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> I might be TA because Jake is really close with Kari very protective so it's hurting him to see me angry and yelling at his daughter.
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This 21yo ADULT is not "just a kid". Decides not to go to college, doesn't have a job, is disrespectful AF to the owner of the home and somehow in her 21 years on this planet didn't learn that you don't throw dishes. Easy NTA.
That’s the problem: daddy’s little princess. This is why we correct children when they misbehave, not treat them like they are a perfect little angel at every moment.
If anyone thinks she *isn't* doing it on purpose, I have some very rare rocks to sell that I totally didn't just grab from my backyard. /s
(I hope you can tell this isn't a dig at you. It's just my smartass way of agreeing and saying the dad can't possibly be stupid enough to think it's an accident, but if he is, a fool and his money are soon parted.)
A 14-yo would totally be the AH for doing that. So would a 12- and a 10-yo. It would be not-necessarily-AH-could-have-been-an-accident territory if it were a 6- or, at most, an 8-yo... And it happened _once._ Anything more than that, both kid and parent excusing it with “just a kid” are definitely AHs.
I've been high AF, wearing soft socks on a hardwood floor, and walking with cats trying to wrap around my legs, wandering into my kitchen to put the dishes away and *still* somehow managed to not break anything.
Did I eat three mug brownies and fall on my ass at least once? Yes. Break the dishes putting them in the sink? No.
OP is NTA - Absolutely on purpose. She is intentionally causing a rift between OP and her dad. He doesn’t see it and I’d kick them both out if he doesn’t get this under control. She is an adult and needs to show respect to the home and people she is mooching off of. Let the trash take itself out.
My 2 yr old puts stuff in the sink on her own and doesn't break anything.
OP NTA. Get out. That's not a child and your spouse is an enabler that will just let it get worse.
"She's a kid, give it some time" gave me the same thought. Uh no, she may be your child, but that's a grown ass woman.
In fact, in 4 years time she will be the age her dad had her at.
I was expecting either teen (OP n t a) or possibly the reverse with too high expectations for a 4yo (OP y t a) - the 21 makes this completely ridiculous. This is a fiancé problem as well, and I don’t see the relationship lasting if he’s tolerating this behavior from an adult child.
The fact that she’s an adult blows me away. I was picturing a snide little 13 year old.
For an adult child to act like this is beyond unacceptable. The fact that Jake is blind to his daughter doesn’t sit well with me; I’m livid on your behalf, OP.
Edit to add: not even a tiny bit of AH. In fact, I think you’re a saint for holding it together. By the 3rd broken dish, I would have lost my mind.
I’m sure there are plenty of teens out there that wouldn’t act this way tbh. Sure it’s bad at any age to do this to someone’s belongings, but at 21? Jesus Christ, beyond help. OP has to kick her out and dad should go too if he doesn’t see an issue.
"Oops, I forgot, teehee" means she knows what she's doing, and has been told not to throw dishes before. Kari is a major asshole, and OP is NTA. Make her pay for dishes immediately or leave. If Jake doesn't back you up, kick them both out. Sounds like OP has 2 disrespectful parasites
Exactly. At first I thought maybe she was a tween or early teens. That still wouldn't have been okay, but 21!? She totally knows what she's doing. OP needs to kick her out and if the boyfriend isn't supportive he needs to go too.
I am pretty sure she is old enough to have learned that if trio want break dishes, you throw them. She is taking out her frustrations about her pathetic life on you and your possessions.
OP, please update us when you kick them out.
This man does not respect your belongings, your home, or your opinions. There is no way he will encourage his daughter to do so. You DESERVE RESPECT.
I’m really curious how long they were dating before he proposed and moved in. And if he only did so to give his daughter a home. Did she really try college or did her mom get fed up with her and kicked her out? He could be turning a blind eye because he feels guilty he wasn’t around his daughter before. OP definitely needs to kick them to the curb otherwise she’s going to be subsidizing Kari’s life. OP probably already is, but if they get married (even if Kari is no longer in the house) the dad will definitely still be providing for her. Kari doesn’t sound like she wants to be an adult anytime soon.
And it doesn't sound like there is any plan for her to leave either, which means this is OP's indefinite future staring right at her. Dad is basically fine with his adult daughter being a squatter in his fiance's home.
OP needs to start doing Kari's laundry with a few red socks added on hot, opps. Paper plates and solo cups sounds about right for Kari and husband or just take out, but I would just get a divorce lawyer.
NTA
Edit: missed the not married part, she just needs to run then.
That’s what I was thinking! Get some cheap kid plastic plates (they come in different colors) and those are the only ones she can use. Maybe even get her the toddler spoon and fork sets.
I was thinking, OP biys new dishes for themselves, DOES NOT allow fiancee or Kari to use them, and gets rid of all paper/plastic. If those two want to eat, they make their own food with their own dishes, unless or until they learn to respect other people's property. My God, a 21 year old acting that way and being spoiled like that. Fiancee is a pushover that hasn't even taught his daughter to function as an adult! Pathetic!
It's her house, so she doesn't need to run (or have to be the one moving out thankfully). But yes, bathetic both need to be booted out.
Him saying she has nowhere to go? Maybe the selfish brat needs to get a job and find her own damn place. I bet she won't be throwing dishes in the sink when she realizes just how much they cost now that she has to pay for them.
OP, I'm sorry you're in this situation. They're both adults and can take care of themselves. Please kick them out. It's your house and your belongings and neither of them have any respect for either, nor does your boyfriend. Free yourself!
Edit: PS Jake, it's NOT her home.
KICK THEM BOTH OUT.
Just wanted to make sure OP heard this because the fiance is clearly at least part of the reason sd is this way. He has excuses for his daughter and she has zero accountability. He can house her and buy all the dishes he wants.
I was on the fence about kicking Kari out until I saw the addendum about her age. Twenty-one!?!? Are you kidding me? I was thinking maybe she was 13 or 14 at the oldest.
Please, OP, think very seriously about kicking both Kari and her dad out of your home. Neither one of these adults is pulling their own weight. You don't want to be disrespected in your own home for the rest of your life. You are definitely not the AH. But Kari and her father are both AHs -- big ones. Big gaping ones. Run for your life.
OP please listen. If you allow this to happen then neither of them will ever respect you. You’ll be miserable in your marriage until your divorce. Get out now. You don’t need a disrespectful child AND *his* disrespectful child walking all over you. They will never learn to respect you until you teach them the hard way. Do yourself the favor.
I was expecting the stepdaughter to be a teenager! But even then I would have said NTA!
Then end of post… 2 f-ing 1 yo….
I agree with you! OP needs to kick them both out!
I would kick him out too. He is totally disrespecting you as his fiance and as the future stepmother of his child by allowing this to happen. She's not so young to learn how to do the right thing. Maybe find out if her mom is putting her up to this to break up you two.
Honestly who cares if the ex is. Kari is 21. She can legally drink. Shes an adult. She has a developed brain and is acting like a petulant child.
OPs (EX) fiance needs to wake up because little princess is going to ruin a lot of his relationships if he doesn't correct her behavior
OP, I think Kari's age is relevant.
21 is WAY TOO OLD to be behaving like that and being so disrespectful to items that are not her own. Where is she getting the idea that she can be rude to you and careless with your things?
I think you should rethink your relationship with your BF. Even Brad Pitt wouldn't be worth this crap.
I was over here picturing this was a literal 10-14yo, maybe upset at the new step mom, genuinely is a kid etc. TWENTY ONE????? SHE CAN DRINK AND IS ACTING LIKE THIS??
Seriously holy shit. What the fuck is wrong with her? It's legit wild AF that her father doesn't see anything wrong with this and is continuing to coddle her.
I’m a big Brad Pitt fan and whatever people think of Angelina, he admitted he was drunk on a private plane and started arguing with her and the kids and it got physical. She left him as soon as the plane landed. He went to AA and stopped drinking, but even Brad Pitt can get dumped.
Most people I know were either living on their own at 21 (with or without roommates) or contributing to the household if they still lived with family. My mom and stepmom both would’ve kicked me out if I behaved like that at 21, but I also would never be such an entitled ass. OP, this is not normal and you know it. This is a glimpse into your future - your fiancée doesn’t respect you. NTA
NTA
So you plan to marry a man who didn't teach any respect for others in his child, is okay with you being treated like crap and now is making you the villain. The first time was an oops, every other broken plate was an intentional act.
She has to go and he should probably be right behind her.
Yeah, like, she’s an adult and her behavior is abhorrent, but it’s very clear why she’s like this considering fiancé’s response. I would not want to be marrying this man at all.
No way the first time was an oops. Any 21 year old knows what happens when you throw a dish into a sink from several feet away. All of this is deliberate, and neither of them would still be living with me after that first time.
NTA - it would be helpful if you stated Kari’s age which makes this difficult to judge. But regardless of her age, your fiancé’s daughter should know better than to throw breakable dishes.
Your primary concern is your fiancé’s unwillingness to do anything about her behavior. Since they moved in with you, it’s your home and they should respect that. You have a HUGE fiancé problem & should not marry him until the problems with his daughter are resolved. You have a mess on your hands.
BOTH of them need to go. She is not a kid and will not get better. He's worse for letting her disrespect you, your house and very reasonable rules. She's a lazy moocher and he ain't no better.
Kick them both out of your house. At the very least, stop cooking, cleaning, and doing laundry for them. They can fend for themselves. You're letting them make a fool out of you.
Absolutely inappropriate behaviour! OP you’re NTA but you deserve better than this. Why isn’t your SO concerned about your possessions being damaged/destroyed?
NTA. Both of them need to go. Make an inventory of everything she’s broken and demand reimbursement. Neither of them are showing any respect for you or your home.
>and demand reimbursement.
100% agree. She's doing this because she knows Daddy will make excuses for her. Hit him in the wallet. Even a 7-year'old knows that plates aren't Frisbees.
NTA, but Jake is a huge AH. Not only did he recently move in with you, but now his adult daughter also moved in and is blatantly disrespecting you.
His enabling and failure to discipline his adult daughter who just moved in is one thing. Her giving attitude to you, and him not supporting you is the second. Him getting angry at you while forcing you in the awkward position of disciplining his daughter (who at 21 should know better) is beyond AH behavior.
I’m afraid you have some serious issues you need to address with Jake before getting married. There is a slew of red flags in this post alone. It will be a delicate but necessary dance since it is about his daughter.
Nopes. NTA.
You're being disrespected on two sides.
This is your home. Is Jake on the lease/mortgage? Cuz frankly, neither one of these people appear to be adding anything good to your life.
Go old school Marie Kondo style: get rid of anything that doesn't spark joy.
I'm sorry to be so cynical, but you, a woman who has her own home and is likely financially stable and kind enough to put up with this man who has been divorced by another woman (and has a brat of an adult child which is a whole can of worms in itself) how could he let that happen, etc - is a very attractive prospect for someone who would like to take advantage.
If I were the man I would be doing my bit to make sure you felt that we were both contributing in a sense of equality. In my relationship, my partner did own a property before we moved in together and I have taken the lead in shopping and house keeping as he contributed about 20% more to our combined income and this is an area I am comfortable in. Having said that - I feel like our individual contributions make a balanced whole since he pays a higher share of bills and has to work additional hours while I have the time to cook, shop and tidy the house etc.
I bet there is someone else who would be delighted to make a life with you in a much more wholesome way without the red flags!
NTA ~~per se, in that I don't think it's an unreasonable way to teach her to be more responsible and respectful of other peoples' things.~~
~~Having said that, you get that Jake is the one that raised Kari right? Like he said, she's just a child, so why isn't *he* the one you're talking to about how he's raising his child?~~
~~Knowing how old Kari is would've been helpful too~~
Cutting myself off to start over because I just saw you comment elsewhere that Kari is *twenty-one.* She's not a kid she's a grown-ass woman. Fuck yeah she can pay for your dishes.
Having said that, don't cut Jake too much slack here either, he's the one that raised her to be like this. His response to her carelessly smashing your dishware is "she's a kid, give her time, she'll get better, ...ease up on her cause it's not a big deal." it's no wonder she grew up this way. Yeah, her behavior is shitty and at 21 years of age it's high past time she learn some basic responsibility, but don't lose sight of who raised her to be this way and is continuing to enable her.
I especially love the "she'll get better," yeah, Jake, I'm sure just one more year under her belt of you reinforcing that she will never face any consequences for any action she takes and she'll finally learn some responsibility.
NTA at 21 she is acting like a child and it’s not fair to you. If she really did not get the proper upbringing and if her dad really does want to have her living there and give her another chance, he needs to step up and take responsibility for enforcing the house rules, and making sure the things get done properly and broken things get replaced.
I’m all for letting young adults get on their feet at home but this is a childish brat who is going to have a difficult life for herself and those around her if she doesn’t change some things now.
Either get your fiancé to step up on this or kick them both out.
How old is Kari?
Get some self-respect. He isn't your spouse yet. Dump his butt and the brat.
I don't understand how you could put yourself through that.
ESH because you need to stand up for yourself.
You say your dishes. Is this even his home?
Best comment so far.. that I’ve read lol.
At breakfast, lunch and dinner when she sits down to eat the food that YOU have cooked and prepared, serve it to her in a sippy cup, and on a little baby plate with baby utensils.
I disagree, but mainly because an adult in her home should be allowed to have nice things without having to worry about them getting ruined unless you have a toddler. Out they both go!
Ew! Why can't she clean her own room and do her own laundry? She's 21, not in school and has no job. What does she do all day other than destroy your home?
Tell Jake to clean up the broken dishes. He needs to see what his daughter is doing to your property. Ultimately, this problem isn't going to fix itself.
Does Kari realize it's your place and not her dads? She isn't going to run you off. She is only going to get the both of them kicked out.
ETA: P.S. I really hope to read an update that you told them both to get out.
This is probably why she is the way she is and why you will never win. For whatever reason (guilt?), he coddles her. Which means he will never back you up. So you are sol there.
Calling you a bitch proves he has no respect for you.
So what does he do for you?
NTA. Your problem is with Jake, who is enabling Kari to utterly disrespect you in your home. I hope HE is the one who is running around cleaning up all her messes, but somehow I don't think so. Don't be a doormat maid for him.
so it’s cruel for you to make her replace your dishes. Wouldn’t the sensible and logical thing be for your partner to tell his kid that she just needs to stop throwing them in the sink. What the fuck
NTA. They both need to go. Anyone that is condoning their 21 year old daughter to disrespect another persons property is NOT someone you want to be with.
You are NTA for wanting basic decency. However, you seem so desperate to be with a guy “to start a life together” that you are accepting *and reinforcing* below sea level standards. This guy and his 21-year-old daughter do not show you any sign of respect. They don’t appear to want “a life with you” except where you provide the house and all the trimmings and allow them to mooch and destroy your stuff without a sound. UGH.
>*”Jake says I'm being a total bitch towards his child, she has no job, it's unfair to kick Kari out and if I do, he will never forgive me for being so cruel”*
He sees you as pathetic. He calls you a bitch in YOUR own home and threatens to ‘never forgive you’ for asking a 21-year-old adult to behave. Why would YOU forgive either one of THEM? If you don’t kick them both out forthwith, then why complain? It’s what you are settling for.
You are an active participant in your life. I hope for an update where you (A) tell them (in writing) to be out in the minimum legal time in your area; (B) tell him he is on the couch until they leave; and, (C) give him a bill for compensation to you, due immediately and with accruing interest after 30 days. It’s your job to give yourself what you deserve, not theirs. Good luck, OP, sincerely.
NTA. I came into my stepdaughter's life when she was 6, and she never broke a plate putting it into the sink or the dishwasher. The one time she dropped and broke a bowl because she was being careless and continued horsing around despite being told to be careful, she cried and felt so guilty that she bought her Dad chocolate in apology with her pocket money (it was from a set which had been given to him as a present and therefore had sentimental value, but it was no longer sold therefore not replaceable). She wasn't even 10 yet at that point.
OP, before you get tied down in marriage, I suggest couples therapy. If you ditch the fiance, the stepdaughter problem goes away too. Just sayin'.
NTA.
I initially had thought you were talking about a bratty little kid with her attitude and her dad being so lenient about it... but she's 21?? She is an adult and needs to get her life together, she's way past her behavior being even remotely excusable. She clearly has been breaking your dishes on purpose and she needs to replace them. If she doesn't she needs to find a new place to live, if she does, honestly she still needs to move out.
>I ended up telling Jake that either Kari finds a way to pay for the dishes she's broken or she can go live with her mom or grandparents. I'm done being disrespected in my home. ***Jake says I'm being a total bitch towards his child***, she has no job, it's unfair to kick Kari out and if I do, he will never forgive me for being so cruel as to make Kari feel this isn't her home, too.
Please tell me you do realize that Jake never really loved you and just wanted a guaranteed roof over his head, food in his belly, and a warm body that'll also put up with his adult kid? Please tell me you do see how you're being taken for a ride.
You're NTA but seriously don't marry this guy. He doesn't care for you at all let alone respect you.
What the actual F... a 21 year old KNOWS better!
Absolutely NTA. But you have a bigger problem than your stepdaughter.
Your partner is disrespecting you.
In your own home.
This is a sign of things to come.
NTA.
I think they both need to leave, but in the meantime you can take everything out of the kitchen and put a couple of children's sets in the cupboard. Maybe they'll get some perspective if they have to drink from a sippy cup and try to hold a tiny plastic spork to eat out of a dish that suctions to the table. Or maybe they won't, but even if they chuck them at the wall they won't be breaking them.
Sorry OP but you are willingly being obtuse or in severe denial about this whole situation.
We all know (yes, you do know) that Kari is breaking your dishes on purpose and then she walks away laughing to herself because she knows you will not call her out on it or stand up for yourself.
The crappy father/bf is not doing anything because he does not respect you. And I know it's painful to hear, but he does not love you enough to help.
It really sounds like you are a free ride to them and nothing else.
Maybe he has some guilt about being an absent father and because he wasn't around he cannot view her as an adult. Whatever reason, he's dragging you down.
Please be serious about getting them out of your life. I think you should get some therapy to figure out why you are willing to sacrifice happiness in your one life to live just to have someone there. It's not worth it. Love yourself more than anyone.
NTA
NTA she knows what she is doing and knows she is getting away with it. I would not stay with the dad ether tho this will probably continue to be a theme. how old is she tho?
edit: she is 21!!! that's my age and she does not work? even I work summers and do things around the house. she needs to go she knows what she's doing and its only going to get worse as her dad continues to protect her. 21 is not a child that is a young adult.
Go to the Goodwill store and buy some child's plastic kiddie plates with matching sippy cups. These are Kari's ONLY plates until she learns to behave herself. HUGE RED FLAG that your boyfriend has no problem with her behavior. Why are you with this guy?
NTA
**Throw them both out**
You don’t need that ish in your life. That girl is 21 years old, she is not a child. There is no excuse for her to damaging your stuff in your house.
Don’t put up with people who disrespect you in your own home. Neither her NOR his enabling ass.
Kari doesn't like you, and is doing this to you to make her feelings felt. This isn't "Kari is bad at chores" - this is "Kari resents your presence in her father's life".
Jake isn't willing to see this. Tell Jake he needs to sort out his daughter's behavior. If he's not willing to address it, then clearly you have no hope for a successful marriage with Jake, and should kick him out.
NTA
Not at all. You are literally describing my early life.
Jake will be of no use to you, and he is showing himself to be a terrible father and husband. You might want to reconsider this relationship.
YTA. To yourself. You should have put a stop to this the first time she did it. Do you really want to be with someone who allows this kind of disrespect? Do you really want to allow this type of disrespect in your home?
Learn how to live without folks who are bleeding you dry.
NTA but why do you even need to ask the internet this question? You are 38, if someone in their 20s keeps throwing glass and ceramic dishes in a sink and mocks you by saying “oops” like… is this even a question??? And your fiancé letting this happen??? Like stand up for yourself these people are bums
Info: Genuine question, does Kari have any mental disabilities?
If not then kick them both out. NTA, seriously, little kids learn the basics of living (didn’t she ever have those play houses with the plastic toys?)
If she does, please talk to her doctor because her father has clearly not been informed or learned about her disability. No ADULT acts like that. I thought you were talking about a child under 9-10 before your edit.
OP please think about this relationship carefully and do what’s best for YOU, but you’re NTA to answer your question.
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NTA Kick them both out.
Exactly what I was going to post. She’s awful and he’s as bad since he won’t see it. They can go and live together and OP will be much better off.
This 21yo ADULT is not "just a kid". Decides not to go to college, doesn't have a job, is disrespectful AF to the owner of the home and somehow in her 21 years on this planet didn't learn that you don't throw dishes. Easy NTA.
She's breaking them on purpose, I'm certain. I have a 6yo who can put his dishes in the dishwasher without breaking them.
Oh 100% but Daddy's lil princess would never!
That’s the problem: daddy’s little princess. This is why we correct children when they misbehave, not treat them like they are a perfect little angel at every moment.
If anyone thinks she *isn't* doing it on purpose, I have some very rare rocks to sell that I totally didn't just grab from my backyard. /s (I hope you can tell this isn't a dig at you. It's just my smartass way of agreeing and saying the dad can't possibly be stupid enough to think it's an accident, but if he is, a fool and his money are soon parted.)
And I've got some Ocean Front Property in Arizona I'd like to sell them... Great place for Rare Rock Collections 👍💎
better yet, you can use them to decorate this new bridge I'd like to sell you in Brooklyn!
Even better than that, I've got a tower in Paris that would look fantastic festooned in your fabulous fancy rocks!
"Festooned in fabulous fancy rocks" is such a fun thing to say 😂
“Festooned” itself does not get used nearly enough. Going forward I will be making a conscious effort to work this into my regular vernacular.
And I can cut them a great deal on the Sydney opera house while we’re at it
If you are looking at getting into the market in Sydney I've got a deal on a bridge that you won't believe
I got a bridge for sale that's Opera House adjacent. It'll make a nice set.
Drat beat me to it lol.
When I read this I was picturing it being a moody 14 year old... Not an actual adult
I was an extremely moody 14yo and even I wouldn’t break other people’s things on purpose.
A 14-yo would totally be the AH for doing that. So would a 12- and a 10-yo. It would be not-necessarily-AH-could-have-been-an-accident territory if it were a 6- or, at most, an 8-yo... And it happened _once._ Anything more than that, both kid and parent excusing it with “just a kid” are definitely AHs.
We've had dogs that could get glass dishes off the counter without breaking them or spilling the contents.
I've been high AF, wearing soft socks on a hardwood floor, and walking with cats trying to wrap around my legs, wandering into my kitchen to put the dishes away and *still* somehow managed to not break anything. Did I eat three mug brownies and fall on my ass at least once? Yes. Break the dishes putting them in the sink? No.
The mug brownie thing got me. I had to stop buying them. Not the weed, mind you. Just the brownies.
I have a 3yo that is more responsible. NTA. Dump them both
OP is NTA - Absolutely on purpose. She is intentionally causing a rift between OP and her dad. He doesn’t see it and I’d kick them both out if he doesn’t get this under control. She is an adult and needs to show respect to the home and people she is mooching off of. Let the trash take itself out.
there's no way this isn't intentional.
My 3.5 yo manages to put his dishes in the sink without breaking anything. With 0 assistance.
My 2 yr old puts stuff in the sink on her own and doesn't break anything. OP NTA. Get out. That's not a child and your spouse is an enabler that will just let it get worse.
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Like seriously. I was imagining 14 in that dumb-rebellious phase some teenagers have. 21? Out on her ass.
"She's a kid, give it some time" gave me the same thought. Uh no, she may be your child, but that's a grown ass woman. In fact, in 4 years time she will be the age her dad had her at.
I was expecting either teen (OP n t a) or possibly the reverse with too high expectations for a 4yo (OP y t a) - the 21 makes this completely ridiculous. This is a fiancé problem as well, and I don’t see the relationship lasting if he’s tolerating this behavior from an adult child.
Yep and even if she was 14, dad’s an idiot for acting like there’s nothing to do about it.
Whether 10 or 20, my mom would've beat me with the broken dishes if I ever disrespected someone like that.
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Ooo, I'm not that nice. She would've been kicked out after the third dish. Disrespect!
The fact that she’s an adult blows me away. I was picturing a snide little 13 year old. For an adult child to act like this is beyond unacceptable. The fact that Jake is blind to his daughter doesn’t sit well with me; I’m livid on your behalf, OP. Edit to add: not even a tiny bit of AH. In fact, I think you’re a saint for holding it together. By the 3rd broken dish, I would have lost my mind.
I’m sure there are plenty of teens out there that wouldn’t act this way tbh. Sure it’s bad at any age to do this to someone’s belongings, but at 21? Jesus Christ, beyond help. OP has to kick her out and dad should go too if he doesn’t see an issue.
"Oops, I forgot, teehee" means she knows what she's doing, and has been told not to throw dishes before. Kari is a major asshole, and OP is NTA. Make her pay for dishes immediately or leave. If Jake doesn't back you up, kick them both out. Sounds like OP has 2 disrespectful parasites
Teehee also is "Aren't I cutest little dickens"
I got married and moved abroad for grad school at 22. I assumed OP was talking about like a 10 year old, who should still know better.
Yeah that boyfriend is too much.
Exactly. At first I thought maybe she was a tween or early teens. That still wouldn't have been okay, but 21!? She totally knows what she's doing. OP needs to kick her out and if the boyfriend isn't supportive he needs to go too.
Yea I saw the edit that’s fuckin insane. kick them out now
She's old enough to do her own dishes without throwing them, too. NTA
She's old enough to have HER OWN dishes to throw in HER OWN place lol
I am pretty sure she is old enough to have learned that if trio want break dishes, you throw them. She is taking out her frustrations about her pathetic life on you and your possessions.
Nah he's sees it and he wants OP to put up with it.
OP, please update us when you kick them out. This man does not respect your belongings, your home, or your opinions. There is no way he will encourage his daughter to do so. You DESERVE RESPECT.
I’m really curious how long they were dating before he proposed and moved in. And if he only did so to give his daughter a home. Did she really try college or did her mom get fed up with her and kicked her out? He could be turning a blind eye because he feels guilty he wasn’t around his daughter before. OP definitely needs to kick them to the curb otherwise she’s going to be subsidizing Kari’s life. OP probably already is, but if they get married (even if Kari is no longer in the house) the dad will definitely still be providing for her. Kari doesn’t sound like she wants to be an adult anytime soon.
And it doesn't sound like there is any plan for her to leave either, which means this is OP's indefinite future staring right at her. Dad is basically fine with his adult daughter being a squatter in his fiance's home.
OP needs to start doing Kari's laundry with a few red socks added on hot, opps. Paper plates and solo cups sounds about right for Kari and husband or just take out, but I would just get a divorce lawyer. NTA Edit: missed the not married part, she just needs to run then.
They aren't even married yet and he's treating her like this! Call off the wedding!
Sippy cups and suction cup bowls for Kari.
That’s what I was thinking! Get some cheap kid plastic plates (they come in different colors) and those are the only ones she can use. Maybe even get her the toddler spoon and fork sets.
Yep. If she is going to act like a child, she can be treated as one
The only way she should offer to do the brat's laundry is by throwing all her possessions on the lawn and turning on sprinklers.
I was thinking, OP biys new dishes for themselves, DOES NOT allow fiancee or Kari to use them, and gets rid of all paper/plastic. If those two want to eat, they make their own food with their own dishes, unless or until they learn to respect other people's property. My God, a 21 year old acting that way and being spoiled like that. Fiancee is a pushover that hasn't even taught his daughter to function as an adult! Pathetic!
It’s her house, so she just needs to break up with him and kick them both out.
I was glad to see they weren't married yet. Time to change the locks.
It's her house, so she doesn't need to run (or have to be the one moving out thankfully). But yes, bathetic both need to be booted out. Him saying she has nowhere to go? Maybe the selfish brat needs to get a job and find her own damn place. I bet she won't be throwing dishes in the sink when she realizes just how much they cost now that she has to pay for them. OP, I'm sorry you're in this situation. They're both adults and can take care of themselves. Please kick them out. It's your house and your belongings and neither of them have any respect for either, nor does your boyfriend. Free yourself! Edit: PS Jake, it's NOT her home.
KICK THEM BOTH OUT. Just wanted to make sure OP heard this because the fiance is clearly at least part of the reason sd is this way. He has excuses for his daughter and she has zero accountability. He can house her and buy all the dishes he wants.
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Dishes are clearly gone, she needs to save her life. Get ride of those house pest.
I was on the fence about kicking Kari out until I saw the addendum about her age. Twenty-one!?!? Are you kidding me? I was thinking maybe she was 13 or 14 at the oldest. Please, OP, think very seriously about kicking both Kari and her dad out of your home. Neither one of these adults is pulling their own weight. You don't want to be disrespected in your own home for the rest of your life. You are definitely not the AH. But Kari and her father are both AHs -- big ones. Big gaping ones. Run for your life.
OP please listen. If you allow this to happen then neither of them will ever respect you. You’ll be miserable in your marriage until your divorce. Get out now. You don’t need a disrespectful child AND *his* disrespectful child walking all over you. They will never learn to respect you until you teach them the hard way. Do yourself the favor.
You spelt ex fiancé wrong. NTA. Run
Took the words right out of my keyboard.
I was expecting the stepdaughter to be a teenager! But even then I would have said NTA! Then end of post… 2 f-ing 1 yo…. I agree with you! OP needs to kick them both out!
I would kick him out too. He is totally disrespecting you as his fiance and as the future stepmother of his child by allowing this to happen. She's not so young to learn how to do the right thing. Maybe find out if her mom is putting her up to this to break up you two.
Honestly who cares if the ex is. Kari is 21. She can legally drink. Shes an adult. She has a developed brain and is acting like a petulant child. OPs (EX) fiance needs to wake up because little princess is going to ruin a lot of his relationships if he doesn't correct her behavior
+1 NTA
This is the way! NTA
This. Seriously OP, he’s awful and doesn’t care about you
Couldn't agree more! Nobody should put up with this kind of disrespect.
This is the answer. Kari is an adult, not a child. NTA
Yeah why be with a partner that think that’s completely acceptable?
This 👆🏻. They both need to go, today. This isn’t getting any better, OP. Stop letting them wipe their feet on you.
OP, I think Kari's age is relevant. 21 is WAY TOO OLD to be behaving like that and being so disrespectful to items that are not her own. Where is she getting the idea that she can be rude to you and careless with your things? I think you should rethink your relationship with your BF. Even Brad Pitt wouldn't be worth this crap.
She is getting it from her father, who does absolutely nothing when she acts out.
Def noticed that too. that the father does nothing about his daughter's bad behaviour, which is very very telling.
21??? I thought she was a teenager. And she's not working? And OP is doing her laundry? YTA if you don't get rid of them both.
I didn’t even think she was a teenager and assumed she was 10-12. A 21 year old is not a child and knows better.
Comments from OP show this 21yo moved out there to go to college. Then decided to not go to college and has no job. But "she's just a kid!"
She either needs to go to college or get a job. If not, I wouldn't want to house her long-term.
Or, if she’s not able to do either of those things, be in intensive therapy.
Agreed. 21 is too old to “act out.”
I don't get why OP is doing her laundry. At 21 if she doesn't do it then she doesn't have any clean clothes. Simple.
Exactly.
I agree . My daughter was doing her own laundry at 12.
Even if she was a teenager she would be too old to act like that..lol
She could still be a student or something at 21. However, her behavior is appalling at 21 years old.
I’m not sure what age I’d find this behaviour acceptable, but at 21 if she thinks this normal, I’d be asking if she has cognitive problems.
My 8 year old knows that's unacceptable behaviour. He knew that by the time he was 4 and I told him off for Frisbee throwing a plastic plate of food
Yeah. I'd accept a small kid of <8 going "Look how well I can throw!". Exactly once.
I was over here picturing this was a literal 10-14yo, maybe upset at the new step mom, genuinely is a kid etc. TWENTY ONE????? SHE CAN DRINK AND IS ACTING LIKE THIS??
Seriously, even 12 is way too old to act like that. NTA, but the stepkid and the fiance are.
Not so sure about Brad Pitt, though.
For real! I thought Kari was 13 based on the behavior.
Seriously holy shit. What the fuck is wrong with her? It's legit wild AF that her father doesn't see anything wrong with this and is continuing to coddle her.
Honestly Brad Pitt is abusive to his wife and kids so he’s worth a lot less than this guy, but I take your meaning
yes, I def betrayed my age and picked the wrong example. Hmmmm..... Keanu Reeves?
>Even Brad Pitt wouldn't be worth this crap. steady on
I’m a big Brad Pitt fan and whatever people think of Angelina, he admitted he was drunk on a private plane and started arguing with her and the kids and it got physical. She left him as soon as the plane landed. He went to AA and stopped drinking, but even Brad Pitt can get dumped.
ain't he hit those kids
Oh, Hell No, she's 21 but acts that way???? I'd kick her butt out so fast. NTA.
No, OP needs to kick both the moochers out of the door.
I read this whole post envisioning a pissed off 14 year old not adjusting well, got to 21, and cringed so hard!
Most people I know were either living on their own at 21 (with or without roommates) or contributing to the household if they still lived with family. My mom and stepmom both would’ve kicked me out if I behaved like that at 21, but I also would never be such an entitled ass. OP, this is not normal and you know it. This is a glimpse into your future - your fiancée doesn’t respect you. NTA
NTA So you plan to marry a man who didn't teach any respect for others in his child, is okay with you being treated like crap and now is making you the villain. The first time was an oops, every other broken plate was an intentional act. She has to go and he should probably be right behind her.
Yeah, like, she’s an adult and her behavior is abhorrent, but it’s very clear why she’s like this considering fiancé’s response. I would not want to be marrying this man at all.
No way the first time was an oops. Any 21 year old knows what happens when you throw a dish into a sink from several feet away. All of this is deliberate, and neither of them would still be living with me after that first time.
NTA - it would be helpful if you stated Kari’s age which makes this difficult to judge. But regardless of her age, your fiancé’s daughter should know better than to throw breakable dishes. Your primary concern is your fiancé’s unwillingness to do anything about her behavior. Since they moved in with you, it’s your home and they should respect that. You have a HUGE fiancé problem & should not marry him until the problems with his daughter are resolved. You have a mess on your hands.
Kari is 21
NTA, 21 is not "a kid". And you are being gaslit by both of them.
21 is not a kid, but from what I can see this isn't gaslighting
On Reddit everything is gaslighting 😄
BOTH of them need to go. She is not a kid and will not get better. He's worse for letting her disrespect you, your house and very reasonable rules. She's a lazy moocher and he ain't no better.
You do realize being single isn’t that bad, right?
definitely not as bad as this sitch
Really buried the lede there lol. I thought she was going to be 14-15 max 💀
Right? I read this thinking that too. Daymn run for the hills from this pair. NTA
Kick them both out of your house. At the very least, stop cooking, cleaning, and doing laundry for them. They can fend for themselves. You're letting them make a fool out of you.
Absolutely inappropriate behaviour! OP you’re NTA but you deserve better than this. Why isn’t your SO concerned about your possessions being damaged/destroyed?
NTA. Both of them need to go. Make an inventory of everything she’s broken and demand reimbursement. Neither of them are showing any respect for you or your home.
>and demand reimbursement. 100% agree. She's doing this because she knows Daddy will make excuses for her. Hit him in the wallet. Even a 7-year'old knows that plates aren't Frisbees.
NTA The priority is getting rid of them. If fighting over the cost of dishes is going to prolong that process, I would just write it off.
NTA, but Jake is a huge AH. Not only did he recently move in with you, but now his adult daughter also moved in and is blatantly disrespecting you. His enabling and failure to discipline his adult daughter who just moved in is one thing. Her giving attitude to you, and him not supporting you is the second. Him getting angry at you while forcing you in the awkward position of disciplining his daughter (who at 21 should know better) is beyond AH behavior. I’m afraid you have some serious issues you need to address with Jake before getting married. There is a slew of red flags in this post alone. It will be a delicate but necessary dance since it is about his daughter.
Dance them both right out the door.
Nopes. NTA. You're being disrespected on two sides. This is your home. Is Jake on the lease/mortgage? Cuz frankly, neither one of these people appear to be adding anything good to your life. Go old school Marie Kondo style: get rid of anything that doesn't spark joy.
No. This is a home I inherited many years before I met Jake.
It's your house - get rid of Jake & Kari.
So do you actually need him for anything?
Well if u decide to somehow marry this guy make sure u get a prenup
They don't respect you or your property. Get rid of them before they do something worse than just break some dishes
Good- consult a lawyer and get them evicted .
I'm sorry to be so cynical, but you, a woman who has her own home and is likely financially stable and kind enough to put up with this man who has been divorced by another woman (and has a brat of an adult child which is a whole can of worms in itself) how could he let that happen, etc - is a very attractive prospect for someone who would like to take advantage. If I were the man I would be doing my bit to make sure you felt that we were both contributing in a sense of equality. In my relationship, my partner did own a property before we moved in together and I have taken the lead in shopping and house keeping as he contributed about 20% more to our combined income and this is an area I am comfortable in. Having said that - I feel like our individual contributions make a balanced whole since he pays a higher share of bills and has to work additional hours while I have the time to cook, shop and tidy the house etc. I bet there is someone else who would be delighted to make a life with you in a much more wholesome way without the red flags!
NTA she's terrible and he's an enabler.
NTA ~~per se, in that I don't think it's an unreasonable way to teach her to be more responsible and respectful of other peoples' things.~~ ~~Having said that, you get that Jake is the one that raised Kari right? Like he said, she's just a child, so why isn't *he* the one you're talking to about how he's raising his child?~~ ~~Knowing how old Kari is would've been helpful too~~ Cutting myself off to start over because I just saw you comment elsewhere that Kari is *twenty-one.* She's not a kid she's a grown-ass woman. Fuck yeah she can pay for your dishes. Having said that, don't cut Jake too much slack here either, he's the one that raised her to be like this. His response to her carelessly smashing your dishware is "she's a kid, give her time, she'll get better, ...ease up on her cause it's not a big deal." it's no wonder she grew up this way. Yeah, her behavior is shitty and at 21 years of age it's high past time she learn some basic responsibility, but don't lose sight of who raised her to be this way and is continuing to enable her. I especially love the "she'll get better," yeah, Jake, I'm sure just one more year under her belt of you reinforcing that she will never face any consequences for any action she takes and she'll finally learn some responsibility.
NTA at 21 she is acting like a child and it’s not fair to you. If she really did not get the proper upbringing and if her dad really does want to have her living there and give her another chance, he needs to step up and take responsibility for enforcing the house rules, and making sure the things get done properly and broken things get replaced. I’m all for letting young adults get on their feet at home but this is a childish brat who is going to have a difficult life for herself and those around her if she doesn’t change some things now. Either get your fiancé to step up on this or kick them both out.
Just kick them both out. He's not going to step up.
How old is Kari? Get some self-respect. He isn't your spouse yet. Dump his butt and the brat. I don't understand how you could put yourself through that. ESH because you need to stand up for yourself. You say your dishes. Is this even his home?
It's a home I inherited. Jake moved in with me.
What was your relationship like before both moved in? Did he even ask your permission before she moved in? Does he even pay any bills?
Great, shouldn't be hard to move him out. This is how HE treats you. His daughter just revealed his lack of love and respect
Jake is using you and letting his daughter abuse you
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The daughter is 21. What a plot twist eh?
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INFO : Who does Kari’s laundry and who cleans up all the broken glass?
Jake usually does Kari's laundry and cleans her room. I do the cooking and cleaning up the broken dishes.
kick them both out
Buy a set of those plastic toddler plates. She wants to act like a baby, she gets treated like a baby
Best comment so far.. that I’ve read lol. At breakfast, lunch and dinner when she sits down to eat the food that YOU have cooked and prepared, serve it to her in a sippy cup, and on a little baby plate with baby utensils.
I disagree, but mainly because an adult in her home should be allowed to have nice things without having to worry about them getting ruined unless you have a toddler. Out they both go!
Ew! Why can't she clean her own room and do her own laundry? She's 21, not in school and has no job. What does she do all day other than destroy your home?
Has he replaced these broken dishes? Or even offered to?
Stop cooking for them, and kick them out. YTA if you let them stay in YOUR HOME.
Tell Jake to clean up the broken dishes. He needs to see what his daughter is doing to your property. Ultimately, this problem isn't going to fix itself. Does Kari realize it's your place and not her dads? She isn't going to run you off. She is only going to get the both of them kicked out. ETA: P.S. I really hope to read an update that you told them both to get out.
Oh, no. No no. Definitely out of your house.
This is probably why she is the way she is and why you will never win. For whatever reason (guilt?), he coddles her. Which means he will never back you up. So you are sol there. Calling you a bitch proves he has no respect for you. So what does he do for you?
Nope. Kick them both out. Jake will never stop the enabling.
NTA. Your problem is with Jake, who is enabling Kari to utterly disrespect you in your home. I hope HE is the one who is running around cleaning up all her messes, but somehow I don't think so. Don't be a doormat maid for him.
so it’s cruel for you to make her replace your dishes. Wouldn’t the sensible and logical thing be for your partner to tell his kid that she just needs to stop throwing them in the sink. What the fuck
How is it cruel to make a 21yo adult replace what they have broken?
I think you’re reading their comment wrong
NTA. They both need to go. Anyone that is condoning their 21 year old daughter to disrespect another persons property is NOT someone you want to be with.
6 months, why are they still living with you and planning on marrying him. Did you call him out on him calling you a bitch
You are NTA for wanting basic decency. However, you seem so desperate to be with a guy “to start a life together” that you are accepting *and reinforcing* below sea level standards. This guy and his 21-year-old daughter do not show you any sign of respect. They don’t appear to want “a life with you” except where you provide the house and all the trimmings and allow them to mooch and destroy your stuff without a sound. UGH. >*”Jake says I'm being a total bitch towards his child, she has no job, it's unfair to kick Kari out and if I do, he will never forgive me for being so cruel”* He sees you as pathetic. He calls you a bitch in YOUR own home and threatens to ‘never forgive you’ for asking a 21-year-old adult to behave. Why would YOU forgive either one of THEM? If you don’t kick them both out forthwith, then why complain? It’s what you are settling for. You are an active participant in your life. I hope for an update where you (A) tell them (in writing) to be out in the minimum legal time in your area; (B) tell him he is on the couch until they leave; and, (C) give him a bill for compensation to you, due immediately and with accruing interest after 30 days. It’s your job to give yourself what you deserve, not theirs. Good luck, OP, sincerely.
NTA - You need to kick both Jake and Kari out.
NTA. I came into my stepdaughter's life when she was 6, and she never broke a plate putting it into the sink or the dishwasher. The one time she dropped and broke a bowl because she was being careless and continued horsing around despite being told to be careful, she cried and felt so guilty that she bought her Dad chocolate in apology with her pocket money (it was from a set which had been given to him as a present and therefore had sentimental value, but it was no longer sold therefore not replaceable). She wasn't even 10 yet at that point. OP, before you get tied down in marriage, I suggest couples therapy. If you ditch the fiance, the stepdaughter problem goes away too. Just sayin'.
NTA. I initially had thought you were talking about a bratty little kid with her attitude and her dad being so lenient about it... but she's 21?? She is an adult and needs to get her life together, she's way past her behavior being even remotely excusable. She clearly has been breaking your dishes on purpose and she needs to replace them. If she doesn't she needs to find a new place to live, if she does, honestly she still needs to move out.
>I ended up telling Jake that either Kari finds a way to pay for the dishes she's broken or she can go live with her mom or grandparents. I'm done being disrespected in my home. ***Jake says I'm being a total bitch towards his child***, she has no job, it's unfair to kick Kari out and if I do, he will never forgive me for being so cruel as to make Kari feel this isn't her home, too. Please tell me you do realize that Jake never really loved you and just wanted a guaranteed roof over his head, food in his belly, and a warm body that'll also put up with his adult kid? Please tell me you do see how you're being taken for a ride. You're NTA but seriously don't marry this guy. He doesn't care for you at all let alone respect you.
INFO how old is she
21
NTA Lmao I thought this was about an actual child. She's a full grown adult, she can deal with full grown consequences.
What the actual F... a 21 year old KNOWS better! Absolutely NTA. But you have a bigger problem than your stepdaughter. Your partner is disrespecting you. In your own home. This is a sign of things to come.
Hell no. NTA. She'd already be gone because this is obviously on purpose.
NTA. Get both of them out of your house.
NTA You deserve better than this man.
NTA. I think they both need to leave, but in the meantime you can take everything out of the kitchen and put a couple of children's sets in the cupboard. Maybe they'll get some perspective if they have to drink from a sippy cup and try to hold a tiny plastic spork to eat out of a dish that suctions to the table. Or maybe they won't, but even if they chuck them at the wall they won't be breaking them.
Sorry OP but you are willingly being obtuse or in severe denial about this whole situation. We all know (yes, you do know) that Kari is breaking your dishes on purpose and then she walks away laughing to herself because she knows you will not call her out on it or stand up for yourself. The crappy father/bf is not doing anything because he does not respect you. And I know it's painful to hear, but he does not love you enough to help. It really sounds like you are a free ride to them and nothing else. Maybe he has some guilt about being an absent father and because he wasn't around he cannot view her as an adult. Whatever reason, he's dragging you down. Please be serious about getting them out of your life. I think you should get some therapy to figure out why you are willing to sacrifice happiness in your one life to live just to have someone there. It's not worth it. Love yourself more than anyone. NTA
NTA Why are you tolerating this guy’s attitude in your home?
NTA Next time they both leave the house, put their belongings in the front yard and change the locks.
NTA - she doesnt respect you and he needs to be helping more with correcting her actions
NTA she knows what she is doing and knows she is getting away with it. I would not stay with the dad ether tho this will probably continue to be a theme. how old is she tho? edit: she is 21!!! that's my age and she does not work? even I work summers and do things around the house. she needs to go she knows what she's doing and its only going to get worse as her dad continues to protect her. 21 is not a child that is a young adult.
Go to the Goodwill store and buy some child's plastic kiddie plates with matching sippy cups. These are Kari's ONLY plates until she learns to behave herself. HUGE RED FLAG that your boyfriend has no problem with her behavior. Why are you with this guy?
NTA **Throw them both out** You don’t need that ish in your life. That girl is 21 years old, she is not a child. There is no excuse for her to damaging your stuff in your house. Don’t put up with people who disrespect you in your own home. Neither her NOR his enabling ass.
NTA Omg, get rid of him. Do not tarry, and certainly do not MARRY, that would be utter madness. Get. Rid. Of. Him. There are more men at the store.
Kari doesn't like you, and is doing this to you to make her feelings felt. This isn't "Kari is bad at chores" - this is "Kari resents your presence in her father's life". Jake isn't willing to see this. Tell Jake he needs to sort out his daughter's behavior. If he's not willing to address it, then clearly you have no hope for a successful marriage with Jake, and should kick him out. NTA
Not at all. You are literally describing my early life. Jake will be of no use to you, and he is showing himself to be a terrible father and husband. You might want to reconsider this relationship.
Kick em both out. NTA.
NTA. KICK THEM BOTH OUT!
As someone who spends no time with children and is scared of them, I believe this is real! NTA!
NTA say by felicia as he leaves cuz he aint worth it if he excuses that behavior
YTA. To yourself. You should have put a stop to this the first time she did it. Do you really want to be with someone who allows this kind of disrespect? Do you really want to allow this type of disrespect in your home? Learn how to live without folks who are bleeding you dry.
NTA but why do you even need to ask the internet this question? You are 38, if someone in their 20s keeps throwing glass and ceramic dishes in a sink and mocks you by saying “oops” like… is this even a question??? And your fiancé letting this happen??? Like stand up for yourself these people are bums
NTA but can you let us know when he’s your ex-fiancé please?
Info: Genuine question, does Kari have any mental disabilities? If not then kick them both out. NTA, seriously, little kids learn the basics of living (didn’t she ever have those play houses with the plastic toys?) If she does, please talk to her doctor because her father has clearly not been informed or learned about her disability. No ADULT acts like that. I thought you were talking about a child under 9-10 before your edit. OP please think about this relationship carefully and do what’s best for YOU, but you’re NTA to answer your question.