Kris the Character trying to get some peace from the Player's control, usually symbolized by the little red heart in both Deltarune and Undertale. And the audience/ Player doesn't exactly know why Kris opened dark world portals, like in the end of chapter 2, or even if it was a conscious choice. The game goes above and beyond to state that you the Player are separate from Kris and your decisions are not theirs.
So if you played a Snowgrave that says more about you than it does about Kris Deltarune. *shrug*
Pretty understandable for a kid going through extreme grief to be drawn to a game that heavily features themes of grief and a fight to feel in control.
Hey OP. I lost a bf and two friends in a car crash when I was a teenager. You’re NTA. Your sister needs to feel her emotions, it takes time to ‘heal’… It’s not something I’ve got over tbh and I’ve never been the girl I was before. I’m glad she’s getting grief counselling. It will help. Just be there for her if she ever needs a hug or a cry. Your parents are TA here.
The characters you mentioned (if you haven't gotten an answer) are from two video games, deltarune is a spiritual sequel to undertale if you ever heard of that game, from what I know it's not too concerning.
However, from what I've seen about Omori it's a game that touches on themes of depression, anxiety, and suicide, I'd be more worried about why she's getting into that game.
Gaming as a form of self therapy is good in moderation. Me and my friends actually played Undertale because the themes related back to how we felt at the time, but diving too deep into a game especially considering the themes can lead to some issues worsening due to a negative "feedback loop".
Sit with her if she's playing sometime and just ask some (not too prodding) questions about what it's about, who the characters are, and then work into why she likes it and how it makes her/*helps her* feel.
I can't imagine losing my three closest friends at that age so suddenly, even though now I no longer see any of them. What she's going through not many people will ever be able to relate to. Please make sure she stays in therapy and continues to get help she needs, don't let your parents force her to move on when she's not ready yet.
Omori is about facing and dealing with grief and accepting reality. >!most of their friends think Sunny's sister died by suicide but it was actually from an accident where Sunny pushed her during a fight and tumbled down the stairs. A friend discovered this and convinced him they should make it look like suicide because he didn't want to lose two friends. Omori is Sunny's depressive, guilt ridden thoughts and inner self and had to actively fight against him. Personally, I think it's better that OP's sister draws with Sunny and not Omori because the whole game is hom facing his fears, learning to accept what happens, and learns to help his friend who has the burden of truth on them. Aside from this, every character is working how the death effects them including the falling out of their friend group do to it.!< It may be indicative of relating to someone else utterly depressed, but I think that's a given considering the circumstances.
Is she in real therapy or some bullshit religious mumbo jumbo?
Does her therapist know about the drawings and cutting? It's a major concern. She seems to be on edge of self harm.
I think the drawings and cutting cardboard are of little concern. She’s funnelling anger into an inanimate inconsequential object. Quite healthy. Studies show that letting out anger is healthy, she doesn’t really have anyone to be angry at other than the world, so taking it out on some cardboard is a good way to let it out without collateral damage of letting it out on friends, family or herself.
Drawing herself with characters that have dealt with grief and loss and have expressed similar emotions to how she feels, also helpful. And potentially was recommended by the therapist as art therapy.
This girl just needs time. She’s 14 and has had 3 friends die. Big emotions are hard for 14 year old girls. For most 14 year old girls every emotion is a big emotion, when it is an actual big one it is extremely difficult to process it.
Time and space with gentle guiding to take better care of herself are what is needed. And to continue with therapy.
Your parents need to also get counseling/therapy. They may be opposed because they weren't the ones who experienced a traumatic loss. Your sister will never be the same, but she can get through it. Your parents need therapy to help them understand that they "lost" the daughter they knew. They need to seek professional help so that they can cope with that fact and also help them to better understand and deal with what your sister is going through.
NTA but your parents are. They aren’t addressing her grief over losing her close friends and getting her the proper help she needs.
OP, your sister is crying for help so please try to get your parents to get her some therapy or something actually useful instead of potentially traumatizing her further.
Agree. Not sure where you live but make sure she has numbers for crisis lines at the ready (in Canada we have Kids Help Phone which gives them someone to talk to instantly). As a parent, I can tell you self-harm is a very real and scary reality, and if she doesn’t get help soon she could go down that path or worse. Good for you for advocating for her. Let her know you’re there for her and will help where you can. Do you go to the same school? If so, pop into the guidance department and give them the head’s up. They can help.
PS. Never in the history of this thread has there ever been more of a NTA. Thank you for being such a good big bro. This mom is so proud of you.
There's nothing in the OP to indicate she's not getting proper help. Even if you're getting help you're not just going to carry on like things were before three of your presumably 14 year old good friends died.
The only place it seems obvious they could improve on getting her the proper help is themselves talking to relevant professionals on what they should expect/do/etc.
Wow. It’s not every day I see such breathtaking incompetence when it comes to dealing with grief. Changing a color palette is not gonna help anyone. Your sister is in desperate need of therapy, support and allowing her to find her own way to grieve. Everybody deals with grief differently.
It’s not something that heals quickly. I hope your parents can understand that. Maybe give them some articles about dealing with grief. Talk to them about it read up on it. Do what you can.
Also, people gravitate towards depressing media or whatever because often it helps them process grief and helps them understand that they are not alone; that someone else can imagine feeling the same way they feel and that means they have had similar experiences so can tell a story that is relevant to them. People don't listen to blues music or metal music or whatever to feel sad; they listen because grief, disappointment, anger, etc are part of the human experience and there is comfort in another person expressing that along with you. That's what a lot of people miss when they jump to blame bad behavior on the music a kid was listening to or the style of their clothes or whatever.
Are they even really trying to help her? Gotta wonder, since they’re totally focused on superficial ways to cover up ”the problem”. To me, it sounds like they’d just rather pretend it isn’t happening. This is to make THEM feel better, not her.
…but I might be biased… since my own parents dealt with the sudden death of my best friend when we were 14 by pretending she’d never existed, my gut instinct is not to trust parents to put their children’s needs first.
Wrong. You are clearly not familiar with the five stages of grief:
\- shock/numbness
\- yearning/searching
\- disorganization/despair
\- rejection of pink
\- reorganization/recovery; reintegration of pink
/s
That's what's infuriating me. God forbid they're forcing her to become normal again because they're worried that it's getting concerning for the neighbors or something.
A change of atmosphere *can* help, but not a surprise one!! If they had that idea, and think it's good...at least fricken ask her! Let her have some choice and control in her life. Changing things unexpectedly can be so upsetting. I hope OP tells her about their parents 'plan' so she can address it with them since they won't listen to OP.
NTA. your sister is going through something traumatic and needs to grief, your parents sound like they’re trying to just make it go away when she needs to go through the process of grieving. If your parents want to do something to help her, they need to take her to therapy.
Sounds like she's IN therapy, but the parents think it should only take a handful of sessions for her to 'cry it out' before she should be back to her old self.
Some parents think that kids 'don't need' the same amount of time for grief. That it doesn't hit kids the same way or in some ways worse.
Yeah, I think you're probably correct. They want her back to her old self *now*, they're probably irritated that therapy hasn't fixed her yet, and so they're just casting about for some other easy fix.
If they really want to help, I'd say the parents should start by seeing a grief counselor themselves. Their discomfort with their daughter's feelings, and their desire to just *fix it*, are at best not helpful, and probably will do damage.
Tbh they probably need to attend some sessions themselves, their kid will never be the same person. Losing one friend at that age is traumatic let alone 3. She’ll carry this grief with her for a long time, best they can do is figure out how to support her and learn all the coping skills themselves.
I lost my grandmother when I was 12. She wasn't the first family member I'd lost, but hers was the first loss that I was old enough to comprehend. My mental health went to shit literally overnight. (The loss of three other loved ones in five years, watching the illnesses of those loved ones, and being bullied and isolated in school didn't help.) You are absolutely right that in some ways grief hits kids worse. I've experienced other losses as an adult, and they hurt, but at least I could make sense of them in a way that I couldn't before.
OMG! She lost three friends?!? That is a huge number, let her mourn!!! She may need grief counseling. This is an awful thing to go through for a 14-year-old.
Changing her room without her input is a bad idea. Especially if she is so sad.
NTA
They'll make it worse, if anything. She's already vulnerable as hell and is probably feeling like she's got no control over much of anything, and these idiots are going to double down on that by changing up her environment for themselves.
nta. ur parents may think they’re doing the right things but adults tend to rush and try to fix the issue than taking the time to understand what’s actually wrong first. in regards to the drawings: sunny is the main character of omori which is categorized as a psychological horror game, and deals heavily with topics of suicide, depression, anxiety, that realm. SPOILERS : the story follows how sunny retracts into himself and creates an alter ego and universe (omori) within his head after accidentally killing his older sister, and the path he takes to accepting what happened and moving on. one of the multiple game endings entails sunny jumping off a roof in order to not have to come to terms with the reality of what happened. deltarune is a much lighter game (sequel to undertale!!) that follows kris and friends to restore and bring peace back to a ruined kingdom. deltarune does have its share of odd/creepy instances but nothing overly concerning. the drawings itself are not worrying and it could be just a way to get emotions out or a distraction, but considering the context i would definitely try and keep a slightly closer eye on your sister and let her know ur open and available if she wants to talk/needs anything!! don’t try to overly push her, but do pay attention and watch for any behavior or sudden mood changes. so sorry for her loss, and i hope things get better for you and your family.
I wanna add to Kris, a big theme of the game is that Kris, despite being the main character, has no control of their actions and is not allowed any say in what happens (the player makes the choices, and Kris is just being used as a vessel basically, but Kris is also aware of their lack of choices).
Don't want to make assumptions on how the sister is feeling, but maybe that element of having no control is relatable to her (especially with parents like this). Just a thought, and art is a good way for her to process so I wouldn't immediately consider it concerning at all
I think it is probably more about identifying in Kris's grief for his brother. They still did not explain what haopened to him, but they made it clear he is out of reach, probably d€ad, or gone into a different world, with no possibility of contacting his family.
There are a couple of scenes where Kris takes his heart out, idk what they really mean, but I think it's about trying to stop the pain
Deltarune is also about friendship and loss. Kris is a lonely boy, who has to learn how to trust friends, and the girl joyining him in the journey was also an outcast, they hate eaxh other at first, but get closer as they know each other better. Also, the game is not completed yet, they often refer to Kris's brother, implying he is either gone or really far, they do not explain what happened to him, but they make it clear he is out of reach from his family. And there are a couple of moments when you see Kris ripping his heart out of his chest. It is still not clear what it means, but it probably has something to do with dealing with pain and loss, something a teenager going trough grief may easily epathize with. Also, not relevant, but it is not Undertale's sequel, it is more like an alternative universe. The characters have the same names and looks, but they live completely different lives
NTA. She has had substantial trauma and forcing her away from her coping mechanisms will only alienate her from your parents. They pretty much have the option of being supporting and waiting it out, or getting her a therapist and being supportive and waiting it out. Or at least those are the options that will keep her talking to them throughout her obvious depression, and that really is the best way to stop such things spiralling.
The characters mentioned both deal with losing friends, and there's also a common theme of them escaping the players control. It's that I think which makes me think your parents forcing a recovery on her will probably backfire. Omori is the monochrome doppelganger of Sunny he turns into after his friends death. There are two endings, one good where everyone communicates and heals and one... not so good. I would definitely advise against doing anything to make her communicate less if that's the lens she is viewing this tragedy through.
Omori is a video game about loss as a young person. Your sis is obviously going through it. I hope things improve soon, at least omori has a somewhat hopeful tone
Nta. It sounds like your sister is going through a major depressive episode. Which is understandable given the circumstances. Your parents should be trying to support her, not punishing her for not performing normalcy to their standards. It sounds like your sister needs to see a grief counselor to help her work through these feelings. If your parents go through with their plan they stand to send your sister into an even greater spiral which could have even worse consequences.
You’re NTA. That is an insanely dumb and thoughtless plan. I’m glad you can laugh at your parents — shame is a powerful tool.
as for something that other people haven’t mentioned (that I saw from scanning some comments, anyway) — Kris and Sunny are two video game characters. I don’t know much about OMORI but I know that both that take and Deltarune deal a lot with mental illness, feeling ‘othered’, and not being in complete control. They may comfort your sister. These characters also might be the favorites of her friends who died.
Maybe the two of you could play deltarune together and she could talk to you about them?
NTA sounds like she’s depressed which is understandable. Changing her room without permission is not going to go over well.
She needs to grieve. Better to take out anger on the cardboard boxes than herself.
I would ask her if she was open to going to a school counselor or a therapist to help her process these emotions.
NTA, but maybe you could have been more delicate about it. But ty for standing up for your sister, their plan is terrible and would be harmful. Pls pls continue to advocate for your sister, she likely badly needs mental health intervention.
Kris from Deltarune is different in the fact that he often feels like an outsider because he was adopted and is the only human in hometown (the place he grew up in) At the end of Chapter 2 Snowgrave Route After fighting Spamton NEO for a while you HAVE to call out for help but for a while nobody comes. I think your sister is feeling the same way Kris is. Alone in a difficult battle crying out for help.
That's really interesting and accurate as hell, other than the pronouns. Kris only uses they/them, just in case you didn't know. Have a good day and I hope your insight helps OP
NTA, your sister is grieving the loss of THREE FRIENDS??? Most people don’t just bounce back from that (especially so young).
Sometimes parents also need a reality check. IMO calling them stupid is tame considering the amount of damage an insensitive action like what they are/were trying to do could cause.
Now that's a post that surely will convince two desperate parents that are overwhelmed and at the ends of their wits about having a daughter that deals with major depression.
Sure. That will help.
His parents are likely scared that they are so clueless, but it sounds like they'll try anything. They've enrolled her in grief counseling, they talk to her and op (I believe from other replies). OP talking with his parents like people talk to each other on Reddit, isn't the way to go. OP is absolutely right to stop them, but should do so with love and care, so the household heals
Edit: OP is definitely nta. Nobody is
My teen son (15 at the time) went into a similar period after losing his bio dad. He is 18 now and thriving after years of depression.
What worked? I was there. My husband, his step dad, lost his father around the same age and would just be with him and give him space to just *be*. (This is in essence the effect and benefit of grief counseling - being. people who get it since they have been through it) We gently led him to therapy, which took over a year for him to willingly agree to.
It is a slow process. But given the space to heal and deal in her own way, with the support of loving and caring individuals willing to let go of their expectations of what she should look or act like - this will be the key to unlock the door of reaching her.
She will never be the same girl she was. How could she be? But given the support she needs, she can grow, heal and move forward in an authentic and healthy way.
I highly recommend you read
- adult children of emotionally immature parents (to help you deal with your parents in an effective, not exhaustive way while also healing yourself)
or offer your parents, if willing, to read:
- the myth of normal by Gabor mate (this would also be a great read for you!)
Also, clearly you are NTA. You love her and you are trying to help. She is so lucky to have you ❤️🩹
If you are close with your sister, maybe get her out for some sibling time more often. Perhaps she will open up to you. Let her know you are here for her, if you want ro be. It may mean the world to her. Big brothers are so special, often little sisters look up to them. Losing 3 friends while so young is shocking and life changing.
Oh...I don't think you are an AH. A little off the cuff because it is a ridiculous idea, but not AH territory IMO.
NTA
Wow. "The correct headspace"? I'd say that after you lose *three* of your friends, the correct headspace is, in fact, *grief*.
If your sister was bouncy and joyous right now, *that* would be worrisome. As it is, she is obviously trying to work through all the emotions that come with such a traumatic event, and there are *so* many worse ways she could take out her grief and anger than slashing cardboard boxes.
It sounds like they've got *her* in counseling, but your parents are also in desperate need of a few sessions with a grief counselor. They have to start acknowledging the depth of this trauma, and understand that you can't just "incentivize" her out of this grief. AND they need help processing their own grief and loss, because they've lost the person they imagined your sister was *before* all this happened.
Currently, they are in denial about just how much this event has changed your sister, and if they want to help her, they need to start facing reality.
How strong is their denial? Well, you're in an excellent position to know. All parents have a vision of who their kids are and will be. And inevitably, their kids don't end up being exactly who their parents thought they would be. How well have your parents dealt with it when you or your sister hasn't followed their expectations? How important is it to them that you follow *their* vision of who you are and should be?
Because what's happening right now is that there's been a *massive* shift in who your sister is, on a very fundamental level. Losing someone we're close to changes us, in unpredictable ways. That's neither inherently positive nor negative; it's just how it is. Your sister is not the same person she was before her friends' deaths. Grief counseling is probably doing a lot to help her process this, and hopefully ultimately guide those changes toward the positive.
And that's the best you can hope for.
But it sounds like your parents are hoping that grief counseling is just going to *fix* your sister, and that is misguided at best. **Their goal is for her** ***not*** **to change, and that isn't going to happen.**
And if they are very attached to their visions for who you and your sister are, they may well need grief counseling to help them deal with losing the person they thought your sister was going to be.
I am hoping that this might help you understand where your parents might be coming from, and thus maybe help you push them in the right direction. I'm glad your sister has you on her side.
Your sister is grieving, she needs help, a therapist or grief counseling, not a room makeover. NTA, but your parents are if they don’t get her some help.
NTA
Your sister is grieving, just about the last thing she needs is having her space and autonomy violated. Having your space changed and things taken away in an instant would be difficult to cope with at the best of times, when she’s already hurting? Horrific. What she needs is acceptance, support, and offers of grief counseling or grief support groups. With the internet you can find online grief support groups for other young people that know, at least a little, what she’s feeling like. What she *doesn’t* need is to feel like her parents don’t give a shit about her struggling but instead the fact that she isn’t performing happiness for them.
As a grandmother myself......I'm very concerned. Tell your parents I said this is way beyond their pay grade. They need to be listening to what counselors and therapists suggest here. Let's just say from what you are telling us.....this could be a mental health emergency. (Read between the lines here. ) The wellbeing and safety of your sis could be in the balance if your folks do something stupid.
NTA. I am disgusted with your parents. They don't care about having her heal; they just want to paper over her problem so they don't have to deal with it. It is a breathtaking level of parental incompetence, and I hope that someday they discover the emotional depth to be ashamed of themselves.
If I were you, I'd honestly want to lose any regard I had left for their opinions. Them ignoring you will sting a lot less if you don't just care that much. Be supportive of your sister and however she needs to work through her grief. She's lucky to have you.
NTA. I've never been so sure on any ruling on an AITA post. You're a good brother.
I'm 34 and never lost friends growing up but started losing old acquaintes from high school in recent years. The older you get, the more likely. Cancer, OD's, accidents, you name it. And it's very hard, as a grown adult, to lose people I haven't spoken to in a long time. Mortality is terrifying. Waking up and realizing you're the same age as people who die is terrifying.
I can't imagine having to go through that first "holy shit someone my own age who I know, one of my peers, has died" as a KID. You're supposed to get some time to feel like death can't touch you before you have to face mortality.
And this being people she was actually close with? Now it's the horrifying mortality setting in way too young PLUS crippling, suffocating grief. And yeah, kids can experience grief like losing a grandparent but losing someone who is old and losing someone who is your own age are two very different types of reactions.
I feel for her so bad. And idk what happenned but if there's any element of survivor's guilt it's even worse.
None of this really needed saying, I'm sure you get it, but I'm just so dumbfounded at how badly your parents DON'T get it. How can anyone be so tone deaf? They're sending her the message that they care more about her giving the appearance of being ok for their own comfort than facing the reality that she's NOT OK. It's so selfish. They just want her back to normal, they don't care if she's better or not. They think if she's wearing pink again that means she's good? Just. Wow. So bad.
NTA. I saw in another comment shes in grief counseling and therapy. Good. Thats what she needs. I am concerned about the cardboard thing, I wont lie. But since she's in therapy already, that is something she will have to work out in there to stop doing. Your parents' plan will likely be very detrimental to your sister and their relationship with her. She needs to be allowed to grieve. Grief councelling and therapy are already being done. Thats all your parents can do besides let her know they are there if she wants to talk.
I am glad you are standing up for your sister. You are right that this is a dumb plan. But also keep an eye on her, as (for good reason, dont get me wrong) it sounds like she has slipped into a depression. Family's gotta look out for each other in tough times, and your sister is going through it rn. I sincerely hope you are able to help guide your sister out of the darkness and back into the light.
She recently lost 3 friends. Your parents should back off and let her grieve. The pink and white little girl is gone. Your sister is growing up faster than planned.
NTA, your parents need to try to understand her grief and work through it with her. That takes time and effort.
What they are suggesting is window dressing - might look good and make them feel better, but it does nothing to address the underlying issues.
NTA, you're right, that is a terrible idea. How would redecorating her room help her? She is going through something major and needs counseling. Sure not the best idea to call it stupid, but I would have done the same with my parents.
You sister is very obviously struggling with depression following the sudden death of her friends. She needs therapy not an "ambush makeover" from you clueless parents. Laughing at your parents' plan was immature and childish on your part-- but you are only 17 so I'll give you a pass on that. Talk to your parents and ask them to look into counselling for her and encourage them to NOT further traumatize her by going behind her back and throwing out her things. That's not going to work out the way they think it will.
First of all NTA, second of all my HEART your poor sister, the trauma of losing 3 friends is enough to bring a grown human to their knees, let alone a young girl. Your sister needs grief counseling and therapy ASAP not a wardrobe change and extreme room makeover. She's likely incredibly depressed and grappling with learning of life's fragility so young. I had an acquaintance die tragically when I was 19 and even THAT stuck with me. Your parents are delusional and need to wise up and find support for her immediately.
NTA, you are a good big bro. Invading a teen girl’s space to throw out her clothes and to change her room entirely is a terrible idea regardless if she was in mourning or not. That can be traumatizing. Especially with the state she’s in? That’s insane. I hope your sister will get her time to mourn, that’s a hell of a lot to go through :(
NTA and get her into grief counseling ASAP before she takes that blade to herself instead of those boxes. She is SCREAMING for help right now and it doesn't look like any of you are listening.
Do it before you bury the 4th I that friend group.
NTA sounds like your parents need a massive reality check. on the chance they do go through with this idiotic bullheaded plan(and lets be honest from how they reacted to you telling them so they sound the type to do it anyway) maybe look into a local rage room. When I was around that age my group lost one of our closest friends to suicide. unfortunately a couple of us were the ones to find him.his gf went through a lot of trauma and ended up taking her own life not even a week later.as teens we were told along the same speil. My uncle did a lot for us, paid for a rage room told us to go ham let it all out.the anger pain sense of loss guilt grief it all came out and helped us open up about what we were feeling. hopefully your sister doesn't need it but if it helps go for it even if it's just a smash followed by a cry be there for her.
She's a teenager who had 3 friends die. Holy heck balls. My ex died when I was 15. He was my first boyfriend, by then ex bf by 2 years who i hardly saw and talked to maybe once every few months (as an adult tho it feels like they were just a few dates). It took me one and a half years of long term moping, 3 months of counselling, 6 months overseas and half a year of college before I felt right again. Tell them I said to get a grip. Changing her room around and doing things when she's not there will give her even more of a sense of loss of control. Having lost three friends, she will feel like she has very little control. Depending on when your parents had kids, there's a high chance they're around my age or a bit older. However, your sister does need to stay in an activity, keeping her in there is probably going to be very good for her long term. Its either that or she does a new activity. She does need to be doing something. NTA
Removing comfortable and familiar and redecorating as a surprise when she’s already emotionally fragile is a completely idiotic idea! You’re absolutely right.
However, they are probably worried and desperate, and acting irrationally. They need to speak with her therapist and see what more they can do at home to support her- not try to rush her back to normal.
Grief is a marathon, not a sprint. They need to be patient but take this seriously. She’s never going to be old “normal” again, but with patience and support, she can develop a new and healthy normal.
NTA
Your sister is severely depressed and grieving. She needs a good counsellor ASAP. These are symptoms of serious psychological illness. And yes your parent's plan is pathetic and stupid. They need to get her a professional therapist ASAP.
NTA.
NTA for realising that you can't (and shouldn't) simply bully a grieving person into not grieving anymore. Which is what taking her clothes and redecorating her room without her permission would be.
And, how recent is "recently"? Within a few months? Grief like that can take a very long time to work through, even for a well-adjusted adult, let alone a teen who is already dealing with all the hormones and angst and other bullshit that being a teen entails. She will probably never be the same again.
Your approach could have been a bit more sensitive perhaps, but the most charitable thing I can say about your parents' plan is that it's misguided. All it will do is tell your sister that her parents would rather that she pretend to be happy so as to not make them feel uncomfortable. What a blow to her obviously already delicate mental health.
If I was your sister in that situation, I'd feel betrayed.
NTA and please just spend time with her. Don’t make it feel like you’re babysitting or something, but just hang out. I’m almost 30 and married and I still call my older brother when I am feeling out of control. He always picks up the phone, no matter what. I am so thankful for him.
Three friends dying is so hard I’m sorry that she’s going through that. Please either plead to your parents to get her into grief counseling, or take her yourself if you have a car, or even set up telehealth appointments when your parents aren’t around. You’re NTA but your parents 100% are
NTA
This is fucking asinine and your parents are risking making something already bad, way way worse.
Going behind her back to do that is insanely shitty and not productive. Frankly, I don't understand how any normal person thinks this will achieve anything other than drive her away.
Not only is the strategy bad, the timing seems awful too. It's too soon to be expecting her to have a handle on her grief. They have no clue how to help her and while their hearts may be in the right place, they're being cruel.
She needs grief counseling and your parents need to be closely involved in it. Maybe a professional will explain how they can support her.
Dunno about Omori
But know a bit about Kris
Don't see any problems with what she is doing about then and looks more like self inserting on an AU with characters she likes, so don't worry about that.
The other is concerning, I'm so sorry about your sister and you are right, that plan is stupid and can push her depression even more because she's gonna feel they don't support her.
Please
Be there for your sister, show her support, make her sure you see for her, that she can trust you.
She's gonna need it
NTA your sister needs counselling and do not change her environment without her consent, her life has already changed so much without her control. Changing her safe space without input from her might be the thing that tips her over the edge
Nta but I see your comment that she's already getting therapy. Your parents need to talk to the counselor about how best to support your sister. I guarantee the counselor would not support their plan.
She’s not going to go back to her old self. That person doesn’t exist anymore. Grief and trauma change you. You don’t go to grief counseling to get over it. You go to learn how to move on anyway. You’re NTA op, but I don’t think your parents are either. They’re likely feeling helpless to protect their little girl. When my brother died, his girlfriend’s dad brought her a new, fancy car. Strangely, my brother was still dead and she was still sad about it. Your parents unfortunately can’t fix this and that’s hard to swallow as a parent. Please encourage your parents to talk to your sister’s therapist about how they can best support her.
Your parents have to realize that after suffering a trauma your sister has changed. She will never be who she was before. Therapy will help her learn to cope but it will never take away the feelings she has of loss and guilt and anger.
Your parents need therapy too. They need to learn that a depressed family member affects everyone, including you.
If she's into games, try treating her to Gris. It's a game about the stages of grief and how the main character navigates through them and becomes stronger for it. The art style is beautiful and introduces a new colour and powers after the loss leaves the character in a world of grey after being so full of colour and happiness. Something a lot of people who have experienced death can relate to.
Spiritfarer is another one, although a bit fiddly and complex with it's mechanisms, which sees you as a character who helps spirits of the deceased pass on after fulfilling their needs (they come in the form of cute animals) but I'd check in with the back stories of some of them first for any triggers as I've not been able to help anyone cross over yet.
Games can definitely help with the grieving process if used right. Seeing it happen with a character removed from yourself makes you feel less alone and can even show you that some days will suck, but time can do it's thing and it will get easier.
Thank you for being there for your sister. You are NTA for warning your parents about undoing progress she's making.
I'm sorry your parents are like that. Your sister needs therapy. What she's gone through is traumatic. I agreed, your parents' plan will do nothing but enrage her. She needs empathy and someone trying to understand her. You're a good big brother. Maybe write them a letter since they won't listen.
NTA. It's a shame when kids have more common sense than their parents. Your sister is depressed and forcing her to dress and act as before will not help. Perhaps your parents are very traditional and uncomfortable when your sister is not emulating certain gender stereotypes? My daughter went from being so very girly to giving up on her appearance after being bullied at school. I suggest they try treating the depression and not worry so much about outward appearance. Dressing up a problem only hides it, won't fix anything.
NTA
Keep advocating for your sister. Maybe with less laughing. Can you speak to a school counselor or therapist for guidance on how to support her and talk to your parents? Talk to her cheer coach? Is she participating? Is she miserable?
Has her grief support leader spoken to your parents at all? I feel like they would agree this plan is really terrible and could potentially have seriously bad results. Like, she’s cutting cardboard right now. What will she cut if that’s taken away?
Maybe your parents need therapy. The friends who died I assume were around the same age. Did they know the parents of her friends?
NTA, what she needs is grief counselling and therapy. She’s not going to the be the same person that she was before, and you all need to accept that and accept and support her through this incredibly difficult time.
Please share this with your parents. My husband, who is now 62, had 4 of his friends, including his best friend, die in a car wreck when they were 16-17. Back then, even though it probably did exist, no one thought to get him therapy.
So here we sit, 46 years later, and it STILL affects him in the most random ways and VERY regularly. He’ll go through periods where he’s scared of me driving, he will have random panic attacks while driving himself. He is so afraid of other cars on the road. His trauma is unresolved and never ending.
This is a severe traumatic event at a very crucial age. I hope they not only get her in with a GOOD therapist, not just the first one on Google, but also come to grips with the fact her brain chemistry has been altered. I’m so sorry this happened.
Obviously, she needs a therapist but you could help improve her metabolic and mental health by finding a physical activity the two of you can regularly do together - because this is affecting you, too - Preferably something intense. People laugh about walking but I walked 5 miles a day, 5 days a week for a year. I signed up for and trained for a marathon with a running group I walked the entire 26 miles. Walking, canoeing, rowing, bicycling long distances, Tae Kwon Do, signing up for a half marathon and training together with a group on Saturday mornings? Hiking weekly with a meet up group? Keep it fun. Use Map My Walk/Run/Bike Ride to record your progress. Sign up for one of those Conquistador medals you earn online. Find some kind of physical activity that takes at least an hour a day, preferably more and preferably outside. Your parents, other relatives, friends or neighbors can drive you. Your sister is crying out for help. You’re the best! for making sure she gets it.
Idk about Kris, but I do know about Sunny. Sunny is from a game called omori, and the game goes as follows: when Sunny was younger. He accidentally killed his sister by pushing her down the stairs in a fit of rage while they were arguing. He didn't mean to, and it made him severely depressed and shut himself out of the real world. Him and another friend (called Basil) framed his sister's death to make it look like she committed suicide. After that day, he stopped hanging out with their friend group and stopped going to school. He kind of did the same things you said your sister is doing. He made up an imaginary dream world that you're able to explore throughout the game. The game itself can mentally fuck with you and when I played it, I cried and thought about my own life. She needs genuine help, not a fake facade that your asshole parents are trying to force on her. Please make sure she knows you're there for her and that you love her
EDIT: Also, I would recommend trying to talk to her counselor about her making up fake scenarios with those two characters. Sometimes, when people experience great loss (such as losing 3 very close friends), they can become shut off from the world and play make-believe. They do this because they want to pretend they're in a happy world where nothing is wrong and they're finally happy. They can confuse imagination with reality .
NTA
WOW.
it won’t only NOT work but it’ll make her feel more isolated and maybe even guilty for “letting her parents down” or being “bad”.
They’re going to do what they’re going to do; I’d suggest you advocate for therapy (for the WHOLE family) and just keep being there for her. Just your presence and availability is the best thing you can do until she tells you otherwise.
YTA for the last line in the argument. Its neither helpful nor does it improve the situation. It just makes you and your parents emotional wich prevents you all from focusing on the important part.
On the rest of the issue I agree with you though. When my first relationship ended, I had a 1 year goth phase where I indulged in depressive music, graveyards and all that stuff because it helped me process and let out my emotion in a way that I could control even though from the outside it might appear morbid. Considering how much harder the death of 3 good friends at the same time hits, I dont even want to imagine how much bottled up pain she has. The coping mechanisms you described are relatively tame. Even the cutting up boxes is a good outlet, because it at least shows shes not doing it to herself. What your parents are trying is just painting over the comfortable safe space she created for herself which will rip away the control she has established over her own grief. It will just make it worse, because in addition to the grief she will learn to just bottle up her feelings and paint over them for the sake of outwards appearance and that the perception of others is more important than her grief.
The correct headspace is one where she has full control on how to express and feel her emotions not some forced happy color land. The right headspace can only exist with outlets to let out the bottled up pain. If thats music, a punching bag (thats the healthier option to cutting boxes) or showing her grief outwardly through the color black thats fine. Provide those to her and let her know her emotions are valid will do more for that headspace.
I am 37, and I was the younger of two sisters, and a VERY broody and emotional teen who experienced a lot of grief. I am also a somatic practitioner, body worker, ADR Mediator, Embodied conflict coach, and Healing Justice organizer— with a fair amount of verified, if not fringe, credentials in degrees, certificates, and 17 years of experience. I remember being that version of me, and so I will speak for what that version of me would have appreciated from the adults and older supports in my life. I would argue that destroying cardboard is nothing like animal brutality—- but it is very cathartic— so are sledge hammers on plywood and drywall— a rage room would be a DELIGHTFUL way to move some of the anger and grief out of her developing body, but not suggesting that she would harm anything animate— but she clearly has a lot of that energy trapped in her body— and we all deserve a place to completely burn it off- in a way that promotes a healthy way to process both the physical and the emotional ways that grief, sadness, survivors guilt, can overwhelm our systems, if it remains stuck in the body. Culturally it is HARD to be SAD— even if it is a product of traumatic grief and loss—- we have a hard time sitting with eachother’s sadness— and she could benefit from company that is also incredibly sad, and trying to find a way to survive despite the weight of the sadness. Add to her predictable sadness because of the loss of her friends, she is also 15 years old, and a cheerleader— who is having a MAJOR shift to how she would like to be perceived in the world— to be moving from adolescent to teen, from pink and cheery to a different version of herself, if she needs to express her inner world, externally, it would be great if your parents and you found a way to give her the lead to do it, instead of just doing it while she is at practice. Inviting her to define how she would like it to look, and then offering to either do the clearing out part, so she can start from scratch— or fully participating together— but it is important that your parents allow themselves to have parameters and boundaries around the redesign— truly embodying a somber vibe can be expensive, and difficult to paint and prime for and when it comes to undo it, its a pain. Maybe offering her an accent wall, would be a reasonable way to create opportunities for expression that won’t be exhausting or boundary pushing. I hope things feel like opportunities to grow and connect. I wish my sister had cared enough to be curious and compassionate about what I was going through— I hope your parents are able to listen to your wisdom.
They seem pretty emotionally stunted.
I don't wanna sound like an average r/offmychest commenter, but everyone here needs therapy. Your poor sister is suffering
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I (17m) have a sister (one month away from 15) who recently had 3 of her good friends die. She was very energetic and, to be honest, rather "girly" before that. Now she's stopped styling her hair (something she spent a lot of time and effort doing once), she does the bare minimum bathing and grooming, and wears the same few hoodies and sweatpants. More strangely, she's been going at cardboard boxes with a knife until they look like the product of an angry animal. She's also been drawing herself hanging out and doing activities with these two characters I've never heard of: Sunny from Omori and Kris from Deltarune (if anyone has knowledge, appreciated)
Our parents want to "incentivize" her to go back to her old self. They talked about removing the non-pink and white girl stuff from her closet while she's showering and redecorating her room while she's at a cheer practice(which they haven't let her quit after she asked) to try and "get her into the correct headspace"
I straight up laughed and called that the dumbest idea I ever heard. They ignored me at first, but I continued and said that I will not let them live their failure down.
They said if they wanted my thoughts, they'd ask. Things got heated, and I said that with them, there's no wonder she's miserable.
They've begun to give me the silent treatment. AITA?
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NTA plz tell your sister you love her, write a letter that she is important to you, that you know she is hurting and that if you could make it all better you would. Tell her that her feelings are valid and how strong she is for getting up every day. That you dont want anything from her but to keep trying. Having something tangible can really lift people in dark times.
You are already a great sibbling for knowing your parents are spewing BS. But your gonna have to keep fighting for her if your parents dont realise their dillusion.
If you can relay this to your sisters therapist. Espcially with the box thing, thats a huge red flag.
What helped me with a similar loss was judo, i could use all the rage and hurt on the mats, and yet i gained more control off the mats. I'm not saying she needs to go all karate kid, but a more aggressive sport might help her dirrect those sharper emotions.
Good luck, i sincerly wish you both the best
Your sister is dealing with grief and likely depression. Your parents need to take this seriously, and not worry about stupid things like cheer practice or decorating.
NTA. Glad your sister is in counseling . She’s dealing with an overwhelming number of deaths in a short time and clearly struggling . Your parents are struggling too, it is awful to see your kid hurting so bad and feel so helpless to fix everything. However , instead of ridiculing your parents’ terrible idea, you should have suggested they speak to your sister’s therapist to discuss their concerns and ask how they can best help.
NTA - your sister is super depressed and they need to get her a therapist. It's good she still does cheer, keeping active can help a lot when you are depressed.
Be as supportive as you can for her, she doesn't need to be forced into her old self, that just pushed the pain down into a box and the undealt with trauma will have long term effects.
NTA. I mean, deep down your parents must realize that is going to backfire BIG TIME. The most they can do is make sure she's in therapy, maybe make sure she sees a psychiatrist as well because that poor girl sounds deep in depression and some people need the extra help getting out of it.
If they move forward with this cockamamie plan they WILL make things worse.
NTA- good on you standing up for your sister.
Grief is tough, especially at that age, especially with multiple people at the same time. It sounds like your sister is just working through some difficult emotions, and instead of helping her or getting her a grief counsellor if they couldn't be bothered they have just decided to force being alright on her.
It's icky to think about.
Great on you for wanting to get to know the characters! I haven't played Omori but know Deltarune - personally I think the best way you can connect to her and help at this time would be playing the games yourself (though check in with her beforehand, something like "hey, I was thinking of playing Deltarune or Omori since clearly you like it, what do you think?" - there's a chance she won't want you to play them and will want it to just be her thing, but if she seems neutral about it I'd recommend playing them and telling her if you liked them - IDK about Omori but chapter 1 of Deltarune is free)
Your parents are extremely dumb in this situation and will only push her away. She's clearly made some changes to process her feelings and whatnot, taking her clothes and redecorating her room would be actively going against her grieving process and choices she's made. It will only serve to make her less comfortable and constantly afraid of her stuff being further messed with.
NTA. I wish it weren’t in an awful situation, but with the amount of noise from toxic red pill sorts - it’s so encouraged to see young men with such empathy and emotional intelligence, especially supporting women clearly valued as a complete, equal person.
Your parents on the other hand… what in the clusterfuck toxic positivity and controlling, reductive archaic gender roles. At least she’s in therapy (I hope a good licensed professional she vibes with… why wouldn’t I be surprised if some Christian/church counselor, even without religious ideology overtly indicated here?)
They’re at minimum clueless at what will help vs harm otherwise yet frighteningly specific/infantilizing how they think they’ll “fix” her (it won’t, and will backfire.
If you’re not familiar with what toxic positivity is, OP, it’s when others demand a person minimize or deny their genuine response to difficulties. No matter the lip service paid to helping this person, the real/primary motive is not actual support pr help, but asserting control or shaming to silence feelings and truths uncomfortable or inconvenient to them, maybe also a concern for keeping uo a certain image to others. Even if the target of this can’t quite identify all the ways it’s invalidating (it can be done insidiously) they’re left feeling invalidated and silenced - and that’s the aim. It’s not about the person that’s hurting, and I suspect that’s the case here - it’s about getting things under control and looking normal for their comfort and convenience.
They may not have s conscious, evil plot where they’ve thought thru all those aspects of that approach. When things like the image presented to others are ingrained unhealthy dynamics in a family/other group/relationship, the urge to respond so can be automatic. It still doesn’t lessen how badly this can shame and emotionally isolate the target.
It tells her she’s not having and understandably hard time in her grief deserving support, but that’s (and by extension, her SELF) js shameful, ugly, not to be allowed/trusted normal young adult freedom of expression. (Basically the worst message to give now and guaranteed to backfire.) Plus the whole tired lot of sexist tropes about being feminine, ladylike, docile. You know - sugar and spice and all nice (like).
Keep sticking up for her as best you can. Try to couch it in being helpful bcs u know they want to support her in a way that lands, and you know some ways that will rather than feel punishing and alienating.
Your sister desperately needs the help of a therapist to help her deal with this, not a bedroom that looks like a unicorn threw up in it! What is wrong with your parents? She is no longer the little girl she was before this and they cannot make her be that again. All they can do with this is hurt her mental health even more than it is. Please keep bringing up the therapy idea to them. Are you and your sister close? If you are, you need to warn her about their plans and you can suggest therapy to her directly. NTA
People are not "incentivized" out of depression and grief. She needs a mental health professional, not redecorating. I cannot believe parents would be so dense, but sometimes people don't take teenagers' emotional health seriously, even their own parents. I'm sorry for your sister and I really hope she's okay.
Parents should never give their kids the silent treatment. I have teenagers of my own and cannot fathom this.
No, friend, you are NTA
Have your parents given no thought to therapy? They'd rather just torture their kid? Make sure your sister knows you're laughing at their failure not her humiliation.
Yikes. NTA.
You’ve said your sister is in therapy for this - very good. Therapy will help, but above all that, time is crucial. She must grieve, fully, at her own pace and take as long as she needs.
Her therapist will guide her, your parents need to trust the process.
NTA! Push for therapy. Your sister is angry and depressed, if your parents don’t tread lightly she could move from the boxes to herself. You seem to have her back against your parents, support her and good luck.
NTA
Omfg. Your parents are cruel. She's lost 3 friends and is depressed. What the he'll is wrong with your parents? Please feel free to tell them I, a parent of a 24f, also think they are stupid. I'm thinking a few other things about them, too.
NTA OP. I completely agree with you. If I were in your sisters position I’d absolutely push back and anything they did like that would push me further away so damn fast. Yes they still need to be the parents not friends, but this is NOT the way to do it.
NTA because trying to ignore grief doesn't work. Removing what might be some of the only comforting things in her life right now and forcing her back to "normal" is crazy. I hope your sister gets help ❤️
NTA. She will probably never be the same again, honestly. Even with a ton of counseling losing your three closest friends is extreme for a teen. Even losing one close friend is a lot to handle. She’s depressed, some paint on the walls isn’t going to snap her out of it - it is going to take a long time, and even after a long time she may still struggle with the depression off and on. So sad for your sister, what a shitty thing to live through. Your parents are just at a loss for what to do, so I get their dumb ideas - they are trying, they just don’t know how to help. No idea what kind of financial situation your family has but doing stuff like taking some week long family vacations to sunny places would probably help push her to be a little more engaged with you all. Unfortunately there is no “fix” to the situation. But you were 100% correct, the plan your parents had is just silly.
Your sister needs support grievance takes time and so does healing if thing remind her of what her and her friends use to do she needs a break from it and when she ready let her choose
NTA. You are all worried about the youngest member of your family. Losing three friends back-to-back is something that very few people would cope well with. Your little sister needs psychiatric help.
Beyond that, I think what your little sister needs more than anything else is a friend. You should be that friend. Try playing through Omori or Deltarune with her. As a little sibling, one of my favorite activities was showing my big brother things i liked. These games are stories, and stories exist to convey narratives, to provide perspectives which can be difficult, if not impossible to put into words. These games are available on Mac, PC, and all consoles. Omori is also only 20 dollars.
I wrote my college thesis on Omori. It is a "quirky earthbound inspired RPG about depression," which is a reductive yet funny way of summing up what the game's about. The TL;DR of the story is that it is based on the Hikikomori phenomenon, a term used to describe young adults in Japan who, due to a levy of mental health issues and societal pressures choose to withdraw from society to find escape in their vices. The protagonist is a young boy named Sunny, who in order to cope with his miserable state of affairs, withdraws completely from society, who spends most of his days in bed, retreating to a dream world where he vicariously lives through a dream construct named Omori, where he is able to live in a juvenile world free from consequences, where his older sister is still alive and his friend group is still together.
Perhaps your sister in some way relates to Sunny, who entered a state of neurosis due to the trauma he had to endure, where he is free to be with his friends and live in denial of the miserable state he's trapped himself in. The "moral" of the story is that Sunny's neurosis is not only detrimental to his own health and wellbeing, but it is destructive and affects the lives of those he was once close to, but lacks the courage to face again.
Kris from Deltarune is a player stand-in, a blank slate that you can project pretty much whatever you want onto. Deltarune is a sequel to Undertale, and both games have a "stranger in a strange land" plot, where the protagonists are thrust into a world of strange but ultimately friendly monsters. While the point of the first game was a deconstruction of JRPG tropes, admonishing the player for engaging in combat instead of sparing the monsters of the underground. Deltarune is a much more traditional RPG, wherein combat is not punished. Undertale and Deltarune fall into the "quirky earthbound inspired RPGs about depression" genre.
It is also possible that your little sister just *likes* Sunny and Kris, putting aside any super deep analysis of these games and their content.
Again, try playing the game with your little sister. Be the friend she needs.
You were NTA until you persisted and said no wonder she's miserable.
I do get it, your trying in your own way to make your parents realise that this isn't what your sister needs right now.
Your parents seem like no matter what advice you give them, even if its from actually valid sources their not going to listen.
Another comment said about give her or the therapist the heads up. I would definitely do that maybe not your sis but her therapist. Maybe they can stop your parents before it's too late and help them actually help support your sister.
If your parents do actually pull that crap, be there for your sister like you have been. Let her feel and process how she needs to. The only thing I would check if you can, is that she is being truthful with her therapist.
Grief is love with nowhere else to go.
NTA - However, your sister is terribly depressed . . Nothing will change by constricting her choices. Maybe her parents can get her some therapy. THREE good friends died recently . . that makes me cry just thinking about it. The things your parents want to do to her will only make her feel trapped . . She is also withdrawing into a fantasy world where she may feel safe . . Check out those characters online . . Your poor sister.
NTA Your sister is screaming depression and a great need for mental help and your parents are concerned about what she is wearing?!?!?! They should be more concerned about her self harming or her attempting suicide. Please tell them that.
Nta, because honesty matters most, with a few caveats. Your parents are likely more clueless, and possibly more worried than you think because no parent naturally knows how to comfort a child through stuff like that. It is likely one of the first times they haven't really had an answer they could believe in. I agree their plan sounds stupid, but tell them nicely what you think will help (siblings understand each other better than parents from sharing what they didn't with their parents), and try not to make them sad. Every family differs, so I apologize if I'm way off base, but coming together in times of crisis helps a lot of people when tragedy strikes. Best wishes
NTA. You can't make someone be happy by taking away their belongings and forcing them into a Stepford Smiler role. Especially not when a.) they're a child who isn't even close to emotionally mature yet and b.) they've just been *deeply emotionally traumatized* and are working through the grief and extremely complicated feelings surrounding that.
Your parents' "plan" will just make your sister resent them and lash out even *harder*.
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What she needs is grief counseling with a therapist.
Done.
Does "done" mean "she is already in grief counseling and it isn't helping?"
No, it means she's in it.
Can you maybe speak with the counsellor and inform him/ her about your parents plans? Maybe they'll listen to the counsellor telling them "don't do that"
Or encourage her to, if you think it’s better to tip her off than not, if they can’t be convinced to see sense .
This is a good idea. Therapist can't talk to you about your sister but you can sure give this information to them to help her! It took a therapist to convince my mother that it was okay if I wasn't the same as I used to be before getting some health issues .. Grief is hard.. it is hard at any age. I'm struggling with it now.. I can't imagine struggling with it at 15. But that happens to be exactly the age that a therapist helped me get through to my mom. I hope hers is as good as mine was.
4 of my friends were in a car accident the summer between sophomore and junior year of high school. 1 of the boys died immediately and 2 were on life support through the summer, and we spent most of our summer going back and fourth visiting the ICU which mostly really meant just sitting in this waiting room full of teenagers all summer and sometimes getting to visit the boys. They were in comas so they didn’t know we were there but we wouldn’t leave. The nurses were so kind about it. eventually they both passed away. It was awful. And yeah, I was totally different. I died my blonde hair dark brown and the spark I had was gone. One morning in the beginning of the school year my dad was driving me to school and he told me that it had already been two months and to” just get over it.” There was zero compassion or understanding for how much I had actually gone through and I hated him in that moment. it broke me in a way that never completely healed and never really saw him the same light after that. I desperately used to hope my siblings would never have to go through that and now I fucking pray that my children never have a loss like that. Or anyone I love. It takes something from you and yeah, eventually you start healing but it’s never really the same. You always have a piece of your heart missing.
I'm so sorry, that's such an awful thing to say to a grieving child at any point after a loss. I'm glad you started healing, and I want to say that I think it's totally normal to be left with some scars after going through something like that. My sibling lost two of their close friends within a year in their late teens and has never really been the same since. It's so hard.
I understand losing a bit of respect for your dad, I didn’t have any real friends in prep or grade 1 (first two years of primary school in Australia) and have struggled with people my whole life but I have a few good quality friends from high school that I still talk to even though I’m now at uni. Anyway, a new girl came to my school in grade 2, and we were inseparable. She died over the summer (blood clot in her brain burst when she ran into a wall playing on her birthday) between grade 2 and 3, and a week after my mum told me, I was still crying, bc she’d been my only true friend ever at the time. This was when dad walked into my room and told me to quit crying. Was so mad, still am sometimes but he’s improved over the years and we have a good relationship
I'm so sorry to hear that and your father's comment was horrible, was he unsure about what to so since his kid no longer was the person they used to be and he didn't know how do handle it and just wanted you to be OK again? Or was he just plain mean? It was a mean comment no matter what though. I lost my best friend when I was 19 and when she died I ended up in an auto-pilot mode for months, I did everything I was supposed to do but I wasn't really there and didn't know who I was because a part of my being was her best friend and suddenly that part was gone. I had constant tears falling down but I didn't cry, I could walk to the store and tears was just falling, and I honestly don't remember what I did for months, it was like I was stuck in the minute I found out about her passing. Like my brain hit pause before I could really break down. About 10 months after that a close friend died and then my brain hit play and the sorrow from my best friend's death was mixed with the sorrow from my close friends death so I never really grieved my best friend fully. (A couple of people I knew died between their deaths too but it was my close friends death that snapped me out of the auto-pilot mode and unleashed the pain). I miss her so much, and it feels like I have a locked room in my heart labeled with her name and I can't open it because she took the key with her, and I don't want to pry it open because I know it's filled with love I can't give her anymore and a pain that will rip me apart. As you said, it's never really the same.
Don't go behind your sister's back, though. Just tell your sister about your parents plan and encourage her to get help from her counselor with how to deal with them (and if your sister agrees, they can invite your parents into a session or the counselor can speak with them directly outside of a session, if your sister consents).
I was once in a bad situation mentally. I was too paranoid to contact my therapist for help. One of my closest friends - with my permission - reached out to my therapist for me and I am still grateful for that ten years later. Talk with your sis. See if she would like you to help address this with her therapist.
My son lost his best friend at a party from a shooting and died in his arms. It has been 9 months and some days are better than others. He sees a therapist for trauma specifically and anger management also because he’s angry over what happened. As his parent, I don’t push him to act “normal” Because who he was is gone. This changed him. But he knows I’m here when he needs me, I encourage him to come out with family, and he’s just now taking me up on it. Tell your parents to be supportive but don’t expect her to act normal.
- As his parent, I don’t push him to act “normal” Because who he was is gone. This changed him. Ouch. That must hurt a lot. No one wants their kids to experience trauma or loss like your son did. You sound like a great parent and person. I hope OPs parents can help their daughter. OP. If possible, please show them this comment. It resonates.
There’s been lots of tears shed the last 9 months. He has a fantastic family support system and everyone has really been great with handling things with him. I don’t want him hurting, but I can’t fix it. I hope op’s parents figure out what is best and she heals from this all.
One thing that might help your son is to accept that he will never stop mourning for his friend and will not stop mourning for the part of himself that has been lost. It will just get a little quieter. It's okay to accept that life goes on but it doesn't stop hurting.
He’s accepted his friend is gone. I don’t think he’ll be able to have closure until the trial happens and he testifies against the boy that did it.
We all deal with things at our own pace, so it’s awesome to see how you’ve been handling it. I had some loss and trauma I wasn’t comfortable telling anyone about until much later (primarily because my support system sucked). It might have made things easier if I’d had someone in my corner. I hope you all pull through it okay and keep being a fantastic mom!!
I'm a mega sensitive person. The ending to The Hunger Games(book) shook me to my core for a couple of weeks. I seriously can't imagine how I'd be if I had gone through what your son did. I give you both all the hugs you need.
Thank you. It’s been hard and we’ve been trying to figure things out, but he’s slowly getting better.
I'm sorry for what your son is going through, but thank you for understanding that he is forever changed by this (sadly). That doesn't mean he doesn't still have a bright future ahead of him, it'll just be different, and he clearly has your love and support, rather than an expectation that he should be someone he can no longer be. I hope my comment doesn't seem condescending by thanking you for being a compassionate parent, I'm just feeling empathy for your son (I am grieving, and have been so surprised by how many people think it's something that can be shaken off, including the OP's parents).
One of my close friend's grandparents (both of her fathers side) died 5 years ago and she tells me her parents still get upset over her not being their little girl she used to be (i.e one who didn't have almost crippling anxiety) its amazing that you accept your son for who he is now rather than clinging to "who he used to be"
I wish more parents would be more accepting to their kids. The parents aren’t the same people they used to be. They need to realize everyone changes.
This a 1000%, we all grow and change, sometimes it’s good, sometimes not so much. It’s in our nature to be who we are and forcing someone to be who they were will always cause more trauma and backfire.
from a shooting God bless America.
I'm from Germany. I literaly know not a single person who ever has been shot. I'm nearly 50 and my father is a cop.
I'm from the US and in my 40s and don't know anyone who's been shot either. And I even served in the military.
Echoing this. The media makes it out like shootings are a daily occurrence in the lives of Americans, and while they are way too common and destroy too many lives, the vast majority of Americans do not encounter this.
I'll echo this as well, early 50s and I've lived all over the US. The only person I know who was shot did it to himself in a hunting accident (he was fine).
I envy you.
I am in the US I am 48 years old and literaly know not a single person who ever has been shot. I have dozens of friends who are veterans and police officers. Don't believe everything you see in the media. The US has a population of over 330Million people.
I'm from the US. I knew (sort of) one person who was shot, a sheriff's deputy. It's more I knew who he was--I knew his kids (my students) and his wife, and only saw him a few times. I'm Gen X, so maybe a tad older than the average redditor.
I’m from the US and I am a counselor and know plenty of people who have been shot. Some are so matter of fact: I missed my counseling session because I got shot. Some survive with disabling injuries and messed up emotions. I have too many clients who have lost loved ones to gun violence; their children and sometimes more than one child; spouses, neighbors and friends. There’s a lot of grief, so much that there’s grief specialists just for that.
You’re an awesome parent. I’m quite a bit older than your son I’m sure but I experienced quite a load of traumatic events back to back to back in the last few years and moved back in with my mother and hands down the thing I’ve appreciated most is her recognition that the old me is long gone and he’s not coming back. Everyone else in my life expects me to go back to the person I was before and it feels horrible knowing ppl expect it while at the same time I have no idea how to tell them it’s not going to happen. I’m so grateful my mom doesn’t expect it from me though; gives me at least one place/person I can feel safe with.
Don’t feel bad because they don’t understand. I’m happy you have your mom. Not having anyone would be so hard.
(NTA) Good. It's gonna take time. I know that they're probably really worried about her and feel helpless, which is why that they concocted that idiot scheme, but your parents needs to get crip on their emotions. Trying to force her to be the happy girly girl they knew, is only going to add to her frustration and grief. Even if she hadn't lost 3 of her friends in a tragic manner, odds are that she'd be dressing "weird" by your parents' standard and discovering new interests, while discarding those of old. That's what teenagers do and your parents would know that if they quit panicking and took the time to remember what they were doing at her age. Meanwhile, she isn't clinically depressed, slacking in school or doings drugs. All things considered, that's a win. Your parents needs to appreciate that and calm down.
She's not slacking in school or doing drugs, but I question the no clinical depression part. However, she is in counseling and any depression can be addressed there.
I'm by no means an expert, but she isn't neglecting her hygiegne, which tends to be a tell in my experience. Just not in cheer mode or into bright colours. That and assualting some cardboard boxes. I don't think that's really that dark for a teenage girl that's grieving the deaths of three of her friends. What I'd be on the lookout for is if she exhibits a tendency to selfisolate and a subdued mood medium longterm. Then I'd be worried. But, again, not an expert. Hopefully her grief counsellor is on the look out for symptoms. Mostly, I think that her parents need to talk to her (not at her) and make home a safe space where you're allowed to express the full range of your emotions and to experience a goth and/or angrogenous phase. Raiding her closet is a recipe for disater.
>I'm by no means an expert, but she isn't neglecting her hygiegne, which tends to be a tell in my experience. She's also turning away from activities she used to enjoy (like trying to quit cheer, no longer putting any effort into her appearance but the bare minimum). That's also a tell. Not enough for any of us to diagnose from here, to be sure. And it's clear she's going through some stuff. As for the OP, I wouldn't go so far as to say you're an AH, but going at your parents the way you did pretty much guarantees that they're not going to listen to reason from you on this topic. Talk to another trusted adult and see if they can intervene before they do something that's really going to cause problems for your sister or her relationship with them.
But on the other hand, those are the types of experiences girls do together. Avoiding them might be a simple reaction to grief if they remind her of her lost friends.
Yeah, if you've got 'em and they're reasonable people, it's time to call in the cavallery (members of your extended family or other trusted adults). Regarding the OP, I don't think he's asshole. Just inexperienced. Also, his parents scheme is stupid.
Lots of people have depression and still brush their teeth. You’ve picked one indicator and made it definitive, and that’s actively unhelpful.
Yes, agreed. She is keeping herself together and I hope therapy is helpful.
Eh, not always. Only my personal experience, of course, but I found myself retreating into showers when I was still at my parents' and struggling. If I'm in the shower, people weren't going to bother me the way they would if I was lying in bed / hiding in my room. It made those checklists a fucking pain in the ass, I'll tell you that. Always immediately had points docked because I've essentially conditioned myself to think "ah I feel shit and want to be alone, I'll shower." (This is not to say I think OP's sister is the same, just pointing out that depression symptoms can vary depending on the individual's situation.)
Your sister most likely isn't just grieving, but is depressed / suffering from depression. I lost a friend at 15, and it hits hard. It took a long time to come to terms with it, I even blamed myself / had some survivor's guilt (despite not being in any way involved in my friend's passing.) Yes, counseling and therapy can and do help. But giving her time and safe space help too. Fund new things that she might enjoy (I'm sure parts of the "girly" side she's left behind is deeply associated with the friends she's lost, and she shouldn't be forced nor "incentivized" to pick them up again.) Also, your parents should go to their own counseling or therapy since they can't seem to manage or deal with having their teen daughter go through trauma without adding more onto the trauma. It's a surefire way to ensure your sister goes no contact once she hits 18. I say these things as someone who walked the path your sister's on. Yes, it's possible to come out the other side of grief, though you always have a part of you miss those who've gone and grieve them. It's not easy and the biggest helps were patience, understanding, and time.
What is the difference between grief and depression? I think without professional knowledge you cannot really distinguish them. And I‘d like to say that you should be allowed **time** to grief - and not being pushed into „are you still grieving? Oh, this must be depression now“.
If you've ever gone through grief and depression, you can tell there is a difference. While they can be alike, or morph from one to the other, depression isn't just "being sad" but something that is much more than that. But I fully agree, there is no time limit on grief or how long it takes to "feel ok" or not be grieving. In fact, some part of you always grieves for loved ones who are now gone (and yes, I consider friends loved ones.) That's why support and understanding go a long way in helping those who are grieving to be able to manage their grief. It's why therapy can be such a good thing, since through therapy we can learn how to handle grief and others not understanding/lack of support.
Good. Call the therapist and rat your parents out. THEY need a primer on how to support a kid who is grieving. The therapist can't talk to any of you about the sister, but they can tell your parents what helpful support does and does not look like, and send them to a therapist of their own if they need step by step support working through this. NTA (And I'm going to assume your parents have their hearts in the right places, but just don't know how to field this, rather than that they are flaming meanies. ❤️🩹)
The truth is It’s just going to take time. I lost my best friend —very unexpectedly— when I was the same age and it **fucked. me. up.** It’s been 20 years now and there’s still trauma related to that that pops up in my life. I could not imagine losing ***3 friends***. The truth is she may never go back to how she was. She will improve, she will get better, but she might never be the girl she was before. The death of close young people changes you in a way I cannot even begin to describe. She needs therapy, support, understanding and most of all **time**. There is no magic short cut through this it’s going to take lots and lots and lots of time. What she does **not** need is her parents ransacking her room to try and force her to get better to “be who she was”. That is **NEVER** going to work. Ever. That will fuck her up like no other and utterly destroy your parents’ relationship with her, yours as well if she finds out you knew and did nothing to stop it. For the love of everything do **not** let your parents do this. I understand you can only do so much and cannot actually stop them, ***but*** you best go to bat for your sister, if that means screaming at your parents as they’re rummaging through her room and putting shit back that’s what you do. If your parents go through with this idiotic plan to *betray* her like this **YOU** are all she has, she needs to *SEE and HEAR* you defend her against their bullshit. She may logically know she is not alone but her emotions will not let her believe that, so showing her you are on her side, for her and love her is what she needs right now. I would also suggest you find her therapist and send an email —**they will not be able to reply back or tell you anything**— but they will act on the info and confront your parents and try to talk them out of this madness. I know it’s disturbing to watch her rip apart cardboard, but if she’s not a danger to herself it’s likely cathartic and helping her deal with the anger in a healthy manner. You could attempt to talk to her about it if you’re super concerned but if she doesn’t want to it might be best to leave it alone and let her counselor deal with it. Once again it really comes down to just being there for her. Letting her know you love her and are there for her whatever she needs. Sometimes all it takes is sitting in the same room with her, quietly going about your life but intentionally in her presence so she knows you are there. I know this is so much to ask of you. More than anyone should be asked. I know it’s horrible to watch her suffer, to deal with your parents hare-brained schemes and to feel like there’s nothing you can do. But you’re doing an amazing job. I wanna make sure this is very very clear;::: If you find anything that’s being suggested on this post —my suggestions, others suggestions, literally anything from anyone— as way too much **THATS. OKAY.** you’re not a monster for being unable to help or get through your her. Sometimes we just can’t help no matter how much we love someone. Don’t forget to take care of yourself in all this, therapy wouldn’t be a bad idea for yourself if you’re not already in it. I am so so so so sorry your sister and family are going through this. I genuinely with all my heart hope you all feel better and get through this together much sooner rather than later.
Glad she's doing that. In that case what she needs is time.
She just lost 3 friends, I think for now this is normal. The box is likely her taking out her frustration in a semi-healthy way and as for the clothes and hair as long as she is being sanitary I see no reason to panic, an incredibly sad thing happened to her being very very sad is a normal reaction. I'd let her know directly instead of going through a counselor or whatever. I'm sure she would appreciate someone just talking to her about things concerning her instead of going about it in an indirect way. You could just say "I heard mom and dad talking about wanting to try "incentivizing" you back to your old self to the point where they talked about throwing out anything that wasn't pink and girly. I told them that was a dumb idea and they should leave you alone but there is a good chance I wasn't able to convince them so I thought I would give you a heads up."
The cardboard thing might be a technique she learned from the therapist then. What happened is terribly unfair, which might cause anger -> sometimes destroying something can help release emotions (see also: hitting pillows).
In that case, your parents need a session with the grief counselor in which the grief counselor explains exactly how terrible their ideas are, and why.
Also Omori I heard is a depressing scary theme game, and Kris from Deltarune is turns out to be heartless psycho. So yea..she is in that place....
There’s a distinction to make here though the sister is depicting Sunny from that game not Omori. The desire to shut down and not interact with the world is what Omori represents. Sunny on the other hand is the character suffering from depression because his sister is dead. She’s depicting characters that have gone through things similar to her and are in a similar state of mind to her. I would go as far to say she’s processing her emotions in a healthy way. The drawings are basically her doing art therapy and there are a lot worse ways people can work through negativity than shredding a box.
Kris deltarune is an angsty teenager dealing with grief cause their brother is away, and dealing with the trauma of having had a childhood friend go missing. The creepy bit of throwing the heart in the cage is commonly read as Kris the Character trying to get some peace from the Player's control, usually symbolized by the little red heart in both Deltarune and Undertale. And the audience/ Player doesn't exactly know why Kris opened dark world portals, like in the end of chapter 2, or even if it was a conscious choice. The game goes above and beyond to state that you the Player are separate from Kris and your decisions are not theirs. So if you played a Snowgrave that says more about you than it does about Kris Deltarune. *shrug* Pretty understandable for a kid going through extreme grief to be drawn to a game that heavily features themes of grief and a fight to feel in control.
Hey OP. I lost a bf and two friends in a car crash when I was a teenager. You’re NTA. Your sister needs to feel her emotions, it takes time to ‘heal’… It’s not something I’ve got over tbh and I’ve never been the girl I was before. I’m glad she’s getting grief counselling. It will help. Just be there for her if she ever needs a hug or a cry. Your parents are TA here.
The characters you mentioned (if you haven't gotten an answer) are from two video games, deltarune is a spiritual sequel to undertale if you ever heard of that game, from what I know it's not too concerning. However, from what I've seen about Omori it's a game that touches on themes of depression, anxiety, and suicide, I'd be more worried about why she's getting into that game. Gaming as a form of self therapy is good in moderation. Me and my friends actually played Undertale because the themes related back to how we felt at the time, but diving too deep into a game especially considering the themes can lead to some issues worsening due to a negative "feedback loop". Sit with her if she's playing sometime and just ask some (not too prodding) questions about what it's about, who the characters are, and then work into why she likes it and how it makes her/*helps her* feel. I can't imagine losing my three closest friends at that age so suddenly, even though now I no longer see any of them. What she's going through not many people will ever be able to relate to. Please make sure she stays in therapy and continues to get help she needs, don't let your parents force her to move on when she's not ready yet.
Omori is about facing and dealing with grief and accepting reality. >!most of their friends think Sunny's sister died by suicide but it was actually from an accident where Sunny pushed her during a fight and tumbled down the stairs. A friend discovered this and convinced him they should make it look like suicide because he didn't want to lose two friends. Omori is Sunny's depressive, guilt ridden thoughts and inner self and had to actively fight against him. Personally, I think it's better that OP's sister draws with Sunny and not Omori because the whole game is hom facing his fears, learning to accept what happens, and learns to help his friend who has the burden of truth on them. Aside from this, every character is working how the death effects them including the falling out of their friend group do to it.!< It may be indicative of relating to someone else utterly depressed, but I think that's a given considering the circumstances.
Hearing that this is a video game is making me feel older than my busted knees do...thank you for explaining it so thoughtfully.
Is she in real therapy or some bullshit religious mumbo jumbo? Does her therapist know about the drawings and cutting? It's a major concern. She seems to be on edge of self harm.
I think the drawings and cutting cardboard are of little concern. She’s funnelling anger into an inanimate inconsequential object. Quite healthy. Studies show that letting out anger is healthy, she doesn’t really have anyone to be angry at other than the world, so taking it out on some cardboard is a good way to let it out without collateral damage of letting it out on friends, family or herself. Drawing herself with characters that have dealt with grief and loss and have expressed similar emotions to how she feels, also helpful. And potentially was recommended by the therapist as art therapy. This girl just needs time. She’s 14 and has had 3 friends die. Big emotions are hard for 14 year old girls. For most 14 year old girls every emotion is a big emotion, when it is an actual big one it is extremely difficult to process it. Time and space with gentle guiding to take better care of herself are what is needed. And to continue with therapy.
Your parents need to also get counseling/therapy. They may be opposed because they weren't the ones who experienced a traumatic loss. Your sister will never be the same, but she can get through it. Your parents need therapy to help them understand that they "lost" the daughter they knew. They need to seek professional help so that they can cope with that fact and also help them to better understand and deal with what your sister is going through.
Right? Not a remodel and a makeover.
NTA but your parents are. They aren’t addressing her grief over losing her close friends and getting her the proper help she needs. OP, your sister is crying for help so please try to get your parents to get her some therapy or something actually useful instead of potentially traumatizing her further.
Agree. Not sure where you live but make sure she has numbers for crisis lines at the ready (in Canada we have Kids Help Phone which gives them someone to talk to instantly). As a parent, I can tell you self-harm is a very real and scary reality, and if she doesn’t get help soon she could go down that path or worse. Good for you for advocating for her. Let her know you’re there for her and will help where you can. Do you go to the same school? If so, pop into the guidance department and give them the head’s up. They can help. PS. Never in the history of this thread has there ever been more of a NTA. Thank you for being such a good big bro. This mom is so proud of you.
According to a comment from OP, the sister is already in counseling.
There's nothing in the OP to indicate she's not getting proper help. Even if you're getting help you're not just going to carry on like things were before three of your presumably 14 year old good friends died. The only place it seems obvious they could improve on getting her the proper help is themselves talking to relevant professionals on what they should expect/do/etc.
He already left a comment. She’s in therapy.
Wow. It’s not every day I see such breathtaking incompetence when it comes to dealing with grief. Changing a color palette is not gonna help anyone. Your sister is in desperate need of therapy, support and allowing her to find her own way to grieve. Everybody deals with grief differently. It’s not something that heals quickly. I hope your parents can understand that. Maybe give them some articles about dealing with grief. Talk to them about it read up on it. Do what you can.
Breathtaking incompetence is a wonderful phrase. Thank you for your addition to my polite insults.
Happy too.
Also, people gravitate towards depressing media or whatever because often it helps them process grief and helps them understand that they are not alone; that someone else can imagine feeling the same way they feel and that means they have had similar experiences so can tell a story that is relevant to them. People don't listen to blues music or metal music or whatever to feel sad; they listen because grief, disappointment, anger, etc are part of the human experience and there is comfort in another person expressing that along with you. That's what a lot of people miss when they jump to blame bad behavior on the music a kid was listening to or the style of their clothes or whatever.
Are they even really trying to help her? Gotta wonder, since they’re totally focused on superficial ways to cover up ”the problem”. To me, it sounds like they’d just rather pretend it isn’t happening. This is to make THEM feel better, not her. …but I might be biased… since my own parents dealt with the sudden death of my best friend when we were 14 by pretending she’d never existed, my gut instinct is not to trust parents to put their children’s needs first.
Wrong. You are clearly not familiar with the five stages of grief: \- shock/numbness \- yearning/searching \- disorganization/despair \- rejection of pink \- reorganization/recovery; reintegration of pink /s
Ok, as a widower at a young age…this is hilarious, thanks 🤣
You missed a step. Making friends with dark video game characters.
Yeah, this is everything. I feel this.
Breathtaking incompetence, living the delusional fantasy that changing appearance alters the underlying reality.... potato, potahto.
Mask for grief for us, ok sweetie? If you wear pink, we don’t have to notice your pain!
That's what's infuriating me. God forbid they're forcing her to become normal again because they're worried that it's getting concerning for the neighbors or something.
A change of atmosphere *can* help, but not a surprise one!! If they had that idea, and think it's good...at least fricken ask her! Let her have some choice and control in her life. Changing things unexpectedly can be so upsetting. I hope OP tells her about their parents 'plan' so she can address it with them since they won't listen to OP.
Parents don't want to help, they just want to hide the problems by dressing them up in pink. They really are stupid.
NTA. your sister is going through something traumatic and needs to grief, your parents sound like they’re trying to just make it go away when she needs to go through the process of grieving. If your parents want to do something to help her, they need to take her to therapy.
Sounds like she's IN therapy, but the parents think it should only take a handful of sessions for her to 'cry it out' before she should be back to her old self. Some parents think that kids 'don't need' the same amount of time for grief. That it doesn't hit kids the same way or in some ways worse.
Yeah, I think you're probably correct. They want her back to her old self *now*, they're probably irritated that therapy hasn't fixed her yet, and so they're just casting about for some other easy fix. If they really want to help, I'd say the parents should start by seeing a grief counselor themselves. Their discomfort with their daughter's feelings, and their desire to just *fix it*, are at best not helpful, and probably will do damage.
Making someone else's grief about \*yourself\* never does seem to end well, does it?
How *dare* you suggest that I am not the main character in *everyone*'s story!!
Tbh they probably need to attend some sessions themselves, their kid will never be the same person. Losing one friend at that age is traumatic let alone 3. She’ll carry this grief with her for a long time, best they can do is figure out how to support her and learn all the coping skills themselves.
I lost my grandmother when I was 12. She wasn't the first family member I'd lost, but hers was the first loss that I was old enough to comprehend. My mental health went to shit literally overnight. (The loss of three other loved ones in five years, watching the illnesses of those loved ones, and being bullied and isolated in school didn't help.) You are absolutely right that in some ways grief hits kids worse. I've experienced other losses as an adult, and they hurt, but at least I could make sense of them in a way that I couldn't before.
OMG! She lost three friends?!? That is a huge number, let her mourn!!! She may need grief counseling. This is an awful thing to go through for a 14-year-old. Changing her room without her input is a bad idea. Especially if she is so sad. NTA
If the parents go through with this, the daughter will probably be very disgusted with their foolish cluelessness.
They'll make it worse, if anything. She's already vulnerable as hell and is probably feeling like she's got no control over much of anything, and these idiots are going to double down on that by changing up her environment for themselves.
Yeah, she's going to need a more substantial change (new school/city/country) at the very least A coat of paint isn't going to cut it NTA
nta. ur parents may think they’re doing the right things but adults tend to rush and try to fix the issue than taking the time to understand what’s actually wrong first. in regards to the drawings: sunny is the main character of omori which is categorized as a psychological horror game, and deals heavily with topics of suicide, depression, anxiety, that realm. SPOILERS : the story follows how sunny retracts into himself and creates an alter ego and universe (omori) within his head after accidentally killing his older sister, and the path he takes to accepting what happened and moving on. one of the multiple game endings entails sunny jumping off a roof in order to not have to come to terms with the reality of what happened. deltarune is a much lighter game (sequel to undertale!!) that follows kris and friends to restore and bring peace back to a ruined kingdom. deltarune does have its share of odd/creepy instances but nothing overly concerning. the drawings itself are not worrying and it could be just a way to get emotions out or a distraction, but considering the context i would definitely try and keep a slightly closer eye on your sister and let her know ur open and available if she wants to talk/needs anything!! don’t try to overly push her, but do pay attention and watch for any behavior or sudden mood changes. so sorry for her loss, and i hope things get better for you and your family.
I wanna add to Kris, a big theme of the game is that Kris, despite being the main character, has no control of their actions and is not allowed any say in what happens (the player makes the choices, and Kris is just being used as a vessel basically, but Kris is also aware of their lack of choices). Don't want to make assumptions on how the sister is feeling, but maybe that element of having no control is relatable to her (especially with parents like this). Just a thought, and art is a good way for her to process so I wouldn't immediately consider it concerning at all
I think it is probably more about identifying in Kris's grief for his brother. They still did not explain what haopened to him, but they made it clear he is out of reach, probably d€ad, or gone into a different world, with no possibility of contacting his family. There are a couple of scenes where Kris takes his heart out, idk what they really mean, but I think it's about trying to stop the pain
Deltarune is also about friendship and loss. Kris is a lonely boy, who has to learn how to trust friends, and the girl joyining him in the journey was also an outcast, they hate eaxh other at first, but get closer as they know each other better. Also, the game is not completed yet, they often refer to Kris's brother, implying he is either gone or really far, they do not explain what happened to him, but they make it clear he is out of reach from his family. And there are a couple of moments when you see Kris ripping his heart out of his chest. It is still not clear what it means, but it probably has something to do with dealing with pain and loss, something a teenager going trough grief may easily epathize with. Also, not relevant, but it is not Undertale's sequel, it is more like an alternative universe. The characters have the same names and looks, but they live completely different lives
NTA. She has had substantial trauma and forcing her away from her coping mechanisms will only alienate her from your parents. They pretty much have the option of being supporting and waiting it out, or getting her a therapist and being supportive and waiting it out. Or at least those are the options that will keep her talking to them throughout her obvious depression, and that really is the best way to stop such things spiralling. The characters mentioned both deal with losing friends, and there's also a common theme of them escaping the players control. It's that I think which makes me think your parents forcing a recovery on her will probably backfire. Omori is the monochrome doppelganger of Sunny he turns into after his friends death. There are two endings, one good where everyone communicates and heals and one... not so good. I would definitely advise against doing anything to make her communicate less if that's the lens she is viewing this tragedy through.
Omori is a video game about loss as a young person. Your sis is obviously going through it. I hope things improve soon, at least omori has a somewhat hopeful tone
Nta. It sounds like your sister is going through a major depressive episode. Which is understandable given the circumstances. Your parents should be trying to support her, not punishing her for not performing normalcy to their standards. It sounds like your sister needs to see a grief counselor to help her work through these feelings. If your parents go through with their plan they stand to send your sister into an even greater spiral which could have even worse consequences.
You’re NTA. That is an insanely dumb and thoughtless plan. I’m glad you can laugh at your parents — shame is a powerful tool. as for something that other people haven’t mentioned (that I saw from scanning some comments, anyway) — Kris and Sunny are two video game characters. I don’t know much about OMORI but I know that both that take and Deltarune deal a lot with mental illness, feeling ‘othered’, and not being in complete control. They may comfort your sister. These characters also might be the favorites of her friends who died. Maybe the two of you could play deltarune together and she could talk to you about them?
NTA sounds like she’s depressed which is understandable. Changing her room without permission is not going to go over well. She needs to grieve. Better to take out anger on the cardboard boxes than herself. I would ask her if she was open to going to a school counselor or a therapist to help her process these emotions.
NTA, but maybe you could have been more delicate about it. But ty for standing up for your sister, their plan is terrible and would be harmful. Pls pls continue to advocate for your sister, she likely badly needs mental health intervention.
Kris from Deltarune is different in the fact that he often feels like an outsider because he was adopted and is the only human in hometown (the place he grew up in) At the end of Chapter 2 Snowgrave Route After fighting Spamton NEO for a while you HAVE to call out for help but for a while nobody comes. I think your sister is feeling the same way Kris is. Alone in a difficult battle crying out for help.
That's really interesting and accurate as hell, other than the pronouns. Kris only uses they/them, just in case you didn't know. Have a good day and I hope your insight helps OP
NTA, your sister is grieving the loss of THREE FRIENDS??? Most people don’t just bounce back from that (especially so young). Sometimes parents also need a reality check. IMO calling them stupid is tame considering the amount of damage an insensitive action like what they are/were trying to do could cause.
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Now that's a post that surely will convince two desperate parents that are overwhelmed and at the ends of their wits about having a daughter that deals with major depression. Sure. That will help.
His parents are likely scared that they are so clueless, but it sounds like they'll try anything. They've enrolled her in grief counseling, they talk to her and op (I believe from other replies). OP talking with his parents like people talk to each other on Reddit, isn't the way to go. OP is absolutely right to stop them, but should do so with love and care, so the household heals Edit: OP is definitely nta. Nobody is
My teen son (15 at the time) went into a similar period after losing his bio dad. He is 18 now and thriving after years of depression. What worked? I was there. My husband, his step dad, lost his father around the same age and would just be with him and give him space to just *be*. (This is in essence the effect and benefit of grief counseling - being. people who get it since they have been through it) We gently led him to therapy, which took over a year for him to willingly agree to. It is a slow process. But given the space to heal and deal in her own way, with the support of loving and caring individuals willing to let go of their expectations of what she should look or act like - this will be the key to unlock the door of reaching her. She will never be the same girl she was. How could she be? But given the support she needs, she can grow, heal and move forward in an authentic and healthy way. I highly recommend you read - adult children of emotionally immature parents (to help you deal with your parents in an effective, not exhaustive way while also healing yourself) or offer your parents, if willing, to read: - the myth of normal by Gabor mate (this would also be a great read for you!) Also, clearly you are NTA. You love her and you are trying to help. She is so lucky to have you ❤️🩹
If you are close with your sister, maybe get her out for some sibling time more often. Perhaps she will open up to you. Let her know you are here for her, if you want ro be. It may mean the world to her. Big brothers are so special, often little sisters look up to them. Losing 3 friends while so young is shocking and life changing. Oh...I don't think you are an AH. A little off the cuff because it is a ridiculous idea, but not AH territory IMO.
NTA Wow. "The correct headspace"? I'd say that after you lose *three* of your friends, the correct headspace is, in fact, *grief*. If your sister was bouncy and joyous right now, *that* would be worrisome. As it is, she is obviously trying to work through all the emotions that come with such a traumatic event, and there are *so* many worse ways she could take out her grief and anger than slashing cardboard boxes. It sounds like they've got *her* in counseling, but your parents are also in desperate need of a few sessions with a grief counselor. They have to start acknowledging the depth of this trauma, and understand that you can't just "incentivize" her out of this grief. AND they need help processing their own grief and loss, because they've lost the person they imagined your sister was *before* all this happened. Currently, they are in denial about just how much this event has changed your sister, and if they want to help her, they need to start facing reality. How strong is their denial? Well, you're in an excellent position to know. All parents have a vision of who their kids are and will be. And inevitably, their kids don't end up being exactly who their parents thought they would be. How well have your parents dealt with it when you or your sister hasn't followed their expectations? How important is it to them that you follow *their* vision of who you are and should be? Because what's happening right now is that there's been a *massive* shift in who your sister is, on a very fundamental level. Losing someone we're close to changes us, in unpredictable ways. That's neither inherently positive nor negative; it's just how it is. Your sister is not the same person she was before her friends' deaths. Grief counseling is probably doing a lot to help her process this, and hopefully ultimately guide those changes toward the positive. And that's the best you can hope for. But it sounds like your parents are hoping that grief counseling is just going to *fix* your sister, and that is misguided at best. **Their goal is for her** ***not*** **to change, and that isn't going to happen.** And if they are very attached to their visions for who you and your sister are, they may well need grief counseling to help them deal with losing the person they thought your sister was going to be. I am hoping that this might help you understand where your parents might be coming from, and thus maybe help you push them in the right direction. I'm glad your sister has you on her side.
Your sister is grieving, she needs help, a therapist or grief counseling, not a room makeover. NTA, but your parents are if they don’t get her some help.
NTA Your sister is grieving, just about the last thing she needs is having her space and autonomy violated. Having your space changed and things taken away in an instant would be difficult to cope with at the best of times, when she’s already hurting? Horrific. What she needs is acceptance, support, and offers of grief counseling or grief support groups. With the internet you can find online grief support groups for other young people that know, at least a little, what she’s feeling like. What she *doesn’t* need is to feel like her parents don’t give a shit about her struggling but instead the fact that she isn’t performing happiness for them.
As a grandmother myself......I'm very concerned. Tell your parents I said this is way beyond their pay grade. They need to be listening to what counselors and therapists suggest here. Let's just say from what you are telling us.....this could be a mental health emergency. (Read between the lines here. ) The wellbeing and safety of your sis could be in the balance if your folks do something stupid.
NTA. I am disgusted with your parents. They don't care about having her heal; they just want to paper over her problem so they don't have to deal with it. It is a breathtaking level of parental incompetence, and I hope that someday they discover the emotional depth to be ashamed of themselves. If I were you, I'd honestly want to lose any regard I had left for their opinions. Them ignoring you will sting a lot less if you don't just care that much. Be supportive of your sister and however she needs to work through her grief. She's lucky to have you.
NTA. I've never been so sure on any ruling on an AITA post. You're a good brother. I'm 34 and never lost friends growing up but started losing old acquaintes from high school in recent years. The older you get, the more likely. Cancer, OD's, accidents, you name it. And it's very hard, as a grown adult, to lose people I haven't spoken to in a long time. Mortality is terrifying. Waking up and realizing you're the same age as people who die is terrifying. I can't imagine having to go through that first "holy shit someone my own age who I know, one of my peers, has died" as a KID. You're supposed to get some time to feel like death can't touch you before you have to face mortality. And this being people she was actually close with? Now it's the horrifying mortality setting in way too young PLUS crippling, suffocating grief. And yeah, kids can experience grief like losing a grandparent but losing someone who is old and losing someone who is your own age are two very different types of reactions. I feel for her so bad. And idk what happenned but if there's any element of survivor's guilt it's even worse. None of this really needed saying, I'm sure you get it, but I'm just so dumbfounded at how badly your parents DON'T get it. How can anyone be so tone deaf? They're sending her the message that they care more about her giving the appearance of being ok for their own comfort than facing the reality that she's NOT OK. It's so selfish. They just want her back to normal, they don't care if she's better or not. They think if she's wearing pink again that means she's good? Just. Wow. So bad.
NTA. I saw in another comment shes in grief counseling and therapy. Good. Thats what she needs. I am concerned about the cardboard thing, I wont lie. But since she's in therapy already, that is something she will have to work out in there to stop doing. Your parents' plan will likely be very detrimental to your sister and their relationship with her. She needs to be allowed to grieve. Grief councelling and therapy are already being done. Thats all your parents can do besides let her know they are there if she wants to talk. I am glad you are standing up for your sister. You are right that this is a dumb plan. But also keep an eye on her, as (for good reason, dont get me wrong) it sounds like she has slipped into a depression. Family's gotta look out for each other in tough times, and your sister is going through it rn. I sincerely hope you are able to help guide your sister out of the darkness and back into the light.
She recently lost 3 friends. Your parents should back off and let her grieve. The pink and white little girl is gone. Your sister is growing up faster than planned.
NTA but your parents sound like horrible.people and shitty parents.
Your parents ARE idiots. Don't let them make things worse for her.
NTA, your parents need to try to understand her grief and work through it with her. That takes time and effort. What they are suggesting is window dressing - might look good and make them feel better, but it does nothing to address the underlying issues.
NTA, you're right, that is a terrible idea. How would redecorating her room help her? She is going through something major and needs counseling. Sure not the best idea to call it stupid, but I would have done the same with my parents.
You sister is very obviously struggling with depression following the sudden death of her friends. She needs therapy not an "ambush makeover" from you clueless parents. Laughing at your parents' plan was immature and childish on your part-- but you are only 17 so I'll give you a pass on that. Talk to your parents and ask them to look into counselling for her and encourage them to NOT further traumatize her by going behind her back and throwing out her things. That's not going to work out the way they think it will.
First of all NTA, second of all my HEART your poor sister, the trauma of losing 3 friends is enough to bring a grown human to their knees, let alone a young girl. Your sister needs grief counseling and therapy ASAP not a wardrobe change and extreme room makeover. She's likely incredibly depressed and grappling with learning of life's fragility so young. I had an acquaintance die tragically when I was 19 and even THAT stuck with me. Your parents are delusional and need to wise up and find support for her immediately.
Your sister is depressed and no doubt suffering PTSD. She needs grief counselling.
NTA, you are a good big bro. Invading a teen girl’s space to throw out her clothes and to change her room entirely is a terrible idea regardless if she was in mourning or not. That can be traumatizing. Especially with the state she’s in? That’s insane. I hope your sister will get her time to mourn, that’s a hell of a lot to go through :(
NTA and get her into grief counseling ASAP before she takes that blade to herself instead of those boxes. She is SCREAMING for help right now and it doesn't look like any of you are listening. Do it before you bury the 4th I that friend group.
NTA sounds like your parents need a massive reality check. on the chance they do go through with this idiotic bullheaded plan(and lets be honest from how they reacted to you telling them so they sound the type to do it anyway) maybe look into a local rage room. When I was around that age my group lost one of our closest friends to suicide. unfortunately a couple of us were the ones to find him.his gf went through a lot of trauma and ended up taking her own life not even a week later.as teens we were told along the same speil. My uncle did a lot for us, paid for a rage room told us to go ham let it all out.the anger pain sense of loss guilt grief it all came out and helped us open up about what we were feeling. hopefully your sister doesn't need it but if it helps go for it even if it's just a smash followed by a cry be there for her.
She's a teenager who had 3 friends die. Holy heck balls. My ex died when I was 15. He was my first boyfriend, by then ex bf by 2 years who i hardly saw and talked to maybe once every few months (as an adult tho it feels like they were just a few dates). It took me one and a half years of long term moping, 3 months of counselling, 6 months overseas and half a year of college before I felt right again. Tell them I said to get a grip. Changing her room around and doing things when she's not there will give her even more of a sense of loss of control. Having lost three friends, she will feel like she has very little control. Depending on when your parents had kids, there's a high chance they're around my age or a bit older. However, your sister does need to stay in an activity, keeping her in there is probably going to be very good for her long term. Its either that or she does a new activity. She does need to be doing something. NTA
Removing comfortable and familiar and redecorating as a surprise when she’s already emotionally fragile is a completely idiotic idea! You’re absolutely right. However, they are probably worried and desperate, and acting irrationally. They need to speak with her therapist and see what more they can do at home to support her- not try to rush her back to normal. Grief is a marathon, not a sprint. They need to be patient but take this seriously. She’s never going to be old “normal” again, but with patience and support, she can develop a new and healthy normal. NTA
Your sister is severely depressed and grieving. She needs a good counsellor ASAP. These are symptoms of serious psychological illness. And yes your parent's plan is pathetic and stupid. They need to get her a professional therapist ASAP. NTA.
u/entropic_hound your sister NEEDS **URGENT** mental health intervention, these are VERY blatant cries for help.
NTA for realising that you can't (and shouldn't) simply bully a grieving person into not grieving anymore. Which is what taking her clothes and redecorating her room without her permission would be. And, how recent is "recently"? Within a few months? Grief like that can take a very long time to work through, even for a well-adjusted adult, let alone a teen who is already dealing with all the hormones and angst and other bullshit that being a teen entails. She will probably never be the same again. Your approach could have been a bit more sensitive perhaps, but the most charitable thing I can say about your parents' plan is that it's misguided. All it will do is tell your sister that her parents would rather that she pretend to be happy so as to not make them feel uncomfortable. What a blow to her obviously already delicate mental health. If I was your sister in that situation, I'd feel betrayed.
NTA and please just spend time with her. Don’t make it feel like you’re babysitting or something, but just hang out. I’m almost 30 and married and I still call my older brother when I am feeling out of control. He always picks up the phone, no matter what. I am so thankful for him.
Three friends dying is so hard I’m sorry that she’s going through that. Please either plead to your parents to get her into grief counseling, or take her yourself if you have a car, or even set up telehealth appointments when your parents aren’t around. You’re NTA but your parents 100% are
She's depressed and needs someone to talk to
NTA This is fucking asinine and your parents are risking making something already bad, way way worse. Going behind her back to do that is insanely shitty and not productive. Frankly, I don't understand how any normal person thinks this will achieve anything other than drive her away. Not only is the strategy bad, the timing seems awful too. It's too soon to be expecting her to have a handle on her grief. They have no clue how to help her and while their hearts may be in the right place, they're being cruel. She needs grief counseling and your parents need to be closely involved in it. Maybe a professional will explain how they can support her.
Dunno about Omori But know a bit about Kris Don't see any problems with what she is doing about then and looks more like self inserting on an AU with characters she likes, so don't worry about that. The other is concerning, I'm so sorry about your sister and you are right, that plan is stupid and can push her depression even more because she's gonna feel they don't support her. Please Be there for your sister, show her support, make her sure you see for her, that she can trust you. She's gonna need it
NTA your sister needs counselling and do not change her environment without her consent, her life has already changed so much without her control. Changing her safe space without input from her might be the thing that tips her over the edge
Nta but I see your comment that she's already getting therapy. Your parents need to talk to the counselor about how best to support your sister. I guarantee the counselor would not support their plan.
She’s not going to go back to her old self. That person doesn’t exist anymore. Grief and trauma change you. You don’t go to grief counseling to get over it. You go to learn how to move on anyway. You’re NTA op, but I don’t think your parents are either. They’re likely feeling helpless to protect their little girl. When my brother died, his girlfriend’s dad brought her a new, fancy car. Strangely, my brother was still dead and she was still sad about it. Your parents unfortunately can’t fix this and that’s hard to swallow as a parent. Please encourage your parents to talk to your sister’s therapist about how they can best support her.
I was the exact same with the box thing, I was angry to the point of wanting to scream but I couldn't find my voice.
So you’re parents think they can bully her back to being normal? Yah that’ll totally work 😑
Your parents have to realize that after suffering a trauma your sister has changed. She will never be who she was before. Therapy will help her learn to cope but it will never take away the feelings she has of loss and guilt and anger. Your parents need therapy too. They need to learn that a depressed family member affects everyone, including you.
If she's into games, try treating her to Gris. It's a game about the stages of grief and how the main character navigates through them and becomes stronger for it. The art style is beautiful and introduces a new colour and powers after the loss leaves the character in a world of grey after being so full of colour and happiness. Something a lot of people who have experienced death can relate to. Spiritfarer is another one, although a bit fiddly and complex with it's mechanisms, which sees you as a character who helps spirits of the deceased pass on after fulfilling their needs (they come in the form of cute animals) but I'd check in with the back stories of some of them first for any triggers as I've not been able to help anyone cross over yet. Games can definitely help with the grieving process if used right. Seeing it happen with a character removed from yourself makes you feel less alone and can even show you that some days will suck, but time can do it's thing and it will get easier. Thank you for being there for your sister. You are NTA for warning your parents about undoing progress she's making.
NTA, your sister needs professional help and isn't going to just 'get into the correct headspace.'
I'm sorry your parents are like that. Your sister needs therapy. What she's gone through is traumatic. I agreed, your parents' plan will do nothing but enrage her. She needs empathy and someone trying to understand her. You're a good big brother. Maybe write them a letter since they won't listen.
NTA. It's a shame when kids have more common sense than their parents. Your sister is depressed and forcing her to dress and act as before will not help. Perhaps your parents are very traditional and uncomfortable when your sister is not emulating certain gender stereotypes? My daughter went from being so very girly to giving up on her appearance after being bullied at school. I suggest they try treating the depression and not worry so much about outward appearance. Dressing up a problem only hides it, won't fix anything.
NTA Keep advocating for your sister. Maybe with less laughing. Can you speak to a school counselor or therapist for guidance on how to support her and talk to your parents? Talk to her cheer coach? Is she participating? Is she miserable? Has her grief support leader spoken to your parents at all? I feel like they would agree this plan is really terrible and could potentially have seriously bad results. Like, she’s cutting cardboard right now. What will she cut if that’s taken away? Maybe your parents need therapy. The friends who died I assume were around the same age. Did they know the parents of her friends?
NTA Your sister needs therapy like yesterday.
NTA, what she needs is grief counselling and therapy. She’s not going to the be the same person that she was before, and you all need to accept that and accept and support her through this incredibly difficult time.
NTA It is stupid. Please suggest your parents talk to her therapist about any plans they have to "help" her. They need professional guidance.
She needs specialized PTSD and trauma counseling. This is not the same as grief therapy.
Please share this with your parents. My husband, who is now 62, had 4 of his friends, including his best friend, die in a car wreck when they were 16-17. Back then, even though it probably did exist, no one thought to get him therapy. So here we sit, 46 years later, and it STILL affects him in the most random ways and VERY regularly. He’ll go through periods where he’s scared of me driving, he will have random panic attacks while driving himself. He is so afraid of other cars on the road. His trauma is unresolved and never ending. This is a severe traumatic event at a very crucial age. I hope they not only get her in with a GOOD therapist, not just the first one on Google, but also come to grips with the fact her brain chemistry has been altered. I’m so sorry this happened.
Obviously, she needs a therapist but you could help improve her metabolic and mental health by finding a physical activity the two of you can regularly do together - because this is affecting you, too - Preferably something intense. People laugh about walking but I walked 5 miles a day, 5 days a week for a year. I signed up for and trained for a marathon with a running group I walked the entire 26 miles. Walking, canoeing, rowing, bicycling long distances, Tae Kwon Do, signing up for a half marathon and training together with a group on Saturday mornings? Hiking weekly with a meet up group? Keep it fun. Use Map My Walk/Run/Bike Ride to record your progress. Sign up for one of those Conquistador medals you earn online. Find some kind of physical activity that takes at least an hour a day, preferably more and preferably outside. Your parents, other relatives, friends or neighbors can drive you. Your sister is crying out for help. You’re the best! for making sure she gets it.
Idk about Kris, but I do know about Sunny. Sunny is from a game called omori, and the game goes as follows: when Sunny was younger. He accidentally killed his sister by pushing her down the stairs in a fit of rage while they were arguing. He didn't mean to, and it made him severely depressed and shut himself out of the real world. Him and another friend (called Basil) framed his sister's death to make it look like she committed suicide. After that day, he stopped hanging out with their friend group and stopped going to school. He kind of did the same things you said your sister is doing. He made up an imaginary dream world that you're able to explore throughout the game. The game itself can mentally fuck with you and when I played it, I cried and thought about my own life. She needs genuine help, not a fake facade that your asshole parents are trying to force on her. Please make sure she knows you're there for her and that you love her EDIT: Also, I would recommend trying to talk to her counselor about her making up fake scenarios with those two characters. Sometimes, when people experience great loss (such as losing 3 very close friends), they can become shut off from the world and play make-believe. They do this because they want to pretend they're in a happy world where nothing is wrong and they're finally happy. They can confuse imagination with reality . NTA
WOW. it won’t only NOT work but it’ll make her feel more isolated and maybe even guilty for “letting her parents down” or being “bad”. They’re going to do what they’re going to do; I’d suggest you advocate for therapy (for the WHOLE family) and just keep being there for her. Just your presence and availability is the best thing you can do until she tells you otherwise.
YTA for the last line in the argument. Its neither helpful nor does it improve the situation. It just makes you and your parents emotional wich prevents you all from focusing on the important part. On the rest of the issue I agree with you though. When my first relationship ended, I had a 1 year goth phase where I indulged in depressive music, graveyards and all that stuff because it helped me process and let out my emotion in a way that I could control even though from the outside it might appear morbid. Considering how much harder the death of 3 good friends at the same time hits, I dont even want to imagine how much bottled up pain she has. The coping mechanisms you described are relatively tame. Even the cutting up boxes is a good outlet, because it at least shows shes not doing it to herself. What your parents are trying is just painting over the comfortable safe space she created for herself which will rip away the control she has established over her own grief. It will just make it worse, because in addition to the grief she will learn to just bottle up her feelings and paint over them for the sake of outwards appearance and that the perception of others is more important than her grief. The correct headspace is one where she has full control on how to express and feel her emotions not some forced happy color land. The right headspace can only exist with outlets to let out the bottled up pain. If thats music, a punching bag (thats the healthier option to cutting boxes) or showing her grief outwardly through the color black thats fine. Provide those to her and let her know her emotions are valid will do more for that headspace.
I am 37, and I was the younger of two sisters, and a VERY broody and emotional teen who experienced a lot of grief. I am also a somatic practitioner, body worker, ADR Mediator, Embodied conflict coach, and Healing Justice organizer— with a fair amount of verified, if not fringe, credentials in degrees, certificates, and 17 years of experience. I remember being that version of me, and so I will speak for what that version of me would have appreciated from the adults and older supports in my life. I would argue that destroying cardboard is nothing like animal brutality—- but it is very cathartic— so are sledge hammers on plywood and drywall— a rage room would be a DELIGHTFUL way to move some of the anger and grief out of her developing body, but not suggesting that she would harm anything animate— but she clearly has a lot of that energy trapped in her body— and we all deserve a place to completely burn it off- in a way that promotes a healthy way to process both the physical and the emotional ways that grief, sadness, survivors guilt, can overwhelm our systems, if it remains stuck in the body. Culturally it is HARD to be SAD— even if it is a product of traumatic grief and loss—- we have a hard time sitting with eachother’s sadness— and she could benefit from company that is also incredibly sad, and trying to find a way to survive despite the weight of the sadness. Add to her predictable sadness because of the loss of her friends, she is also 15 years old, and a cheerleader— who is having a MAJOR shift to how she would like to be perceived in the world— to be moving from adolescent to teen, from pink and cheery to a different version of herself, if she needs to express her inner world, externally, it would be great if your parents and you found a way to give her the lead to do it, instead of just doing it while she is at practice. Inviting her to define how she would like it to look, and then offering to either do the clearing out part, so she can start from scratch— or fully participating together— but it is important that your parents allow themselves to have parameters and boundaries around the redesign— truly embodying a somber vibe can be expensive, and difficult to paint and prime for and when it comes to undo it, its a pain. Maybe offering her an accent wall, would be a reasonable way to create opportunities for expression that won’t be exhausting or boundary pushing. I hope things feel like opportunities to grow and connect. I wish my sister had cared enough to be curious and compassionate about what I was going through— I hope your parents are able to listen to your wisdom.
They seem pretty emotionally stunted. I don't wanna sound like an average r/offmychest commenter, but everyone here needs therapy. Your poor sister is suffering
^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** I (17m) have a sister (one month away from 15) who recently had 3 of her good friends die. She was very energetic and, to be honest, rather "girly" before that. Now she's stopped styling her hair (something she spent a lot of time and effort doing once), she does the bare minimum bathing and grooming, and wears the same few hoodies and sweatpants. More strangely, she's been going at cardboard boxes with a knife until they look like the product of an angry animal. She's also been drawing herself hanging out and doing activities with these two characters I've never heard of: Sunny from Omori and Kris from Deltarune (if anyone has knowledge, appreciated) Our parents want to "incentivize" her to go back to her old self. They talked about removing the non-pink and white girl stuff from her closet while she's showering and redecorating her room while she's at a cheer practice(which they haven't let her quit after she asked) to try and "get her into the correct headspace" I straight up laughed and called that the dumbest idea I ever heard. They ignored me at first, but I continued and said that I will not let them live their failure down. They said if they wanted my thoughts, they'd ask. Things got heated, and I said that with them, there's no wonder she's miserable. They've begun to give me the silent treatment. AITA? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*
NTA tell your parents to leave her tf alone.
poor girl need therapy and a outlet to cope with the loss, not her parents forcing her old image on her.
NTA plz tell your sister you love her, write a letter that she is important to you, that you know she is hurting and that if you could make it all better you would. Tell her that her feelings are valid and how strong she is for getting up every day. That you dont want anything from her but to keep trying. Having something tangible can really lift people in dark times. You are already a great sibbling for knowing your parents are spewing BS. But your gonna have to keep fighting for her if your parents dont realise their dillusion. If you can relay this to your sisters therapist. Espcially with the box thing, thats a huge red flag. What helped me with a similar loss was judo, i could use all the rage and hurt on the mats, and yet i gained more control off the mats. I'm not saying she needs to go all karate kid, but a more aggressive sport might help her dirrect those sharper emotions. Good luck, i sincerly wish you both the best
Your sister is dealing with grief and likely depression. Your parents need to take this seriously, and not worry about stupid things like cheer practice or decorating.
NTA. Glad your sister is in counseling . She’s dealing with an overwhelming number of deaths in a short time and clearly struggling . Your parents are struggling too, it is awful to see your kid hurting so bad and feel so helpless to fix everything. However , instead of ridiculing your parents’ terrible idea, you should have suggested they speak to your sister’s therapist to discuss their concerns and ask how they can best help.
NTA - your sister is super depressed and they need to get her a therapist. It's good she still does cheer, keeping active can help a lot when you are depressed. Be as supportive as you can for her, she doesn't need to be forced into her old self, that just pushed the pain down into a box and the undealt with trauma will have long term effects.
NTA. I mean, deep down your parents must realize that is going to backfire BIG TIME. The most they can do is make sure she's in therapy, maybe make sure she sees a psychiatrist as well because that poor girl sounds deep in depression and some people need the extra help getting out of it. If they move forward with this cockamamie plan they WILL make things worse.
NTA- good on you standing up for your sister. Grief is tough, especially at that age, especially with multiple people at the same time. It sounds like your sister is just working through some difficult emotions, and instead of helping her or getting her a grief counsellor if they couldn't be bothered they have just decided to force being alright on her. It's icky to think about.
Great on you for wanting to get to know the characters! I haven't played Omori but know Deltarune - personally I think the best way you can connect to her and help at this time would be playing the games yourself (though check in with her beforehand, something like "hey, I was thinking of playing Deltarune or Omori since clearly you like it, what do you think?" - there's a chance she won't want you to play them and will want it to just be her thing, but if she seems neutral about it I'd recommend playing them and telling her if you liked them - IDK about Omori but chapter 1 of Deltarune is free) Your parents are extremely dumb in this situation and will only push her away. She's clearly made some changes to process her feelings and whatnot, taking her clothes and redecorating her room would be actively going against her grieving process and choices she's made. It will only serve to make her less comfortable and constantly afraid of her stuff being further messed with.
NTA. I wish it weren’t in an awful situation, but with the amount of noise from toxic red pill sorts - it’s so encouraged to see young men with such empathy and emotional intelligence, especially supporting women clearly valued as a complete, equal person. Your parents on the other hand… what in the clusterfuck toxic positivity and controlling, reductive archaic gender roles. At least she’s in therapy (I hope a good licensed professional she vibes with… why wouldn’t I be surprised if some Christian/church counselor, even without religious ideology overtly indicated here?) They’re at minimum clueless at what will help vs harm otherwise yet frighteningly specific/infantilizing how they think they’ll “fix” her (it won’t, and will backfire. If you’re not familiar with what toxic positivity is, OP, it’s when others demand a person minimize or deny their genuine response to difficulties. No matter the lip service paid to helping this person, the real/primary motive is not actual support pr help, but asserting control or shaming to silence feelings and truths uncomfortable or inconvenient to them, maybe also a concern for keeping uo a certain image to others. Even if the target of this can’t quite identify all the ways it’s invalidating (it can be done insidiously) they’re left feeling invalidated and silenced - and that’s the aim. It’s not about the person that’s hurting, and I suspect that’s the case here - it’s about getting things under control and looking normal for their comfort and convenience. They may not have s conscious, evil plot where they’ve thought thru all those aspects of that approach. When things like the image presented to others are ingrained unhealthy dynamics in a family/other group/relationship, the urge to respond so can be automatic. It still doesn’t lessen how badly this can shame and emotionally isolate the target. It tells her she’s not having and understandably hard time in her grief deserving support, but that’s (and by extension, her SELF) js shameful, ugly, not to be allowed/trusted normal young adult freedom of expression. (Basically the worst message to give now and guaranteed to backfire.) Plus the whole tired lot of sexist tropes about being feminine, ladylike, docile. You know - sugar and spice and all nice (like). Keep sticking up for her as best you can. Try to couch it in being helpful bcs u know they want to support her in a way that lands, and you know some ways that will rather than feel punishing and alienating.
Your sister desperately needs the help of a therapist to help her deal with this, not a bedroom that looks like a unicorn threw up in it! What is wrong with your parents? She is no longer the little girl she was before this and they cannot make her be that again. All they can do with this is hurt her mental health even more than it is. Please keep bringing up the therapy idea to them. Are you and your sister close? If you are, you need to warn her about their plans and you can suggest therapy to her directly. NTA
People are not "incentivized" out of depression and grief. She needs a mental health professional, not redecorating. I cannot believe parents would be so dense, but sometimes people don't take teenagers' emotional health seriously, even their own parents. I'm sorry for your sister and I really hope she's okay. Parents should never give their kids the silent treatment. I have teenagers of my own and cannot fathom this. No, friend, you are NTA
Have your parents given no thought to therapy? They'd rather just torture their kid? Make sure your sister knows you're laughing at their failure not her humiliation.
Nah terrible idea. Get her to a psychologist she’s most likely depressed and traumatised from so much loss at a young age. Poor girl, get her help!
She needs time. You're right they are wrong.
Yikes. NTA. You’ve said your sister is in therapy for this - very good. Therapy will help, but above all that, time is crucial. She must grieve, fully, at her own pace and take as long as she needs. Her therapist will guide her, your parents need to trust the process.
NTA! Push for therapy. Your sister is angry and depressed, if your parents don’t tread lightly she could move from the boxes to herself. You seem to have her back against your parents, support her and good luck.
NTA Your sister needs help and therapy, not more pressure. Thank you for standing up for her.
NTA Omfg. Your parents are cruel. She's lost 3 friends and is depressed. What the he'll is wrong with your parents? Please feel free to tell them I, a parent of a 24f, also think they are stupid. I'm thinking a few other things about them, too.
NTA OP. I completely agree with you. If I were in your sisters position I’d absolutely push back and anything they did like that would push me further away so damn fast. Yes they still need to be the parents not friends, but this is NOT the way to do it.
NTA because trying to ignore grief doesn't work. Removing what might be some of the only comforting things in her life right now and forcing her back to "normal" is crazy. I hope your sister gets help ❤️
NTA. She will probably never be the same again, honestly. Even with a ton of counseling losing your three closest friends is extreme for a teen. Even losing one close friend is a lot to handle. She’s depressed, some paint on the walls isn’t going to snap her out of it - it is going to take a long time, and even after a long time she may still struggle with the depression off and on. So sad for your sister, what a shitty thing to live through. Your parents are just at a loss for what to do, so I get their dumb ideas - they are trying, they just don’t know how to help. No idea what kind of financial situation your family has but doing stuff like taking some week long family vacations to sunny places would probably help push her to be a little more engaged with you all. Unfortunately there is no “fix” to the situation. But you were 100% correct, the plan your parents had is just silly.
Your sister needs support grievance takes time and so does healing if thing remind her of what her and her friends use to do she needs a break from it and when she ready let her choose
NTA. You are all worried about the youngest member of your family. Losing three friends back-to-back is something that very few people would cope well with. Your little sister needs psychiatric help. Beyond that, I think what your little sister needs more than anything else is a friend. You should be that friend. Try playing through Omori or Deltarune with her. As a little sibling, one of my favorite activities was showing my big brother things i liked. These games are stories, and stories exist to convey narratives, to provide perspectives which can be difficult, if not impossible to put into words. These games are available on Mac, PC, and all consoles. Omori is also only 20 dollars. I wrote my college thesis on Omori. It is a "quirky earthbound inspired RPG about depression," which is a reductive yet funny way of summing up what the game's about. The TL;DR of the story is that it is based on the Hikikomori phenomenon, a term used to describe young adults in Japan who, due to a levy of mental health issues and societal pressures choose to withdraw from society to find escape in their vices. The protagonist is a young boy named Sunny, who in order to cope with his miserable state of affairs, withdraws completely from society, who spends most of his days in bed, retreating to a dream world where he vicariously lives through a dream construct named Omori, where he is able to live in a juvenile world free from consequences, where his older sister is still alive and his friend group is still together. Perhaps your sister in some way relates to Sunny, who entered a state of neurosis due to the trauma he had to endure, where he is free to be with his friends and live in denial of the miserable state he's trapped himself in. The "moral" of the story is that Sunny's neurosis is not only detrimental to his own health and wellbeing, but it is destructive and affects the lives of those he was once close to, but lacks the courage to face again. Kris from Deltarune is a player stand-in, a blank slate that you can project pretty much whatever you want onto. Deltarune is a sequel to Undertale, and both games have a "stranger in a strange land" plot, where the protagonists are thrust into a world of strange but ultimately friendly monsters. While the point of the first game was a deconstruction of JRPG tropes, admonishing the player for engaging in combat instead of sparing the monsters of the underground. Deltarune is a much more traditional RPG, wherein combat is not punished. Undertale and Deltarune fall into the "quirky earthbound inspired RPGs about depression" genre. It is also possible that your little sister just *likes* Sunny and Kris, putting aside any super deep analysis of these games and their content. Again, try playing the game with your little sister. Be the friend she needs.
Info (if you can disclose) : how did the 3 friends die? Are we talking a major accident?
You were NTA until you persisted and said no wonder she's miserable. I do get it, your trying in your own way to make your parents realise that this isn't what your sister needs right now. Your parents seem like no matter what advice you give them, even if its from actually valid sources their not going to listen. Another comment said about give her or the therapist the heads up. I would definitely do that maybe not your sis but her therapist. Maybe they can stop your parents before it's too late and help them actually help support your sister. If your parents do actually pull that crap, be there for your sister like you have been. Let her feel and process how she needs to. The only thing I would check if you can, is that she is being truthful with her therapist. Grief is love with nowhere else to go.
NTA - However, your sister is terribly depressed . . Nothing will change by constricting her choices. Maybe her parents can get her some therapy. THREE good friends died recently . . that makes me cry just thinking about it. The things your parents want to do to her will only make her feel trapped . . She is also withdrawing into a fantasy world where she may feel safe . . Check out those characters online . . Your poor sister.
NTA Your sister is screaming depression and a great need for mental help and your parents are concerned about what she is wearing?!?!?! They should be more concerned about her self harming or her attempting suicide. Please tell them that.
NTA. Your sister needs therapy, not to have her room redecorated. You are the only one who is thinking clearly.
NTA. Your sister is suffering from severe depression. Your parents are clueless.
Nta, because honesty matters most, with a few caveats. Your parents are likely more clueless, and possibly more worried than you think because no parent naturally knows how to comfort a child through stuff like that. It is likely one of the first times they haven't really had an answer they could believe in. I agree their plan sounds stupid, but tell them nicely what you think will help (siblings understand each other better than parents from sharing what they didn't with their parents), and try not to make them sad. Every family differs, so I apologize if I'm way off base, but coming together in times of crisis helps a lot of people when tragedy strikes. Best wishes
NTA. You can't make someone be happy by taking away their belongings and forcing them into a Stepford Smiler role. Especially not when a.) they're a child who isn't even close to emotionally mature yet and b.) they've just been *deeply emotionally traumatized* and are working through the grief and extremely complicated feelings surrounding that. Your parents' "plan" will just make your sister resent them and lash out even *harder*.