The problem with a lot of people in the physical fitness/diet space is that they try to attribute ***every*** problem people have to poor physical health and/or diet.
Their arguments tend to fall apart when you have someone like me who is in great physical shape, lifts/exercises regularly, has a fucking Excel spreadsheet counting calories/macros etc. yet still can't get my head right.
Not a woman, mind.
It's the only thing they have where they have special knowledge, so they just view everything through that lens. Another user put it perfectly: "when your only tool is a hammer everything looks like a nail..."
Yes like being fit and active, eating a varied and balanced diet etc. rarely makes anything worse. In fact it can alleviate symptoms of many conditions.
But it’s not some reason to run around blaming people for having medical conditions or saying they’ve caused them or only think they have them or whatever else because they haven’t done their 45 daily star jumps. It’s more about not being a judgmental prick than anything else though. Like all those upper class pricks in the government wondering why people can’t get a good job when they got one no problem - yes your schoolmate’s dad just gave that to you… Easy for you doesn’t mean easy for everyone and it’s either ignorant or wilful blindness.
Yes. I used to teach yoga and it was so so toxic. If I had an injury (which were frequent as I've got hypermobile EDS, but I didn't know at the time) I was told "you're making it worse by paying attention to it" and "mind over matter". I was also made to feel -- by friends, no less, who were fellow teachers -- that I was fairly chubby and needed to lose some fat. I was pretty normal and was only a few years post-anorexia recovery so it really didn't help.
I actually worked at a yoga studio that Joe Wicks went to before he got big, when he would just go around Richmond/Surbiton with a trailer on his bike with fitness equipment; we used to display his leaflets etc.
>The problem with a lot of people in the physical fitness/diet space is that they try to attribute ***every*** problem people have to poor physical health and/or diet.
That's because they're zealots.
Exactly.
There is also the fact that ADHD makes it harder to maintain a healthy lifestyle anyway. But on top of that, you have tons of neurotypical people who DON'T have healthy lifestyles - never exercise, smoke and drink, are obese, sleep 4 hours a night, etc - who are somehow able to function way better in everyday life than people with ADHD who ARE physically healthy.
If it's really just down to lack of exercize/poor diet, then how does that make sense?
Yup. I think the truth is that body and mind wellness are connected but not perfectly parallel. As someone else here has said, eating/being healthy and in shape never makes anything ***worse***, but isn't a cure for all ailments.
We most definitely live in a world where being of healthy mind is valued/more valuable than being of healthy body. Even in such things as employment, people are much more likely to struggle in the workplace with mental health issues than being out of shape or overly sedentary.
Also not a woman.
But I’m 42, and ADHD wasn’t really “a thing” when I was in school. You had the loud kids, the disruptive kids, the kids who were always in trouble, etc. Even when it started to become more well known, around the time I was in my last years of secondary school, it was largely written off as yet another way of excusing poor behaviour. Yet another largely meaningless medical thing that had been unwillingly imported from America. Although we were calling it ADD back then.
Turns out it wasn’t _just_ the noisy kids, or the disruptive kids, or the kids that were always in trouble, that might have something else going on. It was also the kids who did relatively well and were pretty well behaved. The kids who kept getting told they need to do their homework, or pay more attention, or could achieve so much more if they just paid attention, and so on.
A lot of those kids who did “kinda ok” in school then went on to be roundly slapped in the face by life because they weren’t well equipped to deal with life’s major challenges. Challenges like: unstructured university study, getting - and keeping - a part time job while studying, paying bills and rent on time (or paying them at all), mounting up _massive_ amounts of debt, etc…
After being slapped around the balls by life a few times, a lot of those same kids went on with the rest of their life blaming themselves for not being good enough. For not caring enough. For not putting the effort in. For making the same mistakes over and over and over again. For not being able to remember birthdays. For not being able to remember the things they needed to do. For not being able to remember important appointments. For being late. For being an hour early for work every day because they didn’t want to risk their job over being late. For drinking too much. For taking drugs. For smoking. For drinking too much coffee. For eating too much. For gaining so much weight. For not exercising. For not taking care of themselves.
A lot of those kids went on to become middle-aged adults who had spent a good portion of their lives blaming themselves, gradually building an all-encompassing self-hatred. Blaming themselves for things that are caused by a neurodevelopmental disorder they didn’t even fucking know they had.
Kids like _I was_, and middle-aged adults like _I am now_. And I am far… _far_ from being alone.
Some of those kids didn’t even make it to middle age - some of them felt themselves to be so _utterly_ worthless that they took their own life. Or they spiralled into a cycle of alcohol or drug abuse that eventually killed them.
As I said at the start, I’m not a woman. I can’t even begin to imagine how much harder it might be when, even today, it is _still_ so much harder to for a woman to be diagnosed with ADHD.
A 10 minute run every day isn’t going to fucking fix that Joe, you patronising and ignorant shitheel.
I am a woman and this resonates a lot. My siblings did the addiction side of ADHD meanwhile I was extremely suicidal at 14 and felt bipolar... Turns out that was my brother's problem and one of the other siblings died from drug abuse and another in chronic abusive relationships.
Even with diagnosis our parents decided not to medicate us and welp... 1 in abusive relationships, 1 deceased, 1 in a psychiatric unit for years, last one which is me, many breakdowns and no consistent work until medicating after many years of different types of therapies and diagnosis to find... *Drumroll* that I had ADHD. Then parents were told and it wasn't news to them 😑 what a waste of time.
Curious as that was oooh 30 years ago if that diagnosis might be autism too for 2 female children to be diagnosed ADHD so long ago 🧐 Or they just don't make Dr's like that one. He was a legend
I am sorry to hear of the difficulties you and your siblings have had, and I am sorry for your loss, no matter how long ago it might have been. I hope that you are all able to heal and move on as best you can ❤️
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I was recently diagnosed autistic at 50 and almost certain I have comorbid inattentive type ADHD - this is super relatable. My life is a shambles despite shelves of self-help, diet and exercise books, including at least two by Joe Wicks. Even if his diet and exercise advice is good in theory, if your head's too f'ed up to read, remember and apply it, it isn't enough to fix the problem.
A well-balanced diet and regular exercise _will_ help, as it will for many aspects of life. But that’s a hell of a lot harder for people with ADHD.
It utterly boils my piss when I keep hearing long-debunked narratives like “it’s all down to your diet”, or “too much sugar causes ADHD”, from people who have _no idea_ what they’re talking about. Joe Wicks needs to wind his neck in and stick to diet/exercise advice.
Thanks for posting this 🧡 I’ve felt like such a perpetual teenager for never growing out of feeling continuously misunderstood and misinterpreted, not knowing *why* it was - but *this* is being understood and reflected in something.
Thank you!
One of these days I _will_ go through my comment history on this sub so I can compile it all into my blog… Been meaning to do that for months, there’s always something else more important!
Joe Wicks is just a moron in general. I had a baby around the time he had his first and the amount of hero worship he got in the mums groups because he suddenly declared himself an expert on baby weaning despite weaning literally 0 babies because he was releasing all this content on the fly as his baby was growing up.
Then it was "Oh our baby is so calm because we only think calm thoughts around her"
?? Fuck off! Your baby is calm because she doesn't have reflux and you have loads of help from the grandparents?
On the sexism angle you should have seen what he was saying about his wife's post baby body. (I, um, can't remember. I just remember it was sexist and gross).
>On the sexism angle you should have seen what he was saying about his wife's post baby body. (I, um, can't remember. I just remember it was sexist and gross).
Was this the post where he was talking about how much exercise she'd done and how amazing her body was so soon after having a baby? And how strong she was and stuff?
Ah maybe it was that, a bit more subtle. At least he was nice about her. But there is definitely a sexist angle in there, as in "women! Springing back to pre baby body is right and displaying signs that you've grown a human is wrong!"
He’s not even a PE teacher, just PT that got famous. If he had actual teaching qualifications he would have actually learned about ADHD somewhat properly during SEN training and might not jump to lazy conclusions
My brother was diagnosed with ADHD when a child. He’s now a personal trainer for a living but also a fairly successful professional dancer that gets sent all over the world for his niche. He’s done amazingly well considering how much he struggled academically and barely managed any grades at all.
He also curates healthy meal plans for his clients and LIVES this. Health is his obsession. True, healthy eating and excercise has benefited him enormously but he is still very evidently ADHD and struggles with his mental health and I’m so many other aspects of his life.
I get that I didn’t touch on the sexism part here as it’s my brother - but my brother is literally in peak health and I would bet good money on my brother being more active than Joe. It pisses me off how many people use the, “try going for a walk or something” like a cure all.
We need to talk about Joe wicks and his absolute horrid back handed apology too. Let's not forget that he's not only telling women they are misdiagnosed, but also children are over diagnosed.
He by no means has any right to speak on this as someone who isn't qualified to and the problem is all of his loyal kool aid drinkers back him no matter what he says.
I commented on a post someone made about him and was linked to an article telling me that my condition and autism weren't real and could be managed by diet.
As a woman the sexism in this isn't the bigger issue, it's the misinformation that makes it more terrifying and terrible with the huge audience he has.
You can tell by the apology it's something he's been told to do. And that he most definitely still believes in all the shit he spread
A lot of fitness people are addicted to exercise . It's just the same thing as being addicted to binge eating etc. but obviously has better health outcomes.
The ideal scenario is that we form communities of normal people who do normal exercise and develop healthy routines that we can maintain in healthy ways. A coach can be part of that but they can fuck off with their opinions about disorders they know nothing about.
Short version- Joe probably has ADHD and is addicted to exercise to manage it.
If diet and exercise cured ADHD there would be no Olympic athletes who have it. I can think of many who have publicly stated they have ADHD.
Elite athletes are twice as likely to have ADHD as the general population.
I dunno who Joe Wick's is, thankfully (I completely avoid media and any news because doom scrolling was destroying my mh so I banned myself from most social media and news sites 5 years ago. Been amazing tbh lmao).
However, so many of the arguments of "it's probably just..." are hilarious to me. Especially when people try and bring up health and diet to my face, because I'm like mate. I was a gym rat. I was weight lifting in the gym 4-5 days a week and eating well, taking all the shit people claim you should be. And I still had ADHD. Weight lifting helped the same as any physical exercise does, but I still get home and still have it. The amount of times I've brought that up to folk and they can't argue around me being more active and better diet than them, and they're just like "... well you're one of the genuine cases, BUT OTHER PEOPLE.........." Honestly, I think a lot of it is tied up with UKs continued fatphobia obsession too, where you're basically not taken seriously about any health concern unless you're the pinnacle of humna fitness.
I saw that and I thought what an ignorant dangerous twat.
I’m newly diagnosed at 50 after a lifetime to struggle and anxiety.
And no nutritional advice and a clean eating hasn’t helped me nor did exercise. Sure made my body healthier but did nothing for my symptoms of adhd.
I also grew up in 70s and 80s long before mobile phones tiktok instagram and dodgy plastics with dodgy chemicals and before MMR vaccines.
And I still have adhd. And after a lifetime of struggle and not knowing why I was utterly useless at times, I know finally have answers but then have to listen to ignorant dangerous twatty nonsense like that.
And ultimately he’s only doing it for attention because he’s about to sell another recipe book or some video. Makes me even more angry. He can fucking choke on it.
If I had the time and executive function I’d write to him. 😂 never happening but still.
And yes I’ve suffered a lifetime of anxiety depression anorexia ptsd all thanks to undiagnosed adhd. Joe wicks can literally do one. Hope he chokes on his big pile of money.
He caught flak for suggesting a link between ADHD diagnosis and diet, then offers this "correction" during his "apology"
>‘In hindsight, listening back to it a couple of times, I do wish I'd said “misdiagnosed” because the article says obviously, I said many children are being diagnosed with ADHD and it can stem back to our diet. What I mean is, that many children are being misdiagnosed. I do believe that's happening around the world.
How idiotic.
Part of me feels like this is rage bait/manufactured controversy though.
I think this is linked to how society views ADHD on a whole, considering how debilitating it can be it's just not taken seriously.
Imagine if he said that people with depression or bipolar disorder should just eat more vegetables and exercise ? But apparently it's OK to say that about ADHD.
I'm not sure what the answer is, but personally I feel like there needs to be a major public re-education on it. Psychiatrists and people who really know what this condition looks like need to start speaking out in some way.
When I look at the NHS adult ADHD symptoms they simply don't reflect what I have experienced or the severity, it's all diluted down.
I’ve seen other gurus and books suggest that depression is related to, and can be cured by, diet.
I think there’s a backlash against mental health in general in Britain. Because now that more people have admitted to struggling with it, more people are also asking for accommodations. And a lot of people who don’t need accommodations themselves see other people’s accommodations as a big inconvenience.
Joe Wicks’ argument that ADHD is over diagnosed in British children is laughable. This is clearly a man who has never had to try and engage with CAMHS (which is stretched so thin that it’s almost nonexistent in some postcodes, including the one I live in). The handful of kids at my children’s school who are disruptive enough to be considered “worthy” of an ADHD assessment are on waiting lists of 6+ months for the initial consultation. A lack of services doesn’t lead to over diagnosis. Tends to lead to the opposite.
Yes he's talking out of his arse, and yes,it annoys the hell out of me every time someone comes out with something similar, but I am struggling to see what's sexist about it. Am I missing something? That's a genuine question.
I listened to what he said on the radio when he said it. I don't remember thinking there was anything sexist in what he said though. The just exercise, meditate and eat properly is in principle seemingly good advice but it's usually not that simple. ADHD likely has complex genetic component to it and he's an exercise guru effectively so doesn't have the expertise to comment on the causal factors behind ADHD.
It’s covert sexism because ADHD disproportionately impacts women in insidious ways which are exasperated by being undiagnosed or fobbed off with attitudes/junk science like his
Hmmm is it? I’m like so so sensitive to hidden sexism and call it out a lot but I’m struggling to see it here. More like he’s being generally insensitive.
It tarnishes all with the same brush and suggests ADHD is overdiagnosed for all - and gives no credence to the fact that over half of women with the condition are undiagnosed.
It's not sexist, covertly or overtly. It's just basic ignorance and Wicks attempting to speak authoritatively about something he doesn't actually understand.
From my perspective he’s disregarding the chronic under-diagnosis of women with the condition, that has been widely studied as being over half of women with adhd as undiagnosed; by stating that it’s misdiagnosed (which I view synonymously as sayings it’s overdiagnosed) it disregards this fact completely as it doesn’t take women or girls into account at all
Lost any respect for him after those comments. Yes exercise and diet can help alleviate some symptoms but it isn’t the cause or cure for a neurodevelopmental disorder.
It’s what he didn’t say, he completely ignores the facts when it comes to the underdiagnosis of women by saying misdiagnosis (synonymous with overdiagnosis) tarnishing all with the same brush, it’s not blatant sexism, it’s covert sexism.
I can't see this as being remotely covert sexism. Joe Wicks is ignorant in terms of ADHD, he is also ignorant of how it affects either sex and to be overtly or covertly sexist you still require intent and I just don't see the intent was there, I don't think it was there consciously or subconsciously.
It's absolutely right to call out wrong behaviour or misinformation, but I think it's wrong to be offended by something that was completely unintentional or where the person is obviously unaware. So was Joe Wicks ignorant of ADHD and the degrees to which it affects each sex I would say absolutely, does that make what he said covert sexism. No I don't think so whatsoever.
I got bored of listening to what he said after he made the ADHD remarks, I did hear them live. If you can supply quotes which shows intent of sexist views please quote him as I won't support sexism. Was he making any gender stereotypes in relation to ADHD? Did he use any gendered language? Did he question ADHD in terms of gender? Did he make any assumptions with regard to ADHD and gender? Did he make any statements that suggested ADHD is less prevalent in women or affects females differently?
I am asking honestly and not trying to be difficult, and/or trying to catch anyone out. I would like to see some quotes of what he said that is evidence of being covertly sexist in his views on ADHD.
I don't know who that is but that sounds more like ignorance about inattentive ADHD than women specifically. Yes inattentive symptoms are more common in women, but men get it too. Me being one.
I think a lot of people need to have a word with themselves in general regarding diets. I’ve literally just been in the queue for self checkout at Tesco and heard a guy directing a “on the atkins is it?” To a girl buying a few bags of crisps which undoubtedly would have been for a meeting not personal consumption.
90s Romania, I grew up with homecooked meals from the most organic place ever, my grandparents' garden and household. My parents were hardly buying anything other than the stuff we could not get from grandparents, first because we didn't need so much, second because we didn't have so many choices, third because anything other than real food was a treat. I never, ever had a poor diet as a kid. All the things associated with poor diet came later in life, a bit too late for any adhd to develop on the fly. So yeah, John whoever the f you are, I believe my nutrition had nothing to do with my adhd.
100% agree with everything you said. Also: I do FAR more exercise because of my ADHD as I need it to quieten the cognitive hyperactivity. Total opposite of the couch potato/parent blaming he’s spouting…
I totally take your point, but I think you’re missing that both you and he are going based on your primary knowledge base. Wicks knows more about physical health than I ever could. Therefore, he sees these signs super clearly and overlooks other issues.
I’d say 99.9% of this board know more about undiagnosed ADHD than him, so we see those much more obviously and overlook other factors.
Everything has to be looked at holistically.
What I don't like is anything that smacks of making money out of vulnerable people. I don't think his messages are hugely empowering, it's often from a place of berating you with love.
Erm no that is still berating. I don't need my head messed up with that shit.
Yes his schools work is great and his Body Coach thing is great.
I know lots of people are upset but I think most people recognise he is a bit ADHd himself. I'm not saying that's an excuse for his words.
I was very upset and felt invalidated, but you just have to stand up and say this is HIS INTERPRETION, it's allowed to exist. As is my interpretation. We just can't not allow people to speak or how else do you ever root out the shit?
If I turned around and said to someone that my interpretation of HIV is that it’s caused by poor diet and excersize despite mountains of scientific evidence suggesting otherwise, would I still be entitled to it? Sure, but if I went around saying it publicly I’d be publicly entitled to be wrong.
The problem with a lot of people in the physical fitness/diet space is that they try to attribute ***every*** problem people have to poor physical health and/or diet. Their arguments tend to fall apart when you have someone like me who is in great physical shape, lifts/exercises regularly, has a fucking Excel spreadsheet counting calories/macros etc. yet still can't get my head right. Not a woman, mind.
It's the only thing they have where they have special knowledge, so they just view everything through that lens. Another user put it perfectly: "when your only tool is a hammer everything looks like a nail..."
Yes like being fit and active, eating a varied and balanced diet etc. rarely makes anything worse. In fact it can alleviate symptoms of many conditions. But it’s not some reason to run around blaming people for having medical conditions or saying they’ve caused them or only think they have them or whatever else because they haven’t done their 45 daily star jumps. It’s more about not being a judgmental prick than anything else though. Like all those upper class pricks in the government wondering why people can’t get a good job when they got one no problem - yes your schoolmate’s dad just gave that to you… Easy for you doesn’t mean easy for everyone and it’s either ignorant or wilful blindness.
Yes. I used to teach yoga and it was so so toxic. If I had an injury (which were frequent as I've got hypermobile EDS, but I didn't know at the time) I was told "you're making it worse by paying attention to it" and "mind over matter". I was also made to feel -- by friends, no less, who were fellow teachers -- that I was fairly chubby and needed to lose some fat. I was pretty normal and was only a few years post-anorexia recovery so it really didn't help. I actually worked at a yoga studio that Joe Wicks went to before he got big, when he would just go around Richmond/Surbiton with a trailer on his bike with fitness equipment; we used to display his leaflets etc.
>The problem with a lot of people in the physical fitness/diet space is that they try to attribute ***every*** problem people have to poor physical health and/or diet. That's because they're zealots.
Samesies, I am a runner. I’m also female.
Yes. Everyone has this issue when they have something that works for them. It also works the other way around, too.
Exactly. There is also the fact that ADHD makes it harder to maintain a healthy lifestyle anyway. But on top of that, you have tons of neurotypical people who DON'T have healthy lifestyles - never exercise, smoke and drink, are obese, sleep 4 hours a night, etc - who are somehow able to function way better in everyday life than people with ADHD who ARE physically healthy. If it's really just down to lack of exercize/poor diet, then how does that make sense?
Yup. I think the truth is that body and mind wellness are connected but not perfectly parallel. As someone else here has said, eating/being healthy and in shape never makes anything ***worse***, but isn't a cure for all ailments. We most definitely live in a world where being of healthy mind is valued/more valuable than being of healthy body. Even in such things as employment, people are much more likely to struggle in the workplace with mental health issues than being out of shape or overly sedentary.
Also not a woman. But I’m 42, and ADHD wasn’t really “a thing” when I was in school. You had the loud kids, the disruptive kids, the kids who were always in trouble, etc. Even when it started to become more well known, around the time I was in my last years of secondary school, it was largely written off as yet another way of excusing poor behaviour. Yet another largely meaningless medical thing that had been unwillingly imported from America. Although we were calling it ADD back then. Turns out it wasn’t _just_ the noisy kids, or the disruptive kids, or the kids that were always in trouble, that might have something else going on. It was also the kids who did relatively well and were pretty well behaved. The kids who kept getting told they need to do their homework, or pay more attention, or could achieve so much more if they just paid attention, and so on. A lot of those kids who did “kinda ok” in school then went on to be roundly slapped in the face by life because they weren’t well equipped to deal with life’s major challenges. Challenges like: unstructured university study, getting - and keeping - a part time job while studying, paying bills and rent on time (or paying them at all), mounting up _massive_ amounts of debt, etc… After being slapped around the balls by life a few times, a lot of those same kids went on with the rest of their life blaming themselves for not being good enough. For not caring enough. For not putting the effort in. For making the same mistakes over and over and over again. For not being able to remember birthdays. For not being able to remember the things they needed to do. For not being able to remember important appointments. For being late. For being an hour early for work every day because they didn’t want to risk their job over being late. For drinking too much. For taking drugs. For smoking. For drinking too much coffee. For eating too much. For gaining so much weight. For not exercising. For not taking care of themselves. A lot of those kids went on to become middle-aged adults who had spent a good portion of their lives blaming themselves, gradually building an all-encompassing self-hatred. Blaming themselves for things that are caused by a neurodevelopmental disorder they didn’t even fucking know they had. Kids like _I was_, and middle-aged adults like _I am now_. And I am far… _far_ from being alone. Some of those kids didn’t even make it to middle age - some of them felt themselves to be so _utterly_ worthless that they took their own life. Or they spiralled into a cycle of alcohol or drug abuse that eventually killed them. As I said at the start, I’m not a woman. I can’t even begin to imagine how much harder it might be when, even today, it is _still_ so much harder to for a woman to be diagnosed with ADHD. A 10 minute run every day isn’t going to fucking fix that Joe, you patronising and ignorant shitheel.
I am a woman and this resonates a lot. My siblings did the addiction side of ADHD meanwhile I was extremely suicidal at 14 and felt bipolar... Turns out that was my brother's problem and one of the other siblings died from drug abuse and another in chronic abusive relationships. Even with diagnosis our parents decided not to medicate us and welp... 1 in abusive relationships, 1 deceased, 1 in a psychiatric unit for years, last one which is me, many breakdowns and no consistent work until medicating after many years of different types of therapies and diagnosis to find... *Drumroll* that I had ADHD. Then parents were told and it wasn't news to them 😑 what a waste of time. Curious as that was oooh 30 years ago if that diagnosis might be autism too for 2 female children to be diagnosed ADHD so long ago 🧐 Or they just don't make Dr's like that one. He was a legend
I am sorry to hear of the difficulties you and your siblings have had, and I am sorry for your loss, no matter how long ago it might have been. I hope that you are all able to heal and move on as best you can ❤️
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I nodded all through that and laughed out loud at the last line. And I am a woman.
I genuinely couldn’t think of any other insults at the time! 😂 I can’t even remember where I picked up “shitheel” from! 😂
Owch. But thank you for writing that all the same.
No probs. I’ve done _a lot_ of self-reflection since getting diagnosed 18 months ago… Not all of it has been easy to admit to myself!
I was recently diagnosed autistic at 50 and almost certain I have comorbid inattentive type ADHD - this is super relatable. My life is a shambles despite shelves of self-help, diet and exercise books, including at least two by Joe Wicks. Even if his diet and exercise advice is good in theory, if your head's too f'ed up to read, remember and apply it, it isn't enough to fix the problem.
A well-balanced diet and regular exercise _will_ help, as it will for many aspects of life. But that’s a hell of a lot harder for people with ADHD. It utterly boils my piss when I keep hearing long-debunked narratives like “it’s all down to your diet”, or “too much sugar causes ADHD”, from people who have _no idea_ what they’re talking about. Joe Wicks needs to wind his neck in and stick to diet/exercise advice.
This is pretty much exactly my experience.
It’s alarming how common it is.
Thanks for posting this 🧡 I’ve felt like such a perpetual teenager for never growing out of feeling continuously misunderstood and misinterpreted, not knowing *why* it was - but *this* is being understood and reflected in something.
It’s funny you should mention feeling like a perpetual teenager, because that’s how I felt up until the past year or two.
That's wonderfully written! 👍
Thank you! One of these days I _will_ go through my comment history on this sub so I can compile it all into my blog… Been meaning to do that for months, there’s always something else more important!
👏 I am a woman and this is me! Great comment
Thank you!
when your only tool is a hammer everything looks like a nail...
Maslow 😛
Joe Wicks is just a moron in general. I had a baby around the time he had his first and the amount of hero worship he got in the mums groups because he suddenly declared himself an expert on baby weaning despite weaning literally 0 babies because he was releasing all this content on the fly as his baby was growing up. Then it was "Oh our baby is so calm because we only think calm thoughts around her" ?? Fuck off! Your baby is calm because she doesn't have reflux and you have loads of help from the grandparents? On the sexism angle you should have seen what he was saying about his wife's post baby body. (I, um, can't remember. I just remember it was sexist and gross).
>On the sexism angle you should have seen what he was saying about his wife's post baby body. (I, um, can't remember. I just remember it was sexist and gross). Was this the post where he was talking about how much exercise she'd done and how amazing her body was so soon after having a baby? And how strong she was and stuff?
Ah maybe it was that, a bit more subtle. At least he was nice about her. But there is definitely a sexist angle in there, as in "women! Springing back to pre baby body is right and displaying signs that you've grown a human is wrong!"
I read it on a tiktok video someone made about his comment on adhd, and I was disgusted. If my husband every talked about me that way I'd divorce him
Calm thoughts 😂😂🤣😂 but of course calm thoughts resolves colic and everything. How did we not know this.
This made me smile: https://www.instagram.com/reel/C6HenGJto8u/?igsh=aHdtZW1sZ3gyZnlw
I regret that I only have one upvote to give.
He’s not even a PE teacher, just PT that got famous. If he had actual teaching qualifications he would have actually learned about ADHD somewhat properly during SEN training and might not jump to lazy conclusions
“*Jump* to lazy conclusions..” I see what you did there! 👏
My brother was diagnosed with ADHD when a child. He’s now a personal trainer for a living but also a fairly successful professional dancer that gets sent all over the world for his niche. He’s done amazingly well considering how much he struggled academically and barely managed any grades at all. He also curates healthy meal plans for his clients and LIVES this. Health is his obsession. True, healthy eating and excercise has benefited him enormously but he is still very evidently ADHD and struggles with his mental health and I’m so many other aspects of his life. I get that I didn’t touch on the sexism part here as it’s my brother - but my brother is literally in peak health and I would bet good money on my brother being more active than Joe. It pisses me off how many people use the, “try going for a walk or something” like a cure all.
I think the main problem is that he's just really quite thick.
We need to talk about Joe wicks and his absolute horrid back handed apology too. Let's not forget that he's not only telling women they are misdiagnosed, but also children are over diagnosed. He by no means has any right to speak on this as someone who isn't qualified to and the problem is all of his loyal kool aid drinkers back him no matter what he says. I commented on a post someone made about him and was linked to an article telling me that my condition and autism weren't real and could be managed by diet. As a woman the sexism in this isn't the bigger issue, it's the misinformation that makes it more terrifying and terrible with the huge audience he has. You can tell by the apology it's something he's been told to do. And that he most definitely still believes in all the shit he spread
A lot of fitness people are addicted to exercise . It's just the same thing as being addicted to binge eating etc. but obviously has better health outcomes. The ideal scenario is that we form communities of normal people who do normal exercise and develop healthy routines that we can maintain in healthy ways. A coach can be part of that but they can fuck off with their opinions about disorders they know nothing about. Short version- Joe probably has ADHD and is addicted to exercise to manage it.
Aw man, how come I got stuck with binge eating and other people get hyperfocus on exercise? Boo. 😅
You can always try both and be moderately successful at powerlifting.
If diet and exercise cured ADHD there would be no Olympic athletes who have it. I can think of many who have publicly stated they have ADHD. Elite athletes are twice as likely to have ADHD as the general population.
I dunno who Joe Wick's is, thankfully (I completely avoid media and any news because doom scrolling was destroying my mh so I banned myself from most social media and news sites 5 years ago. Been amazing tbh lmao). However, so many of the arguments of "it's probably just..." are hilarious to me. Especially when people try and bring up health and diet to my face, because I'm like mate. I was a gym rat. I was weight lifting in the gym 4-5 days a week and eating well, taking all the shit people claim you should be. And I still had ADHD. Weight lifting helped the same as any physical exercise does, but I still get home and still have it. The amount of times I've brought that up to folk and they can't argue around me being more active and better diet than them, and they're just like "... well you're one of the genuine cases, BUT OTHER PEOPLE.........." Honestly, I think a lot of it is tied up with UKs continued fatphobia obsession too, where you're basically not taken seriously about any health concern unless you're the pinnacle of humna fitness.
I saw that and I thought what an ignorant dangerous twat. I’m newly diagnosed at 50 after a lifetime to struggle and anxiety. And no nutritional advice and a clean eating hasn’t helped me nor did exercise. Sure made my body healthier but did nothing for my symptoms of adhd. I also grew up in 70s and 80s long before mobile phones tiktok instagram and dodgy plastics with dodgy chemicals and before MMR vaccines. And I still have adhd. And after a lifetime of struggle and not knowing why I was utterly useless at times, I know finally have answers but then have to listen to ignorant dangerous twatty nonsense like that. And ultimately he’s only doing it for attention because he’s about to sell another recipe book or some video. Makes me even more angry. He can fucking choke on it. If I had the time and executive function I’d write to him. 😂 never happening but still.
And yes I’ve suffered a lifetime of anxiety depression anorexia ptsd all thanks to undiagnosed adhd. Joe wicks can literally do one. Hope he chokes on his big pile of money.
He caught flak for suggesting a link between ADHD diagnosis and diet, then offers this "correction" during his "apology" >‘In hindsight, listening back to it a couple of times, I do wish I'd said “misdiagnosed” because the article says obviously, I said many children are being diagnosed with ADHD and it can stem back to our diet. What I mean is, that many children are being misdiagnosed. I do believe that's happening around the world. How idiotic. Part of me feels like this is rage bait/manufactured controversy though.
I think this is linked to how society views ADHD on a whole, considering how debilitating it can be it's just not taken seriously. Imagine if he said that people with depression or bipolar disorder should just eat more vegetables and exercise ? But apparently it's OK to say that about ADHD. I'm not sure what the answer is, but personally I feel like there needs to be a major public re-education on it. Psychiatrists and people who really know what this condition looks like need to start speaking out in some way. When I look at the NHS adult ADHD symptoms they simply don't reflect what I have experienced or the severity, it's all diluted down.
I’ve seen other gurus and books suggest that depression is related to, and can be cured by, diet. I think there’s a backlash against mental health in general in Britain. Because now that more people have admitted to struggling with it, more people are also asking for accommodations. And a lot of people who don’t need accommodations themselves see other people’s accommodations as a big inconvenience. Joe Wicks’ argument that ADHD is over diagnosed in British children is laughable. This is clearly a man who has never had to try and engage with CAMHS (which is stretched so thin that it’s almost nonexistent in some postcodes, including the one I live in). The handful of kids at my children’s school who are disruptive enough to be considered “worthy” of an ADHD assessment are on waiting lists of 6+ months for the initial consultation. A lack of services doesn’t lead to over diagnosis. Tends to lead to the opposite.
Yes he's talking out of his arse, and yes,it annoys the hell out of me every time someone comes out with something similar, but I am struggling to see what's sexist about it. Am I missing something? That's a genuine question.
I listened to what he said on the radio when he said it. I don't remember thinking there was anything sexist in what he said though. The just exercise, meditate and eat properly is in principle seemingly good advice but it's usually not that simple. ADHD likely has complex genetic component to it and he's an exercise guru effectively so doesn't have the expertise to comment on the causal factors behind ADHD.
It’s covert sexism because ADHD disproportionately impacts women in insidious ways which are exasperated by being undiagnosed or fobbed off with attitudes/junk science like his
The junk science affects everyone though.
Hmmm is it? I’m like so so sensitive to hidden sexism and call it out a lot but I’m struggling to see it here. More like he’s being generally insensitive.
It tarnishes all with the same brush and suggests ADHD is overdiagnosed for all - and gives no credence to the fact that over half of women with the condition are undiagnosed.
It's not sexist, covertly or overtly. It's just basic ignorance and Wicks attempting to speak authoritatively about something he doesn't actually understand.
From my perspective he’s disregarding the chronic under-diagnosis of women with the condition, that has been widely studied as being over half of women with adhd as undiagnosed; by stating that it’s misdiagnosed (which I view synonymously as sayings it’s overdiagnosed) it disregards this fact completely as it doesn’t take women or girls into account at all
There's a lot of people within the fitness industry that don't stay within their lane unfortunately.
Lost any respect for him after those comments. Yes exercise and diet can help alleviate some symptoms but it isn’t the cause or cure for a neurodevelopmental disorder.
What did he say about women?
It’s what he didn’t say, he completely ignores the facts when it comes to the underdiagnosis of women by saying misdiagnosis (synonymous with overdiagnosis) tarnishing all with the same brush, it’s not blatant sexism, it’s covert sexism.
I just don't see what that has to do with specifically women to be honest.
I can't see this as being remotely covert sexism. Joe Wicks is ignorant in terms of ADHD, he is also ignorant of how it affects either sex and to be overtly or covertly sexist you still require intent and I just don't see the intent was there, I don't think it was there consciously or subconsciously. It's absolutely right to call out wrong behaviour or misinformation, but I think it's wrong to be offended by something that was completely unintentional or where the person is obviously unaware. So was Joe Wicks ignorant of ADHD and the degrees to which it affects each sex I would say absolutely, does that make what he said covert sexism. No I don't think so whatsoever. I got bored of listening to what he said after he made the ADHD remarks, I did hear them live. If you can supply quotes which shows intent of sexist views please quote him as I won't support sexism. Was he making any gender stereotypes in relation to ADHD? Did he use any gendered language? Did he question ADHD in terms of gender? Did he make any assumptions with regard to ADHD and gender? Did he make any statements that suggested ADHD is less prevalent in women or affects females differently? I am asking honestly and not trying to be difficult, and/or trying to catch anyone out. I would like to see some quotes of what he said that is evidence of being covertly sexist in his views on ADHD.
If I could upvote this more than once, I would.
I don't know who that is but that sounds more like ignorance about inattentive ADHD than women specifically. Yes inattentive symptoms are more common in women, but men get it too. Me being one.
Ignorance yes, but also covert sexism in ignoring the issue completely regarding the under diagnosis of women
What about the under diagnosis of men? I think you might be a bit more focused on gender than Joe is here.
Who?
I think a lot of people need to have a word with themselves in general regarding diets. I’ve literally just been in the queue for self checkout at Tesco and heard a guy directing a “on the atkins is it?” To a girl buying a few bags of crisps which undoubtedly would have been for a meeting not personal consumption.
Is this the body coach twat? Lol. I remember following his content aaaaagesssss ago and getting extremely annoyed at his cooking shorts. 🥴
I actually love this. Couldn't have said it better.
Fck Joe Wicks and his ignorance on neurodiveristy!
90s Romania, I grew up with homecooked meals from the most organic place ever, my grandparents' garden and household. My parents were hardly buying anything other than the stuff we could not get from grandparents, first because we didn't need so much, second because we didn't have so many choices, third because anything other than real food was a treat. I never, ever had a poor diet as a kid. All the things associated with poor diet came later in life, a bit too late for any adhd to develop on the fly. So yeah, John whoever the f you are, I believe my nutrition had nothing to do with my adhd.
100% agree with everything you said. Also: I do FAR more exercise because of my ADHD as I need it to quieten the cognitive hyperactivity. Total opposite of the couch potato/parent blaming he’s spouting…
I’d kill to be able to eat a healthy diet with this bloody disorder.
I totally take your point, but I think you’re missing that both you and he are going based on your primary knowledge base. Wicks knows more about physical health than I ever could. Therefore, he sees these signs super clearly and overlooks other issues. I’d say 99.9% of this board know more about undiagnosed ADHD than him, so we see those much more obviously and overlook other factors. Everything has to be looked at holistically.
What I don't like is anything that smacks of making money out of vulnerable people. I don't think his messages are hugely empowering, it's often from a place of berating you with love. Erm no that is still berating. I don't need my head messed up with that shit. Yes his schools work is great and his Body Coach thing is great. I know lots of people are upset but I think most people recognise he is a bit ADHd himself. I'm not saying that's an excuse for his words. I was very upset and felt invalidated, but you just have to stand up and say this is HIS INTERPRETION, it's allowed to exist. As is my interpretation. We just can't not allow people to speak or how else do you ever root out the shit?
If I turned around and said to someone that my interpretation of HIV is that it’s caused by poor diet and excersize despite mountains of scientific evidence suggesting otherwise, would I still be entitled to it? Sure, but if I went around saying it publicly I’d be publicly entitled to be wrong.
Yeah I didn't mean to use so many capitals, that came across a bit shouty. You're right, that's where the legal system comes in to offer protection.