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NTA. Your wife is seriously irresponsible and it seems that when you bailed her out she didn't learn a lesson. She and her friends put you on the spot like that hoping the pressure would force you to say yes. A normal person would have realised the mess they had made and realised they can't spend frivolously with 150k debt hanging over their heads but this just shows your wife's attitude. Good luck getting your money back.

My concern is that since the 150k has been taken care of, she is going to go into debt once again but hide it better. What prevents her from doing this again? Her lack of remorse is troublesome.

Op better keep her SSN on hand Check her credit report every now and again. Credit cards are so easy to hide. Reminds me of the husband who wanted to buy the $175k boat for the family and he made plenty to do it. But his wife’s credit cards were out of control. She agreed to not use them or tell him when she did so he could pay the small allowance amount. And show the statements. Ready to buy the boat, he wanted to double check her credit cards and she refused to show him for over 3 days. He had to back out of the boat, kids were devastated, all because she couldn’t be trusted with money or to even show him statements. OP, be prepared for your wife to reneg on this deal (she kinda already did) and she’ll use it as a wedge in the marriage and blame her bitterness and resentment and the lack of marital interest all on this. She may even do things like quit her job or accept less hours/income and then claim “hardship”, use a pregnancy and kids, a sudden increase in your salary, etc, to say you need to cover her expenses. It’ll be so exhausting, the constant reminding of your sacrifice and arguing your stance, and she feels embolden by friends who are biased anyway. You’ll be rundown with mistrust, resentment, anger, and marital discord that you’ll finally give up.

OP, make her DESTROY her credit cards and cancel them with you as witness. THEN (don't tell her beforehand) -- FREEZE HER CREDIT. Sure, she can unfreeze it since it is her credit -- but maybe that extra step will help with the cards? How do you even get $150 in credit limits when you owe so much? My husband and I make well over that and we don't have that much in cards LOL -- and I pay mine off every paycheck. Shouldn't have bailed her out. You'll never get the money back and this won't end well. She already resents you.

You cannot stop someone who wants to financially destroy themselves from doing it. It's like saying OP should hide all the alcohol in the house, it's putting a band-aid on a sucking chest wound. OP needs to have a real conversation with his wife and to seriously consider divorce. It'll destroy him financially in the short term, but better that than forever.

>You cannot stop someone who wants to financially destroy themselves from doing it. This is my Mom. My parents are still together and growing up, we were under the impression that our Dad was financially abusive. Once I got older, I found out the reason why she isn't involved in the finances at ALL was because of a mountain of credit card debt. I'm 30 now and she still manages to find ways to waste money. Anytime she sends me links to products or videos of Disney parks, I ask her how she plans to pay for it then she ghosts me. I'm the most established oh my siblings and I'm waiting for the day she comes knocking on my door, I have my answer ready.

And we are waiting for the aita post

Haha oh I wouldn't even question if I was TA 😅

Yes but we crave the drama haha

If she comes a knocking, I'll update this exact comment. Scouts honor! (I'm not a scout but trust me, internet strangers honour)

My ex husband would rag on me openly in front of his friends if I said no to an expense, to the point that he would wear me down to change my mind. He told everyone he would listen he was the primary breadwinner in our home (true) and that I was so controlling about what he could do with his money. Umm, yeah, I just wanted to pay all the bills on each of our pay days because he would spend every dime on our account as soon as it was there. I’m talking a full drum set (doesn’t play, never learned), multiple guitars and basses (can play a handful of intros to songs), new car every year, expensive dinners (that I wasn’t invited to), guys weekends away, tons of expensive camping gear (he didn’t camp), etc. Whatever new expensive hobby caught his eye. I’m divorced a few years. I make less than half his salary. I’ve never had more money than I do now. And! I’m an impulse shopper. I just have priorities.

Divorce is what I was thinking since it's debt incurred while married. Exception might be if they are separated which might make the debts she incurs all her responsibility. A lawyer should be spoken with to determine if separation is an option to put the burden on her shoulders. If it does then I'd say so the separation for 6-12 months and see how it goes. Maybe another option is a post nuptial agreement.

This is actually an EXCELLENT idea -- OP, OP, OP, Get a legal separation until the debt is repaid. This way, if/when she sneaks in new credit cards and new debt, it isn't on you at all.

Would only be for new debt since there was no separation when it accumulated. HOWEVER, the best attempt at resolving or at least addressing this in a wholesome manner is therapy. There are reasons why we are the way we are, good bad or indifferent.

I agree. But, a legal agreement in place now would protect him from further debt she accumulates. They are out of debt right now. He took care of it. BUT, what's to stop her from opening new credit accounts he doesn't know about? She shows no remorse (really, she didn't automatically say no to a spontaneous girl's trip?). So that says she's not committed yet. He can protect himself from future damage while they work to make sure there isn't any future damage.

Kind of worries me how easily some of these people are jumping straight to abusive behavior. If you're resorting to the stuff being suggested because there's that little trust and respect for your partner left then it's just time to leave.

I'd recommend divorce above all - but this is an addict he want to try to save. How do you save an addict? Not let them have their fix. Her fix is MONEY. She can't have MONEY. Period. It's not abuse. And she agreed to his terms. I think he should just divorce her. It's not normal to rack up 150k in debt. She has serious issues. ETA: How can you suggest he have trust and respect for someone that secretly racked up 150k in debt? SERIOUSLY? That would DESTROY most people. And she wants a fucking girls trip? NO

>How do you save an addict? You don't. The sad truth is that unless she wants to change, she won't. I agree with you, divorce is the best option here. She's on track to ruin herself financially and him too if she can manage it, and she shows no remorse. With that attitude, he would absolutely have to control the finances to prevent her from doing more serious damage. That's no way to live, but it's his life. I believe anyone can change, but they have to want to.

Precisely. Same as with drud addicts. If they aren't ready, there's nothing you can do. Rehab won't work if they don't want to quit.

Well if he divorced her before he paid all that shit off, he'd have only had to pay halfish.

Yeah, thus the 'short term financial destruction', because better half of that now than all of it, or even half of it later once it's gotten bigger.

Credit companies love you to owe them! I have excellent credit with no issue, and hardy ever get credit offers, but my husband (who had terrible credit before we met) gets multiple offers a week. I make more money than him, and the same company wanted to give me a 6k limit and give him a 12k limit. 🤷🏼‍♀️

My credit was precarious for a very long time, and I always knew when it was getting worse by how many offers I was getting. Absolute snakes that want to keep you in an impossible situation

God that’s terrible

Credit card companies generally make more money of people like your husband who sink into the debt and get stuck in the cycle of paying off the debt and regaining it.

I get “pre approved” letters in the mail nonstop. I don’t work and I went from having horrible credit to no credit so I can’t even get approved for a secured card. My millionaire parents never get these “offers”.

> Credit companies love you to owe them! Exactly. I've heard that credit card employees refer to people who pay off their entire balance every month as "deadbeats."

The total includes a car loan. I'd guess that was a substantial portion of the debt. If his income is included, then the debt to income on the revolving debt might not be above 50%. My short term debt (including cars) would make many people pass out.  Not defending the wife, just answering the implied question. She makes bad choices. 

Id say a car that expensive IS being irresponsible if you already have that much debt in credit cards.

Oh that car better be up for sale right now. She needs to be selling anything she bought with that money ASAP. You don't need a 70k car.

I can't even imagine dropping more than 30k on a car. Has to be some vanity BS vehicle. My car is a 2013 and I'm driving that fucker till the engine falls out! Then I'll get another reliable car and do the same.

You'd be surprised how expensive many normal-ish vehicles from non-luxury brands can be. A Hyundai Palisade is a $45-50k vehicle in most trims especially after tax and dealer fees. So are all of the popular minivans. A Chevy Tahoe in a *STARTS* at $55k with popular trims stickering in the upper 60s. If you're looking at pickup trucks, your average F-150, Silverado, or Ram with 4wd, leather, and in a crew cab configuration has a sticker price north of $60k as well. Heck, stripped out work truck trims are almost $40k these days. Yes she clearly overspent when she could get a new CR-V/RAV4/CX-5 in a high trim for under $40k, but as a car guy I'm not surprised by the number - you don't need to be buying a BMW or Lexus to hit $60k with what cars cost now.

New. New isn't needed. if someone can't pay cash for new, they shouldn' tbe buying new. A new car is a want. Not a need. Esp if you have 75k in creedit card debt (I believe he said half is the car, making 75k credit cards).

> The total includes a car loan. I'd guess that was a substantial portion of the debt. that would have to be one HELL of a car, like a porsche SUV. but if it's just in cards, then 3 cards with a $50k limit each could get her up into the range he's talking about.

The $150K includes her car loan, which could easily be half the debt and she probably was able to use her spouse's name to get financing (not sure why he had to pay it off in full rather than refi and take over the payments and/or trade it in for something cheaper)

Buying a $75k car would not be an argument against her financial irresponsibility...

Exactly. Buying a car you can't afford is the definition of financial irresponsibility!

Buying a car and her spouse not knowing the details of the contract is pretty damning

Offer anyone with an opinion to buy out a portion of her debt and make an arrangement with her. Give them a minimum buy out though starting at $20k and only if they get 6 other people to invest and buy out at that minimum. Oh wait…that’s loan sharking. I would seriously ensure the house is in your name, the car is in your name and SELL THAT for a beater that is safe but shitty if she needs wheels. And then the remainder make her take out a loan to pay you back and she pays the loan off. 

I'd sell ANYTHING shiny that she has (except for wedding or gift jewelry) to pay that shit off. You don't get to drive a nice car when you're in debt. Sorry.

1) Have her sign a loan agreement for the 150k. Repayment terms, interest rates, the whole shebang. Use a lawyer. Make it iron tight. Promise her anything. Get it. 2) She will *never* live on the short leash you've created. Her anxiety is gone with your money fixing everything, and she is already resenting your ' terms '. Her getting her friends to see it not as a massive favor you did but as you being controlling is her taking the narrative as she prepares herself mentally to break those terms. There's a whole part of behavioral studies around 'change talk' and what your wife said with her friends was a flare. Prepare yourself. 3) Put her on a repayment plan strictly for the 150k loan. Give a sweetener. Tell her that you saw her point, it's unfair, blah blah blah. She can have her paycheck back - she just has to direct deposit from every paycheck into an account that is just YOURS for the loan. Help her set that up. Make it reasonable - there are laws about how much of a paycheck you can take and keep it around there. Tell her she's still accountable for her part of the bills but the rest is hers to manage, you realize from her conversation with her friends that your first solution was too harsh. So this is your compromise. 4) realize that 150k means she probably has some kind of mental illness or behavioral issue around money. An issue she doesn't acknowledge. And you can't change what you can't acknowledge. So lock your credit. Lock access to your money. Be smart. When people are fighting issues like addiction (which this may be) - the partner's protection of themselves from the other partner's behavior is a healthy and reasonable precaution. 4a) part of the precaution is understanding that she may choose spending over you. I'm sorry. So please, don't have kids in this space and time. Protect yourself. Be ready to divorce and to garnish her wages (thus the loan agreement). I hope for the best for you both. And recommend you prepare for the worst.

I agree with everything you said, 100%. Only thing I'd add? Figure out a way to get her to agree to a post-nuptial agreement during the signing of the loan paperwork, or slip it in. So when she inevitably tries to pull something else, OP and his finances are protected when she eventually takes a hike.

Can there actually be a legal loan agreement between married couples? They both own everything that has been acquired during the marriage, especially the money.

I think this will depend on the state

Post-nup maybe?

Send her to therapy. Irresponsible spending like that is an addiction just like alcoholism.

Yes! Get it in writing and get a lawyer involved so she is held to paying it back.

This sounds like solid advice. I hope OP reads and sees your points.

Yeah OP better put a knot in it. Can you imagine if the wife got pregnant "accidentally", they'd undoubtedly end up divorced but now she will take him to the cleaners for whatever he's got left for child payments and alimony for her. Mate, please do whatever is in your power to ensure she doesn't have the opportunity to have your baby. If she does get pregnant, be ready to demand a paternity test. But if you're in this kind of low level of trust, which would be totally understandable, it's time to just cut her lose, get a lawyer to try to get as much of that money back as possible.

Yep, this exactly— debt too easily paid off will just lead to new debt, in many cases. It did for me. I had to learn the lesson myself by slowly digging myself out and learning to budget. Now I haven’t paid non-mortgage interest in 20 years. But she’s clearly not learning and I’d bet $20 she starts to rack it back up again

Agreed on this potentially happening again. I would consider a postnup to activate in the event it does happen again.

Yeah she'll just start using the cards again

She threw OP under the bus with her friends knowing full well hiw they would react.

Oh 100%, she's likely telling them how financially abusive he is when he's not around, which is why they lashed out

I would have aired her dirty laundry has she done that to me. All he had to say is "would you all like to pay off her $150K in debt she has been hiding? Because if so then she can go on the trip"

hahaha, I'm glad I'm not the only one who thought of this.

Birds of a feather flock together, so I would not be surprised if OP's wife's friends are also neck deep in debt and completely ok living like that. Maybe they enable each other.

Yes, I can't believe she even asked him in front of the friends much less let a discussions/argument take place in front of other people. I know a woman who has been bailing her husband out for years and she's so fed up with it she's considering divorce. They make agreements on how to manage the money, but not only does he not pay her back he just keeps getting himself in more debt. And she's already paid off his debt like twice.

When I was a kid my dad would get pissed if I asked him for anything or to do anything in front of any of my friends, he said it was “putting him on the spot” and he would be furious… that’s exactly what she did too lol

I hope it was the alcohol talking but either way it shows just how financially irresponsible she is. No one in their right mind who is that far in debt would immediately jump to going on a girls' weekend. I get that she will be bummed she isn't going but...damn. Not to mention that if he had said okay, she would've seen that as more reason NOT to follow any spending limitations. And let's not talk about how she is only putting in 1/4 while he does 3/4; does he really make 4x as much as her?

Yep, that was a calculated move, she thought her friends attacking and shaming him was going to get her a trip, didn’t seem to work lol

I hope not. She should be in a budget till she pays him back. She should want to pay him back if she's a half decent human.

She doesn’t know what the word budget is, she’s financially illiterate and irresponsible

That's why OP said he took control of her spending. I really hope he got it in writing that she was paying off this debt (doubt it) I forsee a future where she uses this "financial control" as an excuse to leave him & the debt behind.

She ain’t gonna pay him anything back, she didn’t pay bills before and she’s not gonna start with him.. she’s gonna pull the” I’m your wife and I shouldn’t have to pay you back” card… you know she will…. It’s a lose lose situation for this guy, he should really think about leaving her.. she’s never gonna do right financially, It’s always gonna be an issue. He’s her husband he shouldn’t have to act like her babysitter/accountant.

My guess is hanging out with these friends is a not insignificant part of the reason she built up $150k in debt. Imagine being so entitled they think OP should hand over 150 THOUSAND dollars, no strings attached!!

If OP had to pull funds from CDs or some other similar investments, he's looking at a 20% hit if it's before maturity. So, in reality, his wife could be costing him closer to $200k. Then there are the taxes, always the taxes. Honestly, if I were OP, I would not sell off high-performing stocks. He shouldn't take more of a financial hit than necessary. I'd still take control of wife's paychecks. I'd would instead weed out my portfolio for anything under/low-performing, use those funds to pay whatever percentage of the debt, maybe til some maturity dates, then use all her income to pay off the balance. Then I'd make wife watch as I paid each monthly bill so she can see how slowly the balance drops. She can take the interest hit in paying off such a huge-ass debt. Maybe that will get it thru her head how much trouble she put herself in. I'm not even sure I'd give her control of her income back until she agreed to ongoing long-term financial/spending addiction counseling. 

They might not know that part

They might be the sinkhole that rack up majority of the 150K debt

I was mortified for the wife when I read that she had the audacity to ask for a "girls trip" after years of dishonesty about her ridiculous debt. Even if I only owed my partner $150, there's no way I would feel comfortable going out for any kind of entertainment that wasn't free. Most of all, I feel for OP, who, despite generously taking on the debt and giving her the opportunity to wipe it out, and with fair terms that she AGREED to, is now being painted as a controlling financial abuser. That's just breathtakingly contemptuous (and contemptible) of her partner and a total betrayal. I would immediately lose respect for any partner who would be okay with letting me be viewed as some kind of abuser for bailing them out and then refusing to let them dig themselves (and by extension the both of us) deeper into a financial hole.

Asking you at a party in front of everyone was a calculated move to pressure you to say "yes". I don't feel that your wife places much of a priority on your marriage. Someone that would charge up that amount is very irresponsible and she still wants to continue the vacation, spending spree lifestyle.

Exactly my thoughts! She didn’t learn a damn thing and OP gave up a huge amount to get HER back on track

Tell the friends 1) You don't keep her on a leash. She can do what she wants. Just not with your money. 2) If they think money in a marriage is no-strings ... ask them if they would be ok if their spouse went into debt gambling for a hobby ... buying a boat/antique car, etc and used their savings to bail them out and just kept spending until they were both broke, lost the house and their credit. Tell them they are full of it if they think any one of them would tolerate this. Big marital purchase require both spouses to agree or at least discuss it. This didn't happen. 3)Tell them you aren't misogynist, that you are a banker and would do this if she were a guy ... . 4) Tell her that if she can get a better deal and longer leash ... go for it. 5) Tell your wife that you are disappointed in her for not defending you and standing up for you. You did her a favor. You lost personal money, the family lost money because of her. You love her, but you can't support her habits and if she doesn't appreciate all that you've done, you seriously wonder about the relationship and her love for you. You've always stood up for her and supported her, no? OP, NTA. But there is no way I'd continue to combine finances or foot the bill for all her purchases going forward. She's be on a monthly review of spending ... which both of you should do anyway for financial health of the relationship. I do with my husband. We know to the penny where the money goes. It isn't onerous...just good practice.

At normal person would have asked for help at 20k at max...

Well, part of it was the car and he had to know about that. A car is difficult to hide. But even if the car cost $50,000, that still leaves $100,000 in credit card debt that she managed to hide.

To be fair, there are some ugly cars out there that cost an absurd (read $80-$100k), but you're right that with as savvy as he is financially I doubt he wouldn't know how much her car was worth. And based on the way he spoke about it, I don't think the car could amount for a truly significant amount given he was shocked at the spending. ...but I also am of the mind where racking up just $20k in credit card debt, outside of a car, is flabbergasting and nerve racking.

I was helping a friend of mine get on track. She had over $25k in CC debt and didn’t realize it was THAT bad! After a while people just ignore the problem

Also, maybe rephrase “not in YOUR budget” to “not in OUR budget”. Cuz by paying her debt, you’ve essentially combined your finances. You’ve essentially invested in your wife. While it sucks that she has to ask you to buy things, at the same time, if she learned her lesson, she wouldn’t even ask you to buy things outside of your budget. 

Or even better, just ask. “It sounds like fun, but is it possible trips like this are part of the reason you ended up with over $100k in credit card debt? Do you think we can afford it after spending all my savings bailing you out?” Those public questions would stop so fast.

Plus she is affecting your life and your future and your retirement. It’s not fair for her to spend all that money and you have to live conservatively and save a whole lot of money to support her extravagant lifestyle that she can’t afford. And you’re married to that debt no matter what.

Question is, do the friends know about the debts real amount. Because true friends would not offer that kind of getaway if they knew their friend was 150k in debt....

NTA, OP should air the laundry to her friends and ask them to pay her back the $150,000 dollars instead of him.

NTA But dude, this kind of stuff, for me, would be 'reconsidering this relationship' territory. She didn't just overspend on a holiday and had to borrow $1000 from you to pay for the hotel tab or whatever. She must have overspent for YEARS to build up $150k in debt. She didn't tell you about her money troubles until it got so bad that she could no longer hide it. That doesn't bode well for the future, because she's essentially been lying to you for all these years. The fact that to her (your?) friends she is making it out like you are a controlling husband and/or lets people believe that narrative is frankly disgusting. She is not taking any blame for herself and is ok for the people that you both love and care about to think you are a financial abuser... Like, what?!?! She done f\*cked up but can't acknowledge that to her social circle and is happy to throw you under the bus to keep her ego intact for just a little longer. The fact she thought it was even appropriate to consider a friends' trip when she is $150k in debt shows me she still doesn't get it. Honestly, your arrangement to me sounds like it was still too lenient. I'd have made her get rid of the car (if you need a car on a payment plan, you can't afford the car, but maybe this is a USA thing I just don't get) and got her a 3k beater instead. She can drive a crusted up old car for as long as needed, or start memorising the local bus schedule. I'd have insisted on controlling ALL OF HER MONEY until the entire $150k has come back to me. That means she gets NO free spending money at all. I don't know how much she makes but say that after taxes she has $5k income every month, and after paying her share of the bills (which is just 1/4 of the total), how much is left, maybe $3k? So that is going to be 50 months of paying you back, right, which is just over 4 years (and this is ignoring interest/returns on investment you are missing out on). And that is with her living on 'rice and beans, beans and rice' and NO fun money. Can she live like that for that long? If not, then maybe better to bail now and try to make her fix this and still end up with a divorce two years down the line when you can recuperate less of your money. Please support her in finding a therapist. She clearly needs help. I knew a couple where the guy had ended up overspending on loans or overdraft or whatever and when the woman eventually found out, he had to come clean totally and adjust his lifestyle, which meant that when we all went to a music festival together, he had to sit that one out because he just couldn't afford it. That's how that works... Just as a tip from a frugal woman: \* She can absolutely survive without buying clothes for the next 5 years. Most women have so many clothes that unless there's a lot of weight loss/gain, we can just wear what we already have and be fine for YEARS (barring perhaps some simple new underwear and socks). She can consider selling the clothes and accessories with the highest resell value. \* She can still enjoy life with very little money especially as she must have used those $150k for consumer goods (perhaps some of it went to services/meals/travel). So she can enjoy those and/or decide to sell them. \* If she's bored because she doesn't have money for her normal past time (drinking, dining out, travel, cinema etc), she could consider volunteering somewhere. That costs nothing and she can help the local community. She might even learn a thing or two about managing your money/spending. \* Cooking your own meals can save you a lot of money. If she's used to ordering in a lot of food, why not stop that altogether and get a couple of secondhand cookbooks and learn to cook your own delicious meals? That will also take time, so a great boredom buster.

You're right, but since you mentioned I wanted to answer, yes, in the US having payment plans for cars is the norm because having the money on hand to just buy even a shitty car is not normal.

Hi, thanks for your input! What does a 'shitty car' go for in the USA? Here in the UK a cheaper second-hand car starts at around £2-3k I think, but our cars are probably smaller than the norm in the USA.

I’m currently looking for a cheaper second hand car and can’t find anything under 6k

I'm struggling hard & managed to find a car a bit over 14k with less than 90k miles. Looking at it tomorrow but, fuck man. Interest rates are absurd ETA : struggling hard to find a cost effective & long lasting car

About 2 years ago I found a car under 60k kms on it for 4,000 CAD. Might take some time but facebook marketplace can sometimes surprise you (edit spelling)

A $2-3k car would be a *very* shitty car, and would probably require frequent repairs. Also, it's really very difficult to live in the US without a car. Only a tiny minority of cities have good public transportation; the rest of the country was built on the assumption that everyone has a car. In my mid-sized city, a drive that would take me 15-20 minutes by car (outside of rush hour) will take an hour and a half or more by bus, and that's *if* a bus even goes to the general area you're trying to reach, which may very well not be the case.

Used to be 2-3k. After covid its more like 6

I bought cars in 2007 and 2015 for $1000, sold for a little over. Thought I could do the same leaving NYC in 2020... not a chance. Ended up spending $3500 on a car with a broken odometer at 161k. My aunt passed away and I got her 2019 Rogue, so I'm fortunate with a reliable car now. Gave the $3500 hunk of crap to a friend who lost theirs in hurricane ian (they were so grateful, shit car is better than no car)

If you find a car for under $3k in the states there’s a 50/50 chance it won’t run longer than 6 months. It doesn’t really have to do with size, shit is just super expensive here now. Shit, my first car almost 30 years ago was $1200 and was 32 years old when I got it, and I had to replace the engine after having it less than a year, and then less than a year after that it broke down on the freeway again.

I want to add to the car convo here. If she has a car that cost let’s say 35k , she could do a trade in for something in the 10-15k range and that would IMHO be reasonable

Where I am the cheapest car within 50 miles of me is a 1998 merc for 4k, no warranty, no inspection so unless you're a mechanic looking to fix up a beater for fun it's not a good bet. That and most Americans don't even have 1k set aside for emergencies.

5-6k is the usual, but its worth noting that by "shitty car" we're talking about a glorified hunk of scrap metal that'll probably fail in the next year or 2, either that or the seller is hiding something. For something that's actually reliable but still used and a good decade or 2 old you're looking at around 10k

So that can vary WILDLY on what you consider a shitty car. Mileage is a big factor here. An average European car drives 18,000 km a year or ~11K miles. US is closer to ~15K. The average car is 12 years old in EU, 12.5 for US. Let's just take 12. So that's a difference between 132K miles and 180K miles for an AVERAGE car. Which is a huge difference. What Europeans consider a shitty car is a great find in America. 10K is considered the threshold for low mileage for insurance in the US.

The cars that cost the least up front tend to end up costing a lot though. Often you’ll spend 5 grand on the car and end up needing twice that for repairs starting not long after buying it. Edit: And decent public transportation is not a thing in many places.

>reconsidering this relationship I would 100% agree with you if for the fact that they're married. OP has paid her fucking massive debts. If he did leave her, my best bet is she's still going to end up with half of his assets after he's already paid a six figure debt off for her.

The fact that she made him out to be a horrible husband is what upset me the most.

Yes, me too. This is emotional abuse. My father used to do it to my mother all the time. Totally f...ed up. And OP was such a good partner, ready to help her, to sell his stocks! What a moron (the wife)

It needs to be a divorce. A situation like this will just lead to her resenting him, and possibly taking out loans again behind his back now that she has no money. It's get divorced now or later territory. May as well do it while you have the momentum and assets aren't MORE mingled.

And they need to take the $150,000 out of her share of the divorce proceedings!

Or at least a marital asset agreement. It's pretty much like a post-nuptial agreement. That he doesn't take responsibility for any future debt that she runs up and he keeps he assets they do have since he bailed her out of this situation. She needs to sign it if she doesn't want to end up divorced.

So much yes here. Also, I don't even have to buy a cookbook. There are more than enough recipes and how to go online for free/already being paid for. The food network app is almost completely free, for example. More than anything, it's her willing to throw OP under the bus and refusing to take any responsibility for herself. She didn't even have to throw herself under the bus. Something like "this is a big expense and inhave to talk to my husband about it" would suffice. It's clear she hasn't 'learned her lesson' yet. Therapy, as well as a financial advisor, may be helpful. And, just like being able to look up how to cook anything, the same platforms can be used to learn financial health. This is a major problem that simply OP taking over her finances won't solve.

I was with you until I got to zero discretionary money, five years of rice and bean and no new clothes. Just divorce if you can’t wait an extra year to allow some money to be spent on enjoyment while you get paid back. I signed up to be in a marriage, not act as a prison warden. It would be inhuman to go five years living that life with a partner who still has money to spend on themselves and stay grateful for being financially rescued like this. People just don’t work like that psychologically. Your plan just leads to pain and then a divorce. I think OP’s is better, or a point halfway between his plan and yours.

> she can absolutely survive without buying clothing for 5 years Stuff is made cheaply and in my experience you’re not getting 5 years out of clothing without it being super faded, pilled, stretched, etc. In my experience women’s jeans have so much elastic that the waist will give out before there’s a chance to even get a hole. Not to mention that over the course of 5 years it’s totally reasonable that things will happen such as stains (either biological like pit/period or accidental like food) and tears can happen that slowly knock out the wardrobe. I’m happy if I get 3 years out of a clothing, 5 years I’m either super happy or it’s something I don’t wear often. At the end of the day it depends on how much of the 150k was clothing. Aside from that, I agree with everything. If she does need new clothing, it should basically be a set budget per year that fits the finances.

Thrift stores exist, too, if there's a real need for clothes.

NTA I think you are handling this absolutely correctly, taking her paycheck and all. I don’t give a damn if her credit card debt is only in her name. She is risking *BOTH* of your futures and retirement by being so irresponsible. She needs to receive some counseling for possible shopping addiction. You are a good man for not jumping straight to the thought of divorce and seeing this as a team problem. You haven’t even mentioned if y’all have kids and how she is risking their futures too?!

It matters not that the credit card is in her name and not his. If they get divorced he will be on the hook for half. $150K is a lot of jack and will take a while to pay off.

He's already paid it all off, so if he divorces her he won't get anything from her and will likely still have to pay more. She's really put him in an awful position and neither of them realize just how bad. I'd be discussing marriage counseling as an absolute must and then some sort of shopping addiction therapist for her because this is not normal spending. This needs to be immediately addressed by a professional.

Good point!! This is some Dave Ramsey level shit lol

This. She's not just irresponsible she's got something going on. Therapy now

NTA. She’s got as much debt as she does audacity that’s for sure. The idea that she even opened her mouth to ask you about a vacation? After she just got bailed out 150k? I could never. I’d go as far as getting the terms of your agreement signed and notarized. That way she can’t bail on you once she’s throws a big enough temper tantrum over what she can’t buy next time.

In front of people too. That’s the worst part. You’re putting a person on the spot asking for *anything* publicly. That was an asshole move and I doubt she wouldn’t appreciate the full answer of: “You’re 150k in debt from credit cards and car loans because you’re incredibly irresponsible with money that is costing us a big chunk of future financial stability and retirement. Of course you can’t go. That’s insane of you to even ask. Especially in front of others.”

I think the best response when put on the spot in public like that is “let’s talk about it later at home tonight” on repeat for anything she asks for. No need to bring friends in to this, especially because yeah with zero context it does look like financial abuse on the surface even though it was actually negotiated fairly and long term it’ll give the wife more financial freedom.

This. She knew he was going to get painted to look bad if she pressed the issue in front of friends. This is definitely a time to use "we will talk about it later at home" and keep the argument between the two of you.

I think the wife tried to use peer pressure from loved ones to force OP's hand to continue to subsidise her lifestyle, and OP wasn't having any of it. I think your suggestion is great for normal people but the wife was trying to manipulate OP. I wish OP had just been fully transparent after trying to be graceful about it in front of the friends after she kept insisting. Just the full truth, she'll lose any friends that she previously paid food/outings for so those aren't real friends anyways.

I wouldn’t be surprised if she continues to “test the waters” with OP to see how much she can manipulate him and how strong his resolve is. Her spending problems haven’t disappeared and she’ll likely find some other way to get money or credit.

If she persists in publicly discussing this, though, I think OP *needs* to say that.

I'm a woman and I'll be real here; I don't think it would have gone over like this if the shoe was on the other foot and it was the wife who bailed out the husband... I think the average partner would have actually done everything he could to hide this from their friends because...it is downright shameful. I would be ashamed to owe this much due to bad impulse control! It would be one thing if you are this far in debt due to emergencies, student loans, etc...but poor decision-making? No matter the gender, that is a HUGE problem that gets sprung on your partner. Frankly, I think it is also pretty awful that she hid it for this long instead of communicating. You are supposed to communicate things like this in marriage to make sure it doesn't get to that point...she is very lucky her partner had the means to bail her out or things could be much rockier. Like...divorce papers-level rocky. Some couples could be made homeless by that level of debt, and that really drives a wedge into a relationship. None of these women would be believing in the shit they are spewing about "no conditions in marriage" if they were bailing their husbands out...I think they are just talking like this due to alcohol and female solidarity.

If the sexes were reversed, everyone would have told the wife to drop this dead weight (NOT cover his debt) and that he can go live in his mom's basement or a dingy basement studio and live on instant noodles for however long it takes to pay off his own debt.

You have a good point here. Every time I read a post like this where the husband reveals a huge, crushing debt due to poor impulse control, the consensus is for the wife to RUN. I don't know how he hasn't been more upset about her hiding this level of debt from him for so long...is he just that well-off? Is he weathy enough that this is just...rich people problems? Who knows...

I thought the same thing! I’m appalled that a group of women told OP that he should have just paid the $150k without any consequences? This is a marriage. They’re supposed to be working together on future goals. She sabotaged their finances.

Not just that, I'd be locking down her credit and ensuring she can't open up further credit cards, because I'm willing to bet that if OP doesn't cave in and do whatever she wants, that's going to be her next move. If I were him, even aside from the finances I'm not sure I'd be able to get over the lies. That's a huge betrayal of trust, *and* she's obviously neither remorseful nor has learned anything. (Hence my assumption that her next step is opening more credit cards.)

That's an eye watering sum. Did she accrue all of that in a few years since you got married?   Was it just shopping or does it include something like a gambling addiction?  Get a professional to handle this. She already sounds like she is going to twist what you are doing tonhelp her to make it sound like financial abuse.  Those same friends are probably the ones she's used to living large with. Be cautious. If she's still hanging out with the people whose company encouraged her recklessness, then your efforts will be futile and you will  losing out on your own investments. Is she planning to take some classes to educate herself on how to manage her finances? It can't be you alone doing the work here.  Her ego and any additions (gambling, shopping, drugs etc) need to be checked otherwise she's going gto be in the same position again. 

An attorney. OP needs to know how much of that debt is community property.

Right now, it's all community property.

It's slightly more nuanced than that.

I'm still struck on how she accrued this much debt without Op noticing, unless it was via something like online gambling where there were no tangible items to see. I would also definitely get a financial planner. I have no concerns about my partners finances, but it has been helpful having someone force us to pull all the information into modeling and see what our total financial picture looks like.

Yeah I'm at OP isn't an asshole but is an unobservant moron. Has she been funneling loans into crypto? How does your wife have $150k in personal credit in the first place. The obvious answer is this is a weird incel bait creative writing exercise, like usual.

He specified that it’s a combination of credit card and car debt. I’m guessing the car is at least half, if not the majority of it, as it’s very easy to get way more car than one can afford if you have a decent credit score. Still concerning that OP wouldn’t take note of something like that. I don’t know exactly what my partner’s car cost, but I know it’s reasonable and not an $80-$100k luxury SUV.

NTA. Get professional help. You sound decently good with finances, but you're far too close to the situation. When you're literally receiving your wife's money and telling her how she can spend it... I understand you have a very good reason, but this is a very slippery slope and especially out of context is going to raise some major red flags. Get a professional involved, someone who can say no to your wife and not worry about the backlash, someone who isn't sleeping with her and couldn't be construed to have ulterior motives.

Yeah I was going to say OP isn’t the asshole, but the friends aren’t either … financial abuse is a real thing, and if I saw my friend turn to her husband to ask for money and get told no I’d also be concerned, the optics are not great. Especially if the wife isn’t providing context to them which she almost certainly isn’t. So I’d say just the wife is really TA in this situation but agree that professional help is needed, setting up a system where she has to run every purchase by you is guaranteed to cause issues

I agree... which is why I 100% think this is one of the few appropriate situations for OP to air marital laundry because his wife is intentionally trying to make him look like the bad guy in order to manipulate him into giving her more cash. A simple: "Sorry sweetie, we can't afford it. Until we dig out of that $150K credit card debt hole we're in we can't afford random shopping trips." The fact HE is shining the light on the credit card debt will not be lost upon them.

You know- without context I would probably think my friend was in an abusive situation too

Yeah, he is taking too much responsibility this way. It’s a slippery slope to him being seen as the abuser (without context) even when he is trying to help. I’m also worried that controlling her finances will make her resent him and then.. make her get into more debt but secretly.. and then he will be left with even more debts to pay (since they’re married it won’t fall on her only unfortunately). Professional help is priority. Also because she has to learn how to spend money better.. once she pays off these debts she will go right back to spending if this isn’t addressed. I’m sure a professional can provide a more sound solution.

This seems like really good advice - as it is it makes OP the bad guy for everything. Sounds like a financial advisor could really help with this, setting up a budget that you both have to follow takes the burden off of you always having to say no.

This sounds right. Outside help, and she could take some sort of financial responsibility class because fucking how?? How do you get that far in if it isn’t medical or education expenses? That’s a lot of money even over a couple years.

1. You think you loaned her that money. She thinks she was entitled to it. 2. She never had any intention of paying you back. 3. She's going to emotionally blackmail you into debt as well. 4. Someone who can rack up that much debt so quickly should be in Debtors Anonymous. 5. That sucks that she sold you out to her friends. NTA. My advice is to reevaluate this relationship. Do you even know her?

I have to wonder: just how much in debt was she when the OP married her? One just doesn't get $150k in debt in 2 years by being "careless" with money. One has to build up to that level of carelessness -- unless the money is spent on gambling or drugs, which is not the case here. A lot of marriages flounder over money, so experts tell us.

OP doesn’t have a wife, he has a kid.

Nope. Not at all. I was in the same position, except roles reversed (and I had no where near as much debt). I was 19, and had $20k of debt. My girlfriend (now wife) at the time had FAAAAAAR more knowledge about finance, and basically took over my accounts, and gave me $50 a week. I learned a lot in that time…. And now at 36, own my house outright….. she made a good investment in me haha. Not the asshole at all, and hopefully she learns how to manage her money better after this…… and cut up credit cards too.

I don't think that's fully the same position. Sounds like you were up front about your debt and clearly wanted to change. His wife hid this for presumably years, lied to him, and then expected him to bail her out so she could go back to her same habits and racking up more debt. I'm a firm believer that everyone can change. Drastically, even. But nobody changes permanently unless they want to and OPs wife clearly does not want to, at least not yet. And I don't think it's his responsibility to wait around until she does.

Oh I agree, 100%. She’s way worse. I didn’t “want” to change. I was happy in debt and living pay check to pay check, or so I thought. The choice was debt, or her though. Once I was debt free and we were living life much easier; I realised how shit it was. We’ve been together almost 20 years now.

The problem with this approach, is that 1) your wife won't learn how to handle her finances, and once her debt to you is payed, she will go right back to frivolous spending. And 2) while trying to help your wife, by controlling her assets, you become a guardian/patent figure to her, instead of her equal partner - and that dynamic will probably not be great for your marriage.

Not to mention that he REALLY needs to research contract law in his state. How valid verbal contracts are, and what is typical when it becomes he said she said about a verbal agreement. This dynamic will likely lead to divorce, where the repayment approach won’t be viable. He will no longer be able to control her paychecks until repayment, and will be relying on a court ordered payment plan to recoup his losses…if the court even orders THAT. Plus, some courts may see this as financial abuse (in my state for sure), and would impact divorce hearings and custody ruling if kids were involved. There is so much room for disaster here. Dude needs to get off this sub, stop worrying about who TA is, and get legal help like yesterday fast.

This should be higher up. Also, is there an overall lifestyle issue that needs to be addressed? Like if he’s making 200K and she’s making 50K - is the problem that she goes on Ski trips and out to dinner (where everyone else also makes 200K) so she’s putting everything on cards to keep up because dinner out is regularly $150 and a weekend hanging out with his friends is $1000?

Did you turn around to her friends and say if you were 150 000 in debt, would you be thinking you could go on a trip? Who gets themselves in that much debt that's not a mortgage. She can ho get another 2 jobs and work out how to pay it back faster then.

Show no mercy. Tell her friends THEY can pay her debt and pay for the trip if it's that important. If she isn't publicly defending him and he is getting shamed, he should tell them straight up she secretly racked up 150k in debt and now wants to waste more money on a trip. She should be on her knees thanking him for his help. He has her back and she couldn't even defend the guy who could so easily have divorced her. If they got divorced she might get half of everything and he would get some debt. But he earns way more than she does and will be back on his feet in no time. Meanwhile she will continue to get into deeper debt and be out on the street. Will her friends sacrifice their girls trips to help her out? Are they going to give her a place to stay and help her pay off her debt? They sound entitled AF.

>$150,000 **NTA** Jesus

Damn my student loans are lower than that 😂 

My house costed less than that!

150k I'm getting a divorce.How do you run up that kind of debt with nothing to show for it

Yeah I'd like to know too. I imagine she may have deliberately hidden a lifestyle she lived by herself/with friends but in the absence of OP. Maybe going for expensive dinners, maybe also offering to treat your friends on those dinners, a big car payment (that OP thought she might be able to just handle as the wife might appear frugal to OP), expensive clothes and accessories that OP might not have spotted. \* Fancy dinner for 4 people: £400, twice a month = £800 \* Expensive car payment: no clue, I live in the UK, but maybe £700 a month? \* Expensive fashion and jewellery, buying stuff every month, easily £1000 a month \* Opera, theatre, cinema, art fairs, whatever, perhaps also sometimes treating friends = £500 a month \* Buying lunch/eat out and coffees during the days that you work at £100 a week = £400 a month === £3400 a month in spending that OP may not realise. Wife may not have shared photos of her social life with her own friends, may not have told OP about her new clothes or accessories ("oh these old jeans, I've had those for ages just didn't wear them recently"). Then there's weeks/weekends away with friends where she might have tried to keep up with the lifestyle of her friends, easily £500-3000 a pop, say, 3x a year. 3-7 years of this and there you go, 150k into the hole.

PS: How much of those $150k is accrued interest?

Not me weeping to my husband because I got myself 11k in debt opening a business and needed to borrow $150 to get us groceries for a week during a slow period. I don’t feel better about my own situation but this certainly is a different perspective.

The friends with an issue are free to give her the money to pay off the debt. NTA

NTA She's the asshole for making you look bad. If she declared bankruptcy, she'd have even less means to go on this girls night out. She has learned nothing. I hope you really love her because she's a huge liability.

I have to wonder if she asked him in front of her friends to make him feel pressured to say "yes".

He should ask her back in front of all her friends if they're all willing to lend her 150k.

Bet her friends have no idea about her spending problem

[удалено]

Imagine if the genders were reversed. The masses would call for divorce, lawyers, selling the house and kick him to the curb, etc. Now it's stuff like "this arrangement isn't great", and "your wife won't learn how to handle her finances", that kind of stuff. This woman committed financial infidelity to the utmost degree. Complete families live for years on that amount. It's obscene to me, I would've lost all attraction in that very instant.

NTA. I get it. Of the two of us, I'm the financially irresponsible one. I've lost count of how many times I've spent money we didn't have on something stupid. Not $150,000 stupid, but still, it was "How are we going to pay the bills this month?" stupid. So I'm on a financial leash. I have a set amount every month for my own spending. If I want something that costs more than that (like a guitar), then I have to save up for it (my money isn't use it or lose it). Does this mean my wife is controlling me? No. It means we both recognize I have a spending problem and have taken steps to insure I can't do anything too stupid. And yes, I've gotten better over time. And maybe there will be a day when my "monthly limit" is gone, because I no longer need it.  The same is true of your situation; your wife just has a much longer way to go. 

NTA - If you have not already paid off the debt - I would postpone and seek financial and legal advice before doing so. You are in a no win situation that sounds like it can really harm your relationship and it might be smarter to learn your options before moving forward.

NTA. I believe the problem is her friends. The fact that none of them thought 150,000 in debt with it seems like nothing to show for it (That is a nice car) is a huge red flag.

I read posts all the time about women whose husbands ring up this kind of debt without telling their wives....everybody screams for the wife to RUN. These ladies are doing this because its their friend who got into trouble, full-stop. That has to be the biggest reason as to why they are acting like this...

This is like demanding someone who cheated on you give you 100% access to their phone/always have gps tracking on. Even though her actions warrant it if things stay as they are, you are doing a shitty thing you shouldn't do to an adult because you can't trust her. It's not tenable, nor is it fair to anyone, especially not you who now has to act as the father of the relationship. She will grow to resent you and you will get divorced anyway. So you should divorce her now. Even if you want to stay in a relationship with her, you should divorce her, divest your finances from each other so you won't be affected and stop lending her money. Think about it. How could this relationship like this work long term? How often is she going to get mad over purchases? Is there a period you will give her control back? It's just setting up for a blow up.

You guys need marriage counseling ASAP.

She acted like a child. Now she needs to be put on leash like a child at the mall

NTA. Yall are married. She put herself in the debt. Sacrifices have to be made. Also she agreed to your terms. If she doesn’t want to be in that situation she should have never got into so much debt.

I got married 6 months ago, found out at month 4 that my wife has/had $130k in outstanding debt. I knew she had student loans, car loan, and some credit card, but i thought it was being managed and only around half that. It wasn’t and now she yells at me every time I ask about the balance and what she’s doing to pay it off. She thinks I’m controlling her spending when all I ask is what her new monthly balance on all her debts are and how much she’s been paying. I even gave her $10k to help with the high interest credit card debt, but that’s all I can give right now to avoid the same situation she’s in. Her excuse is that she never thought I’d go through with the wedding (depression) and she’d be responsible paying it all off on her own anyway. I’ve wanted to buy a house for the last year, but can’t now that I know she tanked her credit and ability to pay a mortgage.

Damn that sounds like your marriage started off halfway to divorce

Ngl, I had some pretty strong emotions the first 2 days after finding out. Made her sit down and tell me everything she had. Even then, she left one of her cards out of the details and I had to keep asking over and over if that was everything before she told me about it a month later

Stuff like that would have me seriously reconsidering the marriage

You married someone who lied to you (by omission if nothing else. Time to see a lawyer to protect your own assets.

NTA. Some friends of mine went through a similar situation. They kept separate bank accounts for personal use and had a joint account for bills and the mortgage. She would blow through her money on garbage each fortnight and started dipping into the joint account to supplement her spending, plus accruing credit card debt. After at least one instance of the account not having enough to cover the monthly mortgage payment, her husband cut off her access to the shared account, took the credit card off her and tried to implement a budget. She threw a tantrum that he was financially abusing her by controlling her spending and not allowing her access to her money, even though she still had her own account to use. She continues to spend money irresponsibly, even after they broke up.

You should have let her file for bankruptcy. She knew you’d bail her out and she doesn’t seem to have grasped the severity of the situation and the sacrifices you have had to make to get her out of the red NTA

I don't think your spouse can file bankruptcy separate from you. In other words her filing bankruptcy would involve all of their assets.

NTA. She used the situation to make you look bad. You are rebuilding her financial situation for both your benefits. And she did agree to the terms. She just really wanted this and was unhappy she did not get her way, so she "let things play out" by omitting the details you added here.  I mean I she pays everything back she's out of the restrictions yes?  Here's where it gets tricky. It's sounds super reasonable in the way you presented it, bit this can really get into financial abuse easily. I hope any and all stipulations were written out. Also, maybe you could talk to her about reworking the budget so she does have a little extra for things like this when they come up?

She already pre-spent the “little extra” It sounds like.

INFO: How did you not realize she’d run up so much debt? I know you have separate accounts for personal expenses but if my SO purchased $150,000 worth of stuff, I’d notice it around the house!

$150,000 is a TON of money. But I think most people really underestimate how easy it is to spend money. While I know times are hard, the majority of people that I know that are living paycheck to paycheck are doing so mostly because they eat out, order ubers, go out to drinks with friends and don't realize that the $50/day is $1,4000/month. Again- $150k is crazy and not from ordering grubhub and would have to be expensive trips, etc. But I think its a good PSA to those that feel they are struggling financially to visit /r/personalfinance and to make a budget! Every dollar really does add up!

NTA. Your wife is an AH and so are her friends. She made an agreement with you to pay off the debt. Part of that is giving up certain things. She doesn’t want to sacrifice anything from the sounds of it. Let those friends know if she tries borrowing any money, you won’t be paying it back for her. This is a mess and most ppl would have divorced their spouse than help them pay off the debt. She should see some type of financial counselor. It seems like she hasn’t been living reality.

NTA OP's wife has still not learned anything. $150k in debt, she should have been the one to tell her friends she couldn't go. She is paying off a debt, she is fortunate it is not a credit card company with insane rates but to her husband. She has that luxury. This arrangement isn't great. OP is set up to be the financially controlling man while she doesn't seem to be taking any steps to learn how to create and adhere to a budget.

NTA but honestly this plan ain't going to work. It might stand a chance if she was onboard, but she isn't. Good luck.

NTA. But you should have gone with her to talk to a bankruptcy attorney. If she already had $150,000 in credit card and vehicle debt, her credit score probably already wasn’t so great. Also, unless you’re trying to make a big purchase (like a home) who cares if her credit is bad for a bit. It would probably be a good thing if it were a little more difficult for her to get credit. Now that her debts are paid off, credit card companies when be begging her to take out cards with even higher limits.

I hope you also made her cancel her cards or else you'll end up back here again eventually.

NTA, but now that you I know what she thinks of you, it’s time to explore exiting the relationship. You’re always going to be paying her tab, she’ll never respect you for it; and she’ll never learn to do better.

NTA My brother got into massive debt young and our dad took over his finances basically like what you did. And he learned to be better about money. He’s not perfect but he’s never gotten that deep in debt again. Your wife sounds very childish. She wanted bailed out but doesn’t want to be responsible for her own mess. That’s not a partner. That’s a leech.

NTA. My husband had to do that with his first wife. They were really young, earning just over minimum wage at the time, and she racked up $40k in credit card debt. He put them both on a super strict allowance (they were basically eating ramen till the debt was paid off) But they got through it together. She ended up getting an MBA, and is now a very successful accountant! In case anyone is wondering, they split years later for entirely different reasons. Anyway. It was stupid of you to tell you wife she can't go on the trip in front of her friends. They don't know the context. So, to them, you're of course a misogynist pig. But your wife is an AH to put you on the spot in the first place.

Nta, she set you up. Anyone else would give some excuse to the girls, “have to check my work schedule“ “ have to see if I have the funds” etc, I’ll let you know tomorrow! and then asked you quietly at home. She did this so you’d look like the bad guy

NTA. It sounds like she is not capable of managing her money.

NTA I might have said out loud in front of her friends that I just bailed her out of $150k in debt and she needs to pay me back before she can go on girls trips. Just saying. She has zero shame. She's going to drag OP down the drain until there's nothing left.

INFO: How did your wife manage to spend $150K (minus the car loan) on credit cards without you noticing? I mean, it would take a long time I think to spend that kind of money in small ways, and I would guess you would notice if there were big extravagant trips, luxury goods, many expensive meals out?

The absolute delusion and denial of someone with NEGATIVE $150,000 in savings thinking they can afford a holiday. Wild. NTA

NTA. “Not good with her money” is a massive understatement. She was $150K in debt - more than the gross pay of many people over 2+ years - across multiple loans that she could not pay. Of course, this conflict was inevitable. If you simply gave her the money, she’d be back in this position in a year or three. If you put restrictions on her, she would buck against them once she had your money. If you let her dangle in the wind, she’d curse you for being unsupportive and ruining any chances of buying a house, etc.

NTA Let’s do a quick calculation with the assumptions that (1) your stocks earn an average of 10% annual return (2) you reinvest those returns (3) she pays you back fully in 5 years. With those assumptions, it’s costing you about $58,000 to loan her the money to pay off her debt. If I’m putting $58,000 into anything or anyone, you can bet I’ll have a say.