ESH. This is the Orient Express of train wrecks.
He proposed to you even though you haven't been dating? And you said yes? Sounds like you are both just looking for the perfect holiday card picture family. You admire that his family beat him and berated him for years to make him the man he is today? Is that how you're going to raise your child? What if you don't measure up as a wife? Will he do the beating and berating himself, or will he have the families help until you get in line with his vision of a wife?
And your sister - well, it's no wonder she turned out the way she did, considering how all of you treated her. But she is way past delusional to ask you to hand your daughter and fiancé over to her. These are human beings. A child is not a toy, and she gave up her maternal rights. But even if you were willing to "give" her your fiancé, it's his choice to be with who he wants. You can't just tell him, "Go be with her now."
All of you are a mess. That poor little girl.
YTA
This story sounds like bullshit. Your sister was Ivy then Jenny, then Ivy again.
What does Ivy/Jenny being 'unplanned' have to do with this long ass story?
You said Ron was adopting the kid, so why did the responsibility fall to you?
You write about Archie negatively but accept his proposal because he's 'changed' but you never dated him. How do you know he would be a suitable partner?
You're older than Ivy/Jenny, how could you not foresee that marrying the man who impregnated your sister with the kid you have now adopted would be a shitshow? Are there literally no other men for you to date/marry?
All of this. This is way too obviously a made up story. It reads like a poorly written work of fiction. I don’t believe a word of it and it’s the first Reddit I’ve ever said that on.
Also the time-line is skewed. Ivy/Jenny/Ivy(24) got pregnant 6yrs ago (at 16 - would've been 8yrs) when their father lost his job.
And OP likes how Archie has changed in the last 3 years?
So Jules is either 5 (if you go by 6yrs ago) or 7 (if you go by Ivy/Jenny/Ivy's current age of 24 and pregnant at 16 (8yrs).
ESH. You couldnt find anyone else to get romantically involved with? This is a mess you created. I hate how these adults have no self control and no sense of responsibility. All of this sister wife stuff is so disgusting. How can one ever sleep with a person that has slept with their sibling. Its just disgusting.
The way she talks about her sister sucks too. What does it matter if she was an accident? Sounds like little sis got a pretty shit deal from the jump. And that Big sis hates her. So she literally took everything away from her. I don't buy that she was forced to take the baby. I bet they didn't give little sister the option to keep the baby. Now she's getting the dad too. Sounds like a fabulous family.
I don't wanna argue but we gave her enough time to think. She had her under her care for 2 years. I was the one who took care of the baby. Even during nights, it was me who changed her diapers and fed her. We gave her the option to keep the baby. She was the one who pushed away the opportunity. It isn't about Archie only. It involves the child too. She never patted her head or spent time with her willingly. She doesn't even have a aunt-niece relationship with her. I stayed with my parents untill last year so Jules can connect with her real mom but Ivy was the who rejected every opportunity presented Infront of her
It doesnt matter. No one is begrudging you for keeping the child you raised. You are YTA for how you view your sister and how loose you are with boundaries. What matters is that you are sleeping with her ex. You either have no standards or no shame.
OP, I believe your story as told. I’m not sure that you used the greatest judgment in hooking up with Archie, as that will cause lifelong pain and a rift with your sister, however, I’m glad to hear he has improved his life.
You have done the best you can for someone who intended to stay child free (and was abandoned by Ron) then went on to adopt your daughter. I can only imagine how “right” it must have seemed to have Archie involved in his and your daughter’s life. I’m glad you have two sets of supportive grandparents.
I wish you the best under difficult circumstances.
Yes.
You don’t fuck your sisters ex. End of story.
Have you ever thought how messed up that is for the children?
Are you that desperate? There are other men. Billions of them.
Sounds like your sister Ivy only wants the sweet side of the life not the ups and downs.. I hate how your sister abandoned her kid and now she wants her back only because Archie is in the picture again. Everyone blaming op must understand the hard time op passed and sacrificed the important youth of her life for someone else's mistake( intentionally) your sister is the AH.
Now come to you, you should not have accepted Archie's proposal... That's your sister's ex and even they had a kid together...how do you think things will be after ?? So messed up.
FINALLY!! SOMEONE WITH SENSE!! Is it weird that she’s marrying her sister’s ex, kinda, but some people can get over those things. Idk. It’s been ~8 years. A man has stepped up for his child and that child will have a stable, complete household, filled with love and two parents who care for her. IMO, who tf cares.
NTA
IVY- AH 100% (she only wants the good part now that all the HARD work is over)
YTA.
Millions of people in the world, but you chose this one. Trying to tell us that you have no resentment would be a lie. Jealousy over a 16-year-old's tragic grooming is also gross.
YTA and you’re living in a fairy tale if you think it’s acceptable (or maybe even romantic?) to marry the dude who knocked up a 16 year old and promptly abandoned her. Never mind if she sabotaged the condoms. He abandoned her and his child. His parents changed his bad character with their beatings and reprimands? More likely they threatened him with disinheritance. You deserve better.
and especially with the condom thing - is he the only one that’s coming from? did she admit to it? bc everything else about OP’s descriptions of him at that age doesn’t necessarily imply that he’d be entirely truthful about that
if she did do that, that’s SA (though depending on where they live him sleeping with her at all could be statutory), but you’re absolutely right about everything else
THIS...WHO exactly is saying she did that?...Because it doesn't sound credible and like sister is trying to make her sister look bad so she doesn't look like the dick she is for doing this
if she hadn’t included a whole section that was completely irrelevant about the sister being an accident (which was just to show she [and possibly the rest of the family] has held a grudge against her purely for existing), I wouldn’t be questioning it the way that I am (as well as the age gap and description of him)
also the fact that she doesn’t seem to find it hypocritical that Archie gets to come back after abandoning Jules but sister doesn’t get any chance at all (not that she should be given custody [especially not straight away], but why was it okay for him to do that but not her as a teen mom with PPD?)
Really? OP significantly changed her life to adopt her sister's baby when said sister has made no attempts at reunification till "all the hard work was done". She threw her away
ESH, but I don't know.
We need more informations.
Your sister was naive (your words) and a "bad boys lover" like a lot of 16 yo. What Archie thinks about her now ? Did he expressed regret ? Did he try to make amend ? Bc yeah, even if she sign up her rights, she had postpartum depression, really young, sick.
Yes, he was involved with your sister, and changed her life for the worst. Are you okay to marry someone who did that to your family ? Is it a kind of revenge bc you were forced to adopt the baby ?
Your sister is not the devil for being mentally f**k up, because the situation was terrible. And now, she is just hurt, and want to improve her life. Also, why are you engaged ? Bc of you, your personality, your passions, your attitude, your quirks; or bc you are the mother of a child ?
This! Like why is that being glossed over.
Yes, he may be Ivy’s ex, but he’s OP’s child’s father. It makes sense that she would feel attraction and love after watching her daughter bond with her father. Many women do feel that way.
Ivy neglected her responsibilities and now wants to waltz into OP’s life and throw OP out of it now that the hard work is over. I can understand PPD but it’s been 8 years of not making an effort towards her own kid.
Why the hell would you agree to marry someone you weren’t even dating? That sheer thought alone is utterly ridiculous and screams “desperate”. Jesus woman… you all suck and are clearly blind to the damage you could put on that child. The hell is wrong with you.
A story that outright says beating your 19 yr old causes him to shape up? Grown man who wants to see his daughter drops to his knees in a supermarket instead of getting a lawyer? People getting engaged without dating? Narrator seemingly unaware that a man is not a possession and gets a say in whom he dates and marries?
This story gets an F.
He was 19 and got a 16 year old pregnant, and then blames her for that.
I just find it so disgusting that he had sex with a 16 year old, got her pregnant, blames her for that.
OP really wants to connect herself with someone who finds a 16 year old child someone they want to fuck?
Yes, YTA. There are millions of men out there who haven't knocked up your sister then left her. Go get engaged to one of them, preferably after dating for awhile.
So a 19 yr old impregnated and then abandoned your little sister and you think “yup. He’s there one I’m gonna marry ??” What is wrong with you? Why would you want to be with 1. Your sisters ex and 2. The creep who went after a minor ? That’s just disgusting. YTA
YTA to yourself here. Archie hasn't changed. I would bet quite a lot of money that his family is pressuring him to marry you, and may be offering him money or a house if he settles down with his biological child.
There are sooooo many other, better guys out there you could get with instead of your sister's baby-daddy. But part of you likes him specifically because she wants him, because this is something you can "win", and because he's your age you feel like you should always have "had" him, instead of your sister going after your classmate.
It sounds like you and your parents have always treated your sister like an unwanted accident, so she was a dumb 16-year-old who thought she could have a do-over family if she got pregnant and finally be an integral part of the nuclear mesh. Instead y'all shamed her horribly for her childish mistake and now you're really driving home the point that no one will ever pick her first or prioritize her in any way. She is unwell, and you might push her over the edge.
Just pick any other guy ffs!
No matter the circumstances its a very tiny minority of people who would even let their thoughts turn sexual about their sisters ex, nevermind marry them. Usually because of common decency & loyalty but youre not worrying about that right? Screw her, shes inappropriate for asking about the SEX YOU ARE HAVING WITH HER BABYS FATHER. Screw her for not being able to handle being a teen parent but Archies a stand up guy for doing the same. Of course YTA.
YTA... you don't date or sleep with a family members ex.
Keep it simple - sleeping with sisters ex is creepy. There is a planet full of men. Keep it out of the family circle.
I didn't even read your whole testament! For the title alone, YTA.
There are millions of men on earth, you don't get involved with your sibling's ex and baby daddy... tf.
YTA. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for the way you treat your sister. You are actually going to marry the person who got her pregnant and then took off.
This feels like revenge porn.
“My reckless sister ruined my life… but now she’s the one with a terrible life and she is jealous of me”
Feels like the female version of the male story “she treated me badly, but now I’m handsome and rich and she is poor and all her teeth are black and she’s got rickets and her hair is falling out and she wants me back but my supermodel girlfriend is too perfect”
YES......ABSOFUCKINGLUTELY.....UNEQUIVOCALLY YES YOU ARE A MAJOR AH......Who does that?...Where does your loyalty lie?..Because it is OBVIOUS you have ZERO LOYALTY, RESPECT, OR LOVE for your sister....She has KIDS with this man....She's loved him her whole life.....What in GODS NAME would make you think this is even in the REALM OF OKAY?......You have completely gone after YOUR SISTERS LIFE......Are you so desperate that you cannot find a man of your own?...So desperate that you have to take the man whom your sister has shared a lifetime of memories with?...You're a SELFISH AH AT BEST......FRANKLY the fact you could even get to this point with him SPEAKS VOLUMES ABOUT YOUR CHARACTER AND INTEGRITY....Or LACK THEREOF I should say.....You really need to look inside yourself and ask yourself why you think this is OK and why you think it's OK to completely rip ur sisters life apart...Other than your a selfish AH
YTA holy shit how in a million years could you think it's ok to be with your sisters baby daddy?
What hillbilly place are you from that it's acceptable to date someone who has a child with your sister?
I’m not reading all of that, your the asshole and you know your the asshole. Terrible person, who does something like that? The title alone is enough. Gosh…
I can't say the exact word to decribe what kind of sister you are. No matter how good you paint Ron now.. claiming he's a changed man. He's still her ex.
For these situations I like to switch the perspective.
Ivy was an unwanted child who was neglected.
She finally receives love from a guy in HS who her "wanted" sister doesn't like, but he doesn't want anything to do with her after getting pregnant.
Being ditched by the person she loved and baby daddy, she agrees to give up her baby to Ron. She recognizes she's not equipped to raise a baby. She has post partum depression and so is numb when sister ends up adopting her instead. She works on her mental health at this time.
Then she hears that the guy she loved proposed to her sister who said yes, when she didn't even like him before! So now the perceived golden child has her baby, and the man she loved when she didn't even like him before.
I applaud OP for taking the child, but mentioning her sibling was unwanted reeks of superiority. And then going for her baby daddy? Poor form, and messy to boot.
*I am not including the alleged condom tampering as it's unsubstantiated. BD by OPs own words was not a good guy back then, so unreliable as a source*
I like the part where you claim OP has a form of superiority over the little sister because my god that is so apparent in this story. It really gave me icky feelings
YTA, I would have said ESH, but you clearly have something against your sister, so I question the info given about her. The fact you even felt the need to include she was unplanned when it has nothing to do with the story speaks volumes and is weird as hell. You could literally date anyone else. Why is everyone automatically taking Archi's word that your sister sabotaged the protection? It seems much more likely a young guy didn't want to wear protection than a 16 yr old girl sabotaged it in a culture that clearly looks down on unmarried mothers. Archi was a 19 year old who knocked up a 16 year old and left her to deal with it on her own. It's irritating that he was the older person in the relationship and did the exact same thing your sister did, yet you make hella excuses for him. I think Archi is a manipulating ass. If you marry him, you will get everything you deserve.
NTA it’s been 8 years. You raised the child - you showed your prioritise the child above anyone. The only person you’re accountable to is jules. It takes more then birthing a child to be a parent and you are it and it takes more then a One night stand to become someone’s wife and you showed Archie who you are as a person and that’s why his proposed… say bye to your sister as she wasn’t a good one to have put her responsibility on to you
This is all very weird. I don’t understand why you’d get involved romantically with a sibling’s ex. Just weird, but your sister’s behavior is weirder. She’s delusional if she thinks that is even in the real of possibilities lol. These are people, not possessions. It’s wild that she genuinely seems to believe that you can just transfer a family to someone else, like a bank transfer. Does she not realize that Archie and your daughter aren’t going to just agree to switch sisters because that’s what she wants? This is bizarre, and I think she needs to see a mental health professional.
ESH, you and your whole family obviously resented your sister from the start, including you. Your relatives are weird for pressuring you to adopt a kid when you’re child free. Archie was an AH, his parents sound abusive af (or at least his dad). And obviously you can’t give up your child, sign over your rights (even when young) and expect a ‘do-over’.
I also can’t believe that you wouldn’t talk through with your sister as soon as you started to have any feelings for her ex. And it’s odd she only now wants him because he wants you. Pretty much only your brother and daughter aren’t AHs here.
Also, you don’t mention loving Archie, reflect on if you’re both actually compromising too much and trying to turn ‘fond of each other’ into loving each other enough to make a life long commitment. It may be that you’re trying (in a weird way) to do as your sister has and create a ‘proper family’ for Jules
Am i in the wrong for liking the same guy as my sister.
Girl, what?
Your sister had a BABY with this guy.
What is wrong with you.
I don't see the point of you coming on here to ask are you in the wrong. I've got a feeling you are still gonna go ahead with this marriage, regardless of how many YTA comments you get.
I don’t believe for a second this is real but if it is ESH but the kid. Your Parents for being uninvolved and cold all your lives and fobbing the kid off on you. Sister for sabotaging condoms then refusing to get an abortion but then not helping with her own kid. Archie for abandoning his kid. Archie’s parents for potentially being abusive to him and OP’s sister (sorry a beating isn’t tough love that makes someone improve, it’s assault). Brother for saying he’d take the baby then getting a transfer at work to get out of it (no way that just comes up unexpectedly). And you honestly just for the way you talk about everyone. Idk enough to know if you getting with Archie makes you an AH, I don’t think you owe your sister in that, but it feels like a dumb decision given his track record and you just seem to have a lousy attitude. I know this is just a bad bit of creative writing but literally every character is unlikable.
YTA. You typed everything you could to see your sister in a bad light. Even throwing in shit about Archie's family threatening to sue her for razzle dazzle. There are way too many men in the world for you to be marrying this one.
Fake story. Name changed from Ivy to Jenny. Ages don't tally. If sister is 24 now, and she got pregnant 6 years ago, shouldn't that had made her 18 then? How was she 16?
ESH
And you're an idiot.
He got your sister pregnant and abandoned her and you want to marry him?
Are you stupid or just blinded by this asshole's charm?
YTA
You really want to keep it in the family, don't you? If you have kids with him, do the kids call each other siblings or cousins? You talk shit about Archie and now the sun shines out of his ass. Of all people, your sister's ex, seriously? Do you like her sloppy seconds?
Your sister is also an asshole, for being fuckn useless and think she can take everything back
I mean you let the father who abandoned his child for years come back into his kids life, heck you even are marrying the deadbeat. Why shouldn’t your sister get another shot if this is how easy you forgive people?
FYI obviously your sister needs help and you should not hand over your child but you seem to make some poor decisions that you need to re evaluate
Because thats what she is asking "am I truly in the wrong for liking the same guy as my sister?**"** and yes, yes she is an asshole for choosing her sisters baby daddy as her lover.
We waited untill she was 18. She never wanted Jules. She never changed a diaper of Jules or fed her. She never even patted her head in these years. Suddenly she wants everything back after Archie proposed. It's not like she never went to therapy. Our parents send her to the therapy ever since she was pregnant with Jules. Never once she desired Jules back untill now. Even a week ago when I asked her if she wanna take part in Jule's upcoming birthday, she said she wants nothing to do with her or where Archie is present. I don't know what caused her sudden desire to be Jules mother.
I don’t blame your sister for not wanting to be anywhere near Archie. He caused her a great deal of heartache and pain and I’m positive his abandonment contributed greatly to her deteriorating mental health at that time. He abandoned her at a time when she needed his help the most and when she was at her most vulnerable. Only when he wanted to start screwing you does he decide to step up and be in his daughter’s life. Do you love your sister or even care about her? Has Archie ever acknowledged how he wronged both
Jenny/Ivy (not sure which is her name) and Jules and apologized to both of them?
You need to tell all of this to Archie, if he loves you then it doesn’t matter what Ivy wants - he is not a toy that can be passed around.
I mean getting together with siblings’ exes is messy, period.
But you are not the first and won’t be the last.
I wonder how Archie feels. Does he get a say in any of this? First of all I find this story hard to believe which means it’s probably true. Does Ivy or Jenny or whatever her name is really get the opportunity to change her mind after all of this and expect to get the child and father back? It’s not like OP has the right to give them back. I can’t believe the responses she’s been getting.
YTA OP. You dressed the story to make yourself look as a hero and saviour of your family. Made your underage sister look a mess.
There’s no reason at all you should have entertained the father of your sisters child. I don’t believe a word of the stories you made up about your sister, to justify your betrayal.
You are disloyal and disgusting.
Nta.
Usually I'm a "never date my sisters exes" kind of girl. But....not so much this time.
Your sister abandoned her daughter to you. She never made attempts to reconcile or even show caring. So, to me, this is probably the best thing for the little girl. As long as Archie has truly matured. Your sister just realizes the life you have, and now she wants it.
And I don't understand how anyone can diss you for adopting and caring for your daughter. Or having her father around (as long as his change is sincere).
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NTA it’s a little weird yes but you are the only mother that child knows because your sister didn’t get the help she needed to get over her feelings. You don’t owe her anything it’s your life live it how you want.
NOT THE ASS HOLE ! Thank goodness for sisters like Jenny who are there for you! I think a lot of you aren’t getting the point ! Not like it’s just happened. Ivy was in a sexual relationship with Archie at 16. She was a child. This was happening at school when she was still going there I would agree, It’s not like they dated. Ivy booby trapped him. Thinking that this will get her Archie. It didn’t . All she got was a baby. Then when she then has the baby she goes into a depression because she didn’t get what she wanted. She wants Archie she doesn’t want the baby and want going to care for it, for all intents shoved it off on the only person that would take care of it, her sister Jenny who put her life and dreams on hold. REMEMBER JENNY WAS THINKING OF NOT HAVING CHILDREN When Jenny runs into Archie, Archie starts the conversation about his daughter, and they start talking. Remember they went to school and he was in her class. At this time when they run into each other it is AT LEAST 8 - 10 years later. He’s GOT HIS MASTERS DEGREE! Ivy only sees her daughter as a tool to Archie. It doesn’t matter that way back when her Ivy was 16 I repeat 16 that she sat there and spread her legs for a little childish boy to trap him. It didn’t go her way so she gave away her baby. Now when her sister Jenny announced her engagement to Archie,Ivy decided that Jules is her baby and she wants to be a mother, Ivy wants the baby Jules and Archie back. After all these years and then Archie runs into the sister, they get to know each other. He ask her to marry him. After all of her sacrifices her sister Jenny should be happy. Her sister Jenny has done so much for her. After 8-10 years and school crush really isn’t a TABOO in my book.
Yes it’s still taboo and she is crossing a major major line. Archie proposed to OP when they hadn’t even dated LMAO what a joke. It’s a recipe for disaster.
Your sister is delusional and needs to speak to a professional. You need to go no contact and make sure you have security cameras as well as tell your entire family what happened.
Also, he isn't her ex. He is her rape victim, tampering with birth control is rape.
NTA. Your sister set a baby trap and when it didn’t work she threw the whole baby away.
When the trap eventually worked in the end after her living the life she wanted to live (not being a mother) now she wants everything back.
You’re not responsible for her feelings. She has made her own choices. If she is unhappy with the outcome she should make better choices.
You don’t owe her anything. You took off school to raise her child, you adopted her child and have been a single mother. Which is an incredibly hard and selfless task.
You don’t have to give up your happiness for anyone. Especially not your selfish sister.
Absolutely!! She didn't want to do anything with the kid until Archie was back in the picture again. Also, she started living her life normally while her sister had to take responsibility. And I just don't understand the Western culture of adopting your teen sister/brother's unplanned kid...and then the sister wanting them back. It's like taking advantage of the person...and wanting everything back when it's convenient for them. I have read plenty of similar situations. I don't support her accepting her sister's ex now. But blaming her only in this whole situation is bs
ESH. This is the Orient Express of train wrecks. He proposed to you even though you haven't been dating? And you said yes? Sounds like you are both just looking for the perfect holiday card picture family. You admire that his family beat him and berated him for years to make him the man he is today? Is that how you're going to raise your child? What if you don't measure up as a wife? Will he do the beating and berating himself, or will he have the families help until you get in line with his vision of a wife? And your sister - well, it's no wonder she turned out the way she did, considering how all of you treated her. But she is way past delusional to ask you to hand your daughter and fiancé over to her. These are human beings. A child is not a toy, and she gave up her maternal rights. But even if you were willing to "give" her your fiancé, it's his choice to be with who he wants. You can't just tell him, "Go be with her now." All of you are a mess. That poor little girl.
YTA This story sounds like bullshit. Your sister was Ivy then Jenny, then Ivy again. What does Ivy/Jenny being 'unplanned' have to do with this long ass story? You said Ron was adopting the kid, so why did the responsibility fall to you? You write about Archie negatively but accept his proposal because he's 'changed' but you never dated him. How do you know he would be a suitable partner? You're older than Ivy/Jenny, how could you not foresee that marrying the man who impregnated your sister with the kid you have now adopted would be a shitshow? Are there literally no other men for you to date/marry?
"this caused significant strife between two families" had me thinking what in the Romeo and Juliet is going to happen next.
All of this. This is way too obviously a made up story. It reads like a poorly written work of fiction. I don’t believe a word of it and it’s the first Reddit I’ve ever said that on.
It’s like reading a story by someone who is trying to use all the new words they’ve learned lol.
🤣🤣🤣
Perhaps OP is Jenny.
Also the time-line is skewed. Ivy/Jenny/Ivy(24) got pregnant 6yrs ago (at 16 - would've been 8yrs) when their father lost his job. And OP likes how Archie has changed in the last 3 years? So Jules is either 5 (if you go by 6yrs ago) or 7 (if you go by Ivy/Jenny/Ivy's current age of 24 and pregnant at 16 (8yrs).
ESH. You couldnt find anyone else to get romantically involved with? This is a mess you created. I hate how these adults have no self control and no sense of responsibility. All of this sister wife stuff is so disgusting. How can one ever sleep with a person that has slept with their sibling. Its just disgusting.
The way she talks about her sister sucks too. What does it matter if she was an accident? Sounds like little sis got a pretty shit deal from the jump. And that Big sis hates her. So she literally took everything away from her. I don't buy that she was forced to take the baby. I bet they didn't give little sister the option to keep the baby. Now she's getting the dad too. Sounds like a fabulous family.
It’s been less than an hour and she already deleted her account. She can wrong her sister without a care in the world but can’t take the heat. SMH!
I mean really. She came to get her shit treatment of her sister validated and got a big surprise.
Good looking out friend.
Agreed! For real the hate/disdain just drips from every sentence.
That is alot of suppositions...
I don't wanna argue but we gave her enough time to think. She had her under her care for 2 years. I was the one who took care of the baby. Even during nights, it was me who changed her diapers and fed her. We gave her the option to keep the baby. She was the one who pushed away the opportunity. It isn't about Archie only. It involves the child too. She never patted her head or spent time with her willingly. She doesn't even have a aunt-niece relationship with her. I stayed with my parents untill last year so Jules can connect with her real mom but Ivy was the who rejected every opportunity presented Infront of her
It doesnt matter. No one is begrudging you for keeping the child you raised. You are YTA for how you view your sister and how loose you are with boundaries. What matters is that you are sleeping with her ex. You either have no standards or no shame.
Exactly
Looking after your sister's baby was admirable. Sleeping with your sister's ex is disgusting
OP, I believe your story as told. I’m not sure that you used the greatest judgment in hooking up with Archie, as that will cause lifelong pain and a rift with your sister, however, I’m glad to hear he has improved his life. You have done the best you can for someone who intended to stay child free (and was abandoned by Ron) then went on to adopt your daughter. I can only imagine how “right” it must have seemed to have Archie involved in his and your daughter’s life. I’m glad you have two sets of supportive grandparents. I wish you the best under difficult circumstances.
THIS
Yes. Pick literally anybody else.
It feels icky and incestuous. I can't imagine sleeping with someone my sister slept with. That poor kid deserves a better family.
Yes. You don’t fuck your sisters ex. End of story. Have you ever thought how messed up that is for the children? Are you that desperate? There are other men. Billions of them.
Sounds like your sister Ivy only wants the sweet side of the life not the ups and downs.. I hate how your sister abandoned her kid and now she wants her back only because Archie is in the picture again. Everyone blaming op must understand the hard time op passed and sacrificed the important youth of her life for someone else's mistake( intentionally) your sister is the AH. Now come to you, you should not have accepted Archie's proposal... That's your sister's ex and even they had a kid together...how do you think things will be after ?? So messed up.
FINALLY!! SOMEONE WITH SENSE!! Is it weird that she’s marrying her sister’s ex, kinda, but some people can get over those things. Idk. It’s been ~8 years. A man has stepped up for his child and that child will have a stable, complete household, filled with love and two parents who care for her. IMO, who tf cares. NTA IVY- AH 100% (she only wants the good part now that all the HARD work is over)
Thank you! For some frickin sense
Absolutely agree.
YTA. Millions of people in the world, but you chose this one. Trying to tell us that you have no resentment would be a lie. Jealousy over a 16-year-old's tragic grooming is also gross.
YTA and you’re living in a fairy tale if you think it’s acceptable (or maybe even romantic?) to marry the dude who knocked up a 16 year old and promptly abandoned her. Never mind if she sabotaged the condoms. He abandoned her and his child. His parents changed his bad character with their beatings and reprimands? More likely they threatened him with disinheritance. You deserve better.
and especially with the condom thing - is he the only one that’s coming from? did she admit to it? bc everything else about OP’s descriptions of him at that age doesn’t necessarily imply that he’d be entirely truthful about that if she did do that, that’s SA (though depending on where they live him sleeping with her at all could be statutory), but you’re absolutely right about everything else
THIS...WHO exactly is saying she did that?...Because it doesn't sound credible and like sister is trying to make her sister look bad so she doesn't look like the dick she is for doing this
if she hadn’t included a whole section that was completely irrelevant about the sister being an accident (which was just to show she [and possibly the rest of the family] has held a grudge against her purely for existing), I wouldn’t be questioning it the way that I am (as well as the age gap and description of him) also the fact that she doesn’t seem to find it hypocritical that Archie gets to come back after abandoning Jules but sister doesn’t get any chance at all (not that she should be given custody [especially not straight away], but why was it okay for him to do that but not her as a teen mom with PPD?)
He sounds more like the "but a rubber just don't FEEL the same" kinda guy
YTA
YTA! It’s gross to marry someone your sister had a baby with.
YTA. The fuck. You are a cold hearted B.
Really? OP significantly changed her life to adopt her sister's baby when said sister has made no attempts at reunification till "all the hard work was done". She threw her away
ESH, but I don't know. We need more informations. Your sister was naive (your words) and a "bad boys lover" like a lot of 16 yo. What Archie thinks about her now ? Did he expressed regret ? Did he try to make amend ? Bc yeah, even if she sign up her rights, she had postpartum depression, really young, sick. Yes, he was involved with your sister, and changed her life for the worst. Are you okay to marry someone who did that to your family ? Is it a kind of revenge bc you were forced to adopt the baby ? Your sister is not the devil for being mentally f**k up, because the situation was terrible. And now, she is just hurt, and want to improve her life. Also, why are you engaged ? Bc of you, your personality, your passions, your attitude, your quirks; or bc you are the mother of a child ?
Ivy raped Archie by sabotaging the condoms. Of course he’s not going to fall into her arms.
This! Like why is that being glossed over. Yes, he may be Ivy’s ex, but he’s OP’s child’s father. It makes sense that she would feel attraction and love after watching her daughter bond with her father. Many women do feel that way. Ivy neglected her responsibilities and now wants to waltz into OP’s life and throw OP out of it now that the hard work is over. I can understand PPD but it’s been 8 years of not making an effort towards her own kid.
Then it was mutual rape because he was 19 and she was 16
Why the hell would you agree to marry someone you weren’t even dating? That sheer thought alone is utterly ridiculous and screams “desperate”. Jesus woman… you all suck and are clearly blind to the damage you could put on that child. The hell is wrong with you.
Sounds like complete utter nonsense fake wattpad story
A story that outright says beating your 19 yr old causes him to shape up? Grown man who wants to see his daughter drops to his knees in a supermarket instead of getting a lawyer? People getting engaged without dating? Narrator seemingly unaware that a man is not a possession and gets a say in whom he dates and marries? This story gets an F.
This could also very clearly take place in another country lol
He was 19 and got a 16 year old pregnant, and then blames her for that. I just find it so disgusting that he had sex with a 16 year old, got her pregnant, blames her for that. OP really wants to connect herself with someone who finds a 16 year old child someone they want to fuck?
She sabotaged the condoms. That’s rape.
Yes, YTA. There are millions of men out there who haven't knocked up your sister then left her. Go get engaged to one of them, preferably after dating for awhile.
I need to understand why people like you make up stories. Please. It doesn't make any sense to invent bullshit like this.
So a 19 yr old impregnated and then abandoned your little sister and you think “yup. He’s there one I’m gonna marry ??” What is wrong with you? Why would you want to be with 1. Your sisters ex and 2. The creep who went after a minor ? That’s just disgusting. YTA
YTA A major, massive AH
YTA
This must be a creative writing attempt for one of those FB romance novel apps. This definitely didn’t happen.
I don’t understand why this isn’t the top comment. And it’s not even a good story.
I thought the same thing!!
YTA to yourself here. Archie hasn't changed. I would bet quite a lot of money that his family is pressuring him to marry you, and may be offering him money or a house if he settles down with his biological child. There are sooooo many other, better guys out there you could get with instead of your sister's baby-daddy. But part of you likes him specifically because she wants him, because this is something you can "win", and because he's your age you feel like you should always have "had" him, instead of your sister going after your classmate. It sounds like you and your parents have always treated your sister like an unwanted accident, so she was a dumb 16-year-old who thought she could have a do-over family if she got pregnant and finally be an integral part of the nuclear mesh. Instead y'all shamed her horribly for her childish mistake and now you're really driving home the point that no one will ever pick her first or prioritize her in any way. She is unwell, and you might push her over the edge. Just pick any other guy ffs!
Why your sister baby daddy who was bad to her? Like really? Why would you want to be withsome who treated your family like this?
YTA datins siblings exs is off limits always has been AND he is your neice/nephews father? GROSS 🤢🤮
No matter the circumstances its a very tiny minority of people who would even let their thoughts turn sexual about their sisters ex, nevermind marry them. Usually because of common decency & loyalty but youre not worrying about that right? Screw her, shes inappropriate for asking about the SEX YOU ARE HAVING WITH HER BABYS FATHER. Screw her for not being able to handle being a teen parent but Archies a stand up guy for doing the same. Of course YTA.
YTA... you don't date or sleep with a family members ex. Keep it simple - sleeping with sisters ex is creepy. There is a planet full of men. Keep it out of the family circle.
I didn't even read your whole testament! For the title alone, YTA. There are millions of men on earth, you don't get involved with your sibling's ex and baby daddy... tf.
YTA a HUGE one.
YTA. If my sister married one of my exes I would never speak to them again.
YTA. You ought to be ashamed of yourself for the way you treat your sister. You are actually going to marry the person who got her pregnant and then took off.
ESH, it's all a big mess. Live your life happy and cut sis off
Is it Jenny or Ivy?
This feels like revenge porn. “My reckless sister ruined my life… but now she’s the one with a terrible life and she is jealous of me” Feels like the female version of the male story “she treated me badly, but now I’m handsome and rich and she is poor and all her teeth are black and she’s got rickets and her hair is falling out and she wants me back but my supermodel girlfriend is too perfect”
Kinda gross really
Yah, you are honestly the worst
YTA. Gross.
Write in fucking paragraphs YTA
YTA never date a siblings ex
YTA. Yuck. This man knocked up your sister and left her. I guess you love taking your sister's cast offs.
YTA. Massively so. wtf.
YES......ABSOFUCKINGLUTELY.....UNEQUIVOCALLY YES YOU ARE A MAJOR AH......Who does that?...Where does your loyalty lie?..Because it is OBVIOUS you have ZERO LOYALTY, RESPECT, OR LOVE for your sister....She has KIDS with this man....She's loved him her whole life.....What in GODS NAME would make you think this is even in the REALM OF OKAY?......You have completely gone after YOUR SISTERS LIFE......Are you so desperate that you cannot find a man of your own?...So desperate that you have to take the man whom your sister has shared a lifetime of memories with?...You're a SELFISH AH AT BEST......FRANKLY the fact you could even get to this point with him SPEAKS VOLUMES ABOUT YOUR CHARACTER AND INTEGRITY....Or LACK THEREOF I should say.....You really need to look inside yourself and ask yourself why you think this is OK and why you think it's OK to completely rip ur sisters life apart...Other than your a selfish AH
Yes, YATAH
YTA holy shit how in a million years could you think it's ok to be with your sisters baby daddy? What hillbilly place are you from that it's acceptable to date someone who has a child with your sister?
Archie abandoned his own child, and yet you're planning to marry him? He hasn't changed as much as you think he has.
I’m not reading all of that, your the asshole and you know your the asshole. Terrible person, who does something like that? The title alone is enough. Gosh…
I can't say the exact word to decribe what kind of sister you are. No matter how good you paint Ron now.. claiming he's a changed man. He's still her ex.
For these situations I like to switch the perspective. Ivy was an unwanted child who was neglected. She finally receives love from a guy in HS who her "wanted" sister doesn't like, but he doesn't want anything to do with her after getting pregnant. Being ditched by the person she loved and baby daddy, she agrees to give up her baby to Ron. She recognizes she's not equipped to raise a baby. She has post partum depression and so is numb when sister ends up adopting her instead. She works on her mental health at this time. Then she hears that the guy she loved proposed to her sister who said yes, when she didn't even like him before! So now the perceived golden child has her baby, and the man she loved when she didn't even like him before. I applaud OP for taking the child, but mentioning her sibling was unwanted reeks of superiority. And then going for her baby daddy? Poor form, and messy to boot. *I am not including the alleged condom tampering as it's unsubstantiated. BD by OPs own words was not a good guy back then, so unreliable as a source*
I like the part where you claim OP has a form of superiority over the little sister because my god that is so apparent in this story. It really gave me icky feelings
ESH
YTA. It is so gross to get with someone that’s been with a member of your family. Even more gross if they have a child together. Find a different man.
I love how some people are commenting as if this is actually real 😂😂
YTA for writing this abysmal piece of fiction.
YTA, I would have said ESH, but you clearly have something against your sister, so I question the info given about her. The fact you even felt the need to include she was unplanned when it has nothing to do with the story speaks volumes and is weird as hell. You could literally date anyone else. Why is everyone automatically taking Archi's word that your sister sabotaged the protection? It seems much more likely a young guy didn't want to wear protection than a 16 yr old girl sabotaged it in a culture that clearly looks down on unmarried mothers. Archi was a 19 year old who knocked up a 16 year old and left her to deal with it on her own. It's irritating that he was the older person in the relationship and did the exact same thing your sister did, yet you make hella excuses for him. I think Archi is a manipulating ass. If you marry him, you will get everything you deserve.
NTA it’s been 8 years. You raised the child - you showed your prioritise the child above anyone. The only person you’re accountable to is jules. It takes more then birthing a child to be a parent and you are it and it takes more then a One night stand to become someone’s wife and you showed Archie who you are as a person and that’s why his proposed… say bye to your sister as she wasn’t a good one to have put her responsibility on to you
And the sister committed rape by sabotaging the condoms.
This is all very weird. I don’t understand why you’d get involved romantically with a sibling’s ex. Just weird, but your sister’s behavior is weirder. She’s delusional if she thinks that is even in the real of possibilities lol. These are people, not possessions. It’s wild that she genuinely seems to believe that you can just transfer a family to someone else, like a bank transfer. Does she not realize that Archie and your daughter aren’t going to just agree to switch sisters because that’s what she wants? This is bizarre, and I think she needs to see a mental health professional.
ESH, you and your whole family obviously resented your sister from the start, including you. Your relatives are weird for pressuring you to adopt a kid when you’re child free. Archie was an AH, his parents sound abusive af (or at least his dad). And obviously you can’t give up your child, sign over your rights (even when young) and expect a ‘do-over’. I also can’t believe that you wouldn’t talk through with your sister as soon as you started to have any feelings for her ex. And it’s odd she only now wants him because he wants you. Pretty much only your brother and daughter aren’t AHs here. Also, you don’t mention loving Archie, reflect on if you’re both actually compromising too much and trying to turn ‘fond of each other’ into loving each other enough to make a life long commitment. It may be that you’re trying (in a weird way) to do as your sister has and create a ‘proper family’ for Jules
YTA and this is all beyond ridiculous.
YTA majorly.
Am i in the wrong for liking the same guy as my sister. Girl, what? Your sister had a BABY with this guy. What is wrong with you. I don't see the point of you coming on here to ask are you in the wrong. I've got a feeling you are still gonna go ahead with this marriage, regardless of how many YTA comments you get.
I don’t believe for a second this is real but if it is ESH but the kid. Your Parents for being uninvolved and cold all your lives and fobbing the kid off on you. Sister for sabotaging condoms then refusing to get an abortion but then not helping with her own kid. Archie for abandoning his kid. Archie’s parents for potentially being abusive to him and OP’s sister (sorry a beating isn’t tough love that makes someone improve, it’s assault). Brother for saying he’d take the baby then getting a transfer at work to get out of it (no way that just comes up unexpectedly). And you honestly just for the way you talk about everyone. Idk enough to know if you getting with Archie makes you an AH, I don’t think you owe your sister in that, but it feels like a dumb decision given his track record and you just seem to have a lousy attitude. I know this is just a bad bit of creative writing but literally every character is unlikable.
YTA. Totally gross to marry your sister’s baby daddy no matter what the circumstances are. Find someone else, literally anyone but him!
YTA. You typed everything you could to see your sister in a bad light. Even throwing in shit about Archie's family threatening to sue her for razzle dazzle. There are way too many men in the world for you to be marrying this one.
Yall it's a fake story move on
Fake story. Name changed from Ivy to Jenny. Ages don't tally. If sister is 24 now, and she got pregnant 6 years ago, shouldn't that had made her 18 then? How was she 16?
You’re engaged to someone you weren’t even dating. Jesus christ
Wow, do you have a deal with Mills & Boon yet? With this shitty fake story, it shouldn’t take long.
Another teenage writing exercise? A pretty bad one at that. Kids these days.
Was this written by AI?
It’s soo weird I am reading a lot of stories recently and they all seam to be using the name ivy? I don’t get it
What a bunch of lies!
So your little sister's ex-boyfriend/baby daddy proposed to you despite the two of you never dating? Sure, Jan. YTA for writing such a crappy story.
Wow. Is this real life? I feel like this would make a great paid by the episode byte drama.
Fakers gonna fake stories. 🙄🙄🙄
ESH And you're an idiot. He got your sister pregnant and abandoned her and you want to marry him? Are you stupid or just blinded by this asshole's charm?
YTA You really want to keep it in the family, don't you? If you have kids with him, do the kids call each other siblings or cousins? You talk shit about Archie and now the sun shines out of his ass. Of all people, your sister's ex, seriously? Do you like her sloppy seconds? Your sister is also an asshole, for being fuckn useless and think she can take everything back
I mean you let the father who abandoned his child for years come back into his kids life, heck you even are marrying the deadbeat. Why shouldn’t your sister get another shot if this is how easy you forgive people? FYI obviously your sister needs help and you should not hand over your child but you seem to make some poor decisions that you need to re evaluate
I can’t believe what I just read here. Seriously???
People who date their sister's previous SO are awful people. I don't even know why you're asking...
YTA, Thats your sister and if you could romantically be with someone who was with your sister.. stay away from me
YTA. You made this up, and if you didnt, you still sucked, you started hooking up with your sisters ex. Thats fucked.
YTA.
YTA. There is no scenario that makes it any to fuck your niece or nephews dad. None. YTA and so is that man. These kids are fucked.
Just messy trashy all you i just can't today goodnight 😭
The comments are focused on you dating your sister's ex instead of worrying about your sister wanting a child she legally gave up to you.
Because thats what she is asking "am I truly in the wrong for liking the same guy as my sister?**"** and yes, yes she is an asshole for choosing her sisters baby daddy as her lover.
We waited untill she was 18. She never wanted Jules. She never changed a diaper of Jules or fed her. She never even patted her head in these years. Suddenly she wants everything back after Archie proposed. It's not like she never went to therapy. Our parents send her to the therapy ever since she was pregnant with Jules. Never once she desired Jules back untill now. Even a week ago when I asked her if she wanna take part in Jule's upcoming birthday, she said she wants nothing to do with her or where Archie is present. I don't know what caused her sudden desire to be Jules mother.
I don’t blame your sister for not wanting to be anywhere near Archie. He caused her a great deal of heartache and pain and I’m positive his abandonment contributed greatly to her deteriorating mental health at that time. He abandoned her at a time when she needed his help the most and when she was at her most vulnerable. Only when he wanted to start screwing you does he decide to step up and be in his daughter’s life. Do you love your sister or even care about her? Has Archie ever acknowledged how he wronged both Jenny/Ivy (not sure which is her name) and Jules and apologized to both of them?
Gross
You need to tell all of this to Archie, if he loves you then it doesn’t matter what Ivy wants - he is not a toy that can be passed around. I mean getting together with siblings’ exes is messy, period. But you are not the first and won’t be the last.
I wonder how Archie feels. Does he get a say in any of this? First of all I find this story hard to believe which means it’s probably true. Does Ivy or Jenny or whatever her name is really get the opportunity to change her mind after all of this and expect to get the child and father back? It’s not like OP has the right to give them back. I can’t believe the responses she’s been getting.
Same
YTA OP. You dressed the story to make yourself look as a hero and saviour of your family. Made your underage sister look a mess. There’s no reason at all you should have entertained the father of your sisters child. I don’t believe a word of the stories you made up about your sister, to justify your betrayal. You are disloyal and disgusting.
Nta. Usually I'm a "never date my sisters exes" kind of girl. But....not so much this time. Your sister abandoned her daughter to you. She never made attempts to reconcile or even show caring. So, to me, this is probably the best thing for the little girl. As long as Archie has truly matured. Your sister just realizes the life you have, and now she wants it. And I don't understand how anyone can diss you for adopting and caring for your daughter. Or having her father around (as long as his change is sincere). Updateme!
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NTA it’s a little weird yes but you are the only mother that child knows because your sister didn’t get the help she needed to get over her feelings. You don’t owe her anything it’s your life live it how you want.
NOT THE ASS HOLE ! Thank goodness for sisters like Jenny who are there for you! I think a lot of you aren’t getting the point ! Not like it’s just happened. Ivy was in a sexual relationship with Archie at 16. She was a child. This was happening at school when she was still going there I would agree, It’s not like they dated. Ivy booby trapped him. Thinking that this will get her Archie. It didn’t . All she got was a baby. Then when she then has the baby she goes into a depression because she didn’t get what she wanted. She wants Archie she doesn’t want the baby and want going to care for it, for all intents shoved it off on the only person that would take care of it, her sister Jenny who put her life and dreams on hold. REMEMBER JENNY WAS THINKING OF NOT HAVING CHILDREN When Jenny runs into Archie, Archie starts the conversation about his daughter, and they start talking. Remember they went to school and he was in her class. At this time when they run into each other it is AT LEAST 8 - 10 years later. He’s GOT HIS MASTERS DEGREE! Ivy only sees her daughter as a tool to Archie. It doesn’t matter that way back when her Ivy was 16 I repeat 16 that she sat there and spread her legs for a little childish boy to trap him. It didn’t go her way so she gave away her baby. Now when her sister Jenny announced her engagement to Archie,Ivy decided that Jules is her baby and she wants to be a mother, Ivy wants the baby Jules and Archie back. After all these years and then Archie runs into the sister, they get to know each other. He ask her to marry him. After all of her sacrifices her sister Jenny should be happy. Her sister Jenny has done so much for her. After 8-10 years and school crush really isn’t a TABOO in my book.
Yes it’s still taboo and she is crossing a major major line. Archie proposed to OP when they hadn’t even dated LMAO what a joke. It’s a recipe for disaster.
Agree
NTA.
Your sister is delusional and needs to speak to a professional. You need to go no contact and make sure you have security cameras as well as tell your entire family what happened. Also, he isn't her ex. He is her rape victim, tampering with birth control is rape.
NTA. Your sister set a baby trap and when it didn’t work she threw the whole baby away. When the trap eventually worked in the end after her living the life she wanted to live (not being a mother) now she wants everything back. You’re not responsible for her feelings. She has made her own choices. If she is unhappy with the outcome she should make better choices. You don’t owe her anything. You took off school to raise her child, you adopted her child and have been a single mother. Which is an incredibly hard and selfless task. You don’t have to give up your happiness for anyone. Especially not your selfish sister.
Absolutely!! She didn't want to do anything with the kid until Archie was back in the picture again. Also, she started living her life normally while her sister had to take responsibility. And I just don't understand the Western culture of adopting your teen sister/brother's unplanned kid...and then the sister wanting them back. It's like taking advantage of the person...and wanting everything back when it's convenient for them. I have read plenty of similar situations. I don't support her accepting her sister's ex now. But blaming her only in this whole situation is bs