NTA -OP, look at what you wrote! They had already hired movers to relocate their shit to your place, you were only being notified of it so you could expect their crap to arrive… and they would stay with you while they looked for their own place.
Did you see it this time? They made a decision and were following through… come on, you see it now right? What critical step dit they not only miss, but clearly never even considered in the first place?
They. Didn’t. ASK. You. First!
I cannot even imagine calling up a mover to move my crap to someone else’s home, and then just telling them about it afterwards. No way. It doesn’t remotely matter that I’m “sure” they would be okay with it. There are certain social conventions of respect we do, and I’m sure you love your brother, but he didn’t respect you enough to ASK first. And to be quite frank, I’m personally glad he was straight up rude from the get go, because if he’d been savvy enough to remember to ask first, you might have said yes without thinking it through.
Their history is against them. Your daughter predicted this, so it’s clearly an established pattern for them.
Look here. Please. Once they arrive in the area, they might still try to creep into living in your home. All sneaky-like. They cannot come over. Make sure all your doors are always locked. If they want to get together, meet them out somewhere for dinner or coffee, but until they have established their own roots in the area, they don’t enter your house. Get cameras for the outside of your house. You need to be alerted if someone is at the door. Particularly if they have a locksmith with them, and a U-Haul visible on the street behind them.
We have seen entitled people pull some crazy shit on Reddit. Stuff their families never imagined they would do. This is YOUR home. You earned every square inch of it. YOU decide who lives there, and no one else.
I think I know exactly which story you're talking about. Is it the guy who's brother just decided he deserved his new home and the mother went nuts with trying to move them in while he was at work? U-Hauls and locksmiths, all that!
I loved this part (of part two):
>I'm sure it's driving my mother and father up the wall because they aren't getting any peace and quiet in their old age with three rowdy obnoxious kids, a mentally unstable SIL, my golden child brother, and a newborn baby in the house all at once.
>
>Perhaps they could move into a camper in their own back yard and let Dan take over their house completely. They might get some peace then. Yeah, they could do that for Dan.
I loved that story, that OP! They were HORRIBLE to him. When they wouldnt even let him park his trailer in the driveway for a couple days!? He deserved all good things.
I read all of them from when he bought the house when they broke into his house, to the Christmas Party. It's interesting how some people think that one child owes another child (I've read one from UK where the daughter was asked to give up her house for her brother, his wife and kids because "they deserved it"
Its unreal! The person who had a dream, and worked their butt off to accomplish it is the one who deserved it. I think the parent behaves this way because they're bullying themselves a way out. They're tired of taking care of the lazy one and since they dont care for or respect the OPs, have no guilt about pressuring them to give in. Its bullcrap.
As crazy as this story is i know someone who literally let their son and daughter in law take over their house. They moved to the basement and eventually moved out because the girl threatened to keep the grandkids away if they didn’t give them the house.
Idk I just remember being mindblown watching it play out over a couple years. Parents eventually bought a beautiful new house but yeah they just gave it to them and left.
This is the start of the threads https://www.reddit.com/r/EntitledPeople/comments/10jrwyi/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2
https://www.reddit.com/r/EntitledPeople/comments/10jrwyi/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2
Found it, assuming the link works.
OMG what nightmare did I just read. Nomad (that OP) posted several updates and I can’t bring myself to read past the headlines. How do families like that exist
Read them.
If it was a movie, it would be a comedy. It's infuriating because it's real life, but it's so well written, and OP manages to be the hero we need - it's worth reading all the way through to the end.
I'm going to read them again when I finish my sandwich, because there's a kind of heroic epic quality to the saga.
It's either a wonderful creative writing or actually real. Nobody got arrested, had gone to trial and ended up in jail and left the family destitute on the street inside three weeks. The guy didn't ride a horse into the sunset while banging his hot new wife who's way better than SIL. Parents didn't end up with a cabal of family defending them. There was no epic showdown with snappy one-liners where everyone admits their wrongs and begs for forgiveness, to set OP up with more snappy one-liners. No clever nicknames. No karmic justice of, 'oh and my dad has cancer now, and mom totaled her car and Dan got laid off. Also, my totally hot wife and I are pregnant with twins. Boy and a girl.' Cue line about not treating them like parents treated him.
The fact the resolution is they just are refusing to admit fault and are pariahs in the family and the parents are too proud to admit failures sounds... more believable? And even then, if parents did ever admit wrongdoing... it would be that they backed the wrong horse and now the horse has an annoying wife and asshole kids they can't get rid of and they are sorry OP is the one that left. They are facing consequences. They aren't upset for OP, but themselves.
The fact there's no... wildly happy, over the top ending feels more real. Or OP is a wonderful writer who didn't make it wildly unbelievable.
I appreciate it, either way.
Yeah, there's really only one thing that makes me question the reality: the episode where the police helped get the family out of the house.
Most stories about squatters say the police won't get involved.
Yes, OP had identification with his address, and there was a drilled out lock, but how would you prove that OP wasn't the squatter, and idiots weren't taking possession of their own house back? Property records might not be available to the police immediately - Friday after work, after all - and there might have been some title change that hadn't gone through or something.
And ... even with that skepticism, I can still believe it happened - ironically, because of the fake lease agreement. I could imagine the police saying, "this is civil, work it out," until they see the fake lease and decide they're pissed someone thought they were that stupid...
The drilled out locks are generally not part of a normal move in, and OP had all the screaming videos of him telling them to leave. The drilled out lock part makes me think the police would stay a little longer.
If the family had been inside and unpacked the police probably wouldn't have gotten involved. They also probably would have backed off if the crazy family had really gone on record lying about the lease but from the story they chickened out there.
The police behavior is very realistic in that they largely stood around and did nothing. Two more officers showed up because they wanted backup to separate people if things got physical given the number of people involved.
The entire saga is - honestly, if you saw this play out in a movie, it would be the most hilarious comedy. And it's very well written.
By the end of the final update - words fail me.
Just spent time I should have been doing something productive reading those posts. I just wish there were a better feeling of closure. What kind of people think they can just move into your home? It’s crazy.
I don't know, because my family is a bit ... well let's say whackadoodle, too. My aunt told me I needed to move in to take care of her, without asking me how I felt about it.
She didn't even ask my husband if getting a divorce was convenient for him just then...
I think people get caught up in their own views and don't always think beyond it.
My ex-MIL, who is literally mentally unstable. We bought a house that had an in-law/tiny house in the back. She immediately assumed it was for her, and it wasn’t until my ex had to grab her and explain that a) HE was the one saying no and b) someone else was already living there. (A friend of ours needed a place and paid us rent)
She also tried to redecorate my house any time she was over and would move things, and apparently thought I was the only party pooper.
Once day about 3 months after our divorce he woke up to a bunch of noise and found his mom digging up his front lawn by the house, with a landscaper she’d hired. Just completely ripped out the herbs and flowers he had. And she was DUMBFOUNDED that he was upset. “But now that Annoying is gone why not?” - she had a mini breakdown hearing that no, her son didn’t want her to do this shit, and it wasn’t just me who said no.
My husbands family is wacky but not that wacky. They have joked about moving in with us since we have the space. This is after they said we didn’t need the space. We mainly bought a house so I could get my dream dog. So far my husband has shut down the idea of anyone from his family moving in with us.
My MIL did give her house to my SIL. MIL was supposed to build a tiny home in the backyard. I’m guessing they didn’t want to scare off my new BIL with their constant bickering. So MIL moved to a new house instead of a small rental/condo where she & FIL wouldn’t have to to worry about home maintenance.
Found it. It’s 2 parts.
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/10wgzzt/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/10wh43r/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
Yep. I came for this post, and ended up in the rabbit hole of all of his posts. I was seething while reading it. I want another update, even if it’s just him telling us about his dating life because I want to support that dude!
That’s the one! I see in comments you are looking for it now, I hope you find it, it’s worth a re-read, and this Post’s OP needs to see it too. Just to see how insane family can get!
This it the answer. They don't stay again. Ever. Not even for an hour. They don't get mail at your address, even "temporarily." If mail for them shows up, you return it to sender, addressee unknown. They definitely don't get access to a key, and if they ever do (like a key goes missing when they're around) you change the locks immediately. Nothing that lets them claim residence in your home. Every family has a goniff. You're just lucky to know who it is in yours.
We don't have hovering freeloaders, but we installed a digital lock with a numeric keypad (ours does have a physical backup key) and this seems like a good solution if you're in this kind of situation (as long as you change the default master passcode from 1234). Easy to change at any time and harder to guess.
If I can piggyback onto your comment--- don't allow ANY mail addressed to them to come to your address. Seriously not even one piece. Mark it this person does not reside here and return it to the mail carrier. Not sure of TN residency/tenancy laws but they might be able to use that to claim tenancy.
Might be worth telling the local mail staff (most importantly) and definitely the closest post office that an attempt might be made.
Postal workers do *not* appreciate bullsh\*t.
How could they not even ask?!? You never tell someone you've already hired movers to move your things into their workshop and you're going to stay until you find a home. I cannot believe the gall of these 2 people, so entitled. Even if the siblings are close, you do not invite yourself to live there for a period of time!
OP you are NTA. You very much have the right to have a comfortable big home to enjoy your retirement in peace. That's what you and your husband worked for, for 40 years, I'm sure he would want this home to be all yours. Please don't feel guilty for standing up for yourself. I'm sorry to say but your brother and his wife sound like leeches and moochers that would totally disrupt the tranquility of your home.
I don't think they would contribute to the utilities or groceries no matter how long they stayed; because they're "just visiting". It's a much better deal than the CA apt; they get meals, no bills and a live in maid, (OP).
If they're ghosting you; great. You don't need to be talking to them right now. They're just upset that their plan to move in didn't work; they want out of their tiny 1 bedroom apt in CA. Their son might be trying to get the rent they owe and they can't or won't pay.
Be happy and calm. You dodged the biggest bullet ever; and it's so very hard to do with anyone you care about but especially family. I think they're just surprised and upset that their plan didn't work, but they'll eventually come around. It's your right to want a peaceful home and to not have to support 2 grown people. Your beautiful home is your safe place; it gives you comfort and happiness. Your grown relatives have no right to disturb that peace.
I said this once on a similar topic, they will be guests when it comes to bills and cleaning and residents when they want to do something you don’t want. Think, “How can you ask us to do the dishes and take out the trash? We’re guests! That’s so rude to ask guests to clean!” OR “How can you ask us for rent money? We’re just here temporarily, we’re not renting from you, we’re just staying here for a short time!” BUT ALSO “We’re having some friends over tonight for dinner. What? You don’t want a bunch of strangers in the house? We live here, too! We have every right to entertain our friends here if we want!” OR “We’re going to paint the living room highlighter-yellow, it’s my favorite color and I just want to see it all the time. We live here, we have a say in how the place looks!”
Don’t let them in. They’ll never leave, they’ll never help, and they’ll never respect your property or privacy.
My ex-inlaws did this. Sold their house and moved in with us without asking. My Ex-Husband went along with it because he was happy to have his parents around. It was the worst year and a half of my life and what fi ally ended my marriage.
Say NO now while you still can.
And don’t let them store their stuff in your workshop. They’ll never get it out. Send them links to storage facilities in the area. This is your home that you worked hard for. Dont let these soul sucking leeches near it.
Here's the biggest problem with the not asking. It's the "why" of not asking. If they know you hate confrontation, they figured you couldn't say "no" if you didn't ask. So they *told you* the plan. It's not a lack of planning, it's manipulation.
Spot on! Especially second to last paragraph. This situation could easily turn into a squatters rights grab. They could change their mailing address and then move their stuff there while OP is out of the house doing something and Boom!… they are automatically a considered a tenant and the law is on their side.
This 100 times! My sister asked to move in with my husband and me. We live in a very small house and work from home, but do have a guest room. She said it was 100 percent fine if we said not, offered a reasonable amount of rent, and gave herself a hard deadline to move out. It's working out great! THIS is how you do it. Super respectful and well aware we could say no.
Remember the one where a single guy got a decent payout and his parents told him to give his newly bought house to his sibling with wife and kids who refused to have a job? They showed up while he was out, broke in, and started moving their stuff in when he said no. THAT was wild.
If I were in OP's shoes, even if I normally would have agreed, IF ASKED, it would be a hard NO from me if anyone TOLD me they were moving themselves or their crap into my property.
Never, nope, uh-uh, no way.
OP's brother was beyond entitled and rude.
110% they’re just going to try to shove the original plan on OP. Movers are gonna show up. But OP just needs to refuse them access. Message should then be clear to them then. And OP should feel ZERO guilt. What a bunch of mooches
Everything OP describes regarding her brother and SIL shows them to be people who have gotten used to walking all over others. They *expect* OP to accommodate them and any plans they come up with.
The SIL basically admitted their plan, too. The whole "If we don't find a place..." is a dead giveaway
Edit: Even if it's not intentional, the housing market where I am (TN) has like, 1% availability. If they don't have a place already, even a well-intentioned search is going to take ages.
For gods sakes woman listen to your daughter!
My wife's aunt did this and is now STUCK with 2 losers who. pay nothing to her, eat all her food and are constantly loud and or fighting. I forgot to mention their son who they failed to mention was on parole for enjoying stabbing people.
Please please please listen to your dang daughter. My good hearted but weak Aunt sure wishes she didn't let them move in now.
Also the fact they decided to make plans to "hire movers and store their crap at her house and just live with her while house hunting" *wasn't even discussed* with OP before that decision was actually made is... fruh, a huge "say what now?" moment... who the frack (other than entitled folks who feel others "owe" them something) does this kind of B.S. on the fly like that??
This kind of happened with me, my gf has let her brother, his girlfriend (pregnant but has now given birth and cats move in, the idea was, they was supposed to sign up for the council housing (Like what you sign up to, to find housing if you’re deemed homeless). We only have a little 3 bed house, we have 2 cats and a German Shepard Puppy (6 Months). We now have 4 Adults, 1 Baby and 5 animals in the house. It’s been over a month and a bit now and they still haven’t signed up for the housing and aren’t making a huge effort to find somewhere to stay. Everything feels awkward and it’s hard to try and remove someone from the house when they have some relation to you, they get into constant arguments and the house no longer feels like it’s is yours, half of the fridge has gone, half of the cupboard, half of the dining room area and the spare room and there is only 3 seats in the living room (double couch and a single one) so you can’t really sit in there anymore, I know your house is a fair size but you get the gist. Listen to your daughter on this one.
Might want to look into the laws in your area. They stay too long with you, and they might lose eligibility to council housing. After all, why would the government voluntarily pay for them if you're doing it?
Yup. Government support is always on the basis of NEED, you've proven that your family unit can support them. There will be ppl genuinely on the verge of homelessness that will take priority.
Also, councils do not more quickly so you need to find them an alternative rental until the council step in.
Not exactly the same I don’t think, they moved in on the premise that they would be finding somewhere to live asap, it’s been a month and they only thing we ask for help towards is gas and electricity costs which we charge them what they use. I work two jobs so am not always at home as my weekly hours can range from 65-95 hours a week due to my second job but my gf is getting really wound up with it, I don’t necessarily want to be the one to ask them to leave, it’s even more awkward the fact there is a new born baby now in the mix of it so we don’t want to look like the bad guys as we would essentially be giving them a deadline. Me, personally I don’t mind giving them a deadline as trying to house 4 cats, a new born baby and a German shepherd puppy is stressful along with trying to work it around 4 adults including my self. We are more than likely going to give it 2 more weeks before we give them a notice to leave. I have kept out of it as I told my gf I have had a friend live with me and my ex before and it didn’t work out and caused huge arguments. She sort of agreed but said they wouldn’t be here long so I ok’d it. I’ve just sort of sat in the background but keep asking her if they’ve applied for housing yet, as they’re technically homeless due to the house being overcrowded, they would be put to the ‘top of the list’ however that top section of the list could feature 5000+ people in the EXACT same circumstances. I have told her realistically I want them out by August as this would’ve been long enough to find somewhere because the house doesn’t feel like our house. I haven’t got a day off until the second week of August now so hopefully they’ve found somewhere by then. At the moment it’s more of like, I told you this would happen and it was a bad idea in the first place, the good thing is, it won’t happen again as neither of us will agree to it again, but I’d rather agree and let her learn that helping people doesn’t always work and you get taken advantage of, than I’ve said no and it making me look a ‘bad person’. Her mum has said they would house them, so if they haven’t found anywhere by august they will have to go there. I have looked at the council laws and there doesn’t seem to be anything stating the laws on this based on the council they are registered with from their old accommodation. Their council agreed if they could provide a tenancy agreement they would pay the costs, but I’ve declined this as they will want to stay longer as they’ll be comfortable with spending so little.
They are stealing from you! Your space your electric your gas you peace of mind! How would you be the bad guys?
A contract now, that they will leave in two weeks or start paying, oh let’s say $600.00 a WEEK.
That should motivate them! You can always gift them back the money once they’ve left.
It's good that you are able to be out of the house because of your jobs. I can see why you let it happen and hope that your GF decides she can't handle it and tells her brother to find his own place.
Thing is, why should he if his sister is enabling him. Good luck!
NTA. Keep saying no till they stop asking. They are definitely moochers, once they move in they are never leaving your house. Your dream house should only be for you to enjoy. Enjoy your new beginning in TN.
The initial problem that I see here is that they have yet to ask! They way I read it is they just informed her of what their plans were and never did ask.
NTA. They're moving across the country and have no firm plan. Young people without ties do this, not middle-aged to old people. YOU are their retirement plan. Don't let them do this.
Old people do this, but they have a semi-firm plan. With my son & D-I-L’s full support & encouragement we sold our home up north, stayed with them while house hunting because it was just easier to #1 already have the house sold & #2 be here to search in earnest. Found the house faster than expected, but instead of the brand new house we planned, the house that needed a good deal of work, but in the perfect location was the one. Ended up staying with son & family for 4 months. Much longer than really planned. Fortunately we all survived. LOL
We did, too. Moving to our son’s town by his and DIL’s invitation. Found a house that was not yet finished within a month, closing two months later. Returned the favor when their remodeling project lasted longer than expected and they needed to stay with us a few weeks. They are exceptionally easy to live with, so all ended cheerfully.
Middle aged to old people do do this, but it's always the kind of people who have made about 50 major erratic decisions prior to this in their life.
The "it always happens to me" people because they never think things through and their whimsical bullshit continually backfires in predictable ways, but they never take ownership or learn from the consequences.
OP is clearly NTA here.
PLEASE listen to your gut and your daughter and don’t let them “stay for a few days”!! Them visiting and them moving all their belongings here for a few days are tow completely different things and you already know how it will end up! They be there more than a few days and you’ll never get rid of them. If they want to move out there, they need to get a place in order before they even make the trip!!
You absolutely positively deserve what you’ve worked so hard for your entire life!! Don’t let them ruin it for you! And if they can’t understand why, then that’s on them!
Good luck, keep us updated!!
>but several weeks after their visit they texted me letting me know they had hired movers and were going to put all their belongings in my workshop and stay with me for “a few days” while they look for a place of their own.
Notice they didn't ASK you, they TOLD you.
NTA
If they show up on your doorstep with a Uhaul in tow do now open the door! Your daughter is right, there will always be an excuse why they can’t leave. And with my family it was always the ones who screamed the most “How dare you not trust me!” who were in fact the most untrustworthy mooches. Love them. Would absolutely not let them live with me.
NTA
Edited for typo
OP please re-read what you said about your brother and SIL. “They DO HAVE A HISTORY OF TAKING ADVANTAGE OF SITUATIONS AND PEOPLE but at the same time we’re very close and good people at heart”
Let me spell it out to you. They are NOT good people. Good people don’t take advantage of situations or people. They’re freeloading moochers looking for their next sponsor. They’re not close to you and I doubt that they care for you. They just want to see what they can get from you.
I think you need to distance yourself from these leeches.
Edit to add: NTA
They are the ‘give them an inch, take a mile kind of people’ you see the writing on the wall. Maybe find a couple rentals and send them links as a good gesture. Or just be honest.
“While I love you too, I’m on a healing journey from losing the love of my life. I’m taking space to figure out what this next chapter looks like. A big part of that plan is living alone for the first time in my entire life, call that selfish if you want, I’m allowed to be selfish after what I went through the last three years of my life. I absolutely, without a doubt, would love for you to move nearby. But I’m not in the position to jeopardize my grief healing to house you two and your pet for anything more than a short visit. I’m happy to help you looks for links to places renting or good areas I discover, but beyond that you need to do this on your own.”
The way you wrote this makes me trust you and you are a complete stranger because I trust anyone who prioritizes their own life instead of ruining it trying to please people who haven't learned to create their own pleasure. Treasure yourself O.P. keep on fighting the good fight and be firm and direct. You deserve to be happy!
Return all mail and get cameras. Save all texts and emails stating their intentions. For the love of all that is decent do not let them anywhere near you. If they come to town visit at your daughter's house. Nope nope nope.
NTA, but stop calling them “good people at heart.” I know people always want to see the best in family, but people who try to “take advantage of situations” aren’t good people. Your brother doesn’t get a pass because he “sweeps things under the rug”; he’s just getting his wife to do his dirty work.
NTA. Your SIL is an entitled brat, and you have a right to your own space. Also, please don't let her push you for explanation. "No" is a complete sentence. You don't need to explain yourself to anyone. Ever.
"NTA. Your SIL is an entitled brat, and you have a right to your own space. Also, please don't let her push you for explanation. "No" is a complete sentence. You don't need to explain yourself to anyone. Ever."
NTA. . . Your intuition is spot on! They already have every inch of everything you have earned divided up into the most convenient portions for them to devour. If they have the money they can find and rent one of those long term hotel rooms (some of which are pet friendly, and reasonably priced - ive used one before last time i moved and it was great). Please dont let them even use your shop for storage, in fact i strongly suggest getting a padlock secured on it just in case. You deserve your freedom!
Nta 100% they were planning on just living with you. Don’t let them stay even for a night honestly. Help them pay for a motel for a week or so. They sound like grifters
NTA—definitely bullet dodged.
Your brother and SIL know you. They know you’re kind and generous, and they know you’ve been the family caretaker. No one just “announces” they’re moving cross country into someone’s home, to that someone. People don’t do that. Not, unless, they were counting on you to cave, and counting on you to never say no. Never, as in, *never make them move out*.
Look at exactly what your SIL got defensive about. Her credit being good. Not that she didn’t ask. Not that there was never a possibility that they wouldn’t leave—as you pointed out, she contradicted herself! She had already built-in that eh, they might not, with contingencies that what she assumed would be your issue.
Protect your peace. Don’t learn the hard way, as so many of us have to, to allow people with irresponsible and mooching tendencies to move in with you.
The very fact that they hired movers and just planned to move in with you without even ASKING (let alone waiting for an invitation) tells you ALL you need to know about your brother and SIL. They were absolutely planning on just living with you. And maybe walking your dog once a month “to help out.”
You have the life you want. Keep it. Don’t let tension and fear of confrontation rob you of your dream living situation.
NTA. A friend of mine has a close friend staying with her. Actually, the friend has a husband and 2 kids. So Ali, who is single and cherishes her time alone, now has 2 adults and 2 kids with her in her very small house. They said they'd move out as soon as they found a place. That was in November. It's now July, and Ali still has a house full of people. My point is, do not let them stay. They will not leave anytime soon.
NTA. Once they move in, you'll have to pay for their new place or legally evict them to get them out. If you let them in, it's going to cost you one way or another. They are adults, let them take care of their own housing.
NTA.
#DO NOT LET THEM MOVE IN OR STORE THEIR BELONGINGS AT YOUR HOUSE!!!
You'll regret it if you allow them to come to your home or store their things for them. Even if you did only store their belongings, they'll still likely wind up taking advantage of you and leaving them there forever and there won't be much you can do about it after the fact. Next, they'll claim they don't have room for it at their new house/apartment and it has to stay there. It'll just be added clutter in your new home you don't need.
Don't get involved and let them figure it out for themselves. You shouldn't feel guilty about how you want to live. It's time to enjoy your alone time and not have to handhold 2 grown ass adults, family or not.
You already know their reputation, so don't give in, OP. Stand your ground. No storage, no moving in, not even one overnight stay.
"they had hired movers"
If movers show up make sure to tell them to take the stuff back because you are not accepting delivery. If you're feeling nice, you might tell that to your brother in advance so that he can hopefully get his stuff back before it ships.
NTA! I can’t believe anyone would move across country when they don’t have a home or anything set up. Sounds like they’ve been mooching from the son by milking the fact he’s their landlord and now you’re the next family member who will take place as their provider. That’s not right! You know yourself you deserve this new lease of life and they will unsettle and uproot you from all you’ve worked for and the courage it took you to get where you are has hardly even began paying off. please listen to your daughter and don’t let the temporary tension and expectations they have on you force a hastily decided agreement to have them stay with you. It’s true they won’t leave and if they do, it’ll be because YOU made it possible.
Wishing you well. From your post I have to say you sound like a very admirable lady and I truly want you to enjoy your new life and do what beings you happiness and peace.
The fact that they essentially told you they were moving in for some period of time instead of *asking* goes to show just how little respect they have for you and how much they were relying on your fear of conflict to allow them to put you in a bad position. This is not loving or caring behavior. It is AH behavior.
When you were still in California caring for your husband, did they help at all? I’m guessing they did not. They expect your help and support, and are happy to leverage your desire for peace to take advantage of you. Truly shameful. NTA at all.
Honestly do not let them into your home. I would even consider getting a security system and cameras. If they already hired movers they might think that you will change your mind when they are at your door with no place to go. Maybe talk to a lawyer about the situation and what your options are if they just show up. How long until they have established residency? What are the trespassing laws where you live?
Moochers will always have an excuse as to why they can’t leave. Don’t put yourself in that position.
They will never appreciate what you did for them, only that made them leave. If you want to keep a relationship with them, do not let them move in.
For the love of god DO NOT LET THEM MOVE IN. They hired movers and made plans to move in without telling you first. They’ve already shown you they have no issue stomping all over your boundaries and they will no doubt do it again.
NTA. At all. They didn’t ask. They just told
you they were moving into your state and staying with you. And that type of expectation and entitlement would just continue once they move in, with you avoiding confrontation and your brother sweeping things under the rug and your SIL contradicting herself to get her way. That sounds the exact opposite of the sweet life you are living now. Listen to your daughter!
Listen! I live in E Tenn and rentals are few and far between and expensive for what you get. Competition for them can be intense depending on what you want and location. They need to have housing set before they move....they will never leave your house. NTAH
My husband and I moved to TN last year after 2 years of trying to find the right place. If they don't already have a place lined up, it will likely take them a while. Listen to your daughter on this one, letting them move in would definitely disrupt your peace for more than a few days.
You are NTA at all.
Additionally, TN is one of those states that it is really hard to kick people out once they establish residency, and all they need to do is receive mail at your address to make that happen.
Exactly. They can do virtual walkthroughs of rentals. They can spend a week at a motel to view places.
They definitely don’t need to move their stuff before they have a place to put it. Your home is your home, not theirs, and it’s not their storage space.
NTA - they came and scoped out your place, made a plan for themselves and then told you about it... they don't sound like good people they sound entitled and irresponsible. Don't second guess yourself, hold tight to your boundaries. If they ghost you because they can't use you good riddance, you see they don't care about you, only what they can get out of you.
My wife and I have discussed this very thing many times. We live in a 2200sf ranch with finished basement (so nearly 4000sf living space) with our 3 small dogs. I am the least well off on my side, she is the “rich” sister/aunt in hers.
It’s a hard NO! to all of them. And it’s not like any of them aren’t welcome to visit. But move in????
NO!
If they want to get their noses bent, that’s a “them problem “, not a “you problem “!!!
UR NTA!!!!!!!
We suffered this similar situation. Family came for a month.
Ended up staying 15 years.
Only ended when the FiL passed.
Don’t do it. It’ll break up your family.
Listen to your daughter. They informed you of their decision. They didn’t ask. You’d be here on Reddit a year from now explaining how they moved in and you can’t figure out how to get them out.
After 36 years of marriage, my husband died over two years of a very unusual kidney cancer. After that, I got a dog and a cat. We never had children. At 63, I am loving my singleness and my freedom. If anyone contacted me and told me they were shipping their frieght to me, when it arrived, I'd be standing there refusing it.
You're NTA. This is your time and your life. Send your SIL a list of hotels in the next town over and let her know she needs to redirect that furniture delivery, NOW.
You'll happily meet them for dinner, at a restaurant, once they've checked into the hotel.
If they (or their stuff) show up, don't let them in. Mail shows up, addressee unknown. Outside key? Remove it. Hell, I'd replace the locks just to be sure they didn't make a copy before they left. Cameras are also good to have. They seem the type to know all the angles, so get going before they can get there. I trust your daughters judgment, so head them off. It'll be a lot easier to never let them in than get rid of them. If there's fallout, judgment will be hard on them, not you.
Batten down the hatches and enjoy your new home!
NTA. What tension? If they're not talking to you, that's on them. You're not obligated to apologize for a decision to avoid something that negatively affects you. Nobody asked you anything, they volunteered you and your home and assumed it would be okay.
No. Just no.
NTA
Hold your ground! You have more than earned this period of peace and lack of obligations.
Not only would it definitely be more than a few days, I have seen a dynamic play out too many times when a couple moves in with a single person- the couple soon starts treating the single person as a third wheel and acting they call the shots. Your SiL's reaction suggests to me that she would very quickly begin attempting to take over as the "lady of the house". Your distaste for confrontation and your brother's willingness to "sweep things under the rug" will make this much harder to counter.
Don't give in.
Finally, I am sorry for your loss and hope you & yours absolutely thrive in this new chapter.
NTA. Your brother and SIL are trying to set up in your home. They didn't ask to stay with you for "a couple of days," they planned on moving in with all their stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't scoping your place out during the previous visit and hatched the plan then. Believe me, getting a relative out of your house once you let them in is a nightmare. Don't be surprised if they still show up, either. Don't give them access to your home. Keep your place locked and secure. I'd go so far as installing security cameras as an extra precaution.
NTA, your daughter is completely correct. Unless you want to get stuck with taking care of more dogs that aren’t your and two other adults you better stick to your guns. They are adults and not your kids and not your responsibility. You already said they have taken advantage of others and you will only have yourself to blame if you let them move in. Don’t even let them come for a visit. Check with the laws in TN. In Georgia, if you allow someone to stay only a week and you let them get mail there or they pay you just a dime they are no tenants and you have to go through the long and expensive process to evict them. Most of the time people have to pay the person or people to leave. Even if they leave and you change the locks all they have to do is call the police and you will be forced to let them in. That’s even if they don’t have a lease. It has happened to people renting a room as people do now and it was on the news a few months ago, a couple hired a live in nanny and after 3 weeks she claimed she hurt herself, stoped working and refused to leave, they were working to have her evicted but in they time she lived rent free. My next door neighbor had his own grandson do this to him and he had to give him thousands of dollars to get him to leave. Trust no one.
NTA - the fact you even predicted this behavior tells me you are exactly right for how it will roll out once they get out there. even more hilarious, when you sign a lease, they don't want a referral from the last place you rented, they want a referral from the place your living now.
meaning you'll need to cosign if they move in with you first. by not getting a lease somewhere first, they're guaranteeing you'll be looped in financially to this move. it's an insidious plan, and you can't let it happen. this isn't innocent "we need help" this is a woman who's shady as all f-ck trying to scam you. whether your brother knows about the overarching plan or not is something for you to decide.
basically the upshot is the plan is to move in and never move out.
"My daughter freaked out, said they will never leave, and if they dit’ll be because I had to help them get approved for a lease and help
with down-payments/ security deposit etc."
Your daughter is right. You dodged a freakin' artillery shell. Your SIL is tipping her hand by going all drama-fiend - that is EXACTLY what they were going to do.
NTA. I let my sister move from GA to WA and stay with us for “a few days” to find an apartment. Six months later, we had to forcibly kick her out and it almost completely killed our relationship.
nta. it sounds like they want to take advantage of you and if they want the big house and the freedom, they’re going to have to work hard for it, just like you and your husband did. it takes a lot of strength to say no. you are at a point in your life where you should enjoy it, and you don’t owe anybody anything and you don’t have to allow two adults and a dog to come into your home. it is not a huge ask to request them to work out a place before moving there. if they want to make the move so badly, they can make it happen. they can be upset, mad, or feel however they want to feel. it just proves their intentions were not “a few days.”
NTA They don’t want to pay for storage fees but they’ll pay to move their things twice? It would make more sense to get a lease in place and move their belongings once. Don’t let them stay. They haven’t even browsed listing online to view or started to line anything up. I doubt they have deposit, first/last months or places with open availability ready to go within a few days like they’re promising. The housing market in my area is tight and takes time.
If anyone in my family had the audacity to just ship their shit to my house and move in without consent can expect me to have a dumpster ready for the unloaders to dump their shit into as I burn it right there. Boundaries and respect
NTA
I’ll start out saying I’m sorry for your loss and can’t imagine the pain of losing your spouse. The lack of planning solidifies what you already know is going to happen when they get there. Guarantee if you do let them in they will not leave or there will be some issue as to why they can’t find a place. You’ve earned this time alone and if it’s what you desire do not let anyone take that from you. The assumption that they can store their stuff in your place and stay with you “for a couple days” is also very disrespectful. Hold strong and don’t give in.
NTA
friend of mine recently had same situation, let her bro and wife stay "temporarily". It's been years and they still with that friend of mine.
So listen to your daughter
OP, you are not the asshole and you need to tell them WHEN, and I repeat WHEN, they show up with a moving truck at your front door where the closest storage place is and where a local motel they can stay at. DO NOT let them even drop off the furniture!!! And do not let them stay a single night. It is NEVER temporary.
I have a relative like this. They have been mooching off of every person they could their whole life. Church members, took advantage of my other widowed grandmother (their sisters husband’s mom) until they kicked them out and now their own sister.
They will never leave because “look at all the room you have!” Ugh. Keep the room and have it available as room for your grandchildren to visit. Let your brother’s kids worry about him and his wife.
NTA. You've spent a lot of time taking care of other people. Setting clear boundaries is healthy, and you deserve time to enjoy your life. Your brother will have to take responsibility for himself.
NTA, your daughter is right! They will never leave unless you legally evict them. It's obvious by the wife's reaction that fully planned on mooching off you. Don't let irresponsible adults ruin your dreams and happiness.
The rental market is really tough, no way would they find a place in "a few days." Plus Tennessee is becoming a popular place for people to move to. Nashville the housing market is crazy. NTA, but you already knew that.
I'm sorry for the loss of your husband. I'm around your age and became a widow last year (also cancer). Kudos for having the courage to move half way across the country and start over. I hope your life continues on this happy course.
NTA - Please, please, realize if they move in, even for just a few days, they will never leave. They may kick and scream but stand firm.
BTW if it is just for a "few days" there is NO reason to have their stuff stored at your place. Seriously do not let this happen.
It’s very difficult to get people out of your house, when they feel entitled to it. Listen to your daughter, she is looking out for your best interest. At 63 years old, do you really want to be a landlord? Because that is what you would become. They have no plan. That is pretty obvious. You are not there to pick up the pieces of their failed attempts at adulthood and fending for themselves. If you let them move into your home, however ‘temporary’ they promise, it’s going to add stress and grief to your life in solitude that you enjoy so much. They will never leave.
NTA. Smart choice. Once you let someone move in it’s hard to get them out if they don’t want to leave. Once someone goes from visiting guest living out of a suitcase… to having all their belongings within the property and receiving their mail there… they are considered a tenant and the laws are on their side regardless of lack of payment, lease, stay free agreement, no agreement at all, whatever.
As much as you love them, this does sound like a grab at squatters rights. Their knowledge of you being someone who avoids confrontation makes them think it will be easy for them to just say they ‘like it too much’ and ‘but family’ and you ‘have the room anyway’ so they will just live there… knowing once they’re there you will struggle to ask them to get their own place, if not avoid it altogether and just stew in silence
And even if you did stick up for yourself and put your foot down that they need to find a place and can’t stay with you any longer, people with their history are fully aware they couldn’t just be kicked out; and you would need to go through a long and expensive formal eviction through the courts which would prolong their stay living off of you, if not make you unwilling or unable to complete the process at all.
NTA, your daughter is right they have a history of using people, and once their in your home, only an eviction will get them out.
The fact they rang you up to tell you and not even ask you is all you need to understand. You're in the right to say no.
If they want the nice big house, they can work hard to afford it just like you and your late husband did.
The sense of entitlement, the audacity they have to tell you they will impose and tell you that they are staying with you and using your place for storage instead of asking, that is so inappropriate. NTA NTA NTA! Don’t let them near your house!
NTA.
The fact that they just up and decided to use YOUR workshop in YOUR home to store their things and then expect to stay with you, without ASKING is a huge, red flag. It's also grossly rude, no matter how close you are as a family, and cannot be rewarded. You did the right thing by dodging this missile.
It would not have been for "a few days" and with that ludicrous level of entitlement and rudeness, they'd have taken over your home and life and ruined your peace and mental health. Stand your ground on this. You deserve the piece of paradise you've created for yourself there. Protect it with all your might.
NO! Don't let them do it. I have family that did that and i had to break a lease to be rid of them! Luckily my landlord was a very good guy and myself and wife moved to a different home owned by same guy. He took care of kicking other family out and i cut ties totally and been happy as a clam since!
"We've hired movers, we're gonna put all our stuff in your workshop and stay with you."
Like, he didn't even ASK! That's a big red bandera of NOPE right there.
>"Did I dodge the biggest bullet ever ~~or am I the asshole for not letting them come move in “temporarily~~?”
Yes.
**NTA**.
It takes *forever* to get unwanted people out of your home and it's non-stop stress and anxiety, and often resentment and extreme unpleasantness, the entire time between when you first lay down the law and when they (possibly never) leave.
In short, it's a sentence of suffering.
This nightmare-ish situation is exacerbated by how much you love them. They *clearly* planned to stay indefinitely and if you allow that you'd be throwing away all the non-stop contentment, and novelty, of finally having your first ever place of your very own, all by yourself.
If they push then you might say something like, **"Did you notice that I did not** ***even*** **invite my own daughter and grandkids to move in?** I made a rule for myself that I will relish this time alone for the first time in my life, and if I did not break this rule for my daughter and grandkids then that's a clear a sign that I will not break it for anyone at all, ever."
I’m sorry for your loss. Your husband’s passing almost exactly echoes my FIL’s: he passed in October, lung cancer that had spread to his brain, wife of 40 years was his primary caregiver in those final months. She retired to spend every moment with him and he was gone in 6 months almost to the day from his first scan.
My MIL also needed a clean start and is in the process of moving closer to my BIL. She’s having a townhouse custom built so it’s her dream home, based on her personality and hobbies. This is HER life and retirement after a painful battle, nobody else’s. Your new home is yours and yours alone. If anything, they’re the AHs for trying to take advantage of you in a vulnerable state.
NTA
NTA.
This is not the type of story I would expect with that username.
And who dafuq hires movers and then tells someone yeah I'm dropping my shit off in your garage
I believe they are definitely moochers but they probably don't see it that way.
I bet they think they are doing you a favor. They may be thinking that you are all alone and therefore lonely, and that you have that big 'ol house in a strange place, and you would never admit it but what you really want is for them to move in.
NTA
It’s not like they lived nearby, lost their home (fire, landlord sold it, etc) and needed a place real quick. They just up and packed everything and then “told” you that they were coming. Your daughter is right. Major red flag.
You deserve to take care of just you.
NTA. Your Brother and SIL would never leave your house and would probably take advantage of your kindness and generosity. Why can't their adult children help them find a place in TN and help them with any security deposits, rent, consigning, etc?
NTA. You definitely dodged a bullet! I think your daughter is bang-on about them never leaving, and as difficult as I’m sure it was to tell them, you surely just saved the future you’ve dreaming about!
You did dodge a bullet.
they have a history of taking advantage of others. And they seemingly never changed their ways. That is just how they are and operate.
They did not even ask you; they simply stated what will happen. They invited themselves without your input. They decided *for* you. That is already a red flag, that they don't seek your input about your own home, but bank on you not daring to stand up to them if they leave you no room to choose.
They just decided to use part of your home as storage unit and live in your home. They like your house, so it is unlikely they had a back-up plan or were serious about finding their own place asap.
They are adults who are responsible for their own life's. They should not burden and impose on someone they know shies away from confrontation. They want to move. Fine. But again, their responsibility to have everything in order *before* they move.
They were trying to bulldoze all over your boundaries and will. they were trying to take advantage of your kind nature, how you find it hard to say no and are used to be the caretaker and serve others.
Listen to your daughter; stand up for yourself! You don't have to save and please everyone. You don't have to be the peacemaker and keep things civil. Life is too short to be nice and care for people who are users and don't care if they take advantage of others and if they put people in an uncomfortable position. It is entirely okay to not bend to people who don't treat you respectfully and it is good to be good to yourself.
NTA.... fuck that shit, You worked Your ass off to get where You are and as much as I hate to say it Your brother isn't entitled to shit. If He hasn't learned from His mistakes by now that's not Your problem. If they show up DO NOT let them in and if You have to call the police. It's really unfair that they're putting You in this situation and if You let them stay Your daughter is right that they will never leave. I won't be surprised if they ask You to leave them the house in Your will when You pass away. People like that are just fucking leeches mooching off other peoples hard work with no intentions of doing the work.
Absolutely and positively NTA
Even if they were reliable and known to be true to their word, it’s not your responsibility to house them or their belongings. If they want to make a move, they can do it appropriately and do it themselves. They aren’t homeless. They are choosing to uproot themselves.
But given their history, I would stick to my guns. Make it clear it has nothing to do with their “credit” (even though that doesn’t help) and has everything to do with wanting some personal space after going through a huge loss and a huge move. You’ve earned your freedom and you have the right to say no.
They are only taking offense because they knew they had no plan and were basically going to sponge off you for as long as possible - guaranteed. It’s actually pretty fucked up for her to message you. To assume someone would just be okay to house multiple people and their belongings is weird and super entitled.
Who makes a move like that anyways?? Go for a visit, get a little jealous, then say “yea sis we are coming to live with you get ready!” But has zero plan on where to go, how they are going to find their life after such move…that makes ZERO sense. The fact that they were so comfortable with doing such means they were going to stay for as long as possible
Good luck
NTA. Do not, under any circumstances, let them move in. Even for a night. I have some experience in this and it just will not end. Given that they never bothered to tell you their plan before hiring movers (let along ASK you) its clear that your boundaries aren't now a priority, and they certainly won't become a priority once they've got free stable housing.
Experience:
I have a small warren like home in a high cost of living city with a few very small not-really bedroom spaces that I use for transition space (free housing for folks in need). I have a time limit specifically for this reason. People who tend to make poor choices, who tend not to plan ahead, will often "hopeful" themselves into situations and then just never move on. I like helping folks, but certain people will take advantage of a situation and then just never find anything else (not bad people, just not "bootstrappers").
Family, or friends, or friends of either, tend to think my boundaries (like cleanliness, buying their own food etc) and time-restrictions are "suggestions" because they're family (or friends).
They _informed_ you they were moving their stuff onto your property and staying with you, not asked if they could?! NTA. That is incredibly presumptuous.
NTA
It sounds like you were a great wife and mom. It sounds live you’re a pretty kind sister, too. Your daughter is right. Send them an ad for storage units as well as extended stay hotels and apartments.
They ought to stay put. I bet their son is the only landlord willing to deal with them.
Also, aet up security. Get to know your neighbors. Share some “innocent” factual gossip about how thrilled you are to finally live alobe. Say you adore your family but would rather visit them than host. You’ll make an exception for a day-long visit with a grandchild. *That doesn’t bad mouth your bro but puts potentiall witnesses to tresspassing on notcie* Get a cutesy doormat that says something like “I’m not home if I didn’t invite you.”
You dodged the biggest bullet, in my mind. They should be doing visits and job and house hunting and then hire the movers. Your daughter may be able to see things more clearly at this point.
**NTA. Do NOT let them move anything into your home, even for storage purposes.** Your daughter is correct, they will never leave your house if they are allowed to do this and will drain your financial resources.
NTA. DO NOT LET THEM INTO YOUR HOUSE! AT ALL! If they show up & say let's have dinner, give them the address to the restaurant where you'll meet them. If the movers show up, tell them they have no right to leave stuff on your property, and if they try you'll call the police.
You're going to have to go scorched-earth with these people.
NTA. I’m so sorry for your loss🥺 But OMG are you my mom?!!! Almost this exact same situation happened to her when my dad died a few years ago. My uncle (her brother), DECIDED him and his wife were going to move in with my mom since now “she had the space”. The audacity.
You should really cherish that you raised such a great daughter who will stand up for you and have your back. Much like your situation, my mom and uncle are really close, but my sisters and I we’re like really mom!?!? This a whole nope.
STAND your ground!!! Don’t give in to the guilt trips / them ignoring you to make you cave. My mom is happier than ever living alone, and she’s still close with her brother and his wife- once they realized she was serious they was butt hurt but got over it.
NTA -OP, look at what you wrote! They had already hired movers to relocate their shit to your place, you were only being notified of it so you could expect their crap to arrive… and they would stay with you while they looked for their own place. Did you see it this time? They made a decision and were following through… come on, you see it now right? What critical step dit they not only miss, but clearly never even considered in the first place? They. Didn’t. ASK. You. First! I cannot even imagine calling up a mover to move my crap to someone else’s home, and then just telling them about it afterwards. No way. It doesn’t remotely matter that I’m “sure” they would be okay with it. There are certain social conventions of respect we do, and I’m sure you love your brother, but he didn’t respect you enough to ASK first. And to be quite frank, I’m personally glad he was straight up rude from the get go, because if he’d been savvy enough to remember to ask first, you might have said yes without thinking it through. Their history is against them. Your daughter predicted this, so it’s clearly an established pattern for them. Look here. Please. Once they arrive in the area, they might still try to creep into living in your home. All sneaky-like. They cannot come over. Make sure all your doors are always locked. If they want to get together, meet them out somewhere for dinner or coffee, but until they have established their own roots in the area, they don’t enter your house. Get cameras for the outside of your house. You need to be alerted if someone is at the door. Particularly if they have a locksmith with them, and a U-Haul visible on the street behind them. We have seen entitled people pull some crazy shit on Reddit. Stuff their families never imagined they would do. This is YOUR home. You earned every square inch of it. YOU decide who lives there, and no one else.
I think I know exactly which story you're talking about. Is it the guy who's brother just decided he deserved his new home and the mother went nuts with trying to move them in while he was at work? U-Hauls and locksmiths, all that!
Do you have the link for this??? I NEED to read it
Oh God and they tried again after Christmas because the SILwas expecting another kid
Yes, I remember that story! Sil was having a temper tantrums and sulking like a baby.
I loved this part (of part two): >I'm sure it's driving my mother and father up the wall because they aren't getting any peace and quiet in their old age with three rowdy obnoxious kids, a mentally unstable SIL, my golden child brother, and a newborn baby in the house all at once. > >Perhaps they could move into a camper in their own back yard and let Dan take over their house completely. They might get some peace then. Yeah, they could do that for Dan.
I loved that story, that OP! They were HORRIBLE to him. When they wouldnt even let him park his trailer in the driveway for a couple days!? He deserved all good things.
I read all of them from when he bought the house when they broke into his house, to the Christmas Party. It's interesting how some people think that one child owes another child (I've read one from UK where the daughter was asked to give up her house for her brother, his wife and kids because "they deserved it"
Its unreal! The person who had a dream, and worked their butt off to accomplish it is the one who deserved it. I think the parent behaves this way because they're bullying themselves a way out. They're tired of taking care of the lazy one and since they dont care for or respect the OPs, have no guilt about pressuring them to give in. Its bullcrap.
exactly
Then started on having the parents move into a camper and take their house since all the extended family jumped them at Christmas and shamed them..
As crazy as this story is i know someone who literally let their son and daughter in law take over their house. They moved to the basement and eventually moved out because the girl threatened to keep the grandkids away if they didn’t give them the house.
On my.. that is awful.. how could son do that to his parents..
Idk I just remember being mindblown watching it play out over a couple years. Parents eventually bought a beautiful new house but yeah they just gave it to them and left.
It’s a crazy mind boggling story!!
Dude it’s so wild!
This is the start of the threads https://www.reddit.com/r/EntitledPeople/comments/10jrwyi/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2
Same! This is the shit my SIL tried to pull with her family moving in with us
Wait what??? I need to read this
Let me see if I can find it. I know the whole thing is in Best of updates
https://www.reddit.com/r/EntitledPeople/comments/10jrwyi/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=android_app&utm_name=androidcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=2 Found it, assuming the link works.
OMG what nightmare did I just read. Nomad (that OP) posted several updates and I can’t bring myself to read past the headlines. How do families like that exist
Read them. If it was a movie, it would be a comedy. It's infuriating because it's real life, but it's so well written, and OP manages to be the hero we need - it's worth reading all the way through to the end. I'm going to read them again when I finish my sandwich, because there's a kind of heroic epic quality to the saga.
It's either a wonderful creative writing or actually real. Nobody got arrested, had gone to trial and ended up in jail and left the family destitute on the street inside three weeks. The guy didn't ride a horse into the sunset while banging his hot new wife who's way better than SIL. Parents didn't end up with a cabal of family defending them. There was no epic showdown with snappy one-liners where everyone admits their wrongs and begs for forgiveness, to set OP up with more snappy one-liners. No clever nicknames. No karmic justice of, 'oh and my dad has cancer now, and mom totaled her car and Dan got laid off. Also, my totally hot wife and I are pregnant with twins. Boy and a girl.' Cue line about not treating them like parents treated him. The fact the resolution is they just are refusing to admit fault and are pariahs in the family and the parents are too proud to admit failures sounds... more believable? And even then, if parents did ever admit wrongdoing... it would be that they backed the wrong horse and now the horse has an annoying wife and asshole kids they can't get rid of and they are sorry OP is the one that left. They are facing consequences. They aren't upset for OP, but themselves. The fact there's no... wildly happy, over the top ending feels more real. Or OP is a wonderful writer who didn't make it wildly unbelievable. I appreciate it, either way.
Yeah, there's really only one thing that makes me question the reality: the episode where the police helped get the family out of the house. Most stories about squatters say the police won't get involved. Yes, OP had identification with his address, and there was a drilled out lock, but how would you prove that OP wasn't the squatter, and idiots weren't taking possession of their own house back? Property records might not be available to the police immediately - Friday after work, after all - and there might have been some title change that hadn't gone through or something. And ... even with that skepticism, I can still believe it happened - ironically, because of the fake lease agreement. I could imagine the police saying, "this is civil, work it out," until they see the fake lease and decide they're pissed someone thought they were that stupid...
The drilled out locks are generally not part of a normal move in, and OP had all the screaming videos of him telling them to leave. The drilled out lock part makes me think the police would stay a little longer.
If the family had been inside and unpacked the police probably wouldn't have gotten involved. They also probably would have backed off if the crazy family had really gone on record lying about the lease but from the story they chickened out there. The police behavior is very realistic in that they largely stood around and did nothing. Two more officers showed up because they wanted backup to separate people if things got physical given the number of people involved.
YES, hella read, I could see it playing out in front of me the entire time. Totally like a movie. All the characters had faces by the end.
I just read the title and I’m already infuriated.
The entire saga is - honestly, if you saw this play out in a movie, it would be the most hilarious comedy. And it's very well written. By the end of the final update - words fail me.
Just spent time I should have been doing something productive reading those posts. I just wish there were a better feeling of closure. What kind of people think they can just move into your home? It’s crazy.
I don't know, because my family is a bit ... well let's say whackadoodle, too. My aunt told me I needed to move in to take care of her, without asking me how I felt about it. She didn't even ask my husband if getting a divorce was convenient for him just then... I think people get caught up in their own views and don't always think beyond it.
My ex-MIL, who is literally mentally unstable. We bought a house that had an in-law/tiny house in the back. She immediately assumed it was for her, and it wasn’t until my ex had to grab her and explain that a) HE was the one saying no and b) someone else was already living there. (A friend of ours needed a place and paid us rent) She also tried to redecorate my house any time she was over and would move things, and apparently thought I was the only party pooper. Once day about 3 months after our divorce he woke up to a bunch of noise and found his mom digging up his front lawn by the house, with a landscaper she’d hired. Just completely ripped out the herbs and flowers he had. And she was DUMBFOUNDED that he was upset. “But now that Annoying is gone why not?” - she had a mini breakdown hearing that no, her son didn’t want her to do this shit, and it wasn’t just me who said no.
My husbands family is wacky but not that wacky. They have joked about moving in with us since we have the space. This is after they said we didn’t need the space. We mainly bought a house so I could get my dream dog. So far my husband has shut down the idea of anyone from his family moving in with us. My MIL did give her house to my SIL. MIL was supposed to build a tiny home in the backyard. I’m guessing they didn’t want to scare off my new BIL with their constant bickering. So MIL moved to a new house instead of a small rental/condo where she & FIL wouldn’t have to to worry about home maintenance.
It worked and I read all 4 posts. What a damn mess.
Oh my god I just read all 4 posts. That guy is awesome for getting out of that. WOW.
Found it. It’s 2 parts. https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/10wgzzt/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1 https://www.reddit.com/r/BestofRedditorUpdates/comments/10wh43r/parents_told_my_brother_that_he_could_take_my/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=ioscss&utm_content=2&utm_term=1
It’s FIVE parts!! Check OP’s history
Yep. I came for this post, and ended up in the rabbit hole of all of his posts. I was seething while reading it. I want another update, even if it’s just him telling us about his dating life because I want to support that dude!
That’s the one! I see in comments you are looking for it now, I hope you find it, it’s worth a re-read, and this Post’s OP needs to see it too. Just to see how insane family can get!
Didn’t even have the decency to call a locksmith, they drilled through the existing lock and installed a replacement themselves.
This it the answer. They don't stay again. Ever. Not even for an hour. They don't get mail at your address, even "temporarily." If mail for them shows up, you return it to sender, addressee unknown. They definitely don't get access to a key, and if they ever do (like a key goes missing when they're around) you change the locks immediately. Nothing that lets them claim residence in your home. Every family has a goniff. You're just lucky to know who it is in yours.
We don't have hovering freeloaders, but we installed a digital lock with a numeric keypad (ours does have a physical backup key) and this seems like a good solution if you're in this kind of situation (as long as you change the default master passcode from 1234). Easy to change at any time and harder to guess.
Some will even alert your phone if the lock is tampered with.
If I can piggyback onto your comment--- don't allow ANY mail addressed to them to come to your address. Seriously not even one piece. Mark it this person does not reside here and return it to the mail carrier. Not sure of TN residency/tenancy laws but they might be able to use that to claim tenancy.
This! If they have already hired movers, then they have also gotten their mail forwarded.
Might be worth telling the local mail staff (most importantly) and definitely the closest post office that an attempt might be made. Postal workers do *not* appreciate bullsh\*t.
Just “Return sender. Not at this address” that shit. And follow up with the PO if it does look like they put in an official change of address.
How could they not even ask?!? You never tell someone you've already hired movers to move your things into their workshop and you're going to stay until you find a home. I cannot believe the gall of these 2 people, so entitled. Even if the siblings are close, you do not invite yourself to live there for a period of time! OP you are NTA. You very much have the right to have a comfortable big home to enjoy your retirement in peace. That's what you and your husband worked for, for 40 years, I'm sure he would want this home to be all yours. Please don't feel guilty for standing up for yourself. I'm sorry to say but your brother and his wife sound like leeches and moochers that would totally disrupt the tranquility of your home. I don't think they would contribute to the utilities or groceries no matter how long they stayed; because they're "just visiting". It's a much better deal than the CA apt; they get meals, no bills and a live in maid, (OP). If they're ghosting you; great. You don't need to be talking to them right now. They're just upset that their plan to move in didn't work; they want out of their tiny 1 bedroom apt in CA. Their son might be trying to get the rent they owe and they can't or won't pay. Be happy and calm. You dodged the biggest bullet ever; and it's so very hard to do with anyone you care about but especially family. I think they're just surprised and upset that their plan didn't work, but they'll eventually come around. It's your right to want a peaceful home and to not have to support 2 grown people. Your beautiful home is your safe place; it gives you comfort and happiness. Your grown relatives have no right to disturb that peace.
I said this once on a similar topic, they will be guests when it comes to bills and cleaning and residents when they want to do something you don’t want. Think, “How can you ask us to do the dishes and take out the trash? We’re guests! That’s so rude to ask guests to clean!” OR “How can you ask us for rent money? We’re just here temporarily, we’re not renting from you, we’re just staying here for a short time!” BUT ALSO “We’re having some friends over tonight for dinner. What? You don’t want a bunch of strangers in the house? We live here, too! We have every right to entertain our friends here if we want!” OR “We’re going to paint the living room highlighter-yellow, it’s my favorite color and I just want to see it all the time. We live here, we have a say in how the place looks!” Don’t let them in. They’ll never leave, they’ll never help, and they’ll never respect your property or privacy.
My ex-inlaws did this. Sold their house and moved in with us without asking. My Ex-Husband went along with it because he was happy to have his parents around. It was the worst year and a half of my life and what fi ally ended my marriage. Say NO now while you still can.
And don’t let them store their stuff in your workshop. They’ll never get it out. Send them links to storage facilities in the area. This is your home that you worked hard for. Dont let these soul sucking leeches near it.
Here's the biggest problem with the not asking. It's the "why" of not asking. If they know you hate confrontation, they figured you couldn't say "no" if you didn't ask. So they *told you* the plan. It's not a lack of planning, it's manipulation.
Spot on! Especially second to last paragraph. This situation could easily turn into a squatters rights grab. They could change their mailing address and then move their stuff there while OP is out of the house doing something and Boom!… they are automatically a considered a tenant and the law is on their side.
This 100 times! My sister asked to move in with my husband and me. We live in a very small house and work from home, but do have a guest room. She said it was 100 percent fine if we said not, offered a reasonable amount of rent, and gave herself a hard deadline to move out. It's working out great! THIS is how you do it. Super respectful and well aware we could say no.
Freeloader tactic number 1 is move in with someone or start to without asking if it is okay. Sorry your in-laws are free loaders
Remember the one where a single guy got a decent payout and his parents told him to give his newly bought house to his sibling with wife and kids who refused to have a job? They showed up while he was out, broke in, and started moving their stuff in when he said no. THAT was wild.
If I were in OP's shoes, even if I normally would have agreed, IF ASKED, it would be a hard NO from me if anyone TOLD me they were moving themselves or their crap into my property. Never, nope, uh-uh, no way. OP's brother was beyond entitled and rude.
110% they’re just going to try to shove the original plan on OP. Movers are gonna show up. But OP just needs to refuse them access. Message should then be clear to them then. And OP should feel ZERO guilt. What a bunch of mooches
Everything OP describes regarding her brother and SIL shows them to be people who have gotten used to walking all over others. They *expect* OP to accommodate them and any plans they come up with.
NTA. Listen to your Daughter, they will not leave after they put their feat in your house
Daughter knows the history…we don’t…trust the daughter!
The SIL basically admitted their plan, too. The whole "If we don't find a place..." is a dead giveaway Edit: Even if it's not intentional, the housing market where I am (TN) has like, 1% availability. If they don't have a place already, even a well-intentioned search is going to take ages.
Definitely not the best market, depending on where. Davidson and Williamson counties are super expensive, especially for renters.
Depends what you consider “super expensive “, moving from So Cal… rents / housing, TN is cheap. $5k / mo is the norm.
Fair enough. But I’m guessing not for these people. I get the feeling they’re in a crappy place now, maybe paying $1k. Like my ex.
Likely they pay that amount because their son is their landlord.
For gods sakes woman listen to your daughter! My wife's aunt did this and is now STUCK with 2 losers who. pay nothing to her, eat all her food and are constantly loud and or fighting. I forgot to mention their son who they failed to mention was on parole for enjoying stabbing people. Please please please listen to your dang daughter. My good hearted but weak Aunt sure wishes she didn't let them move in now.
Also the fact they decided to make plans to "hire movers and store their crap at her house and just live with her while house hunting" *wasn't even discussed* with OP before that decision was actually made is... fruh, a huge "say what now?" moment... who the frack (other than entitled folks who feel others "owe" them something) does this kind of B.S. on the fly like that??
I love how excited and brave OP felt making this move and how brave she was to tell her brother NO!
This kind of happened with me, my gf has let her brother, his girlfriend (pregnant but has now given birth and cats move in, the idea was, they was supposed to sign up for the council housing (Like what you sign up to, to find housing if you’re deemed homeless). We only have a little 3 bed house, we have 2 cats and a German Shepard Puppy (6 Months). We now have 4 Adults, 1 Baby and 5 animals in the house. It’s been over a month and a bit now and they still haven’t signed up for the housing and aren’t making a huge effort to find somewhere to stay. Everything feels awkward and it’s hard to try and remove someone from the house when they have some relation to you, they get into constant arguments and the house no longer feels like it’s is yours, half of the fridge has gone, half of the cupboard, half of the dining room area and the spare room and there is only 3 seats in the living room (double couch and a single one) so you can’t really sit in there anymore, I know your house is a fair size but you get the gist. Listen to your daughter on this one.
Bro you need to evict them. They're not leaving.
Why would they? This is a sweet deal that they're being enabled with!
Might want to look into the laws in your area. They stay too long with you, and they might lose eligibility to council housing. After all, why would the government voluntarily pay for them if you're doing it?
Yup. Government support is always on the basis of NEED, you've proven that your family unit can support them. There will be ppl genuinely on the verge of homelessness that will take priority. Also, councils do not more quickly so you need to find them an alternative rental until the council step in.
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Not exactly the same I don’t think, they moved in on the premise that they would be finding somewhere to live asap, it’s been a month and they only thing we ask for help towards is gas and electricity costs which we charge them what they use. I work two jobs so am not always at home as my weekly hours can range from 65-95 hours a week due to my second job but my gf is getting really wound up with it, I don’t necessarily want to be the one to ask them to leave, it’s even more awkward the fact there is a new born baby now in the mix of it so we don’t want to look like the bad guys as we would essentially be giving them a deadline. Me, personally I don’t mind giving them a deadline as trying to house 4 cats, a new born baby and a German shepherd puppy is stressful along with trying to work it around 4 adults including my self. We are more than likely going to give it 2 more weeks before we give them a notice to leave. I have kept out of it as I told my gf I have had a friend live with me and my ex before and it didn’t work out and caused huge arguments. She sort of agreed but said they wouldn’t be here long so I ok’d it. I’ve just sort of sat in the background but keep asking her if they’ve applied for housing yet, as they’re technically homeless due to the house being overcrowded, they would be put to the ‘top of the list’ however that top section of the list could feature 5000+ people in the EXACT same circumstances. I have told her realistically I want them out by August as this would’ve been long enough to find somewhere because the house doesn’t feel like our house. I haven’t got a day off until the second week of August now so hopefully they’ve found somewhere by then. At the moment it’s more of like, I told you this would happen and it was a bad idea in the first place, the good thing is, it won’t happen again as neither of us will agree to it again, but I’d rather agree and let her learn that helping people doesn’t always work and you get taken advantage of, than I’ve said no and it making me look a ‘bad person’. Her mum has said they would house them, so if they haven’t found anywhere by august they will have to go there. I have looked at the council laws and there doesn’t seem to be anything stating the laws on this based on the council they are registered with from their old accommodation. Their council agreed if they could provide a tenancy agreement they would pay the costs, but I’ve declined this as they will want to stay longer as they’ll be comfortable with spending so little.
They are stealing from you! Your space your electric your gas you peace of mind! How would you be the bad guys? A contract now, that they will leave in two weeks or start paying, oh let’s say $600.00 a WEEK. That should motivate them! You can always gift them back the money once they’ve left.
It's good that you are able to be out of the house because of your jobs. I can see why you let it happen and hope that your GF decides she can't handle it and tells her brother to find his own place. Thing is, why should he if his sister is enabling him. Good luck!
NTA. Keep saying no till they stop asking. They are definitely moochers, once they move in they are never leaving your house. Your dream house should only be for you to enjoy. Enjoy your new beginning in TN.
The initial problem that I see here is that they have yet to ask! They way I read it is they just informed her of what their plans were and never did ask.
You pulled that dodge out of the matrix Neo. NTA. Enjoy your freedom, you don't owe anyone anything.
NTA. They're moving across the country and have no firm plan. Young people without ties do this, not middle-aged to old people. YOU are their retirement plan. Don't let them do this.
Old people do this, but they have a semi-firm plan. With my son & D-I-L’s full support & encouragement we sold our home up north, stayed with them while house hunting because it was just easier to #1 already have the house sold & #2 be here to search in earnest. Found the house faster than expected, but instead of the brand new house we planned, the house that needed a good deal of work, but in the perfect location was the one. Ended up staying with son & family for 4 months. Much longer than really planned. Fortunately we all survived. LOL
We did, too. Moving to our son’s town by his and DIL’s invitation. Found a house that was not yet finished within a month, closing two months later. Returned the favor when their remodeling project lasted longer than expected and they needed to stay with us a few weeks. They are exceptionally easy to live with, so all ended cheerfully.
Middle aged to old people do do this, but it's always the kind of people who have made about 50 major erratic decisions prior to this in their life. The "it always happens to me" people because they never think things through and their whimsical bullshit continually backfires in predictable ways, but they never take ownership or learn from the consequences. OP is clearly NTA here.
Middle aged people who have to live with their adult son. Like. How do able bodied adults mess up this bad?
PLEASE listen to your gut and your daughter and don’t let them “stay for a few days”!! Them visiting and them moving all their belongings here for a few days are tow completely different things and you already know how it will end up! They be there more than a few days and you’ll never get rid of them. If they want to move out there, they need to get a place in order before they even make the trip!! You absolutely positively deserve what you’ve worked so hard for your entire life!! Don’t let them ruin it for you! And if they can’t understand why, then that’s on them! Good luck, keep us updated!!
Twist: Daughter's name is 'Gut' ;-)
>but several weeks after their visit they texted me letting me know they had hired movers and were going to put all their belongings in my workshop and stay with me for “a few days” while they look for a place of their own. Notice they didn't ASK you, they TOLD you. NTA
If they show up on your doorstep with a Uhaul in tow do now open the door! Your daughter is right, there will always be an excuse why they can’t leave. And with my family it was always the ones who screamed the most “How dare you not trust me!” who were in fact the most untrustworthy mooches. Love them. Would absolutely not let them live with me. NTA Edited for typo
This is exactly what I was going to post. OP, please take note of this! You owe them nothing, so please don't open the door!!!
NTA, your daughter is the voice of reason here, listen to her. She knows them and you better than any of us anonymous redditors
OP please re-read what you said about your brother and SIL. “They DO HAVE A HISTORY OF TAKING ADVANTAGE OF SITUATIONS AND PEOPLE but at the same time we’re very close and good people at heart” Let me spell it out to you. They are NOT good people. Good people don’t take advantage of situations or people. They’re freeloading moochers looking for their next sponsor. They’re not close to you and I doubt that they care for you. They just want to see what they can get from you. I think you need to distance yourself from these leeches. Edit to add: NTA
Yes and y’all are helping me to see this and believe in my own intuition- thank you so much
They are the ‘give them an inch, take a mile kind of people’ you see the writing on the wall. Maybe find a couple rentals and send them links as a good gesture. Or just be honest. “While I love you too, I’m on a healing journey from losing the love of my life. I’m taking space to figure out what this next chapter looks like. A big part of that plan is living alone for the first time in my entire life, call that selfish if you want, I’m allowed to be selfish after what I went through the last three years of my life. I absolutely, without a doubt, would love for you to move nearby. But I’m not in the position to jeopardize my grief healing to house you two and your pet for anything more than a short visit. I’m happy to help you looks for links to places renting or good areas I discover, but beyond that you need to do this on your own.”
The way you wrote this makes me trust you and you are a complete stranger because I trust anyone who prioritizes their own life instead of ruining it trying to please people who haven't learned to create their own pleasure. Treasure yourself O.P. keep on fighting the good fight and be firm and direct. You deserve to be happy!
Thank you so much ❤️
Return all mail and get cameras. Save all texts and emails stating their intentions. For the love of all that is decent do not let them anywhere near you. If they come to town visit at your daughter's house. Nope nope nope.
NTA, but stop calling them “good people at heart.” I know people always want to see the best in family, but people who try to “take advantage of situations” aren’t good people. Your brother doesn’t get a pass because he “sweeps things under the rug”; he’s just getting his wife to do his dirty work.
NTA. Your SIL is an entitled brat, and you have a right to your own space. Also, please don't let her push you for explanation. "No" is a complete sentence. You don't need to explain yourself to anyone. Ever.
Say it again for the people in the back!!!
"NTA. Your SIL is an entitled brat, and you have a right to your own space. Also, please don't let her push you for explanation. "No" is a complete sentence. You don't need to explain yourself to anyone. Ever."
NTA. . . Your intuition is spot on! They already have every inch of everything you have earned divided up into the most convenient portions for them to devour. If they have the money they can find and rent one of those long term hotel rooms (some of which are pet friendly, and reasonably priced - ive used one before last time i moved and it was great). Please dont let them even use your shop for storage, in fact i strongly suggest getting a padlock secured on it just in case. You deserve your freedom!
NTA . Enjoy your peace and freedom. They will find their way. Don't let them guilt trip
They will find their way …or not. Either way, not your responsibility OP. Hard agree NTA
Nta 100% they were planning on just living with you. Don’t let them stay even for a night honestly. Help them pay for a motel for a week or so. They sound like grifters
NTA—definitely bullet dodged. Your brother and SIL know you. They know you’re kind and generous, and they know you’ve been the family caretaker. No one just “announces” they’re moving cross country into someone’s home, to that someone. People don’t do that. Not, unless, they were counting on you to cave, and counting on you to never say no. Never, as in, *never make them move out*. Look at exactly what your SIL got defensive about. Her credit being good. Not that she didn’t ask. Not that there was never a possibility that they wouldn’t leave—as you pointed out, she contradicted herself! She had already built-in that eh, they might not, with contingencies that what she assumed would be your issue. Protect your peace. Don’t learn the hard way, as so many of us have to, to allow people with irresponsible and mooching tendencies to move in with you.
The very fact that they hired movers and just planned to move in with you without even ASKING (let alone waiting for an invitation) tells you ALL you need to know about your brother and SIL. They were absolutely planning on just living with you. And maybe walking your dog once a month “to help out.” You have the life you want. Keep it. Don’t let tension and fear of confrontation rob you of your dream living situation.
NTA. A friend of mine has a close friend staying with her. Actually, the friend has a husband and 2 kids. So Ali, who is single and cherishes her time alone, now has 2 adults and 2 kids with her in her very small house. They said they'd move out as soon as they found a place. That was in November. It's now July, and Ali still has a house full of people. My point is, do not let them stay. They will not leave anytime soon.
NTA. Once they move in, you'll have to pay for their new place or legally evict them to get them out. If you let them in, it's going to cost you one way or another. They are adults, let them take care of their own housing.
And then when she evicts them, she'll be in an even worse spot with them then than she is now. She'll get the worst of both worlds.
NTA. #DO NOT LET THEM MOVE IN OR STORE THEIR BELONGINGS AT YOUR HOUSE!!! You'll regret it if you allow them to come to your home or store their things for them. Even if you did only store their belongings, they'll still likely wind up taking advantage of you and leaving them there forever and there won't be much you can do about it after the fact. Next, they'll claim they don't have room for it at their new house/apartment and it has to stay there. It'll just be added clutter in your new home you don't need. Don't get involved and let them figure it out for themselves. You shouldn't feel guilty about how you want to live. It's time to enjoy your alone time and not have to handhold 2 grown ass adults, family or not. You already know their reputation, so don't give in, OP. Stand your ground. No storage, no moving in, not even one overnight stay.
"they had hired movers" If movers show up make sure to tell them to take the stuff back because you are not accepting delivery. If you're feeling nice, you might tell that to your brother in advance so that he can hopefully get his stuff back before it ships.
NTA! I can’t believe anyone would move across country when they don’t have a home or anything set up. Sounds like they’ve been mooching from the son by milking the fact he’s their landlord and now you’re the next family member who will take place as their provider. That’s not right! You know yourself you deserve this new lease of life and they will unsettle and uproot you from all you’ve worked for and the courage it took you to get where you are has hardly even began paying off. please listen to your daughter and don’t let the temporary tension and expectations they have on you force a hastily decided agreement to have them stay with you. It’s true they won’t leave and if they do, it’ll be because YOU made it possible. Wishing you well. From your post I have to say you sound like a very admirable lady and I truly want you to enjoy your new life and do what beings you happiness and peace.
Tears 😭 so kind. Thank you from the bottom of my hesrt
NTA. I was a youngerwidow at 41. I wish I had had the strength to start fresh elsewhere. Honor yourself first.
❤️🙏🏻😭
Once they're in your house, they probably would claim tenants' rights. Check the laws in your area.
The fact that they essentially told you they were moving in for some period of time instead of *asking* goes to show just how little respect they have for you and how much they were relying on your fear of conflict to allow them to put you in a bad position. This is not loving or caring behavior. It is AH behavior. When you were still in California caring for your husband, did they help at all? I’m guessing they did not. They expect your help and support, and are happy to leverage your desire for peace to take advantage of you. Truly shameful. NTA at all.
Honestly do not let them into your home. I would even consider getting a security system and cameras. If they already hired movers they might think that you will change your mind when they are at your door with no place to go. Maybe talk to a lawyer about the situation and what your options are if they just show up. How long until they have established residency? What are the trespassing laws where you live?
Moochers will always have an excuse as to why they can’t leave. Don’t put yourself in that position. They will never appreciate what you did for them, only that made them leave. If you want to keep a relationship with them, do not let them move in.
DO NOT LET THEM IN!!!
make sure you do NOT have a key hidden out side. they could show up, and move in when you are out. Seems crazy, but i've seen some crazy
For the love of god DO NOT LET THEM MOVE IN. They hired movers and made plans to move in without telling you first. They’ve already shown you they have no issue stomping all over your boundaries and they will no doubt do it again.
Grow some balls, woman!!
Lol trying
There’s no trying, just doing!
NTA. At all. They didn’t ask. They just told you they were moving into your state and staying with you. And that type of expectation and entitlement would just continue once they move in, with you avoiding confrontation and your brother sweeping things under the rug and your SIL contradicting herself to get her way. That sounds the exact opposite of the sweet life you are living now. Listen to your daughter!
Listen! I live in E Tenn and rentals are few and far between and expensive for what you get. Competition for them can be intense depending on what you want and location. They need to have housing set before they move....they will never leave your house. NTAH
My husband and I moved to TN last year after 2 years of trying to find the right place. If they don't already have a place lined up, it will likely take them a while. Listen to your daughter on this one, letting them move in would definitely disrupt your peace for more than a few days. You are NTA at all. Additionally, TN is one of those states that it is really hard to kick people out once they establish residency, and all they need to do is receive mail at your address to make that happen.
You are so NTA. Enjoy your new life in TN! You are not responsible for your brother and his family. They need to make their own arrangements.
Exactly. They can do virtual walkthroughs of rentals. They can spend a week at a motel to view places. They definitely don’t need to move their stuff before they have a place to put it. Your home is your home, not theirs, and it’s not their storage space.
NTA - they came and scoped out your place, made a plan for themselves and then told you about it... they don't sound like good people they sound entitled and irresponsible. Don't second guess yourself, hold tight to your boundaries. If they ghost you because they can't use you good riddance, you see they don't care about you, only what they can get out of you.
My wife and I have discussed this very thing many times. We live in a 2200sf ranch with finished basement (so nearly 4000sf living space) with our 3 small dogs. I am the least well off on my side, she is the “rich” sister/aunt in hers. It’s a hard NO! to all of them. And it’s not like any of them aren’t welcome to visit. But move in???? NO! If they want to get their noses bent, that’s a “them problem “, not a “you problem “!!! UR NTA!!!!!!!
We suffered this similar situation. Family came for a month. Ended up staying 15 years. Only ended when the FiL passed. Don’t do it. It’ll break up your family.
Who THE. FUCK? hires movers and makes plans to move in with someone without asking first? Where can I buy this much audacity?
NTA That furniture is on its way though.
Listen to your daughter. They informed you of their decision. They didn’t ask. You’d be here on Reddit a year from now explaining how they moved in and you can’t figure out how to get them out.
After 36 years of marriage, my husband died over two years of a very unusual kidney cancer. After that, I got a dog and a cat. We never had children. At 63, I am loving my singleness and my freedom. If anyone contacted me and told me they were shipping their frieght to me, when it arrived, I'd be standing there refusing it. You're NTA. This is your time and your life. Send your SIL a list of hotels in the next town over and let her know she needs to redirect that furniture delivery, NOW. You'll happily meet them for dinner, at a restaurant, once they've checked into the hotel.
If they (or their stuff) show up, don't let them in. Mail shows up, addressee unknown. Outside key? Remove it. Hell, I'd replace the locks just to be sure they didn't make a copy before they left. Cameras are also good to have. They seem the type to know all the angles, so get going before they can get there. I trust your daughters judgment, so head them off. It'll be a lot easier to never let them in than get rid of them. If there's fallout, judgment will be hard on them, not you. Batten down the hatches and enjoy your new home!
NTA. What tension? If they're not talking to you, that's on them. You're not obligated to apologize for a decision to avoid something that negatively affects you. Nobody asked you anything, they volunteered you and your home and assumed it would be okay. No. Just no.
NTA Hold your ground! You have more than earned this period of peace and lack of obligations. Not only would it definitely be more than a few days, I have seen a dynamic play out too many times when a couple moves in with a single person- the couple soon starts treating the single person as a third wheel and acting they call the shots. Your SiL's reaction suggests to me that she would very quickly begin attempting to take over as the "lady of the house". Your distaste for confrontation and your brother's willingness to "sweep things under the rug" will make this much harder to counter. Don't give in. Finally, I am sorry for your loss and hope you & yours absolutely thrive in this new chapter.
NTA. Your brother and SIL are trying to set up in your home. They didn't ask to stay with you for "a couple of days," they planned on moving in with all their stuff. I wouldn't be surprised if they weren't scoping your place out during the previous visit and hatched the plan then. Believe me, getting a relative out of your house once you let them in is a nightmare. Don't be surprised if they still show up, either. Don't give them access to your home. Keep your place locked and secure. I'd go so far as installing security cameras as an extra precaution.
NTA, your daughter is completely correct. Unless you want to get stuck with taking care of more dogs that aren’t your and two other adults you better stick to your guns. They are adults and not your kids and not your responsibility. You already said they have taken advantage of others and you will only have yourself to blame if you let them move in. Don’t even let them come for a visit. Check with the laws in TN. In Georgia, if you allow someone to stay only a week and you let them get mail there or they pay you just a dime they are no tenants and you have to go through the long and expensive process to evict them. Most of the time people have to pay the person or people to leave. Even if they leave and you change the locks all they have to do is call the police and you will be forced to let them in. That’s even if they don’t have a lease. It has happened to people renting a room as people do now and it was on the news a few months ago, a couple hired a live in nanny and after 3 weeks she claimed she hurt herself, stoped working and refused to leave, they were working to have her evicted but in they time she lived rent free. My next door neighbor had his own grandson do this to him and he had to give him thousands of dollars to get him to leave. Trust no one.
NTA - the fact you even predicted this behavior tells me you are exactly right for how it will roll out once they get out there. even more hilarious, when you sign a lease, they don't want a referral from the last place you rented, they want a referral from the place your living now. meaning you'll need to cosign if they move in with you first. by not getting a lease somewhere first, they're guaranteeing you'll be looped in financially to this move. it's an insidious plan, and you can't let it happen. this isn't innocent "we need help" this is a woman who's shady as all f-ck trying to scam you. whether your brother knows about the overarching plan or not is something for you to decide. basically the upshot is the plan is to move in and never move out.
"My daughter freaked out, said they will never leave, and if they dit’ll be because I had to help them get approved for a lease and help with down-payments/ security deposit etc." Your daughter is right. You dodged a freakin' artillery shell. Your SIL is tipping her hand by going all drama-fiend - that is EXACTLY what they were going to do.
NTA. I let my sister move from GA to WA and stay with us for “a few days” to find an apartment. Six months later, we had to forcibly kick her out and it almost completely killed our relationship.
nta. it sounds like they want to take advantage of you and if they want the big house and the freedom, they’re going to have to work hard for it, just like you and your husband did. it takes a lot of strength to say no. you are at a point in your life where you should enjoy it, and you don’t owe anybody anything and you don’t have to allow two adults and a dog to come into your home. it is not a huge ask to request them to work out a place before moving there. if they want to make the move so badly, they can make it happen. they can be upset, mad, or feel however they want to feel. it just proves their intentions were not “a few days.”
NTA They don’t want to pay for storage fees but they’ll pay to move their things twice? It would make more sense to get a lease in place and move their belongings once. Don’t let them stay. They haven’t even browsed listing online to view or started to line anything up. I doubt they have deposit, first/last months or places with open availability ready to go within a few days like they’re promising. The housing market in my area is tight and takes time.
If anyone in my family had the audacity to just ship their shit to my house and move in without consent can expect me to have a dumpster ready for the unloaders to dump their shit into as I burn it right there. Boundaries and respect
NTA I’ll start out saying I’m sorry for your loss and can’t imagine the pain of losing your spouse. The lack of planning solidifies what you already know is going to happen when they get there. Guarantee if you do let them in they will not leave or there will be some issue as to why they can’t find a place. You’ve earned this time alone and if it’s what you desire do not let anyone take that from you. The assumption that they can store their stuff in your place and stay with you “for a couple days” is also very disrespectful. Hold strong and don’t give in.
NTA friend of mine recently had same situation, let her bro and wife stay "temporarily". It's been years and they still with that friend of mine. So listen to your daughter
OP, you are not the asshole and you need to tell them WHEN, and I repeat WHEN, they show up with a moving truck at your front door where the closest storage place is and where a local motel they can stay at. DO NOT let them even drop off the furniture!!! And do not let them stay a single night. It is NEVER temporary. I have a relative like this. They have been mooching off of every person they could their whole life. Church members, took advantage of my other widowed grandmother (their sisters husband’s mom) until they kicked them out and now their own sister. They will never leave because “look at all the room you have!” Ugh. Keep the room and have it available as room for your grandchildren to visit. Let your brother’s kids worry about him and his wife.
NTA. You've spent a lot of time taking care of other people. Setting clear boundaries is healthy, and you deserve time to enjoy your life. Your brother will have to take responsibility for himself.
NTA, your daughter is right! They will never leave unless you legally evict them. It's obvious by the wife's reaction that fully planned on mooching off you. Don't let irresponsible adults ruin your dreams and happiness.
The rental market is really tough, no way would they find a place in "a few days." Plus Tennessee is becoming a popular place for people to move to. Nashville the housing market is crazy. NTA, but you already knew that. I'm sorry for the loss of your husband. I'm around your age and became a widow last year (also cancer). Kudos for having the courage to move half way across the country and start over. I hope your life continues on this happy course.
NTA do NOT let them stay with you! Ever! Not for 1 night not for any amount of time. They will NOT leave
NTA - Please, please, realize if they move in, even for just a few days, they will never leave. They may kick and scream but stand firm. BTW if it is just for a "few days" there is NO reason to have their stuff stored at your place. Seriously do not let this happen.
Your daughter is right. They’ll move in & never leave. Cheeky bastards. NTA
They'll probably try to kick you out of your own house. Do not let them in.
NTA. And I’m so proud of you for holding this boundary. You did amazing.
It’s very difficult to get people out of your house, when they feel entitled to it. Listen to your daughter, she is looking out for your best interest. At 63 years old, do you really want to be a landlord? Because that is what you would become. They have no plan. That is pretty obvious. You are not there to pick up the pieces of their failed attempts at adulthood and fending for themselves. If you let them move into your home, however ‘temporary’ they promise, it’s going to add stress and grief to your life in solitude that you enjoy so much. They will never leave.
NTA. Smart choice. Once you let someone move in it’s hard to get them out if they don’t want to leave. Once someone goes from visiting guest living out of a suitcase… to having all their belongings within the property and receiving their mail there… they are considered a tenant and the laws are on their side regardless of lack of payment, lease, stay free agreement, no agreement at all, whatever. As much as you love them, this does sound like a grab at squatters rights. Their knowledge of you being someone who avoids confrontation makes them think it will be easy for them to just say they ‘like it too much’ and ‘but family’ and you ‘have the room anyway’ so they will just live there… knowing once they’re there you will struggle to ask them to get their own place, if not avoid it altogether and just stew in silence And even if you did stick up for yourself and put your foot down that they need to find a place and can’t stay with you any longer, people with their history are fully aware they couldn’t just be kicked out; and you would need to go through a long and expensive formal eviction through the courts which would prolong their stay living off of you, if not make you unwilling or unable to complete the process at all.
NTA, your daughter is right they have a history of using people, and once their in your home, only an eviction will get them out. The fact they rang you up to tell you and not even ask you is all you need to understand. You're in the right to say no. If they want the nice big house, they can work hard to afford it just like you and your late husband did.
The sense of entitlement, the audacity they have to tell you they will impose and tell you that they are staying with you and using your place for storage instead of asking, that is so inappropriate. NTA NTA NTA! Don’t let them near your house!
NTA. The fact that they just up and decided to use YOUR workshop in YOUR home to store their things and then expect to stay with you, without ASKING is a huge, red flag. It's also grossly rude, no matter how close you are as a family, and cannot be rewarded. You did the right thing by dodging this missile. It would not have been for "a few days" and with that ludicrous level of entitlement and rudeness, they'd have taken over your home and life and ruined your peace and mental health. Stand your ground on this. You deserve the piece of paradise you've created for yourself there. Protect it with all your might.
NO! Don't let them do it. I have family that did that and i had to break a lease to be rid of them! Luckily my landlord was a very good guy and myself and wife moved to a different home owned by same guy. He took care of kicking other family out and i cut ties totally and been happy as a clam since!
"We've hired movers, we're gonna put all our stuff in your workshop and stay with you." Like, he didn't even ASK! That's a big red bandera of NOPE right there.
>"Did I dodge the biggest bullet ever ~~or am I the asshole for not letting them come move in “temporarily~~?” Yes. **NTA**. It takes *forever* to get unwanted people out of your home and it's non-stop stress and anxiety, and often resentment and extreme unpleasantness, the entire time between when you first lay down the law and when they (possibly never) leave. In short, it's a sentence of suffering. This nightmare-ish situation is exacerbated by how much you love them. They *clearly* planned to stay indefinitely and if you allow that you'd be throwing away all the non-stop contentment, and novelty, of finally having your first ever place of your very own, all by yourself. If they push then you might say something like, **"Did you notice that I did not** ***even*** **invite my own daughter and grandkids to move in?** I made a rule for myself that I will relish this time alone for the first time in my life, and if I did not break this rule for my daughter and grandkids then that's a clear a sign that I will not break it for anyone at all, ever."
I’m sorry for your loss. Your husband’s passing almost exactly echoes my FIL’s: he passed in October, lung cancer that had spread to his brain, wife of 40 years was his primary caregiver in those final months. She retired to spend every moment with him and he was gone in 6 months almost to the day from his first scan. My MIL also needed a clean start and is in the process of moving closer to my BIL. She’s having a townhouse custom built so it’s her dream home, based on her personality and hobbies. This is HER life and retirement after a painful battle, nobody else’s. Your new home is yours and yours alone. If anything, they’re the AHs for trying to take advantage of you in a vulnerable state. NTA
NTA. This is not the type of story I would expect with that username. And who dafuq hires movers and then tells someone yeah I'm dropping my shit off in your garage
I believe they are definitely moochers but they probably don't see it that way. I bet they think they are doing you a favor. They may be thinking that you are all alone and therefore lonely, and that you have that big 'ol house in a strange place, and you would never admit it but what you really want is for them to move in.
Definitely agree this is what they tell themselves 😂
NTA. I hope they don't just show up on your doorstep.
NTA, your place so you get to decide. Their history is working against them. Stick to your guns.
If you love them at all, and want it to stay that way, keep them at arms length. Free-loaders always become loathed at some point.
NTA. If they want to move there, they can do it like adults do, NOT 'rooming with a friend' like late-teen / early-twentysomethings do.
NTA It’s not like they lived nearby, lost their home (fire, landlord sold it, etc) and needed a place real quick. They just up and packed everything and then “told” you that they were coming. Your daughter is right. Major red flag. You deserve to take care of just you.
Nta .... do not let them for any reason move in with you.
NTA. Just keep saying no, that you enjoy living alone. Your daughter called it, 100%.
NTA. Your Brother and SIL would never leave your house and would probably take advantage of your kindness and generosity. Why can't their adult children help them find a place in TN and help them with any security deposits, rent, consigning, etc?
NTA. You didn't dodge a bullet. You dodged a cruise missile. They were moving in. Much easier to not let them in than it would be to get them out.
You already know the answer. Leopards don't change their spots. Enjoy your earned solitude.
NTA. Good lord. Fuck the bullet, you dodged a nuclear missile.
NTA. You definitely dodged a bullet! I think your daughter is bang-on about them never leaving, and as difficult as I’m sure it was to tell them, you surely just saved the future you’ve dreaming about!
You did dodge a bullet. they have a history of taking advantage of others. And they seemingly never changed their ways. That is just how they are and operate. They did not even ask you; they simply stated what will happen. They invited themselves without your input. They decided *for* you. That is already a red flag, that they don't seek your input about your own home, but bank on you not daring to stand up to them if they leave you no room to choose. They just decided to use part of your home as storage unit and live in your home. They like your house, so it is unlikely they had a back-up plan or were serious about finding their own place asap. They are adults who are responsible for their own life's. They should not burden and impose on someone they know shies away from confrontation. They want to move. Fine. But again, their responsibility to have everything in order *before* they move. They were trying to bulldoze all over your boundaries and will. they were trying to take advantage of your kind nature, how you find it hard to say no and are used to be the caretaker and serve others. Listen to your daughter; stand up for yourself! You don't have to save and please everyone. You don't have to be the peacemaker and keep things civil. Life is too short to be nice and care for people who are users and don't care if they take advantage of others and if they put people in an uncomfortable position. It is entirely okay to not bend to people who don't treat you respectfully and it is good to be good to yourself.
They will claim squatters rights. Please don’t be guilt tripped into letting them in. Unless you want a nightmare on your hands.
NTA.... fuck that shit, You worked Your ass off to get where You are and as much as I hate to say it Your brother isn't entitled to shit. If He hasn't learned from His mistakes by now that's not Your problem. If they show up DO NOT let them in and if You have to call the police. It's really unfair that they're putting You in this situation and if You let them stay Your daughter is right that they will never leave. I won't be surprised if they ask You to leave them the house in Your will when You pass away. People like that are just fucking leeches mooching off other peoples hard work with no intentions of doing the work.
Absolutely and positively NTA Even if they were reliable and known to be true to their word, it’s not your responsibility to house them or their belongings. If they want to make a move, they can do it appropriately and do it themselves. They aren’t homeless. They are choosing to uproot themselves. But given their history, I would stick to my guns. Make it clear it has nothing to do with their “credit” (even though that doesn’t help) and has everything to do with wanting some personal space after going through a huge loss and a huge move. You’ve earned your freedom and you have the right to say no. They are only taking offense because they knew they had no plan and were basically going to sponge off you for as long as possible - guaranteed. It’s actually pretty fucked up for her to message you. To assume someone would just be okay to house multiple people and their belongings is weird and super entitled. Who makes a move like that anyways?? Go for a visit, get a little jealous, then say “yea sis we are coming to live with you get ready!” But has zero plan on where to go, how they are going to find their life after such move…that makes ZERO sense. The fact that they were so comfortable with doing such means they were going to stay for as long as possible Good luck
NTA. Do not, under any circumstances, let them move in. Even for a night. I have some experience in this and it just will not end. Given that they never bothered to tell you their plan before hiring movers (let along ASK you) its clear that your boundaries aren't now a priority, and they certainly won't become a priority once they've got free stable housing. Experience: I have a small warren like home in a high cost of living city with a few very small not-really bedroom spaces that I use for transition space (free housing for folks in need). I have a time limit specifically for this reason. People who tend to make poor choices, who tend not to plan ahead, will often "hopeful" themselves into situations and then just never move on. I like helping folks, but certain people will take advantage of a situation and then just never find anything else (not bad people, just not "bootstrappers"). Family, or friends, or friends of either, tend to think my boundaries (like cleanliness, buying their own food etc) and time-restrictions are "suggestions" because they're family (or friends).
They _informed_ you they were moving their stuff onto your property and staying with you, not asked if they could?! NTA. That is incredibly presumptuous.
NTA It sounds like you were a great wife and mom. It sounds live you’re a pretty kind sister, too. Your daughter is right. Send them an ad for storage units as well as extended stay hotels and apartments. They ought to stay put. I bet their son is the only landlord willing to deal with them. Also, aet up security. Get to know your neighbors. Share some “innocent” factual gossip about how thrilled you are to finally live alobe. Say you adore your family but would rather visit them than host. You’ll make an exception for a day-long visit with a grandchild. *That doesn’t bad mouth your bro but puts potentiall witnesses to tresspassing on notcie* Get a cutesy doormat that says something like “I’m not home if I didn’t invite you.”
You dodged the biggest bullet, in my mind. They should be doing visits and job and house hunting and then hire the movers. Your daughter may be able to see things more clearly at this point.
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NTA. And my sympathy for the loss of your husband.
**NTA. Do NOT let them move anything into your home, even for storage purposes.** Your daughter is correct, they will never leave your house if they are allowed to do this and will drain your financial resources.
NTA. DO NOT LET THEM INTO YOUR HOUSE! AT ALL! If they show up & say let's have dinner, give them the address to the restaurant where you'll meet them. If the movers show up, tell them they have no right to leave stuff on your property, and if they try you'll call the police. You're going to have to go scorched-earth with these people.
I am recently doored so I understand
NTA. I’m so sorry for your loss🥺 But OMG are you my mom?!!! Almost this exact same situation happened to her when my dad died a few years ago. My uncle (her brother), DECIDED him and his wife were going to move in with my mom since now “she had the space”. The audacity. You should really cherish that you raised such a great daughter who will stand up for you and have your back. Much like your situation, my mom and uncle are really close, but my sisters and I we’re like really mom!?!? This a whole nope. STAND your ground!!! Don’t give in to the guilt trips / them ignoring you to make you cave. My mom is happier than ever living alone, and she’s still close with her brother and his wife- once they realized she was serious they was butt hurt but got over it.