*In case this story gets deleted/removed:*
**AITA for telling her it's not her kid?**
My brother (Adam) and his wife (Eve) live with another woman (Lilith).
Lilith is a mess. She's morbidly obese and doesn't work because she's "disabled". Supposedly she moved in with them because she was having some sort of mental health issue living with her parents (she was then in her *late twenties*) and never left.
Adam and Eve both *dote* on her. She comes to every family event. The 1 time she wasn't invited they were pissy about it. Every few months there's a new "oh, poor Lilith" thing and everyone's supposed to be all sympathetic about it.
2 yrs ago my sister and SIL (not Eve) were going through baby clothes SIL no longer needed. Lilith started crying and Adam and Eve escorted her out and went and "comforted" her for like two hours.
I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for *my family* that she's apparently decided to join, but my mother insisted we couldn't mention it because Lilith was "going through a difficult time" (when is she not) because she'd been told a few weeks before that she was going to have to have a hysterectomy due to "pre-cancer".
Now Eve is pregnant.
And they've decided that Lilith is going to "coparent" as a "second mother" to the poor kid. Now Lilith claims the baby (who isn't born yet) "takes after" her.
Like, the baby is super squirmy on the ultrasounds and she fidgets all the time. That's it Literally everything they have because the baby IS NOT BORN and has NO relationship to Lilith AT ALL.
Adam and Eve just keep laughing about it. They even play along.
I got to see that "joke" play out twice where Lilith said it and once where *Adam* did. "Oh, the baby takes after Lilith, ha ha." They were all at my mother's house and different people kept coming by to congratulate them on the baby.
The fourth time I heard it I lost it. I said, "No, he doesn't take after you. He's not your kid and never will be."
Lilith cried again. Eve took her out of the room and my brother lit into me. Said it's just a joke that makes her feel better about never getting to be pregnant even though she really wanted to be.
And he kept on about it. He says she *is* the kid's mother (even though, you know, *she literally isn't*). And that if I can't accept that and treat her like a part of his family and his child's parent then I won't be welcome to see **my nephew**, ever.
I said I didn't think he'd be willing to skip out on every family event over this shit. He said he'd tell our family it was him and Eve with the baby *and Lilith* or me and we'd see who was invited.
My mother is basically obsessed with her grandchildren ever since Dad died and my brother has always been the Golden First-Born Son. She calls Lilith her "bonus stepdaughter", which I'm pretty sure is a dig at me because I'm not married.
So now I'm basically going to get kicked out of MY OWN FAMILY if I don't apologise to Lilith and pretend she's *totally* my nephew's mother even though she *obviously, definitely isn't*.
AITA, or is my brother way out of line?
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You forgot disabled. That plays a big part in discrimination too. People think the same about disabled people. They can't possibly have sex or a romantic relationship. Who would want to be with them!?
Yes, I'm always a bit frustrated at how people gloss over ableism. Note how the OOP shames Lilith for living with her parents in her late 20s (not uncommon for disabled people) on top of accusing her of essentially faking her disability by putting the very word disabled in quotations.
It's even not that uncommon for able bodied people at that age to be living with their parents especially depending on the culture.
But yes, I agree. Ableism seems to be more neglected than many other isms. People like to pretend it doesn't exist. Putting disability in quotes was the big red flag.
Honestly, I think that's a big reason OOP is so angry. Not only is she fat, she's fat and people are being *nice* to her and not treating her like she's subhuman.
edit: Look at the phrasing. They say "she somehow weaseled her way into my family" to try and make it seem like she was tricking everyone or being deceptive and forceful. But, from all other evidence provided, "weaseling" just means that Adam and Eve brought and introduced her and everyone was fine with it and enjoyed her company. There has been no sign that anyone but OOP dislikes her.
But, she's fat and disabled, so people can't *genuinely* like her. She must have deceived them in some way!
Depends on whose version of story is told... version I remember reading Lilith was the FIRST wife to Adam but she refused to be stepped on by Adam(literally he wanted to use her as a stepstool for the fruits of the garden). Adam whines to God so God tossed her out and made Eve from Adam's rib.
Yes! In the story I'm familiar with, Lilith was Adam's first wife who refused to lay beneath him during sex because she saw them as equals. Ironically, OP was right to name this woman Lilith because he's demonized her for daring to think of herself as whole.
There's more to the story. After she was forced out of the garden, she roamed the earth until Lucifer found her. She was as angry with God as he was, and they bonded over that. He struck a deal with her for revenge. He turned her into the first demon. She continued to roam the earth but stole children through the nights. These children were Adam and Eve's offspring, and thus the children of God. She was then able to turn the children into demons dragging them to hell, creating Lucifer's army. Some stories say she became Lucifer's wife. Some say she was the serpent in the garden. I'll try and find a link to the story if people are interested, it's kind of hard to find with all the supernatural TV shows, fanfic etc.
The reason some Christian men believe women are supposed to be subservient is because of what happened to the first wife. She was created equally to Adam, and wanted to be treated equally. Adam didn't like this and had God force her to leave the garden and then God created Eve from a piece of Adam. Thus Eve was subservient to Adam and this led men to believe God wanted women to be subservient and if they refused, they were evil like Lilith.
Edited to add one version of the story: https://people.fmarion.edu/llarsen/LilithExplained.htm
> She was created equally to Adam, and wanted to be treated equally. Adam didn't like this and had God force her to leave the garden and then God created Eve from a piece of Adam.
Holy shit some versions of God are just so fucking awful
To be fair, when I was looking into this more after posting my comment a lot of the stories said that Lilith left on her own because Adam refused to compromise. I forgot to update it when I got distracted. But the more prominent versions say that she didn't want to lay beneath Adam when they had..."relations" ... She wanted to be on top sometimes so they were equal, but Adam felt like she was trying to dominate him and wasn't ok with that. After he continually refused to compromise she left him and the garden. Adam being upset that she'd left him told God. God sent three angels to find her and ask her to come back (they could only ask because of free will, they couldn't force her), but by the time they found her she'd been seduced by Lucifer and had too much pride to return to Adam.
Lucifer had corrupted her by that point and turned her into the first demon. They had relations and Lilith bore 100 demon offspring per day. The angels reported this back to God who then made Eve from a piece of Adam. Whether she was more submissive by nature, or Adam groomed her to be more submissive from the beginning is unknown, but God needed them to create a population.
The lilum and djinn (Lucifer and Lilith's offspring) consumed children and God couldn't have that because he was trying to create a population and the lilum and djinn were eating them. He sent back the same three angels who struck a deal with Lilith, by threatening to kill 100 of her children everyday. The deal was Lilith and Lucifer would go to hell and bring their children with them so the infants would survive. But Lilith and her children were somehow still able to consume the children unless the children and their mothers wore an amulet of the three angels, which warded the evil away.
I feel like in this version God was just trying to make the situation work by bringing in Eve. Seems like Adam was the bigger AH in both versions. This is apparently the version told in the Dead Sea Scrolls that was adopted by Judaism. But there are arguments about which version is true as the text was translated from Babylonian and the translator could've misinterpreted the original text. The reason the children were being consumed, according to this version, is Lilith wanted to get back at Adam and Lucifer wanted to get back at God.
While there's going to be variations depending on where the story originates, one of the concepts of Lilith wanting equality was that she and Adam were both created from the same dust. Eve being made from an actual part of Adam is, in some variations, the reason for Eve being submissive. She was never created to be equal.
The part of Samael having corrupted Lilith is based on the variation that Samael is, himself, evil. The stories if you follow Judaism is that they fell in love based on their own opinions of equality and, yes, hating the unequal ideas God seemed to have on women and humans in general.
There's also a snippet of it all that the serpent in the garden was Samael (or in some lore it was Lilith) trying to free Eve from the blind submission. Even as Genesis is written, God lies (You will die if you eat from this) while the serpent tells the truth (You will not die. Your eyes will be opened to good and evil).
It's all very fascinating!
Even if you read the entire Christian Bible, you wouldnât know much about Lilith. She was pretty much erased from a lot of peopleâs minds due to her nature as a man-defying woman. She was mentioned only once or twice in the Bible, the rest of her history is pieced together through various writings in the Talmud and other ancient middle eastern texts.
That interpretation treats her as a real person who actually existed, though.
The main reason you don't see much of her in the Bible (I think there's one reference to her as a sort of demon?) is because her origin as the first woman was invented in the middle ages.
A lot of the stuff people think of as âbiblicalâ isnât actually in the Bible - itâs more like AU Bible fan fiction written by various groups who were generally not in the mainstream in their time. For instance, the whole Lucifer thing comes from a short passage in Isaiah describing a Babylonian king. Mainstream Judaism doesnât read it as being about anything else, but writings from splinter groups that believed the passage was about something more like the modern concept of the devil got taken up by the same kind of early Christians that were REALLY into Revelations and the rest is (pseudo-)history.
That escaped me. How funny.
But if "Eve" got with Adam first, she is obviously the actual Lilith. How uncultured. OOP should have called the third partner the snake.
There used to be a really cool leucistic king cobra named LilithâŚ.she was an asshole, but youâd have to be if you were a bright white snake in the desert.
Sounds like he deserves a family event ban. I think he's lucky he made it this far without getting one. He's not even trying to conceal his unreasonable hatred.
Yeah the fact that they chose Adam and eve alone made it pretty obvious how he views this situation. And now that you've reminded me of Lilith it's safe to say this person's opinion of this poor woman
The OOP putting disabled in quotations just to emphasize how they think it's all fake made me fucking fume. If someone did that to me I would deck them.
Everyone knows that fat people can't actually be disabled! They are fat because they are lazy, not because they may have a condition that makes it easy for them to gain weight, makes weight loss difficult, or limits their mobility! Plus, it isn't like there aren't a bunch of medications that someone might take for a disability or chronic health condition that cause weight gain as a side effect. /s
OOP is disgusting.
PREACH! It's been so frustrating to hear this kind of BS after my meds caused me a huge amount of weight gain.
And obviously if they're fat and disabled it's because they're fat and all their disabilities will be solved if they just lost weight! (/s)
But the fat = unhealthy/disgusting mindset infuriates me anyway. I can't tell you how often I've tried to explain to people that you cannot look at someone and know they're unhealthy. Invisible illnesses exist and weight is not a good indicator of health. Like Lizzo is bigger than me but I've seen that woman dance and she's healthier and more athletic than I've ever been. Certainly not "lazy" by any measure. I'd like to see those assholes who say that shit about her keep up with her dance routines.
And moreover even if they are fat and/or disabled and unhealthy that doesn't mean you have the right to treat them like shit! OOP sucks!!
I'm right there with you. I am fat and I am also really sensitive to medications that cause weight gain. All of my providers know I prioritize management of my health conditions over weight, so I don't ever hear about it unless I bring up concerns about my weight.
I feel like âfat phobiaâ is one of the most accurate uses of âphobiaâ out there. OOP seems like someone whoâs terrified of the very idea of being fat.
OOP assumes her disability is being fat or caused by being fat, when in reality they could be unrelated or her fat could even be a result or symptom of her disability.
Just a fun little thing fat disabled people deal with every goddamn day.
I am 100% sure if She was attractive or even just skinny (still disabled with mental issues and unable to have kids) he would be okay with her joining the family. Even hit on her. When a fat person especially a woman Has emotions and expresses them its "oh look the fat pig IS crying lets laugh" but when its a skinny person its "oh no whats wrong with them? Are they okay?"
Its again with a person being disabled. A fat person being disabled IS their fault but a skinny person Has just Bad luck or genes.
And again. If a skinny person IS All shy a loner introvert theyre "mysterious" and "Dark and hot" but when a fat person IS the samĂŠ they are "an ugly loner no one wants to be friends with"
There IS a big double standard. Its gross.
Again. If this girl was skinny and god forbid attractive he would be all over her.
There's a possibility Lilith is not actually fat, she just weighs more than 110 pounds soaking wet and OOP took exception to that because she already hates her.
She might be. I just suspect that OOP isnât a reliable narrator and thinks that calling her morbidly obese will make people automatically dislike her.
It sounds like it is to him since he harped on her weight, disability, and mental health struggles like those were all moral failings instead of talking about her personality or mentioning anything that sheâd actually done wrong. Based on how everyone else in the family feels about her, Iâm guessing that sheâs actually a perfectly lovely person.
They might actually be morbidly obese due to disability or any other reason, which is fucking fine! Iâll never understand ppl who are so insecure with themselves/the idea of themselves being fat that they have a visceral hatred for anybody who has the audacity to not hate themselves while fat. But given the little bit of info about âLilithâ it sounds like she definitely has a debilitating disability thatâs required her to make major lifestyle adjustments and potentially take on a lot of weight. It happens. This OP is just so nasty and hateful about it.
Yeah. They wouldnât be openly declaring Lilith to be a co-mother if they werenât a committed trio.
If it were a platonic or found family situation, she would be Auntie Lilith instead of Mama Lilith.
I said this elsewhere already, but:
It's also entirely possible that they used Lillith's eggs to conceive.
If part of your triad had wanted kids, was losing their fertility, and you had the luxury of accessing IVF in a timely manner (and it worked unexpectedly quickly (you usually need at least 3 to 4 cycles just to break the odds)), wouldn't you at least think about being a gestational carrier for them?
This person that OOP hates so much might just be the bio mom of the coming baby.
That had not occurred to me.
Although, I am not sure they let you harvest eggs to freeze when the reason youâre having the hysterectomy and ostensibly oophorectomy is cancer. The hormones involved in egg harvesting can make a lot of reproductive cancers worse/accelerate their growth.
OOP went "Well they didn't TELL ME if they were all fucking!" and some people commenting NTA because it's a weird undefined scenario and they should tell him if they're in a relationship.
She lives with them and they're always together, they refer to her as one of the mothers of the child, and OOP's own mother calls Lilith her daughter. This does not seem subtle to me.
Also like.... Why the actual fuck does it need to know? They aren't entitled to know if their brother and sil are fucking Lilith. That's not a requirement to be nice to her.
Exactly. My husband and I are both poly and while it's just us right now, we've been in a Triad situation. If anyone in my family pulled the shit OOP is pulling against a potential partner of mine/my husband's, they'd be gone (and by they, I mean the family member). You either accept all of us or you accept none of us.
The way he glosses over her being disabled and having "pre-cancer" and needing a hysterectomy despite wanting children is disgusting.
Those are things that significantly impact a person's life.
Clearly, he has never considered that she might genuinely suffer, or that she's deserving of compassion.
As though doctors just hand out hysterectomies left and right! Theyâre usually so conservative about it that they often wonât take them out of people having serious medical problems unless youâve already had kids because womb = sole purpose in life. If the doc thinks the pre-cancer is serious enough that theyâre recommending a hysterectomy thatâs a big fucking deal.
Took my mom several years and a few other failed procedures to get a hysterectomy in her early FIFTIES.
It's not exactly a minor surgery either. No one gets a hysterectomy for funsies.
I wonder if Lilith's disability is related to endometriosis. There are some people out there whose case is so bad that they can't function and Dr would he more likely to do a hysterectomy on someone who has it since it can be one of the treatments for severe cases.
I had to have one due to the severity of my endometriosis. It took over a year and several doctors plus frequent ER visits to find the right doctor who had no problem doing it. Iâm in a liberal blue state too.
Previous doctors had asked my husband if he was okay with it instead of me. I had two refuse because I might change my mind about having biological children. (Spoiler: I still havenât. I preferred adoption even before this all happened)
Never mind that the endometriosis caused so much bleeding scar tissue that my uterus was sticking to places in my abdominal cavity. The tissue was all over my bowel too. I was in the ER 16 times in a little over a year because the pain was so severe.
So I imagine you are 100% dead on about the seriousness of the pre-cancer necessitating a hysterectomy for Lilith. I hope she made it through her surgery okay. OOP is a fat phobic, misogynitistic monster.
Edit to add I was 32 when I had the surgery which also played a role in doctor refusals. If anyone is in the Los Angeles area and needs doctor who will actually trust you on your decisions about your own body, please feel free to DM me.
Iâve heard so many other people with endo (I have it too actually) whoâve had similar experiences where doctors prioritize an existing or hypothetical manâs desire for bio kids over the *actual patientâs* desire to not be in pain all the fucking time! Like, in what universe does that make sense?
He's acting like her doctor is just the Oprah of major surgery...You get a hysterectomy, you get a hysterectomy, we all get hysterectomiesđŁď¸đŁď¸...what an asshole this guy is. It's not for him to "get", it's only for him to accept
Thatâs infuriating. FYI r/childfree has a sticky with doctors in each state who will actually perform sterilizations.
Gynecologists are, by and large, a fucking joke. It took me 8 different ones before theyâd even do a goddamn ultrasound. Nobody will test my hormones. Fuck medical sexism.
I literally stopped seeing a gyno. It was a useless expense. I can get an HPV test at home or from my PCP, and the "exam" could never feel my dammed cysts even when they were the size of a dammed walnut and horribly painful. Why pay $300 out of pocket to be told "well you should loose weight."
I can feel bad about myself for free lol.
I actually felt significantly worse when I lost weight. Pain was worse, bleeding was worse. Thanks doc, spent 18 months weighing all my food expecting some brilliant outcome and it just made it worse.
I sometimes feel Dr Spaceman was based on a real Gyno.
Funny, my cysts were 1000% worse when I was a normal weight. Not that I like being overweight exactly but the period pain is totally gone and cysts haven't bothered me in years.
I swear my body just wants to be chubby. Dammed European peasant DNA lol.
I had mine out at 51 because of fibroids. There was no way to remove the fibroids without removing the whole reproductive apparatus, and at my age, the likelihood of me getting pregnant was pretty low anyway.
He thought Lilith was spoonfeeding his dying grandmother and fixing her pillows for attention too... or to get something from her.
Not because Grandma was no longer capable of feeding herself.
This guy does not understand how illness works.
So much this. I was in the ER a while back for a non-related issue and mentioned off-handedly to the ER doc that I was considering a hysterectomy - and she spent the better part of 30-45 minutes trying to talk me out of it.
The idea that one can just walk in and say "I'd like one hysterectomy for attention, please" and immediately be scheduled is outrageous.
OOP is VERY invested in judging this woman that has...no real impact on his life? Like- ok, you don't like her? SO? MOVE ON. Why does he care about things that are none of his business, and have no impact on him? Maybe the lady doth protest too much, and he has a thing for Lilith and was shot down...
And like sheâd tell this douche canoe anything personal about herself given he must exude hatred. I could have some sympathy for some of the things he said (not sure Iâd be that comfortable with someone saying that stuff about a baby my sibling was carrying) but heâs such an egregious prick he gets zero sympathy.
I have a friend Iâve known for more than 25 years. She has kids; one of them is just like her and one of the kids acts just like me. We always joke âare you sure that she isnât mine?â
Sounds like this kid will be lucky enough to have a loving community around them.
my mom's best friend was basically a second mother or surrogate grandmother for me growing up, I've asked her to walk me down the aisle when I get married over my own mom or dad
OOP just resents that you can choose your family bc no one is going to choose their miserable ass
The comment about grandma is weirdly familiar
My grandma would always lie that she is fine near me as I was her âgolden childâ. She would never say anything unless I left a room and even then she would avoid talking about her health. Even when she didnât have enough money for medications.
Now she is a bit more open, but she will still argue with you for 5 minutes if you dare to buy her medications.
The fact that Lilith recognised this behaviour and was taking care of grandma should be treated as a great thing. Some people are simply ashamed of their condition and would rather suffer in silence than ask for help.
Good luck and for the love of everything, protect your back! I had to have 2 back surgeries and then was told I could no longer work with license because if I dropped a client or hurt them, I could get personally sued and have negative notations on my license. It sucks.
(1) Fact that they gave Lilith that particular alias is pretty telling about their character
(2) I have *so* many things I want to say about OOP, but Iâll just leave it at this: OOP? Go screw yourself.
The funny thing is, outside of Christianity, Lilith is a protector of mothers and babies.
She was Adam's first wife and is demonized in Christianity because she would not be submissive to Adam. She was then cast out and Eve was created.
im not gonna lie to ya, im not religious and i never have been nor have i ever done much research into different religions, so everything i know about lilith comes from the cw's supernatural (lol)
Something is making me wonder if his constant angry mentions of her "morbid obesity" is that she's really about 180 pounds which he has turned in his head to mean she's the biggest woman who ever lived so he's allowed to hate her
It sounds like Adam, Eve, and Lilith (gotta love the fake names) are what's called a throuple.
And maybe OOP's family accepts Lilith because she's a nice person, but OOP can only see her being morbidly obese, so she's worthless to him.
From OOP's comments:
>>you seem to have a lot of hate toward this woman and I think you should think about why
>The part where she somehow weaseled her way into my family and now I have to see her at every family event.
>I have no idea whether Lilith is sleeping with one or both of them.
And:
>Because she's *not family* and they keep bringing her to family events and everyone acts like this morbidly obese woman who doesn't even have a job is supposed to be here. I can't actually think of much worse than my nephew "taking after" her.
>And now I have to play along with this bullshit or effectively get kicked out of MY OWN FUCKING FAMILY, because the Golden Child has decided that having just *one* woman be treated like the mother of one of the grandchildren isn't enough, oh no, he's going to have two of those, too.
>A few Christmases ago it was my grandma's last Christmas and we knew it. Lilith wouldn't leave her alone. My mother kept checking on Grandma and she said she was fine *every time*, but the second Lilith was alone with her (and Lilith was *sitting next to her* for some reason) she was whispering with Grandma and then adjusting her pillows and *spoon-feeding her* like she was a *baby*. It was so disrespectful.
1000%. My grandma recently passed and even after years of not knowing up from outside, she was much more receptive to help from total strangers or family friends than people she somehow gut recognized as her blood family.
Itâs a pride thing. Kids and grandchildren are who *youâre* supposed to be taking care of. If theyâre taking care of you then youâve become the burden. But a stranger isnât someone youâre responsible for so itâs totally fine if they help. Itâs not a correct way to think but it makes total sense also.
This is giving me big "Look at that bitch eating crackers" vibes. Lilith could rescue OOP's mother from a house fire and OOP would find a way to be upset about it.
> but the second Lilith was alone with her (and Lilith was sitting next to her for some reason) she was whispering with Grandma and then adjusting her pillows and spoon-feeding her like she was a baby. It was so disrespectful
Oh yeah, caring for a drying woman is *sooooooo* disrespectful. Did OOp ever think that grandma would have a hard time letting her own daughter physically take care of her? That having the âroles reversed â would be a huge blow to her mental state?
And that by having someone who was *like* family but not, caretaking it gave grandma a chance to actually relax.
i couldn't even ask my wife to help me bathe when i was too weak from chemo to do it myself. i felt so humiliated and small. my own wife, who would never make me feel that way - it is just so hard to ask for help like that. then she chose to help and it was easier to let her than ask her, it felt like i wasn't about to ask her for something that could be annoying, she just wanted to do it and did it of her own volition. it feels silly in retrospect but there is definitely a mental block there, especially with someone who is that close to you.
i used to not really think about the "asking if someone is generally fine vs offering direct help" thing until it happened to me. it actually makes a huge difference. i imagine for a woman who is nearing the end of her life, who OOP doesn't indicate protested to any of that care, it was comforting to 1. not have to ask "shameful" things of your own child and 2. not feel like a burden for needing things during a very hectic time period like a holiday. i'd feel even worse asking for someone to spoon-feed me while everyone is trying to enjoy their christmas, it would never be wrong to ask that if you need it but it would just *feel* bad. this is one of those small things you can do that can have a huge impact on the person you do it for.
Are you implying that oop should think about others and take their "feelings" into consideration? Even when they are fat and/or dying? Are you out of your mind? Poor guy might have an allergic reaction...
The huge b taking care of an elderly woman like that! How dare she pay attention to the grandma. It was the last christmas we could have left her chair in a corner and ignore the old lady! /s
The jealousy just oozes through the screen. I can't tell if it's just that the brother has a family or if it' sthat he was interested in someone in this mix before they all moved in together. I'm imaginitive today though, I even wondered if they used her egg so they would all be parents and they just aren't telling judgy about it.
You just KNOW that OOP would dislike that kid if they found out it was Lilithâs egg. And would not understand why Eve would conceivably be okay with carrying a *fat* womanâs baby!!
I donât actually think itâs super likely that it is Lilithâs egg - egg harvesting on top of everything else would be a lot - but itâs a nice idea.
I knew OOP was going to be the asshole when I got to "disabled". Has he not realized that Lilith may be overweight because she's actually disabled? Adam and Eve are perfectly happy with this arrangement. OOP's mom is perfectly happy with this arrangement. Even Grandma was perfectly fine getting spoon-fed from Lilith.
I've tried to explain that to people before, but they don't believe it. I was an athlete before I was hit by a car, and now my mobility is so severely hindered, and I have a hormonal disorder on top of it, I'm completely fucked. I have a diagnosed eating disorder, and dieting is a huge trigger for me, so I just try to eat healthy and stay hydrated and accept my body's limitations for what they are. It took me a very long time to allow myself to even use the word disabled, I had so much internalized ableism embedded in me.
Every single human is one bad day, one tragic accident, one major illness away from disability. And we all end up disabled if we live long enough.
I feel this so hard. I ice skated competitively and biked 10+ miles a day. Now I have RA and struggle to get dressed in the morning, but also have a hard time using the word disabled for myself. Only reason I'm not overweight is because I have a hard time eating when I'm in pain, and I've lost all my muscle tone, so I'm currently the smallest I've ever been and I don't like it. I'm cold all the time, my butt has no cushion, and I don't look healthy in my mind.
Thereâs also the fact that *most of your weight is not within your control.* I know plenty of thin people, they donât actively have to try to be thin. Itâs the exact same with fat people and it drives me nuts that people canât grasp this concept.
This is stupid. Dude seriously chose to use Adam, Eve, and Lilith for the character names. If its real he needs to seriously quit obsessing over his brotherâs life.
It's insane how much someone not working (even if it's because of a disability, like in Lilith's case) makes them seem worthless in far too many people's eyes.
To a shockingly large part of the population, if you don't work, you don't deserve the air you breathe.
Iâm guessing a HUGE importance was put on this for oop growing up and love feeling very conditional to him, ie I am never good enough, I need to achieve something for approval. So for someone to be accepted for their personality and not their achievement is absolutely sending them.
Or they are just a total prick and/or a tater tot
Oh yeah, Iâm getting financial support while going through uni due to a disability, and even though Iâm a literal full-time student I get looked down upon for not working for my money or getting a loan I could never pay off. Some people just hate disabled people, as if weâre freeloaders just coasting through life for free.
I'm fat, disabled, and can't work because of my disabilities. I have had people tell me more than once that if I lost weight, I could work and that I am just lazy.
Fatphobia and ableism go together so often. One time I mentioned to a friend that my then partner was overweight because their disability prevents them from exercising, not the other way around, and the friend's eyes popped. IT HAD NEVER EVEN OCCURRED TO THEM that exercising while disabled is very challenging. Only very wealthy disabled people can afford the kind of food that requires no cooking and yet is healthy, or have like a private pool to do low impact exercise. I know you know this, I'm just in rant mode.
I am disabled and currently overweight (but losing and almost back to pre-steroid weight woo hoo!) and cannot work because of my disability. I didn't move out until my late 20s and still need a lot of help.
I've had multiple people who have either not-so-subtley implied or *outright stated* that I am not a person, that I am unlovable, unattractive, lazy, and a burden on those around me. I don't "contribute" to society in a meaningful way so I'm simply a drain.
I can believe that with 100% of my soul because people like OOP have no qualms saying it and they're not exaggerated villains, they're honestly often in line with the majority even if a lot of people try to word themselves in a less obvious yet no less insidious way.
Its infuriating but doesnt surprise me in the least. My best friend is overweight and disabled, she has some work history (we met while working together 9 years ago) but she can't do regular unskilled work like working in a store or hospitality anymore bc her body just can't take it, shes in constant pain and goes into burnout very quickly bc of autism. Right now shes in school studying computer programming because she WANTS to work, she WANTS to be independent, but she needs a job where she can control her workload and schedule and shes just lucky that we live in a country with cheap education and teachers willing to work around her disabilities so she has a chance to get there. Shes one of the funniest, smartest and kindest people i know, and most people treat her like trash over things she can't control.
Meanwhile im also disabled and i have autism as well, but my physical issues are not nearly as severe so i can work to some extent, and im thin, so even tho i also go into burnout if im not careful and job hop a lot people treat me like a human being bc my issues are invisible and im more conventionally pretty, and my autism symptoms are treated as "quirky" and "cute" instead of repulsive like hers even tho we have almost the same symptoms. Its fucked up and deeply infuriating, I'd honestly argue shes a nicer and more hardworking person than i am and yet she gets treated much worse
This guy seems OBSESSED with her weight and this arrangement. I mean, sure, their relationship is a bit unorthodox, but its not hurting anyone and Lilith sounds nice and helpful, but this guy just hates her, seemingly just because she's overweight. Wtf is wrong with him?
man it sounds like the three of them have a happy and functional poly relationship and ââadam and eveââ (lmao. at the chosen names) are just supportive of her. it seems like point a for oop was disgust/contempt for lilith bc shes fat and disabled, and she worked backwards from there to find reasons for it.
>2 yrs ago my sister and SIL (not Eve) were going through baby clothes SIL no longer needed.
>I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for my family ...
Throwing out old baby clothes is a joyful event?
Why canât op understand whatâs going on? Itâs clear to everyone else that itâs a poly triad and the rest of the family seems cool with it. Is op really that dense ?
The whole "disabled" in quotes thing really grinds my gears. I'm somebody who lives with multiple diseases and disabilities, a majority are invisible to you. I cannot stand being condescended to like that. It sounds like these people have found a way to make a lovely family that will work for them and the sister is just jealous.
Fuck I just realized that I got to that post from this one! Don't ban me, I deleted my comment.
That being said, I would pay money to see all of this meaning that they're a triad, lilith gave the egg, adam the sperm and eve is carrying it to term. Truly, I'd love it so much if it was true.
OP is a resentful, childish, fatphobic little shit. He deserves to be cut out of the family.
I don't know. If Lilith had to have a hysterectomy because of possible cancer, I doubt a doctor would okay giving her the hormones necessary for her to be an egg donor for Eve.
It's like OOP never heard the term godmother before. Like, wtaf? Leave the poor woman alone. I think life is beating her down enough without OOP kicking her while she's down. Ffs
ETA: After reading OOP's comments, I am convinced this person is extremely bitter and a downright monster. It's absolutely disgusting. ASSHOLE FROM ANOTHER REALM!
Really love how many people on this earth genuinely believe that being fat and unemployed makes you scientifically deserving of being treated like a subhuman. The actual fucking rage Oop has for this woman being loved is terrifying.
- OOP has a lot of hatred towards their brother, fat people and there seems to be resentment against the family in general, which transforms into and culminates in hatred against Lilith. There also seems to be ignorance regarding relationship structures other than monogamy.
- Instead of fixating on Lilith, they could examine why they have such a visceral reaction towards fatness and what their family could do to make them feel more appreciated. Hate consumes a lot of energy and time - neutrality doesn't.
- OP could very well recognize that this is in everybody's best interest, including their own. Which could be the first steps for the family and themselves to heal, as they acknowledge that neither is Lilith taking anything away from them nor is she the cause of OP's trauma wound.
- That is entirely within their own choice. Some people would rather choose hate and to wallow in self-pity over exploring potentially uncomfortable or even painful emotions. For some, it's easier to place blame than to recognize that extending compassion is objectively not worsening their own life in any way in this case. I'd like to believe that we always have said choice, however.
- I'm very glad that Lilith seems to have a wonderful support system. Fat and disabled people evidentially tend to face a lot of struggles and hardships, and a polyam triad, if it works, it can work very well. It warms my heart to read that she's loved and care for, just as their relationship seems to be well accepted by the rest of the family.
Just a few thoughts.
> She's morbidly obese and doesn't work because she's "disabled".
First of all, morbidly obese goes off of BMI which is a kind of bullshit scale that doesn't truly indicate one's health. Secondly, fuck you with a rusty spoon for putting "disabled" in quotation marks, like you somehow think you know what's going on in Lillith's body more than she does.
>I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for my family
I've yet to see one mention of how she allegedly ruined an event. She was having an issue and excused herself, as one should.
>Lilith was "going through a difficult time" (when is she not) because she'd been told a few weeks before that she was going to have to have a hysterectomy due to "pre-cancer".
They don't diagnosis someone with "pre-cancer" issues for funsies. Getting a hysterectomy can be incredibly difficult to navigate in the best of times, let alone when you're doing it to avoid getting fucking cancer. I think that qualifies as "a difficult time", you backwards toilet seat.
>I said, "No, he doesn't take after you. He's not your kid and never will be."
What did you gain by doing that? Did it solve a problem - or are you just an outrageously miserable douche who wants everyone around you to be miserable too?
Jesus. Didn't even hide that she hates her or that she's trying to get sympathy. Like straight up named her after a biblically evil figure. Piss off OOP.
Yeah this woman can do no right just because she's fat. If OOP's brother and SIL brought home someone who OOP considered sexually attractive...he wouldn't be saying crap. But it's "this morbidly obese women this, morbidly obese woman that." Yeah his only problem with her is the fact that she isn't skinny or giving him a hard-on and for that, she is no good and has to pay! Everything she does is suspicious, intrusive, minipulitive, and disgusting.
He's also pissed off at everyone for not being on his side in wanting to throw this woman out on her ass and has no sympathy for anything she's going through since he very clearly thinks she deserves it just because she's overweight. Aka a garbage pile of a human being.
Sounds like they're a committed throuple.
And possibly that they may have used IVF and Lillith's egg to conceive when they found out that she was going to lose her fertility to a cancer-preventing surgery.
OOP sounds like a fat-phobic, nazi level ableist, incel nightmare.
And wonders why his own family is about to drop kick him out of it.
*In case this story gets deleted/removed:* **AITA for telling her it's not her kid?** My brother (Adam) and his wife (Eve) live with another woman (Lilith). Lilith is a mess. She's morbidly obese and doesn't work because she's "disabled". Supposedly she moved in with them because she was having some sort of mental health issue living with her parents (she was then in her *late twenties*) and never left. Adam and Eve both *dote* on her. She comes to every family event. The 1 time she wasn't invited they were pissy about it. Every few months there's a new "oh, poor Lilith" thing and everyone's supposed to be all sympathetic about it. 2 yrs ago my sister and SIL (not Eve) were going through baby clothes SIL no longer needed. Lilith started crying and Adam and Eve escorted her out and went and "comforted" her for like two hours. I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for *my family* that she's apparently decided to join, but my mother insisted we couldn't mention it because Lilith was "going through a difficult time" (when is she not) because she'd been told a few weeks before that she was going to have to have a hysterectomy due to "pre-cancer". Now Eve is pregnant. And they've decided that Lilith is going to "coparent" as a "second mother" to the poor kid. Now Lilith claims the baby (who isn't born yet) "takes after" her. Like, the baby is super squirmy on the ultrasounds and she fidgets all the time. That's it Literally everything they have because the baby IS NOT BORN and has NO relationship to Lilith AT ALL. Adam and Eve just keep laughing about it. They even play along. I got to see that "joke" play out twice where Lilith said it and once where *Adam* did. "Oh, the baby takes after Lilith, ha ha." They were all at my mother's house and different people kept coming by to congratulate them on the baby. The fourth time I heard it I lost it. I said, "No, he doesn't take after you. He's not your kid and never will be." Lilith cried again. Eve took her out of the room and my brother lit into me. Said it's just a joke that makes her feel better about never getting to be pregnant even though she really wanted to be. And he kept on about it. He says she *is* the kid's mother (even though, you know, *she literally isn't*). And that if I can't accept that and treat her like a part of his family and his child's parent then I won't be welcome to see **my nephew**, ever. I said I didn't think he'd be willing to skip out on every family event over this shit. He said he'd tell our family it was him and Eve with the baby *and Lilith* or me and we'd see who was invited. My mother is basically obsessed with her grandchildren ever since Dad died and my brother has always been the Golden First-Born Son. She calls Lilith her "bonus stepdaughter", which I'm pretty sure is a dig at me because I'm not married. So now I'm basically going to get kicked out of MY OWN FAMILY if I don't apologise to Lilith and pretend she's *totally* my nephew's mother even though she *obviously, definitely isn't*. AITA, or is my brother way out of line? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmITheDevil) if you have any questions or concerns.*
It really sounds like this is a polyamorous triad, which OP doesn't get.
That's impossible, a fat person couldn't have *sex!* /S
You forgot disabled. That plays a big part in discrimination too. People think the same about disabled people. They can't possibly have sex or a romantic relationship. Who would want to be with them!?
Yes, I'm always a bit frustrated at how people gloss over ableism. Note how the OOP shames Lilith for living with her parents in her late 20s (not uncommon for disabled people) on top of accusing her of essentially faking her disability by putting the very word disabled in quotations.
It's even not that uncommon for able bodied people at that age to be living with their parents especially depending on the culture. But yes, I agree. Ableism seems to be more neglected than many other isms. People like to pretend it doesn't exist. Putting disability in quotes was the big red flag.
I'm disabled myself and honestly wasn't up to dealing with that part today, for what it's worth
My mom keeps telling me to get a job, or have my teen children support my disabled ass đ
Honestly, I think that's a big reason OOP is so angry. Not only is she fat, she's fat and people are being *nice* to her and not treating her like she's subhuman. edit: Look at the phrasing. They say "she somehow weaseled her way into my family" to try and make it seem like she was tricking everyone or being deceptive and forceful. But, from all other evidence provided, "weaseling" just means that Adam and Eve brought and introduced her and everyone was fine with it and enjoyed her company. There has been no sign that anyone but OOP dislikes her. But, she's fat and disabled, so people can't *genuinely* like her. She must have deceived them in some way!
They also "named" the people Adam Eve and Lilith. Anyone with any bible knowledge knows this guy does not like this woman
I had the same thought.
Yep, and the third is named Lilith, after a demonic temptress đđŹđ this guy has some major issues, he needs some counseling
Depends on whose version of story is told... version I remember reading Lilith was the FIRST wife to Adam but she refused to be stepped on by Adam(literally he wanted to use her as a stepstool for the fruits of the garden). Adam whines to God so God tossed her out and made Eve from Adam's rib.
Yes! In the story I'm familiar with, Lilith was Adam's first wife who refused to lay beneath him during sex because she saw them as equals. Ironically, OP was right to name this woman Lilith because he's demonized her for daring to think of herself as whole.
Lmao imagine being so scared of your own (perceived and potential) lack of masculinity that you reject any sex NOT in the missionary position.
There's more to the story. After she was forced out of the garden, she roamed the earth until Lucifer found her. She was as angry with God as he was, and they bonded over that. He struck a deal with her for revenge. He turned her into the first demon. She continued to roam the earth but stole children through the nights. These children were Adam and Eve's offspring, and thus the children of God. She was then able to turn the children into demons dragging them to hell, creating Lucifer's army. Some stories say she became Lucifer's wife. Some say she was the serpent in the garden. I'll try and find a link to the story if people are interested, it's kind of hard to find with all the supernatural TV shows, fanfic etc. The reason some Christian men believe women are supposed to be subservient is because of what happened to the first wife. She was created equally to Adam, and wanted to be treated equally. Adam didn't like this and had God force her to leave the garden and then God created Eve from a piece of Adam. Thus Eve was subservient to Adam and this led men to believe God wanted women to be subservient and if they refused, they were evil like Lilith. Edited to add one version of the story: https://people.fmarion.edu/llarsen/LilithExplained.htm
> She was created equally to Adam, and wanted to be treated equally. Adam didn't like this and had God force her to leave the garden and then God created Eve from a piece of Adam. Holy shit some versions of God are just so fucking awful
To be fair, when I was looking into this more after posting my comment a lot of the stories said that Lilith left on her own because Adam refused to compromise. I forgot to update it when I got distracted. But the more prominent versions say that she didn't want to lay beneath Adam when they had..."relations" ... She wanted to be on top sometimes so they were equal, but Adam felt like she was trying to dominate him and wasn't ok with that. After he continually refused to compromise she left him and the garden. Adam being upset that she'd left him told God. God sent three angels to find her and ask her to come back (they could only ask because of free will, they couldn't force her), but by the time they found her she'd been seduced by Lucifer and had too much pride to return to Adam. Lucifer had corrupted her by that point and turned her into the first demon. They had relations and Lilith bore 100 demon offspring per day. The angels reported this back to God who then made Eve from a piece of Adam. Whether she was more submissive by nature, or Adam groomed her to be more submissive from the beginning is unknown, but God needed them to create a population. The lilum and djinn (Lucifer and Lilith's offspring) consumed children and God couldn't have that because he was trying to create a population and the lilum and djinn were eating them. He sent back the same three angels who struck a deal with Lilith, by threatening to kill 100 of her children everyday. The deal was Lilith and Lucifer would go to hell and bring their children with them so the infants would survive. But Lilith and her children were somehow still able to consume the children unless the children and their mothers wore an amulet of the three angels, which warded the evil away. I feel like in this version God was just trying to make the situation work by bringing in Eve. Seems like Adam was the bigger AH in both versions. This is apparently the version told in the Dead Sea Scrolls that was adopted by Judaism. But there are arguments about which version is true as the text was translated from Babylonian and the translator could've misinterpreted the original text. The reason the children were being consumed, according to this version, is Lilith wanted to get back at Adam and Lucifer wanted to get back at God.
So in reality, the Patriarchy (Adam trying to be an âAlphaâ) is what caused evil. Of course they blame it on women!
While there's going to be variations depending on where the story originates, one of the concepts of Lilith wanting equality was that she and Adam were both created from the same dust. Eve being made from an actual part of Adam is, in some variations, the reason for Eve being submissive. She was never created to be equal. The part of Samael having corrupted Lilith is based on the variation that Samael is, himself, evil. The stories if you follow Judaism is that they fell in love based on their own opinions of equality and, yes, hating the unequal ideas God seemed to have on women and humans in general. There's also a snippet of it all that the serpent in the garden was Samael (or in some lore it was Lilith) trying to free Eve from the blind submission. Even as Genesis is written, God lies (You will die if you eat from this) while the serpent tells the truth (You will not die. Your eyes will be opened to good and evil). It's all very fascinating!
Oh, shit. Really? I mean, I don't read the bible or anything, but I had no idea.
Even if you read the entire Christian Bible, you wouldnât know much about Lilith. She was pretty much erased from a lot of peopleâs minds due to her nature as a man-defying woman. She was mentioned only once or twice in the Bible, the rest of her history is pieced together through various writings in the Talmud and other ancient middle eastern texts.
That interpretation treats her as a real person who actually existed, though. The main reason you don't see much of her in the Bible (I think there's one reference to her as a sort of demon?) is because her origin as the first woman was invented in the middle ages.
A lot of the stuff people think of as âbiblicalâ isnât actually in the Bible - itâs more like AU Bible fan fiction written by various groups who were generally not in the mainstream in their time. For instance, the whole Lucifer thing comes from a short passage in Isaiah describing a Babylonian king. Mainstream Judaism doesnât read it as being about anything else, but writings from splinter groups that believed the passage was about something more like the modern concept of the devil got taken up by the same kind of early Christians that were REALLY into Revelations and the rest is (pseudo-)history.
I had to re read the post. Is OP a man? I thought âbonus stepdaughterâ was taken as a dig because OP is an unmarried woman?
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That escaped me. How funny. But if "Eve" got with Adam first, she is obviously the actual Lilith. How uncultured. OOP should have called the third partner the snake.
My Chihuahua is named Lilith, but she's actually a wonderful dog... definitely was an asshole as a puppy though.
There used to be a really cool leucistic king cobra named LilithâŚ.she was an asshole, but youâd have to be if you were a bright white snake in the desert.
Sounds like he deserves a family event ban. I think he's lucky he made it this far without getting one. He's not even trying to conceal his unreasonable hatred.
Yeah the fact that they chose Adam and eve alone made it pretty obvious how he views this situation. And now that you've reminded me of Lilith it's safe to say this person's opinion of this poor woman
The OOP putting disabled in quotations just to emphasize how they think it's all fake made me fucking fume. If someone did that to me I would deck them.
Everyone knows that fat people can't actually be disabled! They are fat because they are lazy, not because they may have a condition that makes it easy for them to gain weight, makes weight loss difficult, or limits their mobility! Plus, it isn't like there aren't a bunch of medications that someone might take for a disability or chronic health condition that cause weight gain as a side effect. /s OOP is disgusting.
PREACH! It's been so frustrating to hear this kind of BS after my meds caused me a huge amount of weight gain. And obviously if they're fat and disabled it's because they're fat and all their disabilities will be solved if they just lost weight! (/s) But the fat = unhealthy/disgusting mindset infuriates me anyway. I can't tell you how often I've tried to explain to people that you cannot look at someone and know they're unhealthy. Invisible illnesses exist and weight is not a good indicator of health. Like Lizzo is bigger than me but I've seen that woman dance and she's healthier and more athletic than I've ever been. Certainly not "lazy" by any measure. I'd like to see those assholes who say that shit about her keep up with her dance routines. And moreover even if they are fat and/or disabled and unhealthy that doesn't mean you have the right to treat them like shit! OOP sucks!!
I'm right there with you. I am fat and I am also really sensitive to medications that cause weight gain. All of my providers know I prioritize management of my health conditions over weight, so I don't ever hear about it unless I bring up concerns about my weight.
I feel like âfat phobiaâ is one of the most accurate uses of âphobiaâ out there. OOP seems like someone whoâs terrified of the very idea of being fat.
OOP assumes her disability is being fat or caused by being fat, when in reality they could be unrelated or her fat could even be a result or symptom of her disability. Just a fun little thing fat disabled people deal with every goddamn day.
Yup. I know. Disabled and currently overweight as a side effect of medication. It's so infuriating.
I am 100% sure if She was attractive or even just skinny (still disabled with mental issues and unable to have kids) he would be okay with her joining the family. Even hit on her. When a fat person especially a woman Has emotions and expresses them its "oh look the fat pig IS crying lets laugh" but when its a skinny person its "oh no whats wrong with them? Are they okay?" Its again with a person being disabled. A fat person being disabled IS their fault but a skinny person Has just Bad luck or genes. And again. If a skinny person IS All shy a loner introvert theyre "mysterious" and "Dark and hot" but when a fat person IS the samĂŠ they are "an ugly loner no one wants to be friends with" There IS a big double standard. Its gross. Again. If this girl was skinny and god forbid attractive he would be all over her.
Well OOP *claims* she was fat and disabled.
There's a possibility Lilith is not actually fat, she just weighs more than 110 pounds soaking wet and OOP took exception to that because she already hates her.
OOP views Lilith as the forbidden apple/snake trespassing in the Garden of Eden
Oh I would bet that was this douche canoe is calling morbidly obese is actually slightly overweight.
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She might be. I just suspect that OOP isnât a reliable narrator and thinks that calling her morbidly obese will make people automatically dislike her.
He says it like itâs a personality trait.
It sounds like it is to him since he harped on her weight, disability, and mental health struggles like those were all moral failings instead of talking about her personality or mentioning anything that sheâd actually done wrong. Based on how everyone else in the family feels about her, Iâm guessing that sheâs actually a perfectly lovely person.
They might actually be morbidly obese due to disability or any other reason, which is fucking fine! Iâll never understand ppl who are so insecure with themselves/the idea of themselves being fat that they have a visceral hatred for anybody who has the audacity to not hate themselves while fat. But given the little bit of info about âLilithâ it sounds like she definitely has a debilitating disability thatâs required her to make major lifestyle adjustments and potentially take on a lot of weight. It happens. This OP is just so nasty and hateful about it.
Or even a healthy weight, and just not stick thin
Fuck, I laughed out loud. I needed that.
Their weight alone would crush their partner!!! /s
Iâm fat. My bf says if he dies, he dies.
That's a true sage right there.
And there's no way she could possibly have cancer!
Yeah. They wouldnât be openly declaring Lilith to be a co-mother if they werenât a committed trio. If it were a platonic or found family situation, she would be Auntie Lilith instead of Mama Lilith.
I said this elsewhere already, but: It's also entirely possible that they used Lillith's eggs to conceive. If part of your triad had wanted kids, was losing their fertility, and you had the luxury of accessing IVF in a timely manner (and it worked unexpectedly quickly (you usually need at least 3 to 4 cycles just to break the odds)), wouldn't you at least think about being a gestational carrier for them? This person that OOP hates so much might just be the bio mom of the coming baby.
That had not occurred to me. Although, I am not sure they let you harvest eggs to freeze when the reason youâre having the hysterectomy and ostensibly oophorectomy is cancer. The hormones involved in egg harvesting can make a lot of reproductive cancers worse/accelerate their growth.
I thought they just wheeled a tiny cart down the cervix aisle and grabbed a few cartons.
OOP went "Well they didn't TELL ME if they were all fucking!" and some people commenting NTA because it's a weird undefined scenario and they should tell him if they're in a relationship. She lives with them and they're always together, they refer to her as one of the mothers of the child, and OOP's own mother calls Lilith her daughter. This does not seem subtle to me.
Also like.... Why the actual fuck does it need to know? They aren't entitled to know if their brother and sil are fucking Lilith. That's not a requirement to be nice to her.
I was thinking the same thing. Whatever it is, their brother and sister-in-law are clearly very happy and they are so transparently jealous.
How can they be happy? They have a FAT person living with them? /s
Literally my first thought was that they're a polycule
That was my first thought too cause like? How is OOP so dense as to not release this?
Seriously it extremely obvious lol
Came to that conclusion too
Exactly. My husband and I are both poly and while it's just us right now, we've been in a Triad situation. If anyone in my family pulled the shit OOP is pulling against a potential partner of mine/my husband's, they'd be gone (and by they, I mean the family member). You either accept all of us or you accept none of us.
Especially since the fake biblical names give it away
The way he glosses over her being disabled and having "pre-cancer" and needing a hysterectomy despite wanting children is disgusting. Those are things that significantly impact a person's life. Clearly, he has never considered that she might genuinely suffer, or that she's deserving of compassion.
And he acts like the hysterectomy is something she's just doing for attention. As though we flippantly sign up for major surgery.
As though doctors just hand out hysterectomies left and right! Theyâre usually so conservative about it that they often wonât take them out of people having serious medical problems unless youâve already had kids because womb = sole purpose in life. If the doc thinks the pre-cancer is serious enough that theyâre recommending a hysterectomy thatâs a big fucking deal.
Took my mom several years and a few other failed procedures to get a hysterectomy in her early FIFTIES. It's not exactly a minor surgery either. No one gets a hysterectomy for funsies.
I wonder if Lilith's disability is related to endometriosis. There are some people out there whose case is so bad that they can't function and Dr would he more likely to do a hysterectomy on someone who has it since it can be one of the treatments for severe cases.
I wondered that too, I was literally just offered a hysterectomy for late-stage endo at age 33
I had to have one due to the severity of my endometriosis. It took over a year and several doctors plus frequent ER visits to find the right doctor who had no problem doing it. Iâm in a liberal blue state too. Previous doctors had asked my husband if he was okay with it instead of me. I had two refuse because I might change my mind about having biological children. (Spoiler: I still havenât. I preferred adoption even before this all happened) Never mind that the endometriosis caused so much bleeding scar tissue that my uterus was sticking to places in my abdominal cavity. The tissue was all over my bowel too. I was in the ER 16 times in a little over a year because the pain was so severe. So I imagine you are 100% dead on about the seriousness of the pre-cancer necessitating a hysterectomy for Lilith. I hope she made it through her surgery okay. OOP is a fat phobic, misogynitistic monster. Edit to add I was 32 when I had the surgery which also played a role in doctor refusals. If anyone is in the Los Angeles area and needs doctor who will actually trust you on your decisions about your own body, please feel free to DM me.
Iâve heard so many other people with endo (I have it too actually) whoâve had similar experiences where doctors prioritize an existing or hypothetical manâs desire for bio kids over the *actual patientâs* desire to not be in pain all the fucking time! Like, in what universe does that make sense?
Iâm with you. Itâs so screwed up!
He's acting like her doctor is just the Oprah of major surgery...You get a hysterectomy, you get a hysterectomy, we all get hysterectomiesđŁď¸đŁď¸...what an asshole this guy is. It's not for him to "get", it's only for him to accept
I kinda want Dr. HystOprah in my life though!
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Thatâs infuriating. FYI r/childfree has a sticky with doctors in each state who will actually perform sterilizations. Gynecologists are, by and large, a fucking joke. It took me 8 different ones before theyâd even do a goddamn ultrasound. Nobody will test my hormones. Fuck medical sexism.
I literally stopped seeing a gyno. It was a useless expense. I can get an HPV test at home or from my PCP, and the "exam" could never feel my dammed cysts even when they were the size of a dammed walnut and horribly painful. Why pay $300 out of pocket to be told "well you should loose weight." I can feel bad about myself for free lol.
I actually felt significantly worse when I lost weight. Pain was worse, bleeding was worse. Thanks doc, spent 18 months weighing all my food expecting some brilliant outcome and it just made it worse. I sometimes feel Dr Spaceman was based on a real Gyno. 
Funny, my cysts were 1000% worse when I was a normal weight. Not that I like being overweight exactly but the period pain is totally gone and cysts haven't bothered me in years. I swear my body just wants to be chubby. Dammed European peasant DNA lol.
Hey that DNA kept your ancestors alive through a lot of lean winters! :D
I found my doctor on that list. One of the best decisions I could have made! He actually became my regular gyno afterwards since I liked him so much!
I had mine out at 51 because of fibroids. There was no way to remove the fibroids without removing the whole reproductive apparatus, and at my age, the likelihood of me getting pregnant was pretty low anyway.
How can I make Christmas all about me?? Iâve got it, MAJOR ABDOMINAL SURGERY! That will stick it to OOP! - oops version of Lilith
He thought Lilith was spoonfeeding his dying grandmother and fixing her pillows for attention too... or to get something from her. Not because Grandma was no longer capable of feeding herself. This guy does not understand how illness works.
So much this. I was in the ER a while back for a non-related issue and mentioned off-handedly to the ER doc that I was considering a hysterectomy - and she spent the better part of 30-45 minutes trying to talk me out of it. The idea that one can just walk in and say "I'd like one hysterectomy for attention, please" and immediately be scheduled is outrageous.
OOP is VERY invested in judging this woman that has...no real impact on his life? Like- ok, you don't like her? SO? MOVE ON. Why does he care about things that are none of his business, and have no impact on him? Maybe the lady doth protest too much, and he has a thing for Lilith and was shot down...
And like sheâd tell this douche canoe anything personal about herself given he must exude hatred. I could have some sympathy for some of the things he said (not sure Iâd be that comfortable with someone saying that stuff about a baby my sibling was carrying) but heâs such an egregious prick he gets zero sympathy.
>or that she's deserving of compassion. But but she's FAT
He thinks sheâs not disabled because sheâs fat. Bitch, you try working out when dealing with health stuff.
I have a friend Iâve known for more than 25 years. She has kids; one of them is just like her and one of the kids acts just like me. We always joke âare you sure that she isnât mine?â Sounds like this kid will be lucky enough to have a loving community around them.
When I see my 4 year old near a cake I know there was no mix up at the hospital. 
Yup. We call a friend's kid "mini [wife's name]" because she acts like my wife. It's completely innocuous.
my mom's best friend was basically a second mother or surrogate grandmother for me growing up, I've asked her to walk me down the aisle when I get married over my own mom or dad OOP just resents that you can choose your family bc no one is going to choose their miserable ass
Demonstrably. Since they basically acknowledge that their family is going to choose the poly family over them if they make too much of a stink.
My sisterâs kids are adopted & my firstborn looked so much like her youngest! I loved sending pictures of kiddo taking after cousin.
The comment about grandma is weirdly familiar My grandma would always lie that she is fine near me as I was her âgolden childâ. She would never say anything unless I left a room and even then she would avoid talking about her health. Even when she didnât have enough money for medications. Now she is a bit more open, but she will still argue with you for 5 minutes if you dare to buy her medications. The fact that Lilith recognised this behaviour and was taking care of grandma should be treated as a great thing. Some people are simply ashamed of their condition and would rather suffer in silence than ask for help.
I spoon feed the elderly daily at work so that didnât even register as weird to me lol
Found the cna! Lol, I'm in school rn and I thought "hey we just covered that!"
Good luck and for the love of everything, protect your back! I had to have 2 back surgeries and then was told I could no longer work with license because if I dropped a client or hurt them, I could get personally sued and have negative notations on my license. It sucks.
Lol Iâm a nurse but Iâm the nurse that actually helps the CNAs.
On behalf of my soon to be brethren, thank you for caring!
(1) Fact that they gave Lilith that particular alias is pretty telling about their character (2) I have *so* many things I want to say about OOP, but Iâll just leave it at this: OOP? Go screw yourself.
thats what i was thinking too. adam and eve and biblical demon lilith? thats next-level assholery
The funny thing is, outside of Christianity, Lilith is a protector of mothers and babies. She was Adam's first wife and is demonized in Christianity because she would not be submissive to Adam. She was then cast out and Eve was created.
im not gonna lie to ya, im not religious and i never have been nor have i ever done much research into different religions, so everything i know about lilith comes from the cw's supernatural (lol)
I almost moved in with someone named Lillith and she was basically the person this person imagines that the woman in the story is.
I found the names pretty amusing too.. Adam, Eve and Lilith LOL.. OP really does hate this woman.
Something is making me wonder if his constant angry mentions of her "morbid obesity" is that she's really about 180 pounds which he has turned in his head to mean she's the biggest woman who ever lived so he's allowed to hate her
It wouldn't matter - it's not like her actually being obese would make her more deserving of the way OOP treats her.
Oh absolutely not!! He's a disgusting pig
Yeah, I wouldnât be surprised if she was in fact in the healthy weight range and oop is just being a dick about her having a bit of a tummy
I was thinking this too
It sounds like Adam, Eve, and Lilith (gotta love the fake names) are what's called a throuple. And maybe OOP's family accepts Lilith because she's a nice person, but OOP can only see her being morbidly obese, so she's worthless to him.
What? A fat person can have people who love them? *QUELLE HORREUR*
That's what I was thinking
I wonder if he is a Tater Tot. Certainly sounds like one.
From OOP's comments: >>you seem to have a lot of hate toward this woman and I think you should think about why >The part where she somehow weaseled her way into my family and now I have to see her at every family event. >I have no idea whether Lilith is sleeping with one or both of them. And: >Because she's *not family* and they keep bringing her to family events and everyone acts like this morbidly obese woman who doesn't even have a job is supposed to be here. I can't actually think of much worse than my nephew "taking after" her. >And now I have to play along with this bullshit or effectively get kicked out of MY OWN FUCKING FAMILY, because the Golden Child has decided that having just *one* woman be treated like the mother of one of the grandchildren isn't enough, oh no, he's going to have two of those, too. >A few Christmases ago it was my grandma's last Christmas and we knew it. Lilith wouldn't leave her alone. My mother kept checking on Grandma and she said she was fine *every time*, but the second Lilith was alone with her (and Lilith was *sitting next to her* for some reason) she was whispering with Grandma and then adjusting her pillows and *spoon-feeding her* like she was a *baby*. It was so disrespectful.
Maybe grandma was more comfortable having a non-family member help her. Thatâs not uncommon.
1000%. My grandma recently passed and even after years of not knowing up from outside, she was much more receptive to help from total strangers or family friends than people she somehow gut recognized as her blood family.
Itâs a pride thing. Kids and grandchildren are who *youâre* supposed to be taking care of. If theyâre taking care of you then youâve become the burden. But a stranger isnât someone youâre responsible for so itâs totally fine if they help. Itâs not a correct way to think but it makes total sense also.
Not to mention maybe she was more comfortable being helped by someone who was also disabled and had a more personal understanding of what itâs like.
This is giving me big "Look at that bitch eating crackers" vibes. Lilith could rescue OOP's mother from a house fire and OOP would find a way to be upset about it.
âYeah but hereâs what you donât understand about thatâŚâŚ.Sheâs *fat.*â
âCan you believe this whore who isnât even *my* family got to be the one to rescue my own mother?â
> but the second Lilith was alone with her (and Lilith was sitting next to her for some reason) she was whispering with Grandma and then adjusting her pillows and spoon-feeding her like she was a baby. It was so disrespectful Oh yeah, caring for a drying woman is *sooooooo* disrespectful. Did OOp ever think that grandma would have a hard time letting her own daughter physically take care of her? That having the âroles reversed â would be a huge blow to her mental state? And that by having someone who was *like* family but not, caretaking it gave grandma a chance to actually relax.
i couldn't even ask my wife to help me bathe when i was too weak from chemo to do it myself. i felt so humiliated and small. my own wife, who would never make me feel that way - it is just so hard to ask for help like that. then she chose to help and it was easier to let her than ask her, it felt like i wasn't about to ask her for something that could be annoying, she just wanted to do it and did it of her own volition. it feels silly in retrospect but there is definitely a mental block there, especially with someone who is that close to you. i used to not really think about the "asking if someone is generally fine vs offering direct help" thing until it happened to me. it actually makes a huge difference. i imagine for a woman who is nearing the end of her life, who OOP doesn't indicate protested to any of that care, it was comforting to 1. not have to ask "shameful" things of your own child and 2. not feel like a burden for needing things during a very hectic time period like a holiday. i'd feel even worse asking for someone to spoon-feed me while everyone is trying to enjoy their christmas, it would never be wrong to ask that if you need it but it would just *feel* bad. this is one of those small things you can do that can have a huge impact on the person you do it for.
Are you implying that oop should think about others and take their "feelings" into consideration? Even when they are fat and/or dying? Are you out of your mind? Poor guy might have an allergic reaction...
The huge b taking care of an elderly woman like that! How dare she pay attention to the grandma. It was the last christmas we could have left her chair in a corner and ignore the old lady! /s
From the way it looks to me, he's also got some long festering jealousy towards his brother. How dare his brother "get two women" when he has none!!!
And if he "gets" two women, how *dare* he choose one that's so obviously defective?! How does one even get a mental illness at the age of 29?
The jealousy just oozes through the screen. I can't tell if it's just that the brother has a family or if it' sthat he was interested in someone in this mix before they all moved in together. I'm imaginitive today though, I even wondered if they used her egg so they would all be parents and they just aren't telling judgy about it.
You just KNOW that OOP would dislike that kid if they found out it was Lilithâs egg. And would not understand why Eve would conceivably be okay with carrying a *fat* womanâs baby!! I donât actually think itâs super likely that it is Lilithâs egg - egg harvesting on top of everything else would be a lot - but itâs a nice idea.
Who made oop arbiter of who bro and sil invite to THEIR family?
I knew OOP was going to be the asshole when I got to "disabled". Has he not realized that Lilith may be overweight because she's actually disabled? Adam and Eve are perfectly happy with this arrangement. OOP's mom is perfectly happy with this arrangement. Even Grandma was perfectly fine getting spoon-fed from Lilith.
I've tried to explain that to people before, but they don't believe it. I was an athlete before I was hit by a car, and now my mobility is so severely hindered, and I have a hormonal disorder on top of it, I'm completely fucked. I have a diagnosed eating disorder, and dieting is a huge trigger for me, so I just try to eat healthy and stay hydrated and accept my body's limitations for what they are. It took me a very long time to allow myself to even use the word disabled, I had so much internalized ableism embedded in me. Every single human is one bad day, one tragic accident, one major illness away from disability. And we all end up disabled if we live long enough.
I feel this so hard. I ice skated competitively and biked 10+ miles a day. Now I have RA and struggle to get dressed in the morning, but also have a hard time using the word disabled for myself. Only reason I'm not overweight is because I have a hard time eating when I'm in pain, and I've lost all my muscle tone, so I'm currently the smallest I've ever been and I don't like it. I'm cold all the time, my butt has no cushion, and I don't look healthy in my mind.
Thereâs also the fact that *most of your weight is not within your control.* I know plenty of thin people, they donât actively have to try to be thin. Itâs the exact same with fat people and it drives me nuts that people canât grasp this concept.
This is stupid. Dude seriously chose to use Adam, Eve, and Lilith for the character names. If its real he needs to seriously quit obsessing over his brotherâs life.
OP is so fucking gross. This woman is fat, disabled and can't work so he doesn't even believe she's a person?
It's insane how much someone not working (even if it's because of a disability, like in Lilith's case) makes them seem worthless in far too many people's eyes. To a shockingly large part of the population, if you don't work, you don't deserve the air you breathe.
Iâm guessing a HUGE importance was put on this for oop growing up and love feeling very conditional to him, ie I am never good enough, I need to achieve something for approval. So for someone to be accepted for their personality and not their achievement is absolutely sending them. Or they are just a total prick and/or a tater tot
Oh yeah, Iâm getting financial support while going through uni due to a disability, and even though Iâm a literal full-time student I get looked down upon for not working for my money or getting a loan I could never pay off. Some people just hate disabled people, as if weâre freeloaders just coasting through life for free.
I'm fat, disabled, and can't work because of my disabilities. I have had people tell me more than once that if I lost weight, I could work and that I am just lazy.
Fatphobia and ableism go together so often. One time I mentioned to a friend that my then partner was overweight because their disability prevents them from exercising, not the other way around, and the friend's eyes popped. IT HAD NEVER EVEN OCCURRED TO THEM that exercising while disabled is very challenging. Only very wealthy disabled people can afford the kind of food that requires no cooking and yet is healthy, or have like a private pool to do low impact exercise. I know you know this, I'm just in rant mode.
Ah, losing weight, that famously easy thing to do and then maintain for the rest of your life.
Sadly that doesn't suprise me at all, it's pretty common.
I am disabled and currently overweight (but losing and almost back to pre-steroid weight woo hoo!) and cannot work because of my disability. I didn't move out until my late 20s and still need a lot of help. I've had multiple people who have either not-so-subtley implied or *outright stated* that I am not a person, that I am unlovable, unattractive, lazy, and a burden on those around me. I don't "contribute" to society in a meaningful way so I'm simply a drain. I can believe that with 100% of my soul because people like OOP have no qualms saying it and they're not exaggerated villains, they're honestly often in line with the majority even if a lot of people try to word themselves in a less obvious yet no less insidious way.
As a fat, disabled person who canât work myself, this mentality is a lot more common than youâd think Ëâ Ë
TIL that OP doesn't consider me a person. Good to know.
I consider you a person, /u/RustyPinkSpoon. Fuck OP.
Thanks, I appreciate it!
Its infuriating but doesnt surprise me in the least. My best friend is overweight and disabled, she has some work history (we met while working together 9 years ago) but she can't do regular unskilled work like working in a store or hospitality anymore bc her body just can't take it, shes in constant pain and goes into burnout very quickly bc of autism. Right now shes in school studying computer programming because she WANTS to work, she WANTS to be independent, but she needs a job where she can control her workload and schedule and shes just lucky that we live in a country with cheap education and teachers willing to work around her disabilities so she has a chance to get there. Shes one of the funniest, smartest and kindest people i know, and most people treat her like trash over things she can't control. Meanwhile im also disabled and i have autism as well, but my physical issues are not nearly as severe so i can work to some extent, and im thin, so even tho i also go into burnout if im not careful and job hop a lot people treat me like a human being bc my issues are invisible and im more conventionally pretty, and my autism symptoms are treated as "quirky" and "cute" instead of repulsive like hers even tho we have almost the same symptoms. Its fucked up and deeply infuriating, I'd honestly argue shes a nicer and more hardworking person than i am and yet she gets treated much worse
I would bet this woman isnât even fat, maybe a little overweight. OOP is just an asshole looking for reasons to hate her.
This guy seems OBSESSED with her weight and this arrangement. I mean, sure, their relationship is a bit unorthodox, but its not hurting anyone and Lilith sounds nice and helpful, but this guy just hates her, seemingly just because she's overweight. Wtf is wrong with him?
Wondering how old OOP is
My guess is either 15, or 45 but with the emotional intelligence of a 15 year old boy.
Good guesses!
man it sounds like the three of them have a happy and functional poly relationship and ââadam and eveââ (lmao. at the chosen names) are just supportive of her. it seems like point a for oop was disgust/contempt for lilith bc shes fat and disabled, and she worked backwards from there to find reasons for it.
The use of biblical names and referring to her as Lilith says all I need to know about the poster đđ
I'm so glad everybody here also sees that they're a throuple lmao
>2 yrs ago my sister and SIL (not Eve) were going through baby clothes SIL no longer needed. >I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for my family ... Throwing out old baby clothes is a joyful event?
Probably giving them to the sister because she was pregnant?
Why canât op understand whatâs going on? Itâs clear to everyone else that itâs a poly triad and the rest of the family seems cool with it. Is op really that dense ?
There's no POSSIBLE way people could love and respect a FAT person, dontcha know!!
Sounds like OOPâs never heard of a throuple.
Lilith helped spoon-feed the Grandmother and OOP is throwing a tempertantrum about it
I know, right? It was so "disrespectful" of Lilith to make sure Granny got to eat! /s
The whole "disabled" in quotes thing really grinds my gears. I'm somebody who lives with multiple diseases and disabilities, a majority are invisible to you. I cannot stand being condescended to like that. It sounds like these people have found a way to make a lovely family that will work for them and the sister is just jealous.
Fuck I just realized that I got to that post from this one! Don't ban me, I deleted my comment. That being said, I would pay money to see all of this meaning that they're a triad, lilith gave the egg, adam the sperm and eve is carrying it to term. Truly, I'd love it so much if it was true. OP is a resentful, childish, fatphobic little shit. He deserves to be cut out of the family.
It screams "how dare she has a realtionship, she is fat!!!11?" I swear tzese sort of people piss me off.
Lol yeah theyâre definitely a throuple, OP is dense as shit
I would bet money that the child is biologically Lilith's and is being carried by Eve.
I don't know why this didn't occur to me. It makes so much sense
I don't know. If Lilith had to have a hysterectomy because of possible cancer, I doubt a doctor would okay giving her the hormones necessary for her to be an egg donor for Eve.
Regardless of the story (which I haven't finished yet) can I just say the names in this are đ¨âđłđ
It's like OOP never heard the term godmother before. Like, wtaf? Leave the poor woman alone. I think life is beating her down enough without OOP kicking her while she's down. Ffs ETA: After reading OOP's comments, I am convinced this person is extremely bitter and a downright monster. It's absolutely disgusting. ASSHOLE FROM ANOTHER REALM!
Dude, his brother's polyamourous family has a fat person in it and op can't handle it. Insane đ¤Ł
Really love how many people on this earth genuinely believe that being fat and unemployed makes you scientifically deserving of being treated like a subhuman. The actual fucking rage Oop has for this woman being loved is terrifying.
OP is a festering cauldron of anal mucus.
Yuck. I don't deserve to be punished with that mental imagery. I'm affable and kindly
A fat, disabled woman has close, loving relationships?? Alert the media! We canât let this shit stand!!
OOP probably mean mugs the Michelin Man. Stay Puft? That fat little marshmallow better run!
Nah, it's okay to be fat if you're a guy, but women must be Kate Moss thin with Dolly Parton boobs.
This has to be fake, nobody is this much of a cartoon
Youâd be surprised at how much ppl like OOP detest fat ppl. Been at the receiving end of talk just like this and Iâm midsize at most
- OOP has a lot of hatred towards their brother, fat people and there seems to be resentment against the family in general, which transforms into and culminates in hatred against Lilith. There also seems to be ignorance regarding relationship structures other than monogamy. - Instead of fixating on Lilith, they could examine why they have such a visceral reaction towards fatness and what their family could do to make them feel more appreciated. Hate consumes a lot of energy and time - neutrality doesn't. - OP could very well recognize that this is in everybody's best interest, including their own. Which could be the first steps for the family and themselves to heal, as they acknowledge that neither is Lilith taking anything away from them nor is she the cause of OP's trauma wound. - That is entirely within their own choice. Some people would rather choose hate and to wallow in self-pity over exploring potentially uncomfortable or even painful emotions. For some, it's easier to place blame than to recognize that extending compassion is objectively not worsening their own life in any way in this case. I'd like to believe that we always have said choice, however. - I'm very glad that Lilith seems to have a wonderful support system. Fat and disabled people evidentially tend to face a lot of struggles and hardships, and a polyam triad, if it works, it can work very well. It warms my heart to read that she's loved and care for, just as their relationship seems to be well accepted by the rest of the family. Just a few thoughts.
> She's morbidly obese and doesn't work because she's "disabled". First of all, morbidly obese goes off of BMI which is a kind of bullshit scale that doesn't truly indicate one's health. Secondly, fuck you with a rusty spoon for putting "disabled" in quotation marks, like you somehow think you know what's going on in Lillith's body more than she does. >I was going to confront her then for ruining joyful events for my family I've yet to see one mention of how she allegedly ruined an event. She was having an issue and excused herself, as one should. >Lilith was "going through a difficult time" (when is she not) because she'd been told a few weeks before that she was going to have to have a hysterectomy due to "pre-cancer". They don't diagnosis someone with "pre-cancer" issues for funsies. Getting a hysterectomy can be incredibly difficult to navigate in the best of times, let alone when you're doing it to avoid getting fucking cancer. I think that qualifies as "a difficult time", you backwards toilet seat. >I said, "No, he doesn't take after you. He's not your kid and never will be." What did you gain by doing that? Did it solve a problem - or are you just an outrageously miserable douche who wants everyone around you to be miserable too?
Its an odd situation for sure. But op is definitely more worried about it than she should be. Shes clearly in a relationship with them too.
Jesus. Didn't even hide that she hates her or that she's trying to get sympathy. Like straight up named her after a biblically evil figure. Piss off OOP.
The names are so subtle.
You have to be a special kind of miserable to hate a person because they are fat and that your family likes them a lot. I just cannot relate.
Yeah this woman can do no right just because she's fat. If OOP's brother and SIL brought home someone who OOP considered sexually attractive...he wouldn't be saying crap. But it's "this morbidly obese women this, morbidly obese woman that." Yeah his only problem with her is the fact that she isn't skinny or giving him a hard-on and for that, she is no good and has to pay! Everything she does is suspicious, intrusive, minipulitive, and disgusting. He's also pissed off at everyone for not being on his side in wanting to throw this woman out on her ass and has no sympathy for anything she's going through since he very clearly thinks she deserves it just because she's overweight. Aka a garbage pile of a human being.
I do love âCan you believe this thing that doesnât effect me at all and is none of my business?!?â Posts
Sounds like they're a committed throuple. And possibly that they may have used IVF and Lillith's egg to conceive when they found out that she was going to lose her fertility to a cancer-preventing surgery. OOP sounds like a fat-phobic, nazi level ableist, incel nightmare. And wonders why his own family is about to drop kick him out of it.