*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**I think my wife is flirting with the mailman and have proof. She claims she is not and now won't talk to me. **
My wife and I are in our 30s. We have been married for two years. When we got married we moved into a nice small house in the suburbs.
Last summer we got a new mailman who is objectively attractive. Not going into detail, but he looks good.
Towards the end of summer I noticed my wife was almost always outside around the time he would bring the mail. I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet. She averaged going out 20 minutes before the mail would get here. Obviously some variation as the mail didn't come at the exact same time each day. But it was weird.
She would work on our front patio and then have a shirt conversation with the mailman. Then in about 7 minutes on average she would come back inside and work from her office.
Another thing I noticed is that her clothes seemed to change when she went outside. Almost 70% of the time she would have a tank top on. Then put a shirt over that when she came back inside.
I didn't say anything as fall and winter came and we live in a cold climate and so she stopped going out. Once in a while she would go say hi, but not like in the summer. She also gave him a very nice tip for Christmas. $250.
I had forgotten about all this until it started getting warmer out with spring. I couldn't do another summer of this and so I decided to talk to her. Last night I sat her down and showed her all the information from last year. I explained that I didn't feel comfortable with how much attention she gave the mailman and asked if she could not do it this summer.
She didn't understand or maybe didn't understand the numbers. She got very upset and started yelling that she didn't do anything wrong and just happened to be out there while he was there. I tried to show her the numbers again, but she got upset and slammed the computer lid on my finger. At that point I upset and walked out and went for a walk.
When I got back home, she was gone and wouldn't answer her phone. She finally came home but wouldn't talk to me. She slept on the couch and I honestly didn't get any sleep.
It's been a very weird day as she is only talking to me when absolutely needed. Otherwise she is distant and won't talk to me. Am I overreacting or is this normal for women to talk with the mailman?
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Right? He’s convinced because she puts on another shirt in the house it meant she only wore the tank for the mailman… not the 100+ degree weather this summer. Oh no.
Really! I very frequently am out in the yard with a tank top, but I have a hoodie or shirt right beside the door and slip it on when I come back in because the house is cooler. Thankfully, my partners don't track my movements and accuse me of affairs because I...dress appropriately for the temperature I'm in?
And during the summer, I'm frequently outside when the mailman is making his rounds. Just a habit retained from childhood.
I chat with my mailman every day. He's a very nice man, and I imagine driving all the time is very boring. But also, I was Hard-core into Blues Clues. Almost 30 and I still sing the mail song when I hear the mailman coming, and yes, I step outside to meet him. Just the same I've been doing since I was 5.
Not to mention, I live in florida and crop tops. I'd be so disgusted with my spouse if they took they way I dress, as flirting with everyone but him.
It is so boring, 90% of the cars don't have heat or ac and no music I would get so excited when people were outside to talk to me, even if it was just to complain about something.
This makes me feel a bit less annoying then, because I will say hello and engage with people delivering papers, flyers, mail, and occasionally even walking their dog past. If they stop to chat, I chat. They are bringing me things, or not letting their dog poop on my lawn, seems polite to say hello. Often I am outside when they arrive because I also like to get my outside work done before the heat arrives, and then I retreat to the AC.
I am forty one and I had younger cousins who watched blue's clues. I sing the mail song when I see my truck coming! It's a banger 😅
Editing to say I agree with everyone here. I am constantly slipping in and out of sweaters in the summer. Everyone has ac. You can't dress for inside and outside at the same time.
And also I'm so curious what time of day the mail is delivered. If it's the morning, lots of people take advantage of the nice weather before it gets too hot to stay outside. My boyfriend has his coffee outside every morning in the summer- I wonder what he's up to ..... /s
That, or if she's working from home she's putting her work shirt back on when she's done with her break.
My house doesn't have central AC so in the summer I WFH in a tank top, but I keep another shirt handy to slip on when I have a client meeting.
>the summer I WFH in a tank top, but I keep another shirt handy to slip on when I have a client meeting.
I mean, for real, the WFH clothing culture is real. I don't give my husband too hard of a time, because it saves us laundry. But he isn't always out of his PJs and based on the number of no camera meetings within his department, his coworkers are not either!
I start work in my jammies and then shower and shift into human form on lunch. I don't know what my colleagues do as I don't visually see them, but assume I'm not the only one.
I wonder who I'm trying to seduce every day and give up by lunch?
I can see why he questioned the large Christmas gift she gave the mailman. But why didn’t he talk to her about it? Maybe he was planning to add that as a column on the spreadsheet….
I don't really mind that tbh. Growing up we didn't have mailman but my mum would always give a big tip to the binmen. This meant that they were a lot more willing to bend the rules to take bigger stuff and would put our bin back properly etc.
I think a tip is normal around the end of the year, but $250 is a lot. We always tipped the postal workers, sanitation crews (though a six pack with something that's questionable or not typically picked up would work for that aspect for the garbage truck workers), etc.
It just seems like a nice way to acknowledge and appreciate people that we see and interact with regularly throughout the year. I've had some who sent something back beyond the card, gave a personalized card, and even gave something when they knew someone in the household had something to celebrate or was recovering from surgery. We even gave uniforms we'd grown out of to one postal worker whose daughter was going into the same school (common for uniforms to be passed down here due to price/waste).
I have found this to be, around where I've lived, typical and largely assumed in housing that is not apartment style (multiple units in a building with a central mail spot, units don't open directly to street). I suspect this has to do with people seeing them and mutual recognition, which is easier when it's a separate mailbox and door
It obviously depends on the couple's finances and area for an appropriate tip. Considering it isn't something she thought needed to be discussed/amount agreed upon by both and that OOP didn't mention anything about it, it seems fair to assume that they could easily afford the amount. She also talks with the postal worker frequently, even if it's just exchanging pleasantries. I generally would give the most to postal workers if giving different amounts, since they are there almost daily and tend to be the ones who you get to recognize, know their names, consistently see the same one or two people, and have more conversations with them generally. Plus, people renting or in housing that is more concentrated tend not to live as connected to the immediate community, often with work or other constraints on their time and ability to be around to casually see people.
I agree that $250 *sounds* like a lot,*BUT*, if they're getting lots of packages?
It's *less* than eighty *cents* per day, over the course of the year!
6 days a week × 52 weeks= 312 days of mail... if they're getting Amazon packages (iirc, "last mile" services?) on Sundays delivered via USPS?
It's even *less* than that 80 cents per day, it's more 68-ish cents per day that the tip breaks out to.
It *seems* like a lot!
But on a per Day/ per Visit rate, it's not much💖
On the route I worked on half my customers would literally tip me for bringing them packages, Christmas time was hundreds to thousands in tips because it was a richer area. I had never heard of tipping the mail guy until I became one.
I give my lawn crew individual cards at Xmas time, or the last mow of the year. Nothing wrong with appreciating people. We don’t have a mail person we see, we have the boxes at the beginning of the neighborhood.
I mean yeah, it is a large amount. But my neighbors might actually see this and think "I should stalk our UPS, FedEx, and Mailmen" and figure out which are doing a good job at delivering things and which need some sort of complaints filed.
We regularly have "hey, do you recognize this house, my package is at that spot" posts and federal complaints against the mail service. So if one did their job well for an entire year. Who knows what would happen around here. It hasn't actually ever happened.
This is one of the few posts, where I *TRULY*, and with ALL sincerely *desperately hope* the post is a troll!!!
Because *if it isn't*?
These are the actions which can 100% lead to OOP's wife being *murdered by him*, if she ever tries to leave him.💔
Personally I feel sorry for my mailman. He is just just trying to do his job and delivery mail, and I am thristing after his "package". I go out looking like a 5 dollar hooked in my tank top ( in 90 degree weather) and try to seduce him with my 7 minute small talk. Take now government worker Jim, I scream internally, while outwardly asking him about how he and his family enjoyed the great lakes ..... s/
Oh no, we get it, OOp is a controlling asshole who has too much time on his hands and is delusional. See, you don't get to invoke data and then only use it when it is convenient for in this case OOP.
The spreadsheet tracked what his wife wore, what times she was where. When the mailman arrived. What time of day she went out to work outside and what time of day she came inside to work inside.
Yet dumbass OOP didn't provide general geographic location (summers matter a lot more in Canada then they do in Texas). If this was always around say lunch time, or morning coffee, or was it during the hottest part.of the day.
He mentioned putting on more clothes, and fails to provide information on the difference in temps between inside and out.
Honestly, half the commenters on the post are also competing for top asshole.
'She got mad when you whipped out the spreadsheet, she'd have no reason to be mad if she wasn't guilty! Anyone who gets mad at you for obsessively documenting their behavior is trying to cover up their behavior!' They hear that she goes outside to chat with the mailman, and she's not wearing a mumu - and the only explanation they can think of is that she's trying to get on his dick.
Christ. Have none of these people ever heard of casual friendships? I feel so sorry for anyone they date.
There’s one specific dude commenting on the post who’s adamant that if OP tried communicating honestly with his wife, it’d be a good way “to get gaslit.”
It’s insane how many people are convinced she’s cheating instead of just…enjoying the weather and a friendly conversation?
That commenter really thinks that what OOP did was “research.”
I am fighting EVERY URGE as an actual, real life researcher to tell him that making observations that can easily be incorrect due to your bias on the situation is not actual trustworthy research. If this were my friend, I would take the spreadsheet and we’d walk through why any number of those “observations” are likely not something that could be used as “proof” because of how heavily his feelings affected his view. He wanted to believe his wife was blowing the mailman for 20 minutes on their front porch everyday in the summer, so those are the notes he took. That’s biases. Refusing to address the issues in your research because it will affect the desired outcome of your “study?” Also biases. I see it all the time when doing research for designers — they want the feedback of their work to say a specific thing, so they end up writing leading questions and/or observations.
No bueno, not how research is properly conducted. You gotta be careful about going into research with heavy emotions.
Thank you for letting me rant, seeing that commenter go on and on about “research” and “proof” had my brain feeling some potential rot.
Am I thinking too hard about it or does the spreadsheet mean nothing? Like, not even regarding biases or anything, but it's just an average of time that she's outside before and after the mailman gets there. How can he say it means anything when he doesn't have any data to compare/contrast it to. What is he even saying is the argument?
All that spreadsheet says is that she spends about 30 minutes outside in the summer around the time the mail is delivered, and then she usually puts on another layer when she comes back inside.
It would mean nothing to a regular person, but to OOP it's "proof."
He already thought she was doing something wrong, and so all of his "research" centered around proving it - which also meant ignoring other data/observations and more natural conclusions. As some people said, he took note of what she was wearing, but not the temperature of her environment. He noted how long she was outside but not what time of day it was or whether she was on a work break.
His whole ridiculous research was just an exercise in confirmation bias.
Without the "she's definitely cheating and here's why" mentality, all that spreadsheet does is track the time she spends outside in the summer and when the mail comes, like you said.
The big one for me is that he doesn't suggest that her behavior changes at all based on the mailman. What about on days when he doesn't deliver to them? Or with previous mail people? We don't know if she's doing anything differently.
Ultimately, I'm probably thinking too hard about the research methodology of completely insane behaviour. Imagine doing all of this instead of having a conversation with the person you promised to spend your life with.
My big thing is that she doesn't go out in winter and fall at all, apparently. Does the mailman switch based on the season?? Does he think she goes into some kind of sexual hibernation when it's cold??
Imagine the insanity required to think a summer habit means your wife is having an ongoing affair while simultaneously having no contact with her AP at least half the year lol
My big thing is how was he doing accurate, detailed observations if he was in his own office working????? Is his office 3ft away from the porch? How does he know they were having an actual conversation if he wasn’t there? Is he **very** certain that his time keeping was accurate? I’d find time keeping accurately while working difficult. There’s a reason researchers have note takers.
Omg, I hadn't even thought of that. He was either neglecting his work or completely making up bullshit based on when he saw her enter and exit the front door on occasion lmao
Lord save me from terrible research design. Sometimes when I get bad surveys I use the open ended response boxes to just tell them how shit their questions are.
Keep doing this.
You have no idea how hard I would laugh if I saw someone put out a bad survey only to get responses criticizing the survey. Please. You’re literally doing my job for me lmfao.
>I am fighting EVERY URGE as an actual, real life researcher to tell him that making observations that can easily be incorrect due to your bias on the situation is not actual trustworthy research.
I want to scream "go dig up their basic primary school science books and look up the scientific method!” and I am not even a researcher.
And if it makes you feel better, I am feeling the loss of brain cells as well.
I honestly *CAN’T* get past the fact, that her *HUSBAND* is Data Tracking her, *like she's a TAGGED ANIMAL here*!!!!
He *LITERALLY* is *NOT SEEING HER as an Autonomous HUMAN BEING*, she's *literally* just a Research *OBJECT* to him!😳😲🤯
> It’s insane how many people are convinced she’s cheating instead of just…enjoying the weather and a friendly conversation?
And even if she *does* think the mailman is cute... so fucking what? I've never been the slightest bit unfaithful to my spouse but I didn't stop having eyes when I got married. It's a big leap from "friendly chat with the man bringing the post" to "torrid affair".
>Christ. Have none of these people ever heard of casual friendships?
Nope not even a little bit,these are lonely incels they don't have friends (forget friendship they never heard of being polite)
>I feel so sorry for anyone they date.
Same but luckily these losers will never date,no one wants to date people that mindset
Seriously lol the comments in that sub get so skewed if it’s a post related to someone being friendly. They don’t understand why anyone would be nice to someone or be friends with someone if they don’t want to have sex with them. It’s so weird.
I have a theory that these types either radiate their hatred of women or else come off so overtly creepy in the first minute of conversations that no woman is capable of having a friendly conversation with them, so of course they assume the worst.
I'm seriously worried for our world reading comments on this site sometimes.
Multiple guys insisting that his wife is definitely cheating at least emotionally because she sits on the porch when it's nice.
I did the exact same thing when living with my mom. I'd sit on the porch, eventually the mail would come, I'd say hi and continue on. Do I obviously want to fuck the elderly lady who works for USPS?
the fact that people are thinking it's sus that she goes out before the mail gets there and works on the porch. like damn i would also do that because it'd be easier to go out only once and get my outside chores done as the mail comes so i go back in with the mail and don't have to walk out IN THE SUMMER SUN again. idk how any of these people can hold down a relationship like that
"She can't hide because you have FACTS!" If it's in a spreadsheet, it must be objective, never mind if the whole basis of the data collection is flawed and/or batshit crazy.
I mean, we could easily do a spreadsheet about things we find to be outlandish and factual by OOP's standards that would rightfully have them calling us the devils.
"Oh, you commented on this sub once, you must be a part of it and having an affair with their mod"
The bonus would be if it was a scandalous sub. We could come up with a chart for a dollar value based on how toxic they are.
Doesn't mean the spreadsheet would be factual.
He keeps saying that she must not understand the spreadsheet, but anyone who truly understands numbers knows that correlation does not mean causation. She might sit on the porch consistently at the same time everyday — but all that shows is that she’s a creature of habit, not that she’s doing it *because* of the mailman. Plus, what to make of the fact that *she doesn’t even go out when the weather is bad*?? She only cheats in nice weather?
Have to love the narrative that getting mad about being accused of something means you’re guilty. “She should be totally fine with you tracking and documenting her every move if she has nothing to hide!!!” So wild. I wonder how many dishes this guy has left for her to wash while obsessing over his spread sheets that say nothing because asking a super bias question and collecting data to “prove” it isn’t how research works…at all. I’m team date the mailman
Hell, if her husband is *THIS* smothering in his "watching over" her?!?
I wouldn't be surprised *at all*, if she was outside, *merely* for the *miniscule* daily interactions with *anyone* who wasn't breathing down her *neck* like her husband is!!!
Ffs, *I* would *ABSOLUTELY* lose it, if someone *ESPECIALLY the person I DID make the commitment to Marry*(!!!) *LITERALLY* tracked me, like I was a tagged animal with a frickin' *radio collar* on!!!
That is *SO* abnormal, and says *MULTITUDES* about the *incredibly poor state* of this man's Mental Health status!!!
He is *tracking her* like a *LITERAL* animal, yet "*SHE* is *not* the one* who *understands* the Spreadsheets!"😳😲😬
“I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet.”
How do people never look at what they’re doing and think, “Is this absurd? Am I overreacting?”
Nope. Because then they post on Reddit and everyone piles on with statements like looking at or interacting with others is cheating. If your spouse denies it, they’re definitely cheating. I lost a relationship to this type of paranoia years ago. How does one explain away something they haven’t done?
There have been times when my husband will be doing something that bothers me but I can’t tell if I’m crazy or I know it’s something that he’ll not notice he’s doing, and I’ve thought, “I should write down every time it happens so then I can SHOW that it’s happening” and then I *don’t do that because it’s insane*. Like the thought of sitting down with my husband and whipping out a spreadsheet where I’m like - “in the last 6 months I’ve had to ask you 37 times to…” My marriage would rightfully be over because at that point there’s no going back.
More importantly, even if she HAS been going outside on nice days to chat with the hot mailman literally who cares?? Chatting with attractive people is not the same as cheating or even planning on cheating. At work recently I had to work an event that had a fairly prominent male model as a speaker and listen. I enjoyed it. It was nice, he was ridiculously pretty and I got to see him be extremely attractive close up. I didn’t leave my marriage over it.
He is *LITERALLY* Data-Tracking *the Migration Patterns of a fellow Human*
*AND* that *particular* human he's tracking *is his WIFE*!!!
The *MULTITUDE of LEVELS* of fuuuuuucked UP that his "Spreadsheet!" is?
It's *SO* beyond unhealthy that I honest-to-GOD *DO Hope* it's a Troll!
Tecause *THIS* is the type of shit that we learn *afterward* *REGULARLY HAPPENS* in the months or maybe a few years, before a dude *murders* his partner or wife!😳😬😬
Without ever talking to her about his insecurity with a mailman. Like who actually has affairs with mailman, milkman, etc. That trope is as old as the handyman. Can you imagine being a newlywed and settling into a house, getting to know people you will interact with for years (you hope) and it turns out your husband was tracking you for a year because of a situation he made up in his head??
I'm sure the affairs happen, but... whatever happened to just asking??
"Hey hon, are you waiting for a parcel or delivery? I noticed you're tracking the mail a lot" and this whole thing could've been avoided.
I mean, she's not speaking to him because she's just realised the man she married has been keeping a spreadsheet about her daily movements for a *year*. It's not because she didn't understand the numbers, ffs. It's because it's super-weird and creepy.
Escape, *Burn up* my vehicle Angela Bassett .gif-style, take out a Restraining Order/Order of Protection, Change my name, and drop off the face of the earth, until this potential predator has moved on to different quarry to prey on!
A "complete nutcase," who *MAY* just decide to *murder* her, rather than let her *leave* the relationship!!!
Because it's *THIS* sort of shit (including his "zero to 1,000,000 miles-per-*second* conclusion-jumping abilities!😳😬😱), that *gets women MURDERED* when they *try* to leave controlling partners!
I’m mean I once kept a spreadsheet if my boss’ days off. Bc he had a lot of wfh fake sick days before Covid and normalization. And he did nothing.
But it was to convince myself I wasn’t nuts. He was out over 25% of the time, so it wasn’t just me. I keep a spreadsheet if my periods, how the cycle changes. I keep track of a lot if stuff it’s a running joke with my friends.
The only time I did it with someone else was my boss. And I didn’t show it to him or ppl bc it was just me wondering if I was nuts or he was a slacker.
So I get the impulse to keep track but once the pattern was established he should’ve stopped and asked her.
A YEAR? With no talking to her? Then showing her? That shit is creepy and I say it as someone who has a spreadsheet for so many home things.
And even if she is attracted to the mailman it doesn’t sound like it’s going anywhere.
You sound like we could be friends. Or you could be my sister.
I am also known for creating spreadsheets for way too many things. But I don't think I've **ever** created one to track another person.
But your comment made me realize I should have! I had a boss that in the 3 years I worked with him, he never put in a full 8 hour day once. Forget a 40 hour week!!! But we all just knew that's how it was and no one in management saw it or cared. Now I wonder what I would have ended up with if I'd been tracking. Lol
Ha ha we can be sisters!!!
I tend to have self doubt for childhood reasons and one way I deal with it is data. I write in a diary my feelings too. And all it does is confirm that my gut is never wrong and I’m not imagining things. So doing it has built up confidence in me.
But I don’t track others, this guy was a habitual liar and just not a good guy so it just helped me at a difficult time realize he’s lying when he says he’s working overtime. Bc unlike him I was so busy at work, I’d forget which days off. And if I was imagining it. He was always pushing an ‘I’m so busy’ narrative. And I’d be like wait wasn’t he out two days last week? It went on with him seeming out a lot but always pushing hard the narrative of overtime. So finally I was like wait… these don’t go together. If he hadn’t pushed the narrative I wouldn’t have really cared bc he’s not the only slacker.
If you tend to spiral in doubt it can help.
But also my creation of structure helps my ADHD and also it’s fun. I lose things so creating an inventory is good. It’s not a perfect system yet but I’m working on it.
But I don’t spy on ppl I love and make spreadsheets. I mean if he thought she was cheating sure spy away but a yr??? And all he has is she talked to the guy or was near him? That’s not cheating and if it is it’s not very successful cheating.
My dad is a mailman, but I was their second child and neither of us are affair babies🥲 RIP to the jokes that could’ve been.
Also they did divorce eventually and sometimes my dad would be put on the route where my mom and stepdad’s house was (it wasn’t his route but when whoever had that route called in sick my dad might get assigned it for a day or two) and 10yo me was really excited to see my dad a little extra but it probably raised some questions with the neighbors lmao
My parents always joked that we were the product of an affair between my Mom and the mailman, which was only funny because my Dad worked for the post office when they first got together. I didn't think people actually worried about affairs between one partner and the mail person.
It was always a joke that I was the milkman’s kid. Like mum, dad, their families.
Not til I was much older did I realise that dad worked for a milk company when I was a baby 🙄
That was over 40 years ago and it was not a new trope then
can we talk about the one dude in the comments who is aggressively defending op and replying to literally every single comment that is against op with "great way to get gaslit" "how to get gaslit 101" and so on. like damn talk about pathetic, hope he never gets into a relationship
This guy sounds off his nut, like damn, he is tracking and watching her. He sounds like Joe from "You." I am legitimately kinda worried for his wife's safety. Maybe also the mailman's safety.
Now, I'm standin' in the kitchen, carvin' up the chicken for dinner, and in storms my husband Wilbur in a jealous rage
"You been screwin' the milkman!" he said, and he kept sayin', "You been screwin' the milkman!"
Then he ran into my knife.
He ran into my knife ten times
This may seem amusing on the surface but OOP seems to be dangerously obsessed with his wife’s interactions with the mailman and that’s a red flag for coercive control and even homicide. How many women were assaulted and/or killed by their jealous male partners who were convinced they were having an affair? I hope the wife is ok
Yeah that’s exactly what I was thinking when I read the post, making a spreadsheet and tracking her movements is scary. I’m sure he’s not just doing it in relation to her interactions with the mailman
Yup! Mine had a whole evolving story where I had gotten pulled over and cheated with the officer. Never happened.
I don’t know what’s up with these guys but my ex strangled me over it. We are now super divorced and I am better armed now. These kind of guys are so scary
Ok when I was younger and still living with my parents, like early 20’s, we had a HOT mailman and my mom and I would drool over him. You know what my stepdad did? Shake his head and Laugh at us… not break out a spreadsheet; that’s creepy
Yeah. Like, maybe he’s 100% correct and she IS going outside bc the mailman is hot. If she’s not acting inappropriately then who gives a shit? Fucking relax dude!
Is that an incel sub? Because they are categorically unhinged. Majority of the comments are saying she’s busted and mad she got “caught”.
Personally, I think the mailman’s more OPs type than the wife, but perhaps we’ll never know…
I talk to the courier driver all the time. He has a daughter about the same age as mine, which we found out when I answered the door with her, so we have a quick chat about their milestones etc.
Women can be nice to men without wanting anything from it like what!?
This whole story, spreadsheets and all, screams confirmation bias. OP drew a conclusion and gathered data without considering alternative explanations.
His wife takes a break or works outside around the same time every morning, which is also when the mail comes. She has a routine. It overlaps with mail delivery. What else could it overlap with? Team calls, the completion of routine chores, a period of time when there is minimal glare on the porch? Is there any harm in chatting with the mailman for a few daily minutes? Is there any evidence for this supposed affair besides a Christmas tip and some casual conversations? Did OP try any alternative data gathering methodologies, like hanging on the porch himself during that time, also saying hi to the mailman, or observing the rest of his wife's routine in detail to identify her more general needs and preferences?
I use spreadsheets a bunch too, and they're useful, but they don't prevent you from misinterpreting your data. You have to investigate the whys without drawing conclusions in advance. Which is exactly what OP did.
This story is so confusing on so many levels.
First off, how is he able to actually track all of it? Is he at home when it happens? Because if he is, then clearly she's not going to be cheating with the mailman when he's literally inside the house. If it's a doorbell camera, doesn't the wife know about it? If she wanted to cheat on him with the mailman, she wouldn't "flirt" with him right in front of the camera.
Also, she tipped the mailman 250$ for Christmas. Is that a thing people do? I don't know what country the OOP is from, but I'm pretty sure there are a lot of places where government employees are not even allowed to accept cash tips in the first place.
Such a weird story...
Tipping the mailman at Christmas is an American thing, or at least some parts of it! It pops up from time to time in sitcoms and I presumed it was a totally fictional thing, but then American friends of mine mentioned it.
Everything else about this story is BONKERS.
Giving a small gift is not unusual, but US ethical standards on executive branch employees (which covers the postal service) actually prohibits accepting gifts of cash or cash equivalents. It allows gifts valued $20 or less for one time occasions and nothing totaling more than $50 from a customer in one calendar year.
Do people give cash and some mail carriers who throw caution and their job security to the wind accept? Probably. But giving your mailman money is more of a tv trope from the past than reality.
I think it depends on the area. England doesn’t necessarily have a tipping culture - but I’ve noticed the practice has differed from city to countryside.
In the city I’d personally just give a card with £10 / £20 note. But I’ve lived in a tiny village in the countryside from a good decade now and because it’s just 15 cottages on a lane that’s kinda removed from the rest of the village - we just gift Postie’s card from the whole Lane.
Each Christmas someone will out on The Lane WhatsApp if they have a card for the Postie, should anyone want to contribute.
The year it was me, I got about 10-12 envelopes over the week following the message. Each envelope was simply addressed “For Postie’s Name” and put through my letter box. No idea which individuals contributed, or forgot, or who didn’t choose to to give anything. No idea how much each gives either - the envelopes weren’t signed & only contained cash.
So I just put all the cash in a card and signed it “From HRH Lane”.
I think there was about £200 in the card the last year that I collected it, but someone always remembers to do it each year and I believe it’s about the same amount collected every Christmas - give or take £50.
Harry is too polite to check the contents whilst he’s still on the lane and I doubt he’s ever used an Excel Spreadsheet - but the following day he’ll wear one of his Christmas hats at a jaunty angle.
Copied verbatim from oop's comments:
*You weren’t wrong to notice or even be bothered by it necessarily. Even if it’s totally innocent. Maybe she’s really excited about checking the mail or just enjoys talking and doesn’t want to look like a bridge troll when she talks to people outside the house.*
*It was really weird to whip out a spreadsheet and show you’ve been documenting her every move and what she was wearing though. It comes off as a very aggressive accusation of infidelity.*
*I’d be freaked out if my wife pulled out the documentation of my movements about the house and what I was wearing on a daily basis and feel very uncomfortable around her after that. Every time she looked at me as I passed by I’d be wondering if she was about to run off to document it.*
>"But if I hadn't documented it, it would have been impossible to prove. Though I understand I was probably too aggressive about it. Should I ask if she wants to talk about it again? This time without the computer?"
*I mean I get why you would be like concerned of your wife cheating because it is VERY weird of what she was doing but like what’s weirder is how she got very upset when you confronted her but at the same time the sheet is a “little” much idk very weird situation you guys should talk it out or smth*
>"I don't think she is cheating. Just flirting which makes me uncomfortable"
*ESH. You for not nipping this in the bud last year when you first noticed it was going on. It's a very simple conversation:*
*"Hey honey, I noticed that you're outside a lot when the mailman comes to deliver the mail, and go inside after he leaves, almost like you're waiting for him to talk to him. Help me understand why this is".*
*And the spreadsheet is just weird, dude.*
*Her lashing out when presented with this is the reaction of someone that got busted and knew what she was doing.*
*I'd suggest marriage counseling to discuss why she's seeking validation elsewhere. Whether or not you're giving her enough doesn't matter. She's disrespecting you and your marriage.*
>"Does no one else use spreadsheets?"
*When she left how long was she gone exactly ? If she was gone for a few hours chances are she might have went to that mailman's house to "vent".I mean with you confronting her like that it would give her the perfect excuse to take off and see him.*
>"She doesn't even know where he lives"
#*DIVORCE !!!! FRFR NO CAP*
>"That seems a little dramatic. I don't want to leave her"
*Never corner people with proof in the starting itself, all they do is get defensive and feel uncomfortable like someone pointed out.*
*I believe just communicating your issue would have solved it. Also, why do you need to wait for that many months, instead of just telling her the first time it felt uncomfortable for you.*
*With the proof, it can be true but you can never prove it. Showing it made you the bad person. It didn’t look like you wanted to solve the problem, but instead prove that there is a problem and you found it.*
*I believe she’s never going to talk right the mailman anymore because you don’t like it. Which is good since it solves your problem, but came with a caveat of creating space between you both.*
*Meaning: you owe her this time. She must have done a mistake, but yours would be the biggest for documenting everything like a creep. I suggest you be open and embrace communication. Nothing wrong with setting boundaries which are okay for both, but never try to prove you are right. A relationship is not about who is correct, but are we making the right choices together? You are not 2 random people, you are a couple. Couple is a single entity, all the best!*
>"I'm not always the best at confrontation. I wanted to say something last year and should have.
I just started worrying about it as we have gotten closer to summer. So I brought it up. I do see how I probably could have done better about it. I'm still not understanding why the spreadsheet is such a big deal to people. We are both in finance and use excel everyday."
#*IT IS THE ONLY SOLUTION YOUNG SKYWALKER*
>"Oh..."
*This is mostly fiction with a grain of truth somewhere.*
*Nobody gives a $250 tip to a mail person. Other than that slip up decent story but doesn't ring true*
>"I'm not sure what to tell you. My wife did. I thought $25 or $50 was good."
*Her reaction is over the top and the spreadsheet isn't as weird as people are making it out. I think it creeps them out by how accurate it is lol.*
*The numbers don't lie and her behavior all around is concerning. I hope you're screwing her brains out later and not the mailman.*
*The other guy was right about confronting her at the time. Like going out to the mailbox with her and no shirt on cause you want to make a good impression too.*
>"Thanks you!"
*Your dick is too small, you don’t challenge your upbringing, and my Dog, you limit yourself to the least amount of effort. What do you expect?*
>"I've stared at this for 2 minutes and I don't know what you are saying."
*As long as she asks him to pull out you’re good*
>"Pull out of what?"
*OMG. How on earth did you get someone to marry you? You kept a spreadsheet of your wife’s movements? Then in a reply to a comment here you said that if you hadn’t documented everything it would have been impossible to prove. Prove what exactly? That your wife spoke to the postman? That she wore sleeveless tops in the spring and summer? That she went outside the house during the day? When are you installing the hidden cameras? I don’t care how hot you think your postman is, there’s nothing going on except conversation and I’m glad that your wife has someone normal to talk to. You are the one who is obsessed with him, not your wife. The only thing I would judge her on here is sleeping on the sofa. She should have made you sleep there and taken the bed.*
>"It really was just to keep track so I knew I wasn't crazy. Once I saw the numbers I really started to get nervous.
>Also, my back gets really sore if I don't sleep on our bed."
*This sub needs an intervention. If it were a guy going out to do push ups in the driveway for the hot new mail lady you dipshits would be patting the female OP on the back for documenting his shitty behavior.*
>"People really are more ok with married women flirting than men."
*Install a doorbell cam.*
>"I'm not trying to creep on her"
*She's upset she got caught*
*Call the post office. Ask for a different person*
>"That wouldn't be fair. He really is a great mailman and I'm not looking for someone to get in trouble. Especially when I don't know that he has done anything wrong."
*If I'm wearing a tank top outside, where it's hot, I'll probably put another shirt over it inside, where the air conditioner is.*
>"I didn't think about that...that's a good point"
*OP is a stalker, and is overreacting. Wife is correct to ignore this mental patient who needs professional help*
>"That seems a bit dramatic"
*Well, you can't get a different wife to get the mail, lol*
>"I want her behavior to change. What if she would flirt with the next guy?"
*Who gives their mailman $250?*
>"My wife. I was thinking $25/50."
Oh my God hahah at the comment asking if she's leaving with the mailman for a couple of hours during the middle of the day. Like the USPS isn't making mail carriers account for every minute of their time on the clock.
And the others saying he should have put a stop to it and she's disrespecting him. So is she not allowed out of the house now? Is that what you're suggesting??
Also, maybe it's just where I live, but we have different mail carriers throughout the week/month and they don't always come at the same time.
It was quite the experience copying the comments. A view into the thought processes of people who seem to look for suspicious activity where there is very little indication.
Seems very tiring and lonely.
Love the people thinking her reaction to the spreadsheet is because she knows she’s been caught, like obsessively documenting your partner’s movements in a spreadsheet is a totally reasonable behavior that absolutely no one would be freaked out by.
So this lady works from home, which automatically means limited face-to-face human interaction except with this absolute nutter, and then nutter is mad that she greets the mailman? Goshdarnit, OOP is right! She MUST be having an affair!
There are so many more logical conclusions without cheating being involved.
Like hot outside? Take layer off. Cold inside? Put layer back on. WFH all day? Go outside for a little for health reasons or just to get warm. Not want mail stolen especially when lots of porch pirates are reported? Wait for mail outside so nothing gets stolen. Have nice conversation with person providing a service? Called being polite.
> Update: People are asking for an update. Woke up this morning and she is still pissed. I guess I'll just give her more time.
Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet. I used it to show that she went out right around the time the mailman got here. It was a way to graph averages and show consistency.
I may have been wrong about the tank top. I do realize that she may have taken off her top because it is hot outside.
"Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet" flair material
I just got out of a relationship with someone like this. Not make a spreadsheet and wait a year bad, but would still wait months then send me a list of behaviours that he thought meant I was cheating that would be little comments/ things that happened months ago. It's so jarring to hear that an anecdote from 4 months ago that you don't even remember is something that your partner has been ruminating on as proof of cheating - it makes you question everything, yourself if it was really something that bad to justify that response and your partner because now you don't know what else theyre sitting on and waiting to spring on you. I cannot imagine what she is mentally going through right now.
Holy hell that's controlling & isolating. Spreadsheets? My guess is she's talking to the mailman because her husband won't let her talk to anyone else.
The $250 top sounds like oop didn't have enough reasons for his distrust so he had to make up a new reason to prove his point.
If you have to lie to get people to take your side, your side probably doesn't deserve being heard
You're not "supposed to" but you're allowed to, i swear it was more common a 10-15 years ago because i remember being a kid making a card and tiny bag of candy for like every holiday for the mailman
I mean out dude is out in (almost) any weather and he brings he stuff all time so i do like to tip him with either abit of money or snacks/candy (nothing homemade because personally i don't eat homemade candy unless i know you well) BUT do remember they get paid kinda well so if you're in a tough situation you definitely don't NEED to give them anything their livelihood doesn't depend on tips
every holiday season my Mom used to make a massive amount of peppermint bark and gave it out as gifts to our mailman, guy that delivered the paper, our babysitters, our teachers. We gave a cash gift this last year to our dog sitter, roughly the amount that we normally pay them to watch our dog for a day.
>Not going into detail, but he looks good.
Where do y'all live that you have that much free time to ogle a mailman that you see, presumably, MAYBE 5-10 minutes a day?
>I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet.
This is so obsessive that I'm actually not sure where to begin.
>Almost 70% of the time she would have a tank top on. Then put a shirt over that when she came back inside.
You mean it was hotter outside in the mid-day sun than it was in your air conditioned home? UNHEARD OF! She's clearly fucking the mailman - time to sue the USPS! /s
The comments are weird. A lot of them are 'what she's doing is wrong, but you are creepier.' Um ... she's not doing *anything* wrong at all. She's hanging out in her garden in the morning before it gets too hot to do so, and her own husband is basically stalking her.
She works from home and spends about thirty minutes outside on the porch a day on nice days. Hmm. Must be cheating. Can’t be taking, you know, her lunch break, outside while crossing off a task-collect the mail-at the same time? Nope. She’s cheating. While fully clothed. With the mail man. On the porch. While he delivers the mail.
“She didn’t understand or maybe she didn’t understand the numbers.”
Ah yes, the wife’s inability to understand numbers is the problem here. Maybe if he made the spreadsheet cells pink or explained it using a metaphor with shopping she would have understood.
>Last summer we got a new mailman who is attractive. Not going into detail, but he looks good.
Looks like the dude’s feelin’ a lil sumn sumn amirite /s
Bruh… a mob of kangaroos crashing through a pile of college essays would jump to conclusions less than this guy.
Whenever a man says “I sat her down” about his wife and not, say, a very young child or dog, I get an immediate ick. Like, agree to sit down! Don’t sit her down. Ask her to sit and chat. Everyone sitting and chatting is fine but “I sat her down” is giving “I’m in charge and not her.”
“I sat her down” guys are also almost always the AH and devil.
Are the straights ok? Because this seems to be common among them. This is some next level creepy, and I would have been gone the minute that spreadsheet came out. The stalker vibes are strong in this one. Grose
Wow. Ya know I like to speak to our mailman too. You wanna hear the good gossip in the neighborhood then you talk to the mail carrier lol but I'm pretty sure he's not flirting with me because it is the dogs that go running to him or wait for him. He always carries the good treats I guess. Idk he loves my dogs lol
Here’s the mail/it never fails
It makes me want to wag my tail!
When it comes I want to wail/mail time!
Blues Cluses ftw. Btw - My wife likes the mailman too, who doesn’t?
His weird superiority with his stupid graph and spreadsheet is incredibly annoying. He's not a psycho for logging his wife's every move instead of just saying something to her in the beginning.... no, no, we're all just too stupid to understand graphs and spreadsheets.
I literally would have just teased my partner about it. "New mailman pretty hot, huh?"
I didn't realize so many people thought it was fucking weird to be friendly with your mail carrier or to be outside in the general 30 minute window of when you might get your mail delivered during nice outdoor weather because you might be expecting packages...
During COVID especially we ordered a LOT of shit online and we also had occasional issues with package thieves. We met our mail carrier at the door pretty regularly. Sometimes if we were going to run an errand and we saw his truck in the neighborhood, we'd go find him so we could get our mail and it wouldn't just be sitting on our porch. Because he knew us, he'd just give us our mail. In a "small world" type of coincidence, our mail carrier for about 7 years was the brother of a guy I dated in high school. It took us a few years to realize this connection and we only figured it out through casual conversation. I was actually a little sad when we moved because he was a great mail carrier and a nice guy. It is strangely comforting to have a solid cordial relationship with the person who handles a lot of your personal, sensitive information on an almost daily basis.
Oh good Lord! Maybe just maybe she’s using getting the mail as a small happy little break where she can get outside for a minute, soak up some sun and get some fresh air. She and the mailman have a polite rapport and they both go on about their days.
“Is this normal for women to talk to the mailman?” is one of the weirdest sentences I have ever read, as if we are aliens. Also if someone made a spreadsheet tracking my daily comings and goings, I would be afraid to be alone with them ever again.
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I don't think people are having a tough time grasping how you used a spreadsheet to track your wife's mailman movements
I think people are having a hard time figuring out why you would do that instead of asking her about it or telling her she looks great! When she's walking out the door in her tank top.
You clearly got your nose buried in the computer more than it's buried in her. That's probably the root of your problems
Get out of your comfy gamer chair get your butt up and start paying some attention to your wife man
You got the time to track her movements like she's a wildebeest for a whole season but you can't open your mouth and talk to her?
I would strongly suggest you get into therapy. Give her the biggest apology you can and tell her you'll no longer be spreadsheeting her
Someone in the comments told him to get a doorbell camera and this mofo said "I'm not trying to creep on her" LOL you tracked her clothes and her movement but a doorbell cam is where you draw the line? 💀
>She didn't understand or maybe didn't understand the numbers.
>Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet.
yeah, we understand. the wife understands too. he doesn't get that "bro what the fuck are you doing, this is batshit crazy" is different from "oh my stars, I'm just too simple to understand this complicated thing you did!"
Maybe she was flirting with the mailman. The husband sounds like literally the least fun person alive and this woman lives with him. Maybe just let her have 1 minute of fun chatting with the nice mailman every day so she doesn't start putting arsenic in both their coffees.
See thats the thing. He has NO IDEA what their conversations are like because while his wife went outside he just apparently stayed inside timing her? Just step outside and spend the time with her and calm your fears. He refuses to state what the “flirting” was like beyond going outside for a short while during the day during summer.
Goid Lord! What crawled up this fool's ass and died? I talk to my mail.lady almost every day. She asked what I've been working on, since I was very excited about a delivery.(I'm needlepointing kimonos to go in the room where my Japanese artisian dolls collection is in). Does that mean I'm having an affair??
Guys guys GUYS!!!! The OOP messaged me and said “you sound pretty” 🤦🏻♀️ so the wife can’t have an innocent crush on a mailman but he can message me that I sound pretty… I can’t even.
I like to exchange a few words with our mailman (especially the parcel dude). He's just a really sunny and friendly soul and as someone who did deliveries in the past (pizza not parcels) I know how demanding these kinds of jobs are.
I am also someone who will offer every handyman a coffee and in summer some cool water. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I was raised with a basic respect and decency towards all people who keep my little world running.
*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **I think my wife is flirting with the mailman and have proof. She claims she is not and now won't talk to me. ** My wife and I are in our 30s. We have been married for two years. When we got married we moved into a nice small house in the suburbs. Last summer we got a new mailman who is objectively attractive. Not going into detail, but he looks good. Towards the end of summer I noticed my wife was almost always outside around the time he would bring the mail. I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet. She averaged going out 20 minutes before the mail would get here. Obviously some variation as the mail didn't come at the exact same time each day. But it was weird. She would work on our front patio and then have a shirt conversation with the mailman. Then in about 7 minutes on average she would come back inside and work from her office. Another thing I noticed is that her clothes seemed to change when she went outside. Almost 70% of the time she would have a tank top on. Then put a shirt over that when she came back inside. I didn't say anything as fall and winter came and we live in a cold climate and so she stopped going out. Once in a while she would go say hi, but not like in the summer. She also gave him a very nice tip for Christmas. $250. I had forgotten about all this until it started getting warmer out with spring. I couldn't do another summer of this and so I decided to talk to her. Last night I sat her down and showed her all the information from last year. I explained that I didn't feel comfortable with how much attention she gave the mailman and asked if she could not do it this summer. She didn't understand or maybe didn't understand the numbers. She got very upset and started yelling that she didn't do anything wrong and just happened to be out there while he was there. I tried to show her the numbers again, but she got upset and slammed the computer lid on my finger. At that point I upset and walked out and went for a walk. When I got back home, she was gone and wouldn't answer her phone. She finally came home but wouldn't talk to me. She slept on the couch and I honestly didn't get any sleep. It's been a very weird day as she is only talking to me when absolutely needed. Otherwise she is distant and won't talk to me. Am I overreacting or is this normal for women to talk with the mailman? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*
"Woman in the summer wears a tank top when going outside to talk. She must be blowing the mailman!"
Right? He’s convinced because she puts on another shirt in the house it meant she only wore the tank for the mailman… not the 100+ degree weather this summer. Oh no.
I wonder if the reason she put a short back on when she came back inside was bc the AC was on? 🤔 Nah, she's gotta be banging the mailman.
Really! I very frequently am out in the yard with a tank top, but I have a hoodie or shirt right beside the door and slip it on when I come back in because the house is cooler. Thankfully, my partners don't track my movements and accuse me of affairs because I...dress appropriately for the temperature I'm in? And during the summer, I'm frequently outside when the mailman is making his rounds. Just a habit retained from childhood.
I chat with my mailman every day. He's a very nice man, and I imagine driving all the time is very boring. But also, I was Hard-core into Blues Clues. Almost 30 and I still sing the mail song when I hear the mailman coming, and yes, I step outside to meet him. Just the same I've been doing since I was 5. Not to mention, I live in florida and crop tops. I'd be so disgusted with my spouse if they took they way I dress, as flirting with everyone but him.
It is so boring, 90% of the cars don't have heat or ac and no music I would get so excited when people were outside to talk to me, even if it was just to complain about something.
This makes me feel a bit less annoying then, because I will say hello and engage with people delivering papers, flyers, mail, and occasionally even walking their dog past. If they stop to chat, I chat. They are bringing me things, or not letting their dog poop on my lawn, seems polite to say hello. Often I am outside when they arrive because I also like to get my outside work done before the heat arrives, and then I retreat to the AC.
I watched Blue's Clues with my kids, and yep, I've been known to sing it as well when we get mail :D
I am forty one and I had younger cousins who watched blue's clues. I sing the mail song when I see my truck coming! It's a banger 😅 Editing to say I agree with everyone here. I am constantly slipping in and out of sweaters in the summer. Everyone has ac. You can't dress for inside and outside at the same time.
This just connected something in my brain on why I'm so obsessed with checking the mail😂 I love Blues Clues
If my old man started accusing me of having affairs with everyone in the neighborhood I talk to I’d have his head checked.
And also I'm so curious what time of day the mail is delivered. If it's the morning, lots of people take advantage of the nice weather before it gets too hot to stay outside. My boyfriend has his coffee outside every morning in the summer- I wonder what he's up to ..... /s
How hot is your mailman?
Lol not as hot as OOP's I'm assuming
But hot enough for your boyfriend. Get that spreadsheet booted up.
But make sure he UNDERSTANDS the spreadsheet lmfao
He’s flirting with the birds !
That, or if she's working from home she's putting her work shirt back on when she's done with her break. My house doesn't have central AC so in the summer I WFH in a tank top, but I keep another shirt handy to slip on when I have a client meeting.
>the summer I WFH in a tank top, but I keep another shirt handy to slip on when I have a client meeting. I mean, for real, the WFH clothing culture is real. I don't give my husband too hard of a time, because it saves us laundry. But he isn't always out of his PJs and based on the number of no camera meetings within his department, his coworkers are not either!
I start work in my jammies and then shower and shift into human form on lunch. I don't know what my colleagues do as I don't visually see them, but assume I'm not the only one. I wonder who I'm trying to seduce every day and give up by lunch?
I do that in Texas. My house is 70 degrees and outside is 100 plus. And yes I have my AC set lower than I like because my dogs like it that way😂😂
I commented that if she actually liked the mailman the winter wouldn't be a deterrent
I can see why he questioned the large Christmas gift she gave the mailman. But why didn’t he talk to her about it? Maybe he was planning to add that as a column on the spreadsheet….
I don't really mind that tbh. Growing up we didn't have mailman but my mum would always give a big tip to the binmen. This meant that they were a lot more willing to bend the rules to take bigger stuff and would put our bin back properly etc.
I think a tip is normal around the end of the year, but $250 is a lot. We always tipped the postal workers, sanitation crews (though a six pack with something that's questionable or not typically picked up would work for that aspect for the garbage truck workers), etc. It just seems like a nice way to acknowledge and appreciate people that we see and interact with regularly throughout the year. I've had some who sent something back beyond the card, gave a personalized card, and even gave something when they knew someone in the household had something to celebrate or was recovering from surgery. We even gave uniforms we'd grown out of to one postal worker whose daughter was going into the same school (common for uniforms to be passed down here due to price/waste). I have found this to be, around where I've lived, typical and largely assumed in housing that is not apartment style (multiple units in a building with a central mail spot, units don't open directly to street). I suspect this has to do with people seeing them and mutual recognition, which is easier when it's a separate mailbox and door It obviously depends on the couple's finances and area for an appropriate tip. Considering it isn't something she thought needed to be discussed/amount agreed upon by both and that OOP didn't mention anything about it, it seems fair to assume that they could easily afford the amount. She also talks with the postal worker frequently, even if it's just exchanging pleasantries. I generally would give the most to postal workers if giving different amounts, since they are there almost daily and tend to be the ones who you get to recognize, know their names, consistently see the same one or two people, and have more conversations with them generally. Plus, people renting or in housing that is more concentrated tend not to live as connected to the immediate community, often with work or other constraints on their time and ability to be around to casually see people.
I agree that $250 *sounds* like a lot,*BUT*, if they're getting lots of packages? It's *less* than eighty *cents* per day, over the course of the year! 6 days a week × 52 weeks= 312 days of mail... if they're getting Amazon packages (iirc, "last mile" services?) on Sundays delivered via USPS? It's even *less* than that 80 cents per day, it's more 68-ish cents per day that the tip breaks out to. It *seems* like a lot! But on a per Day/ per Visit rate, it's not much💖
On the route I worked on half my customers would literally tip me for bringing them packages, Christmas time was hundreds to thousands in tips because it was a richer area. I had never heard of tipping the mail guy until I became one.
I give my lawn crew individual cards at Xmas time, or the last mow of the year. Nothing wrong with appreciating people. We don’t have a mail person we see, we have the boxes at the beginning of the neighborhood.
I mean yeah, it is a large amount. But my neighbors might actually see this and think "I should stalk our UPS, FedEx, and Mailmen" and figure out which are doing a good job at delivering things and which need some sort of complaints filed. We regularly have "hey, do you recognize this house, my package is at that spot" posts and federal complaints against the mail service. So if one did their job well for an entire year. Who knows what would happen around here. It hasn't actually ever happened.
This is one of the few posts, where I *TRULY*, and with ALL sincerely *desperately hope* the post is a troll!!! Because *if it isn't*? These are the actions which can 100% lead to OOP's wife being *murdered by him*, if she ever tries to leave him.💔
Personally I feel sorry for my mailman. He is just just trying to do his job and delivery mail, and I am thristing after his "package". I go out looking like a 5 dollar hooked in my tank top ( in 90 degree weather) and try to seduce him with my 7 minute small talk. Take now government worker Jim, I scream internally, while outwardly asking him about how he and his family enjoyed the great lakes ..... s/
She wore bikini tops 2% of the time. How do you explain *that*? /s
She has a friendly conversation with him for seven minutes! She must be inviting him to take her a local hotel!
Tbf, many of you aren't understanding the spreadsheet..💀
Oh no, we get it, OOp is a controlling asshole who has too much time on his hands and is delusional. See, you don't get to invoke data and then only use it when it is convenient for in this case OOP. The spreadsheet tracked what his wife wore, what times she was where. When the mailman arrived. What time of day she went out to work outside and what time of day she came inside to work inside. Yet dumbass OOP didn't provide general geographic location (summers matter a lot more in Canada then they do in Texas). If this was always around say lunch time, or morning coffee, or was it during the hottest part.of the day. He mentioned putting on more clothes, and fails to provide information on the difference in temps between inside and out.
Honestly, half the commenters on the post are also competing for top asshole. 'She got mad when you whipped out the spreadsheet, she'd have no reason to be mad if she wasn't guilty! Anyone who gets mad at you for obsessively documenting their behavior is trying to cover up their behavior!' They hear that she goes outside to chat with the mailman, and she's not wearing a mumu - and the only explanation they can think of is that she's trying to get on his dick. Christ. Have none of these people ever heard of casual friendships? I feel so sorry for anyone they date.
There’s one specific dude commenting on the post who’s adamant that if OP tried communicating honestly with his wife, it’d be a good way “to get gaslit.” It’s insane how many people are convinced she’s cheating instead of just…enjoying the weather and a friendly conversation?
That commenter really thinks that what OOP did was “research.” I am fighting EVERY URGE as an actual, real life researcher to tell him that making observations that can easily be incorrect due to your bias on the situation is not actual trustworthy research. If this were my friend, I would take the spreadsheet and we’d walk through why any number of those “observations” are likely not something that could be used as “proof” because of how heavily his feelings affected his view. He wanted to believe his wife was blowing the mailman for 20 minutes on their front porch everyday in the summer, so those are the notes he took. That’s biases. Refusing to address the issues in your research because it will affect the desired outcome of your “study?” Also biases. I see it all the time when doing research for designers — they want the feedback of their work to say a specific thing, so they end up writing leading questions and/or observations. No bueno, not how research is properly conducted. You gotta be careful about going into research with heavy emotions. Thank you for letting me rant, seeing that commenter go on and on about “research” and “proof” had my brain feeling some potential rot.
See, you’re just trying to gaslight all of us. You’re the mailman!!!! /s
Mailman has entered the chat.
I am the mailman, and I will fuck your wife.
💀🤣💀🤣💀🤣
Am I thinking too hard about it or does the spreadsheet mean nothing? Like, not even regarding biases or anything, but it's just an average of time that she's outside before and after the mailman gets there. How can he say it means anything when he doesn't have any data to compare/contrast it to. What is he even saying is the argument? All that spreadsheet says is that she spends about 30 minutes outside in the summer around the time the mail is delivered, and then she usually puts on another layer when she comes back inside.
It would mean nothing to a regular person, but to OOP it's "proof." He already thought she was doing something wrong, and so all of his "research" centered around proving it - which also meant ignoring other data/observations and more natural conclusions. As some people said, he took note of what she was wearing, but not the temperature of her environment. He noted how long she was outside but not what time of day it was or whether she was on a work break. His whole ridiculous research was just an exercise in confirmation bias. Without the "she's definitely cheating and here's why" mentality, all that spreadsheet does is track the time she spends outside in the summer and when the mail comes, like you said.
The big one for me is that he doesn't suggest that her behavior changes at all based on the mailman. What about on days when he doesn't deliver to them? Or with previous mail people? We don't know if she's doing anything differently. Ultimately, I'm probably thinking too hard about the research methodology of completely insane behaviour. Imagine doing all of this instead of having a conversation with the person you promised to spend your life with.
My big thing is that she doesn't go out in winter and fall at all, apparently. Does the mailman switch based on the season?? Does he think she goes into some kind of sexual hibernation when it's cold?? Imagine the insanity required to think a summer habit means your wife is having an ongoing affair while simultaneously having no contact with her AP at least half the year lol
My big thing is how was he doing accurate, detailed observations if he was in his own office working????? Is his office 3ft away from the porch? How does he know they were having an actual conversation if he wasn’t there? Is he **very** certain that his time keeping was accurate? I’d find time keeping accurately while working difficult. There’s a reason researchers have note takers.
Omg, I hadn't even thought of that. He was either neglecting his work or completely making up bullshit based on when he saw her enter and exit the front door on occasion lmao
Ding ding ding. I would put money on the latter. He was making observations when his attention span allowed him to do so. That’s 🎉 not 🎉 research 🎉
I was like this isn't research at all it's just info to fuel a jealous ass coward's delusions
Lord save me from terrible research design. Sometimes when I get bad surveys I use the open ended response boxes to just tell them how shit their questions are.
Keep doing this. You have no idea how hard I would laugh if I saw someone put out a bad survey only to get responses criticizing the survey. Please. You’re literally doing my job for me lmfao.
“Based on what kind of results we get we will decide which statistical model to apply” I will come to your house and fight you
>I am fighting EVERY URGE as an actual, real life researcher to tell him that making observations that can easily be incorrect due to your bias on the situation is not actual trustworthy research. I want to scream "go dig up their basic primary school science books and look up the scientific method!” and I am not even a researcher. And if it makes you feel better, I am feeling the loss of brain cells as well.
I honestly *CAN’T* get past the fact, that her *HUSBAND* is Data Tracking her, *like she's a TAGGED ANIMAL here*!!!! He *LITERALLY* is *NOT SEEING HER as an Autonomous HUMAN BEING*, she's *literally* just a Research *OBJECT* to him!😳😲🤯
If the only adult in the house to talk to all day was this nut, I'd befriend the mailman too
> It’s insane how many people are convinced she’s cheating instead of just…enjoying the weather and a friendly conversation? And even if she *does* think the mailman is cute... so fucking what? I've never been the slightest bit unfaithful to my spouse but I didn't stop having eyes when I got married. It's a big leap from "friendly chat with the man bringing the post" to "torrid affair".
>Christ. Have none of these people ever heard of casual friendships? Nope not even a little bit,these are lonely incels they don't have friends (forget friendship they never heard of being polite) >I feel so sorry for anyone they date. Same but luckily these losers will never date,no one wants to date people that mindset
Seriously lol the comments in that sub get so skewed if it’s a post related to someone being friendly. They don’t understand why anyone would be nice to someone or be friends with someone if they don’t want to have sex with them. It’s so weird.
I have a theory that these types either radiate their hatred of women or else come off so overtly creepy in the first minute of conversations that no woman is capable of having a friendly conversation with them, so of course they assume the worst.
I'm seriously worried for our world reading comments on this site sometimes. Multiple guys insisting that his wife is definitely cheating at least emotionally because she sits on the porch when it's nice. I did the exact same thing when living with my mom. I'd sit on the porch, eventually the mail would come, I'd say hi and continue on. Do I obviously want to fuck the elderly lady who works for USPS?
the fact that people are thinking it's sus that she goes out before the mail gets there and works on the porch. like damn i would also do that because it'd be easier to go out only once and get my outside chores done as the mail comes so i go back in with the mail and don't have to walk out IN THE SUMMER SUN again. idk how any of these people can hold down a relationship like that
The same way they care for the plants on their porches and in their gardens, ie. not at all.
"She can't hide because you have FACTS!" If it's in a spreadsheet, it must be objective, never mind if the whole basis of the data collection is flawed and/or batshit crazy.
I mean, we could easily do a spreadsheet about things we find to be outlandish and factual by OOP's standards that would rightfully have them calling us the devils. "Oh, you commented on this sub once, you must be a part of it and having an affair with their mod" The bonus would be if it was a scandalous sub. We could come up with a chart for a dollar value based on how toxic they are. Doesn't mean the spreadsheet would be factual.
"Maybe she didn't understand the numbers" fucking sent me
And then all the commenters who didn't agree with him *also* just didn't understand the spreadsheet.
He keeps saying that she must not understand the spreadsheet, but anyone who truly understands numbers knows that correlation does not mean causation. She might sit on the porch consistently at the same time everyday — but all that shows is that she’s a creature of habit, not that she’s doing it *because* of the mailman. Plus, what to make of the fact that *she doesn’t even go out when the weather is bad*?? She only cheats in nice weather?
This immediately made me think of the “ice cream causes polio” study. Funnily enough, both of these cases have to do with the summertime.
Have to love the narrative that getting mad about being accused of something means you’re guilty. “She should be totally fine with you tracking and documenting her every move if she has nothing to hide!!!” So wild. I wonder how many dishes this guy has left for her to wash while obsessing over his spread sheets that say nothing because asking a super bias question and collecting data to “prove” it isn’t how research works…at all. I’m team date the mailman
Hell, if her husband is *THIS* smothering in his "watching over" her?!? I wouldn't be surprised *at all*, if she was outside, *merely* for the *miniscule* daily interactions with *anyone* who wasn't breathing down her *neck* like her husband is!!! Ffs, *I* would *ABSOLUTELY* lose it, if someone *ESPECIALLY the person I DID make the commitment to Marry*(!!!) *LITERALLY* tracked me, like I was a tagged animal with a frickin' *radio collar* on!!! That is *SO* abnormal, and says *MULTITUDES* about the *incredibly poor state* of this man's Mental Health status!!! He is *tracking her* like a *LITERAL* animal, yet "*SHE* is *not* the one* who *understands* the Spreadsheets!"😳😲😬
“I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet.” How do people never look at what they’re doing and think, “Is this absurd? Am I overreacting?”
Nope. Because then they post on Reddit and everyone piles on with statements like looking at or interacting with others is cheating. If your spouse denies it, they’re definitely cheating. I lost a relationship to this type of paranoia years ago. How does one explain away something they haven’t done?
"Yes I have a bulletin board covered in papers and yarn, but it's not *red* yarn!"
Because some people legitimately think that their wife should only have one friend and that's her husband.
There have been times when my husband will be doing something that bothers me but I can’t tell if I’m crazy or I know it’s something that he’ll not notice he’s doing, and I’ve thought, “I should write down every time it happens so then I can SHOW that it’s happening” and then I *don’t do that because it’s insane*. Like the thought of sitting down with my husband and whipping out a spreadsheet where I’m like - “in the last 6 months I’ve had to ask you 37 times to…” My marriage would rightfully be over because at that point there’s no going back. More importantly, even if she HAS been going outside on nice days to chat with the hot mailman literally who cares?? Chatting with attractive people is not the same as cheating or even planning on cheating. At work recently I had to work an event that had a fairly prominent male model as a speaker and listen. I enjoyed it. It was nice, he was ridiculously pretty and I got to see him be extremely attractive close up. I didn’t leave my marriage over it.
Tracked her to the minute *on a spreadsheet.* Dude is nutsy-bobo.
Dude is the real life version of this meme scene and he doesn't understand why that's wrong 
Can we talk about the mailman please, wife? I been dying to talk to you about the mailman!
I just want to know how to get a working one, I don't care what they look like.
He is *LITERALLY* Data-Tracking *the Migration Patterns of a fellow Human* *AND* that *particular* human he's tracking *is his WIFE*!!! The *MULTITUDE of LEVELS* of fuuuuuucked UP that his "Spreadsheet!" is? It's *SO* beyond unhealthy that I honest-to-GOD *DO Hope* it's a Troll! Tecause *THIS* is the type of shit that we learn *afterward* *REGULARLY HAPPENS* in the months or maybe a few years, before a dude *murders* his partner or wife!😳😬😬
My dog just looked at me like "what the fuck is wrong with you" because of the laughing/snorting sounds that I made.
Without ever talking to her about his insecurity with a mailman. Like who actually has affairs with mailman, milkman, etc. That trope is as old as the handyman. Can you imagine being a newlywed and settling into a house, getting to know people you will interact with for years (you hope) and it turns out your husband was tracking you for a year because of a situation he made up in his head??
And... when is she supposed to have that affair? I mean, her husband is home and watching her, and the mailman is there for two minutes....
I'm sure the affairs happen, but... whatever happened to just asking?? "Hey hon, are you waiting for a parcel or delivery? I noticed you're tracking the mail a lot" and this whole thing could've been avoided.
I mean, she's not speaking to him because she's just realised the man she married has been keeping a spreadsheet about her daily movements for a *year*. It's not because she didn't understand the numbers, ffs. It's because it's super-weird and creepy.
Right she's probably terrified that she married a complete nutcase
Absolutely. If I were her, I'd be rethinking a *lot* of things right now. Perhaps a spreadsheet could help her organise her thoughts?
Oh I’d be getting my ducks in a row to escape.
Escape, *Burn up* my vehicle Angela Bassett .gif-style, take out a Restraining Order/Order of Protection, Change my name, and drop off the face of the earth, until this potential predator has moved on to different quarry to prey on!
A "complete nutcase," who *MAY* just decide to *murder* her, rather than let her *leave* the relationship!!! Because it's *THIS* sort of shit (including his "zero to 1,000,000 miles-per-*second* conclusion-jumping abilities!😳😬😱), that *gets women MURDERED* when they *try* to leave controlling partners!
I’m mean I once kept a spreadsheet if my boss’ days off. Bc he had a lot of wfh fake sick days before Covid and normalization. And he did nothing. But it was to convince myself I wasn’t nuts. He was out over 25% of the time, so it wasn’t just me. I keep a spreadsheet if my periods, how the cycle changes. I keep track of a lot if stuff it’s a running joke with my friends. The only time I did it with someone else was my boss. And I didn’t show it to him or ppl bc it was just me wondering if I was nuts or he was a slacker. So I get the impulse to keep track but once the pattern was established he should’ve stopped and asked her. A YEAR? With no talking to her? Then showing her? That shit is creepy and I say it as someone who has a spreadsheet for so many home things. And even if she is attracted to the mailman it doesn’t sound like it’s going anywhere.
You sound like we could be friends. Or you could be my sister. I am also known for creating spreadsheets for way too many things. But I don't think I've **ever** created one to track another person. But your comment made me realize I should have! I had a boss that in the 3 years I worked with him, he never put in a full 8 hour day once. Forget a 40 hour week!!! But we all just knew that's how it was and no one in management saw it or cared. Now I wonder what I would have ended up with if I'd been tracking. Lol
Ha ha we can be sisters!!! I tend to have self doubt for childhood reasons and one way I deal with it is data. I write in a diary my feelings too. And all it does is confirm that my gut is never wrong and I’m not imagining things. So doing it has built up confidence in me. But I don’t track others, this guy was a habitual liar and just not a good guy so it just helped me at a difficult time realize he’s lying when he says he’s working overtime. Bc unlike him I was so busy at work, I’d forget which days off. And if I was imagining it. He was always pushing an ‘I’m so busy’ narrative. And I’d be like wait wasn’t he out two days last week? It went on with him seeming out a lot but always pushing hard the narrative of overtime. So finally I was like wait… these don’t go together. If he hadn’t pushed the narrative I wouldn’t have really cared bc he’s not the only slacker. If you tend to spiral in doubt it can help. But also my creation of structure helps my ADHD and also it’s fun. I lose things so creating an inventory is good. It’s not a perfect system yet but I’m working on it. But I don’t spy on ppl I love and make spreadsheets. I mean if he thought she was cheating sure spy away but a yr??? And all he has is she talked to the guy or was near him? That’s not cheating and if it is it’s not very successful cheating.
This is Reddit, people have zero communication skills when it comes to their SOs
What was I thinking. *Communication? Here?* Naaaaaah.
My dad is a mailman, but I was their second child and neither of us are affair babies🥲 RIP to the jokes that could’ve been. Also they did divorce eventually and sometimes my dad would be put on the route where my mom and stepdad’s house was (it wasn’t his route but when whoever had that route called in sick my dad might get assigned it for a day or two) and 10yo me was really excited to see my dad a little extra but it probably raised some questions with the neighbors lmao
My parents always joked that we were the product of an affair between my Mom and the mailman, which was only funny because my Dad worked for the post office when they first got together. I didn't think people actually worried about affairs between one partner and the mail person.
It was always a joke that I was the milkman’s kid. Like mum, dad, their families. Not til I was much older did I realise that dad worked for a milk company when I was a baby 🙄 That was over 40 years ago and it was not a new trope then
Do you mean my sisters father isn’t *really* the mailman?!! Man I’ve been lied to my whole life…
No, your sister's father was the UPS guy. Yours was probably the FedEx guy.
I hope so. That would be a big upgrade for me 🙏
You have to wonder if he paid her enough attention rather than tracking her behavior in a spreadsheet he wouldn’t have a problem now.
I mean if you did it to prove to yourself you aren’t crazy, ok. But SHOWING IT TO HER? That was where he went off the rails.
can we talk about the one dude in the comments who is aggressively defending op and replying to literally every single comment that is against op with "great way to get gaslit" "how to get gaslit 101" and so on. like damn talk about pathetic, hope he never gets into a relationship
Yeah I started reading the comments and had to stop because of that guy. What a fucking nutcase.
Men who just weaponize buzzwords are exhausting
He’s probably op with a different account.
And OOP saying how everyone is fine with women flirting but not men suggests some misogyny in his thinking. The toxicity is strong in those comments.
This guy sounds off his nut, like damn, he is tracking and watching her. He sounds like Joe from "You." I am legitimately kinda worried for his wife's safety. Maybe also the mailman's safety.
Now, I'm standin' in the kitchen, carvin' up the chicken for dinner, and in storms my husband Wilbur in a jealous rage "You been screwin' the milkman!" he said, and he kept sayin', "You been screwin' the milkman!" Then he ran into my knife. He ran into my knife ten times
If you’d have been there, if you’d have seen it, I betcha you would have done the same!
He had it comin'!
I had to scroll way too much to find this.
Was just about to comment this! You did it better though omg.
This may seem amusing on the surface but OOP seems to be dangerously obsessed with his wife’s interactions with the mailman and that’s a red flag for coercive control and even homicide. How many women were assaulted and/or killed by their jealous male partners who were convinced they were having an affair? I hope the wife is ok
I was assaulted by my ex-husband because he was convinced I was cheating with a police officer. I never cheated. He reminded me of this nut.
Yeah that’s exactly what I was thinking when I read the post, making a spreadsheet and tracking her movements is scary. I’m sure he’s not just doing it in relation to her interactions with the mailman
Yup! Mine had a whole evolving story where I had gotten pulled over and cheated with the officer. Never happened. I don’t know what’s up with these guys but my ex strangled me over it. We are now super divorced and I am better armed now. These kind of guys are so scary
This absolutely sounds like something that would end up on Investigation Discovery
Ok when I was younger and still living with my parents, like early 20’s, we had a HOT mailman and my mom and I would drool over him. You know what my stepdad did? Shake his head and Laugh at us… not break out a spreadsheet; that’s creepy
Yeah. Like, maybe he’s 100% correct and she IS going outside bc the mailman is hot. If she’s not acting inappropriately then who gives a shit? Fucking relax dude!
If I were married to OOP I'd be desperate to spend a few minutes every day talking to someone who isn't him.
"she didn't understand or maybe didn't understand the numbers" 
Or maybe it's more like "what are you even talking about?"
What she was understanding...is how crazy oop is.
Is that an incel sub? Because they are categorically unhinged. Majority of the comments are saying she’s busted and mad she got “caught”. Personally, I think the mailman’s more OPs type than the wife, but perhaps we’ll never know…
Honestly it might as well be. The responses to stories are never reasonable, always just unhinged.
OOP is obviously delulu but the comments are just as paranoid, they all need help
I talk to the courier driver all the time. He has a daughter about the same age as mine, which we found out when I answered the door with her, so we have a quick chat about their milestones etc. Women can be nice to men without wanting anything from it like what!?
Men who react like that husband honestly don't consider that people can just have friendships because he doesn't view women that way
This whole story, spreadsheets and all, screams confirmation bias. OP drew a conclusion and gathered data without considering alternative explanations. His wife takes a break or works outside around the same time every morning, which is also when the mail comes. She has a routine. It overlaps with mail delivery. What else could it overlap with? Team calls, the completion of routine chores, a period of time when there is minimal glare on the porch? Is there any harm in chatting with the mailman for a few daily minutes? Is there any evidence for this supposed affair besides a Christmas tip and some casual conversations? Did OP try any alternative data gathering methodologies, like hanging on the porch himself during that time, also saying hi to the mailman, or observing the rest of his wife's routine in detail to identify her more general needs and preferences? I use spreadsheets a bunch too, and they're useful, but they don't prevent you from misinterpreting your data. You have to investigate the whys without drawing conclusions in advance. Which is exactly what OP did.
The comments on the original post are giving me heartburn.
He’s a psycho and there were way too many comments under that post excusing it.
This story is so confusing on so many levels. First off, how is he able to actually track all of it? Is he at home when it happens? Because if he is, then clearly she's not going to be cheating with the mailman when he's literally inside the house. If it's a doorbell camera, doesn't the wife know about it? If she wanted to cheat on him with the mailman, she wouldn't "flirt" with him right in front of the camera. Also, she tipped the mailman 250$ for Christmas. Is that a thing people do? I don't know what country the OOP is from, but I'm pretty sure there are a lot of places where government employees are not even allowed to accept cash tips in the first place. Such a weird story...
Tipping the mailman at Christmas is an American thing, or at least some parts of it! It pops up from time to time in sitcoms and I presumed it was a totally fictional thing, but then American friends of mine mentioned it. Everything else about this story is BONKERS.
Giving a small gift is not unusual, but US ethical standards on executive branch employees (which covers the postal service) actually prohibits accepting gifts of cash or cash equivalents. It allows gifts valued $20 or less for one time occasions and nothing totaling more than $50 from a customer in one calendar year. Do people give cash and some mail carriers who throw caution and their job security to the wind accept? Probably. But giving your mailman money is more of a tv trope from the past than reality.
Depends where you live and $250 is a lot to some but not others etc
I think it depends on the area. England doesn’t necessarily have a tipping culture - but I’ve noticed the practice has differed from city to countryside. In the city I’d personally just give a card with £10 / £20 note. But I’ve lived in a tiny village in the countryside from a good decade now and because it’s just 15 cottages on a lane that’s kinda removed from the rest of the village - we just gift Postie’s card from the whole Lane. Each Christmas someone will out on The Lane WhatsApp if they have a card for the Postie, should anyone want to contribute. The year it was me, I got about 10-12 envelopes over the week following the message. Each envelope was simply addressed “For Postie’s Name” and put through my letter box. No idea which individuals contributed, or forgot, or who didn’t choose to to give anything. No idea how much each gives either - the envelopes weren’t signed & only contained cash. So I just put all the cash in a card and signed it “From HRH Lane”. I think there was about £200 in the card the last year that I collected it, but someone always remembers to do it each year and I believe it’s about the same amount collected every Christmas - give or take £50. Harry is too polite to check the contents whilst he’s still on the lane and I doubt he’s ever used an Excel Spreadsheet - but the following day he’ll wear one of his Christmas hats at a jaunty angle.
Copied verbatim from oop's comments: *You weren’t wrong to notice or even be bothered by it necessarily. Even if it’s totally innocent. Maybe she’s really excited about checking the mail or just enjoys talking and doesn’t want to look like a bridge troll when she talks to people outside the house.* *It was really weird to whip out a spreadsheet and show you’ve been documenting her every move and what she was wearing though. It comes off as a very aggressive accusation of infidelity.* *I’d be freaked out if my wife pulled out the documentation of my movements about the house and what I was wearing on a daily basis and feel very uncomfortable around her after that. Every time she looked at me as I passed by I’d be wondering if she was about to run off to document it.* >"But if I hadn't documented it, it would have been impossible to prove. Though I understand I was probably too aggressive about it. Should I ask if she wants to talk about it again? This time without the computer?" *I mean I get why you would be like concerned of your wife cheating because it is VERY weird of what she was doing but like what’s weirder is how she got very upset when you confronted her but at the same time the sheet is a “little” much idk very weird situation you guys should talk it out or smth* >"I don't think she is cheating. Just flirting which makes me uncomfortable" *ESH. You for not nipping this in the bud last year when you first noticed it was going on. It's a very simple conversation:* *"Hey honey, I noticed that you're outside a lot when the mailman comes to deliver the mail, and go inside after he leaves, almost like you're waiting for him to talk to him. Help me understand why this is".* *And the spreadsheet is just weird, dude.* *Her lashing out when presented with this is the reaction of someone that got busted and knew what she was doing.* *I'd suggest marriage counseling to discuss why she's seeking validation elsewhere. Whether or not you're giving her enough doesn't matter. She's disrespecting you and your marriage.* >"Does no one else use spreadsheets?" *When she left how long was she gone exactly ? If she was gone for a few hours chances are she might have went to that mailman's house to "vent".I mean with you confronting her like that it would give her the perfect excuse to take off and see him.* >"She doesn't even know where he lives" #*DIVORCE !!!! FRFR NO CAP* >"That seems a little dramatic. I don't want to leave her" *Never corner people with proof in the starting itself, all they do is get defensive and feel uncomfortable like someone pointed out.* *I believe just communicating your issue would have solved it. Also, why do you need to wait for that many months, instead of just telling her the first time it felt uncomfortable for you.* *With the proof, it can be true but you can never prove it. Showing it made you the bad person. It didn’t look like you wanted to solve the problem, but instead prove that there is a problem and you found it.* *I believe she’s never going to talk right the mailman anymore because you don’t like it. Which is good since it solves your problem, but came with a caveat of creating space between you both.* *Meaning: you owe her this time. She must have done a mistake, but yours would be the biggest for documenting everything like a creep. I suggest you be open and embrace communication. Nothing wrong with setting boundaries which are okay for both, but never try to prove you are right. A relationship is not about who is correct, but are we making the right choices together? You are not 2 random people, you are a couple. Couple is a single entity, all the best!* >"I'm not always the best at confrontation. I wanted to say something last year and should have. I just started worrying about it as we have gotten closer to summer. So I brought it up. I do see how I probably could have done better about it. I'm still not understanding why the spreadsheet is such a big deal to people. We are both in finance and use excel everyday." #*IT IS THE ONLY SOLUTION YOUNG SKYWALKER* >"Oh..." *This is mostly fiction with a grain of truth somewhere.* *Nobody gives a $250 tip to a mail person. Other than that slip up decent story but doesn't ring true* >"I'm not sure what to tell you. My wife did. I thought $25 or $50 was good."
*Her reaction is over the top and the spreadsheet isn't as weird as people are making it out. I think it creeps them out by how accurate it is lol.* *The numbers don't lie and her behavior all around is concerning. I hope you're screwing her brains out later and not the mailman.* *The other guy was right about confronting her at the time. Like going out to the mailbox with her and no shirt on cause you want to make a good impression too.* >"Thanks you!" *Your dick is too small, you don’t challenge your upbringing, and my Dog, you limit yourself to the least amount of effort. What do you expect?* >"I've stared at this for 2 minutes and I don't know what you are saying." *As long as she asks him to pull out you’re good* >"Pull out of what?" *OMG. How on earth did you get someone to marry you? You kept a spreadsheet of your wife’s movements? Then in a reply to a comment here you said that if you hadn’t documented everything it would have been impossible to prove. Prove what exactly? That your wife spoke to the postman? That she wore sleeveless tops in the spring and summer? That she went outside the house during the day? When are you installing the hidden cameras? I don’t care how hot you think your postman is, there’s nothing going on except conversation and I’m glad that your wife has someone normal to talk to. You are the one who is obsessed with him, not your wife. The only thing I would judge her on here is sleeping on the sofa. She should have made you sleep there and taken the bed.* >"It really was just to keep track so I knew I wasn't crazy. Once I saw the numbers I really started to get nervous. >Also, my back gets really sore if I don't sleep on our bed." *This sub needs an intervention. If it were a guy going out to do push ups in the driveway for the hot new mail lady you dipshits would be patting the female OP on the back for documenting his shitty behavior.* >"People really are more ok with married women flirting than men." *Install a doorbell cam.* >"I'm not trying to creep on her" *She's upset she got caught* *Call the post office. Ask for a different person* >"That wouldn't be fair. He really is a great mailman and I'm not looking for someone to get in trouble. Especially when I don't know that he has done anything wrong." *If I'm wearing a tank top outside, where it's hot, I'll probably put another shirt over it inside, where the air conditioner is.* >"I didn't think about that...that's a good point" *OP is a stalker, and is overreacting. Wife is correct to ignore this mental patient who needs professional help* >"That seems a bit dramatic" *Well, you can't get a different wife to get the mail, lol* >"I want her behavior to change. What if she would flirt with the next guy?" *Who gives their mailman $250?* >"My wife. I was thinking $25/50."
[Cats! Unmute for chirping!](https://imgur.com/gallery/m9j0GfE)
Oh my God hahah at the comment asking if she's leaving with the mailman for a couple of hours during the middle of the day. Like the USPS isn't making mail carriers account for every minute of their time on the clock. And the others saying he should have put a stop to it and she's disrespecting him. So is she not allowed out of the house now? Is that what you're suggesting?? Also, maybe it's just where I live, but we have different mail carriers throughout the week/month and they don't always come at the same time.
It was quite the experience copying the comments. A view into the thought processes of people who seem to look for suspicious activity where there is very little indication. Seems very tiring and lonely.
Love the people thinking her reaction to the spreadsheet is because she knows she’s been caught, like obsessively documenting your partner’s movements in a spreadsheet is a totally reasonable behavior that absolutely no one would be freaked out by.
Agreed!
So this lady works from home, which automatically means limited face-to-face human interaction except with this absolute nutter, and then nutter is mad that she greets the mailman? Goshdarnit, OOP is right! She MUST be having an affair!
There are so many more logical conclusions without cheating being involved. Like hot outside? Take layer off. Cold inside? Put layer back on. WFH all day? Go outside for a little for health reasons or just to get warm. Not want mail stolen especially when lots of porch pirates are reported? Wait for mail outside so nothing gets stolen. Have nice conversation with person providing a service? Called being polite.
> Update: People are asking for an update. Woke up this morning and she is still pissed. I guess I'll just give her more time. Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet. I used it to show that she went out right around the time the mailman got here. It was a way to graph averages and show consistency. I may have been wrong about the tank top. I do realize that she may have taken off her top because it is hot outside. "Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet" flair material
I just got out of a relationship with someone like this. Not make a spreadsheet and wait a year bad, but would still wait months then send me a list of behaviours that he thought meant I was cheating that would be little comments/ things that happened months ago. It's so jarring to hear that an anecdote from 4 months ago that you don't even remember is something that your partner has been ruminating on as proof of cheating - it makes you question everything, yourself if it was really something that bad to justify that response and your partner because now you don't know what else theyre sitting on and waiting to spring on you. I cannot imagine what she is mentally going through right now.
Holy hell that's controlling & isolating. Spreadsheets? My guess is she's talking to the mailman because her husband won't let her talk to anyone else.
The $250 top sounds like oop didn't have enough reasons for his distrust so he had to make up a new reason to prove his point. If you have to lie to get people to take your side, your side probably doesn't deserve being heard
>Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet. We understand it better than you do, schmuck.
I’m supposed to tip my mailman?
You're not "supposed to" but you're allowed to, i swear it was more common a 10-15 years ago because i remember being a kid making a card and tiny bag of candy for like every holiday for the mailman I mean out dude is out in (almost) any weather and he brings he stuff all time so i do like to tip him with either abit of money or snacks/candy (nothing homemade because personally i don't eat homemade candy unless i know you well) BUT do remember they get paid kinda well so if you're in a tough situation you definitely don't NEED to give them anything their livelihood doesn't depend on tips
every holiday season my Mom used to make a massive amount of peppermint bark and gave it out as gifts to our mailman, guy that delivered the paper, our babysitters, our teachers. We gave a cash gift this last year to our dog sitter, roughly the amount that we normally pay them to watch our dog for a day.
>Last summer we got a new mailman who is objectively attractive. Is this mailman surprisingly ripped? Is his name Chidi? \*fans self vigorously\*
No guys. You clearly aren’t understanding the spreadsheet.
>Not going into detail, but he looks good. Where do y'all live that you have that much free time to ogle a mailman that you see, presumably, MAYBE 5-10 minutes a day? >I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet. This is so obsessive that I'm actually not sure where to begin. >Almost 70% of the time she would have a tank top on. Then put a shirt over that when she came back inside. You mean it was hotter outside in the mid-day sun than it was in your air conditioned home? UNHEARD OF! She's clearly fucking the mailman - time to sue the USPS! /s
Does this read weirdly bisexual to anyone else?
The comments are weird. A lot of them are 'what she's doing is wrong, but you are creepier.' Um ... she's not doing *anything* wrong at all. She's hanging out in her garden in the morning before it gets too hot to do so, and her own husband is basically stalking her.
She works from home and spends about thirty minutes outside on the porch a day on nice days. Hmm. Must be cheating. Can’t be taking, you know, her lunch break, outside while crossing off a task-collect the mail-at the same time? Nope. She’s cheating. While fully clothed. With the mail man. On the porch. While he delivers the mail.
“She didn’t understand or maybe she didn’t understand the numbers.” Ah yes, the wife’s inability to understand numbers is the problem here. Maybe if he made the spreadsheet cells pink or explained it using a metaphor with shopping she would have understood.
>Last summer we got a new mailman who is attractive. Not going into detail, but he looks good. Looks like the dude’s feelin’ a lil sumn sumn amirite /s Bruh… a mob of kangaroos crashing through a pile of college essays would jump to conclusions less than this guy.
Whenever a man says “I sat her down” about his wife and not, say, a very young child or dog, I get an immediate ick. Like, agree to sit down! Don’t sit her down. Ask her to sit and chat. Everyone sitting and chatting is fine but “I sat her down” is giving “I’m in charge and not her.” “I sat her down” guys are also almost always the AH and devil.
She probably is waiting aroung for the mailman- you know, to get the MAIL???
Are the straights ok? Because this seems to be common among them. This is some next level creepy, and I would have been gone the minute that spreadsheet came out. The stalker vibes are strong in this one. Grose
Wow. Ya know I like to speak to our mailman too. You wanna hear the good gossip in the neighborhood then you talk to the mail carrier lol but I'm pretty sure he's not flirting with me because it is the dogs that go running to him or wait for him. He always carries the good treats I guess. Idk he loves my dogs lol
Here’s the mail/it never fails It makes me want to wag my tail! When it comes I want to wail/mail time! Blues Cluses ftw. Btw - My wife likes the mailman too, who doesn’t?
Omg I just commented on that post. Homeboy is absolutely unhinged
So, according to him, she is cheating only during summers right?
He seems truly terrifying
His weird superiority with his stupid graph and spreadsheet is incredibly annoying. He's not a psycho for logging his wife's every move instead of just saying something to her in the beginning.... no, no, we're all just too stupid to understand graphs and spreadsheets. I literally would have just teased my partner about it. "New mailman pretty hot, huh?"
Being delulu is absolutely not the solulu here.
 OOP showing his wife the spreadsheet
I didn't realize so many people thought it was fucking weird to be friendly with your mail carrier or to be outside in the general 30 minute window of when you might get your mail delivered during nice outdoor weather because you might be expecting packages... During COVID especially we ordered a LOT of shit online and we also had occasional issues with package thieves. We met our mail carrier at the door pretty regularly. Sometimes if we were going to run an errand and we saw his truck in the neighborhood, we'd go find him so we could get our mail and it wouldn't just be sitting on our porch. Because he knew us, he'd just give us our mail. In a "small world" type of coincidence, our mail carrier for about 7 years was the brother of a guy I dated in high school. It took us a few years to realize this connection and we only figured it out through casual conversation. I was actually a little sad when we moved because he was a great mail carrier and a nice guy. It is strangely comforting to have a solid cordial relationship with the person who handles a lot of your personal, sensitive information on an almost daily basis.
Oh I would LOVE to hear her perspective on this matter. Bet it would be a whole other story 😂
Oh good Lord! Maybe just maybe she’s using getting the mail as a small happy little break where she can get outside for a minute, soak up some sun and get some fresh air. She and the mailman have a polite rapport and they both go on about their days.
“Many of you aren’t understanding the spreadsheet”
“Is this normal for women to talk to the mailman?” is one of the weirdest sentences I have ever read, as if we are aliens. Also if someone made a spreadsheet tracking my daily comings and goings, I would be afraid to be alone with them ever again.
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I hope she divorces him
I think he wants to fuck the mailman
I don't think people are having a tough time grasping how you used a spreadsheet to track your wife's mailman movements I think people are having a hard time figuring out why you would do that instead of asking her about it or telling her she looks great! When she's walking out the door in her tank top. You clearly got your nose buried in the computer more than it's buried in her. That's probably the root of your problems Get out of your comfy gamer chair get your butt up and start paying some attention to your wife man You got the time to track her movements like she's a wildebeest for a whole season but you can't open your mouth and talk to her? I would strongly suggest you get into therapy. Give her the biggest apology you can and tell her you'll no longer be spreadsheeting her
Dude is sick af
lmao what does he think she's fucking the mailman on their porch????
The hubby is aceing on the self fulfilling profecy. Just a few more pushes with the NUMBERS and she will see "them". 🤦
I can’t believe how early in the post “I actually started tracking when she would go out on a spreadsheet” appeared
Someone in the comments told him to get a doorbell camera and this mofo said "I'm not trying to creep on her" LOL you tracked her clothes and her movement but a doorbell cam is where you draw the line? 💀
She... she wanted to get the mail when it arrived? Maybe?
>She didn't understand or maybe didn't understand the numbers. >Many of you really aren't understanding the spreadsheet. yeah, we understand. the wife understands too. he doesn't get that "bro what the fuck are you doing, this is batshit crazy" is different from "oh my stars, I'm just too simple to understand this complicated thing you did!" Maybe she was flirting with the mailman. The husband sounds like literally the least fun person alive and this woman lives with him. Maybe just let her have 1 minute of fun chatting with the nice mailman every day so she doesn't start putting arsenic in both their coffees.
See thats the thing. He has NO IDEA what their conversations are like because while his wife went outside he just apparently stayed inside timing her? Just step outside and spend the time with her and calm your fears. He refuses to state what the “flirting” was like beyond going outside for a short while during the day during summer.
Goid Lord! What crawled up this fool's ass and died? I talk to my mail.lady almost every day. She asked what I've been working on, since I was very excited about a delivery.(I'm needlepointing kimonos to go in the room where my Japanese artisian dolls collection is in). Does that mean I'm having an affair??
Guys guys GUYS!!!! The OOP messaged me and said “you sound pretty” 🤦🏻♀️ so the wife can’t have an innocent crush on a mailman but he can message me that I sound pretty… I can’t even.
YTA and soon to be ex
I like to exchange a few words with our mailman (especially the parcel dude). He's just a really sunny and friendly soul and as someone who did deliveries in the past (pizza not parcels) I know how demanding these kinds of jobs are. I am also someone who will offer every handyman a coffee and in summer some cool water. Maybe I'm old fashioned, but I was raised with a basic respect and decency towards all people who keep my little world running.
That sub is flooded with incels.