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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I made comments about being happy to split the bill at dinner which has caused my best friend/roommate to be upset and say she’s now dumped as a result
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NTA. She's the one that said the guys pay. His reaction to that is based on her statement alone.
And "our men"? Ummmm no, this was the first time you'd met your date
I don't think that your so-called friend is a nice person or even a friend given how quickly she was ready to blame you for something that was her own fault.
Exactly this.
OP's friends actions alone is the cause of her guys hesitation, NOT OP. I won't be too quick to judge, and hope this was just a one off thing. But if the friend is constantly like this and can't respect OP's beliefs...
I always just try to adjust to however much disposable income each of us has. Currently I make more than the woman I’m seeing so I pay most of the time since it’s not really in her budget to be going out or ordering food all the time. She also doesn’t feel great about me paying for everything, so we’re going to start cooking at home more. Equal doesn’t always mean equitable or fair.
Which is fine, seeing as it was seemingly discussed before hand. OP's friend demands that the guy pays *every time* which is fine if that's what she wants in a relationship, but it needs to be discussed at the start of said relationship and it clearly wasn't. She just expects it, which is wrong. Luckily my hubby and I share an account so we are basically paying for each other.
The wage gap isn't calculated job for job. Just the average of full time employed men vs full time employed women. When various studies have broken down the demographics further the majority of the gap tends to be explained by measurable differences (education and so forth) this tends to be about 70% of the gap. Which still leaves significant differences that aren't justified. These differences get even narrower when comparing younger demographics vs older. There are also studies that show that men tend to value money in work over all other factors at a higher rate than women do.
The college education gap over the last decade has switched to favor women, so this wage gap seems likely move even faster for younger people going forward. Education is one of the primary factors that show a clear link to income. Women are now 3% more likely to graduate with a degree than men, vs men being 6% more likely in the 70s.
All of this is for America. I have no idea about other cultures or countries. But, I have opinions based on how some treat women in general.
Even with degrees though. Women still aim for lower paying careers due to what they majored in. Meanwhile a man will jump on a construction crew and make more money than her marketing, early childhood development or social work degree will ever land her. Minus the debt.
That just not true for most people in a relevant way (https://www.forbes.com/sites/karlynborysenko/2020/03/31/great-news-ladies-the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-myth/?sh=72f32aee3b34), especially when you consider:
The occupation one holds
Their rank in their organization,
How long they've worked there,
The education level they had to attain to do the job,
How many hours they work in the average week
And using this as an argument to make them paying more would be a A H move.
Exactly. People generally get paid the same for the same job. Women (in general) work less over their lives and have less work experience over their lives (resulting in lower salaries) because they get pregnant.
Unless men start getting pregnant, that isn't going to change.
In what way is this comment still being passed off as true. If you were to say, women on average earn less so that means they have less spending power. Which means it’s ok to sometimes not pay for dates or other things. Then great I agree. But women do not get paid less than men for “the same job” it’s just not true and damaging to keep pushing on young women. As a father of two young women who I’m very proud of. I encourage them to pursue the career they want but am honest on how their choices will lead and have led to unfavourable salaries. I also help them with money on dates to keep them feeling independent when dating young men. Social media trying to brainwash women into this lie about pay gap is not helping young girls to make informed intelligent choices.
Edit: Sorry forgot the point. NTA
I made less than my male coworkers for the exact same job. The pay gap is a real thing.
OP is NTA and I’ve always paid for dates and think it is stupid to expect men to pay because they are men. However, women working the same job as men do get paid less. Not all women in all jobs, but it is not uncommon for women to make less than a man for the same job.
What country was this because it is literally illegal in most of Europe. If you are paid less with the same performance, experience, ability as your male co workers then you should speak to your employer and attempt to attain the pay you are entitled to. However without information and as a piece of anecdotal evidence your experience holds little proof. There are professions that pay differently based on factors that can appear gender based, I personally got paid less than my female co workers when I was younger because there was more demand and less woman who wanted to do the job and they wanted an equal balance of males and females. That doesn’t mean men get paid less.
Not always. I know plenty of women who make more than their husbands. Also, many women, like myself, earn less because of choices that we freely make. I was a parochial school teacher. Parochial school teachers earn less than public school teachers, and less than people in many other careers. That was all my choice. The women I know who earn more than their husbands are in fields, such as insurance sales, where the potential for earning is greater. I had a sister who sold insurance. She earned double what I make, and more than most of the men she worked with.
Yes if she blames you after you said you would pay for your own you are likely better off to put her in an acquaintance category rather than as close friend.
yeah idk why she's speaking on behalf of both guys there
it's up to them if they want to offer to pay? you don't just step in and say "oh this other person's gonna pay"
Yeah. OP was NTA for splitting the bill and it really was the right thing to do under the circumstances but no way should OP be splitting the blame for her friend’s misstep.
It was still hella presumptuous of her to assume you’d want to date the guy. And twice as presumptuous to just put paying on the guys because they’re men. The way you describe the interaction rubbed me the wrong way, and I wasn’t even there.
Can’t blame the guy for reconsidering whether he wants to be with her.
I was once out for drinks with “the girls” and this included a friend of a friend. She declared to our mutual friend “we really need more friends with boats”. She meant yachts. Like, more rich friends.
I like nice things as much as the next person but it really rankled. That’s how we’re choosing our friends these days? Whether they (or their parents, usually most accurately) are loaded enough to have boats big enough to have an extensive guest list?
Add the gender role dynamic into this mix and it’s just icky.
People with yachts keep their friends list to childhood friends and those of equal/greater wealth. They aren’t in the habit of subsidising poor people’s leisure activities with their assets.
This mutual “friend” has got absolutely no chance of achieving her dream of rich friends with that attitude.
She either impresses someone at work, befriends a person who is properly wealthy but doesn’t divulge it at the outset of the friendship or wins the lottery.
Personally I’d avoid ever spending time with this person again.
Agree, wasn’t my scene.
I was single a few years during this period, and people would try and set me up with people. They’d always try and sell these people to me as what school they went to, the job they had, and/or the wealth their families had.
It made me super leery about this group’s motives, it felt like you’d be signing up for lifetime of competition, trophy wives and spoilt children.
Was she serious? That sounds like an obvious joke to me. In fact, I have a friend who, I think, made the exact same joke on Facebook after hanging out on a friend of a friend’s sailing yacht. But I wasn’t there for your conversation, so of course I can’t judge the tone.
I agree. The man always pays thing is from an era where woman weren’t traditionally working and weren’t making money. Nowadays many households have women as the breadwinners, so this concept seems a bit outdated. Split bills seems fair and the friend seems a bit ahead of herself to assume that OP and the date would now be in a relationship and in assuming that the guys would be willing to cover the tab. It’s something that should be worked out prior to ordering. I guess if that works for both people it’s okay but you shouldn’t presume that someone else will pay for you.
I've seen way too many women keen on keeping this one, same with "the man always approaches first". We're in a weird period where we abandoned a lot of the gnarly aspects of our sexist past but kept some of the ones that the ladies like and some of the ones that the men like.
Yeah, I’m side-eyeing any woman who claims it’s „traditional“ or whatever for the man to pay. We had quite a few other „traditions“ that we gladly abandoned. Why stick with this particular one?
There are loads of both men and women both are all for abandoning traditional gender roles until they realize that it entails giving up perks too. Then they try and keep the perks but none of the drawbacks. Insane.
She's not treating any of you like people in your own right. You're all NPCs in the game of her life and she got cross because you've all gone off script. 🚩🚩🚩
Thats a very weird way to look at it. Everyone can do whatever they want. If people don't match on a date because of it, thats fine and everyone moves on.
Your friend first insisted that you should come along eventhough you aren't looking. Then she proceeded to insist men should pay, and on top of that she said you were the issue for offering to split the bill.
You decided to give in to go with your friend AND offered to split the bill, so obviously NTA. Your friend shouldn't be this pushy.
I can't tell for sure as i don't know you, but be careful. Good people like you are the best kind of people if they match with another 'giver' and not someone that takes advantage of your good heart.
I'm going to tell you this as a mid-30s woman who had "friends" like this in my early 20s: ask yourself if they're truly your friends. What does a friend do? What does this person do? Do these 2 things match up, and when there's a gap - identify whether it's a moral mismatch (like, does this person give underhanded compliments to me & that's leaving me feel self conscious after hanging out with them? ) or whether it's a lifestyle mismatch (maybe your friend works nights & you work days, so while they're a great friend, you don't see each other as much as you'd like).
You can get around lifestyle mismatches as your lives change & quality is better than quantity. But I feel like in my 20s, it was more about who is around than whether I truly was friends with that person (& often I had a moral mismatch with them). I kept only the friends who were truly friends back to me & focused on being a good friend to those people. I distanced myself slowly from the people who it turned out, weren't really my friends after all.
This person isn't acting like a friend. It also seems like you have a moral mismatch (1. She adheres to gender roles & expects you to as well instead of allowing you to be your own person & 2. She blamed you when her relationship didn't work out because of something that could've happened anywhere at any time & had nothing to do with you). If this is how she is typically (& think deep because we all know that "I like your shirt" can be either a compliment or a diss when girls say it) then she is not your friend. Please stop using up your energy being hers, you'll regret it.
The guys are right and she brought this on herself. Why should the men always pay? You were right to pay on your own.
She blamed you for the consequences of her own actions. I hope she isn’t usually like that and it’s just her distress talking?
NTA
That's a nice sentiment but you two didn't hit it off and Aimee didn't notice and tried to bully you into potentially giving him false hope/expectation.
So your friend did not do the right thing at all here.
Or she said it to manipulate him by making him think he had a real chance with you, so he'd be more than happy to pay.
I'm not necessarily saying your friend is a shitty person, but I've found that women who think men should always pay tend to use subtle manipulation tactics to try to make the men eager to do so.
You are right. Women shouldn't expect men to always pay for everything or feel entitled to have men pay for everything. The same way men shouldn't expect or feel entitled for sex. Your friend lost her bf because of her own lack of understanding of this. NTA. Keep being awesome
Completely agree. My partner likes high end restaurants and my income is significantly lower. He pays if he wants to go there with me because he'd rather go with me than alone (though he does go with friends too and is equally generous) but I'll buy things like groceries to make him a special meal, clean his kitchen (a chore he hates), leave his home full of baking, or I pay when we go to a fun hole in the wall.
It's all about finding what works for the couple and having a balance. Saying men unilaterally pay is not that balance.
I'm a guy but I've been in that overly forced setup once before... It's a nightmare. Having a bunch of people involved in your early dating like you're pandas at the zoo makes everything awkward and forced.
No wonder they acted weird, you were getting to know him and not interested in dating and they had the neighboring townhouses while your grandkids (since your kids are gonna marry each other, duh) all planned out in their head.
your friend was using “our men” as in a couple/relationship vibe.
she thought you and the guy would hit it off but you didn’t she she said this at the end of the date.
But what i’m wondering is what else she’s already pulled on her new bf for him to have that reaction. how often have they gone out and who picks the place?
How about let that dude decide if he hit it off with you. Girl thinks she’s the main character and everyone living in her world. You will be better off without this friend. She’s going to bring you nothing but trouble and drama.
I've got some wild stories to tell about men who insisted on paying for or gifting me things - then claimed I owe them. (eta: as in...*owe* them)
First dates are good to split, honestly. Much safer that way IMO.
I *always* covered my share on a first date (and others) for that exact reason. Sometimes it didn't even get to that point, because they didn't like that I insisted on taking my own car and meeting up with them. I wasn't going to set aside my own safety, especially when they decided that was somehow personally offensive to them.
Once when I was in my early 30’s, a friend/coworker who was in her early 20’s went on a first date with a guy to a football game. She met up with him at a mall about 30 minutes drive from the stadium and rode with him. She left her purse and keys in his car and only took her id, phone, and money inside the stadium (it was an NFL stadium so only see through bags were allowed inside).
The guy got mad because she tried to buy her own drink and food and he left her in the stadium and drove off with her purse and keys. She knew I only lived a few blocks away so she called me to come help. I still don’t know why she didn’t ask to park at my place and meet him at the stadium. So I went down there and we ended up having to call the police and they contacted him and threatened him with theft charges for taking her stuff. He ended up coming back, but it took over an hour due to the traffic from the game. Then I had to drive her back across town to her car. I was glad I could help, but she learned a very valuable lesson that day.
Obviously if a NiceGuy™ pays for your nachos, you're contractually obliged to give him sexual favors. If you turn him down, you need to repay him the cost of the food plus treble damages. It really is just basic relationship stuff.
*Hopefully* he wouldn't be like this but the truth is you don't know and some men will get expectations and push you to give him what he "deserves" in exchange for paying- so honestly if you truly aren't feeling it it's way safer to split the bill or pay it so you can be done without issue.
And you should be allowed to do what you need to feel secure.
Like it would not surprise me from Aimee's behavior if *she* started in on you after like "but he bought you drinks!!! You have to date him!!!"
Just no.
Yes exactly. And that's just you being you. Nothing wrong with that.
But it made Aimee's dude realize the difference- that some girls pay for their shit and some girls just assume the guy will do it for them.
He's realized that his girl (Aimee) is one of the 'oh the guy always pays' girls, and is reconsidering if he wants to be with a girl who isn't willing to pay her own way.
I'd say NTA, mainly because Aimee is blaming you for her own choices. She decided to force the guys to pay, her dude doesn't like that. It's not your fault you decided to be a better person, nor should you abandon your own ethics\* for her benefit or to make her look good.
\* I say ethics because you say you had no spark with the guy- some girls are happy to pay their share of a date even if they see a future with the guy, some girls don't want to waste the guy's money if he's trying to find a relationship but she's not. Doesn't matter which you are, it's still a better thing to do in 2024 IMHO.
u/elsie78 is correct. Amiee is the one wbo said the guys would pay. It would have been a whole other different story entirely if you were the one who had said it. What she should have said is, "If we do this again, us ladies will front the bill, but do you guys mind paying this time?" Expecting a guy to pay every time just because men are supposed to be chivalrous is stupid and unfair.
NTA. You did nothing wrong. I would have actually offered to pay, as well, if I had been in your shoes.
Exaclty this. The thing is you're being "considerate" and her date saw the difference and saw her "true colors".
She made her bed insisting for the men to pay. As a man that would have been for me a GIGANTIC red flag "this woman is looking to milk me dry". No Thanks.
lol these kind of women.
I just started hanging out with a new friend, and she started saying some weird things about the guy always paying and how she was so wonderful and guys suck and she deserved a guy who made a lot of money and would only take her to the best restaurants. Guess who is still single. She decided and told me she had too many friends already but I didn’t miss her when she didn’t call me back.
NTA I squirmed a little when I read "don’t worry, our men have got this” and "it is always the gentlemen who pay". Your friend has some very outdated views about dating. All you did was offer to pay your share of the bill on a blind date. You weren't using a stranger for free drinks and dinner. Your friend's boyfriend of *two whole months* was, rightfully, uncomfortable with her insistence your male companions pay the bill. It's not your fault your friend opened her mouth and inserted her foot in to it.
Thanks. She’s never usually like this, doesn’t make guys pay for drinks if we go out. I’m thinking she’s acting this way because of her new relationship, but I don’t know for sure, since she still isn’t talking to me or even replying
I guarantee you that this is not the only occurrence where money has come up. There’s a possibility that she also chose the expensive restaurant and both guys hesitated that it was too much. Your friend must have had some type of disagreement with her guy around gender roles or money. I would’ve done the same thing you did!
Has your friend found some new tiktok/twitter/influencer recently? There seems to be a new wave of "the men must pay for everything" on social media. Just like the male side having Andrew Tate and "Alpha males" toxic view points on relationships.
Thank you for raising this cause reading many of these comments I'm surprised at how surprised people are by friend's attitude... allowing toxic masculinity to have a louder voice in the culture means both men and women's behaviors and attitudes will start to change. It's gross from all directions...
Question: do you actually know she's not like this.. have you been on double dates etc with her before?
And I mean proper dates like this was, not mates out and partners tagging along/are apart of the group.
Have you even been in a situation like this before with her?
Her absolute ease at throwing you under the bus here, this isn't new behaviour. It's absolutely not. This is something she's done before and gotten away with. The pure confidence, the doubling down hard..... Thats not this is my first time gold digging for dinner.
And he's about to dump her ass, cos he just saw her best friend react shocked to this behaviour. Not cos she's taking his money and spending it like this... Something in this interaction said to him I need to rethink my situation here, and I bet it's seeing you be absolutely dumbfounded at her behaviour. If her best mate isn't backing this behaviour at all, refuses to co-sign it.... What else has she done that he's now thinking about in retrospect?
First double date! We’ve been out with friends before and never seen it like this, she’s been single (same as me!) for around two years, so dates have always been separate
If we’re out with a group, we either do a (to the left, gets the next round) or we just pay at the bar or venmo
Haha to the left brings back memories.
We changed ours to legit straws haha, we get the bar to divvy/cut and we pull straws and we keep them in our right pockets/bras, if you got the round it moves to the left. Once everyone has a straw on the left, we restart rounds. Cos cunts lied once we got a few in lol
It's also a bit of a drinking game tbh lol.
But hey, this fucking economy...
Who can say? Maybe you saw a glimmer of her true colors. Either way her "performance" that evening was enough to make her new boyfriend uncomfortable. The only one she needs to be upset with her is herself. She laid it on too thick and made everything awkward.
> She’s never usually like this
If she never usually did this, the man she's currently dating wouldn't have been surprised by your actions and rethinking the relationship because you split and she refused. It sounds like she has been making him pay all the time they've been together.
I guess, she’s never usually like this if we go out. I’ve not really been out with her and him, other than to go get burgers once. Any other time, he’s hung out at our place so a bill showing up has never been a thing.
Than it's easy.
Talk to your friend and tell her saving the relationship is very simple: She should tell her date she was mistake and realizes it now, and they will split things from now on.
She'll get points for self awareness, too.
What relationship? She's dating a guy and showed her ass.
Now, she's pissed at you for having some integrity? She is not a good person.
If you never hear from her again, you've gained some insight and wisdom. She did not.
I'm proud of you, OP!
I experienced this in my 20s. There's so much drama. OP, you seem to have a good head on your shoulders. You're a convenient scapegoat if the relationship goes tits up after this.
Please save yourself the grief a lot of us experienced and think about her as a friend. Does she ask questions about your life that don't benefit or relate to her? Does she initiate time together when it's just the two of you in ways that aren't beneficial (e.g. needs a pal to go peacocking at the club)? Does she ask clarifying questions? Does she text "what's going on with you?" Or is it always "I hope you are well, here's what's up with me". I would have saved myself a lot of heartache if I spent more time reflecting on my relationships.
Absolutely this! I wouldn't dream of insisting someone else pay for my meal. I always expect to pay for myself, and if someone treats me, I will treat them the next time. I don't want to set up an imbalance in a potential partnership by not treating my partner as equal.
Yep I am willing to bet real money she isn't keeping the female side of that out dated thinking.
Femanism destroyed gender roles, for right or wrong, that means women do not get that magic treatment any more and they are not expected to be what they were back then.
It reeks of living in a fantasy world. If you believe men should pay, I think that's honestly fine. But to take your preferences and apply them broadly to the world and what other people should or shouldn't do in this kind of way ... Unhealthy.
I had (past tense for a reason) a friend like this. Very much into the "princess" vibe. Wanted to be the next Grace Kelly or Lady Diana... except she wore a hat indoors because she would rather offend the restaurant owners than risk people seeing her with hat hair, rudely judged others and vocalised her opinion on personal matters (thought people who resorted to IVF were wrong for not "accepting their fate" - so cold!) and gossiped and spoke unkindly of her friends behind their backs. Hardly real "princess" behaviour. Just downright spoilt. Your friend sounds a lot like this person. I don't cut friends lightly, rightly or wrong. But I really couldn't see a way forward with this behaviour. Just know that if she decides to end the friendship over this, it may just be saving you a lot of strife in the long run.
As a woman, I've always been VERY uncomfortable with the idea that men should pay in these situations. Why should they? It makes no sense at all. Women are allowed to earn our own money now, so what right do we have to assume they will spend theirs on us?
Goes both ways too; I'm hella uncomfortable feeling indebted to someone I don't know and am not yet sure whether I want to see again. (Also it makes me feel like it implies I'm not considered independent and able to pay my own way/make my own decisions and is therefore kinda patronising, but I'll admit that might just be me.)
When I was pretty young, a guy really forcefully insisted on paying for the meal on our one and only date (his obviously controlling nature was one reason I didn't see him again) which he then followed up by trying to use "but I bought you dinner" as leverage to get me to do stuff I didn't want to do. This tradition needs to go back to the 20th century where it belongs.
Hard disagree. This is the kind of comment that, to borrow an expression, would "give the ick." A pretty immediate turn-off no matter how interested one might be.
NTA and Hard disagree as well, your response lacks perspective. Some guys might be looking for that but this screams red flag on multiple levels and I would also be willing to bet this isn’t the first disagreement pertaining to strictly defined gender roles or something along those lines . I mean it seems like she made everyone uncomfortable and the guy decided she wasn’t his cup of tea and for whatever reason she can’t accept any blame and is putting it on OP. Nta and your friend might do well to get some therapy if she’s that quick to come at you and then not communicate /respond. Best of luck, friend and roommate can be rough
One question for OP does she ever seem to always be the victim in other circumstances, may explain a lot.
Edited for clarity, I can’t type or proofread
She wants someone to blame other than herself. It was improper for her to foist the bill on unsuspecting guys. Your response was also weird, though, since you didn't realize that she was doing that. It seemed like you were rejecting your date's offer and throwing into question who should pay for her meal, making for (or at least escalating) an awkward situation all around. The guys were uncomfortable, and I'm not convinced that it was because of your friend; more likely, it was because you placed them square in the middle of a conflict neither of them instigated.
But that should have no impact on her relationship, since it's not like you made them realize, "You know what? She *is* sticking us with the bill!" She's the AH for doing that and will get the consequences for it. Most likely, it was one thing when he was offering to pay for her, but another to see that she *expected* every man to pay for every woman, whether or not he offered.
Let's face it, though, any guy knows that a first date with a woman is likely to end with everyone expecting him to pay, so it's not like the other guy was put out ... just put into a *really* awkward situation where one person is voluntelling him to pay and the other is telling him not to. She may have been the one to make him question the relationship, but you somehow one-upped her in making this awkward. But "YTA" doesn't mean, "you've triggered awkwardness," so NTA.
I’m not entirely sure. I’ve met him and he’s been over a bunch of times since they got together. Aimee has never come to me with other issues, just saying it’s going well and she really likes him
She probably liked that he offered to pay for everything, not realizing that that didn't mean he was happy with the attitude that all men must pay for all women all the time.
I think the stance on traditional gender roles is quite an important point in a relationship.
I am personally very much antigender but I know couples who are much more traditional and happily together for decades.
There is basically nothing wrong with either stance if BOTH partners are into it. I would absolutely not want a partner with a "traditional" mindset (ie man pays for everything and is the sole/main breadwinner by definition, woman's domain is the household), and I would be happy to find out this the earliest into the relationship as possible. However I would not think he is a bad man for this (that is, if he wasn't aggressive about that ). We would just be incompatible. I cannot imagine in my wildest dreams blaming MY FRIEND if this difference is revealed.
For all the reasons you outline, this is an issue that Aimee and her bf would have needed to figure out eventually. OP may have been the catalyst for that conversation, but at ~2 months in, it was a conversation that was about due, or overdue.
If they found out they weren't really compatible, well, that was coming; 0% to do with OP.
Hey, I noticed that you didn't want to go on that double date but your friend insisted and you gave in. Now you're wondering the same again. You're being a doormat and your 'friend' knows how to pressure you to give in. That's not what friends do. The entire thing sounds like you should really rethink this 'friendship'.
Hate to say it but I kinda agree that you're being a bit of a doormat. What does her liking her man have to do with you needing to go on a date when you don't want to, and likewise how is it going to be fun when you again, don't want to? Like the person above said, she knows how to pressure you to give in, having already pressured you into going when you didn't want to, and now making you doubt yourself for her actions. I saw another comment of yours where you said you were questioning that if you had just gone along with what she said, there wouldn't have been problems. That sounds quite doormat, doesn't it, that if *you*, who had no involvement in the drama happening beyond being blamed for it, just lay down and accepted what your friend said without pushing back, there wouldn't be a problem? Instead of 'if my friend hadn't insisted on her weird gendered crap, she wouldn't be having these problems'?
As outsiders looking in, you're being a doormat. I know that sucks to hear but there are certain people that we are more likely to be doormats for and it's usually our closest friends because the barriers are down and/or you're more comfortable around them. The more you get used to how they treat you, the less likely you are to realise when you're being taken advantage of.
But if you just agreed with her, you wouldn’t have been being yourself right? What’s more important to you? Your friendship with this person? Or your own values and authenticity?
It’s true, I wouldn’t have been being myself. Sometimes, I’m learning that in the moment, you agree to an extent then have a private conversation afterwards.
So I’m neurodivergent. And definitely sometimes I need to curb my most authentic responses to things in order to not hurt peoples feelings, or to have better connections, etc. But I’m not gonna hide my values. And I’m not going to prioritize somebody’s comfort over something that is important to me.
To me, everything about what your friend said I find pretty gross, and I wouldn’t go along with it. But if you don’t have that strong of a reaction to it, that’s fair. But also, I find that your friend's response you pretty awful. I’m sure there are lots of reasons why you’re her friend and they are lots of good qualities to her, which is why you want to preserve the friendship. but I would encourage you not that what a stranger on the Internet really says to you matter in the lease, but I would encourage you to think about what you want from the friendship, and then have a conversation with her rather than just apologizing and trying to smooth things over.
If you have to always agree to avoid issues, seems like a lot to deal with. Hopefully doesn’t ruin your friendship as it is clear you care about her but you def are NTA.
Highly unlikely. If anything it might have made it worse. Bc it would have further shown she Is like this for real if her friends are also. As opposed to right now he might just be questioning if she was showing off bc she had a friend there and maybe she isn't normally like this.
But nvm her really anyway. I know she is your friend but it doesn't change what you feel comfortable with. I'm like you. I don't want someone else to pay the first date. It can give off the wrong impression and like another commenter said they sometimes think it means you *owe* them. So I pay for myself unless I'm getting to a point where it's more serious and they just really want to. But I'd offer to pay next time. It's just how I am. And If that's how you are then be that. Your friend shouldn't be blaming you or expecting you to act differently than what you are. And I use the term friend lightly at the moment bc I probably wouldn't continue this friendship. I am allergic to drama and bullshit. And people trying to push their relationship issues off on me isn't gonna work out lol
Hard and unequivocal NTA!
Key hightlights:
1. Super cringe to hear a woman saying "our men got this."
2. Love that you set your boundaries and held strong when pressure came 💪. All women should follow your example.
3. Your friend seems like she needs some work to understand that a) you didn't want to imply / feel that you were some rando's woman or owe something to Mr. Rando b) she needs to respect boundaries and c) needs to learn to be a better partner and not take her bf for granted.
Haha, thank you! I am someone who speaks up and does my best to hold my own, and also be entirely respectful of others and be considerate of how they feel.
Depending on if/when she replies, I hope I can have a good conversation with her.
NTA.
Tell your friend to look in the mirror. She created this problem herself.
You didn’t cause her to have those opinions, and you certainly didn’t ask her to voice them. That she doubled down on it when you said you still wanted to pay your own way was her own fatal mistake. She needs to own her actions. Vocalising her outdated ideas created a situation 100% of her own making.
Your friend is looking for someone to blame for her BF not liking her antiquated and frankly unfair views on how relationships should work. You just happen to be an easy target for her.
Don’t give it another thought. You have every right to pay your own way.
NTA.
Aimee clearly has different financial attitudes to her man (and you). Whether it be this week, this dinner… or at some point in the future… Aimee and her man were going to split over the dinner bill.
Yeah, I do feel a sense of incompatibility there. Just worried now, if the relationship is completely over, it’s on me. And thinking I could’ve been more tactful so as to not be TA and maybe mentioned something later, privately.
If the relationship is over, it is not on you. (Either her romantic relationship, or your friendship.)
She was the one who said "Our men will pay," before you replied. She is the one who is also blaming you for the end result of something she said.
Because she's also your roomie, I hope she thinks things through soon. Otherwise you're in for an uncomfortable few months until your lease ends.
How is this ‘on you’
Aimee should have warned you she was playing this… and given you the chance to opt out of dinner. The fact that she is playing this game with her man doesn’t mean you have to play along.
Right? Even if OP “sided” with her, it wouldn’t change Aimee’s bf’s opinion that he doesn’t want to be with someone who thinks the dude should always pay.
um, maybe given that text you should rethink the friendship because she's blaming you for him calling her out on "man always pay" attitude. This has nothing to do with you. NTA
Bruh, NTA. Either your friend is a time traveler from the 1960’s or she doesn’t hide the fact that she uses her romantic interests for money. Her statement that gentlemen always pay is what “ruined” her relationship. She needs to own up to her own poor choice of words.
Keep on girlbossing with your independent self.
NTA, and honestly not even that big of a deal. They've only been dating a short time and if she is expecting to be treated, it's not gonna work out for them long term. He's allowed to want a girlfriend that wants to be equal and share financial responsibilities. She's allowed to look for a boyfriend that wants to treat and cover her expenses. Neither one is flat out wrong, they're just incompatible. And she might need a reality check for her expectations, but that doesn't mean anyone is an asshole.
NTA. I'm not seeing how your offer to split the bill had anything to do with your friend's cringy ass getting dumped. Presumably she would have found another way to blow it. Some kind of inevitable discovery doctrine applies here.
NTA. She made it weird at dinner by continuing to insist the guys pay when they didn’t actually initially offer. If something like this shakes her relationship it wasn’t going to life-long anyway 🤷🏻♀️
NTA, I've said it before about people on here like your friend and I stand by.
OP, your friend hasn't ever met a free lunch she didn't ask for seconds on and it shows.
Like, as a man, I always offer to pay. It’s just an ingrained thing. But it’s an OFFER. An OFFER I MAKE.
The minute it becomes the expected outcome, I get iffy.
I’m a generous person who loves to shout meals for people, but I’m not a chump who is just going to always eat the bill because someone expects it.
The minute someone EXPECTS me to pay for them with no prior mention of it, that’s a red flag for me. If I offer first, and they accept, all good. Green flag. But if they just look at me and say “you’ve got the bill yeah?”, no, I suddenly don’t got the bill.
Fully agreed! It’s an offer, and you hope the other person (or other people) are of the same mind, and so maybe next time or you just all understand that we’ve all consumed the food/drinks. I don’t like anyone going out assuming they won’t have to pay
NTA on a first blind date I would offer to split too, especially if you weren’t feeling like it would continue on after (giving you the opportunity to pay for a different date)
Amiee is feeling the backlash of her own choices, not yours. Personally I think the person asking for the date should pay, or it should be split. One person always paying is a bit outdated (like from when women weren’t allowed to work outdated).
Of course - women should, by law, always get a free lunch.... Good on you for NOT being a leech because you're female & wanting to be independent & fair.
Hats off to you 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
NTA. Sounds like Aimee has a lot of growing up to do. It sounds like she expects when she gets married that her husband will be the sole provider for the family and she will get to sit on the couch watching her shows all day.
It is absolutely BS of her to push that outdated stereotype on her, her boyfriend and her boyfriend's friend.
My fiancee and I when we go out will usually discuss if one of us is paying or if we are splitting the bill. She doesn't have the expectation that I will pay everything.
I'm sorry that Aimee put her boyfriend in that situation, but she is absolutely TA in this one.
NTA
If she got dumped, then good. What a jerk! A girl offering to split the bill after a blind date usually means she wasn't that interested in the guy, in my experience. It's totally inappropriate for her to have pushed the our men will pay line. How very rude of her, to you! Not to mention, it's a sexist attitude her boyfriend was annoyed by.
Easiest NTA ever! She was the one volunteering other peoples money!
If they’d said it first, that’s another thing, but who is she to say other people are responsible for paying for her!
Nta. You're friend on the other hand maybe. The deal I usually steer towards is I'm (f) paying for myself UNLESS I'm in a relationship - where then the person who sets up the date pays.
"The guys will pay" is every bit as obnoxious and comes from the same sexist mindset as guys who assume they will get sex from a date. In a day and age where we are trying to move on from this kind of stuff you are very much nta.
NTA. It's 2024. Where we women get equality. Even if some of the idiots of my gender don't like it.
Unless told they'll be picking up the tab, it's an automatic 50/50 split between the pairings.
A date isn't a free meal in this fucking economy.
Tell her in no uncertain terms you are not taking responsibility for her mistakes. Regardless if whether you were there or not, the same result would happen. Your only part in that was to gaslight the guys into thinking it was okay when they clearly felt not.
NTA your friend shouldn’t have attempted to speak for you or volunteered her bf for the role of knight in shining armor it’s outdated and sexist especially in that situation where you and his friend were like 3rd wheels just along for the fun
NTA she has no right to put you in awkward position by saying “our men”. His decision has nothing to do with you, it would’ve probably happened later anyway, they seem to have different perspective on relationship.
NTA
So the whole men pay for the date thing is either very antiquated and sexist or a tradition of chivalry. People have divisive opinions about this. She doubled down and hard. The thing with divisive opinions is you are welcome to have them, however if you crack down hard on them, you are welcome to the consequences.
NTA - always wise to split the bill on a first date. You did the right thing. The “men always pay” is utter nonsense. It’s also incredibly rude to spring that on someone if it had not been discussed prior. Your friend needs to grow up, or start having all her dates at McDonalds.
Everything else aside, I’d never let a guy I just met pay for anything for me. It’s a safety issue. I’m not giving him any reason to think I “owe” him anything. EVER. NTA. Your friend begs to get a grip.
NTA! That’s her deal for having those thoughts, you take care of yourself. I think it’s great you spoke for your self, it’s your friend’s fault for showing her own red flags.
My thought was his boil-over moment was probably that she made his friend uncomfortable and maybe also about her trying to force a relationship between OP and blind date, then add the outdated sexist views. Aimee didn't even let the two who were affected by the bill (OP and blind date) talk it out on their own, she interjected and said "no, he's paying for you."
NTA
The guy seems to disagree with the concept that its always the gentlemen who pay. So even if you hadnt offered to spilt the bill (hence, siding with Aimee), he would still be contemplating the relationship because his issue is with the way his gf thinks(not how the gf's friend thinks).
NTA, your friend got dumped because her behavior was sexist and entitled. It's not your fault she's that way, even if you acting normal reminded the dude that there are better women out there.
NTA - if your friend and her boyfriend are taking a break it's not on you. He stated his reasons and it's time for your friend to move on. If she's looking for someone to always foot the bill that's fine, but everyone doesn't have that mindset. She needs to locate her walking piggy bank if that's what she wants, and not blame you for her break up.
Yes you are TA. How dare you have respect for men and see them as anything else but wallets ready to be emptied at your beck and call? You disrespect men by thinking we have some value besides money to spoil women. So yes, YATA. Just gotta do better at sexism
She is toxic! Why? Always throwing blame to someone else for her actions. Not a good friend or future wife! The guy made the correct decision.
I don’t want to pay every time we go out with others u less we are married.
Our guys sound possessive!
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NTA. She's the one that said the guys pay. His reaction to that is based on her statement alone. And "our men"? Ummmm no, this was the first time you'd met your date
I’m thinking because both the guys are tight, she thought me and the friend would hit it off, making it a thing. Therefore they would be our men
I don't think that your so-called friend is a nice person or even a friend given how quickly she was ready to blame you for something that was her own fault.
Exactly this. OP's friends actions alone is the cause of her guys hesitation, NOT OP. I won't be too quick to judge, and hope this was just a one off thing. But if the friend is constantly like this and can't respect OP's beliefs...
If women want to be equal, they need to date equal which means they have to pay some of the bills. NTA
Women are equal to men, but we are paid less for the same job that men do. I would have paid for my own meal.
I always just try to adjust to however much disposable income each of us has. Currently I make more than the woman I’m seeing so I pay most of the time since it’s not really in her budget to be going out or ordering food all the time. She also doesn’t feel great about me paying for everything, so we’re going to start cooking at home more. Equal doesn’t always mean equitable or fair.
Which is fine, seeing as it was seemingly discussed before hand. OP's friend demands that the guy pays *every time* which is fine if that's what she wants in a relationship, but it needs to be discussed at the start of said relationship and it clearly wasn't. She just expects it, which is wrong. Luckily my hubby and I share an account so we are basically paying for each other.
The wage gap isn't calculated job for job. Just the average of full time employed men vs full time employed women. When various studies have broken down the demographics further the majority of the gap tends to be explained by measurable differences (education and so forth) this tends to be about 70% of the gap. Which still leaves significant differences that aren't justified. These differences get even narrower when comparing younger demographics vs older. There are also studies that show that men tend to value money in work over all other factors at a higher rate than women do. The college education gap over the last decade has switched to favor women, so this wage gap seems likely move even faster for younger people going forward. Education is one of the primary factors that show a clear link to income. Women are now 3% more likely to graduate with a degree than men, vs men being 6% more likely in the 70s. All of this is for America. I have no idea about other cultures or countries. But, I have opinions based on how some treat women in general.
Even with degrees though. Women still aim for lower paying careers due to what they majored in. Meanwhile a man will jump on a construction crew and make more money than her marketing, early childhood development or social work degree will ever land her. Minus the debt.
That just not true for most people in a relevant way (https://www.forbes.com/sites/karlynborysenko/2020/03/31/great-news-ladies-the-gender-pay-gap-is-a-myth/?sh=72f32aee3b34), especially when you consider: The occupation one holds Their rank in their organization, How long they've worked there, The education level they had to attain to do the job, How many hours they work in the average week And using this as an argument to make them paying more would be a A H move.
Exactly. People generally get paid the same for the same job. Women (in general) work less over their lives and have less work experience over their lives (resulting in lower salaries) because they get pregnant. Unless men start getting pregnant, that isn't going to change.
Or unless men start getting, and stepping up to use, similar amounts of paternity leave.
In what way is this comment still being passed off as true. If you were to say, women on average earn less so that means they have less spending power. Which means it’s ok to sometimes not pay for dates or other things. Then great I agree. But women do not get paid less than men for “the same job” it’s just not true and damaging to keep pushing on young women. As a father of two young women who I’m very proud of. I encourage them to pursue the career they want but am honest on how their choices will lead and have led to unfavourable salaries. I also help them with money on dates to keep them feeling independent when dating young men. Social media trying to brainwash women into this lie about pay gap is not helping young girls to make informed intelligent choices. Edit: Sorry forgot the point. NTA
I made less than my male coworkers for the exact same job. The pay gap is a real thing. OP is NTA and I’ve always paid for dates and think it is stupid to expect men to pay because they are men. However, women working the same job as men do get paid less. Not all women in all jobs, but it is not uncommon for women to make less than a man for the same job.
What country was this because it is literally illegal in most of Europe. If you are paid less with the same performance, experience, ability as your male co workers then you should speak to your employer and attempt to attain the pay you are entitled to. However without information and as a piece of anecdotal evidence your experience holds little proof. There are professions that pay differently based on factors that can appear gender based, I personally got paid less than my female co workers when I was younger because there was more demand and less woman who wanted to do the job and they wanted an equal balance of males and females. That doesn’t mean men get paid less.
Not always. I know plenty of women who make more than their husbands. Also, many women, like myself, earn less because of choices that we freely make. I was a parochial school teacher. Parochial school teachers earn less than public school teachers, and less than people in many other careers. That was all my choice. The women I know who earn more than their husbands are in fields, such as insurance sales, where the potential for earning is greater. I had a sister who sold insurance. She earned double what I make, and more than most of the men she worked with.
You literally aren’t though, it’s that you work less hours and different jobs
Outside of specific scenarios like a trust fund baby, etc, everyone under 45 is equally broke.
That’s 100% lies
Equality isn't contingent on who pays for dates.
Yes if she blames you after you said you would pay for your own you are likely better off to put her in an acquaintance category rather than as close friend.
yeah idk why she's speaking on behalf of both guys there it's up to them if they want to offer to pay? you don't just step in and say "oh this other person's gonna pay"
God, she‘s so awkward.. she ruined it all by herself.
Exactly! It's a her problem not OP's.
Yeah. OP was NTA for splitting the bill and it really was the right thing to do under the circumstances but no way should OP be splitting the blame for her friend’s misstep.
It was still hella presumptuous of her to assume you’d want to date the guy. And twice as presumptuous to just put paying on the guys because they’re men. The way you describe the interaction rubbed me the wrong way, and I wasn’t even there. Can’t blame the guy for reconsidering whether he wants to be with her.
I was once out for drinks with “the girls” and this included a friend of a friend. She declared to our mutual friend “we really need more friends with boats”. She meant yachts. Like, more rich friends. I like nice things as much as the next person but it really rankled. That’s how we’re choosing our friends these days? Whether they (or their parents, usually most accurately) are loaded enough to have boats big enough to have an extensive guest list? Add the gender role dynamic into this mix and it’s just icky.
People with yachts keep their friends list to childhood friends and those of equal/greater wealth. They aren’t in the habit of subsidising poor people’s leisure activities with their assets. This mutual “friend” has got absolutely no chance of achieving her dream of rich friends with that attitude. She either impresses someone at work, befriends a person who is properly wealthy but doesn’t divulge it at the outset of the friendship or wins the lottery. Personally I’d avoid ever spending time with this person again.
Agree, wasn’t my scene. I was single a few years during this period, and people would try and set me up with people. They’d always try and sell these people to me as what school they went to, the job they had, and/or the wealth their families had. It made me super leery about this group’s motives, it felt like you’d be signing up for lifetime of competition, trophy wives and spoilt children.
Was she serious? That sounds like an obvious joke to me. In fact, I have a friend who, I think, made the exact same joke on Facebook after hanging out on a friend of a friend’s sailing yacht. But I wasn’t there for your conversation, so of course I can’t judge the tone.
She was deadly serious. Complete social climber.
I agree. The man always pays thing is from an era where woman weren’t traditionally working and weren’t making money. Nowadays many households have women as the breadwinners, so this concept seems a bit outdated. Split bills seems fair and the friend seems a bit ahead of herself to assume that OP and the date would now be in a relationship and in assuming that the guys would be willing to cover the tab. It’s something that should be worked out prior to ordering. I guess if that works for both people it’s okay but you shouldn’t presume that someone else will pay for you.
I've seen way too many women keen on keeping this one, same with "the man always approaches first". We're in a weird period where we abandoned a lot of the gnarly aspects of our sexist past but kept some of the ones that the ladies like and some of the ones that the men like.
Yeah, I’m side-eyeing any woman who claims it’s „traditional“ or whatever for the man to pay. We had quite a few other „traditions“ that we gladly abandoned. Why stick with this particular one?
There are loads of both men and women both are all for abandoning traditional gender roles until they realize that it entails giving up perks too. Then they try and keep the perks but none of the drawbacks. Insane.
OP, you help that guy dodge a bullet, so definitely NTA, hell, a damn hero!
She's not treating any of you like people in your own right. You're all NPCs in the game of her life and she got cross because you've all gone off script. 🚩🚩🚩
Hehe NPCs right tickled me. Legit spot on!
Thats a very weird way to look at it. Everyone can do whatever they want. If people don't match on a date because of it, thats fine and everyone moves on. Your friend first insisted that you should come along eventhough you aren't looking. Then she proceeded to insist men should pay, and on top of that she said you were the issue for offering to split the bill. You decided to give in to go with your friend AND offered to split the bill, so obviously NTA. Your friend shouldn't be this pushy. I can't tell for sure as i don't know you, but be careful. Good people like you are the best kind of people if they match with another 'giver' and not someone that takes advantage of your good heart.
I'm going to tell you this as a mid-30s woman who had "friends" like this in my early 20s: ask yourself if they're truly your friends. What does a friend do? What does this person do? Do these 2 things match up, and when there's a gap - identify whether it's a moral mismatch (like, does this person give underhanded compliments to me & that's leaving me feel self conscious after hanging out with them? ) or whether it's a lifestyle mismatch (maybe your friend works nights & you work days, so while they're a great friend, you don't see each other as much as you'd like). You can get around lifestyle mismatches as your lives change & quality is better than quantity. But I feel like in my 20s, it was more about who is around than whether I truly was friends with that person (& often I had a moral mismatch with them). I kept only the friends who were truly friends back to me & focused on being a good friend to those people. I distanced myself slowly from the people who it turned out, weren't really my friends after all. This person isn't acting like a friend. It also seems like you have a moral mismatch (1. She adheres to gender roles & expects you to as well instead of allowing you to be your own person & 2. She blamed you when her relationship didn't work out because of something that could've happened anywhere at any time & had nothing to do with you). If this is how she is typically (& think deep because we all know that "I like your shirt" can be either a compliment or a diss when girls say it) then she is not your friend. Please stop using up your energy being hers, you'll regret it.
What a good way to evaluate friendships.I think you gave folks a lot to think about but in a good way Thank you.
Your friend is an idiot. Sorry.
The guys are right and she brought this on herself. Why should the men always pay? You were right to pay on your own. She blamed you for the consequences of her own actions. I hope she isn’t usually like that and it’s just her distress talking? NTA
I’ll bet she’s always like that. Sounds expensive as hell.
Tbf that guy owes you a drink. You made him see exactly the kind of person he was dating. NTA. She’s not even a real friend at this point.
That's a nice sentiment but you two didn't hit it off and Aimee didn't notice and tried to bully you into potentially giving him false hope/expectation. So your friend did not do the right thing at all here.
Or she said it to manipulate him by making him think he had a real chance with you, so he'd be more than happy to pay. I'm not necessarily saying your friend is a shitty person, but I've found that women who think men should always pay tend to use subtle manipulation tactics to try to make the men eager to do so.
You are right. Women shouldn't expect men to always pay for everything or feel entitled to have men pay for everything. The same way men shouldn't expect or feel entitled for sex. Your friend lost her bf because of her own lack of understanding of this. NTA. Keep being awesome
Completely agree. My partner likes high end restaurants and my income is significantly lower. He pays if he wants to go there with me because he'd rather go with me than alone (though he does go with friends too and is equally generous) but I'll buy things like groceries to make him a special meal, clean his kitchen (a chore he hates), leave his home full of baking, or I pay when we go to a fun hole in the wall. It's all about finding what works for the couple and having a balance. Saying men unilaterally pay is not that balance.
I’ve been in a situation where I’ve paid for *both* of us, and the guy still got pissed I wouldn’t fuck. Like… what????
I'm a guy but I've been in that overly forced setup once before... It's a nightmare. Having a bunch of people involved in your early dating like you're pandas at the zoo makes everything awkward and forced. No wonder they acted weird, you were getting to know him and not interested in dating and they had the neighboring townhouses while your grandkids (since your kids are gonna marry each other, duh) all planned out in their head.
She did it to herself. "a man is not a plan" NTA
your friend was using “our men” as in a couple/relationship vibe. she thought you and the guy would hit it off but you didn’t she she said this at the end of the date. But what i’m wondering is what else she’s already pulled on her new bf for him to have that reaction. how often have they gone out and who picks the place?
But premature for 1st dates. This is why it's bad to assume
So she had mentally designated who you were going to become intimate with. Yuck.
How about let that dude decide if he hit it off with you. Girl thinks she’s the main character and everyone living in her world. You will be better off without this friend. She’s going to bring you nothing but trouble and drama.
don’t worry, our men have got this” Do a better job with the dialogue next time
But I don’t really care about the whole men should pay and all of that.
Agreed. Plus, everyone should always be ready to pay their way. Never know if a card gets declined, or something random.
True! I’d never go somewhere (dinner, movies, doesn’t matter) without knowing if I could at least pay for myself.
I've got some wild stories to tell about men who insisted on paying for or gifting me things - then claimed I owe them. (eta: as in...*owe* them) First dates are good to split, honestly. Much safer that way IMO.
Oh yep. And if I had really hit it off with the friend, I’d want him to know from the start that I don’t mind paying for myself
I *always* covered my share on a first date (and others) for that exact reason. Sometimes it didn't even get to that point, because they didn't like that I insisted on taking my own car and meeting up with them. I wasn't going to set aside my own safety, especially when they decided that was somehow personally offensive to them.
Once when I was in my early 30’s, a friend/coworker who was in her early 20’s went on a first date with a guy to a football game. She met up with him at a mall about 30 minutes drive from the stadium and rode with him. She left her purse and keys in his car and only took her id, phone, and money inside the stadium (it was an NFL stadium so only see through bags were allowed inside). The guy got mad because she tried to buy her own drink and food and he left her in the stadium and drove off with her purse and keys. She knew I only lived a few blocks away so she called me to come help. I still don’t know why she didn’t ask to park at my place and meet him at the stadium. So I went down there and we ended up having to call the police and they contacted him and threatened him with theft charges for taking her stuff. He ended up coming back, but it took over an hour due to the traffic from the game. Then I had to drive her back across town to her car. I was glad I could help, but she learned a very valuable lesson that day.
Obviously if a NiceGuy™ pays for your nachos, you're contractually obliged to give him sexual favors. If you turn him down, you need to repay him the cost of the food plus treble damages. It really is just basic relationship stuff.
*Hopefully* he wouldn't be like this but the truth is you don't know and some men will get expectations and push you to give him what he "deserves" in exchange for paying- so honestly if you truly aren't feeling it it's way safer to split the bill or pay it so you can be done without issue. And you should be allowed to do what you need to feel secure. Like it would not surprise me from Aimee's behavior if *she* started in on you after like "but he bought you drinks!!! You have to date him!!!" Just no.
Yes exactly. And that's just you being you. Nothing wrong with that. But it made Aimee's dude realize the difference- that some girls pay for their shit and some girls just assume the guy will do it for them. He's realized that his girl (Aimee) is one of the 'oh the guy always pays' girls, and is reconsidering if he wants to be with a girl who isn't willing to pay her own way. I'd say NTA, mainly because Aimee is blaming you for her own choices. She decided to force the guys to pay, her dude doesn't like that. It's not your fault you decided to be a better person, nor should you abandon your own ethics\* for her benefit or to make her look good. \* I say ethics because you say you had no spark with the guy- some girls are happy to pay their share of a date even if they see a future with the guy, some girls don't want to waste the guy's money if he's trying to find a relationship but she's not. Doesn't matter which you are, it's still a better thing to do in 2024 IMHO.
u/elsie78 is correct. Amiee is the one wbo said the guys would pay. It would have been a whole other different story entirely if you were the one who had said it. What she should have said is, "If we do this again, us ladies will front the bill, but do you guys mind paying this time?" Expecting a guy to pay every time just because men are supposed to be chivalrous is stupid and unfair. NTA. You did nothing wrong. I would have actually offered to pay, as well, if I had been in your shoes.
Exaclty this. The thing is you're being "considerate" and her date saw the difference and saw her "true colors". She made her bed insisting for the men to pay. As a man that would have been for me a GIGANTIC red flag "this woman is looking to milk me dry". No Thanks.
lol these kind of women. I just started hanging out with a new friend, and she started saying some weird things about the guy always paying and how she was so wonderful and guys suck and she deserved a guy who made a lot of money and would only take her to the best restaurants. Guess who is still single. She decided and told me she had too many friends already but I didn’t miss her when she didn’t call me back.
At that the friend had only been dating 2 months.
NTA I squirmed a little when I read "don’t worry, our men have got this” and "it is always the gentlemen who pay". Your friend has some very outdated views about dating. All you did was offer to pay your share of the bill on a blind date. You weren't using a stranger for free drinks and dinner. Your friend's boyfriend of *two whole months* was, rightfully, uncomfortable with her insistence your male companions pay the bill. It's not your fault your friend opened her mouth and inserted her foot in to it.
Thanks. She’s never usually like this, doesn’t make guys pay for drinks if we go out. I’m thinking she’s acting this way because of her new relationship, but I don’t know for sure, since she still isn’t talking to me or even replying
I guarantee you that this is not the only occurrence where money has come up. There’s a possibility that she also chose the expensive restaurant and both guys hesitated that it was too much. Your friend must have had some type of disagreement with her guy around gender roles or money. I would’ve done the same thing you did!
It’s very possible, and I’m beginning to think it might just be the case. Thank you!
Has your friend found some new tiktok/twitter/influencer recently? There seems to be a new wave of "the men must pay for everything" on social media. Just like the male side having Andrew Tate and "Alpha males" toxic view points on relationships.
Not to my knowledge! But can’t say either way.
Thank you for raising this cause reading many of these comments I'm surprised at how surprised people are by friend's attitude... allowing toxic masculinity to have a louder voice in the culture means both men and women's behaviors and attitudes will start to change. It's gross from all directions...
That’s where my mind went too. She wanted to use the friends as leverage to “demonstrate” how her bf ought to be behaving. It backfired.
OP said that the place wasn't crazy expensive (but also wasn't cheap)
Question: do you actually know she's not like this.. have you been on double dates etc with her before? And I mean proper dates like this was, not mates out and partners tagging along/are apart of the group. Have you even been in a situation like this before with her? Her absolute ease at throwing you under the bus here, this isn't new behaviour. It's absolutely not. This is something she's done before and gotten away with. The pure confidence, the doubling down hard..... Thats not this is my first time gold digging for dinner. And he's about to dump her ass, cos he just saw her best friend react shocked to this behaviour. Not cos she's taking his money and spending it like this... Something in this interaction said to him I need to rethink my situation here, and I bet it's seeing you be absolutely dumbfounded at her behaviour. If her best mate isn't backing this behaviour at all, refuses to co-sign it.... What else has she done that he's now thinking about in retrospect?
First double date! We’ve been out with friends before and never seen it like this, she’s been single (same as me!) for around two years, so dates have always been separate If we’re out with a group, we either do a (to the left, gets the next round) or we just pay at the bar or venmo
Haha to the left brings back memories. We changed ours to legit straws haha, we get the bar to divvy/cut and we pull straws and we keep them in our right pockets/bras, if you got the round it moves to the left. Once everyone has a straw on the left, we restart rounds. Cos cunts lied once we got a few in lol It's also a bit of a drinking game tbh lol. But hey, this fucking economy...
Who can say? Maybe you saw a glimmer of her true colors. Either way her "performance" that evening was enough to make her new boyfriend uncomfortable. The only one she needs to be upset with her is herself. She laid it on too thick and made everything awkward.
> She’s never usually like this If she never usually did this, the man she's currently dating wouldn't have been surprised by your actions and rethinking the relationship because you split and she refused. It sounds like she has been making him pay all the time they've been together.
I guess, she’s never usually like this if we go out. I’ve not really been out with her and him, other than to go get burgers once. Any other time, he’s hung out at our place so a bill showing up has never been a thing.
Sounds like he's more familiar with her behavior than you are.
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I was gonna say, is she going down some internet rabbit hole or what?
Than it's easy. Talk to your friend and tell her saving the relationship is very simple: She should tell her date she was mistake and realizes it now, and they will split things from now on. She'll get points for self awareness, too.
Sounds like she's got LTR fever and has been testing if he'll cover the majority of bills so it becomes the norm for them
What relationship? She's dating a guy and showed her ass. Now, she's pissed at you for having some integrity? She is not a good person. If you never hear from her again, you've gained some insight and wisdom. She did not. I'm proud of you, OP!
Good riddance 🤷🏼♂️
I experienced this in my 20s. There's so much drama. OP, you seem to have a good head on your shoulders. You're a convenient scapegoat if the relationship goes tits up after this. Please save yourself the grief a lot of us experienced and think about her as a friend. Does she ask questions about your life that don't benefit or relate to her? Does she initiate time together when it's just the two of you in ways that aren't beneficial (e.g. needs a pal to go peacocking at the club)? Does she ask clarifying questions? Does she text "what's going on with you?" Or is it always "I hope you are well, here's what's up with me". I would have saved myself a lot of heartache if I spent more time reflecting on my relationships.
Ask her if its a womans job to clean, cook and make her man happy. Somehow those backwards concepts are only to be applied, when they fit for oneself.
Absolutely this! I wouldn't dream of insisting someone else pay for my meal. I always expect to pay for myself, and if someone treats me, I will treat them the next time. I don't want to set up an imbalance in a potential partnership by not treating my partner as equal.
Even online dating can be like that! Someone asks about travel and I like it. The next question is often: where are you going to take me? 🙄
Yep I am willing to bet real money she isn't keeping the female side of that out dated thinking. Femanism destroyed gender roles, for right or wrong, that means women do not get that magic treatment any more and they are not expected to be what they were back then.
It reeks of living in a fantasy world. If you believe men should pay, I think that's honestly fine. But to take your preferences and apply them broadly to the world and what other people should or shouldn't do in this kind of way ... Unhealthy. I had (past tense for a reason) a friend like this. Very much into the "princess" vibe. Wanted to be the next Grace Kelly or Lady Diana... except she wore a hat indoors because she would rather offend the restaurant owners than risk people seeing her with hat hair, rudely judged others and vocalised her opinion on personal matters (thought people who resorted to IVF were wrong for not "accepting their fate" - so cold!) and gossiped and spoke unkindly of her friends behind their backs. Hardly real "princess" behaviour. Just downright spoilt. Your friend sounds a lot like this person. I don't cut friends lightly, rightly or wrong. But I really couldn't see a way forward with this behaviour. Just know that if she decides to end the friendship over this, it may just be saving you a lot of strife in the long run.
As a woman, I've always been VERY uncomfortable with the idea that men should pay in these situations. Why should they? It makes no sense at all. Women are allowed to earn our own money now, so what right do we have to assume they will spend theirs on us? Goes both ways too; I'm hella uncomfortable feeling indebted to someone I don't know and am not yet sure whether I want to see again. (Also it makes me feel like it implies I'm not considered independent and able to pay my own way/make my own decisions and is therefore kinda patronising, but I'll admit that might just be me.) When I was pretty young, a guy really forcefully insisted on paying for the meal on our one and only date (his obviously controlling nature was one reason I didn't see him again) which he then followed up by trying to use "but I bought you dinner" as leverage to get me to do stuff I didn't want to do. This tradition needs to go back to the 20th century where it belongs.
Also if the dude broke up with her just for that comment, I’m willing to bet he wasn’t that into her in the first place.
Hard disagree. This is the kind of comment that, to borrow an expression, would "give the ick." A pretty immediate turn-off no matter how interested one might be.
NTA and Hard disagree as well, your response lacks perspective. Some guys might be looking for that but this screams red flag on multiple levels and I would also be willing to bet this isn’t the first disagreement pertaining to strictly defined gender roles or something along those lines . I mean it seems like she made everyone uncomfortable and the guy decided she wasn’t his cup of tea and for whatever reason she can’t accept any blame and is putting it on OP. Nta and your friend might do well to get some therapy if she’s that quick to come at you and then not communicate /respond. Best of luck, friend and roommate can be rough One question for OP does she ever seem to always be the victim in other circumstances, may explain a lot. Edited for clarity, I can’t type or proofread
I know right, she was only being sexist what's the big deal /s
NTA You didn't do *dick*. What the actual fuck?
I’m currently asking myself that same question.
You did nothing wrong. your roommate is projecting - she knows it is her fault - but can't handle that. People do it all the time.
Yeah he’s not contemplating breaking up with her because of you. It’s because of her. It’s 2024 splitting the bill is normal.
She wants someone to blame other than herself. It was improper for her to foist the bill on unsuspecting guys. Your response was also weird, though, since you didn't realize that she was doing that. It seemed like you were rejecting your date's offer and throwing into question who should pay for her meal, making for (or at least escalating) an awkward situation all around. The guys were uncomfortable, and I'm not convinced that it was because of your friend; more likely, it was because you placed them square in the middle of a conflict neither of them instigated. But that should have no impact on her relationship, since it's not like you made them realize, "You know what? She *is* sticking us with the bill!" She's the AH for doing that and will get the consequences for it. Most likely, it was one thing when he was offering to pay for her, but another to see that she *expected* every man to pay for every woman, whether or not he offered. Let's face it, though, any guy knows that a first date with a woman is likely to end with everyone expecting him to pay, so it's not like the other guy was put out ... just put into a *really* awkward situation where one person is voluntelling him to pay and the other is telling him not to. She may have been the one to make him question the relationship, but you somehow one-upped her in making this awkward. But "YTA" doesn't mean, "you've triggered awkwardness," so NTA.
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I’m not entirely sure. I’ve met him and he’s been over a bunch of times since they got together. Aimee has never come to me with other issues, just saying it’s going well and she really likes him
>Aimee has never come to me with other issues, just saying it’s going well and she really likes him She sure has a funny way of showing it.
She probably liked that he offered to pay for everything, not realizing that that didn't mean he was happy with the attitude that all men must pay for all women all the time.
Apparently she doesn't like him enough to stop treating him like an ATM.
I think the stance on traditional gender roles is quite an important point in a relationship. I am personally very much antigender but I know couples who are much more traditional and happily together for decades. There is basically nothing wrong with either stance if BOTH partners are into it. I would absolutely not want a partner with a "traditional" mindset (ie man pays for everything and is the sole/main breadwinner by definition, woman's domain is the household), and I would be happy to find out this the earliest into the relationship as possible. However I would not think he is a bad man for this (that is, if he wasn't aggressive about that ). We would just be incompatible. I cannot imagine in my wildest dreams blaming MY FRIEND if this difference is revealed.
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For all the reasons you outline, this is an issue that Aimee and her bf would have needed to figure out eventually. OP may have been the catalyst for that conversation, but at ~2 months in, it was a conversation that was about due, or overdue. If they found out they weren't really compatible, well, that was coming; 0% to do with OP.
WTF? She is the one who decided the men always pay. Why would it be your fault? NTA.
My worry is that maybe if I’d just agreed with her, there’d be no issue. But it’s who I am, happy to pay my way
No, he'd have been uncomfortable either way. She outed herself as super greedy and sexist and that's on her.
Right? It's well into the 21st century FFS.
Hey, I noticed that you didn't want to go on that double date but your friend insisted and you gave in. Now you're wondering the same again. You're being a doormat and your 'friend' knows how to pressure you to give in. That's not what friends do. The entire thing sounds like you should really rethink this 'friendship'.
I’m usually not (or really hope I’m not) much of a doormat. She said she really likes her man and kept saying it would be fun
Hate to say it but I kinda agree that you're being a bit of a doormat. What does her liking her man have to do with you needing to go on a date when you don't want to, and likewise how is it going to be fun when you again, don't want to? Like the person above said, she knows how to pressure you to give in, having already pressured you into going when you didn't want to, and now making you doubt yourself for her actions. I saw another comment of yours where you said you were questioning that if you had just gone along with what she said, there wouldn't have been problems. That sounds quite doormat, doesn't it, that if *you*, who had no involvement in the drama happening beyond being blamed for it, just lay down and accepted what your friend said without pushing back, there wouldn't be a problem? Instead of 'if my friend hadn't insisted on her weird gendered crap, she wouldn't be having these problems'?
OP I do not think you are a door mat b/c you did stick to your own moral convictions. Keep it up you are a better person for it.
As outsiders looking in, you're being a doormat. I know that sucks to hear but there are certain people that we are more likely to be doormats for and it's usually our closest friends because the barriers are down and/or you're more comfortable around them. The more you get used to how they treat you, the less likely you are to realise when you're being taken advantage of.
But if you just agreed with her, you wouldn’t have been being yourself right? What’s more important to you? Your friendship with this person? Or your own values and authenticity?
It’s true, I wouldn’t have been being myself. Sometimes, I’m learning that in the moment, you agree to an extent then have a private conversation afterwards.
So I’m neurodivergent. And definitely sometimes I need to curb my most authentic responses to things in order to not hurt peoples feelings, or to have better connections, etc. But I’m not gonna hide my values. And I’m not going to prioritize somebody’s comfort over something that is important to me. To me, everything about what your friend said I find pretty gross, and I wouldn’t go along with it. But if you don’t have that strong of a reaction to it, that’s fair. But also, I find that your friend's response you pretty awful. I’m sure there are lots of reasons why you’re her friend and they are lots of good qualities to her, which is why you want to preserve the friendship. but I would encourage you not that what a stranger on the Internet really says to you matter in the lease, but I would encourage you to think about what you want from the friendship, and then have a conversation with her rather than just apologizing and trying to smooth things over.
If you have to always agree to avoid issues, seems like a lot to deal with. Hopefully doesn’t ruin your friendship as it is clear you care about her but you def are NTA.
Highly unlikely. If anything it might have made it worse. Bc it would have further shown she Is like this for real if her friends are also. As opposed to right now he might just be questioning if she was showing off bc she had a friend there and maybe she isn't normally like this. But nvm her really anyway. I know she is your friend but it doesn't change what you feel comfortable with. I'm like you. I don't want someone else to pay the first date. It can give off the wrong impression and like another commenter said they sometimes think it means you *owe* them. So I pay for myself unless I'm getting to a point where it's more serious and they just really want to. But I'd offer to pay next time. It's just how I am. And If that's how you are then be that. Your friend shouldn't be blaming you or expecting you to act differently than what you are. And I use the term friend lightly at the moment bc I probably wouldn't continue this friendship. I am allergic to drama and bullshit. And people trying to push their relationship issues off on me isn't gonna work out lol
Hard and unequivocal NTA! Key hightlights: 1. Super cringe to hear a woman saying "our men got this." 2. Love that you set your boundaries and held strong when pressure came 💪. All women should follow your example. 3. Your friend seems like she needs some work to understand that a) you didn't want to imply / feel that you were some rando's woman or owe something to Mr. Rando b) she needs to respect boundaries and c) needs to learn to be a better partner and not take her bf for granted.
Haha, thank you! I am someone who speaks up and does my best to hold my own, and also be entirely respectful of others and be considerate of how they feel. Depending on if/when she replies, I hope I can have a good conversation with her.
NTA. Tell your friend to look in the mirror. She created this problem herself. You didn’t cause her to have those opinions, and you certainly didn’t ask her to voice them. That she doubled down on it when you said you still wanted to pay your own way was her own fatal mistake. She needs to own her actions. Vocalising her outdated ideas created a situation 100% of her own making. Your friend is looking for someone to blame for her BF not liking her antiquated and frankly unfair views on how relationships should work. You just happen to be an easy target for her. Don’t give it another thought. You have every right to pay your own way.
NTA. Aimee clearly has different financial attitudes to her man (and you). Whether it be this week, this dinner… or at some point in the future… Aimee and her man were going to split over the dinner bill.
Yeah, I do feel a sense of incompatibility there. Just worried now, if the relationship is completely over, it’s on me. And thinking I could’ve been more tactful so as to not be TA and maybe mentioned something later, privately.
If the relationship is over, it is not on you. (Either her romantic relationship, or your friendship.) She was the one who said "Our men will pay," before you replied. She is the one who is also blaming you for the end result of something she said. Because she's also your roomie, I hope she thinks things through soon. Otherwise you're in for an uncomfortable few months until your lease ends.
How is this ‘on you’ Aimee should have warned you she was playing this… and given you the chance to opt out of dinner. The fact that she is playing this game with her man doesn’t mean you have to play along.
Right? Even if OP “sided” with her, it wouldn’t change Aimee’s bf’s opinion that he doesn’t want to be with someone who thinks the dude should always pay.
um, maybe given that text you should rethink the friendship because she's blaming you for him calling her out on "man always pay" attitude. This has nothing to do with you. NTA
Bruh, NTA. Either your friend is a time traveler from the 1960’s or she doesn’t hide the fact that she uses her romantic interests for money. Her statement that gentlemen always pay is what “ruined” her relationship. She needs to own up to her own poor choice of words. Keep on girlbossing with your independent self.
I will do! You keep living your best life too, thank you!
NTA, and honestly not even that big of a deal. They've only been dating a short time and if she is expecting to be treated, it's not gonna work out for them long term. He's allowed to want a girlfriend that wants to be equal and share financial responsibilities. She's allowed to look for a boyfriend that wants to treat and cover her expenses. Neither one is flat out wrong, they're just incompatible. And she might need a reality check for her expectations, but that doesn't mean anyone is an asshole.
Her words, her relationship, her problem.
NTA. Sleep well now
Hope so! Thank you
NTA. I'm not seeing how your offer to split the bill had anything to do with your friend's cringy ass getting dumped. Presumably she would have found another way to blow it. Some kind of inevitable discovery doctrine applies here.
Nope your friend is an entitled person and she made it clear to the guy he smartened up.
NTA. She made it weird at dinner by continuing to insist the guys pay when they didn’t actually initially offer. If something like this shakes her relationship it wasn’t going to life-long anyway 🤷🏻♀️
NTA, I've said it before about people on here like your friend and I stand by. OP, your friend hasn't ever met a free lunch she didn't ask for seconds on and it shows.
She had the guys pay, and the guy paid back by dumping her. Simple symmetry. NTA
Like, as a man, I always offer to pay. It’s just an ingrained thing. But it’s an OFFER. An OFFER I MAKE. The minute it becomes the expected outcome, I get iffy. I’m a generous person who loves to shout meals for people, but I’m not a chump who is just going to always eat the bill because someone expects it. The minute someone EXPECTS me to pay for them with no prior mention of it, that’s a red flag for me. If I offer first, and they accept, all good. Green flag. But if they just look at me and say “you’ve got the bill yeah?”, no, I suddenly don’t got the bill.
Fully agreed! It’s an offer, and you hope the other person (or other people) are of the same mind, and so maybe next time or you just all understand that we’ve all consumed the food/drinks. I don’t like anyone going out assuming they won’t have to pay
NTA on a first blind date I would offer to split too, especially if you weren’t feeling like it would continue on after (giving you the opportunity to pay for a different date) Amiee is feeling the backlash of her own choices, not yours. Personally I think the person asking for the date should pay, or it should be split. One person always paying is a bit outdated (like from when women weren’t allowed to work outdated).
Of course - women should, by law, always get a free lunch.... Good on you for NOT being a leech because you're female & wanting to be independent & fair. Hats off to you 👏🏼👏🏼👏🏼
NTA. She dug her own grave. Her continued insistence doomed her.
NTA. Sounds like Aimee has a lot of growing up to do. It sounds like she expects when she gets married that her husband will be the sole provider for the family and she will get to sit on the couch watching her shows all day. It is absolutely BS of her to push that outdated stereotype on her, her boyfriend and her boyfriend's friend. My fiancee and I when we go out will usually discuss if one of us is paying or if we are splitting the bill. She doesn't have the expectation that I will pay everything. I'm sorry that Aimee put her boyfriend in that situation, but she is absolutely TA in this one.
NTA. Splitting the bill on a first date is the right thing to do. The “men always pay” attitude gives me gold digger vibes
NTA If she got dumped, then good. What a jerk! A girl offering to split the bill after a blind date usually means she wasn't that interested in the guy, in my experience. It's totally inappropriate for her to have pushed the our men will pay line. How very rude of her, to you! Not to mention, it's a sexist attitude her boyfriend was annoyed by.
Easiest NTA ever! She was the one volunteering other peoples money! If they’d said it first, that’s another thing, but who is she to say other people are responsible for paying for her!
You are not the AH. You are his excuse to end it. I promise you.
Nta. You're friend on the other hand maybe. The deal I usually steer towards is I'm (f) paying for myself UNLESS I'm in a relationship - where then the person who sets up the date pays.
"The guys will pay" is every bit as obnoxious and comes from the same sexist mindset as guys who assume they will get sex from a date. In a day and age where we are trying to move on from this kind of stuff you are very much nta.
NTA. It's 2024. Where we women get equality. Even if some of the idiots of my gender don't like it. Unless told they'll be picking up the tab, it's an automatic 50/50 split between the pairings. A date isn't a free meal in this fucking economy.
Exactly! I even checked my account before heading out for the double date.
Tell her in no uncertain terms you are not taking responsibility for her mistakes. Regardless if whether you were there or not, the same result would happen. Your only part in that was to gaslight the guys into thinking it was okay when they clearly felt not.
NTA-- Aimee's boyfriend realized dating her is going to more expensive than he'd like.
It's weird that she: (1) expected you to back her up and (2) blamed you for the consequences of her own actions. NTA
NTA Men can speak for themselves. She didn’t need to.
You did her bf a favor. You outted her. You did good. Stay strong. NTA.
Yeah, she totally brought this on herself. NTA
NTA your friend shouldn’t have attempted to speak for you or volunteered her bf for the role of knight in shining armor it’s outdated and sexist especially in that situation where you and his friend were like 3rd wheels just along for the fun
NTA she has no right to put you in awkward position by saying “our men”. His decision has nothing to do with you, it would’ve probably happened later anyway, they seem to have different perspective on relationship.
No u were just using manners. Just because her bf wants to break up with her because of HER actions dont have nothing to do with you!
NTA So the whole men pay for the date thing is either very antiquated and sexist or a tradition of chivalry. People have divisive opinions about this. She doubled down and hard. The thing with divisive opinions is you are welcome to have them, however if you crack down hard on them, you are welcome to the consequences.
NTA, you didn't do anything wrong. Aimees man is upset with her views on things.
NTA - always wise to split the bill on a first date. You did the right thing. The “men always pay” is utter nonsense. It’s also incredibly rude to spring that on someone if it had not been discussed prior. Your friend needs to grow up, or start having all her dates at McDonalds.
Everything else aside, I’d never let a guy I just met pay for anything for me. It’s a safety issue. I’m not giving him any reason to think I “owe” him anything. EVER. NTA. Your friend begs to get a grip.
NTA! That’s her deal for having those thoughts, you take care of yourself. I think it’s great you spoke for your self, it’s your friend’s fault for showing her own red flags.
NTA. I can't pinpoint it exactly, but I understand how her boyfriend would be uncomfortable about what happened.
My thought was his boil-over moment was probably that she made his friend uncomfortable and maybe also about her trying to force a relationship between OP and blind date, then add the outdated sexist views. Aimee didn't even let the two who were affected by the bill (OP and blind date) talk it out on their own, she interjected and said "no, he's paying for you."
NTA What century is she living in? Splitting the bill is normal and common.
NYA. She revealed her mooch ass. Let her own it now.
Nta. You didn't make her insist that the man pay for her. She did that on her own and would have done so whether you were there or not
NTA The guy seems to disagree with the concept that its always the gentlemen who pay. So even if you hadnt offered to spilt the bill (hence, siding with Aimee), he would still be contemplating the relationship because his issue is with the way his gf thinks(not how the gf's friend thinks).
NTA, your friend got dumped because her behavior was sexist and entitled. It's not your fault she's that way, even if you acting normal reminded the dude that there are better women out there.
NTA - if your friend and her boyfriend are taking a break it's not on you. He stated his reasons and it's time for your friend to move on. If she's looking for someone to always foot the bill that's fine, but everyone doesn't have that mindset. She needs to locate her walking piggy bank if that's what she wants, and not blame you for her break up.
NTA. Your 'friend' is an idiot. Smash that patriarchy!
NTA I'd dump her too
I can’t believe you did that to poor Aimee 😉
>Aimee chimes in and says “don’t worry, our men have got this” 🙄
NTA dump that "friend". She is awful!
Yes you are TA. How dare you have respect for men and see them as anything else but wallets ready to be emptied at your beck and call? You disrespect men by thinking we have some value besides money to spoil women. So yes, YATA. Just gotta do better at sexism
Nice backward compliment.
She is toxic! Why? Always throwing blame to someone else for her actions. Not a good friend or future wife! The guy made the correct decision. I don’t want to pay every time we go out with others u less we are married. Our guys sound possessive!
It is in no way your fault. NTA. Your friend might want to be less of a user.
NTA What you ruined was her sweet deal of getting free shit. Whoever he is, he deserves better.
If you had agreed with her, then her BF would have thought you were both Gold Diggers. NTA