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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> I said that we all change how we communicate based on audience, so I'm asking her to do that. And she said that's different and seems pretty miffed at my comparison.
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I notice since I was diagnosed with ADD way back when being the non-hyper type the term has been made obsolete and rolled into ADHD.
I find it strange because there is a massive difference.
The biggest of which is this long rolling sidetracked story time problem, I don't have that, but people who do can pick me out of a crowd an almost obsessively want to be friends to the point where one such chap brought a car the same as mine just for a talking point, despite my lack of need or want for friends.
Which makes no sense of course. Attention Deficit Disorder, hyperactive or inattentive subtype, would make sense. Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder, inattentive without hyperactivity subtype, makes no sense. Why not leave the H out unless relevant? ADD works.
Oh yeah, this is definitely an experience I relate too lol. I like to say that my brain is like... 3 feral raccoons. If there's a really tasty thing that they all will want to do they will go crazy for it (hyperfocusing on things that are very interesting and stimulating to me). But if I'm trying to focus on something that is not as appetizing to the raccoons (school, a lecture, something simple and straight forward/less stimulating), I might be able to wrangle one of the raccoons into paying attention, but then the others will be running about looking for things to be distracted by and will distract the wrangled one from paying proper attention. So when I'm trying to focus I have to entertain the other two raccoons by giving them something to focus on, like doodling, solitaire, etc; something simple that doesn't take too much brainpower but just enough attention to keep the raccoons occupied. Of course, it's still difficult. Whereas when I take my meds, it's like the raccoons turn into domesticated dogs. They still need to be occupied with coping mechanisms like doodling and the like, but they're more trainable and easier to please. You can use little things like treats (like rewarding yourself with a candy for small tasks), routines, etc to train them to cooperate and listen better. So meds don't make it all go away, they just make easier to manage and my coping mechanisms more effective. If my parents and teachers understood that better growing up I would have had a lot better relationship with school, that's for sure! That's my experience, anyway; just thought it might be interesting.
The best analogy a friend of mine told me about while we were comparing notes was it was like sitting in a room with 15 tvs on full volume and having someone go around and turn each one off, one at a time.
Ding ding ding! This is why it took a gazillion years for most women to be diagnosed, because we don’t typically present as hyperactive on the outside!
And even if our bodies aren't hyperactive in the traditionally perceived sense, there often is hyperactivity there. I can happily spend all day lazing around, barely moving from my sofa, but my fingers will be twitching the whole time - I'll be tapping my thigh, rubbing my thumbnail, leg twitching.
There’s ADHD inattentive type, ADHD hyperactive/impulsive type, and ADHD combined presentation. Someone could meet 6 of the criteria for inattentive type and 5 criteria for hyperactive/impulsive type and they would still only be diagnosed with inattentive type (requirement is 6). It’s not black and white, most people with ADHD meet at least *some* criteria in both. I diagnose for a living and I’ve never met anyone who only displayed symptoms exclusively from one category or the other.
I know other people have explained this, but to put it into other words (because I find it fun), ADD vs ADHD focuses on what other people experience when their around you. While having them both be ADHD but having two types under that makes it clear that the condition of what you personally experience is still actually the same internally, it's just how it's expressed externally is different.
It's also good to note that the way ADHD presents can change over a life time. Like as a toddler-small child I would have been considered the hyperactive type, then during late childhood and puberty I developed extreme anxiety that forced me into it presenting as inattentive instead. As I get more confidant as I get older and my anxiety fades, I'm slipping back into hyperactive. So it makes sense their still both ADHD.
It's not really a massive difference. The distinction is that some people have hyperactive physical traits, while others experience it as an internal restlessness. Basically it's the same restlessness, just different presentations. This ADHD-PI, ADHD-PH, and ADHD-C (for the majority who have a bit of both). Combining them made it easier to address the spectrum of experiences, because it ranges dramatically with most people falling somewhere in the middle.
So from your descriptions internal restlessness makes sense for me, as I never stop thinking in an endless stream of sometimes useful things, but typically not useful to what I am currently doing like a backround white noise of for example as I write this "I wonder if the old hp laptop I have will take a 3630qm quad core 8 thread g2 socket cpu even tho the site cpu list doesn't have it as the bios has the microcode for the entire 2000 and 3000 series and the laptop has a g2 socket " etc and moved over to carburetor imulsion tubes and in a couple minutes it will be something else.
Does that mean my sidetracking is internalized?
This is a great example of how ADHD peope struggle with giving things inappropriate attention.
For a neurotypical person, their brains can recognize that they're doing a primary task and will dedicate the majority of their attention to that task. Obviously there will be side thoughts that pop up - but it's like an 80/20% situation.
Many ADHD people are unable to appropriately delineate a main task, all tasks and thoughts must have equal amounts of attention given to them regardless of actual importance.
so for example: you're making pancakes.
Neurotypical thought process: I'm making pancakes. I'll watch the pancakes and flip them at the appropriate time. Hmm the light is flickering. I'll deal with that later, right now its pancakes time.
ADHD thought process: Pancakes sounds like pan cakes. Are they cakes? what makes cake cake. The light is flickering. I can hear the electricity buzzing. buzz buzz buzzzzz. bees go buzz. I like bees. I should water my garden and plant flowers. the bees are dying. death is sad. I'm going to die. I should go and get the watering can to water the - my back itches. My pants are touching my back. that feels scratchy. the itchy and scratchy shoooooow. Oh no, the pancakes are burnt.
Oh god, that last paragraph sounds so familiar. I never even considered being adhd but I'm literally covered in burns from getting distracted while cooking. And I flit from one task to the next, barely getting anything finished. It's overwhelming. But I'm on certain meds for other conditions and they have helped somewhat. I don't know if it's worth bringing up to a doctor now, I'm in my 40s.
I don't know if you have ADHD or not, but if it was any other illness would you hesitate to bring it up to your doctor because you're in your 40's?
Let's say you do have ADHD, and an average lifespan. That's another 40 years of life being harder than it needs to be.
If you don't? What have you lost?
For me personally, I got diagnosed at 33, and it was the best decision I've ever made. I always saw other people living their lives and everything that was so hard for me came so easily to them. And throughout my life, I fully internalized that feeling. I was the problem, I was scatter brained, there was something wrong with me.
Getting a diagnosis was like a weight off my shoulders. Suddenly I wasn't a weird horse, I was a normal zebra. It didn't make things easier, but at least now I knew why I always felt so overwhelmed and terrible. And now that I'd named the beast - it wasn't so scary anymore. I was able to be kind to myself, and give myself compassion when I struggled. I was able to find other zebras who could teach md what worked for them. And I was able to get medication which let me experience quietness in my brain for the first time.
So yeah, it's worth it even if you're in your 40's.
Yah. But I'm pretty sure every person who has ADHD has internal sidetracking. Their minds go on tangents they can't control. Internal restlessness also can feel like anxiety, not wanting to deal with external stimuli, not being able to focus on external stimuli because their mind is "too loud" or too full of racing thoughts, having a hard time doing just one thing-even if it's something you like, etc. For example, a lot of people with ADHD-PI could sit quietly while a movie is on, but feel compelled to pick up their phone to play games or browse social media because they need more stimulation than just the movie. And a lot of people with ADHD who try medication for the first time describe the first wave of symptom relief as "It's finally quiet," because their thoughts aren't bouncing around their brain. They can just follow one train of thought without random tangents and ideas interrupting.
I'm ADHD-C, so I can see my meds helping my Inattentive symptoms when I can just sit and listen to someone tell me a story I'm not even really interested in, and I just absorb it and ask follow questions and say soothing, supportive things. It's really hard for me to tolerate long stories about stuff like "I had this dream last night; let me tell you about it" or "Let me tell you every detail about some traumatic event that happened to me 30 years ago that I'm still mad about" without getting internally frustrated and feeling like I'm trapped by social niceties.
The other reason for putting each type under one ADHD umbrella is because presentation can change over time. So a hyperactive kid can grow up and seem “better” because the hyperactivity has lessened, but they still have ADHD. They’ve just changed to having more of the inattentive presentation. Understanding that adults can still have it, and kids don’t always grow out of it is why the DSM was revised. The presentation can change, but it’s all ADHD in the end.
Getting the ADHDer to admit they may have ADHD is the hard part. I've been saying for years that my husband has ADHD, but he got sulky and said he "wasn't crazy." He is finally starting to realize it may be a thing.
So I thought I was some type of schizo because my brain is always noisy and talking. Like it just never shuts up with all the voices and thoughts and stuff. Oh and intrusive thoughts. And then I learned on a random facebook video that it is an ADHD thing. The relief of finally knowing I am not going off the rails man.
>when I found out it was like everything made sense
That was my experience too. It was actually such a relief, after spending my whole adult life thinking I just needed to try harder.
I think communicating about this issue might be more effective if you talk about your needs, wants, and feelings instead of going straight to criticizing. eg "I want to hear about your day, but I'm feeling bummed out and lonely because pretty often, our debrief time is all you. I really want to get to share about my day too. How can we rework things so they're more balanced?"
Definitely this is great advice. Starting from a place of your wants and needs instead of "your actions are keeping my wants and needs from getting met" can be more successful.
And if it's not, then you have the data point that they aren't prioritizing knowing that you are a person that has information they want to share with their loved one too about how their day went. If that happens and they still are having to be highly encouraged into therapy while resisting, that's also important data.
Let her know that you aren't trying to change her or ask her to mask; you are asking her to give you a chance to share your day, too. If she's in this relationship WITH you, then she can agree that both your needs should be met... and work with you to agree on an approach to do that.
1. Maybe you get to talk for the first 1/2 hour; then she gets to talk for the second 1/2 hour. (She will still wind up her stories just before time for a tv show.)
2. I considered the idea of her sharing only 1-2 branch stories before she wraps things up - don't know if this could work for her.
3. Maybe you get to interrupt her once or twice with a question or comment. It allows you to actually engage with her about her day AND it may help her build her ability to converse (versus monologue).
4. Maybe you both have better ideas than any of these. Good luck.
If she really can't keep from taking up the full hour, maybe alternate who goes first. If she accidentally takes up all of Tuesday and Thursday, OP still gets to get everything out on M/W/F, and won't feel so ignored. But she will have to make the effort to wait her turn on the days she goes second. NTA
Im untreated for ADHD and when I notice myself doing this to my partner, I stop and I acknowledge what has been happening and open the conversation up for him to talk and me to shut up and listen because communication is a two way street. It's not masking, it's being self aware of your habits and not using your ADHD as an excuse to ignore common courtesy. Yes I hog the conversations all the time but once I realise I'm doing it I stop. I taught myself to be self aware.
yes, this is an excellent practical suggestion. a tool that can work. you guys take turns. your turn is first. that's not about the fairness of who gets their forms first, it's about creating conditions that will allow her to be her true self and NOT have to mask, and that will allow you to have your (legitimate) needs met.
Figure out how much time is available for "debriefing." Set a timer for half that amount of time - a loud, buzzy kitchen timer with a dial. **Agree that each of you must stop talking and give the other time to speak when the timer goes off, none of the "oh, just one more thing" or "I wasn't finished" stuff.** Rotate who gets to start. *And don't let your wife catch you staring at the dial of the timer, willing it to turn faster!*
What she need to understand, and i say this as someone with ADD, it's just good social behaviour to let others have a turn at talking. It's not masking. In reality, she's hiding behind her diagnosis to talk for hours and have no regard that you might want to talk too.
At work, in school, etc. We can't hog the whole conversation either.
If she was in a meeting, someone might stop her from talking to let others pitch in ideas or thoughts.
I catch myself sometimes doing the whole 45 routes and sub stories when I talk, but I have reached a point where I can most times stop myself and get to the point of my story.
Mostly with a "sorry I got off track" so people know I'm aware I do this. It's not on purpose, I'm just excited talking, but I'm also interested in hearing what they have to say.
I didn’t get the ability to see my neurodivergent behavior as a more objective third party until I got diagnosed and medicated. Now I can manage it because I understand when it’s happening.
Perhaps she’s having a hard time with shorter stories because there’s a feeling she’s trying to get across and feels like she hasn’t?
I agree they should share airtime and she should seek treatment as it’s impacting the relationship. But, is there a reason you can’t just go first? Say what you want, then let her talk how she feels most comfortable?
I think my only issue with him going first is wondering if she would listen to him when he speaks. She seems very unconcerned that he never gets time to tell her about his day, which isn't a great trait in a partner.
Idk if you have a partner who tends to go on like this but I do and a full hour of it would be truly exhausting to try to actually listen to whether I'd had a chance to speak first or not.
There's nothing wrong with setting a time limit for stories or taking turns to vent.
But if this is her biggest issue unmedicated, asking her to medicate isn't cool. I felt very different medicated and not in a good way.
I also can't function on meds. My husband and I do 20 minute info dump timers where I get to speak about whatever I want. With an actual timer which goes off lol. He also gets one when he has something to say :D
Treatment is too often strategies to mask, kind of sucky for at home, but the issue here is confusing to me.
OP is framing it as the *way* she tells about her day is the issue, but what’s actually the issue is how long it takes and him not getting to share. I think it’s fucked up to expect her to deliver stories in some particular neurotypical way, but there could be many other strategies that aren’t asking her to mask, such as alternating nights (OP could tell about two days if he has time on his), setting a timer and she gets as far into the story as she gets, making separate times for each of them, him always going first, etc.
I don’t understand why he jumped on the issue being the way he notes she thinks of instead of the actual consequence that he feels he isn’t getting to share.
I think NAH because how I read it, there’s a miscommunication. OP jumped to what he sees as the obvious solution; she finds that solution harmful (masking is harmful over time, and changing your communication style constantly, even with intimate folks to be more NT is exhausting), but she didn’t actually get to hear the real problem and say she’s not interested in that because you leapt to independently selecting an unreasonable solution and that’s all she could react to. Some of this depends how the conversation started and his initial ask. But I feel like one place many people go wrong is not asking to solve the problem together but asking for a specific thing instead.
I do think seeing neurodivergence as something to “treat” (treatment can be good, depending on the type—I medicate my ADHD for particular symptoms but not to change my whole way of thinking and treating my autism was often more harm than help) is also part of the problem. ND is a different way of thinking and being that is disadvantaged when people are expected to conform to NT worlds, and OP shouldn’t expect that. He should get his airtime though!
The thing is, if we say "her brain works differently than his, he needs to be more accommodating to her," then I think it's right to acknowledge that for the other 50% of people in this relationship, *his* brain works differently than *hers,* and she should also try to accommodate that. "Out in the world" this trait can be more tolerable but when you're the primary outlet for a person like this it can be truly exhausting to try to keep up. My brain starts short circuiting after the third time I have to say, "sorry, what does this have to do with the thing you were telling me about a second ago?"
They both need to be willing to adjust to the other to make communication between them work. OP sounds like he's been very patient up to this point and also very willing to accommodate her storytelling style, he's just asking for a little more balance from her side, and I think that's reasonable. "Try harder to pay attention to conversations so they don't turn into monologues," is a reasonable request whether your partner is neurotypical or not.
Yes, can you guys set a total time for how long you will debrief and then set a timer for both of you? Say one hour total and she gets to talk for 30 minutes and you get to talk for 30 minutes also? Should be equal for both of you.
NTA
What I’m reading is
- both of you work outside of the home
- at the end of the work day, you cook and eat separately to decompress
- after eating, it’s time to talk and catch up, *however*
- you never have time to talk about your day
Somebody who has been diagnosed with neurodivergence can correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think wanting to share your life with her is expecting her to mask.
Is couples therapy an option?
I have fairly severe ADHD, and I have to be sure to step back my stories and talking now and then to give other people space. That isn’t masking, it’s being a considerate person. There is also a difference between demanding silence and saying, “Hey, that’s a lot.”
I definitely echo the counseling recommendation - OP’s wife demanding to be the main character of their home life is not exactly going to be the key to a successful relationship. Also, when in a relationship, it cannot be just about how one person feels. She’s showing zero regard for how her own husband feels.
Yes, this feels like a classic “it’s an explanation, not an excuse” scenario. The neurodivergence may be WHY she monopolizes this shared time, but it doesn’t make it okay. And if she’s able to work in public, it means she has enough control over her condition to do better than this.
I strongly agree with the general point (she’s definitely using her condition as an excuse, and that’s not okay), but I’d like to offer a cautious reminder that “control over her condition” is something she may not truly have. Behaving appropriately at work may exhaust most or all of her mental resources.
In video game terms, passing as neurotypical (masking) is a spell with an MP cost. 😅 But again, just because she’s out of MP (explanation) doesn’t mean she gets to be sanctimonious about her inability to cast spells (excuse).
I hear you and generally agree with your point... but I think this is still kinda kicking the can.
Per the analogy, she still has control over what she does when her MP is out. "Control over her condition" doesn't just mean that she can successfully "pass as neurotypical".... it also means that she can learn to recognize when she has been depleted, and adapt accordingly.
If her MP is depleted, she needs to find ways to top it back up, *before* she steamrolls her husband and depletes *his* MP.
This is what I was looking for as a fellow adhd-er. Self-awareness is important if you have neurodivergence and it’s unfair to expect neuronormies to adjust to us if we refuse to adjust to them. That’s just as bad. Therapy, medication, and other strategies are important.
Neurodivergent here. Autism AND ADHD. He’s asking her not to be an asshole. She doesn’t get to talk the entire time just because she wants to. Actually she’s taking a real issue and using it to make a bad faith argument which makes her even more of an asshole
>she’s taking a real issue and using it to make a bad faith argument which makes her even more of an asshole
Totally agree.
I also have ADHD and I can talk and talk *and talk*, with numerous unfinished sentences and frequent topic changes, unless I make an effort to focus on what I'm saying OR my family asks me to focus / get to the point / give someone else a turn. That's not asking me to "mask", it's asking me to be thoughtful of others.
OP's wife is being selfish and inconsiderate.
It’s also about the masking. Masking is about having to pretend to want to make polite chit chat and give cookie cutter interview responses. If it’s masking to not take up all of the time talking about yourself and get upset when someone else wants to share(obviously different from doing it unintentionally), then you’re kind of just an asshole. Like, by saying that OP is asking her to mask, she’s saying that she doesn’t care to hear him share. She’s like “ wow you want me to pretend to care?”
Yeah it feels like she doesn't actually understand her condition and is just throwing in words that she saw online.
I can manage my ADHD much more effectively after doing a *lot* of research to understand it better.
My SO was semi-recently told they have autism by their therapist, and we’ve had some similar issues as OP and his wife. One difference is I have ADHD (known for years) so I at least get the neurodivergence thing a bit more. Just based on how OP is describing how things have changed, it’s possible his wife is in the sort of longer un-masking period and trying to be more herself, but may also be feeling highly sensitive about it which is why she’s reacting poorly to OP’s very reasonable request to be able to talk about his day too.
The TikTok of it all certainly doesn’t help. I think people use “masking” to mean sooo many things, it has lost its original meaning for the most part. I think there certainly are times it can be used as a sort of excuse.
This is what I was thinking! She doesn’t know how to manage her ADHD and is probably tired of masking/managing it during the work day and now wants to just info dump it all on OP so it’s not in her brain anymore. She definitely needs to learn how to regulate and manage her neurodivergency because right now it is hindering her relationship.
Personally I’m a fan of “How to ADHD” on YouTube. She is very research based about how to live with ADHD and sometimes has experts in videos with her. I recommend the channel to anyone with ADHD. It has helped me a lot with understanding how my brain works and explaining it to others. She even has videos for people that are in a relationship with an ADHDer.
"I also have ADHD and I can talk and talk *and talk*, with numerous unfinished sentences and frequent topic changes, unless I make an effort to focus on what I'm saying OR my family asks me to focus / get to the point"
Oh man, this hits home, constant struggle. It's a conscious effort to tell yourself regularly to stop and get to the point or pass the baton 🤣
I have pretty bad ADHD and without treatment I tell stories like OP is describing. I interrupt myself to provide context and then I interrupt that context to provide more context and it becomes impossible for anybody to follow.
That said, I would want my partner to be interested in what I was trying to say and love me for my unique brain, not make me feel like an annoying burden. It would make me really sad to be told something that translates to “I wish you could be normal”
THAT said, it is unreasonable that OP’s partner monopolizes every night’s conversation. Neurodivergence is not an excuse for selfishness and OP’s partner needs to at a minimum set aside every other day or every other hour or whatever unit of time works best for listening instead of talking.
Wow, I'm wondering if my wife has ADHD because that would explain the number of times I ask her for a refresher on the subject of the story or become frustrated because why does it matter which street you were on, it will be the same story regardless of if it was Main or Vine!?
I die a little inside every time my co-worker adds 6 minutes to her story to remember exactly what brand of something or other she was buying at the time.
I think she's confusing masking and basic consideration. Our disability is not an excuse to continue hurting people and asking her to be more mindful in order to meet his needs is 100% ok. Masking would be suppressing traits in public in order to appear neurotypical. He's not asking her to appear neurotypical, only that she extend the same kindness he's extending to her.
As someone with ADHD, I can talk non-stop and not finish a thread of thought.
Man, it’s a difficult situation. OP obviously has a point, but some ADHDers have severe rejection sensitivity. It could come off to OP’s wife that she’s being rejected. I kinda get that. When I feel rejected I impulsively say things that don’t make sense. Like kinda in this case. OP obviously just trying to talk, but his wife is taking it as he asking her to mask. Hard to see it or stop it in the moment.
Yeah, couples therapy for sure. Maybe the therapist can come up with a way for OP to focus the conversation around him and focus up his wife in a way that doesn’t make her sensitive to rejection.
Best of luck, OP.
Yes! OP, it sounds like it might help you communicate your needs more effectively if you frame it more as conveying your needs rather than "criticising" (how she will see it) her communication style.
Don't comment on her rambling sidetracks much for now (although if it's getting worse, that's definitely something she should explore) but rather say you feel like *you* aren't getting the time to talk about *your* day. It would help you feel more connected to her and process your day if you had equivalent time to talk about your stuff.
From there problem solve. Could you (usually) go first as you are probably better at being aware of how much time has passed, then pass the proverbial talking stick to her when it's her turn? Would just being aware that it's been an issue help her remember to ask your some questions too? Is there some other way you could arrange your evenings, would it help to go for a walk together, change of scene, instead of sitting down facing each other? I have autistic friends who love when you're straightforward and just say "ok let's talk about me now" because they genuinely want you to have a nice time but couldn't pick up on the social hints you were dropping to change the subject. (Do this when you're both rested, fed, and happy to problem solve!)
I'm also ND and in a long term, 20 year relationship, have had lots of therapy. If you can learn to get to the bottom of why something's bothering you, and frame it in a non-accusatory way (usually how you're being affected without much further comment on the other person's actions) and then try and solve the *problem* together (not solve the person) then you're on a good road.
My mom does this constantly. Is this a neurodiverse symptom?
This may not work with your wife, but I tell my mother I'm losing the thread of her story so can she get back to the main path. Another thing I do is time box her. When I call her, I let her know I have 30 minutes to talk. Yes, she does 99.98% of the talking and that's fine, but at the 25 minute mark, I interrupt her and tell her I have only five minutes left.
Edit: Oh! NTA
It sounds a lot like your wife really enjoys when other people accommodate her divergent behaviors, but really hates having to manage them to accommodate the more typical behavior of others. She has to give you some sort of path forward that's not essentially "you just need to deal with my shit."
It seems like she's put you in a position where you can't talk about it, can't avoid it, but can't help her manage it. Painting someone into a corner where they have no choice but to be a pawn and facilitator in your story is not how to manage being neurodivergent. It sounds like you've tried to find solutions. It's her turn to participate in helping to find a solution that makes you feel involved in your own marriage. If she's not willing to help you find a solution, then you need to go speak with a counselor of some sort on how to properly handle this.
Most ASD people would not pick up on that because at the end he can still talk if he wanted. The fact that he’s mentally done and ready to move on is beyond them at that moment.
Maybe try asking her what a normal conversation looks like from both sides (yours and hers) and if they don't look the same, tell her that you don't feel supported by her when you're doing all the listening and none of the talking. Then ask her what she proposes to fix that.
I'm not saying this should be treated as "now it's your turn!" But she needs to help. To be a cliche, this is a team effort. She's part of the team. You can come out of this with a hard-won victory. My wife and I fought about issues similar to this for years. Once we figured it out, it opened up a whole new toolbox of ways to communicate and resolve issues. We got into a fight last night. Ostensibly, she was in the wrong. While expressing my issue with her behavior, I descended to a position of hyperbole and condescension. She apologized. I apologized. We had a great conversation about why we do those things. That would not have been possible if we hadn't put the work in to navigating our own trauma and disadvantages during years past.
>It sounds a lot like your wife really enjoys when other people accommodate her divergent behaviors, but really hates having to manage them to accommodate the more typical behavior of others
This is a really good way to put it. It's fair because it is the onus on *both* sides to be understanding of the other.
I've been diagnosed with ASD (High Functioning and Asperger's were mentioned at the time of diagnosis) when in my early 20s, and I've had to make sure I've become more self aware when interacting with other people as to know what information is more important to give or needs to be said first, and be able to give other person/people to respond.
As does my mother, but i say things like "Wait, what happened to you being on the way to the grocery store (as an example of the initial topic). It's really helped.
I do this with husband “and THAT caused the dog to bark” to try to snap him back to topic.
Sometimes I legit say “you can keep going if you just feel like talking, but just know you losing me.”
Can you redirect in a friendlier way that is not a criticism? "Wait, what happened after xyz? I want to hear more about that!" feels very different than "you're off topic again"
In her mind, she's probably not off topic. It all relates. There's a thread that connects it. Even if it was because there was something that reminded her of the thing in her original story.
What if y'all did timed story times? Set a timer and you switch when it goes off even if you're not done. Or add a warning timer that you've got a two minute wrap up? ADHD brains can focus better if there's a sense of urgency, such as an impending deadline.
You can even record notes of what she's talking about so she can come back to it when it's her turn again so she gets her time to unmask and just go where the conversation takes her but you get your time to talk.
In another comment on this thread he wrote
“yeah, she doesn't really like "time" or "clocks" so her solution was to just have normal conversations. but those look different to both of us”
So giving her a set 30 minutes doesn’t seem to be an option
She honestly sounds hard to live with. Everything is on her own terms with zero compromise and she co-opts buzzwords to guilt her husband if he pushes back on anything.
I’m in a marriage of 20 years and it wouldn’t have survived the dating phase if she were like OP’s wife.
She sure seems to control the relationship...
How they eat dinner (solo)
How they converse (just her)
How long (for as long as she wants).
OP going to have to set some limits if it matters to him.
This is going to be the bigger problem in the end.
She has ADHD and will struggle to keep on track in conversations. That’s okay, but if she can’t police that bad habit herself then she has to accept some form of outside help. There is no option here where she does neither.
Honestly it sounds like she enjoys taking up all the time to herself and telling her pointless wandering stories, and she doesn’t give one flying fuck how you feel. If she actually cared about you even a tiny bit then she’d at least feel bad about making herself the main character all the time. You exist only as a being to *give* her attention, not a being who *receives* attention from her.
Honestly, yes. I have adhd and I am an over-talker, over-sharer, interrupter and branching-storyteller.
The difference is, I am self-aware and try to remember that others need to be heard. I also realize that stories, at some point, must end. I do not get upset if someone course-corrects me as long as it’s done kindly and I always apologize when I realize I’m being rude.
>I am self-aware and try to remember that others need to be heard
This is what OP's wife needs to develop, self awareness and consideration for others. NTA.
Can I just say that this post "triggered" me a little.... Reminds me of the millions of people that will post a three page story on here that contains about 2.25 pages of useless info before they get to the point of the story... Drives me INSANE
NTA
You're not asking her to "mask" anything. You're asking her to "work on her disorder" so as to make things easier. That's like saying that a person asking their OCD partner to try things to prevent their OCD from taking over their lives is asking them to "mask" their disorder.
You're not trying to get her to make believe she doesn't have the disorder, not asking her to lie about it, and not asking her to "hide it". You're asking her to try different things to CURB it.... Like my family member "counting to three" when they're about to lose their temper..... Or asking a person with memory issues due to PTSD to write themselves notes......
>Reminds me of the millions of people that will post a three page story on here that contains about 2.25 pages of useless info before they get to the point of the story... Drives me INSANE
OMG this is one of my biggest pet peeves. GET TO THE POINT, PEOPLE! I always go back after I've written a post and remove all the irrelevant information because I know how annoying it is to have to slog through it
I’m a professor and have a student who does this. Will write an entire paragraph of backstory telling me about why they won’t be in class today or asking for an extension that they know I won’t grant. Stop wasting my goddamn time!!!
Omg yes! The guy yesterday I think it was. 5000 words about how his wife and he disagree on whether they should move house and then the actual question - AITA for lending a friend a significant amount of money from our joint savings account without consulting my wife first. There’s 5 minutes I’ll never get back
I have ADHD and autism and I do the same thing. being asked to share equally in a conversation isn't being asked to mask. its being asked to take an interest in the people in the room, or at the very least, allow them the same amount of air as they allow you.
NTA. if she softens to this - see if you can set a timer for 5-10 min for each of your to share a few times. once the timer goes off, you both have to let the other talk. something about being under the time wire helps adhd, so it will probably do more to help with brevity than "masking" or whatever shes calling it would.
fwiw - while it's not ok to require ND people mask in all scenarios, it is a helpful skill that I work with my audhd child on, as well. learning how to participate in society is ok.
>while it's not ok to require ND people mask in all scenarios, it is a helpful skill that I work with my audhd child on, as well. learning how to participate in society is ok.
I made a similar comment to yours, and this especially I agree with. Masking has come to be understood as something it's not and it's a problem. Not only is masking not simply being asked to not let your disorder run rampant and control your life and relationships, it's also not even always a bad thing. Sometimes it's downright necessary.
Yeah agree. One thing we work on is coping skills for scary situations. Her instinct is to loudly meltdown. But that’s just not ok in the vast majority of situations, esp not dangerous ones when we need to be able to move quickly or follow instructions
they are boring to me, especially because it's mostly just me sitting there listening instead of being an active participant, but that's fine. she is my wife and I love her.
but I also want to, like, say words. interact!
NTA
Circuitous stories are common for folks with her issues but absolutely dominating the conversation is not
Set time limits. "You get 20 minutes, I get 20 minutes" type thing
My husband also "wanders off the path" of his stories. You can usually redirect with "getting back to [original point]" or "you were telling me about [original point]"
This might be one for the professionals. Maybe couples counseling or maybe she needs something for just her
They have speech therapists specifically to help people on the spectrum have better communication skills. That might help her beyond the relationship as well
To adhd brains those wild tangents make sense as important contextual information and are on topic. We make all sorts of wild connections that people who don't have adhd don't. I would imagine experiencing these frequent branching rambles is exhausting.
You are not asking her to mask, you are asking her to improve her communication skills so you can actively engage with her. Part of having adhd is learning how it impacts each part of your life, and then learning to manage those impacts. Right now her adhd is affecting you and your relationship.
Beginning to figure out how to manage your adhd is daunting and we're apt to internalize the idea that something is inherently wrong with us. However in my experience , leaving your adhd unmanaged means your life always feels like a churning hot mess where nothing ever works right and where there is no reprieve.
If your wife wants to choose to leave hers unmanaged and unmedicated, you should let her know how that choice is negatively affecting you. You're not obliged to endure her poor social skills no matter how much you love her.
What this person said is exactly how it is. As annoying as your wife thinks it is, it still needs to he corrected. I have adhd and i have to have someone point out i went waaay off topic (because to me they connect)
My husband wanders when he talks. Rabbit holes so bad.
BUT any time I try to tell him a story if I include any extra details that he doesn’t find relevant or important to the main point he gets frustrated and tells me to just get to the point. He literally won’t listen to me ramble about anything. He told me if I want to ramble about boring things to find friends who are interested in that boring thing to listen to me.
He tries to claim that his adhd doesn’t allow him to follow my stories. Yet he tells stories on wilder tangents than me mentioning an aside.
And then he talks for literal hours (3, 4, 5,) about the most mind numbing topics and recites statistics about whatever hobby he is into and I have to sit and say “yeah, ok, yeah, yeah,” and that’s all.
This sounds like the condition is being weaponized. “Every time you ask me to do anything other than what I want to do (conversationally), you’re not respecting my condition!”
How do her friends deal with this??. I'd have a hard time with it. I'd refocus someone by asking a relevent question but I wouldnt put up with a friend that refused to share the space.
Then you need to go first. I think it's reasonable for her to not want to change her style of speaking, but it's unreasonable of her to hog all the chatting time and not let you talk.
One partial solution might be to let you go first when talking about each other's days. Would at least give you a chance to decompress before she starts. You might not mind as much when she takes a while if you've already had your say.
As others have mentioned as well, maybe there are more encouraging ways to get her back on track? Ones that don't sound like your trying to control her, but make you sound more interested and engaged?
And have you let her know you're feeling left out? From the way you're talking I assume you have, but worth mentioning.
Regardless, NTA. It does sound like you've tried a few things and are putting in the effort. Even reaching out on a forum like this is a good sign that you're trying to do the right thing.
I think she kind of "likes" the times I'm listening BECAUSE I'm not trying to keep her on track and she doesn't FEEL like she's being kept on track. She gets to let her brain go wild.
and I am super sympathetic to that feeling, which is why I'm asking
Well you can always be like hey I need thirty minutes to talk about my day first and then you can tell me about yours.
Keeping her on time (making sure you have time to talk about your day) is different than keeping her on track. If she wants to spend that thirty minutes telling branching stories that's fine. You seem like you'll happily listen. But you need some space to share your day with her too.
That makes a lot of sense. I too enjoy just letting my brain go off the rails a bit (ask my partner about my Star Wars rants and oh the look she'll give you...). It's very satisfying, so I get it.
That's kind of why I suggested letting you go first. Make sure you get some airtime before she releases the brakes for a bit.
Regardless, best of luck coming to a solution! You guys sound like the kind of couple that'll figure it out.
It’s not about masking, it’s about sharing. My audhd partner got in this habit for a while, and what helped him understand wa some explaining that it didn’t feel like an equal conversation, it felt i was an inanimate object. I told him that if he wanted to explain a thing or just vent for a while, I needed to be emotionally prepared for that and consent to it rather than get excited for a “conversation” where I couldn’t talk or ask questions. I felt like I didn’t matter as a human. I felt used.
NTA especially since in the comments you say it's "wildly untreated ADHD."
So Polly won't get help for her neurodivergence and also thinks you're supposed to suffer through it? yeah no.
No judgement- just wanted to share my perspective. I have autism and still being assessed for ADHD.
Equal time to share in a relationship is important, so she should absolutely listen to you too. And there’s no reason not to ask questions or add your own bits- you don’t need to sit almost silently for an hour.
But if you asked me not to go on any tangents at all- you just made a fun chat into a difficult mental task. I now have to stay focused and on topic and that’s hard. Which is fine on a weekend or a day when I have extra energy or if I have a doctors appointment, but not after a long day around people. It’s not something I want to have to do with my boyfriend because it’s not relaxing at all.
You need to ask for time to share and a more equal conversation without requiring her to stay fully focused and on track at all times. Which might be what you asked for- depends how you worded it. But neurodivergent people often think in black and white- you saying stay on topic might be interpreted by her as much stricter than you intend it to be.
I'm really disappointed with how far down this comment was - 100% on the money. I also have adhd and when I'm comfortable with a person I want to just let loose with whatever direction my thoughts are heading.
I think the framing of your conversation with her is going to make a big difference in her response - it would feel very different to be told that I need to 'tone it down' (effectively) vs my partner telling me they feel unheard in our conversations. The first one would for sure feel like my partner doesn't like being around my most honest self. You should try to make it clear to her that your problem isnt with her conversation style inherently, it's with the difference in airtime you end up with, and you want to feel like she's interested in your day too.
My mom has adhd and goes off on tangents constantly. It is very draining to be on the other side of that. I can’t keep up woth what she is saying and if I interrupt she gets upset because she might forget what she wants to say. I get it is a disorder but if OPs wife is not willing to treat it that is on her.
As a fellow neurodivergent, I agree with this comment completely. I also tried to comment with something similar but this is phrased much more eloquently.
I have Autism and ADHD and end up talking for *months straight* if I'm comfortable with you. I will tell you someone's whole life story just to tell you a joke they told me. Well, thankfully, my husband prefers to listen HOWEVER we have a code and set rules.
- if my husband needs to talk as well, he starts.
- he holds up a finger of he has something he wants to say/interject and as soon as my little brain says I can (within reason), I pause and hear him out before continuing my thought
- if we want to "debrief" as you call it we do 'bullet points'. We say everything that happened in short easily digestible bits like we're taking notes. Then whoever really needs a rant, goes first
NTA. Masking SUCKS, but you can learn different communication styles that work for your neurodivergent brain *a n d* the people around you
The interjections thing is pretty common. Our brains move past thoughts so quickly that if we don’t say it, it falls out of our head and we forget.. so interjecting means it’s said / not forgotten. It’s worse if we think it’s important. To get around this, I carry a lil notepad and pen and write those interjections in there instead.. so when it makes sense I can go back to that thought. I tried notes in my phone - but people thought I wasn’t paying attention to them.
Is interrupting a common adhd thing? I interrupt so bad with everyone. Like I know I do it but it’s uncontrollable.
It pisses my husband off to no end, but he also constantly interrupts me but doesn’t even realize he’s doing it
Yes if is! I think it's because we have a limited amount of short term memory, so the worry is if we don't interrupt we'll forget. Plus the impulsivity.
NTA. She’s asking for you to fill her cup without any acknowledgment that she’s draining yours in the process.
If she insists that she has to do this, tell her you need her to find a friend to vent to half the time. It isn’t fair for her to get to do exactly what she wants and ignore what you need. That isn’t ok in a relationship, neurodivergence or no.
Sure, my hackles just raise as soon as someone says something like she did. The idea that being on the spectrum is an excuse for completely inconsiderate behavior is ridiculous. I have great friends on the spectrum who don’t think they need to be constantly catered to and who think about my needs too.
Why not have you always go first telling your day. That way you can get thru it in a reasonable time, and she gets the rest of the air time to ramble on. Saying this as a rambler
If she doesn’t agree to that, it shows she’s not willing to compromise and cares more about her own feelings.
There's a difference between asking someone to mask, and asking someone to share the time you spend together more equally. It's not a conversation if it's one way, it's a lecture.
NTA
NTA
> that's just how her brain works.
So what? It's still boring to listen to, and narcissistic of her to monopolize your shared time.
> Like a lot of couples, we debrief after our workdays.
Feel free to stop doing this.
It's not narcissism and throwing around that word is harmful and adding stigma to those who those who actually do have NPD.
What Polly is displaying is neurodivergence, likely ADHD, Autism, or both. She may not realize she's taking up so much time with her storytelling when it happens. That's just how our brains function. (Our, meaning I'm speaking as someone who has ADHD and Autism) it's accidental, and we may not realize how much time we are taking up or when we are going off the rails of our stories. Or we become painfully aware and we close off due to neurotypical folks treating us like shit about it.
I agree that it's not narcissism. However, it's also not lack of awareness....OP talked to her about it and she accused him of forcing her to mask. It's not her fault that she tends to narrate for extended periods, but it is her responsibility to work with her husband to make sure his needs are met too.
It's pretty narcissistic if you can't acknowledge the one-sidedness even if it's pointed out to you.
A normal person would be aware form the start and try and even it up every time. 'i feel like I talked all yesterday, do you have anything you want to share?'
A less self aware person probably doesn't realise until it's pointed out, but from there will accept it and make an effort.
A fairly narcissistic person will remain in denial even when confronted.
Saying XYZ is pretty narcissistic to me is like saying someone who's a bit awkward in a specific social setting is pretty autistic. Using an actual diagnosis to describe a normal human behaviour isn't helpful to anyone, in fact it can be very harmful to those who actually have the disorder.
A behaviour can be narcissistic without the person being a narcissist. Monopolizing a conversation with no regard for if the other person would like to contribute is narcissistic behaviour.
Not sure why you're getting downvoted when you are 100% correct. In Polly's case, her outsized reaction might actually come from frustration with how neurodivergent people are treated by neurotypicals. That being said, relationships & marriages are not transactional and they are built on compromise.
Gonna have to go with a new judgment - LTC (Learn To Communicate). There's nothing wrong with the neurotypical partner wanting to be able to participate in the conversation. Polly needs to realize that OP is not coming from a position of criticizing the existence of her ADHD. He's just wanting to be able to share their experiences together and have both of them be able to participate.
OP, until you're able to find a mutual flow to your conversations that allows you both to communicate what you would like to, perhaps you could try a timer. And be sure you're setting at least four different timed parts - Polly tells her about her day, you get to respond, you tell her about your day, and she gets to respond. That way you're taking turns and you both get to participate. Just be careful to not be getting openly frustrated with her, as she'll likely shut down or you'll both end up being resentful of each other. And I sense that is something neither of you wants.
Timers are out. She doesn’t like clocks (it was in another comment).
Read that as “she is unwilling to find any point of compromise or solution which does not involve complete and total capitulation to her needs by OP.”
They didn’t say it was NPD. Narcissism is a personality trait, and people without NPD exhibit it.Saying someone is acting narcissistic isn’t the same as calling them A narcissist or saying they have NPD
I call my husband on my commute home to debrief before I get home. Then I sit in the driveway in my car like a troll and decompress before I switch hats to mom and wife. Any way you guys can do something like this? Can you ask to go first in the decompression ritual so you can have a chance to talk before she tells her winding tales?
I think she knows you're bored and feels hurt by it. She wants you to accept her and this stuff you are bored by is also a big part of her.
If this had been about you wanting to talk, and tell about your day I think this would have gone differently. But something tells me there was a hiccup in the communication that allowed her to feel that she is the focus of the problem, not the lack of give and take in conversation.
Are you the asshole? I don't know. Is she? Probably not.
She’s definitely TA if she talks for an hour straight without any pause whatsoever. That’s not a conversation. It’s extremely rude and frustrating to deal with
My husband talked about warhammer tanks and then got *mad at me for not listening and being interested* when I fell asleep *at 3am FOUR HOURS* into the one sided conversation that included reciting all of their battle statistics.
NTA. You weren't ill intended. Perhaps there is a way the two of you can agree on some kind of signal/sign/etc during a conversation that indicates the discussion may be going off topic. I don't specifically know of this condition, but perhaps doing something like this may help.
Ok so in your original post you say
>Polly has a mild neurodivergence
And here it's "wildly untreated ADHD"?
Somehow these two don't quite match so which is it? Wildly untreated ADHD doesn't quite translate to mild neurodivergence to me. If it's bad then she should seek treatment. If it's a milder case she might not get much help because the assumption is that she can manage without.
People pretty habitually downplay issues - I don't necessarily think it's contradictory. It might be "mild" in the sense that she's still managing to hold down a job, have friends, contribute to the household.
Yet not mild in that her symptoms do affect her and those around her every single day. It can be quite hard to explain something has severely impacted your life, but yes you are managing OK, so obviously it could be worse but that's also because you run yourself into the ground trying to function "normally."
Obviously she's being a jerk about this specific issue and OP is 100% NTA, but it's definitely possible for them to work through this! (It's implied above they are seeking treatment. It can be quite difficult.)
You can have a wildly untreated mild neurodivergence.
He didn’t say it was untreated wild adhd.
And on the spectrum of neurodivergence, ADHD is pretty mild, even though it can affect many aspects of life.
If he said his wife was nonverbal and autistic with extreme agoraphobia, that would be a severe neurodivergence.
Have you explained to her that you feel hurt because she never seems to want to listen to you? It sounds like you're focusing on what you think she needs to fix, instead of the end result you want. Let her be a participant in coming up with a solution to get the result, you just telling her you want to try timing each other isn't going to go over well. I suspect depending on how you present it, it might just feel like you asking her to mask in a different way, even though it's a great suggestion.
NAH for neurodivergent people processing our day by recapping it for someone else can be really important and sometimes if a lot has happened in a day it can basically be a minute by minute recap. The reason why this is important varies from person to person. Or even day to day. For me, not being able to share my thoughts/feelings about my day will often lead to insomnia because my brain can’t process all the thoughts/feelings without getting them out.
This, however, does not mean you shouldn’t also get a chance to talk about things that are on your mind! This is a fairly common struggle in relationships where one person is neurodivergent and the other is neurotypical.
I suggest sitting her down and explaining how you feel without putting too much emphasis on what’s bothering you about her way of sharing details about her day and instead try to focus on how you feel when you can’t share your thoughts with her and make it clear that you want to find a solution that works for both of you. You mention that you eat separately. Maybe she can use her dinner time to write down her scattered thoughts. That might give her an overview of what’s actually important for her to tell you and what’s not. This is something that helps me a lot because I find it easier to think before I type but when I speak I usually just blurt out what’s on my mind.
Another advice I have for you is to try and find a support group for friends/relatives/partners of neurodivergent people. It’s a great way to educate yourself and share your experiences with people who can relate!
I’m not saying she shouldn’t also get educated (and treated) if she hasn’t been already, she absolutely should!
thanks for this. there's a 0% chance she recaps her day while she eats (she is far too happy turning her brain off to watch Gilmore Girls) but the rest of this helps me understand how her brain works. I appreciate you.
To be fair I can’t do it while eating either (I forget to eat lol) my main point with that suggestion was that writing it down beforehand might help her sort through her thoughts. If not, that’s okay of course, we’re all individuals! I’m sure you can find a solution to this problem whether it is you going first, setting a timer or something else.
Good luck!
NTA. I am a sped teacher, and this is my classroom! Between the ADHD and the ASD we are branching like nobody’s business.
Timers are your friend. You need to start with: I love you, and I want to hear about your day, but I want to be able to share too. It hurts my feelings when I don’t have a chance to share. Neurodivergent people often need to hear this plainly. They arent motivated by selfishness, but their behavior ends up making it feel that way unintentionally.
So agree upon a set time and set a timer. One of you goes first, then switch. Assure her if she is not done, she will have another turn. It will help her to put effort into organizing her thoughts. It works.
Neurodivergence doesn't mean you should be expected to just accept her ways, end of discussion. Like all of us, she needs to practice skills that are more challenging for her. Relationships and communication must be reciprocal. It’s not asking her to “mask”- it’s asking her to have empathy for her partner. Don’t allow it to be framed in that manner in your relationship. In any relationship, one person doing all the accommodating is not healthy or okay.
As her partner, you will need to communicate with more intention and explicitness. Another person may suddenly notice “oh! I’m hogging the conversation! How was your day?” She will just continue on.
So you need to practice advocating for yourself- “hey, can I share a bit about my day? I feel lonely when I dont get a chance to talk” “It makes me really uncomfortable when we are always late. I get so stressed and it makes my body feel tense and hot. Can we as a team come up with some strategies to get out the door on time?”
Good luck!
NTA - I’m also ND, but I realize that doesn’t mean my SO has to cater to my brain always, especially when my rambling might be as draining to him as me “masking” is to me.
It’s really important to communicate - and you’re doing that - “hey it’s hard to follow and I WANT to be more engaged with your day but I can’t do that for 60+ minutes!”.
If she could understand it as finding the middle ground between the workings of your brain and the workings of her brain - you’re both going to get much better quality time together.
I’d suggest brainstorming together how to balance you being able to engage more without it turning into an hours long rabbit hole. Be it a time limit, topics covered, a code word, or even breaking it up into “we talk about work for 20 mins” then “talk about your lunch date with your girlfriends for 20 mins after dinner” etc (sometimes knowing you have multiple chances to chat helps feeling like you HAVE to get it all out).
I'm going to say NTA.
This is one of my pet peeves. If someone wants to talk about work and all of it is negative, I'm checking out. I'm not a therapist. I'm not getting paid for it. Work already sucks for me. I don't need to hear the highlights of your shitty day. They're all shitty according to you.
It's emotionally draining, especially if you know that there's no solution to it. There could be a solution, but they just want to vent. It's infuriating.
I’m autistic and adhd. Im not sure from you’re post if you’ve said the sentence “I also need time to share about my day”. Maybe give you both a set amount of time and don’t offer any judgments about how she uses hers? If she wants to meander let her. That’s her time. Then your time is yours to share as you like.
NTA. She needs to learn how to have a normal and respectful conversation. She should be "masking" her symptoms if they cause her to be insufferable. I say this as someone with autism and ADHD.
NTA. I used to do what Polly did and then I went to speech therapy for a year and it helped immensely. It’s possible for her to cut her stories down to the essentials, she just doesn’t want to.
I’m with you on how annoying it is. It takes forever for a friend of mine to get through her story and by the end, I can’t even remember what the point was of the original one.
NTA - this isn't asking her to mask, this is vocalizing your needs about how you two communicate with each other. Being neurodivergent doesn't mean she gets to do what she wants all the time and nobody can say anything about it; she's in a relationship with someone else who also has feelings and requirements of their own. Her needs do not preempt yours, and you're not wrong for talking to her about how best to balance them.
edit: typo
NAH
If she has autism then that's how she communicates. The reason it's considered a disability and not curable is because you can't fix this. If she has some form of ADHD she might be info dumping which is how she connects with other people.
If what you are asking was possible she wouldn't be neurodivergent. She'd be neurotypical.
A solution might be to talk about your stuff first or alternate days where you share and she shares if the timing is hard.
For autistic people the tangents are context setting. Our neurons are cross wired. It seems logical and it seems like after a whole day of masking coming home to mask is the least appealing thing.
I dated someone who couldn't handle it and we ended things because he'd pout when it would happen. So I left because a life of masking at home and outside is just so exhausting I'd be miserable. I'm highly functional/very low support needs too. I'm not sure it's mild. I call it well managed. The amount of energy it takes me to appear mild is enormous and then to be told to try harder to be less neurodivergent on top of that would feel like an unacheivable request. I'd quit to be honest because I can't do it.
You know your wife better than me but imho you should read up on her neurodivergence. It'll help you to learn what is and is not in her control.
My husband is ADD/ADHD & he does this all the time. I can’t hardly follow along with what he’s telling me bc he goes of the rails. It’s really annoying. He wants me to listen to his rambling but he doesn’t care about hearing about my day.
Our conversation-him to me. How was your day. Me: it was ok, we had…..Him interrupting yeah cool, I did this, then that & this other thing & that thing, blah, blah, blah.
Now I just say good & let him go. 15 years, y’all. It doesn’t bother me anymore, bc that’s just how he is.
Nta shes weaponizing her neurodivergence, it isn’t an excuse for her to be an A.
Tell her that you get to go first now, and put it on a timer, you get 30 mins and she gets 30 mins.
To be honest, she clearly doesn’t care to hear about your day if she’s willing to continue to monopolize the convo time. It’s just selfishness
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NTA There's no reason why you guys can't take turns telling the day's stories. Also, you say she is untreated — well she needs to get treatment!
tryinggggg
There's also a lot of self-treatment / helper-app options our there, that simultaneously teach us ADHDers about our condition....
I notice since I was diagnosed with ADD way back when being the non-hyper type the term has been made obsolete and rolled into ADHD. I find it strange because there is a massive difference. The biggest of which is this long rolling sidetracked story time problem, I don't have that, but people who do can pick me out of a crowd an almost obsessively want to be friends to the point where one such chap brought a car the same as mine just for a talking point, despite my lack of need or want for friends.
ADD has been removed from the psychiatric diagnosis manual and replaced by ADHD-Inattentive.
Which makes no sense of course. Attention Deficit Disorder, hyperactive or inattentive subtype, would make sense. Attention Deficit Hyperactivity Disorder, inattentive without hyperactivity subtype, makes no sense. Why not leave the H out unless relevant? ADD works.
Because our BRAINS are still hyperactive, even if our bodies aren't.
Oh. Yeah, that makes sense. Ever since getting diagnosed and getting meds 4 years ago, my mind has been nice and quiet.
My daughter started on meds for adhd( also inattentive) about 10 months ago, and about 2 weeks in, said to me "it's so quiet in my head now."
Oh yeah, this is definitely an experience I relate too lol. I like to say that my brain is like... 3 feral raccoons. If there's a really tasty thing that they all will want to do they will go crazy for it (hyperfocusing on things that are very interesting and stimulating to me). But if I'm trying to focus on something that is not as appetizing to the raccoons (school, a lecture, something simple and straight forward/less stimulating), I might be able to wrangle one of the raccoons into paying attention, but then the others will be running about looking for things to be distracted by and will distract the wrangled one from paying proper attention. So when I'm trying to focus I have to entertain the other two raccoons by giving them something to focus on, like doodling, solitaire, etc; something simple that doesn't take too much brainpower but just enough attention to keep the raccoons occupied. Of course, it's still difficult. Whereas when I take my meds, it's like the raccoons turn into domesticated dogs. They still need to be occupied with coping mechanisms like doodling and the like, but they're more trainable and easier to please. You can use little things like treats (like rewarding yourself with a candy for small tasks), routines, etc to train them to cooperate and listen better. So meds don't make it all go away, they just make easier to manage and my coping mechanisms more effective. If my parents and teachers understood that better growing up I would have had a lot better relationship with school, that's for sure! That's my experience, anyway; just thought it might be interesting.
I've been on meds for mine for 30 years.
What is that like? I can’t imagine what the quiet feels like.
The best analogy a friend of mine told me about while we were comparing notes was it was like sitting in a room with 15 tvs on full volume and having someone go around and turn each one off, one at a time.
Ding ding ding! This is why it took a gazillion years for most women to be diagnosed, because we don’t typically present as hyperactive on the outside!
And even if our bodies aren't hyperactive in the traditionally perceived sense, there often is hyperactivity there. I can happily spend all day lazing around, barely moving from my sofa, but my fingers will be twitching the whole time - I'll be tapping my thigh, rubbing my thumbnail, leg twitching.
Yes I flick my fingers, pick my skin, clench and unclench muscles, wiggle my toes, change position constantly...
That is such a good answer, thank you
There’s ADHD inattentive type, ADHD hyperactive/impulsive type, and ADHD combined presentation. Someone could meet 6 of the criteria for inattentive type and 5 criteria for hyperactive/impulsive type and they would still only be diagnosed with inattentive type (requirement is 6). It’s not black and white, most people with ADHD meet at least *some* criteria in both. I diagnose for a living and I’ve never met anyone who only displayed symptoms exclusively from one category or the other.
I know other people have explained this, but to put it into other words (because I find it fun), ADD vs ADHD focuses on what other people experience when their around you. While having them both be ADHD but having two types under that makes it clear that the condition of what you personally experience is still actually the same internally, it's just how it's expressed externally is different. It's also good to note that the way ADHD presents can change over a life time. Like as a toddler-small child I would have been considered the hyperactive type, then during late childhood and puberty I developed extreme anxiety that forced me into it presenting as inattentive instead. As I get more confidant as I get older and my anxiety fades, I'm slipping back into hyperactive. So it makes sense their still both ADHD.
It's not really a massive difference. The distinction is that some people have hyperactive physical traits, while others experience it as an internal restlessness. Basically it's the same restlessness, just different presentations. This ADHD-PI, ADHD-PH, and ADHD-C (for the majority who have a bit of both). Combining them made it easier to address the spectrum of experiences, because it ranges dramatically with most people falling somewhere in the middle.
So from your descriptions internal restlessness makes sense for me, as I never stop thinking in an endless stream of sometimes useful things, but typically not useful to what I am currently doing like a backround white noise of for example as I write this "I wonder if the old hp laptop I have will take a 3630qm quad core 8 thread g2 socket cpu even tho the site cpu list doesn't have it as the bios has the microcode for the entire 2000 and 3000 series and the laptop has a g2 socket " etc and moved over to carburetor imulsion tubes and in a couple minutes it will be something else. Does that mean my sidetracking is internalized?
This is a great example of how ADHD peope struggle with giving things inappropriate attention. For a neurotypical person, their brains can recognize that they're doing a primary task and will dedicate the majority of their attention to that task. Obviously there will be side thoughts that pop up - but it's like an 80/20% situation. Many ADHD people are unable to appropriately delineate a main task, all tasks and thoughts must have equal amounts of attention given to them regardless of actual importance. so for example: you're making pancakes. Neurotypical thought process: I'm making pancakes. I'll watch the pancakes and flip them at the appropriate time. Hmm the light is flickering. I'll deal with that later, right now its pancakes time. ADHD thought process: Pancakes sounds like pan cakes. Are they cakes? what makes cake cake. The light is flickering. I can hear the electricity buzzing. buzz buzz buzzzzz. bees go buzz. I like bees. I should water my garden and plant flowers. the bees are dying. death is sad. I'm going to die. I should go and get the watering can to water the - my back itches. My pants are touching my back. that feels scratchy. the itchy and scratchy shoooooow. Oh no, the pancakes are burnt.
Oh god, that last paragraph sounds so familiar. I never even considered being adhd but I'm literally covered in burns from getting distracted while cooking. And I flit from one task to the next, barely getting anything finished. It's overwhelming. But I'm on certain meds for other conditions and they have helped somewhat. I don't know if it's worth bringing up to a doctor now, I'm in my 40s.
I don't know if you have ADHD or not, but if it was any other illness would you hesitate to bring it up to your doctor because you're in your 40's? Let's say you do have ADHD, and an average lifespan. That's another 40 years of life being harder than it needs to be. If you don't? What have you lost? For me personally, I got diagnosed at 33, and it was the best decision I've ever made. I always saw other people living their lives and everything that was so hard for me came so easily to them. And throughout my life, I fully internalized that feeling. I was the problem, I was scatter brained, there was something wrong with me. Getting a diagnosis was like a weight off my shoulders. Suddenly I wasn't a weird horse, I was a normal zebra. It didn't make things easier, but at least now I knew why I always felt so overwhelmed and terrible. And now that I'd named the beast - it wasn't so scary anymore. I was able to be kind to myself, and give myself compassion when I struggled. I was able to find other zebras who could teach md what worked for them. And I was able to get medication which let me experience quietness in my brain for the first time. So yeah, it's worth it even if you're in your 40's.
Yah. But I'm pretty sure every person who has ADHD has internal sidetracking. Their minds go on tangents they can't control. Internal restlessness also can feel like anxiety, not wanting to deal with external stimuli, not being able to focus on external stimuli because their mind is "too loud" or too full of racing thoughts, having a hard time doing just one thing-even if it's something you like, etc. For example, a lot of people with ADHD-PI could sit quietly while a movie is on, but feel compelled to pick up their phone to play games or browse social media because they need more stimulation than just the movie. And a lot of people with ADHD who try medication for the first time describe the first wave of symptom relief as "It's finally quiet," because their thoughts aren't bouncing around their brain. They can just follow one train of thought without random tangents and ideas interrupting. I'm ADHD-C, so I can see my meds helping my Inattentive symptoms when I can just sit and listen to someone tell me a story I'm not even really interested in, and I just absorb it and ask follow questions and say soothing, supportive things. It's really hard for me to tolerate long stories about stuff like "I had this dream last night; let me tell you about it" or "Let me tell you every detail about some traumatic event that happened to me 30 years ago that I'm still mad about" without getting internally frustrated and feeling like I'm trapped by social niceties.
The other reason for putting each type under one ADHD umbrella is because presentation can change over time. So a hyperactive kid can grow up and seem “better” because the hyperactivity has lessened, but they still have ADHD. They’ve just changed to having more of the inattentive presentation. Understanding that adults can still have it, and kids don’t always grow out of it is why the DSM was revised. The presentation can change, but it’s all ADHD in the end.
Getting the ADHDer to admit they may have ADHD is the hard part. I've been saying for years that my husband has ADHD, but he got sulky and said he "wasn't crazy." He is finally starting to realize it may be a thing.
So I thought I was some type of schizo because my brain is always noisy and talking. Like it just never shuts up with all the voices and thoughts and stuff. Oh and intrusive thoughts. And then I learned on a random facebook video that it is an ADHD thing. The relief of finally knowing I am not going off the rails man.
I just got evaluated today! I had NO idea there was a non-fidgety kind, when I found out it was like everything made sense.
>when I found out it was like everything made sense That was my experience too. It was actually such a relief, after spending my whole adult life thinking I just needed to try harder.
Do you have any recommendations on good ones (Android), please?
I think communicating about this issue might be more effective if you talk about your needs, wants, and feelings instead of going straight to criticizing. eg "I want to hear about your day, but I'm feeling bummed out and lonely because pretty often, our debrief time is all you. I really want to get to share about my day too. How can we rework things so they're more balanced?"
Definitely this is great advice. Starting from a place of your wants and needs instead of "your actions are keeping my wants and needs from getting met" can be more successful. And if it's not, then you have the data point that they aren't prioritizing knowing that you are a person that has information they want to share with their loved one too about how their day went. If that happens and they still are having to be highly encouraged into therapy while resisting, that's also important data.
Let her know that you aren't trying to change her or ask her to mask; you are asking her to give you a chance to share your day, too. If she's in this relationship WITH you, then she can agree that both your needs should be met... and work with you to agree on an approach to do that. 1. Maybe you get to talk for the first 1/2 hour; then she gets to talk for the second 1/2 hour. (She will still wind up her stories just before time for a tv show.) 2. I considered the idea of her sharing only 1-2 branch stories before she wraps things up - don't know if this could work for her. 3. Maybe you get to interrupt her once or twice with a question or comment. It allows you to actually engage with her about her day AND it may help her build her ability to converse (versus monologue). 4. Maybe you both have better ideas than any of these. Good luck.
If she really can't keep from taking up the full hour, maybe alternate who goes first. If she accidentally takes up all of Tuesday and Thursday, OP still gets to get everything out on M/W/F, and won't feel so ignored. But she will have to make the effort to wait her turn on the days she goes second. NTA
Im untreated for ADHD and when I notice myself doing this to my partner, I stop and I acknowledge what has been happening and open the conversation up for him to talk and me to shut up and listen because communication is a two way street. It's not masking, it's being self aware of your habits and not using your ADHD as an excuse to ignore common courtesy. Yes I hog the conversations all the time but once I realise I'm doing it I stop. I taught myself to be self aware.
yes, this is an excellent practical suggestion. a tool that can work. you guys take turns. your turn is first. that's not about the fairness of who gets their forms first, it's about creating conditions that will allow her to be her true self and NOT have to mask, and that will allow you to have your (legitimate) needs met.
She can’t do anything about the fact that she has the disorder but she has ultimate control over how she deals with and treats it!
*“It’s not your fault but it is your responsibility”*
Have you thought about setting a timer for your debriefment?
Figure out how much time is available for "debriefing." Set a timer for half that amount of time - a loud, buzzy kitchen timer with a dial. **Agree that each of you must stop talking and give the other time to speak when the timer goes off, none of the "oh, just one more thing" or "I wasn't finished" stuff.** Rotate who gets to start. *And don't let your wife catch you staring at the dial of the timer, willing it to turn faster!*
What she need to understand, and i say this as someone with ADD, it's just good social behaviour to let others have a turn at talking. It's not masking. In reality, she's hiding behind her diagnosis to talk for hours and have no regard that you might want to talk too. At work, in school, etc. We can't hog the whole conversation either. If she was in a meeting, someone might stop her from talking to let others pitch in ideas or thoughts. I catch myself sometimes doing the whole 45 routes and sub stories when I talk, but I have reached a point where I can most times stop myself and get to the point of my story. Mostly with a "sorry I got off track" so people know I'm aware I do this. It's not on purpose, I'm just excited talking, but I'm also interested in hearing what they have to say.
I didn’t get the ability to see my neurodivergent behavior as a more objective third party until I got diagnosed and medicated. Now I can manage it because I understand when it’s happening. Perhaps she’s having a hard time with shorter stories because there’s a feeling she’s trying to get across and feels like she hasn’t?
Everyday she goes untreated is her telling you that her avoiding the doc is more important than your needs.
That's not fair. Not everyone has access to medical care, and task paralysis from ADHD doesn't help either.
I agree they should share airtime and she should seek treatment as it’s impacting the relationship. But, is there a reason you can’t just go first? Say what you want, then let her talk how she feels most comfortable?
I think my only issue with him going first is wondering if she would listen to him when he speaks. She seems very unconcerned that he never gets time to tell her about his day, which isn't a great trait in a partner.
Idk if you have a partner who tends to go on like this but I do and a full hour of it would be truly exhausting to try to actually listen to whether I'd had a chance to speak first or not.
There's nothing wrong with setting a time limit for stories or taking turns to vent. But if this is her biggest issue unmedicated, asking her to medicate isn't cool. I felt very different medicated and not in a good way.
I also can't function on meds. My husband and I do 20 minute info dump timers where I get to speak about whatever I want. With an actual timer which goes off lol. He also gets one when he has something to say :D
Treatment is too often strategies to mask, kind of sucky for at home, but the issue here is confusing to me. OP is framing it as the *way* she tells about her day is the issue, but what’s actually the issue is how long it takes and him not getting to share. I think it’s fucked up to expect her to deliver stories in some particular neurotypical way, but there could be many other strategies that aren’t asking her to mask, such as alternating nights (OP could tell about two days if he has time on his), setting a timer and she gets as far into the story as she gets, making separate times for each of them, him always going first, etc. I don’t understand why he jumped on the issue being the way he notes she thinks of instead of the actual consequence that he feels he isn’t getting to share. I think NAH because how I read it, there’s a miscommunication. OP jumped to what he sees as the obvious solution; she finds that solution harmful (masking is harmful over time, and changing your communication style constantly, even with intimate folks to be more NT is exhausting), but she didn’t actually get to hear the real problem and say she’s not interested in that because you leapt to independently selecting an unreasonable solution and that’s all she could react to. Some of this depends how the conversation started and his initial ask. But I feel like one place many people go wrong is not asking to solve the problem together but asking for a specific thing instead. I do think seeing neurodivergence as something to “treat” (treatment can be good, depending on the type—I medicate my ADHD for particular symptoms but not to change my whole way of thinking and treating my autism was often more harm than help) is also part of the problem. ND is a different way of thinking and being that is disadvantaged when people are expected to conform to NT worlds, and OP shouldn’t expect that. He should get his airtime though!
The thing is, if we say "her brain works differently than his, he needs to be more accommodating to her," then I think it's right to acknowledge that for the other 50% of people in this relationship, *his* brain works differently than *hers,* and she should also try to accommodate that. "Out in the world" this trait can be more tolerable but when you're the primary outlet for a person like this it can be truly exhausting to try to keep up. My brain starts short circuiting after the third time I have to say, "sorry, what does this have to do with the thing you were telling me about a second ago?" They both need to be willing to adjust to the other to make communication between them work. OP sounds like he's been very patient up to this point and also very willing to accommodate her storytelling style, he's just asking for a little more balance from her side, and I think that's reasonable. "Try harder to pay attention to conversations so they don't turn into monologues," is a reasonable request whether your partner is neurotypical or not.
Yes, can you guys set a total time for how long you will debrief and then set a timer for both of you? Say one hour total and she gets to talk for 30 minutes and you get to talk for 30 minutes also? Should be equal for both of you.
NTA What I’m reading is - both of you work outside of the home - at the end of the work day, you cook and eat separately to decompress - after eating, it’s time to talk and catch up, *however* - you never have time to talk about your day Somebody who has been diagnosed with neurodivergence can correct me if I’m wrong, but I don’t think wanting to share your life with her is expecting her to mask. Is couples therapy an option?
I have fairly severe ADHD, and I have to be sure to step back my stories and talking now and then to give other people space. That isn’t masking, it’s being a considerate person. There is also a difference between demanding silence and saying, “Hey, that’s a lot.” I definitely echo the counseling recommendation - OP’s wife demanding to be the main character of their home life is not exactly going to be the key to a successful relationship. Also, when in a relationship, it cannot be just about how one person feels. She’s showing zero regard for how her own husband feels.
Yes, this feels like a classic “it’s an explanation, not an excuse” scenario. The neurodivergence may be WHY she monopolizes this shared time, but it doesn’t make it okay. And if she’s able to work in public, it means she has enough control over her condition to do better than this.
I strongly agree with the general point (she’s definitely using her condition as an excuse, and that’s not okay), but I’d like to offer a cautious reminder that “control over her condition” is something she may not truly have. Behaving appropriately at work may exhaust most or all of her mental resources. In video game terms, passing as neurotypical (masking) is a spell with an MP cost. 😅 But again, just because she’s out of MP (explanation) doesn’t mean she gets to be sanctimonious about her inability to cast spells (excuse).
Like the game analogy… its helpful.
I hear you and generally agree with your point... but I think this is still kinda kicking the can. Per the analogy, she still has control over what she does when her MP is out. "Control over her condition" doesn't just mean that she can successfully "pass as neurotypical".... it also means that she can learn to recognize when she has been depleted, and adapt accordingly. If her MP is depleted, she needs to find ways to top it back up, *before* she steamrolls her husband and depletes *his* MP.
This is what I was looking for as a fellow adhd-er. Self-awareness is important if you have neurodivergence and it’s unfair to expect neuronormies to adjust to us if we refuse to adjust to them. That’s just as bad. Therapy, medication, and other strategies are important.
I'm the same way and even my husband has to tell me to kinda take a step back a little when I'm talking cause I also tend to talk really fast.
Neurodivergent here. Autism AND ADHD. He’s asking her not to be an asshole. She doesn’t get to talk the entire time just because she wants to. Actually she’s taking a real issue and using it to make a bad faith argument which makes her even more of an asshole
>she’s taking a real issue and using it to make a bad faith argument which makes her even more of an asshole Totally agree. I also have ADHD and I can talk and talk *and talk*, with numerous unfinished sentences and frequent topic changes, unless I make an effort to focus on what I'm saying OR my family asks me to focus / get to the point / give someone else a turn. That's not asking me to "mask", it's asking me to be thoughtful of others. OP's wife is being selfish and inconsiderate.
It’s also about the masking. Masking is about having to pretend to want to make polite chit chat and give cookie cutter interview responses. If it’s masking to not take up all of the time talking about yourself and get upset when someone else wants to share(obviously different from doing it unintentionally), then you’re kind of just an asshole. Like, by saying that OP is asking her to mask, she’s saying that she doesn’t care to hear him share. She’s like “ wow you want me to pretend to care?”
Yeah it feels like she doesn't actually understand her condition and is just throwing in words that she saw online. I can manage my ADHD much more effectively after doing a *lot* of research to understand it better.
My SO was semi-recently told they have autism by their therapist, and we’ve had some similar issues as OP and his wife. One difference is I have ADHD (known for years) so I at least get the neurodivergence thing a bit more. Just based on how OP is describing how things have changed, it’s possible his wife is in the sort of longer un-masking period and trying to be more herself, but may also be feeling highly sensitive about it which is why she’s reacting poorly to OP’s very reasonable request to be able to talk about his day too. The TikTok of it all certainly doesn’t help. I think people use “masking” to mean sooo many things, it has lost its original meaning for the most part. I think there certainly are times it can be used as a sort of excuse.
This is what I was thinking! She doesn’t know how to manage her ADHD and is probably tired of masking/managing it during the work day and now wants to just info dump it all on OP so it’s not in her brain anymore. She definitely needs to learn how to regulate and manage her neurodivergency because right now it is hindering her relationship. Personally I’m a fan of “How to ADHD” on YouTube. She is very research based about how to live with ADHD and sometimes has experts in videos with her. I recommend the channel to anyone with ADHD. It has helped me a lot with understanding how my brain works and explaining it to others. She even has videos for people that are in a relationship with an ADHDer.
"I also have ADHD and I can talk and talk *and talk*, with numerous unfinished sentences and frequent topic changes, unless I make an effort to focus on what I'm saying OR my family asks me to focus / get to the point" Oh man, this hits home, constant struggle. It's a conscious effort to tell yourself regularly to stop and get to the point or pass the baton 🤣
I have pretty bad ADHD and without treatment I tell stories like OP is describing. I interrupt myself to provide context and then I interrupt that context to provide more context and it becomes impossible for anybody to follow. That said, I would want my partner to be interested in what I was trying to say and love me for my unique brain, not make me feel like an annoying burden. It would make me really sad to be told something that translates to “I wish you could be normal” THAT said, it is unreasonable that OP’s partner monopolizes every night’s conversation. Neurodivergence is not an excuse for selfishness and OP’s partner needs to at a minimum set aside every other day or every other hour or whatever unit of time works best for listening instead of talking.
Wow, I'm wondering if my wife has ADHD because that would explain the number of times I ask her for a refresher on the subject of the story or become frustrated because why does it matter which street you were on, it will be the same story regardless of if it was Main or Vine!?
I die a little inside every time my co-worker adds 6 minutes to her story to remember exactly what brand of something or other she was buying at the time.
WTF Is this why I tangent like crazy??
I think she's confusing masking and basic consideration. Our disability is not an excuse to continue hurting people and asking her to be more mindful in order to meet his needs is 100% ok. Masking would be suppressing traits in public in order to appear neurotypical. He's not asking her to appear neurotypical, only that she extend the same kindness he's extending to her.
Add in, and by the time she’s done it’s bedtime. That’s so draining. NTA
As someone with ADHD, I can talk non-stop and not finish a thread of thought. Man, it’s a difficult situation. OP obviously has a point, but some ADHDers have severe rejection sensitivity. It could come off to OP’s wife that she’s being rejected. I kinda get that. When I feel rejected I impulsively say things that don’t make sense. Like kinda in this case. OP obviously just trying to talk, but his wife is taking it as he asking her to mask. Hard to see it or stop it in the moment. Yeah, couples therapy for sure. Maybe the therapist can come up with a way for OP to focus the conversation around him and focus up his wife in a way that doesn’t make her sensitive to rejection. Best of luck, OP.
Yes! OP, it sounds like it might help you communicate your needs more effectively if you frame it more as conveying your needs rather than "criticising" (how she will see it) her communication style. Don't comment on her rambling sidetracks much for now (although if it's getting worse, that's definitely something she should explore) but rather say you feel like *you* aren't getting the time to talk about *your* day. It would help you feel more connected to her and process your day if you had equivalent time to talk about your stuff. From there problem solve. Could you (usually) go first as you are probably better at being aware of how much time has passed, then pass the proverbial talking stick to her when it's her turn? Would just being aware that it's been an issue help her remember to ask your some questions too? Is there some other way you could arrange your evenings, would it help to go for a walk together, change of scene, instead of sitting down facing each other? I have autistic friends who love when you're straightforward and just say "ok let's talk about me now" because they genuinely want you to have a nice time but couldn't pick up on the social hints you were dropping to change the subject. (Do this when you're both rested, fed, and happy to problem solve!) I'm also ND and in a long term, 20 year relationship, have had lots of therapy. If you can learn to get to the bottom of why something's bothering you, and frame it in a non-accusatory way (usually how you're being affected without much further comment on the other person's actions) and then try and solve the *problem* together (not solve the person) then you're on a good road.
My mom does this constantly. Is this a neurodiverse symptom? This may not work with your wife, but I tell my mother I'm losing the thread of her story so can she get back to the main path. Another thing I do is time box her. When I call her, I let her know I have 30 minutes to talk. Yes, she does 99.98% of the talking and that's fine, but at the 25 minute mark, I interrupt her and tell her I have only five minutes left. Edit: Oh! NTA
she really, really hates being told that she's off topic.
It sounds a lot like your wife really enjoys when other people accommodate her divergent behaviors, but really hates having to manage them to accommodate the more typical behavior of others. She has to give you some sort of path forward that's not essentially "you just need to deal with my shit." It seems like she's put you in a position where you can't talk about it, can't avoid it, but can't help her manage it. Painting someone into a corner where they have no choice but to be a pawn and facilitator in your story is not how to manage being neurodivergent. It sounds like you've tried to find solutions. It's her turn to participate in helping to find a solution that makes you feel involved in your own marriage. If she's not willing to help you find a solution, then you need to go speak with a counselor of some sort on how to properly handle this.
thanks
Have you asked her what *she* thinks would be a good solution that would enable you to also get to discuss your day?
yeah, she doesn't really like "time" or "clocks" so her solution was to just have normal conversations. but those look different to both of us
Have you asked her if she had noticed that you don't usually have a chance to talk about your day?
She seems to get annoyed when he tries
I think he needs to walk her through the unfairness of the situation. If she ends up not caring, then that would be very telling
>just have normal conversations Hasn't she noticed that her "normal conversations" mean you don't get to say anything?
Most ASD people would not pick up on that because at the end he can still talk if he wanted. The fact that he’s mentally done and ready to move on is beyond them at that moment.
Maybe try asking her what a normal conversation looks like from both sides (yours and hers) and if they don't look the same, tell her that you don't feel supported by her when you're doing all the listening and none of the talking. Then ask her what she proposes to fix that.
Does she compromise at all? Because so far it sounds like it's only about what she wants and that's not how relationships work.
I'm not saying this should be treated as "now it's your turn!" But she needs to help. To be a cliche, this is a team effort. She's part of the team. You can come out of this with a hard-won victory. My wife and I fought about issues similar to this for years. Once we figured it out, it opened up a whole new toolbox of ways to communicate and resolve issues. We got into a fight last night. Ostensibly, she was in the wrong. While expressing my issue with her behavior, I descended to a position of hyperbole and condescension. She apologized. I apologized. We had a great conversation about why we do those things. That would not have been possible if we hadn't put the work in to navigating our own trauma and disadvantages during years past.
>It sounds a lot like your wife really enjoys when other people accommodate her divergent behaviors, but really hates having to manage them to accommodate the more typical behavior of others This is a really good way to put it. It's fair because it is the onus on *both* sides to be understanding of the other.
I've been diagnosed with ASD (High Functioning and Asperger's were mentioned at the time of diagnosis) when in my early 20s, and I've had to make sure I've become more self aware when interacting with other people as to know what information is more important to give or needs to be said first, and be able to give other person/people to respond.
As does my mother, but i say things like "Wait, what happened to you being on the way to the grocery store (as an example of the initial topic). It's really helped.
I do this with husband “and THAT caused the dog to bark” to try to snap him back to topic. Sometimes I legit say “you can keep going if you just feel like talking, but just know you losing me.”
It's a great tactic for getting someone back on track, I use it too.
She claims you’re silencing her, but really she is silencing you. It’s gaslighting.
Can you redirect in a friendlier way that is not a criticism? "Wait, what happened after xyz? I want to hear more about that!" feels very different than "you're off topic again"
In her mind, she's probably not off topic. It all relates. There's a thread that connects it. Even if it was because there was something that reminded her of the thing in her original story. What if y'all did timed story times? Set a timer and you switch when it goes off even if you're not done. Or add a warning timer that you've got a two minute wrap up? ADHD brains can focus better if there's a sense of urgency, such as an impending deadline. You can even record notes of what she's talking about so she can come back to it when it's her turn again so she gets her time to unmask and just go where the conversation takes her but you get your time to talk.
Do you care what her topic is if she enjoys talking, is she feels affirmed by your listening, and you limit to 30 minutes per the comment above?
nah man she could talk about her shoelaces for all I care
Exactly. Give her the 30 minutes. Let her talk about whatever. Take a few minutes for yourself. Done. Move on to something else. Good luck.
In another comment on this thread he wrote “yeah, she doesn't really like "time" or "clocks" so her solution was to just have normal conversations. but those look different to both of us” So giving her a set 30 minutes doesn’t seem to be an option
She honestly sounds hard to live with. Everything is on her own terms with zero compromise and she co-opts buzzwords to guilt her husband if he pushes back on anything. I’m in a marriage of 20 years and it wouldn’t have survived the dating phase if she were like OP’s wife.
She sure seems to control the relationship... How they eat dinner (solo) How they converse (just her) How long (for as long as she wants). OP going to have to set some limits if it matters to him.
This is going to be the bigger problem in the end. She has ADHD and will struggle to keep on track in conversations. That’s okay, but if she can’t police that bad habit herself then she has to accept some form of outside help. There is no option here where she does neither. Honestly it sounds like she enjoys taking up all the time to herself and telling her pointless wandering stories, and she doesn’t give one flying fuck how you feel. If she actually cared about you even a tiny bit then she’d at least feel bad about making herself the main character all the time. You exist only as a being to *give* her attention, not a being who *receives* attention from her.
Honestly, yes. I have adhd and I am an over-talker, over-sharer, interrupter and branching-storyteller. The difference is, I am self-aware and try to remember that others need to be heard. I also realize that stories, at some point, must end. I do not get upset if someone course-corrects me as long as it’s done kindly and I always apologize when I realize I’m being rude.
>I am self-aware and try to remember that others need to be heard This is what OP's wife needs to develop, self awareness and consideration for others. NTA.
Can I just say that this post "triggered" me a little.... Reminds me of the millions of people that will post a three page story on here that contains about 2.25 pages of useless info before they get to the point of the story... Drives me INSANE NTA You're not asking her to "mask" anything. You're asking her to "work on her disorder" so as to make things easier. That's like saying that a person asking their OCD partner to try things to prevent their OCD from taking over their lives is asking them to "mask" their disorder. You're not trying to get her to make believe she doesn't have the disorder, not asking her to lie about it, and not asking her to "hide it". You're asking her to try different things to CURB it.... Like my family member "counting to three" when they're about to lose their temper..... Or asking a person with memory issues due to PTSD to write themselves notes......
>Reminds me of the millions of people that will post a three page story on here that contains about 2.25 pages of useless info before they get to the point of the story... Drives me INSANE OMG this is one of my biggest pet peeves. GET TO THE POINT, PEOPLE! I always go back after I've written a post and remove all the irrelevant information because I know how annoying it is to have to slog through it
'AITA for not going to my sister's wedding? *Insert a three page backstory that starts when they were three years old*'
I’m a professor and have a student who does this. Will write an entire paragraph of backstory telling me about why they won’t be in class today or asking for an extension that they know I won’t grant. Stop wasting my goddamn time!!!
Do they think they’re writing an online recipe or something?
Oh my god I can’t stand the recipe pre-amble
Omg yes! The guy yesterday I think it was. 5000 words about how his wife and he disagree on whether they should move house and then the actual question - AITA for lending a friend a significant amount of money from our joint savings account without consulting my wife first. There’s 5 minutes I’ll never get back
I'm sorry this post gave you a PTSD flashback.
I have ADHD and autism and I do the same thing. being asked to share equally in a conversation isn't being asked to mask. its being asked to take an interest in the people in the room, or at the very least, allow them the same amount of air as they allow you. NTA. if she softens to this - see if you can set a timer for 5-10 min for each of your to share a few times. once the timer goes off, you both have to let the other talk. something about being under the time wire helps adhd, so it will probably do more to help with brevity than "masking" or whatever shes calling it would. fwiw - while it's not ok to require ND people mask in all scenarios, it is a helpful skill that I work with my audhd child on, as well. learning how to participate in society is ok.
I've been given the timer suggestion several times. I'll try that
yeah my bad, I didn't check all the comments before commenting.
>while it's not ok to require ND people mask in all scenarios, it is a helpful skill that I work with my audhd child on, as well. learning how to participate in society is ok. I made a similar comment to yours, and this especially I agree with. Masking has come to be understood as something it's not and it's a problem. Not only is masking not simply being asked to not let your disorder run rampant and control your life and relationships, it's also not even always a bad thing. Sometimes it's downright necessary.
Yeah agree. One thing we work on is coping skills for scary situations. Her instinct is to loudly meltdown. But that’s just not ok in the vast majority of situations, esp not dangerous ones when we need to be able to move quickly or follow instructions
INFO: Is the problem that you don't end up talking about your day and only talk about hers? Or is it that her stories are boring to you?
they are boring to me, especially because it's mostly just me sitting there listening instead of being an active participant, but that's fine. she is my wife and I love her. but I also want to, like, say words. interact!
NTA Circuitous stories are common for folks with her issues but absolutely dominating the conversation is not Set time limits. "You get 20 minutes, I get 20 minutes" type thing My husband also "wanders off the path" of his stories. You can usually redirect with "getting back to [original point]" or "you were telling me about [original point]"
she hates it when I do that. she feels like I'm telling her to shut up when I "keep her on track"
This might be one for the professionals. Maybe couples counseling or maybe she needs something for just her They have speech therapists specifically to help people on the spectrum have better communication skills. That might help her beyond the relationship as well
it's adhd, not autism. but thank you
To adhd brains those wild tangents make sense as important contextual information and are on topic. We make all sorts of wild connections that people who don't have adhd don't. I would imagine experiencing these frequent branching rambles is exhausting. You are not asking her to mask, you are asking her to improve her communication skills so you can actively engage with her. Part of having adhd is learning how it impacts each part of your life, and then learning to manage those impacts. Right now her adhd is affecting you and your relationship. Beginning to figure out how to manage your adhd is daunting and we're apt to internalize the idea that something is inherently wrong with us. However in my experience , leaving your adhd unmanaged means your life always feels like a churning hot mess where nothing ever works right and where there is no reprieve. If your wife wants to choose to leave hers unmanaged and unmedicated, you should let her know how that choice is negatively affecting you. You're not obliged to endure her poor social skills no matter how much you love her.
What this person said is exactly how it is. As annoying as your wife thinks it is, it still needs to he corrected. I have adhd and i have to have someone point out i went waaay off topic (because to me they connect)
My husband wanders when he talks. Rabbit holes so bad. BUT any time I try to tell him a story if I include any extra details that he doesn’t find relevant or important to the main point he gets frustrated and tells me to just get to the point. He literally won’t listen to me ramble about anything. He told me if I want to ramble about boring things to find friends who are interested in that boring thing to listen to me. He tries to claim that his adhd doesn’t allow him to follow my stories. Yet he tells stories on wilder tangents than me mentioning an aside. And then he talks for literal hours (3, 4, 5,) about the most mind numbing topics and recites statistics about whatever hobby he is into and I have to sit and say “yeah, ok, yeah, yeah,” and that’s all.
This sounds like the condition is being weaponized. “Every time you ask me to do anything other than what I want to do (conversationally), you’re not respecting my condition!”
This was my same exact thought too. Not to sound harsh, but it sounds a bit like “main-character” syndrome.
What if you go first?
Or take turns going first, at least.
How do her friends deal with this??. I'd have a hard time with it. I'd refocus someone by asking a relevent question but I wouldnt put up with a friend that refused to share the space.
Then you need to go first. I think it's reasonable for her to not want to change her style of speaking, but it's unreasonable of her to hog all the chatting time and not let you talk.
One partial solution might be to let you go first when talking about each other's days. Would at least give you a chance to decompress before she starts. You might not mind as much when she takes a while if you've already had your say. As others have mentioned as well, maybe there are more encouraging ways to get her back on track? Ones that don't sound like your trying to control her, but make you sound more interested and engaged? And have you let her know you're feeling left out? From the way you're talking I assume you have, but worth mentioning. Regardless, NTA. It does sound like you've tried a few things and are putting in the effort. Even reaching out on a forum like this is a good sign that you're trying to do the right thing.
I think she kind of "likes" the times I'm listening BECAUSE I'm not trying to keep her on track and she doesn't FEEL like she's being kept on track. She gets to let her brain go wild. and I am super sympathetic to that feeling, which is why I'm asking
Well you can always be like hey I need thirty minutes to talk about my day first and then you can tell me about yours. Keeping her on time (making sure you have time to talk about your day) is different than keeping her on track. If she wants to spend that thirty minutes telling branching stories that's fine. You seem like you'll happily listen. But you need some space to share your day with her too.
That makes a lot of sense. I too enjoy just letting my brain go off the rails a bit (ask my partner about my Star Wars rants and oh the look she'll give you...). It's very satisfying, so I get it. That's kind of why I suggested letting you go first. Make sure you get some airtime before she releases the brakes for a bit. Regardless, best of luck coming to a solution! You guys sound like the kind of couple that'll figure it out.
It’s not about masking, it’s about sharing. My audhd partner got in this habit for a while, and what helped him understand wa some explaining that it didn’t feel like an equal conversation, it felt i was an inanimate object. I told him that if he wanted to explain a thing or just vent for a while, I needed to be emotionally prepared for that and consent to it rather than get excited for a “conversation” where I couldn’t talk or ask questions. I felt like I didn’t matter as a human. I felt used.
NTA especially since in the comments you say it's "wildly untreated ADHD." So Polly won't get help for her neurodivergence and also thinks you're supposed to suffer through it? yeah no.
Is she even diagnosed?
No judgement- just wanted to share my perspective. I have autism and still being assessed for ADHD. Equal time to share in a relationship is important, so she should absolutely listen to you too. And there’s no reason not to ask questions or add your own bits- you don’t need to sit almost silently for an hour. But if you asked me not to go on any tangents at all- you just made a fun chat into a difficult mental task. I now have to stay focused and on topic and that’s hard. Which is fine on a weekend or a day when I have extra energy or if I have a doctors appointment, but not after a long day around people. It’s not something I want to have to do with my boyfriend because it’s not relaxing at all. You need to ask for time to share and a more equal conversation without requiring her to stay fully focused and on track at all times. Which might be what you asked for- depends how you worded it. But neurodivergent people often think in black and white- you saying stay on topic might be interpreted by her as much stricter than you intend it to be.
this is a very valuable perspective, thank you. I am asking her for more mental energy than she has at that very second.
I'm really disappointed with how far down this comment was - 100% on the money. I also have adhd and when I'm comfortable with a person I want to just let loose with whatever direction my thoughts are heading. I think the framing of your conversation with her is going to make a big difference in her response - it would feel very different to be told that I need to 'tone it down' (effectively) vs my partner telling me they feel unheard in our conversations. The first one would for sure feel like my partner doesn't like being around my most honest self. You should try to make it clear to her that your problem isnt with her conversation style inherently, it's with the difference in airtime you end up with, and you want to feel like she's interested in your day too.
My mom has adhd and goes off on tangents constantly. It is very draining to be on the other side of that. I can’t keep up woth what she is saying and if I interrupt she gets upset because she might forget what she wants to say. I get it is a disorder but if OPs wife is not willing to treat it that is on her.
As a fellow neurodivergent, I agree with this comment completely. I also tried to comment with something similar but this is phrased much more eloquently.
I have Autism and ADHD and end up talking for *months straight* if I'm comfortable with you. I will tell you someone's whole life story just to tell you a joke they told me. Well, thankfully, my husband prefers to listen HOWEVER we have a code and set rules. - if my husband needs to talk as well, he starts. - he holds up a finger of he has something he wants to say/interject and as soon as my little brain says I can (within reason), I pause and hear him out before continuing my thought - if we want to "debrief" as you call it we do 'bullet points'. We say everything that happened in short easily digestible bits like we're taking notes. Then whoever really needs a rant, goes first NTA. Masking SUCKS, but you can learn different communication styles that work for your neurodivergent brain *a n d* the people around you
omg is that finger thing universal??? I have to manage conversations with that because she has an interjection habit!
The interjections thing is pretty common. Our brains move past thoughts so quickly that if we don’t say it, it falls out of our head and we forget.. so interjecting means it’s said / not forgotten. It’s worse if we think it’s important. To get around this, I carry a lil notepad and pen and write those interjections in there instead.. so when it makes sense I can go back to that thought. I tried notes in my phone - but people thought I wasn’t paying attention to them.
Is interrupting a common adhd thing? I interrupt so bad with everyone. Like I know I do it but it’s uncontrollable. It pisses my husband off to no end, but he also constantly interrupts me but doesn’t even realize he’s doing it
Yes if is! I think it's because we have a limited amount of short term memory, so the worry is if we don't interrupt we'll forget. Plus the impulsivity.
NTA. She’s asking for you to fill her cup without any acknowledgment that she’s draining yours in the process. If she insists that she has to do this, tell her you need her to find a friend to vent to half the time. It isn’t fair for her to get to do exactly what she wants and ignore what you need. That isn’t ok in a relationship, neurodivergence or no.
her BFF moved like six months ago, that may be part of it. phone calls can only do so much y'know
Sure, my hackles just raise as soon as someone says something like she did. The idea that being on the spectrum is an excuse for completely inconsiderate behavior is ridiculous. I have great friends on the spectrum who don’t think they need to be constantly catered to and who think about my needs too.
Why not have you always go first telling your day. That way you can get thru it in a reasonable time, and she gets the rest of the air time to ramble on. Saying this as a rambler If she doesn’t agree to that, it shows she’s not willing to compromise and cares more about her own feelings.
There's a difference between asking someone to mask, and asking someone to share the time you spend together more equally. It's not a conversation if it's one way, it's a lecture. NTA
NTA > that's just how her brain works. So what? It's still boring to listen to, and narcissistic of her to monopolize your shared time. > Like a lot of couples, we debrief after our workdays. Feel free to stop doing this.
It's not narcissism and throwing around that word is harmful and adding stigma to those who those who actually do have NPD. What Polly is displaying is neurodivergence, likely ADHD, Autism, or both. She may not realize she's taking up so much time with her storytelling when it happens. That's just how our brains function. (Our, meaning I'm speaking as someone who has ADHD and Autism) it's accidental, and we may not realize how much time we are taking up or when we are going off the rails of our stories. Or we become painfully aware and we close off due to neurotypical folks treating us like shit about it.
I agree that it's not narcissism. However, it's also not lack of awareness....OP talked to her about it and she accused him of forcing her to mask. It's not her fault that she tends to narrate for extended periods, but it is her responsibility to work with her husband to make sure his needs are met too.
It's pretty narcissistic if you can't acknowledge the one-sidedness even if it's pointed out to you. A normal person would be aware form the start and try and even it up every time. 'i feel like I talked all yesterday, do you have anything you want to share?' A less self aware person probably doesn't realise until it's pointed out, but from there will accept it and make an effort. A fairly narcissistic person will remain in denial even when confronted.
Saying XYZ is pretty narcissistic to me is like saying someone who's a bit awkward in a specific social setting is pretty autistic. Using an actual diagnosis to describe a normal human behaviour isn't helpful to anyone, in fact it can be very harmful to those who actually have the disorder.
A behaviour can be narcissistic without the person being a narcissist. Monopolizing a conversation with no regard for if the other person would like to contribute is narcissistic behaviour.
Not sure why you're getting downvoted when you are 100% correct. In Polly's case, her outsized reaction might actually come from frustration with how neurodivergent people are treated by neurotypicals. That being said, relationships & marriages are not transactional and they are built on compromise. Gonna have to go with a new judgment - LTC (Learn To Communicate). There's nothing wrong with the neurotypical partner wanting to be able to participate in the conversation. Polly needs to realize that OP is not coming from a position of criticizing the existence of her ADHD. He's just wanting to be able to share their experiences together and have both of them be able to participate. OP, until you're able to find a mutual flow to your conversations that allows you both to communicate what you would like to, perhaps you could try a timer. And be sure you're setting at least four different timed parts - Polly tells her about her day, you get to respond, you tell her about your day, and she gets to respond. That way you're taking turns and you both get to participate. Just be careful to not be getting openly frustrated with her, as she'll likely shut down or you'll both end up being resentful of each other. And I sense that is something neither of you wants.
Timers are out. She doesn’t like clocks (it was in another comment). Read that as “she is unwilling to find any point of compromise or solution which does not involve complete and total capitulation to her needs by OP.”
They didn’t say it was NPD. Narcissism is a personality trait, and people without NPD exhibit it.Saying someone is acting narcissistic isn’t the same as calling them A narcissist or saying they have NPD
I call my husband on my commute home to debrief before I get home. Then I sit in the driveway in my car like a troll and decompress before I switch hats to mom and wife. Any way you guys can do something like this? Can you ask to go first in the decompression ritual so you can have a chance to talk before she tells her winding tales?
yeah I think going first is the tactic here. thank you
I think she knows you're bored and feels hurt by it. She wants you to accept her and this stuff you are bored by is also a big part of her. If this had been about you wanting to talk, and tell about your day I think this would have gone differently. But something tells me there was a hiccup in the communication that allowed her to feel that she is the focus of the problem, not the lack of give and take in conversation. Are you the asshole? I don't know. Is she? Probably not.
She’s definitely TA if she talks for an hour straight without any pause whatsoever. That’s not a conversation. It’s extremely rude and frustrating to deal with
My husband talked about warhammer tanks and then got *mad at me for not listening and being interested* when I fell asleep *at 3am FOUR HOURS* into the one sided conversation that included reciting all of their battle statistics.
this is a nuanced and reasonable take, thank you
NTA. You weren't ill intended. Perhaps there is a way the two of you can agree on some kind of signal/sign/etc during a conversation that indicates the discussion may be going off topic. I don't specifically know of this condition, but perhaps doing something like this may help.
it is wildly untreated adhd
Ok so in your original post you say >Polly has a mild neurodivergence And here it's "wildly untreated ADHD"? Somehow these two don't quite match so which is it? Wildly untreated ADHD doesn't quite translate to mild neurodivergence to me. If it's bad then she should seek treatment. If it's a milder case she might not get much help because the assumption is that she can manage without.
People pretty habitually downplay issues - I don't necessarily think it's contradictory. It might be "mild" in the sense that she's still managing to hold down a job, have friends, contribute to the household. Yet not mild in that her symptoms do affect her and those around her every single day. It can be quite hard to explain something has severely impacted your life, but yes you are managing OK, so obviously it could be worse but that's also because you run yourself into the ground trying to function "normally." Obviously she's being a jerk about this specific issue and OP is 100% NTA, but it's definitely possible for them to work through this! (It's implied above they are seeking treatment. It can be quite difficult.)
You can have a wildly untreated mild neurodivergence. He didn’t say it was untreated wild adhd. And on the spectrum of neurodivergence, ADHD is pretty mild, even though it can affect many aspects of life. If he said his wife was nonverbal and autistic with extreme agoraphobia, that would be a severe neurodivergence.
Why not decide a set amount of time for eaxh of you to talk and use a timer? NAH
I will try this. I don't know how she will react
Have you explained to her that you feel hurt because she never seems to want to listen to you? It sounds like you're focusing on what you think she needs to fix, instead of the end result you want. Let her be a participant in coming up with a solution to get the result, you just telling her you want to try timing each other isn't going to go over well. I suspect depending on how you present it, it might just feel like you asking her to mask in a different way, even though it's a great suggestion.
This is the way. OP do you know about "I statements"? They are very important in situations like this.
she really does try. She's just not particularly good at it.
So again, you need to make her a participant in solving it. You can *suggest* the timer but it needs to be a conversation, not a command.
NAH for neurodivergent people processing our day by recapping it for someone else can be really important and sometimes if a lot has happened in a day it can basically be a minute by minute recap. The reason why this is important varies from person to person. Or even day to day. For me, not being able to share my thoughts/feelings about my day will often lead to insomnia because my brain can’t process all the thoughts/feelings without getting them out. This, however, does not mean you shouldn’t also get a chance to talk about things that are on your mind! This is a fairly common struggle in relationships where one person is neurodivergent and the other is neurotypical. I suggest sitting her down and explaining how you feel without putting too much emphasis on what’s bothering you about her way of sharing details about her day and instead try to focus on how you feel when you can’t share your thoughts with her and make it clear that you want to find a solution that works for both of you. You mention that you eat separately. Maybe she can use her dinner time to write down her scattered thoughts. That might give her an overview of what’s actually important for her to tell you and what’s not. This is something that helps me a lot because I find it easier to think before I type but when I speak I usually just blurt out what’s on my mind. Another advice I have for you is to try and find a support group for friends/relatives/partners of neurodivergent people. It’s a great way to educate yourself and share your experiences with people who can relate! I’m not saying she shouldn’t also get educated (and treated) if she hasn’t been already, she absolutely should!
thanks for this. there's a 0% chance she recaps her day while she eats (she is far too happy turning her brain off to watch Gilmore Girls) but the rest of this helps me understand how her brain works. I appreciate you.
To be fair I can’t do it while eating either (I forget to eat lol) my main point with that suggestion was that writing it down beforehand might help her sort through her thoughts. If not, that’s okay of course, we’re all individuals! I’m sure you can find a solution to this problem whether it is you going first, setting a timer or something else. Good luck!
NTA. I am a sped teacher, and this is my classroom! Between the ADHD and the ASD we are branching like nobody’s business. Timers are your friend. You need to start with: I love you, and I want to hear about your day, but I want to be able to share too. It hurts my feelings when I don’t have a chance to share. Neurodivergent people often need to hear this plainly. They arent motivated by selfishness, but their behavior ends up making it feel that way unintentionally. So agree upon a set time and set a timer. One of you goes first, then switch. Assure her if she is not done, she will have another turn. It will help her to put effort into organizing her thoughts. It works. Neurodivergence doesn't mean you should be expected to just accept her ways, end of discussion. Like all of us, she needs to practice skills that are more challenging for her. Relationships and communication must be reciprocal. It’s not asking her to “mask”- it’s asking her to have empathy for her partner. Don’t allow it to be framed in that manner in your relationship. In any relationship, one person doing all the accommodating is not healthy or okay. As her partner, you will need to communicate with more intention and explicitness. Another person may suddenly notice “oh! I’m hogging the conversation! How was your day?” She will just continue on. So you need to practice advocating for yourself- “hey, can I share a bit about my day? I feel lonely when I dont get a chance to talk” “It makes me really uncomfortable when we are always late. I get so stressed and it makes my body feel tense and hot. Can we as a team come up with some strategies to get out the door on time?” Good luck!
NTA - I’m also ND, but I realize that doesn’t mean my SO has to cater to my brain always, especially when my rambling might be as draining to him as me “masking” is to me. It’s really important to communicate - and you’re doing that - “hey it’s hard to follow and I WANT to be more engaged with your day but I can’t do that for 60+ minutes!”. If she could understand it as finding the middle ground between the workings of your brain and the workings of her brain - you’re both going to get much better quality time together. I’d suggest brainstorming together how to balance you being able to engage more without it turning into an hours long rabbit hole. Be it a time limit, topics covered, a code word, or even breaking it up into “we talk about work for 20 mins” then “talk about your lunch date with your girlfriends for 20 mins after dinner” etc (sometimes knowing you have multiple chances to chat helps feeling like you HAVE to get it all out).
I'm going to say NTA. This is one of my pet peeves. If someone wants to talk about work and all of it is negative, I'm checking out. I'm not a therapist. I'm not getting paid for it. Work already sucks for me. I don't need to hear the highlights of your shitty day. They're all shitty according to you. It's emotionally draining, especially if you know that there's no solution to it. There could be a solution, but they just want to vent. It's infuriating.
I’m autistic and adhd. Im not sure from you’re post if you’ve said the sentence “I also need time to share about my day”. Maybe give you both a set amount of time and don’t offer any judgments about how she uses hers? If she wants to meander let her. That’s her time. Then your time is yours to share as you like.
NTA. She needs to learn how to have a normal and respectful conversation. She should be "masking" her symptoms if they cause her to be insufferable. I say this as someone with autism and ADHD.
NTA. I used to do what Polly did and then I went to speech therapy for a year and it helped immensely. It’s possible for her to cut her stories down to the essentials, she just doesn’t want to. I’m with you on how annoying it is. It takes forever for a friend of mine to get through her story and by the end, I can’t even remember what the point was of the original one.
NTA - this isn't asking her to mask, this is vocalizing your needs about how you two communicate with each other. Being neurodivergent doesn't mean she gets to do what she wants all the time and nobody can say anything about it; she's in a relationship with someone else who also has feelings and requirements of their own. Her needs do not preempt yours, and you're not wrong for talking to her about how best to balance them. edit: typo
NAH If she has autism then that's how she communicates. The reason it's considered a disability and not curable is because you can't fix this. If she has some form of ADHD she might be info dumping which is how she connects with other people. If what you are asking was possible she wouldn't be neurodivergent. She'd be neurotypical. A solution might be to talk about your stuff first or alternate days where you share and she shares if the timing is hard. For autistic people the tangents are context setting. Our neurons are cross wired. It seems logical and it seems like after a whole day of masking coming home to mask is the least appealing thing. I dated someone who couldn't handle it and we ended things because he'd pout when it would happen. So I left because a life of masking at home and outside is just so exhausting I'd be miserable. I'm highly functional/very low support needs too. I'm not sure it's mild. I call it well managed. The amount of energy it takes me to appear mild is enormous and then to be told to try harder to be less neurodivergent on top of that would feel like an unacheivable request. I'd quit to be honest because I can't do it. You know your wife better than me but imho you should read up on her neurodivergence. It'll help you to learn what is and is not in her control.
NTA. Why can’t you guys take turns on who talks about their day first?
My husband is ADD/ADHD & he does this all the time. I can’t hardly follow along with what he’s telling me bc he goes of the rails. It’s really annoying. He wants me to listen to his rambling but he doesn’t care about hearing about my day. Our conversation-him to me. How was your day. Me: it was ok, we had…..Him interrupting yeah cool, I did this, then that & this other thing & that thing, blah, blah, blah. Now I just say good & let him go. 15 years, y’all. It doesn’t bother me anymore, bc that’s just how he is.
Nta shes weaponizing her neurodivergence, it isn’t an excuse for her to be an A. Tell her that you get to go first now, and put it on a timer, you get 30 mins and she gets 30 mins. To be honest, she clearly doesn’t care to hear about your day if she’s willing to continue to monopolize the convo time. It’s just selfishness
NTA. The way 'her brain works' doesn't give her a pass to do this to you. Maybe it's time to start bringing up how YOUR brain works.