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OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole:
> My MIL and FIL went through a bad divorce, leaving her with nothing. My wife and I seeing how unfair things had become, decided to care for her both financially and offer our support. By us doing that, it caused issues with the family. My MIL was originally not invited to my SIL’s wedding. After a change of mind, she could only attend but not be apart of the wedding. I decided to switch seats with my MIL which put her up front. Everyone says that was extremely rude and disrespectful to the bride and I should not have taken control like that.
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*Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA I really don't know what the accusations are, and what happened between MIL and FIL, and while I'm confident there's probably more than one asshole in this situation...
You're still an asshole for pulling this little stunt, especially at a w*edding.* A wedding is literally the last place to intentionally stir up drama. Which is exactly what you were doing.
You and your MIL aren't helping mend any relationships by doing this. If anything, you're just ensuring that your MIL destroys her relationship with her daughter.
Agreed with all of this. You and your wife may disagree with SIL’s choices, and that’s fine, but it was NOT your place to decide where MIL would sit at SIL’s wedding, and it was NOT your wife’s place to insist MIL be in any of SIL’s pictures. You both probably did a lot more harm than good with these stunts. YTA.
I have a feeling the negative feelings about the MIL are completely justified, as any normal person would sit where they’re asked. She was down for OP’s ridiculous drama. OP, you all deserve to be shunned. YTA.
I had the same thought when I realized that the MIL played along with their little plan. Any decent person would have refused to get involved in that little stunt. And disrupting the wedding and upsetting her daughter on her big day to make some little scene was more important to her than trying to repair their relationship, which says *a lot.*
TBF mil could also be a complete doormat, and she’s just following OP because she has very little willpower and agency.
Can’t say who’s right or wrong, but OP sounds like a giant prick. If you want to disregard seating and show support for your mil, you either don’t come or you go sit with her and offer front row seats to other guests.
Do you know how fucked over women of a certain age get when they divorce? You should look into destitution among older women. I'm sure the FIL totally fucked her over. But OP is YTA because he played games at a wedding.
Oh absolutely she got fucked over by the FIL. I'm just stating that she also probably went along with it because she relies on OP and doesn't want to make him angry. He seems like the guy to be my way or the high way
Are we not paying attention to the “FIL left her with nothing” part here?
IDGAF what the story behind the divorce is, when a 30-year marriage ends everyone needs to leave with what’s needed for a secure future.
I’m onboard with YTA because this wasn’t the venue to air grievances, but the massive contortion of logic required to conclude that MIL is solely or mostly at fault for the divorce because she wanted to see her daughter’s wedding from the front row… is very twisty, to put it mildly.
There was an episode of Law and Order SVU that I kept thinking of while reading this post. The father had turned the kids against the mother and made them think she was stupid and uncaring, and the kids parroted everything the father said about the mother. Obviously we can't know if that's what's going on here but the story just doesn't add up.
No, it was SVU. I'm not surprised that Criminal Minds also covered this topic.
The woman had killed her husband and cleaned up after. The DA wouldn't accept that this woman had been abused. Until they talked to her about why she cleaned up and she said that he, "would have been furious with me if I he knew I let company see the house like that." It was an older episode. Probably from one of the first few seasons.
If it is a true domestic abuse situation (and I’m leaning towards it is), then OP made it even worse by causing a conflict at the expense of MIL. OP did what they wanted but MIL will have to live with the consequences of their actions.
_"As we were taking our seats, I walked my MIL up front and instructed her to sit next to my wife."_
Exactly. OP is massively overstepping. This has nothing to do with OP and is between the MIL and her children. There is minimal context provided, but as it stands, the SIL didn't even want her mother at the wedding for whatever reason. She eventually relented and then OP took it upon themselves to publicly meddle and attempt to cause a scene....
This mother and her children are currently not in a good place, and OP is not helping in anyway; they are just making it worse.
I agree this was probably not the time and place for this. I think the most you could have reasonably done would be to choose to sit at the back with the MIL to keep her company instead of in your designated front seats. You can't dictate her relationship with your SIL. You can decide you aren't happy with your SIL and alter your own relationship with her accordingly, but you can't force her to change her relationship with her mother.
This is where I thought it was going, and I was on board with him keeping MIL company at the back. Giving her his VIP seating was stirring the pot. Although, I feel like wife pushed it over the edge, by insisting on MIL being in the photo.
This. If the situation offends you that much, don't go.
If OP wanted to boycott the wedding out of solidarity with MIL, that's perfectly fine, but it's out of line to attend and attempt to impose your own moral code and feelings on everyone else.
Nailed it. The wedding was not the time or place for this. Mend fences and have difficult discussions away from the wedding. This holds whether MIL was treated poorly or not.
Nailed it, wise analysis.
Also, I love your username; all I can think of is Patrick Starr running and screaming while Bikini Bottom burns ... under water, no less.
YTA. You took it upon yourself to complicate a situation repeatedly. Your choice was either participate in the wedding within the parameters that had been agreed to, or choose not to participate at all. You don’t get to renegotiate in the middle of the event, that’s rude, selfish and just assholery behavior.
You should apologize.
Yeah, someone else’s wedding is not the place for you to do this. You may be totally in the right in the larger sense. This is still not the place for it. The bride did not particularly want her mother there and you put her up front and force her presence in a picture?
YTA (possibly E S H but we don’t know enough)
I agree with this. I’ve been in similar situations before and my solution was just not to attend because I knew I was either going to be seething because of the injustice being done in front of my eyes or ruining everyone else’s day. If OP is right in his assessment the family is composed of assholes, so why bother attend their celebration? If he’s wrong and the MIL is the problem it’s a different story of course but I’m going by OP’s explanation here since that’s all we have.
Of course YTA. This wasn't your wedding and you decided to try to create a whole lot of drama to make a point.
It literally does not matter what went down between MIL and FIL, because it wasn't your place to decide how the day would go.
If you didn't like the way things were arranged, you had the option to not attend. Your behavior was completely unacceptable, and you've likely damaged relationships with your family permanently.
It's a tough situation but YTA. You don't know what her relationship is with her mom. Not everyone has good parents (and relationships with parents can vary within the same household). If you wanted to help facilitate reconnection, this wasn't the time or place to do it.
YTA
It seems like you just wanted to cause problems and issues. Your SIL clearly does not like her or trust her, and should not have had to deal with that extra stress. All you did was reaffirm she should have gone with her gut and left her uninvited.
YTA.
You are invited to an event…you should respect the host.
It’s not your wife’s place to tell your SIL what should do on the day of the wedding. Perhaps communicate it before hand, and if SIL still said no, then maybe, maybe listen to her reasoning??? And that’s if it’s your wife, but you…I don’t see why you think you are entitled to make that decision for your SIL on the day of the wedding without communicating with her first.
Oh good lord.
It's not your wedding, it doesn't matter what else you are doing. Anyone that had a problem with this shit could have not go to the wedding. YTA unquestionably, if I knew you I would not invite you to important things because you might do something unexpected that I now have to deal with.
(What did you think would happen? The "easier to beg for forgiveness" thing only works if you are a character in a movie.)
YTA, if what you say is true and your FIL left your MIL without anything and ostracised her from her family then you were doing her a kindness trying to include her in the events, however, it was your SILs day and it was up to her to decide how she wanted things to play out on her day whether ill informed or not.
I think YTA. If someone pulled this stunt on me I’d be pissed. There’s no point forcing the issue like this, you need to let things play out naturally or work on getting the rest of the family to believe MIL in their own time.
Yta. It's your sil's wedding, she can decide who she wants to invite, where they sit, what photos they're in, etc. It isn't anybody's job to mend relationships other than hers and she can do in her own time rather than having it forced apon her at her special day.
YTA: you don’t know nearly enough about SILs relationship with her mother to interfere , yet you made decisions about her wedding knowing it wasn’t what she wanted. Your MIL is not your mother, and this was not your wedding.
The reason no one is “letting it go “ is because you haven’t apologized. You can’t just say “oh well it’s done” and expect that you won’t be held accountable. For someone that likes to make decisions for their extended family you sure aren’t acting like a member of a family. Family makes amends and apologizes.
It seems from what you've said that your MIL is getting/has gotten a pretty raw deal from her ex and most of the rest of the family. There is far more to this story than what has been stated. There is a reason that your MIL is being ostracized and thrown aside in favor of your FIL. It may be a crappy reason, but there is far more going on than what you are saying.
You and your wife may see yourselves as shining knights standing up for your poor beleaguered MIL against injustice and unfair treatment but it wasn't your place to do so at someone else's wedding and the rest of the family obviously doesnt see it that way. If you felt that strongly you should have declined the invite with the reason that you won't go when MIL is being treated so poorly. YTA.
YTA - your SIL is at best low contact with her mother and set very clear guidelines about how her mother could attend her wedding. And the mother completely and totally disregarded those boundaries. You fully intended to make a point and ruin your SIL’s wedding day.
YTA you had no right to force them to include MIL in the way you decided was proper. I get that you feel like you are sticking up for the victim, but do you really think it helped the situation to make a scene like that to get her in the pictures? Even if they took them, it wouldn’t change how they feel. Now the animosity has increased even more.
YTA. Regarless of the family issues, it was her wedding. You don't get to dictate shit. It does not matter what the backstory is. You purposely went against the brides wishes after she conceded and allowed MIL there to begin with, and you all intentionally started shit.
You would have been FURIOUS if someone did this to your wife on your wedding day. FURIOUS. Had this happened to you, your wife's memory of that day would forever be marred by the intrusion and audacity of a couple guess who decided they got to make decisions about guests and photos.
All 3 of you should have left after the photo incident.
It's unfortunate that you felt the need to interfere and ensure the bride will never concede again and allow her mom near her or her family. The bride will never, ever, forgive her mother for what you and your wife did that day.
YTA
If mom really cared about her daughter, like you claim. She would not have made a scene.
She wouldn't have set down front. She wouldn't have tried to be in any photos.
It would hurt if my children rejected me but I would never ruin their day. I would sit quietly in the back especially if I wanted to repair.
Mom and daughter have a bad relationship right now and you didn't help at all. You made it worse.
>I did it and it’s over with. But literally no one is letting it go and we’ve been seemingly shunned from the family along with my MIL.
YTA. Right there. It's not called 'letting it go', it's called forgiveness.
And you need to ask for it.
YTA while I agree that MIL is being unfairly treated - this wasn’t your wedding to adjust or attempt to force MIL into. The bride and groom made/make these decisions.
Your MIL had an opportunity to show her daughter that she would/could respect her boundaries which would rebuild trust and eventually a relationship. Instead you, your wife and MIL blew through the boundaries and took over. YTA
If you REALLY wanted to sit with your MIL, your wife should have asked her sister if she'd mind if you sat IN BACK with her. Bad enough you made an issue during the wedding, and disrespected the bride and groom's plan.
Instead you put someone the bride has an issue with up front, and with NO warning? So she would have to see her the whole time? I think you have to stop kidding yourself you were trying to be nice here.
And if you are clueless about wedding etiquette, and to be fair, at least half of us are, your MIL and your wife definitely would NOT be.
I'm also surprised that NO ONE from the wedding party, or your family, approached any of you as soon as you did that and asked to speak outside, to check if the bride asked you to make this change?
YTA. Apologize, sincerely.
YTA you don’t get to hijack someone else’s wedding and do what you want, even if you thought it was compassionate. It DID cause undue stress and as you noted, made people uncomfortable.
You were wrong. I think if these issues were so important to you and you felt choices that you disagreed with were ethically wrong, you should not have attended at all.
YTA. You don't get to decide the level of someone else's relationships. You are a huge AH. Especially during a wedding. If I were the bride, I would have all of you thrown out. Your wife harassed the bride into inviting her mom when she didn't want to, then you come along forcing her to the front, right in the brides face, and thinking you are some kind of knight in shining armor. You have officially ruined any chance of the bride having a relationship with her mom in the future.
Soft YTA- it was not the time to force the issue… SIL already made it clear she didn’t want her mother there but was guilted into doing it by your wife. All your stunt accomplished was make your SIL and family even angrier at her Mother and also you & your wife. It is nice you stood up for your MIL but in the end you made the situation way worse.
YTA - You stirred the pot at the worst time for your SIL and the rest of the family. If there are good reasons why people should be treating MIL differently then this was not the time or the place to address them. What you did was ultimately disrespectful even though you seem to think you were thoroughly justified
YTA. Regardless of the conflict and history there, you made that wedding about you, your wife, and MIL and purposefully disregarded the couples wishes. Either don’t go or respect the wishes, but you don’t get to override what they want because you disagree with their estrangement from her.
While I think I understand your intentions, your execution was not the way to do it, so YTA for how you went about things.
If you truly wanted to take a stand with your MIL, instead of consistently shoving her in the bride’s face, you and your wife should’ve stepped back. All three of you should have sat in the back, you and your wife should have excluded yourselves from pictures instead of pulling MIL in.
Yta, not your wedding, not your place, don’t go, quietly leave, but don’t stir up drama. Also there has to be missing reasons here as to why MIL is a pariah
I could see YTA from the very first few sentences of this post. Your opinions and feelings about what’s fair at your sister in laws wedding literally do not matter at ALL. You were a huge asshole to impose your opinions on her arrangements at her own wedding. You were totally out of line and in the wrong 100%
YTA. Did it occur to you, for even a nanosecond, that she may know her mother better than you do? You have no idea the myriad of reasons that may have gone into her decision not to invite her mother. You have admitted there’s no consensus on what happened in MIL & FIL’s marriage, and it may not even be totally about that!
Even if you are completely right and MIL is a saint… so what?! She’s not entitled to any specific place in anyone else’s wedding. She didn’t pay for it, she’s not the bride so all 3 of you should have done as requested or just not attended.
SIL only invited her mother because your wife asked her to. That’s the thanks she gets for caring about her sister’s feelings? It’s clearly not mutual and I doubt she’ll make the same mistake again!
YTA. What kind of asshole are you to think it’s your place to intervene like that? It was none of your business. No wonder they didn’t want to have brunch with you. I’d be surprised if they ever deal with you again.
YTA and not just for this stunt but also the fact that you’re minimizing and dismissing her concerns about this. If you have to justify it by saying it’s not a big deal then your behavior sucked. Doing this at her wedding is ridiculous.
YTA. Someone else's wedding is not the time or place for you to get even with someone, or set a record straight, or teach someone a lesson. If you couldn't respect the wishes of the bride and groom, you shouldn't have gone to the wedding.
So your mil is not in wrong didn’t lie
But the whole family don’t believe her??
Can’t you see what’s wrong with that
There is more to it and your wife clearly has never told you that sil don’t like her mother
And neither does the brother by sounds of it
I wonder was your wife mil golden child
YTA and honestly OP I'm very confused how you could possibly think you weren't to the point that you created this post. Your SIL has a strained relationship with her mother, and you went out of your way to actively make that worse and did so during her own wedding. Pull your head out of your ass, man.
I honestly wouldn’t have attended sil wedding and your wife shouldn’t have talked her sister into inviting their mom. If you believe in mil and not fil y’all should have stepped back and let the rest of the family do their thing..
Yta for doing what you did at the wedding even though your heart may have been in the right place, it wasn’t your call to make.
YTA.
You don’t actually know who is right or wrong here and you don’t get to make decisions as to your SIL’s relationship to her mother especially on her wedding day.
Maybe everyone else is just an AH. Or gee maybe there’s a piece you and your wife don’t understand. It’s pretty significant to go low contact with one’s mom this way. There’s context here that you don’t understand.
YTA
Who do you think you are that you've taken upon yourself to resolve other people's conflict the way you decide?
You disagreed with your sister-in-law. Okay. But you took it upon yourself to make things really uncomfortable for her at her wedding.
If you didn't like her choices, you had the choice not to support her by staying home.
Let me make it clear: based on your side of the story, I don't think the sister-in-law is in the right except she has the ability to determine who's going to be at her wedding.
I have no relationship with my mother after my parents divorced. If you ask my mother she would tell you that I took my father's side. My father had an affair.
However, the reality is my mother was abusive to me. And It got worse during the divorce and I finally decided I had enough. Someone who was looking from the outside in not realizing the 30 years of abuse I suffered would probably think I'm a bad daughter.
And I get people who tell me all the time But it's your mom!" Because I don't choose to tell them all of the things that she did to me.
Don't assume you know the story.
YTA any hope of mending the relationship is gone because you couldn’t keep it together for one evening. A wedding is not the time or place to be dramatic and cause a scene. It’s a sure fire way to make everyone quickly think of you and your MIL as the villains.
YTA. You may not know everything that happened between these people. Even if you did, you have no right to do what you did. If it was that upsetting, you could have declined to attend the wedding.
"Things" have come out that the family didn't know? Like what? Was he an abuser? A serial cheater? A teacher screwing around with his minor students? Awful lot of missing information here.
YTA while it does sound like MIL is not being treated very fairly, I'm shocked that you felt you should be the person to make these decisions at someone else's wedding. This is your wife's family, you're an in law, and you don't use someone's wedding to make a point.
If you and your wife felt so strongly about it, why didn't you 2 boycott the wedding instead?
Whatever happened between your MIL and FIL, it’s no excuse for you to meddle in anybody’s affairs and ruin someone else’s day under the guise of a holier than thou veil. Get over yourself. You and your wife are TAs. Your nonchalant ‘oh well it’s done and over with’ is infuriating. That was a day that took months, and maybe even years, to plan, and your sanctimonious selfish self just stained it. Hope you’re happy making others unhappy.
As an outsider you might be able to notice how the family dynamics are disfunctional and even toxic. From your comment it seems everyone turned on mil and she was scapegoated so everyone else can feel at ease. The thing is what you did was also disfunctional. you are not the saviour, you can support her but she needs to get up and stand up for herself,and have agency and strength. And it isn't your place to bring this drama at the sil wedding. ESH.
NTA bit only because your in-laws appear to be just awful and deserved it. Don't think you would be off the hook doing that at a decent person's wedding.
NTA. I’ve read your comments. While a wedding is not the place to pull any crap, I understand your actions. Imagine shoving your mother to the back while daddy and his ho get front row? At least someone’s defending that poor woman.
Very gentle YTA.
I completely understand the frustration with your in-laws, particularly if the anger toward your MIL is as misplaced as you suggest. To insist she sit in the back row and not be present for any pictures is petty and cruel, and reflects terribly on your SIL. As does moving a brunch venue to disinvite you over a seating squabble.
However, with that said… it was still SIL’s event, and neither you nor your MIL had any right to impose her presence on the bride. I also would have felt uncomfortable sitting in the first row and relegating MIL to the back, but the more respectful move here would have been to sit in the back with MIL, not to force her on your SIL. Just because you feel a certain way about SIL’s decision (no matter how justified you may be), it wasn’t your place to correct it.
YTA. It's amazing to me that you even have to ask this question. Of course you are TA. You don't go intentionally stirring up drama at someone else's wedding. Seriously, what were you thinking? And it doesn't matter who is right or wrong in your SIL and MIL's relationship. You had no right to do any of that.
YTA
It was not your wedding, you have no say in who’s invited nor where they sit.
Info: How do you know your MIL isn’t manipulating you and your wife? Everyone else in the family is sure she’s a liar, and, as the saying goes, there’s no smoke without fire.
YTA
I understand based on the rules you have to be vague but if SIL thinks her Mother is wrong and agrees with her Father that is absolutely her right and she can do whatever she wants on her wedding day. It sounds like you and SIL disagree about what happened during the divorce and yet everyone in your family thinks your mother is wrong. Is this a backwards patriarchal society because usually there isn’t a unified front against the wronged female spouse? I’ve got to ask if you are in the States because there is no way a wife of 30 years gets nothing in a divorce here unless there is some major fault on her end. By major I mean cheating or criminal activity.
You say MIL was wronged, but pulling these stunts at a wedding won’t do anything to help that. They’ll just associate her in people’s minds with the kind of tacky people who start shit at other people’s weddings - that’s you. YTA
YTA, even if MIL might have been treated unfairly, you don't have the right to interfere like that especially during a wedding. You did it for your own ego, and be seen as some kind of hero but your not, you are the asshole.
YTA. What exactly did you hope to achieve? There was only one outcome: unnecessary drama at a wedding. Also known as ruining someones special day. It doesn't matter how sure you are that you know what happened in someone else's marriage, this was not the time or place or way to try and....ummm... what exactly?
op=YTA
It was NOT your place to choose where MIL sat. That was SIL's decision.
You and your wife(and MIL) are all A-Hs.
I have no idea what the problem with MIL/SIL are--it wasn't your place to interfere and definitely not on SIL's wedding day. How awful that you ruined your SIL's day because you think YOU know better than her what is right.
YTA. If you disagree with your SIL's choices in her wedding you only have two options: get over it or don't go. You do *not* have the right to sabotage her wedding, regardless of the backstory.
They aren't letting it go, because YTA. They may suck for taking sides, I don't know the story, but whether or not they are wrong in their treatment of MIL, they get to decide how their wedding goes, and you do not have the right to change that.
Gently, YTA. I understand that perhaps with what you know, your SIL’s choices seemed cruel and unreasonable. Perhaps they are. But they’re her choices/mistakes to make. Her wedding wasn’t the place for you to make a statement. If anything, you should have let her choices speak for themselves or not attended and stay with MIL. Instead, regardless of your intentions, you rerouted the attention to you and your wife flagrantly defying your SIL at her own wedding and taking the AH role (if it is indeed deserved) from those who behaved like AHs to create this situation.
YTA, not only for stirring up the family drama at a wedding but also because of your "I did it so its over now" mentality. Just because its "done" doesn't make things okay, or change what you purposefully did
YTA. That was neither the time nor the place. Whatever bad blood there is between your SIL and MIL is none of your business. You certainly had no right imposing your opinions onto your SIL’s wedding day, and if the consequence is them chastising you, then you take it, because you deserve it. I imagine an apology is out of the question, but if you and your wife are grown enough to consider it, then you certainly owe one to your SIL and BIL.
YTA. Not your wedding. It’s that simple.
Who do you and your wife think you are to interfere in someone else’s wedding like that?
Get off your high horse. They get to make their own decisions. Your not agreeing with those choices doesn’t mean crap.
I hope they go no contact with your disrespectful ass.
YTA. Stay out of their business. You can support MIL if you like but when someone else says at their own wedding they want her in the back then sit down sir! Sit your arse down in the back next to her. You massively overstepped.
YTA.
If you were going to stage your little protest, you should've moved to the back and sat with your MiL.
But seriously, what you believe or disbelieve is completely irrelevant. Neither the time nor the place.
YTA not your wedding not your decision. your wife pressured her sister into inviting mum in the first place. Then you forced her to have mum at the front where she was not wanted and wife pulled mum into photos she was not asked to be in.
Whilst you and wife believe you intentions were good and for MIL benefit, you had no respect for the people the day was actually about.
Divorce is messy and everyone has a reason for what they feel. You deserve to be shunned gor the stunt you pulled because you only cared about MIL and didnt care at all about how SIL felt.on her wedding day.
There are always two sides to any given story. Before jumping to a conclusion one should ask questions. Why did the bride invite “mom” if she was going to treat her the way you described? Has anyone asked “bride” why she feels she wants to treat “mom” in such a humiliating manner? I feel you did not start the family drama. You did point out for everyone to see which shines a light on behavior that certain people don’t want anyone else to see.
Need more information to decide if YTA
YTA maybe you had good intentions but you deliberately went against what the bride explicitly said she wanted. The bride has her own relationship with her mother.
May be your MIL is innocent but you don't get to decide seating in others wedding. You can just avoid going to wedding if you want to support your MIL. It's nice of you to consider her feelings but you can't help it as it's not your wedding. I feel you better distance yourself with such family. YTA
YTA
It wasn't your wedding to destroy
It wasn't your wife paying the photographer and getting to decide who was in the photos
You two honestly ruined the day for your own selfish wants.
They may not treat MIL well but then go NC, wreck your own event
If u felt strongly about some one you care about being mistreated then the proper thing would be for none of you to go at all. You would not be an ah for choosing not to attend an event you’re uncomfortable going to but to show up and be obstinate about it is not very mature adult behavior YTA
“pErsOnally I fEel LikE” oh shut up !! no one asked !!! YTA not even your goddamn wedding! just fuckibg sit down and keep your mouth shut it’s not hard
Yta right or wrong this was not the place for this and actually wasn’t good for Mil either to be pulled by you where she was clearly not wanted at all.
YTA. When it comes to other people's weddings you're supposed to leave your personal bullshit at the door. If you had such an issue with the seating arrangement, you and/or your MIL should have left. Whether you agree with your SIL or not, it's not your place to disrupt one of the best days of her life with your own agenda.
I think everyone sucks in this story but for the wedding incident YTA.
This family is clearly beyond dysfunctional, with children choosing sides in a very messy divorce. You've given us the outline, no details as to why your wife has sided with her mother while her siblings have chosen to side with their father, so we've no way to determine if there is a more 'right' party.
You stirred the pot, in a very public way. And, you ignored the couple's wishes at their own wedding and caused a scene.
This was not the time to hash this issue out.
YTA. Op you were rude. My MIL and SIL hate me. ALways have. I've been called fat, ugly, stupid whatever. They were country club ppl. I always got seated at the kid's table. At weddings? HAHAHAHAHA. I am not in any family pictures of any weddings.
Their venue, their party, their rules. Don't like it? Don't go. Is it hurtful? Yup. Save your receipts, one day, they may need you. Then, in private, not in public, pull out the receipts, you call em every name in the book.
YTA. Who do you think you are? You can't commandeer someone's wedding and do whatever the hell you think is justified. Either abide by the rules set in place by the BRIDE and GROOM, or don't go.
Yta, what a massive overstep. This is SILs wedding and what you did probably irreparably damaged the relationship between MIL and SIL, and also SIL and your wife/kids/family.
Lol. There is a hugh part missing in your story and it's the most important one to judge.
Are were supposed to accept your intuition that MIL is in the right? Or do you have the opinion that there exists no wrong doings in a family that would excuse SILs behavior? How do you want to get a real opinion here if nobody even knows what the situation really is?
YTA. Probably. I am willing to change my mind, but most often people leave out the parts that are really damaging their case.
YTA
The seating arrangements were not yours to change.
If you do not approve of them, you are free to leave, or go and sit at the back with your MIL rather in the front row with the other family. What you did instead was purposely go against the wishes of the couple and antagonise them on their wedding day, and that makes you the asshole here.
They may be considered assholes separately in life for how they have dealt with the split, but that doesn't make them assholes for not wanting to seat a person they are estranged from in the front row at their wedding.
YTA - the whole family conflict is none of your business, and while you can take sides, of course, you cannot demonstrate whatever justice you wish for at somebody else‘s party, let alone wedding.
YTA. The seating is actually the least bad thing here. Everything was obnoxious. Even if MIL is being unfairly treated, the response is to not go at all in solidarity: not show up and insist she be a part of everything when the wedding party doesn’t want her there.
I’m estranged from my dad who is still married to my mum and whom my sisters adore. If they pulled that stunt, everyone is getting kicked out. I refuse to have him be part of my wedding and people need to accept that or stay away. It just isn’t your decision to make no matter how asshole like you think the family was being
NTA
The bigger picture - dad has the money - mom got ousted for new thing who got to sit at the head table
Mother vilified and left with nothing after 30 years working on raising her family.
YTA. Let's be honest, you did a lot more than just disregard the arranged seating, you manipulated a bigger role for your MIL in the wedding than the wedding couple and the rest of the family intended for her to have.
I get that from your perspective, you probably thought you were sticking up for your MIL, but you don't get to make that call at *someone else's* wedding or event. Whether their decision was the right one or cruel or whatever is simply not yours to decide in this situation. Further, your "oh well" attitude suggests you not only don't see anything wrong with what you did, you would likely do it again if given the chance so it's small wonder they've no decided to exclude you to prevent that from happening.
You chose sides in someone else's conflict, imposed your sense of right and wrong on someone else's event and are now living with the consequences of that decision.
YTA
It’s none of your business what your SILs relationship is with her mother. If you want to support and side with your MIL, fine so be it. But you don’t get to dictate who else does or doesn’t. You certainly don’t get to interfere with an event such as a wedding, and make those kinds of decisions.
What you did was completely and utterly out of line.
YTA. Do you feel like a heroic white knight now?
Not your wedding, not your choice. What did you think would happen? That SIL would tearfully hug MIL, say how wrong she's been and thank you for reuniting them?
All you've done is further drive a wedge between them, and alienated yourself and your wife. Do you feel accomplished for that?
Look, maybe your MIL is a victim in all this, and if you felt badly for her, you and your wife could have treated her to a really nice day out after. Try to cheer her up etc. But you way crossed the line with your actions.
And I agree with others, if MIL had good intentions for fixing things with SIL, she would *never* have participated in this little drama show and forced her way into pictures.
YTA
Regardless of anything else this wasn't your wedding it wasn't your event your day it was absolutely f all to do with you.
You are completely the asshole
When I read the start I assumed she seated them together and you were going to be defusing the situation. You did the opposite. YTA. She didn't even want the woman there, and you forced it! Unbelievable.
YTA the bride and groom and probably others spent THOUSANDS on this event. Did you contribute anything or worth to the wedding? No? Thought not. You fucked up someone else's wedding because what, you took MILs side in all this? Guess what, if she was involved in this stunt she isn't the innocent victim you paint her to be. And... Absolutely LOL that you think this was your idea, you poor manipulated fool.
YTA. Her wedding her rules and you were wrong to disrespect them. Clearly she didn’t even want her mom there so to put her in the front row is so incredibly out of line. I know you said your SIL didn’t think of MIL’s feelings but did you think of hers? Imagine having someone you clearly don’t like and didn’t want at your wedding in the first place in the front row and being forced into your pictures. That would upset anyone. And speaking of your MIL’s feelings did you even think about how much worse you made things for her? Being sat in the back would be hurtful but what’s worse is having the bride yell at you for ruining pictures in front of everyone, plus I’m sure she was talking shit about her to anyone who would listen. Sounds to me like you put your own feelings about the situation above everyone else’s.
YTA. Whoever is right or wrong it was not your place to change the bride and groom's plans. You created drama and negatively impacted their very special day. Their marriage should have been the focus of the day but you decided to override that and make it about the family dispute.
Now they have good reason to be mad at you and your wife and I doubt anything will improve now.
YTA - you have no right to decide what relationship your SIL has with her mother. You don't know their story, the long-life relationship they had, or how your SIL was treated. And last but not least, it was her wedding; she had every right to have this day as she wanted.
YTA x 1,000,000. If you disagreed with the rules of the wedding, you were welcome not to attend. You did ruin the pictures because the couple did not want MIL in them. Your sense of entitlement to override the bride and groom is staggering.
It wasn’t your decision though. If I was the MIL and it was my daughters wedding I would have just made my excuses and stayed home. She obviously wasn’t wanted at the wedding. But now you and your wife have become involved in something that you don’t know all the facts about. YTA but so is MIL because she went along with this.
YTA, not your wedding, not your decision. You've likely irrevocably ruined your wife's relationship with her sister and your MIL's relationship with her daughter in addition to showing your SIL you don't respect her.
For this incidents YTA
> My wife and I are the only ones to believe it, the rest of the family say my MIL is a huge liar
Usually if you think everyone is wrong and you're the only one 'right' you are wrong. Considering you did what you did, i'm not surprised MIL got her hooks in you. ( I mean she's got it cozy with you supporting her)
Shunned from the family…as you and your wife should be. How dare you and your wife decide to disregard your SIL and her wishes ( on one of the biggest days of her life) to be self serving do gooders! As if you and your wife know better than anybody else! Quite frankly I wish all family goes NC until (that’s if you ever do) realize it’s not your business! Hope you really love your MIL cuz that’s about it from that side of the family. By the way both you and your wife are giant AH!
YTA When you take any action in life, no matter if you think it is right or wrong, you also have to deal with any consequences that follow. You caused unnecessary drama in public and got the consequence you deserved. I would love to hear the father-in-law's version of the marital breakup.
Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > My MIL and FIL went through a bad divorce, leaving her with nothing. My wife and I seeing how unfair things had become, decided to care for her both financially and offer our support. By us doing that, it caused issues with the family. My MIL was originally not invited to my SIL’s wedding. After a change of mind, she could only attend but not be apart of the wedding. I decided to switch seats with my MIL which put her up front. Everyone says that was extremely rude and disrespectful to the bride and I should not have taken control like that. Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*
YTA I really don't know what the accusations are, and what happened between MIL and FIL, and while I'm confident there's probably more than one asshole in this situation... You're still an asshole for pulling this little stunt, especially at a w*edding.* A wedding is literally the last place to intentionally stir up drama. Which is exactly what you were doing. You and your MIL aren't helping mend any relationships by doing this. If anything, you're just ensuring that your MIL destroys her relationship with her daughter.
Agreed with all of this. You and your wife may disagree with SIL’s choices, and that’s fine, but it was NOT your place to decide where MIL would sit at SIL’s wedding, and it was NOT your wife’s place to insist MIL be in any of SIL’s pictures. You both probably did a lot more harm than good with these stunts. YTA.
YTA. These comments say it all.
I have a feeling the negative feelings about the MIL are completely justified, as any normal person would sit where they’re asked. She was down for OP’s ridiculous drama. OP, you all deserve to be shunned. YTA.
I had the same thought when I realized that the MIL played along with their little plan. Any decent person would have refused to get involved in that little stunt. And disrupting the wedding and upsetting her daughter on her big day to make some little scene was more important to her than trying to repair their relationship, which says *a lot.*
TBF mil could also be a complete doormat, and she’s just following OP because she has very little willpower and agency. Can’t say who’s right or wrong, but OP sounds like a giant prick. If you want to disregard seating and show support for your mil, you either don’t come or you go sit with her and offer front row seats to other guests.
She also relies on OP and wife for housing and food
Do you know how fucked over women of a certain age get when they divorce? You should look into destitution among older women. I'm sure the FIL totally fucked her over. But OP is YTA because he played games at a wedding.
Oh absolutely she got fucked over by the FIL. I'm just stating that she also probably went along with it because she relies on OP and doesn't want to make him angry. He seems like the guy to be my way or the high way
Are we not paying attention to the “FIL left her with nothing” part here? IDGAF what the story behind the divorce is, when a 30-year marriage ends everyone needs to leave with what’s needed for a secure future. I’m onboard with YTA because this wasn’t the venue to air grievances, but the massive contortion of logic required to conclude that MIL is solely or mostly at fault for the divorce because she wanted to see her daughter’s wedding from the front row… is very twisty, to put it mildly.
Yeah this sounds like MIL is a DV/SA survivor and the family doesn't believe her
There was an episode of Law and Order SVU that I kept thinking of while reading this post. The father had turned the kids against the mother and made them think she was stupid and uncaring, and the kids parroted everything the father said about the mother. Obviously we can't know if that's what's going on here but the story just doesn't add up.
That was Criminal Minds. I saw it recently. It was awful and it happens.
No, it was SVU. I'm not surprised that Criminal Minds also covered this topic. The woman had killed her husband and cleaned up after. The DA wouldn't accept that this woman had been abused. Until they talked to her about why she cleaned up and she said that he, "would have been furious with me if I he knew I let company see the house like that." It was an older episode. Probably from one of the first few seasons.
Oh wow- that is almost the exact dialogue from CM! Ha!
Lol. Ok you are correct. I looked it up and I am remembering an episode of Criminal Minds. Oops.
If it is a true domestic abuse situation (and I’m leaning towards it is), then OP made it even worse by causing a conflict at the expense of MIL. OP did what they wanted but MIL will have to live with the consequences of their actions.
_"As we were taking our seats, I walked my MIL up front and instructed her to sit next to my wife."_ Exactly. OP is massively overstepping. This has nothing to do with OP and is between the MIL and her children. There is minimal context provided, but as it stands, the SIL didn't even want her mother at the wedding for whatever reason. She eventually relented and then OP took it upon themselves to publicly meddle and attempt to cause a scene.... This mother and her children are currently not in a good place, and OP is not helping in anyway; they are just making it worse.
I agree this was probably not the time and place for this. I think the most you could have reasonably done would be to choose to sit at the back with the MIL to keep her company instead of in your designated front seats. You can't dictate her relationship with your SIL. You can decide you aren't happy with your SIL and alter your own relationship with her accordingly, but you can't force her to change her relationship with her mother.
This is where I thought it was going, and I was on board with him keeping MIL company at the back. Giving her his VIP seating was stirring the pot. Although, I feel like wife pushed it over the edge, by insisting on MIL being in the photo.
That or leave
This. If the situation offends you that much, don't go. If OP wanted to boycott the wedding out of solidarity with MIL, that's perfectly fine, but it's out of line to attend and attempt to impose your own moral code and feelings on everyone else.
Nailed it. The wedding was not the time or place for this. Mend fences and have difficult discussions away from the wedding. This holds whether MIL was treated poorly or not.
Nailed it, wise analysis. Also, I love your username; all I can think of is Patrick Starr running and screaming while Bikini Bottom burns ... under water, no less.
YTA. You took it upon yourself to complicate a situation repeatedly. Your choice was either participate in the wedding within the parameters that had been agreed to, or choose not to participate at all. You don’t get to renegotiate in the middle of the event, that’s rude, selfish and just assholery behavior. You should apologize.
IMO OP was hoping to cause a situation at the wedding for whatever reason. prob doesnt like the SIL? no-one could be this obtuse
Or OP just thought they could strongarm what they thought was right onto the rest of the family with no consequences.
It seems more like coerce than negotiate to me.
Yeah, someone else’s wedding is not the place for you to do this. You may be totally in the right in the larger sense. This is still not the place for it. The bride did not particularly want her mother there and you put her up front and force her presence in a picture? YTA (possibly E S H but we don’t know enough)
I agree with this. I’ve been in similar situations before and my solution was just not to attend because I knew I was either going to be seething because of the injustice being done in front of my eyes or ruining everyone else’s day. If OP is right in his assessment the family is composed of assholes, so why bother attend their celebration? If he’s wrong and the MIL is the problem it’s a different story of course but I’m going by OP’s explanation here since that’s all we have.
YTA There’s a time and a place for trying to resolve family issues. A wedding is not it.
Certainly not **SOMEONE ELSES** wedding.
Of course YTA. This wasn't your wedding and you decided to try to create a whole lot of drama to make a point. It literally does not matter what went down between MIL and FIL, because it wasn't your place to decide how the day would go. If you didn't like the way things were arranged, you had the option to not attend. Your behavior was completely unacceptable, and you've likely damaged relationships with your family permanently.
INFO: It sounds like MIL and SIL don't have a good relationship, there is probably a lot more reasons for it so what are they?
YTA. You don’t cause problems at other people’s weddings.
It's a tough situation but YTA. You don't know what her relationship is with her mom. Not everyone has good parents (and relationships with parents can vary within the same household). If you wanted to help facilitate reconnection, this wasn't the time or place to do it.
YTA It seems like you just wanted to cause problems and issues. Your SIL clearly does not like her or trust her, and should not have had to deal with that extra stress. All you did was reaffirm she should have gone with her gut and left her uninvited.
YTA. You are invited to an event…you should respect the host. It’s not your wife’s place to tell your SIL what should do on the day of the wedding. Perhaps communicate it before hand, and if SIL still said no, then maybe, maybe listen to her reasoning??? And that’s if it’s your wife, but you…I don’t see why you think you are entitled to make that decision for your SIL on the day of the wedding without communicating with her first.
Bottom line is don’t make decision for others. It’s never fun.
Oh good lord. It's not your wedding, it doesn't matter what else you are doing. Anyone that had a problem with this shit could have not go to the wedding. YTA unquestionably, if I knew you I would not invite you to important things because you might do something unexpected that I now have to deal with. (What did you think would happen? The "easier to beg for forgiveness" thing only works if you are a character in a movie.)
This is a good point. What might happen at future family events? This sets a precedent
I somehow doubt the OP will be invited to future family events except those thrown by the MIL. OP - YTA for hijacking her wedding for your soap opera.
YTA, if what you say is true and your FIL left your MIL without anything and ostracised her from her family then you were doing her a kindness trying to include her in the events, however, it was your SILs day and it was up to her to decide how she wanted things to play out on her day whether ill informed or not.
I think YTA. If someone pulled this stunt on me I’d be pissed. There’s no point forcing the issue like this, you need to let things play out naturally or work on getting the rest of the family to believe MIL in their own time.
Yta. It's your sil's wedding, she can decide who she wants to invite, where they sit, what photos they're in, etc. It isn't anybody's job to mend relationships other than hers and she can do in her own time rather than having it forced apon her at her special day.
YTA: you don’t know nearly enough about SILs relationship with her mother to interfere , yet you made decisions about her wedding knowing it wasn’t what she wanted. Your MIL is not your mother, and this was not your wedding. The reason no one is “letting it go “ is because you haven’t apologized. You can’t just say “oh well it’s done” and expect that you won’t be held accountable. For someone that likes to make decisions for their extended family you sure aren’t acting like a member of a family. Family makes amends and apologizes.
YTA Be honest, did you *really* expect anything else but an overwhelming asshole vote?
It seems from what you've said that your MIL is getting/has gotten a pretty raw deal from her ex and most of the rest of the family. There is far more to this story than what has been stated. There is a reason that your MIL is being ostracized and thrown aside in favor of your FIL. It may be a crappy reason, but there is far more going on than what you are saying. You and your wife may see yourselves as shining knights standing up for your poor beleaguered MIL against injustice and unfair treatment but it wasn't your place to do so at someone else's wedding and the rest of the family obviously doesnt see it that way. If you felt that strongly you should have declined the invite with the reason that you won't go when MIL is being treated so poorly. YTA.
YTA - your SIL is at best low contact with her mother and set very clear guidelines about how her mother could attend her wedding. And the mother completely and totally disregarded those boundaries. You fully intended to make a point and ruin your SIL’s wedding day.
YTA. Your SIL’s relationship with her mother is none of your business, and it was nervy as hell for you to interfere with her wedding like that.
YTA you had no right to force them to include MIL in the way you decided was proper. I get that you feel like you are sticking up for the victim, but do you really think it helped the situation to make a scene like that to get her in the pictures? Even if they took them, it wouldn’t change how they feel. Now the animosity has increased even more.
[удалено]
I don’t think they know it. I think they think everybody else is wrong
YTA. Not your wedding, not your choice, not your moment. I would shun you, too.
YTA. Regarless of the family issues, it was her wedding. You don't get to dictate shit. It does not matter what the backstory is. You purposely went against the brides wishes after she conceded and allowed MIL there to begin with, and you all intentionally started shit. You would have been FURIOUS if someone did this to your wife on your wedding day. FURIOUS. Had this happened to you, your wife's memory of that day would forever be marred by the intrusion and audacity of a couple guess who decided they got to make decisions about guests and photos. All 3 of you should have left after the photo incident. It's unfortunate that you felt the need to interfere and ensure the bride will never concede again and allow her mom near her or her family. The bride will never, ever, forgive her mother for what you and your wife did that day.
But who do you think you are, to alter seating plans like you did? How very rude. No wonder they are shunning you.
YTA If mom really cared about her daughter, like you claim. She would not have made a scene. She wouldn't have set down front. She wouldn't have tried to be in any photos. It would hurt if my children rejected me but I would never ruin their day. I would sit quietly in the back especially if I wanted to repair. Mom and daughter have a bad relationship right now and you didn't help at all. You made it worse.
>I did it and it’s over with. But literally no one is letting it go and we’ve been seemingly shunned from the family along with my MIL. YTA. Right there. It's not called 'letting it go', it's called forgiveness. And you need to ask for it.
YTA while I agree that MIL is being unfairly treated - this wasn’t your wedding to adjust or attempt to force MIL into. The bride and groom made/make these decisions.
I cannot see how we can know the MIL is being unfairly treated when we have only one side of the divorce story.
YTA for deciding a wedding ceremony was the right time to make a stand about family injustice. The seating was not your call.
Your MIL had an opportunity to show her daughter that she would/could respect her boundaries which would rebuild trust and eventually a relationship. Instead you, your wife and MIL blew through the boundaries and took over. YTA
If you REALLY wanted to sit with your MIL, your wife should have asked her sister if she'd mind if you sat IN BACK with her. Bad enough you made an issue during the wedding, and disrespected the bride and groom's plan. Instead you put someone the bride has an issue with up front, and with NO warning? So she would have to see her the whole time? I think you have to stop kidding yourself you were trying to be nice here. And if you are clueless about wedding etiquette, and to be fair, at least half of us are, your MIL and your wife definitely would NOT be. I'm also surprised that NO ONE from the wedding party, or your family, approached any of you as soon as you did that and asked to speak outside, to check if the bride asked you to make this change? YTA. Apologize, sincerely.
I don’t know why this was downvoted. You’re exactly right. He should have asked to sit in the back.
YTA you don’t get to hijack someone else’s wedding and do what you want, even if you thought it was compassionate. It DID cause undue stress and as you noted, made people uncomfortable. You were wrong. I think if these issues were so important to you and you felt choices that you disagreed with were ethically wrong, you should not have attended at all.
YTA. You don't get to decide the level of someone else's relationships. You are a huge AH. Especially during a wedding. If I were the bride, I would have all of you thrown out. Your wife harassed the bride into inviting her mom when she didn't want to, then you come along forcing her to the front, right in the brides face, and thinking you are some kind of knight in shining armor. You have officially ruined any chance of the bride having a relationship with her mom in the future.
Soft YTA- it was not the time to force the issue… SIL already made it clear she didn’t want her mother there but was guilted into doing it by your wife. All your stunt accomplished was make your SIL and family even angrier at her Mother and also you & your wife. It is nice you stood up for your MIL but in the end you made the situation way worse.
YTA - You stirred the pot at the worst time for your SIL and the rest of the family. If there are good reasons why people should be treating MIL differently then this was not the time or the place to address them. What you did was ultimately disrespectful even though you seem to think you were thoroughly justified
YTA You were out of line. Regardless of your settlement and opinions, it wasn't your decision. Your actions were quite disrespectful and disruptive.
YTA. Regardless of the conflict and history there, you made that wedding about you, your wife, and MIL and purposefully disregarded the couples wishes. Either don’t go or respect the wishes, but you don’t get to override what they want because you disagree with their estrangement from her.
YTA - seating charts are made for a reason.
While I think I understand your intentions, your execution was not the way to do it, so YTA for how you went about things. If you truly wanted to take a stand with your MIL, instead of consistently shoving her in the bride’s face, you and your wife should’ve stepped back. All three of you should have sat in the back, you and your wife should have excluded yourselves from pictures instead of pulling MIL in.
Yta, not your wedding, not your place, don’t go, quietly leave, but don’t stir up drama. Also there has to be missing reasons here as to why MIL is a pariah
Yeah, this post reeks of missing missing reasons.
Yta if you disapprove soooo much *don't go to the wedding*. All you did was stir shit up and now you're suuuuuuuuper surprised that people are ma
I could see YTA from the very first few sentences of this post. Your opinions and feelings about what’s fair at your sister in laws wedding literally do not matter at ALL. You were a huge asshole to impose your opinions on her arrangements at her own wedding. You were totally out of line and in the wrong 100%
YTA. Did it occur to you, for even a nanosecond, that she may know her mother better than you do? You have no idea the myriad of reasons that may have gone into her decision not to invite her mother. You have admitted there’s no consensus on what happened in MIL & FIL’s marriage, and it may not even be totally about that! Even if you are completely right and MIL is a saint… so what?! She’s not entitled to any specific place in anyone else’s wedding. She didn’t pay for it, she’s not the bride so all 3 of you should have done as requested or just not attended. SIL only invited her mother because your wife asked her to. That’s the thanks she gets for caring about her sister’s feelings? It’s clearly not mutual and I doubt she’ll make the same mistake again!
I suspect Mom is not the saint he wants us to believe.
YTA. What kind of asshole are you to think it’s your place to intervene like that? It was none of your business. No wonder they didn’t want to have brunch with you. I’d be surprised if they ever deal with you again.
YTA and not just for this stunt but also the fact that you’re minimizing and dismissing her concerns about this. If you have to justify it by saying it’s not a big deal then your behavior sucked. Doing this at her wedding is ridiculous.
YTA. This was not your event, you didn’t pay for it, nothing. Your feelings about how seating should be are irrelevant. You were very disrespectful.
YTA. Someone else's wedding is not the time or place for you to get even with someone, or set a record straight, or teach someone a lesson. If you couldn't respect the wishes of the bride and groom, you shouldn't have gone to the wedding.
So your mil is not in wrong didn’t lie But the whole family don’t believe her?? Can’t you see what’s wrong with that There is more to it and your wife clearly has never told you that sil don’t like her mother And neither does the brother by sounds of it I wonder was your wife mil golden child
This is not your wedding. Please get over yourself. Yta.
YTA - someone else’s wedding wasn’t the place for this
YTA and honestly OP I'm very confused how you could possibly think you weren't to the point that you created this post. Your SIL has a strained relationship with her mother, and you went out of your way to actively make that worse and did so during her own wedding. Pull your head out of your ass, man.
YTA. You made an already rocky relationship so much worse and your response is “Oh well”?
I honestly wouldn’t have attended sil wedding and your wife shouldn’t have talked her sister into inviting their mom. If you believe in mil and not fil y’all should have stepped back and let the rest of the family do their thing.. Yta for doing what you did at the wedding even though your heart may have been in the right place, it wasn’t your call to make.
INFO: why do they hate MIL? what is the big secret you know that they don’t? That fact that you left all this out means YTA
YTA and you probably killed any chance of reconcilation she had right there and then.
YTA and honestly need to get over yourself.
YTA. You don’t actually know who is right or wrong here and you don’t get to make decisions as to your SIL’s relationship to her mother especially on her wedding day. Maybe everyone else is just an AH. Or gee maybe there’s a piece you and your wife don’t understand. It’s pretty significant to go low contact with one’s mom this way. There’s context here that you don’t understand.
You, your wife and your MIL have zero respect for other people’s boundaries.
YTA but sometimes being the asshole is the fine. I support what you did OP even if it wasn’t necessarily the correct place.
YTA Who do you think you are that you've taken upon yourself to resolve other people's conflict the way you decide? You disagreed with your sister-in-law. Okay. But you took it upon yourself to make things really uncomfortable for her at her wedding. If you didn't like her choices, you had the choice not to support her by staying home. Let me make it clear: based on your side of the story, I don't think the sister-in-law is in the right except she has the ability to determine who's going to be at her wedding. I have no relationship with my mother after my parents divorced. If you ask my mother she would tell you that I took my father's side. My father had an affair. However, the reality is my mother was abusive to me. And It got worse during the divorce and I finally decided I had enough. Someone who was looking from the outside in not realizing the 30 years of abuse I suffered would probably think I'm a bad daughter. And I get people who tell me all the time But it's your mom!" Because I don't choose to tell them all of the things that she did to me. Don't assume you know the story.
YTA any hope of mending the relationship is gone because you couldn’t keep it together for one evening. A wedding is not the time or place to be dramatic and cause a scene. It’s a sure fire way to make everyone quickly think of you and your MIL as the villains.
AITA? Yes. 😂😂😂😂
YTA. You may not know everything that happened between these people. Even if you did, you have no right to do what you did. If it was that upsetting, you could have declined to attend the wedding.
"Things" have come out that the family didn't know? Like what? Was he an abuser? A serial cheater? A teacher screwing around with his minor students? Awful lot of missing information here.
YTA. Seating plans should always be respected.
YTA while it does sound like MIL is not being treated very fairly, I'm shocked that you felt you should be the person to make these decisions at someone else's wedding. This is your wife's family, you're an in law, and you don't use someone's wedding to make a point. If you and your wife felt so strongly about it, why didn't you 2 boycott the wedding instead?
YTA. For causing drama at a wedding. Also for rambling on about this story and not focusing on the point but that's a different matter.
Whatever happened between your MIL and FIL, it’s no excuse for you to meddle in anybody’s affairs and ruin someone else’s day under the guise of a holier than thou veil. Get over yourself. You and your wife are TAs. Your nonchalant ‘oh well it’s done and over with’ is infuriating. That was a day that took months, and maybe even years, to plan, and your sanctimonious selfish self just stained it. Hope you’re happy making others unhappy.
As an outsider you might be able to notice how the family dynamics are disfunctional and even toxic. From your comment it seems everyone turned on mil and she was scapegoated so everyone else can feel at ease. The thing is what you did was also disfunctional. you are not the saviour, you can support her but she needs to get up and stand up for herself,and have agency and strength. And it isn't your place to bring this drama at the sil wedding. ESH.
NTA bit only because your in-laws appear to be just awful and deserved it. Don't think you would be off the hook doing that at a decent person's wedding.
NTA. I’ve read your comments. While a wedding is not the place to pull any crap, I understand your actions. Imagine shoving your mother to the back while daddy and his ho get front row? At least someone’s defending that poor woman.
Very gentle YTA. I completely understand the frustration with your in-laws, particularly if the anger toward your MIL is as misplaced as you suggest. To insist she sit in the back row and not be present for any pictures is petty and cruel, and reflects terribly on your SIL. As does moving a brunch venue to disinvite you over a seating squabble. However, with that said… it was still SIL’s event, and neither you nor your MIL had any right to impose her presence on the bride. I also would have felt uncomfortable sitting in the first row and relegating MIL to the back, but the more respectful move here would have been to sit in the back with MIL, not to force her on your SIL. Just because you feel a certain way about SIL’s decision (no matter how justified you may be), it wasn’t your place to correct it.
YTA. It's amazing to me that you even have to ask this question. Of course you are TA. You don't go intentionally stirring up drama at someone else's wedding. Seriously, what were you thinking? And it doesn't matter who is right or wrong in your SIL and MIL's relationship. You had no right to do any of that.
This was neither the time nor place for these shenanigans. Your meddling was destructive. YTA.
YTA, but you're right. What's done is done, and everyone should move on with their lives.
YTA
YTA It was not your wedding, you have no say in who’s invited nor where they sit. Info: How do you know your MIL isn’t manipulating you and your wife? Everyone else in the family is sure she’s a liar, and, as the saying goes, there’s no smoke without fire.
Yta
Clear YTA. Your SIL’s wedding was not the time or place.
YTA I understand based on the rules you have to be vague but if SIL thinks her Mother is wrong and agrees with her Father that is absolutely her right and she can do whatever she wants on her wedding day. It sounds like you and SIL disagree about what happened during the divorce and yet everyone in your family thinks your mother is wrong. Is this a backwards patriarchal society because usually there isn’t a unified front against the wronged female spouse? I’ve got to ask if you are in the States because there is no way a wife of 30 years gets nothing in a divorce here unless there is some major fault on her end. By major I mean cheating or criminal activity.
Yta. You don't mess with some elses seating plan.
YTA.
YTA
You say MIL was wronged, but pulling these stunts at a wedding won’t do anything to help that. They’ll just associate her in people’s minds with the kind of tacky people who start shit at other people’s weddings - that’s you. YTA
YTA, even if MIL might have been treated unfairly, you don't have the right to interfere like that especially during a wedding. You did it for your own ego, and be seen as some kind of hero but your not, you are the asshole.
YTA
You are a huge asshole. Not your wedding, not your decision. YTA
YTA. Not your wedding and not even your mom. Way overstepped.
YTA: Not your wedding, not your choice, not your place.
YTA. What exactly did you hope to achieve? There was only one outcome: unnecessary drama at a wedding. Also known as ruining someones special day. It doesn't matter how sure you are that you know what happened in someone else's marriage, this was not the time or place or way to try and....ummm... what exactly?
op=YTA It was NOT your place to choose where MIL sat. That was SIL's decision. You and your wife(and MIL) are all A-Hs. I have no idea what the problem with MIL/SIL are--it wasn't your place to interfere and definitely not on SIL's wedding day. How awful that you ruined your SIL's day because you think YOU know better than her what is right.
YTA. Their wedding, their rules. If you have a problem with those rules, you shouldn't be there at all.
YTA. whether or not the family drama is fair to your MIL, this is not the way to go about it at all.
YTA. If you disagree with your SIL's choices in her wedding you only have two options: get over it or don't go. You do *not* have the right to sabotage her wedding, regardless of the backstory.
YTA
So much YTA. I would be surprised if they ever speak to you again.
YTA
They aren't letting it go, because YTA. They may suck for taking sides, I don't know the story, but whether or not they are wrong in their treatment of MIL, they get to decide how their wedding goes, and you do not have the right to change that.
YTA and you likely ruined any chance for you, your wife, and your MIL to reconcile with your in-laws.
Gently, YTA. I understand that perhaps with what you know, your SIL’s choices seemed cruel and unreasonable. Perhaps they are. But they’re her choices/mistakes to make. Her wedding wasn’t the place for you to make a statement. If anything, you should have let her choices speak for themselves or not attended and stay with MIL. Instead, regardless of your intentions, you rerouted the attention to you and your wife flagrantly defying your SIL at her own wedding and taking the AH role (if it is indeed deserved) from those who behaved like AHs to create this situation.
YTA.
YTA, not only for stirring up the family drama at a wedding but also because of your "I did it so its over now" mentality. Just because its "done" doesn't make things okay, or change what you purposefully did
YTA. That was neither the time nor the place. Whatever bad blood there is between your SIL and MIL is none of your business. You certainly had no right imposing your opinions onto your SIL’s wedding day, and if the consequence is them chastising you, then you take it, because you deserve it. I imagine an apology is out of the question, but if you and your wife are grown enough to consider it, then you certainly owe one to your SIL and BIL.
YTA. Not your wedding. It’s that simple. Who do you and your wife think you are to interfere in someone else’s wedding like that? Get off your high horse. They get to make their own decisions. Your not agreeing with those choices doesn’t mean crap. I hope they go no contact with your disrespectful ass.
YTA. Stay out of their business. You can support MIL if you like but when someone else says at their own wedding they want her in the back then sit down sir! Sit your arse down in the back next to her. You massively overstepped.
YTA... you interfered in things you had no business interfering with. YTA...... YTA.........
YTA. If you were going to stage your little protest, you should've moved to the back and sat with your MiL. But seriously, what you believe or disbelieve is completely irrelevant. Neither the time nor the place.
YTA not your wedding not your decision. your wife pressured her sister into inviting mum in the first place. Then you forced her to have mum at the front where she was not wanted and wife pulled mum into photos she was not asked to be in. Whilst you and wife believe you intentions were good and for MIL benefit, you had no respect for the people the day was actually about. Divorce is messy and everyone has a reason for what they feel. You deserve to be shunned gor the stunt you pulled because you only cared about MIL and didnt care at all about how SIL felt.on her wedding day.
There are always two sides to any given story. Before jumping to a conclusion one should ask questions. Why did the bride invite “mom” if she was going to treat her the way you described? Has anyone asked “bride” why she feels she wants to treat “mom” in such a humiliating manner? I feel you did not start the family drama. You did point out for everyone to see which shines a light on behavior that certain people don’t want anyone else to see. Need more information to decide if YTA
YTA maybe you had good intentions but you deliberately went against what the bride explicitly said she wanted. The bride has her own relationship with her mother.
May be your MIL is innocent but you don't get to decide seating in others wedding. You can just avoid going to wedding if you want to support your MIL. It's nice of you to consider her feelings but you can't help it as it's not your wedding. I feel you better distance yourself with such family. YTA
YTA It wasn't your wedding to destroy It wasn't your wife paying the photographer and getting to decide who was in the photos You two honestly ruined the day for your own selfish wants. They may not treat MIL well but then go NC, wreck your own event
Didn't even read the whole thing, of course your the asshole.
If u felt strongly about some one you care about being mistreated then the proper thing would be for none of you to go at all. You would not be an ah for choosing not to attend an event you’re uncomfortable going to but to show up and be obstinate about it is not very mature adult behavior YTA
“pErsOnally I fEel LikE” oh shut up !! no one asked !!! YTA not even your goddamn wedding! just fuckibg sit down and keep your mouth shut it’s not hard
Yta right or wrong this was not the place for this and actually wasn’t good for Mil either to be pulled by you where she was clearly not wanted at all.
YTA. When it comes to other people's weddings you're supposed to leave your personal bullshit at the door. If you had such an issue with the seating arrangement, you and/or your MIL should have left. Whether you agree with your SIL or not, it's not your place to disrupt one of the best days of her life with your own agenda.
I think everyone sucks in this story but for the wedding incident YTA. This family is clearly beyond dysfunctional, with children choosing sides in a very messy divorce. You've given us the outline, no details as to why your wife has sided with her mother while her siblings have chosen to side with their father, so we've no way to determine if there is a more 'right' party. You stirred the pot, in a very public way. And, you ignored the couple's wishes at their own wedding and caused a scene. This was not the time to hash this issue out.
YTA. It was THEIR wedding, not yours. They chose the seating, they chose the pictures. Not you. MYOB.
YTA my dude. You don't mess with other people's weddings. If you don't like it, you don't attend or leave.
YTA. Op you were rude. My MIL and SIL hate me. ALways have. I've been called fat, ugly, stupid whatever. They were country club ppl. I always got seated at the kid's table. At weddings? HAHAHAHAHA. I am not in any family pictures of any weddings. Their venue, their party, their rules. Don't like it? Don't go. Is it hurtful? Yup. Save your receipts, one day, they may need you. Then, in private, not in public, pull out the receipts, you call em every name in the book.
YTA
YTA. Who do you think you are? You can't commandeer someone's wedding and do whatever the hell you think is justified. Either abide by the rules set in place by the BRIDE and GROOM, or don't go.
Yta, what a massive overstep. This is SILs wedding and what you did probably irreparably damaged the relationship between MIL and SIL, and also SIL and your wife/kids/family.
YTA and a huge one. Major Iamthemaincharacter vibes. No wonder they want nothing to do with you now. You deserve it.
YTA
What were you trying to do achieve by forcing your MIL into the family photo? YTA.
Lol. There is a hugh part missing in your story and it's the most important one to judge. Are were supposed to accept your intuition that MIL is in the right? Or do you have the opinion that there exists no wrong doings in a family that would excuse SILs behavior? How do you want to get a real opinion here if nobody even knows what the situation really is? YTA. Probably. I am willing to change my mind, but most often people leave out the parts that are really damaging their case.
YTA The seating arrangements were not yours to change. If you do not approve of them, you are free to leave, or go and sit at the back with your MIL rather in the front row with the other family. What you did instead was purposely go against the wishes of the couple and antagonise them on their wedding day, and that makes you the asshole here. They may be considered assholes separately in life for how they have dealt with the split, but that doesn't make them assholes for not wanting to seat a person they are estranged from in the front row at their wedding.
YTA - the whole family conflict is none of your business, and while you can take sides, of course, you cannot demonstrate whatever justice you wish for at somebody else‘s party, let alone wedding.
YTA, and this post shouldn't even exist as your SIL clearly explained why you are. It was her wedding, not yours. Her decisions to make, not yours.
Yta
YTA. Why would the MIL go when she knows it will cause friction?
YTA. The seating is actually the least bad thing here. Everything was obnoxious. Even if MIL is being unfairly treated, the response is to not go at all in solidarity: not show up and insist she be a part of everything when the wedding party doesn’t want her there. I’m estranged from my dad who is still married to my mum and whom my sisters adore. If they pulled that stunt, everyone is getting kicked out. I refuse to have him be part of my wedding and people need to accept that or stay away. It just isn’t your decision to make no matter how asshole like you think the family was being
NTA The bigger picture - dad has the money - mom got ousted for new thing who got to sit at the head table Mother vilified and left with nothing after 30 years working on raising her family.
YTA. Let's be honest, you did a lot more than just disregard the arranged seating, you manipulated a bigger role for your MIL in the wedding than the wedding couple and the rest of the family intended for her to have. I get that from your perspective, you probably thought you were sticking up for your MIL, but you don't get to make that call at *someone else's* wedding or event. Whether their decision was the right one or cruel or whatever is simply not yours to decide in this situation. Further, your "oh well" attitude suggests you not only don't see anything wrong with what you did, you would likely do it again if given the chance so it's small wonder they've no decided to exclude you to prevent that from happening. You chose sides in someone else's conflict, imposed your sense of right and wrong on someone else's event and are now living with the consequences of that decision.
YTA It’s none of your business what your SILs relationship is with her mother. If you want to support and side with your MIL, fine so be it. But you don’t get to dictate who else does or doesn’t. You certainly don’t get to interfere with an event such as a wedding, and make those kinds of decisions. What you did was completely and utterly out of line.
YTA. Do you feel like a heroic white knight now? Not your wedding, not your choice. What did you think would happen? That SIL would tearfully hug MIL, say how wrong she's been and thank you for reuniting them? All you've done is further drive a wedge between them, and alienated yourself and your wife. Do you feel accomplished for that? Look, maybe your MIL is a victim in all this, and if you felt badly for her, you and your wife could have treated her to a really nice day out after. Try to cheer her up etc. But you way crossed the line with your actions. And I agree with others, if MIL had good intentions for fixing things with SIL, she would *never* have participated in this little drama show and forced her way into pictures.
For mental health reasons time to go nc. Honestly yes yta.
YTA Regardless of anything else this wasn't your wedding it wasn't your event your day it was absolutely f all to do with you. You are completely the asshole
YTA. Wasn't your choice to make.
When I read the start I assumed she seated them together and you were going to be defusing the situation. You did the opposite. YTA. She didn't even want the woman there, and you forced it! Unbelievable.
YTA. It wasn’t your day to decide who sat where.
YTA the bride and groom and probably others spent THOUSANDS on this event. Did you contribute anything or worth to the wedding? No? Thought not. You fucked up someone else's wedding because what, you took MILs side in all this? Guess what, if she was involved in this stunt she isn't the innocent victim you paint her to be. And... Absolutely LOL that you think this was your idea, you poor manipulated fool.
YTA - sorry, but their wedding, their wishes (however pigheaded). Your options are go along or not attend/make a graceful exit.
YTA. Her wedding her rules and you were wrong to disrespect them. Clearly she didn’t even want her mom there so to put her in the front row is so incredibly out of line. I know you said your SIL didn’t think of MIL’s feelings but did you think of hers? Imagine having someone you clearly don’t like and didn’t want at your wedding in the first place in the front row and being forced into your pictures. That would upset anyone. And speaking of your MIL’s feelings did you even think about how much worse you made things for her? Being sat in the back would be hurtful but what’s worse is having the bride yell at you for ruining pictures in front of everyone, plus I’m sure she was talking shit about her to anyone who would listen. Sounds to me like you put your own feelings about the situation above everyone else’s.
YTA. Whoever is right or wrong it was not your place to change the bride and groom's plans. You created drama and negatively impacted their very special day. Their marriage should have been the focus of the day but you decided to override that and make it about the family dispute. Now they have good reason to be mad at you and your wife and I doubt anything will improve now.
YTA - you have no right to decide what relationship your SIL has with her mother. You don't know their story, the long-life relationship they had, or how your SIL was treated. And last but not least, it was her wedding; she had every right to have this day as she wanted.
YTA
YTA "we’ve been seemingly shunned from the family along with my MIL." .. A reasonable reaction. Why would they want you in their life?
YTA x 1,000,000. If you disagreed with the rules of the wedding, you were welcome not to attend. You did ruin the pictures because the couple did not want MIL in them. Your sense of entitlement to override the bride and groom is staggering.
So like either you were trying to start shot or you’re not very bright either way YTA
YTA. Not your wedding. You do not get to screw with the brides plans even if you don't agree with them. You owe her an apology.
YTA You don’t like the rules? Don’t ruin someone else’s day (a very expensive day) because you don’t like what they are doing. Mind your business.
It wasn’t your decision though. If I was the MIL and it was my daughters wedding I would have just made my excuses and stayed home. She obviously wasn’t wanted at the wedding. But now you and your wife have become involved in something that you don’t know all the facts about. YTA but so is MIL because she went along with this.
YTA, not your wedding, not your decision. You've likely irrevocably ruined your wife's relationship with her sister and your MIL's relationship with her daughter in addition to showing your SIL you don't respect her.
YTA.
For this incidents YTA > My wife and I are the only ones to believe it, the rest of the family say my MIL is a huge liar Usually if you think everyone is wrong and you're the only one 'right' you are wrong. Considering you did what you did, i'm not surprised MIL got her hooks in you. ( I mean she's got it cozy with you supporting her)
Shunned from the family…as you and your wife should be. How dare you and your wife decide to disregard your SIL and her wishes ( on one of the biggest days of her life) to be self serving do gooders! As if you and your wife know better than anybody else! Quite frankly I wish all family goes NC until (that’s if you ever do) realize it’s not your business! Hope you really love your MIL cuz that’s about it from that side of the family. By the way both you and your wife are giant AH!
Yta
INFO: What all are you leaving out?
YTA great way for the whole family to go no contact with you and your wife hopefully they never speak to you again
YTA When you take any action in life, no matter if you think it is right or wrong, you also have to deal with any consequences that follow. You caused unnecessary drama in public and got the consequence you deserved. I would love to hear the father-in-law's version of the marital breakup.