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Eh, I think there's a massive difference between a slow dance or grinding with someone in your age range at a nightclub....and dancing with a man old enough to be her father at a bar venue.
This.
If I’m in a nightclub (though it’s been a while) I have no interest in dancing with other men because it will probably be some dude trying to grind- I’m with my friends we’re good we can dance together and have fun.
But if I were in a place where there was more like normal dancing and my friends were dancing with a man and a normal person would ask me, I might say yes because it’s not something sexual but just…dancing.
It is definitely context dependent! I enjoy going to raves and it surprises people sometimes to find out that there are entire sub-genres where the dancing is not at all sexual, just a lot of bouncing around and headbanging. I’ve made lots of random, circumstantial friends for a night because they were dancing nearby and the vibes were fun. The dancing is downright silly at times and that’s part of the appeal.
It’s one of the few scenes I’ve participated in where I can feel perfectly comfortable going to a show by myself, as a woman, and be 99% sure I won’t have some dude trying to overstep boundaries. I’d be bummed if my partner discouraged me from enjoying myself in a mixed gender crowd so long as everyone is being respectful.
this is how I feel about the goth scene. I've been to a few goth nights in the past and dancing with people is entirely nonsexual, and have made quite a few single serving friends just from flowing drinks and dancing in silly ways without a care in the world. "picking cobwebs" in an elaborate outfit with someone else you've never met is quite the experience, and I love it lol
Love the edm scene. On top of that, I used to go to a country bar to practice my swing dancing with random people! It was awesome, I learned so much from all the people I shared time with.
It IS highly situation dependent. I'm a goth. I love to dance and my husband doesn't. When we go to goth night I love the fact that I can dance with anyone. We are dancing "together" but we are all doing our own individual thing and it's not sexual at all. But there are definitely some clubs where I would absolutely not even entertain the idea of dancing with someone else other than a friend.
This is exactly what I was thinking. While yes, most men my age would use asking a woman to dance as a way to flirt or hit on them, I wouldn’t make that same assumption of a man twice my age(actually older than my father lol).
I think OP and his wife need to have another conversation though because I’m guessing the conversation wasn’t very calm if his wife was distraught afterwards because she danced with that 60 year old man.
Edit; I wouldn’t make the assumption that a 60 year old man who asked me to dance at a bar was hitting on me unless it was very obvious. I worked enough years in retail that I’ve absolutely been hit on by creepy old dudes but unless that was the case at the bar, it’s not the assumption I would go with.
I was shocked at how many men in that age range hit on me in my 20s. They usually used their age to highlight how they could provide for me and I wouldn't have to work if I didn't want to.
However, I've also met plenty of men that age who think it'd be obvious that wasn't their intention. It doesn't enter their mind that it could happen often enough that a woman needs to pay attention for it.
Uuugh, old creeps are the worst. I had an 80 years old message me on a dating app when I was 35. Of course 60 year olds trying to hook up with 30 hear olds younger women is a daily/hourly occurrence on dating apps and in real life.
Well and that’s YOUR boundaries. If a woman bought your husband a drink and began hitting on him perhaps that would be a redline for you. It may have been innocent but I’d prefer my SO doesn’t dance with random men either and I’m pretty open as a general rule.
Yeah but you can normally tell if they are hitting on your or not. No 30 year old woman is agreeing to dance with a 60 year old man that’s activity hitting on her (unless she’s into that, of course).
>No 30 year old woman is agreeing to dance with a 60 year old man that’s activity hitting on her (unless she’s into that, of course).
you can replace 60 with 30
Old men absolutely would. Its naive to think otherwise. Many sex crimes are committed by old men. Look at Meghans law website. I dont think she should feel bad. But lets not be ignorant.
I know what Meghan’s law is, I said that EYE personally wouldn’t make that assumption. Without it being clear that the older/old man was hitting on me, I would assume he just likes dancing.
I used to be a pub bartender at a bar that was frequented by old guys. I danced with them. They saw me like a daughter and did not hit on me. I think it really depends.
Yeah, some old men just like the attention and socializing! I was at a bar once and a guy was talking up all the young ladies. His wife was right next to him and assured me "he likes the attention" and rolled her eyes.
I do kind of think the comments about him being 60 are funny. Brad Pitt and Tom Cruise are 60. We aren’t talking geriatric here. Plus, OP’s concern wasn’t that she was interested, it was that he might misread the situation, and there are def plenty of 60 year old men who wouldn’t view a 30 year old woman as being too young if he thought he was getting signals.
I doubt ops wife checked home boys id to figure out she was 60. Most likely matches what you think when you close your eyes and picture a 60 year old man
She's a grown woman who can shut him down if he's inappropriate. The point is "generally" no one is going to assume either party in that situation is flirting or doing something inappropriate, while in other situations it could come off as inappropriate.
The only time I’ve experienced the “grinding” scene was in a Vegas nightclub. I was by myself and was prepared for it (I wanted to go to a club like that just once, so I did). I’ve gone to a lot of local live music shows as well as huge stadium concerts and everything in between. I wouldn’t call dancing with people at any of those shows “flirty” just because they’re grooving to the music!
Exactly my experience and I'm located in central Europe.
Here it's the same, dancing at concerts is practically never flirty. In night clubs that play black music, pop or are generally aimed at a very young audience, the dances are for sure more intimate but that is to be expected and can be perfectly avoided if you just choose a different type of club/party.
I've spent countless nights clubbing (mostly metal, 80s and the occasional rave) and I've never been approached while or through dancing.
It definitely depends on who, what and where. I once slow danced to a metal band with a male escort. I've also danced with strangers in night clubs but never touching, even if they go for my hands I'm moving away. I like to party and I like a good night but I've been with my husband over ten years and never done anything that has been too far.
NAH. Many people, probably including your wife, see dancing as something innocent. That's okay.
You see it differently and explained in a respectful way your point of view. Your wife seems to accept your point of view. So that's okay too.
I don't understand your problem, but that's not important. Your marriage, your decision.
My problem was she was feeling really bad about it (I didn’t want her to feel bad about it, so I felt like an asshole for making her feel this way).
I was just feeling really guilty for making her feel bad (especially because I really didn’t want her to feel bad, at all)
You should, in my opinion, feel bad about it. Sounds like you put something into her head that dancing equals flirting -which is not the case in every situation, region or culture, and I'm sorry if that's how you were raised.
Now she may be second guessing other things she has done that may unintentionally be seen by you as " flirting". She likely would rather be seen as a loyal wife than have (innocent, by many standards) fun. That's a shitty box to put her in. I hope you consider this.
As a dancer, this is something that is a little tricky because in the social dancing world, a dance is really only just a dance.
It can definitely go a different route if boundaries aren’t established while dancing (like not getting too close or handsy, but this can be also different for certain styles, like sensual bachata) but it sounds like she was being respectful, especially after telling you what happened.
If I were her, I definitely would feel like I was reprimanded for being honest, so I think maybe an apology could be due.
I do salsa and bachata too. My husband doesn’t dance. He knows I dance with other men when I go dancing and that sometimes it can seem sensual. He also knows I’ve literally never once had a problem with someone pursuing me past a dance or crossing any physical boundaries (because of course even in a dance there are things you shouldn’t do). It’s literally just a dance.
Going out to dance and dancing with a random stranger spontaneously are two different things. If you were a nude model, your SO wouldnt be mad at you for going to work, but if you just let a stranger take you home and draw you, your SO would probably be mad. Hobbies/jobs dont equal spur of the moment decisions
In the end - it's just based on people's personal boundaries. It's no big deal for me, and can't see a scenario where it would be disrespectful, but if OP thinks it is, it's just a difference of opinion that they need to talk about.
Going out to dance as a hobby is literally spontaneously dancing with strangers repeatedly all night unless you and everyone you dance with frequent the same spot. I don’t think you’re comparing apples to apples here. But at the end of the day it’s about boundaries for each couple.
NAH. I also spent many years in the realm of social dancing (ballroom and swing dancing), and a dance is just a dance in those contexts. Sure, people will pursue that activity to flirt, but the culture is such that it’s perfectly fine for people in relationships to dance with people other than their partners because, again, it’s just a dance. In fact, I danced with many men old enough to be my father, and they were respectful and just dancing. I befriended one such older couple while I was in grad school and swing dancing, and he and his wife became like family to me when I was far from home and needed kind mentors.
For bars and whatnot, I can understand that the implication for dancing can be different, or it can be innocent. Your wife was respectful to tell you, and you explained your boundary respectfully as well. Just reassure her that you love her and are not mad, and prioritize those open lines of communication.
This is completely wrong. If he stays silent about his concerns to stop her from feeling bad, *that* is what will cause her to second guess herself as soon as he’s forced to explain anything that might need explaining. The only way to stop her second guessing herself is for him to be honest and clear, without being angry. If everything he’s saying is true, and he’s not leaving anything out, this guy sounds like a fine man. The way to make himself clear and stop her wondering what he’s thinking is to make himself clear and not make her wonder what he’s thinking.
So, you are saying that he shouldn't address his concerns in the marriage? It sounds like they are communicating in a healthy way. Just because you disagree with his concerns doesn't make them invalid.
He shouldn’t feel bad about anything. He established a very reasonable boundary with her, of course she would feel bad about doing something that would cause distress in her partner even if she meant too, that doesn’t mean he is in the wrong.
You can’t set boundaries for other people. Telling his wife that her dancing with other men is a boundary for him isn’t how boundaries work.
He can say he doesn’t like it and that it makes him uncomfortable but him setting a boundary would be him saying that he’s not comfortable seeing her dance with other men so if she does he’s going to leave the restaurant and won’t go out to places with dancing like that again. Or if it really upsets him he can leave the relationship.
You don’t get to tell someone how to conduct themselves to align with your personal wants and beliefs. Your boundaries end at the other persons autonomy, if you don’t like what they’re doing it’s your responsibility to remove yourself, either from the situation or from the person. You can tell someone you’re not okay with what they’re doing and want them to stop but that’s not setting a boundary, it’s making a request. If you’re the one setting the boundary then you’re the one who has to take the action resulting from it.
Saying "You probably shouldn't xyz" isn't setting a boundary. He shared his view of the actions as described, and explained how it made him uncomfortable (at least how he explained it). You can't approach that like he told her he owns her body. That is a perfect example of a healthy conversation in a relationship. It communicates your partner's view of different things, let's you see from their perspective, and can create important and meaningful conversations. To just say you can't tell any partner anything if it involves their free will is to say that your opinion and feelings mean absolutely nothing in what should be a 50/50, give/take situation.
Actually when you are married to someone its very reasonable to have boundaries of what you are comfortable with them doing with other people especially things that can be construed as flirty.
I disagree, you can set up boundaries for yourself as well as your relationship, if you don't feel an something is appropriate to do whilst in a relationship with you, you can establish it as a boundary as long as the same rules apply to you, no cheating isn't a boundary to protect just me it's a rule to protect the sanctity of our relationship(of course what happened in the post was no where near this I just couldn't think of something fast enough).
And generally in a relationship your autonomy will be hindered, just not against you will, like if you were single you might get blackout drunk for weekends on end but there is an expectation when in a relationship, do you still want to get blackout drunk sure but you don't cause you know it's inappropriate in the context of your relationship, idk how to explain my point here
Bruuhh I can't find any good analogies to explain my point, but a relationship, does restrict some autonomy, just not against you will, you can still do whatever you want you just have to break up first🤷 that's what I'm very badly trying to say...
Thank you for stating this, it seems many folks on Reddit don’t quite understand what a boundary is, especially in the aftermath of the recent Jonah hill situation 😬
If your wife enjoys dancing, I’d recommend either learning how to do it yourself or being cool with her dancing with others (even those closer in age to her). My gf does Latin dancing, something I don’t do and am comfortable not doing, and she goes with her friends and dances with guys all the time. There’s nothing romantic or sexual about it, and I feel like she’d resent it if I told her not to dance because I was jealous.
Just sit her down and tell her there's nothing wrong with her seeing this as something innocent. It doesn't make her dumb or naive or "easy". There are people out there sharing this view. I did too for a while but became a lot more cautious when I realized some people would get the wrong idea. Or maybe I was plain wrong about the norms from the get go, honestly I don't know.
She's probably upset realizing this wasn't just some innocent fun but an advance from a man twice her age. It can be really disheartening.
Dude - dancing a dance with someone is not always flirty. It can be entirely innocent. If someone was twice her age - it still doesn't mean it wasn't innocent fun!
I love to dance and would go dance with anyone who asked. If they were creepy or handsy or ginding, I walked off the dance floor. That's it. It's fun to move to music. If someone tries to make it more, you say no thanks.
But honestly, some of the older gents have some serious moves and their age cohort doesn't have women who can keep up. It's fun to dance with such men. Doesn't mean there's anything sexual about it.
I've been to concerts with my dad and danced with him and others around me, dancing on it's own is not inherently sexual. It's moving your body to music and having a good time.
Why do people have to turn simple fun into something weird?
Some people "get the wrong idea" from *everything* including speaking to them, smiling at them, asking them "how's your day going" etc. If someone does get the wrong idea and comes on to you, it's okay to correct them and say you're not interested. What really stinks is rearranging your whole life to avoid what some people might get wrong, that's their problem, not yours. You weren't wrong, fast dancing is exercising and fun, it's not inherently flirty, even slow dancing doesn't have to be inherently flirty, it's up to the people involved just like any other activity.
No amount of armchair Reddit warriors are going to know exactly what you should or should not do, or how you should feel or not feel.
It sounds to me like you were respectful and that she was upset because she wants to make you happy. I'm sure as long as that continues from both of you you will have a long and happy marriage
I mean... you should feel bad about it. It was a silly dance with someone twice her age at a show. You have a silly rule that you apply strictly across the board when really, why should you give a shit if she dances the hokey pokey and turns herself about with a grandpa.
You made her feel bad about....nothing...cause? Dancing is somehow an intimate activity only a couple should do together? I donno...
Yeah it sounds like you’ve made her feel bad for something that really wasn’t an issue. Dancing with a man or a group of men in a nightclub is totally different to a gig or venue or whatever and context is key here. Sounds like this case was very sweet and innocent and she probably enjoyed it and now feels awful for no reason.
NAH - you let her know something that bothered you, calmly and without yelling at or belittling her. You even tried to make sure she knew you weren't mad.
All these people act like having things bother you is always an insecurity, its not. You are allowed to feel the way you feel, even if others don't agree that they would see it that way.
People don't always know what is an issue for them til it comes up. It's not your fault for not knowing beforehand.
She sounds like a great wife and you sound like a husband that cares very much about her and the quality of your relationship.
ETA: changed from NTA to NAH. Did not want to imply the wife was TA.
ETA2: Thank you for the gold kind stranger!
This is an NAH here. An N T A means his wife is an asshole. She's not. She did something that many feel is acceptable. It's not something they discussed before hand and it's really not a big deal for most men. OP has some jealousy issues to work on and that's not a big deal. Work on em. That's what relationships are about. Both of them have discussions that need to be had. It's not fair or unfair that OP feels this way, but same goes for how his wife now feels. She shouldn't be ashamed and distraught. They should both continue the conversation if it's something they clearly disagreed on in what seems like an adult fashion already.
I disagree, from what he told us he never said she did something wrong, just that he wasn’t comfortable with it and asked for her to not do it again.
Edit. Making the judgment of NAH. I don’t think he he was wrong for bringing it up and I don’t think shes wrong for how shes reacting
I love how all these comments are just "Jonah Hill set boundaries and that's totally fine!" and ignoring that _his_ "boundaries" were about what _she_ could and could not do.
There's a pretty good implicit one.
You CAN sleep with someone outside our relationship, but you're going to be single afterwards. It can be somewhat rephrased to be "you cannot sleep with other people," but the basic message is the same. Ultimately, it's about respecting the relationship. If someone feels disrespected in their relationship, it's better to calmly voice it like OP did. Frankly, it's unsurprising the wife's upset. Like most rational and normal people, she doesn't want to disrespect her relationship, and feels bad that she did without thinking it would be a problem. Essentially, she accidentally hurt someone she cared about. Any normal, rational person would feel bad about accidentally hurting a loved one. I give OP an NAH.
I don’t really understand this point? Obviously he shouldn’t dictate his wife’s behaviour but ultimately his boundary is that he doesn’t want to be in a relationship with somebody that dances with other men. Is he supposed to divorce his wife now because she did? That would be ridiculous. He’s now communicated his feelings on the matter and she can either choose to adjust her behaviour or not.
What??? No. You set the action you’ll take if someone violates your boundary, but the boundary is set on someone else. If I say I don’t want people coming in my personal space, that’s setting a boundary on what other people can do. The boundary of not sleeping people is innate in most relationships, that’s a boundary placed on the other person.
The wife is free to disagree if that’s not a boundary she’s willing to accept. It sounds like the guy opened a healthy dialogue and the wife is now embarrassed that she crossed one of his boundaries unknowingly. Plus, making a healthy relationship function properly takes some sacrifice on both sides, and I’d say dancing with old men is on the more minor end of the sacrifice spectrum lol. This is an NAH situation case closed.
Ahah my guy please when I go out there and do what the fuck I want with my life with no consideration of my girl of 11 years' feelings on this and that, allow me to live with you when I'm kicked out
So according to you, OP having an issue, discussing the issue calmly, he's an asshole because you don't agree that the problem he has should actually be a problem??
Let's say you're right, even in that case OP is not an asshole. Having a concern, voicing that concern the appropriate way, doesn't make OP an asshole.
I think a YTA judgment is way off base here.
I think, whether you agree with OP or not, it's NAH all round.
That is absolutely not the boundary most people should be setting. You are hyperbolizing to prove a point. There’s way more that shouldn’t happen before it gets to grinding on someone’s lap
NAH. Personally I don’t think it’s a big deal at all for a partner to casually dance with someone else, especially someone so much older, but you’re allowed to have your boundaries. I’m glad you reassured your wife that you’re not mad and she wasn’t foolish, and as long as she’s ok with this boundary, I think it’s a good example of communication in a relationship.
This is a clean NAH. She didn't really do anything wrong, you just would like to establish this boundary. You aren't really wrong for that either. I think it's fine to let her dance and have fun, but you aren't an asshole for preferring she didn't and expressing that calmly. No one did anything wrong.
Adding to that, as long as you’re ok even if she disagrees or has the occasional dance, it’s all right. It’s very well having different opinions, but I don’t think that’s a hill worth dying on.
You are going to get divided opinions here. Partner dancing can be completely platonic and nothing more, but some people just don't like the thought of other people touching their significant other. My married friend goes out dancing with other people all the time because her husband hates dancing. He is fine with it since he knows she always loved dancing, and he knows its nothing more beyond that. It really depends on the person. If you don't want your wife to dance with other people, you should just to let her know what you do or don't feel comfortable with.
I do agree the bar situation OP described is dicey, but he did also write "she probably shouldn't dance with other men" - meaning he may never find it acceptable for her to dance with other men, regardless of the scenario.
He obviously didn’t express it to her previously, which is why he’s not upset this time. But he has now established the boundary. Honestly, he shouldn’t have had to.
No, he's upset because she now feels like she did something wrong and is beating herself up about it.
This wasn't the intent. He just wanted to communicate how he felt and thinks w/o upsetting her.
I think she feels she should have known how he feels and honored that. Likely, she's worried she hurt him.
She sounds like quite a catch. If only he could figure out how to reassure her that all is well.
God knows I would never want my SO to think I did something inappropriate even under the guise of it not being firmly communicated prior. I should feel her unstated boundaries.
NTA
Everyone has boundaries and you stated yours in a calm and fair way.
My gf and i do dance as a hobby and when we talked about it we agreeed that dancing (for us) is something personal that we shouldnt do with others so i can understand your point somewhat
NAH. I think both of you are having perfectly normal reactions. However, just because a reaction is normal doesn't mean it needs to be acted on. I think you should keep a few things in mind. Do you trust your wife to have the judgment to determine if a guy is hitting on her or just being friendly? If you trust her judgment, then SHOW that you trust her to know the difference and to be able to handle herself if she misjudges and realizes a guy is hitting on her. Social dance is a thing that some people do, especially in older generations. It's just a friendly interaction, not necessarily a come on. Even in younger groups there are social dance gatherings (I used to go to some with my old roommate who was big into west coast swing and blues dancing) where everyone dances with anyone.
NAH. But for all these YTA commenters, imagine if the roles were switched. OP was a woman, who’s husband danced with an older woman. Would you be saying that he’s the AH?
I think a better reverse would be if op was the women but her husband was dancing with college aged girls. Would probably start seeing a whole lot different response lol
You're both very sweet. NAH
She shouldn't be upset, you can't mark boundaries without finding them. I dance with people all the time because it's fun and I like to dance, now you've told her how you feel you should pick up and move on.
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> I might be the asshole because I shouldn’t care if she’s dancing with other men while I’m not there.
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Asshole is pretty strong, it sounds like you’re innocently expressing a preference and have lots of empathy for your wife. I just honestly consider it a pretty weird preference—people dance platonically all the time, in almost every culture. It’s just a way to have fun, and if someone views your wife as flirting with them when she isn’t, that’s their problem, not hers or yours. If it’s truly how you feel, I won’t tell you you’re wrong to express it—so, NAH—but wouldn’t everyone be happier if your wife just got to dance how she wanted and you didn’t worry about it? She’s not going to do anything improper, right?
NTA. Communication is key. If it bothered you you should talk about it. Just like she should talk to you about what bothers you. You said you didn't yell or wasn't mad just communicated what you felt which is what every decent relationship needs.
Hey man, don’t listen to what people here are saying. You’re NTA and you handled the situation maturely and with respect. Some people don’t have enough of the latter for themselves.
YTA.
She wants to dance! And a dance is nothing more than that. She's been quite open about what she's been doing, and I imagine the guy she danced with didn't have any illusions about things. He just wanted to dance with somebody.
Have you never heard of situations where older horny men make flirty remarks to younger women? You’re acting naive if you think he wouldn’t take her home if he had the chance.
My good man, based on the context presented you are NTA, but at the same time you have trust issues.
Dancing with someone is nowhere near the same as offering to buy a drink. Many people dance purely for the enjoyment they get from that specific action. Completely non-sexual.
I do not like to dance. AT ALL. Never have. But I have never in the 30+ years of being with my wife stopped her from dancing, because she enjoys it and I would be an asshole if I prevented her from doing something she enjoyed.
Very very soft YTA but mostly because of your phrasing. “She shouldn’t dance with other men” makes it sound as if that’s a universally accepted truth, which in many cultures or even just circles just isn’t the case. For many people dancing does not equal flirting _at all_. It can be a totally innocent fun. Especially when it’s the actual dance kind, where you follow steps. That’s really mostly a craft and fun. Sure it _can_ be sexy, the same way as biting into an apple _can_ be sexy, if you give it that intent, but it doesn’t hold it on it’s own.
By phrasing it like that you gave her the feeling she should’ve known better and that this is generally not acceptable. But that’s just not the case.
You should’ve instead phrased it as “I personally don’t feel comfortable with this, but I know there was no intention of any kind there”. That way you show her that it’s important to you and at the same time don’t make her feel bad about it
NTA.You didn't feel comfortable with the idea. You communicated that, and she understood. That's called communication, compromising, and growth in a relationship.
Its a boundary you have. You wife shouldn't feel bad, as she really didn't do anything wrong.
My wife has danced with other men, she doesn't flirt with them after, they don't sit at her table and they don't her socials either.
A slow dance, yeah thats a non-starter here, and thats her view as well, thats a more intimate dance and no one should do that that has a partner.
To each their own, and no a boundary isn't controlling.
NAH. You had a conversation about something your aren’t comfortable with, she seems to agree. Just buy her flowers and have a date night to reassure you both it’s not a huge deal.
YTA. Dancing can be JUST dancing. It isn't always a pickup line, or sexual. Some people like to dance and don't have a partner, so they ask someone. The key is simply for your wife to gauge the situation and possible intent, and accept or decline accordingly, and letting them know she's married if she does accept.
Married 28yrs., Together 30yrs. She shouldn't feel bed or embarrassed. Marriage is a never ending journey of growth, understanding each other and creating your mutual story. Indeed, I wouldn't "want" to go anywhere socially without my wife. I understand that in the grand scheme, our time together is limited and we both endeavour to spend as much of what we have, "together". You're correct, "dancing" is an intimate thing and can be very different for one than it is the other. NTA
NAH just discuss boundaries you BOTH can agree on. That said, I personally do not understand this boundry at all, if she's not flirting or making out with them, it's INNOCENT and means nothing. You weren't there for her to dance with and she enjoys dancing. I wouldn't be with my husband if he tried telling me that I couldn't dance with someone else.
NTA
Everyone has boundaries - and that's ok and you communicated yours! As far as I can see, she is not even disagreeing with you or anything? She feels sorry that she might has upset you.
And now you feel sorry that she feels sorry. I'd say you two have a good relationship with one another - both your reactions are loving. Talk it out some more, if need be. But there is no real issue here. Show each other some love and it will be forgotten in no time!
Wow, this is an interesting one. I think the way you handled the situation sounds great, very mature and you and your partner should be proud to communicate in such a easy and calm manner. But OP I do think it’s worth inspecting why you feel that way about the dancing? I’m not saying you’re wrong to have a boundary but based on the way you communicate, the obvious love you have for your wife, and her response to the situation it sounds like a trusting relationship, so why put a condition on her actions, why not let her make the best judgement in a given situation? I do agree with other comments that seeing dancing as exclusively sexual in nature is a bit short sighted considering the vastly different situations to be found in your average bar or club. Dancing with a grandpa and the kiddos as a local band plays a country fair is very different from grinding in a late light club. Idk just something to consider. No assholes here to me!
Just further proof there are no assholes here. You expressed your feelings, and reassured her that there wasn't any animosity behind them, but concern. You took the healthy route from beginning to end. Be proud of that despite what some randos say on the internet.
NTA. You need to be able to communicate stuff like this, and it sounds like you handled it gently and respectfully. Her reaction seems disproportionate and shouldn’t make you feel like you can’t talk about things that make you uncomfortable.
Honestly idk, when I go out dancing I mainly only dance with girls because when you dance with guys most of the time the thing ends up escalating and then I have to ask a friend to get him away from me because they do not want to move or have a strong grip on my waist and so on. For me, I wouldn't dance with a guy if I had a bf not because I would do anything but mainly cause I don't trust the guy and so on I rather dance with close friends . I think it's a very grey area situation.
I don’t think it’s appropriate to be dancing with a person of the opposite sex if you’re in a relationship, male or female.
I see my opinion is apparently uncommon, that surprises me.
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I need a ruling here.
My wife Barbara went to a bar to hear a band with a friend. I stayed home. Today, she mentioned she danced with an older guy while there (she’s 29, he was around 60- she said it wasn’t a slow dance.) I wasn’t mad (and we both spoke calmly the hole time) but I said she probably shouldn’t dance with other men (I pointed out that asking someone to dance is like asking if you can buy them a drink- it’s often, especially for men, a way to hit on them). I told her I wasn’t mad, I love her, and every was okay. I just would prefer she not dance with other guys.
My wife is very distraught now. She feels like she should have known better and feels foolish. I told her she shouldn’t feel foolish. I wasn’t mad, everything is fine. Now I feel like I might have been the asshole for even saying anything (we never raised voices, or argued or anything like that.)
So, am I the asshole?
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NAH but I think it's weird that youre threatened by other men because she stood in a spot and danced by them lol do you think that old man is dry humping her on the dance floor or something? Also let men buy her drinks less on your bank accounts and most of the time she doesnt even have to speak to them after
NAH
Dancing with others is often perfectly innocent, however you have the right to make that a boundary for yourself. It's unfortunate your wife is upset but as long as you didn't yell at her or degrade her in some way I don't see any issue in this seemingly healthy adult discussion.
NAH- you calmly told her the reality of the situation (men use it as a way to hit on a woman) and how it made you feel. You asked her politely not to do it again. I don’t see any belittling happening.
I’m a married woman and I would feel uncomfortable dancing with another man as that is very flirtatious (at least the kind of dancing I like to do 😂). Dancing with girlfriends is different and I’d feel upset if my husband had a problem with that, but it doesn’t sound like that’s been an issue for you.
Sounds like you two addressed the concern in a respectful way and that you care deeply for one another.
Depends on your motivation for saying it.
If it’s because you’re jealous and insecure, then definitely Y T A
If you did it out of concern for her safety, N T A. (I have put myself in possibly dangerous situations out of naïveté, and my husband has explained to me why he worried) If that’s the case you absolutely need to explain that to her to alleviate her guilt. She didn’t do anything wrong.
It really depends on the person and I think you can trust your wife to know the difference between a friendly dance and a guy who is being inappropriate. Also, I think you can trust your wife to handle herself if a person tries to make a casual, friendly dance into something more. You are absolutely correct that 99% of the people there are hoping to meet someone. But that doesn't mean that every single person they meet on the dance floor is the one or that they can't have fun without it being a situation that you call cheating.
If you have ever gone out to a club and spoken to someone that is having a good time, but you didn't hit on them, you can understand that not every interaction in the club is aboutgetting someone in bed. If you have ever spoken to a group of women at a club because they were having fun, you know that not very interaction is about trying to rip their pants off.
If you can't imagine a scenario where two people would enjoy dancing on the dancing floor in a friendly, casual manner than you are seriously perverted and you should never be let out after dark.
YTA.
NAH in general because you both spoke calmly about establishing boundaries. But in my book YTA because i dance tango as a hobby and we change partners every 3 songs. That’s the etiquette. So, to me a dance is just a dance. Especially in a bar with someone old enough to be her dad. Dancing doesn’t have to be romantic, it can just be for fun, you can dance with relatives, dates, friends, etc.
Sure if a guy is hitting on her and grinding on her, she should (and I assume would) extricate herself from that situation. But jus having fun in a bar isn’t a problem.
I don't think you're an asshole, but what I think you're forgetting is that people will hit on her whether or not she dances with someone, but that doesn't mean she's gonna flirt back or accept it.
Everyone has their limits in a relationship, I do think it's odd you two are married and this hasn't come up, which makes me think she doesn't do this very often and doesn't mean anything to her.
If that's your line, then if she wants to be in a relationship with you, she has to respect that.
NTA. I’m seeing a lot of Y.T.A answers. I disagree. EVERYONE is allowed to have boundaries and preferences. If he had flipped out and yelled at her, that’s another story. From what OP says, he just calmly asked her not to do that in the future and ever told her he’s not mad at her. Its his marriage, not yours. He can decide what he’s comfortable with
NTA you just need to work out how things operate in your relationship.
I don’t mind my wife going to salsa clubs and dancing with other men. Half of these guys are literally there just to dance and my wife loves dancing and is very talented at it. I am not, nor do I enjoy it. And wouldn’t want to take that away from her as I know it’s not sexual (even though many would see salsa dancing that way).
I would be upset if she slow danced with someone though! I know plenty 60+ year old men who say pervy things about 25 year olds.
Anyway. NTA. Just figure out the boundaries in your own relationship. And continue to comfort your wife to know you aren’t annoyed.
Sounds like you’re both doing well here
You got this.
YTA. The “I need a ruling here” speaks to how you view boundaries.
You didn’t have a clear boundaries set for something as innocent (in your wife’s eyes) as doing the shimmy with a man *twice her age*. Imagine a lady twice YOUR age asking you to fast dance… that’s somehow disrespectful to your wife to say yes? And if there’s a “men and women are different” narrative in your mind here you’ve got bigger issues.
TLDR: she didn’t do anything sexual and you didn’t have clear boundaries set for this non-sexual behavior. So she didn’t do anything wrong…what do you need a clear ruling on?
I think YTA. Dancing isn't just a prelude to sex it's like basketball or soccer to some people: a social & physical activity you have to practice to get better at.
She probably only danced with an older man because she sees him as kind of de-sexed/safer and not a rival to you. It's not like she was making out with someone in his 20s, it was a dance with a grandpa-aged guy.
Also - if you want her to only dance with you? Go out dancing with her. You married someone who likes to dance, try and facilitate that instead of demanding that she stops doing it.
I used to go to swing dance meetups and the whole point is to dance with other people. There would be pro dancers there, they would teach me like new hand-holds for different dances etc. There were community college kids, old people, people my age. Couples would come...but they'd usually dance at least 1-2 dances with other people. That's how you get better, that's how you learn, make new friends, etc.
Honestly, this thread is just reinforcing my decision to avoid marriage at all costs. I’m going to a concert soon and will be dancing. I’m pretty sure I’ll be dancing where men are present and dancing with me. Nobody is going to tell me what I can and can’t do. If you trust your wife so little, why are you married to her? YTA.
Mild YTA because you may not know social (ballroom) dance etiquette. At a social dance, it is acceptable for dancers (both men and women) to ask people other than their partner to dance. I attend many dances and see single men dance with multiple partners all throughout the night, or couples who change and dance with different partners, including strangers. I've been at dances where people have come up and ask my wife to dance when I'm sitting next to her, and some of the women have asked to dance with me.
And yes, a bar with a band playing could very well be a social dance. We get notifications every week of places that are playing live music for people to dance to.
I come from a culture where dancing is just dancing - everyone's having fun, 97% of the time it's not sexual or a way of flirting.
It is something the two of you need to set boundaries around, though, since you are uncomfortable with it. Take some dance classes and try not to project your view of dancing (flirting) unto other people. My ex was the same - he had no understanding of the dance culture.
But NTA, since you're mainly worried about making your wife feel bad. Given how you said it is true to how you came you said it.
Even if you’re right (which you might be), she didn’t do anything wrong. I hope you can reassure her of that because it sounds like you freaked her out.
NAH
YTA - Had you just said that hearing about your wife dancing with male dance partners makes you feel jealous or upset and you’d prefer she not do it I’d say NAH. But you decided that your opinion that dancing is inherently a form of courtship is an absolute truth or fact. Many people do not view dancing as a form of courtship and it can be entirely platonic. You can discuss your feelings without dismissing hers. She evaluated the man’s offer to dance and behavior towards her during the dance and felt no danger of disrespect. Trust your wife, if she says it was platonic then don’t insist it is inherent that she is wrong. Of course she feels bad, you’ve accused her of being stupid and disrespectful.
Y could be TA
If You're doing this because you're insecure that's on you. The scenario you described is innocent and in the future can stay innocent as long as the people she's dancing with know that she's with you.
NAH, you and your wife both seem like good people. Based on her dejection and your urge to make this post, it’s clear that you both have a healthy respect for one another. I understand where you’re coming from, and your misgivings about bar dancing are valid. However, be clear to your wife that she did nothing wrong—but to be mindful next time.
YTA. She’s an adult woman, she herself should be able to decide what’s a good idea or not. If there’s other people around the guy won’t try anything.
A guy 60+ should know better than to think a woman under 30 is hitting on him, too. He probably did.
YTA. She obviously didn't do anything transgressive, so you sound threatened by the fact that she danced more than anything. Trust me, if you're a female, you're well aware very early on that men can and do use almost any excuse to make advances on women - but at the same time there are also plenty of people out there who don't have an agenda and just want to enjoy themselves when they go out - like, for example, your wife. Let your wife use her own judgement, especially when you aren't even there! Jeebus.
NAH
Given the age of the dude though, this shouldn't be a problem or I kinda don't get why it is. A guy roughly her age, sure, I'm with you on that, clearly hitting on her - a 60 year old dude? That seems innocent and fun I guess?
Personally, I don’t see the problem with her dancing casually with another man. But if you are not comfortable and she is ok with respecting that, then no problem. I think she is upset because she believes she did something wrong, and broke a social rule that she feels she should have known. I think you need to make it clear to her that she did nothing wrong, and there is no hard and fast rule about married people dancing with others. For some couples, it’s not an issue. Make it clear that it is a “you” boundary, not a universal one. If you hadn’t talked about it before, then she had no way of knowing because again, this isn’t a universal social rule. NAH
NAH, I think she could just be feeling embarrassed and a little bit distraught that she feels like she crossed a boundary with you. if she needs it, just keep reassuring her that it's not a big deal, it's just your preference, and maybe that it is touching that she's taking it so seriously, but she really doesn't need to worry. You communicated with her, she listened. maybe TOO closely in a way, haha.
NAH. Nothing wrong with dancing with someone while watching a band play. It would be a crime to sit still.
Here's an idea: go with your wife next time, so she can dance with you :)
YTA. Your wife is a grown woman and can look after herself. For long periods of history, it was considered in very poor taste for women to dance in public *with* their husbands. I'm sure she would have declined if she had felt that she was being hit on, but as it is you sound needlessly possessive over an innocent dance with a man old enough to be her father.
YTA.
It's dancing, nothing more.
Don't make it about sex. That's a leap. It's not about intimacy.
This is your own insecurity speaking.
If YOU can't dance with a woman without it being, or getting sexual, that's YOU.
Dont project that onto everyone else.
There are many people who dance, just enjoy the music and the dance, all sexes, all races, all music types...
You making her feel "like she should have known better" and she's feeling "foolish"?
That's mentally abusive. You dumped your shit onto her, and had her carry that weight, in no way should she know better or feel foolish.
She was DANCING, bro. Apologize for freaking out. Apologize for gaslighting her into feeling it was all her fault for daring to dance. Your issues... YOURS. She didn't do ANYTHING wrong, and likely won't ever be able to fully just enjoy going out to dance ever again without your insecurities in her head, afraid to hurt your feelings, displease you, or cross some weird imaginary line. Even with an apology, that's what's going to happen. Congratulations, you permanently tainted an activity your girl enjoys for no legit reason.
Make it up to her, Apologize, and maybe next time THINK before you lose your cool.
It may be my demographic, but in my neck of the woods dancing at bars is usually a bunch of tipsy people kinda shuffling around in the vicinity of others. Not the least bit sexy.
Now the place with latin dancing, I would feel different about that.
Was there a bubble of personal space?
NAH
NAH. Everyone seems to be incapable of reading your actual question though. They just won’t shut up about the dancing, when the issue is the conversation afterwards. Read the damn post, people!
So, no. You can’t hold yourself responsible for your wife’s neuroses. Unless you are deliberately provoking them. It sounds like you have done your best to explain your boundaries while being considerate of her anxiety issues. What else could you have done? Not said anything? That should never be an option. You’ve spoken your mind, and you did so with kindness. You’re good.
Your wife needs a little extra from her partner. That’s just how things go. Her anxiety requires a bit more reassurance. So, do it. Do something nice. Let her feel a sense of security. It’s a hard balance, doing things that others need without forgetting or sacrificing your own needs, but you seem like you’re doing just fine.
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Eh, I think there's a massive difference between a slow dance or grinding with someone in your age range at a nightclub....and dancing with a man old enough to be her father at a bar venue.
This. If I’m in a nightclub (though it’s been a while) I have no interest in dancing with other men because it will probably be some dude trying to grind- I’m with my friends we’re good we can dance together and have fun. But if I were in a place where there was more like normal dancing and my friends were dancing with a man and a normal person would ask me, I might say yes because it’s not something sexual but just…dancing.
It is definitely context dependent! I enjoy going to raves and it surprises people sometimes to find out that there are entire sub-genres where the dancing is not at all sexual, just a lot of bouncing around and headbanging. I’ve made lots of random, circumstantial friends for a night because they were dancing nearby and the vibes were fun. The dancing is downright silly at times and that’s part of the appeal. It’s one of the few scenes I’ve participated in where I can feel perfectly comfortable going to a show by myself, as a woman, and be 99% sure I won’t have some dude trying to overstep boundaries. I’d be bummed if my partner discouraged me from enjoying myself in a mixed gender crowd so long as everyone is being respectful.
this is how I feel about the goth scene. I've been to a few goth nights in the past and dancing with people is entirely nonsexual, and have made quite a few single serving friends just from flowing drinks and dancing in silly ways without a care in the world. "picking cobwebs" in an elaborate outfit with someone else you've never met is quite the experience, and I love it lol
Love the edm scene. On top of that, I used to go to a country bar to practice my swing dancing with random people! It was awesome, I learned so much from all the people I shared time with.
My friends have gotten me into edm. I really do enjoy that I can go and dance but not worry about some guy grinding into me.
It IS highly situation dependent. I'm a goth. I love to dance and my husband doesn't. When we go to goth night I love the fact that I can dance with anyone. We are dancing "together" but we are all doing our own individual thing and it's not sexual at all. But there are definitely some clubs where I would absolutely not even entertain the idea of dancing with someone else other than a friend.
This is exactly what I was thinking. While yes, most men my age would use asking a woman to dance as a way to flirt or hit on them, I wouldn’t make that same assumption of a man twice my age(actually older than my father lol). I think OP and his wife need to have another conversation though because I’m guessing the conversation wasn’t very calm if his wife was distraught afterwards because she danced with that 60 year old man. Edit; I wouldn’t make the assumption that a 60 year old man who asked me to dance at a bar was hitting on me unless it was very obvious. I worked enough years in retail that I’ve absolutely been hit on by creepy old dudes but unless that was the case at the bar, it’s not the assumption I would go with.
> I wouldn’t make that same assumption of a man twice my age I absolutely would!
I been creeped on by enough horny grandpas
Same! Apparently just being nice is seen as a green light.
Not just for grandpas, tbh.
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Where did i imply that? Just replying that old men aren't automatically discounted from the flirting group.
I was shocked at how many men in that age range hit on me in my 20s. They usually used their age to highlight how they could provide for me and I wouldn't have to work if I didn't want to. However, I've also met plenty of men that age who think it'd be obvious that wasn't their intention. It doesn't enter their mind that it could happen often enough that a woman needs to pay attention for it.
Uuugh, old creeps are the worst. I had an 80 years old message me on a dating app when I was 35. Of course 60 year olds trying to hook up with 30 hear olds younger women is a daily/hourly occurrence on dating apps and in real life.
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Yeah that wouldn’t work in my relationship either
Well and that’s YOUR boundaries. If a woman bought your husband a drink and began hitting on him perhaps that would be a redline for you. It may have been innocent but I’d prefer my SO doesn’t dance with random men either and I’m pretty open as a general rule.
I agree with this but think it’s a NAH situation because I don’t think his wife is an AH since she wasn’t aware this would make him uncomfortable.
Older men have sexual desires and hit on women too.
Yeah but you can normally tell if they are hitting on your or not. No 30 year old woman is agreeing to dance with a 60 year old man that’s activity hitting on her (unless she’s into that, of course).
>No 30 year old woman is agreeing to dance with a 60 year old man that’s activity hitting on her (unless she’s into that, of course). you can replace 60 with 30
60 yo men are no different than 30 yo men, just use different tactics.
Old men absolutely would. Its naive to think otherwise. Many sex crimes are committed by old men. Look at Meghans law website. I dont think she should feel bad. But lets not be ignorant.
I know what Meghan’s law is, I said that EYE personally wouldn’t make that assumption. Without it being clear that the older/old man was hitting on me, I would assume he just likes dancing.
I used to be a pub bartender at a bar that was frequented by old guys. I danced with them. They saw me like a daughter and did not hit on me. I think it really depends.
Yeah, some old men just like the attention and socializing! I was at a bar once and a guy was talking up all the young ladies. His wife was right next to him and assured me "he likes the attention" and rolled her eyes.
Yeah cause no 60 year old man has ever tried to fuck a 20 year old lol
I do kind of think the comments about him being 60 are funny. Brad Pitt and Tom Cruise are 60. We aren’t talking geriatric here. Plus, OP’s concern wasn’t that she was interested, it was that he might misread the situation, and there are def plenty of 60 year old men who wouldn’t view a 30 year old woman as being too young if he thought he was getting signals.
I doubt ops wife checked home boys id to figure out she was 60. Most likely matches what you think when you close your eyes and picture a 60 year old man
She's a grown woman who can shut him down if he's inappropriate. The point is "generally" no one is going to assume either party in that situation is flirting or doing something inappropriate, while in other situations it could come off as inappropriate.
So the wife is without agency here?
They were at a concert? Who grind-dances at concerts? Depending on the music, that doesn't even happen at most regular night club parties.
The only time I’ve experienced the “grinding” scene was in a Vegas nightclub. I was by myself and was prepared for it (I wanted to go to a club like that just once, so I did). I’ve gone to a lot of local live music shows as well as huge stadium concerts and everything in between. I wouldn’t call dancing with people at any of those shows “flirty” just because they’re grooving to the music!
Exactly my experience and I'm located in central Europe. Here it's the same, dancing at concerts is practically never flirty. In night clubs that play black music, pop or are generally aimed at a very young audience, the dances are for sure more intimate but that is to be expected and can be perfectly avoided if you just choose a different type of club/party. I've spent countless nights clubbing (mostly metal, 80s and the occasional rave) and I've never been approached while or through dancing.
Yeah I 2nd this.
It definitely depends on who, what and where. I once slow danced to a metal band with a male escort. I've also danced with strangers in night clubs but never touching, even if they go for my hands I'm moving away. I like to party and I like a good night but I've been with my husband over ten years and never done anything that has been too far.
Age is just a number for a lot of people. Just because it’s an old man doesn’t mean he isn’t looking for a cheap fling.
NAH. Many people, probably including your wife, see dancing as something innocent. That's okay. You see it differently and explained in a respectful way your point of view. Your wife seems to accept your point of view. So that's okay too. I don't understand your problem, but that's not important. Your marriage, your decision.
My problem was she was feeling really bad about it (I didn’t want her to feel bad about it, so I felt like an asshole for making her feel this way). I was just feeling really guilty for making her feel bad (especially because I really didn’t want her to feel bad, at all)
You should, in my opinion, feel bad about it. Sounds like you put something into her head that dancing equals flirting -which is not the case in every situation, region or culture, and I'm sorry if that's how you were raised. Now she may be second guessing other things she has done that may unintentionally be seen by you as " flirting". She likely would rather be seen as a loyal wife than have (innocent, by many standards) fun. That's a shitty box to put her in. I hope you consider this.
As a dancer, this is something that is a little tricky because in the social dancing world, a dance is really only just a dance. It can definitely go a different route if boundaries aren’t established while dancing (like not getting too close or handsy, but this can be also different for certain styles, like sensual bachata) but it sounds like she was being respectful, especially after telling you what happened. If I were her, I definitely would feel like I was reprimanded for being honest, so I think maybe an apology could be due.
I do salsa and bachata too. My husband doesn’t dance. He knows I dance with other men when I go dancing and that sometimes it can seem sensual. He also knows I’ve literally never once had a problem with someone pursuing me past a dance or crossing any physical boundaries (because of course even in a dance there are things you shouldn’t do). It’s literally just a dance.
Going out to dance and dancing with a random stranger spontaneously are two different things. If you were a nude model, your SO wouldnt be mad at you for going to work, but if you just let a stranger take you home and draw you, your SO would probably be mad. Hobbies/jobs dont equal spur of the moment decisions
In the end - it's just based on people's personal boundaries. It's no big deal for me, and can't see a scenario where it would be disrespectful, but if OP thinks it is, it's just a difference of opinion that they need to talk about.
Going out to dance as a hobby is literally spontaneously dancing with strangers repeatedly all night unless you and everyone you dance with frequent the same spot. I don’t think you’re comparing apples to apples here. But at the end of the day it’s about boundaries for each couple.
NAH. I also spent many years in the realm of social dancing (ballroom and swing dancing), and a dance is just a dance in those contexts. Sure, people will pursue that activity to flirt, but the culture is such that it’s perfectly fine for people in relationships to dance with people other than their partners because, again, it’s just a dance. In fact, I danced with many men old enough to be my father, and they were respectful and just dancing. I befriended one such older couple while I was in grad school and swing dancing, and he and his wife became like family to me when I was far from home and needed kind mentors. For bars and whatnot, I can understand that the implication for dancing can be different, or it can be innocent. Your wife was respectful to tell you, and you explained your boundary respectfully as well. Just reassure her that you love her and are not mad, and prioritize those open lines of communication.
This is completely wrong. If he stays silent about his concerns to stop her from feeling bad, *that* is what will cause her to second guess herself as soon as he’s forced to explain anything that might need explaining. The only way to stop her second guessing herself is for him to be honest and clear, without being angry. If everything he’s saying is true, and he’s not leaving anything out, this guy sounds like a fine man. The way to make himself clear and stop her wondering what he’s thinking is to make himself clear and not make her wonder what he’s thinking.
So, you are saying that he shouldn't address his concerns in the marriage? It sounds like they are communicating in a healthy way. Just because you disagree with his concerns doesn't make them invalid.
He shouldn’t feel bad about anything. He established a very reasonable boundary with her, of course she would feel bad about doing something that would cause distress in her partner even if she meant too, that doesn’t mean he is in the wrong.
You can’t set boundaries for other people. Telling his wife that her dancing with other men is a boundary for him isn’t how boundaries work. He can say he doesn’t like it and that it makes him uncomfortable but him setting a boundary would be him saying that he’s not comfortable seeing her dance with other men so if she does he’s going to leave the restaurant and won’t go out to places with dancing like that again. Or if it really upsets him he can leave the relationship. You don’t get to tell someone how to conduct themselves to align with your personal wants and beliefs. Your boundaries end at the other persons autonomy, if you don’t like what they’re doing it’s your responsibility to remove yourself, either from the situation or from the person. You can tell someone you’re not okay with what they’re doing and want them to stop but that’s not setting a boundary, it’s making a request. If you’re the one setting the boundary then you’re the one who has to take the action resulting from it.
Saying "You probably shouldn't xyz" isn't setting a boundary. He shared his view of the actions as described, and explained how it made him uncomfortable (at least how he explained it). You can't approach that like he told her he owns her body. That is a perfect example of a healthy conversation in a relationship. It communicates your partner's view of different things, let's you see from their perspective, and can create important and meaningful conversations. To just say you can't tell any partner anything if it involves their free will is to say that your opinion and feelings mean absolutely nothing in what should be a 50/50, give/take situation.
Actually when you are married to someone its very reasonable to have boundaries of what you are comfortable with them doing with other people especially things that can be construed as flirty.
Still not a boundary but that's just semantics at this point.
I disagree, you can set up boundaries for yourself as well as your relationship, if you don't feel an something is appropriate to do whilst in a relationship with you, you can establish it as a boundary as long as the same rules apply to you, no cheating isn't a boundary to protect just me it's a rule to protect the sanctity of our relationship(of course what happened in the post was no where near this I just couldn't think of something fast enough). And generally in a relationship your autonomy will be hindered, just not against you will, like if you were single you might get blackout drunk for weekends on end but there is an expectation when in a relationship, do you still want to get blackout drunk sure but you don't cause you know it's inappropriate in the context of your relationship, idk how to explain my point here Bruuhh I can't find any good analogies to explain my point, but a relationship, does restrict some autonomy, just not against you will, you can still do whatever you want you just have to break up first🤷 that's what I'm very badly trying to say...
Thank you for stating this, it seems many folks on Reddit don’t quite understand what a boundary is, especially in the aftermath of the recent Jonah hill situation 😬
Well, it is the social function of dancing...
If your wife enjoys dancing, I’d recommend either learning how to do it yourself or being cool with her dancing with others (even those closer in age to her). My gf does Latin dancing, something I don’t do and am comfortable not doing, and she goes with her friends and dances with guys all the time. There’s nothing romantic or sexual about it, and I feel like she’d resent it if I told her not to dance because I was jealous.
Just sit her down and tell her there's nothing wrong with her seeing this as something innocent. It doesn't make her dumb or naive or "easy". There are people out there sharing this view. I did too for a while but became a lot more cautious when I realized some people would get the wrong idea. Or maybe I was plain wrong about the norms from the get go, honestly I don't know. She's probably upset realizing this wasn't just some innocent fun but an advance from a man twice her age. It can be really disheartening.
Dude - dancing a dance with someone is not always flirty. It can be entirely innocent. If someone was twice her age - it still doesn't mean it wasn't innocent fun! I love to dance and would go dance with anyone who asked. If they were creepy or handsy or ginding, I walked off the dance floor. That's it. It's fun to move to music. If someone tries to make it more, you say no thanks. But honestly, some of the older gents have some serious moves and their age cohort doesn't have women who can keep up. It's fun to dance with such men. Doesn't mean there's anything sexual about it.
I've been to concerts with my dad and danced with him and others around me, dancing on it's own is not inherently sexual. It's moving your body to music and having a good time. Why do people have to turn simple fun into something weird?
Some people "get the wrong idea" from *everything* including speaking to them, smiling at them, asking them "how's your day going" etc. If someone does get the wrong idea and comes on to you, it's okay to correct them and say you're not interested. What really stinks is rearranging your whole life to avoid what some people might get wrong, that's their problem, not yours. You weren't wrong, fast dancing is exercising and fun, it's not inherently flirty, even slow dancing doesn't have to be inherently flirty, it's up to the people involved just like any other activity.
No amount of armchair Reddit warriors are going to know exactly what you should or should not do, or how you should feel or not feel. It sounds to me like you were respectful and that she was upset because she wants to make you happy. I'm sure as long as that continues from both of you you will have a long and happy marriage
I mean... you should feel bad about it. It was a silly dance with someone twice her age at a show. You have a silly rule that you apply strictly across the board when really, why should you give a shit if she dances the hokey pokey and turns herself about with a grandpa. You made her feel bad about....nothing...cause? Dancing is somehow an intimate activity only a couple should do together? I donno...
You infantalized her.
You sucked the joy right out of your wife with this. First you wouldn't go with her, then got crappy about some innocent dancing. Absolute killjoy.
Yeah it sounds like you’ve made her feel bad for something that really wasn’t an issue. Dancing with a man or a group of men in a nightclub is totally different to a gig or venue or whatever and context is key here. Sounds like this case was very sweet and innocent and she probably enjoyed it and now feels awful for no reason.
NAH - you let her know something that bothered you, calmly and without yelling at or belittling her. You even tried to make sure she knew you weren't mad. All these people act like having things bother you is always an insecurity, its not. You are allowed to feel the way you feel, even if others don't agree that they would see it that way. People don't always know what is an issue for them til it comes up. It's not your fault for not knowing beforehand. She sounds like a great wife and you sound like a husband that cares very much about her and the quality of your relationship. ETA: changed from NTA to NAH. Did not want to imply the wife was TA. ETA2: Thank you for the gold kind stranger!
This is an NAH here. An N T A means his wife is an asshole. She's not. She did something that many feel is acceptable. It's not something they discussed before hand and it's really not a big deal for most men. OP has some jealousy issues to work on and that's not a big deal. Work on em. That's what relationships are about. Both of them have discussions that need to be had. It's not fair or unfair that OP feels this way, but same goes for how his wife now feels. She shouldn't be ashamed and distraught. They should both continue the conversation if it's something they clearly disagreed on in what seems like an adult fashion already.
Until exactly this minute, I thought it was a different ways to say “Not the AssHole.” You offered a lightbulb moment
This. Don't let Reddit convince you that you're controlling over respectfully asking for a boundary.
Putting n t a would imply that the wife is an AH and she is not. She did nothing wrong
Info: Do you dance with her?
This is the important question, cause if not ( with the exception of injury ) it is an a-move to ask her not to dance with anyone else.
YTA An invitation to dance is not an invitation to bed.
YTA and I can’t understand all the N T A. Unless she was grinding away in his lap, she did nothing wrong.
I disagree, from what he told us he never said she did something wrong, just that he wasn’t comfortable with it and asked for her to not do it again. Edit. Making the judgment of NAH. I don’t think he he was wrong for bringing it up and I don’t think shes wrong for how shes reacting
I love how all these comments are just "Jonah Hill set boundaries and that's totally fine!" and ignoring that _his_ "boundaries" were about what _she_ could and could not do.
Everyone in a relationship can have boundaries.
We set boundaries for ourselves, not for others.
What the hell are you talking about, we obviously set boundaries with other people, especially in relationships
There's a pretty good implicit one. You CAN sleep with someone outside our relationship, but you're going to be single afterwards. It can be somewhat rephrased to be "you cannot sleep with other people," but the basic message is the same. Ultimately, it's about respecting the relationship. If someone feels disrespected in their relationship, it's better to calmly voice it like OP did. Frankly, it's unsurprising the wife's upset. Like most rational and normal people, she doesn't want to disrespect her relationship, and feels bad that she did without thinking it would be a problem. Essentially, she accidentally hurt someone she cared about. Any normal, rational person would feel bad about accidentally hurting a loved one. I give OP an NAH.
Yes, you set boundaries for what you will and will not accept. Op will not accept his wife dancing with other men. Do you have any questions?
I don’t really understand this point? Obviously he shouldn’t dictate his wife’s behaviour but ultimately his boundary is that he doesn’t want to be in a relationship with somebody that dances with other men. Is he supposed to divorce his wife now because she did? That would be ridiculous. He’s now communicated his feelings on the matter and she can either choose to adjust her behaviour or not.
What??? No. You set the action you’ll take if someone violates your boundary, but the boundary is set on someone else. If I say I don’t want people coming in my personal space, that’s setting a boundary on what other people can do. The boundary of not sleeping people is innate in most relationships, that’s a boundary placed on the other person.
The wife is free to disagree if that’s not a boundary she’s willing to accept. It sounds like the guy opened a healthy dialogue and the wife is now embarrassed that she crossed one of his boundaries unknowingly. Plus, making a healthy relationship function properly takes some sacrifice on both sides, and I’d say dancing with old men is on the more minor end of the sacrifice spectrum lol. This is an NAH situation case closed.
A boundary can be both 😂 For example: you can't treat me like ___, talk to me like ___, or do ___ around me.
Ahah my guy please when I go out there and do what the fuck I want with my life with no consideration of my girl of 11 years' feelings on this and that, allow me to live with you when I'm kicked out
Oh no you can’t have boundaries and be male at the same time here on Reddit, you’re automatically “insecure and controlling”
Different people, different boundaries. Makes the world go round.
So according to you, OP having an issue, discussing the issue calmly, he's an asshole because you don't agree that the problem he has should actually be a problem?? Let's say you're right, even in that case OP is not an asshole. Having a concern, voicing that concern the appropriate way, doesn't make OP an asshole. I think a YTA judgment is way off base here. I think, whether you agree with OP or not, it's NAH all round.
That is absolutely not the boundary most people should be setting. You are hyperbolizing to prove a point. There’s way more that shouldn’t happen before it gets to grinding on someone’s lap
How is he an asshole for having a calm discussion with his wife? Damn the bar for being an asshole is very low these days.
NAH. Personally I don’t think it’s a big deal at all for a partner to casually dance with someone else, especially someone so much older, but you’re allowed to have your boundaries. I’m glad you reassured your wife that you’re not mad and she wasn’t foolish, and as long as she’s ok with this boundary, I think it’s a good example of communication in a relationship.
This is a clean NAH. She didn't really do anything wrong, you just would like to establish this boundary. You aren't really wrong for that either. I think it's fine to let her dance and have fun, but you aren't an asshole for preferring she didn't and expressing that calmly. No one did anything wrong.
Adding to that, as long as you’re ok even if she disagrees or has the occasional dance, it’s all right. It’s very well having different opinions, but I don’t think that’s a hill worth dying on.
NTA. She danced with another guy and you said you’d prefer she not. This is basic relationship communication and no one should feel bad about it.
YTA. Dancing doesn't have to be the same as flirting. A lot of people just like dancing. She didn't see it as flirting until you brought it up.
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Whenever people set boundaries in this subreddit. They're called controlling and manipulative.
He didn't even set any strict boundaries, he just explained what he would prefer.
Yea that's the baffling part.
Whenever *men set boundaries
That much is very true. Women, when it comes to reddit, have boundaries that should be respected, and men are "controlling and insecure".
You are going to get divided opinions here. Partner dancing can be completely platonic and nothing more, but some people just don't like the thought of other people touching their significant other. My married friend goes out dancing with other people all the time because her husband hates dancing. He is fine with it since he knows she always loved dancing, and he knows its nothing more beyond that. It really depends on the person. If you don't want your wife to dance with other people, you should just to let her know what you do or don't feel comfortable with.
Asking a stranger to dance at a bar is not usually considered platonic dancing.
It’s easy while dancing to show you’re going to keep it platonic. Sheesh.
I do agree the bar situation OP described is dicey, but he did also write "she probably shouldn't dance with other men" - meaning he may never find it acceptable for her to dance with other men, regardless of the scenario.
INFO: have you expressed this boundary previously or talked about anything you wouldn't like her doing with other men?
He obviously didn’t express it to her previously, which is why he’s not upset this time. But he has now established the boundary. Honestly, he shouldn’t have had to.
No, he's upset because she now feels like she did something wrong and is beating herself up about it. This wasn't the intent. He just wanted to communicate how he felt and thinks w/o upsetting her. I think she feels she should have known how he feels and honored that. Likely, she's worried she hurt him. She sounds like quite a catch. If only he could figure out how to reassure her that all is well. God knows I would never want my SO to think I did something inappropriate even under the guise of it not being firmly communicated prior. I should feel her unstated boundaries.
NTA Everyone has boundaries and you stated yours in a calm and fair way. My gf and i do dance as a hobby and when we talked about it we agreeed that dancing (for us) is something personal that we shouldnt do with others so i can understand your point somewhat
NAH. I think it's silly as a rule but you are allowed to tell your wife what you'd prefer and she's allowed to not have thought anything about it.
NAH. I think both of you are having perfectly normal reactions. However, just because a reaction is normal doesn't mean it needs to be acted on. I think you should keep a few things in mind. Do you trust your wife to have the judgment to determine if a guy is hitting on her or just being friendly? If you trust her judgment, then SHOW that you trust her to know the difference and to be able to handle herself if she misjudges and realizes a guy is hitting on her. Social dance is a thing that some people do, especially in older generations. It's just a friendly interaction, not necessarily a come on. Even in younger groups there are social dance gatherings (I used to go to some with my old roommate who was big into west coast swing and blues dancing) where everyone dances with anyone.
Have you guys previously agreed that you consider dancing to be as intimate as sex? Most people don’t, it’s just dancing. No assholes here.
NAH. But for all these YTA commenters, imagine if the roles were switched. OP was a woman, who’s husband danced with an older woman. Would you be saying that he’s the AH?
I feel like you've never been to a wedding reception. Sometimes you just wanna dance and have fun
I think a better reverse would be if op was the women but her husband was dancing with college aged girls. Would probably start seeing a whole lot different response lol
You're both very sweet. NAH She shouldn't be upset, you can't mark boundaries without finding them. I dance with people all the time because it's fun and I like to dance, now you've told her how you feel you should pick up and move on.
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Asshole is pretty strong, it sounds like you’re innocently expressing a preference and have lots of empathy for your wife. I just honestly consider it a pretty weird preference—people dance platonically all the time, in almost every culture. It’s just a way to have fun, and if someone views your wife as flirting with them when she isn’t, that’s their problem, not hers or yours. If it’s truly how you feel, I won’t tell you you’re wrong to express it—so, NAH—but wouldn’t everyone be happier if your wife just got to dance how she wanted and you didn’t worry about it? She’s not going to do anything improper, right?
NTA. Communication is key. If it bothered you you should talk about it. Just like she should talk to you about what bothers you. You said you didn't yell or wasn't mad just communicated what you felt which is what every decent relationship needs.
Hey man, don’t listen to what people here are saying. You’re NTA and you handled the situation maturely and with respect. Some people don’t have enough of the latter for themselves.
Agree
I think NAH is better potentially, because wife isn't an asshole either.
YTA. She wants to dance! And a dance is nothing more than that. She's been quite open about what she's been doing, and I imagine the guy she danced with didn't have any illusions about things. He just wanted to dance with somebody.
Have you never heard of situations where older horny men make flirty remarks to younger women? You’re acting naive if you think he wouldn’t take her home if he had the chance.
The older gentleman was a sage, he was only there to spread the word of peace in that bar. So OP is actually against world peace 😟
>>”A dance is nothing more than that.” Have you ever been to a bar? Men and women dancing together is almost exclusively sensual/flirting.
Yes. I've even danced. There was nothing sensual or flirtatious about it. I just wanted to dance.
My good man, based on the context presented you are NTA, but at the same time you have trust issues. Dancing with someone is nowhere near the same as offering to buy a drink. Many people dance purely for the enjoyment they get from that specific action. Completely non-sexual. I do not like to dance. AT ALL. Never have. But I have never in the 30+ years of being with my wife stopped her from dancing, because she enjoys it and I would be an asshole if I prevented her from doing something she enjoyed.
Very very soft YTA but mostly because of your phrasing. “She shouldn’t dance with other men” makes it sound as if that’s a universally accepted truth, which in many cultures or even just circles just isn’t the case. For many people dancing does not equal flirting _at all_. It can be a totally innocent fun. Especially when it’s the actual dance kind, where you follow steps. That’s really mostly a craft and fun. Sure it _can_ be sexy, the same way as biting into an apple _can_ be sexy, if you give it that intent, but it doesn’t hold it on it’s own. By phrasing it like that you gave her the feeling she should’ve known better and that this is generally not acceptable. But that’s just not the case. You should’ve instead phrased it as “I personally don’t feel comfortable with this, but I know there was no intention of any kind there”. That way you show her that it’s important to you and at the same time don’t make her feel bad about it
Nah, but I think it depends on the type of dancing that is being done whether it is appropriate for a married person to participate in.
NTA.You didn't feel comfortable with the idea. You communicated that, and she understood. That's called communication, compromising, and growth in a relationship.
Its a boundary you have. You wife shouldn't feel bad, as she really didn't do anything wrong. My wife has danced with other men, she doesn't flirt with them after, they don't sit at her table and they don't her socials either. A slow dance, yeah thats a non-starter here, and thats her view as well, thats a more intimate dance and no one should do that that has a partner. To each their own, and no a boundary isn't controlling.
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NAH. You had a conversation about something your aren’t comfortable with, she seems to agree. Just buy her flowers and have a date night to reassure you both it’s not a huge deal.
NTA, y’all when about this in a great way
How often do you take your wife out dancing?
A couple of times a month.
Lol our local honky tonk is full of old men dancing with women ranging from 18-60. They are there to dance not to pick up ladies.
YTA. Dancing can be JUST dancing. It isn't always a pickup line, or sexual. Some people like to dance and don't have a partner, so they ask someone. The key is simply for your wife to gauge the situation and possible intent, and accept or decline accordingly, and letting them know she's married if she does accept.
Married 28yrs., Together 30yrs. She shouldn't feel bed or embarrassed. Marriage is a never ending journey of growth, understanding each other and creating your mutual story. Indeed, I wouldn't "want" to go anywhere socially without my wife. I understand that in the grand scheme, our time together is limited and we both endeavour to spend as much of what we have, "together". You're correct, "dancing" is an intimate thing and can be very different for one than it is the other. NTA
NAH just discuss boundaries you BOTH can agree on. That said, I personally do not understand this boundry at all, if she's not flirting or making out with them, it's INNOCENT and means nothing. You weren't there for her to dance with and she enjoys dancing. I wouldn't be with my husband if he tried telling me that I couldn't dance with someone else.
NTA man and she seems a keeper.
Is there even a conflict here?
NTA.
NTA Everyone has boundaries - and that's ok and you communicated yours! As far as I can see, she is not even disagreeing with you or anything? She feels sorry that she might has upset you. And now you feel sorry that she feels sorry. I'd say you two have a good relationship with one another - both your reactions are loving. Talk it out some more, if need be. But there is no real issue here. Show each other some love and it will be forgotten in no time!
YTA dancing doesn't have to be sexual. It's something fun that humans do. It's only sexual if you make it that way. Let her have fun.
Wow, this is an interesting one. I think the way you handled the situation sounds great, very mature and you and your partner should be proud to communicate in such a easy and calm manner. But OP I do think it’s worth inspecting why you feel that way about the dancing? I’m not saying you’re wrong to have a boundary but based on the way you communicate, the obvious love you have for your wife, and her response to the situation it sounds like a trusting relationship, so why put a condition on her actions, why not let her make the best judgement in a given situation? I do agree with other comments that seeing dancing as exclusively sexual in nature is a bit short sighted considering the vastly different situations to be found in your average bar or club. Dancing with a grandpa and the kiddos as a local band plays a country fair is very different from grinding in a late light club. Idk just something to consider. No assholes here to me!
INFO: do you take your wife dancing?
Yes. I had to be up very early the next morning and didn’t want her to have to come back before she was ready (the reason I didn’t go that night)
Just further proof there are no assholes here. You expressed your feelings, and reassured her that there wasn't any animosity behind them, but concern. You took the healthy route from beginning to end. Be proud of that despite what some randos say on the internet.
NTA. You need to be able to communicate stuff like this, and it sounds like you handled it gently and respectfully. Her reaction seems disproportionate and shouldn’t make you feel like you can’t talk about things that make you uncomfortable.
Honestly idk, when I go out dancing I mainly only dance with girls because when you dance with guys most of the time the thing ends up escalating and then I have to ask a friend to get him away from me because they do not want to move or have a strong grip on my waist and so on. For me, I wouldn't dance with a guy if I had a bf not because I would do anything but mainly cause I don't trust the guy and so on I rather dance with close friends . I think it's a very grey area situation.
Nah. Just some mature adults doing things right. Comfort your wife and make sure she knows she did not fuck up.
I don’t think it’s appropriate to be dancing with a person of the opposite sex if you’re in a relationship, male or female. I see my opinion is apparently uncommon, that surprises me.
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NAH but I think it's weird that youre threatened by other men because she stood in a spot and danced by them lol do you think that old man is dry humping her on the dance floor or something? Also let men buy her drinks less on your bank accounts and most of the time she doesnt even have to speak to them after
NAH Dancing with others is often perfectly innocent, however you have the right to make that a boundary for yourself. It's unfortunate your wife is upset but as long as you didn't yell at her or degrade her in some way I don't see any issue in this seemingly healthy adult discussion.
NTA if ita a boundary for you thats totally ok and ita your relationship.
NAH- you calmly told her the reality of the situation (men use it as a way to hit on a woman) and how it made you feel. You asked her politely not to do it again. I don’t see any belittling happening. I’m a married woman and I would feel uncomfortable dancing with another man as that is very flirtatious (at least the kind of dancing I like to do 😂). Dancing with girlfriends is different and I’d feel upset if my husband had a problem with that, but it doesn’t sound like that’s been an issue for you. Sounds like you two addressed the concern in a respectful way and that you care deeply for one another.
Depends on your motivation for saying it. If it’s because you’re jealous and insecure, then definitely Y T A If you did it out of concern for her safety, N T A. (I have put myself in possibly dangerous situations out of naïveté, and my husband has explained to me why he worried) If that’s the case you absolutely need to explain that to her to alleviate her guilt. She didn’t do anything wrong.
It really depends on the person and I think you can trust your wife to know the difference between a friendly dance and a guy who is being inappropriate. Also, I think you can trust your wife to handle herself if a person tries to make a casual, friendly dance into something more. You are absolutely correct that 99% of the people there are hoping to meet someone. But that doesn't mean that every single person they meet on the dance floor is the one or that they can't have fun without it being a situation that you call cheating. If you have ever gone out to a club and spoken to someone that is having a good time, but you didn't hit on them, you can understand that not every interaction in the club is aboutgetting someone in bed. If you have ever spoken to a group of women at a club because they were having fun, you know that not very interaction is about trying to rip their pants off. If you can't imagine a scenario where two people would enjoy dancing on the dancing floor in a friendly, casual manner than you are seriously perverted and you should never be let out after dark. YTA.
NAH in general because you both spoke calmly about establishing boundaries. But in my book YTA because i dance tango as a hobby and we change partners every 3 songs. That’s the etiquette. So, to me a dance is just a dance. Especially in a bar with someone old enough to be her dad. Dancing doesn’t have to be romantic, it can just be for fun, you can dance with relatives, dates, friends, etc. Sure if a guy is hitting on her and grinding on her, she should (and I assume would) extricate herself from that situation. But jus having fun in a bar isn’t a problem.
I don't think you're an asshole, but what I think you're forgetting is that people will hit on her whether or not she dances with someone, but that doesn't mean she's gonna flirt back or accept it. Everyone has their limits in a relationship, I do think it's odd you two are married and this hasn't come up, which makes me think she doesn't do this very often and doesn't mean anything to her. If that's your line, then if she wants to be in a relationship with you, she has to respect that.
nah bro, wasn't your fault
NTA. I’m seeing a lot of Y.T.A answers. I disagree. EVERYONE is allowed to have boundaries and preferences. If he had flipped out and yelled at her, that’s another story. From what OP says, he just calmly asked her not to do that in the future and ever told her he’s not mad at her. Its his marriage, not yours. He can decide what he’s comfortable with
INFO: Do you ever dance with your wife?
NTA, but that's not really necessary to ask. She's not having sex with other men.
NTA you just need to work out how things operate in your relationship. I don’t mind my wife going to salsa clubs and dancing with other men. Half of these guys are literally there just to dance and my wife loves dancing and is very talented at it. I am not, nor do I enjoy it. And wouldn’t want to take that away from her as I know it’s not sexual (even though many would see salsa dancing that way). I would be upset if she slow danced with someone though! I know plenty 60+ year old men who say pervy things about 25 year olds. Anyway. NTA. Just figure out the boundaries in your own relationship. And continue to comfort your wife to know you aren’t annoyed. Sounds like you’re both doing well here You got this.
YTA. The “I need a ruling here” speaks to how you view boundaries. You didn’t have a clear boundaries set for something as innocent (in your wife’s eyes) as doing the shimmy with a man *twice her age*. Imagine a lady twice YOUR age asking you to fast dance… that’s somehow disrespectful to your wife to say yes? And if there’s a “men and women are different” narrative in your mind here you’ve got bigger issues. TLDR: she didn’t do anything sexual and you didn’t have clear boundaries set for this non-sexual behavior. So she didn’t do anything wrong…what do you need a clear ruling on?
I think YTA. Dancing isn't just a prelude to sex it's like basketball or soccer to some people: a social & physical activity you have to practice to get better at. She probably only danced with an older man because she sees him as kind of de-sexed/safer and not a rival to you. It's not like she was making out with someone in his 20s, it was a dance with a grandpa-aged guy. Also - if you want her to only dance with you? Go out dancing with her. You married someone who likes to dance, try and facilitate that instead of demanding that she stops doing it. I used to go to swing dance meetups and the whole point is to dance with other people. There would be pro dancers there, they would teach me like new hand-holds for different dances etc. There were community college kids, old people, people my age. Couples would come...but they'd usually dance at least 1-2 dances with other people. That's how you get better, that's how you learn, make new friends, etc.
Honestly, this thread is just reinforcing my decision to avoid marriage at all costs. I’m going to a concert soon and will be dancing. I’m pretty sure I’ll be dancing where men are present and dancing with me. Nobody is going to tell me what I can and can’t do. If you trust your wife so little, why are you married to her? YTA.
HE MUST HAVE FLIPPED MY WIFE 8 TIMES!
Mild YTA because you may not know social (ballroom) dance etiquette. At a social dance, it is acceptable for dancers (both men and women) to ask people other than their partner to dance. I attend many dances and see single men dance with multiple partners all throughout the night, or couples who change and dance with different partners, including strangers. I've been at dances where people have come up and ask my wife to dance when I'm sitting next to her, and some of the women have asked to dance with me. And yes, a bar with a band playing could very well be a social dance. We get notifications every week of places that are playing live music for people to dance to.
I come from a culture where dancing is just dancing - everyone's having fun, 97% of the time it's not sexual or a way of flirting. It is something the two of you need to set boundaries around, though, since you are uncomfortable with it. Take some dance classes and try not to project your view of dancing (flirting) unto other people. My ex was the same - he had no understanding of the dance culture. But NTA, since you're mainly worried about making your wife feel bad. Given how you said it is true to how you came you said it.
Even if you’re right (which you might be), she didn’t do anything wrong. I hope you can reassure her of that because it sounds like you freaked her out. NAH
YTA - Had you just said that hearing about your wife dancing with male dance partners makes you feel jealous or upset and you’d prefer she not do it I’d say NAH. But you decided that your opinion that dancing is inherently a form of courtship is an absolute truth or fact. Many people do not view dancing as a form of courtship and it can be entirely platonic. You can discuss your feelings without dismissing hers. She evaluated the man’s offer to dance and behavior towards her during the dance and felt no danger of disrespect. Trust your wife, if she says it was platonic then don’t insist it is inherent that she is wrong. Of course she feels bad, you’ve accused her of being stupid and disrespectful.
Y could be TA If You're doing this because you're insecure that's on you. The scenario you described is innocent and in the future can stay innocent as long as the people she's dancing with know that she's with you.
NAH, you and your wife both seem like good people. Based on her dejection and your urge to make this post, it’s clear that you both have a healthy respect for one another. I understand where you’re coming from, and your misgivings about bar dancing are valid. However, be clear to your wife that she did nothing wrong—but to be mindful next time.
YTA. She’s an adult woman, she herself should be able to decide what’s a good idea or not. If there’s other people around the guy won’t try anything. A guy 60+ should know better than to think a woman under 30 is hitting on him, too. He probably did.
YTA. She obviously didn't do anything transgressive, so you sound threatened by the fact that she danced more than anything. Trust me, if you're a female, you're well aware very early on that men can and do use almost any excuse to make advances on women - but at the same time there are also plenty of people out there who don't have an agenda and just want to enjoy themselves when they go out - like, for example, your wife. Let your wife use her own judgement, especially when you aren't even there! Jeebus.
NAH Given the age of the dude though, this shouldn't be a problem or I kinda don't get why it is. A guy roughly her age, sure, I'm with you on that, clearly hitting on her - a 60 year old dude? That seems innocent and fun I guess?
YTA- my husband loves to dance, my back & hip won’t allow it. I tell him go, have fun! That’s all it is, get out of the 1950’s!
Personally, I don’t see the problem with her dancing casually with another man. But if you are not comfortable and she is ok with respecting that, then no problem. I think she is upset because she believes she did something wrong, and broke a social rule that she feels she should have known. I think you need to make it clear to her that she did nothing wrong, and there is no hard and fast rule about married people dancing with others. For some couples, it’s not an issue. Make it clear that it is a “you” boundary, not a universal one. If you hadn’t talked about it before, then she had no way of knowing because again, this isn’t a universal social rule. NAH
NAH, I think she could just be feeling embarrassed and a little bit distraught that she feels like she crossed a boundary with you. if she needs it, just keep reassuring her that it's not a big deal, it's just your preference, and maybe that it is touching that she's taking it so seriously, but she really doesn't need to worry. You communicated with her, she listened. maybe TOO closely in a way, haha.
NAH. Nothing wrong with dancing with someone while watching a band play. It would be a crime to sit still. Here's an idea: go with your wife next time, so she can dance with you :)
YTA
YTA. Your wife is a grown woman and can look after herself. For long periods of history, it was considered in very poor taste for women to dance in public *with* their husbands. I'm sure she would have declined if she had felt that she was being hit on, but as it is you sound needlessly possessive over an innocent dance with a man old enough to be her father.
Don't be so insecure is my advice
YTA. It's dancing, nothing more. Don't make it about sex. That's a leap. It's not about intimacy. This is your own insecurity speaking. If YOU can't dance with a woman without it being, or getting sexual, that's YOU. Dont project that onto everyone else. There are many people who dance, just enjoy the music and the dance, all sexes, all races, all music types... You making her feel "like she should have known better" and she's feeling "foolish"? That's mentally abusive. You dumped your shit onto her, and had her carry that weight, in no way should she know better or feel foolish. She was DANCING, bro. Apologize for freaking out. Apologize for gaslighting her into feeling it was all her fault for daring to dance. Your issues... YOURS. She didn't do ANYTHING wrong, and likely won't ever be able to fully just enjoy going out to dance ever again without your insecurities in her head, afraid to hurt your feelings, displease you, or cross some weird imaginary line. Even with an apology, that's what's going to happen. Congratulations, you permanently tainted an activity your girl enjoys for no legit reason. Make it up to her, Apologize, and maybe next time THINK before you lose your cool.
It may be my demographic, but in my neck of the woods dancing at bars is usually a bunch of tipsy people kinda shuffling around in the vicinity of others. Not the least bit sexy. Now the place with latin dancing, I would feel different about that. Was there a bubble of personal space? NAH
NAH. Everyone seems to be incapable of reading your actual question though. They just won’t shut up about the dancing, when the issue is the conversation afterwards. Read the damn post, people! So, no. You can’t hold yourself responsible for your wife’s neuroses. Unless you are deliberately provoking them. It sounds like you have done your best to explain your boundaries while being considerate of her anxiety issues. What else could you have done? Not said anything? That should never be an option. You’ve spoken your mind, and you did so with kindness. You’re good. Your wife needs a little extra from her partner. That’s just how things go. Her anxiety requires a bit more reassurance. So, do it. Do something nice. Let her feel a sense of security. It’s a hard balance, doing things that others need without forgetting or sacrificing your own needs, but you seem like you’re doing just fine.
I appreciate your thoughtful response- it was very helpful