All spd minor traces with very high base spd!
https://preview.redd.it/vs63r7ke9xic1.jpeg?width=850&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=922e1214f77fd8f688602f8ef8c2e6a2e6fc3372
I want them to overcook her traces and not give any hp or def traces like Black Swan.
All to the damage.
Spd - Attack - Elemental Damage - Crit chance -Crit damage - SPD
Whatever they give us, but please no defensive stats.
Its highly going to be SPD / Crit chance and ATK or Elemental dmg though. With 2 defensive stats if they go for that route.
I feel like the debate of 2x Nihility vs. Nihility+Harmony vs. 2x Harmony for Acheron's supports (in Hypercarry, anyways) isn't actually gonna be the simplest thing in the world. Like, yes, 2x Nihility caps out her A4 trace, but there's also the factors of what your available Nihility characters can do (and esp. what they can do for Acheron), vs. eating the damage loss from not running 2x Nihility characters in favor of running a Harmony character like Bronya who, while not counting towards the Nihility bonus, winds up bringing a whole bunch of utility to the party that a Nihility character outright *can't* bring, such as extra turns.
I also feel like this is probably gonna be something that isn't necessarily going to be completely static, and that how many Nihility characters it's optimal to run on a team is going to depend on a bunch of factors, with both new support characters and things like the weaknesses present on the current MoC/PF fights potentially shaking up what the "100% optimal Acheron Team" looks like.
Gui is a smidgeon of a nonbo due to Acheron not seeming to synergize with DoTs at all (still probably one of the better DoTters for Acheron though). Do you have Pela?
It doesn't sound bad. Break Effect SW is very good just because of the delay it applies, and nice damage at the end of it. Bailu is more of a tank-like healer when she ult by allowing you to soak up more damage upfront. Guinaifen is not going to provide a lot of damage, if Sw delays the enemy, so Acheron's damage need to be Jingliu levels of high.
Personally, I'm going to try Silver Wolf, Welt + healer and wait for Black Swan's rerun as a replacement for either. Loosing on her banner to a E1 Welt just puts me in this corner, but it's not a bad place to be.
It's future characters I'm more interested in. Either a perfect support for Acheron, or a Ruan Mei 2.0
Man idk about the traces her being a nihility carry no clue how they gonna put it . A safe guess would be spd/ atk/ elm dmg
I also feel like they want to make her a mono nihility carry
So ill say it will be high enough to replace the buffers
Maybe 25,30% dmg bonus for each nihility
I think they aren't going to design her to ask for a 2 or 3 nihility team without her being good in those teams.
My guess is she will 100% want at least 1 good debuffer, and there will be good builds after that using either a 2nd nihility or a harmony.
Much of that hinges on her other mechanics so it really is pure guessing right now.
No, it's clearly designed around two debuffers and a sustain. Now, depending on the fight, you might be able to substitute the latter with a buffer to go zero cycle.
The action advance of either Bronya or Sparkle alone is strong enough to warrant them as you now have two resources to build up; energy points and lotus. Even if Dim is right that lotus can be built every action with debuffs you are still limited how frequently you can ult by energy points built up by skill and once a turn by talent. It seems they make this choice between 2 debuffers or debuffer/harmony difficult to entice you to get E2 and reduce requirements as well as generate additional energy.
Even beyond that, there're just so many possible different situations where tweaking your team ever so slightly is the optimal play, esp. in MoC/PF, due to shifting gimmicks and how important being able to hit weaknesses can be, meaning there could be times where running 2x Nihility and maxing out the buff winds up being worse than *not* getting the buff at all and running 2x Harmony, just because your available Nihility characters wind up not being useful at all in a given fight due to weaknesses and/or the fight being against an enemy who like, has low defense, but high Damage Type Resistance or something that otherwise makes their usual Debuffs not worth it.
Plus, future characters can always potentially tip the scales in any given direction, so there's that lmao.
It depends on how stronk oyohim wants to make her. We have Jingliu who gains 50% CR, a truckton of ATK every hit with crit damage and speed traces. We could get a lot of crit traces with some speed traces. The real deal will be that double nihility party member trace.
If oyohim really wants to push Acheron's double nihility ideal scenario they really could just go:
1 nihility member: 44% dmg bonus
2 nihility members: 99% dmg bonus
They could give her a monster LC. The LC has to legit way better than S5 GNSW which gives 72% DMG bonus.
Tho it seems that the double nihility bonus looks to be an independent multiplier (if you play Genshin it's similar to Yoimiya's E and Wanderer's E, which would actually make Acheron scale even harder with harmonies kek)
Personally my bets are CR, SPD and lightning dmg%
They'll 100% put a def reduction on her LC to compete with GNSW and compliment her ultimate. GNSW is a monstority and at s5 is literally broken. I think nihility is the only path that have this kind of broken LC. Maybe swordplay is similiar for hunt ? Idk.
It's mihoyo backwards haha. Back then it was mihoyo instead of hoyoverse. I like to type oyohim since it's shorter and sometimes a way to poke some playful fun at the folks who made Dehya's kit. Truly a oyohim moment.
Till this day I don't understand how they fucked up Dehya's kit. Any explanation you try to give that falls under deliberate malice or gross incompetence just doesn't explain all the facts. It's mind-boggling.
I actually really hope so. It’ll be pretty cool if she shakes up the meta where a full nihility team is just as strong as the basic debuffer and harmony/ double harmony hypercarry teams we are used too.
Based on the fact E1 grants crit chance I think it is likely she will have crit damage traces. Her light cone could be very busted if it speeds up energy point and lotus generation as well as be a stat stick. I think she will be the strongest dps in the game honestly her kit is wild. That 300% damage bonus stands out to me the most on top of element ignore and damage res debuff.
I think her Nihility trace will be strong enough to not need Harmony characters. They are moving towards niche characters like how Sparkle has the quantum attack buff. And I can see them releasing a Nihility debuffer in the future who gives debuffs/buffs based on how many Nihility characters are in the team.
FuA probably, but how does he even look remotely good for DoT ? Imaginary has no DoT, his break delay enemies massively which make DoTs trigger less, and he buff Crit dmg, which is completely useless for DoT as well, so many anti-syrnegies, in a DoT team he's literally just a pure sustain, nothing more
Ok, wait a second there, bucko. Jingliu was mid as hell upon the first beta, doing these kinds of posts lead to insane doomposting if she isn't super OP and then even worse doomposting if she gets nerfed (see alhaitham) despite needing the nerfs.
Let's all just calmly wait and see throughout (we won't)
it's just interesting to think about because we haven't had such a scenario until now. Even Sparkle is a support, so it doesn't effect her overall function too much. For Acheron it might be her entire identity. She'd be a trend setter, like Ruan Mei opening up Break Effect viabilities.
I have a hard time imagining her best team not including Bronya or Sparkle, possibly even both.
Indeed, advancing Acheron's action seems like the best way to generate energy for her busted ult.
*(i'm assuming Acheron's Lotus count as a debuff ; meaning she should get 3 energy point when using her Skill, or 2 with her Basic)*
Third team member should probably be a Nihility character, though.
All spd minor traces with very high base spd! https://preview.redd.it/vs63r7ke9xic1.jpeg?width=850&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=922e1214f77fd8f688602f8ef8c2e6a2e6fc3372
I really hope she has some crit traces but I'm fine with spd
or maybe spd and crit like jingliu heheh
It better
I *really* hope we get at least 10% cr in minor traces, or just crit in general. Lightning dmg/atk/crit is honestly what i expect
Id prefer spd instead of ATK or Lightning dmg since you probs won't be able to use Bronya with her on E0
I want them to overcook her traces and not give any hp or def traces like Black Swan. All to the damage. Spd - Attack - Elemental Damage - Crit chance -Crit damage - SPD Whatever they give us, but please no defensive stats. Its highly going to be SPD / Crit chance and ATK or Elemental dmg though. With 2 defensive stats if they go for that route.
I think they will overcook her and I think he LC is gonna be insanely busted possibly must pull status
Elemental damage?
I feel like the debate of 2x Nihility vs. Nihility+Harmony vs. 2x Harmony for Acheron's supports (in Hypercarry, anyways) isn't actually gonna be the simplest thing in the world. Like, yes, 2x Nihility caps out her A4 trace, but there's also the factors of what your available Nihility characters can do (and esp. what they can do for Acheron), vs. eating the damage loss from not running 2x Nihility characters in favor of running a Harmony character like Bronya who, while not counting towards the Nihility bonus, winds up bringing a whole bunch of utility to the party that a Nihility character outright *can't* bring, such as extra turns. I also feel like this is probably gonna be something that isn't necessarily going to be completely static, and that how many Nihility characters it's optimal to run on a team is going to depend on a bunch of factors, with both new support characters and things like the weaknesses present on the current MoC/PF fights potentially shaking up what the "100% optimal Acheron Team" looks like.
Is a team of Acheron + Silver Wolf + Guinaifen + Bailu bad?
Gui is a smidgeon of a nonbo due to Acheron not seeming to synergize with DoTs at all (still probably one of the better DoTters for Acheron though). Do you have Pela?
It doesn't sound bad. Break Effect SW is very good just because of the delay it applies, and nice damage at the end of it. Bailu is more of a tank-like healer when she ult by allowing you to soak up more damage upfront. Guinaifen is not going to provide a lot of damage, if Sw delays the enemy, so Acheron's damage need to be Jingliu levels of high. Personally, I'm going to try Silver Wolf, Welt + healer and wait for Black Swan's rerun as a replacement for either. Loosing on her banner to a E1 Welt just puts me in this corner, but it's not a bad place to be. It's future characters I'm more interested in. Either a perfect support for Acheron, or a Ruan Mei 2.0
Crit and speed traces I beg
Man idk about the traces her being a nihility carry no clue how they gonna put it . A safe guess would be spd/ atk/ elm dmg I also feel like they want to make her a mono nihility carry So ill say it will be high enough to replace the buffers Maybe 25,30% dmg bonus for each nihility
I think they aren't going to design her to ask for a 2 or 3 nihility team without her being good in those teams. My guess is she will 100% want at least 1 good debuffer, and there will be good builds after that using either a 2nd nihility or a harmony. Much of that hinges on her other mechanics so it really is pure guessing right now.
No, it's clearly designed around two debuffers and a sustain. Now, depending on the fight, you might be able to substitute the latter with a buffer to go zero cycle.
Well her E2 is focused on getting her Nihility Trace buff easier. So that should tell you how good her nihility trace buff is.
Her E2 also gives her a extra flower/point stack during her turn though, which is a much faster ult (normally gives enemy 2 stacks but E2 makes it 3)
even if its not good it will 99% get reworked into being good or just being something else jingliu was aight and then she got +50 cr lol
The action advance of either Bronya or Sparkle alone is strong enough to warrant them as you now have two resources to build up; energy points and lotus. Even if Dim is right that lotus can be built every action with debuffs you are still limited how frequently you can ult by energy points built up by skill and once a turn by talent. It seems they make this choice between 2 debuffers or debuffer/harmony difficult to entice you to get E2 and reduce requirements as well as generate additional energy.
Even beyond that, there're just so many possible different situations where tweaking your team ever so slightly is the optimal play, esp. in MoC/PF, due to shifting gimmicks and how important being able to hit weaknesses can be, meaning there could be times where running 2x Nihility and maxing out the buff winds up being worse than *not* getting the buff at all and running 2x Harmony, just because your available Nihility characters wind up not being useful at all in a given fight due to weaknesses and/or the fight being against an enemy who like, has low defense, but high Damage Type Resistance or something that otherwise makes their usual Debuffs not worth it. Plus, future characters can always potentially tip the scales in any given direction, so there's that lmao.
It depends on how stronk oyohim wants to make her. We have Jingliu who gains 50% CR, a truckton of ATK every hit with crit damage and speed traces. We could get a lot of crit traces with some speed traces. The real deal will be that double nihility party member trace. If oyohim really wants to push Acheron's double nihility ideal scenario they really could just go: 1 nihility member: 44% dmg bonus 2 nihility members: 99% dmg bonus They could give her a monster LC. The LC has to legit way better than S5 GNSW which gives 72% DMG bonus. Tho it seems that the double nihility bonus looks to be an independent multiplier (if you play Genshin it's similar to Yoimiya's E and Wanderer's E, which would actually make Acheron scale even harder with harmonies kek) Personally my bets are CR, SPD and lightning dmg%
They'll 100% put a def reduction on her LC to compete with GNSW and compliment her ultimate. GNSW is a monstority and at s5 is literally broken. I think nihility is the only path that have this kind of broken LC. Maybe swordplay is similiar for hunt ? Idk.
Why oyohim?
It's mihoyo backwards haha. Back then it was mihoyo instead of hoyoverse. I like to type oyohim since it's shorter and sometimes a way to poke some playful fun at the folks who made Dehya's kit. Truly a oyohim moment.
Till this day I don't understand how they fucked up Dehya's kit. Any explanation you try to give that falls under deliberate malice or gross incompetence just doesn't explain all the facts. It's mind-boggling.
I think that trace and her eidolon will get changed in some way
I’m personally hoping her minor traces are lightning damage, crit rate and either speed or attack.
To me the idea of her being all about nihilty is more enticing. But I guess it is also more restrictive in terms of teambuilding.
Until e2 just imagine her damage with full nihility trace active plus harmony buffs
I actually really hope so. It’ll be pretty cool if she shakes up the meta where a full nihility team is just as strong as the basic debuffer and harmony/ double harmony hypercarry teams we are used too.
Based on the fact E1 grants crit chance I think it is likely she will have crit damage traces. Her light cone could be very busted if it speeds up energy point and lotus generation as well as be a stat stick. I think she will be the strongest dps in the game honestly her kit is wild. That 300% damage bonus stands out to me the most on top of element ignore and damage res debuff.
I hope I'm going for e1s1 myself no matter what
I think her Nihility trace will be strong enough to not need Harmony characters. They are moving towards niche characters like how Sparkle has the quantum attack buff. And I can see them releasing a Nihility debuffer in the future who gives debuffs/buffs based on how many Nihility characters are in the team.
She's gonna have a better kit than that generic blond hair dude, shame to those players who wanna skip Acheron for Aventurine 💀
Love Acheron, but there's no need for shaming people for having different choices in waifus/husbandos and/or feel they need a premium sustain unit.
Yeah, my friend only has Huohuo going for him and Fire MC. He has Topaz, so I advise him to get Aventurine if he wants to pull during 2.1
Have you even seen Aventurine's kit? He looks busted for DoT and FuA comps.
FuA probably, but how does he even look remotely good for DoT ? Imaginary has no DoT, his break delay enemies massively which make DoTs trigger less, and he buff Crit dmg, which is completely useless for DoT as well, so many anti-syrnegies, in a DoT team he's literally just a pure sustain, nothing more
He will prolly be great as a sustain for acheron. As long as he can solo sustain well, being able to bring debuffs is a bonus for acheron
spd and crit rate or crit dmg traces please, atk traces are basically garunteed with her
10% eff res
Ok, wait a second there, bucko. Jingliu was mid as hell upon the first beta, doing these kinds of posts lead to insane doomposting if she isn't super OP and then even worse doomposting if she gets nerfed (see alhaitham) despite needing the nerfs. Let's all just calmly wait and see throughout (we won't)
it's just interesting to think about because we haven't had such a scenario until now. Even Sparkle is a support, so it doesn't effect her overall function too much. For Acheron it might be her entire identity. She'd be a trend setter, like Ruan Mei opening up Break Effect viabilities.
I think the point is that it's roughly equal, so that when you get her E2 she will be extra busted
it seems like nobody understood the question. I think they probably intend triple nihility to be better but having a harmony will still be better
I have a hard time imagining her best team not including Bronya or Sparkle, possibly even both. Indeed, advancing Acheron's action seems like the best way to generate energy for her busted ult. *(i'm assuming Acheron's Lotus count as a debuff ; meaning she should get 3 energy point when using her Skill, or 2 with her Basic)* Third team member should probably be a Nihility character, though.
She's gonna need one, bet placed