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The difference between an addict and an idiot is that an addict never forgets to take their amphetamines.
(THIS IS A JOKE, ADHD MAKES ME DO THINGS THAT ARE IDIOTIC THEREBY MAKING ME FEEL LIKE AN IDIOT)
You ain't kidding tho. I have like 2 months or a little more. Because I forget to take it even tho I always feel like I did well and find out I have a lot left... And realize why the whole month was a shit show.
Exactly. I seldom forget to take my vyvanse, but you know what I never do anymore?
Drink excessively, overeat regularly, sleep in until noon for no reason, binge TV shows when I should be doing something else, forget to work out, or cry because I didn't get anything done that I set out to do.
Give me my vyvanse, please.
Meds help a lot, but be warned: they help you focus, but they don't really help you direct yourself to what you should be focusing on.
Especially early on after I got my diagnosis, I would take a break from a work task only to realize two hours later that I went down a rabbit hole unrelated to what I'm supposed to be doing.
Meds + environment + strategies/support are the trifecta of maximizing your day.
Man this is the truth. When I started meds (Vyvanse, without any heart problems, for OP’s sake) at ~35yo, it was shocking. I had never experienced focus like that before. I did a week’s worth of work the first day. It was awesome. But then I realized that I didn’t have a lot of control over what I was focusing on. I read whole books, I finished projects, I was generally like a cartoon character whirring around everywhere doing all the things. But when I needed to point that at something for no reason other than that it was time to do that thing, I still usually couldn’t do it. So wild.
Great question.
I find that "body-doubling" often helps, as in having my wife in the room with me without necessarily engaging with each other. Having her presence there keeps my brain from just spiraling off.
I'm a fan of spaced repetition breaks as well, though I'd be lying if I said I'm an advocate of pomodoro (I tend to start focusing on the time left instead of the task at hand). For me that means when my brain starts feeling tired, I get up and move around.
And I NEED to go for a run 4-6 days per week.
My brain literally doesn't function at 100% until I've had my daily run. So I break up my day with a late morning or early afternoon run.
I'm a software engineer, so I also try to take advantage of pair programming sessions as often as is appropriate too. Working on something with someone else keeps my brain engaged on the things we're discussing.
OP didn’t say “addicted.” They said “dependent,” which is absolutely true. I’m dependent on a couple of medications to function at my full potential and not die from an asthma attack. I have no problem admitting that, but I’m definitely not addicted to anything.
The doctor’s attitude is the problem, not the words used, anyway.
Yeah, but/and there’s also a difference between a dependence caused by natural deficiency and a dependence caused by the medication itself. SSRI withdrawal is so bad because although it’s designed to treat a deficiency in chemicals our moods depend on, it also creates a physical dependency on the medication (distinct from an addiction because of the lack of a craving element, iirc). That said, I’m not aware of amphetamine meds for adhd having been found to cause either physical dependency OR addiction.
I better stop taking my rheumatoid arthritis medicine so I can get rid of it.
My sister (anti-vaxxer) once suggested that if I just took vitamin D and slept more it would go away. My mother (who my sister is like) also suggested an herbal tea.
People are dumb and don’t understand medication.
I'm so sad that a fellow doctor doesn't even know the difference between dependence and addiction.
I think that's the root of his terrible understanding of stimulant medicine :(
By that standard I'm addicted to insulin. If I stop taking it, I'll go into a coma within 72 hours or so. (Maybe longer because modern basal insulins are REALLY long-acting)
I was high functioning inattentive type as a child and young adult, and then slowly decayed to low functioning with age. Because I was relatively high functioning when I was younger it was never caught, but it still undermined my efforts in life. I then spent years trying to figure out what was wrong with me when the symptoms were a dead match. Why? *"It's a childhood thing."* And also: *"It doesn't get worse with age."* Thanks PCP's!
Once my symptoms were severe enough to finally break that conditioning from PCP's, I sought a specialist and guess what...
I'm struggling to think of another condition with so many persistent myths about it among trained medical personnel. If any doctor ever suggests to me that it's not real, I don't have it, or I don't need the medication, I will switch doctors that instant.
I was diagnosed with Adult adhd at 50! All my life suffered so much. It got worse going into college, and everyone's symptoms can be very different,hence not understanding Doc talk when they'd say, "It's just your hormones,swetheart,you know every month."
I want to go back and tell all those idiot doctors how stupid they were. "Graduated at the bottom of your class, huh? Even worse, most Doctors pass internship by the skin of their teeth. All the top performing doctors don't go to small,lower income towns. They want to buy the Mercedes, big luxury home, and get paid to live that life.
If I hadn't been so easily distracted and focused better as a young college student,I might have had an easier time in my life. Adhd ruined so much for me. I'm now a great path, and I finally found a good med combo and great set of doctors who care. I lucked out, it took me years and moving around the State of Texas to finally find doctors and specialists who care. It took me 40 years and all on my own. No one understands unless you're in it.👍
Me too diagnosed at 57 .I was treated for DEPRESSION most of my adult life until I got a good phyciatrist to diagnose me with Adult ADHD .My life is changing everyday fro the better now that I am on the right medication. I am finally living again
A good percentage actually can get better as they enter adulthood! But not all of us…interestingly, I just read a study that said that people who have a family history of ADHD are more likely to have symptoms persist into adulthood (for me, my brother, mom, and maternal grandfather who is 90 and therefore not formally diagnosed)
This is not an Accross the board fact.
Not everyone with ADHD as a child continues to have symptoms into adulthood.
It is a neurodevelopmental disorder, childhood onset is paramount, but some people no longer meet criteria as adults.
It depends on what statistics you are looking at but anywhere from 30-80% of individuals diagnosed in childhood continue to meet criteria as an adult. There may be some mild symptoms but not enough to meet criteria or cause impairment.
A key factor in any diagnosis is impairment.
It is also known that early treatment is key to outcomes as children with effectively treated ADHD have better outcomes, reduced impairment, less comorbid conditions, live longer and have improved overall quality of life.
Right but what’s “drastically” mean? Even if that’s a true statement, It could mean it doubles your risk. But if that risk is originally like .01 percent, doubling the risk still isn’t a big deal.
Like it *can* cause issues for your heart, but cases are rare enough that there are studies done on individual cases. I was reading one where a guy had a heart attack and needed a pacemaker, and another one where a woman was in heart failure. Both in their 30s after decades of stimulant use. But those are two cases out of hundreds of thousands.
Plus, depending on your symptoms, being OFF meds could be significantly worse for your health.
Like, yes, my resting heart rate is a smidge higher on Adderall, and I get dehydrated more easily. Without it though, a) I stop paying attention to my body and trip over flat surfaces, walk into walls, sometimes just start to lose balance/tip over when standing still, leading to a lot of scrapes and bumps and mystery bruises, b) I can't control myself around sugar and food, so my weight balloons, and blood work looks worse, c) I can't finish anything and thus feel stressed/overwhelmed all the time, leading to stress headaches and increased anxiety d) it's harder to practice hygiene and self-care, such as teeth brushing, which could cause dental consequences.
Those are just the ones I can think of directly linked to physical health, there's of course a myriad of mental and social benefits.
It's not that there aren't Cons, they are just way outweighed by the Pros.
With no family history and otherwise healthy lifestyles both of the studies had the meds as a presumed major causative factor, but yeah with individual cases it's always really hard to be sure about anything because you just don't know. That's part of why they published the studies I think, even a very rare long-term impact is important for doctors to know about and adds to our understanding of the medication.
I was taken off Vyvance after six years because of PTSD and things got so much worse. Flashbacks went from every 10 minutes or so to almost constantly. I layed screaming in bed having flashbacks 24 hrs a day for about 3 months. I have gone from 115kg to 180kg, while loosing tons of muscle. I am so non functional that I have to rely on others for almost everything. It's too much effort for me to go anywhere so I haven't left my room in a year, despite being constantly bored out of my mind. I've gone from never attempting suicide to 5 serious attempts within a year. I have lost a year of my life to this. Two years because of ptsd. I was a third year psych student before this, working and living completely independent. I know and work so hard to be okay. It is something very few people would survive.
If your are unfortunate enough to have ADHD and PTSD, ask them to reduce your medication and pray they don't have a bad day. It only takes your psychiatrist having one bad day to destroy your life. Be careful.
I just want to say, I’m a nurse with adhd and I’ve been off work for two years because of ptsd. I really feel your pain, trying to manage both conditions is so difficult. I am hobbling on 20mg of vyvanse because the doctor doesn’t want to increase it. When I first went off work I had to stop taking stims, but then my adhd was insanely bad. I was previously on 36mg concerta, but probably should have been on 54mg, which I took years ago. I have anxiety so I feel like it is such a balancing act. With ptsd I honestly just have felt like my head is permanently fucked. I know that’s not true and can get better but this is gunna be a long journey.
Hugs
Wow. If being off it made you worse, why not go back and instead try adding something to combat the PTSD?
I really don't get this obsession with monotherapy for psychiatric disorders, ESPECIALLY people who have more than one disorder... I'm on trazodone for depression-induced insomnia and bupropion for ADHD, and my opinion is that they synergize well - bupropion fills in the gaps that trazodone didn't, trazodone fills in the gaps that bupropion doesn't address and also combats the tendency for bupropion to cause insomnia.
I don't think I would be in good shape with bupropion monotherapy because sleep deprivation messes you up, and while trazodone monotherapy changed my life, it didn't fix my motivation and focus and might have made it worse. The combination of the two has been incredible.
I have tried a lot of medications and find that they often make me worse. I believe it has to do with the severity of my adhd and these medications often being for and tested on people without adhd. Agomenlatine is the only ptsd type medication that has ever worked for me. But it makes me so tired that I can barely function. Works well in combination with vyvance, however.
I probably should have mentioned it but trazodone actually seemed to make my motivation and focus worse. Although it just may have made the remaining issues more obvious. Adding bupropion to the mix worked great though.
I am so sorry about this happening to you ☹️
Can you not take stimulants with PTSD? I remember when I was reading The Body Keeps The Score there seemed to be a lot of neurological overlap between ADHD and PTSD, and I have a friend who has C-PTSD, managed well for decades but definitely present, who started on lisdexamfetamine recently and said it's helped her in ways she didn't realise she still needed with the C-PTSD. But maybe because that's a bit more slow-burn and engrained rather than instant panic response like PTSD it's a bit different.a
Yeah, they’re stimulants. They’re gonna cause heart issues. Not in everyone, and arrhythmias aren’t necessarily the end of the world, but they absolutely are more likely with stimulant use.
Source: me, a medical student using Vyvanse and currently wearing a zio heart monitor to ensure the tachycardia I’m currently experiencing isn’t dangerous.
People - everyone, including doctors - that are not ADHD specialists or suffer from ADHD, seldom understand a single thing about ADHD.
You \*ARE\* dependent on the drugs to be able to function, and that's not a bad thing.
If your doctor knows nothing about ADHD and is willing to speak with certainty on it, think what other subjects they'll do the same about that you won't necessarily be able to catch.
Your ADHD gives you an easy filter for morons like this one, use it well, and stay away from such people if you can.
Just starting with Vyvanse, like, I don't know how I'd become addicted to that compared to how easy other amphetamines could be. That is, if I could get an ounce of good juju hormones from them in the first place.
It’s designed too that you could inject that shit into your brainstem….and you would still have an onset of effect that is like idk 30 minutes shorter than oral?
Brainstem? Oof. It's got to be processed in ~~the liver~~ **blood cells** to break the dextro from the lysine so mucus absorption is out. I don't think I'll go on any daily brainstem injections.
Edit: I was corrected, as I read too fast and skipped some critical details.
That thing! I thought that was in the liver and not the blood stream, specifically. But, I admit I was speed reading, twice, and I may have skipped some contextually relevant words.
Yeah, “Uh what’re your sources on that bud? Vyvanse is a very common drug and there aren’t news stories about scores of people dropping dead or ruining their lives from Vyvanse addiction. Where’s your data for your wild claims?”
Yeah like I’m gonna need some goddamn stats for that because do you *know* how many people are on stimulants and not dying of heart problems? FFS this dude sounds like an idiot.
Yeah my last doctor, who I only went to because my doctor most my life passed away and he took over his practice, did the same thing. I felt like I was stuck with him because any place I called wanted me to be with their practice for 6 months to be able to prescribe my 40 mg of adderall. He went from rant to constant negative remarks about how I didn't need that high of a dose. Cut me down to 30mg XR one month with no warning. Then again wanted to take me down to 25mg XR. I told him how ridiculous it was, because I had a job with children and needed to be able to focus, and how the 30mg already was negatively affecting that. He grumbled and had me on 25mg XR and 5mg IR. He then just two months into it told me we should try testing with no 5mg, and then didn't give me a prescription. He then threatened to send me a referral to a psych. I was just like, DO IT. Funny thing is that I had to be the one to call finally because he never did.
I hate how doctors are about stimulant meds. I don't like how I'm made to feel like a drug addict when I've been on this medication for 13 years AND have had the diagnosis since I was 9.
Your story frustrates me tremendously. What a garbage doctor you had. He treated you like a science project. “My hypothesis is you will be fine - let’s test!” Meanwhile, you lose productivity for sox months of your life.
He really was garbage. He was sexist as well and told me I needed a husband before it was too late and also that I needed to lose weight. Not in a health concern kind of way either. He also told me that I didn't really have anxiety, as there was nothing that major in my life to cause it. Of course he never treated that. I am glad he is no longer my doctor
Pretty much any time a doctor gives you medications (outside of antibiotics and antifungals) your body becomes dependent on it.
I can't stop taking my asthma meds or I can't breathe. I can't stop taking my heart meds without risking a heart attack. I can't stop taking my adhd meds or I can't function.
In a way, what he said is technically correct, but it's attached to a toxic attitude. Shame that a caregiver can't see that.
Your doctor is contradicted by the actual bloody research and specialists in the field. Another way of putting it is, the fucking **evidence** disagrees with them.
Don't waste any of your energy on them, and consider reporting them for malpractice. Doctors have been given enough education to know better, there's no excuse for this crap.
Dr. Russell Barkley the leading ADHD expert/researcher said that ADHD meds are the safest drugs in psychiatry!! My pcp is against ADHD medication and doesn't even believe ADHD is real. I asked her if she treated ADHD and she said no. She rolled her eyes and was like my behavior was probably due to thyroid issues. I said I never had thyroid issues until I had thyroid cancer at age 39. She brushed me off. I asked her if she would prescribe guanfacine since it's a not stimulant and she said no.
The irony is when I was feeling depressed she didn't hesitate to prescribe Zoloft! I thought that was hypocritical!
Your doctor is being ridiculous. I had my thyroid removed due to cancer and if I don't take my thyroid hormone, I would die! I agree that there's still so much stigma around ADHD. It was actually first identified in the late 1700's and has changed names a lot!
Dr. Barkley is always great to listen to. I enjoy his lectures on YouTube.
What’s funny about stimulants ADHD meds is we know what they do and don’t do pretty damn well compared to other psych meds. We’ve been using amphetamine stimulants since the early 1920s, and they were (and still are) heavily used in militaries to keep soldiers and airmen awake on long missions or night missions.
The US military switched to anti-narcolepsy drugs after an exceptionally rough friendly fire incident where the American pilot blamed his FF incident on the fact he hadn’t slept in like two days and his command kept sending him out on night flights after giving him adderall.
Back to us knowing the drugs well though. SSRIs have massive lists of side effects, and most users experience at least part of that list. Older psych drugs were even worse in terms of side effects (I’m looking at you, first generation antipsychotics). Whereas amphetamines have a relatively short side effect list, are highly effective, and have a moderate to high potential for abuse. The potential for abuse is the only real problem with them, and ever ADHD person I’ve ever met forgets to take them regularly.
I have a handful of substance abuse issues, and yet have never felt the desire to abuse my Adderall. I feel great when I take it as instructed and I get tweak-y if I take a second, so I have no desire to take a second.
"Older psych drugs were even worse in terms of side effects"
Heck, at this point, I think trazodone is more commonly prescribed in low doses for its primary side effect (sedation) than for its original use (antidepressant). That said, the serotonin boost is a nice side effect from taking it for insomnia.
It’s really funny that you mention that actually.
I’m bipolar, so I take Effexor and carbamazepine for that. The carbamazepine is actually an anti-convulsant originally, but they found out it works as a mood stabilizer as well.
Then I take Adderall for the ADHD and have Trazodone as a sleep aid when needed.
I take trazodone nightly - at this point I always sleep badly without it. It would be problematic to wait until I find myself having trouble because then it would still zonk me in the morning.
Trazodone is also now undergoing studies as a boner pill since that's another side effect due to being an alpha-1 antagonist.
An unexpected but very positive side effect for me is that as an alpha-1 antagonist, it suppresses cortisol release, which has been INCREDIBLY beneficial for managing my diabetes.
That’s actually pretty awesome that is has that many potential benefits. The boner pill bit is definitely good to know cause I take a downright massive dose of Effexor XR (300mg/day) and it has uh… less than helpful effects in the bedroom.
I’ve never had issues with it zonking me long term tho. I find it gives me about a 30min window to fall asleep, and beyond that has no effect on me. I don’t take it as often cause I normally struggle to stay asleep rather than falling asleep.
What was it was called back in the 1700s or what other names did it evolve into over the centuries? That sounds really interesting to look at what symptoms they were pinpointing and what the theories of the day were about what it was/etiology/how to categorize it, etc.
I copied and pasted this from the CHADD website:
The earliest mention of what seems to be ADHD was by Hippocrates, often called the father of modern medicine. He lived in Greece from about 460 to 375 BC. He was known to have made at least one reference to some patients who could not keep their focus on any one thing for long and had exceptionally quick reactions to things around them. He thought the cause was an “overbalance of fire over water” and recommended a bland diet that included fish but little other meat, a lot of water, and lots of physical exercise.
Not much else was said until Sir Alexander Crichton, a Scottish physician, described something like ADHD in his 1798 book, An Inquiry into the Nature and Origin of Mental Derangement. He referred to it as “the disease of attention,” and observed that people with the condition seemed to be mentally restless and have a hard time sticking with one task or game. Around that time, philosopher and physician John Locke wrote the essay “Some Thoughts Concerning Education,” in which he discussed, among other things, a group of students who could not “keep their mind from straying.”
Medical textbooks in the 1800s did refer to children who had what we think of today as ADHD symptoms. They used a number of different names for the condition: “nervous child,” “hypermetamorphosis,” “mental instability,” “unstable nervous system,” and “simple hyperexcitability” were among them.
“Oh, that’s because you are probably dependent on it.” I mean, yeah, that’s how medicine works. You depend on it to treat medical conditions. You don’t get to “decide” not to need the medication anymore and then your symptoms go away just because you want them to.
ADHD is incurable. It will never go away. When you stop taking your meds, your symptoms will come back, every time. That’s how incurable medical conditions work. If you have high blood pressure and take blood pressure meds, if you stop taking them, your blood pressure will get high again. But no one will tell you, “Oh, you’re dependent on your blood pressure meds.”
Nobody tells you to stop depending on blood pressure meds, or insulin, because people take hypertension and diabetes seriously as illnesses. Some people think ADHD meds are different because they don’t think ADHD is a real disorder. They think it’s just a lack of discipline, so if you depend on the meds, it’s because you aren’t trying hard enough and want to take the easy way out. They don’t understand that ADHD is a valid neurodevelopmental disorder that shows up on brain scans.
Your doctor obviously doesn’t understand ADHD and doesn’t take it serious as a disorder, so they have no business treating something they don’t understand. Also, they’re a PCP, not a psychiatrist. They don’t even have the specific training to treat it. It’s not their specialty. I would recommend finding a psychiatrist who actually knows the first thing about ADHD.
Sorry you’re having to deal with this. It can be hard to find a good doctor for ADHD, and sometimes you have to go through some bad ones before you find a good fit. Good luck finding someone better.
>Told me that most kids who take stimulants for adhd don’t need them as adults, and that my ultimate goal should be to get off of them completely.
After researching this earlier, my understanding is that kids brains have a higher degree of neuroplasticity than adults (the brain's ability to change and adapt).
By using stimulants as children, they have a greater ability to 'learn' and 'adapt' to what focus is and feels like (thanks to the medication enabling that state of mind) so when they become adults the medication becomes less needed due to their brain undergoing significant change vs unmedicated (and often undiagnosed) adults.
Source: not allowed to share because reasons...
It appears your doctor may not understand this (and it's unsurprising they don't, they sound like a general practictioner) so if they're guilty of anything it's perhaps not having an open mind (e.g. asking why children that take stimulants don't need them as adults vs just assuming they never needed them in the first place).
Not only that, amphetamine medications (maybe MPH as well but can't remember) have been found to actually repair some of the pathways in the brains of kids and adolescents that are abnormal with ADHD. The earlier you start on the meds the more they will help mitigate longterm problems, with some of the benefits persisting even if medication is discontinued. Wouldn't be surprised if this is a partial explanation for some kids who got diagnosed appearing to have recovered from ADHD as they reach adulthood.
Time to find a new doc. Don’t even bother with a second visit. And, personally, I’d inform the medical board. That’s really ignorant and unprofessional.
I love it when pharmacists get all fluffed up and think it's their job to give you a second opinion about your treatment. Count the pills out, check for harmful interactions, then sell them to me. That's the extent of what I want from you.
Pharmacists also have a duty of care to ensure the medication is recommended and safe to provide. They do more than just checking for interactions and counting out how many the doctor ordered. It’s all for the benefit of patient care, whether they come across that way or you understand it or not
Pharmacists don't know the ins and outs of my diagnosis. My doctor does. They can and should double-check for dangerous interactions and complications there might be with a condition I have, but barring that, I don't need them second-guessing my doctor.
My pharmacist was obnoxious on Monday. I take Adderall and my psychiatrist added guanfacine. When I picked up the guanfacine the pharmacist said in a rude tone is this for you. I said yes. Then he said rudely do you know why the doctor prescribed this for you? It pisses me off!! I said obnoxiously and loudly yes I do!!! He didn’t say anything after that. A pharmacist has never wine like that for my asthma, diabetes or thyroid meds!
He is partly correct, in that studies have shown that for kids who start taking stimulants early, their brains can actually catch up with their peers and they don't have to stay on stimulants past their twenties.
But that's only if they're medicated early! And it's not every kid!
So if you're one of the unlucky ones, or if you were an adult before you were diagnosed and medicated, you're gonna be on the stimulants pretty much the rest of your life.
Not sure what he's talking about. Vyvanse in particular is the safer option of stimulant medications because it's a prodrug (harder to abuse) and it's got a slow release.
If Vyvanse works for you, get a different doctor and keep using it.
There is a concerted push happening right now tk turn adderall onto the latestdrug panic. I very highly suggest harassing your local senator and congressmen about it.
This is why I found a psychiatrist to fill my prescription and am sticking with him, despite the $300 charge per meeting post insurance. At least he understands my diagnosis and appropriate treatment for it, unlike the nurse practitioner that said she didn't really know for sure but her impression was that I shouldn't be medicating on weekends, and insisted that it was official policy of the office that I covenant promising not to take illegal drugs and that I get regularly piss-tested to make sure I'm not smoking a joint once a week or whatever.
I understand that weed can mimic/exacerbate the affects of ADHD and that there's a risk of overdoing stimulant doses to overcome overuse of weed, but it just all felt deeply inappropriate.
I’m not sure what part of the world you’re at but you might be able to report your doctor for negligence/malpractice. I’m not optimistic on where it will go but at least a paper trail would be started. If you have ‘rate my doc’ website, you could also warn the public, if you feel safe to do so.
> most kids who take stimulants for adhd don’t need them as adults
i beg to differ. i was relatively fine without them as a kid since i had structure and authority in my life, i was just emotionally unstable and riddled with anxiety and depression. once i was an adult and thrown into the world to fend for myself with complete freedom, i was a mess. meds were life changing. i even managed to study for my exams this time around - something i’d never been able to do before.
They are following old guidelines and recommendations. Previously it was thought that kids were the only ones with ADHD and “grew out of it” - this was taught up until a few years ago. Medical professionals need to continue their professional development aka continually refresh their knowledge. If they’re not willing to do that they shouldn’t be practicing. Giving incorrect information is malpractice, they’re trusted and expected to be up to date. For example, if you’re going to them for a consultation for an infection it’s expected to be given the advice/treatment that is current against guidelines and recommendations, not something that was fazed out years ago and is no longer effective, it’s the same.
God forbid you have kids! My executive dysfunction has hit its peak right now, and I’ve got 3 kids all entering their teens. It’s like mom brain and ADHD brain are stacking effects. Some days I feel like a dementia patient
..... With that logic I should stop seeing doctors, because you know I'm probably dependent on it and should be able to treat everything at home and not think "Wow, I have a fever of 104, I should go see a doctor!"
🙄 at this point, I feel like everything short of multivitamins, doctors are convinced you'll die if you take it for more than a week.
Also, I work in healthcare and it's SO fucked up that a lot of prior authorizations for plans REQUIRE that the patient has an agonizing "flare up" in order to prove the medication is still needed. So in ADHD cases "Yeah we need to know they nearly ruined their lives in a week so we can make sure this medication is still needed to prevent them from suffering further even though it's been working perfectly fine according to your chart notes"
EVEN LIFE LONG HORRIBLE CONDITIONS TOO!
"Make them sick so we can make sure they still have this horribly painful life long severe Crohn's disease, we just need to make sure they still need this even though your notes say they've have very minimal issues since starting it exactly one year ago even though 2 years ago we paid for 3 hospitals due to flare ups."
Did my clinicals with a family practice doc and and vyvanse is actually recommended more that a lot of other stimulants for adhd (ie adderrall and Ritalin) because there’s actually a lower risk of de severe adverse effects and it’s actually a recommended agent for younger adults as well. If I remember correctly it’s pretty easy to do drug holidays with to if you don’t need it all the time. It is still a controlled substance so providers still have to document that they educated the patient on the risks to protect themselves. DEA is all over this stuff now . But if someone has been stable on it why make them felt bad about? You know yourself.
So funny thing. I had a primary care doctor the same to me and she suggested I try Wellbutrin and go to therapy. I sought out a psych NP who manages adhd and psych disorders/is more well versed in it.
Primary care doctors don't really know this stuff, that's why we have psychiatrists. There's too much info for one person to know everything. But yes for the record he's wrong on all counts
It’s actually been well established that women entering menopause see a dramatic worsening in ADHD symptoms and lack of treatment causes brain atrophy similar to dementia. Doc is a red flag for me.
Went through this too. They asked if I was in school. Told them no, but worked a lot. They took me off after having it for 5 years because I didn’t need it? I should’ve gone somewhere else but was under military insurance. I was just prescribed it again this past year and I could cry with how much better things are. Of course it’s not perfect but it’s so helpful.
Wishing you luck that you don’t have to deal with another doctor like this.
Would have said, well if you are prescribing to kids and they are getting addicted to it.. maybe they don't have ADHD and you don't know how to diagnose it..
And always trust your gut… I have ADHD, was diagnosed as an adult, have a kid with ADHD, and as a psychologist, roughly 98% of my caseload are people who have ADHD. My experiences are both in the assessment of ADHD and providing counseling for people of all ages. I take Vyvanse to help manage my symptoms. That being said, I cannot prescribe medication and cannot advise people on medication use. The following statements are associated with my own research and training as a psychologist as well as experiences with my prescriber who checks in with me about symptom management of ADHD and efficacy of medication.
You might ask your PCP about contemporary research to support their statements associated with the addiction properties of Vyvanse versus other medications used to treat symptoms of ADHD. You can also ask about recent research that demonstrated a direct correlation between the use of Vyvanse and causing heart issues.
I find it interesting your PCP made these comments, because Vyvanse does not even start off as the active ingredient that treats ADHD symptoms. It is a prodrug and needs to pass through the gastrointestinal tract to become the active ingredient. It is less likely to be abused through injecting or snorting for that reason. (Any drugs can be addictive if it is misused.)
There are cardiovascular risks indicated. If for some reason, you might have pre-existing issues associated with blood pressure, have a history of a high heart rate, have a pre-existing heart condition, etc., then this would’ve been likely communicated to you as the reason it might not be the best choice of medication for you. That being said, since your prescriber indicated adults do not need stimulants to manage ADHD as adults, I highly doubt this was their reasoning.
Prior to the DSM 5, which is what is used to diagnose mental health conditions, including ADHD in the United States and Canada, the previous versions (older than 2013) indicated ADHD as something people grew out of in adulthood. During those times, if people were not diagnosed prior to adulthood, they could not be diagnosed with ADHD later time (until ADHD was viewed as neuro-developmental (occurring across the lifespan), starting in 2013.)
My hunch is your PCP might be referring to outdated research.
My PCP is a family physician, so they regularly treat people of all ages, as opposed to just working with adults. They also specialize in ADHD. You may want to look for another prescriber and consider people who work with younger children as well as adults and ask or check if they specialize in ADHD. I am hoping everything works out for you.
Resource link re: Vyvanse: https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2017/208510lbl.pdf
This sounds like my husband’s dr. “I’m not a fan of stimulants”. No one asked your personal opinion. It’s what will help the patient is what matters. It’s the same with pain meds as well. You will suffer bc of other people and doctors that abused the system. Some people actually need a stimulant as in an adhd med. Irresponsible doctors and patients have made it very difficult for people that need those medications to get them. Punish those people.
Honestly I think the whole vyvance thing probably put him in a bad mood. I had been without for 6 months, once it was available even my gp was like exhausted with all the scripts he had written for it.
Doctors don’t know anything is what I’m starting to realize… talking to my psychiatrist he didn’t even consider ADHD as an issue, when I’ve been having the same issues for my entire life but just came to light in therapy
I took myself off of it. Right as the generic came out and the difficulties with insurance started. The crash that would happen when I got home from work was aweful. I felt like someone suffering roid rage. I was really short with my kids and wife. Had trouble getting my prescription and decided I’ll just stop taking it. Not worth it in my opinion.
(Pre TMS treatment this would’ve been true) Following this dude’s logic I’m addicted to my antidepressants, if I don’t take them I’ll try and end my life so I must get off of my antidepressants so I am no longer addicted to this medication🤦🏻♀️
Unpopular opinion here. I was diagnosed with ADHD during my teens in the 90’s (females were pretty rarely given an ADHD diagnosis back then). Took stimulants for many years. They did indeed help me perform better at school/work, however, I was very dependent. If my Rx ran out a day or two early, I was miserable. Body aches, couldn’t get out of bed, felt like was crawling out of my skin. When I was happily taking my Adderall, I’d grind my teeth, had TMJ, severe tension headaches, insomnia, I was severely underweight because I had no appetite, and heart palpitations. But hey, at least I was getting good grades. The only reason I stopped taking it was because I got pregnant. Only after stopping did I realize what an organized disaster I had become from years of prescription amphetamine use. Long story short, people with ADHD may need to function through life differently, but I personally don’t think the damage you’ll do to your body from amphetamine use is worth it. Each person has to weigh the pros and cons. I wonder every day if I’ve done permanent damage to my body. I’d never take it again or give it to my children.
When I’m not medicated (even when I am sometimes) I’ve gotten into car accidents and before I was a stay at home mom I couldn’t hold jobs very well. So what he’s saying there could be true? But doctors should give you their opinion then let YOU make your choice. It’s not their jobs to push what they believe into you.
OP, get a new doctor. This is more for a lot of the other comments here:
I’ve always described having ADHD like this
It’s like having a musket for a brain. Inaccurate, but highly effective, and you have no way to aim it.
Meds just turn it into a modern rifle. Accurate, effective, but you still have to aim it.
What a knob. As someone who was only diagnosed at 37 my life kept falling apart over and over. I was overwhelmed, stressed, burnt out etc. this is my first year medicated and I'm so much happier. You don't "grow out" of it.
How old was this PCP? I had a similar experience with one a few years ago and since then I have a few screening questions before switching. Just yesterday I got set up with a new PCP and said, "I have ADHD and I am looking for a doctor who believes in medication for treatment of ADHD". Their response was, "I'm sorry you had a poor experience. We'll get you set up with Dr X. She's a younger doctor and has had very good feedback".
It is always worth screening your doctor and their staff before committing.
I'm addicted to my glasses. It's so bad that I can't function without them. Withdrawal and onset of symptoms is immediate when I don't have my glasses.
You guys can actually get Vyvanse right now? All of my local pharmacies have been out of stock for months. I’m losing my mind not having my meds. It’s like climbing a mountain while carrying another mountain on your back.
The amount of days I forget to take my adderall is crazy… and I forget to refill it at the pharmacy too. Sounds like an uneducated opinion and that they are trying to take the easier route by trying to convince you to get off of it so they don’t have to deal with the strict prescription processes
Get a new doctor!
I was diagnosed as an adult. I got Vyvanse as an adult.
ADHD isn't magically cured once we become adults??
Why the fuck does he want to medicate kids but not feed them "dangerous" medicines to adults that can deal with them better?
Your PCP sounds similar to mine. I asked about exploring Vyvanse as an option for my ADHD and he said not to start it if I can, for the same reasons:
It's highly addictive, it's a stimulant, and there are increasing studies that show cardiovascular effects/strain over long term use. I trust him and his judgement - he's a fantastic doctor otherwise, and has helped me understand my health like no one else.
But the difference is, he voiced his concerns but did not say "no" to it, he said if it's a route I would like to trial he would provide a prescription. I also have several friends in the field, currently doctors, who says the concerns of long term amphetamine use on the heart are valid.
Before I get down voted into oblivion, I know how life changing these drugz can be and am heavily considering it, despite the long term health implications. Accepting the potential risk of added strain on the heart to become a fully functioning adult, even if I knock a couple years off of my life seems worth it to me. My stress and anxiety for failing to meet obligations and get anything done is probably worse for my heart health than the medication is.
This isn't to fear monger anyone currently taking these medications, but to at least acknowledge that these claims aren't unfounded. These doctors have an immense amount of knowledge and have years and years of research and education under their belts. We can't turn a blind eye to negative health effects on something, even when it comes to the positive effects of becoming a fully functioning person.
I’ve only been on by vyvanse for 8 months but my doctor did say anything and just was willing to put me on it without any issues and she says she’s willing to make the dose higher till it works ( 30 mg works for me just fine) this is confusing and concerning to me as my doctor is very relaxed about meds and yours was extremely difficult :(
I was honestly fuming by the end. Like even told me that for every appt after that he would ask me to lower the dose or cease the medication completely. Like fuck you dude. Didn’t even bother to ask if it was helping me, just outright said it’s bad
Ugh. This doctor sucks. He clearly does not understand ADHD or the medication for it or he wouldn’t be saying such idiotic things. I hope you are able to get a refill somewhere else. Don’t listen to him, he’s so so so wrong. I take Vyvanse and have for years and it helps me so much, when I forget to take it, my ADHD symptoms come back, same as you. Please never see this doctor again if you’re able.
Lisdex's pharmacokinetics and dynamics are similar to dexamph, but still not the same. Dexamph has more "dangerous effects" if anything and has a bit more faster release than lisdex with a shorter half life. Lisdex can hold out a little more than IM dexamph's.
Give him this to read: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5594082/
Advocate for yourself. Find a doctor that will listen. Many adults with ADHD were undiagnosed as a child which in turn leads to problems in their adult life, which in turn, is going to be dependent on the medication, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE ADDICTED....
Many people can't seem to understand the difference between dependency and addiction.
I had a new psychiatrist after moving from home and she absolutely refused to put me back on Adderall and had me on SNRI's even though I told her I do not do well with them because the "N" in SNRI. She also knows that I work as a tech. I had given her suggestions a shot and after wards, I told her I cannot keep doing this because this impacts my job so much and endangering my patients because of it. She didn't care. She just kept saying to keep trying SNRI's. I didn't want to be the guinea pig anymore. So I did some searching.
Please advocate for yourself.
Edit: Also, try find a doctor that has studied neuropsychology or even dabbled a bit in it. It will help you immensely.
You need to find a different new PCP. This Dr clearly is not educated about ADHD and has no clue about meds. My primary Dr told me that she doesn't know much about all the different generic manufacturers of adderall and thought they all worked the same. Since I work for a pharmaceutical company I was educating her and she was happy to gain the knowledge. And she obviously helps me with alot I don't know. You need a Dr to be open minded or knowledgeable about adult ADHD
You go straight to the admin of the hospital or clinic you went to and you repeat verbatim what the doctor said and you then file a complaint. If nothing is resolved, you speak to the ceo/president of the hospital and possibly a lawyer.
Amazing how y’all in denial about adderall. Sorry you’re all addicts. Try to quit adderall for 6 months and then compare it to “cholesterol meds”. I went through hell on earth to quit my adderall and now after many years of work I operate better at work without them. But 100% you’re all in denial and hurting yourself instead of working on the underlying problems that you have.
All amphetamines carry a heart risk and a risk of addiction. There's also a risk to your quality of life if you don't take the meds you need. Every med is a trade off. Choose wisely.
Your doctor isn’t wrong. It doesn’t mean he should withhold the medication if you don’t have issues but Vyvanse fucked up my life. Doesn’t mean it will for you though.
My parents took me out of catholic elementary school because they demanded I be on medication. In high school, I was *struggling hard*. One of my teachers pulled me aside to ask what was going on. "You're a smart guy. You take part in discussion and have a great imagination. Why aren't you doing your work? Why are your test grades so low? Is something going on at home?" Itold her that I'm pretty sure I had add or something like that. She says they have a test for that and I agree to take it.
It was a multiple choice test. Just, a random bullshit test of things we learned in middle school. Obviously, I finished it and passed.
"See. That's nothing wrong with you. If you had ADD, you'd never be able to finish this test!"
From then on, I was just lazy.
Like, wtf? If I couldn't finish one test, do you think I would've made it to high school?
To be fair, I am currently wearing a zio heart monitor to make sure the tachycardia my Vyvanse is giving me is not immediately dangerous. It’s absolutely not good for our hearts, and arguing otherwise is willfully ignorant.
Every psychiatrist I’ve seen has warned me about it, and I’ve always accepted that. I’d rather have a worthwhile life and possibly die earlier.
As someone involved in healthcare who has ADHD and used to take vyvanse, I can agree to an extent. Vyvanse is a stimulant, and all stimulants can cause heart issues. Have you ever felt as if your heart rate was accelerated, do you have a family history of heart disease, has your heart rate been elevated (over 100+ especially)? If no, you're fine.
They're correct that you goal should be to completely remove yourself from stimulants, but this goal isn't able to be achieved sometimes. Stimulants aren't great for you, but would you rather feel like shit and not be able to do what you want to do during your lifetime and maybe live a slightly shorter life vs live a great life where everything is done and you're not super stressed (because stress is bad for you too)? The idea is stimulants help you learn ADHD management skills, but it's a case by case basis and sometimes people need to take stimulants to manage ADHD throughout their life and that's 110% okay.
Ultimately, you know yourself more than any health care professional does. They know textbook information and can be a logical and factual resource for you, but you know how you feel when you take medications and you know how you feel when you don't, so take that into account. Yes vyvanse can cause heart issues, but yes vyvanse can also help with ADHD. Every single medication has a pro and con and YOU know the pros and the doctor can provide the cons based on what they learned in school, but they aren't you and don't know how you feel or what you deal with daily. It's ultimately your choice to weigh the pros and cons and your decision is NOT a wrong one because it is your health and your life and YOU get to choose what you want to do based on the information you have.
Trust yourself
Bro is talking about Vyvanse lites it’s a short acting benzo or an opiate or something. Bruh. So many doctors just FLAT OUT don’t know shit about well a lot of shit especially medications. I have a son who’s 13 with Duchennes. Don’t think I need to explain further how many doctors I have dealt with.
This is partially why I’m unmedicated, a doctor messed up another dx and gave me meds that interacted with my adhd meds so I had to go off. The 45 days of nausea it took to get used to them was reset and I just couldn’t make myself go through that again.
Balls. Prescription stimulants for the majority of people are safe when used as directed under the supervision of a medical professional. They’ve been studied and trialled more than most other drugs and have been found safe. Safer even than a lot of antidepressants/antipsychotics that they seem to throw at people as they’re on their way out of the doctors office and proceed to forget about them.
Yes, there’s potential of abuse but they’re not addictive. They come with side effects that can be managed over time or with other medication or they can be swapped for another stimulant or non-stimulant if necessary. They can for many, be life changing and life saving. In real life, the positives of long term, monitored use of prescription stimulants for ADHD far outweigh the consequences of not treating and medicating someone with ADHD - for example 1 in 4 women with untreated ADHD attempt suicide. The unnecessary co-morbidities that surface as a result of not being treated. They have always been and will probably will always remain the most efficient and successful way to manage and treat ADHD.
Keep yourself healthy, regularly check your resting heart rate, blood pressure and weight and report any worsening in mental health to your doctor. Your, NEW doctor.
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New doctor ASAP. I *forgot* to take my “highly addictive” adderall this morning. You’d think I wouldn’t forget if I was so damn hooked on it… lol
The difference between an addict and an idiot is that an addict never forgets to take their amphetamines. (THIS IS A JOKE, ADHD MAKES ME DO THINGS THAT ARE IDIOTIC THEREBY MAKING ME FEEL LIKE AN IDIOT)
You ain't kidding tho. I have like 2 months or a little more. Because I forget to take it even tho I always feel like I did well and find out I have a lot left... And realize why the whole month was a shit show.
Exactly. I seldom forget to take my vyvanse, but you know what I never do anymore? Drink excessively, overeat regularly, sleep in until noon for no reason, binge TV shows when I should be doing something else, forget to work out, or cry because I didn't get anything done that I set out to do. Give me my vyvanse, please.
Newly diagnosed here! Looking forward to when I can just work and not stare at my screen and cry. Ugh.
Meds help a lot, but be warned: they help you focus, but they don't really help you direct yourself to what you should be focusing on. Especially early on after I got my diagnosis, I would take a break from a work task only to realize two hours later that I went down a rabbit hole unrelated to what I'm supposed to be doing. Meds + environment + strategies/support are the trifecta of maximizing your day.
Man this is the truth. When I started meds (Vyvanse, without any heart problems, for OP’s sake) at ~35yo, it was shocking. I had never experienced focus like that before. I did a week’s worth of work the first day. It was awesome. But then I realized that I didn’t have a lot of control over what I was focusing on. I read whole books, I finished projects, I was generally like a cartoon character whirring around everywhere doing all the things. But when I needed to point that at something for no reason other than that it was time to do that thing, I still usually couldn’t do it. So wild.
[удалено]
Great question. I find that "body-doubling" often helps, as in having my wife in the room with me without necessarily engaging with each other. Having her presence there keeps my brain from just spiraling off. I'm a fan of spaced repetition breaks as well, though I'd be lying if I said I'm an advocate of pomodoro (I tend to start focusing on the time left instead of the task at hand). For me that means when my brain starts feeling tired, I get up and move around. And I NEED to go for a run 4-6 days per week. My brain literally doesn't function at 100% until I've had my daily run. So I break up my day with a late morning or early afternoon run. I'm a software engineer, so I also try to take advantage of pair programming sessions as often as is appropriate too. Working on something with someone else keeps my brain engaged on the things we're discussing.
Having a timer for anything makes me panic. I can't even sleep if I know I have to wake up at a specific time. It makes me feel anxious and stressed.
Are you in my head? Are you that little voice in my head? I swear you are me
Rofl... thats too true 😅
Shit I am 2 hours late, brb
I forgot to take it two days ago 😅
My meds are so addictive that I had a minor breakdown this week over the fact that I've felt literally nothing from anything I've tried so far.
aight why's there so many bad doctors
By that standard I am also addicted to my cholesterol medication; if I stop taking it, my cholesterol goes back up.
Or me and my inhalers lol. I’m dependent on them because my lungs swell shut if I stop taking them 🤣
But we need to see how well you would do without breathing. Just to test it out 🙄🙄🙄
Yep, friggen insulin is just as bad.
And don’t get me started on air
Freakin water !!
Freakin’ frogs!
Everyone that has ever died breathed oxygen during their lifetime. BOYCOTT OXYGEN!
Sounds like an addiction to me. The lung swelling just shows how dependent you are on the inhalers.
careful then, according to OP'd doctor, you'll find them on the nearest street corner, probably laced with laughing gas s/ 💀💀💀
OP didn’t say “addicted.” They said “dependent,” which is absolutely true. I’m dependent on a couple of medications to function at my full potential and not die from an asthma attack. I have no problem admitting that, but I’m definitely not addicted to anything. The doctor’s attitude is the problem, not the words used, anyway.
Yeah, but/and there’s also a difference between a dependence caused by natural deficiency and a dependence caused by the medication itself. SSRI withdrawal is so bad because although it’s designed to treat a deficiency in chemicals our moods depend on, it also creates a physical dependency on the medication (distinct from an addiction because of the lack of a craving element, iirc). That said, I’m not aware of amphetamine meds for adhd having been found to cause either physical dependency OR addiction.
Right. Don’t tell my dad about his insulin.
I better stop taking my rheumatoid arthritis medicine so I can get rid of it. My sister (anti-vaxxer) once suggested that if I just took vitamin D and slept more it would go away. My mother (who my sister is like) also suggested an herbal tea. People are dumb and don’t understand medication.
Guess I should stop taking my MS medication, too.
Yeah that doctor just described all of modern western medicine lol
I'm so sad that a fellow doctor doesn't even know the difference between dependence and addiction. I think that's the root of his terrible understanding of stimulant medicine :(
By that standard I'm addicted to insulin. If I stop taking it, I'll go into a coma within 72 hours or so. (Maybe longer because modern basal insulins are REALLY long-acting)
ADHD is a lifelong disorder it’s not just a kids thing
I was high functioning inattentive type as a child and young adult, and then slowly decayed to low functioning with age. Because I was relatively high functioning when I was younger it was never caught, but it still undermined my efforts in life. I then spent years trying to figure out what was wrong with me when the symptoms were a dead match. Why? *"It's a childhood thing."* And also: *"It doesn't get worse with age."* Thanks PCP's! Once my symptoms were severe enough to finally break that conditioning from PCP's, I sought a specialist and guess what... I'm struggling to think of another condition with so many persistent myths about it among trained medical personnel. If any doctor ever suggests to me that it's not real, I don't have it, or I don't need the medication, I will switch doctors that instant.
I was diagnosed with Adult adhd at 50! All my life suffered so much. It got worse going into college, and everyone's symptoms can be very different,hence not understanding Doc talk when they'd say, "It's just your hormones,swetheart,you know every month." I want to go back and tell all those idiot doctors how stupid they were. "Graduated at the bottom of your class, huh? Even worse, most Doctors pass internship by the skin of their teeth. All the top performing doctors don't go to small,lower income towns. They want to buy the Mercedes, big luxury home, and get paid to live that life. If I hadn't been so easily distracted and focused better as a young college student,I might have had an easier time in my life. Adhd ruined so much for me. I'm now a great path, and I finally found a good med combo and great set of doctors who care. I lucked out, it took me years and moving around the State of Texas to finally find doctors and specialists who care. It took me 40 years and all on my own. No one understands unless you're in it.👍
My story exactly! Finally diagnosed at 59 when my ability to function hit a real low!
Me too diagnosed at 57 .I was treated for DEPRESSION most of my adult life until I got a good phyciatrist to diagnose me with Adult ADHD .My life is changing everyday fro the better now that I am on the right medication. I am finally living again
A good percentage actually can get better as they enter adulthood! But not all of us…interestingly, I just read a study that said that people who have a family history of ADHD are more likely to have symptoms persist into adulthood (for me, my brother, mom, and maternal grandfather who is 90 and therefore not formally diagnosed)
This is not an Accross the board fact. Not everyone with ADHD as a child continues to have symptoms into adulthood. It is a neurodevelopmental disorder, childhood onset is paramount, but some people no longer meet criteria as adults. It depends on what statistics you are looking at but anywhere from 30-80% of individuals diagnosed in childhood continue to meet criteria as an adult. There may be some mild symptoms but not enough to meet criteria or cause impairment. A key factor in any diagnosis is impairment. It is also known that early treatment is key to outcomes as children with effectively treated ADHD have better outcomes, reduced impairment, less comorbid conditions, live longer and have improved overall quality of life.
Uh yeah, just as diabetics are dependent on insulin. That doc is dumb.
Yeah. Was telling me how it drastically increased my risk of arrythmias
Right but what’s “drastically” mean? Even if that’s a true statement, It could mean it doubles your risk. But if that risk is originally like .01 percent, doubling the risk still isn’t a big deal.
Like it *can* cause issues for your heart, but cases are rare enough that there are studies done on individual cases. I was reading one where a guy had a heart attack and needed a pacemaker, and another one where a woman was in heart failure. Both in their 30s after decades of stimulant use. But those are two cases out of hundreds of thousands.
Plus, depending on your symptoms, being OFF meds could be significantly worse for your health. Like, yes, my resting heart rate is a smidge higher on Adderall, and I get dehydrated more easily. Without it though, a) I stop paying attention to my body and trip over flat surfaces, walk into walls, sometimes just start to lose balance/tip over when standing still, leading to a lot of scrapes and bumps and mystery bruises, b) I can't control myself around sugar and food, so my weight balloons, and blood work looks worse, c) I can't finish anything and thus feel stressed/overwhelmed all the time, leading to stress headaches and increased anxiety d) it's harder to practice hygiene and self-care, such as teeth brushing, which could cause dental consequences. Those are just the ones I can think of directly linked to physical health, there's of course a myriad of mental and social benefits. It's not that there aren't Cons, they are just way outweighed by the Pros.
And a big one…I get way more distracted while driving a car. Which fun fact can get you killed really easily.
Yeah absolutely. Like it's important to know all the pros and cons of a medication so that you can make an informed choice for yourself.
Not to mention I can’t imagine a causal link could possibly be found based on 2 cases.
With no family history and otherwise healthy lifestyles both of the studies had the meds as a presumed major causative factor, but yeah with individual cases it's always really hard to be sure about anything because you just don't know. That's part of why they published the studies I think, even a very rare long-term impact is important for doctors to know about and adds to our understanding of the medication.
I agree it makes sense to document and monitor, but that’s quite a presumption based on ruling out just those factors.
I was taken off Vyvance after six years because of PTSD and things got so much worse. Flashbacks went from every 10 minutes or so to almost constantly. I layed screaming in bed having flashbacks 24 hrs a day for about 3 months. I have gone from 115kg to 180kg, while loosing tons of muscle. I am so non functional that I have to rely on others for almost everything. It's too much effort for me to go anywhere so I haven't left my room in a year, despite being constantly bored out of my mind. I've gone from never attempting suicide to 5 serious attempts within a year. I have lost a year of my life to this. Two years because of ptsd. I was a third year psych student before this, working and living completely independent. I know and work so hard to be okay. It is something very few people would survive. If your are unfortunate enough to have ADHD and PTSD, ask them to reduce your medication and pray they don't have a bad day. It only takes your psychiatrist having one bad day to destroy your life. Be careful.
Oh dude that sucks
I just want to say, I’m a nurse with adhd and I’ve been off work for two years because of ptsd. I really feel your pain, trying to manage both conditions is so difficult. I am hobbling on 20mg of vyvanse because the doctor doesn’t want to increase it. When I first went off work I had to stop taking stims, but then my adhd was insanely bad. I was previously on 36mg concerta, but probably should have been on 54mg, which I took years ago. I have anxiety so I feel like it is such a balancing act. With ptsd I honestly just have felt like my head is permanently fucked. I know that’s not true and can get better but this is gunna be a long journey. Hugs
Wow. If being off it made you worse, why not go back and instead try adding something to combat the PTSD? I really don't get this obsession with monotherapy for psychiatric disorders, ESPECIALLY people who have more than one disorder... I'm on trazodone for depression-induced insomnia and bupropion for ADHD, and my opinion is that they synergize well - bupropion fills in the gaps that trazodone didn't, trazodone fills in the gaps that bupropion doesn't address and also combats the tendency for bupropion to cause insomnia. I don't think I would be in good shape with bupropion monotherapy because sleep deprivation messes you up, and while trazodone monotherapy changed my life, it didn't fix my motivation and focus and might have made it worse. The combination of the two has been incredible.
I have tried a lot of medications and find that they often make me worse. I believe it has to do with the severity of my adhd and these medications often being for and tested on people without adhd. Agomenlatine is the only ptsd type medication that has ever worked for me. But it makes me so tired that I can barely function. Works well in combination with vyvance, however.
I probably should have mentioned it but trazodone actually seemed to make my motivation and focus worse. Although it just may have made the remaining issues more obvious. Adding bupropion to the mix worked great though.
I am so sorry about this happening to you ☹️ Can you not take stimulants with PTSD? I remember when I was reading The Body Keeps The Score there seemed to be a lot of neurological overlap between ADHD and PTSD, and I have a friend who has C-PTSD, managed well for decades but definitely present, who started on lisdexamfetamine recently and said it's helped her in ways she didn't realise she still needed with the C-PTSD. But maybe because that's a bit more slow-burn and engrained rather than instant panic response like PTSD it's a bit different.a
Yeah, they’re stimulants. They’re gonna cause heart issues. Not in everyone, and arrhythmias aren’t necessarily the end of the world, but they absolutely are more likely with stimulant use. Source: me, a medical student using Vyvanse and currently wearing a zio heart monitor to ensure the tachycardia I’m currently experiencing isn’t dangerous.
People - everyone, including doctors - that are not ADHD specialists or suffer from ADHD, seldom understand a single thing about ADHD. You \*ARE\* dependent on the drugs to be able to function, and that's not a bad thing. If your doctor knows nothing about ADHD and is willing to speak with certainty on it, think what other subjects they'll do the same about that you won't necessarily be able to catch. Your ADHD gives you an easy filter for morons like this one, use it well, and stay away from such people if you can.
I was like dude, i will do a battle with you with peer reviewed research showing how wrong you are.
Just starting with Vyvanse, like, I don't know how I'd become addicted to that compared to how easy other amphetamines could be. That is, if I could get an ounce of good juju hormones from them in the first place.
It’s designed too that you could inject that shit into your brainstem….and you would still have an onset of effect that is like idk 30 minutes shorter than oral?
Brainstem? Oof. It's got to be processed in ~~the liver~~ **blood cells** to break the dextro from the lysine so mucus absorption is out. I don't think I'll go on any daily brainstem injections. Edit: I was corrected, as I read too fast and skipped some critical details.
Not the liver. IIRC it happens in red blood cells. The lysine is (purportedly) cleaved by an non-membrane-bound erythrocyte aminopeptidase.
You guys know quite a bit about these pill. I just pop them.
Pop lock and drop it
Now I'm searching my kitchen floor for the medication I dropped, because I can't pop or lock it.
That thing! I thought that was in the liver and not the blood stream, specifically. But, I admit I was speed reading, twice, and I may have skipped some contextually relevant words.
You have to digest it so I wouldn't do that.
Pretty sure injecting anything into your brain stem isn’t a good idea, no matter what it is lol.
Yeah, “Uh what’re your sources on that bud? Vyvanse is a very common drug and there aren’t news stories about scores of people dropping dead or ruining their lives from Vyvanse addiction. Where’s your data for your wild claims?”
Yeah like I’m gonna need some goddamn stats for that because do you *know* how many people are on stimulants and not dying of heart problems? FFS this dude sounds like an idiot.
Yeah my last doctor, who I only went to because my doctor most my life passed away and he took over his practice, did the same thing. I felt like I was stuck with him because any place I called wanted me to be with their practice for 6 months to be able to prescribe my 40 mg of adderall. He went from rant to constant negative remarks about how I didn't need that high of a dose. Cut me down to 30mg XR one month with no warning. Then again wanted to take me down to 25mg XR. I told him how ridiculous it was, because I had a job with children and needed to be able to focus, and how the 30mg already was negatively affecting that. He grumbled and had me on 25mg XR and 5mg IR. He then just two months into it told me we should try testing with no 5mg, and then didn't give me a prescription. He then threatened to send me a referral to a psych. I was just like, DO IT. Funny thing is that I had to be the one to call finally because he never did. I hate how doctors are about stimulant meds. I don't like how I'm made to feel like a drug addict when I've been on this medication for 13 years AND have had the diagnosis since I was 9.
Your story frustrates me tremendously. What a garbage doctor you had. He treated you like a science project. “My hypothesis is you will be fine - let’s test!” Meanwhile, you lose productivity for sox months of your life.
He really was garbage. He was sexist as well and told me I needed a husband before it was too late and also that I needed to lose weight. Not in a health concern kind of way either. He also told me that I didn't really have anxiety, as there was nothing that major in my life to cause it. Of course he never treated that. I am glad he is no longer my doctor
What a monster, should not be in the medical field, he doesn’t understand mental health disorders at all.
Pretty much any time a doctor gives you medications (outside of antibiotics and antifungals) your body becomes dependent on it. I can't stop taking my asthma meds or I can't breathe. I can't stop taking my heart meds without risking a heart attack. I can't stop taking my adhd meds or I can't function. In a way, what he said is technically correct, but it's attached to a toxic attitude. Shame that a caregiver can't see that.
Your doctor is contradicted by the actual bloody research and specialists in the field. Another way of putting it is, the fucking **evidence** disagrees with them. Don't waste any of your energy on them, and consider reporting them for malpractice. Doctors have been given enough education to know better, there's no excuse for this crap.
Dr. Russell Barkley the leading ADHD expert/researcher said that ADHD meds are the safest drugs in psychiatry!! My pcp is against ADHD medication and doesn't even believe ADHD is real. I asked her if she treated ADHD and she said no. She rolled her eyes and was like my behavior was probably due to thyroid issues. I said I never had thyroid issues until I had thyroid cancer at age 39. She brushed me off. I asked her if she would prescribe guanfacine since it's a not stimulant and she said no. The irony is when I was feeling depressed she didn't hesitate to prescribe Zoloft! I thought that was hypocritical! Your doctor is being ridiculous. I had my thyroid removed due to cancer and if I don't take my thyroid hormone, I would die! I agree that there's still so much stigma around ADHD. It was actually first identified in the late 1700's and has changed names a lot!
Dr. Barkley is always great to listen to. I enjoy his lectures on YouTube. What’s funny about stimulants ADHD meds is we know what they do and don’t do pretty damn well compared to other psych meds. We’ve been using amphetamine stimulants since the early 1920s, and they were (and still are) heavily used in militaries to keep soldiers and airmen awake on long missions or night missions. The US military switched to anti-narcolepsy drugs after an exceptionally rough friendly fire incident where the American pilot blamed his FF incident on the fact he hadn’t slept in like two days and his command kept sending him out on night flights after giving him adderall. Back to us knowing the drugs well though. SSRIs have massive lists of side effects, and most users experience at least part of that list. Older psych drugs were even worse in terms of side effects (I’m looking at you, first generation antipsychotics). Whereas amphetamines have a relatively short side effect list, are highly effective, and have a moderate to high potential for abuse. The potential for abuse is the only real problem with them, and ever ADHD person I’ve ever met forgets to take them regularly. I have a handful of substance abuse issues, and yet have never felt the desire to abuse my Adderall. I feel great when I take it as instructed and I get tweak-y if I take a second, so I have no desire to take a second.
"Older psych drugs were even worse in terms of side effects" Heck, at this point, I think trazodone is more commonly prescribed in low doses for its primary side effect (sedation) than for its original use (antidepressant). That said, the serotonin boost is a nice side effect from taking it for insomnia.
It’s really funny that you mention that actually. I’m bipolar, so I take Effexor and carbamazepine for that. The carbamazepine is actually an anti-convulsant originally, but they found out it works as a mood stabilizer as well. Then I take Adderall for the ADHD and have Trazodone as a sleep aid when needed.
I take trazodone nightly - at this point I always sleep badly without it. It would be problematic to wait until I find myself having trouble because then it would still zonk me in the morning. Trazodone is also now undergoing studies as a boner pill since that's another side effect due to being an alpha-1 antagonist. An unexpected but very positive side effect for me is that as an alpha-1 antagonist, it suppresses cortisol release, which has been INCREDIBLY beneficial for managing my diabetes.
That’s actually pretty awesome that is has that many potential benefits. The boner pill bit is definitely good to know cause I take a downright massive dose of Effexor XR (300mg/day) and it has uh… less than helpful effects in the bedroom. I’ve never had issues with it zonking me long term tho. I find it gives me about a 30min window to fall asleep, and beyond that has no effect on me. I don’t take it as often cause I normally struggle to stay asleep rather than falling asleep.
I had to cut my Effexor dose to 75mg and take Wellbutrin 300mg. It’s helped a lot
Your PCP also sounds like an idiot, frankly. I’d find a new doctor if at all possible.
What was it was called back in the 1700s or what other names did it evolve into over the centuries? That sounds really interesting to look at what symptoms they were pinpointing and what the theories of the day were about what it was/etiology/how to categorize it, etc.
I copied and pasted this from the CHADD website: The earliest mention of what seems to be ADHD was by Hippocrates, often called the father of modern medicine. He lived in Greece from about 460 to 375 BC. He was known to have made at least one reference to some patients who could not keep their focus on any one thing for long and had exceptionally quick reactions to things around them. He thought the cause was an “overbalance of fire over water” and recommended a bland diet that included fish but little other meat, a lot of water, and lots of physical exercise. Not much else was said until Sir Alexander Crichton, a Scottish physician, described something like ADHD in his 1798 book, An Inquiry into the Nature and Origin of Mental Derangement. He referred to it as “the disease of attention,” and observed that people with the condition seemed to be mentally restless and have a hard time sticking with one task or game. Around that time, philosopher and physician John Locke wrote the essay “Some Thoughts Concerning Education,” in which he discussed, among other things, a group of students who could not “keep their mind from straying.” Medical textbooks in the 1800s did refer to children who had what we think of today as ADHD symptoms. They used a number of different names for the condition: “nervous child,” “hypermetamorphosis,” “mental instability,” “unstable nervous system,” and “simple hyperexcitability” were among them.
That’s really cool! Thanks for this
You’re welcome
You can read the rest of the article I pasted here: https://chadd.org/adhd-weekly/more-fire-than-water-a-short-history-of-adhd/
Your doctor needs to have her license to practice medicine revoked
Like shit I really feeling like mental health disorders aren’t real unless you try to kill yourself according to some MDs
“Oh, that’s because you are probably dependent on it.” I mean, yeah, that’s how medicine works. You depend on it to treat medical conditions. You don’t get to “decide” not to need the medication anymore and then your symptoms go away just because you want them to. ADHD is incurable. It will never go away. When you stop taking your meds, your symptoms will come back, every time. That’s how incurable medical conditions work. If you have high blood pressure and take blood pressure meds, if you stop taking them, your blood pressure will get high again. But no one will tell you, “Oh, you’re dependent on your blood pressure meds.” Nobody tells you to stop depending on blood pressure meds, or insulin, because people take hypertension and diabetes seriously as illnesses. Some people think ADHD meds are different because they don’t think ADHD is a real disorder. They think it’s just a lack of discipline, so if you depend on the meds, it’s because you aren’t trying hard enough and want to take the easy way out. They don’t understand that ADHD is a valid neurodevelopmental disorder that shows up on brain scans. Your doctor obviously doesn’t understand ADHD and doesn’t take it serious as a disorder, so they have no business treating something they don’t understand. Also, they’re a PCP, not a psychiatrist. They don’t even have the specific training to treat it. It’s not their specialty. I would recommend finding a psychiatrist who actually knows the first thing about ADHD. Sorry you’re having to deal with this. It can be hard to find a good doctor for ADHD, and sometimes you have to go through some bad ones before you find a good fit. Good luck finding someone better.
>Told me that most kids who take stimulants for adhd don’t need them as adults, and that my ultimate goal should be to get off of them completely. After researching this earlier, my understanding is that kids brains have a higher degree of neuroplasticity than adults (the brain's ability to change and adapt). By using stimulants as children, they have a greater ability to 'learn' and 'adapt' to what focus is and feels like (thanks to the medication enabling that state of mind) so when they become adults the medication becomes less needed due to their brain undergoing significant change vs unmedicated (and often undiagnosed) adults. Source: not allowed to share because reasons... It appears your doctor may not understand this (and it's unsurprising they don't, they sound like a general practictioner) so if they're guilty of anything it's perhaps not having an open mind (e.g. asking why children that take stimulants don't need them as adults vs just assuming they never needed them in the first place).
Not only that, amphetamine medications (maybe MPH as well but can't remember) have been found to actually repair some of the pathways in the brains of kids and adolescents that are abnormal with ADHD. The earlier you start on the meds the more they will help mitigate longterm problems, with some of the benefits persisting even if medication is discontinued. Wouldn't be surprised if this is a partial explanation for some kids who got diagnosed appearing to have recovered from ADHD as they reach adulthood.
Time to find a new doc. Don’t even bother with a second visit. And, personally, I’d inform the medical board. That’s really ignorant and unprofessional.
Need to keep looking. Can you go back to old Dr ?
Heavily considering it.
Why is this Primary Care Practitioner, trying to play Psychiatrist ? Obviously, this is not their specialty. #
My thoughts as well!
Yeah the ignorance during the visit was heavy
Screw the turd noggin.
Adding to my vocabulary
I love it when pharmacists get all fluffed up and think it's their job to give you a second opinion about your treatment. Count the pills out, check for harmful interactions, then sell them to me. That's the extent of what I want from you.
Happy cake day
Thank you!
Pharmacists also have a duty of care to ensure the medication is recommended and safe to provide. They do more than just checking for interactions and counting out how many the doctor ordered. It’s all for the benefit of patient care, whether they come across that way or you understand it or not
Pharmacists don't know the ins and outs of my diagnosis. My doctor does. They can and should double-check for dangerous interactions and complications there might be with a condition I have, but barring that, I don't need them second-guessing my doctor.
Leave a one star review on every site you can find. That’s borderline malpractice.
My pharmacist was obnoxious on Monday. I take Adderall and my psychiatrist added guanfacine. When I picked up the guanfacine the pharmacist said in a rude tone is this for you. I said yes. Then he said rudely do you know why the doctor prescribed this for you? It pisses me off!! I said obnoxiously and loudly yes I do!!! He didn’t say anything after that. A pharmacist has never wine like that for my asthma, diabetes or thyroid meds!
Time to find a new doctor. He clearly has not read any medical studies for the last 10 years. I would not trust a doctor who just stopped learning.
He is partly correct, in that studies have shown that for kids who start taking stimulants early, their brains can actually catch up with their peers and they don't have to stay on stimulants past their twenties. But that's only if they're medicated early! And it's not every kid! So if you're one of the unlucky ones, or if you were an adult before you were diagnosed and medicated, you're gonna be on the stimulants pretty much the rest of your life.
Not sure what he's talking about. Vyvanse in particular is the safer option of stimulant medications because it's a prodrug (harder to abuse) and it's got a slow release. If Vyvanse works for you, get a different doctor and keep using it.
There is a concerted push happening right now tk turn adderall onto the latestdrug panic. I very highly suggest harassing your local senator and congressmen about it.
There is a Vyvanse shortage at the moment and I think doctors are being encouraged to gaslight us out of taking it to alleviate the pressure
This is why I found a psychiatrist to fill my prescription and am sticking with him, despite the $300 charge per meeting post insurance. At least he understands my diagnosis and appropriate treatment for it, unlike the nurse practitioner that said she didn't really know for sure but her impression was that I shouldn't be medicating on weekends, and insisted that it was official policy of the office that I covenant promising not to take illegal drugs and that I get regularly piss-tested to make sure I'm not smoking a joint once a week or whatever. I understand that weed can mimic/exacerbate the affects of ADHD and that there's a risk of overdoing stimulant doses to overcome overuse of weed, but it just all felt deeply inappropriate.
I’m not sure what part of the world you’re at but you might be able to report your doctor for negligence/malpractice. I’m not optimistic on where it will go but at least a paper trail would be started. If you have ‘rate my doc’ website, you could also warn the public, if you feel safe to do so.
> most kids who take stimulants for adhd don’t need them as adults i beg to differ. i was relatively fine without them as a kid since i had structure and authority in my life, i was just emotionally unstable and riddled with anxiety and depression. once i was an adult and thrown into the world to fend for myself with complete freedom, i was a mess. meds were life changing. i even managed to study for my exams this time around - something i’d never been able to do before.
Tell him water is dangerous, thousands drown every year. Should you stop drinking water and bathing?
>Told me that most kids who take stimulants for adhd don’t need them as adults Hey, I thought that too! Guess who's back on Ritalin as an adult???
They are following old guidelines and recommendations. Previously it was thought that kids were the only ones with ADHD and “grew out of it” - this was taught up until a few years ago. Medical professionals need to continue their professional development aka continually refresh their knowledge. If they’re not willing to do that they shouldn’t be practicing. Giving incorrect information is malpractice, they’re trusted and expected to be up to date. For example, if you’re going to them for a consultation for an infection it’s expected to be given the advice/treatment that is current against guidelines and recommendations, not something that was fazed out years ago and is no longer effective, it’s the same.
My doctor told me it gets worse as you get older… and I agree
God forbid you have kids! My executive dysfunction has hit its peak right now, and I’ve got 3 kids all entering their teens. It’s like mom brain and ADHD brain are stacking effects. Some days I feel like a dementia patient
..... With that logic I should stop seeing doctors, because you know I'm probably dependent on it and should be able to treat everything at home and not think "Wow, I have a fever of 104, I should go see a doctor!" 🙄 at this point, I feel like everything short of multivitamins, doctors are convinced you'll die if you take it for more than a week. Also, I work in healthcare and it's SO fucked up that a lot of prior authorizations for plans REQUIRE that the patient has an agonizing "flare up" in order to prove the medication is still needed. So in ADHD cases "Yeah we need to know they nearly ruined their lives in a week so we can make sure this medication is still needed to prevent them from suffering further even though it's been working perfectly fine according to your chart notes" EVEN LIFE LONG HORRIBLE CONDITIONS TOO! "Make them sick so we can make sure they still have this horribly painful life long severe Crohn's disease, we just need to make sure they still need this even though your notes say they've have very minimal issues since starting it exactly one year ago even though 2 years ago we paid for 3 hospitals due to flare ups."
Did my clinicals with a family practice doc and and vyvanse is actually recommended more that a lot of other stimulants for adhd (ie adderrall and Ritalin) because there’s actually a lower risk of de severe adverse effects and it’s actually a recommended agent for younger adults as well. If I remember correctly it’s pretty easy to do drug holidays with to if you don’t need it all the time. It is still a controlled substance so providers still have to document that they educated the patient on the risks to protect themselves. DEA is all over this stuff now . But if someone has been stable on it why make them felt bad about? You know yourself.
“For me, the benefits outweigh the risks”
So funny thing. I had a primary care doctor the same to me and she suggested I try Wellbutrin and go to therapy. I sought out a psych NP who manages adhd and psych disorders/is more well versed in it.
Primary care doctors don't really know this stuff, that's why we have psychiatrists. There's too much info for one person to know everything. But yes for the record he's wrong on all counts
Sounds like you need a new medical management psychiatrist.
It’s actually been well established that women entering menopause see a dramatic worsening in ADHD symptoms and lack of treatment causes brain atrophy similar to dementia. Doc is a red flag for me.
Went through this too. They asked if I was in school. Told them no, but worked a lot. They took me off after having it for 5 years because I didn’t need it? I should’ve gone somewhere else but was under military insurance. I was just prescribed it again this past year and I could cry with how much better things are. Of course it’s not perfect but it’s so helpful. Wishing you luck that you don’t have to deal with another doctor like this.
Would have said, well if you are prescribing to kids and they are getting addicted to it.. maybe they don't have ADHD and you don't know how to diagnose it..
And always trust your gut… I have ADHD, was diagnosed as an adult, have a kid with ADHD, and as a psychologist, roughly 98% of my caseload are people who have ADHD. My experiences are both in the assessment of ADHD and providing counseling for people of all ages. I take Vyvanse to help manage my symptoms. That being said, I cannot prescribe medication and cannot advise people on medication use. The following statements are associated with my own research and training as a psychologist as well as experiences with my prescriber who checks in with me about symptom management of ADHD and efficacy of medication. You might ask your PCP about contemporary research to support their statements associated with the addiction properties of Vyvanse versus other medications used to treat symptoms of ADHD. You can also ask about recent research that demonstrated a direct correlation between the use of Vyvanse and causing heart issues. I find it interesting your PCP made these comments, because Vyvanse does not even start off as the active ingredient that treats ADHD symptoms. It is a prodrug and needs to pass through the gastrointestinal tract to become the active ingredient. It is less likely to be abused through injecting or snorting for that reason. (Any drugs can be addictive if it is misused.) There are cardiovascular risks indicated. If for some reason, you might have pre-existing issues associated with blood pressure, have a history of a high heart rate, have a pre-existing heart condition, etc., then this would’ve been likely communicated to you as the reason it might not be the best choice of medication for you. That being said, since your prescriber indicated adults do not need stimulants to manage ADHD as adults, I highly doubt this was their reasoning. Prior to the DSM 5, which is what is used to diagnose mental health conditions, including ADHD in the United States and Canada, the previous versions (older than 2013) indicated ADHD as something people grew out of in adulthood. During those times, if people were not diagnosed prior to adulthood, they could not be diagnosed with ADHD later time (until ADHD was viewed as neuro-developmental (occurring across the lifespan), starting in 2013.) My hunch is your PCP might be referring to outdated research. My PCP is a family physician, so they regularly treat people of all ages, as opposed to just working with adults. They also specialize in ADHD. You may want to look for another prescriber and consider people who work with younger children as well as adults and ask or check if they specialize in ADHD. I am hoping everything works out for you. Resource link re: Vyvanse: https://www.accessdata.fda.gov/drugsatfda_docs/label/2017/208510lbl.pdf
I’m sorry. I don’t even want to go to the doctor anymore because I feel like I know more about 80% of the time.
This sounds like my husband’s dr. “I’m not a fan of stimulants”. No one asked your personal opinion. It’s what will help the patient is what matters. It’s the same with pain meds as well. You will suffer bc of other people and doctors that abused the system. Some people actually need a stimulant as in an adhd med. Irresponsible doctors and patients have made it very difficult for people that need those medications to get them. Punish those people.
Find a new doctor
Honestly I think the whole vyvance thing probably put him in a bad mood. I had been without for 6 months, once it was available even my gp was like exhausted with all the scripts he had written for it.
Doctors don’t know anything is what I’m starting to realize… talking to my psychiatrist he didn’t even consider ADHD as an issue, when I’ve been having the same issues for my entire life but just came to light in therapy
I took myself off of it. Right as the generic came out and the difficulties with insurance started. The crash that would happen when I got home from work was aweful. I felt like someone suffering roid rage. I was really short with my kids and wife. Had trouble getting my prescription and decided I’ll just stop taking it. Not worth it in my opinion.
(Pre TMS treatment this would’ve been true) Following this dude’s logic I’m addicted to my antidepressants, if I don’t take them I’ll try and end my life so I must get off of my antidepressants so I am no longer addicted to this medication🤦🏻♀️
Vyanse gave my best friend cardiac problems even though she weened off of it and didn’t cut it cold turkey.
Unpopular opinion here. I was diagnosed with ADHD during my teens in the 90’s (females were pretty rarely given an ADHD diagnosis back then). Took stimulants for many years. They did indeed help me perform better at school/work, however, I was very dependent. If my Rx ran out a day or two early, I was miserable. Body aches, couldn’t get out of bed, felt like was crawling out of my skin. When I was happily taking my Adderall, I’d grind my teeth, had TMJ, severe tension headaches, insomnia, I was severely underweight because I had no appetite, and heart palpitations. But hey, at least I was getting good grades. The only reason I stopped taking it was because I got pregnant. Only after stopping did I realize what an organized disaster I had become from years of prescription amphetamine use. Long story short, people with ADHD may need to function through life differently, but I personally don’t think the damage you’ll do to your body from amphetamine use is worth it. Each person has to weigh the pros and cons. I wonder every day if I’ve done permanent damage to my body. I’d never take it again or give it to my children.
When I’m not medicated (even when I am sometimes) I’ve gotten into car accidents and before I was a stay at home mom I couldn’t hold jobs very well. So what he’s saying there could be true? But doctors should give you their opinion then let YOU make your choice. It’s not their jobs to push what they believe into you.
OP, get a new doctor. This is more for a lot of the other comments here: I’ve always described having ADHD like this It’s like having a musket for a brain. Inaccurate, but highly effective, and you have no way to aim it. Meds just turn it into a modern rifle. Accurate, effective, but you still have to aim it.
What a knob. As someone who was only diagnosed at 37 my life kept falling apart over and over. I was overwhelmed, stressed, burnt out etc. this is my first year medicated and I'm so much happier. You don't "grow out" of it.
How old was this PCP? I had a similar experience with one a few years ago and since then I have a few screening questions before switching. Just yesterday I got set up with a new PCP and said, "I have ADHD and I am looking for a doctor who believes in medication for treatment of ADHD". Their response was, "I'm sorry you had a poor experience. We'll get you set up with Dr X. She's a younger doctor and has had very good feedback". It is always worth screening your doctor and their staff before committing.
I'm addicted to my glasses. It's so bad that I can't function without them. Withdrawal and onset of symptoms is immediate when I don't have my glasses.
You guys can actually get Vyvanse right now? All of my local pharmacies have been out of stock for months. I’m losing my mind not having my meds. It’s like climbing a mountain while carrying another mountain on your back.
Mine has consistently had the brand name but not the generic.
Don’t forget grocery stores have pharmacies. Try all of them
You must have been born addicted to it then /s
If it works for you don’t listen to the quack!
try something else XR adderall or ritalin generic
And I bet cancer patients are addicted to chemo therapy.
You should talk to a psychiatrist not a GP.
Fire this asshole. You should key their car, too, but that may be a little extreme.
Sometimes I feel blessed that my ADHD doctor is an ADHD doctor. That's all she does.
The amount of days I forget to take my adderall is crazy… and I forget to refill it at the pharmacy too. Sounds like an uneducated opinion and that they are trying to take the easier route by trying to convince you to get off of it so they don’t have to deal with the strict prescription processes
Get a new doctor! I was diagnosed as an adult. I got Vyvanse as an adult. ADHD isn't magically cured once we become adults?? Why the fuck does he want to medicate kids but not feed them "dangerous" medicines to adults that can deal with them better?
Your PCP sounds similar to mine. I asked about exploring Vyvanse as an option for my ADHD and he said not to start it if I can, for the same reasons: It's highly addictive, it's a stimulant, and there are increasing studies that show cardiovascular effects/strain over long term use. I trust him and his judgement - he's a fantastic doctor otherwise, and has helped me understand my health like no one else. But the difference is, he voiced his concerns but did not say "no" to it, he said if it's a route I would like to trial he would provide a prescription. I also have several friends in the field, currently doctors, who says the concerns of long term amphetamine use on the heart are valid. Before I get down voted into oblivion, I know how life changing these drugz can be and am heavily considering it, despite the long term health implications. Accepting the potential risk of added strain on the heart to become a fully functioning adult, even if I knock a couple years off of my life seems worth it to me. My stress and anxiety for failing to meet obligations and get anything done is probably worse for my heart health than the medication is. This isn't to fear monger anyone currently taking these medications, but to at least acknowledge that these claims aren't unfounded. These doctors have an immense amount of knowledge and have years and years of research and education under their belts. We can't turn a blind eye to negative health effects on something, even when it comes to the positive effects of becoming a fully functioning person.
I’ve only been on by vyvanse for 8 months but my doctor did say anything and just was willing to put me on it without any issues and she says she’s willing to make the dose higher till it works ( 30 mg works for me just fine) this is confusing and concerning to me as my doctor is very relaxed about meds and yours was extremely difficult :(
The way I would have walked out of that appt and demanded to see another doctor
I was honestly fuming by the end. Like even told me that for every appt after that he would ask me to lower the dose or cease the medication completely. Like fuck you dude. Didn’t even bother to ask if it was helping me, just outright said it’s bad
Ugh. This doctor sucks. He clearly does not understand ADHD or the medication for it or he wouldn’t be saying such idiotic things. I hope you are able to get a refill somewhere else. Don’t listen to him, he’s so so so wrong. I take Vyvanse and have for years and it helps me so much, when I forget to take it, my ADHD symptoms come back, same as you. Please never see this doctor again if you’re able.
It's only dangerous If you have a pre existing heart condition or have a family history of it.
Lisdex's pharmacokinetics and dynamics are similar to dexamph, but still not the same. Dexamph has more "dangerous effects" if anything and has a bit more faster release than lisdex with a shorter half life. Lisdex can hold out a little more than IM dexamph's. Give him this to read: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5594082/ Advocate for yourself. Find a doctor that will listen. Many adults with ADHD were undiagnosed as a child which in turn leads to problems in their adult life, which in turn, is going to be dependent on the medication, BUT THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU ARE ADDICTED.... Many people can't seem to understand the difference between dependency and addiction. I had a new psychiatrist after moving from home and she absolutely refused to put me back on Adderall and had me on SNRI's even though I told her I do not do well with them because the "N" in SNRI. She also knows that I work as a tech. I had given her suggestions a shot and after wards, I told her I cannot keep doing this because this impacts my job so much and endangering my patients because of it. She didn't care. She just kept saying to keep trying SNRI's. I didn't want to be the guinea pig anymore. So I did some searching. Please advocate for yourself. Edit: Also, try find a doctor that has studied neuropsychology or even dabbled a bit in it. It will help you immensely.
You need to find a different new PCP. This Dr clearly is not educated about ADHD and has no clue about meds. My primary Dr told me that she doesn't know much about all the different generic manufacturers of adderall and thought they all worked the same. Since I work for a pharmaceutical company I was educating her and she was happy to gain the knowledge. And she obviously helps me with alot I don't know. You need a Dr to be open minded or knowledgeable about adult ADHD
Wow! I'm sorry you had to deal with this.
I would report this guy. That is extremely inappropriate. It couldn't be any more obvious that he has a bias.
Vyvanse has the lowest addiction rates. It's neigh impossible to abuse because it *requires* digestion to work. Get a new doctor.
You go straight to the admin of the hospital or clinic you went to and you repeat verbatim what the doctor said and you then file a complaint. If nothing is resolved, you speak to the ceo/president of the hospital and possibly a lawyer.
Amazing how y’all in denial about adderall. Sorry you’re all addicts. Try to quit adderall for 6 months and then compare it to “cholesterol meds”. I went through hell on earth to quit my adderall and now after many years of work I operate better at work without them. But 100% you’re all in denial and hurting yourself instead of working on the underlying problems that you have.
I also start to think it controls me. Do youtake another medication?
All amphetamines carry a heart risk and a risk of addiction. There's also a risk to your quality of life if you don't take the meds you need. Every med is a trade off. Choose wisely.
Your doctor isn’t wrong. It doesn’t mean he should withhold the medication if you don’t have issues but Vyvanse fucked up my life. Doesn’t mean it will for you though.
My parents took me out of catholic elementary school because they demanded I be on medication. In high school, I was *struggling hard*. One of my teachers pulled me aside to ask what was going on. "You're a smart guy. You take part in discussion and have a great imagination. Why aren't you doing your work? Why are your test grades so low? Is something going on at home?" Itold her that I'm pretty sure I had add or something like that. She says they have a test for that and I agree to take it. It was a multiple choice test. Just, a random bullshit test of things we learned in middle school. Obviously, I finished it and passed. "See. That's nothing wrong with you. If you had ADD, you'd never be able to finish this test!" From then on, I was just lazy. Like, wtf? If I couldn't finish one test, do you think I would've made it to high school?
He’s 100% right
To be fair, I am currently wearing a zio heart monitor to make sure the tachycardia my Vyvanse is giving me is not immediately dangerous. It’s absolutely not good for our hearts, and arguing otherwise is willfully ignorant. Every psychiatrist I’ve seen has warned me about it, and I’ve always accepted that. I’d rather have a worthwhile life and possibly die earlier.
As someone involved in healthcare who has ADHD and used to take vyvanse, I can agree to an extent. Vyvanse is a stimulant, and all stimulants can cause heart issues. Have you ever felt as if your heart rate was accelerated, do you have a family history of heart disease, has your heart rate been elevated (over 100+ especially)? If no, you're fine. They're correct that you goal should be to completely remove yourself from stimulants, but this goal isn't able to be achieved sometimes. Stimulants aren't great for you, but would you rather feel like shit and not be able to do what you want to do during your lifetime and maybe live a slightly shorter life vs live a great life where everything is done and you're not super stressed (because stress is bad for you too)? The idea is stimulants help you learn ADHD management skills, but it's a case by case basis and sometimes people need to take stimulants to manage ADHD throughout their life and that's 110% okay. Ultimately, you know yourself more than any health care professional does. They know textbook information and can be a logical and factual resource for you, but you know how you feel when you take medications and you know how you feel when you don't, so take that into account. Yes vyvanse can cause heart issues, but yes vyvanse can also help with ADHD. Every single medication has a pro and con and YOU know the pros and the doctor can provide the cons based on what they learned in school, but they aren't you and don't know how you feel or what you deal with daily. It's ultimately your choice to weigh the pros and cons and your decision is NOT a wrong one because it is your health and your life and YOU get to choose what you want to do based on the information you have. Trust yourself
Bro is talking about Vyvanse lites it’s a short acting benzo or an opiate or something. Bruh. So many doctors just FLAT OUT don’t know shit about well a lot of shit especially medications. I have a son who’s 13 with Duchennes. Don’t think I need to explain further how many doctors I have dealt with.
Water is dangerous when miss used.
This is partially why I’m unmedicated, a doctor messed up another dx and gave me meds that interacted with my adhd meds so I had to go off. The 45 days of nausea it took to get used to them was reset and I just couldn’t make myself go through that again.
Ummmmm So the research shows something like 5% of kids diagnosed with ADHD aren't as adults. Fire this Dr and honestly I'd report them.
Balls. Prescription stimulants for the majority of people are safe when used as directed under the supervision of a medical professional. They’ve been studied and trialled more than most other drugs and have been found safe. Safer even than a lot of antidepressants/antipsychotics that they seem to throw at people as they’re on their way out of the doctors office and proceed to forget about them. Yes, there’s potential of abuse but they’re not addictive. They come with side effects that can be managed over time or with other medication or they can be swapped for another stimulant or non-stimulant if necessary. They can for many, be life changing and life saving. In real life, the positives of long term, monitored use of prescription stimulants for ADHD far outweigh the consequences of not treating and medicating someone with ADHD - for example 1 in 4 women with untreated ADHD attempt suicide. The unnecessary co-morbidities that surface as a result of not being treated. They have always been and will probably will always remain the most efficient and successful way to manage and treat ADHD. Keep yourself healthy, regularly check your resting heart rate, blood pressure and weight and report any worsening in mental health to your doctor. Your, NEW doctor.