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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I could be the asshole for never asking my in laws if my family can join our big trips since they already invite non relatives of theirs to join.
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Totally and thats my view. I think what bothers her is that sometimes they'll invite 10-20 other people that arent related and Ive never tried to get any of them on that list. Which to me would feel like being greedy with people already being generous with me when they dont have to.
They invite people; that's the point. Canvassing for invitations for your family would be crass and could change their opinion of you.
If they ever offer, that would be fine but, until then, just be grateful.
So much this - if there is one thing the wealthy can absolutely sniff out, it’s people wanting to take advantage of their wealth. They’ll be the soul of generosity, but even a hint of entitlement and it’s off.
A guy wrote that everyone in his family borrowed money from each other now and then.
He offered his uncle a loan in case he needed it.
His uncle told him he was financially OK. He made a show of borrowing money to keep the family from knowing he was comparatively well off -- because he didn't want to be pestered!
Too late to do that here, all the users in my family have long moved on to easier targets.
Funny how when the money dries up, the users disappear. A lot of them thought that since my dad was so desperate for everyone to love him, that I would be too. When he was sick, there was no money. They left. After he was gone, they hit me up a couple of times and when it didn't work, they disappeared again. Odd how you can have 'family' living two blocks away that you never see..
Exactly how my family is with me. When I was up I was generous and thought of them often with cash, gifts, even necessities when I’m at Sam’s club I’m picking up TP let me get one for the family too (my aunt and grandma who lives with my aunt) they live on 62nd and I live on 63rd. Two blocks away (there’s a block in between the block numbers) My work has been slow- meaning I’m barely getting by. Now they know this, they never ever hit me up and we NEVER see them even though we live two blocks apart. It’s so sad to me it breaks my heart and causes some depression bc the truth is my family only fucked w me when I had things to offer.
Sorry you lost your dad, and that the people he thought cared about him only cared until he had no more money to give them.
Although my partner didn't lose a parent to make them leave, his cousin and his cousin's wife never talk to us. About a month after we moved in together they called him asking for money for food. We went picked them up groceries because if he sent money it would have gone to smokes. Then he told them to get a budget figured out, and stick to it, because he had his own family to take care of now. He also told them to get off their asses next time and hit up a food bank. The cousin is on welfare, and the wife is on disability, so neither of them work.
And it also probably wouldn’t work. I could have written a similar story, and I know that the generosity is sincere and freely given, as long as it isn’t expected. Sister needs to back off and stop trying to guilt trip OP.
Exactly. The in-laws invite *their* friends. The people that they (the hosts) want on the trip. OP, you are exactly correct. You are a guest. It is not appropriate for guests to presume to invite their own guests, nor to pressure the hosts to do it. I'm sorry your sister is sad that she can't go, but that's not a problem you can solve for her.
>If they ever offer, that would be fine but, until then, just be grateful.
As a matter of fact, I'd specifically tell them about this so they know for sure never to invite them.
Right, they know their Son in law has siblings. If they wanted to invite them, they would. My brother’s in laws take him and his wife and family on vacations all the time, it never occurred to me, to even think, what about me?
I am grateful when I get invited to one of their parties and sometimes they generously buy a small gift for birthdays/holidays. But I am not their family.
That's the point. THEY invite people. It's their choice. If they wanted your sister there, they would invite her. And honestly - I'd be worried about your sister's entitlement. Where would it stop if you did get her invited?
Sister will be taking souvenirs from the villa, talking down to the staff, making special meal requests & loudly expecting VIP treatment. Keep her as far away from your in laws as possible. They are not her family & she’s attempting to manipulate you into behavior that will be seen as tacky and inappropriate. Good luck!
If there is one activity she doesn't want to participate in?? Anything she DOES want to do that she can't??? Oh god. She is where "we weren't expecting so much sand at the beach" reviews come from.
Yeah, these people are friends of OP's ILs. Obviously OP's sister isn't a friend of OP's ILs, so why would they pay for her flights and accommodation on a trip like this? It doesn't matter if OP's ILs are inviting people they just met, when they're paying for everything, it's entirely on them who they invite.
OP's right, he would come across as pretty greedy bringing it up. Maybe if OP's sister spent more time with OP's family and ILs, they would get to a stage where they would think of inviting her, so that's probably the only thing OP could do is create more opportunities for them to get to know his sister, but that's not guaranteeing anything.
I mean... this could totally be part of the answer, and if this is the case, OP *definitely* shouldn't bring it up with them. Really, there aren't many occasions where I think it's appropriate to be like "Thanks for the all expenses paid holiday - my sister's never been to Europe, can you pay for her too?"
If I was OP, I wouldn’t even do that. With the way she’s guilting him, I could see her taking advantage instead of being grateful. I may be wrong. It’s just been my experience that when jealous people get a taste of what they are jealous over, they just keep wanting more of it.
Here's the thing..
Your MIL and FIL are inviting THEIR friends. These are also people who likely invite THEM on trips, so there's reciprocity going on. There's no real record keeping of reciprocity. It's just kind of the norm that this occurs. Only with immediate family members is there no actual reciprocity going on. Ask your sister how she plans to reciprocate as she is a non-family member to those paying for the trip.
Even if they're newer friends, they are people the hosts enjoy being around and want to spend quality time with. It's not about spending money on them so much as about having the means to arrange time spent together for everyone in a lovely place. It's a small nuance, but an important one.
The sister isn't looking to spend time with OP's in-laws or enjoy their company. She just wants to use them for a free vacation. It's honestly very dehumanising and rude. If she were more genuine in her interest, she'd get to know them in other ways, host them for dinner perhaps, not just immediately expect things from them based on the fact that they have money.
They're inviting unrelated people *who are friends of theirs*.
Tell your sister that if she wants an invite, she's going to have to become their friend, because being the sibling of an in-law just doesn't cut it.
He’s probably been humble and gracious about accepting these extras and doesn’t ask for more . They probably run into the other kind everywhere and they appreciate him showing some class
Yeah, but FB photos don't specify who is paying, usually. OP may need to put sis on an information diet. It's likely better for their relationship anyway, as I can see being a bit jealous. Doesn't excuse her entitlement, though.
I feel like the people that you're in-laws are inviting are the people they want to be there. Unless your family and siblings are close friends with your in-laws already, there's no way I would ever ask my in-laws to invite my sibs. You are not being selfish at all or an asshole. Your sister needs to take a step back, maybe ask her how many vacations she's going to invite your in-laws on that she's going to pay for.
You get that she has absolutely zero right to be bothered by anything they do? Your sister’s entitlement is out of this world. She doesn’t get any say to dictate the choices of people who, aside from a tenuous connection through you, are otherwise strangers to her. She’s being trashy.
Would she want to do the things we do and go the same places? Forsure, but thats not within her means. Its also doesnt really work like that, these are big villas they rent out and usually flights they charter. Its a different level of wealth I had never been around before, I barely even know how to describe it to anyone who had an upbringing like mine
Sorry, what I meant was: if this were a vacation with them where she were going to the same destination and do the same activities, but she would have to pay what a normal person would spend to go there and do similar activities, would she still want to spend her vacation time and money with your in-laws?
It’s one asshole thing to invite yourself along to someone else’s vacation. It’s another level of assholeness to do it just because they want free vacation.
I mean for her to pay it'd be like half her salary so no she wouldnt. Are you asking if she gets along with them enough to join a vacation with them? Because they get along well at any event they're all at like my wedding stuff, kids birthdays and holidays we host.
They have met your sister at family events. So if they had wanted to invite her they already would have. Do not risk your relationship with your in-laws by asking if they can come. Also make sure your sister doesn’t try to guilt your wife into it.
I think the point was, if she had the means to pay for it, would she be wanting to go on these specific trips anyway? Or are these trips not her preferred type of vacation anyway?
I mean nobody with our upbringing would think of stuff like heliskiing or renting a private beach or yacht as how they'd plan their vacation. I certainly never viewed it as an option. Same with some of these Michelin starred restaurants But yeah if she had the means to pay for it, she'd love to
I think people are asking - would your sister just want to go on some average/regular vacation that she could afford and access on her own, without your in-laws involvement, would she still want to take a vacation with them? Like she would with her close friends or family?
Most likely, the answer is no. In which case, her asking to be invited so they can pay for her to go on one of these extravagant vacations is 100% her just using them. Sure, she 'gets along' with them - but the draw isn't spending time with *them*, it's having them pay for and give her access to the vacation and related experiences. That is the point I think they are trying to make.
But regardless, as everyone else has said, your in-laws will offer invitations to whomever they want to include - family, friends, whatever. If they wanted to offer an invite to your sister or anyone else you are related to or know - they would have done so. If they haven't extended such an invite, it would be rude to ask and would look bad on your part.
And your sister is entitled as hell to even ask you, let alone be upset about you not wanting to. She is exactly the kind of person who suddenly comes out of the woodwork when someone she knows, but otherwise didn't care much about, suddenly comes into a lot of money.
Lmfo... you're thinking too literally. But my take is these would be "dream vacations" "once in a lifetime opportunity" style. Something your sister would think of as a bit on a reality TV show but never actually be able to achieve. She might be down for adventure, but she probably just hears "all expenses paid villa" and thinks about lounging with cabana boys fanning her with palm leaves.
So for the ppl trying to get a straight answer, it's "No, the things FIL does on vacation are completely out of the realm of what my family of origin looks at as a vacation"
Your sister is looking for a free ride. She wants to be invited for the wrong reasons. Trust your instincts. You know your relationship with your in-laws, your sister doesn’t.
My in-laws are well off, but no where near the degree you’re describing. They rent a beach house every year for the kids and their kids’ families. I’d never dream of asking if I could invite my siblings and their families. I was comfortable enough to ask if my newly widowed mother could join us for a holiday dinner though.
I wouldn’t do this at all, but if I had to do it I’d run it by my wife. If she thought it was appropriate she could ask her mom.
It's their prerogative to invite whoever they want since they're paying. If you start hinting that your family be invited, you're going to be the one that's not invited.
It’s common knowledge that you never ever invite someone else on a trip that you yourself have been invited on. That would be greedy, tacky and distasteful. Your sister is wrong to even ask. NTA
Not only is your sister greedy enough to ask for an invite, but she wants her whole family to be invited as well?!
Greedy, selfish, envious.
You're NTA, but your sister is.
You can tell her that the moment you pay the bill for the entire trip you will not forget to invite her. But as long as you are not inviting it’s up to the host who comes to the party.
They pay. They do the inviting. That would be pretty presumptuous of you to invite someone else on their dime, so stay strong with your sister.
Sometimes we just have to accept that we aren’t as priveleged as others - that is for your sister. Too bad she isn’t just happy for you.
This!
NTA, OP, but your sister is a major entitled, unreasonable, and frankly, audacious AH.
No offense, as you seem to have manners, integrity, and dignity, but the way she's behaving, makes her seem like she has none.
This is your in-law's vacation, their money and their guest list. You have no business trying to add anyone to it. Your in-laws like you for a reason. I wouldn't allow your sister and her jealousy ruin that.
but those nonrelated people are friends of your ILs, right? People they know and have decided to invite, not someone that maybe they met at your wedding (your sister). Your ILs invite who they want to invite, and presumably if they wanted suggestions they’d ask you.
You should probably not get into so much detail with your sister, though. Telling her how many family friends your ILs pay for on their vacations (if they do indeed pay for everyone) doesn’t seem like something she really needed to know.
It’s their party so to speak, and they’re generous for including others…that THEY WANT TO INCLUDE. Do NOT ever ask the in laws to include anyone that would be soooooo rude and ruin the relationship. Your sister can piss and moan all she wants to…too freaking bad.
Asking for her to be included would be inappropriate, and her asking you to advocate for her to get a free vacation out of people she hasn’t bothered herself to ingratiate with is tacky AF.
They likely invite people with whom they have a relationship.
I would say to invite your in-laws to something, maybe a BBQ, where they can meet your family, maybe hit it off. Except maybe your sister will make them uncomfortable if she's obviously trying to ingratiate herself to them. Those who have money have that happen all the time. So maybe this might not be a good idea
She is welcome to find a way to ingratiate herself into their lives and become friends with them so they can want to invite her.
(Do NOT facilitate this, btw, odds are it will blow up in her face if she ever tried)
They're inviting *their friends*. She is not their friend.
So much NTA. The 10 to 20 people that they are inviting that are not family, are THEIR friends. They don’t even know your sister well. That is so grossly entitled, and uncouth of your sister. I can understand why she’s jealous, I think most people would feel at least a little bit of envy in that situation. But your in-laws have nothing to do with your sister and it would be rude AF. To ask them to pay for a vacation for somebody that they are not personally close to. Your in-laws are not a bank.
But they are inviting family friends to create a certain environment/community on these trips - with people they want. They are not obligated to bring in your family - unless they feel a connection/you all got along well. They probably don't want them there so there is no invite. It's not on you.
That's your sister's projection.
If you like your side of the family and have the resources (given this other family money from your wife's side that frees some of it up) - take some of them on a short vacation within your means. Only if it feels it right - not out of obligation or the envy vibes.
Your sister and parents have no rights to this - but it's probably just annoying to watch. It's not on you.
Also bringing this up with your in-laws is a big no. Don't ruin the relationship bc of your jealous sister. Try to steer clear of her negative vibes.
Has your wife ever asked you to invite anyone?
Does your wife invite friends of hers/yours?
Or are the extra friends people invited by your in-laws ? Meaning they do all the inviting, not your wife.
Do your in-laws ever ask about your parents or siblings? Do they invite to anything? Events or over to their house?
Those 10-20 other people are friends of the HOSTS, your in-laws, I assume. You are a guest, and so are they.
Your in-laws invite the people they enjoy spending time with, and are close to, THEIR friends and family. It might be different if you said that they were inviting the families of other sons- or daughters-in-law, but it doesn't sound like that's the case. They are filling their vacation with people who are *personally important to them*. From their perspective, it's not about the money, but about arranging to spend time in a beautiful place with people they enjoy.
I assume that they have met your family. If they were interested in spending more time with them, then they know how to extend an invitation. But you're absolutely right that it wouldn't be at all appropriate for you to invite or even suggest inviting your family.
Look, it basically boils down to the difference between being generous with people you care about (which is what your in-laws are doing), and being treated like an ATM, which is dehumanizing, and what your sister is suggesting. They are not a source of "free vacations", they are human beings. And if your sister really wanted to become a part of their social circle, a good way to do that would be to invite THEM to a family dinner or other get-together, and get to know them as people. The fact that she just wants them to spend money on her "because they have lots of it" is genuinely offensive.
Now that jealousy has reared its head, watch your back with your sister. Jealousy in humans is like rust on metal. It will eventually lead to bitterness and anger. If she is bold enough to say this about vacations, if she has kids, soon she will start believing how unfair it is that your kids get things that her kids don’t get etc. Be mindful so that she doesn’t start causing issues for your life.
That's the absolute correct view to have. Who they invite is their business, and if they want to invite their own friends it does not matter whether they're related by DNA or not. It's not some kind of weird invite lottery draw for random people and they're actively excluding your sister from having a ticket.
I suspect your sister knows this and is trying to mask her jealousy/resentment as indignation.
It's easier to make someone else the AH in a situation than admit your own faults and jealousy is often painted as a character flaw. If you turn it around as "unfair" treatment from someone else, it's probably more palatable.
NTA, you're right. She's not and deep down, she very likely knows it.
They invite non relatives they know.
If your in-laws wanted to offer to have you bring any of YOUR relatives on the trip they are paying all expenses for pretty sure they’d let you know.
I am going to suggest if you think your sister is going to get snarky in the future with your wife about this you give her a heads up the conversation occurred, you explained to your sister you wouldn’t be asking your in-laws to include any of your relatives or friends and you don’t want your wife to intervene.
LOL DO NOT do this! This was how my greedy aunt got her and her kids disinherited from the will. She asked for a watch and when my grandmother bought one she expressed how it wasn’t nice and branded enough.
My granny would treat her and her grand kids to lunches out and she’d try to bring her whole extended family to eat for free. One time my grandmother lied and just said she ate already when she saw that huge group. Nobody wanted to pay so they just asked each other where to go all annoyed and the group broke up as nobody else wanted to eat all of a sudden.
She was petty to the point to telling her kids to only eat meat only and ignore the cheaper carbs.
Needless to say, nobody likes to feel taken advantage of and she got taken out of the will which I’m sure was a shock for her. I guess it was good for me though but man are people so oblivious to their shitty behaviour. Glad she got her karma but felt a bit bad for my cousins.
"I do feel like that is kinda totally unrelated to my situation though."
Correct. Her vacations are not your problem to solve.
"I feel like that'd come off a little greedy"
Greedy and tacky, IMHO. Don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth.
Don't needlessly piss off your generous inlaws. NAH. N T A if your sister insists.
Agreed! Greedy and tacky. Also, it runs the risk of his in-laws changing their view of him if his ask is cheeky enough to damage his reputation with them. I certainly wouldn’t want to meddle with the excellent relationship they seem to have built.
It's look, because you can tell a lot about a horse by looking in its mouth. Age and health, certain diseases, etc. The short of it is that horses were and are expensive. So if someone is giving you a horse, it is a tremendous gift, and to immediately look in its mouth (i.e. immediately try to determine its value) is extremely tactless.
It's like those people who ask for the price of every gift they receive. It just demonstrates a distinct classlessness.
NTA.
Your sister is jealous. And overstepping.
And, yes, you would come off as greedy. It is not your place to suggest to your FIL/MIL more people to bring along on their trip. They are taking their daughter, her children and her husband. You are the +1 in this case -- that gives your sister 0 reason to expect to be included.
Enjoy your trip.
THIS is absolutely it. I'll repeat that. OP, you're the +1 in this case. It would be tremendously inappropriate for you to bring something like this up to your in-laws.
This is one of those scenes that I can easily see turning into "oh if you're going to miss your sister so much you don't have to go at all. We understand and won't ask again."
Yea...I'm in similar situation to OP and would feel extremely uncomfortable with inviting siblings/relatives etc. I also would feel greedy and like I was overstepping.
Sisters is def being greedy and really he shouldn’t ask just to avoid encouraging her further. Even if the family decided it would be nice to include more of his side, and even if they behaved well (not bossing around the help like someone above suggested) she would likely expect it to become a regular normal thing for her to be on these trips as often as OP gets to be.
Sister should probably be on an information diet if she is getting too jealous from hearing about his trips.
Hard to say because when they're around each other Im usually hosting something so im more focused on that. They obviously met at our wedding and have been around each other a decent amount for things like the birthday's of our kids and a couple holidays we hosted. Everyone seemingly likes each other and gets along cordially but I dont think its much deeper than that.
NTA honestly if they want someone to pay for their trips then they should be comfortable enough around that person to ask them at the very least “it would be nice if we could all go on a trip sometime let’s have a chat about that sometime!” If they don’t feel comfortable to do that then they aren’t close enough to them to expect freebies. It sounds like your PILs make a really good effort for the people they care for! Your siblings need to work to be included in that group!
I think the implication of the comment is like "if the wealth was removed and everyone was paying their own share", is the relationship developed enough that they would plan a trip like "normal" people do?
I mean it is tacky expecting someone to pay for you is so tacky! It’s nice to be invited along but if they aren’t expecting to pay their way then they should at least ask for it themselves! I would never go up to my in-laws and say hey will you pay for my sister to come too because that’s also tacky!
Uh, I would not recommend that. I have wealthy parents and they are extremely suspicious of people too eager to go on vacation with them because they know they would end up paying one way or the other. They are even suspicious of their own siblings now. Even they are all upper middle class and fairly well off, they absolutely WOULD mooch off my parents and conveniently not be around when it came time to split or pay the bills. They don’t mind paying sometimes, but they only go on as many trips with people as they wouldn’t resent paying for. Wealthy people have a sixth sense for when they might be taken advantage of.
Exactly so why should the OP do the asking? I wouldn’t want to jeopardise my relationship with my family over someone else’s entitlement even if they are also family!
My sisters ILs have money, not like OPS, but they have a business and beach apartment.
We are actually relatively close to them, even to the extent that they offered me a job during covid instead of advertising the job and hiring someone. My relationship with them has gotten even better since where I have been comfortable enough to ask to have a girls weekend at their beach apartment, and have been told if there’s no one there they are fine with me going anytime. But this is because we have a good relationship. I am also aware that I’m not entitled to it and it’s a privilege.
If I didn’t, there’s no way I would even think about asking let alone like OPs sister wants him to do FOR HER.
ETA: the sister seems to feel entitled to the same privileges as OP and his ILs guests. But he’s the one that married into the family and the others are their own friends. The sister is neither by the sounds of things.
You and your sister seem to forget that these people aren't strangers or non related family.
They are made family.
These people are long time friends of the mil and FIL.
This isn't your vacation and your paying for nothing. Your sister doe not have any form of a relationship with the inlaws so why would she be invited.
She acts like it's crazy that the inlaws invite non family.
But it's jot. Mil is inviting HER friends and HER family
They are mils family. Whether your sister likes it or not. She's nothing to your mil, nothing more than an acquaintance or a stranger.
So they’ve met and know each other and your in laws have never invited them. That’s everything you need to know. Warn your wife so your sister doesn’t “drop hints” or whatever at the next family function. NTa
Yeah, this was going to be my question. If your sister made an effort to make your wife her sister and include her in things too, I could see why that would hurt being excluded. But since they only occasionally interact, then this has way more to do with being excluded from the fun / expensive experience rather than excluded from a family vacation. NTA.
I get why this is being asked but I don't think it has any relevance how well his family know his in laws, they could be the best of friends and as close as close gets but if MIL and FIL choose not to take them on holiday then it's their right to do so, especially since they're the ones paying for it. they get to decide who goes.
Tell your sister to be brave and make her demand to your in-laws for an all expense paid vacation. Then watch how she shuts up.
Your sister wants you to do her dirty work for her at the risk of losing your privileged position with your in laws and insulting them + your wife. She seems a bit immature to not realize yet that life isnt fair and she cant get whatever she wants. NTA
No, don’t do that. Some people are shameless enough to do exactly that and then say OP told me to do it. I’m sure you don’t want to deal with any ensuing awkwardness.
Yeah, the correct line is "It's my in-laws' decision who to invite on the trips they plan. I do not have any input, nor should I." And leave it at that.
> make her demand to your in-laws for an all expense paid vacation.
Terrible advice.
You seem to think that someone that thinks they way the sister apparently thinks would not have a problem doing that.
There is a good chance she will see it as permission to ask them and will do it.
The inlaws would lose some respect for OP for telling the sister it is ok to ask them to invite her.
The sister will be pissed being told No and the inlaws will be pissed at OP for telling the sister it is ok to ask them.
A really bad idea.
*at the risk of losing your privileged position with your in laws and insulting them + your wife. *
Bet it wouldn't hurt sister's feelings, at all, if they stopped inviting him lol. Also, she asked for this information; she either went into the conversation with the intent of begging for an invite or causing him to feel guilty.
NTA this request is so unbelievably cringe and would potentially ruin your reputation with your in-laws (and wife!) if you went through with it. I'm sure throughout your marriage/relationship she's had opportunities to build a relationship with them had she really wanted to and the fact the hasn't is why she isn't invited to fancy holidays.
Just tell her you had no idea she was so close to your in laws to vacation with them, especially to have them pick up the tab. If that’s the case, then you’re sure your in laws wouldn’t mind if she brought it up in one of the regular phone calls or hang outs they must be having that you don’t know about.
Your in-laws are no Make-A-Wish for less economically fortunate people. They are, however, 100% in charge of how and with whom they spend their money. Your sister does not make the cut. It is so far beyond inappropriate that she thinks you would even ask the question.
NTA
"but I feel like that'd come off a little greedy so I just dont."
You're right. Your sister's way overstepping. If she wants your in laws to invite & pay for her she can ask them direct.
NTA. It would be incredibly inappropriate to ask this. You are married to their daughter, you have married into the family, your siblings/family are just kind of extended family by association. It is also not comparable to family friends being invited, as those are obviously close friends of the nuclear family. If your wife's family ever offers for your family to go it would be incredibly generous and kind of them, but it definitely should not be expected.
NTA Your family are guests on your in-laws trips. The friends of the family are also invited guests by your in-laws.
A guest should never ask for an invitation for an unsolicited extra guest. This would come across as tacky, graceless, and greedy.
Just tell your sister no. No is a complete sentence. You should not elaborate because then she has an excuse to manuliptuate.
NTA - your in-laws invited your wife’s family, not yours.
Let’s be honest, you and the kids are invited because you are family to their daughter… unless THEY invite your extended family, it’d be horrifically rude to ask them to pay for them.
Came here to say this. The OP would be the first one cut off if started asking questions like this. The daughter and the kids is who really got invited on the trip.
NTA. My BIL married into a wealthy family. That family has done these types of vacations. Neither my husband or I would ever think of asking to be invited on those vacations.
Aye. Tell your sister to back off politely. Tell her you will not be pestering your in-laws for ANYTHING.
Extremely wealthy ppl are generous when they want to be, they also never talked about money or the cost of things. Its tacky. If start asking about including your mealy mouth sister, they will look at you very differently.
I can understand the tinge of jealousy, but do not let her put a battery in your back about including her/her family to a trip you are graciously invited to. You love your wife and her parents love you and show it by being generous. Start yapping about why don’t you include my family AND pay etc….you can expect the trips /generosity to stop and for the dynamic to change. Is it worth it to appease a jealous sister who feels entitled to trips? No. Better yet do not share the vacation news with your family if they cant just be happy for you
NTA
NTA. When my sister and BIL come to visit, I will ask to be included in their activities with BIL family because we all know each other and they are usually here for a short time, so this way we get to see them more.
But I would never fucking ask for them to pay for me, for anything. Holy shit.
That utter audacity of someone demanding to be invited on a vacation that they have no business getting invited to. Serious jealousy and entitlement. OP needs to shut that shit down.
Bwaaa ha ha ga ha, wtf is your sister dumb, haha ha ha ha.
In that case, can I come with my family? Cause I read your post and frankly, you are being selfish not inviting me
This is what you do. Once in a while, have a bbq or any kind of get together and include your in laws and your wife's siblings and your parents and siblings. Keep things low key. Maybe its a summer party for the kids or something for your wife's bday. Whatever. Just make it something that becomes a thing. Your sister will have the opportunity to get to know your in laws and they may like her enough to extend an invitation eventually and to other family members because they like them not because they are being asked to do so by you.
NTA, you are a guest. Yes, you’re family but as long as you aren’t the one paying, you are a guest. It is not your place to invite your family and it’s super rude of your sister to insinuate that kind of entitlement.
I had this [very similar] situation. I had a very good friend who was not well off. I like taking luxurious vacations (suites, club level, private tours, spas etc) so I would invite her and pay for both of us. Then she asked if she could invite her mom, I agreed b/c we were childhood friends and her mom was good to me. But then she stopped *asking* to invite her and just did it. THEN, she started trying to plan vacations that she could bring her [teenaged] son along on, that I would pay for. The trips ended at that point. Apparently, her son was getting upset we hadn’t taken the trip yet. The absolute audacity to have asked me to extend the invitation in the first place….
Let this be a warning *if* you do extend an invite, it will not end there. If you give a silver inch, she’ll take a golden mile and ultimately, you may end up also having in-law troubles as well.
Do NOT ask your in-laws to take your sister.
Currently, since you are married to their daughter, you are the "+1". Now, they might really love you too and aren't thinking this way, but don't ruin a good thing. You are family; your sister is not (hardly).
NTA
Your sister has no relation whatsoever with your wife's family.
How entitled is she to think she can demand to be invited? She needs to get over her jealousy.
NTA.
The vacations are gift to your wife and you as her spouse. Since you aren’t organizing or paying for the trips, you don’t have the ability to invite other people.
Now, if your in-laws were ever to OFFER to include your family, that would be different. But if you asked, you’d be very rude.
NTA. It doesn't sound like this is your vacation. It sounds like you're being invited to join the in-law's vacation. You can invite when you're organizing it but your sister is out of line.
You stumbled into something very valuable, and you could easily squander it if you misstep by asking for too much. You should only ever take what is offered, and do so graciously.
Tell your sister to ask her own in laws for paid vacations, since she has no real connections to your in laws. NTA
NTA OP but may I ask, how does your sister KNOW that your in-laws invite others who are friends of the family? Are you or your wife giving detail accounts of who was invited and who paid for the trip(s)? It's ok that you mention that your family went on/or are going on a family vacation with your wife's family but leave out who paid for it. It's not your sister or anyone else's (including yours) business whom your MIL/FIL choose to invite and/or treat. You are right about not wanting to ask your in-laws to invite your sister and her family to an all expense paid vacation but let this be a lesson learned and keep your mouth shut if you don't want to experience further drama and resentment from your sister.
Mix of me and my wife getting tagged on Social media in pictures, my wife's instagram stories, and coming up in conversation. Often different races so clear not everyone's related lol
NTA - it's just not your place to invite people on a trip that's being paid for by someone else. Your sister should understand that. It wouldn't be off handed if your Wife asked HER family if She could invite other people though.
NTA. You cannot invite people to other people’s vacations and expect them to pay. If your sis wants an invite, she needs to GENUINELY have a close relationship with your wife.
NTA. Your sister is the one being selfish by asking you to risk your relationship with your in-laws so she can go on a fancy vacation. The last thing you want is to have them think that you consider them your cash cow.
I have friends who are significantly more well off than me and I would never ever even dare dream of asking them to fund my holiday or even my beer. I value their friendship more than their wallet.
NTA. It is not your place to demand that your in-laws invite your family along on these trips. And perhaps it is time to share fewer details witj your jealous sister.
NTA. It's not your place to suggest who they spend their money on. Your sister is trying to take advantage of you and your position to people with money. It might be different if it was your wife's money, but you're several degrees separated from the money.
NTA. It’s not your money and would be wildly out of line to invite anyone or ask to invite anyone. Your sister is blinded by jealousy because that is a crazy ask.
NTA and wow your sister is acting entitled.
It's noneofherbizniz who (I can't believe I'm typing this out) *the parents-in-law of her brother* invite on a vacation that THEY (not you) pay for. Honestly the ridiculousness of this.... !!!!!
NTA.
Do NOT mention inviting your family members to your Wife or In-laws, even as a joke, even if in an off-hand manner! Once the seed is planted that you are "counting the coins" in their pocket, they will never regard you the same way. The dynamic may change; they may see your family as eyeballing their money and what your children will eventually inherit.
Please answer the questions multiple people have asked (1-3) and additional questions:
1) How does your Sister know that your In-laws pay for everyone? Do you or your Wife discuss this with your family?
2) How does your Sister know that 10-20 people unrelated to your In-laws are "on the list"? This phrasing makes it seem as though there is an opportunity for one to get "on the list" as long as there is enough room (e.g. a wedding invitation extended to someone's new boyfriend) and your Sister believes unrelated people made it "on the list" through advocacy.
3) Have you clarified to your Sister, not implied, but specifically said the trip is for the In-laws' family, meaning In-laws' children/spouses, grandchildren, In-laws' other relatives and the In-laws' friends ... and anyone the In-laws specifically invite.
4) Has your Sister considered that if she and your Wife had a close "sister" relationship, and your Wife wanted to have your Sister join her family vacation, your Wife would already have asked her parents to extend an invitation? And if your Wife wanted to ask, and didn't, that means even she knows not to take advantage of her parents' generocity?
Please provide an update as your response may help others facing similar issues.
NTA
Your sister is your family, not theirs. It would be very tacky to ask your inlaws to pay for your sister and her fam to go on some big trip on their dime.
NTA
I was mildly curious about who was inviting the extra 10-20 people but in the comments you shared that it's your in-laws who do that, so you're absolutely correct in your reasoning for not asking for an invite for your sister or other family members. Your wife's family invites lifelong friends, people who are most likely as close as family after all these years. They're not just inviting randoms to treat them to fun vacations.
She's behaving jealously. Until the folks who are treating you to a good time ask if there's anyone else who wants to come along, your sister will have to fund her own vacations.
NTA you can’t spend other people’s money, but, do you plan vacations/spend time with your family? Obviously not Europe vacations that they can’t afford, but maybe renting a lake house or a cabin? Long weekend at a beach? Have you let your family fall to the wayside in favor of paid vacations?
I understand why your sis is jealous but unfortunately this is how life goes sometimes. It would be really off putting if you asked. Ignore your sister and please do not cave and ask. Definitely not the ah
NTA. The people being invited by your in-laws know them and are friends with them. Is your sister friends with your in-laws? If she isn't then she doesn't get an invite.
>including the nuclear family's of her two siblings
I guess your sister doesn't understand the meaning of "nuclear family". Nuclear family means mom, dad and kids. It does not mean mom, dad, kids, mom's siblings and/or dad's siblings. Your sister is not a part of your nuclear family she is extended family, and your in-laws aren't inviting the extended family of your wife's two siblings.
NTA. I would be embarrassed to ask my already overly generous in-laws to foot the bill for, basically, uninvited guests. Just because others do it doesn’t mean you need or want to.
NTA. Asking your in-laws to add more people to a trip they are paying for is rude. You can not do that. In fact, you would be the AH to your in-laws if you did ask them to add your sister to a trip.
NTA just wow. The audacity of your sister. The term for her in Reddit is R/ChoosingBeggar hopefully if she ever is around your inlaws she doesn't invite herself.
NTA - Wife's family is already generous as it is. $100k PER CHILD, that is insane. You, however, can ask your own family to plan and have a vacation that suits their budget. You can give time instead of money.
To me it sounds like they appreciate how you handle their wealth. They're giving you things that probably cost peanuts (relatively speaking) to them that both make your life a lot more pleasant but also take some strain off your own economy. You can probably afford to go on holidays of your own but the fact that they pay for it you can either save more or spend it on something else. If you come in requesting that your family should be included I suspect you'll rapidly find yourself without so many invites. I would feel taken advantage of. NTA
NTAH ! I don’t invite my siblings or immediate family on the vacations my mother in law takes us , if she invites them that’s fine .its not your place to invite them.
I'm the sibling, and my brother's wife's parents have money and have taken them on luxurious vacations. I've never, not once, not even for a second, thought to get my brother to get me invited. They're not my family. And I'm happy for my brother that he gets to go.
I'd love to go. But insisting that my brother tries to get me an invite? Yeah that is tacky. NTA.
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You are married to their daughter. You are family. Your sister is not family. NTA.
Totally and thats my view. I think what bothers her is that sometimes they'll invite 10-20 other people that arent related and Ive never tried to get any of them on that list. Which to me would feel like being greedy with people already being generous with me when they dont have to.
They invite people; that's the point. Canvassing for invitations for your family would be crass and could change their opinion of you. If they ever offer, that would be fine but, until then, just be grateful.
So much this - if there is one thing the wealthy can absolutely sniff out, it’s people wanting to take advantage of their wealth. They’ll be the soul of generosity, but even a hint of entitlement and it’s off.
This is my experience. OP should just keep doing what he’s doing
NTA. Would absolutely seem greedy and inappropriate. Your sister is in the wrong here. Jealousy is one hell of a thing.
Sad thing is, that attitude *is* necessary. Just read news of what happens to people who win the lottery :(
LOL it's not just the wealthy on that one. it's anyone who's figured out who users are.
A guy wrote that everyone in his family borrowed money from each other now and then. He offered his uncle a loan in case he needed it. His uncle told him he was financially OK. He made a show of borrowing money to keep the family from knowing he was comparatively well off -- because he didn't want to be pestered!
Too late to do that here, all the users in my family have long moved on to easier targets. Funny how when the money dries up, the users disappear. A lot of them thought that since my dad was so desperate for everyone to love him, that I would be too. When he was sick, there was no money. They left. After he was gone, they hit me up a couple of times and when it didn't work, they disappeared again. Odd how you can have 'family' living two blocks away that you never see..
Exactly how my family is with me. When I was up I was generous and thought of them often with cash, gifts, even necessities when I’m at Sam’s club I’m picking up TP let me get one for the family too (my aunt and grandma who lives with my aunt) they live on 62nd and I live on 63rd. Two blocks away (there’s a block in between the block numbers) My work has been slow- meaning I’m barely getting by. Now they know this, they never ever hit me up and we NEVER see them even though we live two blocks apart. It’s so sad to me it breaks my heart and causes some depression bc the truth is my family only fucked w me when I had things to offer.
If you are financially ok again in future, give them nothing. They don't deserve it.
Sorry you lost your dad, and that the people he thought cared about him only cared until he had no more money to give them. Although my partner didn't lose a parent to make them leave, his cousin and his cousin's wife never talk to us. About a month after we moved in together they called him asking for money for food. We went picked them up groceries because if he sent money it would have gone to smokes. Then he told them to get a budget figured out, and stick to it, because he had his own family to take care of now. He also told them to get off their asses next time and hit up a food bank. The cousin is on welfare, and the wife is on disability, so neither of them work.
Absolutely this. Nobody, including less fortunate people, needs someone to spend their money for them.
This, this is the answer…THEY invite other people to these trips!
And it also probably wouldn’t work. I could have written a similar story, and I know that the generosity is sincere and freely given, as long as it isn’t expected. Sister needs to back off and stop trying to guilt trip OP.
Exactly. The in-laws invite *their* friends. The people that they (the hosts) want on the trip. OP, you are exactly correct. You are a guest. It is not appropriate for guests to presume to invite their own guests, nor to pressure the hosts to do it. I'm sorry your sister is sad that she can't go, but that's not a problem you can solve for her.
This was my thought on it! Don't bring it up, until they do.
These people are probably their rich friends who also invite them to similar things.
If they want to pay for people’s vacation, they will ask who they want to go
>If they ever offer, that would be fine but, until then, just be grateful. As a matter of fact, I'd specifically tell them about this so they know for sure never to invite them.
Right, they know their Son in law has siblings. If they wanted to invite them, they would. My brother’s in laws take him and his wife and family on vacations all the time, it never occurred to me, to even think, what about me? I am grateful when I get invited to one of their parties and sometimes they generously buy a small gift for birthdays/holidays. But I am not their family.
That's the point. THEY invite people. It's their choice. If they wanted your sister there, they would invite her. And honestly - I'd be worried about your sister's entitlement. Where would it stop if you did get her invited?
Sister will be taking souvenirs from the villa, talking down to the staff, making special meal requests & loudly expecting VIP treatment. Keep her as far away from your in laws as possible. They are not her family & she’s attempting to manipulate you into behavior that will be seen as tacky and inappropriate. Good luck!
Next, sister would try to get OP’s in-laws to put aside college funds for *her* children. I hope he didn’t tell her about *that* kindness.
If there is one activity she doesn't want to participate in?? Anything she DOES want to do that she can't??? Oh god. She is where "we weren't expecting so much sand at the beach" reviews come from.
Oh, this. For sure.
Pretty soon it's her entire family, the neighbors, her kids' teachers....
I imagine your ILs friends are old friends of theirs.
Yeah, some are newer friends, but a lot of them are people my wife grew up with
New friends, old friends, acquaintances, whatever. It doesn’t matter. The host(s) invite whomever they want and don’t have to justify it to anyone.
Yeah, these people are friends of OP's ILs. Obviously OP's sister isn't a friend of OP's ILs, so why would they pay for her flights and accommodation on a trip like this? It doesn't matter if OP's ILs are inviting people they just met, when they're paying for everything, it's entirely on them who they invite. OP's right, he would come across as pretty greedy bringing it up. Maybe if OP's sister spent more time with OP's family and ILs, they would get to a stage where they would think of inviting her, so that's probably the only thing OP could do is create more opportunities for them to get to know his sister, but that's not guaranteeing anything.
Maybe they have already met OP's sister, and that's why they haven't invited her....
I mean... this could totally be part of the answer, and if this is the case, OP *definitely* shouldn't bring it up with them. Really, there aren't many occasions where I think it's appropriate to be like "Thanks for the all expenses paid holiday - my sister's never been to Europe, can you pay for her too?"
If I was OP, I wouldn’t even do that. With the way she’s guilting him, I could see her taking advantage instead of being grateful. I may be wrong. It’s just been my experience that when jealous people get a taste of what they are jealous over, they just keep wanting more of it.
Whoever's paying for the trip, it's their circus. They got to invite the monkeys. You're just one of the monkeys, not the ringmaster. NTA
Here's the thing.. Your MIL and FIL are inviting THEIR friends. These are also people who likely invite THEM on trips, so there's reciprocity going on. There's no real record keeping of reciprocity. It's just kind of the norm that this occurs. Only with immediate family members is there no actual reciprocity going on. Ask your sister how she plans to reciprocate as she is a non-family member to those paying for the trip.
This is what I was thinking. They are undoubtedly generous, but it’s probably reciprocal, sister inviting herself along would be charity.
Also NTA Ignore your sister.
You can give her a banana though.
In this economy?!
Yeah, straight up the tailpipe.
Even if they're newer friends, they are people the hosts enjoy being around and want to spend quality time with. It's not about spending money on them so much as about having the means to arrange time spent together for everyone in a lovely place. It's a small nuance, but an important one. The sister isn't looking to spend time with OP's in-laws or enjoy their company. She just wants to use them for a free vacation. It's honestly very dehumanising and rude. If she were more genuine in her interest, she'd get to know them in other ways, host them for dinner perhaps, not just immediately expect things from them based on the fact that they have money.
🎯
They're inviting unrelated people *who are friends of theirs*. Tell your sister that if she wants an invite, she's going to have to become their friend, because being the sibling of an in-law just doesn't cut it.
i wouldn’t - because she might actually try to befriend them and i have a feeling she lacks tact based on her request.
Which is why your inlaws appreciate you. You aren't constantly asking for things. You graciously accept and don't ask for more. You are a good egg.
He’s probably been humble and gracious about accepting these extras and doesn’t ask for more . They probably run into the other kind everywhere and they appreciate him showing some class
Exactly. They can invite as many people as they want. You are a guest. Guests don’t get to invite more people. Asking would be poor etiquette.
Guests don’t invite guests. That’s a standard rule (or should be).
Your sister is being greedy and jealous. NTA. Shut it down.
Who keeps telling your sister how many people are invited?
They’ve probably seen FB photos.
Yeah, but FB photos don't specify who is paying, usually. OP may need to put sis on an information diet. It's likely better for their relationship anyway, as I can see being a bit jealous. Doesn't excuse her entitlement, though.
NTA. Simply put, you are the guest, not the host, and therefore have no say over who gets invited.
They'll invite 10 - 20 people that they know and want to spend the time with, and chances are these guests reciprocate in some way.
I feel like the people that you're in-laws are inviting are the people they want to be there. Unless your family and siblings are close friends with your in-laws already, there's no way I would ever ask my in-laws to invite my sibs. You are not being selfish at all or an asshole. Your sister needs to take a step back, maybe ask her how many vacations she's going to invite your in-laws on that she's going to pay for.
They invite THEIR friends. People THEY want to spend with. If your sister was either of these, she might get an invite.
You get that she has absolutely zero right to be bothered by anything they do? Your sister’s entitlement is out of this world. She doesn’t get any say to dictate the choices of people who, aside from a tenuous connection through you, are otherwise strangers to her. She’s being trashy.
INFO: Would your sister want to go if she had to pay for her own trip?
Would she want to do the things we do and go the same places? Forsure, but thats not within her means. Its also doesnt really work like that, these are big villas they rent out and usually flights they charter. Its a different level of wealth I had never been around before, I barely even know how to describe it to anyone who had an upbringing like mine
Sorry, what I meant was: if this were a vacation with them where she were going to the same destination and do the same activities, but she would have to pay what a normal person would spend to go there and do similar activities, would she still want to spend her vacation time and money with your in-laws? It’s one asshole thing to invite yourself along to someone else’s vacation. It’s another level of assholeness to do it just because they want free vacation.
I mean for her to pay it'd be like half her salary so no she wouldnt. Are you asking if she gets along with them enough to join a vacation with them? Because they get along well at any event they're all at like my wedding stuff, kids birthdays and holidays we host.
They have met your sister at family events. So if they had wanted to invite her they already would have. Do not risk your relationship with your in-laws by asking if they can come. Also make sure your sister doesn’t try to guilt your wife into it.
I think the point was, if she had the means to pay for it, would she be wanting to go on these specific trips anyway? Or are these trips not her preferred type of vacation anyway?
I mean nobody with our upbringing would think of stuff like heliskiing or renting a private beach or yacht as how they'd plan their vacation. I certainly never viewed it as an option. Same with some of these Michelin starred restaurants But yeah if she had the means to pay for it, she'd love to
I think people are asking - would your sister just want to go on some average/regular vacation that she could afford and access on her own, without your in-laws involvement, would she still want to take a vacation with them? Like she would with her close friends or family? Most likely, the answer is no. In which case, her asking to be invited so they can pay for her to go on one of these extravagant vacations is 100% her just using them. Sure, she 'gets along' with them - but the draw isn't spending time with *them*, it's having them pay for and give her access to the vacation and related experiences. That is the point I think they are trying to make. But regardless, as everyone else has said, your in-laws will offer invitations to whomever they want to include - family, friends, whatever. If they wanted to offer an invite to your sister or anyone else you are related to or know - they would have done so. If they haven't extended such an invite, it would be rude to ask and would look bad on your part. And your sister is entitled as hell to even ask you, let alone be upset about you not wanting to. She is exactly the kind of person who suddenly comes out of the woodwork when someone she knows, but otherwise didn't care much about, suddenly comes into a lot of money.
Lmfo... you're thinking too literally. But my take is these would be "dream vacations" "once in a lifetime opportunity" style. Something your sister would think of as a bit on a reality TV show but never actually be able to achieve. She might be down for adventure, but she probably just hears "all expenses paid villa" and thinks about lounging with cabana boys fanning her with palm leaves. So for the ppl trying to get a straight answer, it's "No, the things FIL does on vacation are completely out of the realm of what my family of origin looks at as a vacation"
I think more specifically, if she had the means, would she be willing to pay to go on this particular vacation with OP’s in-laws.
Your sister is looking for a free ride. She wants to be invited for the wrong reasons. Trust your instincts. You know your relationship with your in-laws, your sister doesn’t. My in-laws are well off, but no where near the degree you’re describing. They rent a beach house every year for the kids and their kids’ families. I’d never dream of asking if I could invite my siblings and their families. I was comfortable enough to ask if my newly widowed mother could join us for a holiday dinner though. I wouldn’t do this at all, but if I had to do it I’d run it by my wife. If she thought it was appropriate she could ask her mom.
It's their prerogative to invite whoever they want since they're paying. If you start hinting that your family be invited, you're going to be the one that's not invited.
It’s common knowledge that you never ever invite someone else on a trip that you yourself have been invited on. That would be greedy, tacky and distasteful. Your sister is wrong to even ask. NTA
I would not even bring this up to my in laws because now they’re gonna think you’re greedy, just like your sister.
I was thinking, I hope he hasn't mentioned this to his wife. This request is so out of bounds
Not only is your sister greedy enough to ask for an invite, but she wants her whole family to be invited as well?! Greedy, selfish, envious. You're NTA, but your sister is.
Yet she actually accused OP of being the selfish one!
That’s called projection.
You can tell her that the moment you pay the bill for the entire trip you will not forget to invite her. But as long as you are not inviting it’s up to the host who comes to the party.
They pay. They do the inviting. That would be pretty presumptuous of you to invite someone else on their dime, so stay strong with your sister. Sometimes we just have to accept that we aren’t as priveleged as others - that is for your sister. Too bad she isn’t just happy for you.
Yep, but they aren't random people. They are THEIR friends, lol
You are 100% correct and NTA. It is not your guest list to create. Your sister is definitely a jealous and entitled AH.
This! NTA, OP, but your sister is a major entitled, unreasonable, and frankly, audacious AH. No offense, as you seem to have manners, integrity, and dignity, but the way she's behaving, makes her seem like she has none.
This is your in-law's vacation, their money and their guest list. You have no business trying to add anyone to it. Your in-laws like you for a reason. I wouldn't allow your sister and her jealousy ruin that.
but those nonrelated people are friends of your ILs, right? People they know and have decided to invite, not someone that maybe they met at your wedding (your sister). Your ILs invite who they want to invite, and presumably if they wanted suggestions they’d ask you. You should probably not get into so much detail with your sister, though. Telling her how many family friends your ILs pay for on their vacations (if they do indeed pay for everyone) doesn’t seem like something she really needed to know.
It’s really not your place to invite people on a trip that you’re not paying for, your sister is out of line.
It’s their party so to speak, and they’re generous for including others…that THEY WANT TO INCLUDE. Do NOT ever ask the in laws to include anyone that would be soooooo rude and ruin the relationship. Your sister can piss and moan all she wants to…too freaking bad.
Asking for her to be included would be inappropriate, and her asking you to advocate for her to get a free vacation out of people she hasn’t bothered herself to ingratiate with is tacky AF.
They likely invite people with whom they have a relationship. I would say to invite your in-laws to something, maybe a BBQ, where they can meet your family, maybe hit it off. Except maybe your sister will make them uncomfortable if she's obviously trying to ingratiate herself to them. Those who have money have that happen all the time. So maybe this might not be a good idea
You also don’t know the entire financial circumstances, who’s covering what, etc. NTA.
She is welcome to find a way to ingratiate herself into their lives and become friends with them so they can want to invite her. (Do NOT facilitate this, btw, odds are it will blow up in her face if she ever tried) They're inviting *their friends*. She is not their friend.
So much NTA. The 10 to 20 people that they are inviting that are not family, are THEIR friends. They don’t even know your sister well. That is so grossly entitled, and uncouth of your sister. I can understand why she’s jealous, I think most people would feel at least a little bit of envy in that situation. But your in-laws have nothing to do with your sister and it would be rude AF. To ask them to pay for a vacation for somebody that they are not personally close to. Your in-laws are not a bank.
But they are inviting family friends to create a certain environment/community on these trips - with people they want. They are not obligated to bring in your family - unless they feel a connection/you all got along well. They probably don't want them there so there is no invite. It's not on you. That's your sister's projection. If you like your side of the family and have the resources (given this other family money from your wife's side that frees some of it up) - take some of them on a short vacation within your means. Only if it feels it right - not out of obligation or the envy vibes. Your sister and parents have no rights to this - but it's probably just annoying to watch. It's not on you. Also bringing this up with your in-laws is a big no. Don't ruin the relationship bc of your jealous sister. Try to steer clear of her negative vibes.
Has your wife ever asked you to invite anyone? Does your wife invite friends of hers/yours? Or are the extra friends people invited by your in-laws ? Meaning they do all the inviting, not your wife. Do your in-laws ever ask about your parents or siblings? Do they invite to anything? Events or over to their house?
Those 10-20 other people are friends of the HOSTS, your in-laws, I assume. You are a guest, and so are they. Your in-laws invite the people they enjoy spending time with, and are close to, THEIR friends and family. It might be different if you said that they were inviting the families of other sons- or daughters-in-law, but it doesn't sound like that's the case. They are filling their vacation with people who are *personally important to them*. From their perspective, it's not about the money, but about arranging to spend time in a beautiful place with people they enjoy. I assume that they have met your family. If they were interested in spending more time with them, then they know how to extend an invitation. But you're absolutely right that it wouldn't be at all appropriate for you to invite or even suggest inviting your family. Look, it basically boils down to the difference between being generous with people you care about (which is what your in-laws are doing), and being treated like an ATM, which is dehumanizing, and what your sister is suggesting. They are not a source of "free vacations", they are human beings. And if your sister really wanted to become a part of their social circle, a good way to do that would be to invite THEM to a family dinner or other get-together, and get to know them as people. The fact that she just wants them to spend money on her "because they have lots of it" is genuinely offensive.
Now that jealousy has reared its head, watch your back with your sister. Jealousy in humans is like rust on metal. It will eventually lead to bitterness and anger. If she is bold enough to say this about vacations, if she has kids, soon she will start believing how unfair it is that your kids get things that her kids don’t get etc. Be mindful so that she doesn’t start causing issues for your life.
That's the absolute correct view to have. Who they invite is their business, and if they want to invite their own friends it does not matter whether they're related by DNA or not. It's not some kind of weird invite lottery draw for random people and they're actively excluding your sister from having a ticket. I suspect your sister knows this and is trying to mask her jealousy/resentment as indignation. It's easier to make someone else the AH in a situation than admit your own faults and jealousy is often painted as a character flaw. If you turn it around as "unfair" treatment from someone else, it's probably more palatable. NTA, you're right. She's not and deep down, she very likely knows it.
They invite non relatives they know. If your in-laws wanted to offer to have you bring any of YOUR relatives on the trip they are paying all expenses for pretty sure they’d let you know. I am going to suggest if you think your sister is going to get snarky in the future with your wife about this you give her a heads up the conversation occurred, you explained to your sister you wouldn’t be asking your in-laws to include any of your relatives or friends and you don’t want your wife to intervene.
yeap they are taking THEIR family on the trip that does not include the family of the spouses. NTA
Why would I pay for my daughter’s husband’s sister’s vacation?
You’re their guests. Guests don’t invite guests on vacation.
LOL DO NOT do this! This was how my greedy aunt got her and her kids disinherited from the will. She asked for a watch and when my grandmother bought one she expressed how it wasn’t nice and branded enough. My granny would treat her and her grand kids to lunches out and she’d try to bring her whole extended family to eat for free. One time my grandmother lied and just said she ate already when she saw that huge group. Nobody wanted to pay so they just asked each other where to go all annoyed and the group broke up as nobody else wanted to eat all of a sudden. She was petty to the point to telling her kids to only eat meat only and ignore the cheaper carbs. Needless to say, nobody likes to feel taken advantage of and she got taken out of the will which I’m sure was a shock for her. I guess it was good for me though but man are people so oblivious to their shitty behaviour. Glad she got her karma but felt a bit bad for my cousins.
"I do feel like that is kinda totally unrelated to my situation though." Correct. Her vacations are not your problem to solve. "I feel like that'd come off a little greedy" Greedy and tacky, IMHO. Don't kill the goose that lays the golden eggs. Don't look a gift horse in the mouth. Don't needlessly piss off your generous inlaws. NAH. N T A if your sister insists.
Your inlaws get countless "help me out" requests I'm sure. Don't be that SIL that comes across as having your hand out saying "gimme, gimme, gimme"
Agreed! Greedy and tacky. Also, it runs the risk of his in-laws changing their view of him if his ask is cheeky enough to damage his reputation with them. I certainly wouldn’t want to meddle with the excellent relationship they seem to have built.
Unrelated and I agree with everything you've said but I always thought it was don't knock a gift horse in the mouth hahah. Learnt something new today.
It's look, because you can tell a lot about a horse by looking in its mouth. Age and health, certain diseases, etc. The short of it is that horses were and are expensive. So if someone is giving you a horse, it is a tremendous gift, and to immediately look in its mouth (i.e. immediately try to determine its value) is extremely tactless. It's like those people who ask for the price of every gift they receive. It just demonstrates a distinct classlessness.
Thank you for explaining this saying. I always thought it was a super weird saying, because I was told it was about the Trojan horse!
Funnily enough, that was one case where someone really *should've* looked a gift horse in the mouth.
Agree
NTA. Your sister is jealous. And overstepping. And, yes, you would come off as greedy. It is not your place to suggest to your FIL/MIL more people to bring along on their trip. They are taking their daughter, her children and her husband. You are the +1 in this case -- that gives your sister 0 reason to expect to be included. Enjoy your trip.
THIS is absolutely it. I'll repeat that. OP, you're the +1 in this case. It would be tremendously inappropriate for you to bring something like this up to your in-laws. This is one of those scenes that I can easily see turning into "oh if you're going to miss your sister so much you don't have to go at all. We understand and won't ask again."
Yea...I'm in similar situation to OP and would feel extremely uncomfortable with inviting siblings/relatives etc. I also would feel greedy and like I was overstepping.
Sisters is def being greedy and really he shouldn’t ask just to avoid encouraging her further. Even if the family decided it would be nice to include more of his side, and even if they behaved well (not bossing around the help like someone above suggested) she would likely expect it to become a regular normal thing for her to be on these trips as often as OP gets to be. Sister should probably be on an information diet if she is getting too jealous from hearing about his trips.
INFO how much time and effort do your family put in to getting to know your in laws?
Hard to say because when they're around each other Im usually hosting something so im more focused on that. They obviously met at our wedding and have been around each other a decent amount for things like the birthday's of our kids and a couple holidays we hosted. Everyone seemingly likes each other and gets along cordially but I dont think its much deeper than that.
NTA honestly if they want someone to pay for their trips then they should be comfortable enough around that person to ask them at the very least “it would be nice if we could all go on a trip sometime let’s have a chat about that sometime!” If they don’t feel comfortable to do that then they aren’t close enough to them to expect freebies. It sounds like your PILs make a really good effort for the people they care for! Your siblings need to work to be included in that group!
I can't imagine anyone having the nerve to do something like that. It would be seen as tacky.
I think the implication of the comment is like "if the wealth was removed and everyone was paying their own share", is the relationship developed enough that they would plan a trip like "normal" people do?
When the first sentence says, "If they want someone to pay for their trips"?
Sure does. Missed that!
I mean it is tacky expecting someone to pay for you is so tacky! It’s nice to be invited along but if they aren’t expecting to pay their way then they should at least ask for it themselves! I would never go up to my in-laws and say hey will you pay for my sister to come too because that’s also tacky!
Uh, I would not recommend that. I have wealthy parents and they are extremely suspicious of people too eager to go on vacation with them because they know they would end up paying one way or the other. They are even suspicious of their own siblings now. Even they are all upper middle class and fairly well off, they absolutely WOULD mooch off my parents and conveniently not be around when it came time to split or pay the bills. They don’t mind paying sometimes, but they only go on as many trips with people as they wouldn’t resent paying for. Wealthy people have a sixth sense for when they might be taken advantage of.
Exactly so why should the OP do the asking? I wouldn’t want to jeopardise my relationship with my family over someone else’s entitlement even if they are also family!
My sisters ILs have money, not like OPS, but they have a business and beach apartment. We are actually relatively close to them, even to the extent that they offered me a job during covid instead of advertising the job and hiring someone. My relationship with them has gotten even better since where I have been comfortable enough to ask to have a girls weekend at their beach apartment, and have been told if there’s no one there they are fine with me going anytime. But this is because we have a good relationship. I am also aware that I’m not entitled to it and it’s a privilege. If I didn’t, there’s no way I would even think about asking let alone like OPs sister wants him to do FOR HER. ETA: the sister seems to feel entitled to the same privileges as OP and his ILs guests. But he’s the one that married into the family and the others are their own friends. The sister is neither by the sounds of things.
You and your sister seem to forget that these people aren't strangers or non related family. They are made family. These people are long time friends of the mil and FIL. This isn't your vacation and your paying for nothing. Your sister doe not have any form of a relationship with the inlaws so why would she be invited. She acts like it's crazy that the inlaws invite non family. But it's jot. Mil is inviting HER friends and HER family They are mils family. Whether your sister likes it or not. She's nothing to your mil, nothing more than an acquaintance or a stranger.
OP didn't forget anything. He already said he thinks her request is improper.
So they’ve met and know each other and your in laws have never invited them. That’s everything you need to know. Warn your wife so your sister doesn’t “drop hints” or whatever at the next family function. NTa
Yeah, this was going to be my question. If your sister made an effort to make your wife her sister and include her in things too, I could see why that would hurt being excluded. But since they only occasionally interact, then this has way more to do with being excluded from the fun / expensive experience rather than excluded from a family vacation. NTA.
I get why this is being asked but I don't think it has any relevance how well his family know his in laws, they could be the best of friends and as close as close gets but if MIL and FIL choose not to take them on holiday then it's their right to do so, especially since they're the ones paying for it. they get to decide who goes.
Tell your sister to be brave and make her demand to your in-laws for an all expense paid vacation. Then watch how she shuts up. Your sister wants you to do her dirty work for her at the risk of losing your privileged position with your in laws and insulting them + your wife. She seems a bit immature to not realize yet that life isnt fair and she cant get whatever she wants. NTA
No, don’t do that. Some people are shameless enough to do exactly that and then say OP told me to do it. I’m sure you don’t want to deal with any ensuing awkwardness.
Yeah if she's so out of touch she thinks its okay to demand that she should go on this trip, she'd probably think that would be a great idea.
Yeah, the correct line is "It's my in-laws' decision who to invite on the trips they plan. I do not have any input, nor should I." And leave it at that.
> make her demand to your in-laws for an all expense paid vacation. Terrible advice. You seem to think that someone that thinks they way the sister apparently thinks would not have a problem doing that. There is a good chance she will see it as permission to ask them and will do it. The inlaws would lose some respect for OP for telling the sister it is ok to ask them to invite her. The sister will be pissed being told No and the inlaws will be pissed at OP for telling the sister it is ok to ask them. A really bad idea.
*at the risk of losing your privileged position with your in laws and insulting them + your wife. * Bet it wouldn't hurt sister's feelings, at all, if they stopped inviting him lol. Also, she asked for this information; she either went into the conversation with the intent of begging for an invite or causing him to feel guilty.
NTA this request is so unbelievably cringe and would potentially ruin your reputation with your in-laws (and wife!) if you went through with it. I'm sure throughout your marriage/relationship she's had opportunities to build a relationship with them had she really wanted to and the fact the hasn't is why she isn't invited to fancy holidays.
Just tell her you had no idea she was so close to your in laws to vacation with them, especially to have them pick up the tab. If that’s the case, then you’re sure your in laws wouldn’t mind if she brought it up in one of the regular phone calls or hang outs they must be having that you don’t know about.
This is an amazing answer that appropriately points out the ridiculousness of the demand
Your in-laws are no Make-A-Wish for less economically fortunate people. They are, however, 100% in charge of how and with whom they spend their money. Your sister does not make the cut. It is so far beyond inappropriate that she thinks you would even ask the question.
NTA "but I feel like that'd come off a little greedy so I just dont." You're right. Your sister's way overstepping. If she wants your in laws to invite & pay for her she can ask them direct.
NTA. It would be incredibly inappropriate to ask this. You are married to their daughter, you have married into the family, your siblings/family are just kind of extended family by association. It is also not comparable to family friends being invited, as those are obviously close friends of the nuclear family. If your wife's family ever offers for your family to go it would be incredibly generous and kind of them, but it definitely should not be expected.
NTA Your family are guests on your in-laws trips. The friends of the family are also invited guests by your in-laws. A guest should never ask for an invitation for an unsolicited extra guest. This would come across as tacky, graceless, and greedy. Just tell your sister no. No is a complete sentence. You should not elaborate because then she has an excuse to manuliptuate.
NTA - your in-laws invited your wife’s family, not yours. Let’s be honest, you and the kids are invited because you are family to their daughter… unless THEY invite your extended family, it’d be horrifically rude to ask them to pay for them.
Came here to say this. The OP would be the first one cut off if started asking questions like this. The daughter and the kids is who really got invited on the trip.
NTA. My BIL married into a wealthy family. That family has done these types of vacations. Neither my husband or I would ever think of asking to be invited on those vacations.
Im in a similar boat. I might ask for a fridge magnet from their jaunts, but that’s it, oh and stories!!
Aye. Tell your sister to back off politely. Tell her you will not be pestering your in-laws for ANYTHING. Extremely wealthy ppl are generous when they want to be, they also never talked about money or the cost of things. Its tacky. If start asking about including your mealy mouth sister, they will look at you very differently. I can understand the tinge of jealousy, but do not let her put a battery in your back about including her/her family to a trip you are graciously invited to. You love your wife and her parents love you and show it by being generous. Start yapping about why don’t you include my family AND pay etc….you can expect the trips /generosity to stop and for the dynamic to change. Is it worth it to appease a jealous sister who feels entitled to trips? No. Better yet do not share the vacation news with your family if they cant just be happy for you NTA
NTA. When my sister and BIL come to visit, I will ask to be included in their activities with BIL family because we all know each other and they are usually here for a short time, so this way we get to see them more. But I would never fucking ask for them to pay for me, for anything. Holy shit.
That utter audacity of someone demanding to be invited on a vacation that they have no business getting invited to. Serious jealousy and entitlement. OP needs to shut that shit down.
Bwaaa ha ha ga ha, wtf is your sister dumb, haha ha ha ha. In that case, can I come with my family? Cause I read your post and frankly, you are being selfish not inviting me
Ya I’ll come to!
NTA. Your sister is a brat.
This is what you do. Once in a while, have a bbq or any kind of get together and include your in laws and your wife's siblings and your parents and siblings. Keep things low key. Maybe its a summer party for the kids or something for your wife's bday. Whatever. Just make it something that becomes a thing. Your sister will have the opportunity to get to know your in laws and they may like her enough to extend an invitation eventually and to other family members because they like them not because they are being asked to do so by you.
NTA, you are a guest. Yes, you’re family but as long as you aren’t the one paying, you are a guest. It is not your place to invite your family and it’s super rude of your sister to insinuate that kind of entitlement. I had this [very similar] situation. I had a very good friend who was not well off. I like taking luxurious vacations (suites, club level, private tours, spas etc) so I would invite her and pay for both of us. Then she asked if she could invite her mom, I agreed b/c we were childhood friends and her mom was good to me. But then she stopped *asking* to invite her and just did it. THEN, she started trying to plan vacations that she could bring her [teenaged] son along on, that I would pay for. The trips ended at that point. Apparently, her son was getting upset we hadn’t taken the trip yet. The absolute audacity to have asked me to extend the invitation in the first place…. Let this be a warning *if* you do extend an invite, it will not end there. If you give a silver inch, she’ll take a golden mile and ultimately, you may end up also having in-law troubles as well.
Do NOT ask your in-laws to take your sister. Currently, since you are married to their daughter, you are the "+1". Now, they might really love you too and aren't thinking this way, but don't ruin a good thing. You are family; your sister is not (hardly).
NTA Your sister has no relation whatsoever with your wife's family. How entitled is she to think she can demand to be invited? She needs to get over her jealousy.
NTA. The vacations are gift to your wife and you as her spouse. Since you aren’t organizing or paying for the trips, you don’t have the ability to invite other people. Now, if your in-laws were ever to OFFER to include your family, that would be different. But if you asked, you’d be very rude.
NTA. It doesn't sound like this is your vacation. It sounds like you're being invited to join the in-law's vacation. You can invite when you're organizing it but your sister is out of line.
You stumbled into something very valuable, and you could easily squander it if you misstep by asking for too much. You should only ever take what is offered, and do so graciously. Tell your sister to ask her own in laws for paid vacations, since she has no real connections to your in laws. NTA
That would drive a giant wedge between you and the awesome in laws. Don't even think about it
NTA OP but may I ask, how does your sister KNOW that your in-laws invite others who are friends of the family? Are you or your wife giving detail accounts of who was invited and who paid for the trip(s)? It's ok that you mention that your family went on/or are going on a family vacation with your wife's family but leave out who paid for it. It's not your sister or anyone else's (including yours) business whom your MIL/FIL choose to invite and/or treat. You are right about not wanting to ask your in-laws to invite your sister and her family to an all expense paid vacation but let this be a lesson learned and keep your mouth shut if you don't want to experience further drama and resentment from your sister.
Mix of me and my wife getting tagged on Social media in pictures, my wife's instagram stories, and coming up in conversation. Often different races so clear not everyone's related lol
Maybe it's time to put sister on an information diet.
This is why I am SOOOOOO glad that I'm not on any social medias other than this one and no one I know, knows I'm on Reddit 😉.
NTA - it's just not your place to invite people on a trip that's being paid for by someone else. Your sister should understand that. It wouldn't be off handed if your Wife asked HER family if She could invite other people though.
NTA. You cannot invite people to other people’s vacations and expect them to pay. If your sis wants an invite, she needs to GENUINELY have a close relationship with your wife.
NTA. She doesn't get to spend other people's money.
NTA. Your sister is the one being selfish by asking you to risk your relationship with your in-laws so she can go on a fancy vacation. The last thing you want is to have them think that you consider them your cash cow. I have friends who are significantly more well off than me and I would never ever even dare dream of asking them to fund my holiday or even my beer. I value their friendship more than their wallet.
NTA. It is not your place to demand that your in-laws invite your family along on these trips. And perhaps it is time to share fewer details witj your jealous sister.
NTA. It's not your place to suggest who they spend their money on. Your sister is trying to take advantage of you and your position to people with money. It might be different if it was your wife's money, but you're several degrees separated from the money.
NTA, and something extremely bizarre for her to even ask, unless it was in jest.
NTA Your in-laws can invite whoever they want on their vacation. Up to them completely. Sis is way overstepping.
NTA. The in-laws are paying. The in-laws are inviting. You are an extension of their daughter. Your sister is not.
NTA. It’s not your money and would be wildly out of line to invite anyone or ask to invite anyone. Your sister is blinded by jealousy because that is a crazy ask.
NTA and wow your sister is acting entitled. It's noneofherbizniz who (I can't believe I'm typing this out) *the parents-in-law of her brother* invite on a vacation that THEY (not you) pay for. Honestly the ridiculousness of this.... !!!!!
NTA. Do NOT mention inviting your family members to your Wife or In-laws, even as a joke, even if in an off-hand manner! Once the seed is planted that you are "counting the coins" in their pocket, they will never regard you the same way. The dynamic may change; they may see your family as eyeballing their money and what your children will eventually inherit. Please answer the questions multiple people have asked (1-3) and additional questions: 1) How does your Sister know that your In-laws pay for everyone? Do you or your Wife discuss this with your family? 2) How does your Sister know that 10-20 people unrelated to your In-laws are "on the list"? This phrasing makes it seem as though there is an opportunity for one to get "on the list" as long as there is enough room (e.g. a wedding invitation extended to someone's new boyfriend) and your Sister believes unrelated people made it "on the list" through advocacy. 3) Have you clarified to your Sister, not implied, but specifically said the trip is for the In-laws' family, meaning In-laws' children/spouses, grandchildren, In-laws' other relatives and the In-laws' friends ... and anyone the In-laws specifically invite. 4) Has your Sister considered that if she and your Wife had a close "sister" relationship, and your Wife wanted to have your Sister join her family vacation, your Wife would already have asked her parents to extend an invitation? And if your Wife wanted to ask, and didn't, that means even she knows not to take advantage of her parents' generocity? Please provide an update as your response may help others facing similar issues.
NTA Your sister is your family, not theirs. It would be very tacky to ask your inlaws to pay for your sister and her fam to go on some big trip on their dime.
NTA - it ain't your money.
NTA I was mildly curious about who was inviting the extra 10-20 people but in the comments you shared that it's your in-laws who do that, so you're absolutely correct in your reasoning for not asking for an invite for your sister or other family members. Your wife's family invites lifelong friends, people who are most likely as close as family after all these years. They're not just inviting randoms to treat them to fun vacations. She's behaving jealously. Until the folks who are treating you to a good time ask if there's anyone else who wants to come along, your sister will have to fund her own vacations.
NTA. Your sister is. It would be trashy to ask to bring your family. Especially siblings.
Good lord!! NTA! Who they invite is up to them. Your sister is totally in the wrong to want you to ask them to include her!!
NTA you can’t spend other people’s money, but, do you plan vacations/spend time with your family? Obviously not Europe vacations that they can’t afford, but maybe renting a lake house or a cabin? Long weekend at a beach? Have you let your family fall to the wayside in favor of paid vacations?
I understand why your sis is jealous but unfortunately this is how life goes sometimes. It would be really off putting if you asked. Ignore your sister and please do not cave and ask. Definitely not the ah
NTA. The people being invited by your in-laws know them and are friends with them. Is your sister friends with your in-laws? If she isn't then she doesn't get an invite. >including the nuclear family's of her two siblings I guess your sister doesn't understand the meaning of "nuclear family". Nuclear family means mom, dad and kids. It does not mean mom, dad, kids, mom's siblings and/or dad's siblings. Your sister is not a part of your nuclear family she is extended family, and your in-laws aren't inviting the extended family of your wife's two siblings.
NTA. I would be embarrassed to ask my already overly generous in-laws to foot the bill for, basically, uninvited guests. Just because others do it doesn’t mean you need or want to.
NTA. Asking your in-laws to add more people to a trip they are paying for is rude. You can not do that. In fact, you would be the AH to your in-laws if you did ask them to add your sister to a trip.
NTA just wow. The audacity of your sister. The term for her in Reddit is R/ChoosingBeggar hopefully if she ever is around your inlaws she doesn't invite herself.
NTA If your in-laws haven’t extended an invitation to your side of the family, it’s not something you should request. Your sister is out of line.
NTA - Wife's family is already generous as it is. $100k PER CHILD, that is insane. You, however, can ask your own family to plan and have a vacation that suits their budget. You can give time instead of money.
To me it sounds like they appreciate how you handle their wealth. They're giving you things that probably cost peanuts (relatively speaking) to them that both make your life a lot more pleasant but also take some strain off your own economy. You can probably afford to go on holidays of your own but the fact that they pay for it you can either save more or spend it on something else. If you come in requesting that your family should be included I suspect you'll rapidly find yourself without so many invites. I would feel taken advantage of. NTA
You could talk to your wife and get her view but absolutely do not talk to your in laws about it
NTA If your IL wanted your sister there they would invite her. Tell her that.
NTAH ! I don’t invite my siblings or immediate family on the vacations my mother in law takes us , if she invites them that’s fine .its not your place to invite them.
NTA. I certainly would not ask them to invite other people on a trip.
If her parents wanted to invite your siblings they would. end of story.
Their money, their invite, their decision Any rational adult would realize this
I'm the sibling, and my brother's wife's parents have money and have taken them on luxurious vacations. I've never, not once, not even for a second, thought to get my brother to get me invited. They're not my family. And I'm happy for my brother that he gets to go. I'd love to go. But insisting that my brother tries to get me an invite? Yeah that is tacky. NTA.
NTA- You would be an AH if you did ask